WEBVTT - Weirdhouse Cinema Rewind: The Wicker Man (1973) - Part 1 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:09.080 Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. Rewind, This is Rob Lamb. 0:00:09.200 --> 0:00:12.880 We have some episodes here for you. Let's see. Today 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:16.599 is going to be The wicker Man nineteen seventy three, 0:00:16.920 --> 0:00:18.840 a part one of two. We had a lot to 0:00:18.880 --> 0:00:20.600 say about this one, so we broke it up into 0:00:20.640 --> 0:00:24.280 two pieces. This piece originally published five to twenty twenty five. 0:00:25.079 --> 0:00:28.280 This is a vacation week, a week when we are 0:00:28.400 --> 0:00:32.959 airing reruns every day in an attempt to catch up 0:00:33.360 --> 0:00:36.040 and stay current and all. So this is a prime 0:00:36.080 --> 0:00:38.400 week for a Weird House Cinema two partner because in 0:00:38.440 --> 0:00:41.200 the Friday slot this week we will air The wicker 0:00:41.280 --> 0:00:44.880 Man nineteen seventy three, Part two. So anyway, I hope 0:00:44.920 --> 0:00:47.239 you enjoy this one and you'll get the other one 0:00:47.240 --> 0:00:48.320 again at the end of the week. 0:00:51.120 --> 0:00:57.400 Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio. 0:01:01.600 --> 0:01:05.520 Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. This is Rob Lamb and. 0:01:05.640 --> 0:01:09.520 This is Joe McCormick. And today, as we are recording this, 0:01:09.760 --> 0:01:12.800 it is May first, the sacred festival of May Day, 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:15.800 and so we are going to be talking in accordance 0:01:15.840 --> 0:01:20.440 with the season about the classic nineteen seventy three British film, 0:01:20.720 --> 0:01:24.800 The wicker Man, which is usually usually grouped under a 0:01:24.920 --> 0:01:28.280 genre people call full corror. Maybe we can quibble in 0:01:28.280 --> 0:01:30.800 this episode about whether that title should or should not 0:01:30.880 --> 0:01:35.080 be applied. And also note though we rarely do this 0:01:35.200 --> 0:01:38.000 on Weird House Cinema, usually we keep it one movie 0:01:38.000 --> 0:01:40.760 per episode. This is one we think we're going to 0:01:40.840 --> 0:01:43.440 have to split into two parts because we love the 0:01:43.440 --> 0:01:45.480 Wickerman and we're going to have a lot to say 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:48.440 about it. The only two other movies we've ever done 0:01:48.480 --> 0:01:52.360 this with before were David Lynch's Doune and Highlander two 0:01:52.400 --> 0:01:55.640 The Quickening, So putting the Wickerman in there, there is 0:01:55.720 --> 0:01:57.080 cohesion to this trinity. 0:01:57.440 --> 0:01:59.640 Yes, these are three films that are often associated with 0:01:59.680 --> 0:02:04.200 each other, but I do agree like there's a lot 0:02:04.200 --> 0:02:07.960 to say about the Wickerman. We're probably going to go 0:02:08.040 --> 0:02:10.280 on and on a bit in a good way, so 0:02:10.760 --> 0:02:12.320 it's very possible we'll split here. 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:14.960 So I'm very excited because The Wickerman is one of 0:02:14.960 --> 0:02:18.639 my personal favorite movies. In fact, it's a mutual favorite 0:02:18.639 --> 0:02:21.000 in our house. It's also one of my wife Rachel's 0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:23.000 all time favorite movies. So we've got a lot of 0:02:23.040 --> 0:02:24.960 like Wickerman merch in our house. I don't know if 0:02:25.000 --> 0:02:27.799 you've seen any of that stuff, Rob, but we've got 0:02:27.800 --> 0:02:29.480 like a Wickerman night light, and. 0:02:29.880 --> 0:02:31.799 Oh man, I don't think I remember seeing any of this. 0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:32.880 All right, it's great. 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:35.800 Well it lights up behind the Wicker glows. You know, 0:02:35.840 --> 0:02:39.200 there's kind of an orange glow behind a Wickerman silhouette. 0:02:39.360 --> 0:02:39.720 I guess. 0:02:39.720 --> 0:02:42.520 Actually, before we go on to any further detail, there 0:02:42.600 --> 0:02:46.440 is something I definitely want to say. So in every 0:02:46.480 --> 0:02:49.519 Weird House Cinema episode we end up discussing the plot 0:02:49.600 --> 0:02:52.640 of the movie that we're covering in some detail. So 0:02:52.760 --> 0:02:55.480 it's always the case that you should watch the movie 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:58.160 first if you don't want to have anything spoiled. But 0:02:59.200 --> 0:03:03.320 if you've never seen The Wickerman from nineteen seventy three, 0:03:03.520 --> 0:03:07.360 this in particular is really a film I would recommend 0:03:07.440 --> 0:03:11.840 going into knowing as little as possible. Obviously, it gets 0:03:11.960 --> 0:03:15.440 into some horror territory, so if you're sensitive to horror themes, 0:03:15.480 --> 0:03:18.040 you can look things up ahead of time. But otherwise, 0:03:18.120 --> 0:03:20.320 if you have a general appetite for horror, I would 0:03:20.400 --> 0:03:24.120 strongly strongly encourage you to not even glance at a 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:26.000 plot summary, not listen. 0:03:25.760 --> 0:03:28.480 To any more of this episode, just go ahead and watch. 0:03:28.360 --> 0:03:30.760 It, but then come back and listen to this. Yes. 0:03:30.960 --> 0:03:34.680 Yes, So the first time I saw it, a friend 0:03:34.680 --> 0:03:36.560 of mine when I was in college showed it to 0:03:36.600 --> 0:03:39.160 me without telling me telling me anything ahead of time. 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:42.480 I'm just really grateful I got to experience it that way. 0:03:42.480 --> 0:03:47.280 The Wickerman is such an unusual and surprising film. It 0:03:47.360 --> 0:03:52.240 is full of unexpected humor and horror and delight and despair, 0:03:52.840 --> 0:03:55.840 and even now, like fifty years later, in a world 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:59.120 where a lot of movies you may have already seen 0:03:59.280 --> 0:04:02.760 have been inla fluenced by The Wickerman. If you haven't 0:04:02.760 --> 0:04:04.920 seen it before and you don't know everything ahead of time, 0:04:05.000 --> 0:04:08.000 I think it will keep you very intrigued and puzzled 0:04:08.040 --> 0:04:09.360 in the best possible way. 0:04:10.760 --> 0:04:13.800 Yeah. Absolutely, It's a film that really stands on its own, 0:04:14.720 --> 0:04:18.040 even though it is part of the folk car subgenre 0:04:18.160 --> 0:04:21.680 and is very influential over the full car subgenre. I 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:23.800 think that the big three that are often referred to 0:04:23.800 --> 0:04:27.640 are sixty eighth, witch Finder, General, seventy one's Blood on 0:04:27.680 --> 0:04:29.640 Satan's Claw, and then of course seventy three is The 0:04:29.640 --> 0:04:32.800 wicker Man. But at the same time, nothing else is 0:04:32.839 --> 0:04:36.000 really like The wicker Man, even other movies that have 0:04:36.160 --> 0:04:40.120 the name The wicker Man. There are remakes of the 0:04:40.120 --> 0:04:43.280 movie we're talking about here today are nothing like it. 0:04:43.640 --> 0:04:45.680 We might have to get into the remake in part 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:49.279 two here. I think there really just is no other 0:04:49.440 --> 0:04:53.040 movie like it. It is its own genre and perhaps 0:04:53.080 --> 0:04:56.840 still the only movie in that genre. But anyway, if 0:04:56.880 --> 0:04:59.040 you haven't seen The Wickerman yet and you want to 0:04:59.080 --> 0:05:02.200 pause here and go watch it so you can, you 0:05:02.240 --> 0:05:04.200 can see it unspoiled, and then come back, we will 0:05:04.240 --> 0:05:22.400 give you a little music break. 0:05:22.960 --> 0:05:23.120 You know. 0:05:23.200 --> 0:05:25.000 Looking back, I think I saw The wicker Man for 0:05:25.000 --> 0:05:26.919 the first time, probably like on I think it was 0:05:26.960 --> 0:05:29.400 A and E. So I saw it on cable. Didn't 0:05:29.400 --> 0:05:32.360 know what I was getting into, but it instantly loved it, 0:05:32.760 --> 0:05:34.960 and at some point decided, well, I need to own 0:05:35.000 --> 0:05:38.800 this forever. I'm going to buy a special edition VHS 0:05:39.279 --> 0:05:42.640 of The wicker Man in a big clamshell case. Yes, 0:05:42.680 --> 0:05:46.760 and I did, and of course it was replaced by DVDs. 0:05:46.960 --> 0:05:49.200 Just you know a few years later, did you have 0:05:49.240 --> 0:05:50.520 the version with the wooden box. 0:05:50.920 --> 0:05:53.719 I did not, but I do remember seeing that at 0:05:53.720 --> 0:05:56.320 the movie store at the mall. They had all these 0:05:56.320 --> 0:05:58.800 special editions that one I'm not sure if that was 0:05:58.800 --> 0:06:01.680 an Anchor Bay release, but this was a time period 0:06:01.760 --> 0:06:06.520 during which Anchor Bay was like the source for cool 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:11.000 you know, DVDVHS editions of whatever your favorite genre films 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:11.479 happened to be. 0:06:11.720 --> 0:06:13.360 I have to mention again I've said this on the 0:06:13.400 --> 0:06:15.960 show before, that someday we should come back and do 0:06:16.040 --> 0:06:18.719 a series on weird house cinema. That's just movies that 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:22.200 had gimmick packaging, so like the release of The Wickerman 0:06:22.320 --> 0:06:24.080 and the Wooden Box that I'm sure a lot of 0:06:24.120 --> 0:06:26.560 people now just used to store whatever and. 0:06:28.600 --> 0:06:29.760 Who knows what they put in there. 0:06:30.720 --> 0:06:34.400 Yeah, but also like the Dead Pit with the light 0:06:34.480 --> 0:06:36.279 up eyes, and I'm sure we could get a whole 0:06:36.320 --> 0:06:39.640 list of them. Gimmick packaging on VHS tapes is just 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:42.839 such a beautiful, beautiful thing. Like almost nothing gives me 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:46.000 more weird, gleeful nostalgia. 0:06:46.120 --> 0:06:47.840 I know a collector or two we could reach out 0:06:47.880 --> 0:06:50.200 to for them. But yeah, The Wickerman just such a 0:06:50.240 --> 0:06:53.839 great weird film, one that succeeds in creating not merely 0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:58.520 an uncanny horror movie, but a thought provoking cinematic enigma. 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:01.160 So not to say you can't appreciate it purely as 0:07:01.160 --> 0:07:04.719 a horror film purely as this you know, roller coaster 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:07.920 ride and experience. But there's just a lot of rich 0:07:08.000 --> 0:07:10.440 texture to the film that leaves you to make your 0:07:10.440 --> 0:07:13.760 own interpretations. Like some of the big ones are of course, 0:07:14.480 --> 0:07:17.280 regard like what is the film saying or not saying 0:07:17.320 --> 0:07:21.520 about pagan religious beliefs, about modern Christian faith, about human 0:07:21.560 --> 0:07:22.560 religion in general. 0:07:23.160 --> 0:07:26.600 Yeah, one of my favorite things about it is that 0:07:27.360 --> 0:07:30.240 the movie is saying a lot in a way, but 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:33.760 it's not really reducible to a message. Maybe I would 0:07:33.760 --> 0:07:37.000 say it's not actually saying, it is singing, Like the 0:07:37.040 --> 0:07:40.560 story is just overflowing with meaning and has the kind 0:07:40.600 --> 0:07:44.800 of feeling of a commentary, but it is not really 0:07:44.840 --> 0:07:48.240 reducible to a message or a thesis. There's no point 0:07:48.840 --> 0:07:52.480 the movie really makes without also sort of making the 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:57.440 opposite point. Also, obviously, the subject matter means that the 0:07:57.480 --> 0:08:02.680 story is entangled with the of religion, with religion, ritual 0:08:02.840 --> 0:08:06.600 and faith, which are three different things, but also power 0:08:06.760 --> 0:08:09.920 and violence and the law. Some people talk about this 0:08:09.960 --> 0:08:13.400 movie like they think the point of it is Christianity 0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:17.000 is bad and Paganism was better. I've seen people talk 0:08:17.000 --> 0:08:18.760 about it like they think it kind of means that. 0:08:19.200 --> 0:08:22.520 I feel like it would be hard to really say 0:08:22.560 --> 0:08:26.680 that's the point of the movie if you think about it. Yeah, 0:08:26.880 --> 0:08:28.840 at the same time, it is certainly not saying the 0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:32.080 opposite either. This movie is not Christian apologetics, and it 0:08:32.200 --> 0:08:35.720 was considered extremely offensive by many Christians when it came out. 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:39.200 And so instead the religious themes are more it's just 0:08:39.240 --> 0:08:42.400 sort of a gardening project of religious themes. Just themes 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:45.079 are sort of growing, and we're seeing how they grow 0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:50.000 and interact. It's like throwing Christianity and Celtic Paganism into 0:08:50.080 --> 0:08:53.680 a weird little flower bed together and seeing what pops 0:08:53.760 --> 0:08:55.520 up and how they twist around each other. 0:08:56.080 --> 0:08:58.800 Yeah. Yeah, that's a good point, because I think it's 0:08:58.880 --> 0:09:02.040 easy to reduce the film, you know, sort of boil 0:09:02.080 --> 0:09:04.000 it down to okay, here we have just a it's 0:09:04.000 --> 0:09:07.679 a foll car tale. It's uh, you know, exploitation, your 0:09:07.720 --> 0:09:11.479 standard story about someone from the city or from civilization, 0:09:11.920 --> 0:09:14.760 like going into a rural or more rural part of 0:09:14.800 --> 0:09:18.400 their own country and invoking and encountering like, you know, 0:09:18.480 --> 0:09:19.559 scary locals there. 0:09:19.960 --> 0:09:20.040 Uh. 0:09:20.160 --> 0:09:23.080 You know, you see this a lot uh in fiction 0:09:23.559 --> 0:09:26.400 in general, but also in speculative fiction and weird fiction 0:09:26.520 --> 0:09:30.600 and horror. There's certainly an element of that here, not 0:09:30.640 --> 0:09:33.320 to say that it doesn't, you know, dip its toes 0:09:33.360 --> 0:09:36.760 and wade into those waters. But like you said, it 0:09:37.240 --> 0:09:40.400 presents ideas on both sides. Like there's there's certainly plenty 0:09:40.440 --> 0:09:44.320 to admire in the idealistic, close to nature, sex positive 0:09:44.360 --> 0:09:47.400 society of summer Isle, but we also come to see 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:51.120 the dangers of their ideology. Likewise, our protagonist comes from 0:09:51.160 --> 0:09:54.280 a world of science and reason, and and we you know, 0:09:54.320 --> 0:09:57.360 we we like science and reason, and then obviously that 0:09:57.400 --> 0:10:02.079 seems to be a value that celebrated within the context 0:10:02.080 --> 0:10:04.720 of the film as well. But we also seated his 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:07.200 world as one of, at least in his own experience, 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:11.520 one of sexual repression and deep seated unhappiness. And at 0:10:11.520 --> 0:10:14.439 the same time, these two worlds are linked in very 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:17.320 fundamental ways, and the film does a great job of, 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:22.200 sometimes very subtly, sometimes more overtly, stitching those connections out. 0:10:22.360 --> 0:10:22.880 Why should we. 0:10:22.880 --> 0:10:25.079 Pause really quickly and just say, like what a one 0:10:25.160 --> 0:10:28.920 sentence plot summary is. Yeah, It's like, there is a 0:10:28.960 --> 0:10:33.360 remote Scottish island called summer Isle, and a West Highland 0:10:33.360 --> 0:10:37.079 Police officer, a police detective named Sergeant Howie, has been 0:10:37.200 --> 0:10:42.240 summoned to the island via an anonymous letter saying that 0:10:42.320 --> 0:10:45.880 a girl on the island named Rowan Morrison has gone missing. 0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:49.600 So Sergeant Howie, he is, by the way, a devoutly 0:10:49.720 --> 0:10:53.679 religious Christian police inspector. He goes to the island by 0:10:53.720 --> 0:10:57.080 seaplane to look for the missing girl and to find 0:10:57.080 --> 0:10:58.920 out more about the note he received. 0:10:59.000 --> 0:10:59.960 So that's the setup. 0:11:00.679 --> 0:11:02.640 And then one of the main things we can say 0:11:02.679 --> 0:11:06.080 about the plot branching out from there is that Sergeant 0:11:06.120 --> 0:11:10.000 how he discovers the inhabitants of this remote Scottish island 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:13.680 are not Christians, there in fact practicing what seems to 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:18.959 be a variant of Celtic paganism, celebrating the old gods, 0:11:19.000 --> 0:11:22.360 the joyous old gods, and some of the modes of 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:26.120 their celebration are quite distressing to him, the basics at least. 0:11:26.440 --> 0:11:28.240 Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a good setup here. 0:11:28.679 --> 0:11:30.920 Another thing I want to mention about the Wickerman that 0:11:31.240 --> 0:11:34.400 I'd love and find really unique about the movie is 0:11:34.520 --> 0:11:38.840 the ambiguity of the main characters. So the protagonist of 0:11:38.880 --> 0:11:44.520 the film, the detective protagonist, Sergeant Howie, is simultaneously so 0:11:44.760 --> 0:11:49.120 sympathetic and so hateable. His mission is a good one. 0:11:49.240 --> 0:11:52.920 He is trying to investigate the case of a missing girl, 0:11:53.200 --> 0:11:57.360 and we see his dedication to his mission in a 0:11:57.360 --> 0:11:59.800 way that like, you know, obviously, if a child goes 0:11:59.840 --> 0:12:01.920 me saying, it is very good to want to solve 0:12:01.960 --> 0:12:04.439 that problem and look out for the welfare of the child, 0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:08.360 which we see he is genuinely invested in. We also 0:12:08.400 --> 0:12:11.960 see the setting of summerle from his perspective and are 0:12:12.480 --> 0:12:17.000 thus frustrated with the kind of squirreliness and untrustworthiness of 0:12:17.040 --> 0:12:20.320 the people he encounters while he's trying to solve this mystery. 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:28.080 But also Sergeant Howie's personality and worldview are so off putting. 0:12:28.320 --> 0:12:34.200 He is arrogant, self righteous, puritanical, rude, and over and 0:12:34.240 --> 0:12:38.040 over again his behavior is just so misaligned with how 0:12:38.120 --> 0:12:42.000 it seems he should be conducting the investigation. He gets 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:46.360 sidetracked from this genuinely noble quest in order to screech 0:12:46.400 --> 0:12:49.200 at people about saying the word penis and things like that. 0:12:49.280 --> 0:12:53.000 Yeah yeah, yeah, like the scene where he disrupts the classroom. 0:12:53.320 --> 0:12:54.880 Yeah yeah. 0:12:54.960 --> 0:12:57.319 So this is not a type of protagonist I can 0:12:57.400 --> 0:13:00.040 think of many other examples of and I find it 0:13:00.120 --> 0:13:02.479 such an interesting choice. He's kind of like a combination 0:13:02.640 --> 0:13:07.679 of like Hercule Poirot, but not as but without the 0:13:07.760 --> 0:13:11.480 virtuosity and detective work. I'll come back to that in 0:13:11.480 --> 0:13:14.680 a minute. But then also, I don't know, like one 0:13:14.679 --> 0:13:16.920 of the one of the judges in The Crucible or 0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:22.840 like the Witchfinder General. He's like a totally unsympathetically puritanical prude. 0:13:23.280 --> 0:13:25.760 Yeah, so do we like him, like. 0:13:25.840 --> 0:13:30.080 Not really sometimes not at all, But also we we 0:13:30.400 --> 0:13:33.400 sympathize with what he's doing, and we want him to 0:13:33.440 --> 0:13:35.920 find out what happened to the girl and solve the mystery, 0:13:36.440 --> 0:13:40.040 because we do repeatedly since that something treacherous is afoot 0:13:40.360 --> 0:13:43.360 and that Sergeant Howie might be the only person on 0:13:43.400 --> 0:13:46.120 this island who is actually trying to do what's right. 0:13:46.600 --> 0:13:49.560 Yeah, yeah, and that's that's important to realize and something 0:13:49.600 --> 0:13:52.679 that I think you can sometimes lose track of if 0:13:53.360 --> 0:13:55.200 you haven't seen the film in a long time, or 0:13:55.559 --> 0:13:57.720 rather if you've seen the film and you know the 0:13:57.760 --> 0:14:00.199 general plot, you know what's going to happen and you're 0:14:00.240 --> 0:14:03.320 rewatching it. But yeah, it's important to note like what 0:14:03.440 --> 0:14:06.559 he's not like, He's not a pure punchline like he's 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:08.280 not a he's not a straight man to set up 0:14:08.280 --> 0:14:11.360 a joke. Yeah, and we'll talk more about the tone 0:14:11.360 --> 0:14:13.840 here in a second. He's also not a character that 0:14:13.920 --> 0:14:17.959 deserves punishment like it's. It's you can easily imagine a cheap, 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:20.960 kind of like easy comics Tales from the Crypt version 0:14:21.000 --> 0:14:24.640 of this exact story, where his downfall is directly connected 0:14:24.640 --> 0:14:27.800 to a specific action or choice on his part, or 0:14:27.840 --> 0:14:30.960 a deep seated character flaw or something. And that's not 0:14:31.080 --> 0:14:33.400 really the case either, or at least it's not that 0:14:33.520 --> 0:14:35.960 one thing that fits into the the you know, the 0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:38.440 little box in the in the Tales of the Crypt 0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:41.120 comic book. You know, it's it's broader than that. 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:44.200 It's more complicated, right, I know exactly what you're saying. So, yeah, 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:46.600 he's not like a Tails from the Crypt protagonist. To 0:14:46.800 --> 0:14:51.040 is the classic format of that character is it is 0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:54.160 someone who has done something quite evil, is like flawed 0:14:54.200 --> 0:14:58.440 in a way that that spells their own doom. They're 0:14:58.520 --> 0:15:00.800 going to get a kind of karmic punch, and we 0:15:00.840 --> 0:15:02.600 are satisfied to see them get it. 0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:04.480 Howie is not like that. 0:15:04.600 --> 0:15:10.040 His unlikeability is shallower and more esthetic. Again, it's just 0:15:10.080 --> 0:15:15.160 that he is like a rude, arrogant, aggressive, prudish, self 0:15:15.240 --> 0:15:19.960 righteous jerk. But again I come back to he is 0:15:20.000 --> 0:15:22.680 a character like that, but we're with him because we 0:15:22.800 --> 0:15:26.360 sense something is very wrong on this island and he 0:15:26.480 --> 0:15:30.480 might be the only person who's able to do something 0:15:30.520 --> 0:15:33.520 about it. But then again, is there something wrong on 0:15:33.560 --> 0:15:36.960 this island. Another way the movie really keeps you guessing 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:42.440 is the characterization of the people positioned as Sergeant Howie's antagonists, 0:15:42.600 --> 0:15:46.560 like Lord Summerle played by Christopher Lee in a masterful 0:15:46.640 --> 0:15:49.760 performance we'll talk about more as we go on, or 0:15:49.840 --> 0:15:53.640 Miss Rose played by Diane Cilento by sort of the 0:15:53.680 --> 0:15:57.920 default structure of the mystery narrative. These are the suspects 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:01.920 in the mystery disappearance of Rowen Morison, and they're so 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:08.000 interesting and likable and polite and have thoughtful perspectives, and 0:16:08.040 --> 0:16:11.840 they're sometimes just positively jolly in the face of Howie 0:16:11.880 --> 0:16:16.160 being like rude and aggressive to them. And I don't know, 0:16:16.240 --> 0:16:19.440 like all the antagonists are so lovable even when it 0:16:19.520 --> 0:16:23.000 feels like they're covering something up or not being forthright 0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:23.760 about what they know. 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:35.680 Yeah, yeah, another weird thing about the characters. 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:39.840 This is one of the only detective stories I can 0:16:39.880 --> 0:16:42.440 think of. In fact, maybe it's the only one. Could 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:45.000 you even think of a possible counterexample? I don't know 0:16:45.200 --> 0:16:47.120 one of the only detective stories I know of where 0:16:47.160 --> 0:16:53.800 the protagonist is not only unlikable but not particularly competent. Right, 0:16:54.080 --> 0:16:57.960 this is what You always have a detective story about 0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:03.280 somebody who has powers of reasoning and insights, Sherlock Holmes 0:17:04.400 --> 0:17:07.840 or Poirot. You know, detectives who are skilled at solving 0:17:07.960 --> 0:17:12.320 a complicated puzzle. Sergeant Howie is clearly shown in the 0:17:12.359 --> 0:17:16.320 movie to be not a very good detective at all, 0:17:16.920 --> 0:17:19.640 and I think this is an essential part of his characterization. 0:17:19.720 --> 0:17:25.399 He is constantly missing important clues and constantly making bad 0:17:25.600 --> 0:17:29.320 choices that lead to dead ends in his pursuit of information. 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:33.000 I think one of the main feelings that the audience 0:17:33.040 --> 0:17:37.199 will generally have about Sergeant Howie is the feeling of pity. 0:17:37.680 --> 0:17:40.120 It's like, oh boy, this poor guy, he is out 0:17:40.160 --> 0:17:40.800 of his depth. 0:17:41.080 --> 0:17:42.600 Yeah, isn't that. 0:17:42.520 --> 0:17:46.000 So strange to have a what is essentially a detective 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:49.800 story and that's a key feature of your protagonist. Can 0:17:49.840 --> 0:17:51.679 you think of another story like that? 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:55.360 The only examples I can think of are examples where 0:17:55.400 --> 0:17:58.800 the character is played for humor. Yeah, and this is 0:17:58.800 --> 0:18:00.919 where we should probably talk about the tone of the film, 0:18:01.119 --> 0:18:04.440 and I'll just goe and mentioned like humor wise, there 0:18:04.440 --> 0:18:07.360 are lots of things I think you can you can 0:18:07.680 --> 0:18:09.879 you will find humorous in The wicker Man, and I 0:18:09.920 --> 0:18:13.520 think those things are intended. And yet at the same time, 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:18.960 it's not a comedy. It is played straight, and certainly 0:18:19.440 --> 0:18:23.200 Sergeant Howie's character is played straight like it's you could 0:18:23.240 --> 0:18:25.520 you could easily imagine a character like this tweaked into 0:18:25.560 --> 0:18:28.240 more of like a Michael Scott from the office to area, 0:18:28.320 --> 0:18:31.440 you know, or various like bumbling detective comedies we've seen 0:18:31.480 --> 0:18:34.520 over the years, and that's not what this film is. 0:18:34.600 --> 0:18:36.720 And of course as well as we will continue to 0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:41.160 discuss like it does defy easy categorization in a number 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:41.560 of ways. 0:18:41.720 --> 0:18:43.720 Yeah, I like the way you put it about the humor. 0:18:43.760 --> 0:18:46.720 I think that's right. It's like, there is a lot. 0:18:46.520 --> 0:18:51.399 Of intended humor in the movie, and it's ironic in nature. 0:18:51.440 --> 0:18:54.280 It's not in the form of overt jokes and gags. 0:18:55.359 --> 0:18:59.960 But anyway, just all these character dynamics, like the unlikeability 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:04.280 of the protagonist, the incompetence of the protagonist, and the 0:19:05.760 --> 0:19:10.640 likability and thoughtfulness of his antagonists. All these things really 0:19:10.720 --> 0:19:13.240 keep you guessing, or they certainly did keep me guessing 0:19:13.280 --> 0:19:16.600 when I first watched Again. When I first saw this, 0:19:16.720 --> 0:19:19.520 I really had no idea where the movie was going 0:19:19.840 --> 0:19:23.760 and was floored by the ending, the famous surprise ending. 0:19:24.320 --> 0:19:27.159 Yeah yeah, And that's a testament to a film like 0:19:27.240 --> 0:19:29.800 this if you're along for the ride, even if you 0:19:30.480 --> 0:19:32.680 are beginning to wonder, like, where could this ride possibly 0:19:32.720 --> 0:19:33.080 be going? 0:19:33.760 --> 0:19:35.600 Now, we've said several times we want to come back 0:19:35.640 --> 0:19:38.400 to the tone of the movie. I think I said 0:19:38.480 --> 0:19:42.439 at the beginning that it's questionable whether you should really 0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:47.120 call this movie a horror movie. When people call it horror, 0:19:47.200 --> 0:19:50.479 I think they're thinking mainly about the ending, which is 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:55.760 absolutely horrifying. But for like ninety ninety five percent of 0:19:55.800 --> 0:19:59.120 the movie, does it really feel like a horror film? 0:19:59.440 --> 0:20:00.199 I don't think so. 0:20:00.280 --> 0:20:02.280 I think most of the runtime it feels more like 0:20:02.320 --> 0:20:06.400 a bizarre, whimsical, religiously themed mystery. 0:20:07.680 --> 0:20:11.399 Yeah yeah, and even just feels at times feels like 0:20:11.760 --> 0:20:14.840 a goofy musical, but not at like a laugh like 0:20:14.840 --> 0:20:18.040 a horr horror horror goofy musical, but just like you 0:20:18.560 --> 0:20:21.399 might ask yourself, what am I watching? My wife had 0:20:21.440 --> 0:20:23.720 never seen it before, and she watched part of it 0:20:23.720 --> 0:20:25.600 with me last night, and I think that was kind 0:20:25.600 --> 0:20:27.560 of her reaction, Like I was like, do you want 0:20:27.560 --> 0:20:30.199 to watch part of this full Carr movie from the 0:20:30.280 --> 0:20:32.879 early nineteen seventies, And she's like sure, and then she's like, 0:20:33.240 --> 0:20:34.159 what's going on? 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:36.679 This is funny. 0:20:36.760 --> 0:20:39.000 Last night, Rachel and I also showed this movie to 0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:43.080 somebody for the first time and they had a similar reaction, though, 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:45.400 like what is going on for much of the time, 0:20:45.440 --> 0:20:47.840 But I can report there was a big thumbs up 0:20:47.840 --> 0:20:52.520 in the end. But yeah, it's so so. It's got 0:20:52.520 --> 0:20:56.320 that weird not horror at all tone for most of 0:20:56.359 --> 0:21:00.439 the runtime and then suddenly bam the ending, which is 0:21:00.760 --> 0:21:04.280 I think one of the bleakest, most terrifying scenes I 0:21:04.280 --> 0:21:06.920 can think of in all of movie history. It is 0:21:07.320 --> 0:21:10.480 at once beautiful and terrible. It makes your blood run 0:21:10.640 --> 0:21:13.080 cold and then warm and then cold again. 0:21:13.880 --> 0:21:16.639 Yeah. Yeah, it's pretty powerful, and I in terms of 0:21:16.640 --> 0:21:18.359 films we've watched on Weird House, I'd put it up 0:21:18.400 --> 0:21:22.679 there with Seconds. Yeah, in terms of its impact. I 0:21:22.720 --> 0:21:25.560 also want to add that even in the film's restored state, 0:21:25.600 --> 0:21:29.000 which is generally how you'll find it, I assume streaming 0:21:29.040 --> 0:21:32.359 and certainly on home media, there's a rawness to the 0:21:32.359 --> 0:21:35.560 footage that at times contributes to this feeling that we're 0:21:35.600 --> 0:21:38.800 watching documentary footage of some sort, like it's a documentary 0:21:38.840 --> 0:21:43.000 about the way people actually live on this island. Also, 0:21:43.040 --> 0:21:46.480 you have a lot of non actors in there and musicians, 0:21:46.480 --> 0:21:49.080 as we'll note, which adds to that feel like I'm 0:21:49.080 --> 0:21:51.520 not watching actors, I'm watching real people and this must 0:21:51.560 --> 0:21:54.280 be how they live. The production design, the locations are 0:21:54.320 --> 0:21:56.840 all a part of this, and you could also probably 0:21:56.840 --> 0:21:59.479 compare this to some rather different films from the nineteen 0:21:59.480 --> 0:22:04.280 seventies also have a similar feel, like Texas Chainsaw Massacre, 0:22:04.400 --> 0:22:06.600 though again very different sort of horror film. 0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:08.919 Yeah, though this movie has a lot more of a 0:22:09.000 --> 0:22:13.680 community feel than Texas Chainsaw Masacar does, which is very isolated. 0:22:13.040 --> 0:22:14.520 And you're only going to meet. 0:22:14.400 --> 0:22:17.560 A few weird characters, but it has that documentary visual style. 0:22:18.720 --> 0:22:21.520