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Speaker 1: Worrying. Today's episode contains spoilers for the first four episodes

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Speaker 1: of wonder Man on Disney Plus. We warn't Oo.

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Speaker 2: Hello.

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Speaker 1: My name is Jason Concepcion and I'm rosday Night, and

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Speaker 1: welcome back to ext revision of the podcast where we

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Speaker 1: dive deep into your favorite shows, movies, comics, and pop culture.

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Speaker 1: Coming from my art podcast where Ringing Me three up a.

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Speaker 2: Week plus news plus news. Today's episode, Wow, guys, I've

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Speaker 2: been waiting to talk about this show for so long.

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Speaker 2: It's wonder Man. It's out. You guys are loving it.

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Speaker 2: You're loving it in the discord, the people are loving it,

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Speaker 2: the critics are loving it. It's marvels. Hello, good omen

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Speaker 2: for our twenty twenty six in the MCU. So we're

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Speaker 2: gonna be talking about episodes one through four. So if

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Speaker 2: you haven't watched them yet, you know, go and watch them,

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Speaker 2: then come back or listen to us and then go

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Speaker 2: watch them and listen again.

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Speaker 1: Okay, we're covering the first four episodes of this binge

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Speaker 1: dropped series, wonder Man, which is wonderful and very very fun.

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Speaker 1: Let's quickly recap this chunk. So Episode one is Mattinee.

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Speaker 1: We meet Simon Williams, who is a struggling but very

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Speaker 1: dedicated actor who is, you know, like many in LA

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Speaker 1: searching for that big break, is not finding it, not

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Speaker 1: finding it, not finding it. He gets fired from a

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Speaker 1: show because he's, you know, trying to do too much,

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Speaker 1: basically with he's doing too much one the small part

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Speaker 1: that he has, he's trying to do too much. He

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Speaker 1: meets he also breaks up with his girlfriend, and then

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Speaker 1: he meets Trevor Slattery. We all know him as once

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Speaker 1: the frontman for a terrorist organization, but now just kind

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Speaker 1: of a normal, washed up actor who's since been cleared

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Speaker 1: after the events of Iron Man two. Trevor tells Simon

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Speaker 1: that he really wants to remake the classic wonder Man

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Speaker 1: film directed by von Kovac, and Simon is, like, I

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Speaker 1: got an audition for this. They connect over the opportunity

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Speaker 1: and Simon lands an audition, which he hopes that Trevor

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Speaker 1: can help him with.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's about right. And what I really love

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Speaker 2: about that episode is we kind of establish that Simon

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Speaker 2: is a very lonely guy, but his hyperfixation, his love

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Speaker 2: is acting, and when he was a little kid, his

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Speaker 2: dad would take him to go and watch wonder Man,

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Speaker 2: which were these kind of Saturday morning serials in this world.

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Speaker 2: And obviously we learn in that first episode two that

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Speaker 2: Simon has some kind of budgeoning superhero powers. We're just

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Speaker 2: not sure what. We just get a glow of his

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Speaker 2: eyes here, and it is also revealed that Trevor is

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Speaker 2: not necessarily to be trust and then we move into

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Speaker 2: episode two where after Simon's imprompt you interview that by

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Speaker 2: the way, he scammed his way into and I love

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Speaker 2: that moment. There's so many good La moments here. There's

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Speaker 2: a fantastic La show and he scams his way into

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Speaker 2: the audition. They love him, and the casting director for

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Speaker 2: wonder Man says, Okay, look self tape for this shitty

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Speaker 2: indie movie and then at least I'll have some proof

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Speaker 2: of how good you were. And Simon cannot get the

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Speaker 2: self tape right, it's literally two lines. He is obsessed.

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Speaker 2: He's doing it in his apartment. He calls Trevor. Trevor's like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'll come to your house where he wants to spy

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Speaker 2: on him for the Department of Damage Control, but instead

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Speaker 2: Simon's like, you can't come in there. Maybe I punched

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Speaker 2: a giant hole in the wall, or maybe I didn't,

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Speaker 2: who knows. So Trevor takes him too. In one of

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Speaker 2: the best cameos of the year, Joey panta Liano's house,

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Speaker 2: Joey Pants and Joy Joey Pants to record this incredible

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Speaker 2: sale tape that's going to get Simon the job. But

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Speaker 2: when we get there, it becomes quite clear that there

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Speaker 2: is a very complicated relationship. And while Joey Pants and

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Speaker 2: Trevor world wants close, Trevor's kind of misled Simon about

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Speaker 2: their closeness. There was a falling out, but in one

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Speaker 2: of the moments that sort of gets you really emotionally

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Speaker 2: connected with what this show is doing so well, Joey

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Speaker 2: pushes it a little bit too far and Simon just

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Speaker 2: stands up for Trevor, and the two of them go

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Speaker 2: back to Simon's apartment and they make a fantastic video

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Speaker 2: and they really feel like he's gonna get this role.

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Speaker 2: And again, this show is just so wonderful, And we

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Speaker 2: get this moment where Trevor sees that the wall has

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Speaker 2: this huge hole in it and Simon's like, hey, you

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Speaker 2: like Pepperoni pizza, and Trevor just goes yeah, I love

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Speaker 2: Pepperoni pizza, and there's kind of this burgeoning friendship that's

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Speaker 2: so powerful by the end of episode two, which makes

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Speaker 2: a lot of sense because episode three years Are is

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Speaker 2: like a big emotional kind of core episode.

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Speaker 1: Then we go to episode three Pacoma, in which Simon

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Speaker 1: takes Trevor to his hometown. Trevor in the previous episode

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Speaker 1: has successfully placed the damage hacking ring or a ring.

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Speaker 1: Very funny by the way that damage control is like,

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Speaker 1: we want you to spy on Simon. Take this ring,

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Speaker 1: which was like his whole thing as a man when

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Speaker 1: he was pretending to be the Mandarin and the leader

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Speaker 1: of the fucking ten rings. Take this ring, place it

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Speaker 1: on Simon's computer, and it will do all the hacking

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Speaker 1: for you. He's managed to do that. Now in episode

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Speaker 1: three Pacoima, Simon takes Trevor to meet his family out

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Speaker 1: of Pacoima, and we learned through a flashback that Simon

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Speaker 1: at one point was like in a house fire and

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Speaker 1: was completely unharmed. So we're learning more about Simon's apparent powers,

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Speaker 1: you know. We see a lot of like the family

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Speaker 1: conflict at the home and see how all of this

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Speaker 1: has led Simon to be the person he is and

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Speaker 1: seek out acting as that kind of way to put

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Speaker 1: himself to characters we understand, like why he loves movies

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Speaker 1: and TV from the kind of interactions that he has

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Speaker 1: with his family and his brother and his mom, who

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Speaker 1: is very supportive of everything he does. It's also clear

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Speaker 1: that he's like not he's telling them he's more successful. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he is, is getting more opportunities than he is.

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Speaker 2: His brother obviously not a fan of Simon's lifestyle, right.

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Speaker 1: Trevor learns about this interesting these hints that Simon is unique,

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Speaker 1: perhaps is a super powered individual. He successfully records these

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Speaker 1: as damage control wants him to do. But then deciding,

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Speaker 1: you know, like the family is like, oh, you're such

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Speaker 1: a good friend, you know, And we were worried when

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Speaker 1: Simon moved down to to you know, moved across the

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Speaker 1: mountain to La, over the hill to La, that he

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Speaker 1: was going to be lonely and he wasn't gonna have friends,

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Speaker 1: and you're seeming such a great friend to him, and

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Speaker 1: this is You're exactly what he needs. He needs someone

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Speaker 1: like you in his life who's supporting him and knows

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Speaker 1: the acting the ropes of the industry and what it

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Speaker 1: takes to climb up that mountain, and Trevor, feeling absolutely

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Speaker 1: terrible now you know, erases the recording and it's like,

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Speaker 1: I love that.

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Speaker 2: Do that and then Chemist at.

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Speaker 1: The end they get it's wonderful. There's a moment where

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Speaker 1: there's a big fight, like an argument that's going on

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Speaker 1: in the kitchen, where Simon releases that what I take

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Speaker 1: to be like an ionic ionics, those ionic powered powers.

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Speaker 1: And at the end, Simon gets the callback for the

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Speaker 1: Wonderman film, alongside Trevor, who also gets a callback for

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Speaker 1: the for the Wonderman film.

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Speaker 2: Also, I want to say, Simon, I love you so much.

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Speaker 2: I love your pure hearted nature. But why does this

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Speaker 2: man not have representation and why was he reading for

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Speaker 2: the pall if nobody knows what he is? Like, let's

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Speaker 2: be a bit more suspicious. That's why we're gonna leave

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Speaker 2: all main characters who we love and in this burgeoning

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Speaker 2: new friendship, and we're going to head into a really

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Speaker 2: surreal bottle. Episode episode four, it's Doorman. It's the history

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Speaker 2: of DeMar Doorman Davis, who we learn is the reason

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Speaker 2: that superheroics and superheroes are actually banned from being on

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Speaker 2: sets in real movies, and that is because there was

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Speaker 2: a guy called DeMar the Doorman Davis, who could create

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Speaker 2: essentially like a portal through his stomach that allowed things

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Speaker 2: to pass through. One night, he's at a club, Josh

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Speaker 2: Gadd is there playing himself, singing a rap version of

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Speaker 2: Summer by Olaf, and he ends up having to save

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Speaker 2: the lives of the people in the club by allowing

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Speaker 2: them to go through his stomach portal. Josh Gadd takes

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Speaker 2: him on as kind of like a slightly problematic sidekick

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Speaker 2: and eventually ropes him into being in a movie called

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Speaker 2: cash Grab hilarious, and unfortunately, Josh Gadd goes through DeMar's

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Speaker 2: body and doesn't come out, and we learn that that

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Speaker 2: is why superheroes were banned in what they call the

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Speaker 2: Doorman clause. We earlier saw that Simon l about not

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Speaker 2: having superpowers to be on and his wonder Man audition,

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Speaker 2: and then at the end we see Simon actually watching

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Speaker 2: it when he's on a TV show playing a nurse

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Speaker 2: and seeing them bring in this Dorman closes and he

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Speaker 2: just clause and he walks out, and that's where we

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Speaker 2: leave the first four episodes of wonder Man.

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Speaker 1: Quite a bit of retcon. Oh world building here, Let's

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Speaker 1: take a quick break and then let's talk about this episode. Okay,

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Speaker 1: we're back. So first of all, we must discuss the

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Speaker 1: fact that apparently in the MCU there have been issues

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Speaker 1: regarding superpowered people who have been below the radar of

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Speaker 1: the eventers people that we it's you know, very funny

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Speaker 1: to me that this is built around Doorman, who in

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Speaker 1: the comics was the Lakes Avenger, and the Great Lakes

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Speaker 1: Avengers were basically like exactly what it sounds like, They're

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Speaker 1: like the fourth They're like the fourth String Avenger team.

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Speaker 1: And and we learned that there have been superpowered people

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Speaker 1: in Hollywood for a bit and the and in fact

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Speaker 1: had risen to some amount of fame, like Doorman was

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Speaker 1: like it was like a guy for for for a

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Speaker 1: number of years. But because of this uh you know,

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Speaker 1: terrible work workplace incident in which Josh Gad was swallowed

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Speaker 1: by mister Davis incredible to the period into into some

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Speaker 1: like shadow realm uh that all of the Hollywood players

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Speaker 1: and apparently the unions also got together and said, Okay,

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Speaker 1: from now on, too high insurance, the insurance rates are horrendous. Therefore,

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Speaker 1: superpowered people cannot have like I guess, recurring roles in TV,

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Speaker 1: and cannot be like above the line. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: like what is that? That's why I'm wondering, we need

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Speaker 1: what is the gotta know?

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Speaker 2: We gotta know that is actually I think ironically that's

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Speaker 2: one of the powerful things about this show is like

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Speaker 2: so much of the MCU includes a lot of plausible,

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Speaker 2: you know, deniability, Like can you just imagine that something's

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Speaker 2: gonna happen? Can you suspend your this belief? What I

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Speaker 2: love about this show is like we are thinking it's

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Speaker 2: so grounded in the reality of acting that we really

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Speaker 2: are like okay, but like, can you have like somebody

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Speaker 2: who's really got like you know, what if they just

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Speaker 2: have a superpower that allows them to find really cool fabrics?

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Speaker 2: Like can they be your costume designer? Or is that

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Speaker 2: too dangerous? Like does it have to be a is

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Speaker 2: it like a superpower where you have to go inside

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Speaker 2: somebody else? That's a very specific choice. Josh gab May.

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Speaker 1: I think what they should have done is ban the

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Speaker 1: use of superpowers on set and ban the use of

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Speaker 1: authentic superpowers in movie production, Like you can't use your power,

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Speaker 1: you can't use your power. Like let's say Pyro is

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Speaker 1: in a movie. He can't use his fire power on set,

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Speaker 1: like you'd have to make that would have to be

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Speaker 1: CGI or some kind of like other special effects. But

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Speaker 1: he can't like really do it. And I think that's

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Speaker 1: what they should have done. You can't. It's done to

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Speaker 1: like ban super peer superpowered people. Uh, you know, writ large,

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Speaker 1: what they should have done is like ban all use

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Speaker 1: of superpowers. Now you're gonna have You're gonna have weird

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Speaker 1: incidents now where like somebody with a healing factor or whatever,

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Speaker 1: you know, like less subtle, more subtle powers might fly

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Speaker 1: under the radar, but yeah, you just can't use them

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Speaker 1: on set or in any way benefiting the movie production.

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Speaker 2: I think, Jason, that you're absolutely right that is a

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Speaker 2: sensible option. I would also say, I think that what

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Speaker 2: we're seeing here is the establishment once again of damage

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Speaker 2: control as essentially like a authoritarian government arm. We saw

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Speaker 2: that in Miss Marvel. Obviously they were hunting down kids

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Speaker 2: who had mutations. We know they've been using essentially what

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Speaker 2: seems like pre sentinel technology to find people who have superpowers.

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Speaker 2: So I think this is establishing the fear and oppression

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Speaker 2: and hatred that we need to have an X Men

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Speaker 2: in their MCU. That makes sense, and I love that

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Speaker 2: we're getting to see it from these almost like street

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Speaker 2: eye views. I'm not even calling it like street level

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Speaker 2: because Spider Man's a street level hero when he saves

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Speaker 2: his little local neighborhood. I'm talking about the fact, like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: if you're gonna say kind of like what she Hawk did,

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Speaker 2: so well, if you're gonna say that, this is a

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Speaker 2: world where you can have a Captain America or you

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Speaker 2: can have a Bucky. Marvel has never been the DC

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Speaker 2: universe where there's a pantheon of gods. This is a

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Speaker 2: Marvel universe where anyone could have those powers. So I

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Speaker 2: think there's something so refreshing and fun and inventive about

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Speaker 2: showing us this from the smallest possible perspective of just

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Speaker 2: a regular guy trying to get along in his job.

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Speaker 2: I think that is fascinating, and I think this essentially

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Speaker 2: sets up a great way for them to introduce multiple

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Speaker 2: different genres, vibes, tones also, guys. I know, obviously the

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Speaker 2: big thing here is the studio. The studio. The studio.

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Speaker 2: This is like the studio by got crazy news for you.

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Speaker 2: This show was wrapped like before the studio even came out.

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Speaker 2: So this is just one of those things where people

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Speaker 2: had a similar story in mind. They were thinking about

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Speaker 2: working in LA, the struggles of being a creative and

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Speaker 2: all those things. And I think that that meta angle

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Speaker 2: serves the MCU really well here, and I just generally

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Speaker 2: think they should be making more things like this. I

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Speaker 2: also cannot imagine that the budget was as high as

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Speaker 2: the other SEE shows where they were spending fifty sixty

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Speaker 2: million an episode. So yeah, and also as well, like

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Speaker 2: what a fantastic idea to just be like, well, we're

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Speaker 2: making a show about an actor, so we just need

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Speaker 2: to hire a really good actor. Like the first episode,

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Speaker 2: all the highlights are just Yah Yah doing like different

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Speaker 2: freaking acting exercises and bits, and you just want to

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Speaker 2: keep watching him because he's so good. That's a fee

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Speaker 2: of storytelling. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I think the thing that I like about this show

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Speaker 1: is the fact that it's so charming and kind of

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Speaker 1: low stakes. I mean that like in a not mean way. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: no complimentary in this and then the load bearing stuff,

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Speaker 1: the stuff that connects it to the MCU is is

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Speaker 1: a much lighter touch, And I think you're right, what

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Speaker 1: they've it's basically all damage control. What they've basically done

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Speaker 1: is as they've in previous MCU properties. They're positioning damage

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Speaker 1: control as like the we jail superheroes. We put superheroes

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Speaker 1: in jail well, and I think it's a great on

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Speaker 1: ramp for some of the stuff that we're going to

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Speaker 1: need for the X Men. Let's let's do a quick

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Speaker 1: refresher on damage control. We first see them post post

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Speaker 1: Infinity War in Spider Man Homecoming, we see them doing,

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Speaker 1: you know, seizing alien tech, doing a lot of clean

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Speaker 1: up after the Battle of New York. Of course, that

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Speaker 1: alien tech would then.

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Speaker 2: Fall to various.

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Speaker 1: Villainous forces who want to use it as for their

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Speaker 1: own benefit, but also to sell on the black market.

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Speaker 1: This leads directly to the creation of the Vulture and

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Speaker 1: other things. And then we go to Miss Marvel, where

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Speaker 1: the Department of Damage Control UH is more of an

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Speaker 1: overt villain, tracking Kamalakon as a superhuman threat, et cetera.

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Speaker 1: This is again going to be directly UH I think

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Speaker 1: relevant to the X Men, and of course absolutely Kamala

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Speaker 1: is a mutant, so they are already tracking mutants. In

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Speaker 1: She Hulk, we learn that they have detention facilities for

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Speaker 1: enhanced individuals. They have the legal authority to imprison superhumans.

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Speaker 1: They arrest Shee Hulk, they take her blood. You know,

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Speaker 1: they're part of the government basically, and part of the

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Speaker 1: government's wing of superhuman basically control.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, and Ian made a great I to Wonderman. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: and Ian made a great point like they basically have

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Speaker 2: to fill the super prisons because they've built them, and

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Speaker 2: that is like such a good commentary I feel, I

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Speaker 2: have to say. So, I'm in a I was in

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Speaker 2: the discord this morning, lots of people were watching it

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Speaker 2: and there was a question in there from Muff nineteen

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Speaker 2: seventy six that is in this space And I have

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Speaker 2: actually changed my mind on this with wonder Man, because

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Speaker 2: as everyone knows, I was a big damage control fan.

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Speaker 2: I Leftdway mcduffee, so I didn't love this kind of

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Speaker 2: military government version of them, but I think it works,

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Speaker 2: especially in the state of the world that way. And now,

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Speaker 2: so this is what Muff said, And I'll ask you, Jason,

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Speaker 2: what do you think of the role of damage control

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Speaker 2: in the MCU, Like do you enjoy that take and

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Speaker 2: do you feel like Agent Cleary is kind of a

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Speaker 2: new anti Nick Fury, Well, how do you read how

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Speaker 2: they've kind of reimagined them and why that's gonna lie? Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I do like it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's not quite enough for us to really

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Speaker 1: understand the true nefariousness of it. We've seen the inside

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Speaker 1: of the prison a little bit. We've obviously seen Cleary

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Speaker 1: running around tracking people, but it's not a lot of

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Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, like the it's very like Cloak and Dagger,

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Speaker 1: like it's about tracking people and seeing do they have

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Speaker 1: powers or they're hiding them. That's very nefarious, but there's

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Speaker 1: not been a lot of like open confrontation, say what's

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Speaker 1: the aim and why are they doing it? If the

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Speaker 1: reason is to make sure that superpowered people don't like

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Speaker 1: destroy property, break the law, et cetera, you know, and

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Speaker 1: to and basically as a law enforcement arm, like you know,

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Speaker 1: where do you put a criminal with superpowers? You're going

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Speaker 1: to have to put them in a much more stranger jail. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I'm eager to see how this, if indeed it does

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Speaker 1: evolve into like a Sentinel type program. I'm here to

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Speaker 1: see how that happens and why, because right now, philosophically,

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Speaker 1: it just seems to be you know, it's all about prisons,

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Speaker 1: it's all about it's all about where do we store

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Speaker 1: superhuman people who are who have committed crimes? So how

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Speaker 1: does that then change to we're going out and hunting

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Speaker 1: and persecuting people who have powers that have committed no crime.

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Speaker 1: That is switch that I'm waiting to see me too.

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Speaker 2: So Ian made a great point that Cleary is not

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Speaker 2: necessarily like at the top of the totem pole, like

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Speaker 2: he's not filling the raft or whatever, like this is

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Speaker 2: a small prison he needs to fill. He's going off

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Speaker 2: the low level. Subero's Like Simon, I am really interested

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Speaker 2: to see who our Machiavelli and kind of mind behind

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Speaker 2: damage Control is because it could definitely be a kind

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Speaker 2: of you know, industry plant type situation where somebody in

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Speaker 2: the government who hates mutants, who hates superpower people, is

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Speaker 2: trying to stoke fear and division. Would be interesting to

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Speaker 2: maybe see if they're even a mutant themselves and they

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Speaker 2: want to get humans to you know, attack mutants and

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Speaker 2: then have mutants up rise up. You know, that sounds

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Speaker 2: like something Magneto would do. But yeah, I'm very interested

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Speaker 2: to see if who the real person behind damage control

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Speaker 2: is I also would love a real damage control just

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Speaker 2: a bunch of cool people who go around and clean

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Speaker 2: up after the thing. So maybe we'd get in the future,

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Speaker 2: maybe that's a reform damage control, But I think for

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Speaker 2: now we're gonna find out that somebody be scary and big,

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Speaker 2: has a big agenda for them, and we're just seeing

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Speaker 2: the foot soldiers right now. That's my feeling.

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Speaker 1: I want to see. You know, we haven't really picked

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Speaker 1: up the thread of sword that was there.

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Speaker 2: After the real.

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Speaker 1: WandaVision stuff, and Sword, if you recall, was the government

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Speaker 1: agency that was tasked with controlling and studying sentient technology,

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Speaker 1: so like vision and I could and so I guess

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Speaker 1: I'm wondering if there's a world in which damage control

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Speaker 1: and Sword kind of like get merged together in a

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Speaker 1: in a like MCU Department of Homeland Security against super.

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Speaker 2: Visually see that oh.

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Speaker 1: And that like vision technology, sentient technology then gets turned

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Speaker 1: into like sentinel technology that's then used combined with jamage

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Speaker 1: controls kind of like uh intel that they've gleaned from

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Speaker 1: tracking Howard people, Yeah, surveillance, and they turned that into

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Speaker 1: a kind of sentinel Dude, I think that I wonder

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Speaker 1: if you called it like because.

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Speaker 2: Honestly, we saw in Wondervision when Monica was looking around,

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Speaker 2: we saw those giant robots like we all had those

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Speaker 2: conversations are sword building sentinels while these become sentinels. I

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Speaker 2: love that, Jason. I want to ask you a big

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Speaker 2: question that this show leaves me with less to do

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Speaker 2: with what it sets up or doesn't set up, because

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Speaker 2: I think it's a fantastic show, and we can talk

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Speaker 2: a little bit more about that in this conversation. But Jason,

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Speaker 2: as somebody who follows this stuff, we talk about it

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Speaker 2: for our job. We write stories with both written comics.

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Speaker 2: You've written comics at Marvel. What does a Marvel spotlight

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Speaker 2: mean in the MCU. I think we still trying to

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Speaker 2: work out.

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Speaker 1: So yes, So wonder Man is a Marvel spotlight, as

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Speaker 1: was Echo, as was was wherewolf by Night technically a

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Speaker 1: Marvel spotlight, wherewolf by Night was a special presentation, was

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Speaker 1: not technically a Marvel spotlight. So it's Echo and now

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Speaker 1: wonder Man, Now Marvel spotlight seems to me to be

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Speaker 1: here is the my realistic read. My realistic read is

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Speaker 1: Marvel's spotlight is a term lifted from the Comics, an

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Speaker 1: anthology comic series within Marvel that again highlighted a particular

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Speaker 1: hero or group of heroes for one story that would

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Speaker 1: not then continue. I think that the Spotlight brand is

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Speaker 1: basically a reverse engineered way for Marvel to like clear

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Speaker 1: the decks of the stuff that they had in production

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Speaker 1: that started rolling down the track before Marvel decided, oh,

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Speaker 1: we made too much stuff and we got to cut it.

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Speaker 1: So I think it's a way for them. It's basically

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Speaker 1: like a you know, like a like a clearing house

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Speaker 1: of stuff, and if any of it sticks, maybe it'll

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Speaker 1: become an ongoing series.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it does.

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Speaker 1: It's a way for them. It's a way for them

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Speaker 1: to get off of stuff and to put it out

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Speaker 1: without being married to it being an ongoing series.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. It's basically a mini series. Yeah. I

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Speaker 2: love that. Yeah, that's the perfect read. Also, I would

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Speaker 2: say as well, it is interesting because I do think,

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Speaker 2: like quality wise, the final thing that we got with

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Speaker 2: wonder Man is obviously a much higher quality, much more streamlined,

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Speaker 2: much less chopped up in the edit than what we

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Speaker 2: got with Echo. But I do think that this is

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Speaker 2: the right thing Marvel, which should be doing with the TV.

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Speaker 2: The movies need to look like the movies everybody loves them.

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Speaker 2: We got our great phase one of Disney plus Originals

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Speaker 2: where we did get those deeper conne actions. But let's

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Speaker 2: tell these weird stories. Like when I was growing up,

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Speaker 2: there was a fan comic that was online called like

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Speaker 2: Life as a Hufflepuff or Life as a Background Hufflepuff

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Speaker 2: or something, and me and my friend were obsessed with

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Speaker 2: it because the whole funny story was just like, what

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Speaker 2: would it be like to be somebody in the background

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Speaker 2: of a somebody else's story? Right? And I think that

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Speaker 2: is what wonder Man Echo this incredible, you know, Night

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Speaker 2: of the Seven Kingdoms, Like it's giving us these different views,

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Speaker 2: and I think that it's giving us something we can't

431
00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:32,640
Speaker 2: get in the cinema, especially with wond Amount. Well even

432
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:36,359
Speaker 2: with Echo, you don't get an indigenous, female, disabled, death

433
00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:39,520
Speaker 2: led action movie in the cinema as much as we should.

434
00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,560
Speaker 2: So I think, like these movies are these spaces can

435
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:46,639
Speaker 2: tell really interesting stories. I just want Marvel to trust

436
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,880
Speaker 2: the creators as much as they trust trusted Death's them

437
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,640
Speaker 2: with this, because you can feel this is like a

438
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:56,000
Speaker 2: full artist's vision, like the show does not feel like

439
00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 2: it was compromised or confused, though they did hold it

440
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,760
Speaker 2: for a long time, So I do think that that

441
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 2: hints maybe Mavel wasn't as sure of it as they

442
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:05,320
Speaker 2: are now.

443
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 1: Well, I think that the trust is it trust or

444
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 1: is it just that they loosened the restrictions in terms

445
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:22,720
Speaker 1: of how many connections there needed to be. They could

446
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 1: be the strength to me, the strength of wonder Man

447
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:29,200
Speaker 1: is like, they don't need all this load bearing stuff

448
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,160
Speaker 1: to be like, Okay, now we gotta lead. This has

449
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:32,919
Speaker 1: to lead to Doomsday, and this has to lead to

450
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:34,920
Speaker 1: the X Men, and this part needs to connect here,

451
00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 1: and we need to make sure that when Wonderman shows

452
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:39,240
Speaker 1: up on this that people are like, oh my god,

453
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,239
Speaker 1: what's Wonderman. They don't need it, doesn't They don't need

454
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,560
Speaker 1: to do that. Like, it's really nice to have Slattery

455
00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:48,480
Speaker 1: come in, but he's always been a tangential character one

456
00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:52,760
Speaker 1: that they've done like a wonderful honestly, Like, I I

457
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:58,080
Speaker 1: liked the twist that Slattery was not the Mandarin, but

458
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 1: I love everything they've done with this since sing Into like.

459
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:05,880
Speaker 2: Has been so much more interesting ever since shang Chi. Well, okay,

460
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:08,080
Speaker 2: so something I learned, and I guess why Destin is

461
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 2: in charge of this is that actually this was originally

462
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 2: just going to be a Trevor Slattery show and it

463
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:16,520
Speaker 2: was going to be so low that they did after

464
00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 2: shang Chi and it evolved, And I love that because

465
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 2: I think that Trevor is essentially one of the MCU's

466
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:27,080
Speaker 2: best side men, Like he's such a good person to

467
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 2: uplift another character to be the silly guy opposite them.

468
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:35,160
Speaker 2: And I think actually that that relationship here, what they've

469
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 2: done that they often don't do, and that people have

470
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 2: often criticized them for with cameos or easter eggs. They

471
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,640
Speaker 2: don't feel like they're going to lead anywhere or whatever. Here,

472
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 2: you don't actually mind because what they build in is

473
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 2: a relationship so important to both of these characters that

474
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 2: you just really believe in it and you want them

475
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 2: to be friends and I and you don't really. Yeah,

476
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:57,240
Speaker 2: it's great that it's Trevor Slattery from Shang Chi, But

477
00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:00,680
Speaker 2: we are seeing so many people in the discord online saying, hey,

478
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:02,720
Speaker 2: I watched this with my kid who's never watched a Marvel,

479
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:04,159
Speaker 2: or Hey, me and my mum watched this, and we

480
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 2: just thought it was so fun. This is accessible at

481
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:10,959
Speaker 2: a level where it previously hasn't been. Also helps and

482
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:13,040
Speaker 2: we can do a little mini Rosie explains here, which

483
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,960
Speaker 2: I know Jason Olays loves to do, but also helps.

484
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 2: The something they did that's so interesting in meta is

485
00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 2: for the most part, when Ben Kingsley in this show

486
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,359
Speaker 2: says Trevor Slattery has a previous role, it is a

487
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:30,200
Speaker 2: real Ben Kingsley role. So when they mentioned the plays

488
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:32,200
Speaker 2: he's been in, the guys who directed him in Leah,

489
00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 2: that shit is real. But Rosie explains, England, the big

490
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 2: laugh here that you get if you're English is a

491
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 2: reference to the fact that Ben Kingsley or in this

492
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:43,200
Speaker 2: case Trevor Slattery once played a character I believe called

493
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 2: Roy Jenkins on Coronation Street. Coronation Street is our northern

494
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:50,760
Speaker 2: daily soap. It plays a primetime in the evenings set

495
00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:52,920
Speaker 2: kind of near a fictionalized talent that we've been in

496
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 2: Manchester and it is like ultimate working class soap opera majesty.

497
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 2: I watch it every year I get a britboxer out

498
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 2: at Christmas because there's always like a serial killer or

499
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 2: a mass murder or this year there was a car

500
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:08,800
Speaker 2: crash crossover that also included a girl who'd been kidnapped

501
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:11,200
Speaker 2: and a guy who murdered someone. So you really get

502
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,320
Speaker 2: these crazy, big, bombastic bits. But I think that not

503
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 2: only are they getting to pay homage to the MCU,

504
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:20,760
Speaker 2: to these comic book stories, to cinema. Of course, it's

505
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:22,320
Speaker 2: a movie about it's a show about how much we

506
00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 2: love movies, but also they're building in British history, British

507
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:30,040
Speaker 2: televisual history. They're doing what they did with Wonder Vision,

508
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 2: but they're expanding it out to the weirdest stuff, to

509
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,760
Speaker 2: the character actors. Look Joey Pants, he's no, he's not

510
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 2: a nobody, right, we love Joey Pants. He's an icon,

511
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 2: but to some younger kids he might not necessarily be

512
00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:44,720
Speaker 2: some big name get. Instead, they've gone for a character actor,

513
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 2: someone who will commit to this really complicated role, but

514
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:49,480
Speaker 2: who also then a kid can look up and go,

515
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:51,880
Speaker 2: oh my god. They're in so many like he's in Bound,

516
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 2: He's in the Matrix. We get that great moment where yeah, yes, well,

517
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,640
Speaker 2: Simon says to him, you know, I always every time

518
00:29:57,680 --> 00:29:59,760
Speaker 2: I eat a steak, I think about you and the Matrix.

519
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:03,960
Speaker 2: So there's just so much kind of depth to these

520
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 2: characters that I think that it almost transcends the usual

521
00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:11,680
Speaker 2: questions of how does it set stuff up? And hilariously

522
00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:13,760
Speaker 2: we've answered them it does set stuff up. They do

523
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,680
Speaker 2: a great job seating it. But so far, I'm just

524
00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 2: happy to follow these guys on their adventure, and I

525
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:23,040
Speaker 2: really hope that they don't broaden the scope too much

526
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,479
Speaker 2: because I think that the personal stakes here, they do

527
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 2: such a good job at them that they feel high

528
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:31,440
Speaker 2: enough that I just really care. Like the Percoima family

529
00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 2: episode was like heart wrenching, the first episode where he

530
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:40,040
Speaker 2: gets fired from American Horror Story. I was struggling to

531
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 2: rewatch it because it's so well done and it's so

532
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 2: painful to watch. Also, another important note, guys, Twilight exists

533
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:51,800
Speaker 2: in the MCU confirmed Cannon same cast Simon Williams a

534
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 2: Twilight fan, important for me personally, Jason. Any other kind

535
00:30:55,640 --> 00:30:58,040
Speaker 2: of big takeaways as you look towards the second half

536
00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 2: of the season, which we'll be covering later this week. Well, one,

537
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 2: I wonder.

538
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 1: If so Doorman is in a damage control prison, right

539
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:11,920
Speaker 1: that's my guest, or kidnapping or I don't even know

540
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 1: what the charge is.

541
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 2: They said, I wonder if they've been like experimenting on

542
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 2: him as well, because they said they've like they've searched

543
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 2: every inch of him or something. I do also think

544
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:26,520
Speaker 2: there's some very interesting implications here about like the disposability

545
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:28,920
Speaker 2: of like a black actor and cinema after he's been

546
00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 2: brought up as this kind of mascot to a white actor.

547
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 2: They doing some really interesting stuff. But yeah, he's either dead,

548
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 2: been experimented on, or in a damage control prison.

549
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 1: Would be interesting.

550
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 2: Simon and Trevor are both doing a number of sus

551
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 2: things that are illegal in this show, so I wouldn't

552
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 2: be surprised if we ended up in a damage control prison.

553
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 1: I hope he's okay, and me too. My I feel

554
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:57,760
Speaker 1: like we're gonna Joshka is gonna like they're gonna get

555
00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 1: him back, right, He's probably still alive. We don't know

556
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 1: how it works, but it's side of Doorman, and I

557
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: think there's a chance that Josh we might josh ged

558
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: might pop out of door.

559
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,480
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe you'll get puked up or something. I mean

560
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 2: also would be in This is just my head canon,

561
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 2: but maybe like Doorman and Josh Gadd planned all of

562
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 2: this and now they're just like living happily ever after.

563
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 2: Off the radar.

564
00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm I'm really excited to watch the back half

565
00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 1: of the show.

566
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,400
Speaker 2: We got we got Joey Pants, we got Ashley Green

567
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:38,680
Speaker 2: from Twilight, we got obviously Josh gadd and that crazy cameo.

568
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:42,040
Speaker 2: Any other big actors you would like to see.

569
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 1: I don't even know who the show.

570
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 2: I know, it's so weird, definitely in that Disney space,

571
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 2: I know, I don't think so it's hard to even

572
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 2: think about it. I mean, I mean, I'd love to

573
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 2: see them bring in like Regina King or something, because

574
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 2: you know, because Watchman or something like that. But I

575
00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:58,040
Speaker 2: don't know that's it. She's a she's a big get.

576
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:01,720
Speaker 2: I just think that this show has so many interesting

577
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,600
Speaker 2: things to say, and it's really funny to watch it

578
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:08,240
Speaker 2: coming out post the studio, knowing that this was more

579
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 2: of an armaged and deep impact kind of zeitgeist thing

580
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:13,440
Speaker 2: than a Disney trying to replicate it. But I'm sure

581
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 2: that people will see it as being derivative though so far,

582
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 2: I've just seen people happy that there's another great TV

583
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:20,760
Speaker 2: show out, So that's a nice feeling to have. And

584
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 2: I think people because it was dropped, as happened with

585
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:26,560
Speaker 2: Echo kind of all in one go. And then obviously

586
00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 2: we know with Ironheart that was also a show where

587
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 2: the show ended up being dropped in kind of a

588
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:35,960
Speaker 2: weird phase. And yeah, so this is really nice to

589
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 2: have a BINS drop that at first did seem like

590
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:39,680
Speaker 2: they were trying to bury it. But I think the

591
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 2: word of mouth, the love from people like Alan Sepamore,

592
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:45,160
Speaker 2: who we've had on the show, from other critics has

593
00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:50,160
Speaker 2: just been another great gateway to people getting excited to

594
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 2: check it out, even if it wasn't necessarily on their radar.

595
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 1: On the next episode of Extra Vision, we're diving into

596
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:58,840
Speaker 1: the biggest news of the week. That's it for this episode.

597
00:33:58,840 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 1: Thanks all listening by.

598
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:03,400
Speaker 2: X Ray.

599
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 1: Vision is hosted by Jason Concepcion and Rosie Knight and

600
00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:08,040
Speaker 1: is a production of iHeart Podcasts.

601
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,840
Speaker 2: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Kaufman.

602
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: Our supervising producer is Abu Zafar.

603
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:18,439
Speaker 2: Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan, and Bay Wag.

604
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,359
Speaker 1: A theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme

605
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 1: songs by Aaron Kaufman.

606
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:26,239
Speaker 2: Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman, and

607
00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 2: Heidi our Discord moderator,