WEBVTT - Kim Basinger and Ireland Baldwin: Living with Anxiety, Panic Attacks + Phobias 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.720 Hey, fam, I'm Jada Pinkett Smith and this is the 0:00:02.759 --> 0:00:06.080 Red Table Pop podcast all your favorite episodes from the 0:00:06.120 --> 0:00:10.239 Facebook Watch show in audio produced by Westbrook Audio and 0:00:10.360 --> 0:00:13.360 I Heart Radio. Please don't forget to rate and review 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:17.759 on Apple Podcasts. A Red Table Talk exclusive. The only 0:00:17.840 --> 0:00:20.680 child of Kim Bay Singer and Alec Baldwin. Do you 0:00:20.720 --> 0:00:22.880 remember your first anxiety attack? And then when I was 0:00:22.920 --> 0:00:25.520 a kid? It was really based around his divorce Willow 0:00:25.720 --> 0:00:28.880 One on one with Ireland, I just hit a total 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:31.360 breaking point. I didn't talk to my parents for like 0:00:31.400 --> 0:00:34.440 a year. I think I would have committed suicide. Then, 0:00:34.600 --> 0:00:37.200 for the first time in fourteen years, her mom Oscar 0:00:37.280 --> 0:00:40.760 winner Kim Bay Singer opens up about her severe panic attacks. 0:00:41.520 --> 0:00:43.519 I wouldn't leave the house, I would no longer go 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:46.319 to dinner. I had to relearn to drive. How did 0:00:46.360 --> 0:00:50.479 you feel when you saw that Ireland was all self suffering? 0:00:50.600 --> 0:00:57.200 An important conversation that affects millions. Oh, j you you 0:00:57.320 --> 0:01:07.920 have no idea. Hi, thank you for having me. I'm 0:01:07.959 --> 0:01:11.039 nice to see you. Nice to you. How are you. 0:01:11.160 --> 0:01:14.560 I'm pretty good? I'm pretty good. Yeah right, We we 0:01:14.600 --> 0:01:17.080 can get it. We can get a little comfy I'm 0:01:17.160 --> 0:01:20.920 just so happy we're here about this. Two hundred and 0:01:20.959 --> 0:01:25.720 sixty four million people around the world experience some form 0:01:25.800 --> 0:01:30.119 of anxiety or panic attacks. I know that, including me, 0:01:30.600 --> 0:01:33.480 most everybody that I know has um struggled with some 0:01:33.560 --> 0:01:38.080 kind of anxiety or panic. It doesn't come down to 0:01:39.360 --> 0:01:43.400 getting really expensive therapy. It's just about having conversations like 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:45.600 this and letting it out. I just think it's super 0:01:45.600 --> 0:01:48.120 important to just talk about it. And I want to 0:01:48.160 --> 0:01:53.080 ask you, like, what was your first time experiencing anxiety 0:01:53.240 --> 0:01:57.960 or panic attacks. I didn't really want to call it 0:01:58.000 --> 0:02:00.320 anxiety for a long time because I think it kind 0:02:00.320 --> 0:02:04.120 of makes you feel weak. It makes you feel like 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:06.200 you're put in a box. So it's I think I've 0:02:06.200 --> 0:02:08.080 had it my whole life, since I was a kid. 0:02:08.240 --> 0:02:10.960 I just don't think I was comfortable calling it what 0:02:11.040 --> 0:02:13.680 it was. I just I felt so ashamed of it, 0:02:13.800 --> 0:02:16.320 you know, I just didn't and I didn't really understand 0:02:16.360 --> 0:02:19.079 like what was happening to me. Yeah, I definitely relate 0:02:19.160 --> 0:02:22.200 to not wanting to call it anxiety or not even 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:25.480 like knowing that it's anxiety. Yeah, I feel like when 0:02:25.480 --> 0:02:27.240 I was growing up, I was always told I was 0:02:27.240 --> 0:02:30.560 like being a brat, or like being ungrateful, or like 0:02:30.639 --> 0:02:33.360 having a fit, when in reality, I was kind of 0:02:33.360 --> 0:02:38.000 dealing with a deeper emotional issue. Do you remember your 0:02:38.040 --> 0:02:41.560 first anxiety attack when my parents were getting divorced? That 0:02:41.680 --> 0:02:45.360 was really when Ireland was just a toddler. When her 0:02:45.400 --> 0:02:50.160 parents split, A year's long, bitter, very public custody battle followed. 0:02:50.720 --> 0:02:53.960 When she was eleven, a devastating voicemail from her father 0:02:54.040 --> 0:02:57.560 to her was leaked to the press. The worldwide coverage 0:02:57.600 --> 0:03:03.760 was inescapable. I think for any child, divorce is traumatic, 0:03:04.160 --> 0:03:08.440 extremely traumatic, and I don't think most people can imagine 0:03:08.680 --> 0:03:12.320 how it must feel to have that trauma broadcast or 0:03:12.360 --> 0:03:15.280 everything that happen we want to see everyone can read 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:18.800 about it. I can remember playing with friends, I'm at playdates, 0:03:18.800 --> 0:03:22.040 I'm in school, I'm staying at friends houses. I'm like 0:03:22.160 --> 0:03:24.920 hidden from the realities of it all. But you know, 0:03:24.960 --> 0:03:27.480 when you get older, when you have access to the internet, 0:03:28.040 --> 0:03:30.360 when you have friends in school, older kids, you know 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:32.640 coming to you and asking you, oh, well is this true, 0:03:32.840 --> 0:03:36.800 or that it starts to manifest. And I think the 0:03:36.840 --> 0:03:39.760 other point I'll make that you and I share is 0:03:40.400 --> 0:03:46.839 always trying to have to individualize That's a big one. 0:03:47.560 --> 0:03:51.280 My anxiety is so deep and rooted in that having 0:03:51.280 --> 0:03:53.360 to be being your own person, making sure that people 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:57.200 respect you for who you actually are, not just for 0:03:57.240 --> 0:03:59.200 who your mother is or your father is, or what 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:01.240 they think you should do. Coming to terms with that 0:04:01.320 --> 0:04:03.600 and being like, Okay, well, I guess you know I'm 0:04:03.640 --> 0:04:05.640 gonna model for an hour. I guess I'm gonna act, 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:07.240 or I guess I'm gonna do this because this is 0:04:07.240 --> 0:04:09.760 what people expect of me. You have a lot more 0:04:09.800 --> 0:04:12.720 to prove because you're always going to have that comparison 0:04:12.760 --> 0:04:15.720 to your parents. I don't think I ever would have 0:04:15.760 --> 0:04:18.000 been scouted as a model if it weren't for who 0:04:18.000 --> 0:04:20.960 my parents are. Nothing makes me want to peel my 0:04:21.080 --> 0:04:24.960 fingernails off more than doing like a basing her Baldwin 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:29.279 spread and a you know magazine and then facing the 0:04:29.320 --> 0:04:33.680 criticism and the comparisons and then that anxiety for me 0:04:33.800 --> 0:04:39.760 is like extremely toxic. Since Ireland's first modeling job at seventeen, 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:45.120 she's had to face comparisons to her mother. She's been 0:04:45.120 --> 0:04:48.480 a target of critics and on social media, often getting 0:04:48.560 --> 0:04:53.280 vicious comments on her appearance and wait, I know I've 0:04:53.320 --> 0:04:56.080 struggled a lot with body image, Like even still today, 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:59.679 do you think that coming into modeling that whole world 0:04:59.720 --> 0:05:03.440 just sparked a little bit more of that anxiety just 0:05:03.480 --> 0:05:07.560 through a different perspective. He ruined my brain? Wow, I 0:05:07.560 --> 0:05:12.200 had already had so many body issues, eating disorders, all 0:05:12.200 --> 0:05:14.599 that stuff that I had before I even got into modeling. 0:05:15.279 --> 0:05:17.800 At the beginning of my modeling career, I was like, 0:05:17.800 --> 0:05:20.599 why am I even doing this? Totally? Like you just 0:05:20.680 --> 0:05:23.159 kind of just felt like you needed to do it 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:27.440 or that was like I remember, keenly, like when I 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:30.359 first started really going hard with the modeling and working 0:05:30.400 --> 0:05:33.200 a lot, I would travel and go on these trips 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:35.200 to work and like wake up the next day and 0:05:35.240 --> 0:05:38.560 just be physically sick. Yeah. I remember one specific time 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:41.080 I had to get myself out of the hotel room 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:44.719 like all of my might because every five minutes I 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:47.160 was thrown up. Yeah, I know the exact feeling. I 0:05:47.240 --> 0:05:50.080 was going to be the model actress that people wanted 0:05:50.120 --> 0:05:51.880 me to be, you know, But I would go to 0:05:51.920 --> 0:05:53.640 these big events and I'd be like, what am I 0:05:53.720 --> 0:05:57.760 here even promoting? Why am I here? Totally? The top 0:05:57.880 --> 0:06:00.359 five worst panic attacks I've ever had in my life. 0:06:00.440 --> 0:06:04.440 I had at this Harper's Bizarre dinner and I literally 0:06:04.480 --> 0:06:07.640 had to go outside and rip my dress off. It 0:06:07.720 --> 0:06:10.480 was like so tight. Took my necklace off, and I 0:06:10.520 --> 0:06:13.320 was I was gonna I was dry heaving st in 0:06:13.360 --> 0:06:17.039 New York, like throwing up full. You know, these emotions 0:06:17.080 --> 0:06:19.440 take a toll physically, and they love to come out 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:23.839 at the most inconvenient times ever, like I need to work, 0:06:23.880 --> 0:06:28.080 Please don't do this to me. I suffer from cardiophobia, 0:06:29.720 --> 0:06:32.839 and you're like, what, don't know what that is? I 0:06:32.839 --> 0:06:35.960 didn't know either until I did a lot of research 0:06:36.040 --> 0:06:39.080 for a very long time. I have a fear of 0:06:39.120 --> 0:06:43.720 my own heartbeat. So when it starts getting really fast, 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.840 even when I'm nervous, even slightly nervous, or if I 0:06:47.960 --> 0:06:51.760 exercise or anything, I start panicking to the point where 0:06:51.839 --> 0:06:54.840 I'm convinced, no matter what anyone says, that I'm gonna 0:06:54.839 --> 0:06:56.400 have a heart attack. And I had to go to 0:06:56.400 --> 0:07:01.880 a hospital. So I've had me over twenty hospital visits 0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:05.560 in my life for a doctor to basically come in 0:07:05.640 --> 0:07:08.160 and tell me that my heart's fine and my health 0:07:08.279 --> 0:07:12.640 is great, and that would be this huge release for me, 0:07:12.720 --> 0:07:16.000 this comfort seeing an e k G monitor tell me 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:19.040 that my heart's okay. I've had paramedics come to my house. 0:07:19.800 --> 0:07:23.520 I'm like, listen, you don't understand it's happening. This time, 0:07:23.560 --> 0:07:26.640 I'm dying. I've had the same paramedics come to my 0:07:26.720 --> 0:07:28.880 house a few times and they're like, here we go 0:07:28.920 --> 0:07:31.320 again with the girl at the fake heart attack. You know, 0:07:31.760 --> 0:07:34.520 but it's so crippling because everyone kind of looks at 0:07:34.560 --> 0:07:37.800 you like you're young and fit and healthy. You're fine, 0:07:37.960 --> 0:07:41.200 You're fine, but you're fine. I want to like dack 0:07:41.240 --> 0:07:44.240 people in the face that tell me I'm fine, you know, 0:07:44.360 --> 0:07:46.560 or to breathe. Do you think that there were any 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:51.040 specific experiences that you had that made you focus on 0:07:51.120 --> 0:07:54.080 your heart in particular. I saw someone have a heart 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:56.240 attack when I was a kid. It was a stranger 0:07:56.400 --> 0:07:58.960 in a restaurant, and that messed me up. I think 0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:02.800 that image never left my head ever. That makes sense. 0:08:02.920 --> 0:08:06.680 That's a traumatic experience and that stays with you. Was 0:08:06.720 --> 0:08:09.600 there ever a mental health conversation in your house when 0:08:09.600 --> 0:08:12.440 you were growing up? My mom struggles with anxiety and 0:08:12.520 --> 0:08:17.040 she's definitely my go to my person, so she's so 0:08:17.080 --> 0:08:19.800 she's who I call when I'm panicking. When I'm having 0:08:20.160 --> 0:08:23.160 an anxiety attack or and when it's starting to build up, 0:08:23.320 --> 0:08:25.680 I just I know to call my mom. But she's tough, 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:28.320 so she's just kind of like, go to work, make money, 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:31.400 dear thing, who cares about any of this? Save up 0:08:31.480 --> 0:08:35.480 In some way, I feel like that strong kind of 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:40.600 attitude is amazing in some points, but sometimes you need 0:08:40.640 --> 0:08:42.720 to go to that soft place and be like, I'm human. 0:08:42.920 --> 0:08:46.000 You want to be helped? Yeah, like I'm human, I'm hurt. 0:08:46.360 --> 0:08:48.920 My mom is one of the strongest people. She's so 0:08:49.000 --> 0:08:54.200 unapologetically herself. She really could give less of a you 0:08:54.240 --> 0:08:58.720 know what what people think of her. And I envy 0:08:58.760 --> 0:09:00.880 that in her more than anything, because I care so 0:09:00.960 --> 0:09:03.679 much what people think, you know, and I'm such a 0:09:03.679 --> 0:09:08.120 people pleaser. And with her she manages the energy vampires 0:09:08.120 --> 0:09:14.160 and blood suckers very well because she's like okay, yeah, 0:09:14.200 --> 0:09:16.880 and then she goes home. It's like, you know what 0:09:16.920 --> 0:09:19.800 I mean, only she manages. How does your mother help 0:09:19.840 --> 0:09:23.440 you manage? It? Was rough. I feel like when I 0:09:23.480 --> 0:09:26.760 was growing up, she didn't understand my anxiety because she 0:09:27.040 --> 0:09:30.280 growing up had seen her friends die, like she had 0:09:30.320 --> 0:09:33.720 been through so much stuff that like my issues to 0:09:33.760 --> 0:09:37.000 her kind of felt like smaller, and that was very 0:09:37.040 --> 0:09:39.480 frustrating for me as a child, of course, because I 0:09:39.559 --> 0:09:43.280 was like, how can you not see my internal emotional struggle? 0:09:43.920 --> 0:09:47.080 But like really recently, she we had a talk and 0:09:47.120 --> 0:09:51.840 she was like, I never knew that I actually experienced anxiety, 0:09:52.120 --> 0:09:54.080 and she was pushing it down and pushing it down 0:09:54.120 --> 0:09:56.800 for so many years, like she had no idea. So 0:09:56.920 --> 0:09:59.280 I kind of had to forgive her a little bit, yeah, 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:02.959 for like being like, yeah, yeah, yeah, right, I get it, 0:10:03.000 --> 0:10:05.920 but like it's really not that bad, you know what 0:10:05.960 --> 0:10:08.160 I mean. Yeah, but it's very real to you. Your 0:10:08.200 --> 0:10:11.480 experience is real to you. I've been through so much 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:14.200 before I really got help, I was in a really 0:10:14.200 --> 0:10:17.840 abusive relationship and I did go to a treatment center. 0:10:18.559 --> 0:10:21.280 So I've been through a lot of different kinds of abuse. 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:25.440 I have been in physical, abusive relationships, and for so 0:10:25.480 --> 0:10:27.000 long I didn't want to call just like I didn't 0:10:27.000 --> 0:10:29.400 want to call my anxiety anxiety, I didn't want to 0:10:29.400 --> 0:10:31.520 call the forms of abuse I had been through in 0:10:31.559 --> 0:10:34.600 a lot of ways. And here's the other thing. I 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:39.000 had been abusive to people unknowingly because I'm not hitting 0:10:39.040 --> 0:10:41.520 them or I'm not you know being getting physical, but 0:10:41.760 --> 0:10:43.559 there were there was a lot of learning I had 0:10:43.600 --> 0:10:46.560 to do and a lot of acceptance of okay, wait, 0:10:46.640 --> 0:10:50.839 that was abusive behavior. I was an abuser towards someone else. 0:10:51.559 --> 0:10:55.040 But at that time I just hit a total breaking 0:10:55.080 --> 0:10:58.640 point and I was self medicating with xan X, and 0:10:58.720 --> 0:11:01.439 I was drinking, and I have a lot of alcoholism 0:11:01.559 --> 0:11:04.600 and drug addiction to my family. I had a night 0:11:04.640 --> 0:11:07.400 where I went way too far with drinking and taking 0:11:07.400 --> 0:11:09.160 pills because I couldn't even go to bed at night. 0:11:09.200 --> 0:11:13.080 I was so afraid of this relationship. And when I 0:11:13.120 --> 0:11:16.320 went to this drug and alcohol treatment center, I learned 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:20.400 that I didn't have an addiction to a substance, but 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:24.040 I have an addiction to wanting to fix people. That's 0:11:24.080 --> 0:11:28.600 my addiction. I'd fixate on anything until it shatters my 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:32.920 everything around me. That relationship brought a lot of really 0:11:33.240 --> 0:11:38.400 shady people in my life, and um I had isolated 0:11:38.520 --> 0:11:41.840 all of my real friends, isolated my family. I had 0:11:41.920 --> 0:11:45.120 no control in anything in my life. I tortured myself 0:11:45.200 --> 0:11:47.679 with my eating disorders that I had. I didn't talk 0:11:47.720 --> 0:11:50.840 to my parents for like a year, like I saw 0:11:50.920 --> 0:11:55.120 them here and there, But I was so ashamed of 0:11:55.120 --> 0:11:57.760 of what I had become and how I was living, 0:11:57.920 --> 0:12:00.320 and like I just became this different person. I was 0:12:00.400 --> 0:12:04.559 this like emaciated in every way. I was lifeless. But 0:12:04.640 --> 0:12:08.000 I don't mean in like a you know, literal skinny way, 0:12:08.120 --> 0:12:10.920 but just like my soul, soul everything was just shrunk, 0:12:11.200 --> 0:12:16.319 you know. And family wise, you know, my cousin, Haley 0:12:16.480 --> 0:12:19.920 Haley's older sister is like my sister. I love Haley 0:12:19.920 --> 0:12:23.720 Haley's like my sister too. But Aliah love Aliah. Well, 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:27.920 she was the one who booked a ticket from New 0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:31.160 York came to l A to see me. She was like, 0:12:32.280 --> 0:12:35.720 something's up. You know, I sent something. When she saved 0:12:35.720 --> 0:12:38.120 my life. You know, I think I would have committed 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:41.880 suicide or I would have been dead for sure. I 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:44.599 was so close and like I was so close I 0:12:44.600 --> 0:12:48.080 could feel it to getting to that point, and she 0:12:48.120 --> 0:12:50.560 said my life. She pulled me out of it. Wow. 0:12:51.440 --> 0:12:54.560 I feel like people like that are so important totally. 0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:58.600 How can a loved one, boyfriend, girlfriend, or just friend 0:12:59.120 --> 0:13:04.800 help a person going through a panic attack in the moment? Okay, 0:13:04.960 --> 0:13:09.680 So I love this question because I've had friends. I've 0:13:09.720 --> 0:13:14.800 had boyfriends who just had no clue how to manage 0:13:15.720 --> 0:13:18.719 my anxiety, and it would make me ten times more 0:13:18.760 --> 0:13:23.080 anxious because they didn't understand or they were very dismissive. 0:13:23.760 --> 0:13:27.240 I think the most important thing. I'm going to use 0:13:27.360 --> 0:13:31.199 my now boyfriend as an example or my mom. If 0:13:31.240 --> 0:13:32.880 I tell them I want to go to a hospital, 0:13:33.040 --> 0:13:36.640 they don't even question it. They drive me there. I've 0:13:36.760 --> 0:13:42.359 dated people who have been like this. Again. This past Christmas, 0:13:42.480 --> 0:13:46.439 I had a horrible anxiety attack, and my boyfriend he's like, 0:13:46.480 --> 0:13:48.880 all right, let's go get the keys, you know, and 0:13:48.960 --> 0:13:52.080 just getting to the hospital, breathing in the parking lot, 0:13:52.200 --> 0:13:56.480 I'm like, I think he's like, Okay, let's go home. 0:13:56.559 --> 0:13:59.360 You know. It's like making it not such a big deal, 0:13:59.760 --> 0:14:03.200 not making someone feel ashamed or embarrassed for whatever, caring 0:14:03.200 --> 0:14:05.440 in the moment. Yeah, And I think one other thing 0:14:05.520 --> 0:14:08.960 I'll say is reach out to people totally, like check 0:14:09.000 --> 0:14:12.599 on people, ask if they're okay. Because the anxiety manifests 0:14:12.600 --> 0:14:15.520 itself in a lot of ways, and it swirls and 0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:18.520 turns into depression. People feel trapped, like they don't have 0:14:18.559 --> 0:14:23.359 an escape, and be someone's escape. You know, Wow, that's beautiful, 0:14:23.960 --> 0:14:27.240 Thank you. Shall we go to the red table and 0:14:27.320 --> 0:14:33.640 continue this amazing conversation with our beautiful mother's grandmother. Let's 0:14:33.640 --> 0:14:41.040 see it. Hey guys, hey may hear me? How was 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:44.200 it to be able to feel like and you could 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:47.880 have such an open conversation like that, you feel less alone, 0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:50.640 like a breath of fresh air. That's how it felt like. 0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:54.680 They're totally you know, so I when your mom has 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:58.480 agreed to join us, this is a big moment and 0:14:58.560 --> 0:15:02.440 an honor screwinner. Kim Basinger seemed to have it all, 0:15:02.880 --> 0:15:06.560 a booming career, a movie star husband, and a string 0:15:06.600 --> 0:15:10.200 of iconic films from James Bond to Nine and a 0:15:10.240 --> 0:15:15.360 Half Weeks, Batman and l A Confidential, But behind the scenes, 0:15:15.440 --> 0:15:19.160 Kim continued to grapple with the crippling anxiety that plagued 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:23.320 her since childhood. After a difficult divorce played out in public, 0:15:23.600 --> 0:15:27.000 Kim seemed to disappear from the spotlight. Now, for the 0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:30.280 first time in nearly fifteen years, Kim is opening up 0:15:30.480 --> 0:15:33.360 together with her daughter Ireland, to share their struggles with 0:15:33.440 --> 0:15:47.160 mental health. The One and Only, Yes, Hi, nic brilliant, 0:15:47.240 --> 0:15:53.000 thank you, thank Hi doll. Such a beautiful, thank you, 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:57.440 beautiful job. You know, it's so interesting to be able 0:15:57.480 --> 0:16:02.280 to watch two young people together and have a conversation 0:16:02.400 --> 0:16:05.160 like that, you know, just as a mom, because we 0:16:05.160 --> 0:16:07.520 didn't get to do that. That's very true. You know, 0:16:07.760 --> 0:16:10.600 I didn't come up in a time where that kind 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:15.480 of conversation was even allowed. And I'm sure with you too, Kim, 0:16:15.600 --> 0:16:17.440 Like you know, we were children, and it was like, 0:16:17.520 --> 0:16:19.640 you know, be seen and not heard and sit down 0:16:19.680 --> 0:16:22.960 and just do what she told saying with you right, Yeah. 0:16:23.200 --> 0:16:25.960 You know. When I was a kid, I was really 0:16:26.000 --> 0:16:31.840 a very um, high octane type kid, and I was 0:16:32.000 --> 0:16:36.240 very perceptive about what was going on in my house, 0:16:36.480 --> 0:16:41.200 the strife, the fight, and I was just very very 0:16:41.320 --> 0:16:45.640 sensitive and it affected me seeing my mom struggle. She 0:16:45.720 --> 0:16:48.480 was a very dark woman. She was a beautiful woman, 0:16:48.840 --> 0:16:52.440 but she was troubled deeply. And I saw her struggle 0:16:52.480 --> 0:16:54.960 with anxiety her whole life. And I always had a 0:16:54.960 --> 0:16:57.480 great fear of something happening to my mom. I was 0:16:57.520 --> 0:17:00.760 so afraid, and then that started affecting me in so 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:04.520 many ways that I felt like I had to be 0:17:04.640 --> 0:17:09.800 home with my mom to save her. So I would 0:17:09.840 --> 0:17:12.960 take it to school and I would lie, I would 0:17:13.000 --> 0:17:16.800 make up excuses so the teacher would send me home. 0:17:17.800 --> 0:17:21.760 After a while, they began to think that something was 0:17:21.960 --> 0:17:27.840 really differently wrong with me, so they made me take 0:17:27.880 --> 0:17:31.879 all kinds of tests, they made me draw bunny pictures, 0:17:32.320 --> 0:17:36.159 and basically it was child anxiety. But they did not 0:17:36.560 --> 0:17:40.440 see things like that. And and it took me into 0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:44.120 adulthood to really find out as I was being helped 0:17:44.160 --> 0:17:48.800 for my anxiety, to really reckon with that journey I 0:17:48.840 --> 0:17:51.440 had gone on with my mom to try to save 0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:55.919 her was part of my problem. How did your anxiety 0:17:56.280 --> 0:18:01.760 manifest in your adulthood? You had a condition where you 0:18:01.800 --> 0:18:06.639 stayed in the house for phobia. I literally was in 0:18:06.680 --> 0:18:09.639 a health food store one day. It was my neighborhood store. 0:18:09.920 --> 0:18:13.080 I was going down Aisle number three. My basket was 0:18:13.160 --> 0:18:18.040 almost full, and I found something really overcoming me in 0:18:18.119 --> 0:18:22.560 such a way that I couldn't bring it. So I 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:24.680 left the basket and I made it to my car, 0:18:24.920 --> 0:18:27.399 and that was the last time I drove for almost 0:18:27.440 --> 0:18:31.960 six seven months. It yeah, but I wouldn't leave the house. 0:18:33.119 --> 0:18:35.439 I would no longer go to dinner. I could not 0:18:35.560 --> 0:18:39.680 even have people for dinner. We tried that, and it's 0:18:39.800 --> 0:18:46.240 really horrible to feel it. One as as fairly fiercely 0:18:46.320 --> 0:18:49.080 as I did during those years, you know, and not 0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:53.199 know what it was. It's like something just completely shuts 0:18:53.240 --> 0:18:56.960 down within you and you have to relearn everything. I 0:18:57.000 --> 0:19:01.880 had to relearn to drive, and for any years I 0:19:01.920 --> 0:19:06.960 would not go through the tunnels at Malibu. Everything used 0:19:06.960 --> 0:19:09.240 to make me nervous, like the glass going to open 0:19:09.280 --> 0:19:11.800 the door, or where do I stepped over the door. 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:16.000 Everything became a big job to figure out. How to 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:18.720 do you live with the dry mouth all the time. 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:22.359 You're very shaky, You're just so exhausted all the time. 0:19:22.840 --> 0:19:25.480 How were you able to manage that? We had heard 0:19:25.480 --> 0:19:29.680 about the center. It just helps people with anxieties and 0:19:29.880 --> 0:19:34.240 panic attacks. And I did my six months and learned 0:19:34.280 --> 0:19:39.080 how to redrive everything else I had to do. And 0:19:39.160 --> 0:19:41.480 I was really scared because I didn't want to tell 0:19:41.520 --> 0:19:44.879 anybody in my work what was happening. It's got to 0:19:44.920 --> 0:19:48.640 be a really hard way to exist, yeah, because you're 0:19:48.680 --> 0:19:52.160 not really living your life. We actually have a family 0:19:52.200 --> 0:19:57.639 member who I think probably suffers from a form of agoraphobia, 0:19:58.560 --> 0:20:01.920 and we never do that. We didn't understand. I didn't 0:20:02.000 --> 0:20:05.880 understand her behavior or lack thereof, Like she wouldn't come 0:20:05.920 --> 0:20:08.399 out and come around, and we kind of took it 0:20:08.480 --> 0:20:11.199 personally that she didn't want to be with us, and 0:20:11.320 --> 0:20:13.600 people do take it personally she doesn't want to come 0:20:13.600 --> 0:20:16.080 to the dinner again, or she doesn't want to do this, 0:20:16.160 --> 0:20:20.000 and people don't understand these things. So when you really 0:20:20.320 --> 0:20:24.479 feel like you're in it alone, it is a horrible feeling. 0:20:24.680 --> 0:20:27.040 It's always had to stigma on it about people just 0:20:27.040 --> 0:20:30.200 think you're that's it, and people try to take you down. 0:20:30.359 --> 0:20:32.840 She's nuts, don't get near her, don't deal with her. 0:20:33.240 --> 0:20:36.840 Everybody thinks I'm a hermit. It is hurt, horrible, and 0:20:36.920 --> 0:20:41.040 it flows from one generation to another. It does. But 0:20:41.160 --> 0:20:43.560 I tell you, Ireland has been a great teacher and 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:46.880 a great healer for me. For me, she has no 0:20:46.920 --> 0:20:50.080 idea what she's done for me in my life to 0:20:50.280 --> 0:20:54.280 battle this. She's brought me out of my shell. Kim, 0:20:54.320 --> 0:20:58.480 how did you feel when you saw that Ireland was 0:20:59.440 --> 0:21:06.080 also suffering from anxiety? What did that bring up for you? Oh? 0:21:06.960 --> 0:21:11.160 You you have no idea. When she started twisting her hands, 0:21:11.160 --> 0:21:14.040 because my mother always put her hand over my hands becrise, 0:21:14.080 --> 0:21:16.120 I would twist my hands my whole life to see 0:21:16.200 --> 0:21:20.080 her hurt. It used to hurt me worse than anything 0:21:20.160 --> 0:21:24.879 probably could. There's no description. Really we went through a 0:21:24.920 --> 0:21:27.840 heavy duty, very out loud when you're in the public 0:21:27.920 --> 0:21:31.280 divorce and she had to go through that very rough time. So, Kim, 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:33.440 I want to ask you. I know that co parenting 0:21:33.560 --> 0:21:38.240 can be really listened. Parenting can be difficult in Ireland 0:21:38.280 --> 0:21:42.840 having the anxiety issues that that she's had. Was that 0:21:42.920 --> 0:21:47.320 a difficult process with Alec or were you guys able 0:21:47.400 --> 0:21:50.119 to kind of see eye to eye on how to 0:21:50.200 --> 0:21:56.640 handle it eye to I uh no, you know that 0:21:56.760 --> 0:22:00.600 was not Alex if anyone, um, you know, we were 0:22:00.600 --> 0:22:03.720 all fine, we all get alone whatever. But he's been 0:22:03.800 --> 0:22:06.600 but he's a challenge. I mean, come on, we've had 0:22:06.600 --> 0:22:11.480 our challenges, and I don't think Alec was emotionally or 0:22:11.600 --> 0:22:17.000 mentally available for that kind of talk. Um. Alec, you know, 0:22:17.119 --> 0:22:20.480 operates in a very different way in his life. He 0:22:20.560 --> 0:22:25.200 deals with anxiety greatly, but he's someone who grew up 0:22:25.320 --> 0:22:28.720 in a family that would suppress that as well or 0:22:28.800 --> 0:22:34.640 tell him he's weak feeling that. Yeah, yeah, there's things 0:22:34.680 --> 0:22:37.080 I would go to my father for. But if I 0:22:37.160 --> 0:22:41.680 ever even tried to have this conversation in any way 0:22:41.720 --> 0:22:43.359 with him, I don't think he would be able to 0:22:43.400 --> 0:22:46.800 really absorb any of it, you know, or understand an 0:22:47.200 --> 0:22:49.680 He can't really sympathize as much with it. But it's 0:22:49.680 --> 0:22:53.760 not his fault and he's gotten way better. I think 0:22:53.760 --> 0:22:57.760 he really suppressed his anxiety. Like up until pretty recently, 0:22:57.800 --> 0:23:00.280 he's really been dealing with things that kind of have 0:23:00.440 --> 0:23:04.160 been thrown at him. He's been forced to finally deal 0:23:04.320 --> 0:23:07.600 with these things. That's what God does to us, makes it, 0:23:07.680 --> 0:23:10.520 you know, in a position that we can no longer 0:23:10.640 --> 0:23:13.720 run with you. It took me a long time to 0:23:13.880 --> 0:23:22.640 understand Willow, it really did it. I mean, just her anxiety. 0:23:22.960 --> 0:23:28.760 I had a very difficult time relating because two things, 0:23:29.080 --> 0:23:32.000 her lifestyle and how she was brought up very different 0:23:32.000 --> 0:23:34.240 than mine. I don't know what it's like to be 0:23:34.320 --> 0:23:38.400 a child under hot lights, and then just really not 0:23:38.560 --> 0:23:43.439 knowing how to comfort her, not knowing what help she needed, 0:23:43.600 --> 0:23:50.040 not understanding the behavior. Even though I used to chew 0:23:50.160 --> 0:23:58.080 my fingernails down to yeah and cuticles, I'll still go 0:23:58.160 --> 0:24:00.320 at him a little bit. But they didn't say that 0:24:00.320 --> 0:24:02.920 that was anxiety. Oh my god, I was a nail biter, 0:24:03.119 --> 0:24:06.840 that's right, right. I never identified it as an anxiety 0:24:07.119 --> 0:24:09.800 one thing I would say, and having to deal with 0:24:10.320 --> 0:24:14.080 and learn about her anxiety. I've had to look at 0:24:14.240 --> 0:24:17.600 some of my own behaviors and then behaviors of my 0:24:17.640 --> 0:24:20.280 mother and go, well, of course I probably would have 0:24:20.320 --> 0:24:22.960