1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:08,559 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties, 2 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:11,200 Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big 3 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:14,120 Speaker 1: life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they 4 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:22,600 Speaker 1: mean for our psychology. Hello everyone, welcome back or welcome 5 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:25,840 Speaker 1: to the podcast. Thanks for tuning in. I hope you're 6 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 1: all having a splendid day wherever you are in the world. 7 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:34,080 Speaker 1: Let's jump right into it. Today we're talking about something 8 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 1: a little bit different. We're talking about social attraction in 9 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:41,920 Speaker 1: groups and what it means to be perceived as cool. 10 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:45,760 Speaker 1: I've been thinking about this a lot. Shout out to 11 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 1: a friend of mine who I've been having some conversations 12 00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:53,320 Speaker 1: with this about conversations around status, around the anxiety that 13 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: comes with the acknowledgment that you're perceived by others, wanting 14 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 1: to fit in, wanting to seem cool, and it all 15 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 1: kind of ties together, and there's a pretty interesting narrative 16 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:09,959 Speaker 1: around these topics in psychology and in social psychology. So 17 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:12,600 Speaker 1: I thought it'd be a great episode to talk about 18 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:15,959 Speaker 1: and to talk through today. Before we get into it, though, 19 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:21,039 Speaker 1: I just want to say, if you are an existing 20 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:24,360 Speaker 1: listener of the podcast, I hope you like the new 21 00:01:24,440 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 1: artwork I updated the cover art and have like rebranded 22 00:01:28,200 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 1: the podcast. Still the same content obviously, but let me 23 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:33,200 Speaker 1: know what you think I did do like a little 24 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 1: mini pole on my Instagram and by far this new 25 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:43,520 Speaker 1: kind of design one out against my shitty canvas designed thing. 26 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 1: So yes, new stage, new season of the podcast. Additionally, huge, 27 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 1: huge moment for the podcast coming up. We are about 28 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:56,680 Speaker 1: to celebrate one year of the Psychology of Your Twenties. 29 00:01:56,840 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 1: That's right. I started this podcast a year ago in 30 00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:04,440 Speaker 1: mid late June. I'll obviously announce it when I get 31 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 1: to that stage, but if you listen to the Heartbreak episode, 32 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 1: you would know why I started this podcast to begin with. 33 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:15,960 Speaker 1: And yeah, it's just crazy to look back on this 34 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 1: year and what this kind of platform and you know, 35 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 1: just being able to talk through these things and investigate 36 00:02:23,080 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 1: them and think about them. How much that's kind of 37 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:28,799 Speaker 1: really benefited me and all the growth that I've been 38 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:31,640 Speaker 1: been through and that year. And thanks for supporting me 39 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: throughout this. This was such a new experience for me 40 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:36,200 Speaker 1: when I first started, and now it's just such a 41 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:38,000 Speaker 1: part of my life. It's a part of my identity, 42 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,959 Speaker 1: and it's huge that there are people who reach out 43 00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 1: every week who say they really nice things, people who 44 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:47,560 Speaker 1: leave me, ratings and all of that stuff. So I 45 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 1: really appreciate it. So social attraction, social status, why it 46 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 1: doesn't matter so much in our twenties, Well, I think 47 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 1: that these ideas of being part of the in group, 48 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 1: being liked by others are important because it comes down 49 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:12,440 Speaker 1: to acceptance. It comes down to feeling like you have 50 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 1: a group, feeling like you belong somewhere. That's a really 51 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: important struggle and experience in our twenties, especially because this 52 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,200 Speaker 1: is really the decade in which you kind of start 53 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 1: to place down your foundations. You try out different identities, 54 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: you shift between different social groups, and you're really trying 55 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 1: to find your feet and how you relate to others, 56 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:38,640 Speaker 1: the interactions you have with others, and where you feel 57 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: that you belong. And what comes with that is an 58 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:47,600 Speaker 1: intense pressure around other people's perceptions of us, around other 59 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:52,240 Speaker 1: people's perception of our social status, of our likability, our 60 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:56,880 Speaker 1: accept whether we could be accepted into their group. And 61 00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 1: where does this pressure and influence kind of come from. 62 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: That's something we're really going to discuss today. I'm sure 63 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 1: we've all felt that feeling of just like not fitting in, 64 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 1: not really jelling with people, feeling really lame, and it's 65 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: a really terrible feeling. We've all been there and we've 66 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:17,680 Speaker 1: all felt it, but it's somewhat intangible, and the sense 67 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:21,559 Speaker 1: of not fitting in and this desire to be seen 68 00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:25,279 Speaker 1: as cool. It kind of operates in our social domains, 69 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:28,640 Speaker 1: but to a large extent, it also comes from our 70 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: private thoughts and our assessments of others, and our memberships 71 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:34,120 Speaker 1: to groups that we deem as important to our identity. 72 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 1: All of these things, although we can see them, we 73 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:41,040 Speaker 1: can't really hold them. They're quite intangible and they really 74 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 1: operate without much explanation. The groups we are a part of, 75 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 1: specifically our in groups, which we're going to talk a 76 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,880 Speaker 1: lot about today, are incredibly influential in our twenties and 77 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 1: for the rest of our lives. And a large part 78 00:04:56,160 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 1: of this is to do with social and personal attraction, 79 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:06,600 Speaker 1: wanting to be accepted into a group, wanting to seem 80 00:05:06,640 --> 00:05:10,039 Speaker 1: like an attractive individual, not in the physical sense, but 81 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:14,159 Speaker 1: in kind of the social sense. And another important element 82 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:18,080 Speaker 1: that I really want to discuss is relative and comparative status. 83 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: So much of how we see ourselves comes from our 84 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 1: comparison to others. And to where they stand and their 85 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 1: kind of position in this invisible hierarchy, this invisible social 86 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:33,919 Speaker 1: hierarchy that we all kind of know exists. Essentially, we 87 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:38,479 Speaker 1: want people to like us. We want to be accepted 88 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 1: and to be perceived as high status whatever that means 89 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:45,160 Speaker 1: based on our social memberships. So how do our brains 90 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 1: navigate the complexity around this problem? Why does it come 91 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:54,720 Speaker 1: so naturally to some people? What is it that makes 92 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 1: certain individuals trendsetters? And another big thing we're going to 93 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 1: discuss is around subcos and how they operate, how norms 94 00:06:02,440 --> 00:06:07,120 Speaker 1: take hold. So, like I've said numerous times, and it's 95 00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 1: a pretty known social reality you listening to this, you 96 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 1: want to be liked. I want to be liked. We 97 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 1: want to be seen as part of the us, or 98 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:20,760 Speaker 1: as standing out or being cool, especially in our early 99 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 1: twenties where social status and interpersonal attraction really matter as 100 00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 1: we navigate our identity and who we are. I say 101 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:31,760 Speaker 1: this all the time on the podcast, But humans are 102 00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: social animals, and being rejected from a social group that 103 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:40,279 Speaker 1: we deem as important in the past, what that meant 104 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:43,880 Speaker 1: was losing access to things that were essential for our survival, 105 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 1: like food, protection, mating partners, so to survive, our brains 106 00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: have kind of developed an early warning rejection alert system 107 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:56,839 Speaker 1: that triggers really sharp emotional pain and sometimes the feeling 108 00:06:56,920 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 1: of physical pain as well. That's how deeply we don't 109 00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:04,400 Speaker 1: want to be rejected and how deeply we crave acceptance. 110 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:09,359 Speaker 1: But for so many years, few psychologists in this area 111 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 1: have really tuned into the importance of rejection for shaping 112 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:16,000 Speaker 1: our behavior. It's like the whole field kind of missed 113 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 1: the essentially important part of human life. But that's changed 114 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 1: over the last decade, and a growing number of researchers 115 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:28,040 Speaker 1: and institutions have really turned their eyes towards this uncomfortable 116 00:07:28,080 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 1: fact of life, that rejection it matters to us. People 117 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 1: have realized just how much our concern with social acceptance 118 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 1: kind of spreads its fingers into almost everything we do everything. 119 00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:41,960 Speaker 1: And I was having this conversation with a friend of 120 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:45,560 Speaker 1: mine around how you navigate that. Do we just accept 121 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:49,720 Speaker 1: that social pressure and the desire to appear like you 122 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 1: have status or to be accepted. Do we just accept 123 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:57,240 Speaker 1: that that exists and live within that system and kind 124 00:07:57,240 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 1: of play along with it, or do you kind of 125 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 1: face that constant, existential treadmill of trying to fight against 126 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:07,240 Speaker 1: it but never quite being able to. But back to 127 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 1: the research, So, as researchers have kind of dug deeper 128 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:14,120 Speaker 1: into the roots of rejection, they found some pretty surprising 129 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 1: evidence that the pain of being excluded is not so 130 00:08:16,960 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 1: different from the pain of physical injury, of stubbing your toe, 131 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:25,280 Speaker 1: things like that, and rejection it also has pretty serious 132 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:29,920 Speaker 1: implications for your psychological state and for the state of 133 00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 1: society in general. Social rejection. It influences your emotions, it 134 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:39,680 Speaker 1: influences your cognition and your physical health, and ostracized people 135 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 1: if rejection happens again and again, can become very isolated 136 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 1: and even aggressive or turn violent. I think that the 137 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 1: idea of social rejection has really become part of an 138 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:57,439 Speaker 1: ongoing conversation around things like school shooters in the US, 139 00:08:57,640 --> 00:09:02,080 Speaker 1: or lone wolves, or people who from that rejection have 140 00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:06,720 Speaker 1: gone on to do terrible things. And it's really really 141 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: interesting how our conversations around that have really integrated this 142 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: idea and this acceptance of rejection as a bad thing 143 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:19,800 Speaker 1: into our discussions of these instances and these people. Because humans, 144 00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:22,360 Speaker 1: we have a fundamental need to belong, just as we 145 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:26,079 Speaker 1: have needs for food and water. We also have needs 146 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:31,080 Speaker 1: for positive and lasting relationships. So if we're hardwired to 147 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:36,680 Speaker 1: avoid rejection, where do we seek acceptance and approval, Well, 148 00:09:36,880 --> 00:09:39,040 Speaker 1: that would be from the groups that we are a 149 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,040 Speaker 1: part of. All of us, every single person listening to this, 150 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 1: I'm sure that you can name at least four five 151 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:48,560 Speaker 1: groups that you're a part of. Maybe it's a sport team, 152 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 1: it's the place that you work, it's your group of friends, 153 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:54,200 Speaker 1: it's your family, it's your neighborhood, it's the school you 154 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 1: went to. But some groups matter more to us than 155 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: others based on what we personally value you about ourselves, 156 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 1: but also how we perceive others and how we perceive 157 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 1: our groups in relation to society in general. It also 158 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:12,240 Speaker 1: comes down to whether we like people, yes, but whether 159 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 1: we see our groups and the groups that maybe we're 160 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:19,160 Speaker 1: not part of as an opportunity for social mobility. So 161 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:24,840 Speaker 1: social mobility comes into this conversation a lot status. It exists, 162 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: social status and a hierarchy of different social groups exists. 163 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:32,240 Speaker 1: And if we are seeking approval, it kind of makes 164 00:10:32,240 --> 00:10:35,040 Speaker 1: sense that we'd want that approval to come from the 165 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:38,720 Speaker 1: people that are most admired in society and by gaining 166 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 1: access to those groups, we experience social mobility, we move up, 167 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:47,160 Speaker 1: we improve our self esteem, and we reduce the feelings 168 00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 1: of rejection or the feelings of not really belonging. So 169 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:55,200 Speaker 1: we like those and we like groups that present an 170 00:10:55,240 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 1: opportunity to be liked and included, and this leads to 171 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:02,839 Speaker 1: conformity and a convergence on group norms, which end up 172 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 1: governing our behavior. Many people, all of us, we like 173 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:15,079 Speaker 1: to recognize ourselves as an individual or as unique, and 174 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 1: whilst we do possess specific characteristics that really distinguish us 175 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: from the crowd, we are all unique. The majority of 176 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: us comply with some set of social and societal rules 177 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:30,640 Speaker 1: most of the time. So conformity is the act of 178 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:34,679 Speaker 1: kind of matching your beliefs, your attitudes, and behaviors to 179 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:40,440 Speaker 1: group norms politics, or to those who are like minded. Norms. 180 00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 1: The DIA these implicit, specific rules, intangible really that are 181 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:49,360 Speaker 1: shared by a group of individuals, and they guide our 182 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:53,120 Speaker 1: interactions with others. And it kind of brings up the 183 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 1: question we've kind of already answered it, but just to reiterate, 184 00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:58,559 Speaker 1: why do people conform to these norms? Why do people 185 00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 1: conform in a group will yielding to group pressure. In 186 00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:07,559 Speaker 1: this way. It often happens because we want to fit in. 187 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:11,800 Speaker 1: And there are these five proposed kind of motivations behind 188 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:15,760 Speaker 1: conformity of this type. So the reasons that we can 189 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:20,000 Speaker 1: form and we converge on the group norms of groups 190 00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:22,840 Speaker 1: that we deem as important because we want to be correct, 191 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:27,320 Speaker 1: We want to be socially acceptable and avoid rejection. We 192 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 1: want to accomplish group goals that could in turn help 193 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:34,559 Speaker 1: elevate our social status or our social position and how 194 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:38,160 Speaker 1: well off we are. We also conform to establish and 195 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:41,200 Speaker 1: maintain our self concept and our social identity, and to 196 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 1: align ourselves with similar individuals. And there is kind of 197 00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 1: this general belief that conforming is pretty important for society. 198 00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:53,440 Speaker 1: It makes us more agreeable to live with, and in 199 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:57,360 Speaker 1: some ways it kind of creates a status quo or 200 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:01,520 Speaker 1: a sense of normal. And different groups different identities, They 201 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 1: have different definitions of the norms which govern our behavior 202 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:10,319 Speaker 1: and which norms you need to follow to be seen 203 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:15,000 Speaker 1: or deemed is acceptable. So importantly, although traditional ideas of 204 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:19,200 Speaker 1: in group acceptance often speak of conformity and obedience to 205 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 1: the norm is the most important part of being accepted, 206 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 1: it actually appears a lot more nuance the deeper that 207 00:13:25,160 --> 00:13:28,000 Speaker 1: you kind of dive into the literature and what is 208 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:31,720 Speaker 1: cool or what is socially acceptable. It no longer seems 209 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:33,960 Speaker 1: to just be based on conformity but in some ways 210 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:37,960 Speaker 1: rebellion and violation. So researchers they've tried to kind of 211 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:41,560 Speaker 1: unpack the paradoxes that are inherent in social acceptance and 212 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: being perceived as one of us and as cool. And 213 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 1: they've obviously focused in particular on norms, but more so 214 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:53,960 Speaker 1: on the importance of violating norms or setting oneself apart 215 00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:58,839 Speaker 1: from certain dispensable norms. So one author, this really interesting author, 216 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:02,720 Speaker 1: did this in depth study on why norm violation can 217 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: actually lead to acceptance and attraction. So norm violation that 218 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 1: being going against what is traditionally accepted or expected from you, 219 00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:17,280 Speaker 1: And the conventional wisdom is that violating a norm would 220 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 1: result in rejection, which we know we want to avoid. 221 00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 1: So people normally have an incentive to be as loyal 222 00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 1: and obedient to the norm set by their groups as possible. 223 00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:31,080 Speaker 1: But the things with norms, the thing with norms, sorry, 224 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: is that they are contextually and situationally specific. Humans do 225 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:41,760 Speaker 1: not have one set of norms that we are universal 226 00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:46,760 Speaker 1: and that we're all beholden to. They differ and the 227 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:51,320 Speaker 1: unwritten behavioral and attitudinal codes that govern our lives. They 228 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:55,160 Speaker 1: differ from situation to situation, from group to group, and 229 00:14:55,360 --> 00:14:58,680 Speaker 1: like I said, they're importantly fixed to certain groups and 230 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 1: our memberships to them. So we are aware of the 231 00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: different norms that exists in different contexts. So how you 232 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: behave at work what's expected of you will differ wildly 233 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 1: from how you behave when you're on a rowdy night 234 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 1: out with your friends. But norms are the building blocks 235 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:21,120 Speaker 1: of being liked and being perceived as part of the 236 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 1: in group and as cool. But as I've mentioned, it's 237 00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:28,720 Speaker 1: a complicated process and interactions, and as researchers have pointed 238 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 1: out recently, sometimes it is norm violation that can be 239 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 1: most influential for social mobility and acceptance. I think cool 240 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 1: and being cool has kind of this really strange, brittle 241 00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 1: cultural logic. It's kind of a residual code that has 242 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 1: turned itself into an emerging code. Its performative style is 243 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:55,000 Speaker 1: based upon and derives simultaneously from, symbols of both association 244 00:15:55,560 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: but also of independence and disaffiliation. So for example, the 245 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:04,360 Speaker 1: norms held by broader society versus the norms held by 246 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 1: unique subgroups that we are a part of, they'll differ. 247 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 1: So you can simultaneously break a norm and obey a 248 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: different norm at the same time. And by breaking a 249 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 1: more widely held norm of broader society that maybe not 250 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 1: everyone agrees with, we can kind of signal to our 251 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:27,000 Speaker 1: unique subgroups that we're more loyal to the codes that 252 00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:31,960 Speaker 1: govern our behavior and these unique and smaller scale situations. 253 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:35,840 Speaker 1: So acceptance and being perceived as cool or as part 254 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 1: of the in group nowadays can actually mean breaking the rules, 255 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 1: violating the norm, but only to a certain degree. So, 256 00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:49,360 Speaker 1: according to one researcher, the way people and things are 257 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,560 Speaker 1: perceived as cool as if they're seen as autonomous. It's 258 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:56,040 Speaker 1: not just about always going against the norm and expecting 259 00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:58,280 Speaker 1: people to like you. Based on the logic we were 260 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:04,240 Speaker 1: talking about above, we want to know people, we want 261 00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:08,080 Speaker 1: to see people, We want to see their actions as 262 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:11,400 Speaker 1: if they would do them regardless of what other people think. 263 00:17:12,600 --> 00:17:17,320 Speaker 1: Let me kind of repeat that violating a norm just 264 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: to violate it for the sake of it isn't actually 265 00:17:20,600 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 1: seen as very beneficial. But if you're doing it in 266 00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:29,120 Speaker 1: an autonomous way. If you're doing it for some superordinate 267 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:33,399 Speaker 1: goal and in a way that is very unique or 268 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,400 Speaker 1: seems really self motivated, that's when you're more likely to 269 00:17:37,520 --> 00:17:43,159 Speaker 1: gain acceptance from your unique subgroups. Furthermore, norm violation it 270 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:46,160 Speaker 1: not only indicates that you can be an independent thinker 271 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:49,119 Speaker 1: and that you're autonomous, but that you operate in the 272 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 1: way that favors the more specific inner group norms of 273 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:56,200 Speaker 1: your groups without needing direction or instruction. So it kind 274 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:58,840 Speaker 1: of validates that you are actually a true member of 275 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:01,760 Speaker 1: the group, and in that way you begin to receive 276 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:06,600 Speaker 1: social acceptance. A really interesting kind of example of this 277 00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:09,480 Speaker 1: is the idea of style and how we dress. I 278 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 1: was talking about this with my friend Sydney. We both 279 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:16,880 Speaker 1: live in I would say, pretty cool neighborhoods in Melbourne 280 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:23,440 Speaker 1: and Sydney. Pretty big cities, pretty cool cities, And there 281 00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 1: is definitely this very i think fluid idea of like 282 00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:32,880 Speaker 1: what makes you seem socially acceptable, what makes people like you? 283 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:36,720 Speaker 1: And there is a perception these days that rejecting trends 284 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:39,879 Speaker 1: and choosing kind of a niche unique look, shopping at 285 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:42,760 Speaker 1: op shops or having kind of a look or a 286 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:44,640 Speaker 1: style that's one of a kind. I guess that's that's 287 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:48,160 Speaker 1: what's cool because it shows a rejection of popular fashion 288 00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:52,199 Speaker 1: and dress that can be used to signal independence but 289 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 1: also allegiance to a more contradictory and anti establishment trend 290 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:59,040 Speaker 1: that exists within the certain subgroups that we may be 291 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: a part of. Norm violation has become cool, making it 292 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:06,320 Speaker 1: such that kind of the new norm is to be 293 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:09,480 Speaker 1: anti norm. You know. It's like a bit of a contradiction, 294 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:15,520 Speaker 1: but an interesting thing to think about. Nonetheless, it becomes 295 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:21,560 Speaker 1: more about in this situation independence and uniqueness over norm loyalty, 296 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:24,880 Speaker 1: and that's when autonomy itself becomes the norm and becomes 297 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 1: how we gain social acceptance. So, in some sense, coolness, 298 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 1: our desire to be seen as socially and interpersonally attractive, 299 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:42,360 Speaker 1: mirrors this self actualization process. Self actualizes they're people who 300 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:45,280 Speaker 1: think for themselves. They don't conform to fit in, and 301 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:48,639 Speaker 1: they've kind of evolved beyond basic needs to higher order needs. 302 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:52,800 Speaker 1: Instead of valuing things like belonging, they've come to value 303 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:59,040 Speaker 1: higher principles like self sufficiency, like beauty that is independent 304 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:03,200 Speaker 1: of traditional conceptions of the subject, and things like justice. 305 00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:08,840 Speaker 1: So Maslow. He is this well known psychologist, this author, 306 00:20:08,840 --> 00:20:14,119 Speaker 1: this thinker, and he describes self actualizes as autonomous, standing 307 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:18,480 Speaker 1: apart from their culture and environment. In important ways, they 308 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: might break or reject the rules of broader society that 309 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:27,879 Speaker 1: just don't make sense. They might not be as dependent 310 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 1: on others for satisfaction, or on culture or means to 311 00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 1: an ends in general to receive extrinsic satisfactions. Rather, they're 312 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:44,919 Speaker 1: dependent for their own development and continued growth. And in 313 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:48,160 Speaker 1: this way they kind of set themselves apart and can 314 00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:55,160 Speaker 1: become accepted for that very reason. Self actualization, though importantly 315 00:20:56,280 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 1: it doesn't occur in isolation. Our identity is not concocted 316 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:06,360 Speaker 1: and created in a bubble, but is influenced every day 317 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 1: by what we kind of see in our environment and 318 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:14,359 Speaker 1: what is reflected by our in groups and the subgroups 319 00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:18,119 Speaker 1: that were a part of Especially in this kind of 320 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:19,800 Speaker 1: day and age, I feel like I don't need to 321 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:24,160 Speaker 1: expand upon the additional influence of social media and globalization 322 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 1: and capitalism. Just essentially, I think the main logic to 323 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:32,200 Speaker 1: follower here is that in this day and age, there 324 00:21:32,280 --> 00:21:35,240 Speaker 1: is no such thing as being entirely unique. There is 325 00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:39,720 Speaker 1: no way to separate yourself from trends and the influences 326 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 1: of others because they're in Yeah, I guess the influences others. 327 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:47,120 Speaker 1: But also there's no way to really separate yourself from 328 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:49,600 Speaker 1: the inherent need to be liked or perceived in a 329 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:53,520 Speaker 1: certain way. This has more to do just with general 330 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:59,280 Speaker 1: social well being. Everyone needs community, everyone needs in some 331 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:01,480 Speaker 1: ways to be liked, or they wouldn't be able to 332 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:10,919 Speaker 1: operate in modern day society. I guess a natural progression 333 00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:16,200 Speaker 1: from that discussion of norm violation and of the power 334 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:20,400 Speaker 1: of autonomy and authenticity is a discussion on the existence 335 00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:24,080 Speaker 1: of subgroups and the pressures that they kind of exert 336 00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 1: upon us. Before we talked a lot about norm violation 337 00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:30,320 Speaker 1: and in groups, and I think that does warrant a 338 00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:33,080 Speaker 1: bit more of a deep dive in groups in particular, 339 00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:38,080 Speaker 1: because obviously there are norms that govern broader society, but 340 00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:40,880 Speaker 1: those aren't really the ones that matter because we don't 341 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,840 Speaker 1: really interact with we could never possibly interact with every 342 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:50,119 Speaker 1: member of society. And I guess it goes without saying 343 00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:54,160 Speaker 1: that different groups have different expectations. That's the basis of culture, 344 00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:58,720 Speaker 1: and that's the basis of you know, different different countries 345 00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:02,840 Speaker 1: and different groups that we see in the world. So 346 00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 1: an in group or a subgroup in psychology, and in 347 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,000 Speaker 1: a large part in the field of sociology as well, 348 00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 1: is a smaller group that exists within a larger group 349 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:16,959 Speaker 1: or in this case, society. So in groups are groups 350 00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: which we belong to, which have their own identities, their 351 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:24,640 Speaker 1: own interests, attributes, and behavioral norms, and in this way 352 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:29,040 Speaker 1: possess their own kind of like insular culture of sorts. 353 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 1: For example, an in group it could be something like 354 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:35,000 Speaker 1: your footy team. You don't have to be a footy player, 355 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:37,479 Speaker 1: but like just the team that you support, there are 356 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: a set of attributes that you think kind of distinguish 357 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,480 Speaker 1: you from others that creates an in group. It could 358 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 1: be something like the church you go to. In this instance, 359 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:50,040 Speaker 1: religion has a big part to do it to do 360 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,879 Speaker 1: with it, or it could be something like your neighborhood. 361 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:56,320 Speaker 1: Throughout all these examples, we're seeing that there's something that 362 00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,679 Speaker 1: kind of ties people together and in groups. They can 363 00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:05,400 Speaker 1: also be based on something incredibly minuscule, even sometimes arbitrary, 364 00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:08,880 Speaker 1: but which nonetheless forms an important part of your identity, 365 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 1: like the music you listen to that can just be 366 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,600 Speaker 1: enough for you and someone else to establish an in 367 00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:20,960 Speaker 1: group between the two of you. There's something that unites you, 368 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,600 Speaker 1: which you feel distinguishes you compared to the status quo 369 00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:29,760 Speaker 1: or everyone else. So subcultures are an important caveat here 370 00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,359 Speaker 1: and kind of like a natural progression from that. So 371 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:35,480 Speaker 1: subgroups that types of in groups that are more diffuse. 372 00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: They don't have any formal leadership, formal membership, or explicit 373 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,879 Speaker 1: kind of organizational structure the way that a church group 374 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:51,320 Speaker 1: or a forty team might have these other features. So leadership, 375 00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:55,880 Speaker 1: formal membership, explicit organizational structure, these are the features which 376 00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:59,280 Speaker 1: often typify the existence of an in group, but rather 377 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:04,000 Speaker 1: subgroups they have or subcultures have kind of loose and 378 00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:11,800 Speaker 1: informal participation, mainly because the boundaries of who and what 379 00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:16,560 Speaker 1: embodies a subculture they're contest it and they're fluid, so 380 00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:24,119 Speaker 1: membership is not exclusive. Subculturalists can identify as with just 381 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:28,399 Speaker 1: one part of the subculture and simultaneously interact with people 382 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,840 Speaker 1: in another culture and broader social networks. And consequently, I 383 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:39,240 Speaker 1: think the boundaries between mainstream culture and subcultures are often indistinguishable, 384 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 1: as the two kind of cultural domains, they can share 385 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:47,320 Speaker 1: ideas and coexist in the lives of individuals. They can 386 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:51,879 Speaker 1: be seen as existing within, whereas in groups kind of 387 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,879 Speaker 1: a scene as existing outside of. And here's why we 388 00:25:56,000 --> 00:26:00,639 Speaker 1: might actually count subcultures as an in group. And it 389 00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:02,960 Speaker 1: kind of does have to do with this broader idea 390 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:06,880 Speaker 1: of social attraction that we're talking about. Subcultures. They don't 391 00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:10,840 Speaker 1: only share an identity, they also share values, practices, and 392 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,639 Speaker 1: cultural objects that, if we are a part of this subgroup, 393 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:21,679 Speaker 1: really matter to us. And they often signify status symbols. 394 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:27,280 Speaker 1: So for example, like a particular subculture might be like 395 00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:32,200 Speaker 1: clean living or like yeah, clean living, veganism, that kind 396 00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:37,880 Speaker 1: of thing, and they purchase objects of importance to them, 397 00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:45,760 Speaker 1: like you know, cruelty free products or expensive vegan skincare 398 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:50,680 Speaker 1: or yoga pants. Those things might not be as it 399 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,000 Speaker 1: might not be important to the average person. You know, 400 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 1: if someone came up to me in the street and 401 00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:58,439 Speaker 1: was like, oh my gosh, here's this fantastic brand of 402 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:04,159 Speaker 1: cruelty free sunscreen or whatever, I probably would not know 403 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,560 Speaker 1: what the fuck they were talking about. But it could 404 00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 1: be a status symbol for that clean living culture or 405 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 1: subculture that they operated. So as subcultures emerge, distinct meanings 406 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:21,879 Speaker 1: form to kind of define the specific scenes, unique practices 407 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 1: and cultural objects like the sunscreen. And the other thing 408 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 1: that kind of forms is the practices, the principles, and 409 00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:36,000 Speaker 1: the objects that distinguish the subculture from the mainstream culture. 410 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 1: And it's this chasm. It's this gap that is kind 411 00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:48,120 Speaker 1: of the biggest one to jump to jump over if 412 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:50,280 Speaker 1: you want to move into a group, if you want 413 00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:54,240 Speaker 1: to be socially accepted. But luckily for us, the meanings 414 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:58,400 Speaker 1: around what is cool or what defines the specific subculture, 415 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:03,040 Speaker 1: they continuously grow and change because subcultures don't have any 416 00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 1: form of leadership or formal membership, so there is freedom 417 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:09,919 Speaker 1: to kind of debate existing meanings and create new ones. 418 00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:14,520 Speaker 1: And additionally, the way that subcultures and in groups are 419 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:17,600 Speaker 1: kind of distinguished yet again, is that there aren't any 420 00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:21,119 Speaker 1: kind of barriers to people who are members of subcultures 421 00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:26,200 Speaker 1: being equally loyal to society and other people in society 422 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 1: in general. So it's kind of generally accepted that there 423 00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:36,000 Speaker 1: are interactions between people who aren't really members of the group, 424 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,160 Speaker 1: and those are just as important as the interactions we 425 00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 1: have with those who are members of the group. In 426 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:47,240 Speaker 1: these situations, the main form of influence and power is 427 00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:51,120 Speaker 1: common bonds and attachment to other group members and a 428 00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:56,280 Speaker 1: sense of a strong common identity. So in this way, 429 00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 1: this way, it's kind of a different deer around social 430 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:05,680 Speaker 1: acceptance within these subcultures. In some ways, it's easier to 431 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,160 Speaker 1: seek social acceptance and to be seen as cool or 432 00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 1: as an in group member within these kind of settings, 433 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:14,680 Speaker 1: But in the other way it does another way. It 434 00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:17,360 Speaker 1: does take a lot of effort, and it takes a 435 00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 1: lot of dedication I guess, to a specific way of living. 436 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 1: And another important element that I think really links in 437 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:27,840 Speaker 1: that norm violation concept we were talking about in that 438 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:31,560 Speaker 1: perception of being cool relative to context is the sense 439 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 1: of resistance within subcultures to kind of the dominant dominant 440 00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 1: cultural values. And there's also normally a sense of marginalization 441 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 1: that typically unites members. They feel that they sit outside 442 00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 1: of what mainstream culture and cultural values expects from us. Hence, 443 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 1: their identity and existence is somewhat predicated on norm violation 444 00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 1: and going against what is typical. So if we wrap 445 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:00,719 Speaker 1: this all, we link this all back together, there's this 446 00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:03,040 Speaker 1: idea that to be seen as cool and to be 447 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 1: seen as part of the in group and to be 448 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:09,240 Speaker 1: seen as socially attractive and attractive and socially acceptable, you 449 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,560 Speaker 1: need to conform, and you need to be able to 450 00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,239 Speaker 1: identify what's cool and just follow along with it. But 451 00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:18,760 Speaker 1: what this recent research is saying is that that really depends, 452 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: because there are actually certain groups in which your membership 453 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: is based on your ability to go against what is 454 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:30,080 Speaker 1: the norm and your ability to act as an autonomous individual, 455 00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:35,160 Speaker 1: And what makes someone cool or sets people apart within 456 00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:40,440 Speaker 1: subcultures is often incredibly specific. So I had this thought 457 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 1: at a concert the other day. I was at Carriage Works. 458 00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,360 Speaker 1: If you're a Sydney listener, you'll know where that is. 459 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,160 Speaker 1: But this concert it was like not something I take 460 00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:54,520 Speaker 1: I would like normally go to. It was super grunge, 461 00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 1: kind of goth. And I walked in wearing the clothes 462 00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 1: that I would normally wear, and I just so out 463 00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:03,520 Speaker 1: of place. I think, you know, if I was walking 464 00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 1: down the streets of Newtown, or if I was at 465 00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: my old UNI, what I was wearing, the kind of perception, 466 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:11,920 Speaker 1: I don't know, like the kind of image I was 467 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:16,440 Speaker 1: giving off would be seen as pretty typical elsewhere, but 468 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 1: in this situation, it was really obvious that I was 469 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 1: not a member of this particular subculture. I was not 470 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 1: a frequent participant in goth underground music, that kind of 471 00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 1: music scene, and I felt incredibly uncool. But if members 472 00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:36,880 Speaker 1: of this group were to step into one of my 473 00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,440 Speaker 1: cultural identities or one of the groups I belong to, 474 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:41,760 Speaker 1: I'm sure they would have felt the same. And the 475 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 1: way that that was kind of indicated to me. The 476 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:47,280 Speaker 1: reason I felt uncool was because of these status symbols, 477 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 1: because of what people were wearing, and there was a 478 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:53,560 Speaker 1: sense of convergence here, but there was also a norm 479 00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:57,120 Speaker 1: of independence and a normal authenticity that we've been talking 480 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:01,920 Speaker 1: about a lot. But under lying all that there is trends. 481 00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,360 Speaker 1: There are trends that to be cool we have to 482 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:08,000 Speaker 1: both follow and we have to both violate. So how 483 00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:12,760 Speaker 1: do trends and ideas of in group prototypicality emerge in 484 00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:16,840 Speaker 1: these environments? How do we know what to follow and 485 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:20,080 Speaker 1: what not to follow? You know, why is it that 486 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:23,360 Speaker 1: you know you might be in a specific situation You 487 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,800 Speaker 1: notice that everyone looks the same. Surely there's not a 488 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:30,280 Speaker 1: big group chat that thousands of people are using to 489 00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:33,520 Speaker 1: like coordinate their outfits and to coordinate what's cool. So 490 00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 1: how do trends in this kind of globalized environment, how 491 00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 1: do they emerge? So the origin and the emergence of 492 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:49,440 Speaker 1: social conventions of trends, whatever you want to call them, 493 00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:51,200 Speaker 1: it's kind of been a bit of a problem child 494 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 1: for cognitive scientists and social psychologists in the past and 495 00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:03,360 Speaker 1: prominent ideas. They've often assumed that institutionalized mechanisms like a 496 00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:10,760 Speaker 1: centralized authority, figure leadership or incentives for collective agreement around norms. 497 00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:17,200 Speaker 1: These are what are required for shared conventions to become prevalent. Obviously, 498 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:20,800 Speaker 1: we know that's not true. Trends emerge without someone telling 499 00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:25,920 Speaker 1: us what to do, without a collective conversation. When we 500 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:29,880 Speaker 1: think about subcultures, which often have a real sense of 501 00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:33,800 Speaker 1: commonality and a sense of common trends and common conventions, 502 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,920 Speaker 1: they don't have centralized authority, they don't have leadership, and 503 00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:43,320 Speaker 1: they don't have kind of solid membership either. So these 504 00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:45,960 Speaker 1: newer social ideas have kind of come to play, and 505 00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:50,560 Speaker 1: they've suggested that there are networks of like locally interacting 506 00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:56,479 Speaker 1: individuals that kind of spontaneously and unintentionally self organized and 507 00:33:56,600 --> 00:34:01,160 Speaker 1: self and coordinate to produce a more global coordination and 508 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:06,760 Speaker 1: trend and convergence towards typical conventions and typical signals of 509 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:12,440 Speaker 1: status and in group nous rather than formal institutions. So 510 00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:15,759 Speaker 1: but this kind of sort of self organization has been 511 00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:19,160 Speaker 1: really difficult to demonstrate, especially on a meaningful scale. And 512 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:21,799 Speaker 1: that's where all these kind of discussions around how do 513 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:25,200 Speaker 1: we know what's cool, how do we know what it 514 00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:26,920 Speaker 1: means to be part of the in group if we 515 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:30,360 Speaker 1: don't actually know how the conventions that govern and the 516 00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:34,160 Speaker 1: norms that govern our in groups and our groups come 517 00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:38,680 Speaker 1: to be. But there was this really interesting study that 518 00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 1: kind of cracked the code or cracked open Pandora's box 519 00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:47,319 Speaker 1: in some ways. So it was a university study in 520 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:49,719 Speaker 1: the Netherlands, I think, and they put these students that 521 00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:53,080 Speaker 1: were part of like a first year psychology course, they 522 00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:56,280 Speaker 1: placed them in chat rooms for the entire year, and 523 00:34:56,640 --> 00:35:00,239 Speaker 1: people were placed randomly in different chat rooms, and over time, 524 00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:05,440 Speaker 1: these trends started to emerge and how people talk to 525 00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 1: each other, the jokes they made, and there was also 526 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:12,600 Speaker 1: like a convergence within these little groups that were defined 527 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:16,799 Speaker 1: by these chat rooms on how people took notes, on 528 00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:22,120 Speaker 1: where people ate lunch on what people did and all 529 00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:27,680 Speaker 1: of these things, all of these indicators of the specific 530 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:33,319 Speaker 1: chat rooms they differed, they differed, And when all of 531 00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:35,879 Speaker 1: these groups and one of the chat rooms were kind 532 00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:39,560 Speaker 1: of combined, people still kind of stuck to the groups 533 00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:43,200 Speaker 1: that were created by those initial kind of conversations. And 534 00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 1: what the researchers noticed within that was a trend setter 535 00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 1: or a leader within these smaller local groups who kind 536 00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:56,160 Speaker 1: of started doing something from a place of authenticity and autonomy, 537 00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:59,880 Speaker 1: which we've talked about, and then everyone kind of followed suit. 538 00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:03,560 Speaker 1: We would call them a trend setter, But why was 539 00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:06,400 Speaker 1: this person more influential than the other ones than the 540 00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:10,920 Speaker 1: other people? So I think we know from just our 541 00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:14,120 Speaker 1: basic knowledge of social interactions and of society in general 542 00:36:14,239 --> 00:36:16,960 Speaker 1: social media as well, that not everyone can kind of 543 00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:19,400 Speaker 1: be a trend setter or start a social movement towards 544 00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:23,360 Speaker 1: a particular convention or norm or action. So we typically 545 00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:30,040 Speaker 1: believe it's tied to charisma, natural intelligence, attractiveness, things like that, 546 00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:32,719 Speaker 1: but on a deeper level, it has to do with 547 00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:38,080 Speaker 1: in group prototypicality. So in group typicality that is the 548 00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:44,560 Speaker 1: key that seems to unlock this whole kind of secret 549 00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:49,760 Speaker 1: closet and strange world that was really weird Narnia reference. 550 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:55,360 Speaker 1: But you know what I mean of social attraction and 551 00:36:55,440 --> 00:37:00,760 Speaker 1: being perceived as cool soup prototypicality. Basically, what it means 552 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:04,720 Speaker 1: is that you are You are kind of the median, 553 00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:10,000 Speaker 1: the most sensual and normal figure of all those around you. 554 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:14,960 Speaker 1: You kind of represent the amalgamation of the attributes, the characteristics, 555 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:18,920 Speaker 1: the likes, the behaviors, the attitudes of all those who 556 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:22,560 Speaker 1: might be within kind of your atmosphere and within your 557 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:27,360 Speaker 1: social atmosphere, and people recognize that you're the person who 558 00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:32,120 Speaker 1: has the most kind of relatability to every other member 559 00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:35,319 Speaker 1: of the group. And what comes with that is a 560 00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,960 Speaker 1: sense of trust, a sense of trust from other members 561 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:41,239 Speaker 1: that you'll do the right thing by them, that they 562 00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:45,360 Speaker 1: should follow you. And with that comes charisma and attraction 563 00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,440 Speaker 1: and the emergence of a trend set of a trend setter. 564 00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:53,680 Speaker 1: So ingroup prototypicality, being the most familiar and typical member 565 00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:56,520 Speaker 1: of a group is what gives you the power, one 566 00:37:56,560 --> 00:37:59,320 Speaker 1: individual of the power to set a convention that is 567 00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:03,040 Speaker 1: then carry on by others. But navigating that is so 568 00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:05,800 Speaker 1: not simple. Some people just fall into that role naturally 569 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,800 Speaker 1: and find group membership and acceptance and leadership, whereas others 570 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,759 Speaker 1: are kind of really forced to examine group dynamics and 571 00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:17,600 Speaker 1: trends and figure out where they sit. The good thing 572 00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:21,319 Speaker 1: is all humans and all groups, they kind of leave 573 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:23,359 Speaker 1: a track or a pattern of behavior that can be 574 00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:26,319 Speaker 1: followed and emulated if you really want to be part 575 00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:28,160 Speaker 1: of the in group, if you try hard enough to 576 00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:32,400 Speaker 1: be cool. But the other thing that we've learned is 577 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:38,560 Speaker 1: that always converging on the norms, on the conventions, on 578 00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:42,520 Speaker 1: the trends that define the groups that you think are important, 579 00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:45,399 Speaker 1: isn't probably going to get you to a point where 580 00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:50,280 Speaker 1: you feel accepted. It. It kind of comes more naturally 581 00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:54,319 Speaker 1: to those who are authentic and who act independently. These 582 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:56,800 Speaker 1: are the trend setters. These are the people who aren't 583 00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:01,720 Speaker 1: seeking social acceptance. These are the people who gain social 584 00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:07,200 Speaker 1: acceptance from violating norms, not just obeying them. You know, 585 00:39:07,239 --> 00:39:09,319 Speaker 1: we can talk about the research behind this, but I 586 00:39:09,360 --> 00:39:12,000 Speaker 1: think it has come from a more anecdotal place and 587 00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:18,200 Speaker 1: a more kind of yeah, anecdotal perspective. When you try 588 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:22,960 Speaker 1: too hard to be seen as someone who everyone should 589 00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:26,759 Speaker 1: like and to be socially accepted. Often it has the 590 00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:29,759 Speaker 1: inverse effect. No one likes you. They can tell that 591 00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:32,640 Speaker 1: you're being fake, they can tell that you're not authentic. 592 00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:36,000 Speaker 1: They can tell that you don't naturally know how to 593 00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:42,440 Speaker 1: follow the norms of the group. Trying hard is uncool. 594 00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:45,719 Speaker 1: So I guess the lesson from all this conversation is 595 00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:48,960 Speaker 1: the way to kind of gain social acceptance is to 596 00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:53,799 Speaker 1: be independent, autonomous, and your authentic self. That way, you 597 00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,399 Speaker 1: end up kind of drifting and finding the groups who 598 00:39:56,400 --> 00:40:00,280 Speaker 1: you actually have more in common with naturally, but people 599 00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:03,840 Speaker 1: are more attracted to you because they see you as 600 00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:07,200 Speaker 1: somewhat of a leader and an independent thinker, and as 601 00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:11,560 Speaker 1: someone who is self actualized. As Maslow said, that is 602 00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:16,320 Speaker 1: what makes you the most powerful in social interactions, is 603 00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:25,560 Speaker 1: not actually needing social acceptance. I hope you enjoyed this episode. 604 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:29,200 Speaker 1: I do realize it was a lot more theoretical based 605 00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:33,319 Speaker 1: and kind of like weird ramblings from me than our 606 00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 1: typical episodes are. But I really enjoyed looking into this. 607 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:40,680 Speaker 1: I think it's something I've been thinking about a lot, 608 00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:44,520 Speaker 1: having moved recently. It's not really recently anymore, having moved 609 00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:46,560 Speaker 1: at the start of the year. It's like, how do 610 00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:49,720 Speaker 1: you figure out how to fit in in a social 611 00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:53,320 Speaker 1: situation and circumstances that you don't really know very well? 612 00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:57,360 Speaker 1: And why is it that we're constantly seeking to be 613 00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:01,840 Speaker 1: liked and socially accepted and seeking symbols or indicators of status. 614 00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:04,799 Speaker 1: So I guess that's where this episode kind of came from. 615 00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:10,120 Speaker 1: It's just me unpacking how that kind of area, an 616 00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:13,640 Speaker 1: element of the social world world really works, and what 617 00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:18,279 Speaker 1: things we should consider, what kind of topics and conversations 618 00:41:18,320 --> 00:41:21,240 Speaker 1: and subjects come up. So, if you're thinking of feeling 619 00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:24,400 Speaker 1: a similar way, I hope you enjoyed this. I hope 620 00:41:25,200 --> 00:41:27,520 Speaker 1: as weird as it was, as convoluted as it was, 621 00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:30,600 Speaker 1: you kind of took something away from it. And thank 622 00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:32,480 Speaker 1: you for listening. If you've made it as far as 623 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:35,239 Speaker 1: I always say, if you have made it this far 624 00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:38,080 Speaker 1: and you feel cool to do so, please consider leaving 625 00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:42,120 Speaker 1: the podcast a review on either Apple Podcasts or Spotify. 626 00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:46,359 Speaker 1: It really helps us grow. And when I say us, 627 00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:49,359 Speaker 1: it's just me, so it really Yeah, it makes me 628 00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,160 Speaker 1: really happy to see that people are enjoying this, people 629 00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:55,640 Speaker 1: are enjoying me being my authentic self, even if it's 630 00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:58,799 Speaker 1: not cool. But yeah, thank you again for listening and 631 00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:00,440 Speaker 1: tune in next time.