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Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business of Sports. The cold heart truth

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Speaker 1: about the Olympic journey is not really been financially incentivized

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Speaker 1: in the same way that many of the professional sports are.

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Speaker 1: But this is a basketball involved dB A, willvills are

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Speaker 1: licensing arm think for fifty All of those things will

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Speaker 1: make up what that looks like money in sports. It's

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Speaker 1: one of the reasons why I enjoyed the Money Night

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Speaker 1: countdown and talk about some of the more interesting aspects

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Speaker 1: of business of sports. When you're talking sports, discipline is

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Speaker 1: the bridge from being good to ultimately being great at

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Speaker 1: whatever it is that you're trying to be your accomplished

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Speaker 1: as your profession. Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio.

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Speaker 1: This is the Bloomberg Business of Sports Show, where we

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Speaker 1: explored the big money issues in the world of sports

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Speaker 1: on Michael Barr and I'm Damian Sassour. Scarlet Foo will

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Speaker 1: be joining us later today to chat with Bloomberg's Jerry

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Speaker 1: Smith about Live Golf Champions League TV rights and whether

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Speaker 1: Vince McMahon's misconduct scandal could end up bringing him down.

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Speaker 1: Straight ahead on the Bloomberg Business of Sports Show. But

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Speaker 1: first we want to welcome veterans sports journalist and executive

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Speaker 1: director of Seaton Hall University's Center for Sports Media, Jane McManus.

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Speaker 1: We want her insight on some of the latest headlines,

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Speaker 1: including a few involving female equity and sports. Start with

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Speaker 1: Britney Griner. She pleaded guilty in Russia. She's being held

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Speaker 1: in a Russian jail right now. We were talking about

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Speaker 1: this yesterday, Damien and I we were wondering if this

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Speaker 1: pleading guilty to the drug charges, even though it was

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Speaker 1: a minuscule amount in vaybe oil, is a plan to

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Speaker 1: set something up for a prisoner swap later on. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think we just saw that, right, I mean, former

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Speaker 1: Governor Bill Richardson's getting involved here, and he's you know,

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Speaker 1: he's responsible for having some success in this field. You know,

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Speaker 1: he have freed former US Marine Trevor Reid. What do

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Speaker 1: you think, Well, I think it's you know, it's important

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Speaker 1: to note that Reed had been in prison since two

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Speaker 1: thousand and nine, a very long time, and that usually

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Speaker 1: these kinds of things are not worked out that quickly.

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Speaker 1: So if if this word will occur, and I think

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Speaker 1: obviously there's a ton of public pressure, you know, the

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Speaker 1: w n B A is keeping her name in the headlines.

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Speaker 1: The NBA is as well. You have every single day

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Speaker 1: a new person, a new player. Don Staley was the

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Speaker 1: one today tweeting, you know how long she's been imprisoned

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Speaker 1: and clearly she is wrongfully detained. I think it's important though,

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Speaker 1: to also note that, you know, there are over a

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Speaker 1: hundred American citizens who have been illegally detained in different

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Speaker 1: countries across the world. And you know, as much as

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Speaker 1: it would be terrific to have Britney Grinder home last week,

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Speaker 1: you know, this is a much larger issue, and you

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Speaker 1: do have I think if you're the U. S. Government,

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Speaker 1: certainly not the w n b A, but if you're

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Speaker 1: the U. S. Government, you have to think about the

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Speaker 1: relative safety of Americans abroad and your ability to travel

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Speaker 1: freely if you are doing you know, if you're allowing

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Speaker 1: what is essentially political hostage taking to be rewarded so quickly,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you make a great point there. I mean,

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Speaker 1: Russian wants Victor about. You know, he's known as the

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Speaker 1: merchant of death right and he's an arms dealer serving

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Speaker 1: a year sentence here in the States. And you're absolutely right,

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Speaker 1: we also want Paul well, and he's a former U.

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Speaker 1: S Marine. He's serving a sixteen year sentence there, he's

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Speaker 1: already been detained for two years. Yeah, and I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's important to recognize the hoping that that

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Speaker 1: Britney Griner was personally brought home and that her detainment

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Speaker 1: ends with you know, and the US government has to

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Speaker 1: balance that across everybody who travels and you know, any

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Speaker 1: single you know, think about anybody in the future who

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Speaker 1: plays sports, who wants to go play in Russia. I mean,

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Speaker 1: obviously that's a much different calculation right now in terms

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Speaker 1: of risk, but any fan who wants to go. You know,

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Speaker 1: the World Cup was held in Russia, um, very recently,

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Speaker 1: and so all of these different things, I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: this is part of a larger question. And in Pengshuay

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Speaker 1: for me, comes up as well with it. Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: the Chinese tennis player who was detained before the Olympics

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Speaker 1: and then kind of brought out in very scripted ways

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Speaker 1: to interact with people during the Olympics and and has

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Speaker 1: since not you know, to my understanding, has not been freed.

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Speaker 1: And and that is really disrupted that w T a

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Speaker 1: way that it looks at holding international tournaments now and

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Speaker 1: where it's going to have it's your tournament. I mean,

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Speaker 1: this is really I think if you, if you step

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Speaker 1: back a bit, this is a much bigger picture in

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Speaker 1: terms of kind of the shrinking of the global sports

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Speaker 1: world in a way, um, because it does make the

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Speaker 1: risk calculations so much different. Well, professor, let's let's bring

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Speaker 1: up the reason why Brittney Grinder was in Russia in

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Speaker 1: the first place is because there is still a pay

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Speaker 1: discrepancy in the United States compared to other countries. She

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Speaker 1: was getting paid more in Russia, so she wanted to

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Speaker 1: make more money. And you can't blame anybody for that.

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Speaker 1: When does this get solved? Well, I mean, the w

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Speaker 1: b A and the NBA are two very different leagues

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Speaker 1: with two very different revenue structures, and so I think

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Speaker 1: it's a little bit um and I am very much

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Speaker 1: For example, in the where you have of more of

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Speaker 1: an apples than apples, which would be the US and

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Speaker 1: the national team and the men's national team and their

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Speaker 1: relative success which is more comparable under a single league,

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Speaker 1: That to me is more clear cut case. But the

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Speaker 1: w n b A is different. It does not command

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Speaker 1: the same television audiences the same revenue, it doesn't command

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Speaker 1: the same audiences. So I don't know if you can

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Speaker 1: say quote unquote equal pay for the women in the

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Speaker 1: w n b A, but certainly more equitable pay. And

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Speaker 1: I think in the you know, the recalculation of that

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Speaker 1: c b A that certainly was had the pay structure

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Speaker 1: did improve, it is more commensurate with the amount of

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Speaker 1: revenue that the women were bringing in and the increase

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Speaker 1: in interest and also forcing the NBA to monetize revenue

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Speaker 1: streams that it ignored um over the years and you know,

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Speaker 1: and really kind of make that happen. And there are

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Speaker 1: systemic issues I think in women's sports that they market

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Speaker 1: is deflated artificially and we can certainly get into some

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Speaker 1: of those things, but but I think that's that's an

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Speaker 1: inherent problem. But I think equal pay is is, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's a bit of a misnumber when it comes to

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Speaker 1: the w n b A. That said, you know, there

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Speaker 1: are plenty of places that you could play abroad where

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Speaker 1: you could make money other than uh, you know what

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Speaker 1: it's Oraitarian regime that's very hostile to LGBT two people

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Speaker 1: like Russia has been and you know, and I think

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Speaker 1: that might be the calculation going forward, and there are

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Speaker 1: lots of players who actually do want to play abroad.

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Speaker 1: I mean it's been you know, I covered the first

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Speaker 1: year of the w NBA the New York Liberty and

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Speaker 1: they spoke Italian on the court to one another, and

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Speaker 1: you know, it was great. It was like, oh, because

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Speaker 1: these women really couldn't earn a living in the US

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Speaker 1: and things have changed. And you certainly don't want people

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Speaker 1: to be forced to play you around if they don't

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Speaker 1: want to, but you want them to have that option. Certainly,

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Speaker 1: it should be available to them if they want to,

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Speaker 1: you know, if they want to play abroad. But but

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Speaker 1: obviously the main goal is to improve the revenue structures here,

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Speaker 1: the endorsement ability here, to be able to earn that

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Speaker 1: money here. It's like up next on the show, we

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Speaker 1: continue our conversation with Jane McManus on Brittany Grinder and

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Speaker 1: we'll get into female pay equity and sports straight ahead

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Speaker 1: on the Bloomberg Business of Sports Show. I'm Michael Bar.

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Speaker 1: You can follow me on Twitter at Big Bar Sports

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Speaker 1: and I'm on Twitter at the Sass hour And don't

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Speaker 1: forget to catch our podcast as Monday's Wednesdays and Thursdays

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Speaker 1: on all your podcast platforms. Right here on Bloomberg Business

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Speaker 1: of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. You're listening to Bloomberg Business

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Speaker 1: of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. This is the Bloomberg Business

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Speaker 1: of Sports show, where we explore the big money issues

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Speaker 1: in the world of sports. On Michael barr And along

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Speaker 1: with Damien sassaur And, we're speaking with the executive director

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Speaker 1: of Center for Sports Media at Seaton Hall in University,

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Speaker 1: Jane McManus, and we were talking about Britney Griner being

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Speaker 1: detained in Russia. Jane, let me ask you a question.

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Speaker 1: If this is Lebron James, is he serving a hundred

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Speaker 1: and forty five days in prison and Russia? I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, I mean, how do you factor they? I mean,

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Speaker 1: you're right, their systemic challenges, systemic differences between women's and

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Speaker 1: men's forget about basketball sports in general. But in this case,

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Speaker 1: is she's just not a high profile enough athlete to

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Speaker 1: command the respect from a hostile government like Russia. Does

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Speaker 1: that play a role here? You know, I really have

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Speaker 1: a hard time with that one because I just don't

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Speaker 1: know what the case of the I think the outrage.

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Speaker 1: You know, if you did have a Lebron involved or

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Speaker 1: Tom Brady let's say, or something like that. Yes, it

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Speaker 1: would be it would be much larger because they just

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Speaker 1: command a larger percentage of the Americans sports mind, you know,

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Speaker 1: right consciousness. But at the same time, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: do think that you know, you have to keep in

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Speaker 1: mind that you know, at first, it wasn't that people

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Speaker 1: didn't want to speak up. It was that people were

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Speaker 1: being told that if you make too big a deal

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Speaker 1: about this, or think let that Ladmr putin Sinki has

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Speaker 1: too high quality an asset, that that getting her out

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Speaker 1: of there would be more difficult. And then when that

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Speaker 1: strategy failed, and it was pretty failed, pretty spectacularly, then

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Speaker 1: you have people talking and I think that the outrage

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Speaker 1: has been loud. I think most people know who Britney

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Speaker 1: Griner is. It's certainly, you know, her entertainment has stoked

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Speaker 1: up opinions on the right and the left about this.

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Speaker 1: It's very visible um within the world of the NBA,

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Speaker 1: w n b A that she is not there. Storytelling

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Speaker 1: is absolutely critical and no one's better, especially in sports, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean, look at you know the impact of drive

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Speaker 1: to survive in Formula one Jane. You know, look at

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Speaker 1: the last dance, look at winning time, look at all

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Speaker 1: this up. You know what stories have yet to be

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Speaker 1: told in sports or adapted to the big screen. I mean,

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Speaker 1: is there anything that stands out to you? Oh my gosh, Well, um,

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Speaker 1: that's a great question. I wish I could have prep

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Speaker 1: for this. Um now, I think, you know, because I

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Speaker 1: think I think the story of the economics of women

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Speaker 1: sports as a story that has yet to be told.

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Speaker 1: And that's a different one, that's a difficult one to

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Speaker 1: translate into the screen. But I would say, you know, um,

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Speaker 1: Billy Jean King's ability to uh, to really tell the

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Speaker 1: story of women's sports and the money, um, the money

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Speaker 1: aspect of it. You know, how she was consulted by

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Speaker 1: almost every single woman who tried to start a sports

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Speaker 1: league from the year nineteen seventies three and to the

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Speaker 1: current time. I mean, she really has been kind of

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Speaker 1: um overseeing the way that women are trying to monetize sports,

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Speaker 1: the way that different leagues have tried to monetize sports

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Speaker 1: and failed and succeeded, And she has I think so

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Speaker 1: much knowledge when it comes to that. When her book

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Speaker 1: came out, she really did tell her personal story, which

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Speaker 1: was fantastic, but I think there are more rees to tell,

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Speaker 1: just because she's been such a seminal figure when it

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Speaker 1: comes to that, the movie about Billy Jane King, when

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Speaker 1: that came out, and I remember watching it as a kid,

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Speaker 1: the famous Astrodome tennis match between Billy Jane King and

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Speaker 1: Bobby Riggs, and I'm looking at this and here's a

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Speaker 1: dude coming out with the sugar Daddy and all this

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Speaker 1: other stuff, and I'm thinking, as a kid, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: come on, Billy Jane beat the hell out of this guy. Man.

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Speaker 1: It was I remember that so vividly that that was

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Speaker 1: a mark at that time that really propelled women's sports.

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Speaker 1: Your opinion about that, well, I was, you know, I

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Speaker 1: contemporaneous A Title nine just a year off, and and

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Speaker 1: I so I would have been too when that match happened,

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Speaker 1: and I swear I remember it as well. I can't

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Speaker 1: say I actually remember it, but at the same day,

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Speaker 1: it's such an apocryphal story and it so you know,

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Speaker 1: it played such a role. I was us in the South,

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Speaker 1: and and I'm pretty sure that I might have been

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Speaker 1: the only person routed from Billy ge my immediate surrounding,

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Speaker 1: and you know, it just was it was like it

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Speaker 1: was a real moment where I was like, Okay, I

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Speaker 1: think I think I might belong. You know, I think

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Speaker 1: the confidence to argue my way into uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: neighborhood baseball games and football games. And that was kind

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Speaker 1: of my start in sports. You know, I was the

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Speaker 1: lone woman on many I pick up basketball court in

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Speaker 1: New York City, like back in the nineties. You know,

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Speaker 1: always are doing my way in, always having to endure

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Speaker 1: the joke about shirts or skins and um and and

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Speaker 1: always you know, kind of proving myself well enough to

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Speaker 1: be able to play in a regular pickup games. So

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm certainly and I don't know, you know,

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Speaker 1: Philly Jane King hadn't beaten Bobby Riggs, I don't know

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Speaker 1: that that would have been my story. Well, now that

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Speaker 1: we're reaching back to I mean, we we've got to

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Speaker 1: I've got to ask you. You know, you spent ten

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Speaker 1: years covering the NFL for ESPN, Jane, so I mean,

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Speaker 1: talk to me about Joe Buck Adam Schef there. I mean,

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Speaker 1: what's what's the environment like over there. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: obvi se it must have been an amazing experience. Yeah. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, the thing is so I had based in

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Speaker 1: New York. I covered a lot of Jets and Giants games,

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Speaker 1: and I have to say, like, for you know, for

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Speaker 1: the for the large part, like that was a great experience.

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Speaker 1: And you know, there was not certainly a lot of

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Speaker 1: players that I've covered. And in the New York market,

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Speaker 1: you know, people are expecting women to be in the

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Speaker 1: locker room and and you know, the rolling room situation

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Speaker 1: is different post pandemic because they're not open in the

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Speaker 1: same ways that they used to be. But um, players

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Speaker 1: and coaches now expect women to be part of the

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Speaker 1: media scrum, and that's you know, that's a bit different.

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Speaker 1: And I never had to argue my way into into

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Speaker 1: that setting at all. I think again, I think there

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Speaker 1: are some more structural issues when it comes to broadcasting

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Speaker 1: in terms of the roles for women. Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: very much assigned roles as sideline and host. And you know,

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Speaker 1: we certainly women certainly break out of those roles, and

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Speaker 1: there are women you know, as producers, etcetera. But often

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Speaker 1: you know, you're still the first one to do it

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Speaker 1: in your particular world, and you have to kind of

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Speaker 1: argue your way in and then prove yourself, and you're

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Speaker 1: it's notable that you're generally one of a few women

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Speaker 1: in the room. So and you know, I do think

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Speaker 1: there are a lot of networks that try to change that,

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Speaker 1: but it's it's such slow pace that it ends up

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Speaker 1: meaning you know that every single woman who comes into

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Speaker 1: the business has to be a revolutionary in one way

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Speaker 1: or another, and that's a challenge. And it's nothing wrong

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Speaker 1: with being the a sideline reporter, but I'd like to

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Speaker 1: see more women in the booth calling the game because yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean we need that and the women who do

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Speaker 1: it and the men who do it. Silent reporting is

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Speaker 1: an incredibly difficult job. To do it well, you have

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Speaker 1: to be years on the ground, you have to be

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Speaker 1: noticing things, you have to be have a medical degree

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Speaker 1: to figure out. I mean, it's a real skill, and

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Speaker 1: I think that's a bit discounted um. But because it

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Speaker 1: is the most visible role, it is also the most

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Speaker 1: acceptable role for women. So I don't I do not

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Speaker 1: mean to disparage anyone who's ever done that role and

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Speaker 1: done it well. And we have some great examples of

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Speaker 1: journalists who have made their way through sideline recording. Andrew

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Speaker 1: Kamer comes to mind. She is fantastic um and and

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Speaker 1: came up through side doing it incredibly well. I used

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Speaker 1: to hold it. I think I've told this story a

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Speaker 1: number of times, but I gotta tell it again. When

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Speaker 1: the old U s FL was around, this was the

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Speaker 1: original start of the U s FL. And I'm I'm

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Speaker 1: a young in radio and uh, the Michigan Panthers are

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Speaker 1: playing at the old Pontiac Silverdome and I'm, you know,

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Speaker 1: on this game, holding the parabolic mike, and here comes

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Speaker 1: a sweep. And as I'm seeing this sweep coming directly

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Speaker 1: at me, I hear the producer in my headset say,

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Speaker 1: whatever you do, save the mic. So yes, I agree.

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Speaker 1: Just simply being on the sidelines is something we've been

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Speaker 1: talking about, equity for female athletes in the pros. Let's

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Speaker 1: talk about college athletes, because yeah, we hear about it, uh,

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Speaker 1: the male college athletes getting this or that endorsement, but

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Speaker 1: we don't hear as much about it with women college athletes. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk about that and where that bridge needs

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Speaker 1: to begin? That That to me is interesting. I guess

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Speaker 1: I think back to when Gatorade made Page Beckers its

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Speaker 1: first big name and I ll Endorsey uh ucon basketball

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Speaker 1: player and she Um, I think it was a million dollars.

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Speaker 1: I guess somebody can check my math on that, but

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Speaker 1: it was certainly for for quite a bit of money,

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Speaker 1: you know, blockbuster type of deal. And I think the

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Speaker 1: that did two things right. It made women in college

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Speaker 1: athletics players in that game in a big way. You know,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of value when it comes to having

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Speaker 1: you know, kind of women in your splate of people

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Speaker 1: you're sponsoring. Women do very well in terms of social

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Speaker 1: media and van engagement. Some of those numbers are really high, um,

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Speaker 1: as high as as you know male athletes for sure.

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Speaker 1: So you know, in doing that, um and then having

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Speaker 1: a you know, woman like page on the roster, you

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Speaker 1: really can reach a lot of fans. Um, you get

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Speaker 1: really good bang for your advertising buck in that way. Um.

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Speaker 1: It was also a quote unquote good news story. I

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Speaker 1: think that in the investment in women's sports is still

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Speaker 1: seen as you know, in some ways it got a

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Speaker 1: little bit of shine on it. But that's also the

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Speaker 1: other side of that is you know, there are a

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Speaker 1: lot of people who are not sure about n i

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Speaker 1: L and whether or not it's going to absolutely destroy

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Speaker 1: college sports. So having kind of the you know, putting

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Speaker 1: a woman on your roster first and foremost as a

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Speaker 1: way of kind of diffusing some of that criticism. You know,

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Speaker 1: certainly some people have said Title nine is going to

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Speaker 1: be impacted for this because you can't account for the

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Speaker 1: equity because you know, the people who are who are

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Speaker 1: signing these athletes to n i L deals are not

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Speaker 1: receiving federal funds, so there's no mandate for them to

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Speaker 1: do it equitably. So I think, you know, in that way,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting to me to see how some of these

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Speaker 1: deals have evolved and been named. Also, I think there's

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Speaker 1: the fact that some you know, women in college sports

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Speaker 1: are getting n i L deals not because of how

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Speaker 1: well they play, but how well they kind of fit

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Speaker 1: the idea of attractiveness in our current cultural standards beauty UM,

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Speaker 1: which is also another difficult conversation to have. Again, I

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Speaker 1: don't begredge any any of those athletes have've gotten those

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Speaker 1: deals to money that they are earning, um. But at

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Speaker 1: the same time, I think it does raise a question about,

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Speaker 1: you know, who is getting the deals and women sports

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Speaker 1: and for what reasons and whether or not it does

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Speaker 1: something to advance the idea of women's sports or or not.

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Speaker 1: But ultimately, though, I think the quote unquote revenue generating

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Speaker 1: sports like men's basketball and football are the ones that

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Speaker 1: are going to be getting the big deals when it

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Speaker 1: all shakes out. I can think of many other sports

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Speaker 1: where there is such a discrepancy between men and women.

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Speaker 1: And I'm a big auto racing nut. We we need

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Speaker 1: more women on the racetrack outside of racing in general,

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Speaker 1: do you see any other sports where we really need

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Speaker 1: to Hey, come on, conclude everybody, because there's no reason

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Speaker 1: why you shouldn't. You know, it's interesting that you say that, Michael,

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Speaker 1: because I think there are two ways to look at this. Yes,

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Speaker 1: visibility is super important, but you also want to have

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Speaker 1: women behind the scenes. And if I'm not mistaken, isn't

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Speaker 1: there a woman running one of the big crews in

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Speaker 1: auto racing right now? Yeah? So that's I think. You know,

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Speaker 1: I think those are important games as well, where you

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Speaker 1: have kim ing, you know, at the Marlins, you have

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Speaker 1: you know, women kind of making their way into front offices. Yes, exactly,

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Speaker 1: So so to me, like these are just as important

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Speaker 1: as well, and I think there's real they're real games

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Speaker 1: being made in that way. You know, the Raiders just

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Speaker 1: named a new president, um who is coming out of

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Speaker 1: the Nevada Gaming Commission. Like, there are lots of different

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Speaker 1: ways that women are now um showing that they are

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Speaker 1: that they are qualified for these roles and are being

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Speaker 1: tapped for them, and so that seems to be something

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Speaker 1: that's changing, and I think that's a positive development, and

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Speaker 1: you know, we're gonna hopefully see more of that as

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Speaker 1: it goes along, because you know, certainly the argument can

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Speaker 1: be made that you know, women might not be qualified

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Speaker 1: to be a linebacker, um for a protein, but she's

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Speaker 1: certainly qualified to call that game. She's certainly qualified to

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Speaker 1: be a coach, she's certainly qualified to run the books.

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Speaker 1: You know, there are any any number of ways that

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Speaker 1: women can be involved in sports, just like men who

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Speaker 1: didn't play at the professional level are involved in sports.

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Speaker 1: Jane McManus, executive director of the Center for Sports Media

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Speaker 1: at Seton Hall University. That's Professor Jane mcmannus to you

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Speaker 1: guys out there. Thank you so much for taking the

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Speaker 1: time sitting down and talking with us. We really do

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Speaker 1: appreciate it well, enjoyed the conversation. Thank you very much

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Speaker 1: for having me up. Next on the show, Scarlett Food

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Speaker 1: would join us as we turn to some of this

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Speaker 1: week's sports headlines with Bloomberg's Jerry Smith, and we'll dive

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Speaker 1: into Vince McMahon's misconduct allegations, live golf, and how much

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Speaker 1: Champions League TV rights could go for in the US.

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Speaker 1: I'm Michael barr straight ahead on the Bloomberg Business of

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Speaker 1: Sports Show. You can follow me on Twitter at Big

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Speaker 1: Bar Sports and I'm on Twitter at the sass hour.

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Speaker 1: And don't forget to catch our podcast. That's Monday, is

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Speaker 1: Wednesdays and Thursdays on all your podcast platforms, and right

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Speaker 1: here on Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. You're

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Speaker 1: listening to Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. This

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Speaker 1: is the Bloomberg Business of Sports Show. Will we explore

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Speaker 1: the big money issues in the world of sports. Michael Blarne,

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Speaker 1: I'm Scarlett too, and I'm Danny and Sassaur And there

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Speaker 1: are a few headlines and sports we want to go over,

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Speaker 1: including live golf. For more on that, Let's bring in

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg's Jerry Smith, thank you so much for talking with us,

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Speaker 1: Thanks for having me. Let's begin with Live Jerry, your thoughts.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this is something so this golf is, this

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Speaker 1: new golf league, and it's controversial for a few reasons.

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Speaker 1: The biggest is that it is backed by Saudi Arabia's

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Speaker 1: sovereign wealth funds. So you know, the golfers who have

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Speaker 1: joined the league are getting a lot of criticism from

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Speaker 1: people who feel like you shouldn't be aligning yourself with

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Speaker 1: a golf tour that's backed by a country with a

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Speaker 1: history of human rights abuses. So that's been very controversial.

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Speaker 1: But Live Golf has been a lot more successful than

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Speaker 1: I think a lot of people would have thought. They've

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Speaker 1: been able to recruit a lot of big name golfers,

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00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:25,960
Speaker 1: Phil Michelson, Dustin Johnson, Bryson's Deshambo, Patrick Read and they've

429
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:28,399
Speaker 1: had two events so far. And you know the other

430
00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:30,640
Speaker 1: thing about Live Golf is they are able to get

431
00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:33,920
Speaker 1: these golfers from the PGA Tour because they're offering more money.

432
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:36,160
Speaker 1: I mean, the person is that these guys are playing

433
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:38,720
Speaker 1: for it, and Live Golf is much bigger than you know,

434
00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:42,359
Speaker 1: your typical PGA Tour events and and the schedule is

435
00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:45,640
Speaker 1: lighter and so um. You know a lot of these golfers,

436
00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:49,239
Speaker 1: a lot of them are older and are not as

437
00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:52,360
Speaker 1: competitive as they used to be and are seeing these

438
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:56,320
Speaker 1: huge guaranteed checks I mean dead dead dead laughed, and

439
00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:58,520
Speaker 1: the live golf events to make a hund twenty thousand

440
00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:01,520
Speaker 1: dollars and then the winner US three million. Jerry. The

441
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:03,879
Speaker 1: thing that is interesting now because we know the PGA

442
00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:07,200
Speaker 1: Tour feels under threat, the Justice Department is now looking

443
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:11,080
Speaker 1: into how the PGA Tour is responding, which I thought

444
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:13,680
Speaker 1: was really interesting. Is it unusual for the d J

445
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:16,760
Speaker 1: to step in like this? It is, Um, the PGA

446
00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:20,440
Speaker 1: Tour is suspended indefinitely any of their members who have

447
00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 1: joined the lived golf circuit, so you know, Dustin Johnson,

448
00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:27,520
Speaker 1: Phil Nicholson, all these guys are essentially banned from playing

449
00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:30,600
Speaker 1: on the PGA Tour. Again. This is it's unusual, but

450
00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:34,440
Speaker 1: it's actually not without President Um the Federal Trade Commission

451
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:38,360
Speaker 1: back in the early nineties UH investigated the PGA Tour

452
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:42,720
Speaker 1: for a similar situation where and it was actually Greg

453
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:45,520
Speaker 1: Norman again in the early nineties who wanted to start

454
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 1: a rival golf Tour from the PGA Tour. He called

455
00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,080
Speaker 1: it World Golf, and even one as far as Fox

456
00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:54,639
Speaker 1: was willing to buy the television rights for World Golf

457
00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:58,480
Speaker 1: and the PGA Tour threatened to suspend the golfers who

458
00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:02,800
Speaker 1: joined World Golf, and the fd SEE spent several years investigating. Ultimately,

459
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:05,840
Speaker 1: they decided not to pursue any sort of legal action

460
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:07,960
Speaker 1: against the tour, and that has a lot to do

461
00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,959
Speaker 1: with the fact that the tour did a very aggressive

462
00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 1: job in Washington, d C. Getting members of Congress to

463
00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:16,920
Speaker 1: write letters to the FTC saying, you know, back off

464
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:19,160
Speaker 1: a PGA tour. They do a lot of good things

465
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:21,520
Speaker 1: for charities. So it'll be really interesting to see how

466
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,720
Speaker 1: the PGA Tour response to this Justice Department investigation and

467
00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:28,040
Speaker 1: whether they try to rally a lot of support in

468
00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 1: Washington in their behalf. Harry, let's talk about the live product.

469
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:32,879
Speaker 1: How does it compare to you know, the p G

470
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 1: A and did you like it? Yeah? I spent um

471
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:39,960
Speaker 1: last weekend um Binge watching live golf second tournament. This

472
00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:42,719
Speaker 1: is outside of Portland, and I mean the first thing

473
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:46,000
Speaker 1: to note is is not on US television. You know,

474
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:50,399
Speaker 1: all the big TV networks NBC, CBS, ESPN. They already

475
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 1: have long term deals with the PGA Tour, so they're

476
00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:55,640
Speaker 1: not broadcasting this. So if you want to watch live golf,

477
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:57,800
Speaker 1: you have to watch it on YouTube or Facebook or

478
00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:00,680
Speaker 1: on the liv golf website. Um. You know, I watched

479
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:03,479
Speaker 1: several hours of it. On one hand, it's pretty similar

480
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:06,000
Speaker 1: to what you might watch in the PGA Tour. On

481
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,520
Speaker 1: the other hand, there are some real differences that I

482
00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:11,399
Speaker 1: think are genuine improvements. I mean, there's no commercials, and

483
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:13,920
Speaker 1: that's a big frustration for a lot of golf fans.

484
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:16,680
Speaker 1: You know, there's a shotgun start, which means that all

485
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:18,840
Speaker 1: the players start on the course at the same time

486
00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 1: on different holes, so you don't have to wait for

487
00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,000
Speaker 1: the golfers tee off one by one or have the

488
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:28,119
Speaker 1: leaders finished hours before the telecast starts. So I watched

489
00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:29,719
Speaker 1: it and I thought, you know, I'm watching a lot

490
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:31,800
Speaker 1: more golf shops than I normally would on the on

491
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:35,280
Speaker 1: a PGA Tour event. The formats different they have. They're

492
00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 1: not only competing individually, but they also have these four

493
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 1: man teams and the four man teams, whoever wins that

494
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,719
Speaker 1: also gets a couple of million dollars. Uh. I mean,

495
00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 1: that's really the thing that they hit you over the

496
00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:48,440
Speaker 1: head with when you're watching live golf. It's just it's

497
00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:50,600
Speaker 1: all about the money, you know. They the announcers are

498
00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,640
Speaker 1: constantly reminding you of how how much money is at stake,

499
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:55,720
Speaker 1: how these guys have never played for this much money

500
00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:58,200
Speaker 1: in their life. I mean, one thing that's really important

501
00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:00,719
Speaker 1: is these guys aren't playing for world ranking points right now,

502
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 1: and that matters because world ranking points determined who gets

503
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 1: to plan the majors. So you're in a situation now

504
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:08,840
Speaker 1: where some of these live golf guys may never get

505
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:10,800
Speaker 1: to plan the Masters or the US Open or the

506
00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:13,960
Speaker 1: British Opener, PGA Championship because they play on a tour

507
00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,520
Speaker 1: that doesn't give them the points that would qualify them.

508
00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 1: There is another big story to talk about Vince McMahon's

509
00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:23,760
Speaker 1: reign at w w E. It is threatened by misconduct,

510
00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 1: claims the seventy six year old executive Jerry is in trouble.

511
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: Take us through that, that's right. I mean, there's been

512
00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,600
Speaker 1: reports in the Wall Street Journal in recent weeks about

513
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,840
Speaker 1: how Vince McMahon has made um, you know, several million

514
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:42,720
Speaker 1: dollars in payments to women that he's allegedly sexually harassed

515
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:46,560
Speaker 1: or had affairs with. And so now the w w

516
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 1: e's board has launched an investigation into these allegations, and

517
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 1: we're waiting to see what the outcome of that investigation is.

518
00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:59,359
Speaker 1: In the meantime, Vince McMahon has stepped aside as the CEO,

519
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,720
Speaker 1: and his daughter, Stephanie McMahon has um has taken taken

520
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 1: over that role. You know, one thing that's important to

521
00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 1: note is Vince McMahon still is in creative control of

522
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 1: w w E. And and that's important because what you

523
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:15,520
Speaker 1: really see on the broadcasts of a w w E

524
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:20,160
Speaker 1: wrestling matches, you know, that's Vince's grandchild. He also owns

525
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 1: the majority of the voting shares of the company, so

526
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:25,320
Speaker 1: he's still in control of the company. But we're all

527
00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:27,960
Speaker 1: waiting to see what the outcome of this investigation is. Yeah,

528
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 1: one thing that you've made clear through your reporting is

529
00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:35,440
Speaker 1: that Vince McMahon has changed professional wrestling. He's made it profitable,

530
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 1: and all these different stakeholders are invested in what he's created.

531
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,440
Speaker 1: What has been his secret sauce, Like, what is it

532
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:45,639
Speaker 1: that he does that no one else can do. And therefore,

533
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 1: even with all this misconduct, people are reluctant to see

534
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,520
Speaker 1: him go. Well, I mean he if you go back decades,

535
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:54,040
Speaker 1: I mean he, um, you know, he took what was

536
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 1: essentially a bunch of regional businesses around the country and

537
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:01,440
Speaker 1: he consolidated them all into this day national product and

538
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 1: w w he's even gone national, uh international now, um,

539
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 1: so he's he's just he's built this wrestling into this

540
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:15,119
Speaker 1: global entertainment empire. He's struck very lucrative deals with Fox

541
00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 1: and NBC Universal. I mean, ww matches are on USA,

542
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,920
Speaker 1: They're on the Peacock streaming service. So the exposure that

543
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:27,160
Speaker 1: this sport has gotten under Vince McMahon's leaderships has grown exponentially.

544
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 1: Ww E has even in their SEC filings, has have

545
00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:34,920
Speaker 1: warned investors that if Vince McMahon no longer was involved

546
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:38,880
Speaker 1: in the creative process, that would be a real material

547
00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:41,960
Speaker 1: problem for the company. I mean, he's really the brainchild

548
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 1: of all of the drama that happens at w w E,

549
00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:49,199
Speaker 1: and so if he were to get pushed out over this, uh,

550
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:51,159
Speaker 1: you know, it could have a real impact on the company.

551
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:55,360
Speaker 1: Championship League Saga rights expected the top two billion dollars

552
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:59,680
Speaker 1: in the US. Jerry, that's right. So UEFA this week

553
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 1: off the process of selling their US media rights, and

554
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:09,680
Speaker 1: we've reported that pretty much every major sports broadcaster has

555
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:14,639
Speaker 1: expressed interest in these rights, from NBC and ESPN, CBS,

556
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:17,719
Speaker 1: even Apple and Amazon UM. And so this is going

557
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,080
Speaker 1: to be a really big test of the value of

558
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:22,920
Speaker 1: soccer in America. The last big test we got was

559
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:27,440
Speaker 1: the Premier League rights last year, which NBC renewed their

560
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 1: contract for the Premier League at a significant premium. And

561
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,560
Speaker 1: I think that the soccer clubs with the UFAs Champions League,

562
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 1: and again this is Europe's Champions League, is Europe's top

563
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 1: soccer tournament. I mean, this is the highest level of

564
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 1: European soccer. They feel like they're going to get a

565
00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 1: significant increase in there in the price of the rights

566
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 1: for their US media broadcasts. Bloomberg's Jerry Smith, if you're

567
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 1: lucky enough to have the Bloomberg terminal, or if you

568
00:28:56,160 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 1: can go online, check out his articles. They are very good,

569
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,240
Speaker 1: second to none. Jerry Smith, thank you so much for

570
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:08,400
Speaker 1: joining us, sir, thanks for having met that kids feels

571
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:10,239
Speaker 1: better to be than one than number five. I'll wear

572
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 1: a number. Because of Mike, we have a chance to

573
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: go for three in a row. Good numbers are a

574
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:15,760
Speaker 1: good time. When I first started wearing the number, how

575
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 1: would just have the proud Bloomberg business of sports, the

576
00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:24,400
Speaker 1: number of the week. Alright, alright, alright, it's time for

577
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,680
Speaker 1: the number of the week. And this one. This is

578
00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 1: a simple pickle ball. As everybody knows, it's become very popular.

579
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 1: It's kind of a cross between a racket paddle ball sport.

580
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:41,360
Speaker 1: I want to know what year was it first created?

581
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 1: Now we're talking. We're talking pickle ball. We're not talking

582
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 1: paddle tennis right now, we're talking pickle ball. I will

583
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,800
Speaker 1: tell you what I'm looking for is the date that

584
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: it was first played in Bainbridge Island, Washington. It's gotta

585
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:56,960
Speaker 1: be it's gotta be recent, right, it's got to be

586
00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:00,480
Speaker 1: like the eighties or something. It's gonna be two. Damian

587
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:11,880
Speaker 1: has put his stamp on. I'm gonna say, I really

588
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 1: thought you had that look on your face, Scarlet like

589
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go a little earlier, and I'm like, she's

590
00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:23,680
Speaker 1: gonna get it. No, it was first played in nineteen sixty.

591
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:30,480
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, why it just taken off. Then that's a

592
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:35,520
Speaker 1: very good question. Two. Pickle ball was adopted as the

593
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 1: official state sport of Washington. That's this year, I know,

594
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:46,400
Speaker 1: after nineteen sixty something like pickle ball fans. I love you, Scarlett.

595
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 1: I'm sorry you had it. We'll hit the reset button

596
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,960
Speaker 1: next week. This is the Bloomberg Business of Sports show,

597
00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:55,960
Speaker 1: and we're you're here each and every week at the

598
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:59,440
Speaker 1: same time, bless online wherever you get your podcast, you

599
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 1: can catch those Mondays, Wednesdays and Thursdays. I'm Michael Warren

600
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,840
Speaker 1: Twitter at Big Bar Sports. I'm Scarlet Foo and you

601
00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: can find me on Twitter at Scarlett Food. And I'm

602
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:11,360
Speaker 1: Damien Scarcer and you can find me on Twitter at

603
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: the hour and another victory for Damien. I'm very sorry, Scarlett,

604
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 1: he just picked up vitory. But we have some lovely

605
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:25,000
Speaker 1: parting gifts real pickles as this time. Anyway, Thanks for

606
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:30,080
Speaker 1: joining us next week for the latest all the stories

607
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 1: moving big money in the world of sports. You're listening

608
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,680
Speaker 1: to Bloomberg Business of Sports Bloomberg Rady all around the

609
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 1: bloo