WEBVTT - Teri Weinberg 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:03.160 Hi. I'm Arden Marine from Insatiable and then will you 0:00:03.200 --> 0:00:06.440 accept this Rose Podcast? And I'm Julianne Robinson, an Emmy 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:09.680 nominated director of Bridgeton And we are the hosts of 0:00:09.800 --> 0:00:12.559 Lady of the Road, a funny and inspiring podcast where 0:00:12.560 --> 0:00:15.440 we have conversations with influential women about their lives and 0:00:15.480 --> 0:00:18.520 we get self help advice because we are always looking 0:00:18.520 --> 0:00:22.600 to improve ourselves. True story. We talk about money, health, relationships, 0:00:22.640 --> 0:00:25.560 you name it, from inspiring women like jo't Jet, Nicole Buyer, 0:00:25.640 --> 0:00:28.880 Lauren Lapiz, Rtta and more. Listen and subscribe to Lady 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:31.400 of the Road on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, 0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:35.240 or wherever you get your podcasts. On the latest season 0:00:35.280 --> 0:00:38.440 of The Next Question with Katie Correct podcast, Katie dives 0:00:38.440 --> 0:00:43.760 into Well Katie Here, exclusive podcast only conversations between Katie 0:00:43.760 --> 0:00:46.560 and the people who made her memoir Going There Possible. 0:00:46.720 --> 0:00:50.800 Katie is a pack rad and she has basically her 0:00:50.840 --> 0:00:55.720 own archive of sorts in her basements. Plus, Katie explores 0:00:55.800 --> 0:00:57.880 some of the big news stories she's covered over the 0:00:57.920 --> 0:01:01.640 decades and the people behind them, like Anita Hill. I 0:01:01.680 --> 0:01:04.160 thought I could just get back to my life and 0:01:04.400 --> 0:01:07.680 that was impossible. It was not going to be the same. 0:01:07.920 --> 0:01:12.360 There's plenty of Katie's signature curiosity and no holds barred interviews, 0:01:12.400 --> 0:01:15.320 along with some of her own revealing answers. We spent 0:01:15.400 --> 0:01:18.720 a lot of time together around a dining room table 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:22.440 here and in the city, and you know, it was 0:01:22.480 --> 0:01:26.399 a very intense experience. All episodes of Next Question with 0:01:26.480 --> 0:01:29.280 Katie Curic are available now. Listen on the I Heart 0:01:29.319 --> 0:01:35.240 Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi. 0:01:35.400 --> 0:01:38.240 I'm Hillary Clinton, and I'm so excited to be back 0:01:38.280 --> 0:01:41.679 with a third season of you and Me both. When 0:01:41.720 --> 0:01:45.200 I started this podcast, we were going through some tough times, 0:01:45.280 --> 0:01:48.360 and let's face it, we still are. And here's what 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:52.040 I know. We cannot get through this alone. So please 0:01:52.120 --> 0:01:55.400 join me for more conversations with people who will make 0:01:55.440 --> 0:01:58.320 you think, make you laugh, and help us find a 0:01:58.360 --> 0:02:02.000 path forward. The season, I'll be talking about the state 0:02:02.040 --> 0:02:05.920 of our democracy with experts and with people organizing on 0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:10.840 the ground. We'll draw inspiration from some amazing people like 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:15.520 Olympic star Alison Felix and Grammy Award winner Brandy Carlisle. 0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:19.560 And we'll get into the hard stuff with writer Cheryl 0:02:19.639 --> 0:02:23.760 Strait and my dear friend and colleague Juma Aberdeen, So 0:02:23.880 --> 0:02:26.160 join us. Listen to you and me both on the 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:29.640 I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get 0:02:29.680 --> 0:02:46.680 your podcasts. Hi, I'm Terry Weinberg and I am the 0:02:46.680 --> 0:03:00.280 executive producer of the Office. Hello everyone, and welcome to you. 0:03:00.360 --> 0:03:04.080 Guessed it the Office deep Dive. I am your host 0:03:04.840 --> 0:03:08.240 Brian Baumgartner. But I bet you guessed that too, because 0:03:08.240 --> 0:03:15.919 you are all very smart, as is my wonderful guest today, 0:03:16.160 --> 0:03:20.760 Terry Weinberg. That was a transition. Now, Terry was an 0:03:20.760 --> 0:03:25.440 executive producer of the Office and a longtime partner of 0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:32.000 Ben Silverman, which truly makes her a saint, let's be honest. Uh. 0:03:32.280 --> 0:03:35.680 But she was definitely there from the very beginning in 0:03:35.800 --> 0:03:39.200 the room where it happened, as they say, the room 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:43.440 where they grew the Office from a tiny seed of 0:03:43.480 --> 0:03:48.800 an idea into the crazy popular show that it is today. Um, 0:03:49.000 --> 0:03:52.880 as you will hear all about momentarily, Terry was involved 0:03:53.120 --> 0:03:56.640 from day one in the casting and and really the 0:03:56.720 --> 0:04:00.360 creation of the show. But what's even more fast nating 0:04:00.600 --> 0:04:03.520 to me is that in the later years of the show, 0:04:03.760 --> 0:04:07.440 Terry jumped over to work on the network side at NBC, 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:10.480 so she saw things from the inside and then also 0:04:10.560 --> 0:04:13.760 from the network side and how the network was dealing 0:04:13.920 --> 0:04:16.919 with the show. She has a really unique perspective on 0:04:17.000 --> 0:04:22.239 the whole story of the Office. And this conversation kicks 0:04:22.279 --> 0:04:27.279 off another mini series that we're doing highlighting just some 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:33.840 of the many talented, hilarious, super smart women who made 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:36.200 The Office what it is, both in front of the 0:04:36.240 --> 0:04:40.080 camera and behind the scenes. This is a great bunch 0:04:40.120 --> 0:04:42.760 of interviews, if I do say so myself, So I am. 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:45.440 I'm really excited to share them all with you. So 0:04:45.839 --> 0:04:55.760 let's get started, shall we today with Terry Weinberg, Bubble Squeak. 0:04:57.080 --> 0:05:04.080 I love it, Bubble squign Bubble and Squeaker Cookie every 0:05:04.320 --> 0:05:18.080 moment look over from the nuts people. You know, a 0:05:18.120 --> 0:05:21.280 lot of the cast, I will say, like, we do 0:05:21.520 --> 0:05:26.080 really still, you know, keep in touch. Yeah, like our 0:05:26.640 --> 0:05:30.720 fantasy football league is still going, like fifteen years later, 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:33.800 So John and Rain and me and some of the 0:05:33.839 --> 0:05:38.280 crew guys, and good luck with that this year exactly. 0:05:38.760 --> 0:05:41.039 But you know, Oscar and Angela and I and you know, 0:05:41.160 --> 0:05:43.240 Rain and I and John. And that's part of the 0:05:43.279 --> 0:05:46.240 thing too about this COVID business is that people are 0:05:46.240 --> 0:05:49.400 reaching out Mare. You know, my birthday was on Monday, 0:05:49.800 --> 0:05:52.040 and I spent the entire day and zooms, I mean 0:05:52.120 --> 0:05:56.760 the entire day. You know. But people, you you're learning 0:05:56.839 --> 0:06:00.640 two things. One we're working harder to stay connect with people, 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:03.640 and then you're also learning who wants to stay connected 0:06:04.040 --> 0:06:07.560 to you. You know, Father's Day I heard from people 0:06:07.640 --> 0:06:10.880 like Father's Day, like, what nobody ever reached his act? 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:15.760 Why are you right, I'm not your father? Like everyone's 0:06:15.760 --> 0:06:18.520 reaching out. I don't know. That's been really great. Okay, 0:06:18.600 --> 0:06:25.120 So you were so omnipresent through all of the beginning. 0:06:25.440 --> 0:06:26.920 So if you go all the way back now is 0:06:27.160 --> 0:06:31.160 nineteen years ago, how did you meet Ben? When did 0:06:31.200 --> 0:06:33.479 you start working for Reveling? What was the transition there? 0:06:34.200 --> 0:06:38.159 I'm at Ben in two thousands. I had two roommates 0:06:38.200 --> 0:06:41.400 at the time. One of my roommates, who Ben had 0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:44.039 known for some time, who I think date he dated 0:06:44.120 --> 0:06:50.160 for one second, introduced him to our other roommate. Now 0:06:50.360 --> 0:06:54.880 Ben was still working at William Morris, I think he 0:06:54.960 --> 0:06:57.400 was still in London, and he would fly out to 0:06:57.520 --> 0:06:59.880 l A and he would be out here every month 0:07:00.160 --> 0:07:01.680 and he would stay for you know, a couple of 0:07:01.680 --> 0:07:05.839 weeks whatever. So she introduced one roommate introduces him to 0:07:05.880 --> 0:07:11.160 the other. They start dating in true Bend fashion. He 0:07:11.280 --> 0:07:13.440 used to stay at the Lermitage. I think it was 0:07:13.800 --> 0:07:16.040 for three weeks at a time. Either she would stay 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:19.640 at the Lirmitage with him or he would stay and 0:07:19.720 --> 0:07:22.440 our duplex. And so I started to see him a 0:07:22.480 --> 0:07:27.360 lot and got to know him just socially. And at 0:07:27.400 --> 0:07:30.240 that point my roommate that he was dating and me, 0:07:30.440 --> 0:07:32.920 I just left I c M and we started a 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:36.440 skincare company. I would be up all day, all night 0:07:36.640 --> 0:07:40.960 making all these skincare products in my kitchen, and I 0:07:41.000 --> 0:07:43.080 was talking about about, you know what my experience was 0:07:43.120 --> 0:07:44.640 at I c M and whatever. We just got to 0:07:44.640 --> 0:07:49.280 know each other really well. And it was in March 0:07:49.520 --> 0:07:54.600 I think of two thousand one. He pulled an all 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:58.160 night er I think at the Oscars, came home. I'm 0:07:58.280 --> 0:08:00.560 up at four or five in the morning making these things. 0:08:00.640 --> 0:08:05.520 He comes walking in in his Oswald Botang purple suit, 0:08:06.600 --> 0:08:11.360 right and m we just started talking. He said, you 0:08:11.360 --> 0:08:13.960 know what, I'm gonna start my own production company. I've 0:08:13.960 --> 0:08:17.440 been bringing formats in to the States and I really 0:08:17.480 --> 0:08:20.920 just want to have more of a creative experience. I 0:08:20.960 --> 0:08:23.600 want to be a producer, and when I do that, 0:08:23.840 --> 0:08:27.440 I want you to go work for me. And I said, okay, well, 0:08:27.680 --> 0:08:29.360 I have no idea what you're talking about, but okay. 0:08:29.400 --> 0:08:32.200 Ben talked to me next year because I didn't take 0:08:32.280 --> 0:08:35.160 him seriously, but he kept bringing up and he always 0:08:35.200 --> 0:08:37.400 said to me, you know, I really appreciate your work ethic. 0:08:37.520 --> 0:08:39.360 I like the experience that you have. I have no 0:08:39.400 --> 0:08:41.320 idea what you'd be doing yet, but I know that 0:08:41.360 --> 0:08:42.800 I need you to be a part of my company. 0:08:42.920 --> 0:08:46.439 So cut to that next year where he made the 0:08:46.480 --> 0:08:49.319 deal with the vend Universal was very diller at the time, 0:08:50.040 --> 0:08:55.080 and he brought Howard Owens, Mark Coops, and Chris Grant 0:08:55.600 --> 0:08:57.840 from New York. They were all still in New York, 0:08:58.440 --> 0:09:00.480 and he said, I'm bringing these three guys. US didn't 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:05.960 know them. We have a bungalow at Universal. So I 0:09:06.000 --> 0:09:09.240 want you to go and set at the office and 0:09:09.640 --> 0:09:15.160 I meet a house. Go find me a house. This 0:09:15.320 --> 0:09:20.600 is no surprise at all, and we will be there 0:09:21.320 --> 0:09:24.040 in two months or something like that. So what do 0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:26.720 I do. I go on the lot. I get the 0:09:26.800 --> 0:09:30.640 whole entire bungalow up ready to go. All they had 0:09:30.679 --> 0:09:33.120 to do was walk in and pick up a pen 0:09:33.640 --> 0:09:38.000 and go to work. Phones everything. I'm navigated my way 0:09:38.000 --> 0:09:42.560 through the entire universal, every department you could possibly imagine, 0:09:42.600 --> 0:09:45.640 anyway they come out, and we all just learned how 0:09:45.679 --> 0:09:47.880 to produce, just the five of us. You would have 0:09:47.920 --> 0:09:51.760 thought that a hundred people worked at that production company, 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:57.840 and it was us five, and so Ben, Mark and Howard. 0:09:58.240 --> 0:10:00.800 You know, we're focusing mostly on international all. You know, 0:10:00.840 --> 0:10:03.440 we had Nashville Star I think, was being developed and 0:10:03.840 --> 0:10:07.160 the Biggest Loser just kind of you know, looking at 0:10:07.160 --> 0:10:09.439 formats and kind of touching on what that stuff was 0:10:09.440 --> 0:10:11.440 going to be, which I really didn't have any interest in. 0:10:12.240 --> 0:10:15.800 And we had the format too, Coupling. That was our 0:10:15.840 --> 0:10:19.800 first show that we started to produce in scripted television, 0:10:20.240 --> 0:10:22.560 and so I just kind of cut my teeth in 0:10:22.600 --> 0:10:25.160 that process. I would just sit in a corner, you know, 0:10:25.240 --> 0:10:27.840 in a room and listen to, you know, the conversations, 0:10:27.920 --> 0:10:30.520 and I went to every I did everything with Ben. 0:10:30.679 --> 0:10:33.640 I went everywhere. I was on every phone, call you 0:10:33.920 --> 0:10:36.040 everything that you could possibly imagine. That's really how I 0:10:36.120 --> 0:10:39.440 learned is listening to executives, listening to studios, listening to 0:10:39.480 --> 0:10:43.680 creative people. I certainly had a deep familiarity with script 0:10:43.679 --> 0:10:45.400 because that's how I was raised at I c M. 0:10:46.040 --> 0:10:49.840 And then I just each day I just kept immersing 0:10:49.880 --> 0:10:53.040 myself deeper and deeper in that process, and that's really 0:10:53.040 --> 0:10:56.720 how I built the scripted department at REVELI what did 0:10:56.760 --> 0:11:00.679 you learn from your experience on coupling that felt like 0:11:01.400 --> 0:11:07.240 impacted bringing the office over? We learned a couple of things. One, 0:11:07.960 --> 0:11:09.840 you know, there was so much pressure on that show 0:11:09.880 --> 0:11:13.120 because it was being coined the next Friends, and we 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:16.560 realized that, oh, ship, that's a big problem because people 0:11:16.600 --> 0:11:18.600 are going to have an expectation that we are trying 0:11:18.600 --> 0:11:21.160 to be the next Friends, which we had no intention 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.440 of being. So learning about how critical marketing is of 0:11:24.480 --> 0:11:29.719 a show, and also we pretty much adhered to every 0:11:29.960 --> 0:11:33.880 script from the British version instead of kind of making 0:11:33.880 --> 0:11:38.400 it our own. And so we also learned that that 0:11:38.440 --> 0:11:42.200 stuff doesn't necessarily translate. So I think we learned that 0:11:42.320 --> 0:11:45.320 going into that process, we needed to have a voice. 0:11:45.360 --> 0:11:47.440 We needed to have somebody come in that, you know, 0:11:47.600 --> 0:11:51.640 understood the rhythms and the uniqueness of what that show was, 0:11:51.760 --> 0:11:55.160 but had to bring in their own voice and make 0:11:55.200 --> 0:11:59.240 it their own right. Stephen actually said to me that 0:11:59.640 --> 0:12:02.440 he thought like his greatest contribution was actually and one 0:12:02.440 --> 0:12:05.800 thing he said to Ricky was stepped back, like they 0:12:05.960 --> 0:12:10.200 know culturally about what's happening in America or rhythms or 0:12:10.320 --> 0:12:13.480 specific sensibilities or whatever. So the more we can stay 0:12:13.480 --> 0:12:16.920 out of it, the better. I Mean. The most beautiful 0:12:16.920 --> 0:12:21.679 thing about what Ricky and Stephen did was exactly that 0:12:21.720 --> 0:12:26.240 they came over, met the cast, spent time with Greg 0:12:26.760 --> 0:12:30.360 and just talked about the things that we really cared about. 0:12:31.280 --> 0:12:34.199 How did you create these characters? What made you want 0:12:34.200 --> 0:12:36.160 to be in this world? How did these rhythms, like 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:39.760 all of the things that we're more important. Instead of 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:42.800 tell us exactly how you you know, get this shot 0:12:42.880 --> 0:12:45.720 or whatever, it was really more about all the impetus 0:12:45.840 --> 0:12:49.920 is on creating the show. And then they were the 0:12:49.960 --> 0:12:53.520 most incredible cheerleaders one could ever have. I mean, they 0:12:53.559 --> 0:12:58.080 were absolutely dream partners, and they literally just sat back 0:12:58.360 --> 0:13:01.640 and like fans is fell in love with the show 0:13:01.640 --> 0:13:04.880 and I'll never forget, and I'm sure you'll remember. I mean, 0:13:04.920 --> 0:13:08.120 I was kind of a blur. But when we won 0:13:08.160 --> 0:13:10.400 the Emmy and we were all up on the stage 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:14.880 and Greg reached out and said, Ricky and Stephen, I 0:13:14.920 --> 0:13:18.240 know you're out there somewhere, you know, because of you, 0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:21.560 you're brilliantly I can't remember exactly what he said, and 0:13:21.600 --> 0:13:25.160 then I remembered watching the telecast back and Ricky and 0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:29.280 Stephen they were so proud but got so shy and 0:13:29.320 --> 0:13:32.400 didn't want to take any of the credit for it. 0:13:32.400 --> 0:13:36.319 It was beautiful, and they never had egos about it 0:13:36.360 --> 0:13:40.040 to say, this is our thing, and we're lending it 0:13:40.080 --> 0:13:43.760 to you. This is our thing, and we're giving this 0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:46.679 to you, and we're trusting you to go and do 0:13:46.720 --> 0:13:50.960 your own thing. Yeah. So, at what point in the 0:13:51.040 --> 0:13:55.680 process when you were working with REVELI did you become 0:13:55.720 --> 0:13:59.560 aware of the office, the British Office. I mean it 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:01.920 had to be in the beginning because Ben had the rights, 0:14:03.000 --> 0:14:07.920 he had already secured them. And I remembered Ben showing 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:09.719 it to me and said, look at this and tell 0:14:09.760 --> 0:14:12.320 me what you think. And I remembered watching and said, 0:14:12.320 --> 0:14:14.439 oh my god, I have to we have to do this. 0:14:15.040 --> 0:14:16.360 I don't know what the funk we're doing, but we 0:14:16.400 --> 0:14:21.160 have to do this. I was absolutely obsessed so very 0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:24.200 early on. And then then we put the time into 0:14:24.680 --> 0:14:28.600 you know, try to find the right voice. And in 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:33.120 the conversations that Bennett had with Ari, Greg's name obviously 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:34.800 came up, and I'm sure he probably told you this, 0:14:34.840 --> 0:14:37.080 but he just would not watch it. I mean, I 0:14:37.160 --> 0:14:40.280 think he sat on it for three weeks or something 0:14:40.320 --> 0:14:42.840 like that. And then finally Ben was talking to Ari 0:14:42.960 --> 0:14:45.320 and said, is this guy that ever you know watched this? 0:14:45.400 --> 0:14:47.360 And I think already said the same thing to Greg, 0:14:47.760 --> 0:14:51.080 are you gonna watch this? You know, because they're going 0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:54.360 to move on? And then Greg, I think watched it 0:14:54.400 --> 0:14:56.480 over that weekend and came back and said, oh my god, 0:14:56.520 --> 0:14:58.560 I hope to god they didn't move on because I 0:14:58.600 --> 0:15:01.800 have to do this. Yeah, that's awesome. What was your 0:15:01.800 --> 0:15:08.720 initial impression of him? Introvert, brilliant, one of the nicest 0:15:08.720 --> 0:15:13.960 people I've ever met, collaborative, open, you know, and welcome, 0:15:14.040 --> 0:15:19.680 didn't bring any ego, respected us and me even I 0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:21.640 don't know if he knew how much I'd ever, you know, 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:27.280 produced in my life, and immediately just treated us like 0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:31.360 his partners. I fell in love with him immediately and thought, 0:15:31.360 --> 0:15:32.920 my god, how do we get so lucky? This man 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:38.640 is just brilliant, you know, Greg, He's thoughtful, he's tactile 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:41.640 in his hands, like he thinks before he you know, 0:15:41.800 --> 0:15:45.480 there's a lot ruminating in here before he would share 0:15:45.480 --> 0:15:48.800 an idea. But he was incredibly thoughtful and very very 0:15:48.800 --> 0:15:52.440 respectful of the format and of Ricky and Stephen, and 0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:55.120 cautious because we all knew we were stepping in a 0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:58.080 gigantic pile of are you guys kidding me that you're 0:15:58.120 --> 0:16:01.200 actually going to attempt to do this? So yeah, I 0:16:01.240 --> 0:16:04.360 just I only have the most and still the fondest 0:16:04.520 --> 0:16:09.680 memories of Greg. Was there anybody else that you feel 0:16:09.720 --> 0:16:14.520 like you seriously considered? Or? Was Greg it? Greg? Was it? 0:16:15.200 --> 0:16:20.000 Ricky and Stephen told me both separately that what sold 0:16:20.320 --> 0:16:23.720 them was that Greg saw it as a love story. Yeah, 0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:26.160 it was a It was a love story. Was about humanity, 0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:30.400 it was about human behavior, It was all about people. 0:16:30.920 --> 0:16:34.040 It was all about heart. The thing that we can 0:16:34.040 --> 0:16:37.320 all relate to is that, in some form or fashion, 0:16:37.400 --> 0:16:42.240 we've been in a workplace where you're not necessarily happy 0:16:42.240 --> 0:16:44.120 about the work that you're doing, but you fall in 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:46.480 love with the people. It's love and hate relationship. They 0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:50.400 become family, they become you know, you see them more 0:16:51.160 --> 0:16:53.440 typically in your life than you do your family members, 0:16:53.480 --> 0:16:57.880 and so it really was about the love that's created, 0:16:58.760 --> 0:17:11.000 you know, in a workplace. For sure, it's a hard 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:14.800 time for hiring, so you need a hiring partner built 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:19.520 for hard times. That's Indeed. 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Indeed dot Com 0:18:39.760 --> 0:18:43.840 slash Office Deep Dive terms and conditions apply. Need to 0:18:43.920 --> 0:18:49.440 hire you need Indeed. What grows in the forest trees, 0:18:49.880 --> 0:18:53.240 Sure No. What else grows in the forest, our imagination, 0:18:53.560 --> 0:18:56.840 a sense of wonder, and our family bonds grow too, 0:18:57.080 --> 0:19:02.160 because when we disconnect from this and connect with this, 0:19:03.480 --> 0:19:06.959 we reconnect with each other. The forest is closer than 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:10.399 you think. Find a forest near you and start exploring. 0:19:10.520 --> 0:19:13.080 I Discover the Forest dot org, brought to you by 0:19:13.119 --> 0:19:17.560 the United States Forest Service and the AD Council. Hi. 0:19:17.920 --> 0:19:22.280 I'm Glory Adam, host of Well Read Black Girl. Each week, 0:19:22.320 --> 0:19:25.320 I sit in close conversation with one of my favorite 0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:28.920 authors of color and share stories about how they found 0:19:28.960 --> 0:19:33.200 their voice, hone their craft, and navigated the publishing world, 0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:37.159 and composed some of the most beautiful and meaningful words 0:19:37.200 --> 0:19:41.679 I've ever read. We journey together through the cultural moment 0:19:42.000 --> 0:19:46.560 where art, culture and literature collide and pay homage to 0:19:46.600 --> 0:19:50.320 the women whose books we grew up reading. And of 0:19:50.359 --> 0:19:53.040 course I check in with members of the Well Read 0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:56.520 Black Girl book Club. It's a literary kickback you never 0:19:56.640 --> 0:20:00.359 knew you needed. And you're all invited to join the club. 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:04.000 So tell your friends, tell their friends so we can 0:20:04.119 --> 0:20:08.040 be friends who would love books. Listen to a Well 0:20:08.119 --> 0:20:11.359 Read Black Girl on the I Heart Radio app, Apple 0:20:11.440 --> 0:20:26.280 podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. You were in 0:20:26.480 --> 0:20:29.520 the room for the majority, if not all, of the 0:20:29.560 --> 0:20:33.520 casting sessions. Was there anyone who walked in right away 0:20:34.800 --> 0:20:37.919 that was ultimately cast that you went, that's the person 0:20:39.480 --> 0:20:44.000 John Steve. But Steve is a different story. He didn't 0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:47.840 really audition. Um, you know, it was a really interesting 0:20:47.880 --> 0:20:50.959 audition process because I don't think any one of us 0:20:50.960 --> 0:20:53.800 had ever really kind of been through anything like that before. 0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:57.960 Because actors would come in and read a scene and 0:20:57.960 --> 0:21:00.840 then they would improv, you know, and Greg would throw 0:21:01.040 --> 0:21:04.840 ridiculous little lines out and say, go tell me you 0:21:04.920 --> 0:21:07.960 just got into the refrigerator this morning, you know, or 0:21:08.080 --> 0:21:11.960 just these really kind of weird random things. And we 0:21:12.080 --> 0:21:17.880 saw so many actors, you know, Greg myself, Ken Howard, Ben, 0:21:18.080 --> 0:21:21.760 you know, Allison and um Phillis would be in the 0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:25.679 conference room at REVELI for eight or ten hours a 0:21:25.760 --> 0:21:30.480 day just and it was just a constant. And Alison, 0:21:31.200 --> 0:21:34.480 she had such a deep knowledge of you know, stand 0:21:34.520 --> 0:21:38.680 ups and second cities and groundlings and people that we've 0:21:38.720 --> 0:21:42.200 never seen before. And so there were so many people 0:21:42.240 --> 0:21:44.239 that were so interesting to us. And I think as 0:21:44.280 --> 0:21:46.840 we whittled things down and it became all of you, 0:21:47.600 --> 0:21:51.240 we knew it was all of you because everybody didn't 0:21:51.240 --> 0:21:53.359 fit a mold that we were looking for, but they 0:21:53.400 --> 0:21:57.200 brought something special and beautiful. It was like making a puzzle. 0:21:57.880 --> 0:22:02.800 Everybody just fit in so beautifully for you know, Jim 0:22:02.840 --> 0:22:06.400 and Pam and Dwight, etcetera. Talk to me a little 0:22:06.400 --> 0:22:10.280 bit about doing screen tests, filming them in the office 0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:13.600 as opposed to doing regular studio and network tests. How 0:22:13.720 --> 0:22:16.359 rare was that at that time we were the first, 0:22:16.680 --> 0:22:20.679 if I remember correctly, And the reason was very It 0:22:20.760 --> 0:22:23.919 was selfish on our part because a we thought they 0:22:23.960 --> 0:22:27.159 will never make this show if two actors, you know, 0:22:27.160 --> 0:22:29.680 because at that time, actors used to walk into the 0:22:29.720 --> 0:22:34.879 President's office and there would be twenty people behind the 0:22:34.920 --> 0:22:38.119 president and two people would be asked to perform a 0:22:38.160 --> 0:22:42.080 scene or something with all these eyeballs on them, and 0:22:42.160 --> 0:22:45.240 it was the most unnatural process anybody could ever imagine. 0:22:45.800 --> 0:22:47.879 And then I remember when I went to NBC and 0:22:47.920 --> 0:22:50.720 became a programmer and we were asking people to do that. 0:22:50.800 --> 0:22:52.359 I said, I don't want to I don't want to 0:22:52.359 --> 0:22:54.320 do that. I want to put people on tape because 0:22:54.440 --> 0:22:58.640 it doesn't you don't get the real person because they're 0:22:58.640 --> 0:23:02.359 so busy performing her room and so so. Yeah, I 0:23:02.359 --> 0:23:03.840 think we were the first of its kind, and I 0:23:03.880 --> 0:23:07.080 think because of that, it started to kind of shift 0:23:07.119 --> 0:23:11.680 the way people were auditioning. Do you remember Phillis of course, no, 0:23:11.760 --> 0:23:15.480 I mean reading, and of course anything about the discussion 0:23:15.520 --> 0:23:20.080 around casting her. Yes, I mean part of the process 0:23:20.359 --> 0:23:24.560 was either she would run the camera or Allison would 0:23:24.640 --> 0:23:27.840 run the camera, and then if Allison didn't feel like reading, 0:23:28.440 --> 0:23:31.600 Phillis would read. And then Phillis started reading more and more. 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:35.359 And I don't remember if it was Ken that said 0:23:35.400 --> 0:23:39.119 it first or Greg but said, oh my god, she 0:23:39.160 --> 0:23:42.959 has to be in the show. She's so funny, and 0:23:43.000 --> 0:23:46.880 we all said, oh my god, yes, And I remembered 0:23:47.000 --> 0:23:50.360 us asking Allison how do you feel about if we 0:23:50.480 --> 0:23:54.359 steal Phillis? And she said, oh my god, you know, yes, 0:23:54.640 --> 0:23:58.200 you know, take her And I remember us telling her 0:23:58.200 --> 0:24:01.239 and it was it was pretty amazing. What do you 0:24:01.320 --> 0:24:05.639 remember so thinking about the Office and what that show was, 0:24:05.760 --> 0:24:08.159 the style to no laugh track, all that, What was 0:24:08.200 --> 0:24:12.280 the landscape of television that that show was born into, 0:24:12.359 --> 0:24:15.840 Like what was popular? What was done on broadcast TV 0:24:15.920 --> 0:24:22.320 at that time? Seinfeld cheers all of the seminal comedies 0:24:23.359 --> 0:24:27.240 that were so smart. But the thing about that time, 0:24:27.280 --> 0:24:30.600 as I remember, is that ratings were everything. Eighteen to 0:24:30.720 --> 0:24:33.679 thirty four was everything. You had to have, you know, 0:24:33.960 --> 0:24:37.880 a twenty share or something. So having you know, five 0:24:37.960 --> 0:24:40.320 million people or six million people watching your show is 0:24:40.400 --> 0:24:42.960 just a non starter. You know, it had to be 0:24:43.000 --> 0:24:48.359 twenty million. And our audience was very, very concentrated in 0:24:48.400 --> 0:24:51.920 the eighteen to thirty four and it was very k plus, 0:24:52.640 --> 0:24:56.320 but it was small. And so that's the challenge was 0:24:56.359 --> 0:24:58.359 how do we keep ourselves on the air when a 0:24:59.520 --> 0:25:03.040 the pilot tested worse than I think any other pilot 0:25:03.040 --> 0:25:07.200 had ever tested on NBC. Besides, I think Seinfeld didn't 0:25:07.200 --> 0:25:11.720 test well either, And uh, you know, we only had 0:25:11.720 --> 0:25:14.280 six episodes to prove ourselves, and we were kind of 0:25:14.320 --> 0:25:19.080 at that time also scheduled in kind of the Okay 0:25:19.119 --> 0:25:24.119 you're dead. It was in March, and that's when people said, well, 0:25:24.119 --> 0:25:26.800 why are shows starting to air after the you know, 0:25:27.080 --> 0:25:31.080