Speaker 1: Episode to fifty seven Frugal Side Hustle Freelance Writing with
Speaker 1: Miranda Marquet. Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast, where you'll
Speaker 1: learn to save money, embrace simplicity, and live with your life.
Speaker 1: Here your host Jen and Jill. Welcome to Frugal Friends podcast.
Speaker 1: My name is Jen, my name is Jill. And today
Speaker 1: we have another episode in our Frugal Side Hustle series,
Speaker 1: and today is all about freelance writing, which was the
Speaker 1: way that I was able to not get another job
Speaker 1: when I was laid off at seven and a half
Speaker 1: months pregnant with your first baby, with my first baby,
Speaker 1: and I was able to make a really good living
Speaker 1: really quickly. So this is a side hustle, and you
Speaker 1: don't have to do it full time to start making money.
Speaker 1: We'll find that out later, but this is a really
Speaker 1: good side hustle to start if you want to achieve
Speaker 1: eventual income, flexibility, or maybe you're forced into needing it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's something that I've not done as a side hustle,
Speaker 1: but it was really interesting talking with Miranda hearing what
Speaker 1: her journey was like. The areas that are just excellent
Speaker 1: tips for other people who might want to consider this
Speaker 1: and I think it just opened my eyes to the
Speaker 1: level of accessibility. This could be two people from a
Speaker 1: variety of backgrounds, Like you don't just have to be
Speaker 1: one thing to do this, although you do have to
Speaker 1: have the skill set of writing, but even within that,
Speaker 1: there's all sorts of different types of writing people could do.
Speaker 1: So my horizons were broadened in talking with Miranda, so
Speaker 1: I hope yours are too, and that this could be
Speaker 1: something you consider and find the resources you need from
Speaker 1: Miranda in this episode. If this is what you want
Speaker 1: to do, yes, But first, this episode is brought to
Speaker 1: you by fire. No, not financial independence or the dumpster
Speaker 1: fire that describes life sometimes, but the fire that burns
Speaker 1: within you to know more. This year's listener special is
Speaker 1: coming up. We do one every year around the end
Speaker 1: of the year, either November December, and we want to
Speaker 1: know and this one it's different every year, but this
Speaker 1: one we want to know your burning questions. So anything
Speaker 1: that you want to know that we haven't answered, So
Speaker 1: maybe something about investing, shoot go for it. Got a
Speaker 1: specific question about debt that is maybe a little more
Speaker 1: specific than a general episode might answer. Come at us.
Speaker 1: I want to know more about our personal lives. We
Speaker 1: are open books up until the chapter on social Security numbers.
Speaker 1: We are accepting questions for our listeners special through November.
Speaker 1: So if you have a burning question and one and
Speaker 1: answered by the Frugal Friends, head to Frugal Friends podcast
Speaker 1: dot com slash special to submit it before November and
Speaker 1: you can submit it with your name or anonymously. We
Speaker 1: just want to answer it and for the right price,
Speaker 1: I might give you my social Security number. That's unwise.
Speaker 1: If you love side hustles, then here are a few
Speaker 1: good episodes to cue after this. Our first episode in
Speaker 1: our Frugal side Hustle series Digital Products with Elie Diepp
Speaker 1: got to meet her in person recently, such a gem
Speaker 1: of human being. Love her and that's episode two forty two.
Speaker 1: And then also episode on how to make more money
Speaker 1: with a side business. Any side hustle we are going
Speaker 1: to talk about in this series is something you can
Speaker 1: start on the side of your job, but could eventually
Speaker 1: grow into a business if you wanted to. So in
Speaker 1: this Frugal side Hustle series, it's got to be frugal,
Speaker 1: low cost startup also has to be sustainable with room
Speaker 1: for growth. So those are two priorities in the side
Speaker 1: Hustle series, and we have episode. We have really good
Speaker 1: side hustles lined up for you, guys. I am very excited.
Speaker 1: We're doing it every other month. We're going to do one.
Speaker 1: I'm very excited for this series. Buckle up. And I
Speaker 1: wanted to start with um or continue with one of
Speaker 1: my favorite probably arguably my most favorite side hustle freelance writing.
Speaker 1: And this is something that anybody can start as long
Speaker 1: as you enjoy writing and are competent at writing. You
Speaker 1: do not need a degree in it. You don't need
Speaker 1: to be a good speller or have great grammar. Trust me,
Speaker 1: that's what editors are for. That's a different episode. Uh
Speaker 1: but you can take a lot of the same You
Speaker 1: can take a lot of the same tips Miranda gives
Speaker 1: and use it to become a freelance editor too. I
Speaker 1: am not an editor. I'm a writer. Uh So I
Speaker 1: don't have great grammar, but it is it saved my life, honestly, Jill,
Speaker 1: Like you remember that time in my life because we
Speaker 1: were doing the podcast, yeah, which wasn't making a ton
Speaker 1: of money, and man, what a convergence of difficult things
Speaker 1: for you at that time, almost about to give birth
Speaker 1: laid off. But yet, thank goodness, you had already begun
Speaker 1: aside hustle. You had something that maybe it forced you
Speaker 1: to lead into it sooner than you would have anticipated,
Speaker 1: but you had already had that thing, which is almost
Speaker 1: like an emergency fund in a way, right, Like we
Speaker 1: save up money in an emergency fund, and I think
Speaker 1: investing in our skill set and expanding that and having
Speaker 1: a variety of things that we set our hands to
Speaker 1: is a different version of an urgency fund. And I'm
Speaker 1: so grateful that you had that, and and it was
Speaker 1: adjacent to the work that you were doing. Right, It's
Speaker 1: not this complete departure. It was something that was in
Speaker 1: line with the thing that you already doing already interested in.
Speaker 1: So I just I think side hustles are great. And
Speaker 1: even after talking with Miranda, did I think freelance writing
Speaker 1: is something worth considering for anybody looking for a good
Speaker 1: side hustle. Absolutely. For me, freelance writing was a direct
Speaker 1: conflict of interest with what I was doing because I
Speaker 1: was writing, so I was able to make I just
Speaker 1: used that time to make connections with people and to
Speaker 1: meet other people in the industry. For you, you might
Speaker 1: not be in writing that is a direct conflict with
Speaker 1: what you want to do. So you could maybe do
Speaker 1: one or two articles a month and just start building
Speaker 1: something that gets you paid maybe a couple hundred bucks
Speaker 1: a month, we work up to a thousand, et cetera.
Speaker 1: So so this is something that if you enjoy writing, definitely,
Speaker 1: definitely consider. And there's almost no one better to talk
Speaker 1: about freelance writing with than Miranda Marquet. She's an award
Speaker 1: winning freelancer UM. She covers primarily now exclusively financial stuff,
Speaker 1: but a few other things thrown in there that we'll
Speaker 1: talk about later. And but she has written for Forbes, Time,
Speaker 1: The Hill, NPR, Huff Post, Yahoo, Money, Everything, Um, and
Speaker 1: she does personal finance, investing, college planning, student loans so
Speaker 1: runs the gamut um. She loves coming on podcasts uh.
Speaker 1: She is a co host of the Money Talks news podcast.
Speaker 1: She holds a master's degree in journalism from Syracuse University,
Speaker 1: which helped her get started. But, as you will find out,
Speaker 1: isn't necessary in the landscape today, and she will explain why.
Speaker 1: So out further ado. Here's Miranda. Let's go, Miranda, Welcome
Speaker 1: to the Frugal Friends podcast. We are so delighted to
Speaker 1: have you. I am delighted to be here. This is fun. Well,
Speaker 1: I assume it's going to be fun. Well, let's see
Speaker 1: how this goes. It's not frugal friends. Yeah, that's our motto.
Speaker 1: So fingers crossed, you will have fun. If you don't,
Speaker 1: we will. That's fine. Somebody needs to have on This
Speaker 1: is a topic I am particularly passionate about and excited
Speaker 1: to share with everyone. Yeah, and equally for me, mostly
Speaker 1: because I esteem what you do. I have not written
Speaker 1: for a living in my life. I'm not like that.
Speaker 1: That concept of here's the topic, pump out articles is
Speaker 1: overwhelming to me. But I know many people are so
Speaker 1: good at it, including yourself, and there's a lot of
Speaker 1: people who are interested in this as a side hustle.
Speaker 1: One of the things that we like to introduce our
Speaker 1: community too is all types of different ways that you
Speaker 1: could make money as a side hustle or maybe even
Speaker 1: a main hustle moving into business ownership. So I know
Speaker 1: you've got so much to say on this, So if
Speaker 1: we could kind of go back to the beginning of
Speaker 1: your own freelance writing, how did you get started? Are
Speaker 1: you willing to talk to us about some of the
Speaker 1: monetary gains in those early days. What did that all
Speaker 1: look like? Yeah, so first of all, I did it
Speaker 1: all wrong. Um, I didn't have a real job. So
Speaker 1: so so basically I graduated from college. And by the
Speaker 1: time I graduated from college, I was, um pregnant. I
Speaker 1: got married between the fall semester and spring semester of
Speaker 1: my senior year in college, so twenty two, getting married
Speaker 1: a couple of months later, pregnant, graduated with a little
Speaker 1: baby bump, and then went to work because my my
Speaker 1: now ex there's there's a lot that just came out
Speaker 1: right there, but like there's a lot there. But he
Speaker 1: was still finishing school. He was a couple of years
Speaker 1: behind me in school and because of religious mission reasons,
Speaker 1: not because he's a slacker or anything, but anyway, but
Speaker 1: he was a couple of years behind me in school.
Speaker 1: So I started working and uh, you know, had the baby,
Speaker 1: had jobs whatever. And then when my my ex husband
Speaker 1: finished his undergrad degree, we both decided to do grad
Speaker 1: school together. Might as well with the toddler. You know,
Speaker 1: let's just do this work. Let's just do it, let's
Speaker 1: make it work. And so I did. I got my
Speaker 1: master's degree. Uh, he started a PhD program. And what
Speaker 1: we decided after I finished my master's degree, which was
Speaker 1: in journalism, was one good way to do this was
Speaker 1: I could freelance. So instead of getting a real job,
Speaker 1: just went all in on freelancing with my shiny new
Speaker 1: journalism degree and went ahead and used student loans that
Speaker 1: he got for his PhD program. We went ahead to
Speaker 1: use student loans as our basis for a living so
Speaker 1: that I could start my freelance career, so that I
Speaker 1: would be able to stay home with our son most
Speaker 1: of the time and and then grow the freelancing and
Speaker 1: and kind of support us that way until he finished
Speaker 1: his PhD and he got his real job and then
Speaker 1: we could be the perfect gender role family anyway, And
Speaker 1: none of that happened, and here we are actually really
Speaker 1: like my X. My X is actually fabulous. He is
Speaker 1: one of my favorite people. But yeah, so so yeah,
Speaker 1: So basically, I kind of I got startarted because I
Speaker 1: wanted a way to stay home most of the time
Speaker 1: with my son and provide some support for our family
Speaker 1: while my X was still in school. And it just
Speaker 1: sort of snowballed into something that went from the first
Speaker 1: year I sort of started ramping up and that first year.
Speaker 1: By the end of that first year freelancing, we were
Speaker 1: able to be like, Okay, we can cut back on
Speaker 1: the amount of student loans were taking for school, because
Speaker 1: I make enough for us to cover our rent and
Speaker 1: our instruence needs, and we'll just take a little bit
Speaker 1: of student loans to cover the cost of my ex's
Speaker 1: PhD program, plus maybe some food would be nice. And
Speaker 1: so we kind of figured that out. By the end
Speaker 1: of the second year, we no longer had to do
Speaker 1: student loans for my ex. He by that time he
Speaker 1: was on a research grant, so he had a fellowship
Speaker 1: and a small stipend. And I was making close to
Speaker 1: forty or fifty thousand dollars a year, So that's enough
Speaker 1: for a full time like that's that's full time. That's
Speaker 1: a full time salary. And in the seconds year, in
Speaker 1: my second year, and then by by the time i'd
Speaker 1: reached year five, I was making six figures and um
Speaker 1: and just kind of went from there. And so so
Speaker 1: it just sort of kind of ramped up, but it
Speaker 1: did take sometimes sort of build that in. And part
Speaker 1: of the reason I did get to ramp it up
Speaker 1: and build it in was the fact that, you know,
Speaker 1: by the time I got to my second year, my
Speaker 1: son was old enough to be in preschool, and so
Speaker 1: he was in preschool, and so I had a little
Speaker 1: more time to focus. And then the fact that we
Speaker 1: went ahead and made that choice to take student loans
Speaker 1: to help us supplement our living so that I could
Speaker 1: focus on building my freelance. So I always have to
Speaker 1: talk about that, because there was a lot of privilege
Speaker 1: there that allowed me to ramp up my freelance business
Speaker 1: faster than what might have otherwise been. And then having
Speaker 1: that master's degree in journalism from Syracuse also helped me
Speaker 1: in terms of being able to market myself for higher
Speaker 1: paying gigs because I could say, hey, I held a
Speaker 1: fancy degree from a fancy school, and and that helped
Speaker 1: a lot too. So there's there's a lot there. Um
Speaker 1: And today I do look at round though, and Jening
Speaker 1: can probably tell you depending on your niche, depending on
Speaker 1: what you're writing about, depending on what your focus is. Um,
Speaker 1: there are people who, like I mean, I remember just
Speaker 1: starting out and being like I'm getting five dollars for
Speaker 1: a three hundred word article on bamboo flooring, Like I mean,
Speaker 1: this is this is beautiful right, this is two This
Speaker 1: is two thousand five, my friends, this is the early
Speaker 1: days of online marketing. A lot of what I was
Speaker 1: doing at first was basically helping companies, websites, whatever, just
Speaker 1: build content online. That nobody had content online, right except
Speaker 1: for a few things, and so so a lot of
Speaker 1: what I was doing was like, like I'd be translating
Speaker 1: stuff from like, well, here's a catalog full of our
Speaker 1: blind options of Venetian blinds, you know whatever, Like here's
Speaker 1: here's our catalog of blinds. Now translate that all for online.
Speaker 1: And here's some s c O terms we want. Like
Speaker 1: that's what I was doing six hours a day today
Speaker 1: today freelancers. I sort of envy the young freelancers of
Speaker 1: today who are just like, well, yes, I am going
Speaker 1: to get paid two hundred dollars to write eight hundred
Speaker 1: words on this nice financial topic and hurrah. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: that must be nice. But I don't I don't begrudge them.
Speaker 1: I do feel a little jealous sometimes, but I don't ever,
Speaker 1: I don't ever feel like, well, you must toil because
Speaker 1: I did. I am happy that, you know, online content
Speaker 1: has moved in a direction where if you know where
Speaker 1: to look, and you have those tools, then you can
Speaker 1: find good paying gigs to start with, and it's not
Speaker 1: as difficult it used to be to like get to that,
Speaker 1: like even just a thousand dollars a month, depending on
Speaker 1: your niche and everything. You can do that with five articles.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I have to say that though sometimes between
Speaker 1: writing about a state tax and life insurance companies, I
Speaker 1: might have been enjoyed a five hundred word article on
Speaker 1: Venetian blinds. There are days. There are days like I
Speaker 1: had a thing. I had a thing where like I
Speaker 1: was going through this whole thing where like all the
Speaker 1: content I was writing was how to do X wedding.
Speaker 1: So it's like how to do a Western wedding, how
Speaker 1: to do a winter wedding, how to do a medieval wedding,
Speaker 1: how to do a spring wedding, how to do a
Speaker 1: summer wedding, how to do a fall wedding, how did
Speaker 1: you a mermaid theme wedding? How did you like? And
Speaker 1: I was just talking like how to do all of
Speaker 1: these theme weddings, and I was just like, Okay, let's
Speaker 1: do that's get in the zone. Well, I know you're
Speaker 1: saying that maybe you didn't do it right. Quote unquote
Speaker 1: from the start, but it sounds as though you found
Speaker 1: your own pathway forward in it and to some degree
Speaker 1: have achieved. You've you've achieved in the midst of it.
Speaker 1: And and I think that there are some really helpful
Speaker 1: things in your story for those who might be interested
Speaker 1: in this, and that it is something that can be
Speaker 1: done from home or even potentially on the road as
Speaker 1: long as you've got internet connection. It has the ability
Speaker 1: to have flexibility. Of course, you do need skill and
Speaker 1: talent in being able to write, and clearly being able
Speaker 1: to write over and over and over and over and
Speaker 1: over again, sometimes on the same thing but like a
Speaker 1: different lens, and so that can become monotonous. But for
Speaker 1: someone who feels as though they do have a skill
Speaker 1: set in writing, they want some of that flexibility. I
Speaker 1: think this is a really great option to be able
Speaker 1: to build upon. And I think the unique thing about
Speaker 1: what we're talking here in freelance writing is you there's
Speaker 1: you can write on anything. You can write on whatever
Speaker 1: area you feel expert in. I know, Jen, you ended
Speaker 1: up writing on the area you said you weren't expert in,
Speaker 1: but you became under you know, you had a good
Speaker 1: then base and understanding and knowledge because of them making
Speaker 1: you right on that. But I think this is a
Speaker 1: sphere that someone in any type of profession could do
Speaker 1: if you have the skill set to write on whatever
Speaker 1: area of expertise you have. So there's a lot here
Speaker 1: that I think is accessible for people. Yeah, And I
Speaker 1: think one of the things to remember too is even
Speaker 1: though I talk, I joke about doing it the wrong way,
Speaker 1: the same time made very intentional choices. We're very intentional
Speaker 1: about how we went about this. We said, Okay, we
Speaker 1: know that I need time to ramp up, and we
Speaker 1: know that I want to be able to stay home.
Speaker 1: So we went ahead and wade those pros and cons
Speaker 1: and decided, okay, student loans for the PhD program is
Speaker 1: the way to go. And even though the plans changed
Speaker 1: over time, even though life always changes no matter what
Speaker 1: five year plan you make, the reality situation is we
Speaker 1: did go into this intentionally and really think through, Okay,
Speaker 1: what do we need? What needs to happen in order
Speaker 1: for us to start working towards these goals that we have.
Speaker 1: And I think that's part of it too. Right when
Speaker 1: you're when you're if you're going to decide to do
Speaker 1: any side hustle or freelance right or anything like that.
Speaker 1: You need to look at where you want to be.
Speaker 1: And as um Joe saw Sea High from Stacking, Benjamin says,
Speaker 1: you look at where you want to be and then
Speaker 1: you kind of if you begin with the end in mind,
Speaker 1: you look at that end and you kind of work backward. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And alternatively, you can just get laid off eight weeks
Speaker 1: before you give birth and then decide, Okay, I have
Speaker 1: a freelance writing career now. Ye perfect, I mean absolutely perfect,
Speaker 1: no masters in journalism, but no formal training in finance,
Speaker 1: and just say okay, I'm a I'm a personal finance
Speaker 1: freelancer now. But it did help that I had one
Speaker 1: year of full time writing in personal finance already, so
Speaker 1: I just used that to my advantage and use my
Speaker 1: My network was actually what helped me get started was
Speaker 1: that I had spent time building a network, not even
Speaker 1: a network, I hate that word. Really. I had just
Speaker 1: spent time like making friends with other people who were
Speaker 1: in personal finance as writers, editors, website owners, and that
Speaker 1: paid off in the end. But if you're not going
Speaker 1: to just decide you have this career after getting right off,
Speaker 1: what are some of the questions people should ask themselves
Speaker 1: before getting into this, because it's not the four hour
Speaker 1: work week glamour nomad beauty that some people make it
Speaker 1: out to be. Well and actually so one of the
Speaker 1: things I do like about freelance writing so at this
Speaker 1: point in my career, so, like I said, I started
Speaker 1: doing this two five, I really started writing about finances
Speaker 1: and two six, so I've been doing this for almost
Speaker 1: twenty years. I'm an internet dinosaur anyway, So like, but
Speaker 1: I think one of the things to kind of think
Speaker 1: about is is once you start building that and you
Speaker 1: start getting better paying gigs and you start getting think
Speaker 1: your financial feed under you with this is you do
Speaker 1: have a lot of freedom and flexibility. I'm to the
Speaker 1: point now where I can sustain my personal the conditions
Speaker 1: that I prefer to live live in. I can sustain
Speaker 1: that working somewhere between ten and fifteen hours a week
Speaker 1: on client work, like on client writing. So I can
Speaker 1: sustain that on that amount of client writing because of
Speaker 1: what I get paid for article and how much time
Speaker 1: it takes me to write them, which is not very much,
Speaker 1: and the kinds of clients that I choose, which aren't
Speaker 1: super labor intensive and so so I do kind of
Speaker 1: have that flexibility to It's not exactly a four hour
Speaker 1: week work week, but to be able to make six
Speaker 1: figures working ten to fifteen hours a week is I
Speaker 1: mean to me, I mean, that's as close to the
Speaker 1: dream as you're gonna get. But it takes, but it takes.
Speaker 1: You do have to work to that, like you said,
Speaker 1: and you yeah, and and there are there are times
Speaker 1: like early in my career where I was working four year,
Speaker 1: fifty hours a week and I was, you know, just
Speaker 1: trying to churn out as many of these like keyword
Speaker 1: articles as humanly possible bowl and you know when when
Speaker 1: my son was in first grade, you know, being like, okay,
Speaker 1: I got six hours, like as much as I could
Speaker 1: do in six hours, and just cram it all in.
Speaker 1: And so there were those times, and so you kind
Speaker 1: of have to be ready for that because any time
Speaker 1: you start any side hustle, the first part of it
Speaker 1: is just grueling and it's a slog and you have
Speaker 1: to kind of be realistic about it. Now, almost twenty
Speaker 1: years later, I have a lot more freedom, a lot
Speaker 1: more flexibility. I do this on the road A lot
Speaker 1: of the time. I'll travel and I can travel for
Speaker 1: a week or two at a time, which gives me
Speaker 1: a day or two in there to just set up
Speaker 1: work and just do work and then go site see
Speaker 1: or go eat delicious food. So it really is flexible
Speaker 1: and it really does have freedom. But like you said
Speaker 1: at the beginning, sometimes you really are It's sometimes it
Speaker 1: feels like a slog and my goodness if I have
Speaker 1: to write another credit card review, which I will probably
Speaker 1: too again. But yeah, like you're not writing if you're
Speaker 1: a jobbing I called a jobbing writer, Like you have
Speaker 1: a job, it's your job, I call like, if you're
Speaker 1: a jobbing writer, you are not writing amazing, high flown
Speaker 1: treatises on whatever it is you want to write about.
Speaker 1: You do that on your own time, like after you've
Speaker 1: made the money, right, the boring stuff, and then you
Speaker 1: can write what you want to write with whatever's left. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's so true. It's not like the glamorous like investigative journalism.
Speaker 1: You're not going to be, you know, writing the narratives
Speaker 1: you hear on podcasts. A lot of it is kind
Speaker 1: of boring stuff. Um that you have to really be
Speaker 1: able to focus and write for several hours and at
Speaker 1: a time to finish. But then but those are the
Speaker 1: ones that tend to pay the best too. You don't
Speaker 1: need my fancy degree to do this. If you have
Speaker 1: reasonably good writing skills, and you have the capability to
Speaker 1: improve your writing skills, then you can do that. And
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter what sort of degree you have, what
Speaker 1: sort of qualifications you have. When I started writing about money,
Speaker 1: I had no clue. And I mean I was I
Speaker 1: wanted to write about science. I was writing. I was
Speaker 1: writing for physics dot com and then doing a whole
Speaker 1: bunch of this like bamboo flooring and everything else to
Speaker 1: like you know whatever. And then and then I had
Speaker 1: like a couple of articles a month from physics dot com,
Speaker 1: which I really enjoyed. I really enjoyed the science writing.
Speaker 1: But you know, an opportunity came up to start writing
Speaker 1: about money, and that's that's what happened. I just sort
Speaker 1: of kind of shifted tracks. And because they're gonna be
Speaker 1: niches that pay better, and money is one of those
Speaker 1: niches that pays probably the best. You might get paid
Speaker 1: a little bit more and like entertainment and celebrity gossip news,
Speaker 1: but that can be harder to break into because everybody
Speaker 1: wants to do that. Uh, and then you need to
Speaker 1: have a certain amount of access depending on where you're writing.
Speaker 1: So for one of the niches to break into, writing
Speaker 1: about money is probably one of the most profitable for
Speaker 1: those who are considering this freelance writing as a side
Speaker 1: hustle or their main business. Do you have any tips
Speaker 1: for them, Miranda on how to set themselves up to
Speaker 1: get some of the better jobs. Yeah, So it kind
Speaker 1: of starts with So I personally think it's a good
Speaker 1: idea to just te your own website, have a blog
Speaker 1: that you can write some things on, especially if you
Speaker 1: don't have any clips from anywhere else, so that at
Speaker 1: least you have something that you can send, and then
Speaker 1: you know, hit the job hit the job boards. Um,
Speaker 1: the pro Blogger job board is a good place to start.
Speaker 1: Media Bistro offers some places to start, and then journalism
Speaker 1: jobs and then um, I actually got my first jobs
Speaker 1: on up work. I know that's like the lowest place
Speaker 1: to start, but that was helpful, Like I was, I
Speaker 1: got some of my first like I know, I know,
Speaker 1: but it is. It was super easy and it was
Speaker 1: my first like bylines that weren't on my block. But
Speaker 1: I did get an actual, like full time writing job
Speaker 1: only based on the writing on my personal blog. So yeah,
Speaker 1: definitely have your own website. Yeah, so your on website
Speaker 1: helps UM and you can find like anymore they have um.
Speaker 1: LinkedIn actually does a bunch of jobs that you can do.
Speaker 1: You can set up. That's where I got this and one, yeah,
Speaker 1: is LinkedIn, and so I do a lot of you know, LinkedIn.
Speaker 1: Put a little open to work thing on there when
Speaker 1: you're doing your LinkedIn profile, like identify yourself as a
Speaker 1: freelance writer. Also if you want to be in a
Speaker 1: specific niche, the kind of niche you want to do,
Speaker 1: like my LinkedIn and says I'm a freelance financial writer,
Speaker 1: so that people can find that. So you can find
Speaker 1: those and it really, I mean it just it kind
Speaker 1: of helps. So I did. I had a whole process
Speaker 1: where I would I would get started in the day,
Speaker 1: like if I had something to do that day, I
Speaker 1: would write what I needed to write. But then I
Speaker 1: would spend two hours looking for jobs, like I would
Speaker 1: hit all of the job boards. So I spent two
Speaker 1: hours hitting the job boards, you know, make checking to
Speaker 1: see if any of my clips have been published, so
Speaker 1: that I could add them to my portfolio on my
Speaker 1: website and then updating that kind of stuff, so I would,
Speaker 1: so I did. I just had a whole thing where
Speaker 1: I spent time looking for jobs. Another good place to
Speaker 1: look as Twitter. If you look on Twitter and the
Speaker 1: hashtag freelance, hashtag writing jobs, those two hashtags can really
Speaker 1: help you find some freelancing. A lot of people post jobs.
Speaker 1: A lot of people who are looking for one off
Speaker 1: pitches also posts. So if you don't mind making pitches,
Speaker 1: you can say, like, oh, okay, here's somebody who's looking
Speaker 1: for this article, and it can be a good way
Speaker 1: to get into a good publication and get a good
Speaker 1: byeline and get paid for it. And then, like Jen said,
Speaker 1: building your network is huge. You know, look for some
Speaker 1: freelance groups, look for like connect with other freelancers, and
Speaker 1: that helps you as well. Like a lot of us,
Speaker 1: as we kind of go through in our in the
Speaker 1: freelance world, like we start developing like specialties even within
Speaker 1: personal finance, like I write about investing a lot in
Speaker 1: cryptocurrency and college planning and student loans. I do not
Speaker 1: like writing about insurance if I can avoid it. Nobody does,
Speaker 1: But there are people who eat. But there are people
Speaker 1: who do really well at it. So I have a friend, Yeah,
Speaker 1: my friend Cat. You you can make a lot of
Speaker 1: money in insurance writing and so. But if somebody comes
Speaker 1: to me and like I've got an insurance gig for you,
Speaker 1: I'm like, here is Cats and so, well write your
Speaker 1: insurance for you, not not I. And and likewise, when
Speaker 1: somebody wants a Cat to write about investing, uh, somebody
Speaker 1: will come to Cat and be like, we want investing
Speaker 1: specifically cryptocur and She's like, no, no, thank you, Miranda
Speaker 1: will write about your scam crypto and so anyway, yeah,
Speaker 1: I I think the network has been It was integral
Speaker 1: in in my like freelance writing career, and I I
Speaker 1: was similarly able to increase my income like really rapidly,
Speaker 1: but again that was because I was kind of pushed
Speaker 1: into doing it full time very quickly, and and it
Speaker 1: was because I had this network of people. And Cat
Speaker 1: you're you know, of course co author. She was like
Speaker 1: an integral part of that too, like I met her
Speaker 1: when I was writing for the Penny Order and just
Speaker 1: all of the the networking that I've done. Again, I
Speaker 1: hate that word friendship, Like me people meeting yeah, that
Speaker 1: has been the most effective, and like yeah, being like,
Speaker 1: oh I have I don't you know, really do this,
Speaker 1: but here's this person that would be really good to
Speaker 1: talk about it, and um, you know Cat would be like, hey,
Speaker 1: I don't have any room on my plate for this?
Speaker 1: Do you think you would want to do it? And
Speaker 1: eventually editors will know what you're known for. And and
Speaker 1: I like, I haven't written in probably over a year,
Speaker 1: like for higher and I just got an email from
Speaker 1: an editor the other day saying like, hey, we have
Speaker 1: this article, and I was like I can't. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I definitely definitely agree with that. But yeah, and you
Speaker 1: were so you went in slightly two niches, and I
Speaker 1: do think that's like when you knitche yourself down, that's
Speaker 1: where like bigger money comes in. So you mentioned like
Speaker 1: maybe celebrity, the gossip and entertainment money. Is there anything else?
Speaker 1: Like what are maybe the top five niches that you've
Speaker 1: seen for money making? Over my minute? Yeah? So uh so,
Speaker 1: interestingly travels an interesting one because the pay for the
Speaker 1: article may not be quite as high, but if you
Speaker 1: get the right gigs, then they pay for you to
Speaker 1: do the thing, so you get so you get so
Speaker 1: so that's nice, So travels a nice one because of that.
Speaker 1: If you can write so this isn't really a niche,
Speaker 1: but if you can write web copy, if you're good
Speaker 1: at writing web copy marketing copy, you can actually get
Speaker 1: paid higher. So being able to write that sort of
Speaker 1: web copy that converts for sales whether and and then
Speaker 1: that includes like if you can write emails, which is
Speaker 1: a different type of writing as well, but kind of
Speaker 1: under that marketing copy. But if you can do a
Speaker 1: good job at writing emails and web copy, that's probably
Speaker 1: your top. That's probably your top. If you're a really
Speaker 1: good marketing copywriter, you can get lots of good money there.
Speaker 1: And actually white papers and case studies pay pretty well.
Speaker 1: So if you can if you have a good technical writing,
Speaker 1: a good handle on like technical rideing and explaining concepts
Speaker 1: and putting together compelling case studies, uh, than white papers
Speaker 1: and case studies can also pay fairly well. So that's
Speaker 1: so that's kind of outside of like subject, you know,
Speaker 1: it's kind of outside of genre, but but they're types
Speaker 1: of writing that pay really well. And then kind of
Speaker 1: along with that, press releases. If you can write a
Speaker 1: good press release, you can get upwards of a dollar
Speaker 1: per word. Basically what amounts to about a dollar per
Speaker 1: word if you can write a good press release. So
Speaker 1: there's there's stuff like that that can really be helpful.
Speaker 1: One of the things I like to do is well
Speaker 1: is so to get access to things like writing press releases,
Speaker 1: some email copy and that kind of thing is connecting
Speaker 1: with agencies and so you know agencies that do this
Speaker 1: kind of stuff, like pr agencies and whatnot, and like,
Speaker 1: I don't work for them full time, but I'm on
Speaker 1: the list of some different agencies who every couple of
Speaker 1: months have like they need extra help, they need a
Speaker 1: little bit more from somebody, and so they'll come to
Speaker 1: me and be like, anyway, write us a press release
Speaker 1: and it needs to be turned around fast. So now
Speaker 1: now we're really getting paid because it's got to be
Speaker 1: fast and it's a press release. And so so developing
Speaker 1: like reaching out looking for agencies on LinkedIn kind of
Speaker 1: reaching out can be helpful because those kinds of things
Speaker 1: pay well. But yeah, writing about money pays well depending
Speaker 1: on well, Yeah, and then like entertainment celebrity stuff can
Speaker 1: pay well. It depends on you know where you're going
Speaker 1: and what you're at. So it's just it's kind of
Speaker 1: an interesting mix, but your best. But as far as
Speaker 1: stuff that's relatively easy to write without qualifications, uh and
Speaker 1: without a lot of practice, let's be honest, starting in
Speaker 1: the financial niches, like like financial stuff because because financial
Speaker 1: so I'm already listening to a financial podcast, so you
Speaker 1: have some background, right, well, and that's the thing, right
Speaker 1: if you can explain these concepts in a way that's
Speaker 1: simple and compelling, because most of the time, like companies
Speaker 1: that are trying to make money from financial products like
Speaker 1: conversions on like credit card right, affiliate stuff like from
Speaker 1: credit cards and from insurance leads and from loans and
Speaker 1: you know, all of that stuff, and you know, from
Speaker 1: opening an investment account, like all of those things generally
Speaker 1: pay fairly well. One of the reasons why I, like,
Speaker 1: I actually charge more when I write a credit card review,
Speaker 1: Like like a charge more when I write a credit
Speaker 1: card review than I do for like if I'm writing
Speaker 1: about investing, right, because the credit card review is written
Speaker 1: to convert, it's written specifically to do that, and they're
Speaker 1: getting a nice big fat kickback from every credit card
Speaker 1: that's you know, so so that's that's kind of something
Speaker 1: I'd take into account as well, right, like your rate
Speaker 1: isn't your rate like your rate trying to depicts Yeah,
Speaker 1: and even still rates are kind of still kind of
Speaker 1: shrouded in secrecy to yeah, it's not. I mean, when
Speaker 1: you get in there, you can kind of find what,
Speaker 1: you know, what should I be asking for from this
Speaker 1: person and stuff like that. But yeah, so you can
Speaker 1: charge whatever. You can change your rates based on what
Speaker 1: they're asking you to do too. If there's no like
Speaker 1: standard where they're you know they're looking for, that's awesome.
Speaker 1: Uh So, last question on this part, what are the
Speaker 1: common mistakes most new freelancers make and how can we
Speaker 1: how can they stay away from them? So, I think
Speaker 1: one of the biggest things is trying to figure out
Speaker 1: that balance between how much work do I do for
Speaker 1: free as a beginner and how much do I insist
Speaker 1: that I'm getting paid for And trying to find that
Speaker 1: a balance can be very difficult because on the one hand,
Speaker 1: you're just like, I just need my byline somewhere and
Speaker 1: so so I usually say, Okay, don't do a ton
Speaker 1: of free work. Be kind of strategic if you can
Speaker 1: get your name out there in a network or something
Speaker 1: like that and get paid a small amount, or even
Speaker 1: just do one or two articles for somebody for exposure,
Speaker 1: as long as it doesn't take a ton of time.
Speaker 1: Because the reality of the situation is that if you're
Speaker 1: going to be building your portfolio for free, you might
Speaker 1: as well be doing it on your own website, where
Speaker 1: at least you own the content and where you control
Speaker 1: the content, and where you can send people to read
Speaker 1: samples of your writing. So I think one of the
Speaker 1: biggest things is like doing too many free pieces. You know,
Speaker 1: kind of figure out like, Okay, I will do I
Speaker 1: will do one or two pieces for exposure so I
Speaker 1: can get at least a byeline that's not on my
Speaker 1: website to send people to, or like you said, you know,
Speaker 1: do a couple of pieces through up work. But I
Speaker 1: wouldn't make up work my main place. I did. So
Speaker 1: before up work existed, there was this thing called Guru
Speaker 1: and went and it was like up work, but you know, anyway,
Speaker 1: and it was because when you're on these sites like that,
Speaker 1: you're basically you're competing to undercut yourself, right, You're competing
Speaker 1: to undercut yourself because you want the lowest price, because
Speaker 1: that's what they're looking for. And so you know, do
Speaker 1: one or two to get that you know off your
Speaker 1: own site byline, like you said, and then go back
Speaker 1: to developing your own writing and your own voice and
Speaker 1: your own style on your own website. But you'll have
Speaker 1: these other things. They're like, Okay, you can check out
Speaker 1: my writing on my website, but also here are two
Speaker 1: other places where I've been published, and then so yeah, so,
Speaker 1: But I think the biggest thing is spending so much
Speaker 1: time doing free or super low paid work that you
Speaker 1: don't have time to lead yourself open to other opportunities
Speaker 1: or to even develop your own place. I guess, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's great. I never worked for free to build somebody
Speaker 1: else's business. The only free writing I did was in
Speaker 1: order to like, like a guest post on somebody's blog
Speaker 1: to get back links to my website. That was the
Speaker 1: only free writing I did. And otherwise, if it was
Speaker 1: not building my business, I didn't write for free. That
Speaker 1: was my rule, and I stuck to it. And even
Speaker 1: those those first upwork ones, I made like seventy five
Speaker 1: bucks an article, and that was great. Yeah, I did
Speaker 1: that for a few months, and then I moved on
Speaker 1: and that yeah, because you you really do you can't
Speaker 1: expect to be making a couple hundred bucks an article
Speaker 1: starting out, but you you got to move through the
Speaker 1: season's at a relatively good pace if you want to
Speaker 1: keep with it, right, yeah, if you If you don't,
Speaker 1: just want to be ready to like give up immediately
Speaker 1: because like, yeah, you know, and you go through a
Speaker 1: thing where you're like, okay, now I've got to send
Speaker 1: you know, you do with a few things on out
Speaker 1: work pretty pretty easy, do a couple of things for free,
Speaker 1: and then like you move into the pitch phase, right,
Speaker 1: So you start pitching places and if you can or
Speaker 1: going to job boards that offer to like pro Blogger
Speaker 1: isn't gonna offer you amazing pay, but it's gonna be
Speaker 1: you can find good, mediocre, low barrier to entry things
Speaker 1: that you can try and do. One one thing you
Speaker 1: can do is like on LinkedIn that's really interesting is
Speaker 1: you look for for jobs on LinkedIn where they're looking
Speaker 1: for full time positions. And this is what my friend
Speaker 1: Cat does is show message them, shall reach out to
Speaker 1: them and say, hey, I'm not interested in full time position,
Speaker 1: but you need me to fill in temporarily until you
Speaker 1: get that position filled. And then a lot of the time,
Speaker 1: they just they're just like, oh this is this is
Speaker 1: working out just fine. They keep sending her kill your work.
Speaker 1: And so so there's things like that you can do.
Speaker 1: Um and like you said, you kind of you get
Speaker 1: your start and you know, do a couple of quick
Speaker 1: articles to get your byline out there real fast, get
Speaker 1: a couple of things on your own website so you
Speaker 1: have something to show, and then start applying at job boards,
Speaker 1: start doing pitches, and start really kind of looking for
Speaker 1: those long term kind of stable things like most of yeah,
Speaker 1: most of my clients now are clients that want between
Speaker 1: four and eight articles per month from me. And that
Speaker 1: stability where I just you know more, I know I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go work every month is very very nice and helpful. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but starting somewhere and figuring out how to get take
Speaker 1: a next step in the next step, in the next step,
Speaker 1: and not staying stuck in any of these areas, but
Speaker 1: that there is so much room to grow within this
Speaker 1: type of work, which I think is really compelling. You
Speaker 1: know what else is compelling and and free sometimes low costs,
Speaker 1: sometimes super high costs. It really runs the gamut. Very
Speaker 1: low barrier to entry, though the bill of the week.
Speaker 1: That's right, it's time for the best minute of your
Speaker 1: entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name
Speaker 1: is William. Maybe you paid off your mortgage, maybe your
Speaker 1: car died, and you're happy to not have to pay
Speaker 1: that bill anymore. Duck Bill, Buffalo Bills, Bill Clinton, this
Speaker 1: is the bill of the week, Miranda, it's happening. It's here,
Speaker 1: the famed bill of the week, and so we would
Speaker 1: love to hear yours today. So does sounds really bad
Speaker 1: because most of my stuff is automatic, so I don't
Speaker 1: really know what's coming out, Like if there's anybody named
Speaker 1: Bill that you also also the right now. No, honestly though,
Speaker 1: because I am a politician and I am running for
Speaker 1: office for me right here in the great state of Idaho,
Speaker 1: the actual bill of the week for me is the
Speaker 1: fact that we have a trigger law that we're fighting
Speaker 1: over right now in the courts and once thirty days
Speaker 1: after the Dobbs decision, pretty much almost any type of abortion.
Speaker 1: Can I say that on the show Do We Care?
Speaker 1: It's your bill, it's your bill, pretty much ditty sort
Speaker 1: of abortion became murder and so uh so, anyway, that's
Speaker 1: my bill of the week because we're just here in Idaho,
Speaker 1: we have we have a we have a bounty law
Speaker 1: that's bigger than Texas is and um, yeah, our bounty
Speaker 1: is bigger than the Texas bounty. We were were special here.
Speaker 1: So that's my bill of the weeks. That's what's got
Speaker 1: my aunties in a twist right now. Al Right, it's
Speaker 1: our first congressional bill. And I was not even it's
Speaker 1: not even Congress. It's like a state Oh, I was
Speaker 1: state bill. Well, I was waiting for some kind of
Speaker 1: law bill bill and politician. That's so interesting. It's exciting
Speaker 1: to have a politician and successful freelance writer on the show. Yeah,
Speaker 1: a little less than two weeks, so we'll see whether
Speaker 1: I actually won. It'll be fun. Yeah, it'll be fun.
Speaker 1: That's amazing. Thank you, Miranda. Um, if you want to
Speaker 1: submit your bill of the week, whether it is congressional bill,
Speaker 1: state bill, your favorite politician named bill, visit Frugal Friends
Speaker 1: podcast dot com, slash bill and leave us your bill.
Speaker 1: And now it's time for pew pew. All right, so
Speaker 1: I'm excited for this question. Um, today's lightning around question.
Speaker 1: If you were to write fiction as a side hustle,
Speaker 1: what genre would your fiction be in fantasy. Oh, quick answer,
Speaker 1: like any type of sub genre for fantasy. Um, I
Speaker 1: like adventure, fantasy, magic, fantasy. No romance up in this business. Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: that would not be mine either. UM, I have nothing
Speaker 1: against romances. If you like a do your thing Jill,
Speaker 1: tell us all the romance you're gonna write, I'm just
Speaker 1: gonna yeah, super silacious. Uh. You know this is not
Speaker 1: something I've ever dreamt about. Um, I don't and I'm
Speaker 1: real zing. I don't engage in fiction really at all
Speaker 1: in any parts of my life. I don't watch fiction,
Speaker 1: I don't read fiction. I don't write fiction. I dreamed
Speaker 1: that you would say children's I was just going to
Speaker 1: say that, though, if I were to write anything, it'd
Speaker 1: be children's books. But I don't even know that I'd
Speaker 1: go the fiction round. I would just like help them,
Speaker 1: like utilize children's story. I mean, yeah, I guess it'd
Speaker 1: be fiction. It would be like children's versions of self help,
Speaker 1: Like how do I deal with this anger that's inside
Speaker 1: of me? How do I deal with my parents who
Speaker 1: keep telling me no I need that. If you are
Speaker 1: a politician in Idaho who has progressive leanings, the angers
Speaker 1: inside you, all the time, and so I could use
Speaker 1: that book. So she needs an adult children's book, that
Speaker 1: is what she needs. Yes, so I okay, So I
Speaker 1: do us into fiction audio books like quite frequently, but
Speaker 1: I have never had a desire to right them. I
Speaker 1: think I would also write children's fiction because there's so
Speaker 1: much annoying like children's fiction out there that I would
Speaker 1: like to write non annoying. I really like Sandra Boynton's
Speaker 1: board books. Uh. They are punny, they are witty, and
Speaker 1: I would like to put more of that into the world. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so that would probably be mine. M wow. She has
Speaker 1: one about emotions, happy hippo, angry ducks. Your emotions, Yeah,
Speaker 1: your your emotions can always change unless you're this duck.
Speaker 1: He's always this way. He's just angry wow and angry
Speaker 1: duck Bill. Yeah. Is that super? Is that penny enough
Speaker 1: for you? Jim? It's amazing. You're gonna be brilliant. You're
Speaker 1: gonna be brilliant. Miranda, thank you so much for coming on. Um,
Speaker 1: where can people get more from you if they want
Speaker 1: to see maybe you're writing or maybe like, do you
Speaker 1: have anything to help freelance writers get started? Where can
Speaker 1: people find more from you? Just head on over to
Speaker 1: Miranda Marquet dot com, where you can see where I
Speaker 1: write about how I use money as a tool to
Speaker 1: live the life that I want, as well as freelancing.
Speaker 1: I do have a lot of stuff on freelancing there
Speaker 1: and some resources and tools that I use as a freelancer,
Speaker 1: so you'll be able to get access to that as well,
Speaker 1: And then you can follow me on Twitter. It's at
Speaker 1: m Marquett. I'm very active on Twitter, and I write
Speaker 1: about freelancing and money on Twitter and share things about
Speaker 1: sometimes about politics on Twitter and specifically things where politics
Speaker 1: are affecting personal finances and life, so that's kind of
Speaker 1: specifically what I focused on when I share politics on Twitter. Awesome,
Speaker 1: thanks for joining us today, Miranda, Yeah, thank you so
Speaker 1: much for having me on. Well, she clearly did it.
Speaker 1: I mean she she started. She started from the bottom,
Speaker 1: meaning baby at home, living off of student loans, and
Speaker 1: and now she's here with yeah, really successful businesses and
Speaker 1: has really grown a career in writing, which might not
Speaker 1: be everyone's goal, but hopefully anyone who's interested in freelance
Speaker 1: writing can find themselves somewhere in her story and take
Speaker 1: some sort of tip with them and a lot of
Speaker 1: the links that Miranda mentioned will have in our show notes.
Speaker 1: So if you're just kind of just dip in your
Speaker 1: toes in the water and trying to figure out where
Speaker 1: would I even get started, um, that's a great place
Speaker 1: as well as the resources Miranda mentioned. Yeah. Absolutely, And
Speaker 1: if you have any questions, uh, you can email me
Speaker 1: to our messages on Instagram and Paula, our social media manager,
Speaker 1: will forward it to me. But yeah, hoping that this
Speaker 1: helps you. Guys, if you need to make extra income
Speaker 1: and you are limited by time or location, this is
Speaker 1: an absolute game changer for people and you can start
Speaker 1: making money quickly with it too. It's not a get
Speaker 1: rich quick scheme, but making six figures with freelance writing,
Speaker 1: especially in the finance niche within three to five years
Speaker 1: is not unheard of. It's actually very common. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: not six figures and six months, but even the people
Speaker 1: who are promising that it's few and far between and
Speaker 1: it doesn't last long. So yeah, just so to find
Speaker 1: somewhere where it is common. That's a definite Like Unicorn,
Speaker 1: and stay tuned for more from our series of other
Speaker 1: types of side hustles. If this one's not for you,
Speaker 1: then fine, keep with with us. Hopefully there'll be something
Speaker 1: in here that does pique your interest. Thank you all
Speaker 1: so much for listening, and we're deciding to go the
Speaker 1: O G route today and share a kind review that
Speaker 1: we recently received. Those kind reviews still do help us.
Speaker 1: Those those five star, those nice words, they are very
Speaker 1: very helpful way to support the show. This one comes
Speaker 1: from Hailey Buggoogle. There's a lot of geese, but I
Speaker 1: think it's just Haley Bug and it says thank you
Speaker 1: with a heart emoji. I'm diving into budgeting and working
Speaker 1: on being debt free. I'm earning that just listening to
Speaker 1: podcasts about these topics is really helpful, even if I
Speaker 1: don't take much from it. Episode to twenty two really
Speaker 1: impacted me. I've been scared to budget because I used
Speaker 1: to be nuts about counting calories and dieting. I restricted
Speaker 1: and said I can't because I'm on a diet. Now
Speaker 1: I have a healthy diet that is balanced and like
Speaker 1: second nature. It took about five years to get the
Speaker 1: hang of it. So I don't restrict, but I am conscious.
Speaker 1: I never thought about budgeting like this. It will take time.
Speaker 1: I'll purge, I'll restrict too much. I'll fall off track,
Speaker 1: but with slow, steady, intentional action, it will become second nature.
Speaker 1: Thank you for the great podcast. I also loved Breaking
Speaker 1: the Cycle of Poverty. It was my first listen and
Speaker 1: I felt immediately seen and related. I'm breaking a lot
Speaker 1: of cycles. I also appreciated when you firstly mentioned your
Speaker 1: own privileges in that episode, something we should always consider
Speaker 1: when giving financial advice. Thank you, ladies Hale. I love
Speaker 1: it you feel seen and I feel seen by you
Speaker 1: in this review, So thank you. Yeah, that episode to
Speaker 1: twenty two that she mentioned stop strict budgeting and start
Speaker 1: living in the radical middle is definitely one of my
Speaker 1: favorite episodes, so I'm glad that that I really impacted you.
Speaker 1: And the one I'm breaking the cycle poverty, we really
Speaker 1: took a lot of care with that one since it
Speaker 1: is such a hot topic with so it's a charged topic.
Speaker 1: I'll say it's a charged topic to tread lightly on it,
Speaker 1: So thank you so much for that. Well, for all
Speaker 1: of you who are listening and might want more, I mean,
Speaker 1: there's plenty of ways to support us, like leaving us
Speaker 1: a kind review, but if you also just want to
Speaker 1: engage with us more and get help on this financial
Speaker 1: journey paying off debt. We do monthly challenges in a
Speaker 1: private community that you could join by heading to Frugal
Speaker 1: Friends podcast dot com slash club see what kind of
Speaker 1: money challenge we have coming up. They're all aimed at
Speaker 1: helping us get better with our finances, pay down debt,
Speaker 1: increase our savings, spend more intentionally and according to our values.
Speaker 1: So if that sounds like something really helpful for you,
Speaker 1: Frugal Friends podcast dot com slash club see you next time.
Speaker 1: Frugal Friends is produced by Eric Sirian. So apparently Jen,
Speaker 1: you and I need to team up, become business partners
Speaker 1: and write a children's book. I think maybe that's our
Speaker 1: our Maybe our second book is maybe a version for children,
Speaker 1: a children's like financial literacy, like super low level, talking
Speaker 1: about our resources, helping kids choose the radical middle is
Speaker 1: that they don't have to be all one way or
Speaker 1: all the other. Isn't that such a like life if
Speaker 1: you realized that when you were a child, how many
Speaker 1: things would it have changed? So many? And children's fiction
Speaker 1: is a lot more profitable than adult nonfiction, So that's
Speaker 1: probably if we want to make money, where we should
Speaker 1: go The children's section at the library is the best
Speaker 1: section at the library. Well, that's probably why it makes
Speaker 1: it's It's the same in Barnes and Noble. Like the
Speaker 1: children's section is always more inviting. Even as an adult,
Speaker 1: I want to go to the colorful section with the
Speaker 1: bean bag chairs and boys. They always have good nooks. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think a good nuck. I love a good knook.
Speaker 1: I figured that's the right reason for the decline in
Speaker 1: adult nonfiction sales. No nooks, that's our feedback for them.
Speaker 1: Get more knooks, you'll get more sales. Amen, you don't
Speaker 1: want to know how to save Barnes and Noble knooks
Speaker 1: good knocks next to your books. Books and books, mm hmm,
Speaker 1: books and knooks. It's an indie bookstore name if I
Speaker 1: ever heard one. I'm going there. See you later, bye,