1 00:00:05,840 --> 00:00:09,280 Speaker 1: Hey, Brian, Hi Katie. Well, Brian, you probably know that 2 00:00:09,360 --> 00:00:12,120 Speaker 1: this month marks the one year anniversary of that New 3 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 1: York Times expose on Harvey Weinstein, those allegations of multiple 4 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:22,000 Speaker 1: cases of sexual misconduct, which rocked Hollywood and gave way 5 00:00:22,079 --> 00:00:24,840 Speaker 1: to the Me Too movement as thousands of women from 6 00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: all walks of life came forward to tell their stories. Hollywood, 7 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:32,000 Speaker 1: Katie seemed to be ground zero for this movement, and 8 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: within a few months, women there decided to form a 9 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:39,200 Speaker 1: coalition to combat sexual harassment and assault in the workplace. 10 00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:42,559 Speaker 1: They called it Times Up, and the idea was to 11 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 1: harness their power to stop sexual misconduct not just in 12 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:50,559 Speaker 1: the entertainment industry, but across a multitude of industries. That's right, 13 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:53,239 Speaker 1: and Times Up made a big splash, as you remember 14 00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: at this year's Golden Globes, when dozens of celebrities showed 15 00:00:57,160 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 1: up to the awards wearing black and Times up pen 16 00:01:00,520 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 1: But they also brought with them women who don't usually 17 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 1: show up on the red carpet, those who represent domestic 18 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:10,120 Speaker 1: workers or have been toiling on factory floors across the country, 19 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:13,479 Speaker 1: Women who have had no voice about the abuse they faced. 20 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:18,000 Speaker 1: So we wanted to know where are we one year later? 21 00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:21,160 Speaker 1: And at this moment, there's a new leader in the 22 00:01:21,200 --> 00:01:24,120 Speaker 1: movement who was just announced as the first CEO of 23 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:28,280 Speaker 1: Times UP. Her name is Lisa Borders. Lisa is joining 24 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,920 Speaker 1: that organization after three years as president of the Women's 25 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 1: National Basketball Association, and I had a chance to talk 26 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:38,520 Speaker 1: with Lisa in front of a live audience at the 27 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 1: Vanity Fair New Establishments Summit last week, and joining Katie 28 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: and Lisa for that conversation was an actor who has 29 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 1: been instrumental in Times Up since the very beginning, America 30 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 1: Ferrera and Brian. Because of my daughters Ellen and Carey, 31 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:56,919 Speaker 1: I will always think of America as Kerman from Sisterhood 32 00:01:56,960 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 1: of the Traveling Pants. But since then she's been very busy. 33 00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 1: She's formed her own production company, she started an Ugly 34 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:07,240 Speaker 1: Betty and now superstore. In her spare time, she put 35 00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 1: together a new book called American Like Me, reflections on 36 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:14,400 Speaker 1: life between cultures. But what's taken a big chunk of 37 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: her time is her political activism. She spoke at the 38 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 1: Democratic Convention and of course as an outspoken critic of 39 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,239 Speaker 1: the Trump administration. And by the way, I hope he 40 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 1: doesn't decide to attack her looks on Twitter or something 41 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:32,239 Speaker 1: similarly mature like that. Yes, here's hoping, But Brian, no, 42 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: Lisa has a very interesting backstory. You'll find what she 43 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:39,120 Speaker 1: did prior to coming to the w n B A 44 00:02:39,880 --> 00:02:43,360 Speaker 1: I think fascinating. Meanwhile, I talked to both of them 45 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 1: about the work they've done so far and what they 46 00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 1: planned to do in the future, and America's passion for 47 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:53,080 Speaker 1: everything political made me ask her if she'd ever consider 48 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:55,680 Speaker 1: running for office. After all, Brian, her name is Taylor, 49 00:02:55,720 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: made for a campaign slogan right America for America lutely. 50 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 1: But I began by asking these two powerhouses to describe 51 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:12,800 Speaker 1: what Time's Up actually is. Time's Up started about a 52 00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:17,519 Speaker 1: year ago, at the critical moment where um stories were 53 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:20,320 Speaker 1: breaking and women were coming forward and sharing their stories, 54 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,600 Speaker 1: and this incredible thing started happening in our industry, which 55 00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 1: was that women started gathering in rooms in these unprecedented ways, 56 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: women across disciplines and across studios and across networks and 57 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 1: across agencies showing up and saying what are we going 58 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 1: to do? Because we can't let this moment go by 59 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 1: and not harness our anger, our fear, our pain that 60 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 1: we have all been living with silently and and and 61 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 1: isolated from one another. And it's a sisterhood, is what 62 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 1: it is. And we didn't know what we were building. 63 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:56,200 Speaker 1: All we knew was that we we needed to use 64 00:03:56,200 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 1: our voices, and use our access and use our platform 65 00:03:59,200 --> 00:04:02,760 Speaker 1: to stand up and say that we no longer could 66 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: sit silently and accept the imbalance of power that exists 67 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: in our industry and that we know exists across all 68 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 1: other industries. So times Up is that it's a sisterhood, 69 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:17,799 Speaker 1: and also it's a brotherhood for any man who stands 70 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:22,919 Speaker 1: with us and believes in women having the right to 71 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:27,800 Speaker 1: be safe and dignified in their workplaces. UM, that's what 72 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,120 Speaker 1: Time's Up is, And it's a movement that has expanded 73 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:35,200 Speaker 1: outside of our entertainment industry. UM, women in in the 74 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:39,880 Speaker 1: tech industry, in the advertising industry, in the venture capital industry, 75 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 1: in the health care industry have all started organizing around 76 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:46,800 Speaker 1: times Up in their own organizations. So it's bigger than 77 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:49,839 Speaker 1: any of us could have ever imagined and harder to 78 00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: explain than in one short center. And we'll talk more 79 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:55,599 Speaker 1: in a minute, America about some of the other things 80 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,000 Speaker 1: that you all have been able to accomplish. But Lisa, 81 00:04:58,040 --> 00:05:00,840 Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you, what may do you decide 82 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:03,720 Speaker 1: you were going to take the helm of Times up? 83 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:06,720 Speaker 1: Did you have an aha moment that made you think 84 00:05:07,720 --> 00:05:10,039 Speaker 1: this feels right. I have to be more involved in 85 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:15,159 Speaker 1: this movement. Absolutely So. I was watching the Golden Globes 86 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: and I heard Oprah Winfrey the Oracle say, a new 87 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 1: day is on the horizon. Very good, that residination. But 88 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:30,160 Speaker 1: I already had the privilege of leading the W. N 89 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:33,760 Speaker 1: b A had twelve teams, a hundred forty four elite 90 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 1: athletes who are some of the best female athletes athletes, 91 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:40,320 Speaker 1: not just female athletes in the world. So I had 92 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:44,040 Speaker 1: the privilege of steward ng A League of Women. So 93 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 1: this is a continuation of work not only from the 94 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:51,360 Speaker 1: W but work that I've been doing for four decades. 95 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:54,840 Speaker 1: It seems very natural. I had the privilege of being 96 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:59,000 Speaker 1: at the W, which was sports, one sector, one industry. 97 00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: Times has the ability to impact multiple or all industry, 98 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 1: women of all kinds across the globe. So it's not 99 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:11,160 Speaker 1: only in the US or North America. This is a 100 00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 1: global movement here and now, and I know that in 101 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:19,680 Speaker 1: many ways activism really runs in your family. Tell us 102 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:24,040 Speaker 1: about that, Lisa, and how that inspires you. Sure. So, 103 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: my home city is Atlanta. Katie knows that I love 104 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: my city. It's the cradle of the civil rights movement, 105 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:33,840 Speaker 1: and I'm a civil rights baby. We all have benefited 106 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 1: from the legislation that was passed in the nineteen sixties. 107 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 1: But I personally helped integrate independent schools in my home city, 108 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 1: just like many other African Americans across the country. But 109 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:50,719 Speaker 1: my grandfather, who was a minister in Atlanta, really led 110 00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:53,960 Speaker 1: many of the marches in the city during the sixties. 111 00:06:54,360 --> 00:06:57,080 Speaker 1: The clan burned across on his yard in the late 112 00:06:57,160 --> 00:07:01,240 Speaker 1: nineteen fifties. I was called racial slurs from seventh grade 113 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,520 Speaker 1: to twelfth grade every single day. So I have real 114 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 1: personal experience with being treated improperly or poorly or mistreated, 115 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 1: or having folks have perceptions of me that weren't true, 116 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:17,920 Speaker 1: that we're in their head. So the notion of social 117 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 1: justice or of treating people fairly or ensuring that they 118 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 1: are safe, that they have their dignity intact every day 119 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 1: when they come to work and when they live their lives. 120 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:31,800 Speaker 1: More importantly, comes very naturally to me because I grew 121 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:36,600 Speaker 1: up in this environment in Atlanta, which was segregated growing up, 122 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:40,200 Speaker 1: but which integrated during my lifetime, and I had the 123 00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:44,640 Speaker 1: experiences all the way through. Uh. Dr King's church is 124 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:47,640 Speaker 1: one block from my home church, and he would come 125 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 1: and listen to my grandfather preach, and frankly, he was 126 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:57,840 Speaker 1: just Marty's dad or Yoki's dad. He wasn't Doctor King. 127 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:01,679 Speaker 1: And I think I was forty Katie before I really 128 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:06,200 Speaker 1: understood that I had lived through history, including his assassination 129 00:08:06,320 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 1: and witnessing his funeral, and watching my friend Bernice, the 130 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:13,760 Speaker 1: youngest of the King children, walking down the street, a 131 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:17,560 Speaker 1: very quiet street, holding her mother's hand, with her father's 132 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:22,120 Speaker 1: casket being pulled, an American flag draped, and two mules 133 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 1: pulling that wagon. So moving to hear you talk about that, Lisa. Honestly, 134 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:32,559 Speaker 1: you know, America talked about sort of all these different verticals, 135 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:35,200 Speaker 1: if you will, all these different industries getting together. By 136 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: the way, if you need somebody in media, I'm your girl. 137 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:41,480 Speaker 1: But but but what about some of the other things 138 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:43,480 Speaker 1: that are happening behind the scenes, Because I think that 139 00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:47,040 Speaker 1: a lot of people recognize the sort of public, forward 140 00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: facing actions that you all have taken at award shows 141 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: or things like that. But a lot of hard work 142 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 1: is going on behind the scenes that I feel like 143 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:59,440 Speaker 1: people don't know about. Yeah, yeah, And you know, when 144 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:01,960 Speaker 1: when we're us figuring it out, it's hard to explain 145 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:05,120 Speaker 1: it and present it when you know this is unprecedented. 146 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:07,719 Speaker 1: The women in our industry have never organized in this 147 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 1: way before, and certainly not women in my position who 148 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:14,080 Speaker 1: are actresses. And we've been taught to be the face 149 00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 1: of of issues or the face of movements, or the 150 00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 1: face of some charity. You know, you would all be 151 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:24,160 Speaker 1: so surprised to learn about the names and the faces 152 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:26,080 Speaker 1: that you know, you expect to see on the Golden 153 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: Globe carpets, But you don't expect them to be meeting 154 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: four times a week after a long day of work 155 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 1: to roll up their sleeves and say, Okay, what's the 156 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:36,640 Speaker 1: language of the tweet that's really going to cut through 157 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 1: this moment? And how are we you know, how are 158 00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 1: we working with our unions to get them to adapt 159 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:45,320 Speaker 1: codes of conduct? How do we um figure out how 160 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:49,080 Speaker 1: to implement inclusion writers in our contracts? And and one 161 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:51,600 Speaker 1: of the things that is really in the DNA of 162 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:55,160 Speaker 1: times up from the very beginning is this notion that 163 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 1: it is not just about us as women in entertainment. 164 00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 1: It is about women all across the country and the world, 165 00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:07,680 Speaker 1: and it's and it's about the dignity of every person 166 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:10,200 Speaker 1: being able to show up and be safe in work. 167 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:12,560 Speaker 1: And and the way that manifested for us from the 168 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:17,760 Speaker 1: very beginning was that the president of the National Women's 169 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 1: farm Workers Alliance wrote a letter to the women in 170 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:28,760 Speaker 1: Hollywood after the Weinstein investigation started breaking. She wrote a 171 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:32,560 Speaker 1: letter on behalf of seven hundred thousand farm workers. These 172 00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:36,320 Speaker 1: are women in the field who are the most invisible 173 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:39,520 Speaker 1: and marginalized and sidelined among us, to say to the 174 00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:44,640 Speaker 1: women in Hollywood, we see you, we know your pain, 175 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:49,640 Speaker 1: and we stand with you as your sisters. And this 176 00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 1: lit a fire under us and and called us to 177 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 1: action to not just do what was right for us 178 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:01,040 Speaker 1: and the women in our industry, but to say, we 179 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 1: have an access that so many women will never have, 180 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 1: but we have got to include them and every single 181 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:11,600 Speaker 1: thing that we do. And one of the first steps 182 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:16,080 Speaker 1: that we took before we were anything was establishing the 183 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,200 Speaker 1: Legal Defense Fund with the National Women's Law Center and 184 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:22,840 Speaker 1: raising twenty two million dollars to help women and men 185 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 1: across all industries fight their cases of sexual harassment. And 186 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:32,079 Speaker 1: so that's not sexy golden globes, you know Oprah empowering 187 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:35,680 Speaker 1: speeches on television, But that is the on the ground, 188 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: behind the scenes work that is getting done every day 189 00:11:39,160 --> 00:11:43,160 Speaker 1: by by women who have never come to this work before, 190 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:46,240 Speaker 1: but are rolling up our sleeves and figuring it out. 191 00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: And we're only a year in and we get to 192 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:52,160 Speaker 1: say that we have this amazing woman who is stepping 193 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: in to lead us, and seeing as we've accomplished so 194 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 1: much in just one year, it thrills me to a 195 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 1: man gin where we're going to be in a year 196 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:04,559 Speaker 1: with the leadership of Lisa. Well, that's an excellent segue 197 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:06,840 Speaker 1: to my next question, America, So thank you. I know 198 00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 1: you haven't officially started yet, Lisa, but when you look 199 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:12,920 Speaker 1: at this organization and you see what has been built 200 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 1: in this period of time, how do you hope to 201 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:18,199 Speaker 1: bring it to the next level? I mean, what are 202 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:20,720 Speaker 1: sort of some of the gaps that need to be 203 00:12:20,840 --> 00:12:24,240 Speaker 1: filled structurally and and just tell us sort of what 204 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: you're envisioning, knowing that you're it's very early. Yes, it 205 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 1: is very early. I start officially on November one, but 206 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 1: clearly I have started. We are all in this together, 207 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:39,000 Speaker 1: so I think before you can address any problem, America 208 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: said it so beautifully. We have acknowledged that there is 209 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,200 Speaker 1: a problem, and it's not just an entertainment. It's across sectors, 210 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:50,680 Speaker 1: it's across industries, it's across all geographies, all socio economic groups. 211 00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 1: So awareness of the problem has been built in a 212 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:57,000 Speaker 1: amazing way, and I think Hollywood has done a terrific 213 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,959 Speaker 1: job of that. So one of the things we must 214 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:04,439 Speaker 1: pivot to, though, is to demonstrate empirically that this problem 215 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: exists beyond Hollywood, because a lot of folks still think 216 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:12,640 Speaker 1: it's only in one place. So that's number one. We 217 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:15,320 Speaker 1: have to then address the problem. We've decided we can't 218 00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:20,599 Speaker 1: boil the ocean. We're gonna focus in three areas, culture, companies, 219 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: and laws. What happens in culture gets normalized in our 220 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:30,120 Speaker 1: everyday lives. So we're not just trying to mitigate bad behavior, 221 00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 1: we're trying to eliminate bad behavior. So how do we 222 00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:37,360 Speaker 1: address that from a cultural perspective? We want women and 223 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 1: enlightened men, or anyone who is interested in the same 224 00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:44,319 Speaker 1: thing philosophically that we are interested in, and this is 225 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: about valuing women, valuing their voice. Oftentimes we hear comments 226 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 1: about our actress sisters, well they should just act. Well, 227 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,360 Speaker 1: now that's what they do. That's not who they are. 228 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 1: What America is talking about is what they do and 229 00:13:59,200 --> 00:14:02,000 Speaker 1: who they are. The same thing was said about our 230 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 1: athletes in basketball, they should just dribble and shut up. 231 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: I think not. I think not. In fact, you made 232 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:16,120 Speaker 1: a pretty pretty vocal statement about that. Absolutely. So addressing 233 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:18,960 Speaker 1: the issues, whether it's through the courts, which is a 234 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 1: page right out of the civil rights playbook, right passing laws, 235 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:28,720 Speaker 1: let's go back to and fifteen Amendment, looking for people's 236 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 1: rights to be codified. That's one thing you can do. 237 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 1: But after the laws are passed, you must remain attentive 238 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 1: and open the hearts and minds of people that that 239 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 1: law governs, or over a time it will be eroded. 240 00:14:43,080 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 1: So fast forward fifty years from the civil rights movement. 241 00:14:46,760 --> 00:14:52,120 Speaker 1: People are now trying to deconstruct those laws and take 242 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 1: the teeth out of them, one tooth at a time. 243 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 1: So we made a ton of progress in civil rights 244 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:02,800 Speaker 1: for people of col are primarily African Americans, we still 245 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:06,160 Speaker 1: don't have an equal rights Amendment for women. We don't. 246 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 1: We still have situations where we have sexual hassault and 247 00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:16,240 Speaker 1: harassment at work and other places. We should not tolerate that. So, 248 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 1: whether we address the remedies through large companies who have 249 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 1: big blocks of employees or the laws on the books, 250 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: that's going to be stepped to addressing the problem and 251 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:32,479 Speaker 1: then acting to ensure that they are sustainable, sustainable solutions. 252 00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 1: We can't just have a one off solution, one program, 253 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:39,760 Speaker 1: one memo goes out to every company and then oops, 254 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 1: we're done. I think not If we are not vigilant 255 00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 1: and attentive on an ongoing basis, the movement will not 256 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:51,080 Speaker 1: be sustained and the work that we do will not endure. 257 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 1: But changing cultures is so hard. You know, we're talking 258 00:15:55,480 --> 00:16:02,239 Speaker 1: about institutionalized misogynists and sexism, and really I think learned behaviors, 259 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:06,600 Speaker 1: cultural conditioning. Uh, and how do you really do that? 260 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:10,280 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't think diversity training is necessarily the answer. 261 00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: Sexual harassment training I don't think worked very well, at 262 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,320 Speaker 1: least in my industry. And also I think that the 263 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:20,560 Speaker 1: power powers that be are so invested in maintaining the 264 00:16:20,600 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 1: status quo. They don't want to let go of that power. 265 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:26,800 Speaker 1: So it just seems to me so challenging to go 266 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 1: from activism to action and really institute these changes. It's 267 00:16:31,160 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 1: really not I think at the end of the day, 268 00:16:33,800 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 1: the powers that be, maybe they shouldn't be the powers 269 00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:41,000 Speaker 1: that be. Well, sometimes you know, nobody tells them that, 270 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:44,040 Speaker 1: you know, and even if they did, they're not going 271 00:16:44,080 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: to go anywhere. Well, we don't have to have them 272 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 1: go anywhere. We move them out and bring new people in. 273 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:53,920 Speaker 1: That's called voting in this country typically, But I'm even 274 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:56,600 Speaker 1: talking about that. You know, the heads of companies and everything. 275 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:58,640 Speaker 1: Do we have to wait till they retire it or die? 276 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 1: I think, if I may, I sure we are living 277 00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:04,439 Speaker 1: a change in culture at this very moment, and I 278 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:08,280 Speaker 1: think that no, we're not. No, No, companies have taken 279 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:10,840 Speaker 1: the lead and said we're changing in these big, massive ways. 280 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 1: But we have begun the cultural and mental shift among 281 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:18,720 Speaker 1: ourselves as women in this country and on this planet. 282 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:20,919 Speaker 1: And I would say, I don't know about you, but 283 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,199 Speaker 1: for me, for the women in my life, I have 284 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 1: seen an awakening in the women in my life just 285 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:29,639 Speaker 1: to be able to a speak their truth, be know 286 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:32,360 Speaker 1: that their sisters are gonna be there with them and 287 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:36,240 Speaker 1: see just say, we are not going backwards. And that 288 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,320 Speaker 1: is a cultural shift that I've seen in my lifetime, 289 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:41,840 Speaker 1: and I think it starts there. We have to be 290 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:45,359 Speaker 1: willing as women to give ourselves the permission to be 291 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 1: angry enough to say to say what the problem is, 292 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:51,520 Speaker 1: to call it what it is, and then to call 293 00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 1: each other to action. And I think that comes first, 294 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:57,720 Speaker 1: and I think we are living that moment right now, 295 00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:02,640 Speaker 1: and things like the confirmation of Kavanaugh are are exposing 296 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:06,320 Speaker 1: this moment for what it is and constantly fueling that 297 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:11,360 Speaker 1: awakening and that fire. We'll take a quick break now, 298 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:14,280 Speaker 1: and when we come back, I'll ask Lisa and America 299 00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:18,119 Speaker 1: about how recent news has affected both me too and 300 00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: time's up and America hence what might be next in 301 00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:28,920 Speaker 1: her career. That's right after this. Now, let's get back 302 00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:34,440 Speaker 1: to Katie's conversation with Lisa Borders and America Ferrara. So 303 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 1: let's talk about Brett Cavanaugh. In in many quarters and 304 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 1: in many offices in the U. S. Senate, uh Dr 305 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:45,159 Speaker 1: Christine Blassie Fords testimony was discounted, dismissed, and in the 306 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 1: case of President Trump mocked. So how much of a 307 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 1: set back to the movement in general was Brett Kavanaugh's confirmation. 308 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:56,800 Speaker 1: I don't think it was a setback. I think, you know, 309 00:18:56,920 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 1: so much of what has happened um in the past 310 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:04,359 Speaker 1: couple of years, starting with the announcement of Trump running 311 00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:10,080 Speaker 1: for president, was for so many people a painful awakening 312 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:13,920 Speaker 1: and illumination of what so many other people have known 313 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:18,880 Speaker 1: has existed forever. And and I think that things like 314 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 1: the confirmation of Brett Kavanaugh are telling us exactly where 315 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 1: we are, and we can no longer kid ourselves about 316 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:33,200 Speaker 1: what is happening and how it has happened and how 317 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:36,080 Speaker 1: it has been allowed to happen for so long. If 318 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 1: you put yourself in the position that Christine blasi Ford 319 00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:42,840 Speaker 1: was in on that day, she was staring at a 320 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:48,120 Speaker 1: panel of white men, that is not an accident, it 321 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 1: was It's like that by design. I think what Lisa 322 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,760 Speaker 1: was going towards is we have the power to change 323 00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 1: what that room looks like. Who Christine blasi Ford has 324 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 1: to speak her truth to. We have the how we're 325 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:04,080 Speaker 1: to change that, and and I think we the first 326 00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 1: step is reckoning with what is our reality Okay, this 327 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:10,680 Speaker 1: is our reality. This is what the room looks like. Now, 328 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:13,560 Speaker 1: how do we take our anger with the view of 329 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:17,080 Speaker 1: that room and change what that room looks like? From 330 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: times up perspective, We'd like to see systemic change, right, 331 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 1: we want enduring change. So to that point, as we 332 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:26,479 Speaker 1: think about what the Judiciary Committee looks like today and 333 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:30,840 Speaker 1: what the Judiciary Committee could look like tomorrow. Because women 334 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:33,320 Speaker 1: are more than fifty percent of the population here in 335 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:36,400 Speaker 1: the US, but as we look at women running for office, 336 00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:40,320 Speaker 1: they are running in record numbers and they're winning in 337 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:44,639 Speaker 1: record numbers. We were looking at some statistics just before 338 00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:48,080 Speaker 1: this together and we noted that if women win at 339 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 1: the case that they are winning right now, they will 340 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 1: be thirty eight percent of the elected officials in public office. 341 00:20:55,480 --> 00:21:00,399 Speaker 1: That is an amazing number. Do we want more of horse? 342 00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:03,359 Speaker 1: But when we look today and see how many governors 343 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 1: are female, how many representatives, how many senators, And it's 344 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 1: not that only women can support women or lead women 345 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:14,160 Speaker 1: or represent women, but we need those folks who are 346 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:19,200 Speaker 1: centric and central and sensitized to what women need and 347 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:23,960 Speaker 1: what women want and what we all deserve. We expect 348 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 1: not just in the mid terms here, but in twenty 349 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 1: and beyond that, more people not only will vote, but 350 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 1: they will vote for those candidates who understand what the 351 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:38,280 Speaker 1: real challenges are and who will begin to reflect the 352 00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 1: values that we all hold dear rather than the extremes 353 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:45,919 Speaker 1: on either side. Frankly, it's interesting, you know, I found 354 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:51,160 Speaker 1: it very disconcerting that President Trump, Mitch McConnell, Chuck Grassley, 355 00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:55,360 Speaker 1: or in Hatch Marco Rubio, I'll describe female protesters at 356 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:59,159 Speaker 1: the Capitol as an angry mob, and they're clearly using 357 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:03,159 Speaker 1: it as a wedge issue to motivate Republican voters to 358 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 1: go to the polls in the mid terms. It seems 359 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,119 Speaker 1: to me that time's up. What started me to end 360 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 1: time stuff, What started as a as a movement that 361 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 1: I think was for the most part universally supported and 362 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 1: seeing as unacceptably bad behavior just full stop, has now 363 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:24,480 Speaker 1: become so politicized, and I'm wondering it can Can it 364 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:30,400 Speaker 1: return to being an issue that's not a left right 365 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:35,399 Speaker 1: issue but a right wrong issue. I'm so confused by 366 00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 1: the notion that our lives and the laws that govern 367 00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:41,800 Speaker 1: our lives could in any way be separate from politics. 368 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,119 Speaker 1: Like I my life has been politicized since I was 369 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:48,359 Speaker 1: nine years old. I didn't choose to politicize my life. 370 00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:52,520 Speaker 1: I was nine when legislation in California made it okay 371 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:54,480 Speaker 1: for my teachers to pull me aside and asked me 372 00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:58,080 Speaker 1: if my family was documented or undocumented in this country. 373 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:02,920 Speaker 1: So the notion that our day lives aren't completely linked 374 00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:06,840 Speaker 1: to the laws that govern how we live our lives 375 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 1: and what we are able to do with our lives. 376 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,439 Speaker 1: I don't know how you de politicize the issues that 377 00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:14,840 Speaker 1: impact us every day, because I've never been able to 378 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 1: live it. And so maybe there are some people who 379 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:21,160 Speaker 1: have had that privilege of living their lives devoid of politics, 380 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:23,160 Speaker 1: or at least the illusion that their lives are void 381 00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 1: of politics. But when you're someone like me, you're very 382 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: aware that politics govern your everyday life. And I don't 383 00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 1: know that we can separate women seeking dignity and safety 384 00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:41,520 Speaker 1: in their everyday lives from what's happening in the halls 385 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 1: of power. They seem one in the same two to me, 386 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:47,560 Speaker 1: I'm with you, and at leasta, you know when I 387 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,640 Speaker 1: talk to you about sort of the people who did 388 00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: not believe Dr Ford or did not find her experience 389 00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 1: even that really didn't even acknowledge that it ever happened. 390 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: And you said, you have an interesting technique of dealing 391 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:09,440 Speaker 1: with people who are so hell bent on not listening 392 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: or not hearing or not seeing. Right, I do, Katie? 393 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 1: So may I try it here? Sure? Are you ready? 394 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 1: So let me invite everyone to close their eyes and 395 00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:27,960 Speaker 1: imagine that the female member of your family. Let's start 396 00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:33,240 Speaker 1: with your mother. Is it home and she is alone, 397 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:40,120 Speaker 1: it is nine o'clock at night, someone comes crashing through 398 00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 1: the door and begins to beat her and rips her 399 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:52,320 Speaker 1: clothes off and throws her against the wall and gropes 400 00:24:53,280 --> 00:25:01,879 Speaker 1: and rapes her. How do you feel open your eyes? 401 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,200 Speaker 1: Is that not the most painful thought you could possibly have? 402 00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:11,120 Speaker 1: Is that not a thought that would make you want 403 00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,680 Speaker 1: to spring into action on behalf of your loved one 404 00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:19,199 Speaker 1: at the end of the day, Katie, what I believe 405 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 1: is people have to be have something feel relevant and 406 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:29,400 Speaker 1: resonant for them as individuals. It cannot be an abstract 407 00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: concept that we talk about or a social construct. It 408 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:37,760 Speaker 1: must be something that you either feel happen to you 409 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:43,600 Speaker 1: or happen to someone you know, love and respect. Otherwise 410 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 1: it becomes an inanimate object or something that you can 411 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:53,840 Speaker 1: put to the side because you cannot relate in any way. 412 00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:57,879 Speaker 1: So I invite people to try and listen first and 413 00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:02,480 Speaker 1: internalize what might have happened, and to that person, whoever 414 00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:06,359 Speaker 1: he or she might be, because that pain is real, 415 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:11,639 Speaker 1: that trauma is real. And the challenge with politics today 416 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:16,840 Speaker 1: is that we are so polarized we refuse to even listen. 417 00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:21,240 Speaker 1: We think we have the answer before someone else can 418 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,760 Speaker 1: speak their truth, whatever it is, whether you disagree with 419 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:29,199 Speaker 1: it or not. And I guess, as you had to, 420 00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:32,120 Speaker 1: I guess in the civil rights movement, do you just 421 00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,560 Speaker 1: have to say there are going to be certain people 422 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 1: out there who just don't get it and it can't 423 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:44,000 Speaker 1: stop this from moving forward. Well, that's exactly right. There's 424 00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:46,960 Speaker 1: always in any situation that I have found in my 425 00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:51,480 Speaker 1: sixty years of living, ten of the people are early adopters. 426 00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:55,760 Speaker 1: Of the people will follow the ten percent they're the 427 00:26:55,840 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: majority under the curve, and ten or what are called lacks, 428 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:03,240 Speaker 1: they will never get it and they will never join. 429 00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:07,280 Speaker 1: You have to forget the laggards and move on with 430 00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:11,880 Speaker 1: It's just that simple. And what we tend to want 431 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:17,040 Speaker 1: to do is have the people come with us. That's 432 00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:20,520 Speaker 1: just not happening. We have a question from the audience 433 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 1: for you, Lisa, given your experience on the front lines 434 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 1: of the civil rights movement and the hall team progress 435 00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 1: of racial equality in this country, how long is the 436 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 1: Times UP movement going to take? Boy? I wish I 437 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:35,000 Speaker 1: had a crystal ball and could answer that one two 438 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:42,119 Speaker 1: and a half years. No, I can't say two and 439 00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:45,000 Speaker 1: a half years um. As we look back at the 440 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 1: Civil Rights movement, it's probably the one most recent that 441 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 1: I recall in terms of duration. But you could also 442 00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 1: look at the Arab spring in North Africa and see 443 00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:02,000 Speaker 1: these movements are often started by a disenfranchised class. Often 444 00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:05,600 Speaker 1: they are very young, and it takes a very long time, 445 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:09,240 Speaker 1: I mean generations to get things done. We do not 446 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:13,479 Speaker 1: want to move at glacial speed, but we also know 447 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: that challenges that we see on the horizon that have 448 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:22,000 Speaker 1: been here for centuries. The patriarchy that we live in 449 00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 1: has been the status quo for generations. We cannot snap 450 00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:31,199 Speaker 1: our fingers and have it be corrected in no time flat. 451 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 1: We also can't do it by ourselves. America and I 452 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 1: and all of our sisters at Times Up are deeply 453 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:41,040 Speaker 1: committed to this challenge. But we need those of you 454 00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 1: in the audience and plokes around the world to help 455 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:47,080 Speaker 1: us and support us to push back on what we 456 00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:51,280 Speaker 1: are now because beginning to normalize this bad behavior, we 457 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:55,240 Speaker 1: cannot normalize that by any shape, form or fashion. So 458 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 1: I don't know, Katie, the sooner people join us in 459 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:02,200 Speaker 1: this fight, the fat stir it will be to rectify 460 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,160 Speaker 1: and remedy what is going on today. And also maybe 461 00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,680 Speaker 1: American Lisa, you can talk a little bit um the 462 00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:13,280 Speaker 1: importance of having male allies and making this movement inclusive 463 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:20,240 Speaker 1: for men whose support gender equality right. The folks who 464 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:23,400 Speaker 1: disagree with us, or who are deeply fearful of what 465 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:27,400 Speaker 1: we are trying to do, they have this misnomer that 466 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:31,000 Speaker 1: we are just attacking men. We are attacking bad behavior. 467 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 1: We want women to be valued along with their male peers. 468 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,120 Speaker 1: So we are inviting not just women, but enlightened men 469 00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:40,680 Speaker 1: and those who wish to be enlightened. Do we have 470 00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:47,880 Speaker 1: enlightenment in the audience? Great, because we understand in life 471 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:53,640 Speaker 1: peer to peer interaction is more impactful than someone outside 472 00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 1: the peer groups. So you have only to look. I 473 00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 1: come from sports teams when the captain of the team 474 00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:04,080 Speaker 1: says do this. The players respond much more quickly than 475 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,440 Speaker 1: if a fan in the stands tells a player to 476 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:11,760 Speaker 1: do something. So peer to peer interaction is very powerful. 477 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,040 Speaker 1: So we would like to see that in times of 478 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:18,760 Speaker 1: particularly with our male allies or any allies. We understand 479 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,120 Speaker 1: that everybody's not going to be with us, we invite 480 00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 1: them to listen, first, learn, and then lead alongside us. 481 00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:28,240 Speaker 1: We have another question from the audience. You said, we 482 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 1: have the power to change leadership in government and companies, 483 00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:35,360 Speaker 1: but how will you actually affect that change? Number One, 484 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:39,360 Speaker 1: we want folks to be civically engaged, period, full stop, 485 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:42,720 Speaker 1: whether you're a Democrat or Republican. And you want folks 486 00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:47,080 Speaker 1: to be fully informed about public policy on both sides 487 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:49,480 Speaker 1: of the aisle. And at the end of the day, 488 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,120 Speaker 1: we as Americans have to make decisions about what type 489 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:56,560 Speaker 1: of country we want this to be. If you look 490 00:30:56,600 --> 00:31:00,640 Speaker 1: back historically, we often swing from the left to the right. 491 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:04,440 Speaker 1: I'll just start with the abolition of slavery in eighteen 492 00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:10,320 Speaker 1: sixty three, then reconstruction, then the Jim Crow era, so 493 00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 1: we had black skating rights. They were taken away during 494 00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,920 Speaker 1: Jim Crow, only to be put back with the Civil 495 00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:21,000 Speaker 1: rights movement. There are many insights to be learned from 496 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: that history. One step forward, two steps exactly, which is 497 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:29,280 Speaker 1: why we reject the notion that the Supreme Court justice 498 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:34,720 Speaker 1: is a reflection or somehow hurtful to this movement. I 499 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 1: actually think it's helpful to this movement. Yeah, and I 500 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:41,160 Speaker 1: would I just want to add to Lisa's point about 501 00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:45,120 Speaker 1: peer to peer. You know, I think it's it's crazy 502 00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 1: for any of us to think that one organization, or 503 00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 1: one movement, or one hashtag is going to change these numbers. Right, 504 00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:56,840 Speaker 1: We're at an inflection point in history where we all 505 00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 1: have to ask ourselves not just am I part of 506 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,520 Speaker 1: the problem? But am I a part of the solution? 507 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:07,240 Speaker 1: And so many of the people sitting in this room 508 00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 1: who have access and privilege, and and and circles that 509 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:16,560 Speaker 1: they influence, really need to be asking themselves how am 510 00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 1: I part of the solution? As a woman of color, 511 00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:24,920 Speaker 1: I have had to walk into every single room not 512 00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 1: as an individual, but as a representative of millions and 513 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:31,200 Speaker 1: each of us who come from these groups. Whether you 514 00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,240 Speaker 1: are a man, whether you are a white woman in 515 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:38,440 Speaker 1: this country, you have a responsibility to speak to your 516 00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:41,680 Speaker 1: peer group, to speak to us. It's not enough to say, well, 517 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:44,440 Speaker 1: I'm a wokeman. I I I have women I love 518 00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:46,920 Speaker 1: and I support them and I'm good. No, it's your 519 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:49,720 Speaker 1: job to go out and to speak to other men 520 00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,760 Speaker 1: about what you've learned and about because they're going to 521 00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:55,040 Speaker 1: listen to you more than they're going to listen to us. 522 00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:58,000 Speaker 1: And and the times of movement and the me too movement, 523 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:01,120 Speaker 1: and so I really do think that that is each 524 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 1: one of our call to action in this time is 525 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:06,560 Speaker 1: not just am I on the right side, but am 526 00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:10,600 Speaker 1: I doing everything that I can to influence the individuals 527 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:14,440 Speaker 1: in my life to see more, to know more, to 528 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,520 Speaker 1: be more a part of the solution, Because that's the 529 00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:22,520 Speaker 1: only way we change one hundred and seventy million people's minds. 530 00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:25,920 Speaker 1: That showing up and voting matters. You know, we have 531 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 1: to take responsibility in our day to day lives. It's 532 00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:30,640 Speaker 1: not enough to sort of put your head down on 533 00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:33,640 Speaker 1: the pillow and said, well, I feel good about myself today. 534 00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,280 Speaker 1: Well that's a great way, a great call to action 535 00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:40,400 Speaker 1: and a great conversation. Why don't and would you ever 536 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 1: run for office? Were you asking as I'm asking you? 537 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:49,000 Speaker 1: As LEASA just got a new job. You know. Um, 538 00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:52,440 Speaker 1: my response to that question has always been no, no, no, 539 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:56,000 Speaker 1: But I have to to be perfectly honest. I think 540 00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:58,840 Speaker 1: if every single one of us hasn't asked ourselves that 541 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:01,880 Speaker 1: question in the last you years, you're not asking yourself 542 00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:06,920 Speaker 1: the right questions. Because it really is about it really 543 00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:12,560 Speaker 1: is this whole movement is about balance of power and 544 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:16,080 Speaker 1: who is represented and who has a voice, and whose 545 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:19,640 Speaker 1: stories get told and who tells those stories. And and 546 00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:22,480 Speaker 1: we can't just go around saying, let's make that world 547 00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:25,279 Speaker 1: you know good enough for the people coming behind us 548 00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: to step up and take those positions of power. We 549 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:30,839 Speaker 1: have to be willing to step into those positions ourselves, 550 00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:34,839 Speaker 1: and we have to acknowledge and recognize that when we 551 00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:39,839 Speaker 1: have extraordinary leaders like Lisa and the and the thousands 552 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,280 Speaker 1: of women who are stepping up and running for office, 553 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:46,080 Speaker 1: it's our responsibility to have their backs and to support 554 00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:48,799 Speaker 1: them and to show up. And I think so many 555 00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:51,120 Speaker 1: people think it's this terrible thing to say, yeah, I 556 00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,719 Speaker 1: could run for office. I think women in particular are 557 00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,200 Speaker 1: afraid to say that. So I will say, for the 558 00:34:56,239 --> 00:34:58,720 Speaker 1: first time in a public audience, that's sure, I've asked 559 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:01,160 Speaker 1: myself the question there or not I should be running 560 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 1: for office, and I think you should be asking yourself 561 00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,520 Speaker 1: that question. Is the answer. Yes, The answer is I 562 00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:09,080 Speaker 1: have thought about it all right, so it's not all right. 563 00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:13,880 Speaker 1: Lisa Borders America for thank you so much, Katie Lucki Lisa, 564 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:22,560 Speaker 1: thank you. That was Lisa Borders and America Ferrera. And 565 00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:25,319 Speaker 1: a big thank you to everyone at the Vanity Fair 566 00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:29,320 Speaker 1: New Establishments Summit for inviting me to moderate that panel. 567 00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:31,719 Speaker 1: It was a great conference. I also want to thank 568 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:35,320 Speaker 1: our team at Stitcher, our producer Emma Morgenstern, our associate 569 00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:39,600 Speaker 1: producer Nora Richie, and of course Jared O'Connell, our trustee engineer. 570 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,400 Speaker 1: A big shout out as well to our team at 571 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:46,640 Speaker 1: Katie Currict Media, Beth Demas, my fabulous assistant who has 572 00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:49,719 Speaker 1: the hardest job on the planet, and Julia Lewis, who 573 00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,279 Speaker 1: helps me with all of my social media, which keeps 574 00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:54,960 Speaker 1: her very busy as well. What an exhausting job that 575 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:58,600 Speaker 1: must be anyway. Mark Phillips composed our theme music. You 576 00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,440 Speaker 1: can find me on Twitter under at Goldsmith b and 577 00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:03,959 Speaker 1: you can find Katie almost anywhere on the internet as 578 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:08,640 Speaker 1: Katie Kirk, particularly those Instagram stories which have gone so viral, 579 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 1: they're so fascinating. If you have thoughts about our show 580 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:15,280 Speaker 1: or questions for Brian and me, please reach out, particularly 581 00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:18,879 Speaker 1: if you have questions about the upcoming mid term elections, 582 00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:23,400 Speaker 1: because we're going to do a podcast devoted to understanding 583 00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:26,760 Speaker 1: what's at stake and why it's so important to vote. 584 00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:30,680 Speaker 1: Our email address is comments at current podcast dot com, 585 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,320 Speaker 1: or you can leave a voicemail for us by calling 586 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:38,160 Speaker 1: nine to four four six three seven. As always, thank 587 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:42,759 Speaker 1: you so much for listening, and Brian, bye bye. That's 588 00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:49,080 Speaker 1: my best John McLaughlin impression mold on and for those 589 00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:51,320 Speaker 1: of you under thirty, just google John McLaughlin