Speaker 1: He's the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show, your war
Speaker 1: room for in center news and draft analysis from deep
Speaker 1: within the confines of Cowboys Headquarters at the Star in Fresco,
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys like Ted Lamb and now your hosts Brian
Speaker 1: brought us David Hellman, Bucky Brooks, and Kyle Yeomans. There
Speaker 1: are one hundred and thirteen days until the NFL Draft
Speaker 1: April twenty ninth, of twenty twenty one. It's officially twenty
Speaker 1: twenty one, and the Draft Show rolls on into the
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys offseason. And it's the first offseason edition of
Speaker 1: the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show. Glad you're with
Speaker 1: us everybody on Dallas Cowboys dot Com and coast to
Speaker 1: coast across the world. As Bucky Brooks, Brian brought us, myself,
Speaker 1: Kyle Yeomans will break down this draft David Hellman today
Speaker 1: and Brian, I think that's why this is gonna be
Speaker 1: our best show yet. Right. Yeah, We're just gonna go
Speaker 1: ahead and hand us the Sports Emmy, the Marcody whatever
Speaker 1: you want to do. Dave, feel free to sit at
Speaker 1: the table while Bucky, Kyle Beam we all go up
Speaker 1: there and get our awards. We'll put you in the
Speaker 1: thank you speech. We'll put you in the thank you
Speaker 1: speech for sure. Thank goodness and thank goodness, David Hellman.
Speaker 1: You were great all the way through. But hey, you're
Speaker 1: at the table today and now we love David. He
Speaker 1: just had more important things to do today, like interview
Speaker 1: some guy that was nicknamed the Playmaker or whatever it
Speaker 1: was back in the day, something like that had somebody
Speaker 1: to talk to that was more important than we are.
Speaker 1: But guys, you look at the Cowboys season down coming
Speaker 1: to a close, and the Cowboys have settled into that
Speaker 1: number ten pick, and it's not number four like we
Speaker 1: thought it might have been earlier in the year, but
Speaker 1: it actually ends up being number ten. You're still a
Speaker 1: top ten pick for the first time since twenty sixteen.
Speaker 1: But Bucky, how good of a spot is that for
Speaker 1: the Cowboys whenever it comes to the number ten pick,
Speaker 1: because they've had some they've had some success in the
Speaker 1: top ten in the past. Yeah, you should have success
Speaker 1: when you're picking in the top ten because that's really
Speaker 1: the cream of the crop of each draft class. When
Speaker 1: you think about the top ten and you think about
Speaker 1: getting difference makers, game changers, and when the Cowboys have
Speaker 1: had the opportunity to selective that they've been able to
Speaker 1: nail it. And so this year I think it's actually
Speaker 1: fortunate for them because I think the needs and what
Speaker 1: is available lines up with where they're picking. In terms
Speaker 1: of the Cowboys, what their biggest needs are and where
Speaker 1: the talent is, I think it matches up. So now
Speaker 1: it's just a matter of determining which players are right
Speaker 1: fit for the team and where they want to go.
Speaker 1: Right Yeah, No, I absolutely agree with Bucky because you know,
Speaker 1: we were kind of looking at if you had to say,
Speaker 1: a top four or five pick. You know, if you're
Speaker 1: looking for save, defensive help, do you feel comfortable picking
Speaker 1: it right at that spot? I think initially we said,
Speaker 1: know which you consider trading down, grabbing a pick or
Speaker 1: two from somebody else? Could you go down to ten, eleven, twelve,
Speaker 1: somebody right there? I think the Cowboys are in a
Speaker 1: great spot right there. You know, offensive players, defensive players.
Speaker 1: You'll have an opportunity to grab whatever direction you want
Speaker 1: to go. And you know, if you still want to
Speaker 1: potentially trade down again, I think you're in an absolute
Speaker 1: wonderful spot there. Of course, scouts want to be as
Speaker 1: high as you can on the board, But being in
Speaker 1: the ten hole is not a bad thing, especially in
Speaker 1: this draft, and I think we've talked about it before,
Speaker 1: but really the only thing that you're messing out from
Speaker 1: being maybe in the top five as to being at
Speaker 1: ten as the options of where to go in the
Speaker 1: draft and where you should fall and what you would
Speaker 1: get in return and kind of the draft capital that
Speaker 1: you can play around with there. But in terms of selecting,
Speaker 1: this is right where you want to be. And if
Speaker 1: you look at the Cowboys last six top ten selections,
Speaker 1: five have made the Pro Bowl. Is Zekiel Elliott twenty sixteen.
Speaker 1: More Clayborne is the only one that did not make
Speaker 1: the Pro Bowl Tyrren Smith in twenty eleven, Terrence Newman,
Speaker 1: Roy Williams, and Greg Ellis. That's the last six times
Speaker 1: the Cowboys that picked him the top ten. They've also
Speaker 1: never selected specifically with the tenth overall pick, but the
Speaker 1: closest times they did was when they picked ninth with
Speaker 1: Tyrant Smith and they picked eleventh with DeMarcus Ware. So
Speaker 1: you've had some you've had some success around in that
Speaker 1: area in the draft, and hopefully they can continue that
Speaker 1: a little bit, But Bucky, you brought up a point
Speaker 1: in our group message this week that kind of wanted
Speaker 1: to hit a little bit. But Mike McCarthy was asked
Speaker 1: earlier this week about the identity of this organization and
Speaker 1: the identity of the Cowboys player personnel and kind of
Speaker 1: where they're going from here, and he kind of gave
Speaker 1: a non answer, didn't necessarily answer the question and kind
Speaker 1: of kept it close to the chest. But how important
Speaker 1: is that identity, Bucky, whenever it comes to drafting these
Speaker 1: players and evaluating who you want on your roster and
Speaker 1: who you're going to put in certain situations, Because at
Speaker 1: least right now, this is where the full first full
Speaker 1: off season that Mike McCarthy's going to have in terms
Speaker 1: of trying to get into that moment, I think it's
Speaker 1: very important. I think it's something that should be communicated,
Speaker 1: communicated at all times, not only from coach to coach
Speaker 1: and coach to personnel staff, but players should understand exactly
Speaker 1: what this team is about, and who the players are
Speaker 1: on this team and what court traits are necessary. And
Speaker 1: we're not talking about position specific things, just hey, I
Speaker 1: want a smart, fast, tough, physical football team, and the
Speaker 1: players that play on this team have to exhibit those traits.
Speaker 1: For Mike McCarthy to not be able to articulate it.
Speaker 1: To me, it was troubling, particularly coming off Jalen Smith's
Speaker 1: long rambling answer about the identity of the team and
Speaker 1: all of that stuff. I just wonder if there is
Speaker 1: alignment from top to bottom, and that's something that maybe
Speaker 1: Brian can speak on having worked in the building. I
Speaker 1: just don't know how you can go forward in terms
Speaker 1: of acquiring players if you don't have a clear identity
Speaker 1: for your team and for the individual players that you
Speaker 1: want to bring up. Yeah, that's you know, your ap right, Bucky.
Speaker 1: And you know, let's look at the teams that are
Speaker 1: successful throughout you know. I always like to talk about
Speaker 1: the Ravens, the Steelers, you know, Kansas City. Now look
Speaker 1: what Buffalo's doing. There's clear identity of what their football
Speaker 1: team is. Tennessee's another one. I just feel like though,
Speaker 1: you know, Mike McCarthy comes from a program in Green
Speaker 1: Bay where the head coach didn't have a lot of
Speaker 1: say and what was going on. If we all remember
Speaker 1: too well, Mike McCarthy said, hey, you know, give us
Speaker 1: the players, we'll fit the scheme to the players we have. Well,
Speaker 1: we'll see if that actually is the case, but yeah,
Speaker 1: I think that, you know, the teams that have continuity,
Speaker 1: I think they drafted well under Jason Garrett because they
Speaker 1: had an idea of what kind of player they wanted.
Speaker 1: And if you look at last year's draft of the
Speaker 1: Cowboys coaches coming in late having to set up playbooks
Speaker 1: and stuff like that, maybe the coaches weren't involved as
Speaker 1: much with the Cowboys, and maybe Mike McCarthy. You know,
Speaker 1: we'll see how much. You know, my experience of working
Speaker 1: in the organization is the head coach carries a big
Speaker 1: stick in that room. Whether you want to be like
Speaker 1: Bill Parcels and beat people over the head with it,
Speaker 1: or you want to be like Wade Phillips and Dave Campbell,
Speaker 1: which is kind of sit back and let the scouts
Speaker 1: do their job. So yeah, I think that they If
Speaker 1: Mike McCarthy wants to be involved, he absolutely can, but
Speaker 1: they need to understand what kind of players that these
Speaker 1: coaches want and go forward from there. Because the outstanding
Speaker 1: organizations that I mentioned, the Ravens, you know, the Chiefs,
Speaker 1: the Steelers, they have a clear identity and a clear plan.
Speaker 1: If you had to look at the Cowboys specifically, and
Speaker 1: Bucky will start with you on this one, but if
Speaker 1: you had to look at the Cowboys, what would their
Speaker 1: identity be? Because I don't know. Mike McCarthy may not
Speaker 1: have given that non answer just based off of keeping
Speaker 1: it close to the test. He may he may not know.
Speaker 1: He may not know what that identity is, at least
Speaker 1: looking at as personnel. But what would you tab it
Speaker 1: as as a team overall? You know, I don't know,
Speaker 1: because it is a bit of a team in flux.
Speaker 1: Like you know, we can criticize the previous coaching staff
Speaker 1: and Jason Garrett or whatever. But I knew when I
Speaker 1: turned on the TV, I knew exactly what I was
Speaker 1: watching and what I was gonna get from the Dallas Cowboys.
Speaker 1: I knew offensively they were gonna be a mash team
Speaker 1: that was really driven by the running back play ash
Speaker 1: and passes, and they had a level of sophistication and
Speaker 1: that regard in terms of the big plays. And then
Speaker 1: on defensives gonna be a hard playing unit that would
Speaker 1: run from sideline to sideline and chase the ball and hunt.
Speaker 1: And so when I look at this team, and because
Speaker 1: like they kind of snickered at the notion Mike Nolan
Speaker 1: talked about versatility and wanted to be able to do
Speaker 1: more things and multiple than all that other stuff. I
Speaker 1: kind of believe you have as symboled a team that's
Speaker 1: kind of a jack of all trades, master of none.
Speaker 1: And so I don't know, And I think it's really
Speaker 1: important that you heard the players complain about the uncertainty
Speaker 1: and not knowing. I think it's really really important that
Speaker 1: the team, Mike McCarthy gets a clear definition of the
Speaker 1: identity so that everyone in the organization knows and that
Speaker 1: everyone can act accordingly when it comes to acquired personnel
Speaker 1: and putting in things that mass the talent that is
Speaker 1: now in the building. Yeah, and you know, to be
Speaker 1: honest with you, guys, you know they're in the situation
Speaker 1: right now where there might be some changes on this
Speaker 1: defensive staff. And if you change the defensive coordinator, now
Speaker 1: do you change the identity again? You know, you talk
Speaker 1: about multiple the defense. We want to be a four
Speaker 1: to three, we want to be a three to four.
Speaker 1: We want to hybrid stuff. We want to cover this way.
Speaker 1: You know, Bucky, you brought it up about the corner situation. Hey,
Speaker 1: do you want guys that play off? You want to
Speaker 1: play guys that play man? I mean, they've got to
Speaker 1: figure those things out quickly if they're going to stick
Speaker 1: with the current defensive staff. Okay, well, now you know
Speaker 1: Taylor your needs that way. But if you're going to
Speaker 1: go out and you're gonna draw this out and wait
Speaker 1: and oh we need to talk to this guy and
Speaker 1: all that and that, let's be honest, that's a little
Speaker 1: bit of the cowboy way. Hey, let's just kind of way.
Speaker 1: Let's see if the problem fixes itself. Let's you know
Speaker 1: that that doesn't need you need to be proactive right now.
Speaker 1: If you're going to lose, if you're going to lose
Speaker 1: the opportunity to to have a you know, an identity
Speaker 1: here and and not hire the right guy, then man,
Speaker 1: that that's just that puts you further further back in
Speaker 1: the behind the apol. Well, and how different is it
Speaker 1: going to be from last year to this year? Specifically,
Speaker 1: because when Mike McCarthy was hired, it seemed as if
Speaker 1: Will McClay was the one that kind of took the
Speaker 1: reins and said, I'm gonna get you some guys. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go, we're gonna draft best player available, We're gonna
Speaker 1: scout these guys and then you'll listen to us. Is
Speaker 1: that going to shift at all? Do you think, Brian,
Speaker 1: Because I mean, now a year into things, Mike McCarthy
Speaker 1: has a better idea maybe how he wants to build
Speaker 1: that identity from a roster standpoint. And is Will McClay
Speaker 1: going to have that same kind of say as he
Speaker 1: did maybe last offseason. Yeah, I hope they do. You know, again,
Speaker 1: I always and this is the selfish side of me
Speaker 1: coming out that I do believe the scouts have a
Speaker 1: responsibility to the team in a way of helping build
Speaker 1: this roster and in a big way. You know, I'm
Speaker 1: not going to call a third down defense. I'm not
Speaker 1: going to call a goal line package. I'm not going
Speaker 1: to do those things. You know, I'm not going to
Speaker 1: step into the coaches area there. But let me focus
Speaker 1: on my area. And anytime, you know, I worked in
Speaker 1: an organization in Green Bay where Mike Homegrin said he
Speaker 1: was back in the scouts, and you know, the scouts
Speaker 1: are wrong sometimes, but I always feel like though they're
Speaker 1: responsible for evaluating these players the whole entire year, and
Speaker 1: if they have an idea where the coaches need to
Speaker 1: get to go, well, then they can help more so
Speaker 1: than a coach coming in. I mean, we look what
Speaker 1: Rod Marinelli did to this team for four or five
Speaker 1: years and the way that they the way that they
Speaker 1: went away from players or went towards certain players. You know,
Speaker 1: you can't have that. Yes, I want coach responsibility, but
Speaker 1: I don't want it just overeating every single thing that
Speaker 1: I do going forward as far as building this football team.
Speaker 1: You know, Brian, I want to ask you this because
Speaker 1: you talk about coaches and scouts. I wanted just from
Speaker 1: an overall franchise philosophy, whether it's Jerry Jones or Stephen Jones,
Speaker 1: hasn't been set down. This is a kind of team
Speaker 1: that I want, you know. And then that way it
Speaker 1: is easy because whoever the head of the football chain is,
Speaker 1: they set the vision for the program. And so if
Speaker 1: everyone understands what that is, it makes it easier for
Speaker 1: the coaches and the scouts to understand this franchise is
Speaker 1: about this. So when you name those franchises Baltimore, Pittsburgh,
Speaker 1: those long time franchises where you know, if I tell you, ay,
Speaker 1: the Pittsburgh still does a comeing town. You already know. Hey, guys,
Speaker 1: put your big boy paths on. This is the other
Speaker 1: play and it doesn't matter who the coach is. Yeah. No,
Speaker 1: you're absolutely right, Bucky. I think that. And that's the
Speaker 1: problem that you have with the Cowboys, I believe is
Speaker 1: that you know Jerry Jones as the general manager. I'd
Speaker 1: like to believe that he has his thoughts on what
Speaker 1: kind of team he wants, but I think he allows
Speaker 1: a lot of it to be Hey a head coach, guy,
Speaker 1: what do you really want? What do you envision? How
Speaker 1: can we help you kind of thing. I'm not saying
Speaker 1: that as a general manager you have to beat your
Speaker 1: head coach over the head with a stick, like I
Speaker 1: said earlier, but I feel like you have to have
Speaker 1: ability to say, Okay, this is what my guy wants,
Speaker 1: this is what my guy needs. When I evaluate when
Speaker 1: I look at my football team, we really lack this.
Speaker 1: And I think as a general manager, director player personnel,
Speaker 1: you've got to You've got to do everything in your
Speaker 1: power to try and bring players in that are to
Speaker 1: your vision and try and best match what's going on
Speaker 1: with the head coach. But in this organization. Man, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of well, what do you want to do?
Speaker 1: What do you want to do? What do you want
Speaker 1: to do? Instead of Hey, guys, we need to look
Speaker 1: at it this way and push forward to try and
Speaker 1: make that happen. That's why these two are the elder
Speaker 1: statesman of the Draft Show. But guess what we've got.
Speaker 1: We've got some more members of the Draft Show. And
Speaker 1: that's the cool thing about twenty twenty is the fact
Speaker 1: that we can just call up whoever and get them
Speaker 1: to be a part of the show. So, hey, how
Speaker 1: about that, Jeff Kavanaughs, here what I will have You know,
Speaker 1: I was not invited, Kyle. I just heard that day
Speaker 1: was gone, and I thought, and I thought, I thought,
Speaker 1: you know what, you guys are gonna need somebody who's
Speaker 1: incredibly reckless and irresponsible to go with Bucky and Brian.
Speaker 1: So I volunteered and I texted everyone and I was like, hey,
Speaker 1: let me in, let me in, and so here I am.
Speaker 1: What's up, guys. I kept getting text messages and it
Speaker 1: was from Jeff and it was from Chris and it
Speaker 1: was like in the middle of the show, it was like, hey,
Speaker 1: can we get do we need a fourth do we
Speaker 1: need a fourth? I felt like we were playing pick
Speaker 1: up basketball. Y're like maybe call of duty war Zone.
Speaker 1: I don't even know. It was just like like, hey,
Speaker 1: do we need a fourth? Can we run with four?
Speaker 1: Let's do it. I'm glad to have you here, Jeff
Speaker 1: and Jeff, we're kind of talking about the allocation of
Speaker 1: where the power goes in terms of building an identity.
Speaker 1: Is it the coaching staff, the scouting department at the
Speaker 1: front office. From this Cowboys standpoint, I know you've got
Speaker 1: kind of heard the last couple answers there. Do you
Speaker 1: have an opinion on where that power is and how
Speaker 1: it's going to kind of affect the draft going into
Speaker 1: a Well, I guess I'm a wildcard here because I
Speaker 1: think your identity is basically just your best players, like
Speaker 1: to the Pittsburgh Steelers. For a long time, I remember
Speaker 1: my favorite games to watch in the NFL were Steeler
Speaker 1: raving games because I knew I was just going to
Speaker 1: get people hitting each other in the mouth over and
Speaker 1: over again. And it seemed like that lasted for a decade.
Speaker 1: But like Pittsburgh drifted to an offensive team because that's
Speaker 1: who their best players were, and now they kind of
Speaker 1: got the defense going again. So I guess for me,
Speaker 1: the identity of this team is Dak Prescott or the
Speaker 1: identity of this team was that offensive line being able
Speaker 1: to open holes and protect your quarterback. So I don't know.
Speaker 1: I kind of struggle with things like identity because I
Speaker 1: just think if you gathered me the best players, my
Speaker 1: identity is going to be that I beat everybody. It's
Speaker 1: gonna be awesome. Like you know, not necessarily, our identity
Speaker 1: is Emmett Smith is going to carry this ball twenty
Speaker 1: five times. Our identity is we're better than you and
Speaker 1: you can't stop us. Yeah. I think from a philosophical
Speaker 1: standpoint is Jeffrey would be if I told you a
Speaker 1: play like a cowboy, what does that mean? Like a
Speaker 1: swat level of being able to identify it? Like, what
Speaker 1: does that mean? I mean, I want like a physical thing.
Speaker 1: When we talk about the Ravens, play like a raven
Speaker 1: is hard nose, tough, physical, high instincts. They play to
Speaker 1: a certain standard. I just wonder with the Cowboys, who
Speaker 1: has said, a this is what we're about, this is
Speaker 1: who the players must have, these trades they must have
Speaker 1: when they come into the building. I'd like to think
Speaker 1: guys would want to play like Tank Lawrence when they
Speaker 1: become a Cowboy, because I think if somebody like that
Speaker 1: could be your identity would be great. But I'll be honest.
Speaker 1: When you're thinking about the Cowboys, I consider their identity
Speaker 1: to be linked to Jerry Jones, and I think his
Speaker 1: identity is everybody. You know. You can build an individual
Speaker 1: brand here. You can be incredibly popular. So if you
Speaker 1: made me pick, like, who embodies the Cowboys identity, I
Speaker 1: would say it's Jaalin Smith. I would say it's individual play,
Speaker 1: individual brand, and that's the identity. And unfortunately that's one
Speaker 1: of the hurdles you got to jump with the Cowboys.
Speaker 1: I shouldn't say that right now. All right, it was
Speaker 1: nice being with you guys today. I'll see it next time.
Speaker 1: Then he hops off and rides into the sunset. Mister captain,
Speaker 1: trade down, everybody. No, I don't disagree with what you're
Speaker 1: saying by any means. I really don't. And I think
Speaker 1: that identity maybe shifted a little bit last year when
Speaker 1: it came to thinking about the draft, because Will McClay
Speaker 1: had a bigger say in it, and like Bucky and
Speaker 1: Brian were kind of alluding to a little bit earlier.
Speaker 1: It's it's a little easier whenever you have those scouts
Speaker 1: on top of things and the coaching staff in the
Speaker 1: front office can kind of rely on them as opposed
Speaker 1: to maybe taking the rains themselves. Now in terms of
Speaker 1: the draft this year and kind of where the Cowboys
Speaker 1: are and of course picking tenth, Brian, you said for
Speaker 1: the show when we were just kind of chatting, that
Speaker 1: you wish you wish they would have been a little
Speaker 1: bit higher just for those options. That's kind of where
Speaker 1: it is. But is there any player or position that
Speaker 1: the Cowboys missed out on or may not have as
Speaker 1: good of a chance at at ten than they would
Speaker 1: have if they might have lost three or for their
Speaker 1: last for instead of winning three of their last four. Well,
Speaker 1: we all hope, and we all hope is speaking for
Speaker 1: Cowboy fans that in fact that you now are in
Speaker 1: the window where you can sign Dak Prescott, and to me,
Speaker 1: ten is a little bit of a I think outside
Speaker 1: if the quarterback is something that you needed, I kind
Speaker 1: of feel like, but you're still in position where you
Speaker 1: could trade up if you want to. But you've got
Speaker 1: so many teams that are quarterback Needy, and you know,
Speaker 1: with the Cowboys, if you don't sign your guy along term,
Speaker 1: that's maybe something you missed out on right there. But
Speaker 1: I think overall, I'm far more comfortable now. I think
Speaker 1: there's to be a great player on that board. Smith
Speaker 1: from Alabama, the wide receiver, I think could be a
Speaker 1: great player. Pits from Florida could be a great player.
Speaker 1: I'm far more comfortable taken Farley right there at ten.
Speaker 1: You know, if you wanted Parsons, if that was a guy,
Speaker 1: there's going to be some players I believe for the
Speaker 1: Cowboys right there at ten. I think the only thing
Speaker 1: you missed out on being in the top at four
Speaker 1: is if you had to legitimately go get the quarterback
Speaker 1: because you didn't feel like that you could get your
Speaker 1: guys signed long term. You know, Brian, you talk about that.
Speaker 1: I think the bigger thing that would have happened if
Speaker 1: you finished in the top five. You now have currency
Speaker 1: and you change the leverage when it comes to the
Speaker 1: negotiation with Dak Prescott. Now you can kind of put
Speaker 1: out those smoke setting. I was like, hey, it doesn't matter,
Speaker 1: We'll just take a quarterback and as long as like
Speaker 1: justin fields continues to play like that. It now drives
Speaker 1: the conversation because now you're talking about maybe four quarterbacks
Speaker 1: going in the top five, and so the leverage changes
Speaker 1: and it so it gives you out if the negotiation
Speaker 1: doesn't go your way, you say, okay, cool, we'll just
Speaker 1: find we're just on a young quarterback and away we go,
Speaker 1: or we trade down and we get enough capital to
Speaker 1: now go and feel a couple of different spots. So
Speaker 1: you lose out on that opportunity, but I think it
Speaker 1: better aligns with some of the more immediate needs of
Speaker 1: the Cowboys. Add well, yeah, and real quick check before
Speaker 1: I know you've got an opinion on this, I think
Speaker 1: that you know Cincinnati is now in a position where
Speaker 1: I believe they're at five where they're going to hold
Speaker 1: the card to somebody trying to get up. Because Philadelphia
Speaker 1: and Jeff and I do a show every week together
Speaker 1: and we've talked about if you're the Eagles, you're looking
Speaker 1: at a quarterback at six, you're absolutely looking at a
Speaker 1: quarterback at six, and you know Cincinnati could have been
Speaker 1: that team. If you want maybe the last quarterback, you
Speaker 1: want the next best quarterback, that's five is the spot.
Speaker 1: So if you were in that top five, to your point, Bucky,
Speaker 1: you were going to have that ability to trade back
Speaker 1: if you wanted to, or stand in there and make it.
Speaker 1: And I guess what I'll do is I'll just kick
Speaker 1: a question back to you guys like Bucky, because my
Speaker 1: thought initially is if you want to know names that
Speaker 1: you could have had at four or five and you
Speaker 1: can't at ten, we don't know. Because I remember when
Speaker 1: I used to do simulators, and we're doing mock drafts
Speaker 1: last year. Anytime Ceedee Lamb made it to seventeen, I
Speaker 1: would just on my YouTube or whatever. I would be like,
Speaker 1: now we're going to restart this. Obviously that's not gonna happen,
Speaker 1: and well, lo and behold it did. But I think
Speaker 1: in theory, names that the Cowboys could have considered in
Speaker 1: the top five that may not make it to ten.
Speaker 1: Caleb Farley, Micah Parsons, so Penn State linebacker Caleb Farley,
Speaker 1: maybe Patrick Certan. I think there could be names that
Speaker 1: you would have considered that because you're now at ten,
Speaker 1: don't make it there. There could be a corner or
Speaker 1: two off the board. Michael Parsons could be off the board.
Speaker 1: You could have two offensive tackles off the board. So
Speaker 1: I do think there are names not guys that I
Speaker 1: would be like, oh, I can't believe we didn't get
Speaker 1: to be in the top five. But yeah, I think
Speaker 1: some of those names absolutely could be gone when you
Speaker 1: get on the clock. Yeah, I think. I think. I
Speaker 1: think the bigger thing now the quarterback conversation. We think
Speaker 1: about the teams at the top. So at the tip
Speaker 1: you have Jackson's I was gonna take a quarterback, the
Speaker 1: New York Jackson are gonna be in the mix, we
Speaker 1: don't know, because the Miami Dolphins are the ultimate wildcard
Speaker 1: when it comes to two and what they decide. Then
Speaker 1: you have the Atlanta Falcons at four. So three of
Speaker 1: the top five we know. You talk about the Eagles
Speaker 1: being at six, and then behind them you have enough
Speaker 1: teams that have the interest. And so if you are
Speaker 1: in the top five and you're the guy boys, you
Speaker 1: just talk about being able to really parlay that and
Speaker 1: play other teams against one another to really maybe get
Speaker 1: a big haul. But in terms of the players, the
Speaker 1: players that will fall out of there, because we would
Speaker 1: think that three maybe four quarterbacks and go a good
Speaker 1: player is gonna fall to them. It's a matter of
Speaker 1: are you comfortable pulling the trigger on a guy at
Speaker 1: the top ten? Does his great equate to where you're
Speaker 1: gonna have to select him at well, I think the
Speaker 1: MoCo's in front of you are probably interested in a quarterback.
Speaker 1: So if Trevor Lawrence goes one, then you've got Zach
Speaker 1: Wilson justin fields kind of in that mix for the
Speaker 1: second and third quarterbacks taken, then maybe Trey Lance maybe
Speaker 1: the fourth guy off the board. So there's a chance
Speaker 1: for four quarterbacks to be off the board, So that
Speaker 1: way you get what would that be the fifth or
Speaker 1: sixth best non quarterback falling to you, and hopefully one
Speaker 1: of those guys fits your need at corner or at linebacker,
Speaker 1: like we said with Michael Parsons, potentially, I think Michael
Speaker 1: Parsons might fit a little bit up there in the draft.
Speaker 1: He would be one of the names, Jeff, that I
Speaker 1: would agree with you on that wouldn't be there at ten,
Speaker 1: though he might have been there a little bit early on,
Speaker 1: maybe right after that. Five. Well, let's let's take let's
Speaker 1: take a little vote here, who's the best defensive player
Speaker 1: you guys have seen so far? Who's the best for me.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. See that, because whoever, whoever that is,
Speaker 1: that's likely to be the first player taken, I'm probably
Speaker 1: I think, well, I think we're all pretty good at this,
Speaker 1: We're all pretty good at evaluating, and I would trust
Speaker 1: anybody's opinion on this panel right now. If you said, hey, Brian,
Speaker 1: I think that Parsons is the best defensive player. Oh,
Speaker 1: by the way, Brian, I think Farley's the best defensive player.
Speaker 1: I mean, I would trust you guys to say that,
Speaker 1: because but that's that's where you know. That's whoever, whoever
Speaker 1: the first defensive player is, that's probably not the guy
Speaker 1: it's gonna be on your board. That's not gonna be
Speaker 1: whoever the second guy you say is, Oh, that guy
Speaker 1: very well could be the guy that you have. You
Speaker 1: have the chances Draft seven for me and I have
Speaker 1: it's the most unique draft I can remember. At the top,
Speaker 1: because if you're gonna tell me Micah Parsons is the
Speaker 1: best defender in the class, I'll say, okay. If you
Speaker 1: tell me Caleb Farley is the best defender, I'd be like, okay.
Speaker 1: If you wanted to say certain, if you want to
Speaker 1: tell me a Zizo, JILARI, the Georgia edge is the
Speaker 1: best defender in this class. I'll listen to you. I
Speaker 1: don't know, because there's no Ramsey, there's no Miles Garrett,
Speaker 1: there's no Bosa that they don't even well, Jeff. I
Speaker 1: was trying to I was trying to build you. I
Speaker 1: was trying to build you up there, Jeff. And now
Speaker 1: you're making me feel bad about selection. I mean, you
Speaker 1: give me, give me one name, though I can't. I'm
Speaker 1: not fine personally. If it was me, there's if it
Speaker 1: had me, there's difference. If it was me, I would
Speaker 1: say Farley that I would I have and I And
Speaker 1: it's crazy to say this for a guy. Both guys
Speaker 1: did not play. There's this still last year and now
Speaker 1: and I'm thinking which one do I want to roll?
Speaker 1: If I'm the Cowboys, I think I'm rolling the dice
Speaker 1: on Farley if you know over But to me, I
Speaker 1: don't know whoever, And it might be the teams might say,
Speaker 1: you know what, there's not a consensus number one defensive
Speaker 1: player on that board, and all of a sudden, those
Speaker 1: guys started going down, down, down down, and that you
Speaker 1: never know. At ten, you might be sitting there with you.
Speaker 1: Might be the team that picks the first defensive player.
Speaker 1: Is what I'm saying. That that's it and that's a ten. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and Brian, I think then the conversation and goes to
Speaker 1: if we're having a debate, you talk about Kayleb Farley,
Speaker 1: do I want to take Kayleb Farley? Do I want
Speaker 1: to take Patrick Surtam because I've seen Patrick Curtan play
Speaker 1: this year, Because some of these debates are going to
Speaker 1: be decided, well, I've seen this guy this year. I
Speaker 1: haven't seen this guy in a year. I don't know
Speaker 1: if I can do it. And so this year is
Speaker 1: unlike any that I've seen in terms of defense. I mean,
Speaker 1: defense is so far behind the offensive players and the
Speaker 1: skill players that are available that I think you have
Speaker 1: to be very very careful with you the Cowboys, not
Speaker 1: to reach and to really dig down deep to figure
Speaker 1: out which defensive player you would want to take at ten.
Speaker 1: This is gonna be a this draft that could be
Speaker 1: when when we look back three years from now, it
Speaker 1: could be like the draft with the JJ Watt and
Speaker 1: Smith they have like there's nine great players taken and
Speaker 1: then Jacksonville took took Gabber, you know, and it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, it's like, yeah, everybody got a whole fame player,
Speaker 1: but then you took gabber. You know. That's what can
Speaker 1: happen here. Seriously, I mean it, you know, to me,
Speaker 1: I would it's funny with all those with the defensive
Speaker 1: players on the board and Slater, the offensive tackle from
Speaker 1: Northwestern's there. I'm kind of go away to tackle. I
Speaker 1: raised in my hand after I take a bite in
Speaker 1: my turkey sandwich in the draft room and go, uh
Speaker 1: does anybody like Slater? I like Slater Northwestern tackle? You know,
Speaker 1: I mean, there's there's some questions, but because I can
Speaker 1: say you might be the first you might be the
Speaker 1: first team at ten that takes a defense four wide.
Speaker 1: Maybe we're going Jalen Waddle, DeVante Smith, Kyle Pence, let's
Speaker 1: go yeah. Oh man, there's I mean, and that's another thing.
Speaker 1: As those wide receivers in the top ten Smith, I
Speaker 1: mean Smith from Alabama. You're kidding me? There those guys there.
Speaker 1: I can't wait. The Smith. The Smith conversation is one
Speaker 1: that is going to be interesting because he scares me
Speaker 1: a little bit. Wait, is weights he's one hundred and
Speaker 1: seventy five and four four or four eight four four
Speaker 1: nine is fast? But is that fast enough to convince me?
Speaker 1: The offset the skinny issue because when we think about it,
Speaker 1: when was the last time a skinny wide receiver has
Speaker 1: come in and dominate the league? Because when you take
Speaker 1: him that high, that's what the expectation is. And I
Speaker 1: just have these images of Tavon Austin all over again
Speaker 1: and the debate like, hey, don't take don't take small
Speaker 1: guys at the top of the board. I think, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think the difference would be where to go get
Speaker 1: him set up? Where to get muy. I think that's
Speaker 1: so true. That's why I wanted to be on with
Speaker 1: Brian and Bucky because I think, like I'm fundamentally opposed
Speaker 1: to some of these ideas that it's like, well, I
Speaker 1: haven't seen a lot of this, Like the short safety,
Speaker 1: I'll take him, the short quarterback, I'll take him. I'll
Speaker 1: take him. But yeah, it looks different. It looks different.
Speaker 1: But if you're making a list of DeVante Smith's weaknesses,
Speaker 1: what is the list? I think it's he's skinny, nice,
Speaker 1: he's slight, he's slight. That's I think that there's no question,
Speaker 1: no question, no question. Look, he's he's a fantastic prospect,
Speaker 1: He's a fantastic college player. However, when I think about, Okay,
Speaker 1: I got DeVante Smith lined up opposite Jalen Ramsey, how
Speaker 1: do I feel about that matchup? Do I feel like
Speaker 1: he's gonna be able to hold his own when people
Speaker 1: put their hands on because Brian and Jeff, you know,
Speaker 1: the first thing that people are gonna do when he's
Speaker 1: running free in space those first four games. Okay, let's
Speaker 1: walk up and let's put our hands on him, and
Speaker 1: does he have enough to withstand that? Down after down
Speaker 1: after down ufter down. Now, the other thing would be
Speaker 1: maybe he's Marvin Harrison. So yeah, I mean like like
Speaker 1: that would be that that would be the thing. But
Speaker 1: when you look at some of the other guys that
Speaker 1: may have more like Jamar Chase and some of those
Speaker 1: other guys you just have to balance as a top
Speaker 1: ten pick, do I feel good about the skinny guy
Speaker 1: taking him number one to be my number one receiver? Bucky, Bucky,
Speaker 1: I didn't get to do the show with you last year.
Speaker 1: What did you feel about the build of Ceedee Lamb
Speaker 1: when you watched him the build? How he physically looked.
Speaker 1: So it's funny. I think I likened Ceedee Lamb to
Speaker 1: a more dynamic version of DeAndre Hopkins because I didn't
Speaker 1: feel like Ceedee Lamb created like great separation as a
Speaker 1: route runner. But I felt like he was a catch
Speaker 1: and run specialist. You want to get the ball to
Speaker 1: him and let him run because the best thing that
Speaker 1: he did was either after the catch or went into
Speaker 1: fifty fifty ball. And so that was the difference in
Speaker 1: my mind between him and Jerry Judy. I felt like
Speaker 1: Jerry Judy was more of the route runner, Ceedee Lamb
Speaker 1: was more of the playmaker. And that was my recent
Speaker 1: comp too, when you guys started talking about skinny white receivers. Now,
Speaker 1: I know, Ceedee Lamb's a little bit, I guess, wider
Speaker 1: than DeVante Smith, but overall, I mean, you look at
Speaker 1: Cede Lamb out there, and he looks skinny. I mean
Speaker 1: he's got that build where he's slender and he's shifty
Speaker 1: and a playmaker with the ball in his hands. Now,
Speaker 1: I want to keep talking about these measurables. I think
Speaker 1: this is a conversation. We're gonna have it again. Kind
Speaker 1: of in the third segment, of where does this fit?
Speaker 1: And that's why I'm glad Jeff Cavanalls on this show
Speaker 1: because I think this is going to be interesting talking
Speaker 1: about where players are physically challenged and how that kind
Speaker 1: of affects him as opposed to where it did in
Speaker 1: the past. It come drafted. But when we come back,
Speaker 1: let's do some twitter on the twenty and we're gonna
Speaker 1: go to the opposite side of the top ten. We
Speaker 1: talked about some of the names that could fall. What
Speaker 1: about the names that could jump to the Cowboys at
Speaker 1: number ten when we return here on the Dallas Cowboys
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Speaker 1: This is the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show. Onto
Speaker 1: the second segment here of the Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: Draft Show. Glad you're with us having a lot of
Speaker 1: fun talking about this upcoming offseason for the Dallas Cowboys.
Speaker 1: In the entire NFL Draft, Bucky Brooks, Brian brought us,
Speaker 1: Jeff Cavanall joining us today, and then I'm Kyle Yeomen's
Speaker 1: just you're trying to drive the bus as always here
Speaker 1: on the Draft Show, and it's time now to jump
Speaker 1: into some fan questions via Twitter on the twenty Twitter
Speaker 1: on the Twitter there it is Chris being doing fantastic
Speaker 1: work in the back as always. Now we're gonna start
Speaker 1: things off from a question from Christian and I like
Speaker 1: this because it kind of flip flops. What we talked
Speaker 1: about in the first segment in terms of guys who
Speaker 1: could fall in from the top ten to the tenth
Speaker 1: overall pick. But are there any names that are not
Speaker 1: being talked about right now for the Cowboys at ten
Speaker 1: that could be selected there from maybe the backside of
Speaker 1: that top ten. So I'm gonna take these names out
Speaker 1: of the running, every one of the four quarterbacks, so Lance, Wilson,
Speaker 1: Lawrence of course. And then we'll take all those quarterbacks
Speaker 1: out of the mix. So I'm also gonna take Kyle Pitts,
Speaker 1: Kayla Farley, Patrick's Artan Slater. There is all the offensive
Speaker 1: tackles Seoul and Rousseau out of the mix as well.
Speaker 1: So that's ten names across the board that have now
Speaker 1: flattened away from the Cowboys. I want to find somebody
Speaker 1: that's not been named there that could fall or it
Speaker 1: could jump to the Cowboys. And we'll start with you,
Speaker 1: Bucky Man. That's tough. You took away all the good players.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, tell you we're all the good players
Speaker 1: at the top of the thing. Um, guys, it's crazy, right,
Speaker 1: and I'm ahead reach but yeah, yeah, I'm not. I'm
Speaker 1: not in love with this player. But I can understand
Speaker 1: how people are gonna fall in love with and I'm
Speaker 1: gonna throw the name out and I don't want to
Speaker 1: be tied to it, But Gregory Roussou is gonna be
Speaker 1: a name that we talked about and the reason why
Speaker 1: he's gonna test like a freak. He's gonna test like
Speaker 1: a free He's long, he has that production from that
Speaker 1: one season. He hasn't played this year, and people are
Speaker 1: going to imagine, particularly if the coaches are driving the process.
Speaker 1: Coaches are going to say, man, I take this guy,
Speaker 1: I can take him to the next level. Um being
Speaker 1: a former high school receiver that made the transition, everyone
Speaker 1: is going to gamble on the upside. And in a
Speaker 1: year where you don't have certainty on defense, I just
Speaker 1: believe that people could reach for pass rushes because they
Speaker 1: coveted at a premium. And Jeff, I know you do
Speaker 1: not like Rousseau because you and I have texted about
Speaker 1: how we both do not like Russa. So tell me
Speaker 1: why you don't like Rousseau and how that could be
Speaker 1: the case you're trying to do. You're trying to pit
Speaker 1: me against Buck to tear down the guy. He said,
Speaker 1: but he told you straight a little bit either, Okay. Um,
Speaker 1: so saying saying that I don't like Rousseau, I think
Speaker 1: would make people think, oh, but would you pick him
Speaker 1: in the twenties. No, I'm want to be very clear here.
Speaker 1: Rousseau goes in the fourth round. Okay, I want to
Speaker 1: be very clear here. I don't I don't need a
Speaker 1: two fifty pounds, six foot seven guy who lines up
Speaker 1: at nose tackle to run around guards. Um, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: throw out a very random name because I was working
Speaker 1: through some offensive line yesterday. Because Kyle's making us reach.
Speaker 1: This is the first this is the first line. The
Speaker 1: Cowboys have an offensive line that's awesome. You're making us reach.
Speaker 1: Nobody wants this pick. Yes, Elijah vera Tucker at USC oh,
Speaker 1: I think for you acle or guard, and I think
Speaker 1: he could play it at a high up. So I'm
Speaker 1: just gonna throw out a random offensive line name that
Speaker 1: I think is going to be a first rounder, that
Speaker 1: I think could have position versatility and is a good prospect.
Speaker 1: So you took away, as Bucky said, you took away
Speaker 1: the good players. So I'll go to this. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: go to the slightly less good players, or I'll cheat
Speaker 1: if Brian's not gonna say it, and I'll throw out
Speaker 1: Jac Horne as well. Oh jeez, Jeff to me, how
Speaker 1: many names? How many? How many names are you gonna Kyle?
Speaker 1: How about a better control of the situation here. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: If I were in the same room, it would be
Speaker 1: much more controlled. It's the back of the virtual Brian.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Oh my gosh, Kyle, who who invited Jeff? Anyway?
Speaker 1: Who Jeff? This program? My god, I don't know. Jeff.
Speaker 1: That's a very good one, man, Jac Horne, I think
Speaker 1: now and saying I'll also say this, we're gonna get
Speaker 1: into measurables. But the Samuel kid from Florida State, I
Speaker 1: know he's five ten, but there's some Yeah, there's gonna
Speaker 1: be some people that're gonna fall in love with him.
Speaker 1: But I'll give you one that somebody I think will
Speaker 1: fall in love with and it might not be the cowboys,
Speaker 1: but he's going to come up the boards. Is Terence
Speaker 1: Marshall from LSU the wide receiver. I have a feeling
Speaker 1: that these people are now looking at these LSU wide
Speaker 1: receivers and if you have two thousand nineteen tape but
Speaker 1: watch He's two thousand and twenty tape before he left
Speaker 1: the program, and people there's some questions, Hey, why did
Speaker 1: you bail on the program at LSU. Hey, you know,
Speaker 1: but I'll tell you what. You watch him in this
Speaker 1: tape that the six seven games that he played, and
Speaker 1: he is the only thing that LSU has on offense,
Speaker 1: and they and teams know it, and he's still making plays.
Speaker 1: I have a feeling with what happened with the kid
Speaker 1: at Minnesota, Jamar Chase. People are gonna watch this tape
Speaker 1: and Marshall is gonna be a riser on a lot
Speaker 1: of people's boards. Probably not for the Cowboys at ten,
Speaker 1: but that's a guy to keep an eye on. In
Speaker 1: Jeff's right about porn, and I'm glad he said that.
Speaker 1: And I'm also glad he said about the USC guard tackle.
Speaker 1: I think that was a really, really good get on
Speaker 1: his part. I really do look look to piggyback on
Speaker 1: both of you guys point. I absolutely agree Bara Tucker
Speaker 1: as someone as of interest because everybody wants position versatility upfront.
Speaker 1: You can't get enough guys that can do a bunch
Speaker 1: of different things, particularly if you're the Cowboys and you're
Speaker 1: looking at what you have and Leall Collins and Tyrn
Speaker 1: Smith and just being able to reshuffle the deck. If
Speaker 1: Neeby that would certainly work. Terence Marshall is interesting because
Speaker 1: I want to say he was a number one receiver
Speaker 1: when he came out of high school and have him
Speaker 1: watched him when he was high school as some of
Speaker 1: these events, like, he has everything that you look for
Speaker 1: in terms of the size, the athleticism, the route running,
Speaker 1: ability to skill, and don't underestimate what Justin Jefferson's breakout
Speaker 1: is going to do for the LSU Y receivers. It's
Speaker 1: going to change how everyone looks. And even though we
Speaker 1: say this as scouts, don't scout the helmet, you're gonna
Speaker 1: look at what Justin Jefferson was able to do, and
Speaker 1: you're going to look at him play alongside Jamarches and Marston.
Speaker 1: You'd be like, you know what, Yeah, this guy can
Speaker 1: do it. These other guys can also do it. To
Speaker 1: your point, Bucky, I mean, I know Jeff and I
Speaker 1: have sat down and watch tape for seven years together
Speaker 1: and I always it's always like you're supposed to be
Speaker 1: watching this guy, but then you end up watching somebody
Speaker 1: else guy, and Jeff goes, hey, who is this? Who
Speaker 1: is this number seven? That what you know? Or who
Speaker 1: is this number whatever? And you're you're supposed to be
Speaker 1: watching like an offensive tackle, but then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: this number seven is catching every single ball and now
Speaker 1: you're going, oh, what years you at school? And then
Speaker 1: you make that mental note, Bucky. You and I've sat
Speaker 1: in those rooms. We've sat in those draft rooms and
Speaker 1: somebody brings up a name and we're like, I hate
Speaker 1: this player, but what you know I'm gonna do. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna watch this other guy is what I'm gonna Dante Smith,
Speaker 1: We all Dote Smith when we were watching. When you're
Speaker 1: watching Rugs and you're watching absolutely a sweat. Every play
Speaker 1: is being made by the skinny kid. That's neither one
Speaker 1: of the players I'm watching, and I'm like, why isn't
Speaker 1: this new declaring he's the best one? Yeah? Alabama stupid
Speaker 1: the fact that they had Judy and Leave in the
Speaker 1: first round and the ones in this year's draft to
Speaker 1: me are better. They're better than Judy and Rugs. It's
Speaker 1: stupid what's going on in Alabama. That's the great thing.
Speaker 1: When when that's a great thing, about Kat when he
Speaker 1: was watching take Kat was my go to guy, Like Kat,
Speaker 1: what years this kid that were that were that I'm
Speaker 1: watching here right, what year's that kid? Katie's like, Oh,
Speaker 1: he's only a sophomore process Okay, mental note, mental note
Speaker 1: next year. Yeah. Brian also wants to know their hometown
Speaker 1: for some reason. Hello like k T versus kid from
Speaker 1: Hey you want Lucky Day, Jeff, You want to know
Speaker 1: that because there's certain there's certain places in the country
Speaker 1: that are Florida Bill played Florida Yell City will beat
Speaker 1: the seven five seven if you go to the Tide
Speaker 1: Water region in Virginia, Michael Vick and new Smith like,
Speaker 1: there's there's something in the water. And so you want
Speaker 1: to know those areas because look, you just find, you
Speaker 1: just find guys. They have a way of just KYD
Speaker 1: give him one of those towns. Brian be like, uh huh,
Speaker 1: thought he might be, thought he might be. I knew
Speaker 1: it exactly straight off the dome. But I agree. I
Speaker 1: like Terrence Marshall Junior. I like him a lot, Brian,
Speaker 1: and I think I put him right there. And the
Speaker 1: kind of that second tier of wide receivers trying to
Speaker 1: innch into the first tier right there with maybe like
Speaker 1: a Rashad Bateman from Minnesota. Good player, that's a really
Speaker 1: good player. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I disagree with that. Actually,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't disagree with Tony Beanery. I think I think
Speaker 1: Marshall's right there with Tony though. That's how good I
Speaker 1: think he's been over the last couple of months. Now.
Speaker 1: This comes this question comes from Connor Liftsa on Twitter, who,
Speaker 1: of course is a big draft not I love following
Speaker 1: his stuff at Connor NFL Draft on Twitter. He's fantastic.
Speaker 1: So he asked us a really good question about Michael Parsons.
Speaker 1: He said, Michael Parsons as a pure linebacker at the
Speaker 1: tenth overall pick is a no bueno for him anyways,
Speaker 1: But what if they draft him to rush the passer
Speaker 1: for say, thirty to forty percent of his snaps? Would
Speaker 1: that make you feel better about the value of taking
Speaker 1: the linebacker at the tenth overall pick. That could also
Speaker 1: be intriguing as an edge rusher. Brian, Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: Bucky mentioned about the versatility and stuff like that, and man,
Speaker 1: I was just for that size, you know, and he's
Speaker 1: freakish how big he really is? I mean I was
Speaker 1: watching speaking to Freakis Xavian Collins from Tulsa. That's another
Speaker 1: freakish guy to watch when it comes to these linebackers
Speaker 1: and stuff like that. But I think the thing with
Speaker 1: I think the things with Parsons that that makes him,
Speaker 1: uh you know that this intriguing is the size. But
Speaker 1: I'm also thinking about, you know, the rush, and he's right,
Speaker 1: and I think when you you you know, the one
Speaker 1: thing you want is you want some stoutness. You want
Speaker 1: that ability to hold up, you want that ability to
Speaker 1: be physical. And you know, this guy can make some
Speaker 1: impressive plays. He really can. But there's that scares me
Speaker 1: to death, those stretches of games where you're thinking, man,
Speaker 1: just go dominate that Purdue guy, Go dominate that Indiana guy. Go.
Speaker 1: You know, and he's just not you know, it's just
Speaker 1: not always there for him. But as a pass rusher,
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, I mean, because what he is, that
Speaker 1: power enables him when he has to take on guards,
Speaker 1: when he has to take on backs, he could just
Speaker 1: over power people to get to the quarterback and affect
Speaker 1: the pocket. So and I think he can finish. I
Speaker 1: think there's some things that he does as a finisher
Speaker 1: that are really really good. I just wish at sixty three,
Speaker 1: two hundred and forty four pounds that I saw it
Speaker 1: like every single play. He wears a number of LaVar
Speaker 1: Arrington back in the day at number eleven. That was
Speaker 1: a finisher. That wasn't every down sucker right there, And
Speaker 1: so i'd see that eleven at Penn State uniform. I'm thinking, Oh,
Speaker 1: he's not LaVar Arrington. And you know, and here I am.
Speaker 1: I have to pick him probably in the top ten
Speaker 1: to get him. You know, I'm gonna say this, Brian,
Speaker 1: and I'm probably too close to the kid because I've
Speaker 1: known him since high school. One. He was a defensive
Speaker 1: end in high school and so he was more natural,
Speaker 1: I would say, with his hand in the dirt, and
Speaker 1: so he's learned how to play linebacker. The only thing
Speaker 1: that ever scares me about Michael Parsons is I would
Speaker 1: say the level of immaturity. And so some of the
Speaker 1: inconsistency is due to the immature. And I just don't
Speaker 1: know if that light comes on as a pro. And
Speaker 1: so when I think of a top ten pick and
Speaker 1: we're talking about checking off all the boxes, I think
Speaker 1: you have to examine the football character and just make sure,
Speaker 1: particularly given it, I don't want to put this on them,
Speaker 1: particularly given the Dwayne Haskins situation and how they played
Speaker 1: out in Washington. You just want to make sure that
Speaker 1: the guy you're bringing in he is going to play
Speaker 1: to the standard. Because he gets to the game and
Speaker 1: he's ready to play to the standard. He's not distracted
Speaker 1: by life. Well it congratulations, Bucky, you just killed the
Speaker 1: kid in the eyes of all cowboy fans. So congratulations. Yeah, yeah, everybody.
Speaker 1: Bucky just put the kid in the headline. And you know, hey,
Speaker 1: I'm just kidding, but yeah, but when you hear those things,
Speaker 1: when you talk about taking a guy that high, you
Speaker 1: want you want everything to be in line. You don't
Speaker 1: want those questions. Yeah, the tape is good, but if
Speaker 1: you're telling me there's immaturity things, you know, that's that's
Speaker 1: just what you what you can read. I think that's
Speaker 1: the thing. I think that's the thing that you have
Speaker 1: to investigate. Like we talk about at top ten, you
Speaker 1: want to make sure we get it right. So we're
Speaker 1: trying to mitigate all the risk, and so you want
Speaker 1: to make sure that your guys love it. And so
Speaker 1: if you come from a place where if you're gonna
Speaker 1: take an off the ball linebacker, particularly that huh you're thinking,
Speaker 1: I want someone that is like Luke Keekley in terms
Speaker 1: of the maturity or the way that they get it,
Speaker 1: or I mean even like Sean Lee in terms of
Speaker 1: just a maturity part of it. That guy has to
Speaker 1: come in because if he's coming in, he's probably coming
Speaker 1: into supplant Jaylen Smith and the love hate relationship that
Speaker 1: Cowboys fans have with Jaylen Smith? Are you trying to
Speaker 1: replace him with someone who could potentially be like Jaylen
Speaker 1: Smith in terms of that thing, like, man, does he
Speaker 1: love it? Does he make plays? Does he feel like
Speaker 1: he's Hollywood Henderson? Or is he like what what are
Speaker 1: we getting in the building? Well? In Parsonsincent alone in
Speaker 1: that draft, even on the deep intub side of the football,
Speaker 1: I think with some of those issues in twenty twenty
Speaker 1: kind of it gives you an odd look at how
Speaker 1: they kind of affect these prospects and how they deal
Speaker 1: with those off the field issues. One of the guys
Speaker 1: I watched yesterday, I really liked his tape, Dave and
Speaker 1: Nixon out of Iowa, the defensive tackle. I really liked
Speaker 1: this tape a lot, but from a couple of people
Speaker 1: that I had texted about it, that had kind of
Speaker 1: talked to some scouts, they have issues or at least
Speaker 1: questions around his maturity. And this is the Big Ten
Speaker 1: defensive player of the year and somebody who put up
Speaker 1: a ton of production. But just that that mindset and
Speaker 1: that drive. It's something that I know teams are especially
Speaker 1: looking for because maybe the Dwayne Haskins situation, because of
Speaker 1: the mental toughness that took to get through the twenty
Speaker 1: twenty season. I think there's a lot of different factors
Speaker 1: that play into that. Okay, so we got to take
Speaker 1: our second break here on the Draft Show. When we
Speaker 1: come back, I want to have a quick conversation about
Speaker 1: those measurables. Jeff wants all the weird guys when it
Speaker 1: comes to measurables, and Bucky and Brian are going to
Speaker 1: put him in his place. Maybe we'll see when we
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Speaker 1: Cowboys dot Com Draft Show final ten minutes here of
Speaker 1: the Draft Show, presented by Miller Light Here on Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys dot com. Kyle Yeoman's Brian brought us Bucky Brooks
Speaker 1: and Jeff Cavanaugh as this is the first hour long
Speaker 1: show we'll have of twenty twenty one. The Cowboys eliminated
Speaker 1: from postseason contention, so it's officially draft season here on
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys dot com and Brian Bucky along with David Hellman,
Speaker 1: will be every Tuesday at ten o'clock. And then Jeff
Speaker 1: who's a part of our other crew. We've got Dame Brugler,
Speaker 1: Jeff Cavanaugh and Kevin Turner. They're on Thursdays at ten o'clock,
Speaker 1: so twice the Draft Show every single week Tuesdays Thursday's
Speaker 1: ten o'clock. Make sure and set your calendars, you set
Speaker 1: your schedules accordingly to watch us live and then listen
Speaker 1: to us after those are dated as well. But it's
Speaker 1: exciting to be along with you guys. And we had
Speaker 1: this conversation minimally last week and I wanted to kind
Speaker 1: of revisit it, and we even started kind of talking
Speaker 1: about it in the first segment. But how far has
Speaker 1: the league gone away from looking at the measurables, looking
Speaker 1: at the physicalities and the freaks that are coming out
Speaker 1: of the draft in terms of just the game changing
Speaker 1: type of prospects when it comes to their physical abilities,
Speaker 1: and are there going to be guys that are physically
Speaker 1: challenged taken high like maybe Kyler Murray who was picked
Speaker 1: number one overall offensively, but then there was maybe an
Speaker 1: Antoine Winfield junior who was one of the better defensive
Speaker 1: rookies this season in the NFL. Bucky, how far is
Speaker 1: the league going away from these physical attributes and these
Speaker 1: measurables whenever they come to their draft evaluations. You know,
Speaker 1: it really depends. I think as the scouting world has
Speaker 1: gotten younger, I think you have guys who have gone
Speaker 1: away from maybe some of those traditional norms when it
Speaker 1: comes to certain positions. But part of the reason why
Speaker 1: the measurables are the measurables is because you're trying to
Speaker 1: minimize the risk when it comes to drafting players. Like
Speaker 1: there's a reason why there's been a long history of
Speaker 1: certain guys that measure and weigh a certain thing, that
Speaker 1: have played for a long time in the league, and
Speaker 1: so you subscribe to that. So even though you may
Speaker 1: miss out on a few gems, overall, the odds suggest
Speaker 1: that you're going to get it right because they checked
Speaker 1: off the boxes. That said, if someone doesn't check off
Speaker 1: the boxes and height, weight, speed or those things, they
Speaker 1: better have a superpower because the only way that you're
Speaker 1: going to be able to let those guys come in
Speaker 1: they have to have extraordinary traits in another area. And
Speaker 1: so when you talk about it, Cala Murray, Cala Murray
Speaker 1: may be short, but his superpower was his speed, quickness,
Speaker 1: and his ability to make plays. Baker Mayfield was more
Speaker 1: of the anomaly because he didn't have any of those
Speaker 1: superpowered traits and was taking number one overall. But typically
Speaker 1: you have to have a superpower to go at the
Speaker 1: top of the board, right. Yeah, I'll tell you what though, Buck,
Speaker 1: he hit the nail on the head. John Dorsey took
Speaker 1: Baker Mayfield because he believed that Baker Mayfield could could
Speaker 1: command the locker room. That's why he he he liked
Speaker 1: the swagger of Baker Mayfield is why that pick was made.
Speaker 1: He felt like that Baker's teammates would gravitate towards him,
Speaker 1: would play for would run through the wall for him.
Speaker 1: So you know that's there's certain beliefs. But Bucky's also
Speaker 1: right about these new age general managers. You know, they
Speaker 1: don't look at things like the old the Ron Wolves
Speaker 1: and the Bill Polians and the Al Davises and those people.
Speaker 1: It's a different era of general managers. I mean I've
Speaker 1: seen the list, you know, Bucky works in the NFL network.
Speaker 1: I see the list of general managers that are interviewed
Speaker 1: for these jobs, and I'm going, who who, Who's that?
Speaker 1: But that's what's going to happen. And this group is
Speaker 1: going to change, and they're going to draft players differently.
Speaker 1: They're added to it's about players are going to be differently.
Speaker 1: They might believe in all the metrics and things like that,
Speaker 1: but man, it's like they'll just take guys and it
Speaker 1: doesn't matter height, weight, speed, you know. And I and
Speaker 1: for the for the for the most part, I like
Speaker 1: to see that because I'm just gonna say, in this
Speaker 1: draft so far, I've seen a couple of players I
Speaker 1: mentioned Samuel from Florida State. Rondel Moore is another one
Speaker 1: from Purdum that's five nine eighty. I watch him play
Speaker 1: and I'm going, holy geez, you know, wow, Okay, I
Speaker 1: see it. You know, maybe not, you know, we'll see
Speaker 1: where he gets in the draft and stuff. But there
Speaker 1: are some guys that they could really get your attention
Speaker 1: that that don't have ideal measurables, but they have, like
Speaker 1: Bucky's talking about, that superpower that makes them different than
Speaker 1: everybody else, and some of those measurables are incredibly important.
Speaker 1: I mean, I remember, you know, I think until it
Speaker 1: burns you personally, you can ignore or what other people
Speaker 1: try to tell you. Because, for instance, the corner who
Speaker 1: runs four six or worse. To Bucky's point, you know,
Speaker 1: a lot of teams aren't trying to pick a slow
Speaker 1: corner because you're like, all right, how many great ones
Speaker 1: have there been? And somebody pulls out a spreadsheet of
Speaker 1: all the corners ever drafted that ran a four six
Speaker 1: and they're like, well we found two, and you're like, okay,
Speaker 1: so we should avoid that risk, and it's like, yes,
Speaker 1: now we also were going to miss Josh Norman. Sorry,
Speaker 1: but we weren't willing to take that risk. And it
Speaker 1: burned me when I liked Tease Tabor and he ran
Speaker 1: a bad forty. Turned out he couldn't play in the league.
Speaker 1: So then Cameron Danceler. I watched Cameron Danceler cover Jamar Chase,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, first round. Then he ran in the
Speaker 1: four sixes and I said end of the second and
Speaker 1: I moved him just off a forty time. So you know,
Speaker 1: there's a reason for a lot of these things. I
Speaker 1: think some of the ones that I wouldn't worry about
Speaker 1: as much are basically the height and the weight. I
Speaker 1: understand why you want a three cone time, I understand
Speaker 1: why a corner's got to run fast, But if you're
Speaker 1: talking about weight or height in some cases, I think
Speaker 1: those are the ones I would push back against the
Speaker 1: most Well how about that? About this? If you watch
Speaker 1: Rashaan Slater out of Northwestern the tackle, everybody will tell
Speaker 1: you he's got short arms, and I'm watching it block
Speaker 1: Chase Young, and Chase Young they have to move him
Speaker 1: to the other side of the field to get him
Speaker 1: away from Slater. You know, they're saying, people say, oh,
Speaker 1: he's got short arms, short arms. Yeah, but he's blocking
Speaker 1: the best player in the country right now. You know,
Speaker 1: I mean, what are we? What are we doing? Here
Speaker 1: are we? And sometimes you've become a slave to that
Speaker 1: line of thinking, and you know it it'll, it'll, it'll,
Speaker 1: it'll take you the wrong direction a lot of the
Speaker 1: times though, yeah you know, yeah, no, but I would say,
Speaker 1: like cal like outside of this, like in theory, what
Speaker 1: we're doing is a beauty pageant, right, And so if
Speaker 1: we think about the first round them getting the crown
Speaker 1: and Tierra, you just want to check off the boxes
Speaker 1: to make sure. And so it's not like, oh I
Speaker 1: don't like a player because they don't up all those attributes?
Speaker 1: Is okay? Is this a first round player? Because with
Speaker 1: your general managers, you're going through the checklist and you're
Speaker 1: trying to figure out and approximate. Okay, where's the risk
Speaker 1: reward factor? Is this more of a second round player
Speaker 1: based on a I like everything, but he doesn't have this,
Speaker 1: And so it's just that in a perfect world, you
Speaker 1: want your first round pick to really be a superhero
Speaker 1: that can leap tall builders in a single bound, but
Speaker 1: it doesn't always happen. Yeah, you want your you want that,
Speaker 1: like Buggy's talking about, you want your beauty patchet to
Speaker 1: be in the top ten one of the finalists. You
Speaker 1: don't want them to be like doing the number at
Speaker 1: the end of the night. You know where the other
Speaker 1: authorty girls are kind of doing some numbers. Thank you
Speaker 1: for being in the patchet. You want Miss you want
Speaker 1: Miss Georgia, Miss Texas, Miss California. You knows Miss Mississippi.
Speaker 1: You know you want those. That's what you're looking for. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't even know anything about patchets, so I don't
Speaker 1: know if Hey, if you pick you pick miss if
Speaker 1: you picked Miss Trinidad Tobago in your top ten, you're
Speaker 1: gonna win the pool. Every single time. You're gonna win it.
Speaker 1: You're gonna win the pool. Uh, real quickly, we only
Speaker 1: have a couple of minutes here, but I want to
Speaker 1: I want you each to give me a name that
Speaker 1: fits into that category where the measurables aren't necessarily living
Speaker 1: up to the tape, and where you look at the
Speaker 1: tape and you say, hey, he's a baller. The productions there,
Speaker 1: the tape is there, but he's not necessarily first round
Speaker 1: because of blank. I want to I want to know
Speaker 1: a player from each one of those guys. From you,
Speaker 1: Jeff will start with you. Well, yeah, Gregory Rousseau. We
Speaker 1: already did this, okay, Yeah, yeah, Gregory Russeau is tall,
Speaker 1: and he's long, and he might run a good forty
Speaker 1: and he might test well athletically, and he had eighteen
Speaker 1: sacks in a single season against decent competition. What's not
Speaker 1: to like? And I think I just I watched that
Speaker 1: tape and I came away from it going then ain't
Speaker 1: a first round player, And I have no idea why
Speaker 1: people are talking about him in the top ten. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna gonna be the positive because I felt like I
Speaker 1: was negative early with Mica. So I'm gonna go up.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you a name. Aman Ross Saint Brown
Speaker 1: and the wide receiver from USC. He's probably gonna come
Speaker 1: in a little under the standard stuff, but in terms
Speaker 1: of being a baller, he's an absolute ball and he
Speaker 1: has someone as Steve Smith old school Steve Smith to
Speaker 1: him in terms of his competitiveness and Gruit deskn serving
Speaker 1: will because I think he's gonna outstad in pro. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, I've mentioned Samuel, a bunch from Florida State.
Speaker 1: I think somebody's gonna get a hell of a football
Speaker 1: player there. I love I love the fact that all
Speaker 1: these players have their dads were NFL players. Samuel Well,
Speaker 1: you know you're gonna watch the Clemson tape. You're gonna say, oh,
Speaker 1: the taller guy got him. Taller guy got him. But
Speaker 1: if you watch all his tape, all the opportunities he had,
Speaker 1: this kid goes out there and he plays hard every
Speaker 1: single snap. He makes plays on the ball, he could cover,
Speaker 1: he could tackle. I mean, he's kind of a blockdown tackler,
Speaker 1: but he's aggressive, he's he goes after you. I think
Speaker 1: people are gonna fall in love with him. I hope
Speaker 1: they give him the benefit to the doubt because of
Speaker 1: his height. Though he might be at the bottom of
Speaker 1: the first round, somebody might take him into second. But
Speaker 1: he's gonna be a hell of a football player for somebody.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Kyle, I thought we were doing negative things.
Speaker 1: I didn't realize we were doing positive things. So I
Speaker 1: thought we were just doing straight haydon. I didn't know
Speaker 1: we were doing positive things. Uh. Then I also want
Speaker 1: to piggyback. I want to piggyback on what Brian saying
Speaker 1: and throw out another corner. Elijah Molden at Washington Baller.
Speaker 1: I don't care about your height. Come on down. But
Speaker 1: to Bucky's point, I'm not picking in the first round
Speaker 1: because you're right. Yeah, a good player. His dad was.
Speaker 1: His dad was a good player. Elijah's a really solid player.
Speaker 1: A lot of versatility too. Somebody somewhere, some way, Isaiah
Speaker 1: Stanback is smiling with his U dub on Dallas Cowboys
Speaker 1: dot Com. Hey, hey, for a short guy. Don't forget
Speaker 1: Nick Bolton, flynebacker Missouri, Missouri. Oh yeah, yeah, don't forget him.
Speaker 1: I mean he's probably he's probably gonna be taken down
Speaker 1: towards the bottom, but he needs to be more up
Speaker 1: to the top. Don't let that six foot height scary
Speaker 1: at all. Number ten bron love it man, Hey, Buckie,
Speaker 1: Bucky told me, Parsons just kind of out there. That's
Speaker 1: not what he's saying. I'm gonna say. I'm gonna say
Speaker 1: Bolton is not gonna have that those issues he's gonna
Speaker 1: He loves football. I could tell watching tape. He loves football.
Speaker 1: He loves it, he loves it. We've got to get
Speaker 1: our background information on Nick Bolton from Bucky Brooks. Whenever
Speaker 1: we get an on here a couple of weeks. That's
Speaker 1: gonna do it for us here on the Dallas Cowboys
Speaker 1: dot Com Draft Show. Be sure to join us on
Speaker 1: Thursday at ten o'clock. We've got Dane, Jeff, and Kat
Speaker 1: breaking things down for you as we continue on here
Speaker 1: into the twenty twenty offseason, just one hundred and thirteen
Speaker 1: days away from the NFL Draft. But for Bucky Brooks,
Speaker 1: for Jeff Cavanall, thanks for popping on with us, Jeff,
Speaker 1: for Brian brought us, and for Chris Beam, I'm Kyle
Speaker 1: Yoman saying so long. We'll see you next time on
Speaker 1: the Draft Show. This has been a production of Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club