WEBVTT - Phyllis Smith 0:00:05.600 --> 0:00:09.480 My name is Phyllis Smith, and I played Phillis Lap 0:00:09.640 --> 0:00:18.480 and Vance. Hello everybody, and welcome back, one and all 0:00:18.960 --> 0:00:23.640 to the Office Deep Dive. I am your host, Brian Baumgartner, 0:00:23.800 --> 0:00:29.000 and I am so excited to present to you my 0:00:29.160 --> 0:00:33.920 interview with Phyllis Smith and guys. This episode is truly 0:00:34.040 --> 0:00:39.120 one of my favorites ever, not only because Phillis is 0:00:39.320 --> 0:00:44.839 obviously wonderful, but because I finally finally got to have 0:00:45.880 --> 0:00:49.199 my Oprah moment. Now here's what happened. As some of 0:00:49.240 --> 0:00:52.239 you may know, Phillis did not start out as an actor. No, 0:00:52.520 --> 0:00:56.600 Phillis was actually Alison's casting associate on the Office, but 0:00:56.680 --> 0:00:59.520 she was just so perfect that Greg Daniels and Ken 0:00:59.600 --> 0:01:03.560 Koppa decided to cast her, and obviously she went on 0:01:03.640 --> 0:01:07.440 to be an incredible part of our ensemble. So Phillis 0:01:07.440 --> 0:01:10.720 and Allison had worked together many years, become very very 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:13.520 close friends. But they don't get to see each other 0:01:13.959 --> 0:01:16.120 very often these days. So when I was going to 0:01:16.160 --> 0:01:19.240 be interviewing Phillis, I said to Alison, Hey, Alison, why 0:01:19.319 --> 0:01:23.400 don't you come in. You guys can talk about casting, 0:01:23.440 --> 0:01:25.679 and then I can talk with Phillis about you know, 0:01:25.760 --> 0:01:29.040 her progression through the show. And but let's surprise her. 0:01:29.360 --> 0:01:32.679 Don't tell Phillis that you're going to be there, and 0:01:33.319 --> 0:01:36.000 as you will hear right now. It was just the 0:01:36.040 --> 0:01:41.240 best moment. So um oh, I'm so excited. Let's roll 0:01:41.360 --> 0:01:50.000 the tape. Bubble and Squeak. I love it. Bubble and 0:01:50.040 --> 0:01:56.880 Squeak and Bubble and Squeaker Cookie every month, lift over 0:01:56.920 --> 0:02:10.160 from the night before. I'm so excited for Phillis to 0:02:10.240 --> 0:02:13.639 come in and see you. She's out there. She just 0:02:13.680 --> 0:02:19.320 doesn't know that you're here. Are we good? Okay, she's 0:02:19.320 --> 0:02:35.520 gonna walk through that door. I love this, skinny Phillis. 0:02:35.600 --> 0:02:56.480 What's the surprised? How are you so good to see you? Oh? 0:02:56.560 --> 0:03:10.560 My goodness, ill Hello, asked her? Most everything? Yeah, no, 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:14.679 ask her. So I just this is just to tell 0:03:14.720 --> 0:03:18.000 you what's going on. So I had my thing. I've 0:03:18.040 --> 0:03:22.360 interviewed Allison, We've talked about casting the entire show. But 0:03:22.440 --> 0:03:25.280 I said to her, let's let's leave off Phillis, because 0:03:25.280 --> 0:03:28.000 I wanted you to come in and you guys to 0:03:28.000 --> 0:03:31.600 be able to have a conversation together. So how when 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:34.960 did you guys meet? Oh? God, okay, the first pilot 0:03:34.960 --> 0:03:40.200 we worked on together was called was at those offices 0:03:40.240 --> 0:03:43.640 across from Universal, and we cast James Franco and Ben 0:03:43.680 --> 0:03:47.440 Foster in a really bad sitcom. We were in the trailer. Oh, 0:03:47.560 --> 0:03:49.040 we were in the trailer that we were in the 0:03:49.040 --> 0:03:52.640 trailer first on NBC's lot, that's right, And that was 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:57.080 um because Jessica Walter screamed at her agent for sending 0:03:57.080 --> 0:03:59.320 her to the wrong place and we were like hiding 0:03:59.720 --> 0:04:02.880 behind at the desk like, oh my god, We're like, 0:04:03.080 --> 0:04:09.280 what's going on? Um? But yeah, it was an in 0:04:09.400 --> 0:04:12.520 terrible trailer and it was during like El Nino, and 0:04:12.560 --> 0:04:16.440 our trailer everything was soaked. Everything was soaked. They had 0:04:16.560 --> 0:04:19.480 terrible rain that re leaks. And from my point of view, 0:04:19.520 --> 0:04:22.400 I had been working with Alan Hackford and the day 0:04:22.480 --> 0:04:26.400 that was my last day with him on we went 0:04:26.440 --> 0:04:30.520 across the hall to say goodbye, and that when um 0:04:32.040 --> 0:04:36.880 whose office? They said, oh, Allison John Yeah? And I said, 0:04:37.080 --> 0:04:39.080 do you know if anybody's looking for a casting and 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:41.680 associate and they said, oh, yeah, Allison Jones to it. 0:04:41.839 --> 0:04:45.160 And so then I contacted you and then I had 0:04:45.200 --> 0:04:48.120 an interview on Monday, and you started me on Wednesday, Yes, right, 0:04:48.200 --> 0:04:50.880 right right? And I remember Steve Jacobs was another casting director, 0:04:50.920 --> 0:04:52.800 said if you want someone to whip you into shape 0:04:52.839 --> 0:05:04.400 higher this gal nod he what so what years? Probably 0:05:05.520 --> 0:05:07.680 because then we went on to do some like Freaks 0:05:07.680 --> 0:05:10.000 and Geeks. We did other Yeah, but before that we 0:05:10.040 --> 0:05:13.160 did Roswell, which was lacious. We call our we called 0:05:13.200 --> 0:05:15.479 at the lowest point of both of our lives. It 0:05:15.600 --> 0:05:17.760 was just delicious because it was for a network that 0:05:17.839 --> 0:05:20.679 needed beautiful people. I told you that's where Heath Ledger 0:05:20.760 --> 0:05:24.520 wasn't good looking enough for Fox right and Ian Summer 0:05:25.080 --> 0:05:30.080 remember Ian Summer Holder yelled at me because yes, we 0:05:30.080 --> 0:05:35.160 were shocked. You got yelled at for reading too fast 0:05:35.600 --> 0:05:37.880 with the actor in the room, and I felt terrible, 0:05:37.920 --> 0:05:41.760 but yeah, he yelled at me right after they so, yeah, 0:05:42.480 --> 0:05:45.840 I've never done that. Yeah, I should try that. The 0:05:45.960 --> 0:05:48.800 job not like traumatized me. So I tried to slow 0:05:48.839 --> 0:05:54.719 it down after that. So you worked together from through 0:05:55.080 --> 0:05:57.880 two thousand three the whole time. Still worked through the 0:05:57.920 --> 0:06:01.440 first episodes of the Office. Didn't work till the mid 0:06:01.640 --> 0:06:05.240 second season, right, because you guys weren't getting paid anything, right, 0:06:05.360 --> 0:06:06.839 and I we didn't know if we were getting a 0:06:06.880 --> 0:06:11.280 pickup r Yeah, So I remained in casting Kate remained 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:18.120 working in the restaurant. Yeah, so we all just held on. 0:06:19.360 --> 0:06:22.640 So what did you What did you do in casting 0:06:22.800 --> 0:06:28.680 for like, were you primarily reading or were you I um, 0:06:28.720 --> 0:06:33.000 Alison would give me her ideas and we'd go through. 0:06:33.480 --> 0:06:36.120 At that time and casting we used to get real 0:06:36.200 --> 0:06:43.359 pictures and resumes were stacked full, so I had to 0:06:43.440 --> 0:06:47.000 separate all those in two different you know, and whatever 0:06:47.040 --> 0:06:49.599 Allison wanted me to do, I did it and set 0:06:49.640 --> 0:06:54.000 up the appointments. Make sure. Trying to confirm actors. You 0:06:54.040 --> 0:06:55.800 were a tough one though, because you would say, you 0:06:55.839 --> 0:06:58.120 have to call me back and confirm that the confirmation 0:06:58.240 --> 0:07:03.120 is actually real. Yeah, not just I remember that one 0:07:03.160 --> 0:07:07.119 time we had that one kid that we had given 0:07:07.120 --> 0:07:12.160 out an appointment and it was for um, a bad movie. 0:07:12.240 --> 0:07:17.200 It was a movie that did and it was with 0:07:17.480 --> 0:07:21.120 Creative or you so big agency. I don't remember the agency. 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:24.200 But he I had given out all the appointments, waited 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:28.320 approximately a week or so to confirm. Finally I hadn't 0:07:28.320 --> 0:07:31.640 heard anything. So I called and he still hadn't given 0:07:31.640 --> 0:07:35.360 the appointments out and the session was like, you know, 0:07:35.400 --> 0:07:37.800 a couple of days away. So what I did is 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:42.240 I proceeded to call the managers of everybody, and all 0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:43.960 of a sudden, this kid calls me and he goes, 0:07:44.040 --> 0:07:47.760 what do you think you're doing? And uh, I said, well, 0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:49.960 I'm doing the work that you should have been doing. Yes, 0:07:51.120 --> 0:07:53.480 And he goes, how dare you? And I said, well, 0:07:53.520 --> 0:07:56.040 you know what, let me tell you something I said. 0:07:56.080 --> 0:07:58.920 When I call you, you say hello, because he was 0:07:59.000 --> 0:08:03.640 so be fuddled. When I give you the information, you 0:08:03.720 --> 0:08:06.760 call me back with a confirmation, and when we go 0:08:06.920 --> 0:08:09.960 to hang up, you say goodbye. You just don't drop 0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:13.880 the phone. And you remember I was yelling at this point. 0:08:13.920 --> 0:08:16.280 I came around at Allison, standing this, because who are 0:08:16.280 --> 0:08:23.600 you talking to you? Um? So you did casting for 0:08:24.000 --> 0:08:28.600 nineteen years? Yes? Is that right? Approximately? So someone found 0:08:28.600 --> 0:08:32.880 this quote that you said for nineteen years. That's what 0:08:33.000 --> 0:08:36.719 I did. I examined the character, the truth of it, 0:08:37.280 --> 0:08:39.920 and I think that I didn't know it at the time, 0:08:40.320 --> 0:08:44.559 but I was learning. I don't remember saying that. Does 0:08:44.600 --> 0:08:48.280 that sound right? Well? What I have said in various 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:52.400 interviews is that I was probably honing a craft that 0:08:52.440 --> 0:08:55.720 I didn't know I was honing. I was never in 0:08:55.760 --> 0:08:59.360 the forefront of my mind, and I can honestly say, 0:08:59.760 --> 0:09:06.520 I never thought that I would be an actor. You know. 0:09:07.520 --> 0:09:09.440 It was never something I went, Oh, I wonder if 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:12.080 there's a role for me. At one point I was 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:15.479 trying to get into commercials and and like acting commercials, 0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:22.640 and then life changed and I ended up. Well, you 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:25.520 know how I got into casting, right? Do you know 0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:28.600 that HOWE into casting? I don't know that. Well. I 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:32.240 was working as a receptionist in an aerospace defense company 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:35.199 in Sherman Oaks. A friend of mine called, who had 0:09:35.200 --> 0:09:38.679 worked for Stuart Stu Billet Productions on a court show 0:09:39.280 --> 0:09:41.960 and they said, phillis they need a mousey woman for 0:09:42.120 --> 0:09:48.640 a court show? And I said, oh, man, I didn't 0:09:48.679 --> 0:09:51.960 want to. I wasn't actively auditioning or going out. I 0:09:52.000 --> 0:09:56.199 was being a receptionist and I had one hour for lunch. 0:09:56.240 --> 0:09:59.000 I had to go over the hill to do this audition, 0:09:59.640 --> 0:10:03.120 and in process. At this time, this was the olden days, 0:10:03.160 --> 0:10:08.240 we wore nylons and I went to the bathroom and 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:10.760 as I was pulling them up, I ripped a huge 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:13.640 hole night my entire knee was out of my my 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:16.560 n So I walked into the audition and I said, 0:10:16.559 --> 0:10:19.640 excuse me, are you looking for mousey or lifted up 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:24.160 my skirt or tacky, and so we ended up in 0:10:24.200 --> 0:10:27.520 a conversation and and I wasn't mousey enough to be 0:10:27.559 --> 0:10:33.440 a mousey woman. Shocking. But in the course of the conversation, 0:10:33.480 --> 0:10:34.880 I said, you know, I think I might be good 0:10:34.880 --> 0:10:38.560 in casting. And about a year later she called me, 0:10:39.360 --> 0:10:42.719 and that's how I ended up. And I was at 0:10:42.720 --> 0:10:47.840 the lowest. I mean, I had to do everything, everything 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:50.199 that nobody else wanted to do. I was there doing 0:10:50.200 --> 0:10:55.079 what it was this like three hundred a week or 0:10:55.320 --> 0:10:57.400 my first job was two d fifty bucks a week 0:10:57.400 --> 0:11:00.800 and I was thrilled, but it would have been about 0:11:01.880 --> 0:11:06.240 three what would yours have been probably in late eighties. Yeah, 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:08.400 so I was a little bit earlier, but two and 0:11:08.559 --> 0:11:12.120 fifty bucks a week was huge. Yea. So that's how 0:11:12.160 --> 0:11:14.079 I ended up in the casting and then it just 0:11:14.960 --> 0:11:18.000 now it's a thing people want to do. Shockingly, we 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:21.960 just sort of ended up in it. Um, did you 0:11:22.160 --> 0:11:25.400 feel the casting process of of casting The Office was 0:11:25.400 --> 0:11:27.800 was different than any other show that you had done before. 0:11:28.320 --> 0:11:31.960 I think it was because the the material was so 0:11:32.200 --> 0:11:36.920 different from the other the other shows. It was a 0:11:37.000 --> 0:11:40.320 give and take and it was then Joe, you know, 0:11:41.600 --> 0:11:45.839 and this was completely a different style. Would say, if 0:11:45.880 --> 0:11:49.839 you think you're doing too little, you're still doing too much, right, 0:11:50.080 --> 0:11:54.440 because we had every direction to give everybody, everybody pull 0:11:54.480 --> 0:11:58.360 it down. Yeah, I have the original audition I have 0:11:58.520 --> 0:12:02.240 for stand uh Leslie in my office. I left the 0:12:02.280 --> 0:12:06.360 camera running by mistake, and it shows me explaining the 0:12:06.520 --> 0:12:08.360 genre of the show and how it's going to be 0:12:08.400 --> 0:12:10.440 a fake documentary. And I think you walked by in 0:12:10.440 --> 0:12:13.600 the background, by the way, and I'm you know, just 0:12:13.600 --> 0:12:18.480 saying and there's poor poor Leslie going m h. And 0:12:18.559 --> 0:12:21.160 I was just kept repeating, it's less is more, it's 0:12:21.200 --> 0:12:23.280 it has to feel like it's a documentary like in 0:12:23.320 --> 0:12:25.760 the British show. Blah blah blah blah. But that was 0:12:25.800 --> 0:12:30.480 what we stressed. Was there anyone? Was there someone that 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:36.120 you remember fighting for that was cast or wasn't cast? 0:12:36.240 --> 0:12:38.920 Better you were in the rooms because you were reading 0:12:38.920 --> 0:12:41.080 with these actors, so you you had a better feel 0:12:41.120 --> 0:12:43.880 for it. But you read with them. I read them 0:12:43.880 --> 0:12:46.200 with them until Ken Koppus came up to me and said, 0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:48.600 could you let Phillis read because I think she'd be 0:12:48.600 --> 0:12:50.640 good in the show. I didn't know any of them 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:52.560 saying the same thing. I mean, she got it because 0:12:52.640 --> 0:12:54.760 Ken thought she was good. But he she said, let 0:12:54.840 --> 0:12:58.959 Phillis read. Oh my god, that's a great idea. Um. 0:12:59.000 --> 0:13:01.280 So Phillis then went in and started reading with all 0:13:01.320 --> 0:13:04.920 the actors and she was remember being scared. Though I'm 0:13:04.960 --> 0:13:07.120 sure you were scared because I didn't want to screw 0:13:07.160 --> 0:13:09.800 it up. I didn't know he was auditioning. Yeah, yeah, 0:13:10.040 --> 0:13:12.160 but I was frightened because I wanted to do a 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:16.200 good job for the actors. And I read with Rain 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:19.280 and then another time I read with Kruzinski, and I 0:13:19.280 --> 0:13:22.280 remember when when I read with him, I thought, oh, 0:13:22.600 --> 0:13:28.320 that's that's the one. It just felt right. I remember 0:13:29.400 --> 0:13:35.160 remember John sitting out in the reception area and he 0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:37.839 had you had put him on tape, like the first 0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:40.079 day he was put on tape in New York. I 0:13:40.960 --> 0:13:43.560 remember we had the same man's Jake cru sweater on. 0:13:43.600 --> 0:13:49.319 I remember thinking, oh, I hope he doesn't notice this 0:13:49.480 --> 0:13:56.080 was brown, mind was green, so funny. Yeah, well, they 0:13:56.320 --> 0:13:58.960 were all sitting there and then the second day he 0:13:59.000 --> 0:14:02.080 didn't get called back either way, and he just was 0:14:02.200 --> 0:14:05.960 like very nervous. And he later had told me he 0:14:06.000 --> 0:14:10.160 thought it was because he didn't do well the first day, 0:14:10.760 --> 0:14:14.760 and in reality it was the reverse that I think 0:14:14.760 --> 0:14:18.280 he had already already made an impression. And and and 0:14:18.320 --> 0:14:21.600 I remember BJ sitting out there just he looked like 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:26.080 he was petrified. Yeah he I don't I didn't know him. 0:14:26.120 --> 0:14:28.600 I didn't know his personality, you know. Now that's just 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:32.000 the way he looks, I know, But at the time 0:14:32.080 --> 0:14:34.760 he looked like and he didn't engage with people, he 0:14:34.880 --> 0:14:39.480 didn't talk or what's got put him? You know? But 0:14:39.720 --> 0:14:42.720 then I realized that was part of his My big 0:14:42.760 --> 0:14:45.720 fear in all the casting situations when you mix and matches, 0:14:45.800 --> 0:14:47.600 Oh my god, how bad are they going to feel 0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:50.000 if they don't get called back in? I hate that. 0:14:50.880 --> 0:14:53.920 And then Steve, Steve came in day two because he 0:14:54.080 --> 0:14:56.120 because he was still whatever it was, he was still 0:14:56.200 --> 0:14:58.880 hooked into the other NBC shows, they let him come 0:14:58.880 --> 0:15:01.800 in on the second day. What was your impression of Steve? 0:15:03.120 --> 0:15:06.680 I thought he was brilliant, you know, right off I 0:15:06.760 --> 0:15:08.320 told him that I was for me, it was a 0:15:08.320 --> 0:15:10.200 toss up because Odin Kirk was so cool. And so 0:15:10.840 --> 0:15:13.280 then you said that when I was watching the tape 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:15.720 of Steve, who was the other guy that well, there 0:15:15.800 --> 0:15:18.880 was there was also Paul if Tompkins and really good 0:15:18.920 --> 0:15:21.360 people that were testing. But it came down to between 0:15:21.400 --> 0:15:23.920 oden Kirk and Carroll. But it would have been a 0:15:24.000 --> 0:15:27.160 different It would have been a different different Michael with 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:30.000 oden Kirk. But you had said to me that when 0:15:30.040 --> 0:15:33.120 I was watching the monitor watching Steve's test, and I 0:15:33.200 --> 0:15:36.800 was doubled over with laughter, and Gregg noticed that, Yeah, yeah, 0:15:37.200 --> 0:15:41.640 you always thought that was because you yes, you're having 0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:46.080 a hard time keeping it. Oh my god, yes, yeah, 0:15:46.320 --> 0:15:52.160 that's awesome. What um, So you knew way before that 0:15:52.240 --> 0:15:55.200 they were considering that that Ken was considering Phillis. Oh no, 0:15:55.360 --> 0:15:58.760 like an hour before we were reading that day and said, 0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:01.720 could you just switch you do the camera? You do 0:16:01.800 --> 0:16:03.840 this lit Phillis reach And I was at the coffee 0:16:03.840 --> 0:16:07.000 trying to make sure everything was at the coffee and 0:16:07.160 --> 0:16:09.120 Kim came up and he said, Phillis, someone should read 0:16:09.160 --> 0:16:14.440 the character of Pam today and I went okay. So 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:19.480 I thought, well, maybe one of the PAMs is going 0:16:19.520 --> 0:16:23.360 to be late or I didn't know the why. And 0:16:23.400 --> 0:16:26.200 then I was nervous because I didn't know that you knew, 0:16:26.680 --> 0:16:29.440 and I was like concerned that I was going to 0:16:29.560 --> 0:16:33.720 be doing something out of line for my job, you know, 0:16:35.160 --> 0:16:39.680 So you knew all of that, and no one really 0:16:39.680 --> 0:16:43.240 ever came to me. Wardrobe was actually the first one 0:16:43.280 --> 0:16:46.240 who called and said, I understand you're playing the character 0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:52.080 of Phillis, and I went, yes, I am. Um. So 0:16:52.160 --> 0:16:55.560 you didn't get to tell her, not for years. No, no, 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:57.920 but you didn't. You didn't get to tell her that 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:01.720 she had been cast. I guess Wardrobe to I was 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:04.399 in on it and didn't tell her. Do you remember 0:17:04.440 --> 0:17:08.040 the day that you came in, Yes, to our office, No, 0:17:08.240 --> 0:17:12.720 to the producers session. We were over where we where 0:17:12.760 --> 0:17:16.399 we shot the first Yeah, and um we had to 0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:19.719 go from to get the actors. We had to go 0:17:19.960 --> 0:17:23.600 about a block and a half within the building to 0:17:23.720 --> 0:17:26.600 bring him back to the little where we were recording. 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:30.760 And so as a result, the session we were ran. 0:17:31.560 --> 0:17:34.480 She ran the sessions on time. You didn't sit when 0:17:34.520 --> 0:17:39.560 you went to Allison's. Yeah, you you went in. But 0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:43.040 for some reason that day we were behind. We were 0:17:43.040 --> 0:17:48.439 really behind. And I remember Leslie had another audition to 0:17:48.480 --> 0:17:51.919 go to, so we said, go ahead, go to your 0:17:51.960 --> 0:17:55.720 audition and come back. So he went to his audition. 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:57.639 He came back. He fought the traffic and he was 0:17:57.680 --> 0:18:03.080 in a real premid when he came in and must have. Yeah, 0:18:03.280 --> 0:18:06.760 and you remember when Greg jumped out the windows. Ex 0:18:07.320 --> 0:18:13.320 was gonna say to you in a casting session, just 0:18:13.440 --> 0:18:18.560 West Perkins was there and she yeah, we were. Was 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:22.119 it at the beginning before the lunch hour or it was, 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:24.560 but it was we were had all had to sit 0:18:24.560 --> 0:18:27.000 at a conference table in that the room that you 0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:28.960 didn't have to go into when you read you didn't see, 0:18:29.040 --> 0:18:30.840 but that's where we cast everybody else. And now there 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:34.640 was and all of a sudden, Greg just gets up 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:37.639 and jumps out this window, opened the window and jumped 0:18:37.680 --> 0:18:41.080 out the window, and unfortunately the window was close to 0:18:41.080 --> 0:18:44.920 the ground. Yeah. And then Nancy Perkins, in a thick 0:18:44.960 --> 0:18:48.680 Boston accent, said said, oh my god, I've heard of 0:18:48.920 --> 0:18:51.399 produces wanting to jump out the window before, but he 0:18:51.520 --> 0:18:56.040 just did it. Yeah, we all just looked. He had 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:59.080 to get a sweater in his car something. I don't 0:18:59.119 --> 0:19:01.600 know why he did it, but it was funny. We 0:19:02.040 --> 0:19:05.760 just looked at each other. He also used to graph 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:09.399 the qualities of actors. Um he had a graph and 0:19:09.400 --> 0:19:11.960 he would like put what he needed and what he saw, 0:19:12.080 --> 0:19:14.720 and he would literally graph the qualities of actors. He 0:19:15.320 --> 0:19:17.720 has a I may have that he had a very 0:19:17.760 --> 0:19:20.719 scientific mind, uh when it came to things like that, 0:19:20.760 --> 0:19:23.720 and that of course drove me nuts. But he would 0:19:23.760 --> 0:19:26.399 always say that he was less instinct and more thinking, 0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:30.719 you know, thinking about it. Who would you put with this? 0:19:30.840 --> 0:19:33.040 And who would you who would go with that? If 0:19:33.080 --> 0:19:34.960 you had these two people, who would be this person? 0:19:35.359 --> 0:19:37.600 He thought about it very carefully and it certainly worked 0:19:37.600 --> 0:19:39.920 on the office. But jumping out the window, you and 0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:44.879 I were very fancy. She was, oh my god, he 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:50.080 jumped out the window. And now we know that's kind 0:19:50.080 --> 0:19:57.400 of normal, but it was terrific. Produces one to jump 0:19:57.400 --> 0:20:02.880 out the window before. But well, I, it's interesting because 0:20:03.680 --> 0:20:06.720 of you talking about that on the casting side, because 0:20:06.720 --> 0:20:09.399 what we've been told by some of the writers was 0:20:09.440 --> 0:20:13.040 one of the exercises that they did. They called them 0:20:13.240 --> 0:20:17.359 unlikely duos or something like that, and everyone's name would 0:20:17.359 --> 0:20:19.760 be on the wall, right, so Kevin and Phillis and 0:20:19.840 --> 0:20:23.240 Michael and Dwight and and one of their exercises was 0:20:23.359 --> 0:20:28.720 take two characters that you wouldn't put together, and let's 0:20:28.720 --> 0:20:33.320 put them together and then have some story about that interesting. Yeah, 0:20:33.400 --> 0:20:38.120 but it's interesting on from the casting perspective, from the beginning, 0:20:38.240 --> 0:20:40.560 wanting to he does that's at least how he did 0:20:40.600 --> 0:20:45.119 it with the office. Yeah, he would ask everybody, you know, 0:20:45.119 --> 0:20:47.480 would you rather have this person or this person? And 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:49.399 then if you have this person, would you have have 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:52.320 this person or this person? But he was a very 0:20:52.520 --> 0:20:57.360 um pensive and thoughtful person that way. And those are 0:20:57.359 --> 0:21:00.119 the like the people that we've had the privileged to 0:21:00.160 --> 0:21:03.600 work for, Mitch Herwitz and Judd Apatow and Paul Feige. 0:21:03.800 --> 0:21:07.040 They do think about things in a different way to 0:21:07.160 --> 0:21:09.439 make the whole greater than the sum of its parts. 0:21:09.480 --> 0:21:12.199 They all have strange ways and interesting ways of thinking. 0:21:12.760 --> 0:21:23.080 I call it comedy. Aspergers, Sorry, yea, he was great. 0:21:23.359 --> 0:21:25.119 Why do you think the two of you worked so 0:21:25.160 --> 0:21:32.119 well together? Kind of laid back and we enjoyed it, right, 0:21:32.359 --> 0:21:35.480 We had a lot of laughs. And I truly I'm 0:21:35.480 --> 0:21:38.040 not just saying this because she's sitting here. She can 0:21:38.080 --> 0:21:41.800 remember every actor that not only opened their mouth to her, 0:21:41.920 --> 0:21:46.280 but walked and you know, just walk through the room 0:21:46.359 --> 0:21:49.840 she has and she was never afraid to go out 0:21:49.960 --> 0:21:53.480 and find new talent. She just had an eye she 0:21:53.600 --> 0:21:57.000 had an eye for somebody that was unique and different, 0:21:57.280 --> 0:22:00.000 and so did you though I just a little anecdote. 0:22:00.040 --> 0:22:02.080 We cast a show called spin City when it was 0:22:02.119 --> 0:22:03.879 it was a spin City or Battery Park that you 0:22:03.920 --> 0:22:06.399 meant to go sitting. When she was six, We're at 0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:10.720 Radford and Phillis was reading kids for a one line 0:22:10.840 --> 0:22:15.320 role on a Christmas episode or something, and Phillis said, Allison, 0:22:15.720 --> 0:22:17.240 I read this girl, but come on in and we'll 0:22:17.280 --> 0:22:19.280 read her again, because you've never seen anything like this. 0:22:19.800 --> 0:22:21.440 And it was six year old Da Code of Fanning 0:22:21.480 --> 0:22:24.600 reading one line about being an orphan or something, and 0:22:24.640 --> 0:22:27.760 Phillis literally was like, I've never seen anything like it. 0:22:27.840 --> 0:22:31.359 She was wondering. She was amazing. So Dakoda Fanning and 0:22:31.440 --> 0:22:33.560 Childa both go down for me as the best child 0:22:33.600 --> 0:22:39.000 actors I've ever seen. Wow. Um, when you guys walked 0:22:39.000 --> 0:22:42.880 in and you saw each other, what is it about 0:22:42.960 --> 0:22:46.080 the history between you two that I feel so special? 0:22:48.760 --> 0:22:50.639 We just love you. We just love each other. And 0:22:50.680 --> 0:22:52.760 she's hilarious and we had a lot of good laughs. 0:22:52.840 --> 0:22:56.359 We did. We yeah, a lot of good Yeah. We 0:22:56.520 --> 0:23:01.400 enjoyed it and love actors and basically a great just 0:23:01.600 --> 0:23:06.960 a great like ultimately, who cares, So let's just have fun. Yeah. Well, 0:23:07.000 --> 0:23:08.840 she's a dear person and we worked together for a 0:23:08.840 --> 0:23:11.000 long time and she always knew my sisters and stuff, 0:23:11.160 --> 0:23:16.840 my brothers. Yeah. Yeah, when we come back, we're gonna 0:23:16.920 --> 0:23:20.320 kick Alison out, and Phillis and I we're gonna sit 0:23:20.359 --> 0:23:42.720 down for a chat together. Hi. Phil Hi can that's 0:23:42.720 --> 0:23:45.000 what you've been in my life for so long? Bri? 0:23:45.440 --> 0:23:49.760 I know, well, um, yeah, so we sort of talked 0:23:49.800 --> 0:23:53.840 about Um. I think it's fascinating that you were casting 0:23:53.840 --> 0:23:56.920 all of these shows and never had a thought. I truly, 0:23:57.080 --> 0:24:00.640 I can honestly say that that was not I thought 0:24:00.680 --> 0:24:05.080 that ship had sailed and so, um, I don't know, 0:24:05.200 --> 0:24:11.160 it's just meant to be, and it's changed my life completely. Yeah, 0:24:11.200 --> 0:24:16.159 completely in a good way. You know. Did you have 0:24:16.200 --> 0:24:23.919 any training? No? No, I I'm Alan Hockberg, who I 0:24:24.160 --> 0:24:27.000 worked for on Dr Quinn Medicine Woman. I worked with 0:24:27.080 --> 0:24:30.119 him for about six years, six or seven years, and 0:24:30.240 --> 0:24:34.280 he actually taught me how to hold the parricides and 0:24:34.359 --> 0:24:38.159 read with an actor, and and so he was instrumental 0:24:38.359 --> 0:24:43.120 in helping me to learn how to read with an 0:24:43.119 --> 0:24:47.040 actor and treat an actor and and then when Alison, 0:24:47.640 --> 0:24:51.640 she was another person who really a lot of casting 0:24:51.680 --> 0:24:55.880 directors did not get involved when they read with actors, 0:24:55.920 --> 0:24:59.600 as you know, but Allison really gave her all when 0:24:59.640 --> 0:25:03.280 she read with people. So again being in the room 0:25:03.280 --> 0:25:06.399 and watching her interact with the actor and watching the 0:25:06.440 --> 0:25:13.920 actors um it just I don't know, Well, it's it's 0:25:13.960 --> 0:25:16.800 funny because I've heard of people. I never did this, 0:25:17.160 --> 0:25:20.399 but I've heard of actors who will find an in 0:25:21.000 --> 0:25:24.600 with a casting director to be the person who reads 0:25:24.720 --> 0:25:27.080 with Yeah. There used to happen all the time, right, 0:25:27.240 --> 0:25:30.959 because they wanted to see, you know, actors performances and 0:25:31.000 --> 0:25:33.680 be privy to the conversations about why that person got 0:25:33.720 --> 0:25:35.840 cast and that person got cast. It always seemed like 0:25:35.880 --> 0:25:37.960 kind of a smart thing, you know, to be able 0:25:38.000 --> 0:25:40.840 to go in and hear what people were talking about 0:25:40.920 --> 0:25:42.800 or what they were responding to, or you as an 0:25:42.800 --> 0:25:46.000 actor learning tips from that. And it's so fascinating that 0:25:46.040 --> 0:25:49.320 you were doing that for nineteen years but I didn't. 0:25:49.560 --> 0:25:52.960 But you weren't even trying it just it just came in, right. 0:25:53.080 --> 0:25:55.960 It wasn't. My job at that time was to do 0:25:56.040 --> 0:25:59.520