1 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:09,160 Speaker 1: In this episode of news World. Congressman Bruce Westerman represents 2 00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:13,960 Speaker 1: Arkansas's fourth Congressional district in the US House Representatives, where 3 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: he serves on the Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure and 4 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:21,079 Speaker 1: as chairman of the Committee on Natural Resources. Prior to 5 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: serving in Congress, Chairman Westerman worked for twenty two years 6 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 1: at Mid South Engineering in Hount Springs. He served as 7 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:31,480 Speaker 1: a board member for the Fountain League School District and 8 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 1: was later elected to two terms in the Arkansas General Assembly, 9 00:00:35,479 --> 00:00:38,840 Speaker 1: where he was the state's first Republican House majority leader 10 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: since reconstruction. He's joining the today to discuss bipartisan legislation 11 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:50,640 Speaker 1: known as the speed Act, which stands for Standardizing Permitting 12 00:00:50,680 --> 00:01:06,840 Speaker 1: and Expediting Economic de Almanite Bruce, Welcome and thank you 13 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:08,040 Speaker 1: for joining me the NETS World. 14 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 2: Well, thank you, mister speaker. It's great to be on 15 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:14,080 Speaker 2: newts World. And I'm a fan of your podcasts and 16 00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 2: I found out about it through my quest to do 17 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:19,960 Speaker 2: permitting reform. I'd read a book by a guy named 18 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:23,920 Speaker 2: Philip Howard talking about how We've got to save Americas 19 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 2: can do, and I was curious if he had done 20 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 2: any podcasts, and I found that you had him on 21 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 2: a podcast. So appreciate what you do and the way 22 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,000 Speaker 2: you highlight important issues and get the word out and 23 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:38,240 Speaker 2: obviously all the service that you've given to our country. 24 00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:40,600 Speaker 2: And they're with your wife in Switzerland. 25 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:45,440 Speaker 1: Now you mentioned Howard, He's really a smart guy. I'm 26 00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:47,199 Speaker 1: delighted that you've connected with him. 27 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:49,960 Speaker 2: Well, I've not connected with him. I've just read his book, 28 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 2: and I feel like I've connected with him and listened 29 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 2: to him on your podcast. 30 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 1: I'm sure he'd be delighted to come and visit because 31 00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 1: he is a genuine passion for trying to get us 32 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:02,120 Speaker 1: out of the bureau percy and back to being effective. 33 00:02:02,720 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 1: Now you've intrigued me because of all of the talking 34 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:09,520 Speaker 1: we have gone on right now about affordability. It really 35 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 1: hit me that a lot of the affordability problems come 36 00:02:13,680 --> 00:02:18,279 Speaker 1: directly out of the way in which big government socialism 37 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,800 Speaker 1: fevers more and more regulations makes it harder and harder 38 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:25,560 Speaker 1: to get anything done and artificially raises the cost from 39 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: what it would have been thirty or forty years ago. 40 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:32,400 Speaker 1: And you've said the National Environmental Policy Act, and quoting 41 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:36,160 Speaker 1: you now is a more than half century old permitting 42 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,480 Speaker 1: process that has overdue for a tune up. If we 43 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:41,960 Speaker 1: could start at the basics, because most of us really 44 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 1: don't have the kind of knowledge you do. What was 45 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: the Act originally supposed to do back when they first 46 00:02:48,880 --> 00:02:49,320 Speaker 1: passed it. 47 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:53,080 Speaker 2: This was in the late sixties early seventies, when we 48 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:57,240 Speaker 2: started putting a lot more emphasis on the environment, and 49 00:02:57,280 --> 00:02:58,760 Speaker 2: a lot of law has passed in. You had the 50 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 2: Clean Water Act, the Claim Air Act, you had the 51 00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:05,400 Speaker 2: Endangered Species Act, followed by the Marine Mammal Protection Act, 52 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 2: a lot of underlying statutes that were specifically put in 53 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 2: place to help clean up the environment. There were good laws, 54 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 2: a lot of good things came from that, but over 55 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 2: the years they've been weaponized. And NEPA was kind of 56 00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:23,160 Speaker 2: the first environmental law and it was put in place 57 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 2: as a process to analyze things before we got stuff 58 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 2: like the Clean Air Act and the Clean Water Act, 59 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 2: And over time NEPA's become this massive kind of a 60 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 2: spider web if you think of it in a flow chart, 61 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 2: where you get in these continuous do loops and you 62 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 2: can't get out. And as a result, on average, it 63 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 2: takes four to five years to get a permit through 64 00:03:48,240 --> 00:03:51,600 Speaker 2: NEPA and when you're talking about mining, you can measure 65 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 2: it in decades. The National Mining Association says it takes 66 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 2: twenty nine years from the time you find a resource 67 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 2: until you're producing that resource in a mind in the 68 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 2: United States. And you know what that's led to. It's 69 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 2: led to China dominating critical minerals and rare earth. And 70 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 2: I'm so glad you mentioned affordability because this bureaucratic morass 71 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 2: that's been created by NEPA has created costs that they're 72 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:21,400 Speaker 2: not seen out in the open, Their costs that go 73 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 2: into producing things that consumers ultimately pay for, and they 74 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:29,840 Speaker 2: don't realize that these costs are there. NEPA affects everything, 75 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:33,240 Speaker 2: really with a federal nexus, whether you're trying to build 76 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:36,719 Speaker 2: a road, a bridge, build a navigable waterway, or a 77 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 2: port or an airport, even managing our forest, developing energy projects, poplines, 78 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 2: transmission lines. There's probably not any one issue that affects 79 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:53,359 Speaker 2: every American more than NEPA, other than tax policy that 80 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:57,760 Speaker 2: gets everyone pretty much. But somewhere or another, the NEPA 81 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 2: process affects all America rea. 82 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: Isn't that fair to say that unless we can reform this, 83 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: we will never be able to compete with China because 84 00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:10,640 Speaker 1: they can actually go out and build something as we 85 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:14,159 Speaker 1: start with lawyers and we have to litigate for years 86 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 1: before we build anything. 87 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 2: They are building things right now at a very rapid taste. 88 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 2: They're building coal fired plants at over one hundred gigawatts 89 00:05:24,839 --> 00:05:27,160 Speaker 2: a year. The last coal fired plant built in the 90 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 2: United States was in my district in twenty ten, and 91 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,240 Speaker 2: we've shut a lot of coal plants down. But China 92 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 2: is building one equivalent to that plant in my district 93 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 2: about every two days, which is hard to get your 94 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:42,799 Speaker 2: mind around. And you know, we've got this huge demand 95 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 2: for electricity for AI and data and also if we 96 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 2: want to reshore things here in America, we're going to 97 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:52,479 Speaker 2: need more electricity for manufacturing. And we're really behind the 98 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 2: eight ball without the opportunity to build things like we 99 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 2: used to be able to build things here in this country. 100 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,680 Speaker 2: So getting the permitting is the first step in being 101 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 2: able to build in America again and to win the 102 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:07,839 Speaker 2: AI battle and critical minerals and rrors and all of 103 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 2: that good stuff. 104 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:14,279 Speaker 1: Is it accurate to say that unless we can cut 105 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:17,279 Speaker 1: through the red tape that we have a real danger 106 00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 1: of losing on artificial intelligence, not because of the scientists, 107 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:26,080 Speaker 1: but because in base electricity you need in order to 108 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: be able to run those kind of very complicated. 109 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:32,560 Speaker 2: Systems exactly, and we can't lose that race. It's a 110 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:36,800 Speaker 2: national security issue when you think about AI. So what's 111 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 2: going to happen if we don't build more generation and 112 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:44,160 Speaker 2: transmission is the AI companies are going to be competing 113 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 2: with residents and commercial users, so you're going to have 114 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 2: not enough supply and increased demands. So we know that 115 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 2: means that the price goes up. So as we talk 116 00:06:53,680 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 2: about affordability, it's crucial that we allow new generation and 117 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:02,679 Speaker 2: transmission to be built so that we're not increasing process 118 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:07,599 Speaker 2: and making ourselves in short supply on electricity and the data. 119 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:10,600 Speaker 2: Companies are willing to fund these projects, but they just 120 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 2: have to be able to build them. 121 00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:14,280 Speaker 1: The money can sit in the bank, but if you 122 00:07:14,320 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: don't know the bureaucracy's signing off, you're not going to 123 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:18,080 Speaker 1: get it out of the bank. 124 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 2: Right, And what NEPA has done and the abuse of 125 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:24,000 Speaker 2: our other environmental laws, it's put a wet blanket on 126 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:28,080 Speaker 2: investments in our country. People would love to invest in 127 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 2: our country everywhere I travel. Recently, countries are saying we 128 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,800 Speaker 2: would like to invest in America because they know it's 129 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:37,480 Speaker 2: a good investment, but nobody's going to invest if they 130 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 2: can't get a return on that money. And they've seen 131 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:44,040 Speaker 2: examples of the Keystone popeline where billions of dollars were 132 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:47,160 Speaker 2: spent and a drop of oil never went through that pipeline. 133 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 2: There's a mine in Arizona that there's been two billion 134 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:54,559 Speaker 2: dollars spent on it and they've never mined an ounce 135 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 2: of copper out of it. The process has stopped right 136 00:07:57,000 --> 00:08:00,800 Speaker 2: now because of an injunction through the NEPA process. And 137 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 2: that's what we're trying to fix with permitting reforms to 138 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,520 Speaker 2: make it where people will have certainty that they can 139 00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 2: go through the process in a timely manner, get their 140 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 2: permit and build things. 141 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:15,200 Speaker 1: And don't you also almost up to you to like 142 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:18,200 Speaker 1: a one stop at a place where you can shop, 143 00:08:18,280 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 1: because otherwise you can end up with so many different 144 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:25,440 Speaker 1: regulators with so many different kind of rules that it 145 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: just becomes mindless. 146 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 2: That's correct, and we do that in the Speed Act 147 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 2: as well. And we also give states a better seat 148 00:08:32,679 --> 00:08:35,720 Speaker 2: at the table because we get a lot of duplicity 149 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 2: on top of having multiple federal agencies in charge. So 150 00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:41,839 Speaker 2: we want to streamline it, have one person or one 151 00:08:41,880 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 2: group in charge, and then take down roadblocks and obstacles 152 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 2: that have been added on to NIPA throughout the years. 153 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 2: You know, there was this seven Counties decision out of 154 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 2: the Supreme Court for a case in Utah where the 155 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:01,400 Speaker 2: Supreme Court said in a unanimous decision that NIPA is 156 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:05,319 Speaker 2: a process. It's a procedural statue. It cannot dictate outcomes. 157 00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:07,960 Speaker 2: So we're going to codify that in the Speed Act 158 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:12,120 Speaker 2: and make it a streamlined process. I continue, we will 159 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 2: have better environmental conditions because we can permit quickly and 160 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,840 Speaker 2: do things that are better for the environment by building 161 00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:23,560 Speaker 2: them here in America. But I hate to say the left, 162 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 2: because this is a bipartisan build with the far left, 163 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 2: seems like they just don't want to build here in 164 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 2: our country and they're using the permitting process to stop that. 165 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:35,480 Speaker 2: But if you truly care about the environment, you would 166 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 2: want to process that allows you to develop new kinds 167 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:40,959 Speaker 2: of energy, that allows you to take care of our 168 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:45,360 Speaker 2: forest and our infrastructure in a way that is better 169 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 2: for the environment in the long run. 170 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: Isn't it fair to say that any kind of regulatory 171 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:56,000 Speaker 1: process which discourages investment in the US and leads them 172 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 1: to occur in China or in a thirderal country is 173 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: almost guaranteed to be more environmentally destructive than if you 174 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:05,679 Speaker 1: have some did it right here in the United. 175 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 2: States, without question, we do things cleaner, safer, healthier, and 176 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 2: more efficiently than anybody else in the world. When we 177 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:17,559 Speaker 2: on leash American innovation and we're allowed to do that, 178 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:21,599 Speaker 2: it not only puts a wet blanket on investments, that 179 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 2: puts a wet blanket on innovation. That's been our edge 180 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:26,960 Speaker 2: in this country for so long that we've been able 181 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 2: to innovate and stay ahead of the curve. But if 182 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:34,040 Speaker 2: you can't build what you dream, then someday we're going 183 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:51,400 Speaker 2: to lose that innovative advantage. 184 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 1: One of the examples, but I know you know well, 185 00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:58,920 Speaker 1: is the effort to build a three hundred mile pipeline 186 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 1: from Westwodgin in to Virginia. Can you talk just a 187 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:04,960 Speaker 1: little bit about it. It's sort of crazy how these 188 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 1: things to Boo Moon and cost. 189 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:10,679 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the Mountain Valley popeline, and that was a 190 00:11:10,720 --> 00:11:14,599 Speaker 2: provision that Joe Manchin basically got spelled out in the 191 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 2: I guess that was in the IRA or the IJA. 192 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:20,840 Speaker 2: One of those bills was passed during the Obama administration, 193 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 2: and it was some of the most explicit legislation that 194 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:28,840 Speaker 2: I've ever seen. It was almost like it came from scripture. 195 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:32,040 Speaker 2: They shall build a pipeline, and it shall go through 196 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 2: this area, and nothing shall impede its development. But you 197 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,600 Speaker 2: think about natural gas is one of the cleanest forms 198 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:42,440 Speaker 2: of energy that we have. My co sponsor on the bill, 199 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 2: Jared Golden, the Democrat from Maine. One of his main 200 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:50,679 Speaker 2: concerns is they're burning heating oil in Maine and he 201 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:52,680 Speaker 2: even came to me and asked if I could help 202 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:57,840 Speaker 2: him get an LNG import facility in Maine because they're 203 00:11:57,880 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 2: blocking popelines going through New Hampshire, Massachusetts in New York, 204 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 2: and all he wants is affordable, clean energy for his constituents, 205 00:12:07,960 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 2: But you cannot get a popline permitted up through that area. 206 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 2: And people think of the Permian Basin in Texas and Alaska, 207 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:18,520 Speaker 2: but the largest deposit of natural gas in the planet 208 00:12:18,880 --> 00:12:22,080 Speaker 2: is in the Marcellus and Judifacheale there in Pennsylvania and 209 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:26,319 Speaker 2: New York and Ohio. It's right there available for the northeast. 210 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 2: But if you can't get a popline to use it, 211 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 2: it's of no use to you. 212 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 1: Say a farmer, if you have two cousins who own 213 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:40,280 Speaker 1: farms and warms in Pennsylvania and the others twenty miles 214 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 1: away in New York, because New York will not allow 215 00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:48,560 Speaker 1: them to develop the Marcella shale. So the cousin who 216 00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:51,880 Speaker 1: lives in Pennsylvania is making a tremendous amount of money 217 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,199 Speaker 1: out of this product which is right there on his land, 218 00:12:56,480 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 1: the exact same product twenty miles away. The kind of 219 00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 1: get to it because the state Gilmont, I mean, the 220 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:08,480 Speaker 1: mount to much New York has itself made people poor 221 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:12,240 Speaker 1: with that kind of regulation. It's just I think crazy. 222 00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:15,200 Speaker 2: I don't think that's what our founders were dreaming about 223 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 2: two hundred and fifty years ago. 224 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:20,320 Speaker 1: I don't think that George Washington, who was very big 225 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:24,880 Speaker 1: on development, would have understood the current attitudes. Let me 226 00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:28,400 Speaker 1: ask you, though we have made some reforms then you've 227 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:31,120 Speaker 1: been involved in and as I understand that the Fiscal 228 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 1: Responsibility Act of twenty twenty three actually made some significant 229 00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:40,200 Speaker 1: changes in the national Environmental Policy Act. Can you sort 230 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 1: of explain the progress we have made. 231 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, So that was the famous budget cat deal when 232 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:50,440 Speaker 2: Speaker McCarthy was Speaker of the House, and we got 233 00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:54,720 Speaker 2: some concessions on putting tomlines on doing something called an 234 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:57,760 Speaker 2: environmental analysis, and we said that could only be one 235 00:13:57,840 --> 00:14:02,080 Speaker 2: hundred pages in one year, or an environmental impact statement, 236 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:05,040 Speaker 2: so that could be two hundred pages or two years, 237 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:09,680 Speaker 2: which never really got implemented during the Biden administration. But 238 00:14:09,800 --> 00:14:14,560 Speaker 2: what we found out is that the bureaucrats said, Okay, 239 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 2: we'll follow that one year and two year guideline. There's 240 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 2: no requirements on how long we can delay before we 241 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:25,680 Speaker 2: actually start the process. So they're delaying months and years 242 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 2: before they ever start the time clock, and then once 243 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 2: they get the decision, they'll delay issuing the permit. So 244 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:36,800 Speaker 2: we're fixing that in the Speed Act. A lot of 245 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:39,920 Speaker 2: this should just be common sense, and it's frustrating that 246 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 2: you have to pass laws in Congress to try to 247 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 2: outthink what the bureaucracy is going to do. But I 248 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 2: think we've got them finally in the corner on this one. 249 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:51,720 Speaker 2: If we can get the Speed Act passed. 250 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:55,360 Speaker 1: Did it strikes whether you do have some people who 251 00:14:55,400 --> 00:15:00,600 Speaker 1: want to end the government for the purposes of stopping everything, 252 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 1: not for the purpose of helping it. 253 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,240 Speaker 2: And the system's rigged for people who want to stop something. 254 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 2: It's very difficult to build things, but if you've got 255 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 2: enough money and some lawyers, you can stop just about 256 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 2: anything in our country. I came from a background where 257 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:20,280 Speaker 2: I did engineering work for twenty or twenty five years. 258 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:25,120 Speaker 2: I understand the frustrations of the people that are really 259 00:15:25,640 --> 00:15:29,280 Speaker 2: focused every day, working hard, trying to build something, and 260 00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 2: then all of a sudden, it's like this curve ball 261 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:34,520 Speaker 2: comes out of left field that nobody was expecting, and 262 00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:37,560 Speaker 2: it's somebody that shouldn't even be involved in the process 263 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:39,640 Speaker 2: is saying, well, you got to do it this way, 264 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:43,440 Speaker 2: or we've got to delay, and the cost just goes 265 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:47,400 Speaker 2: through the roof. McKenzie put out a report in July 266 00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 2: of this year looking at just public infrastructure projects, and 267 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:54,680 Speaker 2: they looked at a four year window because these projects 268 00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:58,160 Speaker 2: public infrastructure takes around six years to get a permit. 269 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:02,400 Speaker 2: But they analyze the four year window and they said 270 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 2: that it's costing Americans two point seven trillion dollars for 271 00:16:07,480 --> 00:16:10,840 Speaker 2: these public infrastructure projects. That are held up in permitting. 272 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 2: And part of that is the extra cost of doing 273 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:16,320 Speaker 2: the permit. It's a big part of it is the 274 00:16:16,360 --> 00:16:20,080 Speaker 2: cost that the project takes on because it's being delayed 275 00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:22,920 Speaker 2: and you have to mobilize and demobilize and all of that. 276 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:27,080 Speaker 2: But then you've got this big opportunity cost that's lost 277 00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:29,600 Speaker 2: because you don't have a breach replaced, and you've got 278 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 2: traffic congested. And again, these are hidden costs that every 279 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 2: American's paying, and they don't realize that. At the root 280 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 2: of that is the permitting laws. 281 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:42,440 Speaker 1: And I think this is a listening for the average citizen. Ruiz. 282 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 1: When you get to legislation that is this big and 283 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 1: this complicated, it takes time to think it through, to 284 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: study it, to put together the right language, to make 285 00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:56,200 Speaker 1: sure that the hearings where people can command and help 286 00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:59,520 Speaker 1: you improve it. How long have you personally been working 287 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:00,600 Speaker 1: on the speed at. 288 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:04,000 Speaker 2: The policy and the Speed Act. I've been working on 289 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:06,200 Speaker 2: it for eight years. 290 00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,359 Speaker 1: It's complicated to build a bridge. It's complicated to write 291 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:11,879 Speaker 1: the law to improve regulations. 292 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:14,320 Speaker 2: For building the bridge exactly. And in this instance, we've 293 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:16,320 Speaker 2: got to have sixty votes in the Senate, so it 294 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:18,920 Speaker 2: has to be bi partisan. This bill will not get 295 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 2: signed into law without bipartisan votes, So we've got to 296 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:25,800 Speaker 2: work with our colleagues across the aisle that will work 297 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:28,440 Speaker 2: with us on it. We've actually built a great coalition 298 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:33,639 Speaker 2: with our Democrat co sponsors, and we've got letters of 299 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 2: support from all fifty states and over two hundred and 300 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:43,960 Speaker 2: thirty different letters from organizations that range from energy companies 301 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:49,480 Speaker 2: to data centers to people in construction to utilities. It's 302 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 2: a wide variety of people who realize just how important 303 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:55,879 Speaker 2: permitting reform is. So we've built a huge amount of 304 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,760 Speaker 2: momentum and there's a lot of conversations taking place on 305 00:17:59,800 --> 00:18:02,400 Speaker 2: how do we get the Speed Act not only out 306 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:05,040 Speaker 2: of the House, but through the Senate and signed into law. 307 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:08,240 Speaker 1: And you know the sense that you'll be able to 308 00:18:08,240 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 1: get it done in this Congress. 309 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, we plan to get the bill to the Senate 310 00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:15,199 Speaker 2: before the end of the year, and the Senate is 311 00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:19,320 Speaker 2: working on their version of permitting reform as well. Having 312 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:22,160 Speaker 2: been the Speaker of the House, you understand there's only 313 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 2: so much we can do. We can give them the 314 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:26,439 Speaker 2: bill and then you've got to deal with the Senate. 315 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:28,639 Speaker 2: But you've got to take it one step at a time. 316 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:31,399 Speaker 2: But we are trying to work with the Senate and 317 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:34,320 Speaker 2: with the Administration to make sure that we've got all 318 00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:37,480 Speaker 2: of our bases covered in the bill that we send over. 319 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:42,119 Speaker 1: I think we have a three part process I've begun 320 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:46,440 Speaker 1: to work on about affordability, and one part of it 321 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:51,000 Speaker 1: is the things that exists in the current system that 322 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 1: make everything less affordable. You can produce out of your 323 00:18:54,760 --> 00:19:00,399 Speaker 1: committee trillions of dollars that we could take out of 324 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:04,320 Speaker 1: the current costs over the next decade that will clearly 325 00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:07,679 Speaker 1: make America more affordable. I mean, if that sound about. 326 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:12,159 Speaker 2: Right and more when you think about if we start 327 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:17,000 Speaker 2: using our resources and building here. So the USGS use 328 00:19:17,119 --> 00:19:21,520 Speaker 2: Geological Survey. They do a report every year on material 329 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:25,520 Speaker 2: that's mined and processed in the United States, and they've 330 00:19:25,560 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 2: been doing this for a long time. Currently, we produce 331 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:32,440 Speaker 2: about one hundred and twenty billion dollars worth of raw 332 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:37,320 Speaker 2: material and recycle material. That's net of imports and exports. 333 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:42,440 Speaker 2: When that material gets processed into metals or the next product. 334 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:46,520 Speaker 2: This includes aggregates everything that you mind, it's worth almost 335 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:49,240 Speaker 2: a trillion dollars. So you take one hundred and twenty 336 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 2: billion dollars worth of raw material. You process it and 337 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 2: refine it, and you've got a trillion dollars of material. 338 00:19:57,520 --> 00:19:59,919 Speaker 2: You put that into the economy and it's worth three 339 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:03,199 Speaker 2: two point seven trillion dollars to our GDP. So you 340 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:05,920 Speaker 2: take one hundred and twenty billion dollars of raw material 341 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:08,920 Speaker 2: and it has a three point seven trillion dollar impact 342 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:13,640 Speaker 2: in our economy. You know this. Over time, the federal 343 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:17,920 Speaker 2: tax revenue runs about fifteen or sixteen percent of the GDP, 344 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 2: So if you grow the economy by trillion dollars, you're 345 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:25,639 Speaker 2: adding another one hundred and fifty billion dollars of revenue 346 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:30,160 Speaker 2: to the budget to help reduce the deficit. You're also 347 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:33,679 Speaker 2: employing more people. For every one percent we increase the 348 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 2: labor participation rate, we grow the economy of trillion dollars. 349 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 2: So you've got all these other benefits on top of 350 00:20:42,119 --> 00:20:45,879 Speaker 2: having better national security, you get better jobs, a stronger economy, 351 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:49,720 Speaker 2: and it's just crazy that we've not been doing more 352 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:50,600 Speaker 2: of this all along. 353 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:57,040 Speaker 1: Do you find a substantial number of Democrats understand the 354 00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:01,359 Speaker 1: importance of this kind of economic development and actually the 355 00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 1: national security crisis that we're going to be in both 356 00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:08,000 Speaker 1: in terms of minding key things and in terms of 357 00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 1: energy production for artificial intelligence. Is there a growing bipartisan 358 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:15,760 Speaker 1: awareness of how realness is. 359 00:21:16,440 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 2: There is and we have to take advantage of that 360 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:24,520 Speaker 2: while we can. The advent of data and AI and 361 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:27,440 Speaker 2: the realization of how much energy it's going to take 362 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:30,400 Speaker 2: for that, I think has gotten everybody's attention on both 363 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 2: sides of the aisle, and also understanding the impacts that 364 00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:36,359 Speaker 2: can have on energy affordability. If you've got all this 365 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:39,919 Speaker 2: new consumption taking place and you're not able to supply it, 366 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:44,919 Speaker 2: that's a big issue. The other thing is in the 367 00:21:44,960 --> 00:21:49,800 Speaker 2: Inflation Reduction Act, the Democrats approved a lot of projects 368 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:53,320 Speaker 2: that they found out they couldn't get their projects permitted either. 369 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:56,000 Speaker 2: It kind of brought a dose of reality to everyone 370 00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:59,119 Speaker 2: that if you want to build in our country, you 371 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 2: can't do it under the current permitting system. So I 372 00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:06,119 Speaker 2: think people are realizing the situation we're in, and it 373 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 2: has created a bipartisan effort to get permitting reform done. 374 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:13,159 Speaker 1: Yeah. I saw a study and said that on the 375 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:18,720 Speaker 1: expansion of the New York Subway that it would cost 376 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: eight to ten times what the same expansion would cost 377 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:24,920 Speaker 1: in London or Paris. 378 00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:28,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think Philip Howard actually mentioned that in his book, 379 00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:31,520 Speaker 2: talking about the original construction and how much it would 380 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:35,640 Speaker 2: cost today. There's so many examples. I know you're from Georgia. 381 00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:39,040 Speaker 2: The last runway at the Atlanta Airport, it took eleven 382 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:42,040 Speaker 2: years to build it. It actually only took eighteen months 383 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 2: to build it, but it took nine and a half 384 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,080 Speaker 2: years to get the permit to build it. It's just 385 00:22:46,200 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 2: crazy stuff like that. 386 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:09,840 Speaker 1: I want this also have a significant impact both at 387 00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:14,639 Speaker 1: the War Department and NASA on making it faster to 388 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:17,440 Speaker 1: do the kind of construction and the kind of things 389 00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:18,400 Speaker 1: they need to get done. 390 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 2: Absolutely. You know, I've traveled around and talked to military commanders, 391 00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 2: and I'll never forget a guy out in the Pacific 392 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 2: telling me that the Chinese Communist Party understand our environmental 393 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,760 Speaker 2: law is better than we do. And at the time 394 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,959 Speaker 2: China was building an island on a coral reef, like 395 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 2: hauling big rocks out in the ocean and dumping them 396 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 2: on a coral reef to build an island to put 397 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:46,840 Speaker 2: military assets on. We were trying to redevelop a site 398 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:50,240 Speaker 2: on Tinian where the bombers took off with the atomic bombs. 399 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,240 Speaker 2: That was one of the largest airfields in the world 400 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:56,159 Speaker 2: back in World War Two and had grown up in 401 00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 2: the jungle, and the military wanted to go in and 402 00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:02,400 Speaker 2: redevelop a little piece of that total dead end. They 403 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:05,800 Speaker 2: could not get the permits to go in and redevelop 404 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:09,440 Speaker 2: this site that was strategic to our national security. Yeah, 405 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:12,600 Speaker 2: it has a major impact on the Department of War, 406 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:16,119 Speaker 2: talk about the corp of engineers and the projects that 407 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:20,160 Speaker 2: they do. It creates a tremendous additional cost for government 408 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 2: funded infrastructure. 409 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 1: People really often don't realize that the original purpose of 410 00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:31,360 Speaker 1: creating West Point was to produce engineers. Robert E. Lee, 411 00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:34,760 Speaker 1: for example, it's about part of his early career developing 412 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:39,680 Speaker 1: the port at Saint Louis. And nowadays, in twenty twelve, 413 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:48,160 Speaker 1: they were building a second wider Panama Canal, and the 414 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:52,480 Speaker 1: studying for whether or not you could improve the Charleston 415 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:57,119 Speaker 1: Harbor to take then the larger ships was going to 416 00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 1: take longer to study. It was going to take them 417 00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:03,959 Speaker 1: to build the entire brand new canal. They would have 418 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,359 Speaker 1: ships that could not come into Charleston because it'd be 419 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:10,440 Speaker 1: too big, and the core literally could not get out 420 00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 1: of the way of all the different regulatory requirements. 421 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,840 Speaker 2: Now, anybody who's ever served in Congress has their core 422 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,640 Speaker 2: of engineer's horror story that they've dealt with, and it's 423 00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:23,879 Speaker 2: happening every day. These are great people that want to 424 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,200 Speaker 2: do good work where there's a problem in the leadership 425 00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 2: somewhere in the core and getting projects approved and getting 426 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 2: them done. And we also fund core of engineering projects 427 00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:37,080 Speaker 2: in a backwards way. Instead of funding the whole project 428 00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:39,880 Speaker 2: at one time, we fund them on the appropriations process, 429 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:42,119 Speaker 2: so they have to build in are we going to 430 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,960 Speaker 2: have to stop and wait for more funding? That whole 431 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:48,400 Speaker 2: process needs to be reordered. 432 00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:54,120 Speaker 1: The name they figured out years ago. When they buy 433 00:25:54,320 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 1: an aircraft carrier, they structure a contract so the technically, 434 00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:04,840 Speaker 1: because the Constitution requires annual funding, technically it has to 435 00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: be renewed. But they built in such a prohibitive costs 436 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,640 Speaker 1: for not renewing that Congress will consistently pay for it. 437 00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 1: I'm looking at the air traffic control situation where Secretary 438 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:21,320 Speaker 1: Duffy I think has a huge challenge. We have not 439 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:24,760 Speaker 1: been able to fix the air traffic control system for 440 00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:28,040 Speaker 1: forty years because of the point it is made, which says, 441 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,280 Speaker 1: by the time you get to hangle appropriations, you get 442 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:35,280 Speaker 1: to the federal bureaucracy, you get to the various opportunities 443 00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,960 Speaker 1: to file lawsuits to screw up everything. We literally have 444 00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:42,640 Speaker 1: not been able to modernize the air traffic control system. 445 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:47,160 Speaker 2: I've been on the Aviation Subcommittee, and in the first 446 00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:52,000 Speaker 2: Trump administration we looked at updating the air traffic control system. Now, 447 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,679 Speaker 2: in the reconciliation bill that we did, we put twelve 448 00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,359 Speaker 2: billion dollars in there for the air traffic control system. 449 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:00,920 Speaker 2: I was with Secretary Duffy last night and we were 450 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:04,040 Speaker 2: talking about this. You know what's holding up air traffic 451 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:08,040 Speaker 2: control is getting fiber optics cables to the towers. And 452 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,600 Speaker 2: they can't get the fiber optics cables to the towers 453 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 2: because of the NEPA permitting process. They've got twelve billion 454 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 2: dollars and they can't run a new fiber optics line. 455 00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,679 Speaker 2: They're trying to work around that, but it's ridiculous that 456 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:26,240 Speaker 2: something so important to safety and to our economy and 457 00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:29,280 Speaker 2: it's being held up because they can't run fiber to 458 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:30,240 Speaker 2: control towers. 459 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:33,719 Speaker 1: When I was a speaker, it was so unusual to 460 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:37,080 Speaker 1: have the first Republican speaker in forty years that when 461 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 1: we finished the ten items that were in the contract, 462 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:43,639 Speaker 1: CBS gave me a half hour to do sort of 463 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:47,959 Speaker 1: a national address. And I actually had a vacuum tube 464 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,399 Speaker 1: that was part of the air traffic control system that 465 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:55,200 Speaker 1: was manufactured in Poland because it was the last factory 466 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,600 Speaker 1: on the planet that made these vacuum tubes, and we 467 00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,600 Speaker 1: had not been able. No, I think we've since gotten 468 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:03,920 Speaker 1: away from them, but at the time, we literally have 469 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:06,320 Speaker 1: not been able to get out of vacuum tubes. 470 00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 2: I remember seeing that great job. 471 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,440 Speaker 1: Look with your leadership. I think this is a big deal. 472 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:16,640 Speaker 1: Now it is the Act in the Senate, also called 473 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:17,440 Speaker 1: the Speed Act. 474 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,280 Speaker 2: No, there's not a bill that I'm aware of that 475 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 2: the Senate's filed. Yet they're working on the policy, and 476 00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 2: I think the Speed Act will be the center point 477 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:32,199 Speaker 2: of maybe some larger permitting reform. There's some statutes and 478 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 2: other committees that aren't in natural resources jurisdiction. You've got 479 00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 2: Energy and Commerce in the House that has clean air 480 00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:42,600 Speaker 2: and clean water and furk. You've got T and I 481 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:45,000 Speaker 2: that's got a clean water nexus. And then you get 482 00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:47,120 Speaker 2: over in the Senate and you've got Senate E and 483 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 2: R and Senate EPW that has cross jurisdiction, so all 484 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 2: those committees are working together, and you know, at some 485 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:58,760 Speaker 2: point a lot of other stuff may get added into 486 00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 2: the Speed Act, the biggest and best permitting reform bill 487 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:04,120 Speaker 2: that we can get passed and signed into law. 488 00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:08,520 Speaker 1: So in a real sense, if you look at this, 489 00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: this could become as the title Standardizing Permitting and Expediting 490 00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:20,760 Speaker 1: Economic Development, could be expanded substantially beyond NEPA and still 491 00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:21,920 Speaker 1: fit within the framework. 492 00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:24,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, So I would say if all we can get 493 00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:28,160 Speaker 2: is NEPA, that will be a huge victory. But there's 494 00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 2: opportunity because there's also some areas that have bipartisan support 495 00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 2: with things like the Endangered Species Act and the Clean 496 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:39,320 Speaker 2: Air and the Clean Water Act that could kind of 497 00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 2: some bits and pieces that get sprinkled in with the NEPA. 498 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 1: Do in the mood that's building in the country. If 499 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 1: we can find a way to communicate an affordability issue, 500 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,880 Speaker 1: how much, for example, your family will be better off at 501 00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:58,880 Speaker 1: electricity cost, or how much you'll be better off just 502 00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:01,440 Speaker 1: in terms of your county or your state building a 503 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 1: highway or fixing our bridging there are ways to translate 504 00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 1: all this so it becomes very personal and more people 505 00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:12,480 Speaker 1: realize this is really about their lives. This isn't just 506 00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 1: some abstract. 507 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:17,480 Speaker 2: Theory, right. It's really intuitive if you stop and think 508 00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:20,760 Speaker 2: about it, that if the cost for energy rises, the 509 00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:24,520 Speaker 2: costs for everything rises. When the Ukraine War started, we 510 00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:29,160 Speaker 2: saw an increase in input costs for agriculture. And what 511 00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 2: a lot of people didn't realize that was directly related 512 00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 2: to the fact that there was so much nitrogen fertilizer 513 00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 2: that's made in the Ukraine and the cost of gas 514 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:43,440 Speaker 2: went up there. And natural gas is the main ingredient 515 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:49,360 Speaker 2: in fertilizer and fertilizers of globally traded commodity. So even 516 00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,520 Speaker 2: though we've got a lot of natural gas in the US, 517 00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 2: we don't have a lot of fertilizer plants, and you 518 00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:57,840 Speaker 2: had fertilizer shortages that drove up agg cost and everything 519 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,560 Speaker 2: in agg The fertilizer that you put on the farmland 520 00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 2: is like a base input cost for chickens and pork 521 00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,000 Speaker 2: and beef because they end up eating the crops you grow. 522 00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 2: So when you have a constraint on supply of energy 523 00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:16,400 Speaker 2: and the things that are made from that energy. It 524 00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:20,000 Speaker 2: percolates throughout the whole supply chain, and that can be 525 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 2: both ways. You can get positive effects or negative effects. 526 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 2: You get those costs low and you get in abundance. 527 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:28,240 Speaker 2: Your affordability is going to be much better, and plus 528 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:29,400 Speaker 2: you're going to have better jobs. 529 00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,320 Speaker 1: I really want to congratulate you. This is a hard topic. 530 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:36,520 Speaker 1: It's a topic a lot of people have spent years 531 00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:41,960 Speaker 1: working on. You have brought it together into a serious 532 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:47,120 Speaker 1: reform built which could have an enormous impact on our 533 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:51,680 Speaker 1: national security, on our economic growth, on the cost of energy, 534 00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:55,400 Speaker 1: on our ability to do artificial intelligence. So, Bruce, I 535 00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,880 Speaker 1: think the work you're doing is sort of Congress at 536 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 1: its best. How it is thoughtful, bipartisan, with a huge 537 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:06,719 Speaker 1: impact in the real world. I want to thank you 538 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,200 Speaker 1: for joining me, and I want to let our listeners 539 00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:11,800 Speaker 1: know they can find out more about the work you're 540 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:17,280 Speaker 1: doing by visiting your website at Westerman dot house dot gov. 541 00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:20,880 Speaker 2: Thank you very much, New it's been great to be 542 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:22,920 Speaker 2: with you, and I would add to that list, we're 543 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,840 Speaker 2: going to do more to protect the environment. Some people 544 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 2: think by reforming permitting, we're going to just say the 545 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:32,120 Speaker 2: heck with the environment. But we'll have better environmental outcomes 546 00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:34,400 Speaker 2: by having better permitting processes. 547 00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:39,200 Speaker 1: I promise you, Chairman, you are providing wheel leadership in 548 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:40,600 Speaker 1: the best tradition of the Congress. 549 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:50,280 Speaker 2: I comment you, thank you, nude, appreciate you, Thank you to. 550 00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:54,000 Speaker 1: My guest Chairman, Bruce Westerman. Neut World is produced by Gagers, 551 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: Sweet sixty and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer is Guernsey Sloan. 552 00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:03,080 Speaker 1: Our research sure is Rachel Peterson. The artwork for the 553 00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:06,840 Speaker 1: show was created by Steve Penley. Special thanks to the 554 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 1: team at Ginglish three sixty. If you've been enjoying news World, 555 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:13,200 Speaker 1: I hope you'll go to Apple Podcast and both rate 556 00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:16,200 Speaker 1: us with five stars and give us a review so 557 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:18,960 Speaker 1: others can learn what it's all about. Join me on 558 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:23,120 Speaker 1: substack at Gingwish three sixty dot net. I am new Gingwish. 559 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 1: This is Newsworld.