Speaker 1: Hey, folks, it is the evening of Monday, September eighth,
Speaker 1: as we record this, and what the actual hell? We
Speaker 1: just watched the number one trending show on Netflix. It's
Speaker 1: called Unknown Number the High School Catfish. Our mouths dropped
Speaker 1: open for pretty much the entire hour and a half
Speaker 1: of this documentary, and Roeboch has been absolutely chomping at
Speaker 1: the bit to get everything off her chest and off
Speaker 1: her mind and spirit about what we just saw. And
Speaker 1: I told her, wait, don't do it until we hit record. Well, folks,
Speaker 1: we just hit record, and now welcome to this episode
Speaker 1: of Amy and TJ. First reaction, before we even explain
Speaker 1: anything about this documentary, you tell me how you feel.
Speaker 2: Appalled, disgusted, shocked, and just in disbelief. I'm in disbelief
Speaker 2: of what I saw.
Speaker 1: Disbelief is a good one. Can't believe what we saw,
Speaker 1: and now I'm looking I have softened. Shock and disbelief
Speaker 1: was first. I have a difficult time getting to anger
Speaker 1: just yet. And so let's get into all of that. Folks.
Speaker 1: If you don't know what this thing is about, we
Speaker 1: want to give you a heads up. We're not going
Speaker 1: to give a spoiler, and if we do. We're going
Speaker 1: to give your heads up. We're not going to give
Speaker 1: a spoiler before what the next five minutes, I should say,
Speaker 1: as we set it up, but we're gonna have to
Speaker 1: talk about the reveal and what this story is. It's
Speaker 1: out there and it's public. We just in case you
Speaker 1: haven't seen it and wanted to, we at least want
Speaker 1: to give your heads up before we tell you about
Speaker 1: what went down. Is that fair?
Speaker 2: I would say, we couldn't do a proper podcast without
Speaker 2: discussing what the twist is or what the true This
Speaker 2: isn't even a script, that's the thing. It's not a
Speaker 2: movie script. This is real life. It's always been said
Speaker 2: truth is stranger than fiction. This documentary is proof. If
Speaker 2: you ever didn't believe it, this documentary is proof. And
Speaker 2: so we're gonna have to give the spoiler. So if
Speaker 2: you haven't seen it, I would say, put us on pause,
Speaker 2: go watch the Netflix documentary, and then come back and
Speaker 2: see if you want to join in on this, because
Speaker 2: I guarantee you you're gonna have feelings.
Speaker 1: Yes, And as you listen along here, we promise we
Speaker 1: will give you a heads up before we give the
Speaker 1: thing or anything away. But just to set it up
Speaker 1: here robes is, I mean the teas and the trailer
Speaker 1: and what this is set up as a group of
Speaker 1: friends begin getting harassed from an unknown number and it
Speaker 1: is relentless. And so this goes along and follows the
Speaker 1: story investigation what happens to these kids until the ultimate
Speaker 1: reveal of what happens.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I have to give Netflix so many kudos
Speaker 2: because they really did an artful job in telling a story.
Speaker 2: So you actually are you're actually alone long for the
Speaker 2: horror of it. Where it builds, you start to see
Speaker 2: the initial texts and then there's a little bit of
Speaker 2: a lull and then they come back. And when they
Speaker 2: come back, they're relentless. They're ferocious, they're unending. Sometimes there's
Speaker 2: fifty texts a day of just hardcore bullying that actually
Speaker 2: crescendos into telling the victims, the recipients of these texts
Speaker 2: to go kill themselves. Like it gets that graphic and
Speaker 2: that disturbing.
Speaker 1: You reminded me. I'm still not quite sure the ages
Speaker 1: they were what grade at.
Speaker 2: The time, ninth grade, So we're talking fourteen thirteen, fourteen
Speaker 2: years old.
Speaker 1: Okay, And this is in Bill City, Michigan, and this
Speaker 1: happened twenty two.
Speaker 2: Yeah, within the last few years.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is so Yeah, this is all very current.
Speaker 2: The kids are still in high school.
Speaker 1: Yes, there you go. The kids are still in high school.
Speaker 1: And they did talk to all the kids, but it
Speaker 1: revolved around Owen and Lauren, these two youngins who were
Speaker 1: kind of sweet on each other and started dating, and
Speaker 1: then Owen started getting these messages from an unknown number.
Speaker 1: Essentially Owen and Lauren started getting these messages essentially trying
Speaker 1: to break them up. Now it's hard, and I meant
Speaker 1: to write some down, it's hard to give an accurate
Speaker 1: description of what and just how horrible these messages were.
Speaker 1: You put it in context that it's coming to a
Speaker 1: thirteen year old, it's hard to understand the things that
Speaker 1: were being said to these children.
Speaker 2: They were very sexually graphic. Yes, for even someone who
Speaker 2: is in their twenties, it was sexually graphic. These are kids. Yes,
Speaker 2: I've felt that I was like, WHOA and these kids?
Speaker 2: If I had been their age, I wouldn't have even
Speaker 2: known some of what the texts were, what they were
Speaker 2: referring to, that's how sexually graphic they were. But it
Speaker 2: all was this kind of obsession with Owen, and then
Speaker 2: because he was with his girlfriend from seventh grade, Lauren,
Speaker 2: then all of the anger and vitriol and just unbelievably,
Speaker 2: just horrible, horrible things were being said to Lauren, like
Speaker 2: calling her a skank, and because she was thin, like
Speaker 2: making fun of her flat ass, and her just her
Speaker 2: unwillingness to be sexual with her boyfriend, just all the
Speaker 2: things that girls are vulnerable and embarrassed about at that
Speaker 2: age in ninth grade, when you're becoming a woman, and
Speaker 2: to have someone texting you telling you you're not sexy
Speaker 2: and you don't have the body, and you and you're
Speaker 2: a skank, and you dress provocatively but you won't give
Speaker 2: it up, and just all the things that already girls
Speaker 2: are insecure about. To have somebody just zeroing and honing
Speaker 2: in on that is just awful.
Speaker 1: Again, thirteen year old, all of these kids are, and
Speaker 1: several of them started getting these messages from unknown numbers.
Speaker 1: To your point about Lauren, this is probably one of
Speaker 1: the saddest things is that this unknown number had no
Speaker 1: idea who it was, where was coming from, actually had
Speaker 1: an impact on how she felt about herself, and she
Speaker 1: started changing the way.
Speaker 2: She dressed and how she felt about herself. She talked
Speaker 2: about having thoughts of suicide. Owen talked about having thoughts oficide.
Speaker 1: Power of words in messages coming through a cell phone,
Speaker 1: it's it's horrific to see what happened. So the kids
Speaker 1: then start doing their own investigation trying to figure it out.
Speaker 1: The police get involved, parents get involved, everybody gets involved,
Speaker 1: so everybody's trying to track it down. They can't track
Speaker 1: down who it is necessarily so easily, because they're using
Speaker 1: some kind of technology that allows it to look like
Speaker 1: it's coming from a different cell phone or different phone
Speaker 1: numbers every single time. So it's not that simple until
Speaker 1: they finally get what was the FBI involved and they
Speaker 1: do proper research going.
Speaker 2: Correct, But before is it, Before the FBI got involved,
Speaker 2: the person who was sending these messages was clever enough
Speaker 2: to start sending people out on wild goose chases, so
Speaker 2: creating texts that made it seem as though another student
Speaker 2: was the bully or another student was the bully, So
Speaker 2: then other students were getting involved because they were being accused,
Speaker 2: and then their lives were unraveling because then they looked
Speaker 2: like they were the culprit and it wasn't true, and yes,
Speaker 2: once the FBI got involved, they were able to track
Speaker 2: down IP numbers basically IP addresses. Excuse me, and.
Speaker 1: Let's jump on that. But I wanted to your point.
Speaker 1: I didn't make this point enough about what you just said.
Speaker 1: How Yes, this caused friendships to break down forever, this
Speaker 1: caused marriages to end, Families were split, all because somebody
Speaker 1: unknown number sending negative, nasty, constant bullying via.
Speaker 2: Tech constant like fifty texts a day, constantly your full
Speaker 2: time job.
Speaker 1: Yes, so, yes, this is where we are to pick
Speaker 1: up on what you're saying. Now, the FBI gets involved
Speaker 1: and they start trying to track down IP addresses and
Speaker 1: what phone numbers are.
Speaker 2: Attached for mere so the people who the victims who
Speaker 2: were receiving all of these unwanted and horrific tax Owen
Speaker 2: actually gave his phone. This is kind of what broke
Speaker 2: the case wide open. Gave his phone to the FBI,
Speaker 2: who then did a full extraction, is that what they
Speaker 2: called it. And they were able to look at all
Speaker 2: of the texts that came in, and there were plenty
Speaker 2: to look at, and they were able to cross reference
Speaker 2: even though they were using this app or whatever that
Speaker 2: created different numbers. There was still an underlying number attached
Speaker 2: to two different IP addresses, and when you find out
Speaker 2: what was it, about two thirds maybe three quarters of
Speaker 2: the way through the documentary you find out the number
Speaker 2: that is finally cross referenced, because they went through all
Speaker 2: the students and all the potential found because the information
Speaker 2: that by the way, this harassmer, this bully was using,
Speaker 2: was referencing things that were said, even a picture that
Speaker 2: only someone who was intimate in a friend group or
Speaker 2: in a family unit could possibly have known. So they
Speaker 2: knew that was what was so creepy about it. It
Speaker 2: wasn't like some stranger from Afar. It was somebody who
Speaker 2: intimately knew these characters. So they were cross referencing numbers,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: And they made a very good point. I'm not sure
Speaker 1: where you would have come down on this. As a parent,
Speaker 1: I said, that is really smart. When they were telling them, hey,
Speaker 1: just get your kids' numbers cut off, get new phones,
Speaker 1: new numbers, and all of this will go away. And
Speaker 1: the parents said, no, we actually want to figure this out.
Speaker 1: We want to figure out who this is because clearly
Speaker 1: it's somebody in our circle.
Speaker 2: This person is in our homes this person is being
Speaker 2: invited to those family gatherings. This person is a part
Speaker 2: of our inner circle, and how could we ever trust
Speaker 2: our inner circle again if we don't know who this is.
Speaker 1: So they and they build us up Robes very dramatically.
Speaker 1: And this is where now, folks will tell you if
Speaker 1: you haven't seen and you want to wait for the
Speaker 1: big reveal, this is where the spoiler is going to
Speaker 1: come in. So we'll let you know. We are about
Speaker 1: to go ahead and discuss. I guess really the more
Speaker 1: the meat and the reveal of this, but Robes it
Speaker 1: was as we were watching said the first third two
Speaker 1: thirds of it, we of course we had guesses about
Speaker 1: who it's going to be, and it's probably going to
Speaker 1: be that, and we said early on it's probably an adult.
Speaker 1: So yway, some of the things they said, you know what,
Speaker 1: that's probably got to be the shocker part of this.
Speaker 1: This was the biggest possible shocker of anybody that could
Speaker 1: have been the culprit.
Speaker 2: Yes, because the poor girl Lauren who was being berated
Speaker 2: and being called every name in the book, including telling
Speaker 2: Lauren to go kill herself. And I'm really like not
Speaker 2: even giving the worst of the quotes, those texts were
Speaker 2: coming from her own mother. So Lauren's mother, Kendra, ultimately
Speaker 2: was the person who was behind the texts. These graphic, horrific,
Speaker 2: sexual bullying, and frankly threatening texts all were coming from
Speaker 2: her own mother. And then the question becomes why why.
Speaker 1: So as you say it and you sit here anyone
Speaker 1: listening if you want, you struggle to come up with
Speaker 1: the why. And so again, a very good part of
Speaker 1: the documentary is that Netflix got the bodycam footage of
Speaker 1: when the officer went in there and they had to
Speaker 1: confront her in her home and had to bring her
Speaker 1: daughter in as well to see all this breakdown. You see,
Speaker 1: I'm not sure what comes over her when she knew
Speaker 1: the gig was up. She immediately confessed and there wasn't
Speaker 1: much of an emotional reaction, babe.
Speaker 2: That was what freaked me out. The moment she actually
Speaker 2: had no she had zero emotion, and it the little
Speaker 2: bit you might have seen was so minuscule. It would
Speaker 2: be like telling me that a distant second cousin had
Speaker 2: passed like. There was almost no emotion that crossed over
Speaker 2: her face when she realized that she was caught, and
Speaker 2: her biggest thing was, I don't want Lauren to know.
Speaker 2: Is everyone going to know? That was what she cared about,
Speaker 2: and the officer was like, pretty sure, there's no way
Speaker 2: to avoid that, and she kind of was like okay,
Speaker 2: literally knowing what she had been doing for a year
Speaker 2: and a half, two years almost at that point, just
Speaker 2: harassing two young kids to the point where they both
Speaker 2: considered suicide, and she had zero emotion when she got
Speaker 2: caught as a mom, as a wife, and there were
Speaker 2: more lies her whole She had a whole other web
Speaker 2: of lies that she was selling her husband in addition
Speaker 2: to selling this all to her daughter to be the
Speaker 2: comforter in chief, to be that mom who was there
Speaker 2: for her daughter who was being bullied, because she was
Speaker 2: going to be the comforter when she was the actual
Speaker 2: one who was inflicting the pain. This is a.
Speaker 1: Look, this is a shocking story. And it's easy to mock.
Speaker 1: It's easy to it's easy to beate, it's easy to
Speaker 1: attack this woman and scratch your heads. Certainly from a parent.
Speaker 1: I know a lot of you listening now, if you've
Speaker 1: watched it already, you have the same question, why why why?
Speaker 1: It makes no sense? Why? Okay? If she was sweet
Speaker 1: on the boy, fine, send a couple of things, try
Speaker 1: to break them up. Why are you constantly harassing your
Speaker 1: daughter to the point she is wanting to consider suicide
Speaker 1: and keeping that up for months and months and months. Well, folks,
Speaker 1: stay here, because next we are going to tell you
Speaker 1: what the mom says her logic is for doing, and
Speaker 1: you decide whether or not you buy it or not
Speaker 1: that this woman desperately needs help.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Amy and TG where we are talking
Speaker 2: about Unknown Number, the High School Catfish. It is the
Speaker 2: number one movie on Netflix. We just finished watching it
Speaker 2: and we are still reeling. You are actually listening, as
Speaker 2: I know you all know, to two horror movie fanatics.
Speaker 2: We love thrillers, We love horror movies. We love plot twist,
Speaker 2: we love a good script with great writing. I have
Speaker 2: to say, this documentary, this thing that actually happened in
Speaker 2: a small town in Michigan, had me reeling in a
Speaker 2: way that very few horror movies can even accomplish. Where
Speaker 2: I I we usually can figure out who probably the
Speaker 2: killer might be, and it's not that shock. This just
Speaker 2: shook me. I was shocked.
Speaker 1: You know you you bring up the horror movie thing
Speaker 1: and let me see you made me think of it
Speaker 1: just now. There's some horror movies at the end that
Speaker 1: you get the twist and you go, that's so stupid,
Speaker 1: that doesn't make sense, that would never actually happened. That
Speaker 1: was the twist at the end of this, like, of
Speaker 1: course it's not the mom. That's dumb.
Speaker 2: Actually, Babe. When they started, I thought they were breadcrumbing
Speaker 2: us and there was gonna be some other twist when
Speaker 2: it seemed as though all of the evidence pointed to
Speaker 2: Lauren's mom, Kendra, and you and I looked at each other.
Speaker 2: We said, there's more like, there's no way it's her,
Speaker 2: Like they're just they're just they're making us think it's Kendra,
Speaker 2: but it's not actually Kendra. That's much. We didn't believe
Speaker 2: it when they started setting it up, and then it
Speaker 2: wasn't until Kendra herself fully admits it and we thought,
Speaker 2: oh my god, this actually is what happened.
Speaker 1: Like, I challenge you to watch this without like literally
Speaker 1: your jaw dropping, literally your jaw will drop in watching
Speaker 1: and like you said, Rob, this is something you cannot
Speaker 1: make up. This is a true story of what happened.
Speaker 1: Now the mom, of course, she's a part of the documentary.
Speaker 1: Now that's another brilliant part of this, and that the
Speaker 1: first again, third to two thirds and where they're explaining
Speaker 1: and setting up the story Kendra, we don't know she's
Speaker 1: the actual culprit. They have her as a part of
Speaker 1: the documentary, just as a concerned parent.
Speaker 2: So you really think that she's a part of the solution, yes,
Speaker 2: or at least trying to find a solution for her daughter.
Speaker 2: And she seems like that carrying, doting mom who wants
Speaker 2: to figure out who's doing this to her poor child.
Speaker 2: And so that also creates just this total bombshell of
Speaker 2: a moment when you realize that Kendra actually is the
Speaker 2: person behind all of the hate. And look, when we're
Speaker 2: looking for the why, because that's of course the next
Speaker 2: thing you think, how could a mom do this? But
Speaker 2: why would a mom do this? And yes, okay, fine,
Speaker 2: she might have been obsessed with Owen, she might have
Speaker 2: had some weird fantasy about him, but that still doesn't
Speaker 2: explain how cruel she was to her daughter. She still
Speaker 2: could have done something to break them up. And once
Speaker 2: she broke them up, it didn't end. She just kept
Speaker 2: on with her daughter in such a cruel fashion. And
Speaker 2: when we heard from the investigators, the detectives and their theory.
Speaker 2: All of a sudden, a light bulb went off, Munchausen, where, Look,
Speaker 2: I'm only familiar with this as some people are. I
Speaker 2: did the Gypsy Rose case back in the day, where
Speaker 2: you have a mom who tries to make her daughter
Speaker 2: or her child sick so that she then gets sympathy,
Speaker 2: but they're actually causing their child to be physically unwell
Speaker 2: by either poisoning them slowly or whatever. But it's all
Speaker 2: about getting attention and being the caregiver in chief, basically,
Speaker 2: where you're needed and you're wanted and you're getting attention.
Speaker 2: So the theory is that perhaps Kendra did this so
Speaker 2: that she then could be there for her daughter and
Speaker 2: forged this beautiful bond in connection at a time when
Speaker 2: we know our teenage daughters kind of drift off and
Speaker 2: they have boyfriends and friends, and they go to high
Speaker 2: school and suddenly mom isn't as important. So if she's
Speaker 2: being bullied, who's she going to run to? Her mom?
Speaker 2: So how crazy is it that Kendra would be bullying
Speaker 2: her daughter only to be able to be the one
Speaker 2: to comfort her when she came home.
Speaker 1: Okay, Munchausen syndrome. That's she didn't mention it. I think
Speaker 1: other she mention, and others did mention that as a possibility.
Speaker 1: What she mentioned essentially is that she was ill, she
Speaker 1: didn't know how much help she needed, she hadn't dealt
Speaker 1: with trauma from her past. She does at some point
Speaker 1: talk about she had been raped at the age of seventeen,
Speaker 1: and some of that trauma she has not and had
Speaker 1: not dealt with. She talked about the possibility that she
Speaker 1: was seeing herself and some of the negativity she was
Speaker 1: saying that she was too herself was too thin, she
Speaker 1: had own issues with her own bodies. So some of
Speaker 1: the messages she was sending to her daughter were almost
Speaker 1: maybe even talking to herself. Do you I don't understand
Speaker 1: as in no way. I didn't study the trauma and
Speaker 1: what makes people behave in certain ways. But she explained
Speaker 1: things about herself that I think. Maybe we talk to
Speaker 1: a therapist they would say, Okay, I can see this,
Speaker 1: I can see this, and I can see this. I
Speaker 1: think this woman is complicated and I think she went
Speaker 1: through something, But I just don't think you a normal
Speaker 1: person does this. And I don't want to dismiss her
Speaker 1: as just evil or a hateful woman. I don't know
Speaker 1: what to label her ass I don't know what category
Speaker 1: to put her in, but I'm trying to understand because
Speaker 1: what she has done is so far. The messages again,
Speaker 1: I don't think we're doing a good service, Robes, because
Speaker 1: the message is so bad.
Speaker 2: I actually am uncomfortable saying the messages out. Yes, and
Speaker 2: I think anyone who's listening to this at this point
Speaker 2: has watched it, so they know what we're talking. We
Speaker 2: don't even need to repeat them. But here's my I
Speaker 2: appreciate what you just said, and I am as well,
Speaker 2: trying to not be as judgmental as I want to
Speaker 2: be because that was my reaction as a mom and
Speaker 2: as a human, because I believe she must have I
Speaker 2: got I hope in the sense in terms of a defense,
Speaker 2: that she did go through something that created this version
Speaker 2: of her. But I see a mom who wants to
Speaker 2: be center of attention. I see a mom who is narcissistic.
Speaker 2: I see a mom who doesn't care who she hurts
Speaker 2: to get the attention or feed the desires she has.
Speaker 2: And if anything, to project your pain and your trauma
Speaker 2: onto your daughter, I don't think it's a natural thing.
Speaker 2: I think we try to avoid it. We all mess
Speaker 2: up our kids to some degree without realizing it. But
Speaker 2: this was so intentional, This was so hurtful. This was
Speaker 2: not done in a moment of passion or fury or frustration.
Speaker 2: But this was done repeatedly, persistently, methodically, and to me,
Speaker 2: that is what makes it so evil. And then to
Speaker 2: justify it by saying, well, I had my own trauma.
Speaker 2: It's I think she found aha moment where there is
Speaker 2: some truth to that, and then tries to use that
Speaker 2: to justify all of her atrocious behavior and to point
Speaker 2: out the level of manipulation this poor girl, Lauren, and
Speaker 2: you see her on the documentary. I think one of
Speaker 2: the most heartbreaking things about it for me was to
Speaker 2: hear Lauren talk about how she loves her mom so
Speaker 2: much and wants to have a relationship with her. She's
Speaker 2: desperate for her mom's love. There was some sort of
Speaker 2: dynamic created over the years where there was this neediness
Speaker 2: that Lauren needed Kendra, and Kendra needed Lauren to need her,
Speaker 2: and when she saw Lauren slip away, she created a
Speaker 2: bigger need for her. And somehow it's so sad Lauren
Speaker 2: cannot break free from it.
Speaker 1: No kin, that's I'm sure that's the way a lot
Speaker 1: of people see it, and I'm not there. I think
Speaker 1: there is something. As I watch, there was something very
Speaker 1: loving about that mother and taking care of that child.
Speaker 2: She loved how it made her feel to have Lauren
Speaker 2: love her again.
Speaker 1: I'm not going to put that on that woman from
Speaker 1: that child's birth to she sent that first nasty message
Speaker 1: is that that woman was never genuinely in love with
Speaker 1: that child and a mother to that child. Now, I
Speaker 1: also will acknowledge that there is something possibly that happened
Speaker 1: to this woman that messed her up, sure mesked her
Speaker 1: up real bad. And she kept she referred to and
Speaker 1: she said, I spiraled and this all got out of control,
Speaker 1: and I believe and she said it was an escape
Speaker 1: from real life, is what she used. I am. We
Speaker 1: all are looking for an answer because none of us
Speaker 1: can understand. You see the messages and you go, how
Speaker 1: could anybody send this to somebody? Then you hear that
Speaker 1: a mother sent it to her thirteen year old child. Way,
Speaker 1: I feel sick, no way to understand that. The one
Speaker 1: thing where I am a little I pause on any
Speaker 1: of this. For whatever reason, she didn't come across that
Speaker 1: sincerely scary and sympathetically in the way she was talking
Speaker 1: and giving some of these answers, it was bizarre how
Speaker 1: she was coming.
Speaker 2: She was removed emotionally.
Speaker 1: And you know what, then that probably speaks to something
Speaker 1: in her as well. I this is an awful, awful,
Speaker 1: awful start.
Speaker 2: I think, what's scary about it? Look, obviously, this, thank God,
Speaker 2: is not in any way, shape or form anything we've
Speaker 2: ever heard of before. But just to recognize, oh my goodness,
Speaker 2: that people are capable of this is I think the
Speaker 2: scariest thing of all to me. This documentary was way
Speaker 2: more frightening than any horror movie I have ever watched.
Speaker 1: But it also reminded, I mean, take out the dynamic
Speaker 1: at the end, at least the reveal, but also showed
Speaker 1: you just how just how much of an impact words
Speaker 1: can have. Text messages from somebody they didn't know, ended relationships,
Speaker 1: inded friendships, ended marriages, inded families, people lost homes, all
Speaker 1: these things over text messages. That was a scary part
Speaker 1: of it, as well as far as the entertainment about
Speaker 1: Netflix and all of that. The documentary was just really
Speaker 1: really weren't done well. It really done well. But man,
Speaker 1: you all check it out and have whatever conversation you
Speaker 1: need to have with your kids, with your loved ones.
Speaker 1: But man, and be mindful of folks. I don't know
Speaker 1: why I'm I'm usually that guy, but I'm trying to
Speaker 1: listen and understand before I just completely condemn what I find.
Speaker 2: To be just indefensible, indefensible. What you did, it is indefensible,
Speaker 2: But I do like your takeaway and I think it's
Speaker 2: a good way to end that we all should always
Speaker 2: remember to be mindful of the power of our words.
Speaker 2: Let's use them for good. So thank you for listening
Speaker 2: to us tonight. I made Robock alongside TJ. Hilmes. Have
Speaker 2: a good night, everybody.