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Speaker 1: Oh no, it's not Santa, it's Nancy Grace. Are you

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Speaker 1: trying to find the perfect gift for a parent or

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Speaker 1: I sat down with the smartest people in the world

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Speaker 1: learned is so critical and the information so powerful and important.

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Speaker 1: I want you to have it. I want them as

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Speaker 1: parents to have it. Go to crimestops here dot com

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Speaker 1: for a five part series with action information that you

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Speaker 1: Because I have done it myself based on what they

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Speaker 1: have told me. Give that as a gift, not another onesie.

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Speaker 1: Please find out how to protect your child out and

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Speaker 1: about at the mall, at the store, at the grocery store,

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Speaker 1: join the Justice Nation. Crime stops here dot com. God

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Speaker 1: willing Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. And she was Betty

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Speaker 1: was there to help her get recover from her operation.

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Speaker 1: And they were watching TV and there was a knock

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Speaker 1: at the door and Betty went to the door and

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Speaker 1: opened it up, and this man burst in attacked her,

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Speaker 1: and Betty was trying to keep him away from her friend,

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Speaker 1: and he killed her. Betty and then got to her

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Speaker 1: friend and um for some reason left before he could

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Speaker 1: killed her, and then her friend called the police leaded up.

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Speaker 1: That's what I remember, and then he really great, you

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Speaker 1: are hearing a report from Knock Knock the unsolved murders

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Speaker 1: of Betty Jones and Catherine Kraigler. I mean, it's great.

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Speaker 1: This is crime Stories. Thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 1: Straight out to Robin Wilenski, Crime online dot com investigative

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Speaker 1: reporter and author of an incredible book, It's Beautiful Life.

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Speaker 1: The crime scene investigation behind the Casey Anthony murder Case.

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Speaker 1: Robin Wilenski, Let's start at the beginning, these two ladies

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Speaker 1: living together. How were they killed? Oh, this is a

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Speaker 1: horrendous story. So Betty Jones is sixty five years old

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Speaker 1: taking care of her friend Catherine Krigler. I believe it is.

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Speaker 1: She was an eighty one year old woman and she

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Speaker 1: had a leg Nancy that was anti tated. So they're

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Speaker 1: watching television there, they're hanging out doing what elderly people do, relaxing,

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Speaker 1: and they get a knock on the door and this

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Speaker 1: man comes and immediately immediately when she opens the door,

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Speaker 1: Betty's throat is slashed, so she's down on the floor

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Speaker 1: and he goes into the back bedroom and he raped

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Speaker 1: the eighty one year old woman with only one leg,

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Speaker 1: and she manages somewhat. I don't know how, Robin. I've

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Speaker 1: got to ask you a question, how do you even

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Speaker 1: say that? How do you even say that? Because I

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Speaker 1: recall when I first started prosecuting, I would not curse

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Speaker 1: when I first started prosecuting, and I remember the first

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Speaker 1: time I had to stand in front of a jury

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Speaker 1: and it was I guess a rape and murderer, and

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Speaker 1: I had to read a statement and it had every

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Speaker 1: filthy word that you can imagine. The f word, the

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Speaker 1: p is in Peter word, the every word, every word

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Speaker 1: was in there. And you know what, Robin, that time

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Speaker 1: I actually faltered in front of the jury, and I

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Speaker 1: kept going, guess what, George. Next year I had to

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Speaker 1: read it, it wasn't so hard. The next time I

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Speaker 1: had to say it all, it wasn't hard at all.

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Speaker 1: Pretty soon I was just saying it all on my own.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't even reading it anymore. Now. That all came

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Speaker 1: to a screeching halt when I had the twins John,

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Speaker 1: David and Lucy, because I do not want to hear

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Speaker 1: that coming out of their mouth. But Robin Willinski, I

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Speaker 1: always want to slow down because you and I are

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Speaker 1: in the crying business. Guys with me is awesome. Reporter

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Speaker 1: Robin Willinsky, investigative reporter with Crime online dot Com, a

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Speaker 1: renowned DNA expert in forensic science. Kathleen Murphy, North Carolina

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Speaker 1: family lawyer, she knows her stuff. And doctor Michelle Dupree,

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Speaker 1: renowned medical examiner out of South Carolina and author of

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Speaker 1: Homicide Investigation Field Guide. My point that I'm getting at, Robin,

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Speaker 1: is you gave me so much information right there, just

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Speaker 1: rolled off your tongue can't you just slow it down?

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Speaker 1: For me, We're used to it, we live in it

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Speaker 1: every day. But for those joining us, say that again. Place. So,

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Speaker 1: there are two women. One is sixty five years old

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Speaker 1: taking care of her eighty one year old friend. The

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Speaker 1: eighty one year old unfortunately only has one leg. She

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Speaker 1: had one leg that was amputated for a medical reason.

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Speaker 1: And they are home watching TV. The sixty five year

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Speaker 1: old is and there's a knock on the door in

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Speaker 1: their home in Mississippi, and unfortunately for her, for Betty Jones, Nancy,

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Speaker 1: she answers the door and a guy is there standing

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Speaker 1: there with a knife and slips her throat and she

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Speaker 1: collapses on the floor and dies. And this animal goes

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Speaker 1: and rapes an eighty one year old woman. I have

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Speaker 1: an eighty one year old mother. Your mom, Nancy, who

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Speaker 1: I've met, is in her eighties. You cannot even put

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Speaker 1: yourself in this horror of this guy raping your eighty

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Speaker 1: one year old mother. And she struggles and manages after

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Speaker 1: he leaves and takes off with one leg. Think about

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Speaker 1: that one leg hopping along on one leg after being

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Speaker 1: raped at eighty one years old, and manages. It has

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Speaker 1: a presence of mind to get to her in those days.

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Speaker 1: Rotary phone on the wall. This is twenty eight years

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Speaker 1: ago and has the presence of mind to call nine

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Speaker 1: one one. You know what it brings to mind? Kathleen Murphy,

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Speaker 1: North Carolina lawyer. As a prosecutor, you have to go well.

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Speaker 1: As a lawyer, you have to go to CLA continuing

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Speaker 1: a legal education every year. And if you don't go,

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Speaker 1: and especially if you don't pay your bardis, they are

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Speaker 1: about three inches up here, you know what. Okay, they

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Speaker 1: would love to disbar you over a technolity. Oh yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: Forget all the lawyers that are like stealing money or

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Speaker 1: as they like to say, co mingling accounts, or all

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Speaker 1: these men lawyers that forced their domestic clients to have

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Speaker 1: sex before they'll finish the divorce. Yeah, don't worry about that.

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Speaker 1: But if you don't pay your duser, you mesk Cille, honey,

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Speaker 1: you're out. You cannot make a living. So as one,

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Speaker 1: I would always go to prosecutorial continuing legal educations because

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Speaker 1: the cills can last for days and you have to

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Speaker 1: leave work, you have to leave home. You're there all

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Speaker 1: day getting cille. Well, I remember this when it was

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Speaker 1: a pack prosecuting attorney's counsel, Clee. I'm getting to my point.

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Speaker 1: To stick with me, people. This was about the Columbus Strangler,

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Speaker 1: the Columbus Georgia strangler. And as I'm hearing Robin Walinski,

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Speaker 1: oh here come the chill bumps up my arm. As

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Speaker 1: I'm hearing Robin Walinski, Oh here they come on the legs,

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Speaker 1: recount what happened to these two lovely ladies. They sound

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Speaker 1: like the ladies at my hometown church, Liberty United Methodist

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Speaker 1: Church and Making Georgia that have taken care of me

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Speaker 1: and my family for years. Anyway, at this pack seminar,

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Speaker 1: we were talking about the Columbus strangler. This was a

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Speaker 1: guy that would pick out little old ladies elo ells.

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Speaker 1: He would go into their home at night, rape them

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Speaker 1: and strangle them. And I remember I had gotten up

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Speaker 1: to go get some coffee in the seminar was walking

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Speaker 1: back in and it was all dark, and the one

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Speaker 1: minute I was gone, the whole room went dark and

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Speaker 1: there was a screen up and there were the crime

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Speaker 1: scene photos and there was a little old lady on

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Speaker 1: her bed splayed on her bed dead. And I will

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Speaker 1: never forget seeing that photo in thinking who would do

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Speaker 1: this to this little old lady, this sweet a low lady.

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Speaker 1: And it was to the point that when the grandma's

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Speaker 1: that lived alone, their children come check on them at

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Speaker 1: eleven o'clock at night, lock all their doors, and sure

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Speaker 1: enough that would be the one that would die that night.

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Speaker 1: It was like a horror movie. And hearing this reminds

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Speaker 1: me of that Kathleen. The point, one of the points

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Speaker 1: Robin Willinski made is who would pray on an eighty

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Speaker 1: one year old lady this way? Somebody who is obviously

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Speaker 1: obviously has a brain that has dysfunctioned or disconnected from

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Speaker 1: the real world. Somebody who clearly has no remorse, clearly

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Speaker 1: has no sense of right and wrong. This was the

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Speaker 1: Grizzly Murder. I remember this murder because my mother too

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Speaker 1: lived alone. I remember this murder in nineteen ninety one.

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Speaker 1: In the world is wrong with these people? I still

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Speaker 1: feel bad and I can remember it. I had to

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Speaker 1: be in the second or first grade pushing a little

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Speaker 1: girl or get I didn't push her, I got in

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Speaker 1: front of her to go across the monkey bars, and

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Speaker 1: she just looked at me like she was hurt. I

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Speaker 1: still remember that moment. I feel like doodoo. I can't

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Speaker 1: remember the one time one time I hit my sister

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Speaker 1: in the arm and she just looked at me. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: one time, Jackie, Jackie's laughing a rear end off. One

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Speaker 1: time I hit her in the arm and she just

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Speaker 1: looked at me. I never hit her again. I can't

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Speaker 1: remember those. And they bother me. Who would do this thing? Listen?

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Speaker 1: I remember the coroner hand, the sheriff was there too,

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Speaker 1: and the mothers the place. And I say it was

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Speaker 1: one of the worst I am saying some of her

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Speaker 1: the head had ever seen. And it was and I

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Speaker 1: think her anty and and I had told me how

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Speaker 1: that this person whoever had done it, had really, you know,

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Speaker 1: been very brutal, gets trying every way you could be brutal,

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Speaker 1: and had cut her growth that she you know, that

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Speaker 1: she had been a very in struggle. Hi, Nancy Grace here,

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Speaker 1: have you ever googled yourself, your neighbors, somebody at work?

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Speaker 1: A crush? Fifty seven percent of Americans and meant keeping

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Speaker 1: an eye on their own online reputation. Forty six admit

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Speaker 1: to using the Internet to look up somebody from their past.

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Speaker 1: But Google and Facebook the tip of the iceberg when

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Speaker 1: it comes to finding personal information. There's an innovative new

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Speaker 1: website called truth Finder. It's now revealing the full scoop

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Speaker 1: on millions of Americans. Truth Finder can search through hundreds

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Speaker 1: of millions of public records in a matter of minutes.

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Speaker 1: Truth Finder members can literally begin searching in seconds for

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Speaker 1: sense of data, criminal traffic, arrest records. Before you bring

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Speaker 1: someone new into your life and around the people you

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Speaker 1: care for your children, consider using Truthfinder. What you find

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Speaker 1: may astound you. Go to truthfinder dot com forward slash

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Speaker 1: nancy right away to start searching truthfinder dot com forward

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Speaker 1: slash nancy, truthfinder dot com forward slash nancy Find the truth.

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Speaker 1: I'm tired of the hearsay, of the folklore of what happened,

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Speaker 1: and I want to tell for real. I want to

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Speaker 1: talk with people that were there. I want to know

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Speaker 1: what happened that night, what happened on September third, and

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Speaker 1: why haven't we figured out who did this? You had

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Speaker 1: to think about how you were going to tell me

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Speaker 1: that my grandmother had been taken away? For sure? You

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Speaker 1: really want to hear I? Could you sure? I do? Listen, dude,

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Speaker 1: this is pretty this is as bad as it gets.

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Speaker 1: I'm just surprised at what this town really is compared

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Speaker 1: to what I thought it was the fact that it

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Speaker 1: was aboulent death and those things just don't happen. And

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Speaker 1: start with Mississippi, so many pieces of so many people

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Speaker 1: that I don't know, with information that contraduces itself in

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Speaker 1: all these articles, and so it's hard to know where

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Speaker 1: to start. You know, you are hearing Knock Knock, a

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Speaker 1: podcast by the grandson Betty. It's Jason Jones using the

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Speaker 1: podcast medium to try and find answers as to who

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Speaker 1: killed his grandmother. Listen, you know, I still, you know,

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Speaker 1: I still don't want to go in the house. But

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Speaker 1: her throat was slashed and there was just a lot

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Speaker 1: of blood. I don't know if Bettie ever would have

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Speaker 1: thought that I would have been queen, that I would

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Speaker 1: have been here, that I would be here right now,

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Speaker 1: and I how scary that would have been. Whatever, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna arm myself with a couple of microphones in a

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Speaker 1: recorder and go and try to meet people that can

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Speaker 1: get me a step closer not only to my grandmother

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Speaker 1: but also to her killer. I have no idea where

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Speaker 1: this is going to go, and it kind of scares

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Speaker 1: the hell out of her. But I don't think I'm

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Speaker 1: going to merge from this without some scholars. The only

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Speaker 1: thing that lasts are the stories that we tell, and

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Speaker 1: in order for me to tell the story, I've got

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Speaker 1: to do it. Now you are hearing from Knock Knock.

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Speaker 1: It's a serialized true crime podcast, and that was Jason

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Speaker 1: Jones trying to solve the murder of his grandmother, Betty Jones,

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Speaker 1: who died along with her roommate Katherine Kriegler. And to you,

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Speaker 1: Robert Wilensky, investigated reporter with Crime online dot Com. I

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Speaker 1: know that the moment one of them answered the door,

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Speaker 1: the purps slashed her throat. He then went to the

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Speaker 1: back of the home and he raped the eighty one

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Speaker 1: year old grandmother and killed her. But two people died

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Speaker 1: because the l ol, the little ola that answered the

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Speaker 1: door went into such a deep depression after the murder

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Speaker 1: and her own rape, she died as well. Isn't that true,

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Speaker 1: Robin Willinski? It is a Betty Jones. The sixty five

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Speaker 1: year old woman who opened the door was slashed in

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Speaker 1: the throat and was dead there at the scene by

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Speaker 1: the time the police arrived. The eighty one year old

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Speaker 1: woman Catherine who was raped, who was able to call

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Speaker 1: nine one one. She was treated and they did a

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Speaker 1: rape kit and sealed it at the hospital, and then

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Speaker 1: she later went to a home. She could no longer

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Speaker 1: live alone. That's why she was living with this woman.

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Speaker 1: And she went to a home and just two months

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Speaker 1: later passed away. You know, I've been listening to this

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Speaker 1: guy's podcast and it is incredible. You know, it shows

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Speaker 1: me that, you know, in my own life, after I

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Speaker 1: became a victim of violent crime, you never This is

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Speaker 1: her grandson, Jason Jones, This is Betty's grandson. He didn't

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Speaker 1: get over it. He kept looking for answers to Robin Wilinsky,

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Speaker 1: what is it that made him keep going? We've seen

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Speaker 1: it so many times with crime victims' families. I think

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Speaker 1: that there's this very deep, very very deep, what I

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Speaker 1: call the need to know. And you love someone so

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Speaker 1: much and you have all these scenarios in your mind

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Speaker 1: as to what happens, and you know, the movie of

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Speaker 1: all these different ways that the person could have died

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Speaker 1: and suffered, just it goes through your mind over and

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Speaker 1: over like an old VHS tape that's stuck in a machine.

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Speaker 1: Nancy right, and it keeps going and going in a loop.

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Speaker 1: But they really want to get to the truth, and

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Speaker 1: so the relatives of the deceased never stop looking, never

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Speaker 1: stop until they get the answer. With me now, George

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Speaker 1: Skiro DNA expert and forensic scientists, what would do you

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Speaker 1: make of this crime scene? George S. Giro, Well, that's

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Speaker 1: it was a very brutal crime scene from what I've

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Speaker 1: I've heard. I've worked closely with the Startville Police Department

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Speaker 1: on this case for a number of years. Our lab

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Speaker 1: back in two thousand and five was the first one

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Speaker 1: to develop a profile from a semen stain that was

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Speaker 1: associated with miss Kriegler. What do you mean by a profile?

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Speaker 1: A profile? It is a DNA profile. It's essentially a

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Speaker 1: series of numbers that show various locations on a DNA

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Speaker 1: molecule that will allow us to identify an individual. In

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Speaker 1: this case, we had a semen stain from an unknown individual.

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Speaker 1: Doctor bos Scales, who was then director, had developed that

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Speaker 1: profile and that profile was here and throughout the years,

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Speaker 1: the Starkville Police Department was submitting samples of potential suspects

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Speaker 1: throughout the years uh to see if they matched this

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Speaker 1: particular profile and throughout the years UM leading up until

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Speaker 1: twenty eighteen, there were no identifications to this profile. This

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Speaker 1: profile was in CODAS, there were no hits in codis UM,

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Speaker 1: so this this profile remained unknown for at least thirteen years. Now.

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Speaker 1: When you say CODAS, explain. CODAS is the Combined DNA

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Speaker 1: Index System and that is a database program that UM

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Speaker 1: houses DNA profiles from typically from convicted offenders, from crime

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Speaker 1: scene samples, and from arrestees UM that is used UH

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Speaker 1: crime labs used that database to search UH for unknown

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Speaker 1: UM unknown DNA profiles found at crime scenes to see

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Speaker 1: if they can't get a match to an individual within

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Speaker 1: that database. Two holderly woman dat one brutally murder the

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Speaker 1: other alert to dial nine one one and the gruesome

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Speaker 1: killer still remains unknown. And although this happened almost three

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Speaker 1: decades ago, investigators and family of the victims are not

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Speaker 1: letting this case go unsolved. I'm just opened to faceball

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Speaker 1: to day and like several years a single man, I

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Speaker 1: just feel like a failure sometimes for not being able

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Speaker 1: to solve it. Labor Day in nineteen ninety a man

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Speaker 1: entered the home of sixty five year old Catherine Kriggler.

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Speaker 1: She was raped and strangled. He passed out with broken bones,

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Speaker 1: but when she woke up, she was able to call

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Speaker 1: nine and then he I Krigler died from her injuries

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Speaker 1: and deep depression months later. Her friend, though eighty one

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Speaker 1: year old Betty Jones, did not have much time to think.

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Speaker 1: The killer immediately stabbed her several times in the neck.

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Speaker 1: You are hearing reports from our friends Simone Woolridge at

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Speaker 1: WRGTV reporting on the murders of Betty Jones and Katherine Kraigler.

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Speaker 1: Betty's grandson launches a podcast not not to try to

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Speaker 1: revive interest in his grandmother's death. Take a listen to

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Speaker 1: Simone Woolridge. Who is this person responsible for this horrendous murder?

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Speaker 1: And why were Krigler and Jones the chosen ones? The

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Speaker 1: man walked away with just a couple of bucks and

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Speaker 1: a memento. He got in the house and he asked

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Speaker 1: a question like where is the silver, and like here

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Speaker 1: there to rob. He immediately kills the victim and he

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Speaker 1: doesn't take anything with twenty dollars. Police say sexual homicides

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Speaker 1: of the elderly only occur in three percent of homicide cases,

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Speaker 1: and scary enough statistics show that most suspects know their victim.

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Speaker 1: You kind of feel like you're walking through a dream

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Speaker 1: and you're going to wake up and everything's gonna be fun.

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Speaker 1: I remember telling my mom get dressed, Let's go get her.

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Speaker 1: She's okay. Be back. In twenty fifteen, was to Sergeant

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Speaker 1: Bill Lott of the Startpall Police Department. I had randomly

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Speaker 1: set up a Google alert for the keywords Betty Jones,

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Speaker 1: Labor Day murders, and Starkwall, Mississippi, and out of the blue,

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Speaker 1: one day, I received a notification that there was a

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Speaker 1: brand new press release from the Starkwall Police Department. A

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Speaker 1: few days later, I called Sergeant Lott and he was

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Speaker 1: gracious enough to take my call, and since then he

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Speaker 1: has been so helpful to me, my family, and the

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Speaker 1: Kriggler family, providing information on the work both he and

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Speaker 1: the SPD are doing to help solve this crime. You're

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Speaker 1: hearing Betty's grandson, Jason Jones and then a break in

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Speaker 1: the case. Listen. I was absolutely floored and just stunned.

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Speaker 1: This has been a tad story in my life since

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Speaker 1: I was ten. Jason E. Jones has been looking for

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Speaker 1: answers for much of his life after the death of

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Speaker 1: his step grandmother, Betty Jones. The parents didn't want to

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Speaker 1: talk to me about it because there was nothing really

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Speaker 1: to tell. He started a podcast with his brother in

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Speaker 1: hopes of finding out more. He says his family was

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Speaker 1: thrilled to hear that suspect Michael Devon was arrested in

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Speaker 1: the nearly three decade long case. Zero credit goes to

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Speaker 1: our podcast for the apprehension of this suspect. The credit

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Speaker 1: goes to the startful police department. Joining me right now,

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Speaker 1: renowned forensic scientist George Skiro, who worked on the case

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Speaker 1: for such a long time. George Skiro explain what happened

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Speaker 1: and how it was done. First of all, Nancy credit

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Speaker 1: has to go to the Starkville Police Department for never

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Speaker 1: letting go of this case, in particularly Sergeant Bill Lott,

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Speaker 1: who has always been progressive on this case and was

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Speaker 1: always looking at the science and seeing where things were

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Speaker 1: progressing to. Eventually, Sergeant lot Uh partnered up with Parabond,

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Speaker 1: which is a company that does they do phenotyping of

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Speaker 1: DNA where they look for certain characteristics such as hair color,

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Speaker 1: eye color, facial shape, that sort of thing, and in

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Speaker 1: particularly they also edit a new component to their tests.

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Speaker 1: It's a forensic genealogy component which Sergeant Lot latched onto

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Speaker 1: that and we were able to provide the sample from

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Speaker 1: that unknown DNA sample that we had developed us in

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Speaker 1: two thousand and five. We're able to provide that to

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Speaker 1: Parabond and they were then able to generate a lead

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Speaker 1: for Sergeant Lot to follow up them. So how does

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Speaker 1: it work towards Hero? Essentially, what they do is Parabond

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Speaker 1: takes the DNA sample and they look at many different

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Speaker 1: sites on that DNA molecule to create probably an approximation

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Speaker 1: of what that person might look like. And then what

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Speaker 1: they can do is they can take these uh, forensic

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Speaker 1: genealogy markers that are out out there in public accessible

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Speaker 1: databases where people put their genealogy information from where they're

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Speaker 1: trying to find lost relatives or you know, see who

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Speaker 1: they are related to or you know, see their ancestry,

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Speaker 1: and they're able to put this information into those genealogy

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Speaker 1: databases to see if they could come up with perhaps

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Speaker 1: a family member or someone who may have put their

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Speaker 1: DNA profile into this database to see if there's a

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Speaker 1: possibility of a relative or that particular person being in

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Speaker 1: that database too. Robin Malinski, Crime online dot Com investigative

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Speaker 1: reporter explained to me the break in the case. Who

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Speaker 1: is Michael Wayne Devon. Well, he is the fifty two

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Speaker 1: year old man who is being held responsible for this.

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Speaker 1: He's being held Nancy on eleven million dollar bond and

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Speaker 1: the DNA proves that it's him. The long arm of

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Speaker 1: the law got this guy. What we know about this guy,

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Speaker 1: Michael Wayne de Vaughn, who managed to elude murder charge

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Speaker 1: for over twenty eight years, but not allude modern technology,

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Speaker 1: The advancements in DNA testing, specifically genetic genealogy crack this case.

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Speaker 1: The same thing happened to George skiro DNA expert in

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Speaker 1: forensic scientists in the Golden State killer case, explain, Yes,

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Speaker 1: in the Golden State killer case, very much the same

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Speaker 1: type of analysis was done. What they did was they

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Speaker 1: had a pure DNA sample that they found in storage,

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Speaker 1: They took that they ran with a forensic genealogy company.

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Speaker 1: They then searched and they found relatives close to the

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Speaker 1: man who was eventually identified Joseph James DeAngelo. And they

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Speaker 1: did that again through this uh, you know, looking at

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Speaker 1: locations and doing genealogy research. Essentially to find this person

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Speaker 1: through potential relative. You know, this guy who looks exactly

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Speaker 1: why the composite I might act divold had never been

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Speaker 1: a suspect until genealogy. And I'm talking about ancestry, dot

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Speaker 1: com things like that. Those public websites put police onto

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Speaker 1: his trail. Earlier this year, police send the DNA taken

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Speaker 1: from the murder scene of these two old grandma's little

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Speaker 1: low ladies. Took the evidence, the DNA profile to Parabond.

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Speaker 1: As George Kiro was just describing, it's a private genetic

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Speaker 1: company and they compared the DNA found at the scene

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Speaker 1: it was seaman from the rape to a public genealogy

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Speaker 1: DNA database. I was recently on Doctor Oz speaking with

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Speaker 1: the detective that did the very same thing in the

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Speaker 1: Golden State killer case. And it is amazing the way

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Speaker 1: it works. Kathleen Murphy, North Carolina family lawyer, is that

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Speaker 1: people send in their DNA to find out their genealogy,

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Speaker 1: where they come from, how much Irish are they, how

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Speaker 1: much African are they, how much does how much that?

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Speaker 1: And what that does is it identifies relatives, even distant relatives. Now,

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Speaker 1: I thought what the cops did was they go to

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Speaker 1: those relatives and interview them and isolate who could be

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Speaker 1: a suspect. But what they really do is they go

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Speaker 1: way way back and they start the family tree based

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Speaker 1: on the DNA at the scene and come up with

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Speaker 1: the killer. It's actually very intricate, but they're getting at

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Speaker 1: all things like ancestry dot Com. Kathleen, thank god for

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Speaker 1: all the scientists that are making this dream come true,

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Speaker 1: because again, this was such a grisly murder and we

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Speaker 1: have so many wonderful people on your panel and so

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00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 1: many other wonderful scientists doing the work that needed to

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00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:46,120
Speaker 1: be done. Back to George Guiro, DNA expert and forensic scientist.

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Speaker 1: You know, the law protects you from police intrusion, like

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00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 1: the police can't force you to give DNA unless they've

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00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 1: got a warrant. But the law doesn't protect you or

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00:29:56,920 --> 00:30:00,360
Speaker 1: one of your relatives, maybe a distant relative, from ending

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00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 1: in their DNA from a bugle swab, which is a

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00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 1: mouth swab, and thereby getting you busted. The announcement came

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00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 1: on Betty Jones's birthday. George, yes it did. We had

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00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:17,000
Speaker 1: actually worked with the Starkville Police Department when they had

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00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 1: submitted to the lab I think it was on Friday afternoon,

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00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 1: an item that was discarded by mister Devon, and we

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00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 1: were able to work it overnight and get them results

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00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 1: by Saturday morning, identifying him to the two thousand and

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00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,280
Speaker 1: five profile that we had developed here at the lab.

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00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 1: Now that Devon has been named a suspect, police are

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00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:40,000
Speaker 1: asking anyone who has information about the crime or Dvaun

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00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 1: to contact Starkville PD. The tip line is six six

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00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,400
Speaker 1: two three two three four one three one six six

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00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:51,600
Speaker 1: two three two three four one three one. Take a

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00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 1: listen to Betty's grandson as he reacts to solving the

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00:30:55,880 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 1: case of his murdered grandma, and I was absolutely floored

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00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 1: and just stunned. This has been a taboo story in

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00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 1: my life since I was ten. The parents didn't want

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00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:09,720
Speaker 1: to talk to me about it because there was nothing

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00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 1: really to tell. The zero credit goes to our podcast

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00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:18,080
Speaker 1: for the apprehension of this suspect on the credit goes

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00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 1: to the Startful police Department. I'm sorry his life led

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00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,080
Speaker 1: him to feel like he had to make those types

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00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:28,360
Speaker 1: of choices. Always thought of this guy as being a monster.

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00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 1: He was the boogeyman behind the closet door personified Nancy

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Speaker 1: Grace Crime Stories, signing off goodbye for him,