1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,960
Speaker 1: You've talked about some really good times, and I want

2
00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:05,240
Speaker 1: you to draw this picture for me because I have

3
00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:08,879
Speaker 1: no idea what it is. But when I say a word,

4
00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:10,840
Speaker 1: you tell me and I'll probably be able to pick

5
00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:11,760
Speaker 1: think a little bit.

6
00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:20,680
Speaker 2: Just by the facial expression. But humperdinks, we got we

7
00:00:20,760 --> 00:00:25,080
Speaker 2: got black. That out, you got dark, we got dark.

8
00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:29,480
Speaker 2: Those are some single moments. So this is my experience

9
00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:31,000
Speaker 2: as well. So my first.

10
00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:34,879
Speaker 3: Seven a minute you know about because we do our

11
00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:37,440
Speaker 3: research research here.

12
00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:39,680
Speaker 2: We are professional.

13
00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:42,720
Speaker 4: We haven't nobody the Internet.

14
00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:46,120
Speaker 2: We are a professor Google machine Hot.

15
00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:58,600
Speaker 4: He's on the hot seats. So what's up, everybody. I'm

16
00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:02,560
Speaker 4: Peanut Toman and this this is the NFL Players Second

17
00:01:02,560 --> 00:01:05,760
Speaker 4: Act podcast and with me, as always my trusty co host,

18
00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:08,000
Speaker 4: my work wife, Roman Harper. What's up?

19
00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:10,320
Speaker 2: What's up baby? I appreciate the nicknames. Early.

20
00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:13,040
Speaker 1: I'm really excited about this, this sex episode. Who he

21
00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:15,679
Speaker 1: got as our guests, I mean, everybody will know exactly

22
00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:17,800
Speaker 1: who he is. He's a great representative of the state

23
00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:20,800
Speaker 1: of Texas and the Dallas Cowboys itself. And whenever you

24
00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:22,760
Speaker 1: get all DB's in the room, it's gonna be a

25
00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:26,919
Speaker 1: great all love yea, yeah, all right, go ahead, introduce

26
00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:29,640
Speaker 1: all right, this next guest, This next gentleman U.

27
00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:34,680
Speaker 4: Three time Super Bowl champion, five time Pro bowler. He's

28
00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:38,760
Speaker 4: in a Dallas Cowboys Ring of honor. He's a tech entrepreneur,

29
00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:40,560
Speaker 4: real estate mogul.

30
00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:41,399
Speaker 1: Uh.

31
00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:45,120
Speaker 4: He just came from the office. He just came from

32
00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:47,880
Speaker 4: the office. Ladies and gentlemen, please walk up to the pod.

33
00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:50,360
Speaker 4: Mister Darren, what's yeah, walk up to the pot.

34
00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:53,480
Speaker 2: Appreciate it. Appreciate me in here. Man, I'm good to

35
00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:54,400
Speaker 2: see you on Dallas.

36
00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:57,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, say it all the way down in Texas. I'm

37
00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,960
Speaker 4: from the central part of the state, from coppers Co, Temple, Waco.

38
00:02:01,560 --> 00:02:03,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, Helena, Yeah yeah, used to be far from here,

39
00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:04,760
Speaker 2: on the way to Austin.

40
00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:07,280
Speaker 4: On the way to Austin. Absolutely all my peoples is

41
00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:09,359
Speaker 4: up in Sherman and Gainesville.

42
00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:13,600
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah. Did you see anybody you know you got

43
00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:16,920
Speaker 2: off that plane win yesterday? Yeah? Yeah. The family, the

44
00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:22,280
Speaker 2: family tonight. I'm okay tonight, I'm doing like old Fantom,

45
00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:25,120
Speaker 2: flying without telling anybody.

46
00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:26,600
Speaker 4: Can do that. Dave, my aunt is gonna be mad

47
00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:29,600
Speaker 4: at me. So I'm I'm doing dinner tonight. He's going golfing. Yes,

48
00:02:29,880 --> 00:02:31,000
Speaker 4: I'm doing dinner with the family.

49
00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:33,440
Speaker 2: Knight. Strike that from the record, though my wife does

50
00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:37,320
Speaker 2: not know that. No, you're going golf the record, She

51
00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:40,200
Speaker 2: didn't bigger ass golf club. No, no, no, she was.

52
00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:42,040
Speaker 1: Dropping the kids off and I got to play as

53
00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:45,639
Speaker 1: I booked my flights. Everything is around that, everything is

54
00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:50,840
Speaker 1: around that never strike, that never never rest. It's war mentality.

55
00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:52,720
Speaker 2: Oh my god, you're terrible.

56
00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:55,800
Speaker 4: So I want to get this thing started off right now.

57
00:02:56,360 --> 00:03:02,360
Speaker 4: So you are second as the Dallas Cowboys all time

58
00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:05,880
Speaker 4: tackler or not all time? So your second one? Sports

59
00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:11,639
Speaker 4: teams tackles, yes, first all time? First uh in tackles

60
00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:13,400
Speaker 4: and tackles second all time?

61
00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:15,040
Speaker 2: And special teams.

62
00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:21,080
Speaker 4: Always bring this up thirteen years eleven years. Yeah, I

63
00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:22,680
Speaker 4: played sports teams my entire career.

64
00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:24,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, got to. Yes, you know what I'm saying.

65
00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:26,200
Speaker 4: The more you can do, the more to help your

66
00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:27,000
Speaker 4: team because.

67
00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:29,560
Speaker 5: The team players, right, Yeah, of course you got us.

68
00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:33,400
Speaker 5: This damn devo divo over here. He ain't played a

69
00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:39,240
Speaker 5: damn special team, not one. No like team return nothing,

70
00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,560
Speaker 5: definitely not punt return. I'm like, bro, I'm not blocking nobody.

71
00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:45,080
Speaker 5: I did do kick offf like some safety work.

72
00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:46,360
Speaker 2: But you know that's like that.

73
00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:49,000
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, count, that don't count.

74
00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:51,600
Speaker 2: I'm not the field guy. I'm not. You never ran

75
00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:54,440
Speaker 2: L five or five none, nothing, huh.

76
00:03:54,840 --> 00:03:55,680
Speaker 4: And he's a thumper.

77
00:03:57,800 --> 00:04:01,720
Speaker 2: I wouldn't. That is amazing. That wouldn't never have imagined

78
00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:04,760
Speaker 2: the harp that you had never played special. That's like,

79
00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:05,880
Speaker 2: that's unheard of.

80
00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,360
Speaker 1: They never asked me to as a rookie. They I

81
00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:12,440
Speaker 1: was doing no special teams. Uh, they were just trying

82
00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:14,720
Speaker 1: to let me play. And then second year they kind

83
00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:16,200
Speaker 1: of got me in a little bit and I would

84
00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:19,200
Speaker 1: practice some PP but like I never played in the game,

85
00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:23,719
Speaker 1: like it was never And I always laughed because he

86
00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:25,800
Speaker 1: always laughs and says all these things.

87
00:04:25,880 --> 00:04:27,520
Speaker 2: I'm like overrated.

88
00:04:28,839 --> 00:04:31,960
Speaker 4: Almost every one of Devin Harris's punt returns like us

89
00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:34,680
Speaker 4: me running the same way.

90
00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:36,599
Speaker 2: I just saw a video the other day of Beyond

91
00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,480
Speaker 2: Return and one in New York, and I see myself

92
00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:43,400
Speaker 2: acting like I was trying to forget some But that's

93
00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:46,640
Speaker 2: that was my entire life. I walked in the door. Here,

94
00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:49,560
Speaker 2: I was on all four. I was on kickoff return,

95
00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:54,359
Speaker 2: kickoff return, kickoff, punt return. I held up on the

96
00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:57,680
Speaker 2: outside on a punt return. You're a four core guy,

97
00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:01,160
Speaker 2: all of it, ye my ass. And the reason why

98
00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:04,280
Speaker 2: I have twelve surgeries is because and that's the reason

99
00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:08,120
Speaker 2: I'm serious. I'd say about least half of my surgeries

100
00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:12,200
Speaker 2: came in from a Special Teams play. Didn't see someone

101
00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:15,000
Speaker 2: someone cut me from behind on the side, my own

102
00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:17,560
Speaker 2: player broke my arm. You know, I had some friendly

103
00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:21,080
Speaker 2: fire all the time. Like I mean, it's because it's movings.

104
00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:24,320
Speaker 2: Everything's moving so fast that and the collisions are that

105
00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:26,240
Speaker 2: much greater. Those are the reasons why. That's when the

106
00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:27,200
Speaker 2: Special Teams was real.

107
00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:30,080
Speaker 1: And I would also say one thing about Special Teams,

108
00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:32,960
Speaker 1: and you guys can probably attest to this, and I'm

109
00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,159
Speaker 1: a victim of it, is that if you don't do

110
00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:38,440
Speaker 1: it early, you can't just all your seven eight and

111
00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:41,520
Speaker 1: hit the switch. I'm gonna be a Special Teams guy. No,

112
00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:43,080
Speaker 1: I don't work that way. You got to come in

113
00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:45,040
Speaker 1: doing this, so you get to understand it. And we

114
00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:47,400
Speaker 1: didn't have a choice. There was no choice in them.

115
00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:50,400
Speaker 2: We came in. Joey avazonal Rest in Peace was our

116
00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:53,640
Speaker 2: Special Teams coach, was a great Special Teams coach. Jimmy

117
00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:56,839
Speaker 2: Johnson was a head coach. Jimmy was in every Special

118
00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:01,599
Speaker 2: teams meeting every day, and sometimes it make the entire

119
00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:05,200
Speaker 2: team come in and watch. Specially and on a Monday

120
00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:08,680
Speaker 2: morning after a Sunday game, please, everybody's watching. Turn those

121
00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:12,760
Speaker 2: lights off, Troy, and everybody's in that special teams meeting

122
00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:14,719
Speaker 2: watching you run down the field, and dude, he would

123
00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:18,160
Speaker 2: control the Jimmy would control the tape after a loss.

124
00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:20,000
Speaker 2: He used to call it red ass meetings on special

125
00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:22,800
Speaker 2: team's day. Don't run down the field, find yourself. I

126
00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:26,320
Speaker 2: used to be in games at L four thinking, dude,

127
00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:28,720
Speaker 2: I gotta get off this. I better not be the

128
00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:31,440
Speaker 2: last one. It was a sprint down the field and

129
00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:33,200
Speaker 2: all of them were return back then as well. Oh yeah,

130
00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,120
Speaker 2: you getting hit from the side, they setting you up

131
00:06:38,480 --> 00:06:39,880
Speaker 2: all the wedge. Yeah, I was trying to.

132
00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:42,560
Speaker 1: So you're you're talking about all these hits and collisions.

133
00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:45,680
Speaker 1: We'd like to know everybody else's in. We all have

134
00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:48,000
Speaker 1: our own. But what was your first welcome to the

135
00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:48,799
Speaker 1: NFL moment?

136
00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:53,880
Speaker 2: Uh? First welcome to the NFL moment, I would say

137
00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:57,960
Speaker 2: was training camp and we used to do one on

138
00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:01,840
Speaker 2: one so I was I have a backstory. My backstory

139
00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:04,120
Speaker 2: is I was at Arizona State. I was what they

140
00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:06,599
Speaker 2: call a tweener. I was basically, you're a smaller linebacker.

141
00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:09,120
Speaker 2: I was like the rover back played a little linebacker

142
00:07:09,640 --> 00:07:12,880
Speaker 2: did play. We did. Lovey Smith was my position coach.

143
00:07:12,880 --> 00:07:15,240
Speaker 2: A lovey used to become. I can't call him lovey.

144
00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:18,720
Speaker 2: Coach Smith used to always have me playing multiple positions.

145
00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:22,280
Speaker 2: I'd played lineup at safety. Sometimes I'd covered the slot receiver.

146
00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:24,280
Speaker 2: He taught me how to do all these things right,

147
00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,080
Speaker 2: but I'd never been on that autobond back on the outside,

148
00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:31,720
Speaker 2: like I that's a little different. Right. So I get

149
00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:35,200
Speaker 2: here my first year and we're going through many camps

150
00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:36,880
Speaker 2: and we're not you know, nothing's really going on. We're

151
00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:39,520
Speaker 2: doing some one on ones, but just mostly with the

152
00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:41,240
Speaker 2: rookies and all that. And then the veterans. We get

153
00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:45,600
Speaker 2: the training camp. All the veterans are in and my

154
00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,120
Speaker 2: first time one on ones, eighty eight walked up and

155
00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:50,720
Speaker 2: I had to cover him the first time, and it

156
00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:53,320
Speaker 2: was like it was that moment like, Okay, I've been

157
00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:55,920
Speaker 2: watching you know, if you if you didn't know Mike

158
00:07:56,440 --> 00:08:00,920
Speaker 2: back then it's I'm about to run, you know. He

159
00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:04,360
Speaker 2: just barking and it's a crowd. There's an audience, right

160
00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:07,160
Speaker 2: because our training camps were packed and you had, you know,

161
00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:10,000
Speaker 2: twenty some thousand people in the stands, and he just,

162
00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:13,880
Speaker 2: you know, he just going at it and I can't

163
00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:16,360
Speaker 2: believe you put him out here like he's talking to

164
00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:18,640
Speaker 2: me right. And I think that was my wake up

165
00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:20,600
Speaker 2: moment to be like, Okay, I'm out here on the

166
00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:24,160
Speaker 2: outside one on one with Michael Irvin and he ran

167
00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:27,080
Speaker 2: an out. I jumped out, made a good play on

168
00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:29,760
Speaker 2: the ball, and I was like, yeah, I can do it.

169
00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:32,760
Speaker 2: I can do this. Now. This is you know, Mike

170
00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:35,200
Speaker 2: couldn't run anyway, but Mike was strong and fast. But

171
00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:37,240
Speaker 2: you know, it was one of those days where that

172
00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:40,760
Speaker 2: was that was my wake up moment to to the NFL.

173
00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:44,440
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's cool, I know for I think for me,

174
00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:47,439
Speaker 4: I just assumed that I would always be in Chicago

175
00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,560
Speaker 4: my entire career. I know, you're a Saints Hall of

176
00:08:50,559 --> 00:08:53,840
Speaker 4: Famer and you played for another team. I played for

177
00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:57,640
Speaker 4: one other team. How does it feel that knowing that

178
00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:01,079
Speaker 4: you were in Dallas your entire career and just played

179
00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:01,720
Speaker 4: for one team.

180
00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:04,720
Speaker 2: Yeah. I never experienced free agency. Yeah, I never got

181
00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:06,800
Speaker 2: to free agency. I was always you know, we always

182
00:09:06,880 --> 00:09:09,400
Speaker 2: got signed up before we got there. I think the

183
00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:11,400
Speaker 2: closest I was over there was like a month before

184
00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:15,000
Speaker 2: free agency. Yeah, and you know, they they found a

185
00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:18,120
Speaker 2: way to get me locked up early. You know, I

186
00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:21,360
Speaker 2: couldn't see myself playing anywhere else. And I say that

187
00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:25,560
Speaker 2: because I'm so ingrained in the community here, Like I

188
00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:29,320
Speaker 2: have four kids, all in school. I've been I mean,

189
00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:32,319
Speaker 2: I'm on the Make a Wish Foundation board, the C

190
00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:37,240
Speaker 2: five Texas board. Today, I've been on Salvation Army. You know,

191
00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,920
Speaker 2: I've been so ingrained in this community that I don't

192
00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:44,520
Speaker 2: I never even thought about leaving, Like I don't know

193
00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,880
Speaker 2: what it would feel like to see. And I've saw teammates,

194
00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:52,040
Speaker 2: coaches packing up, leaving, going somewhere else, taking their kids.

195
00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:54,160
Speaker 2: And that's the thing we don't understand that we don't

196
00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:57,719
Speaker 2: see in this sport, right, is that the true fan

197
00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:00,600
Speaker 2: doesn't really see the behind the scenes. And a head

198
00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,920
Speaker 2: coach loses or a position coach loses his job, He's

199
00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:06,960
Speaker 2: go take his babies out of school. Yep, they got friends,

200
00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,319
Speaker 2: he's tied to the church. You know, there's so many

201
00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:13,360
Speaker 2: little small integral things that that that now they have

202
00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:14,880
Speaker 2: to get up and move. And now they're moving to

203
00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:18,440
Speaker 2: Green Bay kids are in another school third fourth grade

204
00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:20,719
Speaker 2: and great, and I just never had to experience that. Man,

205
00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:23,120
Speaker 2: I've been blessed. I mean, I'll tell you now, I've

206
00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:25,960
Speaker 2: been extremely blessed to just be on this team, staying

207
00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:28,320
Speaker 2: in this community. Yeah, that's that's cool.

208
00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:32,319
Speaker 1: So you talked about that, and you talked about your

209
00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:34,160
Speaker 1: teammates leaving and coaches leaving.

210
00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,400
Speaker 2: I mean, you were the last one of the dynasty.

211
00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:40,440
Speaker 1: At one point where it was like you and Irvin

212
00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:43,280
Speaker 1: without the mainstays. You were the last one out of

213
00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:47,160
Speaker 1: everybody the OG. So what was that locker room dynamic

214
00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:49,680
Speaker 1: like thing did you see? I know, you saw the change,

215
00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:51,840
Speaker 1: the change from when you first got in, when you

216
00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:53,240
Speaker 1: were the young guy to all of a sudden, now

217
00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:55,320
Speaker 1: you're the old guy and you don't have the same

218
00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:56,640
Speaker 1: party that you have before.

219
00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:59,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, and not only that personnel changed, you know, the

220
00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:01,800
Speaker 2: coach his staff started to change. I wanted I was

221
00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:03,599
Speaker 2: the only one that went through five coaches and that

222
00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,040
Speaker 2: I ain't proud of that because you know what happens

223
00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:10,120
Speaker 2: when you're going through coaches lost games. So when I

224
00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:12,199
Speaker 2: first came in, Jimmy Johnson was my head coach, and

225
00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:17,439
Speaker 2: Jimmy did everything. He ran personnel, so cut players, brought

226
00:11:17,440 --> 00:11:21,600
Speaker 2: players in, drafted them, did everything, rock coaches in. That

227
00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:24,959
Speaker 2: was all Jimmy. Jerry was overseeing at the top. It

228
00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:28,560
Speaker 2: was base Jerry was basically being a young new owner.

229
00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:31,560
Speaker 2: He had lawsuits with the league he was dealing with,

230
00:11:31,679 --> 00:11:33,360
Speaker 2: he was bringing in sponsors.

231
00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:38,280
Speaker 1: He was the only one with absolute everybody else everybody

232
00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:38,720
Speaker 1: else so that.

233
00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:41,600
Speaker 2: The league was suing him at the times. He wasn't

234
00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:43,880
Speaker 2: involved that much, involved on the day to day. So

235
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:47,040
Speaker 2: that was all Jimmy. So the personnel, you kind of

236
00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:49,160
Speaker 2: knew what the personnel was gonna look like. Jimmy wanted

237
00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:51,760
Speaker 2: alpha dogs that were going to compete. I mean, you

238
00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:53,320
Speaker 2: didn't have to be the most talented to do but

239
00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:55,280
Speaker 2: you better love this game because he was gonna test

240
00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:57,199
Speaker 2: that metal to see if you you know how much

241
00:11:57,240 --> 00:12:01,120
Speaker 2: you really cared about the game. But that personnel was

242
00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:05,280
Speaker 2: from ninety two. Jimmy got fired after the second Super Bowl,

243
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,240
Speaker 2: which is ridiculous, but it's crazy. I don't even go there.

244
00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:15,880
Speaker 2: And then we brought it yeah, which is crazy. Man.

245
00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:18,000
Speaker 2: I was in Phoenix at the time we had won

246
00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:19,800
Speaker 2: the second Super Bowl. I've be in Phoenix. I'm gonna

247
00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:21,640
Speaker 2: go ahead and tell the story. Let me go. So I'm

248
00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:26,560
Speaker 2: in Phoenix and with my family and watching, and back

249
00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:29,480
Speaker 2: then we didn't have like social media. It was just

250
00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:32,280
Speaker 2: you found out on the news, right, And nor did

251
00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:34,120
Speaker 2: we have like the regular old cell phone where you

252
00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:35,599
Speaker 2: just called me up on the cell phone and just

253
00:12:35,920 --> 00:12:40,080
Speaker 2: like the landline rang. My buddy Kevin Smith called me.

254
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:42,800
Speaker 2: Who Pup you guys probably know. Pup called me. He

255
00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:44,680
Speaker 2: was the corner on the team. He said, you watching

256
00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:49,040
Speaker 2: the news. I said, what news? You know that just fired?

257
00:12:49,160 --> 00:12:51,400
Speaker 2: He just said it that way, but it has fired Jimmy.

258
00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:54,840
Speaker 2: I said, there ain't no way. So I'm turning, can't

259
00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:56,840
Speaker 2: find it on time. I got him. I'm on the lawn.

260
00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:00,160
Speaker 2: I'm on the landline phone at my mom's house. I

261
00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:02,760
Speaker 2: got my hand on his long cord. I'm trying to

262
00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:04,600
Speaker 2: find the news channel.

263
00:13:04,840 --> 00:13:06,960
Speaker 1: No one's talking about it, yeah, because it didn't had

264
00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:07,720
Speaker 1: any hit out there.

265
00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:11,800
Speaker 2: Right, And and so I'm talking. I'm still talking to him,

266
00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:16,760
Speaker 2: says man, I'm serious. They just fired Jimmy. And it wasn't.

267
00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,080
Speaker 2: But maybe an hour later, I've turned on the news

268
00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:22,400
Speaker 2: and I'm seeing Michael Irvin in the locker room. Throwing

269
00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:25,079
Speaker 2: the garbage can. I don't know if you guys remember

270
00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:27,120
Speaker 2: all this. You guys probably too young for this, but

271
00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:29,840
Speaker 2: he's throwing the garbage can. He's all pissed off. Reporters

272
00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:32,280
Speaker 2: are all over the place, and I'm seeing this and

273
00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:34,839
Speaker 2: then you know, Phoenix news stations, as you know, Jimmy

274
00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:37,240
Speaker 2: Johnson has just been fired for the Dallas Cowboys and

275
00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:41,800
Speaker 2: blew me away. Man, It's just because we were in

276
00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:46,400
Speaker 2: a moment and we just won back to back. Everybody's

277
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:50,880
Speaker 2: coming back under contract. The mindset was we won the second.

278
00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:52,800
Speaker 2: When we were on the bus going to the airport

279
00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:54,920
Speaker 2: the next day, we partied really hard after that game,

280
00:13:55,000 --> 00:14:00,640
Speaker 2: right Atlanta was you know special. We were on the

281
00:14:00,679 --> 00:14:03,920
Speaker 2: bus going back to the airport and I remember everybody saying, Okay,

282
00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:07,720
Speaker 2: we're gonna get three and we're gonna get four, like

283
00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:10,760
Speaker 2: we were thinking more of not just the three people,

284
00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:13,800
Speaker 2: but it was this was a dynasty that was in place.

285
00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:16,160
Speaker 2: And then Jimmy got fired, and I think it was

286
00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:22,040
Speaker 2: just everything just went just went away. The mindset went away.

287
00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:25,600
Speaker 2: Barry Switzer loved Barry. Barry came in, but it was

288
00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:28,040
Speaker 2: all of Jimmy's coaches. It was you know, you had

289
00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:30,000
Speaker 2: to all of the Jimmy staff and you just plugged

290
00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:32,160
Speaker 2: Barry in. They were all there was all this in

291
00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:35,400
Speaker 2: fighting because all those coaches wanted the job. So you

292
00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:39,760
Speaker 2: can imagine how tumultuous the locker room was. We were.

293
00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,120
Speaker 2: There's a lot of alpha dogs on that team, and

294
00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:45,320
Speaker 2: Jimmy did a good job of controlling us and making

295
00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:47,360
Speaker 2: sure we were you know, you were biting the right

296
00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:51,200
Speaker 2: person that was gone. So the prisoner started running the

297
00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,600
Speaker 2: asylum and it just got worse and over the years,

298
00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:57,920
Speaker 2: you know, we ended up going to the NFC Championship Game,

299
00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:01,400
Speaker 2: losing to San Francisco. The following year when winning the

300
00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:04,160
Speaker 2: Super Bowl, had no idea how that happened. You guys

301
00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:07,680
Speaker 2: were talented, Yeah there was talent, man, but we were

302
00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:11,560
Speaker 2: I was I'll say this, I'll say this. The league

303
00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:16,080
Speaker 2: wasn't that good that year. Okay, there's no way we

304
00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:18,360
Speaker 2: should that team. I look at that team, our last team,

305
00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:20,520
Speaker 2: when that's the last Super Bowl. I'm like, man, our

306
00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,120
Speaker 2: first team to beat the dog piss out of that team.

307
00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:26,400
Speaker 2: Really not even close. It wasn't even close. And that

308
00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:28,000
Speaker 2: was the year that Dion was on the team. In

309
00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:30,400
Speaker 2: ninety five, or whatnot. Our ninety two ninety three teams

310
00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:33,760
Speaker 2: were much stronger than our ninety five team and and

311
00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:37,480
Speaker 2: then after that it was a free fall. Personnel coming

312
00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:40,200
Speaker 2: in was terrible. I mean, we couldn't get guys that

313
00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:43,440
Speaker 2: were drafted in the first second round to play Pete.

314
00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:46,760
Speaker 2: I'm looking at you, play special teams, right. We couldn't

315
00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:49,520
Speaker 2: get it. Just think about it, your first second round pick.

316
00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:51,920
Speaker 2: They couldn't even make the special teams roster. They couldn't

317
00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,040
Speaker 2: do all the little things. So the first second, third

318
00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:58,480
Speaker 2: round guys were just now we were missing. We kept on,

319
00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:01,240
Speaker 2: we continued to miss. We had an opportunity to take

320
00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:06,400
Speaker 2: Randy Moss, we didn't take him. He sat imagine in

321
00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:10,520
Speaker 2: the Dallas Yeah. So the personnel scouting was was a mess.

322
00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:12,280
Speaker 2: And I'm not gonna blame all the guys because it's

323
00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:16,560
Speaker 2: you know, it's aulation of that. But we weren't the

324
00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:20,320
Speaker 2: same outfit and never were pretty much through the rest

325
00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:23,640
Speaker 2: of my time until Bill Parcells came in and I

326
00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:28,160
Speaker 2: had gone three straight years of five and eleven, five

327
00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:30,280
Speaker 2: and eleven. I wanted to get traded. I wanted to

328
00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:32,400
Speaker 2: get up out of here because it was it was terrible. Man,

329
00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:37,880
Speaker 2: it was really bad. Parcels came in, same team, same quarterback,

330
00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:41,440
Speaker 2: same personnel. We go from five to eleven, he comes

331
00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:44,160
Speaker 2: in ten and six in the playoffs.

332
00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:47,320
Speaker 4: To me, that just go that everything you just said.

333
00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:50,480
Speaker 4: The one thing I can think of is just leadership.

334
00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:53,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, how important.

335
00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,800
Speaker 4: It is to bring in the right leader to lead

336
00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:59,600
Speaker 4: all these alphas. Yeah, you know, and it's not really

337
00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:01,800
Speaker 4: I don't want to work controlling, but just leading them

338
00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:02,960
Speaker 4: in the right now direction.

339
00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:04,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, like we don't need.

340
00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:06,600
Speaker 4: To fight each other, keep that energy, keep that same fight,

341
00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:09,399
Speaker 4: keep that dog. But I want it going here. I

342
00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:11,439
Speaker 4: want you to go there. I want you to go there. Hey, coaches,

343
00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:12,840
Speaker 4: I need you to go this. I need you know,

344
00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:14,560
Speaker 4: Like that's yeah leadership.

345
00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and we got relaxed. We got really relaxed around here.

346
00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,200
Speaker 2: And I think it was that time and even today.

347
00:17:20,240 --> 00:17:22,359
Speaker 2: I mean, it's been since nineteen ninety five that this

348
00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:24,680
Speaker 2: organization has won a Super Bowl. But it's been a

349
00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:28,640
Speaker 2: mindset that has pretty much been the same mindset until

350
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:31,399
Speaker 2: until I'm telling you, until Parcels came in and he

351
00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:34,720
Speaker 2: had this nice little run there, they didn't win the championship. Right,

352
00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:38,560
Speaker 2: there was an accountability he held the team accountable.

353
00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:39,639
Speaker 4: The standard is a stand.

354
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:41,159
Speaker 2: Absolutely, if he had the t if he had the

355
00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:43,360
Speaker 2: right personnel, he won a super Bowl.

356
00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:46,080
Speaker 1: So you said something, and that's exactly where all the

357
00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:48,440
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboy fans want to know. And since I got

358
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:49,840
Speaker 1: one here, I'm going to ask him because one of

359
00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:51,760
Speaker 1: my best friends is a huge Cowboy fan, not as

360
00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:54,280
Speaker 1: big as he used to be, but still big. Hearing

361
00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:57,199
Speaker 1: a lot of that, you know, So you have grown

362
00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:01,960
Speaker 1: adult Cowboys fans that have never seen this, all the

363
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,280
Speaker 1: success and Super Bowls that we all brag about as

364
00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:07,920
Speaker 1: Cowboy fans. I'm not one of them, but I'm trying.

365
00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:11,600
Speaker 1: I'm trying to make everybody inclusive. That's right and so

366
00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:17,720
Speaker 1: and so understanding that what is missing because it's not talent.

367
00:18:17,760 --> 00:18:20,679
Speaker 1: You guys have had Hall of fame. The talent has

368
00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:24,480
Speaker 1: been an abundance for the Cowboys. Not only do they drafted,

369
00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:26,719
Speaker 1: but they acquire it and however they get it. So

370
00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:29,639
Speaker 1: it's not the talent. What is it that's missing that

371
00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:32,560
Speaker 1: in your opinion? And I'm gonna ask other Cowboys players,

372
00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:34,679
Speaker 1: formers that I could I get to sit in front of,

373
00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:37,399
Speaker 1: But what is that that's been missing in your opinion.

374
00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:41,520
Speaker 2: I don't know. Honestly, I don't think anyone knows because

375
00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:45,560
Speaker 2: you just said it. I mean, the talent has been Theres,

376
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:49,040
Speaker 2: the Marcus where you had you know a lot of

377
00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:52,240
Speaker 2: you know, I can't tell you how great that offensive

378
00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:54,640
Speaker 2: line was for a long time t O was here.

379
00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,840
Speaker 2: I mean, they had a run where talent was plentiful.

380
00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:00,680
Speaker 1: Trespis is gonna be Hall of fame, absolutely on both

381
00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:04,960
Speaker 1: sides of the ball, Martin up front us they've had guys.

382
00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:09,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. It's I can't. I can't. I

383
00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:11,320
Speaker 2: can't put my finger on it. One. I'm not in

384
00:19:11,359 --> 00:19:13,920
Speaker 2: the locker room anymore. So for anyone that's saying, well,

385
00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:16,440
Speaker 2: you know this, you know the team, Yeah, you don't

386
00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:18,760
Speaker 2: know the team, even if you played in that organization,

387
00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:20,399
Speaker 2: If you're not in that locker room every day, you

388
00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:23,879
Speaker 2: just don't know the man, You just don't. Can't. I

389
00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:27,919
Speaker 2: can watch them, watch them on film sometimes or on

390
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:31,280
Speaker 2: TV or on film and just think, man like they

391
00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:35,560
Speaker 2: are so close. But there's there's, you know, the whole

392
00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:38,280
Speaker 2: mindset that you think that this is old school. Now,

393
00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:42,600
Speaker 2: this is really old school. You don't win championships in

394
00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:44,480
Speaker 2: the playoffs like you just don't get in the playoffs

395
00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:48,000
Speaker 2: and you just win that championship. Like it starts wairly,

396
00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:51,320
Speaker 2: it starts in March April, when there is a true

397
00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:55,040
Speaker 2: belief that us three hey dog were coming in to

398
00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:57,520
Speaker 2: work out every day. We're gonna watch film on third

399
00:19:57,560 --> 00:19:59,399
Speaker 2: and this is how I came in. We're watching film

400
00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:03,480
Speaker 2: in the off season on us breaking down our old

401
00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:07,240
Speaker 2: film and seeing, okay, damn, we were weaking this this

402
00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:09,520
Speaker 2: cover four man, and we got to do better. We're

403
00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:12,000
Speaker 2: we're doing those little things. I don't think that's a

404
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:14,640
Speaker 2: process that they these guys go through anymore. I don't

405
00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,960
Speaker 2: think it's a process of looking back at the year

406
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:22,200
Speaker 2: back and looking at yourself and being critical of your plate.

407
00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:24,960
Speaker 2: Am I running into the ball? Am I giving one effort?

408
00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:27,719
Speaker 2: Am I lined up the right way? Am I reading this?

409
00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:29,760
Speaker 2: You know? Am I reading my keys and doing all?

410
00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:34,040
Speaker 2: Am I studying the right way? Like there's no there's

411
00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:36,879
Speaker 2: I don't think that's a mindset of this organization. I

412
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,159
Speaker 2: think this organization is where the Dallas Cowboys. It's a

413
00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:43,200
Speaker 2: nice star on the helmet. Jimmy Johnson used to say,

414
00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:47,040
Speaker 2: we used to this was like the like some kind

415
00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:50,520
Speaker 2: of golf club. You know, the atmosphere is like very casual.

416
00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,159
Speaker 2: You can't be casual and expect to win championship. Y'

417
00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:55,119
Speaker 2: all know this. You know what this feels like. You

418
00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:56,880
Speaker 2: know what it feels like. I mean, there's some ups

419
00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:59,680
Speaker 2: and downs in order to be a championship team. There's

420
00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:02,200
Speaker 2: going to be disruption along the way. You're not going

421
00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,720
Speaker 2: like each other all the time. There's gonna be some

422
00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:07,959
Speaker 2: some days that you're gonna have to fight through. Some

423
00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:10,160
Speaker 2: days you're gonna want to complain about how many days

424
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:12,080
Speaker 2: we've been out here in pads and we're doing this

425
00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:14,240
Speaker 2: and this, and the coaches got us doing this or not. Hey,

426
00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:16,760
Speaker 2: someone's gotta step and say shut up, let's get out

427
00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:18,960
Speaker 2: here and get this work in right, that's not the

428
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:21,920
Speaker 2: mentality here. There's one guy that you look at right now,

429
00:21:21,920 --> 00:21:24,640
Speaker 2: and it's number four. Yeah, and I look out here.

430
00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:27,760
Speaker 2: I'm office right here on the third floor, and I

431
00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:32,240
Speaker 2: watched number four whether he wins championship. So he doesn't

432
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:37,320
Speaker 2: win championships. I watch him throw to the fifteenth receiver

433
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:43,520
Speaker 2: on the team on hot days by himself out here throwing.

434
00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,000
Speaker 2: So I know he has the workout it, but i'd

435
00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:48,800
Speaker 2: love to see CD. I'd love to see some other

436
00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:51,200
Speaker 2: guys in the off season that our starters be out

437
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 2: here with him throwing instead of going back home. Like

438
00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:55,000
Speaker 2: that's the problem.

439
00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:57,320
Speaker 1: Not only that, but they're gonna bring somebody else with

440
00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,840
Speaker 1: him exactly. That's how you really get better. And I

441
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:04,400
Speaker 1: talked to New Orleans and I'll be candid. One thing

442
00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:07,919
Speaker 1: that they really struggle with is like the team doesn't

443
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:11,320
Speaker 1: watch film together when when when they're not under the coaches,

444
00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:16,359
Speaker 1: they're not together watching film to see lifestyle. Man, I

445
00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:18,639
Speaker 1: know how I see it, and they don't watch film

446
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:22,840
Speaker 1: together unless the coach is there. A lot of these

447
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,720
Speaker 1: teams are struggling with the younger players now they don't

448
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:28,840
Speaker 1: just they're not together. So you may see it one way,

449
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:30,840
Speaker 1: but how does he see it? Then how do we

450
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:31,600
Speaker 1: see it together?

451
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:32,439
Speaker 2: Exactly?

452
00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:35,800
Speaker 1: So that's how we ultimately under can't tell And that

453
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 1: is a big deal.

454
00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:40,240
Speaker 2: Football used to be a lifestyle to us, like this

455
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,280
Speaker 2: this was what you did right, So again in the

456
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:45,440
Speaker 2: off even during the season, we was to have these

457
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:47,520
Speaker 2: pizza call pizza days. Ken Norton I first came in

458
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:50,639
Speaker 2: the league. Ken Norton was the leader as defense. He

459
00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:52,960
Speaker 2: used to have what we call pizza days. That was

460
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:57,439
Speaker 2: at six o'clock on Thursdays. On Wednesdays and Thursdays, so

461
00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:01,640
Speaker 2: we would order in pizza, no coach, six o'clock. We're

462
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:05,760
Speaker 2: all as a defense, were watching film just so we

463
00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:11,760
Speaker 2: speak the same language, the entire defense from six to eight.

464
00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 2: And then you went home, like we spent more time,

465
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:16,400
Speaker 2: and I'm sure y'all did the same thing. We spent

466
00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:18,240
Speaker 2: more time with my teammates and I did with my

467
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:20,560
Speaker 2: own family, and that was a part of it. But

468
00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:22,600
Speaker 2: it was a lifestyle. It was an understanding of this

469
00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:25,679
Speaker 2: is what you do. Show. Yeah, I show up on Sunday.

470
00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 2: I don't wrap, I don't I'm not a roofer, I

471
00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:32,520
Speaker 2: ain't a doctor. I don't play the guitar on weekends.

472
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:34,639
Speaker 2: What do you do? I play football. That's my job.

473
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:37,359
Speaker 2: And I don't know if that's the mentality anymore. And

474
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:39,720
Speaker 2: I don't know if that's just the Cowboys organization. That's

475
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:42,560
Speaker 2: across it's across the league. But if you want to

476
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 2: get back to a championship mentality, it don't doesn't start

477
00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:48,320
Speaker 2: when the season starts. It starts in the off season

478
00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:52,160
Speaker 2: and breaking down things and taking a hard look at yourself. Yeah,

479
00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:53,080
Speaker 2: I agree with that.

480
00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:55,439
Speaker 4: I want to I want to ask you about the

481
00:23:55,920 --> 00:24:00,000
Speaker 4: what's your recollection of that? That to fight Dallas versus

482
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,080
Speaker 4: the forty nine Ers. I know you had got ejected.

483
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,600
Speaker 2: I got ejected, So I don't remember a few minutes earlier.

484
00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 2: Uh t O.

485
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 4: He gets the ball, runs, puts it on the star.

486
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:13,480
Speaker 1: I'm a forty nine Ers fan, so I was excited about,

487
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:16,600
Speaker 1: Oh my god, Jesus this, you.

488
00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 2: Know, this rivalry matchup. I loved it all.

489
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:21,200
Speaker 4: So you didn't watch it in the locker room or you.

490
00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:23,440
Speaker 2: Know, I got kicked out of the game. So look,

491
00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:25,240
Speaker 2: I was looking to get kicked out kind of like

492
00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 2: I was. I was looking for a fight. We were

493
00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:31,159
Speaker 2: getting our asses thumped, right, and I made a tackle

494
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:34,919
Speaker 2: and I was on the ground and no one stepped

495
00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:38,760
Speaker 2: on me. Newberry and that was it was that Newberry. Okay,

496
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 2: So he stepped on me, and I didn't know what

497
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 2: the next day it was. He kind of got pushed.

498
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:49,600
Speaker 2: He didn't matter, it didn't matter. I just saw whatever

499
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,560
Speaker 2: not today. So I'm yelling at him, trying to fight

500
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:55,679
Speaker 2: with him, and then the referee gets in the way

501
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 2: and I kind of bumped the rev. You know, I

502
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,240
Speaker 2: just went in on the rep and he I was like,

503
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:02,320
Speaker 2: you know what, I remember, you know what I said.

504
00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:06,400
Speaker 2: I remember. I remember the ref saying my name, not Woodson.

505
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:10,280
Speaker 2: He called me by my first name. The referee said, Darren,

506
00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:14,240
Speaker 2: your ass is out of here. And for some reason,

507
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,120
Speaker 2: that's I was walking up the tunnel. I said, dude

508
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:18,719
Speaker 2: said my first name because most of the time referee,

509
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:23,240
Speaker 2: so you know, heyah, you know Harper, get out of here, right? Yeah? No, no,

510
00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 2: he called me my first name. I was like, you

511
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,280
Speaker 2: a family friend and you throwing me out of the game,

512
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:29,600
Speaker 2: so you know me somehow. But anyway, so I get

513
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:31,720
Speaker 2: up and I'm in the locker room. I get in

514
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 2: the shower and back then I didn't know. No one

515
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:35,639
Speaker 2: walked me into the locker room. They walked me to

516
00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:37,720
Speaker 2: the tunnel and I walked in the locker room. I

517
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:40,159
Speaker 2: never even kicked out of a game. I didn't know

518
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 2: what to do. So I get in a shower and

519
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:46,399
Speaker 2: I'm you know, they have these monitors, but they are

520
00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:50,639
Speaker 2: the monitors were the game. It's all the sponsorship this stuff, right, not.

521
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:52,359
Speaker 2: I don't have the game. I don't have access to

522
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:54,640
Speaker 2: the game. So I'm I shower up and I'm dressed,

523
00:25:55,640 --> 00:26:00,120
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, boom, George t walks in

524
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:02,280
Speaker 2: to the locker room and Tiaga and I were the safeties, right,

525
00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:04,680
Speaker 2: So Tige walks in. I'm like, what are you doing?

526
00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:09,120
Speaker 2: He's so upset, he's so pissed, he can't even talk

527
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 2: to me. I was like horror, I called him, or Hori,

528
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 2: what happened? You worry about it? You get He's throwing

529
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 2: his stuff off. So I'm standing there, I'm waiting for

530
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,040
Speaker 2: him to get out of the shower. Ask him again

531
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 2: what happened. He's like, man, I don't want to talk

532
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 2: about it. So we both just left, like I still

533
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:30,159
Speaker 2: in the stadium. We left the stadium. We didn't know

534
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 2: what to do.

535
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 4: N't even stay after the No, we didn't know what

536
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:33,920
Speaker 4: I mean.

537
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,919
Speaker 2: We were just sitting there like we what we gonna do?

538
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:38,920
Speaker 2: We can't watch the game, we can't walk back down.

539
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:44,600
Speaker 2: We're gonna sit here. So we left went home, and

540
00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 2: that's when I saw. When I got home, I saw

541
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:51,439
Speaker 2: the replay of what happened with t O on the

542
00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 2: Star and George and the whole I saw it at

543
00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:57,600
Speaker 2: sitting on my couch and I watched the replay of it.

544
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:01,080
Speaker 2: That's how I learned about it. Beat the traffic, beat

545
00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:03,360
Speaker 2: the traffic, and got cussed out the next day. Dude,

546
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:08,439
Speaker 2: they got us the next day for leaving. But we

547
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 2: didn't know what I'm serious, man, if there was someone

548
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:16,679
Speaker 2: that was a yeah, not a trainer, not an equipment dude,

549
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 2: nobody like within you know, the organization that says, hey,

550
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,359
Speaker 2: we need to and we were so we were so bad.

551
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,200
Speaker 2: We were just so bad. It was just we needed

552
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:29,760
Speaker 2: to leave that place. Yeah. So you know, first of all,

553
00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:30,359
Speaker 2: I love this story.

554
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:32,159
Speaker 1: I mean, t O was creative too, because he did

555
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,360
Speaker 1: a big Star and they said you cannot go out there, so.

556
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:36,560
Speaker 2: Then he went on a little star. It was just

557
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 2: it was like a little brother. The next day, they

558
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:42,520
Speaker 2: asked me, you know you got kicked out earlier. You know,

559
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,359
Speaker 2: what would you have done? I was like, dude, look,

560
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,720
Speaker 2: I appreciate what George did, but you want to stop

561
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 2: you know, you don't want him doing that. What he's

562
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 2: gonna do, you know, then stop him? Yeah all right,

563
00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:56,679
Speaker 2: we didn't have the personnel to stop him, so it

564
00:27:56,840 --> 00:28:00,480
Speaker 2: is what it is. Yeah, sucks, and then we bring

565
00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:04,199
Speaker 2: him in years later. You know, I can't beat them,

566
00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:04,640
Speaker 2: join them.

567
00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:08,159
Speaker 1: So you you've talked about some really good times. And

568
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:10,960
Speaker 1: I want you to draw this picture for me because

569
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 1: I have no idea what it is. But when I

570
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:16,399
Speaker 1: say a word, you tell me and I'll probably be

571
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:19,639
Speaker 1: able to pick think a little bit just by the

572
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 1: facial expression.

573
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:27,800
Speaker 2: But humperdinks, we got we got black that out, they

574
00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 2: got dark, they got dark. Those are some single moments.

575
00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:37,280
Speaker 1: So this is my experience as well. So my first

576
00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 1: seven minute.

577
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 3: You know abouts because we do our research, our research here.

578
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:45,760
Speaker 2: We are professional.

579
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 4: We haven't nobody to the Internet.

580
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 3: We are professor Google machine Hot.

581
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 2: He's on the hot season.

582
00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 1: My first six or seven years in the league, I

583
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 1: was single as well, and so we won the Super

584
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:03,800
Speaker 1: Bowl and I was a single male.

585
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 2: I had just my homeboys with me in Miami.

586
00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:08,000
Speaker 1: I went to high school with after you win the

587
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 1: super Bowl, so you know what like when you when

588
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 1: you got your boys, And this is what your experience

589
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 1: was early on in your Dallas career. You were it

590
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 1: was a whole bunch of guys that were all single.

591
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 1: Nobody was more single than than married.

592
00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:24,160
Speaker 2: Got absolutely total different dynastics, a different lot. And that

593
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:27,720
Speaker 2: was the after right after a game, you got showered up.

594
00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 2: You normally didn't even go home most of the time.

595
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 2: You know, you didn't even go You want directly to Humperdinks.

596
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:37,640
Speaker 2: Nobody's paying for drinks. This is no, no, no, this

597
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 2: is and this is just the first stop. Right, Yes,

598
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 2: that was called the landing spot for us. Right, so

599
00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:50,680
Speaker 2: everybody humperd Inks and then from Humperdinks. Then we went

600
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 2: and we went as like the entire team, entire team

601
00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 2: went to the next spot to paint.

602
00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 4: You want to go to Humperdinks tonight, dude.

603
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:00,840
Speaker 2: You know, everybody here's you want to do. Everybody here's

604
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 2: I'm down.

605
00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 1: Everybody, here's about the quote unquote white House, but nobody

606
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 1: about the humper Dicks.

607
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 2: About the humper Dicks was the real Yeah, it was.

608
00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 2: It was a landing spot after the games. Win like

609
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 2: win games, lost games. Now show your face. That's not happening.

610
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:20,560
Speaker 2: Jimmy finds out your humper Dings after a win, after

611
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:24,760
Speaker 2: a loss, Oh hell will break loose? Okay, I like.

612
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 4: It, So I want to I want to get into it.

613
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 4: I want to get into the second act.

614
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 2: Right.

615
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 4: So you retire in two thousand and four, you start

616
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:33,800
Speaker 4: working at ESPN in two thousand and five. What did

617
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 4: you do in between? Did you just sit at home

618
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 4: and just chilled? You get in some golf.

619
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 2: No. You know what's crazy is that I ended up.

620
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:46,760
Speaker 2: So when I retired, I had like about two or

621
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 2: three weeks and I actually was doing I did this

622
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 2: little roundabout the to NBC, CBS to ESPN. Knew I

623
00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,600
Speaker 2: was going to do some type of TV, but for

624
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 2: that first year, and I was coming off an injury.

625
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 2: I was coming off of major back injury. I had

626
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:06,480
Speaker 2: nerve damage. I could barely walk. So I was still

627
00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:10,280
Speaker 2: trying to rehab that process of trying to you know,

628
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:14,560
Speaker 2: trying to get my quality of life back, and that

629
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 2: took me about four or five months, and then I

630
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 2: went right on into ESPN. It wasn't that. It wasn't

631
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 2: as long as you think it was. It was a

632
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,240
Speaker 2: lot shorter. I was on the set of ESPN still

633
00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 2: dealing with a major back issue. That's why you're a

634
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 2: little bit shorter now. That's why.

635
00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, I know you walked in with me.

636
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 2: Between. That's what that is.

637
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 1: That's funny, that's funny. I do want to ask a

638
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 1: personal thing after your career. You know, you have been

639
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:48,440
Speaker 1: a Hall of Fame finalist the last three years and

640
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 1: you've not been able to get in. Now I give you,

641
00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 1: will give you flowers because you are an Arizona State

642
00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 1: Sports Hall of Famer. Yeah, you are the State of

643
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,280
Speaker 1: Arizona Athletic Hall of Fame as well. So you're in

644
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: a couple the main one I know you're shooting for, like,

645
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:04,400
Speaker 1: how does it.

646
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 2: Feel the emotion? Still going through it?

647
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 1: And also, I don't know if you know this, but

648
00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:10,600
Speaker 1: once you get in, which I assume you will, at

649
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,160
Speaker 1: some point, you'll be the only.

650
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 2: Person in your whole draft class absolutely, which is crazy, crazy.

651
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 2: I've been that long and nobody else.

652
00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,200
Speaker 4: Give me some of the people in your draft class first,

653
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 4: so it'll give people a little bit of context.

654
00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 2: You wouldn't even know most of it. So my guys

655
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:33,600
Speaker 2: that I played with is Kevin Smith, Robert Jones. Remember

656
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:38,360
Speaker 2: Jimmy Smith, the wide receiver. Jimmy was drafted two picks

657
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 2: before me the Cowboys by us, right, I didn't, So

658
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 2: we have four in the first two rounds because you

659
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 2: were part of the Herschel, the Herschel washing Walker trade. Yeah,

660
00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 2: my draft pick. I think me and Jimmy were part

661
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 2: of that that those picks. Steve Eman, I think was

662
00:32:56,800 --> 00:32:59,920
Speaker 2: the first guy that went that year, Big Defens Linement

663
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:02,520
Speaker 2: out of University of Washington. And then after that, man,

664
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 2: it kind of Dale Carter Corner, Corny Dale was a player,

665
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 2: true player. But after that, man, it gets kind of dark.

666
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 2: Like if you asked me it's ten years ago, I

667
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:17,160
Speaker 2: probably remember the names. And this is the thing. Who's

668
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 2: doing the who's research? Where's research out here? Man? This

669
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 2: is this is a good question.

670
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 4: Shout out to Thomas producer, he'd be doing this thing

671
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:30,800
Speaker 4: because I didn't know up until like a year ago.

672
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:35,200
Speaker 2: I had one of the Hall of Fame voters out

673
00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:40,280
Speaker 2: of Minnesota says something to me about that draft class.

674
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:41,960
Speaker 2: He said, you would be the only one, and I

675
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 2: it took me back to say, no, there's no way

676
00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:49,120
Speaker 2: that ever, so he sent me the list of all

677
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 2: the players and I thought, damn, isn't that that would

678
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:55,680
Speaker 2: be amazing to go in. But you know why I

679
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:56,960
Speaker 2: want to go in, man, this is one of the

680
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:58,560
Speaker 2: reasons why I want to go into the Hall of Fame.

681
00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:01,680
Speaker 2: It's because in ninety two, ninety three, ninety four, and

682
00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 2: you keep going down for like four or five years,

683
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 2: We were the number one defense in the NFL. We

684
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:10,000
Speaker 2: didn't give up points like it was it was hell

685
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 2: to pay. We had a really good defense. And I

686
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:17,160
Speaker 2: played with guys and outside of Charles Haley, who came

687
00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:20,720
Speaker 2: in from the San Francisco forty nine ers, right, Dion

688
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:24,319
Speaker 2: Sanders went from Atlanta to San France and then came here.

689
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 2: Those are the two guys that are in the Hall

690
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 2: of Fame. There's no one that's been ingrained, drafted by

691
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 2: this organization, and most of the players on that defense

692
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 2: were drafted by Jimmy. I would be the only one.

693
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 2: And I want to represent them. Dudes that came in,

694
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:45,840
Speaker 2: I mean the Russell Maryland's, the Tony Toberts, who people

695
00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 2: just forget about, Like those are my teammates, the Ken

696
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 2: Norton juniors. You know, there's so many guys, Kevin Spicer,

697
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:56,359
Speaker 2: so many guys that I played with that were so

698
00:34:56,880 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 2: damn good. Yeah that when I get up there, do

699
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,759
Speaker 2: I want to recognize them? Yeah? I mean we had

700
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:05,320
Speaker 2: nine turn We forced nine turnovers in the first Super Bowl.

701
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 2: The first Super Bowl. I didn't know that. Yeah, nine turns.

702
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:13,279
Speaker 2: The game was fifty something, Yeah, seventeen. It was blowout. Yeah,

703
00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:16,319
Speaker 2: yeah it was. It got ugly and we we you know,

704
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 2: our defense scored twice in the in the second Super Bowl,

705
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 2: the third Super Bowl, Larry Browns had the two. He

706
00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 2: was the super Bowl MVP. True, like we had we

707
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 2: never got. We got recognized as the Triplets, Troy Mike,

708
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,000
Speaker 2: and that's how they knew the organization. Man. But damn dude,

709
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 2: I ran down on special teams for a lot of games.

710
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,759
Speaker 2: I have more reps than anyone from ninety two to

711
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:40,400
Speaker 2: two thousand and four. That is not a person standing

712
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:41,719
Speaker 2: that has more reps than I am.

713
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 4: You were a core player on that team. Now, I mean,

714
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:45,960
Speaker 4: I know we we talk about the Triplets, but you're

715
00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:48,840
Speaker 4: your quadruple quadrules? Is that what it is before?

716
00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:52,279
Speaker 2: Yeah? You you mean I'm about don't do all that count?

717
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:56,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, baby's born at one time. That's what it means.

718
00:35:58,080 --> 00:35:58,799
Speaker 2: You were.

719
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 4: You were the quad like this that's safe to say,

720
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:04,360
Speaker 4: Like it's you. You were a huge part of the

721
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,920
Speaker 4: success with this organization. I just think it's easy to

722
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 4: sell tickets and put people in the seats when your offense.

723
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:12,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I always say that.

724
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 4: Defense wins championships as good as selling tickets.

725
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:19,400
Speaker 1: Exactly, and so you know you did go into the

726
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:22,719
Speaker 1: Ring of Honor here with the cowboys. And I want

727
00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 1: to know what comes to mind when you hear somebody

728
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 1: like Jerry Jones say such great spiritual words about you.

729
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 4: As unselfish, reliable, dependable, a team player first and a

730
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 4: team leader. He's a living, breathing example of what it

731
00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:42,240
Speaker 4: is to have great character and to be a Dallas Cowboy.

732
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:45,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. I you know when he said I remember him

733
00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 2: saying that. I thought, my mom, that's crazy. I mean,

734
00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 2: it's crazy how that seems like I didn't reflect it

735
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 2: and think, Okay, yeah he's talking about me. I'm talking

736
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:54,520
Speaker 2: he's talking about my mama. Dude. I mama raised four

737
00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:59,400
Speaker 2: kids by herself, project kids, all of went to high school, graduated,

738
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 2: Me and my sister to graduate from college. Like it

739
00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 2: just she worked two jobs five am it was her

740
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 2: first job, got off at four thirty and went to

741
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:09,719
Speaker 2: her second job and got home at eleven o'clock. Like

742
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 2: that's that's character. Like I watched this woman just sacrifice

743
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,960
Speaker 2: for us. So I am you know when he's talking

744
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:23,360
Speaker 2: about that, that's that generation down watch my mom and

745
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:26,719
Speaker 2: then my grandmama and all them. But Uh, it's a

746
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 2: reflection of you know, what I've always strived for was

747
00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:33,319
Speaker 2: to be someone who represented the right way. And it's

748
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:34,640
Speaker 2: the same thing I want to do with my kids.

749
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:36,919
Speaker 2: I want to pour that into my children the same way.

750
00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:39,799
Speaker 2: And how many kids do you have to have? Four? Okay, yeah,

751
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:43,000
Speaker 2: that's the number. That's a great answer for everybody.

752
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, we all got that's just enough to like

753
00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 4: me and get four. Tried to he always trying to

754
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 4: be like me. He wors top button, just like one.

755
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:55,160
Speaker 4: You know what I'm saying. Thomas over he do the

756
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:55,640
Speaker 4: same thing.

757
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I see everybody representing.

758
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, I'm kind of a big try to

759
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:03,279
Speaker 4: like me. But no what that what that being said?

760
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 2: Though?

761
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:05,400
Speaker 4: With your mom, I want to ask this question, and

762
00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 4: I think I know one of the people Mount Rushmore,

763
00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:14,240
Speaker 4: who would be on your personal Mount Rushmore? Of people

764
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,839
Speaker 4: of influence from the time you were born till today?

765
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:21,719
Speaker 4: Who would you put four people on your personal.

766
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 2: Week Mount rush My Lord like hes gonna be. He's

767
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:27,800
Speaker 2: got his own mountains, so I can't put him on that. Okay, Okay,

768
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:33,759
Speaker 2: so Mount Rushmore, I would say. My mother wants She

769
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 2: was my she was my role model, my sister Monica

770
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:43,879
Speaker 2: basically raised me. She was you know, I put all

771
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,239
Speaker 2: my my brother, my siblings, my brother Todd, he was

772
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 2: a thug though he used to kick my ass off,

773
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:50,640
Speaker 2: I ain't putting his ass up there, so he can't

774
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,040
Speaker 2: forget that. So I was the youngest. Yeah, I was

775
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:56,760
Speaker 2: the youngest of four sou but my sister Monica played

776
00:38:57,080 --> 00:38:59,000
Speaker 2: a major role in my life, so I got to

777
00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 2: put her up there. Muhammad Ali, Man, I remember being

778
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:04,800
Speaker 2: a kid, and y'all are way too young for this,

779
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:08,360
Speaker 2: but I remember being a kid and watching a black

780
00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:15,839
Speaker 2: man talk sideways to folks. And you know where I

781
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:19,439
Speaker 2: grew up. You the cops, the white police come in you.

782
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 2: You didn't just talk sideways to people. Man, you you know,

783
00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 2: you kind of had this mentality if you try to

784
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:28,680
Speaker 2: avoid the confrontation from being when they come under that,

785
00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:32,280
Speaker 2: when they that band walk comes through the the neighborhood,

786
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:34,640
Speaker 2: your ass fleas right, you straighten up. You try to

787
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,640
Speaker 2: get it, you know. And to watch Muhammad Ali with

788
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:41,440
Speaker 2: the confidence that he had, the swagger that he had,

789
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:47,520
Speaker 2: and the way he communicated, he just was he was

790
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:50,880
Speaker 2: bigger than big. Like everybody talks about Michael Jordan, a

791
00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:53,319
Speaker 2: lot of the kids watching for myself, even cludo. We

792
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 2: talk about Michael Jordan, love Jordan, but as someone who

793
00:39:58,560 --> 00:40:02,920
Speaker 2: played a who box or play the sport that really

794
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 2: transitioned not just the sport but outside the sport, like

795
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 2: he was just he was phenomenal man, just phenomenal. And

796
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:20,839
Speaker 2: then the last one, that's a horrid woman I got.

797
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,760
Speaker 2: I got a dude that that has been with me forever.

798
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:28,480
Speaker 2: His name is George Bass. He's my agent. And there's

799
00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:31,439
Speaker 2: a reason why I own two businesses in his life,

800
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 2: Like I came into the NFL not having any financial background,

801
00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 2: not having any pursuit of wanting to do own a business.

802
00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 2: That was never my mindset. And I was in my

803
00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 2: first my third year in the league, and my agent,

804
00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:52,520
Speaker 2: his job was he represented you know a number of athletes,

805
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,759
Speaker 2: about six or seven athletes, but his day job was

806
00:40:55,760 --> 00:41:02,319
Speaker 2: he's a CFO for a retail development company. And I

807
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:04,279
Speaker 2: used to see him. He used to talk to me

808
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 2: all the time about real estate, and I would spend

809
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 2: time with him, and so when I i'd watch him

810
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:12,880
Speaker 2: and I try to get into some of their investment

811
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 2: deals and he said, no, no, you can't get in

812
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 2: until you learn the business. You cannot invest until you

813
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:21,279
Speaker 2: get learned the business. So I had to take He

814
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:24,520
Speaker 2: made me take down an office space in his office complex,

815
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:27,560
Speaker 2: and in the off season in ninety six, I think

816
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:29,880
Speaker 2: it was ninety five ninety six, in the off season,

817
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 2: I would have to go in there. After I worked out,

818
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 2: I would go in there and I would learn the business.

819
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:39,240
Speaker 2: And it's the reason why I'm sitting right here today.

820
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 2: And I can tell you I think I probably had

821
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:45,000
Speaker 2: more success off the field than I've had on the field,

822
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:48,719
Speaker 2: and it's because of George Paths. So he just pour

823
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:50,680
Speaker 2: it into me. Man, he would be my he would

824
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:54,840
Speaker 2: be that other Mount rushmore God. That really I like that? Yeah,

825
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:55,440
Speaker 2: I like that.

826
00:41:55,719 --> 00:41:57,480
Speaker 4: I got I got one more question for you.

827
00:41:57,560 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 2: Oh please, I'm gonna fire away too.

828
00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:03,520
Speaker 4: Sin committed complaint, compelled?

829
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:06,680
Speaker 2: Yeah upon that.

830
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:09,360
Speaker 4: You live your life by these four seeds.

831
00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:11,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, I live my life by my core values. My

832
00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 2: core values are God and God represents wisdom and knowledge.

833
00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:18,440
Speaker 2: So God is one and I usually just look at

834
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:21,560
Speaker 2: her as God is that one, and then my family,

835
00:42:22,719 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 2: my health, and it's just morals. Morally, where do I

836
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:30,719
Speaker 2: want to fall in any situation? So I'm not going

837
00:42:30,800 --> 00:42:32,960
Speaker 2: to get into a real estate a business deal without

838
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:36,440
Speaker 2: it falling within my core values. If it's something that

839
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:41,000
Speaker 2: doesn't fall in my core value, if it's relationships, friends, family,

840
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:45,040
Speaker 2: I measure it all in in that little bucket. If

841
00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 2: they don't fall in, they're out. And I'm big, guys,

842
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 2: I'm big on shedding people like in life, like God is.

843
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:56,640
Speaker 2: I mean, certain people aren't yoked for you, right, So

844
00:42:56,880 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 2: I don't have a problem with shedding folks that don't meet,

845
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:03,319
Speaker 2: that don't fall within my core values. It's just plain

846
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:06,880
Speaker 2: and simple, and that comes from that's from close, close family.

847
00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:12,719
Speaker 2: If they're not in, then they're not in. I like that.

848
00:43:13,560 --> 00:43:14,720
Speaker 2: You can't ask more questions.

849
00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:17,440
Speaker 4: We gotta wrap all right fast.

850
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,520
Speaker 2: I know, I know, I appreciate you. That was way

851
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:23,600
Speaker 2: too fast. I agree, I agree. We just sat there.

852
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 2: We're gonna come back.

853
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 4: Not only well, we're gonna have to edit this, but

854
00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:29,480
Speaker 4: here right now?

855
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:32,600
Speaker 2: Is it the corner? Is that? Is that why I'm

856
00:43:32,600 --> 00:43:36,239
Speaker 2: getting kicked out? Is that what it is? Don't is

857
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,839
Speaker 2: that what it is? Okay, you see what I'm saying

858
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:42,120
Speaker 2: a triplet? Tell tell him and I said, kiss my ass.

859
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:47,319
Speaker 4: He's probably gonna you gonna see him as he as

860
00:43:47,320 --> 00:43:49,400
Speaker 4: he as he walks in. I'm just Hey, I'm just

861
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 4: I'm just a messenger.

862
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:53,759
Speaker 2: Don't shoot the messenger. Yeah, no, we should totally shoot

863
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:55,279
Speaker 2: the messenger, Darren Man.

864
00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:58,760
Speaker 1: Bottom line is, bro I hopefully we get to continue

865
00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:02,120
Speaker 1: to do this conversation more more. You are being a

866
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:05,080
Speaker 1: hell of a successful person on and off the field.

867
00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:06,280
Speaker 2: Your story is amazing.

868
00:44:06,680 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 1: You are my new goal guy, because you know, you

869
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:11,960
Speaker 1: did the TV thing, then you went on to be

870
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:12,960
Speaker 1: your own entrepreneur.

871
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:14,480
Speaker 2: You tech guys.

872
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 1: You got in early with the right people, being a

873
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:21,200
Speaker 1: good avid listener and learning. You never stopped learning, and

874
00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:23,920
Speaker 1: that's been a success story that you will continue to

875
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:26,319
Speaker 1: build upon because of who you are. And so I'm

876
00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:28,399
Speaker 1: just really really proud to actually sit down and share

877
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 1: this time with you, allowing you to pour into us

878
00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:33,759
Speaker 1: because me and Peanut really enjoy these things. Yes, and

879
00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:36,480
Speaker 1: I'm still learning as well, and so it's just been

880
00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:38,840
Speaker 1: really really awesome to sit down and have this and

881
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:40,560
Speaker 1: also get some really good stories out.

882
00:44:40,840 --> 00:44:42,480
Speaker 2: I appreciate you, Thank you.

883
00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:45,359
Speaker 1: Our viewers are going to love this, so we're really

884
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:47,759
Speaker 1: gonna be appreciated, man to all of our viewers out

885
00:44:47,800 --> 00:44:49,960
Speaker 1: there and listeners Wherever you pick up your podcast, whether

886
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:52,880
Speaker 1: it's iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, make sure you give us a

887
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:56,040
Speaker 1: five star rating, leave a review, leave a couple of comments,

888
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:59,279
Speaker 1: click that share button and a follow. Tell a friend

889
00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:00,919
Speaker 1: to tell a friend to do what Peanut.

890
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 2: Tell a friend? Yeah, check us out, check us out man.

891
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:06,439
Speaker 1: And also on the NFL's new YouTube channel, Well it's

892
00:45:06,440 --> 00:45:09,080
Speaker 1: not that new anymore, but the NFL pages YouTube channel.

893
00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 2: Check us out.

894
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:14,239
Speaker 4: I'm Peanut. That's wrong, that's their ay. And this is

895
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:34,839
Speaker 4: the NFL Player's second Next podcast