1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:03,160 Speaker 1: Guyana, It's Glen again, tiktoking. 2 00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:07,159 Speaker 2: I am on TikTok again, ticktak. 3 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:09,760 Speaker 1: I'm here to tickle you guys again. 4 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 3: This is Glenn Law. He's the publisher of the newspaper 5 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:20,239 Speaker 3: Keana Wilberg works for Kitter News. He is not your 6 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,760 Speaker 3: average publisher. And I'm not just talking about his penchant 7 00:00:23,880 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 3: for statement hats and snazzy shirts. 8 00:00:27,320 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 4: A change my short. I had a while Toby off 9 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:31,040 Speaker 4: this man. 10 00:00:31,560 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 3: If you watch Law's videos, you will be seeing him 11 00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 3: in different clothes, different shoes, and with glittering jewelry. But 12 00:00:38,600 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 3: Law isn't just a larger than life character. He's also 13 00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 3: an influencer. He has more than twenty thousand followers on 14 00:00:45,120 --> 00:00:49,000 Speaker 3: TikTok and he's a content machine. He puts out a 15 00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 3: video almost every day. 16 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:52,560 Speaker 1: Glen again, tiktoking. 17 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 2: It's Friday, Glenn ticking you, but this time I'm taking 18 00:00:56,120 --> 00:00:57,160 Speaker 2: you guys differently. 19 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 3: Lots of his videos have over one hundred thousand views. 20 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 3: That's a pretty big number in a country with fewer 21 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:07,680 Speaker 3: than eight hundred thousand residents. And Glenn Law hosts a 22 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:11,479 Speaker 3: show on YouTube that he broadcasts on Kit's radio station. 23 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:17,240 Speaker 3: A newspaper a radio show, a YouTube channel, tiktoks. It's 24 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:19,960 Speaker 3: kind of a lot, but it's all part of a strategy. 25 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:23,640 Speaker 3: Law doesn't just want to put information out into the world. 26 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:26,520 Speaker 3: He wants to reach the masses and he knows how 27 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 3: to speak their language. Literally, it's a. 28 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:32,959 Speaker 5: Version of Patois called Kreoles, so it's English and we 29 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:35,600 Speaker 5: have our own lingo that's mixed into that. 30 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:39,800 Speaker 3: That's Keana Wilberg, the journalist from Lall's newspaper Kitter News 31 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 3: that we heard from last time. She says most people 32 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 3: in Guyana, and especially working class people, speak Creolis. We 33 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:50,280 Speaker 3: heard it a lot too, like when our taxi driver 34 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 3: took us to get some typical Guyanese snacks on the 35 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 3: way to the Kijer News office. 36 00:01:55,760 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 6: It's hot. It's hot, very hot, too hot. No, it's 37 00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:08,640 Speaker 6: ara much. 38 00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 3: You said you didn't need it. 39 00:02:10,240 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 6: I don't eat I eat it one a mistake? 40 00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:14,560 Speaker 7: That does that? Does it? 41 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:18,079 Speaker 6: Kind of does it? Kind of take me experience. They're 42 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:22,480 Speaker 6: going to explore an experience like that for no Miwanaka 43 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 6: and peple not too hot. 44 00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:28,040 Speaker 3: I'm not sure if you caught that, but we were 45 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 3: talking about eating some of Guyana's famously spicy peppers and 46 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 3: our driver was speaking in rapid fire creoles. 47 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,799 Speaker 8: So we report the news and that's for. 48 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 5: Middle class and then that is translated into a written 49 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 5: column that we have called them boise and then mister 50 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:55,440 Speaker 5: Glenlow he would also use his platform to do an 51 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:56,800 Speaker 5: extended version of that. 52 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:03,119 Speaker 3: This strategy of speaking to people in a way they 53 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:07,919 Speaker 3: understand and relate to it makes a big difference, especially 54 00:03:07,919 --> 00:03:12,720 Speaker 3: when you're talking about complicated, messy things like oil contracts. 55 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 3: Remember the team at kit News was waiting for months 56 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 3: for the government to release its contract with ExxonMobil. Finally 57 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:24,959 Speaker 3: at the end of twenty seventeen, they did December twenty eighth, 58 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:30,919 Speaker 3: twenty seventeen. To be exact, Christmas is a very special 59 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 3: moment for Guyanese and it's. 60 00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 8: A period that the government knows if it wants to 61 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 8: rush anything that needs careful attention, they put it at Christmas, 62 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 8: which is what they did. 63 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 7: Ah. 64 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 3: Yes, the classic news dump. Every government and corporation in 65 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 3: the world knows this tactic. If you're releasing news you're 66 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 3: not super proud of or that you suspect might have 67 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 3: some backlash, you put it out on a Friday evening 68 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:06,000 Speaker 3: before a long weekend or during a big sporting event, 69 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 3: or in the week between Christmas and New Year's but 70 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 3: this wasn't just any news jump. 71 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 9: Finally, the government said, okay, at six o'clock today, we're 72 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 9: going to release the contract. So Eggxon decided to bowl 73 00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:24,600 Speaker 9: a press conference just about two or three hours before that. 74 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 3: That was the first press conference Exon had in Guyana, 75 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 3: and they've hosted very few since then. But this contract 76 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:35,599 Speaker 3: was really complicated and full of legal eese, so Exon 77 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:38,919 Speaker 3: decided they would break it down for reporters and point 78 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:41,760 Speaker 3: them toward the most important bits helpful. 79 00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 9: It was in a boardroom at the Marriot Hotel, right, 80 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 9: and my colleagues and I we left. Everyone is down 81 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:52,560 Speaker 9: serious and for the first time, because we normally don't 82 00:04:52,640 --> 00:04:55,320 Speaker 9: like to share our angles, but this was the first 83 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 9: time everybody was huddled together. 84 00:04:57,920 --> 00:04:58,719 Speaker 3: Did you understand what. 85 00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 8: This guy was talking about? What is this? 86 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:05,680 Speaker 3: What did he mean by this? Did he really say this? 87 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:09,120 Speaker 9: And I'm talking about season journalists, journalists who've been in 88 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 9: this game for like twenty thirty years, covering so much 89 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 9: here and abroad, and they were confused. And my editor 90 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 9: in chief, who was during the time, he was saying, 91 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 9: you know, this is this is exactly what this press 92 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:28,360 Speaker 9: conference is intended to do. 93 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 3: Remember, the contract still wasn't going to be released for 94 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:37,680 Speaker 3: another few hours, so everything Exon told these reporters at 95 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 3: the press conference it was just like a heads up 96 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:44,160 Speaker 3: before anyone could actually read it, you know, just fyi. 97 00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:48,280 Speaker 3: Then a few hours later, the government did release the 98 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:50,640 Speaker 3: contract and it was chaos. 99 00:05:53,480 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 9: This is something that was hidden from media since nineteen 100 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 9: ninety nine. 101 00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 3: Nineteen ninety nine was the year Guyana first signed a 102 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:09,880 Speaker 3: contract with Exxon Mobile. Then it was revised in twenty 103 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:12,520 Speaker 3: sixteen after oil was discovered. 104 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:16,360 Speaker 9: No one saw this document. No one even knew what 105 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 9: certain terms meant. Nobody didn't understand what what what is 106 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,839 Speaker 9: two percent royalty? What is fifty to fifty profit oil? 107 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:29,920 Speaker 9: What is profit oil? What is cost oil? And they're 108 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:32,560 Speaker 9: talking to us with all of these different terms, and 109 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 9: the conversation just went over everybody's head. 110 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 3: So the contract was unintelligible to anyone who hadn't spent 111 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:44,680 Speaker 3: years reading oil contracts. And to make things even more confusing, 112 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:49,360 Speaker 3: Exon had primed everyone with information. They wanted people to 113 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 3: know parts of the contract. They wanted to point people's 114 00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:56,599 Speaker 3: attention toward. No one could make heads or tails of 115 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 3: it or tell what was really going on. In fact, 116 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:02,600 Speaker 3: it would take you years for local lawyers and international 117 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:06,200 Speaker 3: experts to wrap their heads around what exactly this contract 118 00:07:06,360 --> 00:07:09,279 Speaker 3: laid out. As everyone did start to make their way 119 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:12,720 Speaker 3: through it, one by one, they came to the same conclusion. 120 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 6: The majority of people, including the IMF, has gone on 121 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 6: record as. 122 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 10: Saying it was a very unfair deal for. 123 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:27,240 Speaker 11: The Vienna, a historically bad, profoundly bad contract that the 124 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 11: government got with Exxon. 125 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 3: It's a balance of power problem. 126 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 7: Once the contract assigned, then one of Excellon's sort of 127 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:41,679 Speaker 7: playbooks is to refuse to renegotiate. 128 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:46,760 Speaker 3: That was head of the Transparency Institute of Guyana Frederick Collins, 129 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:51,679 Speaker 3: investigative journalist Antonio Juhas, and journalist Steve call who wrote 130 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:56,160 Speaker 3: about Excellent Mobile in his book Private Empire. One by one, 131 00:07:56,280 --> 00:08:01,679 Speaker 3: environmental nonprofits, government corruption groups, and the International Monetary Fund 132 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:05,160 Speaker 3: came out saying this was a bad deal for Guyana. 133 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 3: When I asked Exon about it, they sent me the 134 00:08:08,280 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 3: following statement quote, our Guyana operation is in what's considered 135 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:18,240 Speaker 3: a frontier offshore exploration basin the terms of our petroleum 136 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 3: agreement with the government of Guyana are common in the 137 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:25,120 Speaker 3: industry and competitive with other countries at a similar stage 138 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 3: of resource discovery. But even some conservative pro oil voices 139 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 3: have been pointing out major flaws in the contract, which 140 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:38,319 Speaker 3: begs the question is this oil boom actually gonna make 141 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:41,920 Speaker 3: Guyana rich? We'll get into it after this quick break. 142 00:08:43,160 --> 00:09:00,679 Speaker 3: This is light, sweet crude, and I'm Amy Westervelt. 143 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:06,440 Speaker 5: Ladies and gentlemen, for a pleasure to welcome you to Georgetown, Guyana. 144 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 4: Please remain seated with your seatbelt securely fastened until we 145 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:11,359 Speaker 4: are partipicate. 146 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:12,440 Speaker 11: If the Captain turns. 147 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 9: Off the fast and seatbelt side, please love check. 148 00:09:14,880 --> 00:09:18,840 Speaker 3: When we landed in Guyana, one thing was very apparent. 149 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:22,679 Speaker 3: Government officials were hesitant to talk to us. A few 150 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:25,960 Speaker 3: ministers and even the Vice President's scheduler had gotten back 151 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 3: to us about the interviews, but then gone very very quiet. 152 00:09:29,880 --> 00:09:33,560 Speaker 3: Then people kept asking us one question over and over. 153 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 3: Had we seen the Vice News story on Guyana? 154 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:42,160 Speaker 11: Guyana is one of the fastest growing economies in the world. 155 00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 3: Is the Chinese that are building this right? 156 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:44,560 Speaker 10: Yes? 157 00:09:44,679 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 3: But these deals have come with claims of corruption. Do 158 00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 3: you accept bribes? 159 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 6: No? 160 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,200 Speaker 12: I don't were a new reporters come from abroad. 161 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:57,320 Speaker 13: They always want to make a developing country leader look corrupt. 162 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 3: In June twenty two, Vice News aired a damning piece 163 00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 3: on corruption in Guyana. Journalists went undercover, posing as a 164 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 3: Chinese businessman who was interested in investing in the country 165 00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:15,559 Speaker 3: and his secretary. They met with various Chinese businessmen who 166 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 3: claimed to be middlemen for bribing government officials, particularly the 167 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 3: Vice President Barat Jugdeo. One man in particular, mister Sue, 168 00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 3: claimed to have handled a deal between the oil company 169 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 3: and Jack Dao. He took the undercover journalist to see 170 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,920 Speaker 3: the Vice president at his home as a way to 171 00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 3: show them that he did have this close relationship with him. 172 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 3: Jagdeo never spoke of bribes, but he did say that 173 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 3: he was good friends with mister Sue and could help 174 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:48,040 Speaker 3: their project from the government side. 175 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 5: Can you understand how with Theo in detail, I'm. 176 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 12: Not getting involved business, you will get his support. 177 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:59,480 Speaker 14: Sus my friend he at all his soon beans, with 178 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:00,400 Speaker 14: all it raiment. 179 00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:03,720 Speaker 3: I don't, I don't I understand. I understand. 180 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:09,360 Speaker 10: The thing is that my thing is invoment. So you 181 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 10: can either assist from. 182 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 3: Goloments after that story came out, Jagdeo's sued mister Sue 183 00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 3: for defamation in Guyana. He claimed fifty million dollars in 184 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:25,480 Speaker 3: damages and he seems to have stopped talking to foreign 185 00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:28,679 Speaker 3: journalists altogether, at least for a while. A lot of 186 00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 3: people look at the contract situation in Guyana and think 187 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 3: it must be corruption. In fact, Jagdeo himself accused the 188 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 3: previous government, the one that actually signed this contract, of corruption. 189 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:47,439 Speaker 3: Now those accusations are flying at him too, after being 190 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:50,600 Speaker 3: a vocal critic of the contract for years and promising 191 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 3: to renegotiate it when his government resumed power. Now Jagdeo 192 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 3: says renegotiation is not an option. He often repeats a 193 00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:03,120 Speaker 3: phrase that Exon has used over and over, Santa Kiyev contract, 194 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:09,240 Speaker 3: Santa Ti of contract, sanctity of contract. Contract renegotiation has 195 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 3: become a big issue in Guyana. Government officials are still 196 00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 3: answering questions about it years later, and Glenlaw is turning 197 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 3: out hundreds of hours of video on the topic. To 198 00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:24,440 Speaker 3: understand why, we're going to have to get into some 199 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:28,079 Speaker 3: of the details and spoiler alert, they are confusing as 200 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:34,720 Speaker 3: hell to recap. Guyana signed a contract with Exon Mobile 201 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 3: in nineteen ninety nine, allowing them to explore for oil, 202 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 3: but Exon didn't really start exploring there until about a 203 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 3: decade later, and then in twenty fifteen they struck oil, 204 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:51,560 Speaker 3: and a year later, in twenty sixteen, they inked a 205 00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 3: new contract with the government of Guyana. According to Exon, 206 00:12:56,520 --> 00:12:59,600 Speaker 3: even though they had found oil, no one knew the 207 00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:03,440 Speaker 3: full potential of Guyana's reserves at the time, but none 208 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 3: of that was made public until December twenty seventeen, when 209 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:12,240 Speaker 3: Exeon held a press conference to explain the contract to 210 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:14,040 Speaker 3: journalists like Keana Wilberg. 211 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 9: It's clear that they weren't exactly telling us lies, but 212 00:13:18,440 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 9: they weren't telling us the truth. 213 00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 3: Eider. This practice using statements that are technically true but 214 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:28,840 Speaker 3: also leave out critical information in order to mislead people. 215 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 3: It has a name paltering, and the fossil fuel industry 216 00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 3: uses it over and over again. John Cook is a 217 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 3: climate communications researcher at Monash University in Australia and an 218 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:44,960 Speaker 3: advisor to Facebook on climate misinformation. He says paltering is 219 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 3: a key tactic for the industry. He often points to 220 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:51,959 Speaker 3: the way fossil fuel companies talk about renewable energy as 221 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,559 Speaker 3: a text book example, the. 222 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:58,560 Speaker 7: Sun doesn't shine at night or the wind doesn't always fly, 223 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:03,080 Speaker 7: and therefore or renewables on a reliable source of energy. 224 00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:06,120 Speaker 3: Of course, it's true that the wind doesn't always blow 225 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:09,360 Speaker 3: and that the sun doesn't shine at night, but this 226 00:14:09,520 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 3: argument intentionally leaves out information about things like battery storage 227 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 3: that address those issues. Exceon Mobile does the same thing 228 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:23,800 Speaker 3: in Guyana. In fact, the company uses a handful of 229 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:28,000 Speaker 3: classic disinformation tactics all the time, not just pultering, but 230 00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 3: also implying that any information not released by the company 231 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 3: itself is inaccurate and something called building social license things 232 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 3: like sponsoring sporting events or educational programs to convince the 233 00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 3: public that the company is a positive member of the community. 234 00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 3: These three tactics have been deployed over and over again 235 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 3: in Guyana, not just at that initial press conference, but 236 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 3: in a steady stream of marketing materials the company has 237 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 3: released since then, like this promotional video they put out 238 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 3: on Facebook to explain the contract to the Guyanese public. 239 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 4: I'm Janelle Persad and I'm Mikaela Careron. So while development 240 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:11,360 Speaker 4: activities continue to progress at a rapid pace. There are 241 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 4: still many of you out there who have questions, questions 242 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 4: specifically about the production sharing agreement or the contract which 243 00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 4: was signed in twenty sixteen. And if you guys hadn't heard, 244 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 4: Exon Mobil will once again be sponsoring the Guyana Amazon 245 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 4: Warriors Cricket Cricket Lovely Titanti Cricket returns to Guyana. 246 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 11: We could not be more excited. 247 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:34,320 Speaker 13: And that's why we're recording this episode from the Guyana 248 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:36,119 Speaker 13: National Stadium in Providence. 249 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 3: That's not us editing the tape, that's the video as 250 00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 3: is going straight from oil to cricket without missing a beat. 251 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:46,240 Speaker 3: This is one of the ways Exon is building social 252 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:51,840 Speaker 3: license by associating cricket, Guyana's beloved national sport with Exon. 253 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 3: These two young women, one of African descent the other 254 00:15:55,280 --> 00:15:58,240 Speaker 3: of Indian descent, who appeal to as much of the 255 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 3: Guyanese public as possible, all are filming from the national 256 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:09,880 Speaker 3: cricket field and highlighting Exxon's contributions to Guyanese society. I 257 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:13,080 Speaker 3: asked Glen Law, the publisher of Kitter News we heard 258 00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:16,320 Speaker 3: from up top, what he thinks of the cricket sponsorship. 259 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:21,960 Speaker 15: I am so afraid, deep with in my soul, with 260 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 15: what they're doing there. That is not only misleading, but 261 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:32,680 Speaker 15: it's very dangerous. I have said that on team times 262 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 15: and I will repeat it tomorrow night on the radio. 263 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 15: You see when they sponsor this cricket before I think 264 00:16:40,600 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 15: two years ago, their sponsor cricket, and when you walk 265 00:16:43,520 --> 00:16:46,240 Speaker 15: in the streets, you would hear every guy and saying 266 00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:51,080 Speaker 15: doubt God for Eggson. It wasn't for Eggxon, we would 267 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 15: have never been able to see cricket live on television. 268 00:16:56,840 --> 00:16:58,560 Speaker 15: You see how dangerous that it. 269 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:05,120 Speaker 3: Oil companies, like all big industrial companies, work really hard 270 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:08,480 Speaker 3: to convince the public that they're doing more good than harm. 271 00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:10,840 Speaker 3: They spend a lot of time and money on it. 272 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:14,840 Speaker 3: Social license. The public's willingness to give them the benefit 273 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:17,880 Speaker 3: of the doubt or support policies that the oil companies 274 00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 3: want is important to their business model. So when they 275 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:25,720 Speaker 3: do things like sponsoring sports teams and music festivals and schools, 276 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:28,919 Speaker 3: they're not just playing the good guy. They're not just 277 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:33,639 Speaker 3: doing it for pr They're also making entire communities dependent 278 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:38,840 Speaker 3: on their apparent generosity. Over time, it makes people less 279 00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:43,160 Speaker 3: likely to criticize them. Because they feel totally beholden to them. 280 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:47,200 Speaker 3: Remember how the Exon promotional video promised to answer all 281 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:50,360 Speaker 3: of our questions about the contract well before getting into 282 00:17:50,359 --> 00:17:53,360 Speaker 3: any of the actual details that they've promised. First they 283 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:56,560 Speaker 3: remind us that Exon is supporting cricket in a big way, 284 00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:59,720 Speaker 3: and then they raise an eyebrow at what anyone else 285 00:17:59,800 --> 00:18:01,960 Speaker 3: might be saying about this contract. 286 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:06,320 Speaker 13: Well, recognizing that there is a lot of incorrect information 287 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:09,440 Speaker 13: out there, we hope to provide clarity through our conversations 288 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 13: with president of ix On Mobile Guyana, Alistair Routledge and 289 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:16,200 Speaker 13: our treasurer at Katrina Masses in this episode of Access 290 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 13: Exon Mobile. 291 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 3: And finally we get to the poultering. Here's Alistair Routledge, 292 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:23,440 Speaker 3: who heads up Exon's operations in Guyana. 293 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 7: So fundamentally, this is a sharing production sharing agreement. 294 00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:31,880 Speaker 3: This is the guy in charge of Exon in Guyana, 295 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 3: Alistair Routledge. 296 00:18:33,520 --> 00:18:37,800 Speaker 7: But in that sharing agreement, the contractors, which is Exomobile, 297 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 7: Hes and Snook, take all of the risk up front. 298 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:45,840 Speaker 7: So if we never made an economic development, we would 299 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:49,439 Speaker 7: swallow all of the costs that went into that investment. 300 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 7: We would never get paid back. So there's never any 301 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:53,399 Speaker 7: risk for the state. 302 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 3: What Routledge is seeing is that Exon and its partners 303 00:18:57,560 --> 00:19:01,240 Speaker 3: are investing money into the discovery and puduction of oil, 304 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 3: and that's expensive. These are things like surveying the ocean 305 00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 3: floor to figure out where oil is and then drilling 306 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 3: exploratory wells to see what kind of oil they can 307 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:13,320 Speaker 3: get there. And in Guyana they can get what's called 308 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:18,280 Speaker 3: light sweet crude, the best kind of oil. It's easier 309 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:21,320 Speaker 3: to turn into gasoline and it commands a higher price 310 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 3: on the world market. So in Guyana they not only 311 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,960 Speaker 3: found oil, they found a lot of the most profitable kind. 312 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 3: But then there are more expenses before that oil can 313 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:35,919 Speaker 3: be sold. Wales need to be built, staff hired, the 314 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 3: oil needs to be refined and shipped. All of it 315 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:42,560 Speaker 3: costs billions and billions of dollars. Here's ex On Guyana's 316 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:47,600 Speaker 3: Vice president and business service manager, Philip Reyatima, explaining it 317 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 3: all at a press conference. 318 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:53,200 Speaker 10: This is the first year since our inception in nineteen 319 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:56,960 Speaker 10: ninety nine that we've generated profit in Guyana, underscoring the 320 00:19:57,000 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 10: complexity of our business and the years of investment required 321 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 10: before payoff overall expenses. We're up from twenty twenty in 322 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:10,200 Speaker 10: line with increase in production. 323 00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 3: In other words, deep water offshore drilling projects take a 324 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:16,400 Speaker 3: lot of time and a lot of money before they 325 00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 3: start to pay off, and before anyone can start divvying 326 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:23,440 Speaker 3: up profits. The oil companies need to pay themselves back 327 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 3: for all those years of investment. It's only fair. But 328 00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:31,200 Speaker 3: there are a couple of things to keep in mind here. First. Well, yes, 329 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:35,560 Speaker 3: Exxon has technically been in Guyana since nineteen ninety nine, 330 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:39,600 Speaker 3: it only started actively looking for oil in two thousand 331 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,600 Speaker 3: and eight, and Exon spokespeople leave out some other key 332 00:20:43,680 --> 00:20:48,680 Speaker 3: details that make things a whole lot more blurry. Here's 333 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:52,199 Speaker 3: what you need to know first, before there's any profit 334 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 3: to split. Exeon and its partners takes seventy five percent 335 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:59,120 Speaker 3: of all revenue off the top to pay themselves back 336 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:02,680 Speaker 3: for exploration and development costs, all those things that Routledge 337 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,359 Speaker 3: was talking about. So if you think about one hundred 338 00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:08,600 Speaker 3: dollars barrel of oil, that's seventy five dollars to the 339 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:12,439 Speaker 3: oil company's straightaway. It's what the oil companies referred to 340 00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:17,320 Speaker 3: as cost oil. The remaining twenty five dollars or profit 341 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 3: oil gets split between Guyana and the oil companies with 342 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 3: an extra two percent royalty coming to Guyana for a 343 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:29,520 Speaker 3: grand total of fourteen dollars and fifty cents a barrel. 344 00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:33,400 Speaker 14: It may be ultimately over a long period of time 345 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:35,399 Speaker 14: of fifty to fifty split. Right now, it is not 346 00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:37,880 Speaker 14: a fifty to fifty split right now, it's six to one. 347 00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 3: This is Tomsonzilo from the nonprofit Institute for Energy Economics 348 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:47,080 Speaker 3: and Financial Analysis. He's looked at Guyana's oil contract closer 349 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:49,000 Speaker 3: than almost anybody. 350 00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:52,760 Speaker 14: Right now, you're looking at a revenue take of somewhere 351 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:56,159 Speaker 14: between six dollars to the oil and gas companies to 352 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 14: every one dollar to the government of Guyana. 353 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 3: And just to put that royalty in perspective, that two 354 00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:07,440 Speaker 3: percent that gets talked about as this like big extra 355 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:12,520 Speaker 3: tip for Guyana. The average range for royalties in situations 356 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:18,520 Speaker 3: like this is eight to twenty five percent, So two 357 00:22:18,520 --> 00:22:21,879 Speaker 3: percent is quite a bit below the low end of 358 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:26,359 Speaker 3: that spectrum. It's not great. Plus, Guana's on the hook 359 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,200 Speaker 3: for a lot of other costs. It pays Exon's Guyanese 360 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:34,240 Speaker 3: income tax, for example, and it's had to get foreign 361 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:38,399 Speaker 3: loans to cover the cost of various infrastructure projects that 362 00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:41,440 Speaker 3: need to be built to support the fossil fuel industry, 363 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:45,720 Speaker 3: like the export terminal in Georgetown that Exon needs to 364 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:49,720 Speaker 3: ship things in and out of. Second, you could look 365 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:52,000 Speaker 3: at the current split and say, okay, well, sure, but 366 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 3: expenses are expenses, and once they're paid off, it will 367 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,679 Speaker 3: be fifty to fifty And again that's technically true, but 368 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,720 Speaker 3: as you heard from Ryet a moment ago, those expenses 369 00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:05,400 Speaker 3: just keep growing. Here's where it starts to get really tricky. 370 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:08,639 Speaker 3: It's pretty normal for an oil company to recoup at 371 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:12,000 Speaker 3: least some of its development costs once a well starts 372 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:16,359 Speaker 3: generating revenue. What's not common is for them to build 373 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 3: against what's called future oil, the oil that future well 374 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 3: sites are projected to produce. 375 00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 14: All of Exxon's development costs are folded in as a 376 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 14: part of the balance that's owed. They've developed a couple 377 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:38,439 Speaker 14: of existing wells where they're actually drawing oil, and that 378 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,640 Speaker 14: oil is producing revenue, and so they're getting money for that. 379 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:45,720 Speaker 14: But they now have also some twenty plus other fields 380 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:49,960 Speaker 14: that they have discovered that are not producing oil without 381 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,800 Speaker 14: the development costs get folded into the balance anyway. In 382 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:57,200 Speaker 14: other words, they're paying for future oil now. 383 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:01,560 Speaker 3: So Exon has two wells that are producing actual barrels 384 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:04,199 Speaker 3: of oil for sale. That's where all the profit is 385 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:07,159 Speaker 3: coming from right now. But on top of covering the 386 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:12,320 Speaker 3: expenses associated with those wells, they're recouping the expenses associated 387 00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:17,359 Speaker 3: with all of their ongoing exploration and development in Guyana. 388 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:20,680 Speaker 3: See Excellon didn't stop exploring once they found that initial 389 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:23,919 Speaker 3: bit of oil. They've continued to survey and drill to 390 00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 3: look for more oil, and they're continuing to build new 391 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:30,639 Speaker 3: wells and production rigs too. All of that costs money, 392 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 3: and normally those costs would be recouped once those new 393 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:38,800 Speaker 3: discoveries start producing sellable barrels of oil. But instead of 394 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:41,880 Speaker 3: waiting for that, Excellent and its partners are paying themselves 395 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 3: back now with the profits from those first two wells. 396 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 3: In other words, Guyana is paying today for well sites 397 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:53,320 Speaker 3: that may never turn a profit, and that's not generally 398 00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 3: how these projects work. Here's how investigative journalist Antonia Yuha 399 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,000 Speaker 3: Let's put it. 400 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:10,159 Speaker 11: It is unprecedented that Exxon is recouping all of its costs, 401 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 11: all of its development costs, that the Guyanese people are 402 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,639 Speaker 11: subsidizing all of the development costs for Exon. 403 00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:20,960 Speaker 3: Like Senzilo, Juhas, has read a lot of oil contracts. 404 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:25,359 Speaker 3: She's been digging into Guyana situation since twenty nineteen and 405 00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:28,600 Speaker 3: has written about it for The Guardian and Wired, and 406 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,160 Speaker 3: she's written books on the way the oil industry operates 407 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:36,639 Speaker 3: in the Gulf of Mexico and also any rock in Guyana. 408 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 3: You've got these two big issues. Seventy five percent of 409 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:43,600 Speaker 3: revenue comes off the top of every barrel to cover expenses, 410 00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 3: and Exon is front loading those expenses, which means Guyana 411 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,359 Speaker 3: is paying today for wells that may or may not 412 00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:55,639 Speaker 3: pay off tomorrow. So far, those expenses are estimated at 413 00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:59,360 Speaker 3: up to twenty nine billion dollars, which could take up 414 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:04,400 Speaker 3: to ten years to pay off. But to really understand 415 00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 3: the problem with this setup, you kind of have to 416 00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:10,119 Speaker 3: understand the global oil market a bit too. It is, 417 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 3: in a word, volatile. The past year has been very, 418 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:17,199 Speaker 3: very good to the industry, thanks in large part to 419 00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:22,439 Speaker 3: Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Oil has fluctuated between eighty and 420 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 3: one hundred and thirty nine dollars a barrel, and oil 421 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:29,680 Speaker 3: companies have been pocketing record profits. But for years before that, 422 00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 3: oil prices were pretty regularly hitting record lows. Fifty dollars 423 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,879 Speaker 3: a barrel seemed kind of like the new normal. And 424 00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:40,920 Speaker 3: then remember at the height of the COVID nineteen pandemic 425 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:46,560 Speaker 3: in twenty twenty, oil prices actually went negative. In other words, 426 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:50,080 Speaker 3: to sell a barrel of oil, you would have to 427 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,640 Speaker 3: pay the person you are selling that barrel to money. 428 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:59,040 Speaker 3: That's because demand plummeted, but companies kept right on producing 429 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,639 Speaker 3: the same amount and there was nowhere to put it. 430 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:05,879 Speaker 3: There was no storage left. At one point, anyone selling 431 00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 3: a barrel of oil was having to pay the buyer 432 00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 3: thirty dollars. 433 00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 12: Oil prices have turned negative. The most extraordinary development that 434 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:20,000 Speaker 12: took place today when the US main blend West Texas 435 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,480 Speaker 12: Intermediate fell more than three hundred and six percent. 436 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:27,480 Speaker 3: Shutting down wells can be expensive and complicated, and then 437 00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:29,360 Speaker 3: there's the risk that you won't be able to get 438 00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 3: them back up and running again when prices rise. So 439 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:36,560 Speaker 3: some oil companies just keep pumping even if they're losing money. 440 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:41,880 Speaker 3: Not exactly a rock solid investment. In fact, most forecasters 441 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,520 Speaker 3: predict prices will go down as the decade progresses, in 442 00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 3: part due to slowing demand as people and countries transition 443 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,959 Speaker 3: away from fossil fuels. So by the time those wells 444 00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:56,440 Speaker 3: Guana is paying for today actually start to turn a profit, 445 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:59,800 Speaker 3: and by the time those profits are truly being split 446 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:03,400 Speaker 3: fit fifty, things are likely to look very different than 447 00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:08,439 Speaker 3: they do today. That's why Glenn Mall is taking to 448 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 3: TikTok every chance he gets to beat the drum for 449 00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,119 Speaker 3: renegotiating the contract. 450 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:15,600 Speaker 1: Now tell me again. 451 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,840 Speaker 2: How or not that is a fifty to fifty profit 452 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:27,520 Speaker 2: sharing business. Huh when one side is huffing out trick 453 00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 2: quarter barrel up front, I'm calling it cost oil. Guyana 454 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:40,960 Speaker 2: cannot say definitively to this country what percentage of revenue 455 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,760 Speaker 2: the Guyanese people are receiving from our oil deal. 456 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:50,719 Speaker 1: The contract was not made freely, knowingly and fairly by 457 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 1: compretent people. And our hands are not handcuffed. We are 458 00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:59,760 Speaker 1: not chained to a concrete posts. So what is stopping 459 00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:00,840 Speaker 1: us from changing it? 460 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 3: Calls to renegotiate the contract have gotten enough support that 461 00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:09,080 Speaker 3: Exon is starting to spend some of its marketing budget 462 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,360 Speaker 3: to counteract the idea that Guyana has a bad deal. 463 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,720 Speaker 3: It made that promotional video I mentioned earlier, for example, 464 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:20,360 Speaker 3: and it's been putting up massive billboards all over Guyana 465 00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 3: about the fifty to fifty split, But not everyone agrees 466 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 3: with law about the need to renegotiate. Some people say 467 00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:29,720 Speaker 3: he's just mad that he's not getting rich off the oil. 468 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:33,720 Speaker 3: Others buy Exon's argument that it's only fair for the 469 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:37,959 Speaker 3: company to recoup its costs in this way. But another 470 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 3: small but growing group of people thinks haggling over the 471 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:45,959 Speaker 3: details of the contract is a fool's errand that Guyana 472 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:49,400 Speaker 3: needs to look past the contract, past the promises of 473 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:53,040 Speaker 3: oil riches, and really grapple with the harm that this 474 00:29:53,280 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 3: project could do in Guyana, and beyond the fact that 475 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:02,640 Speaker 3: there are all these expenses to pay up front and 476 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 3: that it could be a long time before a true 477 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 3: fifty to fifty split kicks in. Creates a huge incentive 478 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 3: for Guyana to fast track oil production. The more barrels 479 00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:16,760 Speaker 3: they can produce, and the faster they can produce them, 480 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 3: the faster they can pay off those expenses and get 481 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 3: to that oil wealth that the public has been promised, 482 00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:25,760 Speaker 3: and fast treking appears to be exactly what they're doing. 483 00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 3: Routledge himself regularly comments on how everything in Guyana is 484 00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:34,200 Speaker 3: happening ahead of schedule at an unprecedented pace. 485 00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:38,040 Speaker 7: Really just six years, less than six years that we've 486 00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:43,960 Speaker 7: been exploring offshore Guyana to achieve that amound is quite outstanding. 487 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:44,479 Speaker 3: Well excellent. 488 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 11: Just repeats every chance it gets that everything about this 489 00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:52,680 Speaker 11: production has been ahead of schedule and way faster than 490 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:56,120 Speaker 11: its other operations. It says this as a point of pride. 491 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,320 Speaker 3: That's investigative journalist Antonia Juhas. 492 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,280 Speaker 11: Again, this is a point of concern that why is 493 00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:05,960 Speaker 11: it so much faster than everywhere else. Exon has been 494 00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:07,920 Speaker 11: producing oil over one hundred and fifty years. Why is 495 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:10,960 Speaker 11: it suddenly you receive this ability to move so much 496 00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:14,000 Speaker 11: faster in Guyana than it does everywhere else in the world. 497 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:20,360 Speaker 11: And the answer is really simple. There's no oversight, there's 498 00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:22,720 Speaker 11: no one telling them to slow down, be careful, follow 499 00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:24,680 Speaker 11: the rules. It's one of the reasons why it's so 500 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:27,920 Speaker 11: cheap for Exon to produce there, and it's why Exon 501 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:30,720 Speaker 11: is pushing so much of its production there. 502 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:35,120 Speaker 3: At the end of twenty twenty two, Exon announced that 503 00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:40,040 Speaker 3: its first two wells in Guyana we're producing above design capacity, 504 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,760 Speaker 3: so pumping out more barrels than they were designed to produce. 505 00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 3: If it stays on its current production schedule, Guyana will 506 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:52,080 Speaker 3: be neck and neck with Exon's longtime stronghold, the Permium 507 00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:54,840 Speaker 3: Basin in Texas within five years. 508 00:31:55,840 --> 00:32:00,280 Speaker 11: That is a shocking development for a country that didn't 509 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:02,840 Speaker 11: have any oil production three years ago. 510 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:08,480 Speaker 3: It's actually another example of paltering too. Exon boasts to 511 00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:12,040 Speaker 3: its shareholders and the public about the remarkable speed with 512 00:32:12,160 --> 00:32:16,120 Speaker 3: which it is developing an oil industry in Guyana, but 513 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:19,840 Speaker 3: in reality, that speed is a major red flag because 514 00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:23,800 Speaker 3: while it's true that rapidly increasing production can increase profits 515 00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:27,200 Speaker 3: in the short term, there's another thing that's even more 516 00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 3: common when oil companies fast track things. 517 00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,560 Speaker 16: The gusher unleashed in the Gulf of Mexico continues to 518 00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:38,000 Speaker 16: spew crude oil. There are no reliable estimates of how 519 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 16: much oil is pouring into the gulf, but it comes 520 00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:45,040 Speaker 16: to many millions of gallons. Since the catastrophic blew out in. 521 00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 11: The US golf, you did have one hundred and fifty 522 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,880 Speaker 11: years of experience, you do have some of the best 523 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:55,320 Speaker 11: regulations in the world, and though limited, you do still 524 00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:58,720 Speaker 11: have some of the best oversight capacity in the world. Again, 525 00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:03,960 Speaker 11: though limited and still the worst offshore drilling oil disaster 526 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:07,480 Speaker 11: in history took place in the US Gulf of Mexico 527 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 11: under these circumstances, and there is tremendous concern both by 528 00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:18,120 Speaker 11: experts and by everybody I talked to in Guyana about 529 00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:22,880 Speaker 11: what would happen if there was a disaster in the 530 00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:25,000 Speaker 11: deep waters offshore Guyana. 531 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:32,800 Speaker 3: That's our story next time. Late Sweet Crude is a 532 00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:37,760 Speaker 3: Drilled and Damage's co production. Both shows are Critical Frequency originals. 533 00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:42,320 Speaker 3: Our editor and senior producer is Sarah Ventry. Sound design, 534 00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:46,480 Speaker 3: mixing and mastering by Martin Saltz Austwick, Our fact checker 535 00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:50,040 Speaker 3: is Anna Prugel Mazzini, and our first amendment attorney is 536 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 3: James Wheaton. The show is reported and written by me 537 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 3: Amy Westerveldt, additional reporting by Keana Wilberg in Guyana and 538 00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 3: Antonio Juhas in DC. We had additional assistance in Guyana 539 00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:06,719 Speaker 3: from Jamal Thomas Salvadorda, Carrie's Wilderness Explorers, and the staff 540 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:10,960 Speaker 3: at Kaiman House. Special thanks to Michael McCrystal for his 541 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:14,279 Speaker 3: help as well. Our theme song is Bird in the 542 00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:18,279 Speaker 3: Hand by Foreknown. The cover of The Godfather Love theme 543 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:23,200 Speaker 3: is by Young Ones of Guyana and licensed from bb Music. 544 00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:27,279 Speaker 3: Sing a Simple Song was originally written by Sly and 545 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:30,680 Speaker 3: the Family Stone. It's performed in this episode by the 546 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:34,240 Speaker 3: Young Ones of Guyana, licensed by b a ME Music. 547 00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:38,560 Speaker 3: Our artwork is by Matt Fleming. Marketing is handled by 548 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:42,040 Speaker 3: the Great Maggie Taylor PR and media outreach by the 549 00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 3: wonderful folks at Tink Media Lauren Passel, Ariel Nissenblatt and 550 00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:50,520 Speaker 3: Devin Andrade. The show is supported in part by generous 551 00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:55,000 Speaker 3: grants from the Doc Society File Foundation, the William Collins 552 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:56,560 Speaker 3: Kohler Foundation, and you