1 00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:09,120 Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. My name 2 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:10,240 Speaker 1: is Robert Lamb. 3 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 2: And I'm Joe McCormick, and it's Saturday. Time to go 4 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 2: into the vault for an older episode of the show. 5 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 2: We are continuing the re air of our series Fire 6 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:20,800 Speaker 2: from the Rocks, originally published in April and May of 7 00:00:20,880 --> 00:00:23,920 Speaker 2: twenty twenty two. This is part three and this episode 8 00:00:24,120 --> 00:00:26,960 Speaker 2: came out on May fifth, twenty twenty two. 9 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:39,120 Speaker 3: Enjoy Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, production of iHeartRadio. 10 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. 11 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 2: My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick, and 12 00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 2: today we're back with part three of our series on 13 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 2: naturally fueled flames and the smolderings and burnings that come 14 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 2: from the earth itself or from the rocks. So in 15 00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 2: the last episode of the series, we talked talked about 16 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 2: the Burning Mountain or Mount WinGen in Australia done in 17 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 2: New South Wales, which is an example of a naturally 18 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:13,000 Speaker 2: fueled type of fire called a coal seam fire, a 19 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:17,960 Speaker 2: place where coal formations underground are set on fire and 20 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:20,319 Speaker 2: then continue to burn as long as they can, as 21 00:01:20,360 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 2: long as they have access to oxygen, probably and while 22 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:26,240 Speaker 2: there's no way to know for sure, Mount WinGen has 23 00:01:26,319 --> 00:01:32,200 Speaker 2: been proposed as potentially the longest burning fire on earth. Though. 24 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 2: It's interesting because today, as we discussed last time, there's 25 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 2: no fire that you can see at the surface. There's 26 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:43,520 Speaker 2: only this large patch of bleached and baked soil which 27 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 2: can be hot to the touch, and or at least 28 00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 2: parts of it can, and it's a devoid of plant 29 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:51,440 Speaker 2: life within this patch. And then of course all around 30 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 2: it there are these interesting sort of there's like a 31 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:57,280 Speaker 2: war for survival at the border of this burned region, 32 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 2: so you'll see, like you know, grasses trying to survive, 33 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 2: and then these bleach tree trunks that are long dead 34 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 2: but still standing. And then also around this area you 35 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 2: find these deep cracks or crevices in the earth, out 36 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 2: of which poor smoke and sulfurous fumes. So the fire 37 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 2: is burning, but it's burning in the deep. It's burning 38 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:21,400 Speaker 2: out of sight down inside the mountain, fed by oxygen 39 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:26,000 Speaker 2: from the surface. And nobody knows how the fire inside 40 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 2: Mount Engine got started, but it's presumed to be a 41 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:33,640 Speaker 2: result of some form of natural ignition. Maybe the coal 42 00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 2: at the surface underwent a chemical reaction leading to spontaneous 43 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:42,480 Speaker 2: combustion or autoignition as it's called, or maybe it was 44 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 2: struck by lightning or by brush fire, but we don't 45 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 2: really know. However, there are many other coal seam fires 46 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 2: that have mostly in one way or another, been created 47 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:58,360 Speaker 2: by human behavior, and a big example here is coal 48 00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:02,600 Speaker 2: mine fires, my fires that fires in a coal seam 49 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:07,359 Speaker 2: that get started one way or another because of mining there, 50 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:09,240 Speaker 2: and they are actually a number of these that are 51 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:11,520 Speaker 2: that are still burning throughout the world today. 52 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:14,239 Speaker 1: I'm trying to remember if I know any coal mining 53 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:18,320 Speaker 1: songs about coal mine fires. There's some really good, like 54 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:21,840 Speaker 1: mining town folk songs and whatnot, but I can't remember 55 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: any offhand that mentioned fires. 56 00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:25,880 Speaker 2: The real good coal mining folk songs I know were 57 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:26,920 Speaker 2: like union songs. 58 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, same yeah, high Sheriff of hazard and so forth. 59 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 2: Which side are you on? 60 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:33,839 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, that's that sort of thing. 61 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, those are great songs, but I don't know 62 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:38,160 Speaker 2: of any of them that mention a coal seam fire. However, 63 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:42,040 Speaker 2: I did actually find a poem that mentions a coal 64 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 2: seam fire, and not just any coal seam fire, but 65 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 2: the one that I was specifically about to talk about. 66 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:51,480 Speaker 2: Because so there's a very famous example in the United 67 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 2: States of a coal seam fire that's been burning for 68 00:03:54,360 --> 00:04:00,160 Speaker 2: decades and it is situated underneath the town of Centralia, Pennsylvania. 69 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 2: The poem I found was one by a poet named 70 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:07,560 Speaker 2: Leonard Cress called the Centralia Mine Fire, and I thought 71 00:04:07,600 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 2: it was really pretty great. It talks about the town 72 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:15,560 Speaker 2: being the shrine of the Holy Order of Anthracite, and 73 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:19,480 Speaker 2: the last four lines of the poem read, though odors 74 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 2: of bottom damp and methane no longer reek into the 75 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 2: streets and ignite, the underground tunnels burn, and each vein 76 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:30,040 Speaker 2: of coal potential fuse leads to another domain. 77 00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 1: Oh nice. This is a contemporary poet by the way. Yeah, 78 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 1: they have a website Leonardcress dot com. 79 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:40,720 Speaker 2: So the town of Centralia is in eastern Pennsylvania. It 80 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,920 Speaker 2: was settled in the mid eighteen hundreds and being situated 81 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:46,719 Speaker 2: over a large coal formation, I think for most of 82 00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 2: its history it was a town where the local economy 83 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:52,279 Speaker 2: was based around a coal mine, which would not be 84 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 2: uncommon in places like Pennsylvania or West Virginia, places in 85 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:59,599 Speaker 2: the US where there's a lot of coal and settlements 86 00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:03,919 Speaker 2: can grow up around the extraction industry based on that coal. 87 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 2: It was never a huge city. I think in the 88 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:10,040 Speaker 2: early nineteen sixties the town had some a little over 89 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 2: two thousand residents, I believe, But things started changing in 90 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:18,680 Speaker 2: the year nineteen sixty two when part of the coal 91 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:22,880 Speaker 2: seam that formed the town's industrial base caught fire. Now 92 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 2: there's still apparently disagreement about exactly how it caught fire. 93 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:31,040 Speaker 2: One idea I read is that it happened to because 94 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 2: of a pre existing coal seam fire from a neighboring 95 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 2: region that spread slowly over several decades until it made 96 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 2: contact with the Centralia sem and then just burned on 97 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 2: from there. But I think that's a minority position. The 98 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:49,600 Speaker 2: more commonly cited explanations involve a garbage stump, and so 99 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 2: the idea is that the coal caught fire either when 100 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 2: a scheduled trash burn at a local landfill penetrated the 101 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:02,480 Speaker 2: mine tunnels and managed to ignite the coal, or possibly 102 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 2: when some kind of hot ash or coal was dumped 103 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,839 Speaker 2: directly into the pit and set the coal burning. Either way, 104 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:11,600 Speaker 2: it's a good example to think about how if you've 105 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 2: got open deposits of coal that are exposed to the atmosphere, 106 00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:18,440 Speaker 2: you really don't want to be burning stuff near that. 107 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:21,840 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, trying to imagine the sort of the apocalyptic 108 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:27,240 Speaker 1: scenario where your garbage fires meet your coal mine tunnels. 109 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 2: Yeah yeah. And so apparently the locals knew there was 110 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:33,479 Speaker 2: a fire in the mines beginning in nineteen sixty two, 111 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 2: but didn't quite realize what a problem it was until 112 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:40,039 Speaker 2: years later, around the late seventies and early eighties. And 113 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 2: there were a few touch points here. One story from 114 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:46,120 Speaker 2: nineteen seventy nine that I've seen in multiple sources is 115 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:50,680 Speaker 2: that there was a local gas station owner named John Coddington, 116 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 2: who was also the mayor of the town, who one 117 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 2: day went out to check the levels in his underground 118 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 2: storage tank. So when you go to a gas station, 119 00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 2: you know, you get out the pump the gases being 120 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:04,400 Speaker 2: pumped up from these big tanks under the ground that's 121 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 2: where the gas lives. And something seemed off, I guess 122 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 2: when he was checking the levels in the tanks. So 123 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 2: he ended up checking the temperature in the storage tanks 124 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 2: and found that the gasoline was one hundred and seventy 125 00:07:14,760 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 2: two degrees fahrenheit. Whoa, yeah, yikes, And this did make 126 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 2: me wonder I was like, wait, what is the autoignition 127 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:26,160 Speaker 2: temperature of gasoline? Because I might have guessed that if 128 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 2: you heat gasoline up to one seventy two degrees fahrenheit 129 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:31,520 Speaker 2: in the presence of oxygen, that would be close to 130 00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 2: it automatically igniting on its own. But I checked, and no, 131 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:39,239 Speaker 2: my intuition was way off. I see some pretty different numbers, 132 00:07:39,240 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 2: but they're all much higher than this. A website called 133 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 2: engineering toolbox dot com suggests that the autoignition temperature of 134 00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 2: gasoline is more like four to seventy five to five 135 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:51,120 Speaker 2: thirty six degrees fahrenheit or two forty six to two 136 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:55,000 Speaker 2: eighty celsius. So it wasn't gonna catch fire on its own, 137 00:07:55,000 --> 00:07:56,040 Speaker 2: but that's still freaky. 138 00:07:56,400 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, And quick disclaimer out there, please do not try 139 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:00,960 Speaker 1: and eat up gasolene. 140 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 2: Oh no, don't test out these numbers. Yeah, this is 141 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 2: not an experiment to perform in your kitchen. In fact, 142 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 2: just don't ever take gasoline inside your house. Yeah. But 143 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 2: so that was seventy nine. But then a real turning 144 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:17,560 Speaker 2: point seemed to come in nineteen eighty one, when a 145 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:21,640 Speaker 2: local boy who was twelve years old was nearly swallowed 146 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 2: up and killed. He managed to survive, but he was 147 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:28,720 Speaker 2: nearly swallowed by the sudden collapse of a sinkhole created 148 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:32,720 Speaker 2: by the Coalseum fire. And so for a contemporary report 149 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:36,360 Speaker 2: on this, I found an AP article published on February twentieth, 150 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 2: nineteen eighty one called Pennsylvania Fearful fire rages for nineteen years. 151 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 1: This is a good This is a I mean, it's 152 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: a serious story, don't get me wrong. But also the 153 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: writing in this little news piece is it really drives 154 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:51,439 Speaker 1: home the dread. 155 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah. So it starts off talking about opinions 156 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 2: of locals about you know, being exposed to the fumes 157 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 2: coming out of this mine and stuff. And maybe I 158 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 2: can come back to that in a minute, but first 159 00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 2: I want to tell the story of this what happened 160 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 2: to this twelve year old boy. So the article reads quote, 161 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 2: townspeople said an accident Saturdays heightened their fears, leading to 162 00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 2: a new flurry of government interest. Todd Domboski, twelve, was 163 00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 2: playing in his grandmother's backyard a few houses from his home. 164 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:23,880 Speaker 2: When he went to investigate a tiny whiff of smoke. 165 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 2: The ground beneath him collapsed instantly. The youth was engulfed 166 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 2: in a hot stinking tangle of dirt and tree roots escaping. 167 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 2: When his older cousin pulled him out, Todd fell about 168 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 2: six feet before grabbing the roots. Florence Domboski, Todd's mother, 169 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:44,720 Speaker 2: praised her fourteen year old nephew, Eric Wolfgang, who was 170 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 2: swift and strong enough to reach into the hole, grab 171 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:50,959 Speaker 2: Todd's arm and pull him to safety. A temperature of 172 00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:53,880 Speaker 2: three hundred and fifty degrees was recorded in the hole. 173 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:57,679 Speaker 2: Its depth was not known, and I did look it up. 174 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 2: More recent articles mentioned that the same coal was later 175 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 2: measured and it was one hundred and fifty feet deep 176 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 2: or about forty five meters, and choked with carbon monoxide throughout. 177 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 2: So if you can imagine this, you're just standing on 178 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 2: what you believe to be solid ground, and the ground 179 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:17,400 Speaker 2: beneath you just collapses, It just opens up, and you're 180 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:20,199 Speaker 2: grabbing at tree roots that are protruding from the dirt, 181 00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:22,840 Speaker 2: and you managed to get a hold of it, but 182 00:10:22,960 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 2: down below you is just a pit into nothingness with 183 00:10:27,280 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 2: fumes of hell coughing out. 184 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 1: Absolutely biblical. There's another great paragraph in this ap story 185 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 1: that reads, quote feeding on timbers, coal and gas in 186 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:43,280 Speaker 1: a maze of abandoned anthracide tunnels that date back to 187 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:47,160 Speaker 1: the eighteen eighties. The creeping inferno is believed to have 188 00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:50,959 Speaker 1: spread beneath forty acres despite repeated attempts to curb it. 189 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, so this article, part of what it's reporting on 190 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:57,800 Speaker 2: is attempts to put out the mind fire that have failed. 191 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:01,360 Speaker 2: I think at the time this was written, already more 192 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 2: than three and a half million dollars had been spent 193 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 2: on trying to fight the fire, and to no avail. 194 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 2: It just didn't work. And so another thing this article 195 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 2: cites is quotes from local townspeople talking about their fears 196 00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:14,559 Speaker 2: about the mind fire, Like one says that it's kind 197 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 2: of scary going to sleep at night and not knowing 198 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 2: if you'll wake up in the morning because you've been 199 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 2: poisoned in your sleep by fumes from the mine. And 200 00:11:22,679 --> 00:11:25,920 Speaker 2: it quotes a local teacher named Bob Goadinsky who says, 201 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:28,840 Speaker 2: we feel like rats in a laboratory. No one knows 202 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:31,000 Speaker 2: what the effect of the carbon monoxide is going to 203 00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 2: be in the future, the children, what will be the 204 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:34,720 Speaker 2: effect on them. 205 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:37,720 Speaker 1: All of this, I mean, all this sounds like something 206 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:40,800 Speaker 1: you'd encounter in a horror movie, except it is real life. 207 00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:44,960 Speaker 1: It's a real life, horrible situation. Concern for the children, 208 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:50,520 Speaker 1: the creeping darkness beneath the earth, eruptions preying on the innocent. 209 00:11:50,880 --> 00:11:54,320 Speaker 2: Yeah. Another quote it gives is from a resident named 210 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 2: Sally Sulik, who says, my nose burns, my eyes tear, 211 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,520 Speaker 2: I'm like a zombie, feel like going to sleep all 212 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:04,200 Speaker 2: the time. If they don't soon do something for us, 213 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,880 Speaker 2: they'll drive us crazy. So in the years since, the 214 00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:12,559 Speaker 2: population of Centralia has been steeply declining. It basically I 215 00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 2: think between nineteen eighty and two thousand it declined to 216 00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 2: almost nothing as the residents moved away. The local homeowners 217 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 2: were offered buyouts from the government to relocate, and then 218 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:27,240 Speaker 2: at some point the government essentially condemned all of the 219 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 2: property in town by way of imminent domain. There were 220 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:33,680 Speaker 2: a few residents left who didn't want to leave, but 221 00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 2: most of the recent articles I read mentioned only like 222 00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 2: a handful of people still living in the area, fewer 223 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:42,559 Speaker 2: than ten. And apparently nobody is going to be allowed 224 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:46,040 Speaker 2: to move to the area, So it's just those people 225 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:48,520 Speaker 2: there as long as they stay or until their deaths. 226 00:12:48,880 --> 00:12:49,480 Speaker 1: Wow. 227 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:51,800 Speaker 2: Another thing that struck me about the story is. I 228 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 2: was reading an article in Atlas Obscura by a freelance 229 00:12:55,360 --> 00:12:58,640 Speaker 2: writer based out of Pennsylvania named Jim Cheney, who was 230 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:02,439 Speaker 2: writing up the history the Centralia fire but also had 231 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:05,360 Speaker 2: been there and taken a bunch of pictures on the scene, 232 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:07,479 Speaker 2: and there was one that struck me as really interesting. 233 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,720 Speaker 2: It was a picture of what the author says, or 234 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:16,040 Speaker 2: the remains of Route sixty one, which is a section 235 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:19,320 Speaker 2: of roadway a highway that's now abandoned since it was 236 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 2: re routed elsewhere. And if you look at the pictures, 237 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:24,600 Speaker 2: you can see why. Right down the middle of the 238 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:28,559 Speaker 2: road is a gigantic crack, again like in a bad 239 00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:33,320 Speaker 2: earthquake movie, and so the road is just sort of 240 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 2: split down the middle. And it actually reminded me a 241 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 2: bit of the cracks and crevices that had been forming 242 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 2: in Mount WinGen for the past six thousand years or 243 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:45,240 Speaker 2: more when you look at the pictures of that. I 244 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:47,719 Speaker 2: don't know the exact cause of every surface feature we're 245 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:49,319 Speaker 2: looking at here, but if I had to guess, I 246 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 2: would say this is probably some kind of collapse caused 247 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:56,080 Speaker 2: by the burning out that's going on underneath the surface, 248 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,160 Speaker 2: just like we saw in these other cases or like 249 00:13:58,160 --> 00:13:59,320 Speaker 2: would have caused the sinkhole. 250 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:05,199 Speaker 1: Of course, sometimes the real life tragedy does inspire great art. 251 00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:09,920 Speaker 1: It's worth noting that the town of Centralia inspired the 252 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:15,520 Speaker 1: fictional town of Valkanvania in the nineteen ninety one film 253 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: Nothing but Trouble, Really, dan Ackroid's weird horror comedy about 254 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 1: a bunch of sort of sort of. I guess you 255 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:33,320 Speaker 1: would say Texas chainsaw massacre esque family residing above a 256 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: big coal mine fire. Quite a film. Quite a film. 257 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:40,600 Speaker 2: Tri Star Pictures or whoever it is, should have a 258 00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 2: standing cash prize for anybody who can manage to watch 259 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 2: that whole movie. 260 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: It has a lot of fun things in it. You've 261 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:51,120 Speaker 1: got a wonderful digital underground performance. 262 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:52,640 Speaker 2: I think you got to make it through a lot 263 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 2: of stuff before you get to that. 264 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,840 Speaker 1: Dan Ackroyd is clearly having the time of his life 265 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: in this film. 266 00:14:57,880 --> 00:14:58,360 Speaker 2: Yeah. 267 00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 1: So if it's if it's, if you considered a film 268 00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 1: for an audience of one an absolute success, I think 269 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:05,360 Speaker 1: you know. 270 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 2: There's another interesting tidbit I came across that's related to 271 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 2: the Centralia coal mine, and it seems geologically interesting, But 272 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:16,400 Speaker 2: I couldn't tell if it was because of the fire 273 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:19,480 Speaker 2: in particular. So there was a news report I read 274 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:24,360 Speaker 2: on the site for a new station called WNEP sixteen. 275 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 2: I guess that's an ABC affiliate, and this was out 276 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:32,720 Speaker 2: of Butler Township, Pennsylvania, and it's talking about a geyser 277 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 2: in Pennsylvania. That's not something that you would expect to 278 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 2: find in Pennsylvania. 279 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 1: I'm looking at the footage here, though it looks geysery, but. 280 00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 2: This is not a natural geyser. This is a geyser 281 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 2: that was created when many years ago, the mining company 282 00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:51,680 Speaker 2: I guess that ran the Centralia mine drilled a hole 283 00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:54,480 Speaker 2: in the ground connecting to one of the tunnels for 284 00:15:54,680 --> 00:15:58,960 Speaker 2: ventilation of the mine shafts, and somehow now with the 285 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 2: tunnels partially flooded. I think it's especially when there's like 286 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:05,520 Speaker 2: been heavy rain or when the snow melts in the spring, 287 00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:10,040 Speaker 2: you get suddenly a guyser gushing up out of this 288 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 2: ventilation hole. And it looks like a real guyser. It's 289 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:15,160 Speaker 2: just spraying up into the air and then running off 290 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:18,360 Speaker 2: into a nearby creek. And they say that the guyser 291 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:22,160 Speaker 2: has a distinct smell. It smells like eggs which I 292 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 2: guess is an indication of sulfurous compounds, and that would 293 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 2: again make sense since you know, you got the coal 294 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:30,560 Speaker 2: down there and it's on fire. And I was unable 295 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,160 Speaker 2: to tell if this, guys, is actually related to the 296 00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:36,840 Speaker 2: fire or if it's just an unrelated, weird feature of 297 00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:37,760 Speaker 2: this same mine. 298 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:41,520 Speaker 1: You see, Like there's a quote in the tweet that's 299 00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:46,520 Speaker 1: attached where the reporters saying that it's been there as 300 00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 1: long as quote anyone can remember. There's a mention of 301 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: like some people say, oh, there used to be a 302 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: second one, and it is kind of I mean, all 303 00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: of this is a stark reminder of how an enterprise 304 00:16:56,680 --> 00:17:00,720 Speaker 1: like coal mining, how you're you're changing the earth, you know, 305 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:02,760 Speaker 1: at least on a local level, and of course you 306 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 1: can get into larger issues of actual climate change as well, 307 00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:09,399 Speaker 1: but even just on a local level, like you're just 308 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 1: you're vastly altering how the ground beneath your feet is functioning. 309 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:27,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, all right, let's move on to another fire in 310 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:27,520 Speaker 4: the earth. 311 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:29,960 Speaker 1: This is a fun one. I'm excited to talk about 312 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 1: it because it concerns natural fires that may have been 313 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:36,200 Speaker 1: burning for two and a half millennia, as well as 314 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:41,359 Speaker 1: a mythical monster, and that monster is the Chimera. Oh 315 00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:44,840 Speaker 1: and the chimera, of course. I think most folks out 316 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:47,359 Speaker 1: there will have some image of this in their mind. 317 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:50,800 Speaker 1: There are some wonderful depictions of it. There's the Chimera 318 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 1: of Arezzo. It's an Etruscan bronze statue of four hundred 319 00:17:56,040 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: BCE that's absolutely gorgeous. If anyone has seen this, or 320 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:01,200 Speaker 1: seen or reproduction of this. 321 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 2: I've been to a retzo, but I don't think I've 322 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:04,959 Speaker 2: seen this. 323 00:18:05,920 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 1: Well, I'm not sure. I didn't put in my notes 324 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:10,600 Speaker 1: where it is currently how so I don't know where 325 00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: its current status is. But I've seen plenty of images 326 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 1: of it. 327 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 2: You know. 328 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:18,680 Speaker 1: It's this wonderful, uh you know, dark bronze finish, and 329 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:22,879 Speaker 1: it looks impressive for a creature that is not always 330 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:27,040 Speaker 1: impressive in artistic renditions, because it is it is not 331 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:29,360 Speaker 1: only a chimera. It is the chimera. It is this. 332 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:34,399 Speaker 1: It is this, this hybrid form that some have criticized 333 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:37,119 Speaker 1: for not completely making all that much sense and maybe 334 00:18:37,160 --> 00:18:40,920 Speaker 1: being too counterintuitive. So at the heart of things, the 335 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:46,359 Speaker 1: chimera is, of course a goat monster. Most of its 336 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:48,920 Speaker 1: recognizable body is usually that of a goat. I guess 337 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 1: one of the interesting things about the camera of Arezzo 338 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:55,160 Speaker 1: is that less of it is a goat, and maybe 339 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:57,399 Speaker 1: that's why it's more impressive, Like it looks like the 340 00:18:57,480 --> 00:19:01,919 Speaker 1: artists decided to lean more into the into the lion 341 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:05,719 Speaker 1: aspects of its body. But generally when you hear talk 342 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,879 Speaker 1: about yeah, we're talking about something that is in large 343 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,639 Speaker 1: part a monstrous she goat. It roams the myths of 344 00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:17,879 Speaker 1: ancient Greece and Rome, and the name itself means she goat, 345 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:20,919 Speaker 1: and in all depictions it has at least some goat 346 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:22,560 Speaker 1: properties to its hybrid form. 347 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:26,160 Speaker 2: Hm, that's funny. I certainly believe you that that's true. 348 00:19:26,160 --> 00:19:28,720 Speaker 2: But I do not really associate the camera with a 349 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 2: goat at all. I think, like, yeah, like lion, snake, 350 00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 2: eagle or something. 351 00:19:34,520 --> 00:19:36,960 Speaker 1: Yes, some depictions it has wings. I want to say that. 352 00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:39,439 Speaker 1: In the Dungeons and Dragon's Monster Manual they give it 353 00:19:39,480 --> 00:19:45,400 Speaker 1: wings specifically. Now, the oldest records of the monster can 354 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 1: be found in the sixth book of Homer's Iliad, and 355 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: this is you know, written down at some point in 356 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:55,479 Speaker 1: the eighth century BCE, and the beast here is described 357 00:19:55,520 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 1: as a great fire breathing, she goat with a lion's 358 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 1: head and the tail of a serpent. And then slightly 359 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 1: more recently, Hesiod wrote of the chimera in his book Theogeny, 360 00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 1: composed between seven thirty and seven hundred DCE. So in Theogeny, 361 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:18,560 Speaker 1: Hesiod is discussing the monstrous Echidna quote divine, stubborn hearted Echidna, 362 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:22,480 Speaker 1: half nymph with dark eyes and fair cheeks, and half 363 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:26,719 Speaker 1: on the other hand, a serpent, huge and terrible and vast, 364 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:32,719 Speaker 1: speckled and flesh devouring beneath caves of sacred earth. And 365 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 1: there in the depths, Echidna mates with the deadly giant Typhon, 366 00:20:38,119 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 1: and they produce quote, fierce hearted children monsters, all including 367 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:47,879 Speaker 1: the two headed dog Orthos, the three headed dog Cerebus, 368 00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 1: and then the even more headed lenaean Hydra, as well 369 00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:56,879 Speaker 1: as the sphinx, the Nemian lion, and of course the chimera. 370 00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: And here's what Hesiod had to say about the kr 371 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,680 Speaker 1: And these are these are all translations from the Reverend J. 372 00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 1: Banks translation. Quote. But she Echidna bore chimera, breathing, restless fire, 373 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:15,199 Speaker 1: fierce and huge, fleet footed, as well as strong. This 374 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 1: monster had three heads, one indeed of a grim visaged lion, 375 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 1: one of a goat, and another of a serpent, a 376 00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:26,440 Speaker 1: fierce dragon in front a lion, a dragon behind, and 377 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:30,720 Speaker 1: in the midst a goat breathing forth the dread strength 378 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:31,879 Speaker 1: of burning. 379 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:34,159 Speaker 2: Fire, and in the midst a goat. 380 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:38,560 Speaker 1: So like, mostly a goat, that's what you're saying, mostly, 381 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 1: that's what That's what I take it. 382 00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:42,720 Speaker 2: To me, is that he's saying the middle head is 383 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:45,520 Speaker 2: the goat head, I think, or wait, but it's also 384 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 2: saying in front a lion and a dragon behind. Yeah, 385 00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:52,120 Speaker 2: So I'm trying to picture this. I'm having it, and I. 386 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 1: Think this is This is why you have a lot 387 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:57,199 Speaker 1: of variation in how it's depicted, like that the the 388 00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:59,879 Speaker 1: Etruscan statue, for instance, and other depictions will have the 389 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:02,240 Speaker 1: oa head just straight up growing out of the back 390 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 1: of the creature other times, but it's a good head. 391 00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:08,280 Speaker 1: And the goat always looks a little awkward there, like, 392 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,560 Speaker 1: what what are you even doing there, buddy? Like you 393 00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:14,160 Speaker 1: can imagine the creatures moving around the goast just sort 394 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:17,480 Speaker 1: of awkwardly making a play for vegetation and stuffed. 395 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:19,800 Speaker 2: In Nibylon, you see a ripple in the water. The 396 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:23,200 Speaker 2: Jaws theme plays, but it's a goat's head poking out 397 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:26,360 Speaker 2: over the certain bah. Yeah wait, dude, the goats baar. 398 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 2: They don't really they bleat. 399 00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:31,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, the bleeding. So yeah, you see. Then you see 400 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:33,880 Speaker 1: it depicted other ways where all the heads are sort 401 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:38,240 Speaker 1: of arranged up front and so forth. But yeah, you can. 402 00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:40,240 Speaker 1: I imagine a lot of this is coming from different 403 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 1: interpretations like this passage. Now, every monster must have its slayer, 404 00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:47,960 Speaker 1: of course, and in this case it is mighty Bellerophon, 405 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:52,000 Speaker 1: sometimes described as a half human son of Poseidon, who 406 00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:56,440 Speaker 1: uses Athena's bridle to capture the winged Pegasus right into 407 00:22:56,480 --> 00:22:59,639 Speaker 1: battle against the Chimera, and then he thrust his spear 408 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,720 Speaker 1: into the monster's flaming maw. Where what happens The metal 409 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:06,639 Speaker 1: instantly melts. Oh no, he's defeated. Oh no, he's not, 410 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 1: because then the liquid metal chokes the deadly monster to death. 411 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:12,399 Speaker 1: So I always found that to be kind of a 412 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:13,120 Speaker 1: nice twist. 413 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:16,399 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Now, surely the hero didn't intend for the 414 00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:18,159 Speaker 2: metal to melt and choke the monster. 415 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:22,200 Speaker 1: I don't know. I never doubt these heroes, These Greek 416 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:24,280 Speaker 1: heroes are are wicked smart. 417 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,000 Speaker 2: That strikes me as more like a like a War 418 00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:29,680 Speaker 2: of the World's type ending where yeah, something you didn't 419 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:31,159 Speaker 2: even expect kills the monster. 420 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:34,399 Speaker 1: Now you're probably asking, okay, well, how does this tie 421 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:39,520 Speaker 1: into places and fire? Well, this myth is certainly tied 422 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:43,159 Speaker 1: to specific places. For starters, it is written that the 423 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:46,720 Speaker 1: Chimera was for a time the pet of the king 424 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 1: of Krea before it escaped and rampaged. This was a 425 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:55,399 Speaker 1: region of western Anatolia from the eleventh through sixth centuries BCE. 426 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:58,440 Speaker 1: This region is now part of Turkey. But then the 427 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,399 Speaker 1: Chimera is said to descend upon an area to the 428 00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:06,120 Speaker 1: southeast of Caria in Lysia, where it generally devours every 429 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 1: mortal in sight and just sets everything on fire. So 430 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:12,560 Speaker 1: this is the realm of Mount Chimera. In the Book 431 00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:17,680 Speaker 1: of Imaginary Beings, Jorge Luis Borges writes that Virgil describes 432 00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:21,399 Speaker 1: the Chimera and the Aeneid, and that the fourth and 433 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:27,840 Speaker 1: fifth century commentator Servius ties the monster to Licia and 434 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:29,800 Speaker 1: went so far as to say that the monster was 435 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:33,960 Speaker 1: a metaphor for a volcano there, and this was apparently 436 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 1: echoed by plenty of the elder as well. 437 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 2: Okay. Interesting. 438 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,600 Speaker 1: This is how Borges summarizes it. Quote, the base of 439 00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:45,800 Speaker 1: the volcano is infested with serpents. On its sides, there 440 00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:50,439 Speaker 1: are meadows where goats pasture, and on top flames shoot forth, 441 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:52,360 Speaker 1: and lions have their dens. 442 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 2: I see. Okay, So it's like combining the different types 443 00:24:56,400 --> 00:25:00,679 Speaker 2: of local wildlife, at least allegedly, the serpents around the base, 444 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:04,400 Speaker 2: and then the goats grazing in the meadow and the lions 445 00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 2: in their caves, and then you have, of course the 446 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,880 Speaker 2: flames coming out. I guess that's the dragon aspect, right. 447 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:15,119 Speaker 1: Yeah. So I have to say, like, when I was 448 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:17,000 Speaker 1: reading this, it sended a little far fetched to me 449 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:20,520 Speaker 1: because we've talked about geomithology before, but I don't remember 450 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:24,399 Speaker 1: like a version of geo mythology where like the aspects 451 00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:27,399 Speaker 1: of a given geographical feature are then just sort of 452 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 1: cobbled together into a into a hybrid monster. And as 453 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 1: it turns out, Borges also finds this ridiculous and mentions 454 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:39,639 Speaker 1: that he thinks it's absurd, as well as an idea 455 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:43,400 Speaker 1: that I think was put forth by Plutarch that Chimera 456 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: is the name of a pirate who just happened to 457 00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:48,639 Speaker 1: have these three different animals as part of his iconography 458 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 1: and his flag and so forth. 459 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 2: It was a pirate. 460 00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:54,760 Speaker 1: Now. One of the advancements in the sort of figuring 461 00:25:54,800 --> 00:26:00,399 Speaker 1: out this myth and tying the myth into actual geology. 462 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:06,640 Speaker 1: This occurred during the early nineteenth century. In eighteen eleven, 463 00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:12,000 Speaker 1: hydrographer and Irish rear Admiral Sir Francis Beaufort linked Mount 464 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:16,280 Speaker 1: Chimera to the geographical features in the region known as 465 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:20,879 Speaker 1: jan Ar or Janartis. And he explored this region, I believe, 466 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: in eighteen eleven through eighteen twelve, basically going around looking 467 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:30,240 Speaker 1: at various ruins, citing various ruins, and he's noted during 468 00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 1: this time for rediscovering Hadrian's Gate built there for Roman 469 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:39,040 Speaker 1: Emperor Hadrian in the year one thirty. So jan Artists, 470 00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,439 Speaker 1: what does it look like? Well, it matches up with 471 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 1: some of these other descriptions we've discussed in these episodes. 472 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,680 Speaker 1: You have a rocky mount here with active gas seeps 473 00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 1: that have produced burning flames for depending on what sources 474 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 1: you're looking at, perhaps two and a half millennia, so 475 00:26:55,200 --> 00:27:00,200 Speaker 1: perhaps twenty five hundred years. So some still kind of 476 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 1: interpret it and say, well, this site could have been 477 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:06,320 Speaker 1: the inspiration for the monster itself, And I guess you 478 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:09,000 Speaker 1: can kind of open that up and you can look 479 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,560 Speaker 1: at the ideas of the monster being a metaphor for them, 480 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:14,879 Speaker 1: for this mountain, or just kind of like the oh, 481 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 1: here's this weird landscape with fire, and you end up 482 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:20,640 Speaker 1: with this idea of, well, a monster lives here. Surely 483 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 1: this is the habitat for some sort of monstrous fire 484 00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:28,640 Speaker 1: breathing creature. So the seeps in question here are largely 485 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:33,680 Speaker 1: on barren ground and they follow various fissures and perhaps faults, 486 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:37,560 Speaker 1: according to a twenty fifteen paper I was looking at 487 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:43,960 Speaker 1: from Meyer Dombard at All, published in Frontiers in Microbiology. 488 00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 1: These researchers also reported a fluid seap that they discovered 489 00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:52,439 Speaker 1: in this area, and numerous papers mentioned as well that 490 00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:55,720 Speaker 1: sailors used the fires of the mountain as a kind 491 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:59,960 Speaker 1: of natural landmark at night in ancient times. Today, however, 492 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: hikers visit the flames and they do things apparently like 493 00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:06,840 Speaker 1: brew tee, cook marshmallows over them, or you know, just 494 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,200 Speaker 1: just look at them as well. Because this is all 495 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:13,760 Speaker 1: part of the Olympus National Park. So if you know, 496 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:15,879 Speaker 1: if you're in Turkey, this is a site you can 497 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:20,119 Speaker 1: go and see. Now, the seeps here are reportedly stronger, 498 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,240 Speaker 1: as are the flames during winter, and apparently this is 499 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:28,320 Speaker 1: link to changes in atmospheric pressure and ground water recharge. 500 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 1: And this kind of takes us back to where we're 501 00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:33,919 Speaker 1: just talking about. You know, when you disrupt the underground 502 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 1: environment through extensive coal mining, you know, these are the 503 00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:42,880 Speaker 1: sort of things like groundwater recharge or the situations you're 504 00:28:42,920 --> 00:28:47,560 Speaker 1: potentially interfering in the vent gases that come up. I 505 00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 1: was looking at a profile of these and it is 506 00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:54,080 Speaker 1: mostly methane and there's some other ingredients in there as well. Now, 507 00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: as to whether there are actual snakes there, I mean, 508 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 1: one presumes, I know there are snakes in Turk. I 509 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,000 Speaker 1: guess it's if we can presume that there either are 510 00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:06,720 Speaker 1: goats or could have been goats there as well, goats 511 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:10,480 Speaker 1: like a rocky area with some vegetation to muncheon. And 512 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:14,120 Speaker 1: as far as lions go, you won't find any lions 513 00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:17,360 Speaker 1: here today, but there were once lions found throughout what 514 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,480 Speaker 1: is now Turkey. So I mean, I guess all of 515 00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:22,880 Speaker 1: that is plausible as well to at least a certain extent. 516 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 2: Oh yeah. If you compare maps of the historic distribution 517 00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:30,600 Speaker 2: of lions to the present distribution throughout Africa and Eurasia, 518 00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 2: it's well, on one hand, it's kind of sad to 519 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:37,960 Speaker 2: see how much their range has been constricted, but it's 520 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:42,400 Speaker 2: also eye opening to like, it's eye opening about how 521 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:46,480 Speaker 2: so many ancient myths and stories all throughout the Middle 522 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 2: East and the Greek myths and stuff, it seems that 523 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:52,560 Speaker 2: there are lions everywhere. And you're like, what, because you 524 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 2: don't really think that there are lions wandering around and 525 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 2: say Greece or Turkey today, but you know, thousands of 526 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 2: years ago, they're absolutely. 527 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,360 Speaker 1: It brings us back to the topic we discussed in 528 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:08,160 Speaker 1: the past about the first known human animal hybrid represented 529 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,680 Speaker 1: in art, that of the lion man. Yeah. Yeah, Now 530 00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 1: this side of this side is also interesting because there 531 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:16,600 Speaker 1: is a link to the Greek forge god he Festus 532 00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:20,240 Speaker 1: here as well. Hepestus, of course, was the blacksmith's god 533 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 1: who was also deformed after his father Zeus cast him 534 00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:26,360 Speaker 1: off Mount Olympus for taking his mother Hera's side in 535 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,680 Speaker 1: an argument, Or at least that's one version of the story. 536 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,600 Speaker 1: The Remains of a temple to Hefestus I can be 537 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:35,400 Speaker 1: found at this site just below the fires, which again 538 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:39,200 Speaker 1: makes sense given that the sites of natural flames like 539 00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:42,520 Speaker 1: this seem to be inevitably tied to human industry. Like 540 00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:45,080 Speaker 1: we've discussed in these various other examples, people see them 541 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,720 Speaker 1: and they think of like cook fires and the depths 542 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:52,040 Speaker 1: maintained by the little people, or you know, we think 543 00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 1: of industrial processes, you know, chemical fires and so forth, 544 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 1: But then sometimes we all tie them to fire breathing monsters. 545 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 1: And I wanted to mention one more thing that Borjes 546 00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 1: brings up about the chimera. He discusses how he thinks 547 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 1: that the chimera was ultimately quote too heterogeneous. In other words, 548 00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:23,160 Speaker 1: these parts were all too dissimilar, and it all resists 549 00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:26,800 Speaker 1: quote merging into a single animal. So I guess in 550 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:28,760 Speaker 1: that you could say that he's sort of saying that 551 00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: it's too counterintuitive. To a certain extent, he contends that 552 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:35,040 Speaker 1: people got a bit tired of the idea of the chimera, 553 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 1: and we see that reflected in the use of chimeracle 554 00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 1: and the use of chimera as referring to something that 555 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 1: is just too outrageous to be true. Too outrageous to 556 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:49,800 Speaker 1: actually exist in the real world, something that just doesn't 557 00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,160 Speaker 1: gel together in a form that you can believe in. 558 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's interesting. I'm always curious about why our intuitions 559 00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,959 Speaker 2: about imaginary beings work the way they do. I'm sure 560 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,760 Speaker 2: I've asked questions like this on the show a bunch 561 00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:06,480 Speaker 2: of times, But like, why does one unreal monster seem 562 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:11,760 Speaker 2: plausible in quotes and another one doesn't? Like the chymerira is, Yeah, 563 00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:13,960 Speaker 2: it's got a goat head in the middle of its back, 564 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,959 Speaker 2: or at least in some depictions, and people are just like, eh, no, no, yeah, 565 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,640 Speaker 2: that doesn't work. The hydra, which has many heads coming 566 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:23,760 Speaker 2: out of the Yeah, that that works. 567 00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:27,000 Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean even the vegetable lamb of Tartary, as 568 00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:29,160 Speaker 1: fantastic as that is and is you know, with the 569 00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:33,880 Speaker 1: gulf existing between plant and mammal like, that feels more 570 00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:36,720 Speaker 1: believable and I think clearly was more believable for a 571 00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:40,800 Speaker 1: very long period of time compared to the chimera. 572 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:45,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, so what are the underlying psychological factors, Like what 573 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 2: subconscious criteria do we use to judge an unreal being 574 00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:53,959 Speaker 2: that makes sense to us versus an unreal being that 575 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:57,600 Speaker 2: doesn't the chimera goat head. That's just that doesn't make sense. 576 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:01,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe part of it comes down into like a basic, 577 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:05,600 Speaker 1: you know, primal estimation of another animal, like what is 578 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:07,600 Speaker 1: the head on this thing going to bite me? What 579 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:10,480 Speaker 1: is the head on this animal seem to want to do? 580 00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:13,920 Speaker 1: And if you look at that goat head sticking out 581 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 1: of the middle of the camera's back, what am I 582 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:17,239 Speaker 1: supposed to make of that? 583 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:17,920 Speaker 2: Yeah? 584 00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:18,800 Speaker 1: What's it even doing? 585 00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:22,760 Speaker 2: Now? Cyclops, on the other hand, one big eye in 586 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,280 Speaker 2: the forehead. I picture that all day long. That works. 587 00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:28,880 Speaker 1: Yeah. One of the interesting things about these I guess 588 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:30,440 Speaker 1: you could call them, you could think of them as 589 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 1: minimally counterintuitive monsters and hybrids, is that the best of 590 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:43,160 Speaker 1: them we continue to look at and reconsider and also 591 00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:48,280 Speaker 1: apply like theoretical biological models like I've read. I know, 592 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:51,920 Speaker 1: I read a wonderful paper once on the biology of 593 00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 1: the centaur where the author was discussing how the centaur's 594 00:33:55,640 --> 00:34:00,480 Speaker 1: body would work, and you know, really focusing on onlatory 595 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 1: system and and the fact that it would need two hearts, 596 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:05,880 Speaker 1: one in the human part and one in the horse part. 597 00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:09,080 Speaker 1: You know, I love I love examinations like that. So, 598 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:11,520 Speaker 1: but it's an example of how the the centaur, as 599 00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:15,560 Speaker 1: fantastic as it is, is not so far removed from 600 00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:20,239 Speaker 1: reality that we can't apply this line of thinking to it. Whereas, yeah, 601 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever seen anybody go out on 602 00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:24,960 Speaker 1: a limb and write a you know, a paper like 603 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: This is how the biology of the chimera would work. 604 00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:29,319 Speaker 1: This is how it would breathe fire. This is the 605 00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,279 Speaker 1: function of the the live goat head growing from its back, 606 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:34,760 Speaker 1: and this is why its tail is a live snake. 607 00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:40,040 Speaker 1: This is the diet it consumes. Yeah, this, it's just 608 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:43,680 Speaker 1: it's just ridiculous. Now, coming back just a little bit too, uh, 609 00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:46,160 Speaker 1: you know to what we've been talking about here, eternal 610 00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:48,560 Speaker 1: flames and all I do want to point out that 611 00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:51,560 Speaker 1: this is the examples we've brought up are are certainly 612 00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:55,360 Speaker 1: not the only examples of natural gas seeps and so forth, 613 00:34:55,400 --> 00:35:00,480 Speaker 1: where eternal flames have evoked mythic ideas, religious devote and 614 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:05,920 Speaker 1: so forth. I was reading Seeps in the Ancient World, Myths, 615 00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:11,920 Speaker 1: Religions and Social Development by Giuseppe Etope of the National 616 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:16,600 Speaker 1: Institute of Geophysics and Volcanology in Italy, and he has 617 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:19,800 Speaker 1: a book titled natural Gas Seepach, but one of the 618 00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:23,360 Speaker 1: chapters is devoted to just looking at some of these examples. 619 00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:27,600 Speaker 1: So he mentions the chimera there. He mentions the fires 620 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: of Baku that we previously discussed, as well as a 621 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:34,760 Speaker 1: couple of other examples. There's the Baba GurGur seep in Iraq, 622 00:35:35,640 --> 00:35:39,239 Speaker 1: he writes, was probably the burning fiery furnace into which 623 00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,760 Speaker 1: King and Nebucanezer cast of the Jews. 624 00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:47,359 Speaker 2: I've seen this claim before, So Baba gurger is it's 625 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:52,520 Speaker 2: like an oil field near Kirkook, I believe, And there 626 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:55,480 Speaker 2: is at least one place there where, yeah, there's a 627 00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 2: there is a natural gas seep where the volatiles that 628 00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:02,840 Speaker 2: are out of it have been set a flame and 629 00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:05,880 Speaker 2: they're burning. And yeah, I don't know what the actual 630 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:08,720 Speaker 2: evidence is that this is the basis of the Bible story. 631 00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:11,520 Speaker 2: One of these many cases where somebody like connects a 632 00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:16,799 Speaker 2: story from ancient history or mythology or legend to an 633 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:20,879 Speaker 2: observable feature today. And in some cases you can do that, 634 00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,000 Speaker 2: like there's a pretty clear link, and in other cases 635 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:27,080 Speaker 2: I'm not quite sure how strong the evidence for that 636 00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:30,719 Speaker 2: direct connection is. But so, yeah, there is the story 637 00:36:30,719 --> 00:36:34,200 Speaker 2: of King Nebuchadnezzar throwing what is it, Shadragnieshak and a 638 00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:37,960 Speaker 2: bed nego. Oh yeah, yeah, into a burning furnace, and 639 00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:41,600 Speaker 2: I have read some modern authors saying, ah, maybe the 640 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:45,720 Speaker 2: furnace was this geological feature we see today. Bobby GurGur, 641 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:49,800 Speaker 2: by the way, I think, means something like father flame 642 00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:50,960 Speaker 2: or Daddy flame. 643 00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:55,399 Speaker 1: Another example that he brings up is the sacred Mangarma's 644 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,640 Speaker 1: flame in Indonesia, which has been active at least since 645 00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:02,040 Speaker 1: the fifteenth century, he writes, and is still used in 646 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:06,000 Speaker 1: annual Buddhist ceremonies. And then there's the Oracle of Delphi 647 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,239 Speaker 1: in Greece, which we've discussed at least a little bit 648 00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:13,839 Speaker 1: on the show. In the past, there's talk of there 649 00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 1: having been an internal flame at the Temple of Apollo 650 00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:20,359 Speaker 1: there at least at one point. And then there's this 651 00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:23,640 Speaker 1: idea that I believe researchers have kind of gone back 652 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:26,520 Speaker 1: and forth on this idea that vapors from the earth 653 00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:31,239 Speaker 1: contributed to the visions granted to the priestess of the 654 00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:35,279 Speaker 1: sacred site. The idea I think kind of fell out 655 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,880 Speaker 1: of favor for a while, but more recent geological research 656 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:39,560 Speaker 1: I was looking at it from two thousand and four 657 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:42,919 Speaker 1: two thousand and five. They argue that, Okay, the site 658 00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:46,919 Speaker 1: here lies over a fault where gas leaks could theoretically 659 00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:51,719 Speaker 1: cause oxygen and reduction in an individual that would then 660 00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:56,000 Speaker 1: result in a mild hypnotic state complete with hallucinations. I mean, 661 00:37:56,040 --> 00:38:00,640 Speaker 1: even coming back to this ap article about Centralia, you 662 00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:02,959 Speaker 1: have this quote about the you know, the woman talking 663 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:05,520 Speaker 1: about feeling like she's a zombie walking around due to 664 00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:09,000 Speaker 1: the fumes, which is an altered state. And in this 665 00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:11,440 Speaker 1: and in this case, I mean she she knows that 666 00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:14,840 Speaker 1: it's not the divine trying to speak through her, et cetera. 667 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:18,359 Speaker 1: But you can you can well imagine a situation where 668 00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:23,600 Speaker 1: if you're combining holy expectations, religious expectations, and ritual with 669 00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:26,920 Speaker 1: this sort of environment, you could easily get to this point. 670 00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:30,680 Speaker 2: If only we could get a medical readout on the 671 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:35,799 Speaker 2: the oracles of Delphi, that that might be really illuminating. Yeah, 672 00:38:36,120 --> 00:38:37,440 Speaker 2: kind of information exists. 673 00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:41,400 Speaker 1: I wouldn't mind going back and looking at the oracle 674 00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,440 Speaker 1: again in the future. It's there's there's a lot of 675 00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:48,000 Speaker 1: interesting writing about it. It is a has a wonderful history. 676 00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:50,239 Speaker 1: All Right, we're going to go and close it out there. 677 00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:53,440 Speaker 1: This this was a fun journey. We got to talk 678 00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:56,520 Speaker 1: about a number of fascinating locations around the Earth, some 679 00:38:56,600 --> 00:39:01,399 Speaker 1: wonderful history, mythology, and religion. If there's a particular site 680 00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:03,400 Speaker 1: we didn't discuss that you would like to bring to 681 00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:05,600 Speaker 1: our attention, certainly write in and let us know. And 682 00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 1: especially if you have visited any of these locations and 683 00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:14,280 Speaker 1: you have direct first hand experience, perhaps you've actually glimpsed 684 00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:18,360 Speaker 1: the flames emerging from the earth, definitely write in and 685 00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:21,040 Speaker 1: tell us about it, share your photos, etc. We would 686 00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:25,440 Speaker 1: love to hear from you. In the meantime. Core episodes 687 00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:28,240 Speaker 1: of Stuff to Blow Your Mind publish every Tuesday and Thursday, 688 00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:31,400 Speaker 1: and the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast feed, short form, 689 00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:35,440 Speaker 1: Monster fact or Artifact episodes on Wednesdays, listener Mail on Mondays, 690 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:38,040 Speaker 1: and on Friday. We set aside most serious concerns and 691 00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:41,120 Speaker 1: just discuss a weird film with Weird House Cinema. 692 00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,640 Speaker 2: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer Seth 693 00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:47,160 Speaker 2: Nicholas Johnson. If you would like to get in touch 694 00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:49,560 Speaker 2: with us with feedback on this episode or any other, 695 00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:51,719 Speaker 2: to suggest a topic for the future, or just to 696 00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:54,880 Speaker 2: say Hello. You can email us at contact Stuff to 697 00:39:54,920 --> 00:40:03,800 Speaker 2: Blow Your Mind dot com. 698 00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:06,840 Speaker 3: Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For 699 00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:10,759 Speaker 3: more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 700 00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:26,200 Speaker 3: or wherever you're listening to your favorite shows.