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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 2: Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election,

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Speaker 2: and we are so excited about what that means for

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Speaker 1: This is the only place where you can find honest

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Speaker 1: not exist anywhere else.

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Speaker 2: So if that is something that's important to you, please

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Speaker 2: go to Breakingpoints dot com.

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Speaker 1: We need your help to build the future of independent

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Speaker 1: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 1: dot com.

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Speaker 4: Good morning everyone, how's it going.

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Speaker 3: It's going good. Nice to have Ryan back from his

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Speaker 3: overseas trip.

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Speaker 5: Good to be back. How's everything ready? That's right.

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Speaker 6: You have a giant toolbag under your right, your desk, of.

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Speaker 4: Course, building something. What's going on down there in.

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Speaker 5: This basement is something else you guys wouldn't know.

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Speaker 7: It's he's like that TikTok lady who's like tunneling into

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Speaker 7: the basement, creating a labyrinth under.

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Speaker 5: It that.

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Speaker 6: I'll send you some linked I.

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Speaker 5: Was at that conference called Web Summit in Lisbon Portugal,

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Speaker 5: which is there's some media, but it's mostly tech and

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Speaker 5: seventy eighty thousand people come to it. It's like the

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Speaker 5: biggest tech conference in the world. And it was just

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Speaker 5: all AI slop, like a complete AI takeover of the

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Speaker 5: of the tech scene. Although interestingly, the most interesting thing

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Speaker 5: there was a rumor kicking around that when when this

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Speaker 5: is over they have they have like a couple more

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Speaker 5: years on their contract in Lisbon, that they might might

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Speaker 5: take it to China, which would be Wow, it would

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Speaker 5: be a real shot across the American tech bow if that, Yeah,

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Speaker 5: that actually happened. They do, want to know they do

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Speaker 5: one in Vancouver, they do one and I think so Paulo,

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Speaker 5: but the main one has been in Lisbon since it

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Speaker 5: was moved out of Dublin.

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Speaker 2: Maybe I was seeing some some good news for the AI,

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Speaker 2: the American AI industry, which is we might get to

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Speaker 2: this in the show, this big hack that happened first,

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Speaker 2: like major hack that happened using AI tools with very

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Speaker 2: little human involvement. They did use US AI tools, American

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Speaker 2: AI tools, so a win for us.

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Speaker 3: Until I was pointing that.

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Speaker 5: Out, incredible, we have a propic. Yeah, yeah, it's a

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Speaker 5: lot but it's the most transparent of the monstrous AI companies.

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Speaker 3: Yeah that's right, Yeah, that's true.

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Speaker 8: So we got a lot of stories this Friday Packed

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Speaker 8: Friday Show. We've got more Epstein stuff. We're going to

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Speaker 8: be looking at an article that Emily wrote an unheard

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Speaker 8: about the groupers and how many actually are there.

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Speaker 7: We've even describe this segment as the Groypersensus, so that's

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Speaker 7: how we're going to refer to it.

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Speaker 8: That's right, which is now an official yearly sense valuable.

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Speaker 3: Public service you're providing there. Thank you.

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Speaker 8: As Crystal mentioned, we've got artificial intelligence, cyber attacks. And

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Speaker 8: then we have a guest Crystal, who are we having

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Speaker 8: on this Friday show.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so we've got Peggy Flan again. She's the current

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Speaker 2: Lieutenant governor of Minnesota, which is interesting in its own right,

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Speaker 2: you know, working closely with Tim Wallasey's they were mates together,

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Speaker 2: and then she's now running for US Senate in Minnesota.

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Speaker 2: She's in the Democratic primary against a sort of moderate

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Speaker 2: to conservative Democrat named Angie Craig who worked in the

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Speaker 2: medical device industry before coming into Congress.

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Speaker 3: So should be an interesting one.

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Speaker 2: Peggy Flann again is you know, broadly sort of progressive

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Speaker 2: on the left type of candidate, so interesting.

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Speaker 3: Interested to chat with her, you know.

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Speaker 5: And I got a video of Angie Craig being a

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Speaker 5: little crazy at a town hall and that I hadn't

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Speaker 5: done anything with yet, so maybe I'll play that for

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Speaker 5: Peggy Flan again. Get hurry out to it. She's getting

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Speaker 5: challenged at a like an auction dinner about Gaza and

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Speaker 5: just shouts back at the person, We're not a cult. Basically,

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Speaker 5: It's like it's very bizarre and weird because I didn't

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Speaker 5: even know what to do with this, Like this is

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Speaker 5: so weird, what do we do with this? But anyway,

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Speaker 5: I figured out what I'm gonna do with it. I'll

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Speaker 5: post it by the time she comes on, and we're speaking.

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Speaker 8: Of speaking of hidden troves, Ryan sitting in a lot

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Speaker 8: of hidden troves.

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Speaker 4: But let's get a little bit to the Epstein stuff.

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Speaker 8: Ryan had hadn't been on this week, so he really

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Speaker 8: wanted to hear from Ryan about his reaction. The one

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Speaker 8: thing I wanted to note. It seems like the new

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Speaker 8: vibe or the new perspective is that, well, maybe Trump

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Speaker 8: may have had sexual interactions with fifteen year olds, but

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Speaker 8: you know, like maybe not younger kids, and the White

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Speaker 8: House went and posted a video of him interacting with children.

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Speaker 8: Can't can't help but think that this might be somewhat

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Speaker 8: related to the news this week him handing out pens.

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Speaker 8: So yes, the White House confirms he's okay with eight

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Speaker 8: year olds. But Ryan, you know, my first question to

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Speaker 8: you is, with all this Epstein news, did all this

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Speaker 8: come out because of they wanted to cover up the

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Speaker 8: drop site reporting about his Israel connections, because it seems

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Speaker 8: like that has not been mentioned at all this week

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Speaker 8: for the mainstream media.

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Speaker 5: I don't know, you know, I try to not get

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Speaker 5: too conspiratorial in what when things come out, why they

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Speaker 5: come out. You know, could well the.

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Speaker 2: Reason I came out now, I mean, in part Rokanna

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Speaker 2: came on our show and said, hey, me and James

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Speaker 2: Comer actually did the subpoena of the Epstein the state,

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Speaker 2: and they've just been releasing things in batches. And then

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Speaker 2: the other reason Epstein is big this week is actually

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Speaker 2: because of the end of the government shutdown, which allowed

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Speaker 2: Adelidea Grihalva to so as So much as I would

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Speaker 2: like to imagine a drop site centered conspiracy, I don't

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Speaker 2: actually think that's what's going on.

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Speaker 5: I agree, I tend to agree with that, yes on

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Speaker 5: Griffin on your point, I think you're referencing that the

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Speaker 5: cringe like Megan Kelly boughtya segment where you know, they

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Speaker 5: seem to be they're actually mission structure for barely legal

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Speaker 5: type of illegal activity. But I don't I mean, so far,

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Speaker 5: you know, I Trump is obviously all over these files

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Speaker 5: because his administration has basically said he is, and he's

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Speaker 5: going to the mat to keep him you know, to

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Speaker 5: keep them from getting released. So he's letting the entire

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Speaker 5: world know he's guilty. But so far, Whatmocrats released I

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Speaker 5: didn't think was necessarily that impressive about Trump. You know,

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Speaker 5: Like I guess the best thing we can talk about

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Speaker 5: this sect that was the Epstein saying that, you know,

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Speaker 5: he had told the Russians that he's got some dirt

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Speaker 5: on Trump or something like that, and Epstein telling people,

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Speaker 5: you know, if Trump says he didn't fly on the plane,

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Speaker 5: he's a flat out liar. You know, if Trump says

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Speaker 5: he's never been to the mansion, he's a flat out liar.

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Speaker 5: We all, we kind of already knew that that he'd

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Speaker 5: been on the plane, that he'd been, that he'd been

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Speaker 5: in the mansion. You know, there's videos of him and Epstein.

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Speaker 5: He Epstein were very close friends until they apparently had

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Speaker 5: this falling out because Epstein kept poaching girls from mar

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Speaker 5: A Lago into his like trafficking operation, and I think

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Speaker 5: and Trump was like, these are these people work for me?

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Speaker 5: I don't think he was like chivalrous and like opposed

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Speaker 5: to whatever Epstein was going to do with him, but

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Speaker 5: it's like, it's hard to hire people. It's annoying. Now

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Speaker 5: I got to hire new people. So I think it

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Speaker 5: was more along those lines.

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Speaker 3: They also had that falling out. They also had that

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Speaker 3: falling out over the war a real estate some sort

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Speaker 3: of a real estate deal.

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Speaker 2: And then there's a suggestion, you know, the one email

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Speaker 2: where he's like that one dog that has embarked is

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Speaker 2: Trump and then he says something something police chief, I'm

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Speaker 2: seventy five percent there, like very cryptic. There's also some

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Speaker 2: theorizing that Epstein thinks Trump may actually have tipped off

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Speaker 2: the police chief that ends up doing the investigation that

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Speaker 2: then gets scuttled by alex Acosta whatever.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, go on, Ryan, finish finished.

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Speaker 5: So that's that is a funny kind of twist if

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Speaker 5: like Trump, out of spite over some real estate deal,

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Speaker 5: called the cops on his friend and ended up then

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Speaker 5: entangling himself fifteen twenty years later in this entire reckless controversy.

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Speaker 5: But yeah, thee the coverage of the Putin and Epstein

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Speaker 5: connection coming out of the latest email was the one

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Speaker 5: that kind of jumped out of me the most. It's like,

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Speaker 5: all right, good, that's interesting. You can write about that.

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Speaker 5: Maybe in your second paragraph you could mention that Epstein

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Speaker 5: worked with the Israeli government to set up a back

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Speaker 5: channel to Putin, Like that feels that also feels relevant.

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Speaker 5: It feels like they're the amount of gymnastics and contortions

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Speaker 5: they're going to to make news out of these drops

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Speaker 5: without mentioning the country of Israel and the connections that

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Speaker 5: he has to Israel. Even as we have the inbox

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Speaker 5: of Ahud Barak, his very good friend, to go through,

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Speaker 5: we have the inbox of Ambassador Proser to go through.

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Speaker 5: We have enormous amounts of contextual information coming from the

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Speaker 5: House Oversight Committee to establish that he was working directly

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Speaker 5: with Israeli intelligence, So you can argue about what he

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Speaker 5: was doing he's working with them. We even as we

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Speaker 5: published this week and you guys talked about he's even

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Speaker 5: wiring money, so like Israeli intelligence official, like getting wire

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Speaker 5: transferred data from Barack. It's like this can maybe work

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Speaker 5: its way into the coverage at some point, but it

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Speaker 5: feels like it's acceptable at this point for the media

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Speaker 5: to just talk about the sex trafficking part of it,

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Speaker 5: but they will not touch the rest of it.

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Speaker 7: Well, I just want to say, like, what we can

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Speaker 7: expect to see out of these fsteines disclosures for the

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Speaker 7: next several decades are exactly what we saw this week.

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Speaker 7: Twenty thousand emails here there, and you get pieces.

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Speaker 6: Of a big puzzle.

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Speaker 7: You don't even know what the picture of the puzzle

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Speaker 7: you're assembling is, and so you just have this scattering

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Speaker 7: of pieces scraps. It's exactly like what we've gotten in

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Speaker 7: the John F. Kennedy assassination stuff. It'll stretch into decades

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Speaker 7: and you'll get really fascinating tidbits, like that dog that

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Speaker 7: hasn't barked yet is frump and it'll be gesturing at

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Speaker 7: something like fascinating, intriguing and important, but there's no smoking gun.

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Speaker 7: The government is going to just those to us. We're

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Speaker 7: not going to see it buried in twenty thousand email

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Speaker 7: dump dump from the estate. Any smoking gun has probably

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Speaker 7: been destroyed, and they're certainly not going to put it

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Speaker 7: in the twenty thousand email dump randomly on one day

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Speaker 7: from the estate.

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Speaker 6: But what we can do is see this picture emerging

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Speaker 6: through literally only.

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Speaker 7: The drop site reporting of a sprawling intelligence operation.

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Speaker 6: So do I think the sex trafficking is real?

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Speaker 7: Yes?

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Speaker 6: Do I think they're going to.

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Speaker 7: Ever release anything that definitively legally puts anybody in jeopardy

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Speaker 7: for it?

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Speaker 6: Probably not. I hope they do, but probably not.

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Speaker 7: But what we are going to be able to see

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Speaker 7: are the contours of this sprawling and obvious intelligence operation.

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Speaker 6: And that's proven through Ryan's reporting with mos.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And it's interesting, it's like, what would this, what

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Speaker 5: kind of a smoking gun would would actually be needed,

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Speaker 5: because it then depends on what you're trying to prove.

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Speaker 5: If all you're trying to prove is that he had

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Speaker 5: lots of actions with American intelligence and Israeli intelligence and

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Speaker 5: also elites in Russia and Europe, it's proven done. Gotcha,

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Speaker 5: You're covered. If you want to know specifically what he

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Speaker 5: was doing. Uh yeah, you know, we can lay out

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Speaker 5: some of it. You know, so far we can tell

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Speaker 5: you what he was doing in Syria and with with

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Speaker 5: Mongolia with code of War. Soon we're going to have

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Speaker 5: some Angola stuff, we'll have some Nigeria stuff. Well, we

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Speaker 5: can tell you exactly what's going on with the you know,

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Speaker 5: the different gems and the gold mining. Like there's like

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Speaker 5: enormous amounts of details you can get into. So like

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Speaker 5: but then you're like, Okay, well now I know. Now

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Speaker 5: I have a ton of details about this global network

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Speaker 5: that is a kind of super national government that that operates.

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Speaker 5: And that's what makes it so confusing, I think even

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Speaker 5: to us as we're like originally going into it, because

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Speaker 5: you're looking for like is he working for Masad? Is

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Speaker 5: he's working for the CIA. It's like it misunderstands what

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Speaker 5: the role of like Masad and CIA are in this world.

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Speaker 5: Like there's a super superanational network of elites that in

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Speaker 5: the twenty tens were congregating Davos Man was how you

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Speaker 5: really understood them, and they were not None of them

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Speaker 5: were working for Masade or the CIA. Cia and the

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Speaker 5: Massade were working for them. Is a better way of

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Speaker 5: putting it. Were they getting a W nine or like

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Speaker 5: W two, Like how are they going to pay?

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Speaker 6: You find a W nine that Epstein filled out for

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Speaker 6: the CIA.

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Speaker 5: It's like, but we even have the fire transfer, it's

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Speaker 5: Epstein sending the money to the Israeli spy. So it's like,

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Speaker 5: which is actually a nice metaphor for like, how we

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Speaker 5: actually do properly understand this? I think, which is there?

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Speaker 5: They work for this network of people, and how they

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Speaker 5: work for them depends on who's who's kind of has

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Speaker 5: more power within the click at that moment. And how

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Speaker 5: do you know that? You have to be on the inn.

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Speaker 5: You have to be on the inside. It's just the

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Speaker 5: same way with any other network.

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Speaker 2: And that's why ignoring that piece of the story, you know,

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Speaker 2: makes so Look, I think Americans want to know if

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Speaker 2: Trump knew about this massive pedophile ring. I think that's

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Speaker 2: probably the most suggestive thing in these emails. Epstein certainly,

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Speaker 2: you know, insinuates multiple times. It explicitly states I have

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Speaker 2: dirt on Trump that could bring him down, right, And

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Speaker 2: he's always teasing this to this New York Times reporter.

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Speaker 2: He's talking to Bannon about it. He's talking to abandoned

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Speaker 2: about it right up until the point that he ends

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Speaker 2: up in prison and then dead, which is interesting in

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Speaker 2: and of itself.

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Speaker 3: Right. So, but is it a question of just the

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Speaker 3: like horror.

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Speaker 2: And morality, which I mean, I don't want to minimize that, right,

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Speaker 2: that's very important and horrifying. I think many people are

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Speaker 2: horrified by it. Or is it a question of is

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Speaker 2: the president of the United States compromised in some you know,

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Speaker 2: significant way by Israel and also here by Russia.

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Speaker 3: Right, Because this is.

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Speaker 2: The point you always make Ryan like, even if Epstein

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Speaker 2: is bluffing, clearly people thought that he did have all

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Speaker 2: the videos, that he did have all the goods, that

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Speaker 2: he did have, all the dirt, and you would have

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Speaker 2: certainly known that he was directly connected to the Israelis.

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Speaker 2: I mean, Bestie's with this former Israeli Prime minister doing

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Speaker 2: business deals with him, obviously directly connected to Masad Gallaine,

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Speaker 2: Maxwell's dad was directly connected to Masad. That's just undeniable stuff.

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Speaker 2: And then you also have this, you know, Russian connection.

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Speaker 2: You have to assume that whatever it is that you

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Speaker 2: don't want the public to know, Epstein knew and conveyed

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Speaker 2: to these various parties. So now we're talking about issues

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Speaker 2: of foreign policy. We're talking about how is this now

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Speaker 2: impacting our country here in the present with the decisions

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Speaker 2: you're making Visa v Russia, Viza VI, Israel, and god

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Speaker 2: knows what other countries you're concerned about here. And one

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Speaker 2: thing you can say, probably yeah, right, right, what is

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Speaker 2: this doing to our relationship with Mongolia? But people need

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Speaker 2: to know? Okay, but you know, one of the to me,

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Speaker 2: you have to put together the emails, which are suggestive, right,

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Speaker 2: no smoking gut, but very suggestive, and also suggests of

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Speaker 2: a longer term relationship or at least connectivity with Epstein

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Speaker 2: than Trump claims.

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Speaker 3: The fact that Trump is acting.

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Speaker 2: Guilty as hell, right, I mean, you know what, It's

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Speaker 2: almost like he has shame on this particular which I've.

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Speaker 3: Never seen before.

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Speaker 5: I found his shame.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I'm like, okay, well, what is it that's so

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Speaker 2: bad that it apparently is worse than shooting someone on

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Speaker 2: Fifth Avenue since he thinks that would be fine for

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Speaker 2: him to do, but this he thinks would be would

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Speaker 2: be worse. And we know not only from his public

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Speaker 2: actions how sort of panicked he is, but also this

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Speaker 2: special treatment of Glene Maxwell is also a very important

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Speaker 2: piece of trying to understand the psychology of Trump, Like,

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Speaker 2: this woman should never be in this club fed person

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Speaker 2: number one. Number two, she's getting the frickin' puppies and

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Speaker 2: the special meals and the exercise and getting to meet

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Speaker 2: with people after hours, et cetera. Number Three, she's putting

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Speaker 2: in her commutation application. Every time Trump's asked about it,

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Speaker 2: he won't say whether he'll accept or reject it, et cetera.

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Speaker 2: So very clearly he wants to keep her happy so

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Speaker 2: that she does not divulge whatever it is that he

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Speaker 2: is afraid of her divulging. So to me, when you

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Speaker 2: put those pieces together, it's like, what is going on

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Speaker 2: here that is causing him to act in this bizarre

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Speaker 2: way the normal way that.

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Speaker 3: He conducts himself.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, the only other thing I'd lay on top of

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Speaker 5: that is absolutely correct, and especially about people assuming that

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Speaker 5: Epstein had the goods, like what we now know from

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Speaker 5: all of the reporting we've done recently, the business that

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Speaker 5: he and Ahu Barack were getting into on behalf of

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Speaker 5: Israeli companies and the Israeli government itself was cyber surveillance,

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Speaker 5: was the bleeding edge of the most sophisticated spying technology

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Speaker 5: in the world, and so they so people who knew

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Speaker 5: him knew that he has direct access to these no

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Speaker 5: click you know, penetrations of your phone or cameras god

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Speaker 5: knows where, like the kinds that like sci Fi st

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Speaker 5: off that where where there are several years ahead where

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Speaker 5: we now understand what they're capable of. They had that,

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Speaker 5: you know, they knew about it years ago. So even

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Speaker 5: if he didn't have you in his mansion or on

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Speaker 5: his plane, you had to wonder what else, what do

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Speaker 5: they have?

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Speaker 3: What else is he now?

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Speaker 5: Because when you have state power combined with global surveillance networks,

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Speaker 5: you haven't access to an enormous amount of information.

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Speaker 7: The only other thing I'll add about Gilan Maxwell is,

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Speaker 7: I mean, there could be a lot of stuff going

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Speaker 7: on there. She in those transcribed interviews that were released,

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Speaker 7: was I think pretty obviously deferential to Trump, and Trump

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Speaker 7: has been deferential in turn to Gilan Maxwell. And it

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Speaker 7: obviously seems like there's some information that Maxwell may have

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Speaker 7: that Trump is sort of trying to control her and anything.

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Speaker 6: That she might be able to spill.

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Speaker 7: I don't know if it's like about Trump or if

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Speaker 7: it's about the intelligence community, Like I don't know what

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Speaker 7: they're more worried about, to be honest, But it's like

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Speaker 7: at this point everyone knows Trump. He's like the Fifth

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Speaker 7: Avenue guy, right, Like Fifth Avenue shoots someone on Fifth Avenue,

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Speaker 7: like he is. Crystal's point about him acting guilty as hell,

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Speaker 7: like just politically, just politically, Like it's insane to fight

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Speaker 7: the document releases. It's completely insane. It makes you, it

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Speaker 7: makes you, it makes you.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, nd.

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Speaker 5: He has good political sense. He knows how insane it looks.

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Speaker 5: So therefore he thinks that not doing it is even worse,

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Speaker 5: which is really wild to think.

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Speaker 7: About, which is very Yes, but it's insane because there's

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Speaker 7: already so much like the Birthday book, like there's so

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Speaker 7: much out on Trump's relationship with Epstein.

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Speaker 6: I mean, it's just.

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Speaker 8: If we psycho analyze this, it's gonna be three hours.

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Speaker 8: So I am gonna move us along to your reporting Emily.

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Speaker 6: Into the Groper census.

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Speaker 8: Yes, well there has been a census conducted by Emily. Now,

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Speaker 8: this all started, of course, when Young Republican group chat

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Speaker 8: texts were leagud. There was I love Hitler comments and

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Speaker 8: other unsavory opinions, but Emily decided to do some some

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Speaker 8: gumshoe reporting, some knocking on doors, making phone calls to

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Speaker 8: find out just how many of these Republicans are groped

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Speaker 8: up basement cat boys.

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Speaker 4: Emily, what did you find?

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Speaker 5: What are the numbers.

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Speaker 6: Raped up basic cat boys?

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Speaker 7: Well, okay, so there was a number pinging around conservative

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Speaker 7: movement circles in DC last week from Roderer, who wrote

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Speaker 7: that he was told by an older insider that thirty

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Speaker 7: to forty percent of gen Z staffers in conservative world

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Speaker 7: and here in DC were gropers, and in that it

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Speaker 7: was sort of conflated with groper slash fans of Fuentas.

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Speaker 6: Those are kind of different things.

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Speaker 7: Like it's I'll get into that in just a second.

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Speaker 4: I actually agree with that too.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, Like it's because if you just see someone

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Speaker 7: who's like laughing at Nick quintezs as opposed to with

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Speaker 7: Nick Fuenta's, there's a distinction, and that distinction might be

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Speaker 7: genuine anti Semitism. So it's hard for I think, particularly

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Speaker 7: anyone older than like the age of forty, but maybe

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Speaker 7: even like the age of thirty. So like go through

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Speaker 7: these layers of irony and find the people who just

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Speaker 7: fun to sell them say, are hiding their power level whatever.

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Speaker 7: So the question is, has went to successfully infiltrated professional

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Speaker 7: DC and Republican circles as he has said he has

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Speaker 7: done and as he has planned to do. I think

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Speaker 7: the answer to that question is probably in small measure, yes,

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Speaker 7: but I do not think it's anywhere near thirty to

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Speaker 7: forty percent. My backgrounds in the conservative youth movement, do

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Speaker 7: tons of work with students, have met with like hundreds

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Speaker 7: of people for coffee in the last like ten years,

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Speaker 7: and all that is to say, I wanted to just

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Speaker 7: get a sense from other people, other younger people on

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Speaker 7: the right, what they thought the real number was. So

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Speaker 7: I had like seven sources that I talked to kind

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Speaker 7: of across the board, you everywhere from the White House,

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Speaker 7: Capitol Hill, conservative youth groups, all of that, and every

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Speaker 7: single person I talked to was like that numbers is crazy.

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Speaker 7: Pretty much everybody agrees that there is some small number.

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Speaker 7: One person I talked to the administration was like, it's

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Speaker 7: not double digits, which I know is cold comfort to

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Speaker 7: people are like, oh, you're saying the nine percent of

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Speaker 7: young Republican staffers are gropers.

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Speaker 6: I doubt that it's like even that high.

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Speaker 7: I have no idea what the number is, but I

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Speaker 7: don't think it's even that high either way. I just

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Speaker 7: think it's important to distinguish between, you know, who's legitimately

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Speaker 7: like Gropper, anti Semite, and who is sick and tired

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Speaker 7: of our foreign policy towards Israel and what we saw

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Speaker 7: happen in I think a couple of different recent cases

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Speaker 7: is those young Republicans who were saying legitimately like racist

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Speaker 7: and awful stuff then being conflated with the people at

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Speaker 7: the Heritage Foundation, like the young staffers at the Heritage

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Speaker 7: Foundation who are getting berated by neo cons for saying,

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Speaker 7: we don't like your Israel policy, and like Project Esther

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Speaker 7: is censoring people. So I do think that it's it's

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Speaker 7: worth like pausing to with cooler heads, allowing that to prevail,

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Speaker 7: allowing cooler heads to prevail and be like, we have

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Speaker 7: to distinguish when we're you know, actually trying to have

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Speaker 7: a useful political movement between who's an actual bigot because

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Speaker 7: there are some and it's a problem that it's going

438
00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,400
Speaker 7: to get worse the more disenfranchised a lot of young

439
00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:39,679
Speaker 7: men feel, and people who are just not on board

440
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:44,879
Speaker 7: with the project Esther and your conservative like really broad

441
00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:48,679
Speaker 7: definition of what constitutes anti Semitism. So yes, I had

442
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:54,679
Speaker 7: seven sources, nobody over millennial age, so millennials and younger,

443
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,920
Speaker 7: and yeah, I mean it's not useful if they're anyways

444
00:22:58,119 --> 00:22:58,840
Speaker 7: so true.

445
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:00,480
Speaker 6: That's that's that's what I wrote.

446
00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:03,520
Speaker 7: This is the groper's sensus, and that's we don't we

447
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:06,200
Speaker 7: don't have the firm number, but I think it's safe

448
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 7: to say not double digits.

449
00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 3: Yeah.

450
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:12,840
Speaker 2: I think part of what is hard to kind of

451
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,200
Speaker 2: wrap your arms around is like, what do we mean

452
00:23:15,240 --> 00:23:19,040
Speaker 2: by that term graper? You know, as you were indicating,

453
00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:23,240
Speaker 2: do we mean like the strictest definition would be someone

454
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 2: who is like a Nick Fuentes super fan, who would

455
00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:32,080
Speaker 2: self identify unironically as a groper and who buys into

456
00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 2: the entirety of the worldview. Okay, that would be like

457
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:41,000
Speaker 2: the narrowest definition. And there's a much broader definition, which

458
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,639
Speaker 2: would be that you know, they are sort of you know,

459
00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:50,040
Speaker 2: like racialist and may even come down on a different

460
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:52,440
Speaker 2: question of whether they hate the Jews or the Muslims more,

461
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:58,680
Speaker 2: but have this fundamental like Steven Miller, fundamentally racialist worldview,

462
00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,840
Speaker 2: and I think that, I mean, we see that, that is,

463
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:06,800
Speaker 2: we see publicly from this administration that the people who

464
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:09,640
Speaker 2: are running the social media accounts, the people who are

465
00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:12,000
Speaker 2: like you know, Stephen Miller and his acolytes who are

466
00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:18,800
Speaker 2: designing the policy, they share that racialist worldview. And so

467
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:20,840
Speaker 2: so you know, to me, it's just a question of like, well,

468
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:22,920
Speaker 2: what exactly do we mean by that, and does it

469
00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:24,960
Speaker 2: make it any better? Like I don't think Steven You

470
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 2: can't call Steven Miller a groper because he comes down,

471
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:31,920
Speaker 2: like I said, on a different question places in the

472
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 2: question of whether the Jews or the Muslims are worse,

473
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:41,960
Speaker 2: but he does share this bedrock racialist ideology which he's

474
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,400
Speaker 2: using to effectuate policy as one of the most powerful

475
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,919
Speaker 2: administrative administration staff members. So to me, it's somewhat of

476
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:52,800
Speaker 2: a distinction without a difference. Whether he's technically like a

477
00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 2: Nick Fuenta's super fan, he wouldn't be again because he

478
00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 2: is Jewish and is a Zionist and very committed to

479
00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:02,480
Speaker 2: the state of Israel. But on a lot of levels

480
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:05,200
Speaker 2: they fundamentally agree.

481
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 6: I think the distinction.

482
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,639
Speaker 7: In that case would be Fuentas indicates on his show

483
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 7: he is like controlling sleeper cells of to the narrow

484
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 7: definition you laid out crystal people who are self identified

485
00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:24,200
Speaker 7: grouper jersey wearers who would like activate at a moment's notice,

486
00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 7: like the sleeper cell would be activated.

487
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 2: He talks about like sending them to Iowa, New Hampshire

488
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,600
Speaker 2: to harass jd Vance if jad Vance is to run

489
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:32,040
Speaker 2: for president.

490
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:33,640
Speaker 3: I mean they probably will.

491
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:34,359
Speaker 9: You know.

492
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 2: It's ongoing war actually with Charlie Kirk and TPUSA, which

493
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,760
Speaker 2: is why people when Charlie Kirk was murdered were first

494
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 2: raising eyebrows at the groupers. And we do see a

495
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:46,919
Speaker 2: lot of like gripped up young people showing up at

496
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:51,040
Speaker 2: the TPUSA events. True, and you know, even at events

497
00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:54,600
Speaker 2: with like Eric Trump I saw, you know. And but

498
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:57,560
Speaker 2: to your point, it can be difficult to separate. Okay,

499
00:25:57,560 --> 00:26:00,000
Speaker 2: do you have a legitimate concern about our foreign policy

500
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 2: cvs of the Israel or is this fueled by you

501
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:05,800
Speaker 2: think it's a zion Is occupied government and the Jews

502
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:07,840
Speaker 2: control everything, et cetera, et cetera.

503
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:11,440
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, and I think that it's to like throw

504
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:15,040
Speaker 7: around the thirty forty percent number is dangerous because then

505
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 7: you're going to end up pushing people who are not

506
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 7: anti semitic but are being told they're anti semitic further

507
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:23,280
Speaker 7: to the fringes because there's like there's nothing I can

508
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:26,320
Speaker 7: do that will make you think I'm well intentioned, and

509
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 7: they still have agency and it's still their fault if

510
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 7: that happens. But uh, yes, the yeah, I think the

511
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 7: people who were giving Fuentas too little credit before for

512
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:39,760
Speaker 7: having power are now giving him too much credit. And

513
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:43,159
Speaker 7: so yeah, it's it's a little I don't know, it's tricky,

514
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 7: but the rights got to get Uh, it's got lots.

515
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:47,680
Speaker 6: Of problems, lots of problems.

516
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,560
Speaker 5: And I will say they they seem to be congregating

517
00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:53,920
Speaker 5: in the social media departments of all of these federal

518
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 5: agencies because like this is not you know, George H. W.

519
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:04,159
Speaker 5: Bush content that they're putting out on on like the

520
00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:08,720
Speaker 5: like on main Like they're putting out like far right

521
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:16,240
Speaker 5: like groper style memes like from the of like the

522
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:19,480
Speaker 5: Department of the Department of that like the and so

523
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 5: I assume those are kids.

524
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:24,199
Speaker 8: That somebody remember because it's a Santa's video when he

525
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,639
Speaker 8: was running that had like the bull like like this

526
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 8: is like been happening for like a year or two.

527
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,240
Speaker 2: Now, these memes, I mean, it makes sense that they

528
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 2: would be emily in the like perhaps a disproportionate concentration

529
00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 2: of those departments, because if you're that online, that you're

530
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 2: a Nick Fuentas like super fan, then you're probably going

531
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 2: to have some skill in like the meme and social

532
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 2: media department. Right, possible a major and a major push

533
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 2: in this ministry. We were talking about this earlier in

534
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,920
Speaker 2: the week to the frustration of some you know, ideological allies,

535
00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:02,719
Speaker 2: is to basically, you know, do the based ritual advice

536
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,879
Speaker 2: signaling through their social media and have that substitute for

537
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 2: any substantive policy that actually improves people's lives.

538
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 7: The last thing I'll say is almost all of my sources,

539
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:16,359
Speaker 7: with a couple of exceptions, were populists. So that's another

540
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:18,600
Speaker 7: question that I've gotten in the last couple of days.

541
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:23,200
Speaker 7: This is not like establishment McConnell people. So that's just

542
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:23,919
Speaker 7: just adding that.

543
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:25,440
Speaker 6: And the other thing is.

544
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:29,040
Speaker 7: Before recently, really the only people on the right who

545
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:31,000
Speaker 7: knew what a gripper was were people who were working

546
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,000
Speaker 7: in the youth movement. Because Fontes was so intentional and

547
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 7: strategic about infiltrating some of these youth events, and so

548
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 7: those organizations have for years been like screening grippers, like

549
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,640
Speaker 7: going through like deep dives social media, trying to figure

550
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,760
Speaker 7: out if people have burners, trying to ask certain questions

551
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 7: that might suss out grippers, and that's probably getting harder

552
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:57,400
Speaker 7: to do because they're getting more I think probably strategic

553
00:28:57,440 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 7: to try to avoid that process.

554
00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:02,400
Speaker 2: Well, last thing I'll say is who is this guy

555
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,800
Speaker 2: de Grassio or something like that who had his messages

556
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:11,000
Speaker 2: leaked in Grassia? Yeah, who had his messages leak where

557
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:14,320
Speaker 2: he was talking about like I've got a Nazi streak,

558
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 2: you know, and he just got elevated to a new,

559
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,479
Speaker 2: you know, relatively high level position. So again, like is

560
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 2: he a goroyperer? Probably not, Like he's an older guy,

561
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:29,480
Speaker 2: he's probably maybe not like a you know, Fuentes meme.

562
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 2: I don't, I don't know, maybe he is, but.

563
00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:33,880
Speaker 6: He's from my age and he's like thirty ish.

564
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,680
Speaker 2: But you know, this stuff comes out and reveals that

565
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,240
Speaker 2: he's at least you know, open to he I mean,

566
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 2: he has a racialist worldview, open to overt Nazism. And

567
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 2: this is not disqualifying in this administration. So I don't

568
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:50,960
Speaker 2: know why anyone would think that, you know, like that

569
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 2: somehow an association with Nick Fuentes would in any way

570
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 2: being be disqualifying, or that this administration would have any

571
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 2: interest in tamping down on overt the sentiment, when again,

572
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 2: some of the most powerful players within the administration share

573
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,880
Speaker 2: an overtly racist worldview, even if some of the like

574
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:13,040
Speaker 2: ethnic potent like specific ethnic dividing lines are slightly different.

575
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree with that.

576
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 8: I agree with like Ryan's take on like the DHS

577
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:21,200
Speaker 8: memes and stuff like that, But like I did get

578
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,720
Speaker 8: a sense from the story when like the group chat

579
00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:26,719
Speaker 8: officially like leaked that people were saying, oh, like this

580
00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:29,600
Speaker 8: doesn't just mean the staffers, but that a sizable just

581
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,720
Speaker 8: part of like magabas or voter population like our our our,

582
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 8: our Nazis and Hitler lovers.

583
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 4: Was kind of like a sense from the story.

584
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:39,880
Speaker 8: But I feel like if you reverse that and looked

585
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 8: at like democratic operatives, like I don't believe that like

586
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:46,880
Speaker 8: all democrats are like Olivia Juliana or Harry Sisson, like, like,

587
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 8: I don't think that that's also representative of like the

588
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,240
Speaker 8: democratic base or what have you, and something.

589
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 7: That is I don't think Hasan's representative of the average

590
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 7: like young Democrat, no.

591
00:30:57,080 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 8: Little tall maybe yeah, yeah, yeah, But like there's also

592
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 8: this like entertainment question, because I think Hassan.

593
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 2: Is fairly representative, but a lot of young dem in

594
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 2: a lot of ways. I mean, just look at how

595
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:12,240
Speaker 2: many under thirties voted for Zoron in New York City,

596
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:15,680
Speaker 2: And like, if you're just talking about just like ideological alignment,

597
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:20,560
Speaker 2: Hassan's politics and his politics would be you know, not identical,

598
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 2: but the most closely aligned of any mainstream political figure.

599
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:26,080
Speaker 2: So I actually think it would be fair to say

600
00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:31,560
Speaker 2: that young Democrats under thirty, you know, probably they may

601
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:35,680
Speaker 2: not all be Hassan Piker fans, specifically, they are more

602
00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:38,360
Speaker 2: from that wing of you know, reflective of that wing

603
00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:38,880
Speaker 2: of the party.

604
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:40,480
Speaker 7: Yeah, I think that's true. And I would have said

605
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:41,920
Speaker 7: the same thing with Charlie Kirk with the right.

606
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:42,480
Speaker 5: Yeah.

607
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 8: And people also separate take what they want from content.

608
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:47,120
Speaker 8: And I was thinking about this because I heard I

609
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 8: saw another conservative YouTube influencer Asmen Gold, talk about Fuentes

610
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 8: recently and he said, well, you know, I don't really

611
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:57,440
Speaker 8: agree with like the jew hating stuff, but I agree

612
00:31:57,480 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 8: with his takes on Israel, and I think that is

613
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,719
Speaker 8: like presentative of a lot of the conservatives that probably

614
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:04,920
Speaker 8: do watch frient is is they kind of like take

615
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 8: what they want. They're like, oh, well, I'm not really

616
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 8: sure I agree with like this like racism against Jews,

617
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:12,000
Speaker 8: but I do agree that Israel controls America or what

618
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,560
Speaker 8: have you. And I do think that is like representative

619
00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:16,280
Speaker 8: of like a large part of the audience. Is that,

620
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 8: like in the same with Candace Owens. I'm pretty sure

621
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 8: a large portion of people who watch candis Oen are like,

622
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 8: she's crazy, but I love watching That's true, right, And

623
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:27,600
Speaker 8: there is something to that right that people are coming

624
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:30,480
Speaker 8: to be entertained and they take what they want from it,

625
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,440
Speaker 8: like they don't become the person they're watching entirely, and

626
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:36,560
Speaker 8: they pick and choose what parts of it because ultimately

627
00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 8: a lot of it is entertainment.

628
00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 7: Well, last thing I'll say on this actually is I

629
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 7: think that's why it's incumbent on the right to understand

630
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:45,880
Speaker 7: better why people are watching Candace and Flinta. Some of

631
00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 7: it is because they're getting sucked into bad racial politics

632
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 7: like bigotry.

633
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,800
Speaker 6: On the other hand, some of it is that where else.

634
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 7: Do you go to get a conservative criticism of this

635
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:59,240
Speaker 7: Trump administration, Like that's part of it. And so if

636
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 7: they want to start like actually preventing people from getting

637
00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 7: sucked on these rabbit holes, they need to understand that

638
00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:08,200
Speaker 7: young people are not happy with this administration. Young conservatives

639
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 7: are not happy with this administration, and they're looking for

640
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 7: people to actually have real conversations about what's going on

641
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 7: in DC and in the world. And that pushes them

642
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:24,480
Speaker 7: towards the Fuenticses and Candacees and even towards like Pucker

643
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 7: for at least some modicum of criticism and skepticism about

644
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 7: conservative elites.

645
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's just that it doesn't I mean, if

646
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 2: you're just putting anti semitism off the table, but you're

647
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 2: not putting other forms of racism and bigotry off the table, mode, Yeah,

648
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 2: that's a pretty hollow victory to me, you know, in

649
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:47,920
Speaker 2: my opinion. And it's like, oh, Stephen Miller won out

650
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:50,960
Speaker 2: congratulate fucking lations, you know, or the people that actively

651
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 2: support and fund and armagenocide. Oh their ideology. One, wow,

652
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 2: that's fantastic, you know. I Mean, that's and that's why

653
00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:00,360
Speaker 2: I'm coming back to, like, you know, the Steve Miller

654
00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 2: in the views that are coming out of this administration

655
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:04,520
Speaker 2: of the policies. I mean, they're their refugee policy is

656
00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 2: only why it's allowed. You know, this stuff is just overt.

657
00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:12,840
Speaker 2: So I mean, I just I don't see outside of

658
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 2: I really don't see any significant institutions within the right

659
00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:21,920
Speaker 2: that are ascendant right now who are like, actually, all

660
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 2: bigotry should be off the table, not just like hey

661
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 2: guys like Randy Fine, like, hey guys, let's hate the Muslims,

662
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:31,799
Speaker 2: not the Jews, or Laura Omer, Hey, guys, you know,

663
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:35,239
Speaker 2: it's the Islamization of America that's the real problem. And

664
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 2: it's an outrage that we have any Muslims in in

665
00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:40,720
Speaker 2: Congress and how but how dare you be anti Semitic

666
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:44,520
Speaker 2: like that view where you're just like, well, my ethnic

667
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:47,319
Speaker 2: group or did naice to SUSA right where he's like, well,

668
00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:49,520
Speaker 2: my particular ethnic group should be off the table?

669
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:49,799
Speaker 3: I can't.

670
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:52,719
Speaker 2: But how dare you come for the Indians? Now it's like, yeah,

671
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 2: but you were good with all of this up until

672
00:34:54,920 --> 00:35:00,680
Speaker 2: that point when the hatred turned on you. So I mean, anyway,

673
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:05,239
Speaker 2: it's you know, to me, there's the ideological strain on

674
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:08,719
Speaker 2: the right that is ascendant right now is fundamentally racialist,

675
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 2: and so I don't really particularly have a dog in

676
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,560
Speaker 2: the fight of I think it's all imbhorrant right, whether

677
00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 2: you put the Muslims on top, or the Jews on top,

678
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:17,880
Speaker 2: or who you hate more, I think it's all a

679
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:22,200
Speaker 2: disgusting way to behave fundamentally, and.

680
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,400
Speaker 5: Emily is the right going to need some more distance

681
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:28,840
Speaker 5: from like twenty twenty. It feels like you watch a

682
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 5: right wing organization, if anybody tries to stand up to

683
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:35,520
Speaker 5: any form of bigotry in any circumstance.

684
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:36,080
Speaker 3: Then you're a cock.

685
00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 5: They get called woke.

686
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:39,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're a lib. You're a cock, You're woke.

687
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 7: I think that's the problem with like the ingrassiest stuff,

688
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:46,960
Speaker 7: which is people assume. And that's why I think this

689
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:49,879
Speaker 7: distinction is important. People assume that anyone who gets caught

690
00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:53,160
Speaker 7: up in like a canceled culture scandal, it's more important

691
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,480
Speaker 7: the cost benefit analysis is on owning the libs and

692
00:35:56,520 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 7: not like canceling somebody who's hashag based and so, yeah,

693
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:03,680
Speaker 7: I think maybe maybe that's a good point. Ryan, Yeah,

694
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 7: I think that's you know, all of the conservative institutions.

695
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:11,400
Speaker 7: I think we'll say and have been like hand ringing

696
00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:13,880
Speaker 7: over the last couple of weeks, especially with the heritage stuff,

697
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:19,920
Speaker 7: to like say there's nothing, nothing excuses any of this,

698
00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 7: you know, And that's fueling Flent does. He makes him

699
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 7: seem like really important and really ascendant and all of that.

700
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,680
Speaker 6: So it's confusing.

701
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 8: You need someone that's woke and hates Israel, like you need,

702
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:36,560
Speaker 8: you need to wokely hate Israel on the right for

703
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:37,360
Speaker 8: there to be a help, and.

704
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 2: Then you're just the leftist. Then someone over, guys. Lieutenant

705
00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:48,719
Speaker 2: Governor Peggy flanagain, welcome to the show.

706
00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 3: Guys.

707
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:52,239
Speaker 2: We talked about this earlier, but she is running. She's

708
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:55,200
Speaker 2: lieutenant governor of Minnesota and she is also running for

709
00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 2: the Senate in the state of Minnesota in the Democratic primary.

710
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 2: Believe her main challenger is Angie Craig, who's a current

711
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 2: member of Congress. Lieutenant Governor, welcome, great to have you.

712
00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 3: Thanks so much for having me. I'm so happy to

713
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:07,600
Speaker 3: be here.

714
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:11,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, it's our pleasure. Just why don't you

715
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 2: just introduce yourself a little bit for the audience, your background,

716
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 2: how you ended up in politics, and what some of

717
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 2: the core issues are that motivate you.

718
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:20,279
Speaker 3: Sure, absolutely so.

719
00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 10: As you said, I'm the Lieutenant Governor of the great

720
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:26,560
Speaker 10: State of Minnesota. I've been in this role for the

721
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:31,719
Speaker 10: last seven years. But at my core, I am an organizer.

722
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:34,440
Speaker 10: I was raised on the Wellstone for SETA campaign in

723
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 10: two thousand and two. I've been a school board member,

724
00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 10: the executive director of Children's Defense Fund Minnesota, and also

725
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 10: served in the House of Representatives here in Minnesota. And

726
00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:49,399
Speaker 10: I'm a qude who felt like the bottom could fall

727
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 10: out at any moment. And I know that there's too

728
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,160
Speaker 10: many people who feel that way right now. And that's

729
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 10: why I decided to run for a United States Senate

730
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:00,120
Speaker 10: because I think we need more people who understand what

731
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,040
Speaker 10: it feels like to try to stretch twenty bucks through

732
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 10: the through the end of the month.

733
00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 3: And so I'm excited to be here.

734
00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:10,560
Speaker 10: I'm a mom of a twelve year old, a middle schooler,

735
00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:13,440
Speaker 10: and I live in the community that raised me, of

736
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:16,720
Speaker 10: Saint Louis Park, and I'm the highest ranking Native American

737
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:19,640
Speaker 10: woman in executive office in the country. I'm a member

738
00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:21,880
Speaker 10: of the Wider Band of Ojibway, which is the largest

739
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:23,239
Speaker 10: tribe here in Minnesota.

740
00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 2: And I know you've done a lot of work, you know,

741
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,760
Speaker 2: connecting indigenous communities as well.

742
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:34,920
Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, our My understanding is that even though Angie

743
00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:38,760
Speaker 5: Cragg does not have the official endorsement of say Chuck Schumer,

744
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 5: at this point, she has all the It's understood to

745
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:44,759
Speaker 5: those of us who are here in Washington, DC that

746
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:48,560
Speaker 5: Angie Cragg is the like Democratic leadership candidate one way

747
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:51,200
Speaker 5: they send those signals without sending them all the way

748
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:55,360
Speaker 5: as they have Nancy Pelosi and Hakeem Jeffries endorse You're like,

749
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,960
Speaker 5: wait a minute, why are the House leaders in endorsing

750
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 5: the Senate candidate but not the Senate leader. But yeah,

751
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,560
Speaker 5: and some unions and other other signals that she's the candidate.

752
00:39:06,640 --> 00:39:11,320
Speaker 5: So did you get any pressure from the National Party

753
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:13,840
Speaker 5: not to run? They say, look this, the lane is

754
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:17,359
Speaker 5: cleared for Angie Craig. It's you know, this is this

755
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 5: is her nomination. What are you doing? And how is

756
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:22,160
Speaker 5: that affecting your the campaign?

757
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 3: So I certainly did get any.

758
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:30,680
Speaker 10: Any explicit pressure to to not run, to be clear.

759
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:33,200
Speaker 10: But what I would say is, you know, Ryan, I

760
00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:37,720
Speaker 10: think you're right that I am not a Beltwegh darling.

761
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,560
Speaker 10: And if this race were held in Washington, d C.

762
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 10: I think my opponent would win. Lucky for me, it's

763
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 10: being held in Minnesota, and so that's why I think

764
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:52,800
Speaker 10: that we're going to ruin this this race. You know,

765
00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:55,279
Speaker 10: to tell you, I'm not the establishment candidate, and I

766
00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 10: think right now, especially going into twenty twenty six, that's

767
00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:03,360
Speaker 10: a good thing. There's a particular formula I think that people,

768
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 10: maybe the establishment in Washington like to see.

769
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 3: I'm not part of that formula.

770
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 10: But I think that that is what's speaking to folks

771
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:16,239
Speaker 10: in this moment as we're traveling all across the state

772
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:20,120
Speaker 10: of Minnesota. People are ready for bold leadership. They don't

773
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:22,280
Speaker 10: want folks who are going to nibble around the edges anymore.

774
00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:24,880
Speaker 10: And I think that's what we saw all across the

775
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,680
Speaker 10: country in the most recent elections.

776
00:40:27,719 --> 00:40:28,960
Speaker 3: And that's why I'm in this.

777
00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:33,879
Speaker 10: So you know, if there's folks who are all in

778
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:36,800
Speaker 10: for my opponent, that's just fine. We're going to spend

779
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 10: this time working on the ground, organizing with real folks and.

780
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:41,440
Speaker 3: Being really clear.

781
00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:45,719
Speaker 10: I think that this race is about what is facing

782
00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 10: the Democratic Party overall, because it is a corporate Democrat

783
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:54,680
Speaker 10: versus someone with progressive values who's been delivering for working

784
00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:57,920
Speaker 10: families for a long time, and I think that that's

785
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:00,360
Speaker 10: what people are interested in this moment.

786
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:05,040
Speaker 7: Do you think that message, potentially in a general election

787
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:09,720
Speaker 7: is powerful with people who maybe voted for Donald Trump

788
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 7: or voted for Republican candidates in the past. Do you

789
00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:15,320
Speaker 7: think your background as a left wing populist is actually

790
00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:17,040
Speaker 7: something that helps you. I don't know if you have

791
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:20,319
Speaker 7: conversations with people who've voted for Trump or maybe other

792
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:24,759
Speaker 7: Republicans who are disillusioned disenchanted now where your sort of

793
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:28,280
Speaker 7: flavor of Bernie style populism is appealing.

794
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,279
Speaker 10: I certainly think it is, and we're actually seeing it

795
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:33,680
Speaker 10: as we're going across the state. So we've been holding

796
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:36,799
Speaker 10: what we call kitchen table conversations, and so it's a

797
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:39,680
Speaker 10: little less scripted town hall and a little bit more

798
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 10: community meeting. So of course we have folks who are

799
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:44,880
Speaker 10: coming who are Democrats. We've got a lot of independence

800
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:47,399
Speaker 10: or folks who are like, I don't agree with any

801
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 10: political party, but I'm really freaked out by what I

802
00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:50,919
Speaker 10: see happening here.

803
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 3: And then we have Republicans.

804
00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 10: We were in the community of Canby, Minnesota, which is

805
00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:59,759
Speaker 10: in southwestern Minnesota, a small town, and we had these

806
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:02,319
Speaker 10: four guys show up who sort of were all like

807
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 10: had their arms crossed over their chest in the back

808
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 10: of the room, and you know, and I was like,

809
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 10: I wonder what these guys are about. And one of

810
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:13,440
Speaker 10: them raised his hand and he said, you know, we

811
00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:18,960
Speaker 10: all voted for Trump in sixteen in twenty and we

812
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:24,359
Speaker 10: didn't vote for quote unquote that lady in twenty twenty four.

813
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:26,800
Speaker 10: They said, but we're here because you're a tough cookie.

814
00:42:27,280 --> 00:42:29,880
Speaker 10: And then they went on to say that they were

815
00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:32,959
Speaker 10: concerned about Snap being pulled out of the egg bill

816
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:36,160
Speaker 10: and what that means for the future of farmers, like

817
00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:38,520
Speaker 10: we've already always been able to count on the fact

818
00:42:38,520 --> 00:42:40,840
Speaker 10: that this was going to get done. And he said,

819
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:43,239
Speaker 10: you know, the the you know, little secret that people

820
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 10: won't tell you is how many farmers themselves rely on

821
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:50,000
Speaker 10: Snap to keep food on the table. And so I

822
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 10: think that those are the things that are resonating with people.

823
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:55,799
Speaker 10: And no matter where I go, it can be in

824
00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:59,799
Speaker 10: you know, the urban core, the suburbs, rural communities. Health

825
00:42:59,880 --> 00:43:02,440
Speaker 10: Care here is the thing that I hear about over

826
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,840
Speaker 10: and over and over again. So that is like we

827
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:08,319
Speaker 10: don't have to agree on everything, but I think what

828
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 10: we can agree on is that it's like literally all

829
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 10: of us versus extremist billionaires and the folks at the

830
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:17,440
Speaker 10: very very top who are doing incredibly well under the

831
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 10: Trump administration. And I think that's what can galvanize us.

832
00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:23,400
Speaker 10: Folks know that the game is rigged and we just

833
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:26,239
Speaker 10: have to talk about it. What did you think of

834
00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:30,439
Speaker 10: the shutdown deal that was, you know, agreed to by

835
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:33,319
Speaker 10: eight Democrats in the Senate, And do you believe that

836
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 10: Chuck Shumer should continue to be the Democratic leader? So

837
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 10: I'll tell you it would have not even crossed my

838
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:45,720
Speaker 10: mind to like even entertain voting for that deal. Talk about,

839
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:49,840
Speaker 10: you know, clutching defeat from you know, the the mouth

840
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:50,480
Speaker 10: of victory.

841
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:54,400
Speaker 3: I just I feel like, you know, of course, I

842
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:55,440
Speaker 3: want to be very clear.

843
00:43:56,080 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 10: The shutdown and our federal employees, TSA workers, folks who

844
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:05,719
Speaker 10: depend on snap that was incredibly hard. And I know

845
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:08,319
Speaker 10: that we had people who were coming along with us.

846
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:12,759
Speaker 10: I think case in point elections literally all across the

847
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:15,719
Speaker 10: country that said keep fighting for us.

848
00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:18,879
Speaker 3: And so I just don't.

849
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 10: I just don't understand it. So the answer is like

850
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:24,440
Speaker 10: I want to voted for it. I'm incredibly disappointed in

851
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:26,920
Speaker 10: the eight Senate Democrats and now four members of the

852
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:29,839
Speaker 10: House who went along. I think we only have a

853
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 10: handful of tools in our toolbox right now as Democrats.

854
00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:34,919
Speaker 3: This was one of them.

855
00:44:35,840 --> 00:44:39,239
Speaker 10: And I'm sick and tired of Democrats fighting from a

856
00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:42,680
Speaker 10: defensive crouch. And I think we lost some ground with people,

857
00:44:43,120 --> 00:44:45,759
Speaker 10: and now I, along with others, have to, you know,

858
00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:47,880
Speaker 10: work to rebuild that trust and say I'm going to

859
00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,400
Speaker 10: fight for you. That is not the kind of Democrat

860
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:54,560
Speaker 10: that I am. I think the job of a caucus

861
00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:59,440
Speaker 10: leader is to keep folks together, and we certainly did

862
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 10: not see that. It's I think it's going to take

863
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:07,719
Speaker 10: a lot for for folks to feel like they can

864
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:09,920
Speaker 10: trust his party again.

865
00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:12,840
Speaker 3: And that's you know, that's what's at stake.

866
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,080
Speaker 10: And you said I I, Uh, I think I feel

867
00:45:16,120 --> 00:45:19,279
Speaker 10: the same way about Chuck Schumer that he feels about me.

868
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:22,680
Speaker 3: Unc is what I would say.

869
00:45:22,840 --> 00:45:27,680
Speaker 10: And and so you know, I I as it's been reported,

870
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:30,439
Speaker 10: I don't think I'm his his candidate in this race.

871
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 6: That's okay.

872
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:33,960
Speaker 3: We're just going to keep organizing and and and we're

873
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:34,399
Speaker 3: going to win.

874
00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:37,320
Speaker 5: A number of Democrats have said that he should step

875
00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:40,160
Speaker 5: down as leader. Uh, do you think he should step

876
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:44,799
Speaker 5: down as leader? Would you support him next time? Let's

877
00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:46,759
Speaker 5: say you win and he runs for Coggs leader again.

878
00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 5: There's also been some speculation that he won't even run

879
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:53,120
Speaker 5: for re election. Do you think he should decline to

880
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:53,960
Speaker 5: run for reelection?

881
00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:57,840
Speaker 10: I mean, I think any leader should take time to,

882
00:45:58,320 --> 00:46:03,239
Speaker 10: you know, reflect on where they are needed and necessary.

883
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:07,080
Speaker 10: I would say there's a lot of time right between

884
00:46:07,719 --> 00:46:08,520
Speaker 10: now and the election.

885
00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:09,319
Speaker 3: I'm really going to.

886
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:13,360
Speaker 5: Focus on what about right now? On Brokannas on the

887
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:16,439
Speaker 5: fair number of other Democrats have said enough, like it's

888
00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:18,880
Speaker 5: this is an urgent moment, you just you should step

889
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:21,200
Speaker 5: down now? Do you think you should step down now?

890
00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:24,080
Speaker 10: That's not my decision to make, But I think he

891
00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:27,560
Speaker 10: should seriously reflect on the direction of the party, the

892
00:46:27,640 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 10: need to rebuild trust here. And here's what I think

893
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 10: is so hard about this moment is that there are

894
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:38,719
Speaker 10: people outside of the Beltway who know that things are

895
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 10: on fire right and so I think that is that

896
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:48,040
Speaker 10: disconnect between how people are living right now and what's

897
00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:51,400
Speaker 10: happening in Washington, DC that I think is what deserves

898
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:55,000
Speaker 10: a lot of reflection. Because when I'm in communities and

899
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:58,720
Speaker 10: I'm talking to a librarian who says, my deductibles fifteen

900
00:46:58,719 --> 00:47:01,879
Speaker 10: thousand dollars a year and that I just went to

901
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:04,239
Speaker 10: the doctor for a five minute medcheck and it cost

902
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 10: me six hundred bucks.

903
00:47:06,040 --> 00:47:06,719
Speaker 3: And I don't know.

904
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:08,360
Speaker 10: Whether or not we're going to be able to afford

905
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:12,840
Speaker 10: healthcare next year at all. And we're like nibbling around

906
00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:16,040
Speaker 10: the edges and somehow, you know, saying like, well, we

907
00:47:16,120 --> 00:47:18,799
Speaker 10: sure brought them the fight by raising, you know, this

908
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 10: idea that healthcare is expensive and that somehow that's enough.

909
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:26,239
Speaker 10: It's it's blowney And I think it just speaks to

910
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:31,160
Speaker 10: how disconnected people feel right now from what's what's what's

911
00:47:31,160 --> 00:47:35,040
Speaker 10: happening in in in Washington. So you know, again, I

912
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:41,440
Speaker 10: think Chuck Schumer just isn't that into me. And that's okay, uh,

913
00:47:41,480 --> 00:47:44,719
Speaker 10: And you know, I'm going to keep doing the work

914
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:47,600
Speaker 10: that I need to do here in Minnesota and focus

915
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:51,080
Speaker 10: on this race and making sure that people here have

916
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:53,560
Speaker 10: the fighter that they need and someone who's willing to

917
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:59,719
Speaker 10: take on corporate interests and not capitulate to make sure

918
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:03,000
Speaker 10: that you know, the money keeps coming in to the party.

919
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:06,840
Speaker 5: And Lieutenant governor. Real quickly, if I could play a

920
00:48:07,120 --> 00:48:10,640
Speaker 5: quick clip for you a a Minnesota DFL member who

921
00:48:10,680 --> 00:48:14,640
Speaker 5: was at a party auction slash fundraiser earlier this month.

922
00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 5: You may have even been at this one. I don't know.

923
00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:18,640
Speaker 5: Angie Craig was there and she's kind of leading an

924
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:22,800
Speaker 5: auction and she gets pressed by a Democrat who's that

925
00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:26,880
Speaker 5: in the in the audience about her position on Gaza,

926
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:30,480
Speaker 5: and I want to play her very strange and hard

927
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:34,759
Speaker 5: to understand response. But and then get your response to this.

928
00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:45,799
Speaker 5: Let me play this video here.

929
00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:48,439
Speaker 1: Bye, log.

930
00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:50,200
Speaker 4: Went in the democracy in this set.

931
00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:58,200
Speaker 5: So it goes on like that, she just kind of

932
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:01,680
Speaker 5: continues the auction. Uh, but she says, you know, we

933
00:49:01,719 --> 00:49:03,480
Speaker 5: believe in democracy in this country. We are not a

934
00:49:03,560 --> 00:49:08,799
Speaker 5: cult in response to the person pressing her on whether

935
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:11,480
Speaker 5: or not you know, I was going to stand up

936
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 5: against the genocide and Gaza. So any response to that

937
00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:20,880
Speaker 5: clip itself, but also where are you? Where do you

938
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:23,799
Speaker 5: stand when it comes to you know, us support for

939
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:25,680
Speaker 5: the Israeli military.

940
00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:26,360
Speaker 3: Sure?

941
00:49:27,239 --> 00:49:32,040
Speaker 10: So I was there, Okay, I was, Yeah, I was

942
00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:33,080
Speaker 10: at that dinner.

943
00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:36,400
Speaker 3: And you know these are there were a handful of

944
00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 3: young people who were there who.

945
00:49:41,760 --> 00:49:44,239
Speaker 10: You know, spent their own money, uh to to be

946
00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:46,840
Speaker 10: at this dinner, and I think we're looking for an

947
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:51,160
Speaker 10: opportunity to engage. And it was a pack room. Folks

948
00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:54,759
Speaker 10: are fired up, and you know all of us gave

949
00:49:54,760 --> 00:49:59,000
Speaker 10: a little speech and and that that happened.

950
00:50:00,640 --> 00:50:01,719
Speaker 3: What I decided to do?

951
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:03,319
Speaker 5: What she mean cult like.

952
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:07,640
Speaker 10: I mean, I think it was just sort of a

953
00:50:07,680 --> 00:50:12,120
Speaker 10: wild moment with as you could hear a lot of yelling.

954
00:50:12,400 --> 00:50:14,920
Speaker 10: It was an action like we all, all the electeds

955
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:19,120
Speaker 10: or candidates had an auction off an item and uh, and.

956
00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:21,680
Speaker 3: That's that's Uh, that's what happened.

957
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:26,440
Speaker 10: So I decided, uh, you know, before I left to

958
00:50:26,560 --> 00:50:29,680
Speaker 10: pull these young people aside and I talked to them

959
00:50:30,480 --> 00:50:34,080
Speaker 10: because you know, they they were there to to express

960
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:36,719
Speaker 10: their viewpoints. And I think that's important and I think

961
00:50:36,719 --> 00:50:40,000
Speaker 10: when young people are showing up on our party, uh,

962
00:50:40,080 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 10: it's important to make sure that that they feel hard. Now,

963
00:50:43,160 --> 00:50:45,680
Speaker 10: I want to be really clear, I am not taking

964
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:48,239
Speaker 10: money from APAC. I also don't believe that they would

965
00:50:48,239 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 10: give it to me, so you know, that's that's also

966
00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 10: part of this. But you know, what what has happened is,

967
00:50:56,960 --> 00:51:02,480
Speaker 10: you know I was asked about the Sanders resist this

968
00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 10: summer that both both of my senator Senator Tina Smith

969
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:08,120
Speaker 10: and Senator Amy Klobuchar.

970
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:10,799
Speaker 3: Voted in favor of to.

971
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:18,080
Speaker 10: Stop offensive weapons from getting to Netniahu's government. And it was,

972
00:51:18,200 --> 00:51:23,400
Speaker 10: you know, for me, because we saw the starvation of

973
00:51:23,560 --> 00:51:28,239
Speaker 10: children in Gaza, and I think there are again a

974
00:51:28,280 --> 00:51:31,120
Speaker 10: handful of tools and our toolbox that we can use

975
00:51:32,200 --> 00:51:35,440
Speaker 10: when we see something happening that's that's not right. And

976
00:51:35,480 --> 00:51:39,160
Speaker 10: to be really clear, you know, the same reason why

977
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:41,960
Speaker 10: I would have supported that resolution when I see starving

978
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:44,880
Speaker 10: children is the same reason why I support breakfast and

979
00:51:45,000 --> 00:51:49,160
Speaker 10: lunch being offered to kids universal bials at school, right,

980
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:51,840
Speaker 10: Like that is a consistent through line.

981
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:53,840
Speaker 3: And you know, of course.

982
00:51:55,120 --> 00:52:00,160
Speaker 10: What happened on October seventh is absolutely horrific, and the

983
00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:06,319
Speaker 10: trauma and the violence was unacceptable. And and what we

984
00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:12,879
Speaker 10: see the response from Netanyahu's government of preventing aid, of

985
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:19,360
Speaker 10: leveling entire neighborhoods and communities is not right. And so

986
00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:24,080
Speaker 10: I am now you know, a target uh for a

987
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:28,759
Speaker 10: pack because I spoke up, and you know I'm going

988
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,480
Speaker 10: to continue uh to you know, I get reserve the

989
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:33,960
Speaker 10: right to critique my own government and Donald Trump, and

990
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:39,640
Speaker 10: I certainly reserve the right to critique Benjamin Yahoo and

991
00:52:39,640 --> 00:52:41,400
Speaker 10: and his government as well.

992
00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:44,160
Speaker 3: So I know that this is an issue.

993
00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:47,480
Speaker 10: Uh A pack is supporting UH my opponent to the

994
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:51,520
Speaker 10: tune of hundreds of thousands of dollars, and so, uh,

995
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:54,360
Speaker 10: we're going to be competitive when it comes to fundraising.

996
00:52:54,480 --> 00:52:59,759
Speaker 3: But it's also I also it's not not how I'm

997
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:01,040
Speaker 3: into said in funding my team.

998
00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:06,000
Speaker 5: What did you tell the uh the protesters, the students

999
00:53:06,080 --> 00:53:09,359
Speaker 5: or were they students? Were they what did you tell them?

1000
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:10,120
Speaker 5: And what they tell you?

1001
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:13,959
Speaker 10: They were they were students, and you know, they just said,

1002
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:18,200
Speaker 10: we just want an opportunity to have a conversation. And

1003
00:53:19,920 --> 00:53:22,920
Speaker 10: I think, you know, she was sort of scuttled at

1004
00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:27,760
Speaker 10: the back door of the kitchen. I think people deserve

1005
00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:30,960
Speaker 10: that and listen, Like, you can decide to take money

1006
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:33,680
Speaker 10: from whoever you want you to to fund your campaign.

1007
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:38,799
Speaker 10: To me, integrity matters and you know, and so like.

1008
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:40,200
Speaker 3: I shared that with them.

1009
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:42,440
Speaker 10: They asked how you know if I was taking a

1010
00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:46,000
Speaker 10: PAC money and I said no, and mostly I just listened.

1011
00:53:46,360 --> 00:53:49,719
Speaker 10: And I think that that is I think that that's

1012
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:52,600
Speaker 10: what people are interested in right now. And so if

1013
00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:56,080
Speaker 10: you're if you're not going to even engage, like, what

1014
00:53:56,120 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 10: does that say right about about our democracy. I just

1015
00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:06,040
Speaker 10: we don't have enough young people in this party. We

1016
00:54:06,080 --> 00:54:08,160
Speaker 10: don't have enough young people who are banging on the

1017
00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:10,400
Speaker 10: door to say, like, I want to be part of

1018
00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:10,879
Speaker 10: this work.

1019
00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:12,440
Speaker 3: I want to be part of this movement.

1020
00:54:13,160 --> 00:54:15,719
Speaker 10: I think we have a responsibility to do everything we

1021
00:54:15,800 --> 00:54:18,960
Speaker 10: can to say you're welcome here. And again, we don't

1022
00:54:18,960 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 10: have to agree on everything, but you get to have

1023
00:54:22,440 --> 00:54:26,000
Speaker 10: you know, your your voice heard in this process. And

1024
00:54:26,239 --> 00:54:29,040
Speaker 10: I worry about what that means. If we keep shutting

1025
00:54:29,120 --> 00:54:32,279
Speaker 10: young people down over and over again, maybe they're not

1026
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:33,479
Speaker 10: going to turn out for the other guys.

1027
00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:36,000
Speaker 3: They're just gonna not going to turn out at all.

1028
00:54:38,080 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 2: What do you see, Lieutenant Governor, as the primary differences

1029
00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:45,120
Speaker 2: between you and Congresswoman Anngie Craig. What are some of

1030
00:54:45,160 --> 00:54:47,000
Speaker 2: the key policy differences that you see?

1031
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:48,120
Speaker 4: Sure, so I.

1032
00:54:48,080 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 10: Would say that, you know, the the biggest thing is

1033
00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:54,839
Speaker 10: is really how we are approaching, you know, our elections.

1034
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:58,920
Speaker 10: I've decided not to take corporate pack money. That's incredibly

1035
00:54:58,960 --> 00:55:01,600
Speaker 10: important to me, I think, especially right now when people

1036
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:05,800
Speaker 10: know that the game is rigged. You know, I certainly

1037
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:09,160
Speaker 10: knew that corporations had a lot of power in Washington.

1038
00:55:10,560 --> 00:55:12,920
Speaker 10: It wasn't until I started running for the US Senate

1039
00:55:12,960 --> 00:55:13,520
Speaker 10: that I was like.

1040
00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:15,080
Speaker 3: Whoo, they sure do.

1041
00:55:15,239 --> 00:55:17,880
Speaker 10: And so, you know, this has been a point where

1042
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:22,520
Speaker 10: for me that's incredibly important is to say that I

1043
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:26,759
Speaker 10: want to be accountable to the people of Minnesota and

1044
00:55:26,840 --> 00:55:30,160
Speaker 10: to our small dollar donors all across the country, because

1045
00:55:30,160 --> 00:55:33,560
Speaker 10: I think it's pretty disingenuous to say I'm going to

1046
00:55:33,640 --> 00:55:37,680
Speaker 10: hold big pharma accountable while at the same time taking

1047
00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:41,320
Speaker 10: a big check from a pharmaceutical company. People are smarter

1048
00:55:41,480 --> 00:55:44,799
Speaker 10: than that, and I think that that is really the

1049
00:55:44,840 --> 00:55:46,640
Speaker 10: core of what this is about. Are you going to

1050
00:55:46,719 --> 00:55:48,360
Speaker 10: show for the corporate interests or are you going to

1051
00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:51,680
Speaker 10: work for working people? You know, I also think things

1052
00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:55,399
Speaker 10: like raising the minimum wage, paid family and medical leave,

1053
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:59,880
Speaker 10: making sure you know, as we're talking about healthcare across

1054
00:56:00,080 --> 00:56:03,360
Speaker 10: a state, it is time to just say what is

1055
00:56:03,400 --> 00:56:06,320
Speaker 10: needed and necessary, which is to get rid of prior

1056
00:56:06,360 --> 00:56:09,120
Speaker 10: authorization so some dude behind a desk doesn't get to

1057
00:56:09,160 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 10: decide whether or not you get the life saving healthcare

1058
00:56:11,880 --> 00:56:14,960
Speaker 10: that you deserve, or worse yet, AI or a robot

1059
00:56:15,120 --> 00:56:17,879
Speaker 10: doesn't get to make that decision, and that we need

1060
00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:20,880
Speaker 10: medicare for all. And you know, I think that that

1061
00:56:21,000 --> 00:56:24,279
Speaker 10: has been the clearest difference between the two of us,

1062
00:56:25,120 --> 00:56:28,880
Speaker 10: that I am willing to take on these big corporations

1063
00:56:28,920 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 10: and to fight for what folks need, and I am

1064
00:56:31,680 --> 00:56:34,839
Speaker 10: not being financed by the very people who are responsible

1065
00:56:35,120 --> 00:56:37,600
Speaker 10: for the reason that the economy looks like how it

1066
00:56:37,640 --> 00:56:41,280
Speaker 10: looks now for you know, for for middle class folks

1067
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 10: and for folks who.

1068
00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:45,839
Speaker 3: Are on the margins. Yeah, no, God, go ahead, Ryan,

1069
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:46,479
Speaker 3: go ahead, Ryan.

1070
00:56:46,640 --> 00:56:49,120
Speaker 5: Craig herself correct me if I'm wrongs. I covered her

1071
00:56:49,120 --> 00:56:51,320
Speaker 5: twenty eighteen race. She was actually recruited by the d

1072
00:56:51,440 --> 00:56:55,040
Speaker 5: TRIBC in that race against some other you know, uh

1073
00:56:55,520 --> 00:56:58,480
Speaker 5: were progressive candis there? So my recollection?

1074
00:56:58,600 --> 00:57:01,080
Speaker 4: She and sorry, and we're gonna have to rapper.

1075
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:03,000
Speaker 8: She's got a hard out parent teacher conference in a

1076
00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:05,080
Speaker 8: sex So we'll do this last question and then we'll rapper.

1077
00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:08,040
Speaker 5: She's a medical device executive, Is that right? Like she

1078
00:57:08,040 --> 00:57:10,520
Speaker 5: worked for a medical device company something like normally Democrats

1079
00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:14,880
Speaker 5: are finding like female fighter fighter pilots or something. So

1080
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:18,840
Speaker 5: how does that how does her background in corporate America

1081
00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:20,919
Speaker 5: like play into your campaign here?

1082
00:57:21,440 --> 00:57:23,840
Speaker 10: I mean, you know, I think I don't know how

1083
00:57:23,880 --> 00:57:26,600
Speaker 10: hard we'll lean into like her expertise. I think we're

1084
00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:30,000
Speaker 10: both highly qualified right women who are running for office.

1085
00:57:30,280 --> 00:57:32,640
Speaker 10: I think it is about just who do you want

1086
00:57:32,680 --> 00:57:37,400
Speaker 10: your candidates beholden to? Right corporate interests or real people?

1087
00:57:37,520 --> 00:57:40,120
Speaker 10: And I think that's, you know, really what this this

1088
00:57:40,360 --> 00:57:41,280
Speaker 10: campaign's all about.

1089
00:57:41,680 --> 00:57:43,360
Speaker 3: Just very quickly because you raised AI.

1090
00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:45,200
Speaker 2: I know there have been a few high profile data

1091
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:48,160
Speaker 2: center fights in Minnesota. You know, what is your view

1092
00:57:48,320 --> 00:57:51,040
Speaker 2: of the mass data center build out? Its impact on

1093
00:57:51,120 --> 00:57:52,920
Speaker 2: electricity prices in the environment.

1094
00:57:53,440 --> 00:57:55,640
Speaker 10: I mean, I think we have to have additional protections

1095
00:57:55,640 --> 00:57:58,000
Speaker 10: in there for consumers. I think there's a difference between

1096
00:57:58,040 --> 00:58:00,640
Speaker 10: an AI center that has a closed water system versus

1097
00:58:00,720 --> 00:58:03,959
Speaker 10: one that does not. You know, when we see folks

1098
00:58:04,000 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 10: who are coming in to building communities, I think a

1099
00:58:07,160 --> 00:58:09,120
Speaker 10: lot of times folks are getting a really raw deal.

1100
00:58:09,240 --> 00:58:11,360
Speaker 10: So I think we have to take a really good

1101
00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:14,160
Speaker 10: look at what does that actually mean. They're bringing jobs

1102
00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 10: and that's needed and necessary, especially for the building construction,

1103
00:58:17,520 --> 00:58:19,840
Speaker 10: but how do we make sure that those benefits continue?

1104
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:24,520
Speaker 10: And you know, that's that's deeply concerning to me, and

1105
00:58:24,560 --> 00:58:27,680
Speaker 10: it's something that we here all across the country. I think,

1106
00:58:28,200 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 10: you know, they're needed and necessary. However, we have to

1107
00:58:31,560 --> 00:58:34,000
Speaker 10: have additional protections in place for consumers and for folks

1108
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:35,920
Speaker 10: who live around them to make sure that they're just

1109
00:58:35,920 --> 00:58:36,919
Speaker 10: not getting a raw deal.

1110
00:58:38,400 --> 00:58:40,400
Speaker 2: Lieutenant Governor, thank you so much for your time. We

1111
00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:42,080
Speaker 2: really appreciate it's great to get to meet you.

1112
00:58:42,320 --> 00:58:45,000
Speaker 3: Thanks so much for having me appreciate you. Yeah, a pleasure.

1113
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:51,800
Speaker 8: All right, on that note, but you guys think, yeah, yeah, okay,

1114
00:58:51,800 --> 00:58:53,200
Speaker 8: we can debrief Ryan.

1115
00:58:53,240 --> 00:58:54,160
Speaker 4: What do you think.

1116
00:58:55,720 --> 00:58:57,960
Speaker 5: Is she Yeah, she was about to be governor if

1117
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:01,160
Speaker 5: Harris Walls hadn't Oh that's true.

1118
00:59:01,520 --> 00:59:02,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, I hadn't even thought about that.

1119
00:59:04,320 --> 00:59:06,280
Speaker 5: Yeah, there was a lot of people in Minnesota were

1120
00:59:06,320 --> 00:59:09,600
Speaker 5: really rooting for Walls to become vice president just so

1121
00:59:09,640 --> 00:59:13,680
Speaker 5: she could become Kuffner. So there's a double disappointment in

1122
00:59:13,680 --> 00:59:17,520
Speaker 5: Minnesota when Walls came slinking back to the governor's mansion.

1123
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:22,360
Speaker 2: She's got she's got Bernie's backing. She's one of the

1124
00:59:22,360 --> 00:59:24,760
Speaker 2: candidates that he has endorsed. I mean, there's a number

1125
00:59:24,800 --> 00:59:27,160
Speaker 2: of high profile races at this point that are basically

1126
00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:30,960
Speaker 2: like Schumer versus Bernie, which is a kind of a

1127
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:34,480
Speaker 2: fun dynamic, telling dynamic. But I actually worked with one

1128
00:59:34,520 --> 00:59:36,720
Speaker 2: of the candidates that was opposed, and I can't remember

1129
00:59:36,720 --> 00:59:38,640
Speaker 2: his name at this point. He's a teacher who was

1130
00:59:38,680 --> 00:59:41,040
Speaker 2: in the race against Angie Craig, so I've been.

1131
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:43,800
Speaker 5: Very Yeah, yeah, I remember him, yeah for a while.

1132
00:59:44,160 --> 00:59:47,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, And but yeah, I mean she comes out of

1133
00:59:47,560 --> 00:59:50,800
Speaker 2: the medical device industry and has done a number of

1134
00:59:50,800 --> 00:59:53,520
Speaker 2: favors for them, and they have a large footprint in Minnesota.

1135
00:59:53,600 --> 00:59:55,560
Speaker 2: Is my rock collection as well, Like it's a big

1136
00:59:55,600 --> 00:59:59,280
Speaker 2: business there, so for you know, I think Peggy is

1137
00:59:59,280 --> 01:00:04,320
Speaker 2: obviously really trying to cut a pretty clear contrast in

1138
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:07,280
Speaker 2: terms of like the source of their funding, the way

1139
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:10,840
Speaker 2: that they're going about their campaigns, and then you know,

1140
01:00:10,880 --> 01:00:12,840
Speaker 2: the fact that she's a Medicare for All supporter is

1141
01:00:12,840 --> 01:00:15,640
Speaker 2: also obviously a significant divide at a time when healthcare

1142
01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:17,080
Speaker 2: is increasingly on the minds of people.

1143
01:00:18,160 --> 01:00:21,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, it is. You know, it is interesting because it's like, Okay,

1144
01:00:21,600 --> 01:00:24,560
Speaker 5: medical device, it's a big industry, fine, but like, do

1145
01:00:24,560 --> 01:00:29,000
Speaker 5: we really need a medical device executive representing them in

1146
01:00:29,080 --> 01:00:32,200
Speaker 5: the Senate? It's it is such a classic right, like

1147
01:00:32,200 --> 01:00:33,240
Speaker 5: a corporate executive.

1148
01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:36,680
Speaker 2: Though I don't know that I don't understand the hesitation

1149
01:00:36,960 --> 01:00:39,840
Speaker 2: in throwing Chuck Schumer under the bus, like like she said, he.

1150
01:00:39,760 --> 01:00:42,680
Speaker 3: Doesn't like me, not supporting me. It's like, why can't

1151
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:43,440
Speaker 3: you repay the paper?

1152
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:47,360
Speaker 2: I Kyle and I interviewed Antonio Delgado, who is the

1153
01:00:47,360 --> 01:00:50,520
Speaker 2: Lieutenant governor actually of New York yesterday and is challenging

1154
01:00:50,600 --> 01:00:54,560
Speaker 2: Kathy Higel and is also the progressive insurgent candidate and

1155
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:57,040
Speaker 2: same thing. I don't know what it is that the

1156
01:00:57,080 --> 01:01:00,000
Speaker 2: hold that Chuck Schumer has that is just something invisible

1157
01:01:00,280 --> 01:01:02,560
Speaker 2: underneath the surface. I mean, Ryan, do you have any

1158
01:01:02,560 --> 01:01:05,840
Speaker 2: insight into that? Because del Gatto was New York. I

1159
01:01:05,880 --> 01:01:09,960
Speaker 2: was like, an AOC also was very wouldn't.

1160
01:01:09,600 --> 01:01:13,080
Speaker 8: AOC and Bernie have both been keeping AOC and Berty

1161
01:01:13,160 --> 01:01:15,120
Speaker 8: have both been keeping their powder dry on this, and

1162
01:01:15,160 --> 01:01:18,680
Speaker 8: it's like, you guys are the revolutionaries, Like what's going

1163
01:01:18,720 --> 01:01:19,120
Speaker 8: on here?

1164
01:01:19,360 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 6: Yeah?

1165
01:01:20,280 --> 01:01:22,800
Speaker 2: So I was thinking maybe there's some New York thing

1166
01:01:22,920 --> 01:01:25,760
Speaker 2: that I don't get, but then to hear her so

1167
01:01:25,840 --> 01:01:27,760
Speaker 2: reluctant to I'm like, what what is this?

1168
01:01:27,920 --> 01:01:28,960
Speaker 3: I don't get it.

1169
01:01:29,120 --> 01:01:33,600
Speaker 7: I assume it's because if Schumer is still leader and

1170
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:35,920
Speaker 7: she wins, you want.

1171
01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:39,080
Speaker 8: To be your appointments, your committee and.

1172
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:40,640
Speaker 6: Screws your state or stuff too.

1173
01:01:41,680 --> 01:01:43,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, you just can't be doing this if you're going

1174
01:01:43,640 --> 01:01:47,400
Speaker 2: to be the insurgent, and she's already thrown in for that.

1175
01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:51,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's already. He's already gonna hate you. I think that.

1176
01:01:51,720 --> 01:01:54,640
Speaker 7: I think that's what people don't understand. Like Ted Cruz was,

1177
01:01:54,800 --> 01:01:57,120
Speaker 7: we're gonna make nice with Mitch McConnell. Mitch McConnell is

1178
01:01:57,120 --> 01:01:59,960
Speaker 7: always going to hate you. It's fine, he might tell you,

1179
01:02:00,320 --> 01:02:01,360
Speaker 7: but he's always going to hate you.

1180
01:02:02,040 --> 01:02:04,240
Speaker 2: And I do think Schumer is just going to retire

1181
01:02:04,520 --> 01:02:06,959
Speaker 2: after this term too, don't you, Ryan, Because he's gonna

1182
01:02:07,120 --> 01:02:07,920
Speaker 2: he's gonna lose.

1183
01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:09,320
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1184
01:02:10,440 --> 01:02:12,560
Speaker 4: Right, It's like it's lifeguard rules.

1185
01:02:12,600 --> 01:02:14,360
Speaker 8: You know, if someone's drowning, you got to make sure

1186
01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:16,920
Speaker 8: they don't like you don't drown with them, right, you

1187
01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:18,920
Speaker 8: have to, like you got to pull them out. But

1188
01:02:18,960 --> 01:02:20,240
Speaker 8: if they're going to pull you down.

1189
01:02:20,120 --> 01:02:22,800
Speaker 5: Well, but if you get points for voters for pushing

1190
01:02:22,800 --> 01:02:25,680
Speaker 5: them under the water, then take the points exactly.

1191
01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:30,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, ro understands that, you know, clearly understands that. I'm

1192
01:02:30,240 --> 01:02:33,120
Speaker 2: not trying to be overly negative. I thought she's she's impressive.

1193
01:02:33,760 --> 01:02:36,200
Speaker 2: You know, she's got a lot to offer, and certainly

1194
01:02:36,400 --> 01:02:38,760
Speaker 2: the contrast between her and Angie Kraig, who gets tons

1195
01:02:38,800 --> 01:02:41,280
Speaker 2: of money from you know, pharma and device industry and

1196
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:44,720
Speaker 2: APAC and whatever. Like there's you know, very clear contrast here.

1197
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:47,520
Speaker 2: But I'm just sort of puzzling over why this is

1198
01:02:47,560 --> 01:02:50,600
Speaker 2: difficult for not just her, but any number of candidates

1199
01:02:50,640 --> 01:02:53,000
Speaker 2: to just be like, yeah, you know, we should listen

1200
01:02:53,040 --> 01:02:54,919
Speaker 2: to the bass. The base is done with Schumer. What's

1201
01:02:54,960 --> 01:02:55,560
Speaker 2: time to move on?

1202
01:02:56,400 --> 01:02:57,920
Speaker 5: Yeah?

1203
01:02:57,720 --> 01:02:59,200
Speaker 4: Uh, And and we're gonna move on.

1204
01:02:59,320 --> 01:03:01,680
Speaker 8: We're going to do one last segment here in the

1205
01:03:01,720 --> 01:03:03,480
Speaker 8: public half that I wanted to get to before we

1206
01:03:03,520 --> 01:03:05,920
Speaker 8: switch over to the second half of the show, and

1207
01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:09,080
Speaker 8: that is an AI story. We did ask her about

1208
01:03:09,080 --> 01:03:13,360
Speaker 8: AI data centers, and Anthropic had a little interesting message

1209
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:17,640
Speaker 8: they released where they said this from anthropic ais Twitter account,

1210
01:03:17,800 --> 01:03:22,800
Speaker 8: we disrupted a highly sophisticated AI led espionage campaign. The

1211
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:27,920
Speaker 8: attack targeted large tech companies, financial institutions, chemical manufacturing companies,

1212
01:03:28,160 --> 01:03:32,040
Speaker 8: and government agencies. We assess with high confidence that the

1213
01:03:32,040 --> 01:03:36,800
Speaker 8: threat actor was a Chinese state sponsored group. What are

1214
01:03:36,800 --> 01:03:41,240
Speaker 8: we to make of this, first a publicly announced AI

1215
01:03:41,360 --> 01:03:42,480
Speaker 8: led cyber attack.

1216
01:03:42,960 --> 01:03:45,480
Speaker 2: Let me read a little bit more from the article

1217
01:03:45,640 --> 01:03:47,640
Speaker 2: that they posted, just to get a few more of

1218
01:03:47,720 --> 01:03:52,440
Speaker 2: the details here, which I think are very consequential they

1219
01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:55,880
Speaker 2: said again from anthropic We recently argued an inflection point

1220
01:03:55,920 --> 01:03:58,640
Speaker 2: had been reached in cybersecurity, a point at which AI

1221
01:03:58,720 --> 01:04:03,120
Speaker 2: models had become genuinely useful for cybersecurity operations, both for

1222
01:04:03,200 --> 01:04:07,040
Speaker 2: good and for ill. This was based on systematic evaluation

1223
01:04:07,160 --> 01:04:10,760
Speaker 2: showing cyber capabilities doubling in six months. We'd also been

1224
01:04:10,800 --> 01:04:14,200
Speaker 2: tracking real world cyber attacks observing how malicious actors were

1225
01:04:14,280 --> 01:04:18,040
Speaker 2: using AI capabilities. While we predicted these capabilities would continue

1226
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:19,880
Speaker 2: to evolve, what has stood out to us as how

1227
01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:22,920
Speaker 2: quickly they have done so at scale. In mid September

1228
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:26,320
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, we detected suspicious activity that later investigation

1229
01:04:26,440 --> 01:04:31,120
Speaker 2: determined to be a highly sophisticated espionage campaign. The attackers

1230
01:04:31,200 --> 01:04:35,919
Speaker 2: used AI's agentic capabilities. So these AI agents that they've

1231
01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:38,320
Speaker 2: been really pushing and very excited about as sort of

1232
01:04:38,360 --> 01:04:41,440
Speaker 2: like the next evolution of AI technology, that's what was

1233
01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:43,440
Speaker 2: used here, And they say they used it to an

1234
01:04:43,520 --> 01:04:48,200
Speaker 2: unprecedented degree, using AI not just as an advisor, but

1235
01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:52,600
Speaker 2: to execute the cyber attacks themselves. They say, this group

1236
01:04:52,640 --> 01:04:54,680
Speaker 2: that they assessed to be a Chinese state sponsor group

1237
01:04:54,760 --> 01:04:59,680
Speaker 2: manipulated our cloud code tool into attempting infiltration into roughly

1238
01:04:59,760 --> 01:05:03,840
Speaker 2: third global targets and succeeded in a small number of

1239
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:09,000
Speaker 2: cases that our operation targeted large tech companies, financial institutions,

1240
01:05:09,560 --> 01:05:13,960
Speaker 2: chemical manufacturing companies, which is a little scary, and government agencies.

1241
01:05:14,000 --> 01:05:16,160
Speaker 2: We believe this is the first documented case of a

1242
01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:21,360
Speaker 2: large scale cyber attack executed without substantial human intervention. So

1243
01:05:21,840 --> 01:05:25,080
Speaker 2: that all sounds really bad. And here we are just

1244
01:05:25,160 --> 01:05:29,280
Speaker 2: like going along throw you know, building out these data centers,

1245
01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:33,160
Speaker 2: watching open AI and these other companies like proposed throwing

1246
01:05:33,200 --> 01:05:35,400
Speaker 2: trillions of dollars at this stuff.

1247
01:05:35,720 --> 01:05:36,840
Speaker 3: Any sort of breaks.

1248
01:05:36,560 --> 01:05:40,760
Speaker 2: That, we're on the car completely taken away, just wild

1249
01:05:40,760 --> 01:05:43,440
Speaker 2: west off to the races, and we are just at

1250
01:05:43,440 --> 01:05:46,720
Speaker 2: the beginning of the potential fallout. And here we already

1251
01:05:46,760 --> 01:05:50,400
Speaker 2: have AI with the capability to pull off a mass

1252
01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:56,160
Speaker 2: cyber attack hacking campaign independent of any human involvement. This

1253
01:05:56,240 --> 01:05:58,000
Speaker 2: is I think it's a pretty terrifying moment.

1254
01:05:58,040 --> 01:06:01,760
Speaker 3: Frankly, Yeah, somebody's going to get killed.

1255
01:06:01,880 --> 01:06:05,800
Speaker 7: Like that's that's somebody is actually going to die because

1256
01:06:06,080 --> 01:06:09,280
Speaker 7: they lose control of this stuff. And we're all going

1257
01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:11,680
Speaker 7: to say, we're all going to go through the motions

1258
01:06:11,960 --> 01:06:17,200
Speaker 7: of wow, you know, we really need to start thinking,

1259
01:06:17,240 --> 01:06:21,200
Speaker 7: so seriously, and we need to do something, and everybody's

1260
01:06:21,200 --> 01:06:23,160
Speaker 7: already going through the motions of wow, we need to

1261
01:06:23,160 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 7: think so seriously.

1262
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:24,880
Speaker 6: It's moving so fast.

1263
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:28,400
Speaker 7: But it's like it's going to take people dying for

1264
01:06:28,560 --> 01:06:32,160
Speaker 7: anyone who actually has power over this to say, well,

1265
01:06:32,160 --> 01:06:33,160
Speaker 7: we need guardrails.

1266
01:06:33,640 --> 01:06:38,080
Speaker 9: It's yeah, it's going to be like an AI chernobyl

1267
01:06:38,120 --> 01:06:40,160
Speaker 9: event is what we're going to need, right Like, we're

1268
01:06:40,160 --> 01:06:43,480
Speaker 9: going to need some sort of mass casualty event before

1269
01:06:43,520 --> 01:06:45,520
Speaker 9: there's any regulation or any of this stuff.

1270
01:06:45,840 --> 01:06:46,400
Speaker 3: It's dark.

1271
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:49,600
Speaker 2: But you know what, Griffin and Emily, you're exactly right

1272
01:06:49,760 --> 01:06:52,520
Speaker 2: in that this is actually what a lot of people

1273
01:06:52,600 --> 01:06:56,640
Speaker 2: in the AI safety or AI alignment space sort of

1274
01:06:56,680 --> 01:07:01,440
Speaker 2: hope for that there's something that captures the public's attention

1275
01:07:02,200 --> 01:07:06,480
Speaker 2: that is really bad but is containable and you know,

1276
01:07:07,400 --> 01:07:11,400
Speaker 2: not a total like destruction of all human civilization that

1277
01:07:11,520 --> 01:07:15,280
Speaker 2: opens people's eyes and forces some sort of reckoning. I mean,

1278
01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:17,440
Speaker 2: that is the point where we're at where you know,

1279
01:07:17,640 --> 01:07:21,360
Speaker 2: if they're being honest, these AI safety researchers who are

1280
01:07:21,360 --> 01:07:24,080
Speaker 2: looking at this and feel like, already you have AI

1281
01:07:24,200 --> 01:07:27,680
Speaker 2: that is capable of you know, deceit is capable now

1282
01:07:27,760 --> 01:07:31,200
Speaker 2: of these mass happy attacks that already were at a

1283
01:07:31,240 --> 01:07:34,920
Speaker 2: place where we don't really know what has been built

1284
01:07:35,080 --> 01:07:37,800
Speaker 2: to this point. I saw someone else speculating I wish

1285
01:07:37,800 --> 01:07:41,160
Speaker 2: I could remember what article this was in that basically like, well,

1286
01:07:41,240 --> 01:07:45,360
Speaker 2: maybe if AI quickly gets rid of like ten percent

1287
01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:48,840
Speaker 2: of the jobs, that would be enough to trigger some

1288
01:07:48,840 --> 01:07:52,120
Speaker 2: sort of a mass social revolt, but before we ended

1289
01:07:52,160 --> 01:07:55,520
Speaker 2: with complete societal collapse Like that's Those are the sort

1290
01:07:55,520 --> 01:07:58,040
Speaker 2: of scenarios that are being openly discussed as like a

1291
01:07:58,080 --> 01:08:02,200
Speaker 2: best case scenario. I mean, it's horrifying, And then I mean,

1292
01:08:02,280 --> 01:08:06,200
Speaker 2: I guess the realbust case scenario is that this is

1293
01:08:06,240 --> 01:08:09,400
Speaker 2: all a speculative bubble, which is possible that we never

1294
01:08:09,440 --> 01:08:10,080
Speaker 2: really get.

1295
01:08:09,880 --> 01:08:11,400
Speaker 3: Beyond where we are right now.

1296
01:08:11,600 --> 01:08:13,960
Speaker 2: Of you know, okay, you've got some chatbots and you've

1297
01:08:13,960 --> 01:08:16,080
Speaker 2: got some videos, and now apparently you have the capability

1298
01:08:16,080 --> 01:08:18,320
Speaker 2: to hack a bunch, which is not great, but you know,

1299
01:08:18,400 --> 01:08:20,439
Speaker 2: it doesn't live up to the promise. There's a major

1300
01:08:20,479 --> 01:08:24,200
Speaker 2: financial collapse in correction that would cause mass pain as well,

1301
01:08:24,479 --> 01:08:26,240
Speaker 2: but at least it wouldn't be the sort of like

1302
01:08:26,479 --> 01:08:31,880
Speaker 2: total societal collapse or civilizational upheaval that is being promise

1303
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:35,679
Speaker 2: slash threatened by this technology, that's the other potential outcome.

1304
01:08:35,800 --> 01:08:38,240
Speaker 2: But you know, when you see things like that, you

1305
01:08:38,320 --> 01:08:40,519
Speaker 2: start to feel like we may already be past the

1306
01:08:41,080 --> 01:08:44,160
Speaker 2: kind of like least bad alternatives that face us on

1307
01:08:44,200 --> 01:08:46,440
Speaker 2: the road at this point.

1308
01:08:48,400 --> 01:08:51,599
Speaker 5: Yeah, and the the fact that they suggest it came

1309
01:08:51,600 --> 01:08:55,000
Speaker 5: from China is really dispiriting too, because it's like, because

1310
01:08:55,080 --> 01:08:58,840
Speaker 5: that's the argument that they keep using against people who say,

1311
01:08:58,840 --> 01:08:59,920
Speaker 5: shut all this crap.

1312
01:08:59,680 --> 01:09:03,759
Speaker 3: Down, but China. It was China, but it used American

1313
01:09:03,800 --> 01:09:06,559
Speaker 3: AI tools, right.

1314
01:09:06,439 --> 01:09:09,920
Speaker 5: It's a collab, yeah, yeah, a little crossover.

1315
01:09:10,960 --> 01:09:11,160
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1316
01:09:11,200 --> 01:09:13,759
Speaker 5: And then I've also seen people saying this is actually

1317
01:09:13,800 --> 01:09:16,960
Speaker 5: why the ethical people who are telling us we need

1318
01:09:17,000 --> 01:09:19,840
Speaker 5: to make warm and fuzzy aies are wrong, because we

1319
01:09:19,880 --> 01:09:22,720
Speaker 5: actually have to prepare for all out war. It's like, well,

1320
01:09:22,800 --> 01:09:26,519
Speaker 5: Jesus none less, just all slit our throats now, like

1321
01:09:26,600 --> 01:09:30,479
Speaker 5: that's you know, I mean, the only solution really is

1322
01:09:30,520 --> 01:09:34,880
Speaker 5: as a global summit where they do the same thing

1323
01:09:34,880 --> 01:09:36,520
Speaker 5: they did with nuclear non proliferation.

1324
01:09:36,800 --> 01:09:36,960
Speaker 3: Right.

1325
01:09:37,240 --> 01:09:39,040
Speaker 7: It has to be treated that way because it has

1326
01:09:39,560 --> 01:09:43,360
Speaker 7: power over the entire world. It's not it doesn't stop

1327
01:09:43,360 --> 01:09:46,479
Speaker 7: at anybody's borders. It has power over the entire world.

1328
01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:49,760
Speaker 7: It's moving more quickly even the most powerful people in

1329
01:09:49,800 --> 01:09:52,400
Speaker 7: the industry say more quickly than they are able to

1330
01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:56,200
Speaker 7: keep up with. They do not know how it works,

1331
01:09:56,320 --> 01:09:58,599
Speaker 7: why it does X, Y, and z in every scenario.

1332
01:09:58,880 --> 01:10:02,799
Speaker 7: And that's again, people are gonna die before they actually

1333
01:10:02,800 --> 01:10:03,719
Speaker 7: have any kind of summit.

1334
01:10:04,160 --> 01:10:06,200
Speaker 3: Because we can, we can. We pull up the Matt

1335
01:10:06,240 --> 01:10:06,840
Speaker 3: Walsh tweet.

1336
01:10:07,000 --> 01:10:09,840
Speaker 8: I was just going to bring that because not only

1337
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:12,880
Speaker 8: this is going to change our realities and potentially like

1338
01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:16,360
Speaker 8: our political formations. If Ryan Graham and Matt Walsh are

1339
01:10:16,360 --> 01:10:19,040
Speaker 8: now BFFs like there are new.

1340
01:10:19,160 --> 01:10:21,320
Speaker 5: He's been saying good stuff about formations happen.

1341
01:10:21,360 --> 01:10:23,080
Speaker 6: Actually yeah, yeah he has.

1342
01:10:24,240 --> 01:10:25,800
Speaker 4: I mean I can pull it up.

1343
01:10:25,800 --> 01:10:27,840
Speaker 8: I don't have it on hand, but essentially, like Ryan,

1344
01:10:28,040 --> 01:10:31,200
Speaker 8: like Matt Walsh, was saying that, hey, we're scared that

1345
01:10:31,240 --> 01:10:34,000
Speaker 8: we're coming up on like potentially ten to twenty five

1346
01:10:34,080 --> 01:10:37,720
Speaker 8: million jobs lost in the very near future, that we're

1347
01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:39,960
Speaker 8: walking straight into a wall, and there's no one in

1348
01:10:40,040 --> 01:10:42,439
Speaker 8: politics really doing anything about it.

1349
01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:45,479
Speaker 2: Unfortunately, when I searched Matt Walsh and Ryan Graham, I

1350
01:10:45,560 --> 01:10:47,280
Speaker 2: just get Ryan destroying him on Haiti.

1351
01:10:49,280 --> 01:10:52,720
Speaker 7: I said broad ship to Prince before you go can

1352
01:10:52,760 --> 01:10:54,400
Speaker 7: hash this, We'll.

1353
01:10:54,280 --> 01:10:57,240
Speaker 6: Call it the Porter prince summit, and they'll hash this out.

1354
01:10:57,479 --> 01:10:59,519
Speaker 8: So many summits need to happen. But Ryan, what did

1355
01:10:59,520 --> 01:11:02,720
Speaker 8: you make of this new alliance? If you will. I

1356
01:11:02,720 --> 01:11:04,439
Speaker 8: don't know if it's horseshoe, but it's something.

1357
01:11:06,400 --> 01:11:08,160
Speaker 5: I mean, it's not new.

1358
01:11:08,439 --> 01:11:08,519
Speaker 3: Like.

1359
01:11:09,280 --> 01:11:14,600
Speaker 5: There are concerns on the left and the right about this,

1360
01:11:14,760 --> 01:11:17,720
Speaker 5: and he's right that it doesn't sort well into our politics,

1361
01:11:17,720 --> 01:11:22,000
Speaker 5: and so therefore politicians have just managed to not talk

1362
01:11:22,040 --> 01:11:25,400
Speaker 5: about it. So he right, here, here's what he said said,

1363
01:11:26,120 --> 01:11:31,160
Speaker 5: and here I can I can put it up one second.

1364
01:11:33,520 --> 01:11:35,640
Speaker 5: So he says, AI is going to wipe out at

1365
01:11:35,760 --> 01:11:37,680
Speaker 5: least twenty five million jobs in the next five to

1366
01:11:37,720 --> 01:11:40,719
Speaker 5: ten years, probably much more. It will destroy every creative field.

1367
01:11:40,800 --> 01:11:42,920
Speaker 5: It will make him It will make it impossible to

1368
01:11:42,920 --> 01:11:46,519
Speaker 5: discern reality from fiction. It will absolutely obliterate what's left

1369
01:11:46,520 --> 01:11:49,000
Speaker 5: of the education system. Kids will go through twelve years

1370
01:11:49,000 --> 01:11:52,200
Speaker 5: of grade school and learn absolutely nothing. AI will do

1371
01:11:52,240 --> 01:11:54,360
Speaker 5: it all for them. We have already seen the last

1372
01:11:54,400 --> 01:11:57,840
Speaker 5: truly literate generation. All of this is coming and fast.

1373
01:11:57,880 --> 01:11:59,960
Speaker 5: There is still time to prevent some of the worst outcomes,

1374
01:12:00,040 --> 01:12:02,160
Speaker 5: or at least put them off. But our leaders aren't

1375
01:12:02,200 --> 01:12:04,120
Speaker 5: doing a single thing about any of this. None of

1376
01:12:04,120 --> 01:12:07,360
Speaker 5: them are taking it seriously. We're sleepwalking into a dystopia

1377
01:12:07,360 --> 01:12:10,160
Speaker 5: that any rational person can see from miles away. It

1378
01:12:10,280 --> 01:12:12,720
Speaker 5: drives me nuts. Or we're really just going to lie

1379
01:12:12,760 --> 01:12:15,720
Speaker 5: down and let Ai take everything from us? Is that

1380
01:12:15,760 --> 01:12:21,280
Speaker 5: the plan? I you know, well well said, and you

1381
01:12:21,320 --> 01:12:24,560
Speaker 5: can add on to it the way that Mark Zuckerberg

1382
01:12:24,600 --> 01:12:28,839
Speaker 5: has suggested that this kind of thing is a solution

1383
01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:30,920
Speaker 5: to the like the loneliness crisis, because now you're gonna

1384
01:12:30,920 --> 01:12:33,120
Speaker 5: have people just sitting around chatting with Ais all day,

1385
01:12:33,840 --> 01:12:37,320
Speaker 5: and you know, it's like, no, we don't want this,

1386
01:12:37,479 --> 01:12:43,920
Speaker 5: Like nobody wants this, and so can't somebody do something

1387
01:12:43,960 --> 01:12:48,080
Speaker 5: about it? It's like his his like plea resonates. It's

1388
01:12:48,120 --> 01:12:50,640
Speaker 5: like it's like, isn't there somebody who's going to do

1389
01:12:50,680 --> 01:12:51,360
Speaker 5: something about this?

1390
01:12:53,040 --> 01:12:53,240
Speaker 3: Right?

1391
01:12:53,400 --> 01:12:55,960
Speaker 2: But then there needs to be the next step of

1392
01:12:56,240 --> 01:12:58,599
Speaker 2: I mean, yes, someone could do something about it.

1393
01:12:58,600 --> 01:12:59,920
Speaker 3: It's called the Trump administration.

1394
01:13:00,080 --> 01:13:02,120
Speaker 2: And they're the ones who you know, I mean, listen,

1395
01:13:02,120 --> 01:13:04,600
Speaker 2: that's not like Biden was like had all the breaks up.

1396
01:13:04,680 --> 01:13:07,439
Speaker 2: They were doing some stuff and that's part of why

1397
01:13:07,960 --> 01:13:11,160
Speaker 2: these tech oligarchs all aligned against Biden is one of

1398
01:13:11,160 --> 01:13:14,000
Speaker 2: the reasons. And you know, in the Trump administration, they're

1399
01:13:14,080 --> 01:13:17,120
Speaker 2: given free reign. You got David Sachson there, obviously, Peter

1400
01:13:17,240 --> 01:13:20,000
Speaker 2: Teel is a giant, a major ally. Marc and Dreesen

1401
01:13:20,080 --> 01:13:23,080
Speaker 2: is a major ally. Elon was literally part of the government.

1402
01:13:23,880 --> 01:13:27,360
Speaker 2: You know, even Sam Altman, Elon's nemesis, is brought in

1403
01:13:27,400 --> 01:13:30,960
Speaker 2: for these government deal Zuckerberg hanging out with Trump, sucking

1404
01:13:31,040 --> 01:13:33,800
Speaker 2: up to him, etc. You know, there's a major push

1405
01:13:34,080 --> 01:13:38,400
Speaker 2: directly from this administration go in this direction, and so

1406
01:13:38,680 --> 01:13:40,360
Speaker 2: if you're going to really be part of that, I

1407
01:13:40,360 --> 01:13:42,719
Speaker 2: appreciate the sentiment. I'm not trying to like, you know whatever.

1408
01:13:42,760 --> 01:13:44,800
Speaker 2: I appreciate the sediments. Something Emily and I have been

1409
01:13:44,840 --> 01:13:47,360
Speaker 2: talking about a lot with the Peter Teel antichrist and

1410
01:13:47,360 --> 01:13:50,479
Speaker 2: what he's up to there and the coalition political coalition

1411
01:13:50,560 --> 01:13:53,519
Speaker 2: that needs to come together, and how it doesn't sort

1412
01:13:53,560 --> 01:13:56,479
Speaker 2: ideologically neatly like you said, but we need you to

1413
01:13:56,520 --> 01:13:59,000
Speaker 2: make that next step and realize who the enemy is here,

1414
01:13:59,160 --> 01:14:02,840
Speaker 2: and the enemy is administration. You know, you heard Steve

1415
01:14:02,840 --> 01:14:05,800
Speaker 2: Bannon early on raising flags about these like transhumanists with

1416
01:14:05,840 --> 01:14:07,400
Speaker 2: this anti human ideology.

1417
01:14:07,400 --> 01:14:08,400
Speaker 3: It's truly what it is.

1418
01:14:09,439 --> 01:14:12,719
Speaker 2: And so you know, if you're just raising the concern

1419
01:14:13,240 --> 01:14:15,960
Speaker 2: without pointing the finger at the people who right now

1420
01:14:16,040 --> 01:14:17,960
Speaker 2: are pushing this the hardest in the fast is it's

1421
01:14:17,960 --> 01:14:18,639
Speaker 2: a little impotent.

1422
01:14:20,200 --> 01:14:22,320
Speaker 7: Well, and the Trump administration is falling for it, hook

1423
01:14:22,360 --> 01:14:25,000
Speaker 7: line and sinker. And you know, I'm bringing people in

1424
01:14:25,040 --> 01:14:27,200
Speaker 7: who aren't just falling for it, but who are obviously

1425
01:14:27,320 --> 01:14:31,960
Speaker 7: part of orchestrating this takeover of the entire world, not

1426
01:14:32,000 --> 01:14:34,639
Speaker 7: just our politics, not just our government, not just our media,

1427
01:14:34,680 --> 01:14:38,080
Speaker 7: but the entire world. So it's happening extremely quickly. You

1428
01:14:38,120 --> 01:14:42,080
Speaker 7: couldn't imagine, honestly, a worse situation where you have a

1429
01:14:42,200 --> 01:14:48,280
Speaker 7: president who is totally obsessed with flattery and addicted to flattery,

1430
01:14:48,840 --> 01:14:55,639
Speaker 7: and is very easily swayed by grifts like a meme

1431
01:14:55,760 --> 01:15:00,200
Speaker 7: coin in order to advance his personal wealth, and is

1432
01:15:01,000 --> 01:15:04,040
Speaker 7: easily swayed by the ideological pitch, you know, like you

1433
01:15:04,040 --> 01:15:06,400
Speaker 7: can make lots of money. But it's also you know,

1434
01:15:06,439 --> 01:15:09,599
Speaker 7: sort of anti World Economic Forum and anti global governance,

1435
01:15:09,640 --> 01:15:11,960
Speaker 7: which by the way, it's not, but just saying that

1436
01:15:12,080 --> 01:15:17,519
Speaker 7: he is particularly susceptible, uh to that kind of uh

1437
01:15:17,880 --> 01:15:19,360
Speaker 7: persuasion and flattery.

1438
01:15:19,640 --> 01:15:21,520
Speaker 6: And right now.

1439
01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:25,040
Speaker 7: With the deregulator deregulatory push in the Trump administration, which

1440
01:15:25,040 --> 01:15:27,600
Speaker 7: some of which I obviously support, is a conservative, but

1441
01:15:27,760 --> 01:15:30,320
Speaker 7: not in this And so you have like the perfect

1442
01:15:30,360 --> 01:15:35,280
Speaker 7: storm of things happening for accelerating A for an accelerating

1443
01:15:35,320 --> 01:15:39,519
Speaker 7: AI capture and takeover. And nobody everyone's saying we should

1444
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:42,760
Speaker 7: hit the pause button except for the tech oligarchs, but

1445
01:15:42,880 --> 01:15:45,439
Speaker 7: nobody is actually doing anything to hit the pause button

1446
01:15:45,520 --> 01:15:46,799
Speaker 7: or to create a pause button.

1447
01:15:46,880 --> 01:15:49,400
Speaker 5: Well, even the tech oligarchs are saying it.

1448
01:15:50,479 --> 01:15:54,120
Speaker 2: And and Trump I think knows that the whole stock

1449
01:15:54,160 --> 01:15:57,400
Speaker 2: market is held out by Nvidia. Like the entire thing,

1450
01:15:57,520 --> 01:16:00,759
Speaker 2: the entire US economy is being flowed by in video

1451
01:16:00,880 --> 01:16:05,360
Speaker 2: right now without AI, you know, and data center construction.

1452
01:16:05,600 --> 01:16:08,559
Speaker 2: There's zero GDP growth. Eighty percent of the gains in

1453
01:16:08,560 --> 01:16:11,760
Speaker 2: the stock market are AI stock gains. Actually, there is

1454
01:16:11,800 --> 01:16:14,280
Speaker 2: a bit of a slide. I haven't checked in again

1455
01:16:14,360 --> 01:16:16,680
Speaker 2: this morning, but in the futures this morning, I know

1456
01:16:16,760 --> 01:16:18,599
Speaker 2: things were looking pretty bad in the stock market.

1457
01:16:18,680 --> 01:16:20,080
Speaker 3: Nazac was falling to your media.

1458
01:16:20,479 --> 01:16:23,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, because yeah, stock sell off extends weighing on the

1459
01:16:23,160 --> 01:16:27,479
Speaker 2: down now, so you know, he understands the stock market

1460
01:16:27,560 --> 01:16:30,639
Speaker 2: and really puts a lot puts a lot of quote

1461
01:16:30,680 --> 01:16:35,439
Speaker 2: unquote stock to be corny in what the numbers there say.

1462
01:16:35,880 --> 01:16:38,240
Speaker 2: So I even think from that perspective like he's just

1463
01:16:38,280 --> 01:16:40,400
Speaker 2: going to continue to inflate that bubble as long as

1464
01:16:40,400 --> 01:16:41,479
Speaker 2: he possibly can.

1465
01:16:42,160 --> 01:16:45,400
Speaker 8: M Yeah, I'm also I'm not familiar with like Matt

1466
01:16:45,400 --> 01:16:49,040
Speaker 8: Walsh's populist takes or what he has to say about

1467
01:16:49,080 --> 01:16:50,559
Speaker 8: all of that. But I do think the Daily Wire

1468
01:16:50,600 --> 01:16:53,320
Speaker 8: types are gonna come into some sort of friction with

1469
01:16:53,400 --> 01:16:56,519
Speaker 8: this AI battle because, you know, if your AI critiques

1470
01:16:56,520 --> 01:16:59,080
Speaker 8: are going to be a little limp if you don't

1471
01:16:59,280 --> 01:17:02,560
Speaker 8: if you're if you're always saying, oh, we shouldn't demonize billionairerors,

1472
01:17:02,560 --> 01:17:06,840
Speaker 8: we shouldn't demonize people who are successful. But this AI

1473
01:17:07,240 --> 01:17:11,720
Speaker 8: hyper AI scalification is the result of runaway capitalism, and

1474
01:17:11,880 --> 01:17:15,760
Speaker 8: if you don't but an understanding of that, then all

1475
01:17:15,760 --> 01:17:18,760
Speaker 8: of your AI critiques are going to have no solutions.

1476
01:17:19,520 --> 01:17:24,639
Speaker 5: Ish. You know, it's ironically, I it's interesting, like who

1477
01:17:24,680 --> 01:17:27,160
Speaker 5: do you trust more right now, China or the US

1478
01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:33,160
Speaker 5: to build some sort of uh ethical like AI that

1479
01:17:33,200 --> 01:17:36,280
Speaker 5: doesn't destroy the world. It's like this surveillance state, the

1480
01:17:36,320 --> 01:17:41,360
Speaker 5: authoritarian surveillance state or the US, And it's like, wow, yeah,

1481
01:17:41,360 --> 01:17:45,840
Speaker 5: actually it's not obvious because there's like there there at

1482
01:17:45,920 --> 01:17:48,320
Speaker 5: least is like a pretense toward a public interest there

1483
01:17:48,640 --> 01:17:51,559
Speaker 5: where in the US that's not the case. It's just

1484
01:17:52,680 --> 01:17:56,040
Speaker 5: you know, gloves off, you know, zero sum.

1485
01:17:56,960 --> 01:18:01,200
Speaker 2: I just think it at you, what's I genuinely just

1486
01:18:01,200 --> 01:18:03,120
Speaker 2: think it all needs to be shut down. I think

1487
01:18:03,120 --> 01:18:05,639
Speaker 2: we're at that point where we are imagine and like.

1488
01:18:05,680 --> 01:18:09,080
Speaker 5: The nice chap like you can have like they're there.

1489
01:18:09,400 --> 01:18:13,080
Speaker 5: You don't have to like go back to like zero AI.

1490
01:18:13,160 --> 01:18:16,400
Speaker 5: You can still have like the you know, there are

1491
01:18:16,200 --> 01:18:19,000
Speaker 5: the low level benefits of it, like transcription is better,

1492
01:18:20,439 --> 01:18:23,519
Speaker 5: there's a lot of there's a lot of technology can

1493
01:18:23,520 --> 01:18:26,040
Speaker 5: do when it comes to coding and software development. That's great,

1494
01:18:26,360 --> 01:18:29,800
Speaker 5: that's fine. But like this thing where you're like it's

1495
01:18:29,800 --> 01:18:33,760
Speaker 5: thinking for itself and doing its own do and you know,

1496
01:18:33,840 --> 01:18:36,680
Speaker 5: acting in its own self interests like no, no, no,

1497
01:18:36,760 --> 01:18:37,880
Speaker 5: we're good, like we got.

1498
01:18:37,800 --> 01:18:40,080
Speaker 7: And trying to and trying to pull the rug over

1499
01:18:40,080 --> 01:18:42,559
Speaker 7: your eyes and say it's not right, like it's doing

1500
01:18:42,680 --> 01:18:45,280
Speaker 7: it's it's acting in its own self interest. Well obviously

1501
01:18:45,320 --> 01:18:48,479
Speaker 7: smart enough to try and deceive you that it's not

1502
01:18:48,520 --> 01:18:51,000
Speaker 7: doing anything wrong whatsoever, to the point where you lose

1503
01:18:51,040 --> 01:18:52,920
Speaker 7: track of it and you have no idea which they

1504
01:18:52,960 --> 01:18:54,320
Speaker 7: are all saying is happening.

1505
01:18:54,400 --> 01:18:55,640
Speaker 6: They are losing track of it.

1506
01:18:55,680 --> 01:18:57,040
Speaker 7: So yeah, I mean, I think one of the reasons

1507
01:18:57,080 --> 01:18:59,560
Speaker 7: that we do what we do is that most of

1508
01:18:59,640 --> 01:19:02,479
Speaker 7: us real or all of us realize some of these

1509
01:19:02,640 --> 01:19:04,960
Speaker 7: battles that are coming in the future are going to

1510
01:19:05,200 --> 01:19:09,400
Speaker 7: require people who disagree on a lot of stuff to

1511
01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:12,360
Speaker 7: fundamentally agree that what we're coming up on is a

1512
01:19:12,360 --> 01:19:16,920
Speaker 7: battle between like pro humanism and transhumanism or whatever the

1513
01:19:16,920 --> 01:19:21,479
Speaker 7: hell they call this, because it's happening really quickly. Anti humanism,

1514
01:19:21,560 --> 01:19:23,120
Speaker 7: I think is probably a better way to put it,

1515
01:19:24,040 --> 01:19:28,599
Speaker 7: and it's important to just recognize that people who support

1516
01:19:29,280 --> 01:19:33,040
Speaker 7: like humanity are going to be on like there're gonna

1517
01:19:33,040 --> 01:19:36,040
Speaker 7: be a lot of I think, strange bedfellows, but are

1518
01:19:36,160 --> 01:19:39,600
Speaker 7: up against you know, Peter Thiel trying to convince the

1519
01:19:39,640 --> 01:19:42,240
Speaker 7: Matt Walshes of the world that it would be far

1520
01:19:42,360 --> 01:19:46,120
Speaker 7: worse to it. You know that, Yes, it's scary, the

1521
01:19:46,120 --> 01:19:48,760
Speaker 7: future is scary. Yes, you're right, all of these possibilities

1522
01:19:48,800 --> 01:19:50,759
Speaker 7: could prove true. But you know what would be worse

1523
01:19:51,200 --> 01:19:55,360
Speaker 7: not doing anything, And that's the I think the sophisticated

1524
01:19:55,439 --> 01:20:01,400
Speaker 7: version of the seductive efforts happening from the oligarchs.

1525
01:20:03,000 --> 01:20:05,880
Speaker 8: Well, we have a guest coming on the show next

1526
01:20:05,880 --> 01:20:09,160
Speaker 8: week who has been writing about AI twenty twenty seven,

1527
01:20:09,720 --> 01:20:13,720
Speaker 8: so look forward to that and more doomerism on the

1528
01:20:13,960 --> 01:20:16,840
Speaker 8: artificial intelligence. We're going to switch over to the second

1529
01:20:16,840 --> 01:20:18,880
Speaker 8: half of the show now. If you want to check

1530
01:20:18,920 --> 01:20:21,960
Speaker 8: that out, go to breakingpoints dot com, sign up, become

1531
01:20:21,960 --> 01:20:24,599
Speaker 8: a member. It's in the video description. There'll be a link,

1532
01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:28,439
Speaker 8: and we'll see you all there in the second half.