1 00:00:01,639 --> 00:00:05,199 Speaker 1: Hey, Brian, Hi Katie. So we're releasing a special podcast 2 00:00:05,240 --> 00:00:09,480 Speaker 1: today about the Pittsburgh massacre that happened over the weekend. Yeah, 3 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:11,639 Speaker 1: and this really head home for me, not just because 4 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: I'm Jewish and I've sat and a lot of synagogues 5 00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 1: on Shabbat over the years, but just because this is 6 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:21,919 Speaker 1: not how I imagined our country or thought about the 7 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 1: United States of America. As everyone must know by now, 8 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:30,120 Speaker 1: on Saturday morning, a gunman walked into a synagogue in 9 00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 1: the Squirrel Hill neighborhood of Pittsburgh called the Tree of Life. 10 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 1: The congregants had been celebrating not just the Sabbath, but 11 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 1: also a brisk which is a Jewish baby naming ceremony. 12 00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 1: The gunmen shouted, all Jews must die in open fire, 13 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 1: killing eleven people and injuring six. Authorities have found that 14 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: his social media was filled with anti Semitic hatred, and 15 00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:59,360 Speaker 1: it appears he targeted this particular synagogue because they were 16 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:04,400 Speaker 1: participating eating in a Shabbat celebration of refugees in this country. 17 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:08,040 Speaker 1: This kept off a horrific week that also saw another 18 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: murder motivated by hate, a white man who killed a 19 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:15,240 Speaker 1: black man and woman in a Kentucky grocery store, apparently 20 00:01:15,280 --> 00:01:18,000 Speaker 1: because of their race. And then, of course there were 21 00:01:18,040 --> 00:01:23,039 Speaker 1: those pipe bombs mailed to many Democratic leaders people in 22 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 1: the media, including the Democratic philanthropist George Soros and others. 23 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:32,520 Speaker 1: Brian and I, like so many of you listening to 24 00:01:32,560 --> 00:01:37,319 Speaker 1: this podcast, were heartbroken by the events of this past 25 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:43,880 Speaker 1: weekend and the cold blooded, in human nature of this massacre. 26 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:48,960 Speaker 1: So we wanted to find out more about anti Semitism 27 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:52,600 Speaker 1: in this country and what we might be able to 28 00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 1: do about it as citizens, So we asked Jonathan Greenblack 29 00:01:56,800 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 1: to come in. He is the CEO and National director 30 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 1: of the a D the Anti Defamation League, and its 31 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: mission is to quote fight the defamation of all the 32 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:08,919 Speaker 1: Jewish people and to secure justice and fair treatment for all. 33 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: So we're really pleased that he was able to come 34 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 1: in and help us try to understand or process the 35 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:25,919 Speaker 1: events of Saturday morning. Jonathan Greenblatt, thank you so much 36 00:02:25,919 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 1: for coming in than This has been an extraordinarily difficult 37 00:02:30,520 --> 00:02:32,880 Speaker 1: few days, I'm sure for you and for so many 38 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:36,320 Speaker 1: people in this country, not only from the Jewish community, 39 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: but from all Americans who are completely appalled by this 40 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:44,720 Speaker 1: act of violence. The deadliest shooting of Jews in this 41 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:48,400 Speaker 1: country in history. As we've said, so, I know you've 42 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,520 Speaker 1: talked to members of this congregation. I know you've been 43 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:56,640 Speaker 1: speaking about this horrific event on various media outlets. So 44 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:00,920 Speaker 1: how are you processing all of this personally? Frankly, it's hard. 45 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:05,239 Speaker 1: I mean, this is I've only been on the job 46 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 1: with little over three years, and this is easily the 47 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:11,080 Speaker 1: most painful days. I mean, I'll tell you you know, 48 00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:13,519 Speaker 1: I remember working in the White House when the shooting 49 00:03:13,520 --> 00:03:17,920 Speaker 1: happened in Newtown, and I remember it was still prepping 50 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,839 Speaker 1: to take this job. I was teaching at Wharton when 51 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:24,920 Speaker 1: the shooting happened in Charleston, And so those things affect 52 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 1: you deeply because you're a human being and their children 53 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:33,880 Speaker 1: and their worshippers. To see this happen, though, is so troublesome, 54 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 1: because we have been saying loud and clear that something 55 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: is going on. We have been literally ringing the bell 56 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:46,520 Speaker 1: because we've seen this rise in anti Semitic incidents. We've 57 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 1: seen this rise and hateful rhetoric. We've seen this rise 58 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:57,480 Speaker 1: and online cyber heat, and it is shocking and appalling 59 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:01,160 Speaker 1: and upsetting to think about a man walking into a 60 00:04:01,200 --> 00:04:06,680 Speaker 1: synagogue on a Saturday morning and gunning down elderly people 61 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 1: where they sit, and slaughtering two developmentally disabled men who 62 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:17,880 Speaker 1: are there to greet people when they walked into synagogue 63 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: and hand them prayer books. And to think that he 64 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: in cold blood murdered a couple in their eighties who 65 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 1: were married in that same room where they were butchered. 66 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:34,400 Speaker 1: The fact that a nine seven year old woman was 67 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 1: gunned down, you know, in the pews where she sat praying. 68 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,919 Speaker 1: It's hard to explain to your children, you know, that 69 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:46,719 Speaker 1: which is unexplainable. So, Jonathan, as you mentioned, the trend 70 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:50,840 Speaker 1: recently has not been good. The a d L found 71 00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:53,840 Speaker 1: that the number of anti Semitic incidents in the US 72 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:57,760 Speaker 1: rose fifty seven percent last year, which is the largest 73 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:01,599 Speaker 1: single year increase on record. The number of established neo 74 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:06,279 Speaker 1: Nazi groups is up twice as many hate motivated murders 75 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 1: were committed by white supremacists. What do you attribute all 76 00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 1: of this to what happened in and now eighteen that's 77 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 1: different than the years before. So it's a good question, Brian. 78 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: I think there are a few things to keep in mind. 79 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:23,479 Speaker 1: I think the first thing is that uh, as you 80 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 1: noted we've been tracking anti Semitic against it the United 81 00:05:26,360 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 1: States for forty years. We've been measuring attitudes for more 82 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:36,440 Speaker 1: than fifty years, and anti Semitism, unfortunately has never gone away. 83 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 1: It has been a persistent problem in this country. I 84 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 1: think it's a it's almost like a permanent aspect of 85 00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:45,760 Speaker 1: the human condition. Now, the fact of the matter is, 86 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 1: when we started monitoring attitudes in the sixties, it was 87 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:52,840 Speaker 1: upwards of thirty percent of Americans health classic anti semitic views. 88 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:57,599 Speaker 1: When we lasted the most recent survey sixteen, that number 89 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 1: was down too. I think, so the number has dropped 90 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 1: by more than half. Now that being said, the anti 91 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 1: Semitic instances were on a decline for almost fifteen years, 92 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:14,920 Speaker 1: a gradual, steady decline, and then in they went up 93 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:19,599 Speaker 1: thirty which was a lot, and it was waited toward 94 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 1: the second half of the year, and then of course 95 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:24,800 Speaker 1: seen as you said, a fifty seven percent spiked, the 96 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: single largest we've ever seen. So I think there are 97 00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:31,599 Speaker 1: a few different factors at work. I think number one, clearly, 98 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 1: the public conversation, which is aided and embedded by the 99 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:39,599 Speaker 1: political environment, has changed so previously. As I just noted, 100 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:43,039 Speaker 1: there were people with anti Semitic views, but they did 101 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:47,640 Speaker 1: not feel emboldened. There were people who would consider extremists, 102 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 1: but they did not feel energized. And there were people 103 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 1: on the margins right or people with bad ideas who 104 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:56,600 Speaker 1: are on the margins, but they weren't able to move 105 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 1: into the mainstream. But the political conversation in this country 106 00:06:59,920 --> 00:07:02,679 Speaker 1: is changed, and you now see a kind of hate 107 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 1: filled rhetoric that spews out, and that creates space for 108 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:11,520 Speaker 1: white supremacists and other sorts of bigots to move right in. 109 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,600 Speaker 1: And it's it's undeniable, and we can talk about that 110 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: leadership if you want, but I think the charged environment 111 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 1: is part of it. I think the second factor is 112 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:23,560 Speaker 1: there is broadly felt anxiety and uncertainty. And we know 113 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 1: this right despite the economy, despite the performance of the 114 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 1: stock market, despite the record low unemployment rates, despite the 115 00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 1: growing GDP rates. You hear this when you talk to 116 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: people out in America. They are unsure will the next 117 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:40,160 Speaker 1: generation earn as much as their parents. So this is 118 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 1: all relevant because in an environment where the political system 119 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 1: is and delivering answers and there's widespread uncertainty, scapegoating can 120 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:51,640 Speaker 1: thrive and there's room for those people with silver bullets 121 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 1: like blame the Jews to get their message out there. 122 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 1: And we've seen that pattern throughout history. It is not new, 123 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:03,360 Speaker 1: we've seen in that movie before. But what's so worrisome 124 00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:05,880 Speaker 1: is right now, the conditions seemed ripe for it, and 125 00:08:06,080 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 1: the conditions seem right because of the third factor. So, 126 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:11,640 Speaker 1: in addition to the political environment, and addition't to I 127 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:16,680 Speaker 1: think the broad uncertainty, social media in these platforms have 128 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 1: allowed those extremists to accelerate and amplify their reach in 129 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:27,960 Speaker 1: ways which previously were absolutely unimaginable. I mean, in Katie 130 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 1: know this right, I mean, you've been part of the 131 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,199 Speaker 1: media in this country. Fears you could never find those 132 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:35,840 Speaker 1: people like on a mainstream network, They could never get 133 00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: an audience, right from the editors at the papers to 134 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: those at the networks, they would never allow such individuals 135 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 1: with such hateful ideas to see the light of day today. Facebook, Twitter, Reddit, YouTube, 136 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: and let alone other platforms like four chan, gab, eight chan, 137 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:58,320 Speaker 1: they have allowed them to their hate to to grow 138 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 1: with a velocity and at a volume which is unprecedented. 139 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,959 Speaker 1: Let's talk about the first and the third things that 140 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:08,560 Speaker 1: you mentioned and will table the overall anxiety for another conversation. 141 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 1: The first is leadership. Do you believe that some of 142 00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:18,440 Speaker 1: the blame lay squarely at Pennsylvania Avenue. I mean, let's 143 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:21,480 Speaker 1: just go ahead and address the elephant in the room, 144 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 1: so to speak. So there are a few things here. 145 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:27,560 Speaker 1: Number One, I absolutely positively, and anyone who would deny 146 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: this is sort of I don't know how to lunch. 147 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:33,640 Speaker 1: The President United States has the biggest microphone, he has 148 00:09:33,679 --> 00:09:37,640 Speaker 1: a most significant platform. He's our commander in chief and 149 00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:40,240 Speaker 1: the leader of the country. And we saw this during 150 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 1: the campaign where his account would retweet the rhetoric of 151 00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:48,199 Speaker 1: white supremacists and and and push out the kind of 152 00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:50,800 Speaker 1: memes and images that were coming from some of the 153 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:54,120 Speaker 1: worst elements of society. Whether he understood what those meant, 154 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:57,160 Speaker 1: whether he intended to do that hard to say, but 155 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:01,360 Speaker 1: undeniable that they started there and would spread, and then 156 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:07,000 Speaker 1: in office from not remembering the Holocaust and the Holocaust 157 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:12,040 Speaker 1: members say statement to the moment in Charlottesville when he 158 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: equivocated on neo Nazis and suggest there were fine people 159 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: among both groups of protesters, you want to call them 160 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:23,120 Speaker 1: protesters to the events in Pittsburgh. You know, I'll tell 161 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 1: you the A d L. We're not afraid to speak 162 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:27,079 Speaker 1: truth to power, and we have called this out again 163 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:29,560 Speaker 1: and again when Canada Trump or President Trump did it. 164 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:33,920 Speaker 1: And I think it's critical. It's crucial that it's not 165 00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:36,320 Speaker 1: just about what you say in response to a tragedy, 166 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:38,960 Speaker 1: and he did hit some of the right notes he did. 167 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 1: It's more important how you create a climate where intolerance 168 00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:48,760 Speaker 1: and hatred has no room. And that's what's so deeply 169 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:52,440 Speaker 1: worrying about this. You believe that his reaction to this 170 00:10:52,640 --> 00:10:56,160 Speaker 1: was appropriate in terms of what he said. And how 171 00:10:56,160 --> 00:10:59,840 Speaker 1: did you feel about his suggestion that perhaps there should 172 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 1: be armed guards at synagogues? Yeah, I mean a few thoughts. 173 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:04,920 Speaker 1: I think Number one, he did hit some of the 174 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:06,719 Speaker 1: right notes. There's no question about it. He called that 175 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:10,360 Speaker 1: anti Semitism. We needed to hear that, the country needed 176 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 1: to hear that. Like you didn't know where he would land, 177 00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:18,000 Speaker 1: he landed in the right place with respect to armed 178 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 1: guards and whatnot. Look, I mean every Jewish institution in America, Katie, 179 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:26,120 Speaker 1: from synagogues to schools, to community centers to offices like 180 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:29,080 Speaker 1: those are the A d L. We all have security protocols. 181 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 1: So my synagogue has an armed guard inside of it. 182 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 1: This one didn't have armed guards. But just keep in 183 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:40,199 Speaker 1: mind that four armed, well trained police officers were shot 184 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 1: and wounded by this person. But the reality is I 185 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:47,559 Speaker 1: want to go to synagogue to think about praying, not 186 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 1: to worry about carrying a pistol, Like that's not what 187 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:54,480 Speaker 1: worship in this country should be about. We've talked about 188 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:57,679 Speaker 1: President Trump, but it isn't just restricted to President Trump. 189 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:01,520 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy, who is going to be the leader of 190 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:04,760 Speaker 1: the Republicans in the House after this election, had a 191 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 1: tweet up that said, we cannot allow Soros, Styre, and 192 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:12,720 Speaker 1: Bloomberg to buy this election by in all caps, get 193 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:16,920 Speaker 1: out and vote Republican. November six picture of George Soros. 194 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: You know, my immediate reaction is, Okay, Styre is half Jewish, 195 00:12:21,559 --> 00:12:25,720 Speaker 1: But what are these three people have in common? The 196 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:29,199 Speaker 1: use of the word by Soros emerging, is this major 197 00:12:29,200 --> 00:12:34,480 Speaker 1: boogeyman for Republicans. Has there been a concerted effort on 198 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:38,320 Speaker 1: the right to create a sort of a Jewish villain 199 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:43,000 Speaker 1: that some crazy people have latched onto. Well, I think 200 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 1: there absolutely has been a concerted effort, effort among right 201 00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 1: wing extremists for years to sort of spread this propaganda, 202 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:54,880 Speaker 1: these myths that there's Jewish control and that Jewish the rothchild, 203 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:57,960 Speaker 1: So the Soros or Jewish bankers are manipulating world events. Well, 204 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 1: let's face it, that's nothing new, Jonathanly that that has 205 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: been out there for many, many years. I think what's 206 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:07,080 Speaker 1: frightening about this moment in times that some of that 207 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:11,200 Speaker 1: fearmongering conspiracy theory so somehow again moved out of the 208 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:15,160 Speaker 1: recesses of society into the center of the political and 209 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:19,480 Speaker 1: public conversation. So look, I don't know Kevin McCarthy, but 210 00:13:19,559 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 1: I think and I don't know some of the other 211 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 1: people who have said things. And and let me be 212 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:25,760 Speaker 1: also clear with something. I don't agree with every donation 213 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:30,640 Speaker 1: that George Sorrows makes, but the continual, relentless references to 214 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:36,080 Speaker 1: his religion, and the continual suggestion that he's buying or manipulating, 215 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:40,160 Speaker 1: and the continual tying into some broader conspiracy, this is sickening. 216 00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: I think it's the extreme right wing, the white supremacish 217 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 1: have taken this and somehow been able to insert it. 218 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 1: So what the what we need now though, is this 219 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:51,719 Speaker 1: is bigger than any one person. Whether it's whether it's 220 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy, or it's President Trump, or it's any other 221 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:58,000 Speaker 1: elected officials or by the way, political candidates or other 222 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:01,760 Speaker 1: public figures. Everyone has responsibility to stand up and stamp 223 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:05,040 Speaker 1: this out. And that that is what's different about this 224 00:14:05,080 --> 00:14:08,680 Speaker 1: moment in time. Things are so polarized, things seem so hot, 225 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:11,600 Speaker 1: that people are unwilling to step forward and admit maybe 226 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 1: I made a mistake, maybe this doesn't belong. And so 227 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:16,160 Speaker 1: that's what I would like to see. I don't really 228 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: care how you vote, I care what you value, right, 229 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 1: I don't really care what your party is. I care 230 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:23,720 Speaker 1: how if you stand up to prejudice. And that's what 231 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:25,840 Speaker 1: we really need to see now, more than ever. Have 232 00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:29,920 Speaker 1: you reached out to any of the people who have 233 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:36,040 Speaker 1: been employing language that you would deem racist, anti semitic, etcetera. 234 00:14:36,280 --> 00:14:38,200 Speaker 1: So we we certainly did the a d and I've 235 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 1: done that. I've done it publicly, I've done it privately. 236 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:44,960 Speaker 1: Would you call Kevin McCarthy, Absolutely absolutely. I wouldn't talk 237 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 1: about the nature of our conversations, but I've talked to 238 00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:49,880 Speaker 1: a number of these individuals, and what do they say 239 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: when you reach out and say hey, please restrain yourself. 240 00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:56,400 Speaker 1: Some get it right away and pull back, and some, 241 00:14:56,680 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 1: more so than ever, are in a state of denial. 242 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:01,480 Speaker 1: Would attributed to well, I'm not in it, somebity, I'm 243 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:03,720 Speaker 1: good on Israel, or I'm not an anti Semite. Some 244 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: of my best friends are Jews. I hear those kinds 245 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 1: of comments as well. Um, But look, I think it's 246 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 1: up to us at the a d L, the Shina 247 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:12,000 Speaker 1: Light to make sure that we're using everything in our 248 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 1: power to expose these So people like Kevin McCarthy, who 249 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,680 Speaker 1: I'm sure is not an anti Semite, I'm certain of it, 250 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:21,120 Speaker 1: understand the implications of using that kind of rhetoric. It 251 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 1: reminds me of what Andrew Gillum said in a recent 252 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:28,080 Speaker 1: debate about his opponent. I you know, I'm paraphrasing here, 253 00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 1: but I'm not saying you're a racist racist, think you're 254 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:35,960 Speaker 1: a racist. So similarly, anti Semites think many of these 255 00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 1: people are anti Semitic. Yeah, I mean, let's be clear. 256 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:41,720 Speaker 1: President Trump has Jewish children and Jewish grandchildren. He is 257 00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 1: not an anti Semite. But the anti Semites, I think 258 00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:46,800 Speaker 1: he is winking at them and nodding at them, and 259 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,840 Speaker 1: that's what's so troubling. Well do you think so, Because 260 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:54,240 Speaker 1: when you use language like globalist and nationalist, when you 261 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 1: fail to call out white supremacists, when your initial response 262 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:01,080 Speaker 1: to this incident is basically to blame the victims and 263 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:04,280 Speaker 1: say they needed more protection, it's not a big stretch 264 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:09,520 Speaker 1: to think, gosh, maybe he's actually sympathetic to these views. Well, look, 265 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,520 Speaker 1: I think the president is a paradox. I'll admit that. 266 00:16:12,560 --> 00:16:14,920 Speaker 1: I this is a riddle that I don't totally understand. 267 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,600 Speaker 1: I think by the fact that he works with Jews, 268 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:20,520 Speaker 1: he has Jews and his family. I mean, can you imagine, 269 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:22,120 Speaker 1: for the first time in the history of our country, 270 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: while we had the worst tragedy affecting the Jewish people, 271 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 1: for the first time, we have literally Jewish grandchildren running 272 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 1: around the residence of the of the White House. I 273 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:33,560 Speaker 1: mean it's remarkable. Uh. And it's hard to reconcile these 274 00:16:33,600 --> 00:16:37,840 Speaker 1: two entirely oppositional facts. So I don't think the presidents 275 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:39,840 Speaker 1: in anti Semite. I think the problem is the anti 276 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: Semites rejoice in some of the things that he says, 277 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 1: or maybe more importantly, Brian, the things that he doesn't say. 278 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,520 Speaker 1: How can you say he's not an anti Semite? Yes, 279 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:53,480 Speaker 1: his his son in law is Jewish and his daughter converted, 280 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 1: and he does have Jewish grandchildren. But does that inoculate you. Well, 281 00:16:57,840 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 1: here's what I would say, Katie. I don't know what's 282 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:02,200 Speaker 1: in his heart. I really don't. Well, is it purely 283 00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:05,560 Speaker 1: political that he's trying to appeal to these people? I 284 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:07,000 Speaker 1: don't know it's in his heart, And I'm not a 285 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:09,199 Speaker 1: psychologist analyze in his head. All I know is the 286 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:11,679 Speaker 1: impact of what he's doing. And we see the increasing 287 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: the anti Semitic incidents, and we see the emboldenment of extremists, 288 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:18,080 Speaker 1: and we see moments like this one where if you 289 00:17:18,119 --> 00:17:20,679 Speaker 1: look at the rhetoric and this guy's gab kind of 290 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 1: feed it was the same some of the same kind 291 00:17:23,080 --> 00:17:28,200 Speaker 1: of terms that Brian just said about globalists, about caravans, sorrows, 292 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 1: controlled caravans. That suggests he's taking his cues from the 293 00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:35,919 Speaker 1: political conversation, and that is just deeply disturbing. So how 294 00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 1: are you a hundred person and confident that he doesn't 295 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:40,400 Speaker 1: have these views, that the president doesn't share these anti 296 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:43,320 Speaker 1: Semitic views. Look, I don't, to be very frank, I 297 00:17:43,359 --> 00:17:46,160 Speaker 1: spend my time not trying to gain psychoanalyze the president. 298 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:48,760 Speaker 1: I spend my time literally on the ground trying to 299 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:51,680 Speaker 1: fight anti Semitism and other forms of intolerance when they happen. 300 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 1: So I, as I've said before and that during the campaign, 301 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:58,679 Speaker 1: and as I've said during his presidency, we want the 302 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:03,240 Speaker 1: president to take specific measures to stop anti Semitism and 303 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:07,439 Speaker 1: other forms of intolerance. Right before this massacre at the synagogue, 304 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:11,720 Speaker 1: a number of Democrats and members of the media received 305 00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 1: these pipe bombs from a man who apparently was inspired 306 00:18:16,119 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 1: by the President and his rhetoric. Yeah. I mean, it's 307 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:22,840 Speaker 1: a reminder that words have consequences. It's a reminder that 308 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:28,520 Speaker 1: rhetoric can unfortunately have um you know again, unforeseen outcomes. 309 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:31,200 Speaker 1: And so when the president or anyone else, by the way, 310 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:34,480 Speaker 1: labels the free press the enemy of the people, we 311 00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:38,160 Speaker 1: shouldn't be surprised that some deranged people decided to take action. 312 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 1: And again, there's always been deranged people. You have to 313 00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:43,920 Speaker 1: be deranged to do something like that. But the problem 314 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:46,240 Speaker 1: is that there's an environment now where they feel emboldened, 315 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:48,800 Speaker 1: where they feel like they have a license to operate, 316 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:52,800 Speaker 1: and that's dangerous. And we saw that play out last week, 317 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:56,120 Speaker 1: and they have a target list more or less. More 318 00:18:56,160 --> 00:19:01,159 Speaker 1: or less, you're not simply focused on anti Semitism. You 319 00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:04,080 Speaker 1: are focused on hate crimes in general at the a 320 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:08,399 Speaker 1: d L, and hate crimes against people of color have 321 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:13,600 Speaker 1: increased even more than those hate crimes against Jews. Correct. 322 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:16,040 Speaker 1: I don't know all the specific numbers, you know, as 323 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:19,639 Speaker 1: in versus African Americans or Latinos or l g t 324 00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:23,400 Speaker 1: Q or other forms of immigrants or Muslims. I don't 325 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:25,639 Speaker 1: have the numbers at my top of my head, but 326 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:29,320 Speaker 1: I will tell you this, hate crimes are up, intolerance 327 00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 1: is up. So we've always believed at the a d 328 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:34,639 Speaker 1: L that it's not just about standing up for us, 329 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,160 Speaker 1: it's also about standing up for others. We've been my 330 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:41,000 Speaker 1: predecessors March with Dr King, fought for marriage equality, stood 331 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:43,919 Speaker 1: up for gender against gender violence, and will continue to 332 00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:46,399 Speaker 1: do it today. Let's move on and talk about the 333 00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:51,439 Speaker 1: cyber aspect of this, particularly a site called gab described 334 00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:56,520 Speaker 1: as extremist friendly something the perpetrator of this crime was 335 00:19:56,600 --> 00:20:00,560 Speaker 1: apparently on. You know how many sites are they're like 336 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:05,040 Speaker 1: this out there, Jonathan, and what can be done to 337 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:09,360 Speaker 1: monitor them or shut them down. I know gabst has 338 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 1: now been shut down, has been knocked off, and I 339 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:14,240 Speaker 1: heard from the general counsel of go Daddy this morning 340 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 1: who told me they were taking it offline. You know, 341 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 1: they host the domain. So to try to understand this 342 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:21,960 Speaker 1: world of social media, there's sort of three tiers. There's 343 00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:25,240 Speaker 1: the public web, there's the private web, and then there's 344 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:28,560 Speaker 1: the dark web. So the public web is like YouTube 345 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:32,439 Speaker 1: or Facebook or Google or Twitter. The things you can 346 00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:36,280 Speaker 1: see that anyone can see the private web are the 347 00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 1: password protected zones like on Reddit or on four chance 348 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,120 Speaker 1: or eight chance or these other services that I'm guessing 349 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,000 Speaker 1: Katie has been a lot of time, but they're very 350 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 1: popular and you need to be you know, admitted in. 351 00:20:50,480 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 1: And then the dark web, which is a part of 352 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:54,760 Speaker 1: the Internet you can't access, you know, just with your 353 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:58,760 Speaker 1: Chrome browser, but where a lot of nefarious and very 354 00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:02,720 Speaker 1: ugly activity happens. So gab and four chan and h 355 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,200 Speaker 1: in these kinds of services there on the private web, 356 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:08,400 Speaker 1: and there are a lot of them, and the real 357 00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:10,919 Speaker 1: issue is that hundreds of thousands of people, upwards of 358 00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:13,080 Speaker 1: millions of people use these services, and a lot of 359 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,480 Speaker 1: it isn't necessarily you know, the kind of trafficking in 360 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:21,440 Speaker 1: racist or extreme mr anti Semitic content, but there's enough 361 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:24,760 Speaker 1: of it that is that is incredibly frightening. And I 362 00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:26,240 Speaker 1: see this. You know, at the A d L we 363 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 1: opened a Center for Technology and Society in Silicon Valley 364 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 1: last year because we know that the front line and 365 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: fighting hate it's on Facebook. We know in order to 366 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 1: tackle the kind of slander and stereotypes that I'm referring to, 367 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:43,600 Speaker 1: we need to be engaged with Twitter and YouTube and 368 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 1: all these different platforms. Twitter says that it has a 369 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:51,040 Speaker 1: policy where if you spew hateful rhetoric or prejudice rhetoric, 370 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:54,160 Speaker 1: you're gonna get kicked off the platform. And yet we've 371 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:57,959 Speaker 1: seen people like Louis Ferricon and others who put up 372 00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:01,720 Speaker 1: anti Semitic tweets and they're still there, the at least 373 00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 1: as of this recording, they're still there, and those people 374 00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:07,400 Speaker 1: are allowed to continue to spread hate. What can be 375 00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:11,879 Speaker 1: done to address the public web these very large, powerful, 376 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:16,639 Speaker 1: rich platforms that I don't know whether they allow it 377 00:22:16,840 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 1: or they just can't stop all of the hate that's 378 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:24,240 Speaker 1: you know that's going on. Well, look, I think it's 379 00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 1: it's a good question. Ryan and I think there's no 380 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 1: question that the large companies have a huge role to 381 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:32,959 Speaker 1: play here. I think part of it requires innovation and 382 00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:36,159 Speaker 1: part of it requires sort of intervention. So in the 383 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 1: innovation side, we need the companies to realize improving their 384 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 1: products and making their platforms safer for all users is 385 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:46,879 Speaker 1: not just because of the you know, requests of stakeholder 386 00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:48,960 Speaker 1: groups like the A d L. It's in the interest 387 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:53,159 Speaker 1: of their shareholders, right Their stock price will suffer and 388 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:56,359 Speaker 1: usage will go down if users don't feel safe. So 389 00:22:56,400 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: this is what I said, and I have an op 390 00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:00,040 Speaker 1: ed in the New York Times today about this. The 391 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,480 Speaker 1: best way to show these companies that they need to 392 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:06,720 Speaker 1: do something about it is to deactivate your account, click 393 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:09,560 Speaker 1: off instead of clicking through. Would you have a campaign 394 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:11,639 Speaker 1: trying to urge people to do that, because people are 395 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:14,239 Speaker 1: just aren't going to do it, Jonathan, because oh this 396 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:15,840 Speaker 1: is a good idea. I mean, you have to have 397 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 1: a really an organized campaign the way that we do it, 398 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:21,440 Speaker 1: as we call attention. And so you know, we've exposed 399 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,760 Speaker 1: anti semitic abuse on Twitter, specifically against you know, journalists, 400 00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 1: and when we did that in the summer of sixteen, 401 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:29,960 Speaker 1: I remember we did a podcast about this, we talked 402 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:33,840 Speaker 1: about it. It affected their share price. So why did it? 403 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,199 Speaker 1: Because because suddenly companies who are looking at them in 404 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 1: terms as an m and a possibility. I thought, wait 405 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:40,560 Speaker 1: a second, there's a lot of liability on the platform. 406 00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:43,560 Speaker 1: Maybe the platform is off brand, maybe won't be again 407 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:46,360 Speaker 1: consistent with the shareholder value interests? Is that the only 408 00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 1: way to communicate to these companies and financially. As a 409 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,440 Speaker 1: former executive and I was a senior executive at Starbucks 410 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: and I've worked as an executive to publicly traded companies, 411 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:59,199 Speaker 1: I gotta tell you that absolutely makes a difference. On 412 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:01,600 Speaker 1: the other hand, I would also say that the employees 413 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,520 Speaker 1: and the users have a lot to say, and when 414 00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:07,919 Speaker 1: companies operate outside of core values of things like decency 415 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 1: and respect and tolerance, you're seeing it more and more. 416 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:15,400 Speaker 1: So petitions and campaigns can be useful and the companies 417 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:17,640 Speaker 1: need to realize that we want to collaborate with them. 418 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:20,159 Speaker 1: And I do want to say although Brian, as you 419 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,040 Speaker 1: were saying, Twitter has a lot of work to do, 420 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 1: YouTube is a lot of work to do. Facebook as 421 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,199 Speaker 1: a lot of work to do. They have made progress. 422 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,840 Speaker 1: We have seen improvements in their product. They are better 423 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: today than they were just a few years ago. Bad 424 00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:35,560 Speaker 1: actors do get thrown off far more frequently today than 425 00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 1: they do a few years ago. Look at Alex Jones. 426 00:24:37,359 --> 00:24:41,080 Speaker 1: So there are encouraging signs, but they need to do more. 427 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:45,000 Speaker 1: On Tuesday, the president is going to be traveling to Pittsburgh. 428 00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:49,120 Speaker 1: According to Sarah Huckabee Sanders, what kind of reception will 429 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:53,000 Speaker 1: he get and what advice would you give him as 430 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:56,919 Speaker 1: he goes into that community. Well, look, it's up to 431 00:24:56,960 --> 00:24:58,879 Speaker 1: the local Jewish community and the family is there to 432 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,479 Speaker 1: decide how. I'm how they're going to respond to him. 433 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:03,560 Speaker 1: I don't really know. I think the emotions are very 434 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:07,159 Speaker 1: raw right now. Basically when I've talked to this community 435 00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 1: is struggling. I think the the interfaith vigil last night 436 00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 1: was really important. But I gotta tell you, I mean 437 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:15,439 Speaker 1: they're suffering right now. So I don't know how they 438 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:18,440 Speaker 1: will react. He is the president, and so I think 439 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:22,639 Speaker 1: my advice to him would be two with clarity and 440 00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 1: with consistency, and in a way that is authentic to 441 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:31,680 Speaker 1: denounce not just anti Semitism, but all forms of sort 442 00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:34,639 Speaker 1: of racism and white supremacy. I think he needs to 443 00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 1: speak in a clear voice. And I think, you know what, tomorrow, 444 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:41,640 Speaker 1: this visit will be meaningful, not not only because he's 445 00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: going to a place that suffered such tragedy, but if 446 00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:48,200 Speaker 1: it demonstrates a pivot for the president and he can 447 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:52,119 Speaker 1: shift from not just responding to tragedy but demonstrating a 448 00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:54,960 Speaker 1: commitment to respect going forward. In fact, there's a letter 449 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,680 Speaker 1: that was written to the President by an organization called 450 00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:00,640 Speaker 1: Ben the Ark. Why don't you help our listener understand 451 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,199 Speaker 1: what this organization is and then I'll actually read a 452 00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:05,240 Speaker 1: couple of lines from it. So beni Arc is a 453 00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:08,200 Speaker 1: Jewish um group focused on issues of social justice. They're 454 00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:11,080 Speaker 1: domestically oriented. I knows in the leadership. They're very nice, 455 00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: good well meaning people, and they're focused on, you know, 456 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:19,359 Speaker 1: issues like immigration reform and racism and institutional racism. And 457 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,879 Speaker 1: I think they're very concerned about this. Well, this letter reads. 458 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 1: For the past three years, your words and your policies 459 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,480 Speaker 1: have been bold in a growing white nationalist movement. You 460 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:33,199 Speaker 1: yourself called the murderer evil, but yesterday's violence is the 461 00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: direct culmination of your influence. President Trump, you are not 462 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 1: welcome in Pittsburgh until you fully denounced white nationalism. President Trump, 463 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,800 Speaker 1: You're not welcome in Pittsburgh until you stop targeting and 464 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:49,200 Speaker 1: endangering all minorities. President Trump, You're not welcome in Pittsburgh 465 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:53,240 Speaker 1: until you seize your assault on immigrants and refugees. President Trump, 466 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,840 Speaker 1: You're not welcome in Pittsburgh until you commit yourself to compassionate, 467 00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 1: democratic policies that recognize the dignity of all of us. Well, look, 468 00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:05,320 Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, I think the Jewish community 469 00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:08,200 Speaker 1: of Pittsburgh, the Congregation of Trial Life, needs to decide 470 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:10,200 Speaker 1: whether he's welcome, And I don't think it's for Bemi 471 00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:12,679 Speaker 1: Ark to decide that if the president wants to go. 472 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:15,119 Speaker 1: I think what can make them visit meaningful is if 473 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:21,919 Speaker 1: he actually, truly, sincerely change his course and strikes a 474 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:24,480 Speaker 1: new tone and uses the kind of language that you 475 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:27,160 Speaker 1: would expect, because look, it's one thing to be political, 476 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,960 Speaker 1: it's another thing to be presidential, and it's one thing 477 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,879 Speaker 1: to you know, he may have the formal title of leader, 478 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 1: but he needs to accept the moral responsibility of leadership. 479 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,240 Speaker 1: So if he gets it right, it could be great. 480 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,919 Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't know. I think, you know, Brian, 481 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 1: I was thinking about, you know, Presidential leadership is so 482 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:52,240 Speaker 1: important to healing when these horrific events happen, whether it's 483 00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 1: President Obama shedding a tear over those children at Sandy 484 00:27:56,600 --> 00:28:00,399 Speaker 1: Hook or other presidents who have time and time again 485 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:06,400 Speaker 1: really provided the soothing bomb to a to a really 486 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:11,680 Speaker 1: hurting nation. Um. I hope that President Trump understands, as 487 00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:15,800 Speaker 1: you said, Jonathan, his responsibility and the fact that his 488 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 1: words are exceedingly important. I think about President George W. 489 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 1: Bush going to the Islamic Center in Lower Manhattan shortly 490 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:29,280 Speaker 1: after nine eleven and saying very clearly, at a fraud moment, 491 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:32,639 Speaker 1: we're not at war with the Islamic faith. You know, 492 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,200 Speaker 1: we're at war with terrorism, and we're not going to 493 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:37,640 Speaker 1: target you. I mean, I think of President Reagan after 494 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:41,200 Speaker 1: the Challenger disaster. There's so many examples when this country 495 00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 1: needs a president to bring it together and turn down 496 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:48,400 Speaker 1: the temperature, and remains to be seen whether this president 497 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 1: is capable of that. You know, so many people are 498 00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:53,960 Speaker 1: at a loss as to what they can do. We're 499 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: talking about what the president can do, We're talking about 500 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 1: deactivating our Twitter accounts, But can the average citizen do, Jonathan, 501 00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:06,200 Speaker 1: Because I feel like the majority of Americans are really 502 00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,960 Speaker 1: good people, of course, and yet they're feeling so helpless 503 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 1: and hopeless and in some ways lost. A friend of 504 00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 1: mine texted me, I no longer recognize my country. Yeah, 505 00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:20,400 Speaker 1: I mean it's heartbreaking hear comments like that, like it's 506 00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:23,520 Speaker 1: so crushing to think about people shot and synagogue in chabba. 507 00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 1: I think these are hard times because I don't think 508 00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:28,800 Speaker 1: there's a silver bullet, you know. I don't think there's 509 00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 1: the one thing we can do. I think part of 510 00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:33,960 Speaker 1: me says we have to hug our children tighter. I 511 00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: really feel like that, and part of me says we 512 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 1: have to lock arms with others in need. And so everybody, 513 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 1: you know, shows up in different ways. But this is 514 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:44,240 Speaker 1: a moment when I think we have to really recognize 515 00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 1: the other. If you're a Christian, find that Jewish person. 516 00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 1: You know, if you're straight, find that gay person. If 517 00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:53,960 Speaker 1: you're born here in this country, go find that immigranto 518 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: refugee and strike up a conversation and hold their hand 519 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:00,920 Speaker 1: and create some kind of communion with them. You know, 520 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:03,440 Speaker 1: I'm the I'm the grandson of a Holocaust survivor, and 521 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:07,040 Speaker 1: I am the husband of a political refugee from Iran. 522 00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 1: And I think my grandfather, and I think my in 523 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 1: laws and my wife sometimes have a hard time reconciling 524 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:16,440 Speaker 1: where we are today with the country that they came to. 525 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,880 Speaker 1: But I do think America's greatest strength is her ability 526 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:22,360 Speaker 1: to renew itself. So I think we will, I hope, 527 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 1: I pray we will get through this. And I suspect 528 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: as the head of the a d L, you'll agree 529 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:28,960 Speaker 1: with this, Jonathan. One thing that all of us can do, 530 00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 1: particularly those of us with a big platform or a 531 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:37,120 Speaker 1: lot of followers like Katie has or politicians, have call 532 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:41,200 Speaker 1: out anti semitic or racist rhetoric as soon as you 533 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:44,400 Speaker 1: see it, as loudly as you possibly can. Brian, I 534 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:47,320 Speaker 1: entirely agree with that. But there's no doubt in my 535 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:50,719 Speaker 1: mind that all of us, you know, UM, not just 536 00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:53,440 Speaker 1: people in positions of authority, although they have a certain weight, 537 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,000 Speaker 1: but every single one of us has the ability to 538 00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,720 Speaker 1: interrupt intolerance when it happens, whether it happens at the 539 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:01,920 Speaker 1: water cooler or over the dinner table, or on the 540 00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:05,560 Speaker 1: playing field or anywhere else for that matter, or in 541 00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:10,360 Speaker 1: your social media feed, like none of us should tolerate intolerance, 542 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,640 Speaker 1: and when we roll our eyes and when we simply 543 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:17,160 Speaker 1: dismiss it, that's when it takes hold and spreads. So 544 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:19,840 Speaker 1: from the President to every one of us. We have, 545 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 1: we have and we should try to stop hey when 546 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 1: it happens. Jonathan Greenblad, I'm so happy you came by today. 547 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:33,000 Speaker 1: Thank you so much, as always for having We'd like 548 00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 1: to thank Jonathan Greenblatt for joining us on such short 549 00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:39,360 Speaker 1: notice to talk about this tragedy. The team that produces 550 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:42,040 Speaker 1: this podcast and did a great job this week is 551 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:46,479 Speaker 1: producer Emma Morgan Stern, associate producer Nora Richie, and audio 552 00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:50,200 Speaker 1: engineer Jared O'Connell. Thank you to my assistant Beth Demas, 553 00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 1: my social media producer Julia Lewis, Mark Phillips who wrote 554 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 1: our theme music, and of course you can find me 555 00:31:56,480 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 1: on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram at Katie Curic. I'm spending 556 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:03,320 Speaker 1: a lot of time on Instagram talking about this tragedy 557 00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:07,600 Speaker 1: and presenting biographies of the people who lost their lives. 558 00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,440 Speaker 1: And you can reach out to Bryant on Twitter. His 559 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:13,880 Speaker 1: handle is Goldsmith B. We'll be back on Thursday for 560 00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: a regularly scheduled episode with a look at the upcoming 561 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:20,840 Speaker 1: midterm elections. Thanks so much, for listening. Let's see you 562 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:21,280 Speaker 1: next time.