1 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:17,239 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and happy woke Wednesday. I am away 2 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: on vacation getting some much needed rest in the sun, 3 00:00:21,680 --> 00:00:25,799 Speaker 1: but I'm excited to bring you my conversation with Cola 4 00:00:26,120 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: be Talking. She is the creative behind Black in the 5 00:00:31,560 --> 00:00:38,640 Speaker 1: Garden and her entire work is around decolonizing gardening. Yes, 6 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:43,559 Speaker 1: white supremacy shows up in every fucking thing, even in plants, 7 00:00:43,960 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 1: and so we get into a conversation about who is 8 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:53,200 Speaker 1: allowed to connect to their past and whose past has 9 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 1: been destroyed and disconnected on purpose. In the conversation with Cola, 10 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 1: we talk about, you know, our grandparents and our ancestors 11 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:07,960 Speaker 1: and how they were natural horticulturists, and what it means 12 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:12,640 Speaker 1: to reconnect to that spirit, to reconnect to our history 13 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 1: in that deep way, especially one that was purposefully denied 14 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 1: from us. So I hope that you enjoy this very 15 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:23,840 Speaker 1: woke and very conscious conversation around what it means to 16 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: combat white supremacy with joy. Right. We talk often about 17 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:32,040 Speaker 1: you know, rest being a part of the resistance. We 18 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:35,440 Speaker 1: talk about joy being a part of the revolution, and 19 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:39,199 Speaker 1: in this conversation with Kolabe talking from Black in the Garden, 20 00:01:39,280 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 1: we delve deeper into that experience into our personal journeys 21 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:47,960 Speaker 1: into gardens and plants, and also as a respite from 22 00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:51,040 Speaker 1: the rage right that we feel on a regular basis. 23 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 1: So drop me some thoughts in the comment section about 24 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 1: this Woke Wednesday conversation. Also remember I will not be 25 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: live on this Woke Wednesday, but I will be back 26 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:08,720 Speaker 1: next week and I'm sure overflowing with shit to talk about, folks. 27 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 1: I am so excited to welcome to Woke a f 28 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 1: for the very first time, Kolabee Talking, who is the 29 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:22,000 Speaker 1: creator voice behind the podcast Black in the Garden and 30 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:26,919 Speaker 1: a plant entrepreneur, which god, I love that. I also 31 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 1: love your tagline about the fact that you know, fairies 32 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 1: and gnomes have been given to us as a white right. 33 00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 1: And I'm a person that believes deeply in fairies and gnomes. 34 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: And it's so funny because when I went to college, 35 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:44,760 Speaker 1: my mother had bought me this painting for my first 36 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:47,920 Speaker 1: apartment that was of all of these black fairies and 37 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: gnomes because my sister and I have always loved them 38 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:53,919 Speaker 1: so much, in just the magic behind it all and 39 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 1: secret gardens and what you can find and discovering gardens 40 00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 1: and all of that good stuff. So I want to 41 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 1: talk to you first about, you know, why you started 42 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:07,919 Speaker 1: Black in the Garden and what your hopes were around 43 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:12,480 Speaker 1: the launch of that of your podcast back in twenty nineteen. Absolutely, well, 44 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 1: thank you soone much for having me. I'm having a 45 00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:20,359 Speaker 1: good time already. Just talking a is how I typically 46 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 1: introduced myself, because it's like hello, y'all. So as far 47 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:28,079 Speaker 1: as how I started, when I started, why I started 48 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 1: all in the fall of twenty nineteen, I felt like 49 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 1: I had been pregnant with the concept of Black in 50 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: the Garden because I really have been wanting to do 51 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: it for at least nine months and had not quite 52 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 1: pulled the trigger. Had been conceptualizing it, taking all these 53 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: notes about, oh, you could talk about this and that, 54 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:50,280 Speaker 1: and you know, just you know, getting super creative about it, 55 00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 1: playing around with logos and everything on the podcast, especially 56 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 1: up until this point in particular, DIY like, I figured 57 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:01,640 Speaker 1: out so much on how to do it on my own. 58 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:09,280 Speaker 1: So just started probably like about a month after my 59 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 1: marriage abruptly ended, and I said, you know what, I 60 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 1: got time today, So I'm going to start a podcast 61 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:20,640 Speaker 1: because I love plants. I'm very black. I recognize that 62 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:25,280 Speaker 1: I'm having a very Black experience with my plants. When 63 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 1: I say with my plants, I am interested in every 64 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 1: facet of gardening. What is it. Growing food is important 65 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 1: to me for the sake of health and wellness, and 66 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:43,839 Speaker 1: you know the ability that it provides to people who 67 00:04:43,920 --> 00:04:48,080 Speaker 1: need food to get that level of fecurity. I'm interested 68 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 1: in landscaping and seeing beautiful ornamental plants around homes and 69 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:56,640 Speaker 1: businesses and stuff. I'm always the one that's like trying 70 00:04:56,640 --> 00:05:01,280 Speaker 1: not to get into a car accident. Yeah, passed a 71 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:05,599 Speaker 1: beautiful landscaping arrangement. And then house plants, you know, and 72 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:09,039 Speaker 1: herbs and whatever. Like if it's a plant, if I 73 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 1: could grow it, if I could tend to it, I'm 74 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:14,600 Speaker 1: into it. And then I grew up as a student. 75 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:17,559 Speaker 1: And now I'm saying all of this with clarity because 76 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:20,719 Speaker 1: I figured it out by now. But in the beginning, 77 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 1: I hadn't made all these connections because I just knew 78 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:26,400 Speaker 1: that this was something I wanted to do. But when 79 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:30,680 Speaker 1: I started, oh no, let me stay on point. When 80 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: I started, I was like, you know what, I I 81 00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:39,039 Speaker 1: love radio, you know, So I grew up as a 82 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:43,640 Speaker 1: student of radio, and I'm talking about like Tom Joyner 83 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:46,720 Speaker 1: was the jock that I was most familiar with, because 84 00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:54,039 Speaker 1: I didn't realize the impact that it was having on 85 00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:58,680 Speaker 1: me until I started thinking about how to do podcasts 86 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:03,039 Speaker 1: and you know, being the audio world and figure out 87 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 1: how I wanted it to sound. So as far as, 88 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:08,560 Speaker 1: like I said, me figuring out how to make a 89 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:12,159 Speaker 1: podcast happen where I'm being my black self talking about plants, 90 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:16,920 Speaker 1: I just was like, Hm, let's reverse engineer it and 91 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:19,720 Speaker 1: kind of figure out like what I need to do 92 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 1: in order to kind of emulate what I believe it 93 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 1: should sound like. So you know we are now. I First, 94 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 1: I love all of that. I need to circle back 95 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 1: to your initial point, which is that your marriage had 96 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:41,600 Speaker 1: abruptly ended. And I want to ask because I am 97 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:47,280 Speaker 1: also a divorce recently, and you know, a part of 98 00:06:47,360 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 1: my personal healing and reflection has come through the tending 99 00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:57,120 Speaker 1: to and caring for and the building out of my 100 00:06:57,279 --> 00:07:00,599 Speaker 1: what my friends refer to as my indoor jungle in 101 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: in my apartment. But was that also a part of 102 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:11,600 Speaker 1: how you sourced your healing? Absolutely, it is. There's nothing 103 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:15,240 Speaker 1: like planting a seed and just getting super obsessed and 104 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 1: involved in watching it grow, and you know, it's just 105 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 1: it takes me back to my childhood and in a 106 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 1: very good and positive and healing way. So that is 107 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 1: one of the factors. It's just the plants definitely helped. 108 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 1: But it was the podcast because it's so involved that 109 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,760 Speaker 1: me just talking about the plants and me finding community 110 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:46,520 Speaker 1: by creating podcasts. When I started it only maybe five 111 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 1: of my friends and so it started literally out of nowhere, 112 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: with nobody knowing what it was and nobody knowing who 113 00:07:54,840 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 1: I was or anything like that. To now my last 114 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 1: guest Natalie Bazil, the author of Queen Sugar, so I'm like, 115 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 1: oh my god, people are fucking with it. Yeah. To 116 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 1: answer your question, the plants helped, but I would be 117 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: lying if I said that they were the main therapeutic 118 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 1: source for me, because they had already been providing therapy 119 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 1: in the way that they do for me. But specifically 120 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 1: related to the outlet, the positive outlet that I leaned 121 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:32,280 Speaker 1: into to help me to like, you know, put my 122 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:36,160 Speaker 1: attention in a good space in coping with divorce. It 123 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:40,920 Speaker 1: was the podcast. Yeah. You know, it's funny because I 124 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: got into radio and podcasting, I want to say in 125 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:54,720 Speaker 1: twenty Well, no, my initial podcast was probably in twenty twelve, 126 00:08:56,320 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: and so I've been podcasting for a while before podcasting 127 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,560 Speaker 1: came a thing. Then then was in radio, um in 128 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:06,920 Speaker 1: satellite radio for a couple of years, and then went 129 00:09:06,960 --> 00:09:09,880 Speaker 1: back to podcasting, and I just you know, for me, 130 00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:12,440 Speaker 1: it is it has always been the ability to just 131 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:15,400 Speaker 1: talk to and connect with people, UM that makes me 132 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: feel less crazy. I mean, I talk about you know, 133 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 1: the politics of the day and wanting to make people 134 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:27,160 Speaker 1: conscious of and responsible to and accountable to their citizensury right, 135 00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:30,679 Speaker 1: like you have power, you have um, the ability to 136 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 1: change the world that you're living, and you don't have 137 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 1: to be a passive witness UM to what is to 138 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:41,760 Speaker 1: what is happening. And for me that has been really 139 00:09:42,920 --> 00:09:46,840 Speaker 1: feeling for my for my soul for sure. But on 140 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:51,080 Speaker 1: the flip side of that, it has also been extraordinarily draining, 141 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 1: and so in trying to figure out like which brings 142 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:59,120 Speaker 1: me to you, in trying to figure out how to 143 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: both like how to have a level of consciousness and 144 00:10:03,360 --> 00:10:08,000 Speaker 1: wokeness that isn't just invested in rage, but is also 145 00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: invested in all different avenues of our life and tapping 146 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 1: into the ways in which we kind of you know, 147 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:17,720 Speaker 1: sleepwalk through a lot of things. And I think that, 148 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 1: you know, part of for me connecting with nature, connecting 149 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:26,440 Speaker 1: with plants is being extraordinarily present, right, It's not a 150 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:29,199 Speaker 1: passive relationship. And so I just want you to speak 151 00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:33,760 Speaker 1: to that a bit about like talking with people about 152 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 1: you know, this intersection of quarter culture of blackness and 153 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 1: why you see such you know beauty in that connection 154 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:48,520 Speaker 1: and intersection. Oh what a beautiful question. We got to 155 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:54,760 Speaker 1: unpack that. So let's I'll start with this. I in 156 00:10:55,280 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 1: relation to like what you said about needing to talk 157 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 1: to people so you don't feel crazy. What I recommend, 158 00:11:03,880 --> 00:11:07,040 Speaker 1: cheer is that I need to verbalize things for them 159 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 1: to make sense. So I talked to myself. You know, 160 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 1: I used to be a trucker. I would talk to 161 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 1: myself hours, a skill that comes in handy and that profession. 162 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 1: But talking to people, I prefer that over talking to myself. 163 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:22,960 Speaker 1: I'm good company. You don't get me wrong, but you 164 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:29,640 Speaker 1: get it. So in starting the show and getting into 165 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:35,200 Speaker 1: conversations with other like plant enthusiasts, professionals and all of that, 166 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:40,440 Speaker 1: it was very much to you know, highlight the black 167 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 1: voices that are in the stories that are interested in 168 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 1: plants and all the ways that we engage with them. 169 00:11:47,800 --> 00:11:51,080 Speaker 1: As I mentioned at the top, I am interested in 170 00:11:51,120 --> 00:11:54,040 Speaker 1: every aspect of it. So that just made it that 171 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:56,200 Speaker 1: much easier for me to be able to move in 172 00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 1: and out of conversations about all the different aspects. And 173 00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:01,560 Speaker 1: of course there's so much which I don't know, because 174 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 1: it's a whole world of it's a whole world literally, 175 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:10,120 Speaker 1: like so many different types of plants than there are 176 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:13,800 Speaker 1: stuff stated to every family and stuff. But as far 177 00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:20,439 Speaker 1: as the connecting black people to it, ooh, like you said, ancestrallly, ancestrally, 178 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: it is not that we what am I trying to say? Ancestrally, 179 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:32,600 Speaker 1: we have a knowledge and so black people coming back 180 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:38,160 Speaker 1: to plants for all of the reasons why we should 181 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:42,280 Speaker 1: cherish them all for us coming back to them, that is. 182 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:46,000 Speaker 1: I hate it when my brain does this. It's like 183 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:49,319 Speaker 1: blinking because it wants to go in three different directions 184 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 1: at once. But in encouraging and having these conversations, it 185 00:12:54,840 --> 00:13:02,000 Speaker 1: is encouraging black people to recognize that you're not alone 186 00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:05,079 Speaker 1: in it. Because I for sure when I first started 187 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:09,839 Speaker 1: getting like super obsessed with plants, I knew that it 188 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:13,200 Speaker 1: was not something that people who I knew in my 189 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 1: immediate life were interested in but I knew, I was 190 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 1: very certain that there was definitely a community of black 191 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:26,679 Speaker 1: people who were interested as well. And then as I 192 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 1: got deeper into it, I recognized, wow, yeah, there's literally 193 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:35,760 Speaker 1: a whole world, Like there's black farmers all over the place. 194 00:13:35,360 --> 00:13:41,280 Speaker 1: There are so there in especially since the pandemic happened. 195 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: In the term that I use, I think you probably 196 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 1: heard it before is the plant dimmic, Because when the 197 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:51,439 Speaker 1: pandemic happened, it wasn't just black people, it was everybody 198 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:58,199 Speaker 1: had a increased interest in plants, and so I call 199 00:13:58,280 --> 00:14:01,960 Speaker 1: that like a plant dimic boom, and so that was 200 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:07,440 Speaker 1: something that contributed to a spike in black people starting 201 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 1: plant shops. Yes, you know, I just kind of recognized, Wow, 202 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:15,800 Speaker 1: I came in. Like I said, Fall twenty nineteen was 203 00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 1: when Black in the Garden was officially launched, and a 204 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:26,239 Speaker 1: few months later, where you know, plandemic, pandemic whatever, lockdown, 205 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 1: and now everybody's interested in plants. So it was very 206 00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 1: helpful for me. But it was just, you know, the 207 00:14:33,720 --> 00:14:36,440 Speaker 1: pandemic was trash for the reasons that it was trash. 208 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:43,720 Speaker 1: But on the positive side of it, the ability to 209 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 1: have the time in the space to be still and 210 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:54,280 Speaker 1: be introverted, not introverted, introspective, and take some time to 211 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:56,640 Speaker 1: kind of figure out like what your values are and 212 00:14:57,160 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 1: figure out like, Okay, now I can start this garden, 213 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 1: or now I want to get all these plants. That 214 00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:06,800 Speaker 1: was That was a good thing for black people, especially 215 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 1: the black people like yourself who decided I'm going to 216 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:14,760 Speaker 1: take more time and effort to you know, figure out 217 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: how plants work and how they are important to me 218 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:21,360 Speaker 1: and the benefits that they have in my life besides 219 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 1: just being cute decoration. That is it for today's A 220 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 1: Woke AF Daily podcast. To hear more from today's show, 221 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:37,120 Speaker 1: including my full interview with Kolabe talking do support me 222 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:41,200 Speaker 1: on Patreon at patreon dot com slash Woke AF. Power 223 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:44,040 Speaker 1: to the people and to all the people. Power, get 224 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:46,000 Speaker 1: woke and stay woke as fuck.