WEBVTT - What is weak hypercharge?

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<v Speaker 1>The universe is beautiful and amazing and strange and confusing,

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<v Speaker 1>and we struggle sometimes or a lot of times, to

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<v Speaker 1>make sense of it. One reason is that we have

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<v Speaker 1>a limited vocabulary to explain it to ourselves, not just

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<v Speaker 1>limited to the words that we choose, but the concepts

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<v Speaker 1>that we find familiar, the things we accept as explanations.

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<v Speaker 1>Most of physics is about explaining the weird, bonkers rules

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<v Speaker 1>of our universe in terms that do make sense to us,

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<v Speaker 1>like eating some new, weird fruit nobody's ever tasted before,

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<v Speaker 1>and then describing it in terms of familiar childhood staples.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a little bit like an orange, but with hints

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<v Speaker 1>of cherry and BlackBerry. That's what we try to do.

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<v Speaker 1>For example, with photons, we say, oh, they're kind of

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<v Speaker 1>like waves, they're kind of like particles, even though we

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<v Speaker 1>know that neither of those fully capture the alien of

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<v Speaker 1>the photon. But today's episode isn't about oranges or about photons,

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<v Speaker 1>at least not directly. We're going to dig into another

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<v Speaker 1>basic concept and try to understand what it really is.

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<v Speaker 1>Electric charge. What is it? Where is it? Why do

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<v Speaker 1>some particles have it? Why do some have more than others?

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<v Speaker 1>How is it connected to electric forces? And once we

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<v Speaker 1>have something of a handle on that, we're going to

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<v Speaker 1>see if we can extend it to something less familiar,

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<v Speaker 1>the weak force. How do charges work for those other forces?

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<v Speaker 1>And why, oh why did physicists call the charge for

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<v Speaker 1>the weak force hypercharge? Is it weak or is it hyper?

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<v Speaker 1>Make up your minds, physicists. Welcome to Daniel and Kelly's

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<v Speaker 1>hyper Extraordinary Universe.

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<v Speaker 2>Hello, what smith? I am a parasitologist and weak hypercharge

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<v Speaker 2>is a phrase that makes really no sense to me.

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<v Speaker 1>Huh. I'm Daniel Watson. I'm a particle physicist, and so

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<v Speaker 1>I should understand weak hypercharge, but it still gets scrambled

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<v Speaker 1>up in my head.

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<v Speaker 2>Well that's all right, we're going to clear it all

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<v Speaker 2>up today. And so you and I are very well

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<v Speaker 2>organized people, so we record our episodes a few months

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<v Speaker 2>before they actually come out. So for you and I,

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<v Speaker 2>it actually has recently become the new year, So welcome

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<v Speaker 2>to twenty twenty five. Do you believe in resolutions?

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<v Speaker 1>I believe in self improvement. You know, I think people

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<v Speaker 1>can take positive steps to change their life. I'm not

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<v Speaker 1>one of those naysayers who says people never change, because

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<v Speaker 1>my life has changed significantly in various ways over the years.

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<v Speaker 1>So yeah, I think it's good for people to have introspection,

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<v Speaker 1>think about their life, think about how it could change

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<v Speaker 1>in the new year, especially when you're reaching out to

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<v Speaker 1>folks who are in your community or used to be

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<v Speaker 1>in your community. You know, personal connection is the thing

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<v Speaker 1>that makes life wonderful. So reach out to somebody you

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<v Speaker 1>haven't talked to in a while and make that connection again.

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<v Speaker 2>That is a way deeper answer than I was expecting. Like, so,

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<v Speaker 2>my resolutions aren't usually like think about how you could

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<v Speaker 2>improve your personality and do something better, or reach out

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<v Speaker 2>to an old friend. It's like, I want to get

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<v Speaker 2>done this five resolution. I want two little baby ducks.

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<v Speaker 1>That's not a resolution, that's a wish list.

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<v Speaker 2>I resolved to build their habitat and make time in

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<v Speaker 2>my life for you know, a happy, relaxing pens.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to improve myself by adding ducks.

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<v Speaker 2>Hell, that will make me happy. That's a happiness improver.

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<v Speaker 2>Getting baby ducks and renovating my kitchen. Those are my

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<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty five I guess they're goals now instead of resolutions.

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<v Speaker 2>Do you have a resolution you want to share, then

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<v Speaker 2>or a goal.

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<v Speaker 1>I do have a resolution for the year, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>about the podcast and its response to an email I

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<v Speaker 1>got on January first at eight am, where somebody wrote

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<v Speaker 1>in and says Happy New Year. Unfortunately, I can't listen

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<v Speaker 1>to the show anymore because of the perpetual giggling, which

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<v Speaker 1>of course just made me giggle. And I thought to myself, man,

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<v Speaker 1>who doesn't like a podcast with giggling in it? And

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<v Speaker 1>so this year, I'm gonna lean into the giggling.

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<v Speaker 2>I resolve to giggle with you a lot over we

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<v Speaker 2>hypercharges and strong forces and all sorts of other things.

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<v Speaker 2>We're gonna have a blest.

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<v Speaker 1>But it made me wonder about giggling, because you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I have a bit of a deeper voice, and I've

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<v Speaker 1>always thought myself as more of a chuckler than a giggler.

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<v Speaker 1>And so I don't know, what are your thoughts, where's

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<v Speaker 1>the distinction between giggling and chuckling.

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<v Speaker 2>After we record an episode, our editor does the editing,

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<v Speaker 2>he sends it to us. We listened to it to

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<v Speaker 2>make sure we didn't get anything wrong, and I was

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<v Speaker 2>listening to my laugh and I was like, I've got

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<v Speaker 2>a really like sort of obnoxious, dude ish kind of laugh,

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<v Speaker 2>But I don't care. It's unique. I'm happy and that's

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<v Speaker 2>all I care about.

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<v Speaker 1>Your laugh is not obnoxious. It's expressive. You know, you

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<v Speaker 1>are really showing us how funny you think something is.

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<v Speaker 1>It's very it's very New Jersey also though it is.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, well I was born in New Jersey and

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<v Speaker 2>am proud of that. Yeah. I don't hold back it.

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<v Speaker 2>So I don't feel like either one of us do

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<v Speaker 2>what I would call giggling. But whatever, we're having fun

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<v Speaker 2>and let's resolve to lean into it absolutely.

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<v Speaker 1>And I think a key to understanding difficult concepts is

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<v Speaker 1>to giggle a little bit, right. You can't just always

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<v Speaker 1>go deep on these concepts. You got to lighten the

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<v Speaker 1>mood a little bit. That's kind of our brand, right, Like,

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<v Speaker 1>make a few mom jokes along the way, throwing a

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<v Speaker 1>few dad ponds, keep it light as we go deep

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<v Speaker 1>on the topics.

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<v Speaker 2>A couple jokes about Urinus.

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<v Speaker 1>So hey, if you're here to learn some deep concepts

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<v Speaker 1>about the universe and you are allergic to giggling, you

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<v Speaker 1>might have found the wrong podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>Sorry, there's got to be something else out there for you.

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<v Speaker 1>But we are going to go deep into topics, and

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<v Speaker 1>especially today, we're going to dig into one of my

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<v Speaker 1>favorite concepts in physics, not just because it tells you

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<v Speaker 1>something about how the universe works, but it shows you

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<v Speaker 1>the mechanics of how physics as a field struggles with

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<v Speaker 1>try to grapple with something alien. How we start from

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<v Speaker 1>intuitive concepts and we build this precarious scaffolding to help

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<v Speaker 1>us understand something even weird or and translate it back

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<v Speaker 1>into something we might be able to make sense of.

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<v Speaker 2>And I'm super excited today because you sent me the

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<v Speaker 2>outline for this topic and there's a bunch of things

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<v Speaker 2>when I was reading it through that made me think,

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<v Speaker 2>oh gosh, I thought I knew the difference between like

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<v Speaker 2>charge and force, but maybe I really don't. And I

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<v Speaker 2>think a bunch of that's going to get cleared up today,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm glad that I'll be giggling along the way.

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<v Speaker 2>And you know what's good for giggles.

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<v Speaker 1>What's good for giggles, Kelly.

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<v Speaker 2>The hilarious answers we get from our audience. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>we get lots of great, serious answers, but we also

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<v Speaker 2>usually get some pretty funny ones when folks don't know

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<v Speaker 2>what it is. So let's go ahead and giggle at

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<v Speaker 2>lots of amazing answers.

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<v Speaker 1>So today we're talking about electric charge and the weak fours,

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<v Speaker 1>and specifically weak hypercharge. So I went out there to

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<v Speaker 1>our volunteers and I asked them if they knew what

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<v Speaker 1>weak hypercharge was. Think about it for yourself. Do you

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<v Speaker 1>know what a weak hypercharge is? Here's what audience members

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<v Speaker 1>had to say, All right, sort of.

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<v Speaker 3>A permeter of property. It might even be a mathematical

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<v Speaker 3>concept to describe the weak force. The week hypercharge is

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<v Speaker 3>the value assigned to a particle participant.

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<v Speaker 4>It's either some extortionate tax imposed by a cowardly government,

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<v Speaker 4>or it's something associated with the weak field, which mirrors

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<v Speaker 4>the electric charge in the electromagnetic field.

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<v Speaker 1>Hypercharge combinds with isospin to somehow give a charge under

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<v Speaker 1>the electro weak force.

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<v Speaker 3>A charge state of the weak force.

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<v Speaker 1>I have no idea weaknd hyper sounds like my childhood Nope,

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<v Speaker 1>it's related to.

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<v Speaker 3>Quantum physics.

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<v Speaker 1>I have no idea what the hypercharge part would be

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<v Speaker 1>and how I would tie it to the weak force.

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<v Speaker 1>The weak hypercharge is the charge of the weak force.

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<v Speaker 3>Encapsulates a particles in some particular force along with its

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<v Speaker 3>spin and maybe mother information. I don't know what the

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<v Speaker 3>weak Harper charge is, but it sounds like there's a

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<v Speaker 3>stronger version of it somewhere.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, that's pretty easy. That's when you try to do

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<v Speaker 1>a hypercharge CAU and it's so weak it doesn't really.

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<v Speaker 3>Charge a single factor that enumerates both like a particle's

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<v Speaker 3>electric charge. It's weak charge and I don't know it's magnetic.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, So I chuckled at sounds like my childhood

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<v Speaker 2>and the one about attacks put on by a cowardly

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<v Speaker 2>governmental agency. So thank you everyone for the giggles and

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<v Speaker 2>the serious answers as well.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, and some of these serious answers are right on

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<v Speaker 1>the money, so I was really impressed.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I'm not surprised.

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<v Speaker 1>We have a brilliant and good looking too. Wow, that's right.

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<v Speaker 2>That's what I think. It's called the halo effect. When

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<v Speaker 2>somebody is good at one thing and then you just

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<v Speaker 2>assume they're good at everything else. They're probably also like

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<v Speaker 2>fits and fast.

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<v Speaker 1>They smell good.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, way to go, guys. All right, so let's start

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<v Speaker 2>like super back at the beginning. Let's make sure we're

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<v Speaker 2>all on the same page. With just even what is charge?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Oh wow, I'm supposed to answer that question. Whate'relie physicists?

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<v Speaker 2>Yea, what is charge?

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<v Speaker 1>So yeah, let's begin with charge, and let's just talk

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<v Speaker 1>about charge descriptively first before we get into the philosophy

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<v Speaker 1>of like what is it? Man? We know that electrons

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<v Speaker 1>have negative charge, Protons have positive charge, right, electrons or

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<v Speaker 1>minus one protons or plus one. So already we know

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<v Speaker 1>something about charge, which is that it's associated with the

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<v Speaker 1>number line. Right, it's a number. It can be zero,

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<v Speaker 1>it can be positive, it can be negative, right, It

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<v Speaker 1>also can be fractional. Quarks have two thirds of a

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<v Speaker 1>charge or minus one third of a charge, so it's

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<v Speaker 1>not an integer, right, So it's associated with the real

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<v Speaker 1>number line. We don't know if they're rational or irrational charges.

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<v Speaker 1>We've only ever seen fractional charges. But this tells us

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<v Speaker 1>something that charge lies along this spectrum. It's important to

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<v Speaker 1>keep that in mind because later on, when we get

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<v Speaker 1>to the week four the strong force, that's no longer true.

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<v Speaker 1>But let's stay on the safe ground of electricity. Particles

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<v Speaker 1>have this thing we call charge. It can be positive,

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<v Speaker 1>it can be negative, and there are mirrored versions of

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<v Speaker 1>it like there's the electron that has negative one charge,

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<v Speaker 1>and then there's another particle, the anti particle of the electron,

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<v Speaker 1>which is a version of it with positive charge. We

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<v Speaker 1>call that the positron. And every particle we've observed that

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<v Speaker 1>has a charge, there's also a partner particle that has

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<v Speaker 1>the opposite charge. The anti matter version of it has

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<v Speaker 1>the opposite charge. So a cork might have one third charge,

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<v Speaker 1>but the anti cork would have minus one third.

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<v Speaker 2>For example, I'm thinking of like a number line, and

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<v Speaker 2>we've got electrons with negative one and we've got protons

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<v Speaker 2>with one. Are the magnitude of those charges the same

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<v Speaker 2>in the different directions? Even though electrons are smaller and

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<v Speaker 2>protons are bigger, they still have opposite charges.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, And when to put your finger on one of

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<v Speaker 1>the deepest mysteries in physics right there. Because electrons and

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<v Speaker 1>protons have opposite sign charges and exactly the same magnitude.

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<v Speaker 1>It's like electrons are minus one point zeros or zeros

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<v Speaker 1>z z is their infinite zeros and protons are plus

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<v Speaker 1>one point zero zero. And how do we know they

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<v Speaker 1>match exactly? Well, if they didn't match, you couldn't have

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<v Speaker 1>neutral atoms. Right. You use a proton and an electron

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<v Speaker 1>to make hydrogen, and then it's neutral, and it's crucial

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<v Speaker 1>that hydrogen is neutral, right, Like hydrogen gas clouds are

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<v Speaker 1>what forms most of the universe and the dynamics of

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<v Speaker 1>that and the reason they gravity can pull them together

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<v Speaker 1>to form stars is because it's neutral. Electricity, which is

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<v Speaker 1>much more powerful than gravity, has been literally neutralized because

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<v Speaker 1>these things cancel each other out. But as you say,

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<v Speaker 1>the electron is much smaller than the proton. The electron is,

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<v Speaker 1>we think fundamental, made of nothing but electron. The proton

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<v Speaker 1>is made of three quarks. Two of them have two

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<v Speaker 1>thirds charge, one of them has minus one third charge,

0:11:56.000 --> 0:12:00.080
<v Speaker 1>which add up to plus one. Why is that? Why

0:12:00.080 --> 0:12:03.679
<v Speaker 1>does the electron exactly balance this combination of quarks. Why

0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:06.320
<v Speaker 1>isn't it like off by a little bit, Because in

0:12:06.360 --> 0:12:10.600
<v Speaker 1>our theory those are just two different numbers, like there

0:12:10.600 --> 0:12:13.320
<v Speaker 1>are parameters in our theories, knobs that you could change,

0:12:13.320 --> 0:12:16.200
<v Speaker 1>and we think still have a valid universe, but a

0:12:16.280 --> 0:12:19.600
<v Speaker 1>very different universe. We don't know why these two knobs

0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:22.720
<v Speaker 1>happen to be set in exactly the way, so that

0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:25.440
<v Speaker 1>the charge of the proton and the charge of the

0:12:25.440 --> 0:12:28.680
<v Speaker 1>electron balance. It's like if I asked you to pick

0:12:28.960 --> 0:12:32.640
<v Speaker 1>two random numbers between zero and a zillion and you

0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:36.480
<v Speaker 1>picked the same number twice, or the number and its opposite, Like,

0:12:36.559 --> 0:12:39.560
<v Speaker 1>what are the chances of that? So it's a screaming

0:12:39.640 --> 0:12:42.640
<v Speaker 1>clue that there's a deep connection between the quarks and

0:12:42.679 --> 0:12:44.920
<v Speaker 1>the electrons, but we don't know what it is.

0:12:45.320 --> 0:12:50.160
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So a positron is an electron with a positive charge,

0:12:50.880 --> 0:12:54.719
<v Speaker 2>and that positive charge is that positive charge now plus one,

0:12:54.840 --> 0:12:57.319
<v Speaker 2>like the same quantity of charges a proton. Yes, you're

0:12:57.320 --> 0:13:01.360
<v Speaker 2>shaking your head exactly, but it's not done with that's right, right.

0:13:01.640 --> 0:13:04.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So an electron doesn't switch its charge to become

0:13:04.520 --> 0:13:08.120
<v Speaker 1>a positron. The universe can do two things. The universe

0:13:08.120 --> 0:13:12.280
<v Speaker 1>can make electrons. The universe can also make positrons. And remember,

0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:15.280
<v Speaker 1>electrons are ripples in a field, right the way like

0:13:15.320 --> 0:13:19.760
<v Speaker 1>photons are ripple in the electromagnetic field. Electrons are also

0:13:19.840 --> 0:13:22.880
<v Speaker 1>ripples in a field. They're ripples in the electron field.

0:13:22.960 --> 0:13:25.000
<v Speaker 1>So we have two different fields that sound very similar.

0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:29.920
<v Speaker 1>Bad naming becausists the electron field and the electromagnetic field.

0:13:30.080 --> 0:13:33.080
<v Speaker 1>Ripples in the electron field are called electrons. Or it

0:13:33.120 --> 0:13:35.680
<v Speaker 1>turns out that same field, not a different field. The

0:13:35.679 --> 0:13:39.160
<v Speaker 1>same field can ripple in another way, and that way

0:13:39.440 --> 0:13:42.240
<v Speaker 1>is a positron. So the electron field can ripple to

0:13:42.280 --> 0:13:46.560
<v Speaker 1>make electrons, or can ripple slightly differently to make positrons.

0:13:47.040 --> 0:13:49.440
<v Speaker 1>And this is something to Rack noticed years and years

0:13:49.440 --> 0:13:51.120
<v Speaker 1>and years ago when he was looking at the math

0:13:51.480 --> 0:13:54.320
<v Speaker 1>for electrons in field theory. He was like, hmm, if

0:13:54.320 --> 0:13:57.040
<v Speaker 1>the universe can do this, why can't it also do that?

0:13:57.120 --> 0:13:59.240
<v Speaker 1>In fact, I predict that it does. Then a couple

0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:02.760
<v Speaker 1>of years later, boom, we found positrons. So you're right,

0:14:02.800 --> 0:14:06.360
<v Speaker 1>positrons have the same electric charge as protons, but they're

0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:10.760
<v Speaker 1>fundamentally very different. Positrons, we think, are fundamental particles ripples

0:14:10.800 --> 0:14:13.360
<v Speaker 1>in the electron field that are different from the way

0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:17.720
<v Speaker 1>electrons make that field ripple, and protons are a combination

0:14:17.840 --> 0:14:20.200
<v Speaker 1>of three quarks, each of which is a ripple in

0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:21.040
<v Speaker 1>its own field.

0:14:21.360 --> 0:14:23.440
<v Speaker 2>Okay, all right, so this is.

0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:25.760
<v Speaker 1>All descriptive, right, we're talking about what we've seen in

0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:28.360
<v Speaker 1>the universe. We've seen this charge, we've seen that charge,

0:14:28.680 --> 0:14:31.480
<v Speaker 1>and explaining in terms of fields makes us wonder like, well,

0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:35.160
<v Speaker 1>what is this thing anyway? Like, why is it that

0:14:35.240 --> 0:14:38.440
<v Speaker 1>some fields have charge, Like the electron field when it ripples,

0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:42.360
<v Speaker 1>it has a charged particle, but when the photon field ripples,

0:14:42.400 --> 0:14:45.480
<v Speaker 1>it doesn't have a charge, Like photons aren't neutral, right,

0:14:45.560 --> 0:14:50.080
<v Speaker 1>So makes us wonder like what is charge anyway? Fundamentally?

0:14:50.320 --> 0:14:51.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, go on, what's the answer?

0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:55.720
<v Speaker 1>I was curious because I was like, is that just me?

0:14:56.000 --> 0:14:59.640
<v Speaker 1>Like interested in philosophy and physics? Is a biologist like, well,

0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:01.160
<v Speaker 1>we just grind it and we've given it a name.

0:15:01.200 --> 0:15:01.960
<v Speaker 1>So let's move on.

0:15:03.360 --> 0:15:05.560
<v Speaker 2>No, no, I following you. Let's go down the rabbit hole.

0:15:05.640 --> 0:15:07.040
<v Speaker 2>Let's go one more level of why.

0:15:07.600 --> 0:15:10.680
<v Speaker 1>And so we don't fundamentally know what charge is, but

0:15:10.720 --> 0:15:13.400
<v Speaker 1>we have a bunch of interesting clues. And when I

0:15:13.480 --> 0:15:15.520
<v Speaker 1>was growing up thinking and learning about charge, I used

0:15:15.520 --> 0:15:19.280
<v Speaker 1>to think about charge as a property of a particle

0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:22.160
<v Speaker 1>that could be like removed from it, you know, or

0:15:22.200 --> 0:15:25.040
<v Speaker 1>it's like a description of how the particle is. You know,

0:15:25.160 --> 0:15:27.440
<v Speaker 1>Like if you paint something red, Okay, now it's red,

0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:29.560
<v Speaker 1>but you could also paint it blue and it's still

0:15:29.560 --> 0:15:31.360
<v Speaker 1>the same thing. Right, Like you take an apple and

0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:33.720
<v Speaker 1>it's red, you paint a blue. It's blue now, but

0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:37.000
<v Speaker 1>it's still an apple, right? Or is it a fundamental

0:15:37.120 --> 0:15:39.680
<v Speaker 1>part of the thing that helps define what it is.

0:15:39.680 --> 0:15:41.440
<v Speaker 1>Is it something that you can take off of it,

0:15:41.480 --> 0:15:43.680
<v Speaker 1>like you can peel an apple and then you still

0:15:43.720 --> 0:15:46.040
<v Speaker 1>have an apple, right even though it's peeled. Can you

0:15:46.080 --> 0:15:49.400
<v Speaker 1>take an electron and remove the charge from it and

0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:54.080
<v Speaker 1>have like an peeled electron an uncharged electron, you know?

0:15:54.200 --> 0:15:57.560
<v Speaker 1>Or is the charge fundamentally part of the electron? This

0:15:57.600 --> 0:15:59.440
<v Speaker 1>is something I was always wondering about as I was

0:15:59.480 --> 0:16:02.920
<v Speaker 1>learning about particle physics as a kid, and it's not

0:16:03.000 --> 0:16:05.920
<v Speaker 1>something we have a solid answer for, but thinking about

0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:08.800
<v Speaker 1>it in terms of fields helps. And so let's go

0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:11.840
<v Speaker 1>back to thinking about particles in terms of ripples of fields,

0:16:12.000 --> 0:16:13.800
<v Speaker 1>and I'll show you the role the charge plays in

0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:16.160
<v Speaker 1>the field picture and it gives you a very different

0:16:16.240 --> 0:16:18.760
<v Speaker 1>feel for what charge is fundamentally.

0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:20.960
<v Speaker 2>My first thought was, Okay, is charge going to be

0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:23.960
<v Speaker 2>just like an arbitrary thing that humans use in our

0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:27.560
<v Speaker 2>definition for an electron, like charge in mass or is

0:16:27.560 --> 0:16:29.920
<v Speaker 2>it going to be like do you use the example

0:16:29.920 --> 0:16:32.320
<v Speaker 2>of painting it red or blue? And that doesn't change

0:16:32.320 --> 0:16:34.520
<v Speaker 2>anything fundamental about it. But I think the fact that

0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:37.880
<v Speaker 2>when you change the charge and you get like a positron,

0:16:37.880 --> 0:16:41.000
<v Speaker 2>but they annihilate each other. They're behaving totally different, and

0:16:41.040 --> 0:16:43.360
<v Speaker 2>so that feels different than just painting it red or blue.

0:16:44.000 --> 0:16:46.280
<v Speaker 2>But okay, now let's talk about fields and see if

0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:47.080
<v Speaker 2>we can dig into that.

0:16:47.040 --> 0:16:50.080
<v Speaker 1>Deeper, because the field's picture of physics is going to

0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:52.640
<v Speaker 1>tell us that charge is not a property of particles.

0:16:52.960 --> 0:16:56.080
<v Speaker 1>It's actually a relationship between fields.

0:16:56.360 --> 0:16:59.480
<v Speaker 2>I should have seen that coming. The field's always throw

0:16:59.520 --> 0:16:59.800
<v Speaker 2>me off.

0:17:00.640 --> 0:17:02.720
<v Speaker 1>So remember in the field picture, we still have particles.

0:17:02.760 --> 0:17:05.200
<v Speaker 1>There are things we call particles. We have a different

0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:07.320
<v Speaker 1>mental image for what they are. They're not little bits

0:17:07.320 --> 0:17:09.840
<v Speaker 1>of stuff. There are ripples in these fields, and these

0:17:09.880 --> 0:17:13.480
<v Speaker 1>fields fill the universe, and sometimes these fields can interact

0:17:13.560 --> 0:17:16.639
<v Speaker 1>with each other. So now let's talk about forces. What

0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:19.600
<v Speaker 1>happens to an electron when it's flying through space and

0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:23.600
<v Speaker 1>it encounters an electric field, Well, it accelerates, either it

0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:25.080
<v Speaker 1>slows it down or it speeds it up, but it

0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:28.400
<v Speaker 1>changes its velocity. That's what an electric field is. That's

0:17:28.400 --> 0:17:31.600
<v Speaker 1>what electric field does, right, And that means that there's

0:17:31.600 --> 0:17:33.720
<v Speaker 1>a force on it. You accelerate something, you have to

0:17:33.720 --> 0:17:35.600
<v Speaker 1>put a force on it. That's f equals ma A.

0:17:36.200 --> 0:17:38.920
<v Speaker 1>But a neutral particle like a neutrino flying through the

0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:42.520
<v Speaker 1>same electric field totally ignores it. Right, it will fly

0:17:42.640 --> 0:17:45.600
<v Speaker 1>right through. It has no charge, and it ignores the

0:17:45.640 --> 0:17:48.280
<v Speaker 1>electric field. Yeah, it's there, but it doesn't interact with

0:17:48.320 --> 0:17:51.080
<v Speaker 1>it. It doesn't matter to It does not accelerate the neutrino.

0:17:51.640 --> 0:17:54.160
<v Speaker 1>So you shoot an electron to an electric field, it accelerates.

0:17:54.520 --> 0:17:57.960
<v Speaker 1>You shoot a neutral particle through electric field, nothing happens.

0:17:58.160 --> 0:18:02.560
<v Speaker 2>So electric fields exert force on electrons, but electric fields

0:18:02.560 --> 0:18:05.159
<v Speaker 2>don't exert force on neutrons exactly.

0:18:05.560 --> 0:18:09.160
<v Speaker 1>Electric fields exert force on any particles with charge.

0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:09.679
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:11.679
<v Speaker 1>And you might think, okay, well that's a useful way

0:18:11.760 --> 0:18:14.720
<v Speaker 1>to describe what an electric field does. It's actually a

0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:18.760
<v Speaker 1>description of what charge is. Charge is a label we

0:18:18.840 --> 0:18:21.800
<v Speaker 1>put on particles that are accelerated by electric fields.

0:18:23.119 --> 0:18:25.280
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So charge is the ability to be sped up

0:18:25.400 --> 0:18:27.399
<v Speaker 2>or slowed down. Can you get slowed down by an

0:18:27.440 --> 0:18:28.200
<v Speaker 2>electric field too?

0:18:28.280 --> 0:18:30.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Absolutely, you can get slowed down. Yeah, if you

0:18:30.280 --> 0:18:33.040
<v Speaker 1>flip the direction of it. So charge is a label

0:18:33.080 --> 0:18:35.119
<v Speaker 1>we put on it. Like let's say I give you

0:18:35.160 --> 0:18:37.120
<v Speaker 1>an electric field and they give you a bunch of particles.

0:18:37.160 --> 0:18:39.399
<v Speaker 1>I don't tell you anything about them. You throw them

0:18:39.440 --> 0:18:42.080
<v Speaker 1>all into an electric field. Some of them slow down,

0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:44.920
<v Speaker 1>some of them don't. The ones that slow down, you say, oh,

0:18:45.200 --> 0:18:47.960
<v Speaker 1>this notices the electric field. I'm gonna put a label

0:18:48.000 --> 0:18:50.280
<v Speaker 1>on that one. This notices the electric field in the

0:18:50.320 --> 0:18:53.280
<v Speaker 1>opposite direction. I'm gonna put the negative label on that one.

0:18:53.400 --> 0:18:55.440
<v Speaker 1>This one, it ignores the electric field. I'm putting a

0:18:55.560 --> 0:18:59.159
<v Speaker 1>zero on that one. All right, So charge is a

0:18:59.200 --> 0:19:02.200
<v Speaker 1>label we put on on particles that sense electric fields.

0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:04.360
<v Speaker 1>So now let's go back to the fields. Picture what's

0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:07.480
<v Speaker 1>happening there. The electron is flying through space. It's a

0:19:07.560 --> 0:19:10.679
<v Speaker 1>ripple in the electron field. Now, an encounter is an

0:19:10.720 --> 0:19:14.119
<v Speaker 1>electric field, which is energy in the electromagnetic field. What

0:19:14.240 --> 0:19:16.920
<v Speaker 1>happens is those two fields are coupling with each other.

0:19:17.080 --> 0:19:22.120
<v Speaker 1>Energy is going from the electromagnetic field to the electron field. Right,

0:19:22.160 --> 0:19:26.480
<v Speaker 1>it's accelerating the electron or it's decelerating whichever, but energy

0:19:26.520 --> 0:19:29.720
<v Speaker 1>is passing. These two fields are coupling together. So instead

0:19:29.720 --> 0:19:32.600
<v Speaker 1>of just having like one field slashing through space doing

0:19:32.680 --> 0:19:35.240
<v Speaker 1>its own thing and another field slashing through space doing

0:19:35.280 --> 0:19:38.199
<v Speaker 1>its own thing, think of them as like tied together. Right,

0:19:38.240 --> 0:19:42.080
<v Speaker 1>there's a connection between them. It's like having two guitar strings.

0:19:42.240 --> 0:19:44.720
<v Speaker 1>But now you have like a rubber band connecting them.

0:19:44.880 --> 0:19:47.320
<v Speaker 1>So when one oscillates, the other one's gonna oscillate. Also,

0:19:48.000 --> 0:19:52.119
<v Speaker 1>that's what charge is. Charge is a coupling between two

0:19:52.359 --> 0:19:57.000
<v Speaker 1>fields for two different fundamental particles. So when the electron

0:19:57.080 --> 0:19:59.960
<v Speaker 1>moves through space, it makes ripples in the electromagnetic field,

0:20:00.800 --> 0:20:03.240
<v Speaker 1>and if there's a field there, it pushes on the electron.

0:20:03.280 --> 0:20:07.840
<v Speaker 1>It slashes back and forth between electrons and the electromagnetic field,

0:20:07.960 --> 0:20:10.879
<v Speaker 1>and charge tells us how that works. If you have

0:20:10.920 --> 0:20:13.520
<v Speaker 1>a zero, then there's no coupling. If you have a one,

0:20:14.000 --> 0:20:15.879
<v Speaker 1>then they are coupled. If you have a mindus one,

0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:17.600
<v Speaker 1>you couple the opposite direction.

0:20:18.240 --> 0:20:22.000
<v Speaker 2>Okay, all right, so first we're talking about strings, but

0:20:22.040 --> 0:20:23.359
<v Speaker 2>it has nothing to do with string theory.

0:20:23.480 --> 0:20:26.919
<v Speaker 1>Now we talk about strings because strings follow the wave equation,

0:20:27.040 --> 0:20:29.359
<v Speaker 1>and so do the fields. The wave equation is everywhere.

0:20:29.520 --> 0:20:32.600
<v Speaker 2>Okay, great, perfect. When we're talking about electron fields, we're

0:20:32.640 --> 0:20:36.679
<v Speaker 2>talking about a bunch of electrons acting together. When we

0:20:36.720 --> 0:20:41.080
<v Speaker 2>talk about electric fields, what is an electric field made of?

0:20:41.560 --> 0:20:45.439
<v Speaker 1>Electric field is energy in the electromagnetic field, which is

0:20:45.560 --> 0:20:47.560
<v Speaker 1>just another field in the universe, the same way the

0:20:47.560 --> 0:20:52.080
<v Speaker 1>electron field is, and ripples in the field are photons, right,

0:20:52.480 --> 0:20:55.640
<v Speaker 1>And so in the particle picture, you have electrons which

0:20:55.720 --> 0:20:58.640
<v Speaker 1>shoot photons back and forth at each other, and that's

0:20:58.680 --> 0:21:01.439
<v Speaker 1>how electrons repel each other. In the field's picture, you

0:21:01.480 --> 0:21:04.879
<v Speaker 1>have ripples in the electron field which couple to the

0:21:04.920 --> 0:21:08.120
<v Speaker 1>electromagnetic field and exchange energy that way.

0:21:08.240 --> 0:21:10.600
<v Speaker 2>Okay, all right, I've caught up.

0:21:12.720 --> 0:21:15.359
<v Speaker 1>So that's another way to think about charge. Charge. Here

0:21:15.840 --> 0:21:19.480
<v Speaker 1>is a coupling between fields, right, it says this field

0:21:19.480 --> 0:21:21.560
<v Speaker 1>connects to that field. This field connects to that field.

0:21:21.600 --> 0:21:23.880
<v Speaker 1>These two fields don't connect at all. You put a zero.

0:21:24.440 --> 0:21:27.960
<v Speaker 1>So instead of thinking of charge as something attributed to

0:21:27.960 --> 0:21:30.679
<v Speaker 1>the particle, like the charge is the electrons, it's the

0:21:30.760 --> 0:21:34.160
<v Speaker 1>relationship between the electron and the photon, or the electron

0:21:34.240 --> 0:21:37.879
<v Speaker 1>field and the electromagnetic field. Are they connected? If so,

0:21:38.040 --> 0:21:40.439
<v Speaker 1>put a one. Are they anti connected or do they

0:21:40.440 --> 0:21:43.560
<v Speaker 1>ignore each other? So charge is how the fields couple.

0:21:44.280 --> 0:21:46.040
<v Speaker 1>But it might not just be our description. It might

0:21:46.080 --> 0:21:48.960
<v Speaker 1>be something important to the universe, because this is something

0:21:49.000 --> 0:21:50.360
<v Speaker 1>the universe respects.

0:21:50.880 --> 0:22:13.240
<v Speaker 2>And let's talk about RSPCT. After the break, we're back

0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:17.200
<v Speaker 2>and we're talking about fields respecting each other. And where

0:22:17.240 --> 0:22:18.080
<v Speaker 2>are we going with this?

0:22:19.400 --> 0:22:21.880
<v Speaker 1>So you might think all right, Well, if we are

0:22:22.000 --> 0:22:25.200
<v Speaker 1>just putting label on particles and it's just a relationship

0:22:25.200 --> 0:22:28.520
<v Speaker 1>between fields, then these are just numbers. We made them

0:22:28.600 --> 0:22:32.560
<v Speaker 1>up and they shouldn't have any special properties, right. But

0:22:32.640 --> 0:22:35.640
<v Speaker 1>we know that charge has a really interesting special property,

0:22:35.680 --> 0:22:38.800
<v Speaker 1>which is if you count up all the charges on

0:22:38.920 --> 0:22:41.919
<v Speaker 1>all the particles in some system and then you let

0:22:41.960 --> 0:22:44.280
<v Speaker 1>it do its thing. Let physics happened for a second,

0:22:44.359 --> 0:22:46.439
<v Speaker 1>for a billion years whatever, and you come back and

0:22:46.480 --> 0:22:48.720
<v Speaker 1>you count up all the charges again, and you might

0:22:48.760 --> 0:22:50.800
<v Speaker 1>have you know, some of the electrons are gone, and

0:22:50.880 --> 0:22:53.720
<v Speaker 1>now you've made protons or whatever. The particles have all changed,

0:22:53.960 --> 0:22:57.560
<v Speaker 1>but the total number of charge has not changed. Charge

0:22:57.600 --> 0:23:02.040
<v Speaker 1>is conserved in the universe. Every microphysical process and electron

0:23:02.200 --> 0:23:05.960
<v Speaker 1>radiates a photon, or electron and positron annihilate. None of

0:23:06.000 --> 0:23:09.040
<v Speaker 1>those violate electric charge. So you can do zillions of

0:23:09.080 --> 0:23:11.440
<v Speaker 1>them and they don't add up to any violation of

0:23:11.520 --> 0:23:15.199
<v Speaker 1>the electric charge. It's exactly conserved in the universe in

0:23:15.200 --> 0:23:19.480
<v Speaker 1>a way, very very few things are exactly conserved. And

0:23:19.520 --> 0:23:22.320
<v Speaker 1>for a physics that's like whoa, that's a big screaming

0:23:22.359 --> 0:23:25.320
<v Speaker 1>clue that this might be an important thing to the universe,

0:23:25.400 --> 0:23:26.760
<v Speaker 1>not just something we made up.

0:23:26.960 --> 0:23:29.280
<v Speaker 2>So first of all, I'm finding myself wondering if there

0:23:29.280 --> 0:23:33.360
<v Speaker 2>are more religious people in physics than there are in biology,

0:23:33.560 --> 0:23:35.800
<v Speaker 2>because the more we get into this, it feels like

0:23:35.880 --> 0:23:39.280
<v Speaker 2>something is making these things be symmetrical. Maybe you've hinted

0:23:39.320 --> 0:23:42.159
<v Speaker 2>at the fact that the universe could not be otherwise,

0:23:42.720 --> 0:23:44.600
<v Speaker 2>like when we were talking about the Big Bang and

0:23:44.680 --> 0:23:48.560
<v Speaker 2>why are there electrons and we've lost the positrons and

0:23:49.040 --> 0:23:51.800
<v Speaker 2>if we had equal numbers, everything would annihilate, there'd be nothing, right,

0:23:51.840 --> 0:23:54.640
<v Speaker 2>So this is the only thing that could have arisen

0:23:54.720 --> 0:23:57.920
<v Speaker 2>from the chaos, this symmetry. Is that the right way

0:23:57.920 --> 0:23:59.600
<v Speaker 2>to be thinking about it? Or are we going in

0:23:59.640 --> 0:24:01.320
<v Speaker 2>a different direction with this conversation.

0:24:01.600 --> 0:24:03.640
<v Speaker 1>No, this is definitely the right part of your brain

0:24:03.720 --> 0:24:07.720
<v Speaker 1>to be using here, because the whole juice of physics

0:24:07.720 --> 0:24:10.520
<v Speaker 1>for me is like, let's reveal what the rules are,

0:24:11.160 --> 0:24:13.840
<v Speaker 1>and then let's be odd that the rules are what

0:24:13.960 --> 0:24:17.240
<v Speaker 1>they are and wonder if they could have been different, right,

0:24:17.520 --> 0:24:20.879
<v Speaker 1>And my whole fantasy is that we will work hard

0:24:20.960 --> 0:24:23.919
<v Speaker 1>to unify all of our understanding of the universe and

0:24:23.960 --> 0:24:26.080
<v Speaker 1>be left with an equation and then it will be

0:24:26.119 --> 0:24:29.400
<v Speaker 1>self evident. We're like, oh, yeah, I can see how

0:24:29.440 --> 0:24:31.400
<v Speaker 1>this is the only way you could put a universe together.

0:24:31.440 --> 0:24:33.320
<v Speaker 1>There is no other way to do it. Of course,

0:24:33.320 --> 0:24:35.720
<v Speaker 1>it's got to be this way. The alternative is you

0:24:35.760 --> 0:24:38.439
<v Speaker 1>get to some equation and you're like, huh, well, I mean,

0:24:38.480 --> 0:24:40.240
<v Speaker 1>I see how that works. But you could have also

0:24:40.240 --> 0:24:42.480
<v Speaker 1>made this a six or that a nine, Like why

0:24:42.560 --> 0:24:44.200
<v Speaker 1>don't we live in that universe? Then you got a

0:24:44.200 --> 0:24:46.480
<v Speaker 1>bunch of open questions. I don't know which is going

0:24:46.560 --> 0:24:49.920
<v Speaker 1>to be the outcome. But along the way you have

0:24:50.040 --> 0:24:54.159
<v Speaker 1>these moments where something emerges from the math that you

0:24:54.200 --> 0:24:56.840
<v Speaker 1>didn't build in. Right. You didn't say I'm going to

0:24:56.880 --> 0:24:59.880
<v Speaker 1>create this concept of charge and I'm going to insist

0:25:00.080 --> 0:25:03.560
<v Speaker 1>that it's conserved. You just discover that, right. It's like

0:25:03.600 --> 0:25:06.680
<v Speaker 1>it comes out in our experiments. We notice that charge

0:25:06.680 --> 0:25:09.760
<v Speaker 1>is concerved, and then we also see it in the mathematics,

0:25:09.800 --> 0:25:12.680
<v Speaker 1>and that seems like ooh. You are digging deep into

0:25:12.680 --> 0:25:15.359
<v Speaker 1>the firmament of the universe and you clanged onto something

0:25:15.440 --> 0:25:18.240
<v Speaker 1>hard and you're like, whoa, there's something here. Let's dig

0:25:18.280 --> 0:25:20.639
<v Speaker 1>out this corner and see what this is. And it

0:25:20.680 --> 0:25:24.080
<v Speaker 1>turns out there is a really interesting, very very deep

0:25:24.160 --> 0:25:28.320
<v Speaker 1>realization here which I don't think has penetrated nearly enough

0:25:28.359 --> 0:25:30.960
<v Speaker 1>into like the broader culture of what it means for

0:25:31.040 --> 0:25:34.520
<v Speaker 1>something to be conserved. And it also connects to our

0:25:34.640 --> 0:25:38.880
<v Speaker 1>goal of uplifting overlooked women who've contributed to science, because

0:25:38.880 --> 0:25:41.520
<v Speaker 1>there's a very influential theorem from the mind of Emmy Nuther.

0:25:41.880 --> 0:25:45.480
<v Speaker 1>She was a mathematician working around the same time as Einstein,

0:25:45.800 --> 0:25:48.399
<v Speaker 1>and she just like dabbled occasionally in physics on her

0:25:48.400 --> 0:25:53.280
<v Speaker 1>coffee breaks and came up with these incredible realizations, you know,

0:25:53.400 --> 0:25:56.399
<v Speaker 1>just while gooving around before going back to real stuff

0:25:56.440 --> 0:26:00.400
<v Speaker 1>like mathematics. And her theorem tells us that every time

0:26:00.480 --> 0:26:04.240
<v Speaker 1>something is conserved in the universe, like electric charge or

0:26:04.440 --> 0:26:09.160
<v Speaker 1>momentum for example, that's because there's a symmetry in the universe,

0:26:09.240 --> 0:26:12.760
<v Speaker 1>there's something the universe respects, and so for momentum, it's

0:26:12.800 --> 0:26:16.520
<v Speaker 1>very straightforward. We have momentum conservation in the universe because

0:26:16.600 --> 0:26:20.359
<v Speaker 1>the universe doesn't care where something happens. The rules are

0:26:20.359 --> 0:26:23.440
<v Speaker 1>the same everywhere. So you set up some physics experiment,

0:26:23.800 --> 0:26:26.080
<v Speaker 1>you do it, you get an answer. If you could

0:26:26.119 --> 0:26:28.120
<v Speaker 1>set it up ten meters to the right or ten

0:26:28.200 --> 0:26:30.960
<v Speaker 1>thousand meters to the left, it shouldn't matter. The rules

0:26:30.960 --> 0:26:32.800
<v Speaker 1>of the universe should be the same no matter where

0:26:32.840 --> 0:26:36.359
<v Speaker 1>you are. There's no like absolute origin to the universe.

0:26:36.400 --> 0:26:39.080
<v Speaker 1>You can't tell where you are in the universe. That

0:26:39.160 --> 0:26:41.679
<v Speaker 1>makes sense, right, there's a symmetry there. That symmetry is

0:26:41.720 --> 0:26:45.440
<v Speaker 1>why we have conservation of momentum. So notre connected these

0:26:45.440 --> 0:26:48.440
<v Speaker 1>two ideas of symmetries and conservations. And we can do

0:26:48.480 --> 0:26:50.639
<v Speaker 1>a whole other episode where I try to explain the

0:26:50.680 --> 0:26:53.399
<v Speaker 1>mathematics of that and intuitive way, but today's episode just

0:26:53.480 --> 0:26:57.159
<v Speaker 1>accept like every symmetry means a conservation, and now we

0:26:57.200 --> 0:27:00.520
<v Speaker 1>have a conservation of something electric charge. So you're like, okay, well,

0:27:00.600 --> 0:27:03.520
<v Speaker 1>you know they're telling me, what's the symmetry, right, what

0:27:03.640 --> 0:27:07.040
<v Speaker 1>is the universe respecting here? And it turns out this

0:27:07.080 --> 0:27:11.399
<v Speaker 1>is incredible that what is respecting is some weird internal

0:27:11.920 --> 0:27:16.080
<v Speaker 1>angle that electrons have. Like when we say electrons are

0:27:16.160 --> 0:27:19.639
<v Speaker 1>ripples in the field, that's true, but the mathematics gives

0:27:19.680 --> 0:27:23.439
<v Speaker 1>us another degree of freedom, like electrons ripple through the field,

0:27:23.440 --> 0:27:25.400
<v Speaker 1>but they also have an angle to them as they go,

0:27:25.800 --> 0:27:29.520
<v Speaker 1>and this angle is mostly unimportant, like you can't measure

0:27:29.600 --> 0:27:31.960
<v Speaker 1>it doesn't matter, you can't see it, and you could

0:27:31.960 --> 0:27:33.879
<v Speaker 1>have a universe whether the electron angles are just like

0:27:33.920 --> 0:27:38.160
<v Speaker 1>willy nilly. But if you insist that the universe respects

0:27:38.200 --> 0:27:41.959
<v Speaker 1>this angle, that it's symmetric with respect to this angle,

0:27:42.119 --> 0:27:45.160
<v Speaker 1>that you can change this weird internal electron angle and

0:27:45.200 --> 0:27:47.560
<v Speaker 1>not change any of the physics the same way you

0:27:47.560 --> 0:27:51.040
<v Speaker 1>can change the location or direction of an experiment and

0:27:51.119 --> 0:27:53.560
<v Speaker 1>always get the same answer. The only way to do

0:27:53.600 --> 0:27:55.560
<v Speaker 1>it if you have electrons in the universe and you

0:27:55.640 --> 0:27:59.159
<v Speaker 1>want that symmetry preserve this weird internal angle is to

0:27:59.280 --> 0:28:03.639
<v Speaker 1>have photon. You could only preserve this symmetry, this weird

0:28:03.680 --> 0:28:06.600
<v Speaker 1>electron angle if you add photons to the universe. Electrons

0:28:06.640 --> 0:28:10.000
<v Speaker 1>can't do it by themselves, so it's sort of like

0:28:10.160 --> 0:28:13.800
<v Speaker 1>you derive the existence of photons. You're like, Okay, I

0:28:13.840 --> 0:28:16.119
<v Speaker 1>have electrons and they have charge, and they have this

0:28:16.160 --> 0:28:19.800
<v Speaker 1>weird angle inside them. If I insist for whatever reason

0:28:20.160 --> 0:28:23.480
<v Speaker 1>that this weird internal electron angle has a symmetry, that

0:28:23.520 --> 0:28:26.439
<v Speaker 1>the universe is the same if I spin that angle,

0:28:26.560 --> 0:28:29.440
<v Speaker 1>then I got to add photons. Otherwise it doesn't work.

0:28:29.640 --> 0:28:32.400
<v Speaker 1>You can like derive the existence of photons just from

0:28:32.400 --> 0:28:35.159
<v Speaker 1>this requirement. And of course we know that photons are

0:28:35.200 --> 0:28:37.520
<v Speaker 1>what do the thing that charges do right, they're there

0:28:37.600 --> 0:28:40.960
<v Speaker 1>to provide the forces. So there's this deep connection between

0:28:41.360 --> 0:28:46.080
<v Speaker 1>charge and photons and this bizarre internal angle that electrons

0:28:46.120 --> 0:28:48.720
<v Speaker 1>have and we don't quite understand it, but we know

0:28:49.440 --> 0:28:52.280
<v Speaker 1>that for some reason, the universe really wants to be

0:28:52.400 --> 0:28:56.040
<v Speaker 1>symmetric with respect to this internal angle that electrons have,

0:28:56.280 --> 0:28:59.640
<v Speaker 1>and that's why we have charge conservation in the universe.

0:29:00.040 --> 0:29:02.080
<v Speaker 1>And you have to have photons to make that whole

0:29:02.080 --> 0:29:02.520
<v Speaker 1>thing work.

0:29:02.600 --> 0:29:04.680
<v Speaker 2>All right. So first, when we were talking about symmetry,

0:29:04.960 --> 0:29:08.960
<v Speaker 2>I was thinking that positrons where the symmetrical thing with electrons,

0:29:09.320 --> 0:29:12.560
<v Speaker 2>and so that's a symmetrical thing with electrons, but there's

0:29:12.760 --> 0:29:16.560
<v Speaker 2>another symmetrical thing with electrons, which is this angle. Absolutely,

0:29:16.560 --> 0:29:18.920
<v Speaker 2>you said, we can't measure the angle, So how do

0:29:18.960 --> 0:29:19.560
<v Speaker 2>we know this?

0:29:20.000 --> 0:29:22.480
<v Speaker 1>You can't measure an electrons angle directly. It has to

0:29:22.520 --> 0:29:25.080
<v Speaker 1>do with like what fraction of its wave function is

0:29:25.160 --> 0:29:27.520
<v Speaker 1>real and what fraction is complex? And you can't measure

0:29:27.560 --> 0:29:30.840
<v Speaker 1>complex properties of an electron. But it exists and affects

0:29:30.880 --> 0:29:33.680
<v Speaker 1>how the wave function propagates, so we can make predictions

0:29:33.720 --> 0:29:37.120
<v Speaker 1>based on it in a statistical way. So you're asking, like,

0:29:37.120 --> 0:29:40.080
<v Speaker 1>how do we know this angle is real? Well, it's

0:29:40.120 --> 0:29:41.680
<v Speaker 1>sort of like asking, how do we know the wave

0:29:41.720 --> 0:29:44.840
<v Speaker 1>function is real? We can't see it directly, but it's

0:29:44.840 --> 0:29:47.720
<v Speaker 1>an important part of our model. So yeah, it's a

0:29:47.760 --> 0:29:50.600
<v Speaker 1>deep question in philosophy, like is this real? It's a

0:29:50.680 --> 0:29:54.680
<v Speaker 1>necessary component of the model which predicts the outcome of experiments,

0:29:54.680 --> 0:29:58.360
<v Speaker 1>since that makes it feel real ish. But is anything

0:29:58.400 --> 0:30:02.160
<v Speaker 1>that's complex valued act? I don't know. I mean technically

0:30:02.240 --> 0:30:04.760
<v Speaker 1>mathematicians are like, real numbers are real. Complex numbers are

0:30:04.800 --> 0:30:07.720
<v Speaker 1>not real. But I think we mean real philosophically there

0:30:07.760 --> 0:30:09.800
<v Speaker 1>So anyway, that's a long way of saying, yeah, we

0:30:09.840 --> 0:30:10.200
<v Speaker 1>don't know.

0:30:10.520 --> 0:30:12.800
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Yeah, I feel like fifty percent of the conversations

0:30:12.840 --> 0:30:15.160
<v Speaker 2>you and I have gets down to what is real,

0:30:15.560 --> 0:30:16.360
<v Speaker 2>what exists?

0:30:16.400 --> 0:30:17.040
<v Speaker 1>So I don't know.

0:30:17.440 --> 0:30:19.920
<v Speaker 2>So you could have symmetry with respect to charge and

0:30:19.960 --> 0:30:23.880
<v Speaker 2>with respect to angle. Are there other features of electrons

0:30:23.920 --> 0:30:24.720
<v Speaker 2>that have symmetries?

0:30:24.840 --> 0:30:27.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? So there are lots of these pairings from Notther's theorem.

0:30:28.120 --> 0:30:30.080
<v Speaker 1>You know. One of them is like where are you

0:30:30.120 --> 0:30:34.560
<v Speaker 1>in the universe doesn't matter? That gives you conservation and momentum.

0:30:34.680 --> 0:30:37.480
<v Speaker 1>There's also angles, like hey, what if you send your

0:30:37.600 --> 0:30:40.360
<v Speaker 1>X axis this direction or that direction doesn't matter? No,

0:30:40.560 --> 0:30:43.320
<v Speaker 1>the universe has no preferred angle that gives you angular

0:30:43.400 --> 0:30:47.080
<v Speaker 1>momentum conservation. And there's also symmetries with respect to time,

0:30:47.200 --> 0:30:50.040
<v Speaker 1>like due to the laws of physics change over time, we

0:30:50.160 --> 0:30:54.000
<v Speaker 1>don't think, So that's where energy conservation comes from. So

0:30:54.160 --> 0:30:57.920
<v Speaker 1>all the big conservation laws can be translated into symmetries

0:30:58.000 --> 0:30:59.880
<v Speaker 1>or vice versa, and you can actually think of them

0:31:00.160 --> 0:31:02.320
<v Speaker 1>as sort of two sides of the same coin. And

0:31:02.360 --> 0:31:04.320
<v Speaker 1>all those I think are clues. They tell us like

0:31:04.520 --> 0:31:08.360
<v Speaker 1>how the universe works, Like if energy is concerned, that

0:31:08.480 --> 0:31:10.920
<v Speaker 1>means that the laws of physics don't change with time.

0:31:11.040 --> 0:31:13.520
<v Speaker 1>That's kind of a big deal. And in fact, it

0:31:13.600 --> 0:31:17.080
<v Speaker 1>turns out energy not exactly conserved in our universe because

0:31:17.120 --> 0:31:20.600
<v Speaker 1>the laws of physics are changing slightly with time as

0:31:20.640 --> 0:31:24.360
<v Speaker 1>the universe expands and dark energy is increasing, and that

0:31:24.480 --> 0:31:27.240
<v Speaker 1>changes a factor that we conclude in the laws of physics.

0:31:27.480 --> 0:31:30.480
<v Speaker 1>So that's a whole other rabbit hole. But this one

0:31:30.520 --> 0:31:34.880
<v Speaker 1>is exactly conserved. The universe conserves electric charge exactly, which

0:31:34.920 --> 0:31:39.479
<v Speaker 1>means this weird internal electron angle that seems bizarre and

0:31:39.520 --> 0:31:42.800
<v Speaker 1>just sort of like abstract is important to the universe.

0:31:42.880 --> 0:31:46.720
<v Speaker 1>The universe respects it. It's built in deep, deep to

0:31:46.760 --> 0:31:49.440
<v Speaker 1>the mechanics of the universe. I feel like that's a clue,

0:31:49.440 --> 0:31:52.480
<v Speaker 1>that's something hard we're clinging on in the firmament of physics.

0:31:52.880 --> 0:31:57.040
<v Speaker 2>So protons and electrons have opposite charges of the same magnitude,

0:31:57.360 --> 0:32:00.800
<v Speaker 2>but they don't have the same mass. Does that tell

0:32:00.880 --> 0:32:03.400
<v Speaker 2>us something about mass not being conserved or am I

0:32:03.560 --> 0:32:06.200
<v Speaker 2>clinging to a not relevant factor here?

0:32:06.440 --> 0:32:08.720
<v Speaker 1>The mass of these particles is a totally separate topic,

0:32:08.800 --> 0:32:12.560
<v Speaker 1>And you're right, mass is not conserved. Electrons and positrons

0:32:12.680 --> 0:32:15.080
<v Speaker 1>do have the same mass because of the ripples in

0:32:15.160 --> 0:32:18.600
<v Speaker 1>the same fundamental field. But yeah, mass is definitely not

0:32:18.760 --> 0:32:21.360
<v Speaker 1>conserved in the universe. I mean we destroy mass all

0:32:21.400 --> 0:32:24.040
<v Speaker 1>the time in the large Hadrunk glider unilate protons you

0:32:24.120 --> 0:32:27.160
<v Speaker 1>use their mass to make new stuff that has lower

0:32:27.200 --> 0:32:30.560
<v Speaker 1>mass and higher velocity. You also gain mass all the

0:32:30.560 --> 0:32:32.360
<v Speaker 1>time from energy. You go out and feel the sun,

0:32:32.600 --> 0:32:36.200
<v Speaker 1>the photons that your body absorbs, increase the internal energy

0:32:36.200 --> 0:32:39.400
<v Speaker 1>of your molecules and gain mass. You charge your tesla,

0:32:39.560 --> 0:32:43.680
<v Speaker 1>it gains mass. So yeah, mass is definitely not conserved

0:32:43.680 --> 0:32:47.080
<v Speaker 1>in the universe. But this concept of charge turns out

0:32:47.120 --> 0:32:50.080
<v Speaker 1>to be a little bit more general than even electric charge.

0:32:50.400 --> 0:32:53.600
<v Speaker 1>We've talked about charge as a way that the photon

0:32:53.680 --> 0:32:56.280
<v Speaker 1>the electric fields coupled to each other, right, but also

0:32:56.360 --> 0:32:59.000
<v Speaker 1>somehow deeply connected to the universe. And that turns out

0:32:59.000 --> 0:33:00.440
<v Speaker 1>to be the simplest way to thy think about it,

0:33:00.480 --> 0:33:02.600
<v Speaker 1>because you have just like one kind of charge can

0:33:02.640 --> 0:33:06.360
<v Speaker 1>be positive or negative, and just one field, the photon field,

0:33:06.360 --> 0:33:08.720
<v Speaker 1>that it couples to. And you know, muans coupled to

0:33:08.760 --> 0:33:10.960
<v Speaker 1>the photon field, and quarks couple to the photon field.

0:33:10.960 --> 0:33:14.120
<v Speaker 1>Anything with electric charge couples to the photon field. But

0:33:14.240 --> 0:33:17.000
<v Speaker 1>the other charges for the other forces that are mediated

0:33:17.040 --> 0:33:21.320
<v Speaker 1>by other fields and particles turned out to be an generalization,

0:33:22.160 --> 0:33:25.920
<v Speaker 1>a more complex version of the same basic idea thinking

0:33:25.960 --> 0:33:28.640
<v Speaker 1>about how fields couple to each other.

0:33:29.040 --> 0:33:32.280
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so how is that a more subtle point than

0:33:32.320 --> 0:33:34.560
<v Speaker 2>what we had talked about before. So we had already

0:33:34.560 --> 0:33:39.800
<v Speaker 2>talked about how protons have two two thirds quarks and

0:33:39.840 --> 0:33:42.160
<v Speaker 2>then a negative one third quark or something. And so

0:33:43.240 --> 0:33:45.560
<v Speaker 2>with what you just said, what did we learn that

0:33:45.680 --> 0:33:47.520
<v Speaker 2>was different than what we had known before? Because I

0:33:47.520 --> 0:33:48.400
<v Speaker 2>think I didn't catch it.

0:33:48.520 --> 0:33:51.000
<v Speaker 1>No, we didn't learn anything new. I'm just now trying

0:33:51.040 --> 0:33:53.440
<v Speaker 1>to set us up to think about the other forces.

0:33:53.720 --> 0:33:55.840
<v Speaker 1>In terms of this framework. So we introduced this new

0:33:55.840 --> 0:33:58.680
<v Speaker 1>way of thinking about the electric charge, like not as

0:33:58.840 --> 0:34:01.440
<v Speaker 1>paints you put on some part and other particles, but

0:34:01.480 --> 0:34:04.880
<v Speaker 1>as a relationship between fields. Right now, let's try to

0:34:04.960 --> 0:34:07.040
<v Speaker 1>use that same sort of intellectual framework and think about

0:34:07.080 --> 0:34:11.600
<v Speaker 1>the other forces, the other kinds of charges in the

0:34:11.640 --> 0:34:14.760
<v Speaker 1>same way, because implicit there is the idea that forces

0:34:14.760 --> 0:34:17.320
<v Speaker 1>and charges are linked. Right. Electric charges are how we

0:34:17.400 --> 0:34:20.960
<v Speaker 1>used to label particles that feel forces in electric fields.

0:34:21.520 --> 0:34:24.520
<v Speaker 1>There are other forces in the universe, and some particles

0:34:24.600 --> 0:34:27.280
<v Speaker 1>ignore them. Some particles don't. So, for example, the strong

0:34:27.320 --> 0:34:32.560
<v Speaker 1>force strongest force out there, electrons totally ignore it. Electrons

0:34:32.600 --> 0:34:36.640
<v Speaker 1>that have electric charge have no strong charge. So if

0:34:36.680 --> 0:34:38.040
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to give you a bunch of particles and

0:34:38.040 --> 0:34:40.200
<v Speaker 1>you're going to throw them through a what we call

0:34:40.239 --> 0:34:44.280
<v Speaker 1>a color field, that's the field for the strong nuclear force.

0:34:44.600 --> 0:34:48.040
<v Speaker 1>Electrons fly right through, it doesn't matter. But if you

0:34:48.040 --> 0:34:50.520
<v Speaker 1>throw a QRK through there all sorts of crazy interactions.

0:34:50.520 --> 0:34:53.839
<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh, it gets accelerated like crazy. So now

0:34:53.840 --> 0:34:56.880
<v Speaker 1>we have another kind of label, right like, okay, well,

0:34:57.360 --> 0:34:59.800
<v Speaker 1>every particle has a label for whether it ignores electric

0:34:59.800 --> 0:35:02.360
<v Speaker 1>fiel fields or not. It also has a label for

0:35:02.440 --> 0:35:06.520
<v Speaker 1>whether it ignores color fields fields from the strong force.

0:35:06.920 --> 0:35:09.000
<v Speaker 1>But instead of thinking about as a label in the particle,

0:35:09.320 --> 0:35:12.480
<v Speaker 1>think about it as a way those fields interact. So

0:35:12.640 --> 0:35:16.640
<v Speaker 1>the electron field does not interact with the gluon field.

0:35:16.760 --> 0:35:20.120
<v Speaker 1>That's the analogy in the strong nuclear force of the

0:35:20.160 --> 0:35:24.480
<v Speaker 1>electromagnetic field. Right, we have these gluons, and so electrons

0:35:24.600 --> 0:35:26.920
<v Speaker 1>just don't interact with gluon fields. You kind of intense

0:35:27.040 --> 0:35:29.960
<v Speaker 1>buzzing energy in the gluon field. Electron field is not

0:35:30.040 --> 0:35:32.440
<v Speaker 1>linked to it at all. They oscill it completely independently.

0:35:32.960 --> 0:35:35.080
<v Speaker 1>But a quark field in that same region of space

0:35:35.120 --> 0:35:37.200
<v Speaker 1>where the gluon fields a lot of energy, those are

0:35:37.239 --> 0:35:40.840
<v Speaker 1>tied very strongly together, and so they buzz together.

0:35:41.400 --> 0:35:44.960
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so we talked about charge as the direction of

0:35:45.000 --> 0:35:49.600
<v Speaker 2>the response to the electromagnetic field. That's our baseline. And

0:35:49.719 --> 0:35:52.920
<v Speaker 2>now when you move on to strong force, it's no

0:35:52.960 --> 0:35:55.680
<v Speaker 2>longer really helpful to think of negative and positive because

0:35:55.719 --> 0:35:58.200
<v Speaker 2>it's just like do they respond to these forces or not.

0:35:58.640 --> 0:36:01.600
<v Speaker 1>You're right that we shouldn't think about strong nuclear charges

0:36:01.640 --> 0:36:04.880
<v Speaker 1>as zero, positive or negative, but it's not truth that

0:36:04.920 --> 0:36:06.719
<v Speaker 1>they're simpler. It's not just like a yes or no

0:36:06.920 --> 0:36:11.200
<v Speaker 1>In fact, they're more complicated. There are three different axes

0:36:11.560 --> 0:36:14.040
<v Speaker 1>along which you can have a color charge. So for

0:36:14.120 --> 0:36:16.879
<v Speaker 1>electric forces it's just one axis, right, and you're the zero,

0:36:17.000 --> 0:36:20.280
<v Speaker 1>positive or negative. For the strong force, there are three

0:36:20.400 --> 0:36:24.680
<v Speaker 1>different ones and they call them red, green, and blue.

0:36:24.760 --> 0:36:27.160
<v Speaker 1>And so for example, you can have a quirk that's

0:36:27.239 --> 0:36:29.840
<v Speaker 1>green or an anti green cork, or you can have

0:36:29.880 --> 0:36:32.759
<v Speaker 1>a red cork or an anti blue cork, and so

0:36:33.160 --> 0:36:37.360
<v Speaker 1>it's more complicated than the electromagnetic field. It's a generalization

0:36:37.520 --> 0:36:40.960
<v Speaker 1>of it. The fundamental ideas are the same, but instead

0:36:41.000 --> 0:36:44.799
<v Speaker 1>of like a single number zero, negative one, whatever, you

0:36:44.880 --> 0:36:47.920
<v Speaker 1>have like a vector, you have like three different numbers.

0:36:48.000 --> 0:36:50.680
<v Speaker 1>You have a green, a red, and a blue charge,

0:36:50.760 --> 0:36:53.200
<v Speaker 1>and if you're zero in all of those, that's what

0:36:53.239 --> 0:36:57.080
<v Speaker 1>we call colorless or white. So, for example, the proton

0:36:57.719 --> 0:37:00.000
<v Speaker 1>has quarks inside of it, and each of those quarks

0:37:00.280 --> 0:37:03.760
<v Speaker 1>has a charge. But if you have a red, a green,

0:37:03.920 --> 0:37:06.640
<v Speaker 1>and a blue, the math works out that they add

0:37:06.719 --> 0:37:08.000
<v Speaker 1>up to zero, and.

0:37:08.000 --> 0:37:10.160
<v Speaker 2>So electrons have a red, a green, and a blue.

0:37:10.239 --> 0:37:11.960
<v Speaker 1>You mean protons, Well, I thought you said.

0:37:12.000 --> 0:37:14.440
<v Speaker 2>Protons do respond to the force, but electrons don't.

0:37:14.520 --> 0:37:17.839
<v Speaker 1>So quarks respond to the force. Quarks are charged right,

0:37:18.320 --> 0:37:22.160
<v Speaker 1>But quarks can add up to neutralize themselves to have

0:37:22.320 --> 0:37:24.680
<v Speaker 1>zero color charge, the same way that like an electron

0:37:24.760 --> 0:37:29.120
<v Speaker 1>positron together have zero electric charge. Three quarks that make

0:37:29.160 --> 0:37:32.200
<v Speaker 1>a proton have zero color charge. So if you have

0:37:32.200 --> 0:37:34.759
<v Speaker 1>a red, a green, and a blue cork together, the

0:37:34.800 --> 0:37:37.720
<v Speaker 1>math adds up that they add up to zero total charge,

0:37:37.719 --> 0:37:42.120
<v Speaker 1>so they're not three totally independent directions in this weird way.

0:37:42.280 --> 0:37:45.040
<v Speaker 1>So there's two different ways that you can have zero

0:37:45.120 --> 0:37:47.719
<v Speaker 1>color charge. You can either have one red, one green,

0:37:47.760 --> 0:37:51.479
<v Speaker 1>one blue, or you can have red and anti red.

0:37:51.680 --> 0:37:54.960
<v Speaker 1>So for example, a quark and an antiquark can come

0:37:55.000 --> 0:37:59.120
<v Speaker 1>together to make a colorless object, which is like a pion.

0:37:59.640 --> 0:38:02.520
<v Speaker 1>All these particles we call masons are two quarks together

0:38:02.920 --> 0:38:07.240
<v Speaker 1>in a colorless state. They have no strong charge total,

0:38:07.360 --> 0:38:09.520
<v Speaker 1>same with a proton and a neutron. There's lots that

0:38:09.520 --> 0:38:11.640
<v Speaker 1>you can make it with three quarks. You can also

0:38:11.680 --> 0:38:15.239
<v Speaker 1>make it with six quarks for really crazy particles, but

0:38:15.560 --> 0:38:17.120
<v Speaker 1>most of the stuff we see in the universe is

0:38:17.160 --> 0:38:22.200
<v Speaker 1>either three quarks together colorless or two quarks together overall colorless.

0:38:22.960 --> 0:38:26.160
<v Speaker 1>And there's not just one gluon field because there's so

0:38:26.200 --> 0:38:29.719
<v Speaker 1>many different colors. You need eight different gluon fields, and

0:38:29.760 --> 0:38:32.440
<v Speaker 1>the glue on fields each have two colors, so you

0:38:32.440 --> 0:38:34.640
<v Speaker 1>could have like a red green gluon or a blue

0:38:34.680 --> 0:38:38.839
<v Speaker 1>anti red gluon, and the math is very complicated, it's

0:38:39.000 --> 0:38:42.799
<v Speaker 1>really crazy, but it's an analogy to the way we

0:38:42.840 --> 0:38:47.359
<v Speaker 1>think about electric charge and electric forces and the interactions

0:38:47.360 --> 0:38:49.720
<v Speaker 1>between the fields. So you have these eight gluon fields

0:38:49.760 --> 0:38:52.680
<v Speaker 1>filling the universe with all their color, and they interact

0:38:52.719 --> 0:38:54.879
<v Speaker 1>with quarks, but not with electrons.

0:38:55.120 --> 0:38:57.759
<v Speaker 2>Okay, they interact with quarks, but at the level of

0:38:57.760 --> 0:39:01.640
<v Speaker 2>a proton they usually cancel out full proton usually doesn't

0:39:01.640 --> 0:39:04.800
<v Speaker 2>respond to the strong force, and electrons don't usually respond

0:39:04.840 --> 0:39:05.640
<v Speaker 2>to the strong force.

0:39:05.840 --> 0:39:10.040
<v Speaker 1>Yes, that's exactly right. And these quarks also have weird

0:39:10.160 --> 0:39:14.840
<v Speaker 1>internal angles to them, and the universe likes to conserve those.

0:39:15.320 --> 0:39:18.319
<v Speaker 1>It's more complicated than just conserving one number because a

0:39:18.320 --> 0:39:21.120
<v Speaker 1>three dimensional color thing. But the universe can serves strong

0:39:21.200 --> 0:39:24.120
<v Speaker 1>nuclear color, which means it's symmetric with respect to all

0:39:24.200 --> 0:39:27.719
<v Speaker 1>those weird internal quark angles. So that's all. I'm still

0:39:27.800 --> 0:39:30.880
<v Speaker 1>very similar to electromagnetism.

0:39:29.800 --> 0:39:32.480
<v Speaker 2>All right, so I think I've followed all that. After

0:39:32.520 --> 0:39:51.879
<v Speaker 2>the break, let's talk about the weak force. We're back,

0:39:51.920 --> 0:39:55.319
<v Speaker 2>all right. So we've talked about charge and force as

0:39:55.320 --> 0:39:58.600
<v Speaker 2>it relates to electromagnetic forces and the strong force, and

0:39:58.640 --> 0:40:01.279
<v Speaker 2>so now let's let's get to the weak force. We're

0:40:01.360 --> 0:40:03.719
<v Speaker 2>two thirds of the way through the episode. We're at

0:40:03.800 --> 0:40:05.759
<v Speaker 2>the weak force of our goal of talking about the

0:40:05.760 --> 0:40:08.879
<v Speaker 2>weak hyperforce. So tell me about the weak force, right, So.

0:40:08.920 --> 0:40:12.920
<v Speaker 1>The weak force super fascinating because it touches everything in

0:40:12.960 --> 0:40:15.319
<v Speaker 1>the universe. Like, there are some particles out there with

0:40:15.520 --> 0:40:19.960
<v Speaker 1>zero electromagnetic charge, right, like neutrons or neutrinos. They ignore

0:40:19.960 --> 0:40:23.359
<v Speaker 1>electric fields. There are particles out there with no strong charge. Right,

0:40:23.440 --> 0:40:27.040
<v Speaker 1>Electrons ignore the strong force. There's nothing in the universe

0:40:27.040 --> 0:40:30.760
<v Speaker 1>that ignores the weak force. Everything out there except maybe

0:40:30.880 --> 0:40:32.759
<v Speaker 1>dark matter, which we haven't figured out yet. It might

0:40:32.760 --> 0:40:35.080
<v Speaker 1>not be a particle. Da da da da feels the

0:40:35.080 --> 0:40:39.120
<v Speaker 1>weak force. It's fascinating. It's like unavoidable, but it's also

0:40:39.600 --> 0:40:43.359
<v Speaker 1>super duper feeble. Right, It's the weakest force out there

0:40:43.480 --> 0:40:46.399
<v Speaker 1>except for gravity. Probably not a force anyway, but it's

0:40:46.600 --> 0:40:51.319
<v Speaker 1>much weaker than electromagnetism and the strong force. But it's pervasive.

0:40:51.719 --> 0:40:53.680
<v Speaker 2>Even neutrons are responding to the weak force.

0:40:53.760 --> 0:40:56.160
<v Speaker 1>Yes, neutrons respond to the weak force. Protons respond to

0:40:56.160 --> 0:41:00.200
<v Speaker 1>the weak force, neutrinos respond to the weak force. Absolutely yes,

0:41:00.800 --> 0:41:02.640
<v Speaker 1>And we can think about the weak force in the

0:41:02.719 --> 0:41:06.680
<v Speaker 1>same sort of framework as we thought about electromagnetism and

0:41:06.880 --> 0:41:08.800
<v Speaker 1>generalize it in the way we did also for the

0:41:08.840 --> 0:41:11.560
<v Speaker 1>strong force. So the weak force, like the strong force,

0:41:11.600 --> 0:41:15.239
<v Speaker 1>doesn't just have one charge. It has multiple charges. Right,

0:41:15.239 --> 0:41:18.480
<v Speaker 1>So remember electromagnetism, which seemed complicated at the time, was

0:41:18.520 --> 0:41:20.759
<v Speaker 1>actually nice and simple because it was just a number. Right,

0:41:20.760 --> 0:41:24.120
<v Speaker 1>It's like negative one plus two thirds, what's the big deal? Well,

0:41:24.160 --> 0:41:27.640
<v Speaker 1>weak forces have two charges, and because they were discovered

0:41:27.640 --> 0:41:31.120
<v Speaker 1>at different times and then like adapted from different theories historically,

0:41:31.320 --> 0:41:33.840
<v Speaker 1>the names for the mer disaster. We don't just have

0:41:33.960 --> 0:41:36.560
<v Speaker 1>like week charge one, week charge two or whatever, or

0:41:36.640 --> 0:41:39.279
<v Speaker 1>even the strong force is like nice colors which unify it.

0:41:39.600 --> 0:41:41.560
<v Speaker 1>So that's why we have two different charges and they're

0:41:41.600 --> 0:41:45.360
<v Speaker 1>called weak isospin in weak hypercharge.

0:41:45.680 --> 0:41:47.920
<v Speaker 2>I hate you, guys, it's.

0:41:47.920 --> 0:41:51.600
<v Speaker 1>Terrible, and I hate the word weak hyper charge because

0:41:51.600 --> 0:41:54.920
<v Speaker 1>to me, hyper suggests like it's strong, it's intense, it's powerful,

0:41:55.000 --> 0:41:57.640
<v Speaker 1>it's overwhelming, but then it's weak, So you're like, what

0:41:57.719 --> 0:42:00.320
<v Speaker 1>is it more powerful? Is what's powerful. I can't even tell. Well,

0:42:00.640 --> 0:42:04.080
<v Speaker 1>it's like super big tiny something what And.

0:42:04.040 --> 0:42:06.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm not sure I understand what isospin either.

0:42:06.280 --> 0:42:08.200
<v Speaker 1>Means Oh, that's even worse.

0:42:08.360 --> 0:42:10.400
<v Speaker 2>And the colors were throwing me too. I think you

0:42:10.400 --> 0:42:12.400
<v Speaker 2>guys need to start back at the drawing board. But

0:42:12.440 --> 0:42:14.000
<v Speaker 2>all right, all right, let's work with what we've got.

0:42:14.120 --> 0:42:18.520
<v Speaker 1>Isospin comes from another theory which kind of failed and

0:42:18.560 --> 0:42:21.960
<v Speaker 1>then was adapted later on. It was like, maybe this

0:42:22.000 --> 0:42:24.680
<v Speaker 1>could be reused, Like this happens in physics all the time.

0:42:24.920 --> 0:42:27.600
<v Speaker 1>Somebody studies something for like twenty years, it seems like

0:42:27.680 --> 0:42:30.040
<v Speaker 1>it's going to work out in the universe, says no, thanks,

0:42:30.600 --> 0:42:33.480
<v Speaker 1>that was a nice idea, but no, and then somebody

0:42:33.480 --> 0:42:35.880
<v Speaker 1>else comes along, so well, maybe I could adapt that

0:42:36.000 --> 0:42:38.440
<v Speaker 1>actually to answer this other question. That's what happened with

0:42:38.480 --> 0:42:41.280
<v Speaker 1>string theory. String theory was originally an attempt to explain

0:42:41.760 --> 0:42:44.520
<v Speaker 1>color forces and the strong nuclear force, and it failed.

0:42:44.640 --> 0:42:46.959
<v Speaker 1>But then it turns out to explain much more deep things,

0:42:46.960 --> 0:42:49.480
<v Speaker 1>so that can work sometimes. But you know, come up

0:42:49.520 --> 0:42:52.200
<v Speaker 1>with a new name. Yeah, so the's two different charges,

0:42:52.640 --> 0:42:56.000
<v Speaker 1>and every particle it now has two numbers. Right, you

0:42:56.000 --> 0:43:00.640
<v Speaker 1>have your isospin number and your hypercharge number, and these

0:43:00.719 --> 0:43:04.640
<v Speaker 1>numbers are a little weird, like isospin Electrons have minus

0:43:04.640 --> 0:43:08.719
<v Speaker 1>a half and neutrinos have plus a half, and so muons,

0:43:08.719 --> 0:43:11.080
<v Speaker 1>for example, of minus a half tows of minus a half,

0:43:11.080 --> 0:43:14.440
<v Speaker 1>but all the neutrinos have plus a half. And hypercharge

0:43:14.560 --> 0:43:18.280
<v Speaker 1>is just like another number, and electrons and neutrinos both

0:43:18.320 --> 0:43:23.560
<v Speaker 1>have hypercharge minus one, whereas quarks have hypercharge plus a third.

0:43:23.880 --> 0:43:28.399
<v Speaker 2>Could you have predicted what these charges would be once

0:43:28.440 --> 0:43:30.600
<v Speaker 2>you knew about the weak force or these things where

0:43:30.600 --> 0:43:32.520
<v Speaker 2>you had to measure it and then you were like, huh,

0:43:33.080 --> 0:43:35.200
<v Speaker 2>negative a half, wouldn't I guess that? But now we

0:43:35.320 --> 0:43:37.160
<v Speaker 2>know that's a feature of the universe, Like, can you

0:43:37.200 --> 0:43:39.560
<v Speaker 2>predict these things or did you just measure them and

0:43:39.560 --> 0:43:40.120
<v Speaker 2>then work with that?

0:43:40.600 --> 0:43:44.319
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, great question. Electric charges we definitely just measured. Week

0:43:44.440 --> 0:43:47.120
<v Speaker 1>charges are much harder to measure because the weak force

0:43:47.360 --> 0:43:50.399
<v Speaker 1>is very weak, and these are numbers that we came

0:43:50.520 --> 0:43:54.680
<v Speaker 1>up with later to explain particles we've already seen. Because

0:43:54.680 --> 0:43:57.799
<v Speaker 1>there's a deep connection between the weak force and the

0:43:57.840 --> 0:44:02.680
<v Speaker 1>electromagnetic force. These things are not totally separate. We've unified

0:44:02.680 --> 0:44:06.319
<v Speaker 1>them into one theory called electro week and This is

0:44:06.360 --> 0:44:09.680
<v Speaker 1>really interesting because it turns out that electromagnetism is just

0:44:09.840 --> 0:44:12.680
<v Speaker 1>part of the weak force. So remember how the strong

0:44:12.719 --> 0:44:15.520
<v Speaker 1>force had like a bunch of different gluon fields to

0:44:15.719 --> 0:44:18.920
<v Speaker 1>handle all the complexity. There are four fields in the

0:44:19.000 --> 0:44:22.560
<v Speaker 1>electroweak force, and one of them is the photon, and

0:44:22.600 --> 0:44:26.120
<v Speaker 1>the other three are fields that we call the weak force,

0:44:26.680 --> 0:44:29.360
<v Speaker 1>two W fields, and then the Z field. And the

0:44:29.400 --> 0:44:32.839
<v Speaker 1>electric field is like the weird sibling in the electroweak

0:44:32.880 --> 0:44:36.719
<v Speaker 1>force because it's so simple and well preserved. Like the

0:44:36.800 --> 0:44:40.440
<v Speaker 1>universe preserves the electric charge and respects this weird symmetry.

0:44:41.040 --> 0:44:44.600
<v Speaker 1>But more broadly, the weak charges are not conserved. So

0:44:44.680 --> 0:44:49.279
<v Speaker 1>for example, isospin not conserved in the universe, hypercharge not

0:44:49.480 --> 0:44:53.239
<v Speaker 1>conserved in the universe. The universe doesn't respect this symmetry.

0:44:53.440 --> 0:44:55.600
<v Speaker 1>This is how Higgs made his discovery, because he saw

0:44:55.640 --> 0:44:58.640
<v Speaker 1>that the weak force does not respect these things. His

0:44:58.680 --> 0:45:01.759
<v Speaker 1>whole theory is in a contact we call electroweak symmetry.

0:45:01.840 --> 0:45:05.040
<v Speaker 1>Breaking the weak force is kind of a big, sloppy mess.

0:45:05.640 --> 0:45:09.960
<v Speaker 1>But electric charge turns out to be a weird combination

0:45:10.680 --> 0:45:14.120
<v Speaker 1>of isospin and hypercharge. You have this big, messy weak

0:45:14.120 --> 0:45:16.400
<v Speaker 1>force when nothing is conserved everything is very weak and

0:45:16.440 --> 0:45:19.040
<v Speaker 1>flimsy in sloshing around. But if you look at it

0:45:19.040 --> 0:45:21.000
<v Speaker 1>from just one angler, you take one slice of it,

0:45:21.040 --> 0:45:24.120
<v Speaker 1>you say, oh, this is beautiful. This is the photon

0:45:24.200 --> 0:45:27.920
<v Speaker 1>field on electromagnetism, and everything is perfectly concerned in this

0:45:28.000 --> 0:45:31.920
<v Speaker 1>one weird slice of a larger, messy field. So it

0:45:31.960 --> 0:45:36.439
<v Speaker 1>turns out electric charge is connected to weak hypercharge. It's

0:45:36.480 --> 0:45:40.080
<v Speaker 1>like a combination of hypercharge and isospin together.

0:45:40.800 --> 0:45:44.879
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so the weak force is actually measured in four

0:45:44.880 --> 0:45:49.520
<v Speaker 2>different ways, one of which is the electromagnetic field, and

0:45:49.560 --> 0:45:53.600
<v Speaker 2>that is conserved, yes, But the other three are a

0:45:53.600 --> 0:45:56.040
<v Speaker 2>freaking mess. Yes, And we don't understand why, and we

0:45:56.080 --> 0:46:01.280
<v Speaker 2>don't think that we are misunderstanding something. It's just actually

0:46:01.320 --> 0:46:04.680
<v Speaker 2>not conserved, which maybe tells us something about what's important

0:46:04.680 --> 0:46:08.239
<v Speaker 2>about the universe. Was the conservation for the strong force, Yes,

0:46:08.320 --> 0:46:11.080
<v Speaker 2>conservation for the strong force. These three kinds of weak forces,

0:46:11.680 --> 0:46:13.560
<v Speaker 2>you don't get conservation because.

0:46:13.320 --> 0:46:15.960
<v Speaker 1>Of the Higgs. The Higgs and messes up those other fields.

0:46:16.000 --> 0:46:18.320
<v Speaker 1>In fact, that's how Higgs knew the Higgs was there.

0:46:18.640 --> 0:46:20.719
<v Speaker 1>He's like, oh, how do you mess up these three

0:46:20.760 --> 0:46:23.759
<v Speaker 1>fields and not the photon. I'm gonna invent this thing

0:46:23.840 --> 0:46:26.400
<v Speaker 1>to mess up those three fields and not mess up

0:46:26.400 --> 0:46:30.040
<v Speaker 1>the photon. That's the Higgs boson, and that's how we

0:46:30.120 --> 0:46:32.239
<v Speaker 1>knew that that was there, because the weak field is

0:46:32.280 --> 0:46:36.560
<v Speaker 1>messed up in this weird particular way that preserves one

0:46:36.719 --> 0:46:39.440
<v Speaker 1>corner of it. It's like if you have four siblings

0:46:39.440 --> 0:46:41.960
<v Speaker 1>sharing a room and three of them are total Slavs,

0:46:42.320 --> 0:46:45.640
<v Speaker 1>and somehow one of the siblings is like military corners

0:46:45.680 --> 0:46:48.480
<v Speaker 1>on the bed, not a piece of dust on the floor,

0:46:48.560 --> 0:46:50.399
<v Speaker 1>and you're like, all the way down to the edge

0:46:50.400 --> 0:46:52.640
<v Speaker 1>and you measure it, like down to the micron. You

0:46:52.680 --> 0:46:54.759
<v Speaker 1>have like an electron microscope, and you can't find a

0:46:54.840 --> 0:46:57.840
<v Speaker 1>tiny little bit of dust that goes past that barrier,

0:46:57.880 --> 0:47:01.200
<v Speaker 1>and you're like, wow, there's something going on here. That's

0:47:01.200 --> 0:47:02.640
<v Speaker 1>what Higgs saw. He's like, all right, I'm going to

0:47:02.680 --> 0:47:05.600
<v Speaker 1>invent this mechanism that messes up this part of the

0:47:05.640 --> 0:47:07.839
<v Speaker 1>universe and not that part at all and doesn't even

0:47:07.920 --> 0:47:08.239
<v Speaker 1>touch it.

0:47:08.400 --> 0:47:10.680
<v Speaker 2>Okay, So Higgs has a field and a boson, right.

0:47:10.640 --> 0:47:13.279
<v Speaker 1>Yes, that's right. The boson is a ripple in the field.

0:47:13.360 --> 0:47:14.839
<v Speaker 1>So it's really just one concept.

0:47:15.040 --> 0:47:18.800
<v Speaker 2>So we've got the Higgs field. What is the connection

0:47:18.840 --> 0:47:20.120
<v Speaker 2>between the field and the weak force.

0:47:20.239 --> 0:47:22.920
<v Speaker 1>So the Higgs field is another field, and it interacts

0:47:22.960 --> 0:47:25.640
<v Speaker 1>with all of these fields, and it messes up the

0:47:25.680 --> 0:47:27.960
<v Speaker 1>symmetry of the Week field. So if you didn't have

0:47:28.000 --> 0:47:31.239
<v Speaker 1>the Higgs field, the weak charges would be perfectly conserved

0:47:31.520 --> 0:47:33.920
<v Speaker 1>and the internal angles of the weak field would be

0:47:34.080 --> 0:47:36.759
<v Speaker 1>crystal and beautiful, just like the other forces. But the

0:47:36.840 --> 0:47:40.040
<v Speaker 1>Higgs field messes up the weak field. It breaks electroweek

0:47:40.040 --> 0:47:42.799
<v Speaker 1>symmetry in a way that messes up those fields and

0:47:42.920 --> 0:47:47.640
<v Speaker 1>breaks the conservation of weak hypercharge and weak isospin. So separately,

0:47:47.680 --> 0:47:50.640
<v Speaker 1>these two things are not conserved, but this one combination

0:47:50.800 --> 0:47:53.040
<v Speaker 1>of them is preserved by the Higgs boson.

0:47:53.520 --> 0:47:56.480
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so the Higgs field messes up the three different

0:47:56.480 --> 0:47:59.120
<v Speaker 2>measurements for the weak force. And remind me of what

0:47:59.160 --> 0:48:01.680
<v Speaker 2>a weak hypercharge now that I've got that in my head.

0:48:01.520 --> 0:48:04.280
<v Speaker 1>All right, and we hypercharge is one of these charges

0:48:04.320 --> 0:48:07.200
<v Speaker 1>of the weak force. So the electro week force week

0:48:07.239 --> 0:48:13.799
<v Speaker 1>plus electromagnetism has three charges. Electric charge, weak hypercharge, weak isospin.

0:48:14.200 --> 0:48:17.360
<v Speaker 1>Electric charge is actually a special combination of those two.

0:48:17.440 --> 0:48:22.239
<v Speaker 1>The Higgs field messes up the conservation of it. Generally, right,

0:48:22.440 --> 0:48:26.120
<v Speaker 1>they're not separately conserved, but this combination of them. Electric

0:48:26.200 --> 0:48:29.560
<v Speaker 1>charge is conserved in the universe. So we have this

0:48:29.680 --> 0:48:33.120
<v Speaker 1>fields description of all the ripples of energy in the universe,

0:48:33.480 --> 0:48:36.040
<v Speaker 1>and we know which fields talk to which other fields,

0:48:36.080 --> 0:48:39.000
<v Speaker 1>and that's what we call charge. And fields can talk

0:48:39.000 --> 0:48:41.120
<v Speaker 1>to each other in different ways. Right. They can talk

0:48:41.160 --> 0:48:43.680
<v Speaker 1>to each other through the photon field, in which case

0:48:43.680 --> 0:48:46.040
<v Speaker 1>they both have electric charge, because that's what it means

0:48:46.040 --> 0:48:48.120
<v Speaker 1>to send energy through the photon field. It means you

0:48:48.120 --> 0:48:50.400
<v Speaker 1>have an electric charge you're coupling to the photon field.

0:48:51.040 --> 0:48:53.400
<v Speaker 1>Or they can talk to each other through weak fields

0:48:53.640 --> 0:48:57.920
<v Speaker 1>because all particles have weak hypercharge or weak isospin. Or

0:48:57.960 --> 0:48:59.959
<v Speaker 1>they can talk to each other through the gluon field

0:49:00.239 --> 0:49:02.080
<v Speaker 1>if they couple to the gluon fields, and that's what

0:49:02.120 --> 0:49:06.120
<v Speaker 1>it means to have color charge. So we hypercharge is

0:49:06.160 --> 0:49:10.239
<v Speaker 1>an example how matterfields fields to describe electrons and muons

0:49:10.280 --> 0:49:12.520
<v Speaker 1>and quarks and all this kind of other stuff can

0:49:12.560 --> 0:49:16.120
<v Speaker 1>interact with each other through these force fields, through the

0:49:16.239 --> 0:49:19.960
<v Speaker 1>electromagnetic field and the gluon fields and the W field

0:49:19.960 --> 0:49:22.319
<v Speaker 1>and the Z field and all these other fields that

0:49:22.360 --> 0:49:26.200
<v Speaker 1>help particles interact with each other. And so it's fascinating

0:49:26.239 --> 0:49:29.440
<v Speaker 1>that electric charge is conserved and strong charge is concerned,

0:49:29.440 --> 0:49:32.640
<v Speaker 1>but we hypercharge is not right. The universe mess that

0:49:32.719 --> 0:49:35.760
<v Speaker 1>up created the Higgs boson gave it this weird energy.

0:49:36.160 --> 0:49:37.640
<v Speaker 1>But I hope that this gives you like a different

0:49:37.680 --> 0:49:41.080
<v Speaker 1>view of like what charge is. It's not just about electricity.

0:49:41.280 --> 0:49:43.399
<v Speaker 1>It's not a label we put on particles. It's about

0:49:43.440 --> 0:49:45.920
<v Speaker 1>how fields talk to each other. And a lot of

0:49:45.920 --> 0:49:50.120
<v Speaker 1>particle physics is understanding how energy slashes back and forth

0:49:50.200 --> 0:49:53.680
<v Speaker 1>between these fields. And like you can ask the philosophical

0:49:53.719 --> 0:49:57.000
<v Speaker 1>questions like what is an electron anyway? And our description

0:49:57.040 --> 0:49:59.839
<v Speaker 1>of electron isn't just a particle flying through space. It's

0:49:59.840 --> 0:50:02.479
<v Speaker 1>a buzzing and a rippling in the electron field that's

0:50:02.520 --> 0:50:05.440
<v Speaker 1>also constantly coupled to the photon field, and energy is

0:50:05.480 --> 0:50:07.839
<v Speaker 1>slashing back and forth between them. And that's what we

0:50:07.960 --> 0:50:11.239
<v Speaker 1>mean by the electron we measure in the lab. And

0:50:11.280 --> 0:50:13.240
<v Speaker 1>when we talk about a cork, it's got a cloud

0:50:13.239 --> 0:50:15.279
<v Speaker 1>of gluons around it, or you can think about it

0:50:15.280 --> 0:50:18.600
<v Speaker 1>as a ripple in the quark field, constantly slashing energy

0:50:18.640 --> 0:50:22.359
<v Speaker 1>back and forth via gluon fields. That's really what charges about.

0:50:22.400 --> 0:50:25.400
<v Speaker 1>It's about coupling of the fields and the weak hypercharge

0:50:25.560 --> 0:50:27.640
<v Speaker 1>is that a great example because it shows off how

0:50:27.680 --> 0:50:31.560
<v Speaker 1>the universe can be beautiful and symmetric and crystalline, and

0:50:31.640 --> 0:50:34.840
<v Speaker 1>then sometimes it can just be the messy sibling leaving

0:50:34.960 --> 0:50:36.600
<v Speaker 1>dirty dishes under its bed.

0:50:36.960 --> 0:50:39.799
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, a total disaster. Yeah. So I feel like I

0:50:39.840 --> 0:50:42.719
<v Speaker 2>thought that I understood charge and force going in, and

0:50:42.760 --> 0:50:45.040
<v Speaker 2>it's totally different. I'm thinking about it now in a

0:50:45.040 --> 0:50:47.520
<v Speaker 2>totally different way than I had before, which is really exciting.

0:50:48.080 --> 0:50:51.680
<v Speaker 2>One quick step back, isospin is also not conserved.

0:50:51.719 --> 0:50:53.360
<v Speaker 1>Isospin is also not concerved?

0:50:53.440 --> 0:50:55.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and so did we decide that we wanted this

0:50:55.800 --> 0:50:57.960
<v Speaker 2>episode to be about the weak hypercharge because it's a

0:50:58.000 --> 0:51:02.560
<v Speaker 2>funny name. Why are we emphasizing that charge as opposed

0:51:02.600 --> 0:51:06.239
<v Speaker 2>to talking about isospin? Yeah, and the weak hypercharge because

0:51:06.239 --> 0:51:08.120
<v Speaker 2>they seem to be telling us the same thing. As

0:51:08.120 --> 0:51:08.880
<v Speaker 2>far as I can tell.

0:51:08.840 --> 0:51:10.840
<v Speaker 1>You're right, week isospin and week hypercharge are on the

0:51:10.880 --> 0:51:14.520
<v Speaker 1>same footing. Two reasons why this episode started out about

0:51:14.600 --> 0:51:17.600
<v Speaker 1>hypercharge and not isospin. One is it has the word

0:51:17.719 --> 0:51:19.600
<v Speaker 1>charge in it, So I thought I would at least

0:51:19.640 --> 0:51:22.880
<v Speaker 1>give the listeners a clue when we're asking them about it, Like, otherwise,

0:51:22.920 --> 0:51:24.680
<v Speaker 1>what is this thing? It's just a bunch of words

0:51:24.680 --> 0:51:28.080
<v Speaker 1>physicists invented. And also because at least one person wrote

0:51:28.080 --> 0:51:30.319
<v Speaker 1>in and said, I was reading the Wikipedia page on

0:51:30.360 --> 0:51:32.880
<v Speaker 1>week hypercharge and what is this? Can you explain it?

0:51:33.400 --> 0:51:36.400
<v Speaker 1>So I thought, all right, let's try to dig into.

0:51:36.239 --> 0:51:39.000
<v Speaker 2>This perfect Those are two great reasons. Okay, now I'm

0:51:39.040 --> 0:51:41.280
<v Speaker 2>with you, and I'm never going to see the world

0:51:41.320 --> 0:51:42.080
<v Speaker 2>the same way again.

0:51:42.400 --> 0:51:44.040
<v Speaker 1>And for those of you who want to learn more,

0:51:44.160 --> 0:51:46.920
<v Speaker 1>all the mathematics of these fields and how they interact

0:51:47.000 --> 0:51:50.800
<v Speaker 1>is described with this beautiful piece of theory called group theory,

0:51:51.080 --> 0:51:54.000
<v Speaker 1>which shows you how these things rotate and how energy

0:51:54.000 --> 0:51:57.279
<v Speaker 1>flows between them. It's a great example also of how

0:51:57.400 --> 0:52:01.840
<v Speaker 1>mathematicians will develop a new branch of mathasthematics just for fun.

0:52:02.120 --> 0:52:04.760
<v Speaker 1>They're like, hey, this is cool. Let's create these rules

0:52:04.840 --> 0:52:07.000
<v Speaker 1>and then just play games with them for one hundred years,

0:52:07.080 --> 0:52:09.480
<v Speaker 1>and they totally did that. Then one hundred years later

0:52:09.560 --> 0:52:11.839
<v Speaker 1>physicists are like, oh my gosh, these games you've been playing,

0:52:12.040 --> 0:52:14.920
<v Speaker 1>just like you know, sipping tea and being nerds, turns

0:52:14.960 --> 0:52:18.719
<v Speaker 1>out to be perfect description of this complex mathematics of

0:52:18.760 --> 0:52:21.440
<v Speaker 1>these fields we discovered, thanks guys, and just plugged it

0:52:21.520 --> 0:52:23.680
<v Speaker 1>right in. And now group theory is like at the

0:52:23.760 --> 0:52:26.200
<v Speaker 1>heart of our understanding of the universe.

0:52:26.360 --> 0:52:29.200
<v Speaker 2>Were the mathematicians just devastated when they found out their

0:52:29.200 --> 0:52:33.000
<v Speaker 2>work was applied and then like, oh, I have.

0:52:32.920 --> 0:52:35.040
<v Speaker 1>To move on and invent another irrelevant game.

0:52:35.920 --> 0:52:38.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, oh, it must have been a bad day for

0:52:38.280 --> 0:52:39.120
<v Speaker 2>the mathematicians.

0:52:39.160 --> 0:52:40.920
<v Speaker 1>I think there are two kinds of mathematicians, those who

0:52:40.960 --> 0:52:43.399
<v Speaker 1>are disappointed in, those who are excited yeah yeah, yeah,

0:52:43.480 --> 0:52:45.399
<v Speaker 1>those who have a little bit of physicist in them,

0:52:45.440 --> 0:52:49.880
<v Speaker 1>and those that don't. Yeah yeah, because in the end,

0:52:49.960 --> 0:52:52.279
<v Speaker 1>you know, the dotted lines we draw between math and

0:52:52.320 --> 0:52:55.520
<v Speaker 1>physics and philosophy, these are just the way humans like

0:52:55.560 --> 0:52:59.680
<v Speaker 1>to categorize people, right as you always say, this a spectrum.

0:52:59.000 --> 0:53:02.680
<v Speaker 2>Yep, agree, Nature and humanity don't like to be in categories.

0:53:02.800 --> 0:53:04.719
<v Speaker 1>All right, Well, thank you for joining us for this

0:53:04.920 --> 0:53:07.800
<v Speaker 1>tour along the spectrum of complexity of all the forces,

0:53:07.800 --> 0:53:11.839
<v Speaker 1>from the crisp, beautiful nature of electromagnetism to the messiness

0:53:11.920 --> 0:53:13.840
<v Speaker 1>of the week force. So I hope that helped you

0:53:13.920 --> 0:53:16.799
<v Speaker 1>get a new view of how the universe worked. And

0:53:16.840 --> 0:53:20.520
<v Speaker 1>I hope we giggled just the right amount.

0:53:20.680 --> 0:53:31.279
<v Speaker 2>Fick everyone. Daniel and Kelly's Extraordinary Universe is produced by

0:53:31.280 --> 0:53:34.840
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