Speaker 1: And now move my mic back. You're like that.
Speaker 2: You can strike with waters from headquarters behind.
Speaker 1: Him to be the border if you're just to a
Speaker 1: Minnesivic cipher.
Speaker 3: I'm your host, Ramsys joh I'm your co host q Ward.
Speaker 1: This indeed, Uh, we got a lot more to talk about.
Speaker 1: We're not done with Jalen Walker, but we do want
Speaker 1: to talk about the shooting over last weekend, Fourth of
Speaker 1: July weekend and uh kind of delve a little bit
Speaker 1: more into how things are handled differently when I mean
Speaker 1: when it's black and white, you may as well say that.
Speaker 1: So stick around. We're gonna peel back some layers there.
Speaker 1: I'm excited to talk about that. Also our way Black History.
Speaker 1: In fact, we're gonna delve into the history of the
Speaker 1: Fourth of July itself and talk a little bit about
Speaker 1: when it was a black holiday. How about that, Maggie
Speaker 1: b Knowing our show producer unearthed a little nugget for
Speaker 1: us here, So stick around for that way Black History factor. First,
Speaker 1: let's discuss Baba becoming a better ally? Shall we shall?
Speaker 1: This one is sponsored by Hip Hop Weekly Magazine. Shout
Speaker 1: out to them, They really look out for us here
Speaker 1: on this show, which By the way, a lot of
Speaker 1: great things happening for the show. I want to make
Speaker 1: it a point to drop our cash app and our
Speaker 1: zell and our Patreon. It's all at Civic Cipher. You
Speaker 1: can support the show. Obviously, this is a lot of
Speaker 1: work to do the show, but we don't mind doing it.
Speaker 1: It's the growing the show part that is kind of challenging,
Speaker 1: and everyone that supports fiscally really helps us to take
Speaker 1: advantage of that. Now, Maggie this week wants us to
Speaker 1: becoming better ally by not just being an ally but
Speaker 1: being an advocate. And being an advocate basically is kind
Speaker 1: of going above and beyond just kind of supporting, you know,
Speaker 1: with your words, but actually supporting with your actions, not
Speaker 1: just being empathetic, right, but actually creating the change. So,
Speaker 1: the way she explains is that you want to perform
Speaker 1: things or do things rather that can be performed in
Speaker 1: action across a wide spectrum and variety of channels. She
Speaker 1: asks us, can you provide mentoring, small business, consulting, graphic design,
Speaker 1: where client service training, legal or advocacy assistance. Can you
Speaker 1: share some advice or time with someone with a group,
Speaker 1: with an organization that you normally wouldn't in efforts to
Speaker 1: collectively challenge the status quo and dismantle oppressive and harmful
Speaker 1: institutions and systems, some of which we identified earlier in
Speaker 1: the program. As she puts it, kind of like what
Speaker 1: you said to Please don't just empathize with us. Please
Speaker 1: don't just feel bad for us. Please help us create
Speaker 1: lasting and meaningful change. So this week, that is how
Speaker 1: you can become a better ally. All right, back to
Speaker 1: the lecture at hand. All right, So let's talk a
Speaker 1: bit about the shooting over the weekend in Chicago at
Speaker 1: the parade suburb of Chicago. Suburb of Chicago. It wasn't
Speaker 1: like hyrax Chicago, right, You.
Speaker 3: Get enough of that right In our Black on Black
Speaker 3: Crime section.
Speaker 1: Please stop saying not UQ. For those of you out
Speaker 1: there in the world, if you hear black on black
Speaker 1: crime as a term being said in a conversation, please
Speaker 1: yourself stop using it, and please tell other people to
Speaker 1: stop using It's not a real thing, and it is
Speaker 1: literally a false narrative that we have been trying our
Speaker 1: best to overcome, among others that we've actually overcame or
Speaker 1: are still overcoming, but done lots of work, but that
Speaker 1: one is just kind of like a zombie and it
Speaker 1: won't die. Black on black crime is not a thing.
Speaker 1: Crime happens with people that are close to you, and
Speaker 1: people that are close to you often look like you.
Speaker 1: Meaning of white people kill white people, which is often
Speaker 1: the case. There is no term called white on white
Speaker 1: crime that we can point to and say, see, this
Speaker 1: is what white people always do. But that black on
Speaker 1: black crime thing allows these oppressive systems to continue to
Speaker 1: put the blame on us rather than to really identify
Speaker 1: and deal with the source of a lot of these
Speaker 1: systemic issues again the economic equality, inequality, etc. Sorry sidebar,
Speaker 1: but I felt like it was a teachable moment. Do
Speaker 1: you want to tell the story about what happened in Chicago?
Speaker 1: Should I?
Speaker 3: I'll let you tell it. Tell it because I have
Speaker 3: a lot to say and I don't want to all right,
Speaker 3: get us off track.
Speaker 1: I have a lot of various Yeah, understand, I'm with you,
Speaker 1: all right. So here's what we're doing. Long and short
Speaker 1: of it is mass shooting. As as you mentioned, it's
Speaker 1: a suburb of Chicago Fourth of July parade. Families are
Speaker 1: outside enjoying the parade, go down their main street or
Speaker 1: whatever the name of that street was, but they're you know,
Speaker 1: the main artery in their suburb, traffic artery, I should say.
Speaker 1: So the videos, of course, are people filming the parade.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: You can kind of see what's going on. There's people
Speaker 1: playing the trumpet, marching that sort of stuff, and you
Speaker 1: hear shots go off, you know, and it kind of
Speaker 1: gives you a glimpse in of what happened in a
Speaker 1: lot of these other mass shootings and how it works
Speaker 1: because in this one you can actually see and here
Speaker 1: the shots going off. Most people are not filming in classrooms,
Speaker 1: people aren't filming in the grocery stores, you know, but
Speaker 1: people are filming the parade, so you can kind of
Speaker 1: get a sense of how slow people are to respond
Speaker 1: to the shots.
Speaker 3: Takes a second to realize what's.
Speaker 1: Happening, right, and then it's a slow response when people
Speaker 1: start responding, because some people are trying to help the
Speaker 1: people who have been hit, and then some people are
Speaker 1: not trying to help and they're trying to leave. And
Speaker 1: then the people across the street are like, well, what's
Speaker 1: going on over there? Is it a fight? Is it?
Speaker 1: You know what I mean? And so they're sitting they're dumbfounded, like, well,
Speaker 1: what are they doing? They're in a good day, specifically
Speaker 1: with the fourth of July? Are those fireworks exactly exactly so?
Speaker 1: And then there's drums and all kinds. You know, that's
Speaker 1: sort of you know, guns. Your brain will tell you
Speaker 1: whatever fits the narrative, what your eyes are seeing, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean. But anyway, these folks hear these
Speaker 1: shots go off and then of course start running away.
Speaker 1: Suspect he wore a disguise, he was dressed as a woman,
Speaker 1: got on a roof, shot everybody up left. And the
Speaker 1: thing that we need to talk about here is of
Speaker 1: course the fact that he was apprehended, which was also
Speaker 1: on video, stopped by police, a bunch of police behind
Speaker 1: the car. They found it. Well, great clean police. I
Speaker 1: need to say that, Yeah, he was fleeing the police.
Speaker 1: He was doing the same the other story that walker.
Speaker 3: He was fleeing.
Speaker 1: Yep, same thing. Okay. I just wanted to okay, make
Speaker 1: sure we okay cool apples and then apples, right, yes,
Speaker 1: so that's what? Okay?
Speaker 2: Cool?
Speaker 1: So yeah, uh, this guy they knew killed people by
Speaker 1: this time, knew it for certainly, you didn't violate any
Speaker 1: traffic line, nothing, like that killed people again, Jalen. Perhaps
Speaker 1: he had a gun for whatever reason. It's not illegal,
Speaker 1: but for whatever reason, the police try to engage. He's like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I'm a black man with a gun
Speaker 1: in my car. This is a bad look. Does he
Speaker 1: try to dismantle the gun? Does he you know, does
Speaker 1: it go off by accident? Who knows? He'll never get
Speaker 1: to say that story. And he's fleeing because he's terrified
Speaker 1: because maybe if he shot the gun accidentally or whatever,
Speaker 1: Now he's even more afraid. He puts on a ski
Speaker 1: mask to try to conceal his identity, books it into
Speaker 1: the night, trying his best to get away from what
Speaker 1: he believes to be an absolute certainty. These people are
Speaker 1: going to kill me. And initially I was just like
Speaker 1: kind of thinking that they might let me see if
Speaker 1: I conduct this. Now I know it for a fact.
Speaker 1: I'm out, boom gone dead. Back to the Chicago shooter.
Speaker 1: We don't try to Illinois to keep saying Chicago guys, Illinois,
Speaker 1: thank you, park Illinois. But we don't say the mass
Speaker 1: shooter's name is because we work in media and we're
Speaker 1: doing our part to not turn these guys into heroes.
Speaker 1: So this scumbag. We'll call him scumbag. How about that?
Speaker 1: You know the police get behind him. Of course he's
Speaker 1: trying to get away. They get behind him, he gets
Speaker 1: out of his car. Is the police approach the car,
Speaker 1: take him without incident, without further incident. They know he's armed,
Speaker 1: they know he's dangerous, they know he's a killer. And
Speaker 1: he just killed somebody, right, they knew exactly what they
Speaker 1: were looking for.
Speaker 3: It's running away because he just killed us.
Speaker 1: That right, And guess what, that guy is alive and breathing.
Speaker 1: He can explain his heinous actions to his family.
Speaker 3: When says Judge, alive and breathing, he doesn't mean because
Speaker 3: he survived something. They didn't beat him up, they didn't
Speaker 3: shoot him, they didn't shoot at him. So I don't
Speaker 3: want you guys to think he also got shot and
Speaker 3: then just yes, survive. No, he's unheased, fine, and have
Speaker 3: a bruise on his body from what I could tell
Speaker 3: from the footage of them kind of apprehending him.
Speaker 1: And we see this all the time with these mass shooters,
Speaker 1: and let's be honest, there's an association, and we identified
Speaker 1: part of this in the first half of the show.
Speaker 1: There's an association with black men and fear when it comes
Speaker 1: to guns or black men in fear period.
Speaker 3: And Rams isn't being hyperbolic, by the way when he says,
Speaker 3: we see this all the time with these mass literally
Speaker 3: the basis of the show. There have been more mass
Speaker 3: shootings this year than days by almost double. One of
Speaker 3: those mass shooters was killed. He was surprisingly not white.
Speaker 3: I'll just let that sit with you because I said
Speaker 3: it on purpose, because it means something.
Speaker 1: Now, not only is there this overwhelming fear associated with
Speaker 1: black people, and you know they were associated with violence
Speaker 1: and that sort of stuff unfairly by the way, those
Speaker 1: are called prejudices, right, but the way that the police
Speaker 1: interact with black bodies is hurtful, infuriating. It is incredibly unsettling.
Speaker 1: And when you see the grace given to a Dylan
Speaker 1: Roof which I said his name on purpose because we
Speaker 1: reference him a lot. He's a person that shot up
Speaker 1: a church and theyre took him to Burger King after
Speaker 1: they arrested him.
Speaker 3: And to make sure that he wasn't hungry because you've
Speaker 3: been through a lot today, had a rough day. They said, right,
Speaker 3: you had a rough day. We gotta make sure that
Speaker 3: you eat some burger king, Let's get you something to eat. Man,
Speaker 3: Come on right, you hungry kid. I know you got
Speaker 3: stressed out. Heard your stomach growling. Maybe maybe you're not comfortable.
Speaker 3: You want to number one? No, no, onion. Can you
Speaker 3: cut that in half for him?
Speaker 1: Please?
Speaker 3: We want to make sure he gets it in his
Speaker 3: way because he's having a rough day to day.
Speaker 1: It's not funny because he went into church and ended
Speaker 1: nine lives, black lives, people praying, people.
Speaker 3: Are welcoming into I'm hoping that sounds ridiculous and not funny,
Speaker 3: but that actually happens.
Speaker 1: Ridiculous, that happened, true, that happened to him. And then
Speaker 1: of course with this young man in Highland Park again
Speaker 1: taken in without incident. In other words, no harm when
Speaker 1: the body is not black, but there is often harm
Speaker 1: when it comes to police interacting with black bodies. And
Speaker 1: so there's some people that will say, look and you know,
Speaker 1: the police should have done treated you know, everyone the
Speaker 1: same way they treat black people. There's some people that
Speaker 1: say police should treat everyone the same way they treat
Speaker 1: white people. But in either case, the police should treat
Speaker 1: everyone the same. Right, I think every the police should
Speaker 1: treat everyone in the way they treat white folks. That's
Speaker 1: what I think, you know what I mean, because I
Speaker 1: believe that the police often overstep and we see some
Speaker 1: of our white brothers and sisters become victims of police brutality.
Speaker 1: Remember we did that story about the handicap man was
Speaker 1: he was deaf and I think it was in a
Speaker 1: wheelchair too, and he couldn't hear and couldn't move or something.
Speaker 1: It was the story maybe a year and a half ago,
Speaker 1: something like that. But you know, he was not a
Speaker 1: black man, but the police just beat him up and
Speaker 1: put him in a jail for how many months before
Speaker 1: he even got a chance to talk to the judge.
Speaker 1: This doesn't happen to just us, but it happens to
Speaker 1: us more frequently, and we cant to systemic issues and
Speaker 1: so we don't want to.
Speaker 3: It's also a bit more the outcomes are a bit
Speaker 3: more extreme. Yeah, that literally multiple times more fatal when
Speaker 3: the victims in the bodies are black, right like with
Speaker 3: regard to how they view us, how they see us
Speaker 3: in the way that we're criminal by Melanin Melon. Guilty
Speaker 3: by Jalen Walker, shot at ninety times sixty bullet wounds,
Speaker 3: handcuffed after the fact. I just really need you guys
Speaker 3: to digest that. Yeah, black bodies, he's very dead, very
Speaker 3: there's no chance he's alive. There's no chance he's still
Speaker 3: a threat. We still need to handcuff this guy so
Speaker 3: that it's clear that he's a criminal and a bad person.
Speaker 3: And like, it has to take something beyond fearing for
Speaker 3: your life to place handcuffs on a course that you
Speaker 3: just murdered.
Speaker 1: Well, this is our reality, and you know there's something
Speaker 1: else I want to share it with you. Obviously, this
Speaker 1: is you know, the show in general, it is a
Speaker 1: tough show to listen to day in and day out,
Speaker 1: but we do our best to inform and you know,
Speaker 1: maintain as positive an outlook as we can. But I
Speaker 1: want to ask you to think about something for me. Please,
Speaker 1: as a listener of the show, I want you to
Speaker 1: think about this. Every single other black person that wakes
Speaker 1: up in this country knows what we've just talked about.
Speaker 1: Mass shooters that actually killed me. We know that it happened,
Speaker 1: eye witnesses everything, They know exactly what they're looking for it.
Speaker 1: I got the a be out with the photo. This
Speaker 1: is who this is our person of interest blah blah
Speaker 1: blah versus a traffic stop. Every black person knows what
Speaker 1: we just talked about. You know, how do black people
Speaker 1: feel when this is our reality? How do we feel?
Speaker 1: What do we think our lives are worth to this country?
Speaker 1: To the police. You know, there's why don't black people
Speaker 1: ever talk to the police? You know, it's a real thing.
Speaker 1: Why don't black people trust me? Why? You know, the
Speaker 1: police are trying to engage with this impoverished community, but
Speaker 1: you know they're not getting a lot of help. Only
Speaker 1: a couple of pastors, but the well, the police have
Speaker 1: a lot of rebuilding to do because our reality suggests
Speaker 1: to us that outcomes are often worse for you if
Speaker 1: you are melanated. And when the news blows this stuff up.
Speaker 1: You said it happens daily, the mass shootings, right, I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't know more than daily.
Speaker 3: Equate it right, There's been three hundred mass shootings in
Speaker 3: the country this year, a dozen over the holiday weekend.
Speaker 3: We're at day of one and eighty or something like that.
Speaker 3: We're about halfway through the year. There have been more
Speaker 3: mass shootings than days, so more than every day on average.
Speaker 1: We have a gun problem.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 1: We need to redo that episode. But again, what I
Speaker 1: want you to ponder is how does it feel to
Speaker 1: wake up in America and be black? How does it
Speaker 1: feel to be black and have the police interact with you.
Speaker 1: We're not talking about political stuff right now. We're talking
Speaker 1: about ground level stuff, humans that have to go on
Speaker 1: about their lives and interact with you know, the world.
Speaker 1: We already know that the criminal justice system targets, actively
Speaker 1: targets black men. That doesn't mean if they if they
Speaker 1: catch you slipping, you know, no, they will invent it.
Speaker 1: We've seen it happen some of our friends who protest
Speaker 1: and some activists. As soon as they get on the streets,
Speaker 1: they are targeted specifically, they know who they are. They
Speaker 1: get them over something and they trump up all the
Speaker 1: charges and then they're in the system. Right, But this
Speaker 1: is a thing that happens, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: The police will grab you, try their best to find
Speaker 1: something wrong. They start with the assumption you're doing something wrong,
Speaker 1: and if they can't find anything, sometimes they actually make
Speaker 1: it up. You know, I'm not saying they make it up,
Speaker 1: but they make it up. Right where if you had
Speaker 1: not been a black man, then obviously that jaywalking is
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Come on. So the crazy
Speaker 1: thing is that now we've done hundreds of these stories,
Speaker 1: literally hundreds of them, and so no one can come
Speaker 1: here and tell me that I'm not wrong, because now
Speaker 1: we have our own system here, we have our own
Speaker 1: database here. Right. But it's very telling that we see
Speaker 1: week in and week out, the way we are engaged
Speaker 1: as black people relative to non black people, we see
Speaker 1: outcomes that are very different. You know, we had our
Speaker 1: conversation with doctor Westernberg recently. We recognize that the abortion,
Speaker 1: the overturning of Roe v. Way by the Supreme Court
Speaker 1: has at least a leg in racist belief in ideology,
Speaker 1: and it disproportionately affects black women because equomen get abortions
Speaker 1: at higher rates. And there's reasons for that, you know.
Speaker 1: But the fact is is that almost it's blows my mind.
Speaker 1: It blows my mind because I grew up thinking, Okay,
Speaker 1: racism exists, you got to keep a lookout for it,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, and when you see it,
Speaker 1: you have to be prepared to deal with it. That's
Speaker 1: what I grew up thinking. When I became an adult,
Speaker 1: I realized that everything, everything is rooted in racism, like
Speaker 1: the whole sum total of it all. How in the
Speaker 1: world did they get this off for so long and
Speaker 1: bury it well because there was no need to, because
Speaker 1: because it's not just based in racism, it's based in
Speaker 1: white supremacy. There it is so.
Speaker 3: When you can convince even those being oppressed that those
Speaker 3: they are being oppressed with are their enemies, and they
Speaker 3: will vote, they will organize, they will march, and they
Speaker 3: will pursue their own dismay, their own horrible circumstances. They
Speaker 3: will hold up a system that oppresses them because it's
Speaker 3: oppressing their enemies. Right, make the supremacy of the whiteness
Speaker 3: the catalyst for their union.
Speaker 1: It's not.
Speaker 3: We've discussed at length. They are not the majority. The
Speaker 3: oppressors are not the majority, it's not even close. But
Speaker 3: they have convinced so many of the oppressed that they're
Speaker 3: on the same team that they help builders and boaster
Speaker 3: the system that not only holds us down but themselves. Right,
Speaker 3: we're the only nation where our champions, our Olympians, our
Speaker 3: people that represent our country are booed in our country
Speaker 3: as people cheer the champions and athletes from other countries
Speaker 3: because they're also white We don't care that you're an
Speaker 3: American like us, you're not white like us. We don't
Speaker 3: care that you're poor like us, you're not white like us.
Speaker 3: We don't care that you have all these disadvantages like us.
Speaker 1: Right, the amount of women who voted for the people
Speaker 1: who just supported what happened with Roe v. Wade, Those
Speaker 1: women are mostly white women who identify with their oppressors.
Speaker 3: Right, that patriarchy.
Speaker 1: They support it as well, even though it oppresses them as.
Speaker 3: Well, so they never had to hide it.
Speaker 1: There's too many people that benefit from it or that
Speaker 1: think they benefit from it, so they've never had to
Speaker 1: disguise it.
Speaker 3: They put the system in place a long time ago.
Speaker 3: It has functioned remarkably.
Speaker 1: Actively, and this is what we're talking about here on
Speaker 1: the show.
Speaker 3: And then they make us have these conversations from a
Speaker 3: position of bias. Of course, you guys.
Speaker 1: Think that, yeah, like we're complaining being treated bad because
Speaker 1: you know, people, we don't create these stories. They're happening
Speaker 1: in front of you on camera. You don't even have
Speaker 1: to use your imagination. But we are put in this position,
Speaker 1: As you said, how dare you complain about this wonderful
Speaker 1: country that allows you right, You guys heard me get
Speaker 1: upset while we read a letter last week as this
Speaker 1: man told us the country allowed you understand, let me
Speaker 1: let me share something. Just so you know, it might
Speaker 1: have been twenty thirteen, twenty twelve, somewhere in there you
Speaker 1: and I wanted to do a show together on the
Speaker 1: radio about relationships. Yeah, we did. That would have been
Speaker 1: the coolest showld have been so fun. We would have
Speaker 1: had so many jokes.
Speaker 3: Goodness.
Speaker 1: We're doing this show because it's necessary. So we don't
Speaker 1: want you to think that this is we like this
Speaker 1: which is necessary. We like the time, and of course
Speaker 1: we like to the growth. But left our own devices and
Speaker 1: not having to live a black life, maybe our program
Speaker 1: might feel a little different. Moving on, it's time for
Speaker 1: the way Black History Effect. This one is also brought
Speaker 1: to you by Hip Hop Weekly Magazine, and this one
Speaker 1: comes from the Black Information Network. There's my guys over there.
Speaker 1: So the title is Parades Recitals in More when July
Speaker 1: fourth was a Black holiday. Wow, I know July fourth
Speaker 1: is past. But the way the show works, you know,
Speaker 1: we have to talk about certain things in a certain order.
Speaker 1: We have to get to stuff this pressing. So I
Speaker 1: know our timeline isn't always the way we want it
Speaker 1: to be, but there's a reason for it. We're trying
Speaker 1: to prioritize what we need to prioritize. It was also
Speaker 1: never a wrong time to talk about history. Very good, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'll take that now, I'll read. July fourth, or Independence Day,
Speaker 1: is usually marked with cookouts, barbecues, fireworks, and all types
Speaker 1: of celebrations. As the day Americans formally claimed their independence
Speaker 1: after a war with Great Britain, it is considered the
Speaker 1: best time for US citizens to show off their patriotism.
Speaker 1: For Black Americans, it can bring mixed feelings reminders of
Speaker 1: how some of the United States's early successes was built
Speaker 1: off the backs of their enslaved ancestors. As a result,
Speaker 1: some Black Americans choose to celebrate June teenth, a now
Speaker 1: federal holiday that highlights the emancipation of black slaves. It
Speaker 1: was a time in American history, however, where the fourth
Speaker 1: of July was a time where it was considered a
Speaker 1: black holiday and a time to celebrate black freedom following
Speaker 1: the Civil War. To understand this, we need to take
Speaker 1: a walk back into history. On July fifth, eighteen fifty two,
Speaker 1: renowned abolitionist Frederick Douglass spoke to a mostly white crowd
Speaker 1: in Rochester, New York. Shout out to our affiliate in Rochester,
Speaker 1: New York, which is called oh WXR one hundred point
Speaker 1: nine FM. I didn't want to get that wrong anyway.
Speaker 1: In a speech, he talked about how black people were
Speaker 1: excluded from basic services, amenities, and even the Declaration of
Speaker 1: Independence and various laws in the country. Therefore, a black
Speaker 1: person is excluded from the celebration of Independence day. Quote
Speaker 1: what to the American slave is your fourth of July?
Speaker 1: A day that reveals to him more than all other
Speaker 1: days of the year, the gross injustice and cruelty to
Speaker 1: which he is the constant victim In quote, Douglas explained,
Speaker 1: adding that he felt much the same quote, I am
Speaker 1: not included within the pale of this glorious anniversary. This
Speaker 1: fourth of July is yours, not mine. Quote. This would
Speaker 1: this would consolidate the feelings of both enslaved and freed
Speaker 1: black people before the Civil War, culminating in a new
Speaker 1: sentiment after the bloody conflict. When the four year war
Speaker 1: ended in eighteen sixty five, things began to look more
Speaker 1: hopeful for black people. The emancipation proclamation was signed by
Speaker 1: President Abraham Lincoln and Abraham Lincoln, newly freed slaves embraced
Speaker 1: this new reality. Not only that, but defeated Confederates weren't
Speaker 1: in the mood to take part in July four celebrations
Speaker 1: for years. As a result, black people decided to ascribe
Speaker 1: new meaning to the Independence Day, a celebration of freedom
Speaker 1: from slave. Parades, feasts, and martial displays by black militia
Speaker 1: groups would mark these celebrations, drawing thousands together. Black people
Speaker 1: were also encouraged to contribute to their communities, such as
Speaker 1: building schools and churches quote mutual aid. Groups like the
Speaker 1: Sons of Ham and the Daughters of Zion organized events
Speaker 1: featuring long standing Black American traditions like barbecue and late
Speaker 1: night dancing. According to Jay Store, black people would have
Speaker 1: big gatherings in various cities, from Mobile, Alabama, in Miami, Florida,
Speaker 1: to Charleston, South Carolina, and Washington, d c. They were
Speaker 1: so popular and momentous it began to grate the nerves
Speaker 1: of disgruntled white Southerners. For decades, white Southern politician worked
Speaker 1: to quash these Black celebrations of liberty through segregation laws.
Speaker 1: And even violence. Some cities would gradually push out traditional
Speaker 1: celebration locations, while others published statements delegitimizing black people's claim
Speaker 1: to the holiday. Quote. African American families and friends continued
Speaker 1: to meet in more informal gatherings in the city, but
Speaker 1: by the early nineteen hundreds, both Charleston and Atlanta had
Speaker 1: forbidden vendors from setting up foodstalls along the streets where
Speaker 1: black residents had long congregated on the fourth, The Atlantic wrote. Eventually,
Speaker 1: the commemoration of July fourth as a day for black
Speaker 1: liberty mostly faded across black generations. Today, some black people
Speaker 1: celebrate the holiday as most Americans do, or they celebrate Juneteenth.
Speaker 1: Others take the holiday to reflect on America's history, have discussions,
Speaker 1: or even participate in demonstrations against racial disparities. Since Juneteenth
Speaker 1: has garnered more traction. Who knows if July fourth will
Speaker 1: go back to beating both a day for American patriotism
Speaker 1: and Black liberty. Oh yeah, there's our way black history
Speaker 1: fact certainly something I knew nothing about.
Speaker 3: First of all, shout out to cookouts, barbecues and fireworks,
Speaker 3: and we talk to them.
Speaker 1: I love all of that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is a question that doesn't ever really have
Speaker 3: to be answered. And you know, maybe the rest of
Speaker 3: our lifetime on this place, we will watch this come
Speaker 3: to be. But I wonder will we stagnate the growth,
Speaker 3: popularity and full on celebration of Juneteenth ourselves by holding
Speaker 3: on to it so tight, by protecting it? And I
Speaker 3: did you know air quotes for people who can't see me,
Speaker 3: Because I feel like that holidays should shoot to the moon.
Speaker 3: I think it should shoot out into the atmosphere and
Speaker 3: be celebrated vigorously.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's celebrating brand new, commercialized black holiday, come
Speaker 1: with its obstacles. I hope that we do not wrap
Speaker 1: it in so much red tape and hold on to
Speaker 1: it so tight that we stop it from becoming the
Speaker 1: momentous and grossly celebratory day that it should be. Well,
Speaker 1: we certainly have case precedent for huge celebrations, and now
Speaker 1: that we have this history for the fourth of July,
Speaker 1: lets us know that this is not a new thing.
Speaker 1: This is not a novel thing. You know, we've been
Speaker 1: celebrating even before Juneteenth. We've been celebrating since the end
Speaker 1: of the Civil War. And we know that a lot
Speaker 1: of those Southerners early on didn't even really appreciate the
Speaker 1: Fourth of July, and US black folks did so a lot.
Speaker 1: To keep in mind there, I love your point about
Speaker 1: taking Juneteenth and running it all the way up.
Speaker 3: Is it you think it's too close to the Fourth
Speaker 3: of July and because it's celebrated in much the same
Speaker 3: way that that may diminish it a bit?
Speaker 1: No, because it's Juneteenth is first boom. All right, but
Speaker 1: that's gonna do it for us today here on Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1: So once again, I am your host, Rams's job.
Speaker 3: I'm your co host. I go by the name Qward.
Speaker 1: No, man, you're the host. Man, well, I guess so
Speaker 1: we both be the host. They are the host.
Speaker 3: You forgot your ass?
Speaker 1: Okay, Yeah, I know I left my Okay, you left
Speaker 1: yours off? I Got you. Show produced by our producer
Speaker 1: Maggie aka Maggie be knowing because she'd be knowing. And yeah,
Speaker 1: be sure to check us out next week. Hit the
Speaker 1: website in the meantime, Sipping Cipher dot com. Any questions, topics,
Speaker 1: anything you want us to cover, We do read that
Speaker 1: stuff obviously. Anything that you care to donate, you can
Speaker 1: do it at Civic Cipher that's on the website as well,
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Speaker 1: Cycler too, and you can down on this in any
Speaker 1: previous episodes and until next week you all right, peace.
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