1 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:08,480 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for a Black Girls podcasts, a 2 00:00:08,560 --> 00:00:13,360 Speaker 1: weekly conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the 3 00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:16,480 Speaker 1: small decisions we can make to become the best possible 4 00:00:16,600 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: versions of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr joy Hard and Bradford, 5 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:26,200 Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. To get more information, 6 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: visit the website at Therapy for Black Girls dot com. 7 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:33,479 Speaker 1: And while I hope you love listening to and learning 8 00:00:33,520 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 1: from the podcast, it is not meant to be a 9 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:45,720 Speaker 1: substitute for a relationship with a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, 10 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 1: thanks so much for joining me for session seventy four 11 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:53,480 Speaker 1: of the Therapy for Black Girls podcast. Since we spent 12 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: so much time this week talking about black women athletes, 13 00:00:57,160 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: it felt like a great time to share the conversation 14 00:00:59,840 --> 00:01:03,760 Speaker 1: I had with Natalie Graves all about black women athletes 15 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 1: and body image. Natalie is a certified school social worker, 16 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:15,040 Speaker 1: licensed Clinical social worker, and certified Alcohol and Drug counselor 17 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 1: in Michigan. In her practice, she specializes in athletes, mental 18 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:24,760 Speaker 1: health and wellness. She received her master's degree from the 19 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: University of Chicago School of Social Service Administration and her 20 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:34,760 Speaker 1: bachelor's degree from Chicago State University. Natalie is a member 21 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:38,800 Speaker 1: of the University of Michigan Social Worker and Sports Association 22 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 1: and serves as a guest lecturer for the University of 23 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 1: Michigan's School of Social Work. She has also spent time 24 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 1: working with the NBA to provide mental wellness presentations for 25 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 1: players and participated in their Rookie Transition program, offering information 26 00:01:56,520 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: on mental health, self care, and goal setting. Natalie and 27 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,720 Speaker 1: I discuss some of the common concerns the black women 28 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: athletes face, how black women's bodies are seen and critiqued 29 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: in sports, and we discussed body image issues as it 30 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 1: relates to athletes, but also to black women generally. If 31 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 1: you hear something you enjoy while listening, please be sure 32 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:25,640 Speaker 1: to share it with us on social media using the 33 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:31,360 Speaker 1: hashtag tv G in Session. Here's our conversation. Thank you 34 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:34,400 Speaker 1: so much for joining us today, Natalie Joy, Thank you 35 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: so much for having me. Yeah, I'm very excited to 36 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:41,000 Speaker 1: have you joined us today to talk about black women 37 00:02:41,120 --> 00:02:43,960 Speaker 1: athletes because I definitely think, you know, we see a 38 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 1: lot in the news, we see in a lot in 39 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:47,800 Speaker 1: the media, but I think it will be an interesting 40 00:02:47,800 --> 00:02:50,280 Speaker 1: perspective to kind of hear about some of the struggles 41 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 1: and some of the challenges they often have. Because I 42 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:54,639 Speaker 1: know you work with a lot of black women athletes, 43 00:02:54,800 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: so can you share a little bit about some of 44 00:02:56,800 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 1: the common things that your athletes struggle with. Literally, when 45 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 1: we're talking about female athletes, we look at different sports 46 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 1: and there are different issues. So, for an example, sports 47 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:14,919 Speaker 1: that are judged like swimming, or gymnastics or ice skating, 48 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 1: I find that there's more body issues, eating disorders. So 49 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 1: I take a lot of interest in addressing that with 50 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:29,640 Speaker 1: the athletes that I work with. Obviously, confidence and athletic 51 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 1: stress are big issues struggles with performance, But I think 52 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,400 Speaker 1: one of the things that concerns me greatly with our 53 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: female athletes is some of the challenges they have as 54 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:46,560 Speaker 1: it relates to their physical bodies. There. Yeah, I'm glad 55 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 1: you brought that up, because I do think that there 56 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 1: are some sports that, like size and build are more 57 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 1: important than others. Right, Like, you know, something like gymnastics, 58 00:03:57,200 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 1: you do have to it feels like have a certain 59 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 1: type of to v successful ed gymnastics. That's exactly right. 60 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 1: When you're looking at sports that you actually dressed less 61 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:14,840 Speaker 1: like volleyball, gymnastic, ice skating, with the short outfits, addresses. 62 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: So you are perceived in that sport to have a 63 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 1: certain body type. And what we find is athletes who 64 00:04:23,279 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 1: pursue those sports and don't have the traditional body type 65 00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:31,720 Speaker 1: of those sports expects athletes to have. Those particular athletes 66 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:34,160 Speaker 1: run into a lot of challenges as it relates to 67 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 1: self image. Can you say more about that? For sure? 68 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:42,880 Speaker 1: A perfect example is an athlete who just physically looks 69 00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:47,359 Speaker 1: different than the majority of all the other athletes that 70 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:51,040 Speaker 1: play in their sport. So if you think about someone 71 00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:54,480 Speaker 1: like a Serena Williams for an example, she is at 72 00:04:54,480 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: the pinnacle, has been at the pinnacle of her sport, 73 00:04:57,640 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 1: multi gold medalists, mall high titles, and championships, but she 74 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:10,280 Speaker 1: is really criticized on how she looks physically, not about 75 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:13,320 Speaker 1: her achievements on the court, but how she actually looks. 76 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 1: And she has been criticized on how she looks, uh, 77 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:25,159 Speaker 1: if she's overweight, if she's too muscular, She's been criticized 78 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:29,039 Speaker 1: and looking like a man. And if we look at 79 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:34,320 Speaker 1: what's going on here, it is directly about how she 80 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:40,039 Speaker 1: physically looks and her race, and so she has been 81 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:43,760 Speaker 1: met with a lot of body shaming throughout her career, 82 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:47,719 Speaker 1: starting when she was about sixteen years old entering the work, 83 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:50,440 Speaker 1: and a lot of women can relate to that. It's 84 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:55,039 Speaker 1: just with public athletes. We see it, you know, every day, 85 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 1: and it's played out very publicly. But a lot of 86 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:03,160 Speaker 1: women struggle with how they look, how they perceive themselves, 87 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 1: and there's a lot of struggles around the perception of 88 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 1: how they think they should look, and it plays a 89 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:13,160 Speaker 1: lot on how your self esteem and how you feel 90 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:16,600 Speaker 1: about yourself. I'm glad you brought up the race piece, Natalie, 91 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 1: because even recently Serena has talked about how she continues 92 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 1: to get tested for like for drugs in her system, right, 93 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:26,719 Speaker 1: like even more than other people. And you you have 94 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:30,080 Speaker 1: to believe, I think that that is connected to race 95 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 1: in some ways, you know, like what other reason is 96 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:34,839 Speaker 1: there that she's getting tested at the rate at which 97 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 1: she is other than race And because she's so that's 98 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,080 Speaker 1: exactly right. It's one because she's so good, But I 99 00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 1: think there's also a bias in how she physically looks, 100 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 1: so she looked a certain way, so there is a 101 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 1: conclusion that she must be doing something that is some 102 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:55,240 Speaker 1: drug enhancement or from the steroids are doing something illegal 103 00:06:55,600 --> 00:06:58,840 Speaker 1: instead of acknowledging the greatness that she has, the abilities 104 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:01,919 Speaker 1: that she has, and what we look at other tennis players, 105 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 1: and Serena has talked about this, when we look at 106 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 1: a player like Maria Sharapova, who is blonde, looks like 107 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: a model, she spends and she tested positive for drugs, 108 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:17,880 Speaker 1: and you compare that to Serena how much she's been 109 00:07:17,920 --> 00:07:21,600 Speaker 1: tested versus how Maria Sharapola has been tested and one 110 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,440 Speaker 1: who has been tested positive. You know, you see there 111 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:27,600 Speaker 1: from serious discrepancies there and you can't ignore the fact 112 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: that Serena is black. I'm wondering if there are other 113 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:34,880 Speaker 1: ways that you feel like some of these microaggressions show 114 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 1: up with athletes. Do you have any thoughts about other 115 00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 1: things that have kind of popped up that you've may 116 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,119 Speaker 1: be seen with clients are heard of. Yeah, for sure. 117 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 1: A lot of times there's kind of this otherness that 118 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:50,120 Speaker 1: goes on if you are the only African American on 119 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:54,120 Speaker 1: your team, until you're perceived different even though you're playing 120 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: the same team as your teammates, and that plays out 121 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:00,960 Speaker 1: a lot. We see that with soccer teams, we see 122 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 1: that and individual sports I see it a lot in golf, 123 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 1: where golf is a predominantly white sport, but when we 124 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 1: have black athletes, particularly female athletes, there's a lot of 125 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:16,200 Speaker 1: challenges around that. Some of the challenges that some of 126 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 1: the young doctor's experience is low self esteem because there's 127 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: a comparison not feeling confident within their own abilities because 128 00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 1: they look and feel different. There's a culture around that, 129 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:31,000 Speaker 1: and there's an environment that feeds into that, and so 130 00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 1: we have to really be mindful how we're we're training 131 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 1: our girls, and how we're talking to our girls, and 132 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:41,520 Speaker 1: how we're talking about our girls so that we can 133 00:08:41,600 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 1: really strengthen them and give them the confidence they need 134 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 1: to thrive in sports or in everyday life, whatever that 135 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: may be, whether it's at a job, at college, in school. 136 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:55,680 Speaker 1: Because if we don't have that self worth and that belief, 137 00:08:56,040 --> 00:08:58,080 Speaker 1: it plays out in a lot of ways in our lives. 138 00:08:58,160 --> 00:09:00,560 Speaker 1: And how would you suggest we start having some of 139 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 1: those conversations like where do you feel like we could 140 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 1: be doing a better job at helping girls have better 141 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 1: self worth and better self esteem. One of the things 142 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:13,960 Speaker 1: that I think really important that as parents and caregivers 143 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: and family members were very mindful how we speak to 144 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:22,200 Speaker 1: and about our children. You know, how many times have 145 00:09:22,280 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 1: you heard something like, girl, take those tans off, they're 146 00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 1: too tight. That comment right there put negative connotation on 147 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 1: that young girl's body. Or when we say things like 148 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:36,839 Speaker 1: all these boys looking at you, and if this young 149 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:41,160 Speaker 1: girl did something wrong because she's getting attention from the 150 00:09:41,240 --> 00:09:44,760 Speaker 1: young man. And so those type of comments where we 151 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:48,240 Speaker 1: don't mean anything harmful when we say them, but they 152 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 1: have a great effect. So I I want us to 153 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:54,000 Speaker 1: really be mindful how we talk to our young girls 154 00:09:54,040 --> 00:09:56,839 Speaker 1: and children. We also have to pay attention to how 155 00:09:56,880 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 1: we talk about ourselves in front of our daughters. You know, 156 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:02,560 Speaker 1: when we say, oh, I look so sad as mistress, 157 00:10:03,360 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 1: Oh this topic makes my breast look so big, and 158 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 1: we're saying that in front of our daughters. What do 159 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 1: our daughters think about themselves when they hear their mothers 160 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: talk like that. Words are so powerful, and when you're 161 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:20,079 Speaker 1: growing up in a home and you're hearing negative comments 162 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: indirectly and directly, that can only have a negative effect 163 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 1: on how you feel about yourself. So if we can 164 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: be careful and be aware and actually refrain from having 165 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:34,840 Speaker 1: those comments in front of our children. It would make 166 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:39,079 Speaker 1: a huge difference in how young girls think about themselves. 167 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 1: I think another thing is to really surround yourself with 168 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:45,880 Speaker 1: people who appreciate you. You know, look at the environment. 169 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:49,400 Speaker 1: Is it an environment where is very critical, where you're 170 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:53,080 Speaker 1: always being criticized for the way you look, the way 171 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 1: you dress, where you wear your hair. You know, is 172 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,080 Speaker 1: that's the kind of environment that you want to be in? 173 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 1: And we also have some look at culturally. Are we 174 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:06,600 Speaker 1: creating environments that body shaming is acceptable? So what do 175 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:09,319 Speaker 1: I mean by that? So? Are we at work and 176 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:12,800 Speaker 1: part of the work activities is to just talk about 177 00:11:12,880 --> 00:11:15,760 Speaker 1: how someone dresses every day and we make fun of that, 178 00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:19,880 Speaker 1: or we have comments that are negative about that. And 179 00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 1: what we're doing is we're saying in our workplace, or 180 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:26,600 Speaker 1: in our organizations, or in our school groups or in 181 00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 1: school classes that talking this way about women is okay. 182 00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:36,440 Speaker 1: And women contribute to this quite often. A lot of 183 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:39,720 Speaker 1: times you think, you know, as men objesting women and 184 00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 1: being sexist and disrespectful, But as women, we have to 185 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 1: look at our behavior too. Are we making negative comments 186 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 1: about another woman's body or or a dress she's wearing. 187 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:53,200 Speaker 1: Are we saying that with other people and having a 188 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:58,040 Speaker 1: discussion about that. We're creating a very toxic environment that 189 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:03,040 Speaker 1: says talking about the woman's body is okay to do, 190 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:06,040 Speaker 1: so we really need to be careful about that. And 191 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: I think another thing is revaluing ourselves really not allowing 192 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:16,320 Speaker 1: negative thoughts, whether it's stereotypes, direct comments, self doubt, to 193 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:20,720 Speaker 1: really inform who we really are, you know, really focusing 194 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:24,080 Speaker 1: on the value of who you are and who you 195 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:27,679 Speaker 1: believe you are, who you want to be, building yourself up, 196 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 1: and really just confronting poor behavior. I was on Facebook 197 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:35,760 Speaker 1: the other day and it was a post about someone 198 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 1: commenting on someone's body part, and there was a long 199 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:42,839 Speaker 1: thread of it and it was so funny and people 200 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:45,559 Speaker 1: are just comment on this and that. I was reading 201 00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:48,160 Speaker 1: this and it happened to be about a mail, but 202 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:51,560 Speaker 1: I was reading this and I was thinking, this is 203 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:56,440 Speaker 1: so unacceptable. This post is about a physical feature about 204 00:12:56,520 --> 00:13:00,800 Speaker 1: someone and we're just going to publicly talk negatively about it. 205 00:13:00,840 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 1: And what I posted was, you know, I'm just not 206 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 1: into shaming bodies, whether they're men or women. That's just me. 207 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:11,000 Speaker 1: And that was my way of just pushing back. So 208 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 1: I think we just have to kind of confront and 209 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:16,120 Speaker 1: behavior when we see it as well, because it can 210 00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 1: be very detrimental and it's very toxic. So I'm glad 211 00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:23,400 Speaker 1: that you said that, Natalie, because I think we saw 212 00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:25,800 Speaker 1: a lot of this um and I guess it would 213 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:28,439 Speaker 1: still be considered body shaming, though not necessarily around a 214 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:32,600 Speaker 1: body part, but related to Gabby Douglas and her hair um. 215 00:13:32,679 --> 00:13:34,720 Speaker 1: When she was in the Olympics, right, like, it felt 216 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,079 Speaker 1: like there were a lot of like jokes and memes 217 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:40,160 Speaker 1: and you know, kind of like rude comments made about 218 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:42,680 Speaker 1: her hair. And then you know, years later when she 219 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:45,360 Speaker 1: was interviewed, she talked about how hurtful that had been. 220 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 1: Absolutely and let's look at that joy. You know, we're 221 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:53,040 Speaker 1: talking about twenty twelve and the London Olympics and we're 222 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 1: facing history as African Americans, the first black woman to 223 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:04,800 Speaker 1: win gold individually end all around competition history lawless on 224 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 1: the floor, and the focus was her hair being flipped 225 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 1: back with clips in it, I mean, and that has 226 00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 1: to have been very hurtful for Gabby as she is 227 00:14:17,360 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 1: trying to first off, the only African American on the team, 228 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:23,520 Speaker 1: so there's a lot of pressure just to deal with 229 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:28,840 Speaker 1: that and to hear all of this criticism about how 230 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 1: she is wearing her hair and if that is the 231 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 1: thing she needs to be worrying about. And you know, 232 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: I found that really interesting. And I was sitting by 233 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 1: a lot of the criticism what's coming from our own community, 234 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: and where it was focus was about, you know, how 235 00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:48,320 Speaker 1: her hair looks, and you know it's unkept and it's 236 00:14:48,400 --> 00:14:51,640 Speaker 1: unneed and it's unsanitary. So I read something like that 237 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,200 Speaker 1: and I have to question, like, what is happening within 238 00:14:55,560 --> 00:15:00,600 Speaker 1: us that, Wow, history is being made. He act the 239 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 1: Olympics were worried about how Gabby's hair looks. I was 240 00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:06,840 Speaker 1: worried about it. She's gonna stick the landing, That's what 241 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: I was worried about. But you know, it's very interesting 242 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 1: and and it's truly sad, and I think we have 243 00:15:11,800 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: to really live deeper in some of the self hatreot 244 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:20,600 Speaker 1: that we can have in community, in our community particularly, 245 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: And where do you think some of that comes from? 246 00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:27,040 Speaker 1: Can you talk more about that? Well, some of it 247 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:32,480 Speaker 1: is being uncomfortable with people in different spaces. I think 248 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:35,680 Speaker 1: there's a lack of connection within ourselves. And I was 249 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 1: reading an article of the other day about how adolescent 250 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:43,560 Speaker 1: and teenage girls when they get upset, the first thing 251 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 1: they do is attacked their friends physically. You know, you 252 00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 1: have a big nose, or or that's why you're you're 253 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:55,920 Speaker 1: so fat. And what the research was saying is that 254 00:15:56,120 --> 00:16:00,720 Speaker 1: what happens is instead of dealing with the actual emotions 255 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:03,720 Speaker 1: that are happening in that moment, we go on an 256 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 1: attack physically because that's the first thing we see. But 257 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:09,920 Speaker 1: what's really going on is I'm feeling hurt, you know, 258 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:12,440 Speaker 1: I'm hurt that you're not talking to me, or I 259 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:15,280 Speaker 1: miss you as a friend, And instead of dealing with 260 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 1: those emotions and that and and dealing with being vulnerable 261 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:24,040 Speaker 1: and talking about that, we attack person physically. I think 262 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:29,040 Speaker 1: also when it relates to athletes on a very public stage, 263 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 1: I think it's a lot of racism, and I think 264 00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:35,640 Speaker 1: people just y into not even realizing that it's sexist 265 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:39,160 Speaker 1: and racists and other people of the same communities kind 266 00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:42,280 Speaker 1: of buy into that thought process. So we really have 267 00:16:42,520 --> 00:16:45,880 Speaker 1: to be aware of, you know, where are some of 268 00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:49,120 Speaker 1: these comments and some of the feelings that we are having, 269 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:52,080 Speaker 1: where are they coming from, and really need to address that. 270 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: It definitely sounds like you mentioned before, like the self 271 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,440 Speaker 1: assessment pizza is really important, but also kind of pushing 272 00:16:57,480 --> 00:17:00,080 Speaker 1: back and calling other people out, are calling them in 273 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,240 Speaker 1: when you see other people making comments that are not 274 00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:07,880 Speaker 1: very healthy or helpful to other people, that's for sure. 275 00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:11,000 Speaker 1: And you know, I don't I think we really realize 276 00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: the severity of some of the effects of body shaming. 277 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:19,159 Speaker 1: Whether it's an athlete or you know, the next person 278 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 1: next door. There's a lot of shame, you know, low 279 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: self esteem and in extreme cases there there are at 280 00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 1: risk for eating disorders. You know, there are a lot 281 00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:34,600 Speaker 1: of outcomes as it relates to isolating oneself, not wanting 282 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:38,879 Speaker 1: to be social, and when we look at that, you know, 283 00:17:39,119 --> 00:17:42,119 Speaker 1: that is a real obstacle in your day to day living. 284 00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 1: If you're if you're not willing to try for that promotion, 285 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:49,200 Speaker 1: or you're not willing to speak in a group project 286 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 1: where you're not willing to go to that mixer because 287 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:56,760 Speaker 1: you know you have in the past felt bad about 288 00:17:56,800 --> 00:18:00,359 Speaker 1: how you look physically. There's a daily impact that people 289 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:05,040 Speaker 1: experience because of the negative effects of talking about how 290 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:08,720 Speaker 1: one looks walking around in their body every day. It's 291 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 1: very significant, and I don't think we talk about it 292 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:14,040 Speaker 1: or we realize it and I appreciate you Joy for 293 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:17,240 Speaker 1: really allowing me to talk about it, because it's really serious. 294 00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:20,320 Speaker 1: When we're talking about our young girls and wanting them 295 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 1: to be confident and heard of and wanting them to 296 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:27,159 Speaker 1: achieve their goals, it's hard to do that if you 297 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:29,919 Speaker 1: don't feel good about yourself. Yeah, I would imagine so, 298 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:32,400 Speaker 1: and I would imagine you know, like even more like 299 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 1: for you know, your athletes, because they do tend to 300 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,480 Speaker 1: be so much more visible, you know, like we've talked 301 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:40,600 Speaker 1: about Serena and Gabby, but even you know, your high 302 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:44,240 Speaker 1: school and college athletes do have some level of visibility 303 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:48,120 Speaker 1: you know, typically on their teams. So you're absolutely right, 304 00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:51,280 Speaker 1: and they feel that pressure and stress too. And a 305 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 1: lot of times I do have to do a check 306 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 1: in as far as how they're feeling, you know, emotionally 307 00:18:57,480 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 1: as it relates to you know, their way, their body. Uh, 308 00:19:02,280 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 1: there's a lot of pressure in sports, um for young 309 00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:09,960 Speaker 1: ladies to to have a certain fatique, to weigh a 310 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 1: certain amount, you know, to look a certain way. And um, 311 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 1: even though there may not be direct pressure sometimes to 312 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 1: those athletes, they still feel it because there's a culture 313 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:24,400 Speaker 1: in sports around that. And and so you know, when 314 00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:28,920 Speaker 1: we're talking about thirteen fourteen, you know, fifteen, sixteen years old. 315 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:32,879 Speaker 1: It's hard to navigate that space in that way. You know, 316 00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 1: when we're when we're young, we usually start out is 317 00:19:37,320 --> 00:19:42,000 Speaker 1: body neutral or body positive. We're not conscious of how 318 00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:45,359 Speaker 1: we look or anything that might be right or wrong 319 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:49,240 Speaker 1: with our bodies. We're just we're just existing. And then 320 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:55,439 Speaker 1: when people begin to comment on how we look physically, 321 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:59,480 Speaker 1: comment on our our shape or our size, we become 322 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,960 Speaker 1: aware of our body and this is the time when 323 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:07,720 Speaker 1: that negative body image starts to happen, when we start 324 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:12,200 Speaker 1: comparing ourselves to others, when we start hearing those comments 325 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:14,400 Speaker 1: like you know, if you don't lose the weight, you're 326 00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:16,439 Speaker 1: not gonna get a date, you know, those kind of 327 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:20,359 Speaker 1: things where we work initially thinking about our bodies that way, 328 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: but then that outside influences affects us and it has 329 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: a real impact and how we think about ourselves. And 330 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:30,119 Speaker 1: then dooy not to mention the media and social media, 331 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:34,040 Speaker 1: you know, when we think about how Beyonce's body looks, 332 00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 1: or how a model looks, or how people put things 333 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 1: on on on social media and it's photoshops and our 334 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:44,600 Speaker 1: young girls are having these aspirations to look like this 335 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 1: when it's not even a real concept, and you know 336 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,360 Speaker 1: it really it really opened my eyes. This past weekend, 337 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:56,640 Speaker 1: I was in Toronto for the Carnival celebration there, and 338 00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:00,119 Speaker 1: if you're not familiar with Carnival, it's the celebration of 339 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:05,120 Speaker 1: the emancipation of Africans enslaved people emancipated. And so they 340 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:08,159 Speaker 1: have on the outfit and joy I will tell you, 341 00:21:08,359 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 1: I have never seen anything like this where there were 342 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: all the body type that had on these any type 343 00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:18,400 Speaker 1: outfits with the feathers and very little on and I'm 344 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: saying when I say, the bodies of women that were 345 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 1: considered plus size, stretch marks, cell you like rolls, extra skin, 346 00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 1: and they were out there celebrating the emancipation of African slaves. 347 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:38,520 Speaker 1: I had never seen anything in the United States of 348 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:43,879 Speaker 1: such pride of women's body. I was all struck. You know, 349 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:46,679 Speaker 1: in the States, we are so conditioned to you know, 350 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 1: everything less look perfect, and we have to fit this 351 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:52,639 Speaker 1: certain body type and we have to lose weight and 352 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,400 Speaker 1: we have to look like this. And I was over 353 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,159 Speaker 1: there and I was looking at all these women and 354 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:02,159 Speaker 1: they were just regularly looking women like my body in 355 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:06,120 Speaker 1: the mirror, which I would be shy to show to anyone, 356 00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 1: but they were just out there, and it really taught 357 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 1: me that, you know, as women, we have this unconscious 358 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: kind of self shame about how we look if it 359 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:23,160 Speaker 1: doesn't fit a certain conception. And I think we see 360 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,479 Speaker 1: that a lot of the in nine Estates. And and 361 00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:29,400 Speaker 1: I think that it's really important that we really talk 362 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:34,200 Speaker 1: about and emphasized self acceptance. You know, we're so focused 363 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 1: on the physical outward look of someone when we're not 364 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: looking at their abilities and their intellect and their personality 365 00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:43,920 Speaker 1: and their gifts. And I think it's it's a really 366 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,399 Speaker 1: miss in our culture today. And and when I was 367 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,560 Speaker 1: saying that festival, when I was at the parade, you know, 368 00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:54,199 Speaker 1: it was really an eye opening experience for me to 369 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:56,680 Speaker 1: just say, you know, it's okay, it doesn't matter how 370 00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:59,200 Speaker 1: you look to be who you are. I think we 371 00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:01,679 Speaker 1: need much more of that here. So how do you 372 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: suggest we do some of that natally? I mean, given that, 373 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:07,960 Speaker 1: you know, our culture is so full of these messages 374 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:11,000 Speaker 1: about women's bodies in particular, you know, like, how do 375 00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:14,600 Speaker 1: we start to break free from some of that? I 376 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:19,040 Speaker 1: think that we start with our young girls, for one, UM, 377 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 1: to really normalize them as who they are right, UM, 378 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:27,359 Speaker 1: to really value them no matter who they are, what 379 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,439 Speaker 1: they look like, UM, how long their hair is, what 380 00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,199 Speaker 1: color their skin tone is, how their body looks. I 381 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:35,480 Speaker 1: think we should just love them the way they are 382 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:37,920 Speaker 1: and empower them. I think that's the beginning of that, 383 00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:42,040 Speaker 1: I think. And then it also seems to really allowing 384 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:44,640 Speaker 1: ourselves to be okay with who we are. I mean, 385 00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:48,800 Speaker 1: there's really no such thing as a perfect body, and 386 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:52,240 Speaker 1: when we have that type of construct of an idea, 387 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:54,440 Speaker 1: you know, it's a set up for failure. So if 388 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:59,280 Speaker 1: we could just be okay with being normal, I think 389 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:02,239 Speaker 1: that is a huge concept of you know what. You know, 390 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,480 Speaker 1: I have a little extra weight, and you know what, 391 00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:08,400 Speaker 1: I'm still going to wear these shorts because it's hot today, 392 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:11,919 Speaker 1: and and that's okay. I think there's too much of 393 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:16,320 Speaker 1: criticizing and and we have to call that out and 394 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:18,359 Speaker 1: we have to kind of live in our own truth, 395 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:20,320 Speaker 1: in our own lives to say I'm not going to 396 00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 1: buy into that. I'm not going to contribute to it. 397 00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,639 Speaker 1: My goal should not be perfectionist, should be, you know, 398 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 1: the best value. So I think changing some of the dialogue, 399 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:34,360 Speaker 1: joy is really important and really valuing things more than 400 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: just the physical cality of of how we look. Got it. 401 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 1: I also really like, you know when you said the 402 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,160 Speaker 1: whole starting with our girls. I'm encouraged that I've seen 403 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:45,880 Speaker 1: more of those lists recently. I'm sure you have um 404 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,159 Speaker 1: of like things to say to a girl besides like 405 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 1: that she looks pretty like you know, you can tell 406 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:52,679 Speaker 1: them that she is really smarter. I'm really glad that 407 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:54,760 Speaker 1: you stuck with that. You know, like all different kinds 408 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:56,919 Speaker 1: of compliments you can give to young girls that don't 409 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 1: put the focus on their physicality, and just doing that 410 00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:06,040 Speaker 1: is so impactful in a young girl's life by just saying, 411 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:09,439 Speaker 1: you know, you really had a great answer. You know, 412 00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:14,320 Speaker 1: that was so great. You showed so much courage when 413 00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 1: you did what you did. You know, looking beyond just 414 00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:20,680 Speaker 1: how we look is so important. And you know, at 415 00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 1: the end of the day, our look sadd and and 416 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:27,520 Speaker 1: and that is just not the the important things of 417 00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: in life. You know, it really needs to we really 418 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:32,800 Speaker 1: need to be focusing on with our girls, you know, 419 00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:39,600 Speaker 1: encouraging their goals and their aspirations and building up how 420 00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:44,240 Speaker 1: they feel about themselves as an individual. Not necessarily how 421 00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 1: they look physically. And that's really important to me when 422 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:51,359 Speaker 1: I work with young girls and young women for that matter, 423 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:55,040 Speaker 1: is really having them to look at what do they think, 424 00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:57,359 Speaker 1: what are they feel, and what do they expect? And 425 00:25:57,400 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 1: none of that has anything to do with how they 426 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,439 Speaker 1: look physically. It's about getting in touch with who they 427 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:05,080 Speaker 1: are as an individual. And I think when we do that, 428 00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:10,359 Speaker 1: we feel better about ourselves internally, and in turn, we 429 00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:13,440 Speaker 1: feel better about ourselves physically on the outside as well. 430 00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:17,560 Speaker 1: So what are some of your favorite resources natally? What 431 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 1: are your kind of go to books for people who 432 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: want to learn more or um you know, have more 433 00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:26,440 Speaker 1: discussions around this topic. I'm actually reading right now a 434 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: book um Family Joy. There's not a lot to believe 435 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 1: it or not, there's not a lot of resources as 436 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:37,520 Speaker 1: it relates to UM, the black um female body, and 437 00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:39,840 Speaker 1: as it relates to athletes, there's not a lot of 438 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:42,680 Speaker 1: research out there about it. But there is a book 439 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:47,560 Speaker 1: that I found and it's called Recovering the Black Female Body, 440 00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 1: and it's a book of essays talking about some of 441 00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,640 Speaker 1: the things we talked about today, and it's a collection 442 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:57,880 Speaker 1: of essays in theories with the intersection of black fem 443 00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:01,600 Speaker 1: of bodies and the Western culture. So it's a really 444 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:05,560 Speaker 1: interesting and informative read. I would highly recommend that as 445 00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: it relates to this topic today. And I do have 446 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 1: some other resources that are just related to, you know, 447 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:15,840 Speaker 1: athletes and mental health. I listen to a couple of 448 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:19,000 Speaker 1: podcasts I'm really a fan of. One is called UM 449 00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:25,560 Speaker 1: Sports Psychology Today, and that podcast talks about course psychology 450 00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:29,200 Speaker 1: as it relates to collegiate athletes and high school athletes, 451 00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:32,239 Speaker 1: and there's some mental health episodes on this so I'm 452 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:36,280 Speaker 1: a big fan of that. I have a couple resources 453 00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,679 Speaker 1: myself and I I have a Pinterest page where I 454 00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:43,240 Speaker 1: provide a lot of resources for athletes and people who 455 00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:46,919 Speaker 1: love athletes and they're concerned about maybe mental health or 456 00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:50,760 Speaker 1: performance challenges. So you could find that on Pinterest under 457 00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:54,960 Speaker 1: Natalie Grade Athletic Counseling Joy. Just for your listeners, I 458 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 1: have a free mental health checklist for athletes. Do you 459 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:02,320 Speaker 1: need more information about your athlete you're concerned about maybe 460 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:06,200 Speaker 1: some at risk symptoms or behaviors. I have a checklist 461 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: that you can I can email to you from an 462 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,359 Speaker 1: athlete in your life. You're an athlete and you you 463 00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:14,200 Speaker 1: want to know more about mental health as it relates 464 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 1: to your sports, I'm happy to send that out to 465 00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:22,640 Speaker 1: you and always Joy anyone who I know, I always 466 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,680 Speaker 1: recommend your podcast and then I'm not just saying that, 467 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:27,880 Speaker 1: I mean it is like the best thing out here, 468 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:31,399 Speaker 1: So I always reference therapi of Black Girls podcasts with 469 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 1: those are kind of my top resources that I give 470 00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:38,240 Speaker 1: to people. Perfect I like that. And what is your 471 00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:40,440 Speaker 1: website for people who want to be able to get 472 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:42,720 Speaker 1: in touch with you or find out more about your services, 473 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 1: Natalie Sure, It's Natalie Grades dot com, so you can 474 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:52,320 Speaker 1: reach me there. I'm on Facebook. My private practice page 475 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:55,520 Speaker 1: is Natalie Grades Athletic Counseling. You could find me there. 476 00:28:56,200 --> 00:29:01,680 Speaker 1: On Twitter it's Natalie Underscore One. I'm on Instagram Natalie 477 00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: Grad's Athletic Counselor, and you can also email me directly 478 00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:11,480 Speaker 1: at Natalie Grades LPs W at gmail dot com. Sounds good, 479 00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 1: and of course we will have all that information in 480 00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:15,960 Speaker 1: the show notes for people who want to reference it later. Well, 481 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us today, Natalie, I 482 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,840 Speaker 1: really appreciate it. Thanks so much for having me Joy, 483 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:25,240 Speaker 1: It's really great. Absolutely, I'm so thankful Natalie was able 484 00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,560 Speaker 1: to share her expertise with us today. To check out 485 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:31,880 Speaker 1: the resources that she shared and to learn more about 486 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 1: her practice, visit the show notes at Therapy for Black 487 00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:40,040 Speaker 1: Girls dot Com slash Session seventy four, and please make 488 00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 1: sure to share your takeaways with us from the episode 489 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 1: in your I G stories. Make sure to use the 490 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:49,480 Speaker 1: hashtag TVG and session so that we can find them 491 00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 1: and share them. If you're looking for a therapist in 492 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:57,040 Speaker 1: your area, be sure to visit the therapist directory at 493 00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls dot Com slash directory. And if 494 00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:04,680 Speaker 1: you want to continue this conversation and join a community 495 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:07,920 Speaker 1: of other sisters who listen to the podcast, join us 496 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 1: over in the Thrive tribe at Therapy for Black Girls 497 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,480 Speaker 1: dot com slash tribe. Make sure you answer the three 498 00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 1: questions that are asked to gain entry. Thank y'all so 499 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,880 Speaker 1: much again for joining me this week, and I look 500 00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:24,320 Speaker 1: forward to continuing this conversation with you all real soon. 501 00:30:24,880 --> 00:31:02,080 Speaker 1: Take it care. Two