WEBVTT - S1 E9: Corruption 0:00:00.920 --> 0:00:05.120 Philadelphia, a mystery along the Cooper River after police pulled 0:00:05.120 --> 0:00:07.560 two cars out of the water. And that's not all 0:00:07.600 --> 0:00:09.680 that they found. This afternoon, Goodie being. 0:00:09.760 --> 0:00:12.440 Hensock and police confirmed today that a third vehicle was 0:00:12.480 --> 0:00:15.040 recovered from the Cooper River in South Jersey. 0:00:15.200 --> 0:00:18.320 Now on the ground, we see crime scene investigators sifting 0:00:18.360 --> 0:00:23.160 through the mud, the debris and presumably now evidence. 0:00:22.760 --> 0:00:26.200 There corpse was found inside one of those cars. The 0:00:26.239 --> 0:00:29.960 identity of that person is pending DNA testing. The FBI 0:00:30.160 --> 0:00:31.720 is assisting in that investigation. 0:00:34.360 --> 0:00:37.440 I'm Andrea Gunning and this is therein Gone South Street 0:00:38.200 --> 0:00:50.640 Episode nine. Corruption's a same in machine reached out in 0:00:50.720 --> 0:00:51.520 the dog. 0:00:54.320 --> 0:00:59.080 For you, PI last to me, I'll never give up, 0:01:00.960 --> 0:01:06.560 no matter how I opened my eyes. 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:11.319 Define car. 0:01:13.920 --> 0:01:16.200 Just to note that the views and opinions expressed in 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:19.840 this podcast are solely those of the individuals participating. This 0:01:19.959 --> 0:01:23.640 podcast also contained subject matter which may not be suitable 0:01:23.640 --> 0:01:35.880 for everyone. Discretion is advised. On an early Saturday morning 0:01:35.959 --> 0:01:38.720 in May twenty twenty four, my phone started blowing up. 0:01:39.000 --> 0:01:41.960 First came text messages from friends saying did you see this? 0:01:42.560 --> 0:01:45.080 It was a link to an article about three cars 0:01:45.120 --> 0:01:48.480 being pulled from a river in Pennsauken, New Jersey. Then 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:51.640 came a flurry of other messages saying one of the 0:01:51.760 --> 0:01:55.880 vehicles pulled from the water was reported to contain a body. 0:01:57.000 --> 0:01:59.840 That morning, my colleague Ben picked me up and we 0:02:00.040 --> 0:02:00.840 headed to Jersey. 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:08.560 Pennsauken is absolutely within like the radius. It's twenty minutes 0:02:08.560 --> 0:02:12.560 from Danielle's apartment. It's just outside of Philadelphia, just over 0:02:12.960 --> 0:02:14.280 the Van Franklin Bridge. 0:02:14.560 --> 0:02:16.880 Ben and I were headed to the Cooper River, which 0:02:16.919 --> 0:02:20.119 flows into the Delaware River. If geography isn't your thing, 0:02:20.160 --> 0:02:23.600 the Delaware River actually divides New Jersey from Pennsylvania and 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:25.919 the rivers. It's about four blocks from the bar where 0:02:26.000 --> 0:02:30.040 Danielle and Richard were last seen leaving. It's just crazy 0:02:30.080 --> 0:02:32.480 that there's one body found in the car I knew. 0:02:33.240 --> 0:02:35.600 According to the article, the police were set up near 0:02:35.680 --> 0:02:37.680 a driving range near the Cooper River. 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:40.359 That secluded that secluded. 0:02:41.880 --> 0:02:44.880 By the time we arrived, TV news crews were on site, 0:02:44.919 --> 0:02:49.400 along with a helicopter hovering overhead. At first glance, the 0:02:49.440 --> 0:02:52.919 spot wasn't exactly where I would imagine someone would dump 0:02:52.960 --> 0:02:56.440 a car. While crews pulled vehicles out of the river, 0:02:56.840 --> 0:02:59.240 there were people one hundred feet away working on their 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:03.240 golf swings. Ben was on the phone with FBI agent 0:03:03.280 --> 0:03:07.080 Fido Rosselli and I walked around the area. By that time, 0:03:07.160 --> 0:03:09.679 the search and rescue teams had parked their vehicles as 0:03:09.720 --> 0:03:12.280 a sort of shield, so we couldn't really see what 0:03:12.360 --> 0:03:14.680 was going on. When I got back to the car, 0:03:14.760 --> 0:03:17.480 I could tell from Ben's face that we hit another 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:18.040 dead end. 0:03:19.000 --> 0:03:21.400 I hear anything with by getting update for my good 0:03:21.440 --> 0:03:23.320 I'll get you out sounds good. 0:03:23.520 --> 0:03:26.720 Appreciate it, and sure enough, none of the three vehicles 0:03:26.760 --> 0:03:30.880 pulled from the water belonged to Richard. According to NBC News, 0:03:30.960 --> 0:03:33.840 the body found in one of those cars was later 0:03:33.919 --> 0:03:37.040 identified as a Jersey woman who had been missing since 0:03:37.080 --> 0:03:41.440 twenty ten. Don't get me wrong, we're both relieved for 0:03:41.520 --> 0:03:44.880 the family of that missing New Jersey woman, but it's 0:03:44.920 --> 0:03:48.640 a rollercoaster of emotion. This whole experience was a reminder 0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:52.320 that on any given day, a discovery could be made 0:03:52.920 --> 0:03:56.720 that would turn this case on its head. Anytime a 0:03:56.760 --> 0:03:59.760 car is found, Danielle and Richard's names will come up. 0:04:00.240 --> 0:04:03.760 It's all just a mind fuck. I can't even imagine 0:04:03.800 --> 0:04:06.800 how many times the families had to go through something 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:07.160 like this. 0:04:07.680 --> 0:04:09.600 If you're listening and you're not in their shoes, you 0:04:09.600 --> 0:04:10.520 should feel grateful. 0:04:11.560 --> 0:04:16.280 That's journalist Steve Volk. He wrote about Danielle and Richard's disappearance. 0:04:17.040 --> 0:04:17.800 I would love some. 0:04:17.839 --> 0:04:20.560 Kind of peace for those families to put to bed 0:04:21.440 --> 0:04:22.360 the what ifs. 0:04:22.960 --> 0:04:26.360 The what ifs in this case are endless. What if 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:28.240 they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. 0:04:28.880 --> 0:04:31.719 What if it was murder for hire. What if the 0:04:31.760 --> 0:04:34.520 car was crushed, What if the car was in the water. 0:04:35.120 --> 0:04:37.320 What if it was crushed then put in the water. 0:04:37.800 --> 0:04:42.120 There's no luck that created this. I don't see it. 0:04:42.600 --> 0:04:48.720 You have to have resources and connections to make a 0:04:48.880 --> 0:04:56.440 truck disappear. This was done seemingly professionally, and we don't 0:04:56.480 --> 0:04:59.960 know who, but there is at least one person out. 0:04:59.800 --> 0:05:00.560 There who knows. 0:05:01.279 --> 0:05:03.279 Here's FBI agent Vido Rosselli. 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:07.080 It's not going to get solved by forensics. This will 0:05:07.120 --> 0:05:11.120 get solved by somebody coming forward that had information, had 0:05:11.160 --> 0:05:13.600 certain keys that could tie this whole thing together. 0:05:14.080 --> 0:05:17.599 At least one person and quite possibly many many other 0:05:17.640 --> 0:05:19.320 people know something. 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:24.760 Logic would indicate it's at least two people that are 0:05:25.120 --> 0:05:29.680 confronting the victims, and then you're going to have at 0:05:29.800 --> 0:05:33.240 least a third person controlling the two people. 0:05:33.560 --> 0:05:36.719 And then to dispose of Richard's three thousand pound Dodge 0:05:36.760 --> 0:05:37.960 to codea pickup. 0:05:37.880 --> 0:05:40.080 Generally that would take two people too. The one person 0:05:40.120 --> 0:05:42.240 to drive the truck up there, another person to have 0:05:42.279 --> 0:05:45.040 a forklift to soft crush the vehicle right and then 0:05:45.120 --> 0:05:47.119 put it somewhere where it's not going to be seen. 0:05:47.760 --> 0:05:49.200 So that's going to be at least a couple of 0:05:49.200 --> 0:05:51.239 people just to get the truck crushed. 0:05:52.120 --> 0:05:54.479 If you start adding up the potential number of people 0:05:54.520 --> 0:05:57.760 involved in disposing the vehicle from start to finish, that's 0:05:57.760 --> 0:06:02.080 another two to four people minimum, and without any physical evidence, 0:06:02.160 --> 0:06:04.800 the only way Vito and the FBI are going to 0:06:04.839 --> 0:06:08.320 solve it is for someone to come forward and talk. 0:06:09.200 --> 0:06:12.440 I don't know how many people have direct knowledge, but 0:06:13.000 --> 0:06:16.760 these types of crimes are normally hard to keep quiet. 0:06:17.600 --> 0:06:20.440 Several folks out there. I got to know directly from 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:24.480 the horse's mouth what happened. And also there are a 0:06:24.520 --> 0:06:26.760 lot of people dead in this case that I wish 0:06:26.800 --> 0:06:27.640 I could go talk to. 0:06:28.839 --> 0:06:31.360 Vido never said who those people were, but I can 0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:34.120 think of two names right off the bat, Rob Lafloor, 0:06:34.200 --> 0:06:37.719 and Robert Carrey. Lafloor owned the junkyard believed to be 0:06:37.760 --> 0:06:41.000 where Richard's truck was crushed, and Robert Carey was the 0:06:41.080 --> 0:06:45.040 rumored hitman. Lafloora died of an overdose in twenty twelve. 0:06:45.600 --> 0:06:47.960 Carrie took his own life in jail in twenty ten. 0:06:48.920 --> 0:06:52.200 Journalist Steve Volk wrote extensively about Robert Carrey in a 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:54.919 twenty fourteen article in Philadelphia Magazine. 0:06:55.320 --> 0:06:59.000 The police questioned him directly. You know they didn't get 0:06:59.120 --> 0:07:00.920 anything from him, is my understanding. 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:04.320 Back in twenty ten, the Philadelphia Daily News had already 0:07:04.400 --> 0:07:07.760 named Robert Carey as the alleged hitman and Danielle and 0:07:07.880 --> 0:07:09.080 Richard's disappearance. 0:07:09.760 --> 0:07:13.960 I remember hearing about Robert Carey as somebody that would 0:07:13.960 --> 0:07:17.200 have been potentially available for hire. They had a reputation 0:07:17.280 --> 0:07:20.000 link for potentially being a hit man. It wasn't that 0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:22.400 big a deal to him to do this sort of work, 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:24.760 so if somebody asked him for a favor or whatever, 0:07:25.560 --> 0:07:27.000 he'd be potentially available. 0:07:27.800 --> 0:07:30.920 If you remember, Robert Carey was accused of beating someone 0:07:30.960 --> 0:07:34.600 up so badly that he knocked out the victim's left eye. 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:39.280 He was the roughest customer in one of the roughest neighborhoods, 0:07:39.280 --> 0:07:42.200 if not the roughest neighborhood in Philly. 0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:46.080 The neighborhood steps talking about is Fishtown. Fishtown is a 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:49.760 working class, blue collar part of Philly. The name comes 0:07:49.800 --> 0:07:53.480 from its early settlers, who were mainly fishermen that lived 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:57.240 in this tiny neighborhood along the Delaware River. Although it's 0:07:57.280 --> 0:07:59.600 gentrified quite a bit since two thousand and five, it's 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:02.240 always maintained a rough around the edge's reputation. 0:08:06.160 --> 0:08:12.320 From my point of view, Fishtown was a rough, violent place. 0:08:13.760 --> 0:08:16.920 There's a long history of organized crime operating out of there. 0:08:18.000 --> 0:08:21.600 Fishtown had families in it that would end you. 0:08:23.280 --> 0:08:26.600 Robert Kerrey actually owned property in Fishtown, and people in 0:08:26.640 --> 0:08:29.600 that neighborhood used to look at him almost like the Godfather, 0:08:30.080 --> 0:08:32.120 where he was equally respected and feared. 0:08:33.840 --> 0:08:37.120 There's a segment of people who knew him who were 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:39.440 perversely proud of what a fucking tough guy he was. 0:08:39.960 --> 0:08:43.120 And according to Steve sources, Carrie was the hit man 0:08:43.160 --> 0:08:45.760 who killed Danielle and Richard in Fishtown. 0:08:45.800 --> 0:08:48.480 That case has closed. It's just taken as a given 0:08:48.480 --> 0:08:48.880 that he did it. 0:08:50.120 --> 0:08:52.760 I remember that being like a real hope of investigators 0:08:52.800 --> 0:08:56.600 that like, so you're dealing with underworld types who take 0:08:56.840 --> 0:09:00.000 some kind of money for higher gig and at some point, 0:09:00.000 --> 0:09:01.520 I mean, one of them is going to talk, maybe 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:05.560 even to brag, because guys like that end up in 0:09:05.600 --> 0:09:06.280 and out of jail. 0:09:06.760 --> 0:09:08.559 And there were some rewards being offered. 0:09:09.520 --> 0:09:12.440 At one point that reward was one hundred thousand dollars. 0:09:13.200 --> 0:09:16.280 One of the most like, sort of unlikely crazy things 0:09:16.280 --> 0:09:23.720 about this is that nobody's talked, nobody's bragged, nobody's spoken 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:24.160 about it. 0:09:25.400 --> 0:09:28.160 And here's the thing about Fishtown, there's a sort of 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:30.720 unwritten rule about a code of silence. 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:34.080 You've got families who've known each other for generations. They 0:09:34.120 --> 0:09:39.720 have formed these relationships, and there's a lot of loyalties there, 0:09:40.280 --> 0:09:42.280 but like Carrie's dead. 0:09:43.240 --> 0:09:45.720 Six months after Robert Carey took his own life in jail, 0:09:45.840 --> 0:09:49.520 the police arrested twenty of Kerry's associates. According to the 0:09:49.520 --> 0:09:53.760 Pennsylvania Attorney General, many of those arrested were allegedly involved 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:58.720 in Robert Carey's prescription drug operation and lived in Fishtown. 0:09:59.320 --> 0:10:00.720 Those people haven't even talked. 0:10:02.520 --> 0:10:05.400 It's pretty clear why Vedo said there were times in 0:10:05.440 --> 0:10:08.360 this investigation. He wanted to beat his head against the wall. 0:10:09.240 --> 0:10:12.600 Robert Carey's been dead nearly fifteen years, and no one 0:10:12.679 --> 0:10:16.840 is talking. We learned that Lesson as well. The one 0:10:16.880 --> 0:10:19.160 person who would talk to us on the record about 0:10:19.280 --> 0:10:23.120 Robert Carey asked her remain anonymous. No one else would 0:10:23.120 --> 0:10:26.160 go on the record. Steve said he even got pushed 0:10:26.160 --> 0:10:28.320 back when he was doing research for his article. 0:10:29.360 --> 0:10:33.120 I had asked around about him, and I got some 0:10:33.240 --> 0:10:38.240 kind of email like warning me away, like don't ask 0:10:38.320 --> 0:10:39.440 around about him. 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:43.800 This is fucking fish town. We love that guy. He's dead. 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:46.680 We don't speak ill of the fucking dead, So don't 0:10:46.679 --> 0:10:47.520 come around here with that. 0:11:02.960 --> 0:11:06.040 No matter where you look in this case, there's Joe Embo. 0:11:06.600 --> 0:11:09.880 I mean, just look at the facts. In the year 0:11:09.960 --> 0:11:13.319 leading up to his estranged wife's disappearance, Joe cheated on 0:11:13.440 --> 0:11:16.360 Danielle and left her for that other woman. As their 0:11:16.360 --> 0:11:19.880 marriage headed towards a divorce, Danielle started dating Richard Patron. 0:11:20.360 --> 0:11:23.520 Joe found out and didn't like it. He wanted to 0:11:23.559 --> 0:11:27.080 reconcile with Danielle, but Danielle wasn't ready to forgive and 0:11:27.160 --> 0:11:29.600 forget Joe's Super Bowl affair in two thousand and four, 0:11:30.240 --> 0:11:32.920 and that he left Danielle to raise their twenty month 0:11:32.920 --> 0:11:36.640 old by herself when he moved to Georgia in two 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.560 thousand and five. Joe told the Philadelphia Daily News that 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:41.960 he even called Richard and told him to quote back 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:45.160 off and quote get out of the picture until after 0:11:45.240 --> 0:11:48.520 their divorce. Shortly after the new year in two thousand 0:11:48.559 --> 0:11:52.360 and five, Danielle ended things with Richard. Weeks passed, including 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:55.640 the Valentine's Day holiday, and then Richard called Danielle and 0:11:55.679 --> 0:11:58.439 asked her to meet up on Saturday, February nineteenth, two 0:11:58.480 --> 0:12:02.560 thousand and five. As you know, Danielle ultimately agreed and 0:12:02.600 --> 0:12:08.720 they both vanished that night. Law enforcement has never charged Joe. 0:12:09.360 --> 0:12:12.720 They've also never publicly cleared him, and that's what makes 0:12:12.760 --> 0:12:15.440 things so frustrating, even for Joe. 0:12:16.040 --> 0:12:19.400 One place where I sympathized with Joe is that he 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:23.880 knows everybody's looking at him the whole time with. 0:12:23.840 --> 0:12:27.920 So little information. Journalist Steve Volk said law enforcement was 0:12:27.960 --> 0:12:31.920 forced to examine and re examine what few facts they had. 0:12:32.280 --> 0:12:34.440 Whenever you're dealing with a case where you don't know 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:38.960 in the end, so many different pieces of evidence could 0:12:39.000 --> 0:12:42.920 be turned over different ways and look either evidence for 0:12:43.080 --> 0:12:44.920 or against. 0:12:44.559 --> 0:12:47.120 And depending on how you view them, that's where things 0:12:47.160 --> 0:12:51.199 could look either good or bad for Joe. I mean, 0:12:51.320 --> 0:12:53.440 just look at the night Danielle and Richard vanished. 0:12:53.760 --> 0:12:58.840 His alibi was framed by the patrons as alarmingly convenient 0:13:00.080 --> 0:13:03.240 that he happened to be with his stepdad, police officer 0:13:03.320 --> 0:13:03.720 that night. 0:13:03.960 --> 0:13:06.880 That night, Joe was with his relatives too, who happened 0:13:06.880 --> 0:13:09.680 to be in law enforcement, and he stayed overnight in 0:13:09.679 --> 0:13:13.240 Tom's River, New Jersey. Tom's River is just about an 0:13:13.320 --> 0:13:16.959 hour drive from Danielle's condo, So I could see why 0:13:17.120 --> 0:13:20.480 you could question Joe's alibi. And let's not forget Joe 0:13:20.559 --> 0:13:23.040 admitted to listening to Danielle's voicemails. 0:13:23.720 --> 0:13:26.439 If you are going to put your Joe Imbo had 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:29.680 nothing to do with his hat on and think in 0:13:29.760 --> 0:13:34.760 those terms, wow, as he followed by the circumstances surrounding. 0:13:34.360 --> 0:13:38.439 This, Think about that. Imagine you're in the following scenario, 0:13:39.000 --> 0:13:43.320 your wife vanished, and you have this mountain of circumstantial 0:13:43.320 --> 0:13:46.719 evidence that can be flipped to look either for or 0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:50.760 against you. Like Steve said in the last episode. 0:13:50.880 --> 0:13:52.760 God that would be its own circle of. 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:57.800 Hell, and according to Joe, it was when he was 0:13:57.840 --> 0:13:58.920 just thirty seven years. 0:13:58.720 --> 0:14:05.640 Old heart attack. He connected the heart attack to just the. 0:14:05.600 --> 0:14:10.160 Stress, and according to Steve's article, all of it left 0:14:10.240 --> 0:14:12.280 Joe quote a bitter, bitter man. 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:17.720 I don't think he hid from the idea that this 0:14:17.800 --> 0:14:19.480 whole thing had taken a toll on him. 0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:24.080 We had questions. We tried to sit with Joe. I 0:14:24.200 --> 0:14:27.040 spoke with him twice by phone, but he didn't want 0:14:27.080 --> 0:14:30.080 to be interviewed. Ben spoke to him a number of 0:14:30.120 --> 0:14:32.720 times and ultimately met with him face to face in 0:14:32.800 --> 0:14:37.000 South Carolina in June twenty twenty four. The two had 0:14:37.000 --> 0:14:39.600 an off the record conversation at a small coffee shop 0:14:39.640 --> 0:14:44.000 outside of Charles Stent. A few minutes after their meeting, Ben. 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:51.440 Called me Henika. He is very charming, very friendly, but 0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:53.960 there's some pain in his face. 0:14:55.200 --> 0:14:57.880 Ben said he and Joe talked for around an hour 0:14:58.120 --> 0:15:01.280 and that his physical appearance reminded him of Kyle Chandler, 0:15:01.840 --> 0:15:04.560 salt and pepper hair, the little bit of facial hair, 0:15:05.320 --> 0:15:07.880 but outside of that, he felt like Joe was just 0:15:07.960 --> 0:15:10.120 an ordinary fifty two year old guy. 0:15:10.600 --> 0:15:14.560 The feeling is, you know, he is another person who 0:15:14.640 --> 0:15:18.880 lost someone in all of this and is still grieving 0:15:19.000 --> 0:15:22.200 and still wanting answers like the families. 0:15:21.800 --> 0:15:24.720 Do right, Ben said, talking with Joe was just like 0:15:24.800 --> 0:15:27.560 talking with most other people we've talked to for this podcast. 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:29.600 So how do you feel about it. 0:15:30.400 --> 0:15:32.880 I'm struggling with the fact that he won't go on 0:15:32.920 --> 0:15:34.280 the record and talk with me. 0:15:35.600 --> 0:15:38.320 Do you think he did this? I was responsible for this. 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:42.520 Ben took a deep sigh and took a long pause. 0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:46.760 You know, you're hopeful you're able to read them or 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:52.320 get some sort of tell or indication that, oh, there's 0:15:52.360 --> 0:15:53.240 the smoking gun. 0:15:53.560 --> 0:15:57.520 But I'm not coming back to you with that moment, Trey. 0:15:58.720 --> 0:16:02.040 You spend a lot of time I am reading about 0:16:02.160 --> 0:16:06.920 someone and about their life and about things that they've done. 0:16:07.320 --> 0:16:14.320 I think you can build both expectations and perceptions in 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:18.760 your head. But sitting in front of him, he's just 0:16:18.800 --> 0:16:19.760 an ordinary guy. 0:16:21.320 --> 0:16:24.200 Honestly, we weren't expecting to hear from Joe again, But 0:16:24.320 --> 0:16:27.400 on a Saturday afternoon in August twenty twenty four, almost 0:16:27.440 --> 0:16:31.240 two months after Joe and Ben met for coffee, Ben 0:16:31.280 --> 0:16:34.480 got a text message from Joe. I'll let Ben read it. 0:16:35.760 --> 0:16:38.120 Ben, this is the only thing I would like to contribute. 0:16:38.680 --> 0:16:40.920 If you choose to use it, please use it in 0:16:40.960 --> 0:16:45.240 its entirety and not edited portions of it. I would 0:16:45.320 --> 0:16:47.560 like to thank you and your team at iHeart for 0:16:47.680 --> 0:16:50.360 keeping the disappearance of Danielle and Richard in the news. 0:16:50.960 --> 0:16:53.920 Hopefully someone in your listening audience will know something and 0:16:54.000 --> 0:16:57.240 come forward. The only thing I am guilty of is 0:16:57.280 --> 0:17:00.960 being a shitty husband and making some poor decisions. I 0:17:01.000 --> 0:17:03.000 live with the guilt of knowing I am the one 0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:05.440 who put Danielle in the position where she was out 0:17:05.440 --> 0:17:09.320 with Richard Patron that night. I've spent the last twenty 0:17:09.400 --> 0:17:12.240 years raising our son to become someone I know Danielle 0:17:12.280 --> 0:17:15.000 would be proud of. The last phone call I had 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:18.639 with Danielle was the afternoon she disappeared. She asked me 0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:20.600 to go to the circus with her and our son. 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:23.439 Do you think I could wake up every morning and 0:17:23.480 --> 0:17:25.880 look at my son if I did anything to his mother. 0:17:27.000 --> 0:17:29.399 People who don't know me will have their doubts, and 0:17:29.440 --> 0:17:32.280 I can't change that. The only thing that matters to 0:17:32.320 --> 0:17:34.840 me is that Danielle's family knows I had nothing to 0:17:34.880 --> 0:17:35.320 do with this. 0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:42.480 At the beginning of this series. You heard how Danielle's 0:17:42.480 --> 0:17:43.679 brother John got a tip. 0:17:44.200 --> 0:17:47.200 Some psychic called my mother in law and said Danielle 0:17:47.240 --> 0:17:50.879 was dying in its box car under the Walt Whitman Bridge. 0:17:51.200 --> 0:17:54.600 So here I am scaling this fence at midnight with 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:56.160 a flashlight looking in box. 0:17:56.200 --> 0:18:00.440 Course, that unsolicited lead from a psychic never let John 0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:06.600 to Danielle, but it did give me an idea. Like 0:18:06.680 --> 0:18:10.240 Steve said, we've turned over every scenario of possibilities in 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:13.600 our head. I felt like veto banging my head against 0:18:13.640 --> 0:18:18.560 a wall. I just wanted direction. I thought, what is 0:18:18.600 --> 0:18:22.600 there to lose? So I reached out to a medium, 0:18:23.359 --> 0:18:26.520 and I must preface this by saying, skeptic inside me 0:18:26.560 --> 0:18:29.199 debated whether we should even share this. But if this 0:18:29.280 --> 0:18:31.439 idea turned out to be a total waste of time, 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:34.520 I would not be spending one second on what I'm 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.840 about to share with you. I got in touch with 0:18:37.920 --> 0:18:41.719 Jonathan Mark, who isn't just your ordinary medium. Jonathan has 0:18:41.760 --> 0:18:45.600 been helping law enforcement like the NYPD and FBI for 0:18:45.680 --> 0:18:46.600 a few years now. 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:49.679 I'm their last option, and I'm never there first. 0:18:50.240 --> 0:18:54.720 Jonathan's resume includes some high profile cases, including the Long 0:18:54.760 --> 0:18:56.080 Island serial killer case. 0:18:56.760 --> 0:18:59.439 And that's when the lead Task Forced agent called me 0:19:00.040 --> 0:19:03.040 and he was like, you have fifteen minutes, let me 0:19:03.080 --> 0:19:06.800 see what you got. Then from there I got inundated 0:19:06.800 --> 0:19:10.200 with so many different law enforcement agencies to do these cases, 0:19:10.240 --> 0:19:13.879 like over a thousand cases from all over the world. 0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:18.919 People I think know me more from the Gabby Patito case. 0:19:19.960 --> 0:19:22.640 Gabby Patito went missing while on a cross country trip 0:19:22.640 --> 0:19:25.440 with her boyfriend in twenty twenty one. Her boyfriend later 0:19:25.480 --> 0:19:29.240 admitted to killing Potito. Although Jonathan worked with law enforcement 0:19:29.280 --> 0:19:32.320 on the case, he said he didn't necessarily solve anything. 0:19:33.080 --> 0:19:34.960 I just helped him go into a certain direction and 0:19:35.000 --> 0:19:37.920 they did their amazing law enforcement work and they put 0:19:38.359 --> 0:19:39.119 the pieces together. 0:19:39.440 --> 0:19:41.440 He even got tapped in to help with the case 0:19:41.480 --> 0:19:44.399 of the four Idaho students who were murdered, but was 0:19:44.440 --> 0:19:47.359 admittedly too freaked out by it all, so he turned 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:51.639 it down. Today, his waitlist contains roughly ten thousand names. 0:19:52.040 --> 0:19:54.399 You can hear more about that on his podcast called 0:19:54.840 --> 0:19:59.040 Connect with Jonathan Mark. Jonathan knew I wanted to meet 0:19:59.040 --> 0:20:01.959 about a project was working on, but was given no 0:20:02.160 --> 0:20:05.840 other information. To his credit, he invited me and Ben 0:20:05.920 --> 0:20:09.199 to his home in New York. I should note this 0:20:09.400 --> 0:20:12.320 was two months before the show launched, and I don't 0:20:12.320 --> 0:20:14.400 even think he knew where we were from. 0:20:14.880 --> 0:20:17.520 I always tell people it's a blessing and a gift 0:20:17.520 --> 0:20:19.439 that I can do this and help people and use 0:20:19.480 --> 0:20:23.560 it in different avenues. It occurs because you can't turn 0:20:23.600 --> 0:20:26.879 it off. You're talking about death, and not just death. 0:20:27.200 --> 0:20:30.480 You're dealing with people's emotions that these don't have answers for. 0:20:30.640 --> 0:20:33.040 So it's really difficult and tough. 0:20:34.440 --> 0:20:37.320 I didn't know what to expect, but I didn't expect 0:20:37.320 --> 0:20:40.760 a warm and friendly, lacrossebrow sporting a backwards hat and 0:20:40.880 --> 0:20:45.080 workout clothes, a normal guy from your average Long Island family, 0:20:45.800 --> 0:20:48.679 except for his ability to speak to those who have 0:20:48.760 --> 0:20:55.200 crossed over. I was nervous. Ben was nervous. Jonathan was nervous. 0:20:55.720 --> 0:20:58.639 He mentioned that he typically reads family members and was 0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:01.720 unsure if we could reach anyone other than our loved ones. 0:21:02.320 --> 0:21:05.280 But then he jumped right in, so. 0:21:05.320 --> 0:21:07.600 You're cool with like the intensity of stuff, right, Like 0:21:07.640 --> 0:21:10.199 that's what okay? So you have two people that are 0:21:10.240 --> 0:21:16.919 coming through. Wow, this is kind of nuts. They're showing 0:21:17.000 --> 0:21:20.800 my uncle. My uncle's name is Richard, but it's an 0:21:20.800 --> 0:21:23.280 our name. They're show me my brother. My brother's name 0:21:23.320 --> 0:21:27.480 is Daniel, but the female has a da name. I 0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:30.600 see they both had families. It seems like by families, 0:21:30.640 --> 0:21:33.160 I mean like children with different partners. 0:21:33.960 --> 0:21:36.080 Jonathan stared at a blind wall that was to the 0:21:36.160 --> 0:21:38.520 right of us. He said, he typically does this so 0:21:38.560 --> 0:21:42.199 he can focus and not see our reactions. Ben and 0:21:42.240 --> 0:21:45.600 I sat in complete silence and let him continue. 0:21:46.359 --> 0:21:49.000 This has to be like a two decade or almost 0:21:49.000 --> 0:21:52.399 a two decade case, because what's coming through to me 0:21:53.000 --> 0:21:56.040 is there's little to no movement. And by that that 0:21:56.080 --> 0:21:58.080 doesn't mean that law enforcement's not doing their thing. There's 0:21:58.119 --> 0:22:00.359 just little to no evidence that continue. But what I 0:22:00.400 --> 0:22:03.919 am seeing is that there has been some shifts, like recently, 0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:05.960 like in the last like six months, there's been some 0:22:06.119 --> 0:22:10.240 like shifts. Another thing too, there's a key component to 0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:13.000 their case that's linked to a car that's like gone too, 0:22:14.040 --> 0:22:17.080 whether it's a car or a minivan or a truck 0:22:17.240 --> 0:22:18.320 or something. 0:22:19.960 --> 0:22:22.840 Like I said, I didn't know what to expect, but 0:22:22.880 --> 0:22:25.560 I definitely didn't expect Jonathan to be spot on. 0:22:25.920 --> 0:22:28.080 There's shown me the color black in a car. That's 0:22:28.119 --> 0:22:31.560 a key component of like an evidence, whether it's the 0:22:31.640 --> 0:22:34.080 color black or just like a car. But they're also 0:22:34.119 --> 0:22:37.679 showing me too that there's a body of water that 0:22:37.880 --> 0:22:39.600 is like a huge key factor. 0:22:53.000 --> 0:22:55.440 In May of twenty twenty four, we reached out to 0:22:55.520 --> 0:22:59.200 Jonathan Mark, a medium who has helped the FBI and NYPD, 0:22:59.800 --> 0:23:02.439 and he graciously agreed to talk with us. Just a 0:23:02.480 --> 0:23:06.399 minute or two into our session, Ben and I were speechless. 0:23:06.760 --> 0:23:09.040 Prior to this, Jonathan had never met me or my 0:23:09.080 --> 0:23:11.960 colleague Ben. In fact, he didn't know anything about the 0:23:12.000 --> 0:23:15.280 case or where we were from. And right off the bat, 0:23:15.560 --> 0:23:19.680 Jonathan had clearly identified Richard and Danielle. And then came 0:23:20.359 --> 0:23:21.040