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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.

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Speaker 1: Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox

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Speaker 1: Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to

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Speaker 1: noon Pacific. Find your local station for The Herd at

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Speaker 1: Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every

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Speaker 1: day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio

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Speaker 1: or FSR.

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Speaker 2: This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowver

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Speaker 2: on Fox Sports Radio.

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Speaker 1: Welcome in to a loaded Friday, so so much to

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Speaker 1: talk about live.

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Speaker 3: We're in Chicago.

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Speaker 1: It's the Herd wherever you may be and however you

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Speaker 1: may be watching or listening. Thank you so much for

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Speaker 1: being part of our show. Off a winning week of

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Speaker 1: four and one winning week blazing five returns in one

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Speaker 1: hour for now. It's actually a really interesting slate of games.

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Speaker 3: You know, j Mac.

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Speaker 1: Mike Tomlin, Steelers coach, was brutally honest, fourth right and

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Speaker 1: furious when the Cleveland Browns traded Joe Flacco to the Bengals.

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Speaker 1: And we're like, why is he so upset? Now we

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Speaker 1: know why, Mike Tomlin after last night is one and

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Speaker 1: seven straight up against Joe Flacco on short rest. So

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Speaker 1: Tomlin's great. On Monday Night football these Thursday games. Jay

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Speaker 1: Mack and I talked about it yesterday. Tomlin less time

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Speaker 1: to prepare and motivate. He's not good. So we thought

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Speaker 1: we'd have Bengals Steelers probably boring NWS thirty three thirty one.

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Speaker 1: Flacco in two games with the Bengals five hundred and

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Speaker 1: fifty five yards, five touchdowns, no picks. But that game

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Speaker 1: was not only about Flacco. It was about Pittsburgh's defense.

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Speaker 1: It's the highest paid in the league. Once again, it's

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Speaker 1: atrocious Chase Brown, who knew he was Jim Brown. The

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Speaker 1: Bengals averaged six point two yards a rush and Cincinnati

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Speaker 1: has the thirtieth round offensive.

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Speaker 3: Line in the league. I mean, I thought it was

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Speaker 3: going to be a boring, ugly Steeler win.

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Speaker 1: Not at all. It was a firework show. Don't blame

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Speaker 1: it on Aaron Rodgers. Aaron's been terrific, four touchdown passes.

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Speaker 1: He only got in trouble when he tried to go deep.

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Speaker 1: That The story of the game is that defense. Mike

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Speaker 1: Tomlin's defense four straight years, highest paid, none have been

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Speaker 1: in the top ten.

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Speaker 3: It didn't matter who the running back was.

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Speaker 1: I mean Chase Brown, Illinois kid, whatever I mean, he

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Speaker 1: looked great. So six straight possession this is hard to

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Speaker 1: do in the NFL against anybody, against anybody, forget the Steelers.

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Speaker 1: The Bengals scored at one point on six straight possessions.

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Speaker 1: So Joe Flacco old barely can move. Joe Flacco, he

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Speaker 1: can spin it, he doesn't move much. He only got

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Speaker 1: sacked twice. So this is a really bad loss for

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Speaker 1: the Steelers because now the schedule gets brutal, Green Bay, Coles, Chargers, Buffalo,

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Speaker 1: Detroit couple times. Lamar Jackson's now getting healthy. So watching

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Speaker 1: the Bengals dash the Steelers for nearly five hundred yards

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Speaker 1: with the thirtieth offensive line and Joe Flacco, I mean

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Speaker 1: pitch and catch with Jamar Chase sixteen catches, Cincinnati dominated

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Speaker 1: time of possession. So the AFC North here we go.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you've heard of death by a million cuts.

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Speaker 1: That was like death by one hundred slant patterns. They

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Speaker 1: just did whatever they want, gigantic holes, Jamar Chase, some

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Speaker 1: T Higgins. It didn't even matter. I mean, Cincinnati didn't

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Speaker 1: have their best pass rusher. I'll give them a bit

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Speaker 1: of a pass. Aaron had plenty of time to throw,

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Speaker 1: but Pittsburgh's defense. You can't spend that kind of money

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Speaker 1: and that can't.

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Speaker 3: Be what I see.

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Speaker 1: That was a really, really bad loss. Tomlin struggles on

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Speaker 1: Thursday Night football, Chase Brown average nine point eight yards a.

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Speaker 3: Carry with that Bengal all line.

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Speaker 1: Flaco a guru, a wizard, guys got what five six

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Speaker 1: practices in for the Bengals. Here was Jamar Chase. Jamar said,

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Speaker 1: they did what we thought they would do.

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Speaker 2: It did exactly what we was expecting and hoping they do.

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Speaker 4: You know, they was gonna put Joey on team, put

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Speaker 4: jailing on me, and we knew that he was ready

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Speaker 4: for it. We was gonna take advantage of those opportunities.

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Speaker 5: Just from an analysis perspective, I just thought, you know,

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Speaker 5: in the first half, were allowed to run the ball

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Speaker 5: too much. I think they have about one hundred yards

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Speaker 5: rushing into half, and so that just kind of set

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Speaker 5: a negative trajectory. Will fight uphill the rest of the way.

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Speaker 5: I certainly appreciate the fight, but man, we got to

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Speaker 5: be cleaner, we got to be better.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, it's in this league.

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Speaker 3: It's crazy.

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Speaker 1: There have been so many games this year where we

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Speaker 1: absolutely feel going into a game, like Steelers, they're gonna

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Speaker 1: be five and one. We were absolutely sure the Chargers

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Speaker 1: were to beat Jackson Dart and the Giants. You know,

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Speaker 1: Bills will take care of Atlanta and young Drake May.

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Speaker 1: You'd just never known this league. So the Dodgers are

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Speaker 1: now leading three to zero on the Brewers, one game

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Speaker 1: away from the World Series, and it's official. They have

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Speaker 1: no flaw. We thought it was the bullpen. We thought

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Speaker 1: it was Otawni struggling in the postseason. Yeah, Tyler Glasnow

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Speaker 1: was excellent last night, eight strikeouts, but he only went

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Speaker 1: five and two thirds innings, so the Dodgers had to

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Speaker 1: rely on their bullpen and it was great. For the record,

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Speaker 1: the Brewers have nine hits through three games of a

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Speaker 1: playoff series. That's tied for the fewest in league history.

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Speaker 1: And this is a team that scored a lot of runs, again,

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Speaker 1: a lot of hits. The Brewers first time being held

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Speaker 1: a one run or fewer in three straight games on

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Speaker 1: the season, and Glassnow was excellent, but this was the series.

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Speaker 1: This was the year to beat the Dodgers, right, Otani struggling,

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Speaker 1: Mookie Betts got off to a bad start, shaky bullpen,

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Speaker 1: glass Now and Snell you know had health issues all

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Speaker 1: year long. They don't really have a natural closer.

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Speaker 3: Last No.

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Speaker 1: Five and two thirds fantastic eight strikeouts. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: if the Dodgers can win playoff games with five hits,

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Speaker 1: it's over, Blue Jays, Mariners, Brewers, it will not matter.

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Speaker 1: And once again proving their depth. Much like a cheesecake

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Speaker 1: factory menu, turn the page, limitless combinations. Mookie Betts had

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Speaker 1: a great defensive play. Max Munsey had a great defensive play.

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Speaker 1: Mookie Betts opened the scoring. You know, Tommy edmund hobbled.

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Speaker 1: Tommy edmund ankle injury, not at one hundred percent, so

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Speaker 1: everybody just talks about it's a.

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Speaker 3: Lot of money.

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Speaker 1: No, Mookie Bets is unbelievable, insane talent. Stole him from Boston.

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Speaker 1: Tommy Edmunds again was a Saint Louis Cardinal, hitting two

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Speaker 1: sixty five. Max Munsey, who can be hot and cold

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Speaker 1: in defense, had a great play last night. Months he

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Speaker 1: got released by the Oakland A's. So many combinations and

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Speaker 1: last time again it wasn't necessarily O Tawi or Freddie Freeman,

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Speaker 1: it was the bullpen. It was Tommy Edmond And afterwards,

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Speaker 1: I mean, nobody in the world could have predicted Milwaukee

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Speaker 1: could not hit. Of all the predictions in this series,

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Speaker 1: one of them was, listen, Dodgers going to go to

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Speaker 1: the bullpen. Dodgers are going to need O Tawny to hit.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna get some runs in this series. In Milwaukee's

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Speaker 1: got nine hits and the Dodgers are getting better, Reds Phillies,

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Speaker 1: Brewers more confidence. Here's Dave Roberts after.

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Speaker 6: I think the thing about our guys is they're battle

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Speaker 6: tested and they know that I've never lost faith in him,

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Speaker 6: they never lost confidence in each other, and so, you know,

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Speaker 6: so to see what they're doing right now, I'm not surprised.

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Speaker 6: And we knew all the long that we're going to

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Speaker 6: need these guys, and these guys are delivering, which is huge.

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Speaker 6: And you know, we're doing a great job of preventing

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Speaker 6: runs and the bullpen deserves a lot of credit.

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Speaker 1: You know. It's really interesting and you've seen this. This

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Speaker 1: kind of starts to feel the last couple of years

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Speaker 1: with the Dodgers, like that Alabama run where they were

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Speaker 1: just better, or the Kevin Durant Warriors like not all dynasties.

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Speaker 1: When the Patriots were winning Super Bowls, they were winning

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Speaker 1: them all by three points. Even the losses to the

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Speaker 1: Giants last second games, they weren't overpowering people. The years

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Speaker 1: New England was overpowering people were the Randy Moss years.

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Speaker 1: They didn't win a Super Bowl. This has got a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a Warriors feel to it with KD,

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Speaker 1: like the Warriors won before Katie and after, but those

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Speaker 1: finals felt different than the KD finals or the dominant

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Speaker 1: Alabama run for about eight years where they would play

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Speaker 1: big time teams and they would just outside of maybe

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Speaker 1: Clemson and Trevor Lawrence or something, they just look better

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Speaker 1: than everybody. I mean, if the bullpen's not an issue,

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Speaker 1: they worked all year to try to solve this thing.

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Speaker 1: They do not have a natural closer. So it almost

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Speaker 1: feels Listen, money does matter, but the Mets and Yankees

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Speaker 1: have a lot of it. This feels almost unfair because

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Speaker 1: if Milwaukee can't get hits, forget driving in runs, home runs,

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Speaker 1: they can't get hits, they can't get singles and doubles,

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Speaker 1: the series is probably over. Jmack that game last night,

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Speaker 1: I gotta tell you, I had such low expectations of

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Speaker 1: that game. It had twenty three seventeen. All you had

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Speaker 1: to do is look at the analytics. You're like, the

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Speaker 1: Bengals have a battle line, your two forty year old quarterbacks.

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Speaker 1: It's a short week, it's you know, Tomlin has not

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Speaker 1: been great, so the Steelers will probably win, but they

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Speaker 1: won't be that explosive. Aaron was terrific, Flacco was amazing

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Speaker 1: the run game, and we've got a really interesting weekend.

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Speaker 1: Can Philadelphia bounce out of their issues? Can the Chargers

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Speaker 1: getting healthier now beat the Colts? That's an underrated good

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Speaker 1: game this weekend. What did you make it last night?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, one of the big takeaways. So one of our

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Speaker 7: guys on staff, I got a lot of guys that

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Speaker 7: just didn't gambling, said hey, j Mack, did you see

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Speaker 7: that Joe Flacco's passing yards total was like two hundred

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Speaker 7: and fifty?

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Speaker 3: And I was like, no way, how's he throw it

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Speaker 3: for two fifty? He just got to this team.

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Speaker 7: And then I was like, oh boy, he's gonna be offensive.

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Speaker 7: Fireworks and lo and behold Flacco's unstoppable. Bengals just score

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Speaker 7: it will Did you say they scored on six street

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Speaker 7: possessions against the most expensive defense in the NFL.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's just I think One of the things that

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Speaker 1: was obvious last night how easily they ran the ball.

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Speaker 1: There were huge, huge holes inside the box. So I mean,

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Speaker 1: Jamar Chase is always going to get his Last night

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Speaker 1: was crazy, and again Joe Flacco knows what he knows.

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Speaker 1: If you watched the Bengals last week with Joe Flacco,

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Speaker 1: remember that game, he just the final like drive. It

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Speaker 1: was like, I'm just gonna throw to Jamar Chase over

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Speaker 1: and over and over they did. Jamar Chase said, we

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Speaker 1: knew what they were going to do defensively, and they

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Speaker 1: did it.

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Speaker 7: You know what, it's embarrassing, Colin if you're the Pittsburgh

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Speaker 7: Steelers fans and you were all excited about that four

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Speaker 7: and one start, and then you look at the upcoming.

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Speaker 3: Schedule, They're probably gonna.

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Speaker 7: Lose their next three and all of a sudden gonna

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Speaker 7: be four and five. And then let's see how Aaron

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Speaker 7: Rodgers and Arthur Smith are doing on the sideline and

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Speaker 7: what's going on with Tomlin.

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Speaker 3: I think there's some trouble ahead for the Pittsburgh Steelers.

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Speaker 2: Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays

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Speaker 2: and noon eastern non am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio.

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Speaker 2: FS one and the iHeartRadio app.

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Speaker 5: Hi, this is Jay.

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Speaker 8: I'm the producer of the Paula and Toni Fusco Show.

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Speaker 8: Usually in these promos they ask you to listen to

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Speaker 8: the show. I'm here to ask you please don't listen

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Speaker 8: to the show. The hosts are two absolute morons who

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Speaker 8: have the dumbest takes on sports imaginable. Don't listen to

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Speaker 8: the show so it can get camps.

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Speaker 5: What the hell are you doing in our studio?

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Speaker 2: Get him, Paul, Ignore that fool.

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Speaker 1: Listen to the Paula and Tony Fusco Show on the

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast.

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Speaker 2: He's still moving. Let's blaze it up, right up. It's

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Speaker 2: Collins blazon five Dolphins.

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Speaker 1: And Browns highlight Cleveland at home minus two and a half.

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Speaker 1: There's an argument when Cleveland's at home. They have the

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Speaker 1: best defense in the NFL. PFF has it as the

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Speaker 1: highest graded defense. You cannot run on this team, and

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Speaker 1: the wins are going to be over forty miles an hour,

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Speaker 1: the gusts are and it's going to be rainy. Dylan Gabriel,

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Speaker 1: He'll be fine. They're not gonna ask much. The Dolphins

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Speaker 1: only win this year came up by win over the

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Speaker 1: Jets barely. They have been out gained in five or

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Speaker 1: six games. They have culture issues, the quarterback calling out

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Speaker 1: the coach, and they give up the second most yards

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Speaker 1: per play in the league. You're talking about an elite

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Speaker 1: defense at home against the Dolphins defense that is atrocious,

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Speaker 1: and generally if your defense is bad, it's worse on

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Speaker 1: the road. I think it's mostly low scoring, sloppy. I

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Speaker 1: trust Cleveland's defense to carry the day, maybe get a

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Speaker 1: turnover in points twenty four to seventeen.

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Speaker 3: Browns win and over Giants, said Broncos. I like Denver

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Speaker 3: to win and win big.

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Speaker 1: If you know Jackson Dart yards per play is behind

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Speaker 1: Russell Wilson this year, and Russell Wilson got bench. This

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Speaker 1: defense is the best in the league, best third down defense,

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Speaker 1: best red zone defense, leaves the NFL in sacks. Okay,

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Speaker 1: they're two and zero at home, both comfortably and Jackson Dart.

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Speaker 1: Let's not kid ourselves. Russell Wilson had fewer giveaways and

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Speaker 1: average more yards per play. Jackson Dart's the better story.

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Speaker 1: He's got good energy, But against this defense in Denver,

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Speaker 1: forget about it. The Broncos defense at home this year

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Speaker 1: is unbelievable, relentless pressure. And again I think the Giants

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Speaker 1: are a really fun story, but they're owing three on

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Speaker 1: the road this season. I'm gonna take Denver to win

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Speaker 1: twenty eight to twenty cover the spread. Don't think it'll

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Speaker 1: feel this.

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Speaker 3: Close, Commander said, Cowboys.

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Speaker 1: Take the over fifty four and a half. I don't

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Speaker 1: care if Terry McLeay oram plays opposing quarterbacks against the

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Speaker 1: Cowboys and Commanders are completing sixty eight percent of their

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Speaker 1: throws in a passer rating almost one to ten, both

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Speaker 1: quarterbacks are gonna eat. The Commanders have scored twenty four

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Speaker 1: points plus in four straight games, but their run defense

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Speaker 1: has gotten worse with injuries and their secondary the mess

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Speaker 1: Ceedee Lambs back for the Cowboys, but the problem is

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Speaker 1: they allow the most big plays in the NFL. With

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Speaker 1: or without Terry McLaurin, I think you're gonna get wild scoring.

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Speaker 1: The Cowboys defense this season has lasting virtually everything, and

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Speaker 1: now Washington's has progressively gotten worse over the last three weeks.

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Speaker 1: I don't need Terry McLaurin. That's not the issue. Remember

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Speaker 1: when Washington scored points against Chicago and turned it over

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Speaker 1: three times. They didn't play a clean game, and they

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Speaker 1: scored points. I'm taking the over. Commanders win. That's not

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Speaker 1: my play. Thirty twenty seven. Take the over fifty four

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Speaker 1: and a half.

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Speaker 3: Packers said Cardinals.

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Speaker 1: I think green Bay wins. I'm taking the seven. It's

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Speaker 1: moved up to seven Arizona. It doesn't matter if Jacoby

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Speaker 1: Brissett or Kyler Murray played. Kyler Murray foot injury may play.

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Speaker 1: Last week, Kobe Brissett had nine big plays against the

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Speaker 1: Colts Okay, and Green Bay has yet to win a

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Speaker 1: road game. They're very young, they're a little banged up

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Speaker 1: on offense. Listen Arizona. All six of their games this year,

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Speaker 1: most in the NFL have been one score game. They've

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Speaker 1: lit in the fourth quarter of five of their six games,

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Speaker 1: and they're always feisty at home. And green Bay is

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Speaker 1: not taking the ball away this year. The Arizona offense,

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Speaker 1: green Bay is gonna have to prepare for Kyler Murray

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Speaker 1: and Jacoby Brissett. I think that's a disadvantage. I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: take green Bay to win close. Seven points is too many.

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Speaker 1: Twenty eight to twenty four, feisty Arizona with either quarterback

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Speaker 1: at home keeps it close. Buccaneers said Lions one of

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Speaker 1: my favorite bets of the weekend. I like the Lions

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Speaker 1: to win and cover. First of all, the Lions are

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Speaker 1: not only nine and two at home in the last

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Speaker 1: couple of years, they average thirty seven points a game

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Speaker 1: at home. They're a different offense, very good. Jared Goff

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Speaker 1: leads the NFL in completion percentage that chiefs game. Kansas

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Speaker 1: City's the best team in the league, probably by a touchdown.

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Speaker 1: When this team gets home, they are lethal and their

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Speaker 1: defense is taking the ball away this year top five

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Speaker 1: in the league. In Baker Mayfield has a lot of,

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Speaker 1: as j Max told you the last couple of weeks,

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Speaker 1: turnover worthy plays. So the Bucks have trailed in four

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Speaker 1: their in the fourth quarter in five of their six games,

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Speaker 1: twenty fourth in scoring defense, they're missing a couple of corners.

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Speaker 1: So a team that is really stacked on offense comes

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Speaker 1: home after an ugly loss, they face a Tampa team

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Speaker 1: that is winning close but trailing in all their games. Finally,

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Speaker 1: their separation. I don't think it's a great Sunday for

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Speaker 1: Baker in the Bucks. Lions win it Lions cover twenty

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Speaker 1: eight to twenty one. A game I strongly considered was

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Speaker 1: the Colts beating take the points with the culture over

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Speaker 1: the Chargers. But reportedly Khalil Mack and Joe All are

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Speaker 1: going to play for the Chargers, So I'm not betting

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Speaker 1: against Harball if he's got his starting left tackle and

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Speaker 1: his best pass rusher. So again, I'll take the Browns

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Speaker 1: in an ugly game with horrendous weather against the Miami

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Speaker 1: team that's got cultural issues right now. And more, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna take the Broncos comfortably the over in the Cowboys

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Speaker 1: Commander's wild shootout. Green Baya win but look ugly, Cardinals cover,

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Speaker 1: and I think the Lions. I think the Bucks have

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Speaker 1: been a really fun team to watch, but man coming

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Speaker 1: off an ugly loss Detroit at home, I'm gonna take.

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Speaker 3: The win and the cover.

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Speaker 2: One more. Heard the Herd streams twenty four hours a day,

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Speaker 2: seven days a week. Within the radio app, search her

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Speaker 2: to listen live or on demand whenever you like.

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Speaker 1: So Stafford, Joe Flacco, Aaron Rodgers, the old guys are

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Speaker 1: highly productive. I don't I don't think Aaron's The problem

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Speaker 1: actually is. Passer rating is like one, four one five

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Speaker 1: with Pittsburgh Mike Sando, senior NFL writer for the Athletic

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Speaker 1: Selector Pro Football Hall of Fame. There is you know,

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Speaker 1: it's an interesting thing going on between the old guys

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Speaker 1: flourishing Mike and the Darnold's and the Bakers sort of

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Speaker 1: getting a reboot with clever offensive coordinators. I said, a

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Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago, I saw this where there were

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Speaker 1: fifteen quarterbacks with passer rating over one hundred and it

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Speaker 1: was six two years ago.

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Speaker 5: Is some of it?

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Speaker 1: Maybe it's zone defense across the league, so it's it's

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Speaker 1: kind of throw to a spot.

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Speaker 3: I mean the quarterback play.

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Speaker 1: When I watched Flaco do that last night and Aaron's

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Speaker 1: played well, it does feel like the golden era of

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Speaker 1: quarterback play.

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Speaker 3: Is there is there a reason why?

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Speaker 4: I do think it's easier to play the position from

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Speaker 4: colin But you know, those guys who have been around

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Speaker 4: a long time usually get rid of the ball. And

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Speaker 4: when we're talking about the worst quarterbacking in the league

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Speaker 4: this year, it's Justin Field's taking nine sacks, not because

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Speaker 4: his protection is terrible, because he doesn't know where to

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Speaker 4: go at the ball, and so these guys if you

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Speaker 4: look at Rogers this year, quickest time to throw for

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Speaker 4: him in his whole career. He's getting getting it out. Also,

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Speaker 4: we know, just bigger picture, these guys don't get hit

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Speaker 4: like they used to. You know, I think back in

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Speaker 4: the day some of the legends, you know, Kenny Stabler

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Speaker 4: shows up late to the game, he's been out all night.

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Speaker 5: You know, he.

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Speaker 4: Has a terrible first half, and then he throws up

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Speaker 4: at halftime that's actually happened, and then goes out and

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Speaker 4: has a big second half. You can't play to longevity

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Speaker 4: the way those guys lived and played and say but

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Speaker 4: it was an extreme example in the Hall of Famer.

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Speaker 4: But now these guys are the best rest, the best travel.

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Speaker 4: You know, they know how to take care of their body,

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Speaker 4: and the rules are all set up. You never see

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Speaker 4: him get eear hold, you know. So it's really a

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Speaker 4: great setup for these guys to play when they're older.

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Speaker 4: What happened though the last few years is but a

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Speaker 4: lot of them retired, so you know, there's fewer of

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Speaker 4: them now than there were four or five years ago.

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Speaker 1: You know, I said this generally, if the average NFL

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Speaker 1: franchise quarterback career is fifteen years. I always feel like

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Speaker 1: mid second chapter, I got a good read on you.

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Speaker 1: For years, I said, Dak is Kirk cousins with better mobility.

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Speaker 1: But Kirk never carried this kind of roster, and Dallas

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Speaker 1: isn't a great team. But no Ceede Lamb, no number

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Speaker 1: one tight end offensive line is still in a rebuild

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Speaker 1: every I mean, let's be honest, they play from behind.

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Speaker 1: You have to win by track meet. I honestly feel

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Speaker 1: like we're in chapter eleven or whatever year it is

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Speaker 1: for Dak, and I mean he Zach Martin, Tyron Smith,

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Speaker 1: Zeke Dak, all these changes, Ceedee Lamb. If he's upright,

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Speaker 1: he wins double digit games. I think I've undervalued Dak,

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Speaker 1: or maybe the intangibles, the tangibles caught up with the intangibles.

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Speaker 3: Maybe it's that.

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Speaker 4: Here's what happens so common by the end of the

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Speaker 4: year when they lose in the first round of the

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Speaker 4: playoffs or don't make it. That's what goes into our mind,

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Speaker 4: is like, hey, we discount Dak because he's had good

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Speaker 4: years before and it never leads him anywhere. And so

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Speaker 4: I think that's what happens.

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Speaker 3: We have a.

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Speaker 4: Cowboy fatigue, a Dak fatigue. But you have to realize

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Speaker 4: the last time he played a full season, he was

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Speaker 4: second in MVP balloting. That was twenty twenty three. So

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Speaker 4: he's played really well here, has before, but I think

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Speaker 4: it has been a little bit of a different level

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Speaker 4: for him here maybe a little bit under McCarthy and

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Speaker 4: now under Schottenheimer.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I want to talk about some young quarterbacks.

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Speaker 1: So you know, Caleb's in year two, but Ben Johnson

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Speaker 1: has a pretty sophisticated system. There's a lot of new

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Speaker 1: guy Burden lutheror Burden's new, Loveland's new. They haven't used

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Speaker 1: him much. Ben Johnson's systems new, the staff is new,

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Speaker 1: and so I look at Caleb and I'm like, what

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Speaker 1: my eyes tell me this, Mike. He is playing within

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Speaker 1: structure more than last It's more of an intentional offense.

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Speaker 3: I can see the game plan.

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Speaker 1: But I made this argument this week bow Knicks may

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Speaker 1: never throw a deep ball and Caleb may never be

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Speaker 1: really consistently accurate. I mean, that's what I see is

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Speaker 1: that he's playing with instructure to a degree, but he's

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Speaker 1: still struggling with I mean, Brady couldn't move. There are

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Speaker 1: no perfect quarterbacks. Where do you see Ben and Caleb

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Speaker 1: right now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I think it's really good that it's been relatively quiet

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Speaker 4: and every week's not a referendum on it, because you know,

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Speaker 4: Ben Johnson came out with guns blazing. I mean he

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Speaker 4: was hard on their players and Caleb in the off

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Speaker 4: season and said things like we're watching our body language,

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Speaker 4: or he complained about burden being the training room, all

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Speaker 4: these types of things that it kind of got my

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Speaker 4: attention like, WHOA, this guy's kind of old school in

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Speaker 4: terms of how he treats guys. And I think that

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Speaker 4: can ultimately be good for Caleb Williams because you know,

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Speaker 4: he probably hasn't had that. He probably hasn't had somebody

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Speaker 4: he's always been the star, always come pretty easy for him,

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00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:03,920
Speaker 4: and so now he's got this coach who's tough and

432
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:05,200
Speaker 4: going to hold him to it. I think what we

433
00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:08,040
Speaker 4: want to see over time is, and I can't tell

434
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 4: fully yet, is how much are they setting up the

435
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:15,919
Speaker 4: offense so Caleb can function with whatever his weaknesses are

436
00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:18,600
Speaker 4: versus how much can he really go in the direction

437
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:23,040
Speaker 4: Jared goffwent and really really flourish as the.

438
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:25,719
Speaker 2: In the system.

439
00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:27,639
Speaker 4: I think we've seen some signs that it is a

440
00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 4: little bit more within the system. He still has a

441
00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:31,680
Speaker 4: really long time to throw. I mentioned that for Rogers.

442
00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:35,720
Speaker 4: You know, one extreme Caleb I think is still on

443
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:38,120
Speaker 4: average is time to throw is maybe second or third

444
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:41,880
Speaker 4: slowest in the league. So it's a mix. It's a process,

445
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:44,320
Speaker 4: but I love that it's not every week he's in

446
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 4: the headlines.

447
00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 1: I'm going to ask you about three young quarterbacks. Let's

448
00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:51,120
Speaker 1: start with bo Nicks. Last week in London, I thought

449
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:54,399
Speaker 1: Sean was body language told me he was visibly frustrated

450
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:55,080
Speaker 1: with bo Nicks.

451
00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:56,560
Speaker 3: Where are you on bow?

452
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:00,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's been a little underwhelming this year.

453
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 4: I was very high on what I saw last season,

454
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:06,200
Speaker 4: especially late in the year, and all of the quarterback tiers.

455
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:08,359
Speaker 4: Feedback I got, most of it was from people in

456
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:10,879
Speaker 4: the league was wow, let's see where this can go.

457
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,000
Speaker 4: With Sean Payton. I still kind of feel that way,

458
00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:16,159
Speaker 4: but it feels like it's been a little underwhelling for

459
00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:18,000
Speaker 4: a while. He was a little over the place, a

460
00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:21,959
Speaker 4: little undisciplined. You mentioned, you know, throwing the ball down

461
00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,199
Speaker 4: the field. He still has a really low yard per

462
00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,880
Speaker 4: attempt both years. His explosive play rate is pretty low,

463
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:31,000
Speaker 4: so I guess I need to see how much he

464
00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:34,879
Speaker 4: can do beyond the system still, and that's fine. I

465
00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:37,720
Speaker 4: think he's a solid starting quarterback, but I wouldn't really

466
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 4: move him ahead of high tier three at this point,

467
00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:40,840
Speaker 4: would you.

468
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:41,960
Speaker 1: No?

469
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,520
Speaker 3: No, No, I think that's right Drake May. Now that's different.

470
00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,200
Speaker 1: He's bigger, got a better deep ball arm like bo Nicks,

471
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:52,959
Speaker 1: moves very well. Are you surprised he's this good this quickly?

472
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:56,879
Speaker 1: With all those free agents, draft picks are playing brand

473
00:24:56,960 --> 00:25:00,159
Speaker 1: new staff. There's a lot of moving parts here. I mean,

474
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,400
Speaker 1: this team from two hundred eighty million bucks on free agent,

475
00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:03,840
Speaker 1: you got five six new starters.

476
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:05,080
Speaker 3: Are you surprised?

477
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:08,640
Speaker 4: Very pleasantly surprised on Drake May. You know, I think

478
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 4: that there were positive signs as a rookie, but all

479
00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,080
Speaker 4: the discussion was well, kind of hard to judge him

480
00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:16,480
Speaker 4: because it was so bad around him. And I know

481
00:25:16,520 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 4: they spent a lot of money in fregency, but still

482
00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:20,840
Speaker 4: nine out of ten people in the league thought that's

483
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:23,200
Speaker 4: a really bad roster coming into this year. You can't

484
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 4: buy a team in free agency normally, anyway, you can

485
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:27,399
Speaker 4: make yourself a little bit better. So I think he

486
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:30,120
Speaker 4: has shown, especially the last couple of weeks, some really

487
00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:33,040
Speaker 4: you know, higher level stuff. Some of the off schedule

488
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:36,320
Speaker 4: stuff's been kind of special. He seems to have the

489
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,760
Speaker 4: right makeup for all of this, so I'm really encouraged.

490
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:42,760
Speaker 4: I think he's somebody that's probably ahead of where thought

491
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:43,159
Speaker 4: he would be.

492
00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 1: I think Jackson Dart feels a little better story than

493
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,720
Speaker 1: player right now, but he plays with confidence. I think

494
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,840
Speaker 1: the story is great. It's New York. I just saw

495
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 1: something last night when I was going to make my

496
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 1: picks that, you know, Russell Wilson actually was averaging more

497
00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 1: yards of player than Jackson, but the story's way more

498
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:03,440
Speaker 1: interesting with Jackson. Dark Where are you on Jackson?

499
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, Jackson's first start, the average like three point

500
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,440
Speaker 4: six yards per play and everyone was super excited. So

501
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:12,639
Speaker 4: I think he could definitely throw the ball. I do

502
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:16,120
Speaker 4: like the energy. I do think he has a chance now,

503
00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 4: I was he takes too much contact? Okay, I think

504
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 4: thirty seven percent of his plays, which is a really high.

505
00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:25,440
Speaker 4: I think justin Fields is the only one higher.

506
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:28,399
Speaker 5: Are you know, like a.

507
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 4: Sack, a designed rush, getting hit after you throw the ball,

508
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 4: a scramble And that's okay if you're Lamar Jackson, and

509
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,080
Speaker 4: you know how to wiggle on these hits, and you're

510
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,159
Speaker 4: a really great runner who just doesn't get a let up.

511
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:43,640
Speaker 4: This guy, you know, goes out there and just gets

512
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 4: hit in the chin. I mean, he's out there downfield

513
00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:49,119
Speaker 4: stiff arming, you know, somebody with his throwing hand, and

514
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,160
Speaker 4: he's laughing about it after the game, and it's kind

515
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,560
Speaker 4: of fun. But that's a lot of contact without rolling

516
00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 4: with the punches. Right, He's taken shots and I think

517
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:00,679
Speaker 4: that's not sustainable. So that's my one concern with him.

518
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 3: Okay, finally, let's wrap it up with this.

519
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:09,640
Speaker 1: Did you ever think Baker Mayfield or Sam Darnald we're

520
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,000
Speaker 1: going to be this good? No.

521
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:16,720
Speaker 4: I thought Baker Mayfield could be good, but I didn't

522
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 4: think he'd be this good because he was the number

523
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,119
Speaker 4: one pick who got hurt, you know, and so I

524
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:23,679
Speaker 4: always thought that there was something there. It was kind

525
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:27,119
Speaker 4: of weird how they bailed on him so fast, but

526
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 4: Donald for sure seemed to be, you know, done. I

527
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,159
Speaker 4: thought before he went to the forty nine ers, and

528
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,680
Speaker 4: there were people that I know who had you been

529
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:39,880
Speaker 4: with him before and liked him but just didn't see

530
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,840
Speaker 4: this coming. So the first person that told me look

531
00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:46,360
Speaker 4: out for Donald was Randy Mueler. He's with the Saints now,

532
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:48,399
Speaker 4: but we used to do a podcast together and he

533
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:51,000
Speaker 4: saw him with San Francisco and was like, look out,

534
00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:52,880
Speaker 4: this is going to be a reclamation story. And it's

535
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,119
Speaker 4: been totally right. But what he's doing in Seattle, I

536
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 4: think is another level ahead of what he did in Minnesota. Yes,

537
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:01,920
Speaker 4: you know, and it's like, that's kind of surprising me.

538
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:04,720
Speaker 4: You would have thought with this Seattle team, Hey, they

539
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:09,280
Speaker 4: traded DK metcalf McDonald. Mike McDonald's got this defense going,

540
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 4: but they're gonna have to carry him. They don't even

541
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 4: have much of a run game. Their defense has been

542
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:15,919
Speaker 4: up and down with injuries, and the one constant has

543
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:19,560
Speaker 4: been Darnold looking like a Chier one quarterback. It's awesome

544
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:19,879
Speaker 4: for that.

545
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:20,240
Speaker 6: Yeah.

546
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 1: And also they're the second youngest offense. I said this

547
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: two weeks ago. Minnesota had Justin Jefferson, the great coach,

548
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:32,560
Speaker 1: your left tackle, you know, tight end play Seattle's kids

549
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:35,200
Speaker 1: and we didn't even know if js N was a

550
00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 1: number one. Like this, that's walking into a new system

551
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,240
Speaker 1: with the second youngest offense the Green Bay And I

552
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:44,520
Speaker 1: mean that Baker game was one of the best quarterback

553
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:46,720
Speaker 1: duels I've seen. It's like a Manning Brady game.

554
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:48,440
Speaker 3: It totally was.

555
00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 4: It was, it was, It was really really incredible. I

556
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:54,960
Speaker 4: just I feel like I'm totally betting on those guys.

557
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,320
Speaker 4: As far as Baker, is there any quarterback in the

558
00:28:57,400 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 4: league whose guys are going to lay it on the

559
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,120
Speaker 4: line more for him based on how he plays? I mean,

560
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 4: I want to play for him. You know, I've run

561
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:05,560
Speaker 4: out there and take a huge hit over the middle

562
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,800
Speaker 4: right now for that guy. Just the energy he brings.

563
00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 5: I love it.

564
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:13,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, unique personality. Mike Santoisos, love your work at the

565
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 1: Athletic Senior Writer.

566
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 3: We love his stuff. Mike, thank you so much.

567
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 2: Hey, thank you.

568
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's between the old guys hanging in there and

569
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 1: playing well Flacco, Rogers and Stafford, and the young guys

570
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 1: like Drake May hitting. You know, I said this this

571
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,480
Speaker 1: next draft, if you had four guys in the first

572
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:35,800
Speaker 1: round that could play, you get to a saturation point.

573
00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 1: There's not that many teams. Jets need a quarterback, Raiders

574
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,960
Speaker 1: need a quarterback. Cleveland needs an absolute quarterback. Now, the

575
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:45,880
Speaker 1: Rams may draft one and sit in behind Stafford for

576
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 1: a year or two. But I mean the Jets, the Raiders,

577
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:52,479
Speaker 1: and the Browns absolutely need a quarterback. But I mean

578
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:54,920
Speaker 1: I watched Bryce Young. I'm like, you know what, Now,

579
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 1: they got him a number one receiver, they got a

580
00:29:57,080 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 1: little bit of a running game, they got him an

581
00:29:58,560 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 1: offensive coach.

582
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 3: It's something I think some of the teams.

583
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 1: That draft a quarterback don't necessarily need them now, but they,

584
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 1: you know, their quarterbacks getting older. Like Pittsburgh, you could

585
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:12,280
Speaker 1: see them drafting a quarterback with Aaron Rodgers. Maybe not

586
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 1: first pick, second third pick. But there's only a handful

587
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:19,800
Speaker 1: of team. I mean, Spencer Rattler New Orleans, why not.

588
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 1: I mean, they're not a super Bowl team this year

589
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:25,280
Speaker 1: or next. Let's just let's just let's see if it meshes.

590
00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:28,400
Speaker 1: Let's just let him play. What if Spencer Rattler outplays

591
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,920
Speaker 1: Caleb Williams this weekend? All it takes about three games.

592
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:34,360
Speaker 1: I mean, Jackson Dart's first game, everybody fell in love

593
00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:36,480
Speaker 1: with him, and you're like, yeah, yards per play with

594
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,560
Speaker 1: only listen, you can change the narrative with a bigger

595
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,480
Speaker 1: road win or back to back late game wins. Young quarterback.

596
00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 1: Everybody in the building's like, that's our guy,