1 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: You're listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast DAM 2 00:00:04,800 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 1: Paranormal podcast network, where we offer you podcasts of the paranormal, supernatural, 3 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: and the unexplained. Get ready now for Beyond Contact with 4 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 1: Captain Wrong. 5 00:00:21,360 --> 00:00:24,639 Speaker 2: Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and 6 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:28,680 Speaker 2: opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions 7 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:33,920 Speaker 2: only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast 8 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 2: to Coast AM, employees of Premiere Networks, or their sponsors 9 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 2: and associates. We would like to encourage you to do 10 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 2: your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself. 11 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 3: Hey everyone, it's Captain ron and each week i'd be 12 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 3: Beyond Contact. We'll explore the latest news in upology, discuss 13 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 3: some of the classic cases, and bring you the latest 14 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 3: information from the newest cases as we talk with the 15 00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:11,479 Speaker 3: top experts. 16 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:16,040 Speaker 1: Welcome to Beyond Contact on Captain RONA. Today we're going 17 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: to be speaking with Rich Hoffman from the Scientific Coalition 18 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 1: for UAP Studies. Mister Hoffman's worked as a defense coordinator 19 00:01:22,560 --> 00:01:25,399 Speaker 1: for over twenty years, working primarily for the Army Material 20 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 1: Command Headquarters, with a variety of companies. He spent over 21 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:33,679 Speaker 1: sixty years investigating, researching, and lecturing on the subject of UFOs. 22 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:37,959 Speaker 1: He's investigated over a thousand cases and reviewed many of 23 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:41,840 Speaker 1: the cases from MUFON, Project Bluebook and other databases. In 24 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:45,400 Speaker 1: twenty seventeen, Richard and a few others formed the Scientific 25 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 1: Coalition for UAP Studies. This is a think tank comprised 26 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 1: of scientists, industry professionals, academics and researchers who are dedicated 27 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 1: to applying the scientific principles to the study of this phenomenon. Hi, 28 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 1: rich welcome to Beyond Contact. It's such a pleasure to 29 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 1: have you. 30 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 4: Oh well, it's a pleasure being on. It's good seeing you. 31 00:02:06,080 --> 00:02:09,120 Speaker 1: Good seeing you, sir. Listen, you've been looking at this 32 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,600 Speaker 1: for sixty years, which is incredible. You know, you guys, 33 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 1: you started in the sixties, which is a great time 34 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 1: because that's when Betty and Barney Hill came out, Lonnie 35 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:21,839 Speaker 1: Zamora came out, and you had this formation of well 36 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,240 Speaker 1: precursor to MOUFON, and you were an early member of that. 37 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:29,760 Speaker 1: Then in twenty seventeen you and four other guys branched 38 00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 1: out of Moufon and formed your own separate group. And 39 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: that's the scu that we're talking about, and that just 40 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:38,880 Speaker 1: happened to be the same year the New York Times 41 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:42,040 Speaker 1: article came out and the formation of to the Stars 42 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 1: and everything really changed in our community. That was really 43 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:47,880 Speaker 1: a watershed year for us, don't you think. 44 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 4: Oh, without a doubt. Yeah. I mean to me, I 45 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 4: like this, you know, like from nineteen sixty nine when 46 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:58,360 Speaker 4: the Project Bluebook was terminated to now twenty seventeen, I 47 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:02,640 Speaker 4: call those time periods in there of the scientific dark Ages, 48 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 4: And to me, it was a situation where, you know, 49 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 4: obviously our legs scientifically were knocked out from underneath this. 50 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 4: There's nothing to it. The National Academy of Science has 51 00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:13,920 Speaker 4: blessed it and said that there was nothing. You know, 52 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:16,239 Speaker 4: don't study it. You know, there's nothing to it. There's 53 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 4: no concern for our defense industry to worry about. There's 54 00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 4: no threat, you know, and all this other stuff. Right, So, 55 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:24,640 Speaker 4: I mean, the bottom line that they shut down the 56 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 4: project that they said, yeah, barely at nothing. And if 57 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 4: you think about it, a lot of things like the 58 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:33,399 Speaker 4: nuclear you know, visits and stuff like that by these 59 00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:36,240 Speaker 4: objects was going on after Bluebook. Well it was before 60 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:38,440 Speaker 4: it too, but I mean, but afterward there were a 61 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 4: lot of those things that were going on, and there 62 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:44,280 Speaker 4: was no project, if you would, that was allegedly there 63 00:03:44,320 --> 00:03:47,400 Speaker 4: doing it right. So then we learned, you know, in 64 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 4: twenty seventeen about this a TIP program and this OFFSET 65 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 4: program that was in existence and had been there from 66 00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 4: about the time of two thousand and nine, roughly two 67 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:02,400 Speaker 4: thousand and eight nine. And of course you know, they 68 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:06,040 Speaker 4: were connected with bass over into even Mofon at that time, 69 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:08,400 Speaker 4: you know, and wanting to use Moufon to be able 70 00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:11,800 Speaker 4: to collect information on in terms of cases. So it 71 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:14,240 Speaker 4: was all that stuff going on in the background where 72 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:16,920 Speaker 4: you suspected that there was something else going on, but 73 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 4: you didn't have any confirmation. And then of course then 74 00:04:19,360 --> 00:04:22,599 Speaker 4: we hear you know, Lou and then Leslie Kane and 75 00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:24,960 Speaker 4: all those people talking about it in the New York Times, 76 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:28,520 Speaker 4: and you're going to say, yes, there really is something there. 77 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:32,040 Speaker 4: And and then what we started to see even at 78 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 4: that point, and this is like you said that this 79 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,279 Speaker 4: is about time we were starting this scientific coalition for 80 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:39,920 Speaker 4: UAP studies. But bottom line was that we started to 81 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:43,120 Speaker 4: see scientists in academia now coming out of the closet 82 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:47,359 Speaker 4: wanting to embrace the topic, wanting to talk about it openly, 83 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 4: wanting to publish papers, and so now they could do it. 84 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:54,280 Speaker 4: You know, there was like top cover the government said 85 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 4: that they're real. Hey guess what you know, I could 86 00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:58,480 Speaker 4: write about it now right exactly. 87 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:01,119 Speaker 1: You know, your group is comprised of over three hundred 88 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:05,200 Speaker 1: and some scientists worldwide. I understand thirty one percent of 89 00:05:05,200 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 1: those are PhDs, over fifty six percent have advanced degrees. 90 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 1: So I'm really impressed with this whole idea of your organization. 91 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 1: I really really, it's right up my alley. But you know, 92 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 1: as big as your group is becoming, it still seems 93 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 1: to me that there's a large part of the scientific 94 00:05:21,240 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 1: community that are still not embracing this topic in earnest 95 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 1: what do you think. 96 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:29,280 Speaker 4: Well, it's changing, so like you know, now you've got 97 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 4: universities like the University of Wurtzburg in Germany, who is 98 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 4: actually being funded by the university to do research. And 99 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:38,159 Speaker 4: then if you take a look at Project Galileo with 100 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:41,720 Speaker 4: Abi Loebe, I mean that's that's basically like you know, 101 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 4: Harvard is now out there like looking into the subject. 102 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 4: So we're starting to see a change in that whole 103 00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:53,039 Speaker 4: posture and the stigma around it has changed and it's 104 00:05:53,080 --> 00:05:56,279 Speaker 4: becoming more available to But yeah, there's always going to 105 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:57,919 Speaker 4: be a stigma. I mean, you're going to have a 106 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:00,359 Speaker 4: good part of the population. I mean, we still have 107 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:02,479 Speaker 4: even pilots that don't want to talk about it. You 108 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:05,040 Speaker 4: still have, you know, military people that don't want to 109 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:08,080 Speaker 4: talk about it and they feel awkward. It's going to 110 00:06:08,120 --> 00:06:11,960 Speaker 4: take a time period before that really changes in our culture. 111 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:13,640 Speaker 4: I guess if you would sure that. 112 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:16,320 Speaker 1: Just lasted a long time. We're just coming out of 113 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:18,440 Speaker 1: it now twenty seven. Yeah, you know, I'm glad you 114 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: mentioned the Galileo project because I'm a big supporter of 115 00:06:21,120 --> 00:06:23,800 Speaker 1: that as well. I just had Avi lob On here recently, 116 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:26,159 Speaker 1: and I think he's fantastic, and I wanted to ask 117 00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:28,400 Speaker 1: you about that. There are very there are a few 118 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:32,280 Speaker 1: of these really high profile scientists that do look at 119 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:36,039 Speaker 1: this subject in earnest for example, a Vi Lobe, Jacques Valet, 120 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 1: help put Off, Gary Nolan, Kevin Kanuuth. There's a bunch 121 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 1: of these guys. How do you think they impact the 122 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 1: dissemination of information on the topic. 123 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 4: We just finished up a big paper with Kevin Kanouth 124 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:52,280 Speaker 4: in which we had I think something like twenty co authors. 125 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 4: I was one of them, and it's now finally getting published. 126 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 4: So I mean, what I'm starting to see more and 127 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:04,039 Speaker 4: more is that papers are being accepted by journals and 128 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:06,840 Speaker 4: the fact that you have now like you know, the 129 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:12,120 Speaker 4: Soul Foundation, which is against you know, focusing on academia 130 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:15,200 Speaker 4: and bringing academia to the forefront, and a lot of 131 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:18,960 Speaker 4: others are doing the same thing. The Society for UAP 132 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 4: Studies is doing the same kind of thing. We're kind 133 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 4: of doing the same thing as well. So we're starting 134 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,160 Speaker 4: to see that trend. And it's also going over into 135 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 4: other countries as well. So you're starting to see now 136 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 4: a collection and work, we're connecting with other countries like 137 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 4: South America. We're connecting better with Europe now you know 138 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:41,560 Speaker 4: c S which is the Sigma H Sigma two I 139 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 4: think in which is the CNS is also a part 140 00:07:45,160 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 4: of the Space program over there. But bottom line is 141 00:07:48,600 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 4: we've used Sigma two, we've had we're already participating in 142 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:55,160 Speaker 4: their conferences and stuff like that, so we're starting to 143 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 4: see that that changing. It's just it's a very positive time. 144 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:02,559 Speaker 4: I think with the attention you're going to you're seeing 145 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:05,640 Speaker 4: on the hill. That bottom line is you're going to 146 00:08:05,640 --> 00:08:09,120 Speaker 4: start to see more and more even discussions than what 147 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 4: we've even got now going on, which I'm excited about. 148 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:14,360 Speaker 1: I love it. Do you you've been looking at this for 149 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: over sixty years now in general? Have you noticed a 150 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 1: change in the phenomenon over that time, Like the belief 151 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 1: system seems to have evolved over that span, hasn't it. 152 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 4: So yeah, I mean I definitely in sixty years, I've 153 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:32,280 Speaker 4: seen cultural changes. I've seen, you know, the topic go 154 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 4: through different kinds of like you know, metamorphoses if you would, 155 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:38,320 Speaker 4: if you think about it in the in my early 156 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:40,960 Speaker 4: days and stuff like that, what you had was a 157 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:44,840 Speaker 4: situation where flying saucers were the rage, you know, and 158 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:48,920 Speaker 4: there were UFOs and okay, well you know what are those? 159 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:51,440 Speaker 4: And you would have all different kinds of people. But 160 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 4: you know, then you had a project that was stood 161 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 4: up project you know, all the different projects, project signed, 162 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 4: project garage, and all those other things that were going on. 163 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 4: But even if you take a look at that time 164 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:05,439 Speaker 4: period and you look at project bluebook cases, they were 165 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 4: only like about twelve thousand over that long period of time. Well, 166 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 4: who who contacts the government, Who trust the government to 167 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 4: be able to for me to tell the story right, So. 168 00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:21,840 Speaker 1: It took me in those times like you mentioned, yeah, 169 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:23,840 Speaker 1: it was way down it was today. They didn't have 170 00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:27,560 Speaker 1: social media, they didn't have computers, they didn't have the Internet, that's. 171 00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:30,560 Speaker 4: Correct, and you know, so now you have is this 172 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:33,600 Speaker 4: change where we've got technology that's creeped up on us 173 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:36,800 Speaker 4: and it's more capable than ever. So if you think 174 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 4: about it, like then, I didn't have a cell phone camera, 175 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 4: you know, or anything like that. I barely had a 176 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 4: tape recorder to be able to go and record people. 177 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:47,320 Speaker 4: When I was actually doing my case investigations, I was 178 00:09:47,400 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 4: usually like having people, you know, use pencils to try 179 00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:53,679 Speaker 4: to draw what they saw, right, or something of that nature. Well, 180 00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:57,679 Speaker 4: we've gone from anecdotal kinds of things with occasionally you know, 181 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 4: a bus brownie camera taking a photo of it to 182 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:05,280 Speaker 4: suddenly now what we've got are like way advanced technologies 183 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 4: in the hands of everybody that can now do something 184 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 4: and actually see things in you know, different parts of 185 00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 4: the spectrum like you know, my camera will I've got 186 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:18,920 Speaker 4: one of these things that can actually do IR. So 187 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 4: I'm infra red. So you're starting to see more and 188 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,200 Speaker 4: more of that creeping in, which is giving us the 189 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 4: fact that it's not just you know, anecdotal anymore. It's 190 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:31,600 Speaker 4: actually legitimate people that have recorded something or have a 191 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:32,840 Speaker 4: good device that can do it. 192 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: I like to have that footage and it corresponds with 193 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:38,319 Speaker 1: their story. We have both. We've got to take a 194 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:40,120 Speaker 1: break right here. Rich. When we come back, we're going 195 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:43,880 Speaker 1: to talk to you more about the SCU organization and 196 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 1: how the Condon Report from nineteen sixty nine affected the 197 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:50,960 Speaker 1: scientific community both then and even up till today. Nearly 198 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 1: you're listening to Beyond Contact on the iHeartRadio and Coast 199 00:10:54,000 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 1: to Coast AM Paranormal podcast network. We are back on 200 00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:17,160 Speaker 1: Beyond Contact. I'm Captain Ron. I have the pleasure of 201 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,920 Speaker 1: speaking with Rich Hoffman. Rich, you know you were starting 202 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 1: out investigating UFOs and right in nineteen sixty nine is 203 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 1: when the famous Condon Report was released. Can you tell 204 00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 1: us how your thoughts are on how that affected the 205 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 1: scientific community from studying this. 206 00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 4: Well, let me tell you, I think a lot of 207 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:40,000 Speaker 4: us at that time were hoping, much like we're hoping 208 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:44,080 Speaker 4: today for disclosure, right, So, we were all anticipating the 209 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 4: fact that it was finally going to get some serious treatment. 210 00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:49,600 Speaker 4: There was a two year study by the University of Colorado, 211 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:52,160 Speaker 4: and certainly we tried to be able to push the 212 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 4: better cases off to them, which a lot of them dismissed. 213 00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:58,360 Speaker 4: And you had Condon out there controlling it and controlling 214 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 4: the narrative on it and probably didn't, you know, learn 215 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:03,240 Speaker 4: to put this thing aside. So even if you look 216 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:06,280 Speaker 4: at that with the trick memo that was out where 217 00:12:06,480 --> 00:12:08,480 Speaker 4: it basically said we're we're going to look like we're 218 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:10,679 Speaker 4: scientific and you know, and all this other stuff and 219 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 4: we'll come to a conclusion that says that there's nothing 220 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:14,199 Speaker 4: to it, right, So. 221 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:17,839 Speaker 1: It wasn't the conclusion made before they wrote the report completely. 222 00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:20,040 Speaker 4: But bottom line, if you look at like Jacques vilet, 223 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:22,280 Speaker 4: if you look at Heinik and all those people, they 224 00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 4: were trying to be able to, you know, give them 225 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 4: the better cases, have them look into them, help them 226 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:29,679 Speaker 4: out any way they could. They were dismissing it. And 227 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:32,959 Speaker 4: so you had Condon going out and basically putting this 228 00:12:33,240 --> 00:12:36,320 Speaker 4: big thick document to go this book together, if you would, 229 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:39,880 Speaker 4: on the topic of the results, and the vast majority 230 00:12:39,920 --> 00:12:42,280 Speaker 4: of it was like, you know why what's a sun dog? 231 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:43,800 Speaker 4: How do you get a sun dog? How do you 232 00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:47,079 Speaker 4: get a mirage? And all this other stuff, right, and 233 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 4: then you find out that they don't even account for 234 00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:52,240 Speaker 4: thirty percent of the cases that they didn't look at. 235 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 1: Thirty percent of the cases are not solved. Even if 236 00:12:55,679 --> 00:12:58,079 Speaker 1: it's not a blue book, they used that as a thing. Well, 237 00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 1: project Bluebook was out there, and there's six percent of 238 00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:02,719 Speaker 1: those I think that weren't solved. 239 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:05,600 Speaker 4: So here's this this thing. Thirty percent of the cases 240 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:07,720 Speaker 4: they didn't they couldn't even come to a conclusion on. 241 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 4: And so you know, wait a minute. You know you 242 00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 4: didn't do your homework, you didn't do your job. But 243 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 4: in the beginning of it, I'm going to write this 244 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:16,920 Speaker 4: wonderful executive summary that says it's all just there's nothing 245 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,360 Speaker 4: to it. So then you have the National Academy of 246 00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 4: Scientists Sciences that actually blesses that serious report that's done 247 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 4: and yay verily, and then you clamp down on any 248 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:30,920 Speaker 4: research that's done by scientists, and you go in, like 249 00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:33,320 Speaker 4: I said, to the dark ages. You know you're now 250 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:35,760 Speaker 4: you can't even talk about it in the hallways. You 251 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 4: can't have water cooler conversation. 252 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: Didn't they even say it's a waste of time and 253 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:42,440 Speaker 1: energy for science to investigate it, like they clat out 254 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: discourage scientists for doing this exactly. 255 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 4: It was that emphatic, it was and it was like 256 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:49,840 Speaker 4: and then also to make the claim that there's you know, 257 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 4: we can't explain thirty percent of the cases. It means 258 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 4: we don't know what these objects are, but yet there's 259 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:57,360 Speaker 4: no threat to national security. 260 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:01,800 Speaker 1: Rich, they said there's three we can't identify. I'd say, hey, 261 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:05,880 Speaker 1: that's a problem. Yeah, it's thirty percent. That's alarming. It 262 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:09,199 Speaker 1: almost is for the other side, if you think about it. 263 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:11,640 Speaker 1: I want to ask you this, Rich, there's uh you 264 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: touched on it in the last segment. How I want 265 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:17,800 Speaker 1: to know how you feel about these other governmental attempts 266 00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 1: at studying the subject. As you mentioned, there was Project 267 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 1: Sign and Grunge and Blue Book, you know up until 268 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:27,200 Speaker 1: eight tip. What do you think of those those attempts. 269 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:29,760 Speaker 4: Well, again, I think in the earlier days it was 270 00:14:29,800 --> 00:14:32,680 Speaker 4: a situation where there was almost like a foregone conclusion 271 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 4: that it's just a waste of time and people are 272 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 4: misidentifying stuff, and so that it really didn't get a 273 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:41,600 Speaker 4: lot of serious treatment. In my estimation, I think, you know, 274 00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 4: you had a couple of congressional hearings like you know, 275 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:47,760 Speaker 4: Gerald Ford had one and stuff like that. You had 276 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:51,000 Speaker 4: a number of other like the Stirruck Committee, you had the 277 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:53,960 Speaker 4: Robertson panel and all these other different kinds of things 278 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:56,200 Speaker 4: where there was attempts to be able to treat it 279 00:14:56,240 --> 00:15:02,920 Speaker 4: seriously that were not really well done. Okay, and again, 280 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 4: you know, let me go back to the fact that 281 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 4: that's the time period when we had largely just anecdotal 282 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 4: testimony testimony, right, and so you can't do as a scientist, 283 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:16,000 Speaker 4: you can't do much with just somebody saying, hi, I 284 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:17,480 Speaker 4: saw lights last night. 285 00:15:17,640 --> 00:15:20,400 Speaker 1: You know, what can you do with that? Exactly that much? 286 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:20,960 Speaker 4: What are you gonna do? 287 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 1: Right? Yeah? 288 00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:25,320 Speaker 4: Right, So now you're going to start scientific data. You 289 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 4: need the instrumentation, you need all that technical data that 290 00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:32,360 Speaker 4: can look in different parts of the spectrum, that can 291 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,920 Speaker 4: listen to infrasound or you know, other kinds of things. 292 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 4: And so now we're starting to see those use signals 293 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 4: intelligence and measures intelligence that we're able to now learn 294 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:48,000 Speaker 4: more about these objects than we could before. 295 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: After after all of these programs, you're referring to then 296 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:53,600 Speaker 1: we come out with a few years ago with Arrow, 297 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: which seems like a suspect group with me, haven't you 298 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,240 Speaker 1: guys done something with them? We're given them some data? 299 00:15:58,640 --> 00:15:59,120 Speaker 1: How is that? 300 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:03,840 Speaker 4: Well? We're so we're forging a relationship with EROW. We've 301 00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 4: been always encouraging the fact that there needs to be 302 00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 4: a very serious attempt at looking at this, and so 303 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:13,600 Speaker 4: we've been in contact with the various people at ARROW. 304 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 4: We're actually having a lot of positive, very positive interactions 305 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 4: with them. Now where we had a lot of our 306 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:23,800 Speaker 4: papers that we published were actually we found out that 307 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 4: they were being fed up to the government. So we 308 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 4: were encouraged by the fact that we're some of our 309 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,920 Speaker 4: papers are getting up, like the Limits Report and our 310 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 4: intention study and stuff like that, are starting to get 311 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:38,240 Speaker 4: traction up on the hill and to various other intelligence 312 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 4: services and stuff. 313 00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:42,920 Speaker 5: So we're excited about that. You're a start and you're 314 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 5: encouraged by it. But to me, I hear that you've 315 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:50,920 Speaker 5: given the scientific data to ERROW. I've had multiple people 316 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:52,080 Speaker 5: on this show. 317 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 1: Say how they've testified the Arrow, They've turned in data, 318 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 1: they've given all this stuff, and then Ero comes out 319 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 1: and says we have zero evidence for anything anomalous. That 320 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:06,960 Speaker 1: is very suspect and disingenuous to me, and I am 321 00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:10,040 Speaker 1: very untrusting of this group. Don't you feel that way? 322 00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:14,119 Speaker 1: If you've provided them scientific data, why don't they say, well, 323 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:18,280 Speaker 1: it's not conclusive, or we have some interesting things, but 324 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:21,440 Speaker 1: we don't have it. They flat out deny and dismiss 325 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:24,399 Speaker 1: all of this, and I find it very disingenuous because 326 00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: we know they've been given some things that do show 327 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:28,840 Speaker 1: there's anomalist things happening. 328 00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:32,479 Speaker 4: Yeah, so what we're basing our understanding of what Errow's 329 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 4: got is only on the basis of things that they 330 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 4: can release that are going to be not classified. Okay, 331 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:44,040 Speaker 4: so you're only getting the take of the things that 332 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:47,840 Speaker 4: I've got that I can openly talk about. You're not 333 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:51,960 Speaker 4: hearing the conversations to the background that are the classified level. 334 00:17:52,240 --> 00:17:54,480 Speaker 1: But isn't that enough? Don't you have enough on your 335 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:56,960 Speaker 1: site that shows that there's stuff happening? Why can they 336 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: How can they give a blanket statement that there's nothing happening. 337 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:03,159 Speaker 4: I don't know. I'm not part of those conversations. I 338 00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:05,680 Speaker 4: can only speculate on the basis of what's going on here. 339 00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: I mean, are you disappointed when you hear that? 340 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, certainly I am. I mean I would I would 341 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:14,439 Speaker 4: like to very much see, you know, what they're doing 342 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:17,320 Speaker 4: with the information that they're being given. How are they 343 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:19,760 Speaker 4: treating it? And I don't have any basis for knowing 344 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 4: that transparency is very important, and we've been telling them 345 00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:26,240 Speaker 4: all along that they need to be as transparent as 346 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:30,800 Speaker 4: possible without you know, giving over intelligence data and everything 347 00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 4: else to the world, right if you if you're concerned 348 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 4: about adversaries. So I mean, yes, I would like to 349 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:39,639 Speaker 4: see that. And I you know, of course I'm in 350 00:18:39,640 --> 00:18:42,000 Speaker 4: the military, so I can go over on the zipper 351 00:18:42,080 --> 00:18:44,520 Speaker 4: side and look and see things, and I can do 352 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 4: things where I can see that they've been receiving this, 353 00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:50,199 Speaker 4: and there's a whole lot of Air Force videos that 354 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 4: they've received, and I can see some of those Air 355 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:55,560 Speaker 4: Force videos, and I'm saying that, well, I agree with 356 00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:58,399 Speaker 4: their conclusion because a lot of these pilots are seeing 357 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:02,119 Speaker 4: definitely balloons and various other things that are up in 358 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,359 Speaker 4: the air. And if you go back to even my 359 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 4: you know, experience over these years, we are able to explain, 360 00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:10,240 Speaker 4: you know, now a little bit more than what we 361 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:13,080 Speaker 4: could even before to where it's almost almost like maybe 362 00:19:13,119 --> 00:19:15,199 Speaker 4: twenty percent of the cases, and then you have to 363 00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:19,200 Speaker 4: understand that are identified, but there is a lot more 364 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 4: than that that are basically are on the classified side 365 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:26,320 Speaker 4: that we're not getting as public citizens. I think that 366 00:19:26,359 --> 00:19:29,679 Speaker 4: there they know that there's something there. They're waiting for 367 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,119 Speaker 4: something that they can get where they can really, like 368 00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:35,440 Speaker 4: you know, come forward with it and really do something 369 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:37,080 Speaker 4: about it. I think you take a look at the 370 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:42,600 Speaker 4: actions on you know, Representative Luna and you know exactly. 371 00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 1: I was just going to ask you about that, Ritchie. Yeah, 372 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: in February, you know, they formed that new task for 373 00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:50,399 Speaker 1: looking into these anomalous secrets and one of them is UAP. 374 00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 1: Do you have any hopes for that task force? 375 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:55,560 Speaker 4: Oh sure, I think that, you know, overall, I think 376 00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:58,920 Speaker 4: that I'm looking very much forward to, you know, whether 377 00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:01,960 Speaker 4: they can uncover or what they can learn. But again 378 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:04,720 Speaker 4: it comes back to so if I'm talking on the 379 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:08,400 Speaker 4: classified side, what can I come back and tell the public? 380 00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 4: And even a Congressman is going to have trouble with that, 381 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,959 Speaker 4: because again, clearances are that they've got to do something 382 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:16,639 Speaker 4: to make it so that it's a little bit that 383 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 4: can be a little more transparent without giving up to 384 00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 4: the Chinese or the Russians or anything like that, maybe 385 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:27,639 Speaker 4: their secrets. And again I'm sensitive to that because I 386 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,560 Speaker 4: work in the DoD and I have a better understanding 387 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:34,800 Speaker 4: than I did before about what you keep quiet about 388 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 4: and what you don't you know. 389 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:38,439 Speaker 1: And we're going to take another break here, Rich. When 390 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:39,920 Speaker 1: we come back, we're going to talk to you more 391 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 1: about some of these specific studies that you guys have 392 00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:45,280 Speaker 1: done over the years recently and get to some of 393 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 1: these scientific conclusions you guys have reached. So you're listening 394 00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:51,119 Speaker 1: to Beyond Contact on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast 395 00:20:51,200 --> 00:21:15,760 Speaker 1: AM Paranormal podcast network. We are back on Beyond Contact 396 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:17,960 Speaker 1: speaking with Rich Hoffman. Rich, you've been looking at this 397 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:22,159 Speaker 1: for sixty years from a scientific perspective. Do you personally 398 00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: have any conclusions that you could give us that you 399 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:28,159 Speaker 1: feel obviously it's speculative, but what do you believe? Is 400 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,199 Speaker 1: there strong evidence that shows that some of these craft 401 00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:33,240 Speaker 1: may in fact be from elsewhere? 402 00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,159 Speaker 4: Oh? Very clearly, when you talk about like when we 403 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:38,520 Speaker 4: did the study of like the Nimtz object, you know, 404 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:40,480 Speaker 4: take a look at that you know, when you looked 405 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:43,400 Speaker 4: at the fact that the object was tracked on a 406 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:47,760 Speaker 4: SPY one radar that was on board that princetonship and 407 00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:50,000 Speaker 4: stuff like that, that it would have drop from twenty 408 00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:53,159 Speaker 4: thousand feet in zero point seven eighths of a second 409 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 4: to stopping above the water. 410 00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 1: This is the tic TAC video, folks, that's the one 411 00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:58,960 Speaker 1: you're referring to, right And I was going to ask 412 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 1: you about that next, So go ahead, tell us. 413 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:01,880 Speaker 4: What you know I took to say that. You know 414 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:04,959 Speaker 4: right there, if you date what we did is we 415 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:07,760 Speaker 4: spent you know, nearly two years on studying the thing. 416 00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 4: We interviewed eighteen people that were right there in the 417 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,680 Speaker 4: in the event space. And you take a look at 418 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 4: the physics that are involved in that. You're talking about 419 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 4: an object that was going at mop fifty and above. 420 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:25,000 Speaker 4: You're talking about no sonic boom, no kinetic energy release. 421 00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:28,399 Speaker 4: You know, no way in the world that inertia would 422 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:31,160 Speaker 4: would allow anything to survive on the inside of it 423 00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:33,640 Speaker 4: that it didn't destruct in the If you take an 424 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,720 Speaker 4: F six, you know, an F eighteen about that same 425 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,639 Speaker 4: complimentary size, and you drop it at that speed, it 426 00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:42,240 Speaker 4: would disintegrate to the left you know, and everywhere. So 427 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:44,880 Speaker 4: you don't have any of that with that technology. It's 428 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 4: clearly a technology that is way beyond where we are 429 00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:49,680 Speaker 4: at present time. 430 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: Is there any way this video could be faked or 431 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:54,400 Speaker 1: manipulated or anything else that could be. 432 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:58,359 Speaker 4: No, you know, you we do the analysis on the 433 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,920 Speaker 4: videos and just like you know, and really check to 434 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 4: see if there's something that backs it up. For example, 435 00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:07,439 Speaker 4: even in the Outwood DA case, we're looking at the 436 00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:09,720 Speaker 4: fact that there was actually radar that was going on 437 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:12,720 Speaker 4: at that time that was tracking an object out in 438 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 4: the water where we confirmed that the aircraft was actually military. 439 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:19,359 Speaker 4: We confirmed all that details. So we go into the 440 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:22,479 Speaker 4: ant level, degree and depth on all this stuff and 441 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:23,120 Speaker 4: check this. 442 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 1: Is the twenty three excuse me, twenty thirteen case from 443 00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 1: Puerto Rico where you see it on video that it's 444 00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:33,800 Speaker 1: clearly a trans medium craft because it's flying through the air, 445 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,639 Speaker 1: it goes into the water, comes out of the water 446 00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:40,080 Speaker 1: at the same it maintains the same speed, right, that's 447 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:44,320 Speaker 1: the one you're referring to. Yeah, yeah, so that's really incredible. 448 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:47,959 Speaker 1: So we've seen other people online kind of debunk these videos. 449 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:49,119 Speaker 1: Do you think that they're wrong? 450 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 4: No, So even if you take a look at the 451 00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:56,199 Speaker 4: going back to even the Kenneth arnoldays, I think that 452 00:23:56,240 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 4: there were fourteen types of explanation for what could have 453 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:05,880 Speaker 4: caused those nine objects to have looked the way they yeah, 454 00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:08,639 Speaker 4: you know exactly. The other the other thing is that, 455 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:10,480 Speaker 4: you know, there's a lot of people that want to 456 00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:13,640 Speaker 4: say that we didn't consider parallax. We did. They're they're 457 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,920 Speaker 4: saying that that you know that, well, William a minute, 458 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,239 Speaker 4: you know that we looked at the size, that there 459 00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 4: was a reference point, or that it was a balloon 460 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:23,920 Speaker 4: or something of that nature, or it was birds. 461 00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:24,159 Speaker 1: It was. 462 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:29,120 Speaker 4: We literally had a field engineer who works on the 463 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 4: the ther thermal cameras get the same camera and go 464 00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 4: and see what birds look like in the ir in 465 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:42,040 Speaker 4: that mid midwave ir range, there's no match. When you 466 00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,359 Speaker 4: take a look at the object going by a pole 467 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:49,680 Speaker 4: that's out along a highway, that was at night, that 468 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:53,120 Speaker 4: gave you a reference point for its distance and its position, 469 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:56,520 Speaker 4: it was not. Now you've got that a lot of 470 00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:58,760 Speaker 4: these other people will take a look at it and say, oh, 471 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:01,240 Speaker 4: you're just seeing a blue and they draw a circle 472 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:03,479 Speaker 4: because of the eye that the aircraft was going around it, 473 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 4: but they dismissed that the aircraft was not going around 474 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:09,200 Speaker 4: it the whole time and was actually heading south, and 475 00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:12,480 Speaker 4: that it didn't line up with that at all because 476 00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:14,600 Speaker 4: we went to such depths. There are a lot of 477 00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:17,680 Speaker 4: these things we just dismiss and say, well, find let's 478 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 4: see your paper that you did. Let me see how 479 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 4: you went down to the analyzing frame by frame, pixel 480 00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:26,239 Speaker 4: by pixel, and how you did your analysis. And they 481 00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:28,480 Speaker 4: don't do it. They don't have those. 482 00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:31,800 Speaker 1: Legitimate video and these are legitimate facts that these objects 483 00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 1: are traveling at the speeds that you suggest that they are, 484 00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 1: that you've let's say, proven that they are according to 485 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,760 Speaker 1: the data that you have. Do you think it is 486 00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:45,160 Speaker 1: possible that there would be an unacknowledged program somewhere on 487 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,560 Speaker 1: Earth that could have these technologies that are just way 488 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,960 Speaker 1: beyond what we imagined. We've heard quotes over the years 489 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,920 Speaker 1: from guys like Ben Rich that claim we've got technologies, 490 00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 1: you know, fifty years beyond what you can imagine. Do 491 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:00,879 Speaker 1: you think that that's even possible or do you just 492 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:02,520 Speaker 1: think it's where do you sit on that? 493 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:04,720 Speaker 4: So Ley point out to you the fact that if 494 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:09,080 Speaker 4: you look at those five observables, that let Lou talked about, right, Sure, 495 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:13,680 Speaker 4: objects back in the fifties were doing the same thing. 496 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:17,160 Speaker 4: That's when we had that's when we had we didn't 497 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 4: have any advanced technologies. Right, So if objects are doing 498 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 4: the same thing back then, instantaneous acceleration, hovering, a defying glravity, 499 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 4: these things have been doing it all along. So it's 500 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 4: not like we came across a new technology somewhere and 501 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:33,800 Speaker 4: we're doing that. 502 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:36,399 Speaker 1: Well. Doctor Career is one of the people that have 503 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 1: claimed that we've figured out anti gravitic technology back to 504 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:43,640 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty three. Do you think that's possible? 505 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,200 Speaker 4: Well, I think that, you know, there's certainly been Tee 506 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,240 Speaker 4: Townsend Brown, there's a lot of a whole other scientists 507 00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:51,560 Speaker 4: that have been doing that. The pushback that you can 508 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,120 Speaker 4: also receive in the scientific community or by industry if 509 00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:57,200 Speaker 4: you take a look at that, like you know, even 510 00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:00,159 Speaker 4: our who was competing for the telephone, you know, and 511 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,240 Speaker 4: the pushback you had to you know, was it a 512 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:05,560 Speaker 4: bell or was it Edison? Who was it? You know, 513 00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:08,960 Speaker 4: and and and you know we're going to so you 514 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,679 Speaker 4: probably had pushback. You probably had a lot of like 515 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:15,199 Speaker 4: people trying to keep it on the QT or they 516 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:19,320 Speaker 4: scarfed up that information and you know, did something crazy 517 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:21,600 Speaker 4: like you maybe kill somebody. I don't know, but but 518 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,359 Speaker 4: the bottom line is that, you know, what we've done 519 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:28,560 Speaker 4: is we've we've controlled the narrative and quite frankly, you 520 00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:31,159 Speaker 4: could have potentially something that was back in the But 521 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 4: I think that I think we're getting closer now today 522 00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:39,200 Speaker 4: towards a better understanding of how to do this, and 523 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 4: within you know, a matter of you know, a short time, 524 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:44,920 Speaker 4: I think we could ultimately start seeing craft that are 525 00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:48,159 Speaker 4: doing this type of thing with no propulsion systems and 526 00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:50,800 Speaker 4: stuff like that, and we'll make it look like a 527 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,000 Speaker 4: breakthrough to you know, an understanding. 528 00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:55,960 Speaker 1: Someone's got thirty seconds with you, and they want to 529 00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,959 Speaker 1: know what would be the strongest piece of evidence that 530 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,919 Speaker 1: you've seen over the last sixty years that you feel 531 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:07,680 Speaker 1: speaks to they're definitely being craft from off planet? Would 532 00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:09,840 Speaker 1: what would you think is the strongest piece of evidence? 533 00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 1: Is it one of these videos? 534 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:14,920 Speaker 4: Is it completely the limits case? There? You've got multimodal 535 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,720 Speaker 4: kind of like technology and data and information. I think 536 00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,440 Speaker 4: if you look at the nineteen seventy six Tehran incident, 537 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:23,360 Speaker 4: that's another one of those things where two F four 538 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 4: aircraft that loser navigations. Clearly a jamming kind of thing 539 00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:30,080 Speaker 4: that was going on it. Also the object went over 540 00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 4: the control tower of the Arab Mirabad Airport and also 541 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,960 Speaker 4: interacted with it and did some jamming on the airport. 542 00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,080 Speaker 4: So there are these excellent cases like this where you've 543 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 4: got sensory data or you've got exceptionally very credible people. 544 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:50,280 Speaker 4: My aha moment, if you would, is back in the 545 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:53,480 Speaker 4: seventies when I was doing a basically I was called 546 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 4: on a case that involved UFOs the night before in Carrollton, Ohio, 547 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 4: and we had learned about the fact that the farmer 548 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:05,040 Speaker 4: was looking out of his window seeing bottom line that 549 00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:08,000 Speaker 4: in the middle of this wheat field there's a perfect 550 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,200 Speaker 4: circular area where the wheat's gone now you know, And 551 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 4: we're going like, okay, let's check it out. And then 552 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,080 Speaker 4: we pulled together a whole team to be able to 553 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 4: go out and start to do the analysis. We went 554 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:22,360 Speaker 4: out in seventy foot in diameter circular area where the 555 00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 4: ground is baked two feet in the ground. All the 556 00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,640 Speaker 4: roots from the wheat were all completely vaporized and gone. 557 00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 4: All the wheat crop was gone. Then you get out 558 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:33,200 Speaker 4: in the outer perimeter. You start to see a little 559 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,160 Speaker 4: stubble that comes up, You see a rotational pattern, and 560 00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:39,000 Speaker 4: you also see puffed wheat around the seventy foot diameter 561 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:41,240 Speaker 4: area and you're standing there looking at it, and you're 562 00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:44,880 Speaker 4: saying like, well, you know it had to come from above. 563 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 1: Well, what do you think could have caused that? Is 564 00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 1: there any other explanation we could have? 565 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:52,160 Speaker 4: Well? Yeah, I mean because ultimately what you get around 566 00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:58,320 Speaker 4: these craft are like a microwave, kind of like microwave 567 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,600 Speaker 4: field if you would it's around so it naturally like 568 00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,840 Speaker 4: microwave would eat it up, and they have this field 569 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:09,680 Speaker 4: around it where it's interacting with our atmosphere. And quite often, 570 00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:12,080 Speaker 4: you know, people say, well, it looks like it's not 571 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 4: blurry when I see it or I take a photograph, 572 00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 4: its blurry. Well it's because the field around it is 573 00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 4: distorting what it's actual looks like, right, And it's also 574 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,640 Speaker 4: interacting with our atmosphere. And you get ions that are 575 00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 4: going back and forth between this that are being impacted. 576 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,720 Speaker 4: They heat up and they even glow sometimes there's a 577 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:33,360 Speaker 4: glowing and so you start to see that kind of 578 00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 4: thing with the objects. And so the same thing here 579 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 4: is when it comes down near the ground is actually 580 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 4: now the field is going underneath the soil. It's microwaving it. 581 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:44,600 Speaker 4: You know, it's gone. 582 00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:46,480 Speaker 1: Okay, we're going to take a quick break here. We'll 583 00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 1: be right back with Rich and we come back where 584 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: we ask him more about some of scu's conclusions and 585 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,400 Speaker 1: how they collect their data and where the data will 586 00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 1: be coming from in the future. You're listening to Beyond 587 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,000 Speaker 1: Contact on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal 588 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:22,720 Speaker 1: podcast network. We are back on Beyond Contact speaking with 589 00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:25,480 Speaker 1: Rich Hoffman. One more case that came to mind is 590 00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:28,440 Speaker 1: the rubber duck video from twenty nineteen. Did you guys 591 00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:30,440 Speaker 1: look at that? Do you have any conclusions from that 592 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:30,960 Speaker 1: one as well? 593 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 4: Basically, we came up with it being an unknown because 594 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,600 Speaker 4: we could not come up with any irrational explanation for 595 00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:40,120 Speaker 4: that object and why it looked the way it did 596 00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 4: and how it moved, and it just made no sense whatsoever. 597 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 1: So there is a percentage of these cases you guys 598 00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 1: are looking at that do come out concluded that they're unknowns. 599 00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:56,680 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, okay. As scientists, it seems to me like 600 00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:59,560 Speaker 1: the first place to start would be to collect as 601 00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:03,480 Speaker 1: much data as you could so that you could you know, 602 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,160 Speaker 1: make your conclusions based off of that. So with so 603 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:11,480 Speaker 1: many different repositories for UFO encounters and information, where do 604 00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:12,920 Speaker 1: you guys get your data? You know, we have the 605 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 1: National Reporting Center, Mutual UFO Network of course, Center for 606 00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 1: UFO Studies, the Black Vault, Institute for Neuadic Studies, Discovery Sciences, Nightcap, 607 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:27,080 Speaker 1: There's a lot of places people can turn these in. 608 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:27,920 Speaker 1: What do you guys do? 609 00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:31,200 Speaker 4: So we have access to a number of the databases, 610 00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 4: you know, things like that you mentioned and stuff like that, 611 00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:36,160 Speaker 4: so we're able to go and pull data like if 612 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,200 Speaker 4: we're doing a historical study like for example, from nineteen 613 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:44,120 Speaker 4: forty five to nineteen seventy five, let's see how many 614 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,760 Speaker 4: objects were around nuclear facilities. What we do is we 615 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:50,880 Speaker 4: go into the data. We get these databases, you know, 616 00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:53,880 Speaker 4: we got maybe move on new fork. We bring all 617 00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 4: these things together, we put them in and we start 618 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 4: working with them, and we go through and then our 619 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:01,440 Speaker 4: teams go through and analyze it, and we actually have 620 00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 4: a criteria that we go through and identify only the 621 00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:08,560 Speaker 4: ones that we feel are the best cases because it 622 00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 4: was either investigated by somebody or you know that there 623 00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,880 Speaker 4: were additional other witnesses to it, and so we do 624 00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:19,160 Speaker 4: that criteria to cull out the wheat from the chaff, 625 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:21,040 Speaker 4: if you would. So now we got the wheat, and 626 00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:23,200 Speaker 4: let's take a look at what the wheat tells us. 627 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:26,200 Speaker 4: And so that's precisely what we did with our historical 628 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,480 Speaker 4: kinds of studies like the intention study, or if we're 629 00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:33,080 Speaker 4: looking at you know, cases like for example, what kinds 630 00:33:33,080 --> 00:33:36,120 Speaker 4: of heating effects do you see in the atmosphere? What 631 00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:39,720 Speaker 4: kind of observations have been about that? So again we're 632 00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:41,880 Speaker 4: able to go in the database, we're able to look 633 00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:43,840 Speaker 4: at that look for the cases that are out there 634 00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,800 Speaker 4: that mention something that they saw something around the craft 635 00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:50,240 Speaker 4: like a heating or something. So we start to see 636 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,160 Speaker 4: those atmospheric effects. So now we're actually have a team 637 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,640 Speaker 4: of pulling that together. Right, So we're looking at atmospheric effects, 638 00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 4: we're looking at USO cases, we're looking at that. But 639 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:03,000 Speaker 4: we're wanting to transition over into getting into more instrument 640 00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,800 Speaker 4: and studies on current kind of cases that are going on, 641 00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:09,440 Speaker 4: which is why we're teaming up with like uap X 642 00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:13,360 Speaker 4: and bringing them into the fold. We're also connecting with 643 00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:17,160 Speaker 4: other researchers and stuff like that around the world to 644 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,640 Speaker 4: be able to do to share their data and to 645 00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:23,839 Speaker 4: bring that together so that we can actually have now 646 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:29,279 Speaker 4: scientists that can evaluate it on a multidisciplinary level and 647 00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 4: then help help us to craft a paper that is 648 00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:36,760 Speaker 4: now acceptable to a journal, and so that helps science 649 00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:40,800 Speaker 4: advance into the topic more and we get a better understanding. 650 00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:43,680 Speaker 1: I apologize. Do you think that the fact that there's 651 00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 1: a high percentage of reports that never get reported to 652 00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:48,920 Speaker 1: any of these agencies? Is that hurting you? 653 00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:49,200 Speaker 4: Guys? 654 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:51,200 Speaker 1: If you think we have enough data out there? What 655 00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:52,120 Speaker 1: are your thoughts on that? 656 00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:55,520 Speaker 4: So, yeah, you're absolutely right. In the early days, I mean, 657 00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:58,799 Speaker 4: Heinig Yusta and when I listened to him talking Dayton, 658 00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 4: Ohio and stuff like that say that one out of 659 00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:05,399 Speaker 4: every twelve sightings are reported. I'm sorry, it's like one 660 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,120 Speaker 4: out of every twelve thousand cases. They're probably right, you know. 661 00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:11,080 Speaker 4: I mean, I don't know how they came up with that, 662 00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:14,120 Speaker 4: that's but I don't see that that's accurate at all. 663 00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:16,880 Speaker 4: When I give lectures and stuff like that over the 664 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:19,560 Speaker 4: decades that I've been doing it, I always ask how 665 00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:21,560 Speaker 4: many of you, you know, saw something, how many of 666 00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 4: you reported it? And like nobody said did they report it? 667 00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:27,200 Speaker 1: Right exactly that that's going on for years and years 668 00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: and years, a lot of researches. Even though we have 669 00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:33,440 Speaker 1: thousands upon thousands of cases from move on in these 670 00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,800 Speaker 1: other places, there are some most of them are not reported. 671 00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:37,560 Speaker 1: So that's true. 672 00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:43,040 Speaker 4: And so again you know, wanting to transition into how 673 00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:47,200 Speaker 4: do we go after objects wherever they are and how 674 00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:49,680 Speaker 4: do we get scientific data? So, like you know, think 675 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:51,719 Speaker 4: about it. They seem to have some sort of a 676 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:56,080 Speaker 4: connection around nuclear material. They okay, well nuclear material, Well 677 00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:58,880 Speaker 4: you can create something where you have something that looks 678 00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:02,440 Speaker 4: like smells like it be radioactive that maybe not. And 679 00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:05,000 Speaker 4: we're working on that, and we're using that to see 680 00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:07,399 Speaker 4: if we can't draw them in and then have all 681 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:11,279 Speaker 4: of that whole area surrounded by sensors and various other things. Right, 682 00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:13,520 Speaker 4: So there are ways you can go about it. We 683 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:16,040 Speaker 4: know that they seem to have an affinity around like 684 00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:19,239 Speaker 4: even nuclear or a military basis and stuff, so you 685 00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:22,000 Speaker 4: could do that. How about military exercises that are going 686 00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:24,759 Speaker 4: on in the ocean, Well maybe around that, right, So 687 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,440 Speaker 4: you start to see that there's ways of going about it. 688 00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,000 Speaker 4: And you and so now if you've got a tool base, 689 00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:33,839 Speaker 4: then you're you're able to take these tools. You could 690 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:39,600 Speaker 4: see it in radar, sonar, widar, you're looking at it 691 00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:43,160 Speaker 4: throughout the different parts of the electromagnetic spectrum. That would 692 00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:46,359 Speaker 4: be great. How do you now do that with even 693 00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 4: beyond visible ranges in terms of you know, what we 694 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:53,000 Speaker 4: see with our eyes, can we listen to acoustics and 695 00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:55,439 Speaker 4: see if it's outside of our range of hearing? And 696 00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 4: so if we get those kind of devices out there, 697 00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:00,239 Speaker 4: we're able to go into hotspots, we'll be able to 698 00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:01,719 Speaker 4: collect that data that we want. 699 00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,600 Speaker 1: Do you have a guestimat as to what percentage of 700 00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:07,680 Speaker 1: these cases of all cases do you think are typically 701 00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:10,040 Speaker 1: genuinely anomalous? 702 00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:12,880 Speaker 4: Well, first off, I think that you know, there's a 703 00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,399 Speaker 4: whole lot of things that when we call anomaly, right, 704 00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:17,800 Speaker 4: So let me tell you about the Earth flight phenomena. 705 00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:22,040 Speaker 4: Are you familiar with earth lights? So there's a phenomena 706 00:37:22,080 --> 00:37:25,040 Speaker 4: out there that looks like it often gets reported as UFOs, 707 00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,799 Speaker 4: which are nothing more than an atmospheric kind of got SpaceX. 708 00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:32,839 Speaker 1: So does There's a lot of things that people often misidentify. 709 00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:35,839 Speaker 4: But just think about this, this is an eight foot 710 00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 4: in diameter glowing ball of gas that moves through the 711 00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:43,240 Speaker 4: atmosphere and can and can do incredible speeds and stuff 712 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,080 Speaker 4: like that, go up to two thousand feet altitude, and 713 00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,680 Speaker 4: we know very little about it because we've not studied it. 714 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:52,760 Speaker 4: That's an anomaly that's out there that we don't know about, 715 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,359 Speaker 4: which can account for a lot of UFO reports, by 716 00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:57,200 Speaker 4: the way, but. 717 00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,239 Speaker 1: It's intrustrial explanation to it. 718 00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:02,319 Speaker 4: Sure, yeah, But I guess what I'm trying to get 719 00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:04,640 Speaker 4: at is you have to again going back to you 720 00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 4: have to separate the weed from the chaff. So you've 721 00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:10,680 Speaker 4: got to get smarter about knowing, well, this is a drone, 722 00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,640 Speaker 4: and this is a UFO, this is an earth light, 723 00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:18,960 Speaker 4: and this is something. Until those things are studied, are 724 00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:21,239 Speaker 4: we know more about them, We're always going to have 725 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:26,440 Speaker 4: misidentifications by the public and everybody else. Right, So you've 726 00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:29,000 Speaker 4: got to eliminate the ifos so you can get to 727 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:29,920 Speaker 4: the UFO and. 728 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:32,360 Speaker 1: The identified ones. Right. Do you feel like some of 729 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,279 Speaker 1: these new technologies coming on, they're building this I think 730 00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,480 Speaker 1: it's called the large telescope in Chili or extra large 731 00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,440 Speaker 1: telescope and Chili that's coming online and AI itself. Do 732 00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:45,560 Speaker 1: you think that will be able to sort through this 733 00:38:45,719 --> 00:38:48,640 Speaker 1: data for you? Will that will these new tools really 734 00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:52,120 Speaker 1: help propel this movement forward. What are your thoughts on 735 00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:53,440 Speaker 1: the new technologies coming on? 736 00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:57,319 Speaker 4: Well, certainly, we actually did one study where we use 737 00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 4: machine learning, and so I mean, the more we can 738 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:03,640 Speaker 4: and apply things like AI or machine learning, and as 739 00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:06,200 Speaker 4: it continues to advance, the more that we're going to 740 00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 4: be able to go through a large volume of data 741 00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:11,920 Speaker 4: and narrow it down into a smaller subset that we 742 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:16,800 Speaker 4: can get something from. So we're excited about that as well. 743 00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:20,719 Speaker 4: I mean, and yes, there are constantly things that are 744 00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:24,800 Speaker 4: going on in terms of scientific world. NASA is planning 745 00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:28,680 Speaker 4: to go after the UFO and the UAP, so it's 746 00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:31,040 Speaker 4: going to have satellites and various other things that will 747 00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:34,440 Speaker 4: help out in doing that. Again, the military has advanced 748 00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:36,800 Speaker 4: to the point where it's got this piece of these 749 00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:40,000 Speaker 4: equipment that now are detecting them for the first time 750 00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:45,200 Speaker 4: in quantity, So like the twenty fourteen and the limets case. Wow, 751 00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:47,680 Speaker 4: we're starting to see them more. Oh well guess what 752 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:51,400 Speaker 4: more data collection? Right, So I think that as we 753 00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:54,880 Speaker 4: continue to go on, we're starting we'll start to narrow 754 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,440 Speaker 4: down which tools really work for us to be able 755 00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:02,239 Speaker 4: to give us some very critical data that we can 756 00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:02,560 Speaker 4: work with. 757 00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:05,440 Speaker 1: That's awesome, Rich, thanks so much for coming on and 758 00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:09,120 Speaker 1: sharing with us. People. Check out the SCU website which 759 00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:13,800 Speaker 1: is explore SCU dot org. I think this is exactly 760 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:16,759 Speaker 1: what we need in this community, is the rigorous scientific 761 00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:20,520 Speaker 1: study of this anomalies, and hopefully we're getting closer to 762 00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:22,759 Speaker 1: find on it. What's really going on? Right Rich? 763 00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:23,799 Speaker 4: Yeah? 764 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:26,440 Speaker 1: Awesome, Rich, thanks again for coming on. I really really 765 00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:28,839 Speaker 1: enjoyed this and I really appreciate you taking the time. 766 00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:32,839 Speaker 1: You guys can find Rich at explore SCU dot org 767 00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:35,520 Speaker 1: and you can find me on Twitter and Instagram at 768 00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:40,200 Speaker 1: CID Underscore Captain Ron. Stay connected by checking out contactindtheesert 769 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:44,120 Speaker 1: dot com. Stay open minded and rational as we explore 770 00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,480 Speaker 1: the unknown right here on the iHeartRadio and Coast to 771 00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:58,880 Speaker 1: Coast AM Paronormal Podcast Network. Thanks for listening to the 772 00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:02,240 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and co to Go Stay in Paranormal Podcast Network. 773 00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:04,799 Speaker 1: Make sure and check out all our shows on the 774 00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:13,200 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app or by going to iHeartRadio dot com