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Speaker 1: On today's episode of Ticket of the Draft podcast, we

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Speaker 1: talked top fives plus one. We talk about guys that

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Speaker 1: can bend, that can goes, guys that tackle on I

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Speaker 1: think we come to conclusion we just like football players, Jason,

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Speaker 1: Guys that are tough, nitty gritty, and it all starts

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Speaker 1: right now. Welcome to the Ticket of the Draft Podcast.

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Speaker 1: I'm Logan Paulson with just the Guy Jason. It just

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Speaker 1: reminder you were brought to you by Sea Geek, the

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Speaker 1: official primary ticketing partner of the Washington Commanders. And on

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Speaker 1: today's show, we are talking top five plus one at

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Speaker 1: every defensive position, and make sure you guys stay tuned

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Speaker 1: for next week. Also because we have Connor Rodgers from

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Speaker 1: PFF NFL Stock Exchange, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he's onn that with Trevor Sigma. He's also for

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Speaker 2: NBC Sports.

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Speaker 1: Right, and so he does that, and obviously that's Jason.

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Speaker 1: Just to guy, Jason, here's me, and we are going

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Speaker 1: to give you our ultimate Defensive Draft Guide basically today

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Speaker 1: with the top five at every position.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this is basically part two. We did offense last week,

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Speaker 2: we're doing it this week for all defensive positions. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: top five plus one plus one being that person that

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Speaker 2: you're inviting to the wedding. They're not they don't know

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Speaker 2: the brider groom. They're just like somebody that you want

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Speaker 2: to hang out with and you're there. So like this

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Speaker 2: plus one is maybe not is not number six in

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Speaker 2: our top ranking, may not even be in the top

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Speaker 2: ten or the top twenty. It's just a guy we

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Speaker 2: want to talk about because maybe they're gonna be invited

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Speaker 2: to the party here in Washington.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, no, I think that's that's a that's a

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Speaker 1: great description. So do what do you want to start?

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Speaker 1: You want to start with interior defensive lineman.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's start with interior defensive line before we start

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Speaker 2: with what they want to ask you?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is how hard is it for you

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Speaker 1: to watch defensive football players online? Insanely It's insanely hard.

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Speaker 2: So, well, two things, all right, So you're gonna have

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Speaker 2: a different experience with this than me because I don't

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Speaker 2: know what I'm talking about. I'm just a guy. So

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Speaker 2: like offense, I feel like I have a better grip

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Speaker 2: one when I watch it.

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Speaker 1: There's also more stuff, there's more well.

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Speaker 2: There's more data points, right, But also like when you're

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Speaker 2: a fan of football, like, that's.

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Speaker 1: What that's what you watch.

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Speaker 2: That's what you're watching.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: So if I'm sitting there and I'm watching the Manders

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Speaker 2: on Sunday and I'm watching it in real time, I'm

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Speaker 2: watching what the offense is doing, even when we're on defense.

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Speaker 1: Yeah right, yeah, you're not watching what the defense is doing.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's why I have to go back to

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Speaker 1: see that. That's how I watch film usually too. I

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Speaker 1: watch offensive football, like I'm an offensive player. I do

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Speaker 1: watch some defensive stuff, but even just the way they

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Speaker 1: shoot the games on the on the TV, they kind

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Speaker 1: of cut the back end of the defense off there,

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Speaker 1: which is the one of the more important parts of

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Speaker 1: the defense to see. And so for this evaluation, for

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Speaker 1: some of the defensive linemen, it's easy because they're always

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Speaker 1: in the shot on the TV copy. But for some

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Speaker 1: of these corners, some of these linebackers, some of these safeties,

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Speaker 1: it was it is slim pickens. You're watching every scrap

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Speaker 1: of information you can find on the internet for like

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Speaker 1: maybe ten plays total. So it's gonna be tough.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think the thing, especially with d lineman

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Speaker 2: or linebackers, especially as you never hear their name get

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Speaker 2: called unless they either screw up or do a good play,

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Speaker 2: and that's that's very rare in the game as far

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Speaker 2: as data points, like if you're a wide receiver on

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Speaker 2: a on a good team, like if you're draftable wide receiver,

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Speaker 2: you're getting ten targets, eight catches somewhere in there. So

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Speaker 2: there's like a lot of data points that's going on

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Speaker 2: in the game. You could be an outstanding interior defensive interior.

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Speaker 2: You don't get a sack that game, and you get

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Speaker 2: maybe two tackles for a loss, so that you're only

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Speaker 2: getting your name called twice. But when you go back

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Speaker 2: and watch them, like like what you're saying, you watch

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Speaker 2: every snap, every play, this guy affected the game in

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Speaker 2: a great way and you do a good job. Actually,

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Speaker 2: on our command center shows when we break down film,

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Speaker 2: when it's like all right, break down Deron pain for

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Speaker 2: this game. He needn't get a sack, But look at

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Speaker 2: how this guy's affecting this game. Right, You're not going

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Speaker 2: to hear his name called on this play, but he's

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Speaker 2: causing this bad throw. He's causing the quarterback or the

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Speaker 2: running back to bounce out where Jamon is standing to

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Speaker 2: wrap him up, Like, and we just hear Jamon get

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Speaker 2: called in the game. Because it's happening so fast, you

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Speaker 2: don't expect the color commentators to pick up on that stuff.

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Speaker 2: But when you logan go back and rewatch that film,

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Speaker 2: you're like, yeah, Jamen made a great play here, not

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Speaker 2: taking anything away. This is a dron pain though, right,

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Speaker 2: and like, uh, you do a great job of that

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Speaker 2: on Command Center all our fancial checkout Command Center, especially

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Speaker 2: in season when you do your film breakdowns.

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Speaker 1: Thanks. Man, that's very nice to you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's hard.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's hard.

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Speaker 2: Defense is really hard.

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Speaker 1: It's really hard. It's uh, it's yeah, it's it's tough.

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Speaker 1: But we're gonna give you our best guests here, best

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Speaker 1: estimations because we like I said, I've watched a ton

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Speaker 1: of film on a lot of these guys. Now, the

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Speaker 1: juice isn't always worth the squeeze, you know, for some

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Speaker 1: of these corners. Like I said, I've watched four or

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Speaker 1: five games like whatever, I can find a couple of

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Speaker 1: highlights and it's the same four or five plays. Right,

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Speaker 1: There's just not a lot to go off of. So

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Speaker 1: we're kind of going off of Combine Senior Bowl all

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Speaker 1: the stuff we've been to, but we're gonna give you

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Speaker 1: our best take care.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's do five to one. Okay, we'll start

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Speaker 2: with defensive interior and I'll go first, number five to

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Speaker 2: and Andre Sweat.

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Speaker 1: That's my dude. That's your dude from Texas.

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Speaker 2: Number four, Rouke o'roo from Clemson. All right. Three Brandon

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Speaker 2: Fisk from Florida State.

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Speaker 1: Two j J Jaz Right is it jus On? It's

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Speaker 1: from Illinois.

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Speaker 2: And number one Byron Murphy the second from Texas.

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Speaker 1: Crushed it. So I'm pretty much the same as you.

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Speaker 1: I've got Jandre Sweat from Texas. At five, I got

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Speaker 1: Chris Jenkins. That's the only difference in our list. You have,

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Speaker 1: Ruca Roro. I have Chris Jenkins from Michigan, Braden Fist

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Speaker 1: from Florida State, Jason Newton from Illinois, and Byron Murphy

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Speaker 1: from Texas.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's talk about our differences. You want to

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Speaker 2: kick it off with Chris Jenkins from Michigan.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Chris Jenkins is a guy that I just when

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Speaker 1: you watch him, I feel like he's got a lot

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Speaker 1: of kind of NFL feel, if that makes sense. Like

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Speaker 1: he uses his hands very well. He knows how to

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Speaker 1: penetrate the gap. He's an excellent run defender. At the Combine,

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Speaker 1: he tested better than I expect that and a lot

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Speaker 1: of people were disappointed. But you know, he runs a

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Speaker 1: four to nine. He's almost he think he's over three

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Speaker 1: hundred pounds three zho five, so big athlete that I

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Speaker 1: think has not quite tapped his potential as a pass

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Speaker 1: rusher yet. In that Michigan defense, they really don't allow

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Speaker 1: those guys to rush. You know, they're kind of a

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Speaker 1: blitz heavy scheme and those guys are stunting and looping.

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Speaker 1: But when you watch him fight, like defend the run,

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Speaker 1: he is an excellent run defender, which makes me think

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Speaker 1: he's got a very low floor. And I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: his dad, obviously, Jenkins played for the Panthers, played for

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Speaker 1: the Jets way back in the day. He's got this

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Speaker 1: NFL p pedigree, so he's been there, he's done that,

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Speaker 1: he's been around it. I just feel like he's a

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Speaker 1: guy that's a very safe prospect with some high athletic

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Speaker 1: upside compared to Rucro who again I like his film

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Speaker 1: a lot. Again, a big, high ceiling type of guy,

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Speaker 1: but I feel like there was a little bit of

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Speaker 1: inconsistency in terms of kind of his consistent awareness. That again,

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Speaker 1: I like him a lot. He's probably my sixth or

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Speaker 1: seventh guy if there's on this list, so he's very close.

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Speaker 1: But I just I just felt like Chris Jenkins was

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Speaker 1: such a get on base type of pick. And it's

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Speaker 1: it makes it easier because I think he's I think

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Speaker 1: he's got a high, high ceiling as well.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I like Chris Jenkins too. It's not like

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Speaker 2: I don't and he goes right there. Yeah, No, I understand.

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Speaker 2: He's very good against double teams. I'm gonna tell you

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Speaker 2: what I wrote down. Good against double teams. He's pretty

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Speaker 2: quick with his first step to get across the face, right,

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Speaker 2: So not necessarily exactly, that's a great way. Yes, that's

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Speaker 2: where they use it. And he might be the strongest dude.

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Speaker 1: He's very powerful.

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Speaker 2: He shoves people around no problem, makes him look like

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Speaker 2: rag dolls. But I did have that his pass rush,

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Speaker 2: that first step explosive. It's up there a little lacking

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Speaker 2: I think in this class. And it's almost like he

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Speaker 2: his arm or hand placement sometimes gets a little off.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if it's because he has shorter arms

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Speaker 2: or it's not a right technique. It looks like you

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Speaker 2: just he can get out leveraged with his pads sometimes.

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Speaker 2: That's what it looks like to me.

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Speaker 1: No, I think as a pass rusher doesn't. He doesn't

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Speaker 1: have that feel yet. But I think when you see

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Speaker 1: the athletic traits for the position, that's what I'm banking on, right,

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Speaker 1: And I think it's you know, what you describe there

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Speaker 1: is kind of the opposite like Ruca Roro. I don't

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Speaker 1: think it's a great run defender necessarily, Yeah, but he

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Speaker 1: does flash pretty consistently as a pass rusher because he's

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Speaker 1: six ' five, he's three oh five. He runs well,

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Speaker 1: he bends well. He's kind of got that feel, that

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Speaker 1: length in that feel. But again, like I think both

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Speaker 1: these guys are gonna get on the field early in

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Speaker 1: their careers as kind of early down run players. And

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Speaker 1: I think Chris Jenkins the path is just like he's

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Speaker 1: pro ready in that area. Yeah, and I think he'll

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Speaker 1: grow more quickly because he's gonna get more opportunities than

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Speaker 1: Rook Roro early.

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Speaker 2: I hear you, And speaking of Ruke who was my

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Speaker 2: guy at number four, I agree with you on everything

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Speaker 2: you said I have here that like he looks in

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Speaker 2: pass rush like maybe a one trick pony. He does

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Speaker 2: his speed handswipe thing. I don't know what it's technically called,

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Speaker 2: but he does it almost he does it all the

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Speaker 2: time where he like jumps real quick and then one.

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Speaker 1: Of these like it's like a quick swim, yeah, tight.

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Speaker 2: Swim and if he if that doesn't work, it doesn't

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Speaker 2: look like he has much else. He doesn't have a counter,

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Speaker 2: he doesn't have much else.

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Speaker 1: He's a little bit of like like well I use

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Speaker 1: this term to describe like raw athletes. He's like a

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Speaker 1: wild horse, like he's a big great point. He's out

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Speaker 1: there just kind of run around and plays hard. I

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Speaker 1: mean like, I mean, I like the player. It's just

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Speaker 1: he's got a lot of potential. I think. Again, it's

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Speaker 1: it's apples to apples here really because they both have

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Speaker 1: their issues. But the consistency that Chris Jenkins plays with,

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Speaker 1: if there's a professionalism there that I'm going to bet

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Speaker 1: on just a little bit. And again it's it's again

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Speaker 1: it's six and one a half dozen in the other

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Speaker 1: kind of thing. But that's kind of how I feel.

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Speaker 2: Well, the reason I like ruke is because he has

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Speaker 2: low center of gravity, doesn't look like he ever loses

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Speaker 2: balance even when he is getting pushed around, like what

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Speaker 2: I was talking about, Like great going in there. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: excellent athlete. He has great pursuit and doesn't give up,

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Speaker 2: like he'll keep going even if it looks like he's

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Speaker 2: out of the play. You'll come out of nowhere on

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Speaker 2: the back end, he just keeps ustling. Yeah, and he

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Speaker 2: does have a good first step with like he's a

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Speaker 2: good tach.

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Speaker 1: Yah, he's in the rookie.

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Speaker 2: He's a good player.

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Speaker 1: He's a good player, and the athleticism there is exciting.

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Speaker 1: So when you put him at four, not mad at,

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Speaker 1: I just think there's the consistency, is what I'm betting on.

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Speaker 1: With Chris Akins. I wanted to ask you about Gisean

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Speaker 1: Newton just because he's a guy that I'm having a

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Speaker 1: hard time categorizing. And I put him ahead of Braid

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Speaker 1: and Fist because I think he's got better measurables, like

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Speaker 1: more NFL ready measurables. But everyone talks about him as

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Speaker 1: being this explosive, disruptive football player, and I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: that I always see that.

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Speaker 2: Well. Interesting, and here's what I got for him. I

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Speaker 2: have that he has a nice burse off the line,

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Speaker 2: which makes him pretty darn good in the run game.

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Speaker 2: I think he has good feet that doesn't stop turning.

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Speaker 2: His feet never go flat. He's constantly moving those feet

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Speaker 2: and churning a good hand movement. Looks like he has

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Speaker 2: good placement here, but he will get caught up and

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Speaker 2: shoved around every now and then. I don't know if

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Speaker 2: so he's listed as six to two two ninety five,

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Speaker 2: maybe he's getting shoved around again because I'm not sure

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Speaker 2: if like he's got I don't dense right. I don't

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Speaker 2: know if he's dense right. Maybe he doesn't anchor down

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Speaker 2: enough when he needs to, so I'm not sure what

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Speaker 2: that is. And I think that's the thing about him.

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Speaker 1: I think the thing with Yeah, I like that. I

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Speaker 1: like that description. And then he's not like a top

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Speaker 1: shelf athlete. I don't think like when you watch him,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting watching him because he's a little stiff, doesn't

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Speaker 1: bend super well. He is disruptive, but he's not, you know,

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Speaker 1: overly powerful. He's not overly quick. He does flash, so

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Speaker 1: I don't like it when you watch his highlight only

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Speaker 1: flash time he does flash, but there's like this kind

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Speaker 1: of those those moments of inconsistency, which I find really

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Speaker 1: hard to categorize. But I do think he is more

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Speaker 1: disruptive than a guy like Braden Fisk, who again is

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Speaker 1: one of my favorite players in the entire draft. And

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Speaker 1: then obviously Byron Murphy is a guy that I just

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Speaker 1: cannot I just think he's going to be an excellent pro.

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Speaker 1: I just think the way he bends, the way he moves,

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Speaker 1: his strength, he's got good hand usage. I think he's disruptive.

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Speaker 1: He's got a good motor, and that's to me why

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Speaker 1: he might be. I think there's a world where he's

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Speaker 1: the first defensive players like that. I don't think that's

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Speaker 1: very likely, but I think there's an opportunity for that

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Speaker 1: to happen.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with you, complete with him. The only

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Speaker 2: the only question I have about him is he's he

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Speaker 2: seems small. He looks small.

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Speaker 1: I mean he's not tall, right, he's like six foot

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Speaker 1: or six. What is it? What is his list at

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Speaker 1: six one?

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Speaker 2: He's listed at six to one. He's three oh eight,

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Speaker 2: so there's weight there. But the six to one on

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Speaker 2: his arm length I think is fine. But uh, it

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Speaker 2: looks like to me, right, he's not great with range

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Speaker 2: and speed side to side, looks like he runs out

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Speaker 2: of gas a little bit and he fell down a lot.

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Speaker 1: He does fall down a lot. Yeah, he's super athletic,

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Speaker 1: but falls down. And I don't love that. I don't

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Speaker 1: love when I see that.

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Speaker 2: But these are nipigy things because he's my number one guy, right,

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Speaker 2: I agree with you completely. When I watch him, it's like,

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Speaker 2: this dude can be dominant.

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Speaker 1: I forget what cut up I watch, but just his

294
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Speaker 1: ability to get hands on guys, get to a low,

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Speaker 1: like one knee position, almost like shock and shed, while

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Speaker 1: also having some pass rush ability. He feels very raw

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Speaker 1: to me. But I do think he's a guy that

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Speaker 1: athletically like. I was just so impressed with though how

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Speaker 1: he moved at the combine. I was impressed with his film.

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Speaker 1: He just I think he To me, it's it's you're

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Speaker 1: betting on traits and you're hoping that he gets coached

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Speaker 1: up and detailed up, because I think he's a pretty

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Speaker 1: good football player already. But I think there's more to

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Speaker 1: tap into there for sure.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, all right. The last guy I definitely want

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Speaker 2: to talk about in this is cave Andre Sweat because

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Speaker 2: I can't talk about he's one of my guys there.

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Speaker 2: If you listen to this podcast regularly, A thank you,

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Speaker 2: b you know, I have my guys. Like I said, guy,

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Speaker 2: I can't.

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Speaker 1: I was just looking at you guys are there.

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Speaker 2: I can't. I can't quit it. And it's at some

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Speaker 2: point I'm just going with my gut and I'm gonna

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Speaker 2: bet on these guys and if they turn out, then

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna hang my hat on it. If they don't,

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna be like, oh, it was my first time,

317
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Speaker 2: so I'm not so, you know, don't put too much

318
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Speaker 2: weight on it. But I love Devondre Sweat. He's huge.

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Speaker 2: He he runs out of gas right, He's perpetually one

320
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Speaker 2: e with the blinking light. But that first burst for

321
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Speaker 2: someone his size, reading at three sixty two is incredible.

322
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Speaker 2: He clogs up the middle. He's not gonna play every play,

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Speaker 2: but he is going to be an excellent run stopper

324
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Speaker 2: for you and goal line sets. Good luck trying to

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Speaker 2: go up the middle with him. One of the things

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Speaker 2: I wanted to say about him is Danny Kelly at

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Speaker 2: the Ringer does a great job with comps I think

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Speaker 2: I showed this to you, and his comp was the

329
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Speaker 2: ever given And if you don't know what the ever

330
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Speaker 2: given is, that is the crater ship, the that got

331
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Speaker 2: stuck in the right. That's what he is.

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Speaker 1: He's huge.

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Speaker 2: He doesn't move fast, but he is going to clog

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Speaker 2: everything up. Good luck getting through.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And the thing that impressed me is he's not

336
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Speaker 1: just a big guy. He's got pretty good hand usage too.

337
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Speaker 1: Like his ability to kind of like attack the playside

338
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Speaker 1: pad of the guard and get a push pull and

339
00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:23,840
Speaker 1: grab cloth and kind of get skinny, relatively skinny through

340
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Speaker 1: there and push gets some pushback was pretty impressive. So

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Speaker 1: I do think if he could lose fifteen pounds, I'd

342
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Speaker 1: be much higher on him. But again, I think the

343
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Speaker 1: weight issue is he going to play every play like.

344
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Speaker 1: It makes me a little bit concerned.

345
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Speaker 2: Obviously, it's amazing we're saying that a three hundred and

346
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Speaker 2: sixty two guy can get skinny.

347
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that speaks to what he brings, and

348
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Speaker 1: he does. He does burn out, does gas out. But

349
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Speaker 1: I do think but there's something there to him. And

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Speaker 1: I think let's talk about our plus one's real quad.

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Speaker 2: Let's do it.

352
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Speaker 1: So you got a guy that I haven't watched yet,

353
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Speaker 1: Jordan Jefferson from LSU. Yeah, and talk about him real quick.

354
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Speaker 2: All right, so I think this guy is going to

355
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Speaker 2: go definitely in the later rounds. Okay, Like I wouldn't

356
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Speaker 2: even put him in my top ten, but I could

357
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Speaker 2: see this as like a let's let's take a fire

358
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Speaker 2: on this guy because he has this trait. He is

359
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Speaker 2: a dog. He is super strong, and he's not the fastest,

360
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:15,960
Speaker 2: doesn't as the best first step, but this dude has

361
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:18,840
Speaker 2: a nice swim move and liked Tovandre. He is going

362
00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:21,400
Speaker 2: to clog up that middle on run games and he

363
00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:27,880
Speaker 2: is relentless. He doesn't give an f and that's so

364
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Speaker 2: he's lacks in other areas.

365
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Speaker 1: Right.

366
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Speaker 2: He can completely disappear. He can completely get taken out

367
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Speaker 2: of a play in the sense of like, oh, we

368
00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:40,240
Speaker 2: know this is happening, here's a screen pass. He's completely fooled,

369
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Speaker 2: like there's no he runs out of gas kids, She's like,

370
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Speaker 2: there are things there. But he is an animal. So

371
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Speaker 2: I like that mentality that he brings. And there are moments,

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Speaker 2: especially when LSU was playing sort of a little bit

373
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Speaker 2: of weaker competition, he's just tossing guys around.

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Speaker 1: You can tell he's one of the stronger guys on

375
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Speaker 1: the fields.

376
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Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think that those things are going to

377
00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:06,440
Speaker 2: translate nicely for a team in the later rounds, right, Yeah,

378
00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:08,160
Speaker 2: that mentality strength.

379
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Speaker 1: You're looking for qualities too. I think that's the thing. Is,

380
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Speaker 1: like we'll talk about this, maybe maybe we have time

381
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Speaker 1: for another show like this at some point, just like

382
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Speaker 1: what you look for in a later round prospect. And

383
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Speaker 1: because like you know, we've talked about this metric before

384
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Speaker 1: on our show. It's just like you know, there's this

385
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Speaker 1: binary yes or no, and as you move down the list,

386
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Speaker 1: there's a lot more nos, right knows or maybe's or

387
00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:28,640
Speaker 1: whatever there is, right whatever color we're using to kind

388
00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:30,840
Speaker 1: of denote the gray area there. And when you can

389
00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:33,800
Speaker 1: find a guy that has a trait the strength, the speed,

390
00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:36,080
Speaker 1: the size, whatever it is, Like you know, I sent

391
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,680
Speaker 1: you a video this weekend of the guy from the

392
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:41,760
Speaker 1: Canadian Football League, the oppensive tackle. Right, he's six seven,

393
00:16:41,840 --> 00:16:44,360
Speaker 1: he's three point fifty three. Like that guy is not

394
00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:45,880
Speaker 1: going to be a first round pick. He's probably not

395
00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:47,480
Speaker 1: going to be he's probably not going to be a

396
00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:49,000
Speaker 1: fourth round pick. He's going to be a fifth six

397
00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:51,480
Speaker 1: to seventh round pick, but he's got traits. So if

398
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:53,880
Speaker 1: I'm kind of mortgaging my future on a guy, I

399
00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:56,800
Speaker 1: want a guy that could eventually, at some point figure

400
00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:58,680
Speaker 1: it out and get it done. So I also have

401
00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:00,520
Speaker 1: a guy from LSU, and I think it's really interesting

402
00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:02,480
Speaker 1: that there's so many guys on this list from LSU

403
00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:04,680
Speaker 1: because the other guy I almost went with his Makai

404
00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:07,720
Speaker 1: Wingo from LSU. He's small, undersize, six foot like two

405
00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:10,000
Speaker 1: and eighty pounds, but got he like at the best

406
00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:11,919
Speaker 1: testing day at the Combine, in my opinion, like just

407
00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:14,720
Speaker 1: shoot out when we were there, moved super well. I

408
00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,040
Speaker 1: think there's an inconsistency to his size. But my guy

409
00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:19,879
Speaker 1: is Mason Smith, and he's pretty high on a lot

410
00:17:19,880 --> 00:17:21,560
Speaker 1: of people's boards. He's a top hundred player for a

411
00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:24,320
Speaker 1: lot of people. He's the top seventy player for even

412
00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:26,520
Speaker 1: more people, which is surprising to me because when I

413
00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:28,720
Speaker 1: first watched him, I didn't get it, and then I

414
00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,240
Speaker 1: had a conversation with a scout and he was like, hey, man,

415
00:17:31,800 --> 00:17:34,240
Speaker 1: check out the later half of this year. I try

416
00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:36,160
Speaker 1: to find games from the second half of the year,

417
00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,359
Speaker 1: so I remember I watched him against Florida and I

418
00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,400
Speaker 1: and immediately understood what was happening. He's six six, he's

419
00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:46,240
Speaker 1: three fifteen, three twenty, he's like built in a lab.

420
00:17:46,359 --> 00:17:48,760
Speaker 1: He's this big old hoss, but he's not a fat guy.

421
00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:51,760
Speaker 1: He's kind of a bodybuilder type build. And early in

422
00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:54,040
Speaker 1: the season he just looked his awareness was bad, his

423
00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:56,600
Speaker 1: positioning was bad. He's kind of getting pushed off the ball.

424
00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:58,119
Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden, like the light turns on.

425
00:17:58,200 --> 00:17:59,960
Speaker 1: And for some of that same stuff we talked about,

426
00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:02,399
Speaker 1: like being able to kind of manipulate pads, get to

427
00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,240
Speaker 1: a long arm, grab cloth, push, pull, disrupt offensive tackles,

428
00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:08,560
Speaker 1: push the pocket. It's all there. And then I saw

429
00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:10,440
Speaker 1: a guy in the run game who started to figure

430
00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:13,920
Speaker 1: it out right, getting extension using those long thirty five

431
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:16,439
Speaker 1: and a half inch arms, throwing guys to the ground,

432
00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:18,679
Speaker 1: getting in on tackles. That motor was coming along, the

433
00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,160
Speaker 1: condition was coming along. And the reason that he kind

434
00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:24,520
Speaker 1: of had this maturation, kind of like a butterfly, is

435
00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:26,600
Speaker 1: he was injured last year and so this is his

436
00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:28,720
Speaker 1: first time playing in a couple of years, and he

437
00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:30,520
Speaker 1: started to kind of finally look the part the second

438
00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:31,720
Speaker 1: half of the year. So I think people are going

439
00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:32,960
Speaker 1: to look at the second half of that year and

440
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:35,959
Speaker 1: be like, this guy could be We talked about traits,

441
00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:38,480
Speaker 1: has the traits to be an impact player, be a

442
00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:40,560
Speaker 1: much better pro than he ever was a college player.

443
00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:41,919
Speaker 1: So I thought it would just again, he's high on

444
00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:43,760
Speaker 1: a lot of people's list. We kind of went different

445
00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:46,159
Speaker 1: ways here, but a guy that I think, don't be

446
00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:48,199
Speaker 1: surprised if you hear him in the second round and

447
00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:50,640
Speaker 1: a guy that makes waves for whatever teams that teams

448
00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:51,240
Speaker 1: up looked him.

449
00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:55,400
Speaker 2: He's I watched all the LSU guys. He's really physically gifted. Right,

450
00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:57,840
Speaker 2: it looks like there needs to be development. Like you said,

451
00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:00,520
Speaker 2: I watched some of those earlier games and this wasn't

452
00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:02,360
Speaker 2: quite there. But yeah, you get a guy with those

453
00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:05,560
Speaker 2: trades in yeah, and he can learn. You got something

454
00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:08,240
Speaker 2: good there. Maybe uh, maybe a rotational player out of

455
00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:10,960
Speaker 2: the out of the gate that has pretty darn good.

456
00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:12,200
Speaker 1: Upside for you. Yeah, I agree.

457
00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:14,320
Speaker 2: All right, let's move the linebackers. I want to skip

458
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:16,760
Speaker 2: edges just because I want our fans to hang one

459
00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:19,960
Speaker 2: because it's one of the premier positions. So let's skip

460
00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:22,440
Speaker 2: them real quick and go right. The linebackers A big

461
00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:23,720
Speaker 2: need for Washington here.

462
00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:26,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you want to go first, No, you go first,

463
00:19:26,359 --> 00:19:29,320
Speaker 1: all right? So five to one Jeremiah Trotter Junior from Clemson,

464
00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:33,719
Speaker 1: Maurice Lufau, I'm gonna say Lufou from Notre Dame, Cedric

465
00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:37,000
Speaker 1: Gray from UNC, Edgrian Cooper from Texas A and M

466
00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:39,080
Speaker 1: and Peyton Wilson from NC State.

467
00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:44,760
Speaker 2: Okay, I have time, Tommy Etchemberg Ikenberg. The reason I

468
00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:46,760
Speaker 2: say Etchemberg is because I had an old boss at

469
00:19:46,800 --> 00:19:50,760
Speaker 2: a previous job spelled like that, and you went by anyway, maris,

470
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:52,240
Speaker 2: what did you go with?

471
00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:55,199
Speaker 1: Uh, I'll go with you with that.

472
00:19:55,760 --> 00:20:00,200
Speaker 2: Jeremiah Trotter Junior from Clemson is three, Peyton Wilson is two,

473
00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:03,000
Speaker 2: and then Edrin Cooper Texas AMM is one for me.

474
00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:04,560
Speaker 2: So we flipped one end two.

475
00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:06,920
Speaker 1: It's close to me. They're like so on my big board,

476
00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:09,480
Speaker 1: I think one was if I remember correctly, sixty four

477
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:11,639
Speaker 1: to one was sixty five. So they're like literally holding

478
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:13,480
Speaker 1: hands here. So yeah, good go on either way.

479
00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:15,720
Speaker 2: Well, you went ooh for Jeremiah Trotter, so let me

480
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:16,160
Speaker 2: start there.

481
00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:17,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's all right.

482
00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:20,600
Speaker 2: So the reason I have Trotter Junior there is he's

483
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,040
Speaker 2: not very big and he's not super fast.

484
00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:24,160
Speaker 1: Yeah.

485
00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:26,320
Speaker 2: Uh, he may have traveled with trouble wrapping up. I

486
00:20:26,359 --> 00:20:28,440
Speaker 2: would think with technic because he has shorter arms measured

487
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:32,639
Speaker 2: short there. But from what I can tell watching films,

488
00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:35,120
Speaker 2: this is the leader on that defense. He knows what's

489
00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:37,840
Speaker 2: going on. He's quick to dissect plays, doesn't get fooled

490
00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:40,920
Speaker 2: on play action often, very patient with that. But once

491
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:44,240
Speaker 2: he sees run and knows it's run, really attacks downhill

492
00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:47,879
Speaker 2: and I just feel like the IQ is there with you.

493
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:48,160
Speaker 1: Yeah.

494
00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:51,320
Speaker 2: So the physicals may not quite be there, but the

495
00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:54,399
Speaker 2: IQ is and I would bet on that. As the

496
00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:56,680
Speaker 2: third linebacker off the board, I'm betting on the IQ.

497
00:20:57,040 --> 00:20:59,280
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I think that's where I would differ with you,

498
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:01,360
Speaker 1: because I think I see the IQ there. I think

499
00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:03,439
Speaker 1: he's a really good football player. He's got those kind

500
00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:05,920
Speaker 1: of instincts. His dad played football, same thing, kind of

501
00:21:05,920 --> 00:21:07,640
Speaker 1: thing we were talking about with Chris Shankins, right. Yeah.

502
00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:11,280
Speaker 1: The problem for me is that I think the physical

503
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,000
Speaker 1: tools are a little bit in question. And that's not

504
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:15,439
Speaker 1: just him, that's you know. I really like Tommy Eikenberg too.

505
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,280
Speaker 1: He's on your list, and I have a lot of

506
00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:19,560
Speaker 1: questions about his ability to like physically do it at

507
00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:21,600
Speaker 1: the next level. I think a lot of people forget

508
00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:24,959
Speaker 1: how athletically gifted you have to be to play football

509
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:27,600
Speaker 1: in the NFL, specifically at linebacker, And so when I

510
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:29,760
Speaker 1: went through, I was literally like, physically do I think

511
00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:32,560
Speaker 1: they can get it done? And that's why Jeremiah tried

512
00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:35,280
Speaker 1: to juniors down the list. He's a little undersized, not

513
00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:37,439
Speaker 1: the biggest guy in the world, not super long, not

514
00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:41,080
Speaker 1: super fast. Again, gets by on being on knowing it

515
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 1: and that works really well up to a point. And

516
00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:45,679
Speaker 1: I've played a lot of dudes in my career that

517
00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:48,879
Speaker 1: know it really well, like Will Compton's a great example,

518
00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:51,199
Speaker 1: you know, on bustling with the boys, like knew it

519
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:54,840
Speaker 1: really well never and he had some spits there, right,

520
00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:56,800
Speaker 1: But he had to get lucky. Guys had to get hurt,

521
00:21:57,119 --> 00:21:59,399
Speaker 1: the opportunity had to come for him and so and

522
00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,240
Speaker 1: he never really was able to hold onto that starting

523
00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:03,679
Speaker 1: position because they're always looking to physically upgrade the position.

524
00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:05,400
Speaker 1: So I think that's kind of what I look at

525
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:08,199
Speaker 1: with with Jeremiah Charter junior, and again, a guy that

526
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:11,639
Speaker 1: I like a lot. He's a good football player, just

527
00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:14,840
Speaker 1: the physical ceiling is something that I really question with him.

528
00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:19,280
Speaker 2: So, uh, you want me to talk about Eichenberg real quick?

529
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:22,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, talk about as you mentioned him, I meant.

530
00:22:22,160 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 2: And the traits you're talking about I have here. He

531
00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:28,359
Speaker 2: doesn't look super fast. He like, if there's a bounce

532
00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:30,960
Speaker 2: out or a stretch run to the perimeter, he's pretty

533
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:33,280
Speaker 2: slow to get over there. Not super fast there. But

534
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:36,960
Speaker 2: he's instinctive. He's great in the run game when he

535
00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,840
Speaker 2: identifies it and he attacks downhill. I think he's just

536
00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:41,919
Speaker 2: an all around solid player. Oh and he hits really.

537
00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:43,840
Speaker 1: Hard, which I also like that too.

538
00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,920
Speaker 2: So there's like, I get what you're saying. I guess

539
00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:49,440
Speaker 2: because I didn't play football right like or at the

540
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:53,040
Speaker 2: level that you did. Rather and like I'm looking at

541
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:55,639
Speaker 2: this and also when you watch these plays, like I said,

542
00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:59,080
Speaker 2: I don't know what I don't know, and it's really

543
00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:00,520
Speaker 2: hard for me to tell. I don't know what the

544
00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:02,560
Speaker 2: defense is called. When I'm watching these, I just I'm

545
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:04,760
Speaker 2: seeing it and I'm guessing. But it looks like he's

546
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:06,840
Speaker 2: always in the right spot. It looks like he's getting

547
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:09,560
Speaker 2: other guys in the right spot. So that's the IQ

548
00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:12,480
Speaker 2: that again I'm betting on and maybe these other guys

549
00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:13,959
Speaker 2: that we're going to talk about that of the physical

550
00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:16,520
Speaker 2: traits also of that IQ, and I'm just not seeing it.

551
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 2: And because I'm seeing limitations in these guys, then the

552
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:22,439
Speaker 2: IQ sticks out like I'm not sure, but for me,

553
00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:24,879
Speaker 2: that's why I'm rating these guys a little bit higher.

554
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think with Tommy Eickerberg, if you watch

555
00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:30,639
Speaker 1: him versus Notre Dame last year in twenty twenty two,

556
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:33,159
Speaker 1: he looks like that dude. There's a lot of conversation

557
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,679
Speaker 1: at the start of last season about him being maybe

558
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:39,719
Speaker 1: the third the second linebacker taken right, People were very

559
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:41,440
Speaker 1: very high on him. But I do think there was

560
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:43,080
Speaker 1: a little bit of an aggression. And I don't know

561
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:46,199
Speaker 1: if that's defensive scheme, if there's an injury, what's going on.

562
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:49,680
Speaker 1: But I do get concerned when you see someone who's

563
00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:52,360
Speaker 1: kind of limited athletically, what are they seeling? Are they

564
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 1: a second string linebacker for you for the course of

565
00:23:54,320 --> 00:23:56,680
Speaker 1: their career? And again, there's value there that's a good

566
00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:59,720
Speaker 1: football player, like Drod Mayo shows you exactly what that

567
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:02,119
Speaker 1: can be for you. Like special teams ace guy that

568
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 1: comes in certain situations can get your bio when the

569
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:05,880
Speaker 1: starter's hurt for a little bit, But do you ever

570
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,680
Speaker 1: want that guy to be your starting middle linebacker? And ultimately,

571
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:11,040
Speaker 1: like I kind of said, probably not, even though I

572
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:13,880
Speaker 1: like him a lot as a player, So I think

573
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:16,840
Speaker 1: for me, like that's why I went like Maurice Luaffu

574
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:18,200
Speaker 1: above those guys.

575
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:19,480
Speaker 2: Dude, he's nasty.

576
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:23,440
Speaker 1: He's nasty, he's physical, he's tough. I'd worry a little

577
00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:25,840
Speaker 1: bit about his instincts, but there's no question for me,

578
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:28,199
Speaker 1: Like when I see him in space, like dropping in

579
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:30,640
Speaker 1: his own there's not a lot of stiffness. It's very

580
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 1: natural when I see the guard pool. One of the

581
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 1: things that I really try to evaluate with linebackers because

582
00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 1: with jam in college, you saw him kind of have

583
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:40,680
Speaker 1: a hard time getting extension on blocks and being really

584
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:42,919
Speaker 1: deliberate with his hands right, and that was something that

585
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:44,600
Speaker 1: took a little bit of time for him to develop. Here,

586
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 1: I think he's got it now. Like when you watch

587
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:48,560
Speaker 1: this stuff from last year, it looks like snappy and

588
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:54,080
Speaker 1: physical and decisive, and Luaifu has no issue with that.

589
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 1: He's got long arms, he snaps carts back, he's a

590
00:24:57,359 --> 00:25:00,919
Speaker 1: good blitzer, he's a good tackler. He's pretty instinctive to

591
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:03,960
Speaker 1: the ball. There's times where there's misdirection in the backfield

592
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 1: You're like, he is not looking at the right thing

593
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:08,440
Speaker 1: because he's running completely the wrong direction. But I think

594
00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:10,960
Speaker 1: this kind of speaks to what I just was talking about.

595
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 1: The athlete. Yeah, physicality, because what he's six three, he's

596
00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 1: two thirty five, Yeah, and he's got he's got thirty

597
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: four inch long arms, like thirty three thirty four inch arms,

598
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:23,800
Speaker 1: and he plays that way, And I just think like

599
00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:26,280
Speaker 1: that's something you want to like. That guy can project

600
00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:28,159
Speaker 1: to being a starting caliber player in the NFL. The

601
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:29,879
Speaker 1: arm length in the middle of the field, especially with

602
00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:31,800
Speaker 1: all the play as and stuff behind him, He's gonna

603
00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:33,720
Speaker 1: be able to tip balls and get stuff that a

604
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,399
Speaker 1: lot of guys that a lot of other guys can't.

605
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:37,160
Speaker 1: So that's why I kind of win that director.

606
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:39,640
Speaker 2: We're on the same page there, I have. I said

607
00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 2: the same exact thing. He's a he bullies blockers in

608
00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:45,680
Speaker 2: a run game, YEA, right, He's just he's nasty, aggressive,

609
00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:49,439
Speaker 2: good power. All right. With Wilson and Cooper, let's not

610
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:52,119
Speaker 2: argue over their position on one and two, but let's

611
00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 2: just talk about these guys and we'll go in your order.

612
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,159
Speaker 2: I'll defer to you. So let's start with Edrin Cooper.

613
00:25:57,880 --> 00:25:58,880
Speaker 2: You have him as your two.

614
00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, like a maniac and I love watching him play.

615
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:04,280
Speaker 1: He's got great arm length, kind of in the same

616
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:06,960
Speaker 1: way that Marie Luof who has long arms, Like you

617
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,240
Speaker 1: can see him get off blocks like people don't get

618
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 1: in on his chest. He's a missile to the football, yes,

619
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:15,320
Speaker 1: and he's downhill. I think the one thing I question

620
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:18,160
Speaker 1: is like, in that tex A and m offense, they

621
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 1: blitz him a ton, So is he going to be

622
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:22,120
Speaker 1: more of Like I actually thought he'd be a really

623
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:24,320
Speaker 1: good fit here for Washington, And I think I still

624
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,000
Speaker 1: think that because he has this great pass rush upside

625
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:29,400
Speaker 1: inside he can play off the ball, But I think

626
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:31,800
Speaker 1: he kind of has more traits as a passersto. I

627
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,760
Speaker 1: think he had the fastest ten for any linebacker at

628
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:38,720
Speaker 1: the combine, so has some real get off juice in

629
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,320
Speaker 1: space in coverage. They don't ask him to do a lot,

630
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:43,760
Speaker 1: so I'm always kind of like, what are you going

631
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 1: to be because like as much as people want to

632
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:48,520
Speaker 1: ignore that, that is a huge element of the NFL game,

633
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 1: Like Colston the guy from Michigan is a guy that

634
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 1: I really like his film, but didn't cover a lot.

635
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:57,120
Speaker 1: Junior Colson didn't cover a lot, and so I had

636
00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:00,359
Speaker 1: to put him down my board. Don't that's really why

637
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:02,880
Speaker 1: they're switch for me. It's just because I worry about

638
00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,920
Speaker 1: his ability to cover consistently. But dude can run, Dude

639
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 1: can hit, dude can shake off blocks. He pursues to

640
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 1: the football, Like there was a play I forget. I

641
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:13,000
Speaker 1: think they were playing in Alabama where someone got a

642
00:27:13,040 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 1: reverse and was gone up the sideline and everybody's kind

643
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:18,639
Speaker 1: of trailing away from the play and he's running to

644
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:21,119
Speaker 1: the football and gets the runner. It's a touchdown, but

645
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 1: like he was on the other side of the field

646
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:25,120
Speaker 1: chase it the whole way down like a receiver. So

647
00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:27,480
Speaker 1: I really like the prospect, really like the player.

648
00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, And speaking of chasing guys down, that's Peyton Wilson

649
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 2: right speed speed speed speed speed. Yeah, that's what I

650
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,600
Speaker 2: got for him. Like he's got other stuff. I have

651
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 2: nice coverage, got great pursuit sideline the sideline. He's a

652
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,680
Speaker 2: top tier athlete. He can chase down whide receivers, running backs.

653
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:46,720
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter. My only issue is shedding blocks.

654
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:48,760
Speaker 1: Oh dude, you can get caught some times. And he's

655
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:52,359
Speaker 1: got really short, relatively short arms, and so that's I

656
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:54,679
Speaker 1: go back and forth on them all the time, Like

657
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 1: it depends on what kind of scheme you're running. But

658
00:27:57,080 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 1: if you can find a way to cover him up,

659
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 1: I think you want the athletic upside and coverage and yeah,

660
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:05,919
Speaker 1: because I think that's that's a little bit better. But yeah,

661
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:08,000
Speaker 1: like it's the short arms. He doesn't have great block

662
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 1: destruction techniques. He's trying to jump around stuff. You see

663
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 1: teams gash them all the time because he's jumping around stuff.

664
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:16,000
Speaker 1: And I just wanted to mention one thing real quick.

665
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:17,600
Speaker 1: A guy that a lot of people haven't talked about

666
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:20,480
Speaker 1: is Cedric Gray from UNC and he's a guy that

667
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:22,000
Speaker 1: really jumped out to me again because I think he's

668
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 1: physical to the football, he's got great pursuit, but also

669
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 1: he's good in coverage, and I think that's what separates

670
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:30,199
Speaker 1: like these top guys for me is I think they

671
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 1: have some coverage upside. Like again, Edrin Cooper's a little

672
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:35,320
Speaker 1: hit or miss, but he's just so good at everything else.

673
00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:38,440
Speaker 1: Do you feel good about it? But Cedric gray bumps

674
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 1: guys like Tommy Eikenberg Colson, Jeremiah Chrotter Junior because he

675
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:45,960
Speaker 1: seems to have more ball production and better natural feel

676
00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:46,880
Speaker 1: for playing the football.

677
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:52,320
Speaker 2: And my plus one was Jalen Ford from Texas. And again,

678
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 2: this is a later round guy, right, He's going to

679
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,520
Speaker 2: go later round because he gets his eyes get caught

680
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 2: in the backfield. He gets mixed up a lot. He

681
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:03,960
Speaker 2: doesn't have great pure speed. You can tell that he's

682
00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 2: just he's not an elite speedster. When it comes to that,

683
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 2: he can he's slow. When I watch these other guys,

684
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 2: he looks slower and his quickness change of direction is

685
00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 2: just not there. But for a late round pick downhill

686
00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:19,800
Speaker 2: run guy, that's what this is. This is a run

687
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 2: stopping linebacker. He charges downhill. He doesn't care if there's

688
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 2: a lineman in the way, if there's a pulling guard,

689
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 2: he is going to do everything he can to use

690
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 2: his body to just ram through it and be disruptive.

691
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 2: And he has nice little burst in that tight area.

692
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:38,480
Speaker 2: So let's say there's a stretch play the outside and

693
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:40,720
Speaker 2: he's working in. There's a little like when he goes

694
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 2: to where that tackle was a little burst, right, there

695
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 2: it's a nice solid, hard hit and for a later round,

696
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,440
Speaker 2: for a sixth round we're talking about here, Yeah, why

697
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 2: not take a shot?

698
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: Yeah? And so for me, it's a jountry hunter from

699
00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 1: Georgia State, and he's a guy that, again you're looking

700
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 1: for traits, right, Yeah, I think he runs well. I

701
00:29:56,920 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 1: think he's got a pretty good feeling coverage. I love

702
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:00,560
Speaker 1: his instincts and I think I think when you look

703
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 1: at his physical tools, I think he tested pretty well

704
00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 1: at the combine. Not the best, not the worst, kind

705
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 1: of upper middle, but I like those traits in conjunction

706
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:11,440
Speaker 1: with the instincts that I see on film. Right, He's

707
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 1: and again I think a guy that could grow and develop.

708
00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:16,320
Speaker 1: He might be a six or seventh round pick. But

709
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 1: there was something about when you watch this film, just

710
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:23,520
Speaker 1: a smoothness, a consistency that I enjoyed watching and I

711
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:25,080
Speaker 1: think is transferable to the next level.

712
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:26,600
Speaker 2: All right, let's jump to safety.

713
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 1: Safety guys. This was a nightmare. Yah. It was just tough. Man.

714
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:32,760
Speaker 1: It's just tough to evaluate him like it was.

715
00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:34,959
Speaker 2: This is really hard because they're off the screen. If

716
00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:36,640
Speaker 2: you don't have an ALL twenty two, you don't see what.

717
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 1: They're doing, they're off the screen, and there's just not

718
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:41,600
Speaker 1: a lot of plays right, and like what they're asked

719
00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 1: to do is the way different than what they're going

720
00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:44,680
Speaker 1: to be asked to do at the NFL level. So

721
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,120
Speaker 1: this was challenging for me, but I feel like I've

722
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 1: got I believe in my top five. So why don't

723
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:52,480
Speaker 1: you go first?

724
00:30:52,680 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 2: All right? Tyreek Smith from Georgia is five.

725
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 1: Tikey yes, Tiky, sorry, all right, Cioni Vaki from Utah.

726
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:03,640
Speaker 2: I can't quit them, Cameron Kitchens more Miami, Javon Bullard

727
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 2: from Georgia, and Tyler Nuban from Minnesota.

728
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,520
Speaker 1: Yeah. So I've got Cole Bishop from Utah as my

729
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:13,800
Speaker 1: fifth guy, Jaden Hicks from Washington State, Javon Bullard from Georgia,

730
00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 1: Tyler Nuban from Minnesota, excellent football player. My number one

731
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:19,120
Speaker 1: safety is Cooper Dejene from Iowa.

732
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:23,280
Speaker 2: Interesting, let's hold on the Cooper JJ because he's going

733
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 2: to pop up later. But where do you want to

734
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 2: start here?

735
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 1: I guess for me, let's start with the Utah guys.

736
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,560
Speaker 1: And I think, so, why don't you start with Vake?

737
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:34,200
Speaker 1: Because when I see Vake, I see a guy who's

738
00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:37,040
Speaker 1: got excellent short air quickness. He's pretty good in coverage.

739
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 1: He's good near good and near and around the line

740
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:42,320
Speaker 1: of scrimmage. I didn't see a guy who was great

741
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 1: tackling in the open field the way that I was

742
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 1: hoping to see. I think the other stuff I really enjoyed.

743
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:49,440
Speaker 1: I think when he's in coverage he can match concepts

744
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:52,200
Speaker 1: really well. But if you're going to be that kind

745
00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:56,040
Speaker 1: of box safety, that big nickel, you gotta tackle in

746
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:58,600
Speaker 1: the run game really really well. And I just didn't

747
00:31:58,800 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 1: didn't see that from him. The way.

748
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 2: He's athletic as hell. Yeah, and he's from what I

749
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 2: can tell, he's pretty fast at dissecting what's happening.

750
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:08,720
Speaker 1: Oh, he's got excellent let me just make that clear.

751
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: I think he's got excellent instincts and vision. It's just

752
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 1: about the execution sometimes when he gets there right.

753
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 2: It's the same thing I think that makes him a

754
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,239
Speaker 2: good running back. He's aggressive when he's even when he's

755
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 2: running fast. He does kind of with one tackles, which

756
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:24,880
Speaker 2: I'm not super excited about you're just talking about. But

757
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 2: I just I love the athlete. I love that he's

758
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 2: again the IQ that's there and quite Honestly, the reason

759
00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 2: I'm putting them here is because he will be a

760
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 2: later guy, I think. And I'm taking the athlete here

761
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:42,480
Speaker 2: as a special teams guy, as a guy that has

762
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 2: enough plays on defense that I think he could be.

763
00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 2: You made the accomp to Derek Force here, right in

764
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 2: the sense of a guy that could be on special

765
00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 2: teams and when you need him to step in, he

766
00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:55,239
Speaker 2: can step in and potentially be something there for you.

767
00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 2: I think he can do that. And then the dude

768
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,040
Speaker 2: can play running back. So like, I just think I

769
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 2: think that like he offers a versatility and a high

770
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:07,240
Speaker 2: football IQ. In that versatility, that's worth's taking a shot.

771
00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 1: No, I agree. I agree, And just to me is like,

772
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: where's the value there? And for me, it's that's probably

773
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,360
Speaker 1: a fifth, sixth round guy. But I do think all

774
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 1: of the things I said about him, I enjoy. The

775
00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 1: tackling is a little bit of an issue for me.

776
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,280
Speaker 1: Just the general physicality sometimes is a little bit of

777
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 1: an issue. That's why I think he's probably a better

778
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,240
Speaker 1: offensive player. Cole Bishop's my guy from you, He's my

779
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 1: fifth guy. And I just could not shake Eric weddle vibes.

780
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 1: And I played against Eric Weddle in college, Like just

781
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:38,080
Speaker 1: the way his kind of He's a Swiss Army knife, right,

782
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:41,440
Speaker 1: he's playing linebacker, he's playing post safety, he's the box safety,

783
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 1: he's the star. He's on the line of scrimmage blitzing,

784
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 1: and he was He's very instinctive. He's a better athlete

785
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:48,800
Speaker 1: than people think. I worry a little bit about his

786
00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:51,600
Speaker 1: arm length, especially guarding NFL tight ends. But I just

787
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:56,200
Speaker 1: saw a dude who was good at football, at instinctive,

788
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 1: good at blitzing. He's physical, he's got a great feel,

789
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 1: and he ran a four to four at the combine.

790
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 1: So I was any sixty three and he's two hundred

791
00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 1: and ten pounds. So I was like, you know, he's

792
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:06,760
Speaker 1: not that. He's not a murderous hitter, he's not a

793
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,759
Speaker 1: he's not like, you know, the best blitzer scene. But

794
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: he's just good at every single thing. And and I

795
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:15,360
Speaker 1: I just I value that. I think that's an NFL

796
00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:16,000
Speaker 1: starting player.

797
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 2: Let's talk about two guys that we both have high here.

798
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:20,800
Speaker 2: We'll do Javon Bullard from Georgia and then moved to

799
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 2: Tyler Newman.

800
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:24,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, Javon Bullard and Tyler Newman. They are very similar players.

801
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 1: I think the thing about Tyler Newman is when you

802
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 1: just watch his he's my number he's my number two guy,

803
00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:32,320
Speaker 1: probably my number one true safety on most people's boards.

804
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 2: Yep.

805
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:38,879
Speaker 1: But his ball production is absolutely insane. Like I saw

806
00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:42,799
Speaker 1: one of the best cover two disguises of anybody in

807
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:44,839
Speaker 1: this class. So I forget who they were playing, but

808
00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 1: it's a three by one. He kind of rolls like

809
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:50,320
Speaker 1: rolls to the single receiver side because the middlefield's open.

810
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:52,600
Speaker 1: The quarterback looks right down the middle of the field,

811
00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 1: and I just and instead of like running like a

812
00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:57,719
Speaker 1: backup bat of a hell to a spot, he just stops,

813
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:00,799
Speaker 1: watched the quarterback bates him in a f row and intercepts

814
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 1: the football. And that is advanced stuff. That's like big

815
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:08,960
Speaker 1: boy NFL stuff, top tier ball skill, top tier ball skills.

816
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:11,879
Speaker 1: I think he's a decent blitzer. I think he accelerates

817
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 1: well to the football. Don't love his physicality on blocks

818
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 1: and things like that. But again, he's a safety, so

819
00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:21,000
Speaker 1: how much is he going to do that? I don't know.

820
00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 1: But again, the ball skills were insane. The closing speed

821
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,280
Speaker 1: of the football, even though he didn't run very well,

822
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:28,640
Speaker 1: he's got that kind of football speed where it's like

823
00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:31,080
Speaker 1: he sees the ball, he diagnoses it quickly. He's able

824
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 1: to get there. But a little bit physicality concerns. But

825
00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:35,720
Speaker 1: I think the other stuff's top shelf.

826
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:39,719
Speaker 2: The quick backpedal, nice backpedal, and the flip of the

827
00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:42,920
Speaker 2: hips to turn and run very very nice, very smooth,

828
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 2: great first step, explosive explosiveness, and yeah, man, that's why

829
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 2: I wrote top tier ball skills, which you want a

830
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 2: little writer in the run defense. But when you're that

831
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:56,320
Speaker 2: good back there.

832
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:58,200
Speaker 1: He's like a true like at least in what I watch,

833
00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:01,399
Speaker 1: he's like a true cover two posts over three safety type. Guy.

834
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:03,880
Speaker 1: Didn't do a lot of box stuff, so that's not

835
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 1: really why you're while you're picking him, but you know,

836
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:09,320
Speaker 1: safety's got to tackle, but still a good football player.

837
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:13,319
Speaker 2: All right. So for Bullard from Georgia, I'm gonna say something, man,

838
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:15,480
Speaker 2: I hope Washington fans won't get mad at me for this.

839
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:17,600
Speaker 2: He looks like a fun size Sean.

840
00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:19,760
Speaker 1: Tailor, like smaller. He he's a slight build.

841
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:22,120
Speaker 2: He's a slow much smaller than Sean Taylor. But oh

842
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:24,320
Speaker 2: my gosh, does he want to hit and hit hard?

843
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 2: And he is aggressive.

844
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 1: Towards downhill, Oh my gosh. And he's got decent cover skills.

845
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 1: He's got decent stage skills.

846
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:35,960
Speaker 2: Tracks the ball very well, sudden the jump roots, the

847
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:38,279
Speaker 2: dude can chase down wide. Receiver's pretty fast.

848
00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:39,880
Speaker 1: Do you have uh, do you have his heide and

849
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 1: weight on there? He looks small, I have.

850
00:36:42,440 --> 00:36:43,279
Speaker 2: He's five to ten.

851
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:45,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, I looked a little undersized to me on.

852
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 2: Fun size man. Sean Taylor's Shawn Taylor's the king size.

853
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:51,839
Speaker 1: This is fun sized, And so it's funny you say

854
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:54,479
Speaker 1: fun size Sean Taylor. Like when I was watching Jayden Hicks.

855
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 1: Now it's not all the time. He's the safety from

856
00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:57,719
Speaker 1: Rushington State, And I just had to bring this up

857
00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:00,239
Speaker 1: real quick. When you watch him against you dub, he

858
00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:02,760
Speaker 1: looks like the most devastating defensive player in the draft.

859
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:06,520
Speaker 1: Like he is. He's covering receivers, he's tackling running backs,

860
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:10,360
Speaker 1: he's chinning guards like he's excellent. And then there's like

861
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:12,720
Speaker 1: you watch Arizona game, which the other game he's got online,

862
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:14,799
Speaker 1: and it's a little bit up and down. Yeah, but

863
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,120
Speaker 1: in that one game, I was like, I had these

864
00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:20,520
Speaker 1: strongest Sean Taylor vibes I've ever seen ever watching a player.

865
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:22,719
Speaker 1: It's just about the consistency with him. More of a

866
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:25,560
Speaker 1: box guy. Yeah, but like that six three two twenty

867
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:26,920
Speaker 1: type build, that's just.

868
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:28,240
Speaker 2: Like with that mentality.

869
00:37:28,239 --> 00:37:29,880
Speaker 1: Oh, that's just freaky and he needs to get with

870
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:31,799
Speaker 1: a good coach. But you know, I came out of

871
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:34,640
Speaker 1: this like not. I think there are some really quality

872
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 1: guys at the top of this thing. And you got

873
00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:37,400
Speaker 1: Cameron Kitchens from Miami.

874
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, I do. Let me let me pull up my So.

875
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,400
Speaker 1: Cameron Kitchens is interesting to me because I could not

876
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 1: get a good feel for him. I was a little

877
00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 1: bit worried about his general athleticism when I watched him.

878
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I have he is a solid all around athlete,

879
00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:54,759
Speaker 2: a good eye for where quarterbacks are gonna go with

880
00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,439
Speaker 2: the ball. Looks like he's he's quick to get over there.

881
00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 2: He he knows from what I can tell right and

882
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:05,640
Speaker 2: watching the film, he should be on one side of

883
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:07,360
Speaker 2: the field. But that ball's in here and he's already

884
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 2: making a play on it. So something told him to

885
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 2: break for that ball is what I'm seeing, right. I

886
00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:16,480
Speaker 2: think he has really good ball skills at the catch point.

887
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:22,359
Speaker 2: He's another ballhawk. I think he's a little lighter, smaller frame, right,

888
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:26,319
Speaker 2: and my fear with him is a little bit like

889
00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:28,520
Speaker 2: a corner we're going to talk about Elier. It looks

890
00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:31,000
Speaker 2: like he's not He'll get in there and tackle, but

891
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:34,520
Speaker 2: he's not running downhill. You can tell he's like, oh okay,

892
00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:37,440
Speaker 2: I'll get in here now. Like he's not like the

893
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 2: bullet we just talked about that Sean Taylor mentality, just

894
00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:43,560
Speaker 2: a missile launch right into this line. I'm gonna blow

895
00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:45,719
Speaker 2: it up. It doesn't have that, doesn't have that.

896
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:47,799
Speaker 1: No, it's one hundred percent true. So I think that's it.

897
00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:50,879
Speaker 1: And then I got my last guy is Cooper Degene.

898
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,680
Speaker 2: Who will talk about in the second with the cornerbacks

899
00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:58,920
Speaker 2: because I have him in there, so we'll talk about that. Then, yeah,

900
00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:00,400
Speaker 2: who's your plus one safety?

901
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:03,239
Speaker 1: So I had two guys one Klen Bullock, who I

902
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:06,560
Speaker 1: just I loved him as a mover on film. Not

903
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:09,280
Speaker 1: a physical dude at all, but in terms of ball skills,

904
00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:11,360
Speaker 1: maybe the best ball skills in the whole draft class.

905
00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:13,840
Speaker 1: Like he just the way he tracks the football, the

906
00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:16,680
Speaker 1: way he can close ground. He is not he's he

907
00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 1: can hit you, but in run fits and stuff, dude,

908
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:22,160
Speaker 1: you can tell he's taking creative angles. He's totally disinterested.

909
00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:24,200
Speaker 1: That's why he's my plus one. But a guy that

910
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:27,160
Speaker 1: in this type of scheme, like given free reign, just

911
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:29,320
Speaker 1: to go make plays, get his hands on the football

912
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:31,800
Speaker 1: and make you wrong. And then Dominie Campton was another

913
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,279
Speaker 1: guy way down the list. I decided to bring him up.

914
00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 1: He's six ' four two point fifteen tested like an

915
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:41,400
Speaker 1: absolute mutant. He's got thirty three and a half in charms.

916
00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:44,120
Speaker 1: Thirty three and three quarters in charms. That's an offensive

917
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:46,640
Speaker 1: lineman length there in terms of arms, so he looks

918
00:39:46,680 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 1: like a spider on film. He reminds me so much

919
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 1: of kind of this this body type that Dan Quinn loves,

920
00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:55,240
Speaker 1: which is like I can play linebacker, I can play safety,

921
00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:57,759
Speaker 1: and I can run. And he's a guy because of

922
00:39:57,800 --> 00:39:59,799
Speaker 1: that ability to run that could develop on teams for

923
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:03,480
Speaker 1: or two and then become like your Javon curse for Dallas. Right,

924
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:06,600
Speaker 1: this six four two ten to fifteen type guy that

925
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,080
Speaker 1: can match up with tight ends, play the post if

926
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 1: you need to, but also knows how to fit the run.

927
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:13,520
Speaker 1: And I just thought that guy will go higher than

928
00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 1: people think because of the athletic upside.

929
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:19,400
Speaker 2: Maryland knows how to turn out some defensive backs player

930
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:23,160
Speaker 2: good with that, and I have a bo Brady, Sorry Brady.

931
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:24,560
Speaker 1: Just I feel like, just like a solid set he is.

932
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:27,640
Speaker 2: He's a solid player. Yeah, And for somebody looking for

933
00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:30,120
Speaker 2: a Buffalo Nickel, I feel like that's where he's gonna fit.

934
00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 2: Because he's not the best in coverage. He can get lost,

935
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:35,600
Speaker 2: he can get turned around. I saw that in the

936
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:38,279
Speaker 2: Penn State game because I'm a Penn State fan and

937
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:40,120
Speaker 2: watching that like every now and then, it's like, bro,

938
00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:43,680
Speaker 2: where are you going? But he is a willing tackler.

939
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,759
Speaker 2: He's got good size, six to one to two ten

940
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:50,040
Speaker 2: willly more than a willing tackler. He wants to mix

941
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,280
Speaker 2: it up. He's not afraid of the bigger running backs.

942
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:55,800
Speaker 2: He will charge downhill and go after them. And he's confident.

943
00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 2: He's confident when he runs downhill. So it's a trait

944
00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:01,239
Speaker 2: later in a round. Maryland knows how to turn these

945
00:41:01,239 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 2: guys out that end up being good NFL players. Here,

946
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 2: I take a chance on them, especially again when you're

947
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:10,160
Speaker 2: looking at traits and I'm starting to buy into when

948
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:12,719
Speaker 2: I'm making these evaluations to trade of does he want

949
00:41:12,760 --> 00:41:15,080
Speaker 2: to play football and get nasty. Yeah, I like it

950
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:18,160
Speaker 2: for sure. Why not? So when we're talking the Buffalo

951
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:20,920
Speaker 2: Nickel type of thing, this guy can do it for you.

952
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:23,000
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, I like that pick a lot. I think

953
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:27,040
Speaker 1: he's very consistent football player, you know, if somewhat physically limited.

954
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:27,879
Speaker 1: But yeah, all.

955
00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:29,839
Speaker 2: Right, because you want to talk about Cooper de Jean,

956
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 2: let's go to cornerbacks.

957
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:32,239
Speaker 1: Quarterbacks.

958
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:34,320
Speaker 2: You want to go first this time?

959
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 1: Yeah? I won first last time? Did I know You're right? Okay,

960
00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:41,279
Speaker 1: let's go five TJ Tampa, Iowa State, four, kool Aid mckinnistry, Alabama.

961
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:45,800
Speaker 1: Three Tearrian Arnold Alabama, Nate Wiggins Clemson That hurt my

962
00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 1: heart a little bit. And then Quinon Mitchell Toledo.

963
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:52,280
Speaker 2: Okay, I have at five Nate Wiggins from Clemson. Four

964
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,360
Speaker 2: we have the same one kool Aid three. This is

965
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:57,759
Speaker 2: where I put Cooper de Jean. Yeah, all right, two

966
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:01,360
Speaker 2: Quinon Mitchell from Toledo, and one Marian Arnold from Alabama.

967
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:05,439
Speaker 2: Now for me, before we get arguing with each other here,

968
00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:08,920
Speaker 2: I think all of these guys are actually razor thin close,

969
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:12,440
Speaker 2: and I'm only switching them around based off of a

970
00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:16,680
Speaker 2: trait that I Jag Jason personally like more dislike, but

971
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:19,279
Speaker 2: they're very, very close. I think this is a very

972
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:24,960
Speaker 2: good cornerback class. So let's start with the guys from Alabama, right.

973
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 1: So kool aid. So I was watching in the LSU

974
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 1: game and I just thought, here's a guy that plays

975
00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:33,680
Speaker 1: with great technique, understands leverages, understands how to be competitive

976
00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 1: at the catch point, and that kind of sealed the

977
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 1: deal from me. I wasn't going to put him in

978
00:42:38,200 --> 00:42:40,480
Speaker 1: the top five, but then I watched that game and

979
00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:42,040
Speaker 1: I was like, this dude deserves it. I think he's

980
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 1: pretty physical. I think he's pretty instinctive, you know, not

981
00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:46,759
Speaker 1: the greatest athlete of all time, but I think he

982
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:50,480
Speaker 1: plays with tremendous technical prowess. You know, he's like his

983
00:42:50,480 --> 00:42:51,880
Speaker 1: feet are in the right spot, his hips are in

984
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,160
Speaker 1: the right spot, his hand ushes is great. A lot

985
00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 1: of these guys are going to talk about are super handsy,

986
00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:59,440
Speaker 1: like unnecessarily handsy, and it's gonna get them called in

987
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: the NFL. I I feel like he's the most technically

988
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 1: ready from an NFL standpoint.

989
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:07,640
Speaker 2: I agree completely very solid technically. I called him a

990
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:12,239
Speaker 2: slightly taller Kendall Fuller just trust him right, and I

991
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 2: think he's going to be a very good corner right away.

992
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:18,719
Speaker 2: The interesting thing about him and Terry and Arnold when

993
00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:21,359
Speaker 2: I was looking at it, is that this year, this

994
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:25,680
Speaker 2: past season, less targets went kool Aid's way. More went

995
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:27,600
Speaker 2: Terry and Arnold's way. And I think a lot of

996
00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:30,239
Speaker 2: that has to do because kool Aid had an incredible

997
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:34,239
Speaker 2: year two years ago at Alabama, and I think offenses

998
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:36,640
Speaker 2: were like, we're not throwing that way this year. We're

999
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:39,240
Speaker 2: just not thrown that way. So he had less tape

1000
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:41,839
Speaker 2: than Terry and Arnold did this year, And a part

1001
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 2: of me is like, is that speak to how good

1002
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 2: kool Aid is that there's not as much there and

1003
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 2: like there's a significantly more targets going to Terry and Arnold.

1004
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 2: Now I still have Terry Arnold is number one here

1005
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:58,719
Speaker 2: in this class, but should I consider that kool Aid,

1006
00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:01,160
Speaker 2: who's on the same team with them. They're like, Nope,

1007
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:03,719
Speaker 2: we're not thrown that, We're thrown to this guy. You

1008
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:06,040
Speaker 2: think he's the best corner on the field, but offenses

1009
00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:08,399
Speaker 2: didn't think that. They thought it was cool eight Yeah,

1010
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 2: do you think of that?

1011
00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:10,880
Speaker 1: I mean, I think it brings me to Terry and Arnold,

1012
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:13,200
Speaker 1: like I just put him ahead of kool aid because

1013
00:44:13,200 --> 00:44:15,320
Speaker 1: I think he's a little bit better, like with the

1014
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:17,760
Speaker 1: clicking clothes, the short air of quickness, he's a little

1015
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:20,200
Speaker 1: bit better at anticipating stuff, a little bit stronger, a

1016
00:44:20,239 --> 00:44:22,640
Speaker 1: little bit more aggressive to tackle. But in terms of

1017
00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:26,520
Speaker 1: coverage instincts, he makes me very nervous. And again, like

1018
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:30,680
Speaker 1: he's a guy that I watch and I say to myself, like, like,

1019
00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:32,960
Speaker 1: there's this thing like where you watch a cut up right, Yeah,

1020
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:34,359
Speaker 1: and there's certain things I want to see. I want

1021
00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 1: to see a guy in phase, you know he's breaking

1022
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:39,239
Speaker 1: when the receiver's breaking. And there was a couple, not

1023
00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 1: a lot, but enough for I was like I had

1024
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:45,200
Speaker 1: to watch more where they're running like a box fade

1025
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:47,080
Speaker 1: and he gets in trail, he doesn't get hands on,

1026
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:49,280
Speaker 1: he misses with the hands, didn't have the recovery speed

1027
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:51,800
Speaker 1: to get there, and the ball is overthrown and that's

1028
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:54,040
Speaker 1: a that's considered a pass defendant for him. So I

1029
00:44:54,080 --> 00:44:56,320
Speaker 1: think the thing that got me a little bit concerned

1030
00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:59,360
Speaker 1: was kind of the top end speed, the top shelf speed,

1031
00:44:59,440 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 1: and the elite coverage ability. I think when you look

1032
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:04,600
Speaker 1: at like a football player, like he's your dude, man,

1033
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 1: he's like, you know, he's fitting runs, he's he's getting

1034
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,919
Speaker 1: he's mixing up with receivers, he's anticipating screens. Like there's

1035
00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:13,279
Speaker 1: a lot to like. I just the ceiling because, like

1036
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:15,160
Speaker 1: kool Aid gets away with it because he's excellent from

1037
00:45:15,160 --> 00:45:17,880
Speaker 1: a coverage like, he's excellent from a technical standpoint, And

1038
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:20,759
Speaker 1: Arnold has this superpower of being hyper quick in short

1039
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:23,560
Speaker 1: area space. But when it's like long speed and where

1040
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:26,439
Speaker 1: running running, I get a little bit concerned about that. Again,

1041
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:28,120
Speaker 1: he's my third guy. I like him, but I have

1042
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 1: I had a hard time placing him.

1043
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:31,240
Speaker 2: So I'm gonna disagree just slightly.

1044
00:45:31,280 --> 00:45:32,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, go for it, all right.

1045
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:35,560
Speaker 2: And the slight disagreement is is that I'm seeing that

1046
00:45:35,640 --> 00:45:39,359
Speaker 2: he's chasing in some instances. I don't know if it's

1047
00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:43,400
Speaker 2: his speed. It may just be because he's not super polished.

1048
00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:45,959
Speaker 2: It looks like and he gets turned around.

1049
00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:47,399
Speaker 1: Which is not a great thing.

1050
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:50,919
Speaker 2: No it's not. But I see a recovery speed there.

1051
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:53,399
Speaker 2: So the reason I have him at one is because

1052
00:45:53,400 --> 00:45:57,120
Speaker 2: he's an excellent athlete. He's got great size, and he

1053
00:45:57,160 --> 00:45:59,640
Speaker 2: does have that recovery speed. I do see it there.

1054
00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:02,560
Speaker 2: I think he needs to polish up, but when you do,

1055
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:04,520
Speaker 2: you're going to have a better player than cool maybe,

1056
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:07,560
Speaker 2: And that's why he's he's there. I think it's the

1057
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:11,680
Speaker 2: traits are there and he's got a lot. You can

1058
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 2: see that he's got these things that all they need

1059
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:16,200
Speaker 2: is just a little bit of sanding, and you've got

1060
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,839
Speaker 2: an excellent ballplayer here. And that's why I have him

1061
00:46:18,840 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 2: at one. This is a full projection for me, right.

1062
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:23,719
Speaker 2: It's not a oh I've seen it. I feel great

1063
00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:24,160
Speaker 2: about it.

1064
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:25,759
Speaker 1: It's like kind of like why you like Drake may

1065
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:28,800
Speaker 1: too exactly? Why? Yes, we thought we could avoid the

1066
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 1: quarterback talk, but there was yeah yeah, so I agree

1067
00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:35,239
Speaker 1: with that, and I'm not sure that it's I'm just

1068
00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:37,520
Speaker 1: not sure about his role. I thought his role was

1069
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:39,520
Speaker 1: one thing when I started watching, and then I was like,

1070
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 1: is he just a true nickel? Do you want to

1071
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:43,600
Speaker 1: take that guy in the top fifteen. I think there's

1072
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:47,920
Speaker 1: value there. Again, he's a good football player, So I'm

1073
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:49,920
Speaker 1: not like trying to you know, like yes, absolutely, I

1074
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:52,840
Speaker 1: just I just worry about how like I think maybe

1075
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:55,880
Speaker 1: this is where expectations come out. I was like, he's good,

1076
00:46:57,080 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 1: but I was expecting him to be the best player

1077
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:01,680
Speaker 1: in the defensive player in the draft because of some

1078
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:02,760
Speaker 1: of the stuff I had read before.

1079
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:05,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, and speaking of a recovery speed, let's talk about

1080
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:05,920
Speaker 2: Quenya on Mitchell.

1081
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:08,840
Speaker 1: Quenya on Mitchell Man, Like, this is a little bit

1082
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:10,800
Speaker 1: of a projection too, Man, But when you talk about

1083
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 1: athletic traits, physical traits, like, there's nobody, nobody better in

1084
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:16,960
Speaker 1: my opinion, in this class. Like he's the freakiest of

1085
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:18,839
Speaker 1: the freaky. You know, He's runs a four to three nine,

1086
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:21,680
Speaker 1: he's two hundred pounds, he's six foot, he's got great

1087
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:26,320
Speaker 1: ball production in college. He's got excellent, excellent, excellent recovery speed,

1088
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 1: excellent recovery speed. And I think when I watched him

1089
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:31,160
Speaker 1: at the Senior Bowl, his ability to stay with some

1090
00:47:31,160 --> 00:47:34,040
Speaker 1: of the best receivers in the country, be physical, be quick,

1091
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,920
Speaker 1: undercut stuff. I just think it's a projection because he

1092
00:47:37,960 --> 00:47:40,120
Speaker 1: played at Toledo obviously, and you're kind of like he's

1093
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:42,920
Speaker 1: in this crazy soft zone coverage all the time. But

1094
00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:45,080
Speaker 1: I just was like, this guy's got got what it

1095
00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:47,800
Speaker 1: takes from a competitive standpoint and from a physical standpoint,

1096
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:49,319
Speaker 1: all right, So he's my number one guy.

1097
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:52,480
Speaker 2: Here's you're gonna go on a little journey with me, okay, Right,

1098
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:55,000
Speaker 2: I started off this process and here's what I wrote

1099
00:47:55,040 --> 00:47:58,399
Speaker 2: about him. I said, great recovery speed, but he needs

1100
00:47:58,440 --> 00:47:59,960
Speaker 2: to use it because he gets caught with his eyes

1101
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:02,320
Speaker 2: in the backfield and it looks like he has flat

1102
00:48:02,360 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 2: feet at the beginning of place. That's why I.

1103
00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:06,440
Speaker 1: Wrote, right, it's in his own coverage.

1104
00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:10,640
Speaker 2: I didn't know that, all right, But we went to

1105
00:48:10,680 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 2: the Senior Bowl, right. We went to the Senior Bowl

1106
00:48:13,040 --> 00:48:14,879
Speaker 2: and I watched it, and here's what I typed here.

1107
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:19,080
Speaker 2: Boy was I wrong? Kind of right? Kind of because

1108
00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:21,840
Speaker 2: he he still can get caught.

1109
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:24,359
Speaker 1: There was that route that Roman Wilson had on him

1110
00:48:24,360 --> 00:48:26,960
Speaker 1: where Roman Wilson, who's got these great stems, yeah, kind

1111
00:48:26,960 --> 00:48:28,560
Speaker 1: of got him turned around a little bit and he

1112
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:31,359
Speaker 1: couldn't he couldn't use his speed basically, but.

1113
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 2: He does have that recovery speed, and man does he

1114
00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:36,480
Speaker 2: catch right back up.

1115
00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:36,840
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1116
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:41,120
Speaker 2: So those little at Toledo, I didn't know because it

1117
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:43,040
Speaker 2: was the it was a competition he was playing with,

1118
00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:45,080
Speaker 2: and I was like, oh, well, this recovery speed looks

1119
00:48:45,120 --> 00:48:47,600
Speaker 2: elite on this state because of the competition. But then

1120
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 2: at the Senior Bowl. No, it's elite speed, it's going

1121
00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:53,080
Speaker 2: to play in the NFL. It's just so good. And

1122
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:55,800
Speaker 2: then you're right, it's the z own coverage thing. Seeing

1123
00:48:55,840 --> 00:48:57,960
Speaker 2: him in those one on one drills. He wasn't doing

1124
00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:01,080
Speaker 2: anything and it looked very nice, very smooth, and very clean.

1125
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:03,359
Speaker 2: So is what he was asked to do. A lot

1126
00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:05,920
Speaker 2: of zone there at Toledo. So, boy, was I wrong.

1127
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:08,360
Speaker 2: I moved this guy all the way up from being

1128
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:12,520
Speaker 2: probably outside my five top five to number two, and

1129
00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 2: he's right there for possibly number one. And a part

1130
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:17,839
Speaker 2: of me wanted to die on the hill if he's

1131
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,760
Speaker 2: not going to be good, just because like I wanted

1132
00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:23,600
Speaker 2: to do. Yeah, I want to trust myself in some way,

1133
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:26,439
Speaker 2: and there's a little bit of pride right with this thing.

1134
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 2: And it's just like, man, I was just wrong. He's

1135
00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:29,800
Speaker 2: just a good player.

1136
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:32,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's just a good player, all right, A good player. Uh,

1137
00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:34,640
Speaker 1: we're going to do Nate Wiggins.

1138
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 2: Let's do Nate Wiggins dinner plus ones than Cooper did.

1139
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:41,440
Speaker 1: Okay, all right, so Nate Wiggins. So Nate Wiggins. I

1140
00:49:41,480 --> 00:49:44,640
Speaker 1: don't like him that much, but he's my number two. Yeah,

1141
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:47,279
Speaker 1: because he's the best coverage player in the Drafty, he's

1142
00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 1: the best coverage player in the draft. Like, and he's

1143
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:51,720
Speaker 1: six ' two, he's one hundred and eighty five pounds.

1144
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:55,799
Speaker 1: He runs like the wind, and you know watching him

1145
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:59,600
Speaker 1: against the receivers from Florida State, Now, I give the

1146
00:49:59,600 --> 00:50:01,960
Speaker 1: Florida State guys some leeway because I think the quarterback

1147
00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:04,640
Speaker 1: from Florida State really struggle in that appearance. But he's

1148
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:08,480
Speaker 1: never stressed, even with fast guys, He's never stressed. He's

1149
00:50:08,480 --> 00:50:11,600
Speaker 1: got incredibly smooth feet. Like if you like he's the

1150
00:50:11,640 --> 00:50:13,040
Speaker 1: best coverage play in the draft, that's like, you have

1151
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:15,680
Speaker 1: the best coverage player in the draft. Be like out

1152
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:19,600
Speaker 1: of the first round. Okay, he doesn't tackle, Well, let

1153
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:20,120
Speaker 1: me ask.

1154
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:22,600
Speaker 2: You a question. What's an important thing you're gonna need

1155
00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:23,360
Speaker 2: to do on defense?

1156
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:23,760
Speaker 1: Tackle?

1157
00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:25,359
Speaker 2: And what does he not like to do?

1158
00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:25,840
Speaker 1: Tackle?

1159
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:27,160
Speaker 2: Doesn't like to tackle?

1160
00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:28,600
Speaker 1: He doesn't like so important.

1161
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:31,680
Speaker 2: But teams are going to see him out there and

1162
00:50:31,680 --> 00:50:33,960
Speaker 2: they're going to go, fine, we're just gonna run the

1163
00:50:33,960 --> 00:50:34,360
Speaker 2: ball at you.

1164
00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:36,480
Speaker 1: I know I don't like it, but he's the best

1165
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:38,480
Speaker 1: coverage playing in the drafts. I mean, you can't disagree

1166
00:50:38,520 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 1: with that. I don't think I don't disagree for the

1167
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 1: same reason like Kaylen Bullock, Like he's a little bit

1168
00:50:43,080 --> 00:50:46,480
Speaker 1: more willing than Kailen Bullock to tackle, but it's not much,

1169
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:48,400
Speaker 1: you know. And again he's playing corner so it's not

1170
00:50:48,440 --> 00:50:53,000
Speaker 1: as important. But his his his coverage fundamentals are excellent,

1171
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:55,600
Speaker 1: and he's an excellent athlete. He's long, he's got all

1172
00:50:55,640 --> 00:50:59,560
Speaker 1: of these things. So he reminds me a little bit

1173
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:03,480
Speaker 1: of Go from last year and that I wasn't overly physical.

1174
00:51:04,160 --> 00:51:06,279
Speaker 1: Now the difference about Gonzales that he had in the

1175
00:51:06,320 --> 00:51:07,840
Speaker 1: bag because he was like two ten, you know what

1176
00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:09,920
Speaker 1: I mean. Yeah, and then this guy's like one hundred

1177
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:12,520
Speaker 1: and eighty pounds, so he's much thinner. So it is

1178
00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:14,480
Speaker 1: a concern for me. But I just I cannot get

1179
00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:17,800
Speaker 1: past how good he is in coverage. And I yeah.

1180
00:51:17,760 --> 00:51:20,239
Speaker 2: If you're Washington, you have Nate Williams on the team, right,

1181
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:23,319
Speaker 2: which would be fantastic because you're playing Philadelphia and you

1182
00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:25,600
Speaker 2: can put them on AJ Brown or the Vonta Smithing.

1183
00:51:25,600 --> 00:51:28,640
Speaker 1: You feel good, yeah, right, But then they decide they're

1184
00:51:28,640 --> 00:51:29,160
Speaker 1: gonna run the ball.

1185
00:51:29,160 --> 00:51:30,040
Speaker 2: They're gonna run the ball.

1186
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:31,400
Speaker 1: Well, that's where I got to make sure that my

1187
00:51:31,520 --> 00:51:34,520
Speaker 1: linebackers are linebackers got ear in your paychecks? Defensive ends,

1188
00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:36,400
Speaker 1: Let's work. Let's try to make sure that he doesn't

1189
00:51:36,440 --> 00:51:38,480
Speaker 1: have to have like these full head of steam like

1190
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:40,680
Speaker 1: card run fits. Like we're gonna talk about TJ. Tampa

1191
00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:42,840
Speaker 1: here in a second, Like TJ Tampa mightbe be my

1192
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:45,799
Speaker 1: favorite corner in the class. Worry about his top flight athleticism,

1193
00:51:46,120 --> 00:51:49,800
Speaker 1: but in a scheme similar to one that ran in Dallas,

1194
00:51:49,840 --> 00:51:51,960
Speaker 1: Like he's on the backside of a like with a

1195
00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:54,680
Speaker 1: two tight end set, two receivers away, slot away, and

1196
00:51:54,680 --> 00:51:57,120
Speaker 1: they're running right at him. I have a full one

1197
00:51:57,160 --> 00:51:59,560
Speaker 1: thousand percent confidence that he is going to get in

1198
00:51:59,600 --> 00:52:01,719
Speaker 1: there and get after that running back. And that's why

1199
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:04,040
Speaker 1: I love him. He's got great alarm length. I love

1200
00:52:04,120 --> 00:52:08,080
Speaker 1: him as a prospect. But again I think that this, this,

1201
00:52:08,080 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 1: this is maybe the way to think about it for me.

1202
00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:12,680
Speaker 1: Nate Wiggins was so good at covering. I had to

1203
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:14,759
Speaker 1: overlook that, Like that's out. That's the point I got to.

1204
00:52:14,800 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 1: He was such a good coverage player, I had to

1205
00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 1: kind of put that aside. So just take there for

1206
00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:21,359
Speaker 1: what it is, Like he's not gonna tackle anybody if

1207
00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 1: he can help it, but he will lock down anybody

1208
00:52:24,600 --> 00:52:26,200
Speaker 1: in coverage. So that's how I look.

1209
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:30,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think there's anything else to say about it.

1210
00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:30,880
Speaker 1: That's what he is.

1211
00:52:30,920 --> 00:52:32,680
Speaker 2: He's just he's just not gonna tackle, but he's gonna

1212
00:52:32,719 --> 00:52:33,279
Speaker 2: lock somebody there.

1213
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:35,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what he is. And so I didn't know

1214
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:37,240
Speaker 1: how Like, so I guess the question is leave a comment.

1215
00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:38,200
Speaker 1: Is how you value that?

1216
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:40,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's interesting when you look at like a

1217
00:52:41,080 --> 00:52:43,560
Speaker 2: to Andre Sweat. He's not gonna he's not a great

1218
00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:46,080
Speaker 2: pass rusher, but he's gonna he's gonna clog up the run. Yeah,

1219
00:52:46,160 --> 00:52:48,360
Speaker 2: but we don't put him at number one. Yeah, So

1220
00:52:48,960 --> 00:52:51,320
Speaker 2: I guess it's I think it's his corner like value,

1221
00:52:51,440 --> 00:52:54,480
Speaker 2: it's position. Yeah, I get it. I I just I

1222
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:56,759
Speaker 2: see it with it especially.

1223
00:52:56,920 --> 00:52:58,760
Speaker 1: It's like Chop I put in Robinson.

1224
00:52:59,160 --> 00:53:00,160
Speaker 2: That's a great way to play.

1225
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:02,520
Speaker 1: Shop Robinson like and it will get And the thing

1226
00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:05,839
Speaker 1: about Chop Robinson that drives me absolutely bonkers is Chop

1227
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:09,839
Speaker 1: Robinson is is is this is why the comparison don't work.

1228
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:13,359
Speaker 1: Imagine if Chop Robinson had twenty seven sacks, like that's

1229
00:53:13,360 --> 00:53:15,240
Speaker 1: what Nate Wiggins, you know what I'm saying, Like, Yeah,

1230
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:17,399
Speaker 1: it's just if he was productive, and I think that's

1231
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:19,640
Speaker 1: the thing that I come back to anyway. Sorry, what

1232
00:53:19,640 --> 00:53:20,520
Speaker 1: are we doing? We're doing Cooper?

1233
00:53:20,680 --> 00:53:22,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, the plus ones do Cooper.

1234
00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:24,080
Speaker 1: Okay, so you wanna go first?

1235
00:53:24,440 --> 00:53:27,319
Speaker 2: Sure, I got cam Hart from Notre Dame. The reason

1236
00:53:27,400 --> 00:53:30,799
Speaker 2: I put him one year. You'll probably maybe fourth round, third,

1237
00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:35,040
Speaker 2: fourth somewhere there. He's a bigger body corner that I

1238
00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:38,480
Speaker 2: think just you're gonna need some of those guys around here.

1239
00:53:38,520 --> 00:53:41,720
Speaker 2: And he's a good tackler. He's a decent coverage guy,

1240
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:46,400
Speaker 2: good instincts, good instincts. I'm trying to get to him

1241
00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:46,799
Speaker 2: here real.

1242
00:53:46,719 --> 00:53:48,200
Speaker 1: Quick control, f blood control.

1243
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:51,160
Speaker 2: I know, I know here, he is here, he is Yeah.

1244
00:53:51,160 --> 00:53:55,080
Speaker 2: I think he's smart football player, decent athleticism, willing tackler.

1245
00:53:55,160 --> 00:53:58,160
Speaker 2: All right, So what are the downsides? There's nothing that

1246
00:53:58,200 --> 00:53:59,320
Speaker 2: really stands.

1247
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,640
Speaker 1: Out a little stiff, I think, yeah, for good.

1248
00:54:01,600 --> 00:54:05,000
Speaker 2: Or bad, he's just kind of he's there and he

1249
00:54:05,080 --> 00:54:07,440
Speaker 2: makes he's there to make the play, but he doesn't

1250
00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:10,279
Speaker 2: make a great play and he gets beat. But he's

1251
00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:13,040
Speaker 2: always when when someone catches his touchdown on him, he's

1252
00:54:13,080 --> 00:54:16,120
Speaker 2: right there, right, It's not like he was burnt toast, right,

1253
00:54:16,160 --> 00:54:19,960
Speaker 2: So he's he's kind of like he's.

1254
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:23,719
Speaker 1: Good player and again great. I think the Senior Bowl

1255
00:54:23,840 --> 00:54:26,279
Speaker 1: kind of encapsulated that for me because he he made

1256
00:54:26,320 --> 00:54:29,440
Speaker 1: some great anticipatory interceptions. He does great in press coverage,

1257
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:31,200
Speaker 1: and there's a couple of times where the guy across

1258
00:54:31,320 --> 00:54:33,239
Speaker 1: him is better and he loses a rep and I

1259
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:34,759
Speaker 1: think you want to kind of get him in a

1260
00:54:34,760 --> 00:54:36,319
Speaker 1: scheme that's going to insulate him. But he's a big guy,

1261
00:54:36,560 --> 00:54:39,040
Speaker 1: seems really smart when you watch him play again, the

1262
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:41,600
Speaker 1: stiffness is something that I keep coming back to. It's like,

1263
00:54:41,960 --> 00:54:44,040
Speaker 1: how does that play it? As eventually he moved to safety,

1264
00:54:44,120 --> 00:54:45,680
Speaker 1: But yeah, I like the player a lot. I think

1265
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:48,040
Speaker 1: the third or fourth round range is a little bit different.

1266
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:50,040
Speaker 1: I feel like I have the antithesis of you with

1267
00:54:50,200 --> 00:54:52,680
Speaker 1: my pick, even though they're very similar. Players. Is Kyrie

1268
00:54:52,760 --> 00:54:54,839
Speaker 1: Jackson from Oregon. He's six for He's one hundred ninety

1269
00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:59,640
Speaker 1: five pounds, crazy long arms, and he would transfer from Alabama,

1270
00:54:59,640 --> 00:55:02,360
Speaker 1: went to or is a little bit all over the place,

1271
00:55:02,600 --> 00:55:04,399
Speaker 1: like you know, like we talked about cam Heart being

1272
00:55:04,440 --> 00:55:06,600
Speaker 1: controlled and discipline and where he's supposed to be at

1273
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:10,080
Speaker 1: all times, Like Kyrie Jackson is a wild horse man.

1274
00:55:10,160 --> 00:55:13,279
Speaker 1: He's a freaky athletic. He's got great length, he's got

1275
00:55:13,600 --> 00:55:16,160
Speaker 1: good recovery speed when you watch him. He's great in

1276
00:55:16,280 --> 00:55:18,719
Speaker 1: press man situations because his hands are on guys and

1277
00:55:18,800 --> 00:55:20,600
Speaker 1: he's long enough to like even if he gets beat

1278
00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:23,200
Speaker 1: the fleck passes. But in zone coverage, his eyes are

1279
00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:25,880
Speaker 1: a little bit all over the place. He's a willing tackler.

1280
00:55:25,960 --> 00:55:28,719
Speaker 1: He's downhill, just a lot of kind of rough edges

1281
00:55:28,760 --> 00:55:30,160
Speaker 1: on him that you need to file down. But I

1282
00:55:30,200 --> 00:55:32,960
Speaker 1: think the I think the player is there, and if

1283
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:34,879
Speaker 1: the kids built the right way, you can get something.

1284
00:55:34,880 --> 00:55:36,560
Speaker 1: You can get a starter out of him, probably in

1285
00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:37,839
Speaker 1: the third fourth round area.

1286
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:40,360
Speaker 2: I think, all right, here it is Cooper Jajen.

1287
00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:42,719
Speaker 1: No, here we go. So I have him as a

1288
00:55:42,800 --> 00:55:44,080
Speaker 1: corner corner, all right.

1289
00:55:44,280 --> 00:55:46,480
Speaker 2: The reason I have him as a corner is because

1290
00:55:46,960 --> 00:55:51,359
Speaker 2: that's a premium position and he does it really, really,

1291
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:54,080
Speaker 2: really well. So why would I want to move him

1292
00:55:54,120 --> 00:55:56,759
Speaker 2: to safety where he does that well? But I would

1293
00:55:56,880 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 2: rather have him play corner because that's a pre position.

1294
00:56:00,920 --> 00:56:03,239
Speaker 2: It's kind of like vaky, right, Like, he's really good

1295
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:06,040
Speaker 2: as a safety. He's good as a safety. He could

1296
00:56:06,120 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 2: be excellent as a running back, So why not move

1297
00:56:08,560 --> 00:56:11,359
Speaker 2: him to running back right, Like, it's one of those

1298
00:56:11,400 --> 00:56:13,600
Speaker 2: things where you're gonna have to justify that to me,

1299
00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:15,319
Speaker 2: which I think you'll make a good case. You've done

1300
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:18,520
Speaker 2: it before. But he's big, he's comfortable playing with his

1301
00:56:18,600 --> 00:56:21,520
Speaker 2: eyes on the quarterback or the wide receiver, it doesn't matter.

1302
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:26,080
Speaker 2: He feels fine back there. He has great footwork, nice

1303
00:56:26,120 --> 00:56:30,080
Speaker 2: click and clothes. Although it's not like explosive, it's very smooth.

1304
00:56:30,640 --> 00:56:33,640
Speaker 2: Mixes it up in the run game. He's not flashy.

1305
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:35,880
Speaker 2: He just says everything. Well. I think you call him

1306
00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:37,319
Speaker 2: a football playing Johnny.

1307
00:56:37,000 --> 00:56:39,279
Speaker 1: Football paying john That's what he is. I agree, that's

1308
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:41,360
Speaker 1: what my evaluation would read very similar. I think the

1309
00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:43,719
Speaker 1: one thing that kind of swayed me is there's not

1310
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:46,080
Speaker 1: a lot of all twenty two of Iowa defense, but

1311
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:48,759
Speaker 1: there's one game that's against Ohio State and they're in

1312
00:56:48,800 --> 00:56:52,439
Speaker 1: a lot of Cover three and he's off, like way off.

1313
00:56:52,719 --> 00:56:56,040
Speaker 1: And even in these off situations like Marvin Harrison Junior

1314
00:56:56,080 --> 00:56:58,800
Speaker 1: and the other receivers there, like they're running by and

1315
00:56:58,880 --> 00:57:00,840
Speaker 1: he's having a hard time with his turn. He's in

1316
00:57:00,920 --> 00:57:04,279
Speaker 1: these situations where you're like, there's when you watch him

1317
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:05,680
Speaker 1: in his click and clothes, you say, it's like a

1318
00:57:05,719 --> 00:57:08,279
Speaker 1: little bit. It's deliberate, it's smooth. It is smooth, but

1319
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:11,120
Speaker 1: there's also a little bit of stiff, the slightest bit

1320
00:57:11,160 --> 00:57:12,680
Speaker 1: of stiffness to him, right, because he's a little bit

1321
00:57:12,719 --> 00:57:14,640
Speaker 1: muscle bound. He's a little bit a bigger guy, right,

1322
00:57:15,120 --> 00:57:18,840
Speaker 1: And so I thought, yeah, like can he physically play corner? Sure,

1323
00:57:19,240 --> 00:57:21,640
Speaker 1: but when he goes up against the top flight receivers,

1324
00:57:21,680 --> 00:57:24,600
Speaker 1: like you're gonna be sweating bullets. Imagine to me, treat

1325
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:27,480
Speaker 1: him like Rock Bowers and that he is a defensive weapon.

1326
00:57:27,640 --> 00:57:30,520
Speaker 1: Because when you watch Mniowa, he plays linebacker, plays Buffalo Nicho,

1327
00:57:30,600 --> 00:57:33,360
Speaker 1: plays safety, plays corner. You know else did that was

1328
00:57:33,400 --> 00:57:35,680
Speaker 1: what's what's the dude's name? From LSU a couple of

1329
00:57:35,720 --> 00:57:38,520
Speaker 1: years ago, the Honey Badger. What's his name? Tyron Matthew,

1330
00:57:38,600 --> 00:57:41,080
Speaker 1: Tyron Matthew. If you get him in a situation like that,

1331
00:57:41,400 --> 00:57:45,600
Speaker 1: he will change your defense immediately. So I think that's

1332
00:57:45,640 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 1: a position of value. It's like, let him learn all

1333
00:57:48,080 --> 00:57:49,680
Speaker 1: these different spots. He did it. Like you said, he

1334
00:57:49,720 --> 00:57:51,680
Speaker 1: mixes up in the run game, he can covered tight ends.

1335
00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:54,040
Speaker 1: He's a good athlete, he's got good ball skills. I

1336
00:57:54,280 --> 00:57:58,320
Speaker 1: just worry about the top tier, flexibility and mobility to

1337
00:57:58,520 --> 00:58:02,160
Speaker 1: play corner, and why would I like It's like when

1338
00:58:02,200 --> 00:58:04,520
Speaker 1: it's like with Sam Cosby. Like Sam Cosby can play

1339
00:58:04,560 --> 00:58:07,200
Speaker 1: tackle and was fine playing tackle, but he's an elite guard.

1340
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:09,080
Speaker 1: Like I want an elite guy that's going to be

1341
00:58:09,120 --> 00:58:11,000
Speaker 1: a chess peace on my defense. That's going to change

1342
00:58:11,040 --> 00:58:13,520
Speaker 1: the way we play the game from that standpoint. And

1343
00:58:13,520 --> 00:58:14,600
Speaker 1: so that's why I put him in safety.

1344
00:58:14,720 --> 00:58:17,360
Speaker 2: He has great ball skills, great balls, he returned that

1345
00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:20,320
Speaker 2: played well at safety. Yeah, I get Look, if you

1346
00:58:20,440 --> 00:58:22,280
Speaker 2: draft him, this is a good problem to have. He's

1347
00:58:22,360 --> 00:58:24,520
Speaker 2: so good we don't know where to put him. I'd

1348
00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:28,240
Speaker 2: be happy, super happy if he was somehow on Washington.

1349
00:58:28,440 --> 00:58:30,400
Speaker 2: All right, here it is the edges to round it

1350
00:58:30,480 --> 00:58:33,160
Speaker 2: out our top fives. I'll go first this time. I

1351
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:36,760
Speaker 2: have at five Chris Braswell from Alabama, for Darius Robinson

1352
00:58:36,840 --> 00:58:40,520
Speaker 2: from Missouri, three Jared Verus Florida State, two Dallas Turner

1353
00:58:40,600 --> 00:58:43,720
Speaker 2: from Alabama, and one Leaatu Latu from Ucla.

1354
00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:46,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I've got five and it's kind of a slash,

1355
00:58:46,560 --> 00:58:48,040
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna say that the first name. We'll talk

1356
00:58:48,040 --> 00:58:51,040
Speaker 1: about the other guy in a second. Darius Robinson from Missouri,

1357
00:58:51,600 --> 00:58:54,880
Speaker 1: Marshawn Neeland from Western Michigan, Jared Verse from Florida State,

1358
00:58:55,000 --> 00:58:58,840
Speaker 1: Dallas Turner from Alabama, and Laatu Latu from UCLA.

1359
00:59:00,040 --> 00:59:01,840
Speaker 2: Where would you like to start on this one? How

1360
00:59:01,840 --> 00:59:04,080
Speaker 2: about that we don't have Chop Robinson on.

1361
00:59:04,120 --> 00:59:07,120
Speaker 1: This Yeah, And to me, Chop Robinson's kind of slash five.

1362
00:59:07,240 --> 00:59:10,000
Speaker 1: He's probably my sixth guy on here. And he is

1363
00:59:10,440 --> 00:59:14,400
Speaker 1: he is so hard to talk about and evaluate because

1364
00:59:14,480 --> 00:59:17,880
Speaker 1: God bless he is. He's got juice, man, and I

1365
00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:19,840
Speaker 1: love the juice. When I see an edgresser with juice,

1366
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:21,560
Speaker 1: it's hard for me not to just be like, take him,

1367
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:24,160
Speaker 1: because it's hard to coach juice. But I just said,

1368
00:59:24,200 --> 00:59:26,640
Speaker 1: I want these are I like these football players better.

1369
00:59:26,720 --> 00:59:29,560
Speaker 1: I like Darius Robinson as a football player better. Like

1370
00:59:29,640 --> 00:59:32,640
Speaker 1: I watched the Missouri game versus LSU about five times,

1371
00:59:33,040 --> 00:59:34,919
Speaker 1: and that tackle that he's going against, the left tackle

1372
00:59:35,040 --> 00:59:36,840
Speaker 1: is going to be probably a second round pick next year,

1373
00:59:37,120 --> 00:59:39,920
Speaker 1: and he is wearing that guy out because he's got

1374
00:59:39,960 --> 00:59:43,600
Speaker 1: heavy hands, he's strong, he finishes, he's got great length,

1375
00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:45,880
Speaker 1: and I'm just like, you know, is he a defensive tackle?

1376
00:59:46,000 --> 00:59:47,920
Speaker 1: Is he a defensive end? I like the idea of

1377
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:50,960
Speaker 1: him with a long runway just you know, being big

1378
00:59:51,040 --> 00:59:53,800
Speaker 1: and being mean and being physical. And again that's not

1379
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:55,880
Speaker 1: to say CHOP's not a good football player. I just

1380
00:59:56,600 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 1: there's something about him that I just I like that

1381
00:59:58,800 --> 00:59:59,280
Speaker 1: about him.

1382
01:00:00,120 --> 01:00:03,560
Speaker 2: If I were to take Chop Robinson, I'd rather take

1383
01:00:03,640 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 2: Chris Braswell, really, yes, because I am I am kind

1384
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:10,080
Speaker 2: of high on him because I think they have the

1385
01:00:10,160 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 2: same sort of things. Now, Chop does his one thing better,

1386
01:00:14,200 --> 01:00:18,320
Speaker 2: but I think Braswell has a very He's also very explosive,

1387
01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:24,480
Speaker 2: and he's just as raw his uh speed to power

1388
01:00:24,640 --> 01:00:27,280
Speaker 2: is that what they call it? Like very good? I

1389
01:00:27,320 --> 01:00:31,080
Speaker 2: would he's raw. I would rather take him than Chop

1390
01:00:31,360 --> 01:00:33,760
Speaker 2: personally because I think that there are some things there.

1391
01:00:33,920 --> 01:00:36,960
Speaker 2: He's he has hands that are fast, he has at

1392
01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:41,240
Speaker 2: athleticism to turn a little better than Chop does. So

1393
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:43,840
Speaker 2: I'm just seeing these little things that like Chop is

1394
01:00:43,960 --> 01:00:47,080
Speaker 2: so fast, so fast off the line, he's dom treto

1395
01:00:47,160 --> 01:00:49,520
Speaker 2: and fast and furious, just live in his life a

1396
01:00:49,600 --> 01:00:52,320
Speaker 2: quarter mile at a time, get in the gas. But

1397
01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:56,560
Speaker 2: it's it's that turn is just and when you're that

1398
01:00:57,080 --> 01:01:00,400
Speaker 2: fast and you have that elite of a skill, why

1399
01:01:00,480 --> 01:01:03,160
Speaker 2: are you not productive in college.

1400
01:01:03,480 --> 01:01:07,120
Speaker 1: Right, that's maybe I don't know it could.

1401
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:10,520
Speaker 2: Be, but it just scares me, right, it scares me.

1402
01:01:10,880 --> 01:01:15,280
Speaker 2: Whereas Braswell has all these freakish athletic traits and it's

1403
01:01:15,320 --> 01:01:17,760
Speaker 2: like he's showing a little bit more of Oh, I

1404
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:20,919
Speaker 2: see something there athletically that I can coach up, where

1405
01:01:21,120 --> 01:01:24,080
Speaker 2: for instance, Chop is very stiff, looks like an action figure.

1406
01:01:24,120 --> 01:01:26,680
Speaker 2: You know those old wrestling action figures. They're plastic up

1407
01:01:26,720 --> 01:01:29,160
Speaker 2: top and they just they only turn like this. He

1408
01:01:29,240 --> 01:01:32,200
Speaker 2: looks like that. Brasswell doesn't look like that. No, he can,

1409
01:01:32,320 --> 01:01:34,760
Speaker 2: he can bend a little more. He's not super bendi,

1410
01:01:34,800 --> 01:01:38,240
Speaker 2: he's not a lot too, but there's enough there that

1411
01:01:38,360 --> 01:01:40,840
Speaker 2: I'm like, I would rather take that. I would do

1412
01:01:41,120 --> 01:01:45,280
Speaker 2: one tick less of that speed to get all these

1413
01:01:45,360 --> 01:01:48,560
Speaker 2: other things right. And that's why he's at five for me,

1414
01:01:48,880 --> 01:01:51,680
Speaker 2: and Chop is at like six seventies.

1415
01:01:51,840 --> 01:01:53,040
Speaker 1: He's right there, he's right there.

1416
01:01:53,080 --> 01:01:54,920
Speaker 2: But that's why he's up Brasswall.

1417
01:01:55,040 --> 01:01:56,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, like I said, it's hard. It was hard for

1418
01:01:56,520 --> 01:01:58,240
Speaker 1: me not to put Chop my top five, just because

1419
01:01:58,520 --> 01:02:00,840
Speaker 1: he's got that juice. And you see clips to him,

1420
01:02:00,880 --> 01:02:03,440
Speaker 1: like highlights of him, like just his lateral quick, are

1421
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:05,360
Speaker 1: you just like Wow, this guy in the right system,

1422
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:07,480
Speaker 1: in the right setup, with the right coaching could be dangerous.

1423
01:02:07,560 --> 01:02:09,840
Speaker 1: But again I could hear my heart led me to

1424
01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:12,000
Speaker 1: the guy who plays football the way it should be

1425
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:14,280
Speaker 1: played in that's Darius Robinson. Another guy, Marshawn Neelan. I'm

1426
01:02:14,280 --> 01:02:16,560
Speaker 1: probably a little higher on him the most. I just

1427
01:02:16,680 --> 01:02:21,040
Speaker 1: think when I watch him, he's six three, he's two seventy.

1428
01:02:21,520 --> 01:02:23,840
Speaker 1: He's got great bend, he's got great change direction. He

1429
01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:28,600
Speaker 1: plays like an absolute maniac. At Western Michigan plays like

1430
01:02:28,680 --> 01:02:30,520
Speaker 1: a maniac. And at the Senior Bowl, I thought he

1431
01:02:30,560 --> 01:02:33,080
Speaker 1: showed enough pass rush upside of how to kind of

1432
01:02:33,400 --> 01:02:36,520
Speaker 1: nice little euro step speed to power. There was more

1433
01:02:36,560 --> 01:02:40,120
Speaker 1: diversity of his pass rush there. And I want him

1434
01:02:40,160 --> 01:02:42,919
Speaker 1: on the team. I want him here because I really

1435
01:02:43,040 --> 01:02:46,400
Speaker 1: appreciate that type of football player and that type of mentality.

1436
01:02:46,720 --> 01:02:48,880
Speaker 1: And I think his floor is really high. I think

1437
01:02:48,920 --> 01:02:52,000
Speaker 1: his ceiling's really high. I like him. I just I

1438
01:02:52,120 --> 01:02:55,040
Speaker 1: love what he brings. And that's all I can That's

1439
01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:56,000
Speaker 1: all I have to say about him.

1440
01:02:56,080 --> 01:02:58,560
Speaker 2: All Right, let's do Jared versut Alisna a lot to

1441
01:02:58,720 --> 01:03:01,040
Speaker 2: real quick. First, what do you like about him?

1442
01:03:01,360 --> 01:03:04,200
Speaker 1: Verse? He's physical, as all get out. Man, he'll dent

1443
01:03:04,240 --> 01:03:06,720
Speaker 1: your face mask. He'll be physical. Love that about him.

1444
01:03:07,880 --> 01:03:10,880
Speaker 1: He's very productive. He is a great athlete. I think

1445
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:12,600
Speaker 1: the one thing is the bend, and that's why he's

1446
01:03:12,600 --> 01:03:15,240
Speaker 1: three for me. He just doesn't bend at a high level,

1447
01:03:15,400 --> 01:03:17,320
Speaker 1: and he gets me concerned about his ability to take

1448
01:03:17,400 --> 01:03:21,000
Speaker 1: that elite power from six sacks to ten or eleven sacks.

1449
01:03:21,640 --> 01:03:22,880
Speaker 1: So that's my only concern with him.

1450
01:03:23,000 --> 01:03:24,880
Speaker 2: Yeah. I saw that he whips every now and then

1451
01:03:24,960 --> 01:03:30,280
Speaker 2: on tackles. It's a small thing. His hands are like clubs. Yeah,

1452
01:03:30,280 --> 01:03:33,240
Speaker 2: they're very strong, very aggressive, like Claymore swords. He's just

1453
01:03:33,360 --> 01:03:36,520
Speaker 2: swinging those around and they look like they hurt. But yeah,

1454
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:40,840
Speaker 2: he's very strong, very aggressive. Dallas Turner, why do you

1455
01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:43,400
Speaker 2: like him at two? Because we have the same ones here.

1456
01:03:43,440 --> 01:03:44,280
Speaker 2: That's why I'm just going on.

1457
01:03:44,640 --> 01:03:47,360
Speaker 1: Turner is the freak of the class. Everyone says chop,

1458
01:03:47,480 --> 01:03:50,400
Speaker 1: but I think when you look at his measurables, his bend,

1459
01:03:50,640 --> 01:03:54,680
Speaker 1: his agilities, his production, he's a freak. I think you

1460
01:03:54,760 --> 01:03:57,640
Speaker 1: don't see the most intuitive football player of all time,

1461
01:03:57,680 --> 01:04:00,320
Speaker 1: and I think that's why it's hard. It's because he's productive,

1462
01:04:00,760 --> 01:04:02,960
Speaker 1: But to my mind, he should be more productive is

1463
01:04:03,040 --> 01:04:05,320
Speaker 1: really what it comes down to. But I think I

1464
01:04:05,400 --> 01:04:07,560
Speaker 1: think with the right coaching and the right system, Like

1465
01:04:07,680 --> 01:04:09,600
Speaker 1: if I'm a scout, if I'm a GM, I'm I'm

1466
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:13,600
Speaker 1: drafting him basically saying, coach, figure it out. Like he's

1467
01:04:13,680 --> 01:04:15,800
Speaker 1: got it, we know he's got it, we've seen it.

1468
01:04:16,520 --> 01:04:18,520
Speaker 1: Make it happen more, and that's all we're doing. And

1469
01:04:18,560 --> 01:04:20,200
Speaker 1: I think you get a ten eleven sec guy kind

1470
01:04:20,240 --> 01:04:22,919
Speaker 1: of out that got the gate just based on athletic Yeah,

1471
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:24,800
Speaker 1: and it's not just and that's not just speed that's

1472
01:04:25,360 --> 01:04:29,000
Speaker 1: been that's strength, that's all of these things. Like his

1473
01:04:29,160 --> 01:04:32,560
Speaker 1: combine was legendary. Like he's like forty inch vertical around

1474
01:04:32,560 --> 01:04:34,800
Speaker 1: a four four seven. He's got thirty five inch Like

1475
01:04:34,840 --> 01:04:38,000
Speaker 1: he is a freaky dude. He's six foot. He's built

1476
01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:39,840
Speaker 1: to be a pass rusher. He's built to be a

1477
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:42,240
Speaker 1: pass rusher. So that's why just coach, figure it out.

1478
01:04:42,680 --> 01:04:46,720
Speaker 2: Yeah. I called him Chop Robinson with bend perfect. And

1479
01:04:47,120 --> 01:04:49,280
Speaker 2: this is why Chop is just not up there because

1480
01:04:49,840 --> 01:04:54,520
Speaker 2: he it's awesome that you're fast, but like Turner is

1481
01:04:54,640 --> 01:04:57,160
Speaker 2: fast and can bend. Yeah, right, he's got the motor.

1482
01:04:57,640 --> 01:05:00,480
Speaker 2: The thing is the same as chap Robinson is a

1483
01:05:00,560 --> 01:05:03,880
Speaker 2: little wild at times, like his hands are sometimes kind

1484
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:04,600
Speaker 2: of all over the place.

1485
01:05:04,880 --> 01:05:05,960
Speaker 1: To say that, because I feel like a lot of

1486
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:09,440
Speaker 1: people have him as a lock to Atlanta at eight.

1487
01:05:09,800 --> 01:05:11,680
Speaker 1: But to me, I'm like, it's a he's got to

1488
01:05:11,680 --> 01:05:12,400
Speaker 1: develop a little bit.

1489
01:05:12,600 --> 01:05:14,960
Speaker 2: It's a development piece. But man, all the pieces are

1490
01:05:15,520 --> 01:05:18,320
Speaker 2: all the pieces are there, which leads to I think

1491
01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:23,000
Speaker 2: a lot of people have Let Okay, he's my number one.

1492
01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:25,440
Speaker 2: I don't think he's going off the board as the

1493
01:05:25,480 --> 01:05:28,240
Speaker 2: first RUSS. I just don't. And it's because of the

1494
01:05:28,280 --> 01:05:31,880
Speaker 2: medical history. And I have a hard time figuring out

1495
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:34,560
Speaker 2: where to place him when it comes to mock drafts

1496
01:05:34,600 --> 01:05:36,600
Speaker 2: that we do or these top fives because of that

1497
01:05:36,720 --> 01:05:39,240
Speaker 2: medical history. And a part of me is like the

1498
01:05:39,320 --> 01:05:41,880
Speaker 2: dude decided to play, So I'm just gonna ignore it.

1499
01:05:42,080 --> 01:05:44,439
Speaker 2: And maybe that's maybe that's wrong of me, and maybe

1500
01:05:44,560 --> 01:05:46,600
Speaker 2: NFL teams are not doing that. They're probably not doing

1501
01:05:46,640 --> 01:05:50,040
Speaker 2: that because you're investing a lot in this. But I

1502
01:05:50,440 --> 01:05:51,919
Speaker 2: want to take the ninja black belt.

1503
01:05:52,280 --> 01:05:57,040
Speaker 1: Dude. Dude's got no bones. Yeah crazy, He's so good

1504
01:05:57,320 --> 01:06:01,320
Speaker 1: is his bend, his timing, his rolodex of moves. He's

1505
01:06:01,360 --> 01:06:02,920
Speaker 1: not a bad and not a great athlete, not a

1506
01:06:02,960 --> 01:06:05,440
Speaker 1: bad athlete, but just like, watch he.

1507
01:06:05,560 --> 01:06:07,960
Speaker 2: Tested better at the combine than you thought, which is

1508
01:06:08,480 --> 01:06:10,240
Speaker 2: that only Yeah, we were like, oh, well, he's not

1509
01:06:10,280 --> 01:06:11,720
Speaker 2: gonna be a great athlete, he's not gonna do what.

1510
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:16,000
Speaker 1: But but then he takes like right right in the middle. Yeah,

1511
01:06:16,040 --> 01:06:18,080
Speaker 1: and so like, whoa, that's what, right in the middle

1512
01:06:18,480 --> 01:06:21,640
Speaker 1: with one of the most productive college pass rushers ever.

1513
01:06:22,320 --> 01:06:25,000
Speaker 1: And I'm like, why isn't this guy being talked about

1514
01:06:25,000 --> 01:06:27,840
Speaker 1: going higher? And you know, you watch the USC game,

1515
01:06:27,960 --> 01:06:31,040
Speaker 1: watch the Utah game, watch the Oregon State game. Do

1516
01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:34,760
Speaker 1: like there's times where he just he can't be touched,

1517
01:06:35,120 --> 01:06:38,160
Speaker 1: like and it's unbelievable. And it's not just one play.

1518
01:06:38,240 --> 01:06:41,240
Speaker 1: It's like play after play after play after play, and

1519
01:06:41,400 --> 01:06:44,000
Speaker 1: just again, the medical is a concern. Maybe the top

1520
01:06:44,040 --> 01:06:46,920
Speaker 1: flight athleticism doesn't really bother me, but I'm sure it's

1521
01:06:46,920 --> 01:06:49,840
Speaker 1: concerning to some. But the film, the film is the film,

1522
01:06:49,960 --> 01:06:51,400
Speaker 1: and he's got the best film in the class.

1523
01:06:51,400 --> 01:06:53,479
Speaker 2: I think, oh my gosh. Yeah, And what you're saying,

1524
01:06:53,560 --> 01:06:55,880
Speaker 2: like his bend is how he dips his shoulders, like

1525
01:06:55,960 --> 01:06:58,600
Speaker 2: you said, no bones just looks like water running. When

1526
01:06:58,600 --> 01:07:00,520
Speaker 2: we were at the Senior Bowl. They were just doing

1527
01:07:00,560 --> 01:07:03,280
Speaker 2: a drill where they were bending and turning around the

1528
01:07:03,520 --> 01:07:06,040
Speaker 2: upright write that post and it's like you were like,

1529
01:07:06,320 --> 01:07:08,360
Speaker 2: that's him, and he's like, oh, yeah, you can tell.

1530
01:07:08,440 --> 01:07:11,720
Speaker 2: It just looks different. It's funny. I actually got out

1531
01:07:11,800 --> 01:07:13,680
Speaker 2: my phone the other day. I deleted the recording so

1532
01:07:13,760 --> 01:07:16,120
Speaker 2: you can't ask for it. But there's a pillar at

1533
01:07:16,160 --> 01:07:18,400
Speaker 2: my in law's house, their home, and I was like,

1534
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:20,960
Speaker 2: I'm going to try that, and I tried that drill

1535
01:07:21,040 --> 01:07:21,720
Speaker 2: of like bending out.

1536
01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:22,760
Speaker 1: I was like, it's crazy.

1537
01:07:22,920 --> 01:07:26,200
Speaker 2: I had to move so slow to get my body

1538
01:07:26,320 --> 01:07:28,240
Speaker 2: to do that. And of course I am not the

1539
01:07:28,400 --> 01:07:32,040
Speaker 2: same in the same athletic condition as he is, but

1540
01:07:32,200 --> 01:07:34,360
Speaker 2: I was trying, and my wife's like, what are you doing.

1541
01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:37,200
Speaker 2: I'm like, I just want to see what he's doing

1542
01:07:37,400 --> 01:07:40,320
Speaker 2: and then imagine trying to do it one hundred times faster,

1543
01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:43,120
Speaker 2: and it's wild that he can do that. It's really

1544
01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:44,440
Speaker 2: wild body control.

1545
01:07:45,040 --> 01:07:46,959
Speaker 1: Honestly, if you guys just have like a couple of minutes,

1546
01:07:47,040 --> 01:07:49,080
Speaker 1: go look up a highlight or go watch the USC game,

1547
01:07:49,160 --> 01:07:52,120
Speaker 1: go watch the Utah game. Like it's it's very impressive.

1548
01:07:52,240 --> 01:07:55,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, and not only does he have these things, it's

1549
01:07:55,400 --> 01:07:58,160
Speaker 2: if he gets caught in one of them or one

1550
01:07:58,200 --> 01:08:01,160
Speaker 2: of them isn't successful, immediately transitions into something else.

1551
01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:04,080
Speaker 1: So such a fantastic is everybody else in this class

1552
01:08:04,480 --> 01:08:08,120
Speaker 1: into your ed drusher linebacker the second they get caught,

1553
01:08:08,160 --> 01:08:10,640
Speaker 1: they're boned. And he just has the ability to be like, Nope,

1554
01:08:10,640 --> 01:08:12,280
Speaker 1: I got my next thing. Oh you got that one too,

1555
01:08:12,360 --> 01:08:12,680
Speaker 1: next thing.

1556
01:08:12,760 --> 01:08:15,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, he could do. I've I saw at the Senior Bowl.

1557
01:08:15,960 --> 01:08:17,880
Speaker 2: There was one rep. It was a one on one.

1558
01:08:17,920 --> 01:08:20,600
Speaker 2: I can't remember who it was he was going against, but.

1559
01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:21,840
Speaker 1: The tackle did it from Utah.

1560
01:08:22,120 --> 01:08:25,040
Speaker 2: He did a good job. He held him right and

1561
01:08:26,040 --> 01:08:28,800
Speaker 2: Leotu tried the bend didn't work. I think he tried

1562
01:08:28,840 --> 01:08:31,360
Speaker 2: like I tried to spin and then it didn't work.

1563
01:08:31,400 --> 01:08:33,519
Speaker 2: And it was like then a swim or.

1564
01:08:33,880 --> 01:08:35,120
Speaker 1: You kind of hit him with like what I call

1565
01:08:35,160 --> 01:08:36,880
Speaker 1: like a bull like a bullet transition, Like I hit

1566
01:08:36,920 --> 01:08:38,080
Speaker 1: him down the middle of the guy did a great

1567
01:08:38,160 --> 01:08:39,479
Speaker 1: job finding the edge and then he just kind of

1568
01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:42,799
Speaker 1: tapped his elbow, worked his shoulder over, ducked his inside

1569
01:08:42,840 --> 01:08:44,439
Speaker 1: shoulder and was right there for the place.

1570
01:08:44,520 --> 01:08:48,519
Speaker 2: Yes, and it's like whoa yeah, like the yeah, Jean

1571
01:08:48,600 --> 01:08:51,400
Speaker 2: Claude Fan Dam's nindro back there, he's got.

1572
01:08:51,360 --> 01:08:53,840
Speaker 1: All the moves and who's your plus one? I like

1573
01:08:53,920 --> 01:08:55,880
Speaker 1: your plus one a lot. Almost put him on here.

1574
01:08:56,160 --> 01:09:01,720
Speaker 2: Jonah Ellis, Yeah, he is from Utah. He to me

1575
01:09:01,960 --> 01:09:05,720
Speaker 2: on films. He looks small, but he has long arms.

1576
01:09:05,800 --> 01:09:08,840
Speaker 2: He measured decently long arms, and he has good bursts

1577
01:09:09,000 --> 01:09:12,920
Speaker 2: and exposure energy, excellent motor, keeps working even when blocked

1578
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:16,400
Speaker 2: up well, like even if he's he is not gonna stop,

1579
01:09:16,920 --> 01:09:21,479
Speaker 2: just trying to grind. He can lose his balance just

1580
01:09:21,520 --> 01:09:23,760
Speaker 2: a little bit, but he's got quick feet and he

1581
01:09:23,880 --> 01:09:26,519
Speaker 2: uses those long arms to eventually shed the blocks. I

1582
01:09:26,680 --> 01:09:29,760
Speaker 2: just I like his motor. I like his tenacity and.

1583
01:09:29,840 --> 01:09:32,760
Speaker 1: Got an absolutely brutal spin move. Like his spin move

1584
01:09:32,880 --> 01:09:33,400
Speaker 1: is excellent.

1585
01:09:34,479 --> 01:09:35,840
Speaker 2: There you go see excellent.

1586
01:09:35,960 --> 01:09:38,360
Speaker 1: He's got an excellent spin move. He's got like a

1587
01:09:38,479 --> 01:09:41,400
Speaker 1: nice past rush pedigree. His dad, his brother, his cousin,

1588
01:09:41,479 --> 01:09:43,519
Speaker 1: his other brother Ale play in the NFL. He knows

1589
01:09:43,560 --> 01:09:46,840
Speaker 1: what this is about. Like I love there's a thing.

1590
01:09:46,920 --> 01:09:49,120
Speaker 1: Like he's a little underside, but his length you can

1591
01:09:49,160 --> 01:09:50,800
Speaker 1: see tight ends and tackles try to get on him.

1592
01:09:50,800 --> 01:09:52,479
Speaker 1: He understands how to kind of work his hips, use

1593
01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:55,280
Speaker 1: his length. Throw guys on the ground pursuit of the football.

1594
01:09:55,680 --> 01:09:57,320
Speaker 1: Like he's just got it, you know what I'm saying.

1595
01:09:57,360 --> 01:10:00,040
Speaker 1: Like I worry a little bit about his side. I

1596
01:10:00,080 --> 01:10:02,920
Speaker 1: think he's only six two right, six two, Yeah, a

1597
01:10:02,920 --> 01:10:04,800
Speaker 1: little undersize, so like what's his role? But like in

1598
01:10:04,880 --> 01:10:08,000
Speaker 1: a stand up three four edge guy, you know, situational

1599
01:10:08,040 --> 01:10:09,920
Speaker 1: pass rush guy. I really liked that.

1600
01:10:10,080 --> 01:10:11,920
Speaker 2: I could see him aut a place like this and

1601
01:10:12,120 --> 01:10:12,600
Speaker 2: having a.

1602
01:10:12,840 --> 01:10:15,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, like finding it like they like this staff would

1603
01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:16,840
Speaker 1: find a way to get him on the field and

1604
01:10:17,240 --> 01:10:18,280
Speaker 1: make productive.

1605
01:10:17,880 --> 01:10:19,840
Speaker 2: This for him and your guy.

1606
01:10:20,040 --> 01:10:23,280
Speaker 1: I love your guy too, Javon Solomon. Is he six

1607
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:24,200
Speaker 1: foot or is he six?

1608
01:10:24,720 --> 01:10:25,040
Speaker 2: Real quick?

1609
01:10:25,120 --> 01:10:27,680
Speaker 1: Yeah? Six foot? I think he's four he's a two

1610
01:10:28,160 --> 01:10:31,800
Speaker 1: forty sixth sixty five. Oh, he's definitely not six to two.

1611
01:10:32,080 --> 01:10:33,200
Speaker 1: He's shorter than that for sure.

1612
01:10:33,240 --> 01:10:34,800
Speaker 2: I bet it's what do you wait? That's what he

1613
01:10:34,880 --> 01:10:37,760
Speaker 2: measured in at at the Commine. Yeah, six two forty five.

1614
01:10:37,880 --> 01:10:39,599
Speaker 1: He was so like, why would he have six? Anyway?

1615
01:10:39,600 --> 01:10:42,120
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter. I think what I love about this

1616
01:10:42,240 --> 01:10:45,679
Speaker 1: guy is he's short. He's kind of stubby, he doesn't

1617
01:10:45,680 --> 01:10:48,879
Speaker 1: have long arms, but has great kind of bounding ability

1618
01:10:49,000 --> 01:10:50,759
Speaker 1: and a great feel for pass rush. He had seventeen

1619
01:10:50,800 --> 01:10:53,640
Speaker 1: sacks last year and that production is awesome. And I

1620
01:10:53,680 --> 01:10:54,800
Speaker 1: think if you were to get him in like a

1621
01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:58,320
Speaker 1: Bryce Huff type role where he's a situational pass rusher

1622
01:10:58,360 --> 01:11:00,160
Speaker 1: for a couple of years, a guy that can move

1623
01:11:00,200 --> 01:11:03,160
Speaker 1: around the formation, started off ball linebacker again, a place

1624
01:11:03,240 --> 01:11:06,280
Speaker 1: like this is going to his pass rushing ability would

1625
01:11:06,280 --> 01:11:10,479
Speaker 1: be awesome. Really like him again, undersized, you know, to

1626
01:11:10,479 --> 01:11:12,040
Speaker 1: strugg a little bit at the COMBA or at the

1627
01:11:12,280 --> 01:11:15,439
Speaker 1: Senior Bowl. Not an every down player just yet, but

1628
01:11:15,560 --> 01:11:18,880
Speaker 1: I really like people that have a good feel for

1629
01:11:18,960 --> 01:11:19,599
Speaker 1: rushing the passer.

1630
01:11:19,880 --> 01:11:22,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think his size is what could be limiting,

1631
01:11:22,280 --> 01:11:26,880
Speaker 2: but he's going to be a rotational pass rusher almost immediately. Right,

1632
01:11:26,960 --> 01:11:29,200
Speaker 2: he's got I think you say this before, he's got

1633
01:11:29,280 --> 01:11:33,280
Speaker 2: the juice right, Just there's something that he was at Troy,

1634
01:11:33,479 --> 01:11:35,519
Speaker 2: right and he dominated, which is what you want to

1635
01:11:35,560 --> 01:11:38,160
Speaker 2: see from a guy at facing the type of competition

1636
01:11:38,240 --> 01:11:41,439
Speaker 2: that he would. Yeah, So that did it, right.

1637
01:11:41,560 --> 01:11:43,040
Speaker 1: Let's sad it we made it through the whole defense

1638
01:11:43,120 --> 01:11:46,720
Speaker 1: and we only talked about quarterback for like thirty second second. Yeah,

1639
01:11:46,880 --> 01:11:48,400
Speaker 1: but yeah, that's going to do it. And again, lots

1640
01:11:48,439 --> 01:11:50,479
Speaker 1: of defensive prospects in there, if there's a guy that

1641
01:11:50,560 --> 01:11:52,760
Speaker 1: you guys like that we didn't talk about, please throw

1642
01:11:52,840 --> 01:11:54,280
Speaker 1: him in there. We got a couple more shows to

1643
01:11:54,400 --> 01:11:56,160
Speaker 1: go yet. Before the draft, we'll make sure we talk

1644
01:11:56,200 --> 01:11:59,519
Speaker 1: about those players. Remember there's about three hundred and farder guys.

1645
01:11:59,760 --> 01:12:01,599
Speaker 1: We have watch all of them yet, We're gonna be honest. Yeah,

1646
01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:03,000
Speaker 1: I watched a lot of them without all of them.

1647
01:12:02,920 --> 01:12:05,479
Speaker 2: And it's hard to recall them. I have to have

1648
01:12:05,600 --> 01:12:08,320
Speaker 2: my computer here because I'm I don't have to recall

1649
01:12:08,400 --> 01:12:10,640
Speaker 2: you do. It's amazing that you can remember these arm

1650
01:12:10,720 --> 01:12:11,439
Speaker 2: lengths and all.

1651
01:12:11,320 --> 01:12:14,360
Speaker 1: Of that's it's like it's an obsession, you know what.

1652
01:12:14,400 --> 01:12:15,960
Speaker 1: I think about it all the time.

1653
01:12:16,000 --> 01:12:18,360
Speaker 2: It's pretty crazy. All right. So next week we'll have

1654
01:12:18,439 --> 01:12:21,640
Speaker 2: Connor Rodgers. He'll do tight ends with you, and of

1655
01:12:21,760 --> 01:12:24,400
Speaker 2: course you can't escape the quarterback discussion. I'm sure he'll

1656
01:12:24,439 --> 01:12:27,200
Speaker 2: talk about that. Yeah, And then following that, it will

1657
01:12:27,240 --> 01:12:29,640
Speaker 2: be the week of the draft and we will have

1658
01:12:29,920 --> 01:12:33,120
Speaker 2: an episode that is very special for you. We can

1659
01:12:33,200 --> 01:12:34,479
Speaker 2: announce it because we're gonna do it.

1660
01:12:35,240 --> 01:12:38,920
Speaker 1: We're gonna do a seven round, we hit ourselves round.

1661
01:12:39,000 --> 01:12:40,880
Speaker 2: And it's going to be Selby and Fred Smooter are

1662
01:12:40,880 --> 01:12:42,600
Speaker 2: going to join in this one, and we're gonna do

1663
01:12:42,680 --> 01:12:45,040
Speaker 2: it the week of the draft, and that way people

1664
01:12:45,120 --> 01:12:47,000
Speaker 2: can listen to it and then hear how wrong we

1665
01:12:47,120 --> 01:12:50,720
Speaker 2: are almost immediately because the drafts are just like who

1666
01:12:50,800 --> 01:12:53,439
Speaker 2: knows well, but we're gonna do all seven rounds where

1667
01:12:53,439 --> 01:12:54,400
Speaker 2: you get every pick.

1668
01:12:54,640 --> 01:12:56,599
Speaker 1: We're excited about it, so thank you so much for joining,

1669
01:12:56,840 --> 01:12:58,640
Speaker 1: and please make sure to like and subscribe wherever you

1670
01:12:58,640 --> 01:13:05,320
Speaker 1: get your podcasts. That's it, that's it. H