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Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey Daron, Welcome back to the Book of Joe podcast

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Speaker 1: with me, Tom Barducci and Joe Madden. Joe, it's hard

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Speaker 1: to believe, but this weekend we are coming up on

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Speaker 1: the quarter pole of the twenty twenty five Major League

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Speaker 1: Baseball season. So I want your perspective. Can I still

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Speaker 1: say it's early or is that past its freshness date?

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Speaker 2: At this point.

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Speaker 3: There's trends that are definitely being created.

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Speaker 4: When you're describing to me, always thought about it as

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Speaker 4: slow time, and then it turns into fast time. Spring

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Speaker 4: training a slow time beginning of the season's slow time.

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Speaker 4: Then all of a sudden, this hamster wheel starts spinning

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Speaker 4: and it becomes fast time, and all of a sudden,

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Speaker 4: before you know it, it's the All Star break. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: there's trends that are setting up, and you're looking at

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Speaker 4: teams like an alas the Al East is kind of

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Speaker 4: underwater compared to the Central as an example, and of

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Speaker 4: course even on the western side of things, the athletics

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Speaker 4: what they're doing makes that side even a little bit

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Speaker 4: more pertinent.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, it's the.

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Speaker 4: Orioles having struggles last night, the watch the video of

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Speaker 4: the Angels and the Blue Jays how the Angels came

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Speaker 4: back against Hoffmann in the eighth inning as an example,

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Speaker 4: blue Jay's not gaining any traction once again. So yeah,

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Speaker 4: it's it's hard to think that if you aren't showing

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Speaker 4: signs of being like exceptional in a sense this year,

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Speaker 4: it's hard to think that all of a sudden, it's

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Speaker 4: just gonna happen coming out of camp. The fast starters

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Speaker 4: really always benefit on an annual basis, and there's those

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Speaker 4: anomaly moments, Astros coming back, Nationals coming back years ago,

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Speaker 4: the Rockies coming back. But it's hard to do that.

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Speaker 4: It's like an NBA game. Although your Knicks, the Knicks

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Speaker 4: did it the other night. They came back hard and

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Speaker 4: they held on and won it. But it's hard to

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Speaker 4: come back. It just is you expend a lot of

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Speaker 4: energy in the process and it's difficult.

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Speaker 3: So I think there are that are sitting up right.

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Speaker 1: Now, absolutely, and I want to dive into individual trends here, Joe,

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Speaker 1: because I think the biggest story of this season so

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Speaker 1: far as we reach the quarterpole is Aaron Judge, and

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Speaker 1: we know he's been great, There's no question about it.

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Speaker 1: But he's gone next level this year. And they also

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Speaker 1: want to talk about vis A VI Juan Soto, because

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Speaker 1: it's clear to me at this point, Joe, that Mon

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Speaker 1: Soto misses Aaron Judge a lot more than Aaron Judge

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Speaker 1: missus Mon Soto. You look at that Yankee lineup and

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Speaker 1: it's top heavy. I mean, Bellinger really hasn't gotten on track.

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Speaker 1: Gold Schmidt is getting his hits, He's not necessarily doing

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Speaker 1: a lot of damage in terms of the long ball.

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Speaker 1: So behind Aaron Judge, you know, there's not a whole

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Speaker 1: lot of thump going on there in the Yankee lineup.

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Speaker 1: But right now, Joe, I mean, he's hitting four to twelve,

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Speaker 1: which is just ridiculous. His on base percentage is over

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Speaker 1: five hundred. It's five oh three, and he's slugging over

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Speaker 1: seven hundred, almost eight hundred.

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Speaker 2: Let me give you a couple of numbers here.

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Speaker 1: Joe's the guy who's managed for a long time and

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Speaker 1: done it well in the major leagues.

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Speaker 2: How this is even possible?

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Speaker 1: Aaron Judge is hitting five to twenty against fastballs, five

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Speaker 1: twenty against fastballs, and do you realize that Aaron Judge

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Speaker 1: is seeing an above average rate of fastballs. The percentage

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Speaker 1: of fastballs he sees is above major league average, and

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Speaker 1: he is seeing and this is unbelievable to me, forty

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Speaker 1: nine point eight percent of pitches in the strike zone,

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Speaker 1: which is more than he saw last year, more than

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Speaker 1: he's ever seen. I don't know why people haven't gotten

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Speaker 1: the message, Joe, you just cannot pitch this guy right now.

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Speaker 1: Tell me what you see and how you would approach

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Speaker 1: Aaron Judge.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean just talking about the fastballs. I'm sure

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Speaker 4: it has something to do analytically with these different groups

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Speaker 4: because they all bring from the same well. But it

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Speaker 4: sounds like, you know, let's challenge him with the fastball,

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Speaker 4: and let's locate this fastball in a certain area. But

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Speaker 4: the problem I ran into a lot the last couple

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Speaker 4: of years. It's just overall fastball command. Guys are throwing balls.

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Speaker 4: Baseball is hard, but it's hard for them to hit

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Speaker 4: the exact spot that they're looking for. I start right there,

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Speaker 4: so I'd have to look at it more deeply to

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Speaker 4: see how badly these different pitchers are missing their targets

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Speaker 4: while the ball's coming back to the middle or wherever,

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Speaker 4: wherever that hotspot is for him.

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Speaker 3: That's the number one. Number two. Yeah, I listened.

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Speaker 4: I watched a little bit of the game last night,

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Speaker 4: and how they rallied late was kind of exceptional against

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Speaker 4: the pitching that the Padres had, But it happens. They

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Speaker 4: just they strung together some singles and all of a sudden,

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Speaker 4: here we go. But why again, you said, listen, I'm

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Speaker 4: not denegrating anybody else on that team, but why would

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Speaker 4: you pitch to this guy?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 4: They were forced to in that situation. Later in the game,

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Speaker 4: I think they walked them. But yeah, there was an

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Speaker 4: intentional walk, I think as it turned out. But yeah,

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Speaker 4: it's listen, Analytics doesn't like the intentional walk. Analytics doesn't

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Speaker 4: necessarily like pitching around people. You. I've always got a

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Speaker 4: hard time from guys when I would do that. Even

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Speaker 4: it started like with Harper when we walked them so

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Speaker 4: many times back in once sixteen or sixteen, right, fifteen

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Speaker 4: or sixteen.

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Speaker 3: And I didn't get any grief for that.

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Speaker 4: But eventually it comes back to that these guys don't

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Speaker 4: like that putting another runnerund base, and that's when you

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Speaker 4: start treating everybody the same, just based on data. That

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Speaker 4: makes no sense to me. And that's what we were just

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Speaker 4: talking about.

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Speaker 3: The trends. We just opened up about trends. Trends exist.

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Speaker 4: Guys get hot, guys get cold, guys get better, they

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Speaker 4: get worse. You know, something's bothered them. They're not talking

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Speaker 4: about all these different things. So there's no reason to

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Speaker 4: attack this guy, right I'd make Rice do his job.

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Speaker 4: I would make Wells do his job. I would Grisham

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Speaker 4: right now. I mean, Grisham's always been a fine outfielder,

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Speaker 4: but what he's doing right now again is like crazy good.

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Speaker 4: So I'd have to believe they're gonna regress it the mean

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Speaker 4: at some point here, but for right now, playing the Yankees,

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Speaker 4: I am not pitching to this dude.

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Speaker 3: I'm just not.

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Speaker 4: I mean, And if you're gonna say let's attack him

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Speaker 4: with the fastball, that's for those that really know how

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Speaker 4: to command their fastball.

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Speaker 3: I think.

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Speaker 4: So long answer, there's a lot going on there, but

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Speaker 4: it just doesn't make any sense.

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Speaker 3: He's he's hitting like Bonds right now.

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Speaker 4: He's just hitting like Barry Bonds and the kind of

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Speaker 4: treatment we had to give him back in the day.

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Speaker 1: You're absolutely right, and I like your point about the fastballs.

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Speaker 1: I think that's a big part of it. You know,

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Speaker 1: Aaron Judge has always been one of the best high

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Speaker 1: fastball hitters in the game. And part of that to

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Speaker 1: me is, you know, he's six foot seven and pitchers

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Speaker 1: just don't elevate the ball enough to him. What they

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Speaker 1: think is top rail to him is actually in his

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Speaker 1: nitro zone. And the other thing I've noticed this year,

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Speaker 1: Joe is he did have if there was one hole,

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Speaker 1: and it's not really a hole, but one place where

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Speaker 1: you can keep him in the ballpark and turn him

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Speaker 1: into a singles hitter, is the pitch down in a way.

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Speaker 1: If you can dot that up down and a way,

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Speaker 1: he's not going to do damage. Well he is this year,

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Speaker 1: he's hitting everything. And you look at Aaron Judge in

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Speaker 1: his twenties. He was a two seventy six hitter in

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Speaker 1: his twenties, And I know batting average is not the

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Speaker 1: be all and end all, but just use that as

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Speaker 1: a rule of thumb. Two seventy six hitter in his twenties.

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Speaker 1: In his thirties, he's hitting three thirteen. He has become

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Speaker 1: a pure hitter, a great pure hitter, and not just

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Speaker 1: a slugger. We already always knew he was a great slugger.

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Speaker 1: He's hitting four to seventy three when he puts the

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Speaker 1: ball in play this year. Now, that's not sustainable. His

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Speaker 1: career average is three fifty. He hits the ball really hard,

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Speaker 1: so his ground balls, when he does hit them, they're

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Speaker 1: going to get through for hits. But he can't hit

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Speaker 1: four to seventy three on balls in play. But right now,

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Speaker 1: I I'm with you, Joe, you have to walk him.

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Speaker 1: I go back to a game where Alex Cora, the

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Speaker 1: Red Sox manager, had a base open with load Guerrero

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Speaker 1: up late in the game, decided to pitch to him.

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Speaker 1: Guerrero wins the game hanging breaking ball three to two. Now,

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Speaker 1: the pitcher, justin Slayton, did have moho and two. But

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Speaker 1: alex Cora I liked his answer. He said, you know,

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Speaker 1: if we're October, I'm walking him. But at this point,

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Speaker 1: I want to find out about my guys and I

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Speaker 1: want to trust him, and especially when the count got two,

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Speaker 1: then you're full green light and go after him. So

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Speaker 1: probably context matters too, but I think Aaron Judge right

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Speaker 1: now is just so good the best hit are in baseball.

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Speaker 1: I'm not tempted to try to get himself out. He's

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Speaker 1: not going to do that.

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Speaker 4: You just got to get to oh and three and

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Speaker 4: really get him out. You know, oh and two doesn't

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Speaker 4: work sometimes. I understand Alex's point there, and I honestly

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Speaker 4: have to have had those same thoughts.

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Speaker 3: The thing is that this is different.

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Speaker 4: I mean, the Red Sox are trying to beat these

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Speaker 4: guys or within that division, Guerrero Judge whomever. These games

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Speaker 4: build momentum, where they take momentum away. I've always believed

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Speaker 4: in that too, when you lose close games late, give

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Speaker 4: up something late. And if you've had these like different

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Speaker 4: internal struggles within yourself as a manager, should I do

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Speaker 4: this or not? And then you choose to do the

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Speaker 4: one thing and then it turns out not very good

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Speaker 4: and even though you might have been leaning in the

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Speaker 4: other direction. That's the old Zim thing. If it comes

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Speaker 4: to your mind, do it. And I really try to

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Speaker 4: train myself to do that as I moved it a

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Speaker 4: little bit further along, because when you start having those

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Speaker 4: internal debates, man, it's it's not good. It's not good.

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Speaker 4: I think something like that. You have to make up

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Speaker 4: your mind before the game. And if his mind had

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Speaker 4: been made up before the game, as an example that listen,

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Speaker 4: I'm gonna but still early. I'm and to make sure

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Speaker 4: they're gonna try to give these guys every opportunity. But

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Speaker 4: you know, it's the same thing we said with Bonds

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Speaker 4: in this World series. I know it's a different time

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Speaker 4: of the year, but these guys are you're when you're

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Speaker 4: that good, you're gonna you're probably gonna bet wrong if

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Speaker 4: you're gonna bet that your guy's going to get this

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Speaker 4: particular guy in that moment, especially when they're playing as

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Speaker 4: well as they are.

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Speaker 3: So I'm all about that.

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Speaker 4: I I I don't I prefer not pitching to him.

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Speaker 4: And you know, you've got a guy like with a

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Speaker 4: lead control and command, whoever that guy is in today's game,

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Speaker 4: uh you know the Gram or somebody like that. Maybe

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Speaker 4: you let him roll with that fastball, try to dot

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Speaker 4: him up down in a way. But listen, my my

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Speaker 4: experience has been that with when you get guys out

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Speaker 4: there and today's pitcher just tries to throw as spin

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Speaker 4: and throw as hard as he can and not locate necessarily.

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Speaker 3: That's where I have an issue.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd agree with you on that.

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Speaker 1: I think you trust your ace if you will or

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Speaker 1: maybe your closer, but anybody else, you just don't try

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Speaker 1: to attempt Aaron Judge. He's too good right now. As

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Speaker 1: far as onan soda, I want to get your take

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Speaker 1: on what you see, Joe. I'll give you just some

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Speaker 1: numbers here, because he still gets on base right even

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Speaker 1: when he's not going well. He controls the strike zone

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Speaker 1: very well. He just passed Mickey Mantle for the most

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Speaker 1: walks ever before the age of twenty seven, and he's

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Speaker 1: still getting on base for the New York Mets.

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Speaker 2: He's just not doing any damage.

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Speaker 1: What I see here is his bat speed is down

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Speaker 1: two miles per hour. His swing length is down. Those

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Speaker 1: are also those numbers, by the way, top five in

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Speaker 1: baseball in terms of the difference from last year to

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Speaker 1: this year. What I see is someone who is not

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Speaker 1: turning on the baseball and getting beat by velocity. And

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Speaker 1: that to me is shocking to see Wan Soto not

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Speaker 1: catch up velocity because I again high fastballs. He eats

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Speaker 1: him for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. But last year at

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Speaker 1: this time he had twenty two hits to the pole

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Speaker 1: side and slugged over eight hundred. This year pul side

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Speaker 1: just fourteen hits and he's slugging five eighty five. Here's

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Speaker 1: the big difference to me, Joe. Last year against pitches

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Speaker 1: ninety five and above, he hit three forty seven and

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Speaker 1: slugged over seven hundred, one of the best in baseball

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Speaker 1: on elite velocity. This year, he's hitting one fifty eight

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Speaker 1: and slugging five hundred. He's three for nineteen. He's got

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Speaker 1: three hits against ninety five plus this year.

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Speaker 2: I just see a guy.

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Speaker 1: I don't see the swing that's changed, but I see

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Speaker 1: a guy that timing wise, similar to Aaron Judge last year.

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Speaker 1: First month of the season is simply not there. I

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Speaker 1: don't know why it's happening. It could just be the

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Speaker 1: ebbs and flows of this game. The baseball gods are saying,

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Speaker 1: you're not quite right. But it's strange for me to

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Speaker 1: see one Soto not on time. Tell me what you

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Speaker 1: see of mon Sota this first quarter of the season.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I didn't realize those new eric those numbers,

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Speaker 4: but yeah, it's just obviously something is not right. Just

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Speaker 4: to to just interject, though, I'm watching Alonzo now, we're

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Speaker 4: talking about missing Judge.

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Speaker 3: What about Alonzo?

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Speaker 4: What this guy's doing right now is kind of almost

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Speaker 4: Judge like, so it's like he's already he's already He's

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Speaker 4: actually got Judge with him right now, it's just got

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Speaker 4: a different last name.

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Speaker 3: I mean.

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Speaker 4: The think big thing about Alonzo that really stands out

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Speaker 4: to me where I think Sodo has had an influence

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Speaker 4: possibly although they haven't played a lot together, is look

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Speaker 4: at a Lonzo's walks versus his strikeouts right now.

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Speaker 1: It's incredibly best played discipline of his career right right.

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Speaker 4: And that and I don't know where that has rubbed

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Speaker 4: off on him or not, or this is part of

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Speaker 4: his motivation from kind of being ostracized during the last

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Speaker 4: off season in regards to teams.

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Speaker 3: Wanting him or not.

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Speaker 4: So Soto's got that now. The thing about Soda and

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Speaker 4: I listen, I'm a Sodo guy, but you paid all

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Speaker 4: that money for a guy that's an on base percentage guy,

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Speaker 4: guy that does like to walk. So it's it's he's

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Speaker 4: gonna hit. He's gonna hit more than he's hit right now.

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Speaker 4: But I would keep an eye on the bat speed

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Speaker 4: thing that is an analytical component I like because it's

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Speaker 4: obviously he's not catching up the fastballs. Something's slowed down

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Speaker 4: a bit. In there, and there's no reason too. He's young,

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Speaker 4: he's not hurt. He's in a different ballpark. I don't

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Speaker 4: even know what the weather's been like. But even in

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Speaker 4: that ballpark there the way that sets up compared to

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Speaker 4: the way the Yankee Stadium sets up.

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Speaker 3: Who knows.

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Speaker 4: It's like you know, you know what it's like sitting

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Speaker 4: on a t box and if of a whole fits

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Speaker 4: your eye or not, and if it doesn't fit your

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Speaker 4: eyes becomes more problematic as the one that if you

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Speaker 4: look at the fairway and it fits your eye and

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Speaker 4: all of a sudden you take a better swing. So

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Speaker 4: give him time to really adjust to the background and

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Speaker 4: the quirkiness of that ballpark.

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Speaker 3: I do believe in that. I do believe that has issues.

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Speaker 4: That you know, people never talk about, and if you did,

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Speaker 4: you think somebody's crazy. So give him a little bit

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Speaker 4: more time. He's got judge hitting behind him right now.

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Speaker 4: So that's conversation I think needs to stop. I think

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Speaker 4: it's more internal with him. I can't even think that

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Speaker 4: the size of the contract. I don't think that has

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Speaker 4: anything to do with that. I really don't. I mean,

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Speaker 4: the guy just warphed into the city last year. Like

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Speaker 4: it was nothing. He did all what he did all

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Speaker 4: last year, like it was a big old yawn. He

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Speaker 4: just he's got this wrapped up. So I just say,

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Speaker 4: give him time, let him adjust, and I think adjust

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Speaker 4: to the environment as much as anything matters.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you on that, Joe.

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Speaker 1: I mean, we always try to look for ways to

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Speaker 1: get inside a guy's head and explain why he's hitting

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Speaker 1: or why he is hitting. And this is the guy,

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Speaker 1: as you mentioned, he got to New York last year

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Speaker 1: with the Yankees and just hit the ground running.

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Speaker 2: There was no break in period.

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Speaker 1: So you can't tell me that he's getting to New York,

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Speaker 1: you know, with the Mets, and now he's struggling.

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Speaker 2: That doesn't make sense. Was it interesting?

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Speaker 3: You know?

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Speaker 1: The other day I was talking to Carlos Mendoza, the manager,

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Speaker 1: and I mentioned that Juan Soto has not done a

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Speaker 1: full blown, on full blown Juan Soto shuffle at all

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Speaker 1: this year, not once. So the body language just quite

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Speaker 1: isn't the same. He's not just to my eye, Joe,

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Speaker 1: he's just not feeling like the superman hitter that he is.

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Speaker 1: And Mendoza said, I've noticed that, and you know, I

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Speaker 1: believe the same thing that we're not seeing the body language,

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Speaker 1: the confidence that you always saw, you know, looking the

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Speaker 1: picture in the eye and doing that shuffle. And he's

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Speaker 1: done a semi shuffle, but not the full on Juan

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Speaker 1: Soto shuffle.

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Speaker 2: So that kind of body language.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you looked at that as a manager, Joe,

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Speaker 1: but it's caught my eye.

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Speaker 2: That's not quite the same.

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Speaker 4: The thing that I really was curious, found curious was

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Speaker 4: when that article came out about him actually admitting it's

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Speaker 4: different without Judge hitting behind him, and that created a

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Speaker 4: way bigger, a much bigger stir than it deserved. It's

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Speaker 4: like everything else media wise today, that was like way blown,

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Speaker 4: way out of proportion. But I don't know to what

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Speaker 4: extent it might have gotten in his head a little bit.

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Speaker 4: Confidence is such a tenuous situation, and we live and

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Speaker 4: die by everybody does. Our whole world's always about confidence.

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Speaker 4: The economy is about confidence, confidence in the dollar or not,

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Speaker 4: regarding whether one investor or not, So it's it's it's

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Speaker 4: all about confidence. And I think that article demonstrated how

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Speaker 4: he was feeling. But then I think it might have

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Speaker 4: the reaction to that might have hurt him a little bit.

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Speaker 4: That's that's I thought that was kind of dumb actually,

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Speaker 4: not that he said it, but how the reaction was

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Speaker 4: and then how then maybe he processed it in the

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Speaker 4: wrong way, or who knows, he's going.

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Speaker 3: To come back. He's gonna be really good.

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Speaker 4: He's you know, the kind of hit or he is

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Speaker 4: is going to show up once again.

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Speaker 3: We don't know why.

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Speaker 4: There's a little bit less than maybe something's bothering that

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Speaker 4: he's not even talking about. And I wouldn't doubt that

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Speaker 4: either there might be something going on with a hand

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Speaker 4: or wrist or rib, something might be bothering him that

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Speaker 4: he's not fessing up to. If in factor's a diminished

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Speaker 4: bat speed, So just give him time, it's going to happen.

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Speaker 4: But all these little micro things I think have conspired

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Speaker 4: to make it a difficult start for him.

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Speaker 1: Well, next week, Joe the New York Mets go into

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Speaker 1: the Bronx Swan Sota returns to Yankee Stadium. Mets Yankee,

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Speaker 1: He's at Yankee Stadium. What do you think that scene

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Speaker 1: is going to be?

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Speaker 4: Like left the bed on? I think he's gonna he's

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Speaker 4: gonna turn it on right there. I think he's gonna

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Speaker 4: have a good series. He will rise to the occasion.

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Speaker 3: I believe.

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Speaker 4: I think the confines there is gonna be Like I said,

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Speaker 4: it's very It's a comfortable place for him to play baseball.

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Speaker 4: We'll see what happens between now and then, but by

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Speaker 4: the time he gets back there, I think he's gonna

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Speaker 4: be ready to go.

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Speaker 5: Well.

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Speaker 1: Aaron Judge is tied for the major league home run

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Speaker 1: lead with twelve and when we get back after this

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Speaker 1: short break, we're going to talk about somebody he is

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Speaker 1: tied with, and I believe it's one of Joe Madden's

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Speaker 1: favorite hitters. Welcome back to the Book of Joe Podcasts.

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Speaker 1: Joe Menon, I want to take you back, and why

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Speaker 1: not to your twenty sixteen Chicago Cubs, and that team

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Speaker 1: was the youngest team to win the World Series, especially

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Speaker 1: in a Game seven. And I look back on just

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Speaker 1: the plethora of everyday players, position players you had from

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Speaker 1: ages twenty two to twenty six right, just absolutely loaded

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Speaker 1: with young up and coming or even early established talent.

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Speaker 1: And when I look at those guys, Joe, the one

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Speaker 1: who now is at the top of his game is

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Speaker 1: Kyle Schwarber. Listen, we got Javey Baya is struggling, maybe

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Speaker 1: a bouncing back a little bit, becoming a jack of

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Speaker 1: all trades with Detroit. Chris Bryant his injury histories. We

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Speaker 1: know about Hore Silaira was on that team. He's hitting

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Speaker 1: two twenty one with the Angels. Anthony Rizzo doesn't have

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Speaker 1: a job. Addison Russell's at a baseball, Albert Almore at

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Speaker 1: a baseball. Wilson Contreras has been just an average hitter

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Speaker 1: for the Cardinals. And here's Kyle Schwarber better than he's

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Speaker 1: ever been, slashing two fifty two, four oh eight on

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Speaker 1: base percentage, five eighty five slug and his home run

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Speaker 1: the other night was number two ninety six of his career.

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Speaker 1: Kyle Schwarber, like Judge, is getting better through his thirties,

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Speaker 1: especially against left handed hitting.

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Speaker 2: They used to own him.

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Speaker 1: Last year he hit three hundred against lefties. This year

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Speaker 1: he's hitting three to four. So, Joe, if you go

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Speaker 1: back and you look at your twenty sixteen team in

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Speaker 1: that version of Kyle Schwarber, of course, he had the

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Speaker 1: knee injury and didn't come back until the postseason the

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Speaker 1: World Series, but you knew what he was like as

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Speaker 1: a player, as a young hitter. Tell me what you

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Speaker 1: see now as Kyle Schwarber is just absolutely crushing it.

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Speaker 3: Watch him in the box.

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Speaker 4: I mean he's always kind of like got the same

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Speaker 4: routine going on. He walks into the box, he slides

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Speaker 4: his one foot front and then back, and then he

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Speaker 4: settles in whatever. But I'm telling you what, he cannot

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Speaker 4: be more calm getting in the box right now. He

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Speaker 4: walks in there like he's gonna sit down in his

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Speaker 4: favorite chair to get ready to hit.

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Speaker 3: His confidence cannot be cannot be higher.

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Speaker 4: And his comfort level with his mechanics and how he's

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Speaker 4: seeing things right now cannot be higher.

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Speaker 3: That's what I'm seeing. So it's like of standing in.

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Speaker 4: That box and he and he really feels extremely comfortable.

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Speaker 4: And it's highlighted by the fact the navigated a lefty.

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Speaker 4: When we first had him there, you wanted to hit

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Speaker 4: him lead off when we did, I thought that was

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00:20:17,238 --> 00:20:20,318
Speaker 4: a very interesting concept. The problem with that was at

435
00:20:20,318 --> 00:20:23,278
Speaker 4: that time versus the left hand, it was very difficult

436
00:20:23,318 --> 00:20:26,598
Speaker 4: for him to really be successful. It's just just learning,

437
00:20:26,838 --> 00:20:29,038
Speaker 4: just learning how to do it, that's all. But then again,

438
00:20:29,078 --> 00:20:31,078
Speaker 4: if you're trying to win and you got other options,

439
00:20:31,118 --> 00:20:33,718
Speaker 4: it's it's difficult to just put the guy out there

440
00:20:33,718 --> 00:20:36,278
Speaker 4: against the better lefties at that time, so you're you're

441
00:20:36,318 --> 00:20:38,798
Speaker 4: moving it back and forth. And when you do that,

442
00:20:38,838 --> 00:20:40,958
Speaker 4: even especially to a young player, even though you know

443
00:20:40,958 --> 00:20:42,878
Speaker 4: it's the right thing to do, you can just you know,

444
00:20:42,998 --> 00:20:46,638
Speaker 4: nick their confidence just a little bit because they believe

445
00:20:46,638 --> 00:20:48,918
Speaker 4: they're better than that. Why am I not good enough?

446
00:20:49,478 --> 00:20:51,078
Speaker 4: How am I going to get to this next level?

447
00:20:51,118 --> 00:20:54,838
Speaker 4: There's a little pressure involved, so there's Wow. The underlying

448
00:20:54,918 --> 00:20:58,718
Speaker 4: dynamics involved in situations like that are so tumultuous, so

449
00:20:58,878 --> 00:21:01,518
Speaker 4: you just you can't measure all that. So my point,

450
00:21:01,838 --> 00:21:04,038
Speaker 4: but what I'm seeing is I'm seeing him walking in

451
00:21:04,078 --> 00:21:07,798
Speaker 4: the box. Wow loose. I mean you talk about tension free.

452
00:21:07,878 --> 00:21:11,518
Speaker 4: My god, He's he's got the most tension free approaching

453
00:21:11,798 --> 00:21:14,918
Speaker 4: at the plate right now. He's never in trouble. You

454
00:21:14,918 --> 00:21:16,718
Speaker 4: can strike him out five times and all he's going

455
00:21:16,758 --> 00:21:17,998
Speaker 4: to come back and he's now he's going to rip

456
00:21:18,038 --> 00:21:20,318
Speaker 4: you on the sixth time. So that's what I'm saying.

457
00:21:20,358 --> 00:21:24,238
Speaker 4: Has been a difference. And whatever they're doing there regarding

458
00:21:24,918 --> 00:21:28,398
Speaker 4: maybe it's just reps, but giving the information k Long

459
00:21:28,478 --> 00:21:30,958
Speaker 4: might be doing. Whatever it is, there's a better approach

460
00:21:31,038 --> 00:21:34,598
Speaker 4: versus the lefty. And they have a lot of lefties

461
00:21:34,638 --> 00:21:36,518
Speaker 4: that are in that lineup a lot, so maybe there's

462
00:21:36,558 --> 00:21:40,798
Speaker 4: a compilation of talking everybody whatever, but there's a different

463
00:21:40,998 --> 00:21:43,518
Speaker 4: mental approach. But more than anything, man, if you want

464
00:21:43,558 --> 00:21:46,318
Speaker 4: to look at somebody that has a tension free swing

465
00:21:46,358 --> 00:21:49,158
Speaker 4: that walks into the box like he owns it, it's him. Yeah.

466
00:21:49,238 --> 00:21:51,478
Speaker 1: I think the work with Kevin Long you mentioned it

467
00:21:51,558 --> 00:21:54,598
Speaker 1: goes back to Washington, and it really started then and

468
00:21:55,158 --> 00:21:57,518
Speaker 1: ever since Kyle and Kevin Long have been together here

469
00:21:57,518 --> 00:22:01,678
Speaker 1: in Philadelphia, they've got a routine going where, for instance,

470
00:22:01,718 --> 00:22:03,838
Speaker 1: when the coach does straight on soft toss, he may

471
00:22:04,078 --> 00:22:05,998
Speaker 1: sure he does it from an angle, from a left

472
00:22:05,998 --> 00:22:06,598
Speaker 1: handed angle.

473
00:22:06,758 --> 00:22:07,438
Speaker 2: Kevin's lefty.

474
00:22:07,478 --> 00:22:10,518
Speaker 1: Anyway, when he sets up the pitching machine, it's always

475
00:22:10,598 --> 00:22:12,358
Speaker 1: at the left handers release point.

476
00:22:12,558 --> 00:22:15,598
Speaker 2: I think that's just a great idea where Kyle Schwarber.

477
00:22:15,158 --> 00:22:17,278
Speaker 1: Because you know, coming up through the system and growing

478
00:22:17,358 --> 00:22:19,758
Speaker 1: up in minor leagues, you're gonna see more right handers

479
00:22:19,758 --> 00:22:21,878
Speaker 1: than left handers. You're gonna see about seventy five percent

480
00:22:21,958 --> 00:22:24,998
Speaker 1: right handers. So what they've done is they've literally trained

481
00:22:24,998 --> 00:22:26,878
Speaker 1: his eyes to see that ball coming from the left

482
00:22:26,878 --> 00:22:29,318
Speaker 1: handed slot over and over and over again. He does

483
00:22:29,398 --> 00:22:33,118
Speaker 1: it every single day, takes it like vitamins. And as

484
00:22:33,158 --> 00:22:36,398
Speaker 1: you know, he's he's a guy who's dedicated to his craft.

485
00:22:36,518 --> 00:22:38,878
Speaker 1: And Kyle Schwarber wants to get better. You know, he

486
00:22:38,958 --> 00:22:41,198
Speaker 1: was embarrassed by his number of strikeouts a couple of

487
00:22:41,238 --> 00:22:43,718
Speaker 1: years ago, striking out more than two hundred times. He

488
00:22:43,798 --> 00:22:46,038
Speaker 1: made that a priority to try to get that down.

489
00:22:46,078 --> 00:22:48,518
Speaker 1: He's still going to strike out, we get that, but

490
00:22:48,558 --> 00:22:50,398
Speaker 1: he cares about that. He's not a guy who just

491
00:22:50,478 --> 00:22:52,158
Speaker 1: chalks it up to well, I'm going to take my

492
00:22:52,198 --> 00:22:54,198
Speaker 1: three hacks and if I strike out, I strike out.

493
00:22:54,678 --> 00:22:56,518
Speaker 2: He wants to be a great player.

494
00:22:56,598 --> 00:22:58,758
Speaker 1: And he's also as you know, Joe, he's a great

495
00:22:58,958 --> 00:23:01,238
Speaker 1: teammate and he's been a bunch of places, right. But

496
00:23:01,558 --> 00:23:03,678
Speaker 1: you talk to anybody who's played with Kyle Schwarber and

497
00:23:03,758 --> 00:23:06,358
Speaker 1: he's on their top five list of top five teammates.

498
00:23:06,718 --> 00:23:09,398
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was not raised by wolves. I mean, this

499
00:23:09,438 --> 00:23:13,118
Speaker 4: guy was raised properly and just is uh. The whole

500
00:23:13,118 --> 00:23:14,518
Speaker 4: time there with the Cobs, there was a lot of

501
00:23:14,518 --> 00:23:17,838
Speaker 4: real professional people around, whether the guys that were playing

502
00:23:17,878 --> 00:23:20,358
Speaker 4: at that time, the coaching staff and also the alumni

503
00:23:20,718 --> 00:23:21,998
Speaker 4: so he was a lot, he was around a lot of.

504
00:23:21,958 --> 00:23:23,758
Speaker 3: Greatness, and he's he's a great observer.

505
00:23:24,638 --> 00:23:27,158
Speaker 4: He's one of those guys he doesn't just shoot off

506
00:23:27,198 --> 00:23:29,718
Speaker 4: his mouth and when he does speak, it's it's the

507
00:23:29,758 --> 00:23:32,518
Speaker 4: words are measured. He's just not saying things. Comes from

508
00:23:32,518 --> 00:23:36,118
Speaker 4: a blue collar situation where he grew up. I've been

509
00:23:36,118 --> 00:23:38,838
Speaker 4: to all of his back in the day, the different

510
00:23:38,878 --> 00:23:41,998
Speaker 4: fundraisers we had throughout Chicago. We all had different foundations,

511
00:23:41,998 --> 00:23:45,438
Speaker 4: and Sharps was about first responders. That's what his family is,

512
00:23:45,878 --> 00:23:48,478
Speaker 4: and I would obviously we'd all attend the event, and

513
00:23:48,558 --> 00:23:52,878
Speaker 4: I was so impressed by the authenticity of this particular.

514
00:23:52,358 --> 00:23:54,798
Speaker 3: Group of people they got together.

515
00:23:55,758 --> 00:23:57,878
Speaker 4: You could see the fact that the influence from the

516
00:23:57,998 --> 00:24:01,718
Speaker 4: from the parents and through his wife and everybody else.

517
00:24:01,758 --> 00:24:04,638
Speaker 4: It was just it was just a real solid foundation

518
00:24:04,718 --> 00:24:06,798
Speaker 4: that he works from. It's just like he does as

519
00:24:06,798 --> 00:24:09,798
Speaker 4: a hitter. So he's not gonna be denied ever. Like

520
00:24:09,878 --> 00:24:13,318
Speaker 4: you said, the strikeout thing, I'm gonna fix it really

521
00:24:13,358 --> 00:24:17,798
Speaker 4: focused and today, actually this is going to be great

522
00:24:18,118 --> 00:24:19,798
Speaker 4: because our quote of the day is going to fit

523
00:24:19,878 --> 00:24:20,198
Speaker 4: into this.

524
00:24:20,278 --> 00:24:22,958
Speaker 3: I just thought of that. But just tell him he

525
00:24:22,958 --> 00:24:25,238
Speaker 3: can't do something, Brother and he'll show you that he can.

526
00:24:25,838 --> 00:24:26,358
Speaker 3: I love that.

527
00:24:26,838 --> 00:24:29,838
Speaker 1: By the way, the last five seasons, the only two

528
00:24:29,918 --> 00:24:33,158
Speaker 1: players who have more home runs than Kyle Schwarber Aaron

529
00:24:33,238 --> 00:24:38,438
Speaker 1: Judge and Shoe Otani. Schwarber is third, and he's coming

530
00:24:38,478 --> 00:24:42,798
Speaker 1: up on career number three hundred, just four away from that, Joe.

531
00:24:42,798 --> 00:24:45,158
Speaker 1: We also have to talk about one of the quiet

532
00:24:45,198 --> 00:24:47,718
Speaker 1: trends in the game. It should be getting more attention,

533
00:24:48,398 --> 00:24:50,638
Speaker 1: but it's the Miami Marlins, so they don't get a

534
00:24:50,638 --> 00:24:53,798
Speaker 1: lot of attention. What they are doing on the mound

535
00:24:54,038 --> 00:24:56,958
Speaker 1: is stunning to me. We talked before about the Boston

536
00:24:56,998 --> 00:25:00,158
Speaker 1: Red Sox and how they ran away from fastballs last season.

537
00:25:00,238 --> 00:25:01,638
Speaker 1: It caught up to him in the second half of

538
00:25:01,638 --> 00:25:05,558
Speaker 1: the season, and they're throwing more fastballs this year. Part

539
00:25:05,598 --> 00:25:08,038
Speaker 1: of that is they do have Garrett Crochet right and

540
00:25:08,078 --> 00:25:12,558
Speaker 1: Walker Buehler, who should be throwing their fastballs. The Marlins

541
00:25:12,598 --> 00:25:15,878
Speaker 1: this year and I'm not using cutters here, just two

542
00:25:15,878 --> 00:25:19,518
Speaker 1: seamers and four seamers. The Marlins are throwing thirty five

543
00:25:19,718 --> 00:25:24,398
Speaker 1: percent fastballs. They're actually spinning the ball more than they

544
00:25:24,438 --> 00:25:29,158
Speaker 1: are throwing fastballs. That's the lowest since Baseball has been

545
00:25:29,198 --> 00:25:30,278
Speaker 1: able to record these things.

546
00:25:30,278 --> 00:25:31,238
Speaker 2: Since twenty fifteen.

547
00:25:32,118 --> 00:25:35,718
Speaker 1: So I'll give you the three lowest fastball percentages, Joe,

548
00:25:36,358 --> 00:25:40,198
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty five Marlins, the twenty twenty four Red

549
00:25:40,238 --> 00:25:43,878
Speaker 1: Sox where just about thirty seven percent, and get this,

550
00:25:43,958 --> 00:25:48,038
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty five Chicago White Sox at forty one percent.

551
00:25:48,798 --> 00:25:51,238
Speaker 1: The Marlins are thirteen to twenty two. The last year

552
00:25:51,278 --> 00:25:53,158
Speaker 1: is Red Sox were eighty one and eighty one, and

553
00:25:53,158 --> 00:25:55,398
Speaker 1: the White Sox this year are ten and twenty six.

554
00:25:55,918 --> 00:25:59,318
Speaker 1: I mean, come on, and where the Marlins ranks in

555
00:25:59,438 --> 00:26:02,398
Speaker 1: terms of pitching staff Their last in the major leagues

556
00:26:02,638 --> 00:26:05,878
Speaker 1: and earn run average last and walks. They throw the

557
00:26:05,918 --> 00:26:08,318
Speaker 1: most pitches when they're behind on the count. And here

558
00:26:08,358 --> 00:26:12,598
Speaker 1: they are throwing thirty five percent fastballs. You look at

559
00:26:12,598 --> 00:26:17,478
Speaker 1: their starting rotation. Everybody other than Edward Cabrera is throwing

560
00:26:17,558 --> 00:26:20,478
Speaker 1: fewer fastballs than they've ever thrown in their life, including

561
00:26:20,518 --> 00:26:23,038
Speaker 1: Sandy al Cantre. I mean, you got a kid like

562
00:26:23,118 --> 00:26:27,158
Speaker 1: Max Meyer, He's thrown thirty five percent fastball. He's a guy,

563
00:26:27,278 --> 00:26:29,318
Speaker 1: the young player with a young arm. He's throwing it

564
00:26:29,478 --> 00:26:30,598
Speaker 1: as his foundation pitch.

565
00:26:30,758 --> 00:26:31,318
Speaker 2: The slider.

566
00:26:31,318 --> 00:26:34,718
Speaker 1: He's throwing that more than any other pitch. You know,

567
00:26:34,798 --> 00:26:37,078
Speaker 1: Connor Gillespie's throwing the change up more than he throws

568
00:26:37,118 --> 00:26:40,678
Speaker 1: any other pitch. It's unusual for me to see Joe.

569
00:26:40,798 --> 00:26:42,638
Speaker 1: One thing if I was starting to see results, but

570
00:26:42,678 --> 00:26:44,918
Speaker 1: I'm not seeing results. I'm seeing a team walking a

571
00:26:44,918 --> 00:26:47,358
Speaker 1: lot of guys and last in the major leagues in era.

572
00:26:49,118 --> 00:26:52,238
Speaker 1: It's just part of extrapolating a trend we're seeing, Joe,

573
00:26:52,318 --> 00:26:56,838
Speaker 1: where everybody's trying to shape pitches and mis bats, and

574
00:26:56,878 --> 00:26:59,398
Speaker 1: what you said earlier stands out to me. Just the

575
00:26:59,438 --> 00:27:02,918
Speaker 1: fastball command isn't there. Does that mean you're gonna have

576
00:27:02,958 --> 00:27:05,718
Speaker 1: command to your breaking It's just fascinating to me to

577
00:27:05,758 --> 00:27:07,758
Speaker 1: see the Marlins go this far in this direction with

578
00:27:07,838 --> 00:27:08,798
Speaker 1: such a young staff.

579
00:27:09,158 --> 00:27:11,438
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm sure on paper it looks really good to

580
00:27:11,518 --> 00:27:13,758
Speaker 4: throw those breaking balls, and I'm sure their their data

581
00:27:13,798 --> 00:27:17,158
Speaker 4: supports that attempt. But at the end of the day,

582
00:27:17,238 --> 00:27:20,718
Speaker 4: this is one of those things man that for me,

583
00:27:20,798 --> 00:27:22,998
Speaker 4: for us as coming up, and I still believe it

584
00:27:23,078 --> 00:27:25,318
Speaker 4: to be true. The number one thing I would want

585
00:27:25,358 --> 00:27:28,198
Speaker 4: all my minor league guys coming into the organization be

586
00:27:28,238 --> 00:27:30,918
Speaker 4: able to do is commander fastball number one, because everything

587
00:27:31,238 --> 00:27:33,278
Speaker 4: still works off of that when you're when you're able

588
00:27:33,318 --> 00:27:36,518
Speaker 4: to dot up a fastball, you know all the different

589
00:27:36,598 --> 00:27:40,878
Speaker 4: quadrants are, or just go to wherever you wherever you

590
00:27:40,998 --> 00:27:44,438
Speaker 4: dotted up the best normally when it comes to a fastball.

591
00:27:44,918 --> 00:27:47,798
Speaker 4: My experience growing up as a catcher, and then even

592
00:27:47,998 --> 00:27:51,118
Speaker 4: with different pictures with the Angel organization, primarily as they

593
00:27:51,158 --> 00:27:53,518
Speaker 4: catch them all the time, a lot of guys have

594
00:27:53,638 --> 00:27:57,798
Speaker 4: one spot they locate their fastball best too, and hopefully

595
00:27:57,918 --> 00:28:00,518
Speaker 4: a lot of times it's down in a way. Sometimes

596
00:28:00,518 --> 00:28:03,678
Speaker 4: it could be in elevated in sometimes it just maybe

597
00:28:03,718 --> 00:28:05,838
Speaker 4: have to top of the strike zone. We're like becoming

598
00:28:05,838 --> 00:28:08,438
Speaker 4: more of a trend, but you normally find a spot

599
00:28:08,478 --> 00:28:11,878
Speaker 4: that you really can and back again. You would have

600
00:28:12,238 --> 00:28:14,638
Speaker 4: bullpen sessions where you didn't move on to your next

601
00:28:14,638 --> 00:28:17,118
Speaker 4: pitch until you really found that slot where you could

602
00:28:17,118 --> 00:28:19,398
Speaker 4: command a fastball to that spot that you wanted to

603
00:28:19,878 --> 00:28:22,318
Speaker 4: and then everything works off of that. I don't understand

604
00:28:22,318 --> 00:28:25,318
Speaker 4: why you would think that everything works off a slider

605
00:28:25,478 --> 00:28:28,038
Speaker 4: or an off speed pitch and then the fastball is

606
00:28:28,038 --> 00:28:30,518
Speaker 4: held in your back pocket. Part of that also, and

607
00:28:30,678 --> 00:28:32,678
Speaker 4: you kind of alluded to it, is that's part of

608
00:28:32,678 --> 00:28:34,678
Speaker 4: why guys can't get into the third time to the

609
00:28:34,718 --> 00:28:37,838
Speaker 4: banding order or pitch sixth inning or beyond, because you're

610
00:28:37,878 --> 00:28:42,198
Speaker 4: showing all your stuff from Jump Street and you're not

611
00:28:42,238 --> 00:28:44,078
Speaker 4: taking the advantage of the ability. You're working on the

612
00:28:44,078 --> 00:28:47,158
Speaker 4: ability to get quick outs, quickouts in an any quickouts

613
00:28:47,198 --> 00:28:49,438
Speaker 4: early in the game. That then permits you to pitch

614
00:28:49,478 --> 00:28:52,318
Speaker 4: more deeply into the game and feel strong and be

615
00:28:52,358 --> 00:28:54,798
Speaker 4: able to do things in the latter part. I like,

616
00:28:55,238 --> 00:28:58,638
Speaker 4: for me, if I'm running it, I like fastball fastball command.

617
00:28:58,678 --> 00:28:59,038
Speaker 3: First.

618
00:28:59,518 --> 00:29:01,758
Speaker 4: Off of that, I like straight change up or change

619
00:29:01,798 --> 00:29:05,038
Speaker 4: up second. Those are the two foundation pitches I believe.

620
00:29:05,038 --> 00:29:07,798
Speaker 4: And then off of that, how does this sky's arm

621
00:29:07,958 --> 00:29:10,878
Speaker 4: work best? Some guys can't throw a natural curve. I

622
00:29:11,038 --> 00:29:13,918
Speaker 4: like the natural curveball. Third, and then after that, if

623
00:29:13,918 --> 00:29:16,838
Speaker 4: you can't really do that, then I do like slider

624
00:29:16,838 --> 00:29:18,318
Speaker 4: and the last pitch I would want to teach as

625
00:29:18,318 --> 00:29:21,278
Speaker 4: a cutter. And to me, that's like a poor man's

626
00:29:21,358 --> 00:29:23,958
Speaker 4: version of a breaking ball. If your hand, wrist, arms

627
00:29:23,998 --> 00:29:26,638
Speaker 4: just don't work well enough to throw those other pitches,

628
00:29:26,678 --> 00:29:28,118
Speaker 4: then we could go to the cutter and just try

629
00:29:28,158 --> 00:29:29,718
Speaker 4: to get the ball move a little bit at the end.

630
00:29:30,518 --> 00:29:33,038
Speaker 4: So that would be my order of preference in building

631
00:29:33,118 --> 00:29:33,838
Speaker 4: a young pitcher.

632
00:29:34,238 --> 00:29:36,718
Speaker 3: Coming to my organization. I would want him.

633
00:29:36,918 --> 00:29:38,678
Speaker 4: First of all, let's see where that fastball is going.

634
00:29:38,718 --> 00:29:41,358
Speaker 4: And I would give you throw a change up. Throw Mikey,

635
00:29:41,358 --> 00:29:42,158
Speaker 4: do you throw a change up?

636
00:29:42,198 --> 00:29:44,438
Speaker 3: No? But here let's work on different grips.

637
00:29:44,638 --> 00:29:46,878
Speaker 4: And I want to give you a change up number two,

638
00:29:46,918 --> 00:29:49,558
Speaker 4: and then if you could spin a curve ball. Spinning

639
00:29:49,558 --> 00:29:52,318
Speaker 4: a curveball to me like probably the most effective pitch

640
00:29:52,318 --> 00:29:54,838
Speaker 4: of the opposite side hitter along with the change up.

641
00:29:54,838 --> 00:29:56,118
Speaker 3: And what happens a lot of times.

642
00:29:56,558 --> 00:29:59,198
Speaker 4: The demise of a lot of young pictures is the

643
00:29:59,198 --> 00:30:01,118
Speaker 4: fact that they can't get out the opposite side hitter.

644
00:30:01,518 --> 00:30:03,398
Speaker 3: And to me, the change up and the curveball are

645
00:30:03,398 --> 00:30:04,438
Speaker 3: the two best way up. And there.

646
00:30:04,638 --> 00:30:06,278
Speaker 4: I could go on and on about this, but I

647
00:30:06,358 --> 00:30:10,118
Speaker 4: believe in that I don't understand other than data that

648
00:30:10,238 --> 00:30:11,998
Speaker 4: looks pretty on a piece of paper, it's been not

649
00:30:12,038 --> 00:30:13,118
Speaker 4: supported in real life.

650
00:30:13,238 --> 00:30:15,678
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you're onto something there, Joe, because we're

651
00:30:15,798 --> 00:30:19,478
Speaker 1: going through another iteration of how pitching is changing and evolving.

652
00:30:19,638 --> 00:30:21,478
Speaker 1: Because for a while there, as we know, when the

653
00:30:21,558 --> 00:30:24,638
Speaker 1: launch angle era hit for hitters, that high four steing

654
00:30:24,718 --> 00:30:27,238
Speaker 1: fastball really played right, getting a lot of swings and

655
00:30:27,238 --> 00:30:29,838
Speaker 1: misses and pop ups, top of the zone, velocity began

656
00:30:29,878 --> 00:30:32,678
Speaker 1: to increase and pitchers could live up there. Now what

657
00:30:32,718 --> 00:30:35,918
Speaker 1: I'm seeing is everybody wants to move the ball in

658
00:30:36,038 --> 00:30:40,118
Speaker 1: different directions. If you watch now, especially for starters, they

659
00:30:40,158 --> 00:30:43,878
Speaker 1: have separate menus of pitches for right handers and left handers.

660
00:30:44,038 --> 00:30:46,638
Speaker 2: And everybody now wants to move the ball. Everybody has.

661
00:30:46,678 --> 00:30:49,438
Speaker 1: Alex Cord told me he has three fastballs. Now, you know,

662
00:30:49,598 --> 00:30:52,318
Speaker 1: the for seamer, the sinker, and the cutter. Everybody's got

663
00:30:52,358 --> 00:30:54,878
Speaker 1: three breaking balls. Everybody throws a breaking ball to a

664
00:30:54,958 --> 00:30:58,478
Speaker 1: right handed hitter or a left handed hitter. And I think,

665
00:30:58,718 --> 00:31:02,078
Speaker 1: just there's this approach now that let's move keep moving

666
00:31:02,078 --> 00:31:06,518
Speaker 1: the ball and shaping pitches on analytics and data and

667
00:31:06,558 --> 00:31:08,758
Speaker 1: spin rates and all these things. Not everybody can do

668
00:31:08,838 --> 00:31:11,798
Speaker 1: it that well, but people want to go into pitch

669
00:31:11,878 --> 00:31:15,078
Speaker 1: shaping I think more than commanding the baseball.

670
00:31:15,558 --> 00:31:18,278
Speaker 2: And that's what I'm saying, Joe is really good.

671
00:31:18,358 --> 00:31:21,518
Speaker 1: Pitchers now are throwing just a whole suite of pitches

672
00:31:21,518 --> 00:31:23,798
Speaker 1: now that they would not have thrown before.

673
00:31:24,278 --> 00:31:25,158
Speaker 3: Even like Skeins.

674
00:31:25,518 --> 00:31:27,518
Speaker 4: We talked about that Skins wanting to add a pitch

675
00:31:27,558 --> 00:31:29,918
Speaker 4: this year. See here's what I always wanted to do

676
00:31:29,998 --> 00:31:33,118
Speaker 4: too with But all my guys, you have all these

677
00:31:33,158 --> 00:31:36,278
Speaker 4: different pitches, right breaking balls. Let's says breaking ball specifically,

678
00:31:36,718 --> 00:31:39,678
Speaker 4: which works better against if your right hand? Which works

679
00:31:39,718 --> 00:31:42,478
Speaker 4: better against the lefty? Which works better against the righty? Fat?

680
00:31:42,478 --> 00:31:45,638
Speaker 4: I guess I would say that your slider works better

681
00:31:45,638 --> 00:31:48,758
Speaker 4: against the righty, and your curveball should work better against

682
00:31:48,798 --> 00:31:51,398
Speaker 4: the lefty. Like I said, change up, I like when

683
00:31:51,398 --> 00:31:56,518
Speaker 4: it works against both sides. James Shields outstanding, Kyle Hendricks outstanding,

684
00:31:56,718 --> 00:32:00,318
Speaker 4: Alex Cobb outstanding. To get underneath the right handed hitter.

685
00:32:01,278 --> 00:32:05,558
Speaker 4: Proliferation of elevated fastballs being thrown, which really causes I say,

686
00:32:05,638 --> 00:32:07,878
Speaker 4: right on right, you're trying to really get over top

687
00:32:07,918 --> 00:32:09,358
Speaker 4: of that ball. A lot of times that leaves a

688
00:32:09,398 --> 00:32:11,918
Speaker 4: hole underneath. You find where the hole is, and if

689
00:32:11,958 --> 00:32:14,438
Speaker 4: the holes underneath the right handed hitter, a right handed

690
00:32:14,518 --> 00:32:17,398
Speaker 4: changeup is devastating to that particular hitter if you if

691
00:32:17,438 --> 00:32:20,718
Speaker 4: you could move it down and down and in. Alex Cobb,

692
00:32:21,718 --> 00:32:25,398
Speaker 4: Kyle Hendrix, James Shills were really good at this particular pitch.

693
00:32:25,838 --> 00:32:28,958
Speaker 3: So identify, just don't throw a bunch of pitches.

694
00:32:29,398 --> 00:32:32,438
Speaker 4: What do I do well against the writing, and what

695
00:32:32,478 --> 00:32:34,678
Speaker 4: do I do well against the lefty. The cutter to me,

696
00:32:35,078 --> 00:32:36,838
Speaker 4: to me is more more, should be more of an

697
00:32:36,838 --> 00:32:39,438
Speaker 4: opposite side pitch, and I like it When it's elevated.

698
00:32:39,478 --> 00:32:42,558
Speaker 4: In Mariano Rivera, it was like a buzz stop. Left

699
00:32:42,558 --> 00:32:44,718
Speaker 4: handers couldn't get to it because it would just cut in.

700
00:32:45,078 --> 00:32:46,918
Speaker 4: It would be about bell time, maybe a little bit.

701
00:32:46,798 --> 00:32:47,238
Speaker 3: Better than that.

702
00:32:47,358 --> 00:32:49,038
Speaker 4: Nothing you can do with it, not a thing you

703
00:32:49,038 --> 00:32:52,438
Speaker 4: can do with it. So the figure that out first,

704
00:32:52,478 --> 00:32:54,598
Speaker 4: and I have to believe people are smart enough to

705
00:32:54,678 --> 00:32:56,878
Speaker 4: understand that. But that would be where I would begin

706
00:32:56,998 --> 00:32:59,678
Speaker 4: with all my pitches too, left you hit left, your

707
00:32:59,758 --> 00:33:03,078
Speaker 4: right handed pitcher versus the lefty versus writing, Where does

708
00:33:03,438 --> 00:33:05,758
Speaker 4: the shape of my break and ball work best against

709
00:33:05,798 --> 00:33:09,638
Speaker 4: these guys? And not try to force the round peg

710
00:33:09,718 --> 00:33:13,198
Speaker 4: into the square hole? Whatever? What works best? Based on this?

711
00:33:13,278 --> 00:33:15,238
Speaker 4: And how do I see the plate? How do I

712
00:33:15,318 --> 00:33:17,998
Speaker 4: see hitters? And then also just let's start getting deeper

713
00:33:17,998 --> 00:33:20,678
Speaker 4: into ballgames whatever? How do we get deeper into a

714
00:33:20,718 --> 00:33:23,518
Speaker 4: ball games? Is it even discussed? I could go on on, man,

715
00:33:23,838 --> 00:33:26,198
Speaker 4: these are the things that I'd like. I'm not around

716
00:33:26,318 --> 00:33:28,598
Speaker 4: enough to see it firsthand, which I really wish I was.

717
00:33:29,078 --> 00:33:31,038
Speaker 4: This is stuff that I see on occasion when I'm

718
00:33:31,038 --> 00:33:33,438
Speaker 4: watching a game, I like to be on the field.

719
00:33:33,638 --> 00:33:35,638
Speaker 3: I like to.

720
00:33:34,878 --> 00:33:37,238
Speaker 4: Scout, like use my scouting ie to really tell you

721
00:33:37,318 --> 00:33:40,038
Speaker 4: exactly how I feel. But this is what I believe

722
00:33:40,038 --> 00:33:42,758
Speaker 4: in right here. I would start from these premise and

723
00:33:42,798 --> 00:33:43,758
Speaker 4: then it would work from there.

724
00:33:44,238 --> 00:33:44,518
Speaker 2: Yeah.

725
00:33:44,878 --> 00:33:48,758
Speaker 1: I almost think of it as designer pitching, right you know. Yeah,

726
00:33:48,878 --> 00:33:51,558
Speaker 1: people just want to design pitches, and as I said,

727
00:33:51,598 --> 00:33:54,558
Speaker 1: it's hard to do to execute it as good as

728
00:33:54,558 --> 00:33:57,398
Speaker 1: it looks on paper. But I think given the technology

729
00:33:57,398 --> 00:34:00,398
Speaker 1: and the tools, people are really into that now and

730
00:34:00,478 --> 00:34:03,318
Speaker 1: real quickly. Joe in twenty fifteen, so ten years ago,

731
00:34:04,318 --> 00:34:08,638
Speaker 1: hitters would see fifty seven percent fastballs. That number this year,

732
00:34:08,678 --> 00:34:11,478
Speaker 1: ten years later is down to forty seven percent. It's

733
00:34:11,518 --> 00:34:13,998
Speaker 1: the lowest percentage ever. So we'll keep an eye on

734
00:34:14,038 --> 00:34:16,838
Speaker 1: the Marlins. As I mentioned, the Red Sox did this

735
00:34:16,958 --> 00:34:19,558
Speaker 1: last year and their ERA went up a full run

736
00:34:19,598 --> 00:34:21,478
Speaker 1: in the second half of the season. The Marlins are

737
00:34:21,518 --> 00:34:24,758
Speaker 1: already starting from the worst ERA in the league.

738
00:34:24,518 --> 00:34:27,398
Speaker 2: So we'll see how that develops when we come back.

739
00:34:27,878 --> 00:34:32,198
Speaker 1: I am just about ready to write off the Baltimore Orioles.

740
00:34:32,318 --> 00:34:34,238
Speaker 2: I want to see if Joe Madden agrees with me

741
00:34:34,318 --> 00:34:36,918
Speaker 2: on this. We'll do that right after this at.

742
00:34:36,838 --> 00:34:51,638
Speaker 5: The Book of Joe Joe.

743
00:34:51,638 --> 00:34:53,918
Speaker 1: I know you like the Baltimore Orioles, so do I,

744
00:34:53,958 --> 00:34:56,038
Speaker 1: but I can't. I got to tell you that they're

745
00:34:56,078 --> 00:34:58,358
Speaker 1: the most disappointing team in baseball for me this year.

746
00:34:58,518 --> 00:35:01,158
Speaker 1: There's no question about it. You look at their staff

747
00:35:01,198 --> 00:35:03,918
Speaker 1: era twenty ninth. In era they've allowed the most home

748
00:35:04,038 --> 00:35:06,598
Speaker 1: runs they're twenty eighth, and strikeouts their twenty eighth and

749
00:35:06,638 --> 00:35:08,838
Speaker 1: whip their twenty sixth, then strikeout to walk.

750
00:35:08,918 --> 00:35:10,998
Speaker 2: Right, They're just not getting it done on the mound.

751
00:35:11,518 --> 00:35:12,038
Speaker 2: We know that.

752
00:35:12,198 --> 00:35:14,398
Speaker 1: And even offensively, this should be a much better team

753
00:35:14,678 --> 00:35:17,038
Speaker 1: their twenty sixth and batting average twenty sixth. Then on

754
00:35:17,158 --> 00:35:20,078
Speaker 1: base percentage you look at their record, they're thirteen to

755
00:35:20,118 --> 00:35:23,318
Speaker 1: twenty one, and you can say, well, it's early, right,

756
00:35:23,398 --> 00:35:25,678
Speaker 1: we talked about this at the start of this episode.

757
00:35:25,998 --> 00:35:26,518
Speaker 2: It's early.

758
00:35:26,638 --> 00:35:29,438
Speaker 1: Well, there's only been eight teams in the history of

759
00:35:29,478 --> 00:35:33,078
Speaker 1: baseball that started thirteen and twenty one or worse and

760
00:35:33,198 --> 00:35:36,958
Speaker 1: made the postseason. And there's only been one who have

761
00:35:37,038 --> 00:35:39,558
Speaker 1: done that out of the very difficult American League East.

762
00:35:39,558 --> 00:35:43,478
Speaker 1: That was in nineteen eighty nine, Toronto Blue Jays. It's

763
00:35:43,478 --> 00:35:46,198
Speaker 1: happened once in the past twelve years. That's the twenty

764
00:35:46,238 --> 00:35:49,438
Speaker 1: four Astros. I think they're just about out of it, Joe,

765
00:35:49,518 --> 00:35:52,118
Speaker 1: I really do. I just don't see where this team

766
00:35:52,198 --> 00:35:55,198
Speaker 1: is going to get better, especially on the mound and

767
00:35:55,278 --> 00:35:58,918
Speaker 1: playing uphill in the American League East. I know you've

768
00:35:58,918 --> 00:36:02,238
Speaker 1: done it. It's a difficult road to go. Tell me

769
00:36:02,278 --> 00:36:04,118
Speaker 1: what you see. The Orioles and with their chance, are

770
00:36:04,278 --> 00:36:05,518
Speaker 1: getting back into this thing.

771
00:36:05,958 --> 00:36:09,198
Speaker 4: In spite of their offensive deficiencies. That's one thing that's

772
00:36:09,198 --> 00:36:11,878
Speaker 4: something I think they can overcome. But the pitching deficiencies

773
00:36:11,878 --> 00:36:15,598
Speaker 4: are almost impossible. All the different injuries they've had, the

774
00:36:15,598 --> 00:36:18,078
Speaker 4: different guys they brought in that really have not performed,

775
00:36:18,598 --> 00:36:19,118
Speaker 4: that's the.

776
00:36:19,078 --> 00:36:19,958
Speaker 3: Tough one right there.

777
00:36:19,998 --> 00:36:21,998
Speaker 4: To really flip a switch on that, it's going to

778
00:36:21,998 --> 00:36:24,398
Speaker 4: be very difficult, and that's to me, that's where good.

779
00:36:24,478 --> 00:36:26,998
Speaker 4: That's going to be the difference maker regarding whether they're

780
00:36:26,998 --> 00:36:29,238
Speaker 4: going to be able to get back into it or not.

781
00:36:29,518 --> 00:36:32,278
Speaker 4: The players on the field, these are young guys, you

782
00:36:32,278 --> 00:36:35,158
Speaker 4: know right now, they're probably we talked about confidence a

783
00:36:35,238 --> 00:36:38,398
Speaker 4: moment ago. It's definitely at a low point when you

784
00:36:38,478 --> 00:36:40,758
Speaker 4: have to score that many runs on a nightly basis,

785
00:36:40,838 --> 00:36:43,518
Speaker 4: or I haven't followed it closely enough, but to be

786
00:36:43,558 --> 00:36:46,438
Speaker 4: giving up leads, giving up leads late, we score some points,

787
00:36:46,478 --> 00:36:47,798
Speaker 4: and all of a sudden, here comes the other team

788
00:36:47,838 --> 00:36:50,958
Speaker 4: roaring back. Devastating I managed, you know, when you manage

789
00:36:50,958 --> 00:36:54,238
Speaker 4: in Midland, Texas, it's tough. When you score points and

790
00:36:54,278 --> 00:36:57,798
Speaker 4: the other team just keeps coming back. It really wears

791
00:36:57,838 --> 00:37:00,678
Speaker 4: down the offensive side. And I'm not pointing fingers. I'm

792
00:37:00,678 --> 00:37:03,678
Speaker 4: just pointing out that it seems to be what's going

793
00:37:03,718 --> 00:37:05,918
Speaker 4: on right here. So I don't know how they fix

794
00:37:05,998 --> 00:37:08,598
Speaker 4: their pitching. That would be the number one thing. Unless

795
00:37:08,638 --> 00:37:11,638
Speaker 4: they get some kind of consistency on the mound. To

796
00:37:11,638 --> 00:37:14,038
Speaker 4: think that they're going to be able to generate enough

797
00:37:14,118 --> 00:37:17,838
Speaker 4: offense to overcome any kind of pitching deficiencies right now,

798
00:37:18,558 --> 00:37:22,198
Speaker 4: nearly impossible if they can tried and true, I mean,

799
00:37:22,238 --> 00:37:24,078
Speaker 4: I don't even know. You probably know better that you

800
00:37:24,078 --> 00:37:26,438
Speaker 4: do know better than I. Defensively, if they're playing up

801
00:37:26,438 --> 00:37:29,398
Speaker 4: to their standards defensively or not. But those are the

802
00:37:29,438 --> 00:37:31,838
Speaker 4: two things that they got to start winning three to two,

803
00:37:31,958 --> 00:37:34,438
Speaker 4: two to one, four to three kind of games again.

804
00:37:35,158 --> 00:37:37,438
Speaker 4: They got to start winning those holding onto leads late

805
00:37:37,998 --> 00:37:41,878
Speaker 4: and all this stuff really speaks to pitching and defense.

806
00:37:42,278 --> 00:37:45,918
Speaker 4: So without having seen them often enough, I'm not disagreeing

807
00:37:45,918 --> 00:37:47,758
Speaker 4: with you. I think that they are in kind of

808
00:37:47,838 --> 00:37:51,238
Speaker 4: a deep situation. Trouble wise, it's hard to come back. See,

809
00:37:51,238 --> 00:37:53,238
Speaker 4: it's one thing to come if you're like if you're

810
00:37:53,878 --> 00:37:56,878
Speaker 4: behind in the division by five, six, seven, eight games,

811
00:37:56,878 --> 00:37:59,238
Speaker 4: like we were, but you're you're playing well, if you

812
00:37:59,278 --> 00:38:01,958
Speaker 4: have a nice record, if had a nice season, good

813
00:38:01,958 --> 00:38:05,078
Speaker 4: things have occurred. It's okay to you could understand why

814
00:38:05,118 --> 00:38:07,358
Speaker 4: team can fight back. But when a team is just

815
00:38:07,398 --> 00:38:10,118
Speaker 4: like underwater so badly to think that they're just going

816
00:38:10,158 --> 00:38:12,718
Speaker 4: to flip a switch and start playing good baseball, that's

817
00:38:12,758 --> 00:38:14,878
Speaker 4: a difficult part to wrap.

818
00:38:14,678 --> 00:38:15,318
Speaker 3: Your mind around.

819
00:38:15,678 --> 00:38:17,918
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I wonder Joe about the mindset, and you

820
00:38:17,998 --> 00:38:21,078
Speaker 1: kind of alluded to this. When you're not getting consistently

821
00:38:21,358 --> 00:38:23,518
Speaker 1: really good pitching and you feel like you have to

822
00:38:23,558 --> 00:38:26,078
Speaker 1: score a lot of runs, it's there's would seem to

823
00:38:26,078 --> 00:38:27,838
Speaker 1: me a lot of pressure, Like you go into a

824
00:38:27,918 --> 00:38:30,118
Speaker 1: series thinking we've got to outslug the other team.

825
00:38:30,158 --> 00:38:31,038
Speaker 2: That's a hard way.

826
00:38:31,638 --> 00:38:33,598
Speaker 1: I mean that all happened once in a while, but

827
00:38:33,718 --> 00:38:36,118
Speaker 1: to play five months of baseball like that, that's why

828
00:38:36,198 --> 00:38:38,398
Speaker 1: you know, I looked at the Atlanta Braves early. They

829
00:38:38,398 --> 00:38:40,518
Speaker 1: started zero and seven, and you know, a lot of

830
00:38:40,558 --> 00:38:42,398
Speaker 1: things were not going right for the Braves. But you

831
00:38:42,438 --> 00:38:45,638
Speaker 1: saw their pitching staff. You know, some guys that they

832
00:38:45,638 --> 00:38:47,798
Speaker 1: spin the ball as well as anybody. They've got really

833
00:38:47,838 --> 00:38:51,038
Speaker 1: good arms. You saw the potential there that they could have,

834
00:38:51,158 --> 00:38:53,478
Speaker 1: say a month like twenty and ten, which you need

835
00:38:53,518 --> 00:38:56,678
Speaker 1: to do when you start out so poorly. I don't

836
00:38:56,798 --> 00:38:59,398
Speaker 1: see the Orioles having a twenty and ten month because

837
00:38:59,438 --> 00:39:02,238
Speaker 1: I don't see their pitching being that being good enough,

838
00:39:02,278 --> 00:39:05,558
Speaker 1: that consistent enough. You know, well a series here and there, sure,

839
00:39:05,718 --> 00:39:07,838
Speaker 1: but they need to make up ground with some of

840
00:39:07,878 --> 00:39:10,798
Speaker 1: these months where they do play six hundred, seven hundred baseball.

841
00:39:11,158 --> 00:39:13,518
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's hard to out slug your mistakes, it really is.

842
00:39:14,518 --> 00:39:16,438
Speaker 4: The other teams got, you know, pitching their flakers that

843
00:39:16,478 --> 00:39:17,078
Speaker 4: are playing.

844
00:39:16,838 --> 00:39:17,478
Speaker 3: In the East.

845
00:39:18,038 --> 00:39:19,878
Speaker 4: But although the Central is no walk right now, there's

846
00:39:19,918 --> 00:39:23,878
Speaker 4: some really good baseball going on there. There's nowhere to

847
00:39:23,918 --> 00:39:25,878
Speaker 4: hide when you get underwater like that.

848
00:39:26,438 --> 00:39:26,678
Speaker 3: Wow.

849
00:39:27,398 --> 00:39:29,318
Speaker 4: We've talked about this in the past with the Rays,

850
00:39:29,358 --> 00:39:32,678
Speaker 4: we were eighteen under one time, it was twenty three

851
00:39:32,718 --> 00:39:34,758
Speaker 4: and forty one. I think our record was believe that

852
00:39:34,838 --> 00:39:37,518
Speaker 4: or not, and I vowed we're going to get back to.

853
00:39:37,518 --> 00:39:39,318
Speaker 3: Five hundred, and we did.

854
00:39:39,398 --> 00:39:41,798
Speaker 4: We were like sixty four and sixty five and five

855
00:39:41,878 --> 00:39:43,798
Speaker 4: or something like that. Fought so hard to get back

856
00:39:43,838 --> 00:39:45,798
Speaker 4: to that point. But just like we talked about earlier,

857
00:39:46,318 --> 00:39:48,718
Speaker 4: when you fight that hard to get back, I remember

858
00:39:48,718 --> 00:39:51,078
Speaker 4: talking Alex Cob in front of his locker. We were

859
00:39:51,118 --> 00:39:53,598
Speaker 4: so jacked that we finally got back to five hundred

860
00:39:53,758 --> 00:39:57,638
Speaker 4: from eighteen under think about it, eighteen under five hundred.

861
00:39:57,918 --> 00:40:00,318
Speaker 4: He got back to five hundred within the same year.

862
00:40:00,878 --> 00:40:02,478
Speaker 4: But wow, does it take a lot out of it.

863
00:40:02,918 --> 00:40:06,918
Speaker 4: So yes, if they could somehow get that pitching staff

864
00:40:07,078 --> 00:40:10,678
Speaker 4: right it, if they could catch the ball consistently every night,

865
00:40:11,318 --> 00:40:13,758
Speaker 4: I believe that offense will pick it up enough to.

866
00:40:13,718 --> 00:40:14,398
Speaker 3: Make some noise.

867
00:40:14,718 --> 00:40:17,118
Speaker 1: Well, Joe, I've been waiting to get to your final

868
00:40:17,198 --> 00:40:20,278
Speaker 1: thought here because you teased it. That was a great tease,

869
00:40:20,358 --> 00:40:21,958
Speaker 1: by the way, You've had me on the edge of

870
00:40:21,958 --> 00:40:24,438
Speaker 1: my seat here, So I want to know where you're

871
00:40:24,478 --> 00:40:24,998
Speaker 1: going here.

872
00:40:25,118 --> 00:40:28,878
Speaker 4: Well, you know you're talking about Schwerbert, right, Yeah, And

873
00:40:28,918 --> 00:40:32,278
Speaker 4: the fact that when he came up, a lot of

874
00:40:32,358 --> 00:40:34,998
Speaker 4: asayers about him hitting left on left and he wanted

875
00:40:35,038 --> 00:40:38,478
Speaker 4: to sew badly. I can hit lefties. Just give me

876
00:40:38,478 --> 00:40:40,078
Speaker 4: a chance. I can hit lefties. I'm telling you I

877
00:40:40,078 --> 00:40:41,998
Speaker 4: could hit left these but I'd never doubted it. But

878
00:40:42,038 --> 00:40:44,758
Speaker 4: like I said, if you had alternatives, more had to

879
00:40:44,798 --> 00:40:47,878
Speaker 4: play as an example. So we're doing at different things

880
00:40:48,398 --> 00:40:53,158
Speaker 4: platoon wise. Okay, so this is from Albert Einstein. I'm

881
00:40:53,158 --> 00:40:55,998
Speaker 4: grateful to all those people who said no. It is

882
00:40:56,038 --> 00:40:59,798
Speaker 4: because of them. I did it myself. Kyle Swerbert in

883
00:40:59,918 --> 00:41:01,318
Speaker 4: the story Mike Trump.

884
00:41:01,718 --> 00:41:08,478
Speaker 1: That is so good at Einstein, Kyle Schwerber, I always

885
00:41:08,478 --> 00:41:09,358
Speaker 1: had them peg.

886
00:41:09,278 --> 00:41:10,078
Speaker 3: The same breath.

887
00:41:10,118 --> 00:41:12,758
Speaker 2: Yeah, great stuff.

888
00:41:12,838 --> 00:41:13,118
Speaker 3: Joe.

889
00:41:13,198 --> 00:41:16,398
Speaker 1: Hey, We'll see you next week, next time on the

890
00:41:16,398 --> 00:41:17,558
Speaker 1: Book of Joe Podcasts.

891
00:41:18,158 --> 00:41:20,358
Speaker 3: Thanks Tom, We have a great day.

892
00:41:26,798 --> 00:41:29,998
Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

893
00:41:30,238 --> 00:41:35,118
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

894
00:41:35,358 --> 00:41:37,118
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.