1 00:00:15,276 --> 00:00:23,076 Speaker 1: Pushkin. A little content warning. We get into some pretty 2 00:00:23,076 --> 00:00:26,676 Speaker 1: big emotions and tears in this episode, plus some possibly 3 00:00:26,756 --> 00:00:30,716 Speaker 1: upsetting descriptions of psychiatry of your so keep that in 4 00:00:30,716 --> 00:00:39,516 Speaker 1: mind when listening. Okay onwards. When we left off with 5 00:00:39,556 --> 00:00:43,236 Speaker 1: episode three, I had just opened my diagnosis from doctor Nadlie. 6 00:00:43,716 --> 00:01:00,156 Speaker 1: You might remember it wants something like this. Obviously, I 7 00:01:00,196 --> 00:01:03,276 Speaker 1: didn't know what to make of the diagnosis, mostly because 8 00:01:03,356 --> 00:01:05,796 Speaker 1: I couldn't read it through my giant rain dropped tears. 9 00:01:06,396 --> 00:01:09,676 Speaker 1: But after I finished sobbing into my dog's I was 10 00:01:09,716 --> 00:01:14,356 Speaker 1: able to see what the assessment actually said. Diagnosis autism 11 00:01:14,556 --> 00:01:20,036 Speaker 1: spectrum disorder. Okay, so I'm autistic, got it? But then 12 00:01:20,396 --> 00:01:25,676 Speaker 1: I kept reading persistent deficits in social communication and social 13 00:01:25,716 --> 00:01:33,796 Speaker 1: interaction across multiple contexts Level one restricted repetitive patterns of behavior, interests, 14 00:01:33,956 --> 00:01:39,556 Speaker 1: or activities Level one. Lauren fulfills the DSM five criteria 15 00:01:39,596 --> 00:01:44,596 Speaker 1: for a diagnosis of autism. Her psychometrics show distinct correlations 16 00:01:44,636 --> 00:01:49,996 Speaker 1: with autism. Wow, that's a lot of confusing words. What 17 00:01:50,156 --> 00:01:54,636 Speaker 1: did any of them mean? And furthermore, who decided that 18 00:01:54,676 --> 00:01:58,916 Speaker 1: this is what autism is? Apparently the DSM five people, 19 00:01:59,156 --> 00:02:04,676 Speaker 1: that's who I'm a fact finder. By nature, information helps 20 00:02:04,716 --> 00:02:07,156 Speaker 1: bring order to my world and gives me a sense 21 00:02:07,196 --> 00:02:11,276 Speaker 1: of control. And so to manage the bigness of this 22 00:02:11,356 --> 00:02:14,636 Speaker 1: diagnosis and all it entailed, I was going to have 23 00:02:14,676 --> 00:02:18,956 Speaker 1: to go into reporter mode and find some facts. And man, 24 00:02:19,356 --> 00:02:23,556 Speaker 1: there were a lot of facts. There's the clinical knowledge 25 00:02:23,556 --> 00:02:26,316 Speaker 1: of the autism spectrum and the history of the condition, 26 00:02:26,876 --> 00:02:31,276 Speaker 1: plus the almost infinite ways the diagnosis can present itself, 27 00:02:31,556 --> 00:02:34,716 Speaker 1: as well as all the different interpretations of autism in 28 00:02:34,716 --> 00:02:38,156 Speaker 1: the media. Initially, I figured I could run all that 29 00:02:38,236 --> 00:02:40,956 Speaker 1: through the filter of my own experience and out the 30 00:02:40,996 --> 00:02:43,636 Speaker 1: other side would pop a whole new concept of who 31 00:02:43,636 --> 00:02:47,316 Speaker 1: I was. So I started making a list. I was 32 00:02:47,356 --> 00:02:50,836 Speaker 1: going to go through all the literature and movies, documentaries 33 00:02:50,836 --> 00:02:55,156 Speaker 1: and TV shows, etc. Where autism is even mentioned. My 34 00:02:55,276 --> 00:03:02,116 Speaker 1: info tank would be filled up. But first the DSM, 35 00:03:02,276 --> 00:03:07,396 Speaker 1: or the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. Doctor 36 00:03:07,476 --> 00:03:11,356 Speaker 1: Nadley's diagnosis follow the standards set forth for autism in 37 00:03:11,396 --> 00:03:14,476 Speaker 1: the DSM five, but I wanted to go back to 38 00:03:14,516 --> 00:03:19,716 Speaker 1: the source, the og manual, the DSM one. The whole 39 00:03:19,756 --> 00:03:23,236 Speaker 1: process of doing the diagnostics and waiting for the results 40 00:03:23,236 --> 00:03:25,516 Speaker 1: and trying to unpack them was like going through the 41 00:03:25,556 --> 00:03:29,436 Speaker 1: emotional spin cycle. I was wrung out. But if I 42 00:03:29,476 --> 00:03:32,596 Speaker 1: was going to attempt to understand this diagnosis, it was 43 00:03:32,636 --> 00:03:35,796 Speaker 1: important for me to know who set the standard, who 44 00:03:35,876 --> 00:03:39,916 Speaker 1: determined the clinical definition of autism, and why should I 45 00:03:39,916 --> 00:03:44,836 Speaker 1: listen to them. Historically, our collective understanding of the brain 46 00:03:44,956 --> 00:03:48,436 Speaker 1: and its inner workings has been dodgy at best. It 47 00:03:48,476 --> 00:03:52,516 Speaker 1: hasn't exactly been sophisticated or accurate, or based on anything 48 00:03:52,596 --> 00:03:57,796 Speaker 1: other than the observations of some mustache twirling alienists, as 49 00:03:57,836 --> 00:04:01,876 Speaker 1: evidenced in this nineteen fifties educational film from the Ohio 50 00:04:01,996 --> 00:04:07,556 Speaker 1: Department of Public Welfare. Because of mental illness, the brain's 51 00:04:07,676 --> 00:04:10,996 Speaker 1: ability and energy of American in twenty will be lost. 52 00:04:12,036 --> 00:04:15,676 Speaker 1: Metal illness will take a toll of talents and beauty, No, 53 00:04:15,996 --> 00:04:21,076 Speaker 1: not beauty, anything but that because people hate and sorrow 54 00:04:21,396 --> 00:04:25,156 Speaker 1: and fear. One in every twenty will go to another city, 55 00:04:25,636 --> 00:04:31,756 Speaker 1: a city a state hospital ornamentally ill, where psychiatric patients 56 00:04:31,836 --> 00:04:36,396 Speaker 1: were locked away in brutal gulags, diagnosed with very unscientific 57 00:04:36,476 --> 00:04:42,956 Speaker 1: conditions melancholia, hysteria, mania of all kinds, most of which 58 00:04:42,956 --> 00:04:46,236 Speaker 1: were probably treated with leeches or bloodletting or some other 59 00:04:46,316 --> 00:04:50,836 Speaker 1: horrifying Victorian restorative. So when the DSM first landed on 60 00:04:50,916 --> 00:04:54,556 Speaker 1: doctor's desks in nineteen fifty two, it represented a sea 61 00:04:54,676 --> 00:04:59,276 Speaker 1: change in our understanding of psychiatric and neurological conditions, at 62 00:04:59,356 --> 00:05:03,396 Speaker 1: least on paper. It's standardized conditions and their symptoms, and 63 00:05:03,556 --> 00:05:07,876 Speaker 1: it professionalized diagnoses, which is not to say that people 64 00:05:08,036 --> 00:05:12,236 Speaker 1: given these diagnosed sees were treated better, because they weren't. 65 00:05:12,276 --> 00:05:15,876 Speaker 1: The very first DSM was a slim, leather bound volume, 66 00:05:16,076 --> 00:05:20,476 Speaker 1: just one hundred thirty two pages. It described conditions ranging 67 00:05:20,556 --> 00:05:27,276 Speaker 1: from chronic brain syndrome associated with mongolism, to inadequate personality 68 00:05:27,316 --> 00:05:35,076 Speaker 1: disorder to sexual deviation, including but not limited to fetishism, transvestism, 69 00:05:35,116 --> 00:05:39,556 Speaker 1: and homosexuality. But don't worry, there were PSAs for that. 70 00:05:40,916 --> 00:05:43,716 Speaker 1: What Jimmy didn't know was that Ralph was sick. The 71 00:05:43,876 --> 00:05:47,556 Speaker 1: sickness that was not visible like smallpox, but no less 72 00:05:47,636 --> 00:05:52,236 Speaker 1: dangerous and contagious, a sickness of the mind. You see, 73 00:05:52,476 --> 00:05:59,036 Speaker 1: Ralph was a homosexual. No, not Ralph anyway, the DSM 74 00:05:59,116 --> 00:06:03,116 Speaker 1: became like a bible for conditions of the brain. But curiously, 75 00:06:03,436 --> 00:06:07,236 Speaker 1: that bible only made two brief mentions of autism and 76 00:06:07,436 --> 00:06:11,356 Speaker 1: didn't bother to explain it. It took nearly thirty years 77 00:06:11,436 --> 00:06:14,476 Speaker 1: since the very first DSM for autism to get its 78 00:06:14,476 --> 00:06:17,716 Speaker 1: own entry in the manual, and even then it only 79 00:06:17,756 --> 00:06:23,796 Speaker 1: addressed infantile autism, which we heard about in the previous episode. Finally, 80 00:06:23,916 --> 00:06:27,276 Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty seven, the DSM got wise. The big 81 00:06:27,356 --> 00:06:31,516 Speaker 1: ups at the American Psychiatric Association decided that both kids 82 00:06:31,676 --> 00:06:36,636 Speaker 1: and adults could be autistic fun so the organization coined 83 00:06:36,676 --> 00:06:41,636 Speaker 1: a new diagnosis, autistic disorder. Then in nineteen ninety four, 84 00:06:41,876 --> 00:06:46,676 Speaker 1: the APA added four subcategories to autistic disorder. One of 85 00:06:46,676 --> 00:06:50,236 Speaker 1: those was Asperger syndrome, which was viewed at the time 86 00:06:50,356 --> 00:06:54,236 Speaker 1: like high functioning autism, an imprecise term that we don't 87 00:06:54,236 --> 00:06:57,396 Speaker 1: really use anymore because what does it really mean to 88 00:06:57,476 --> 00:07:03,036 Speaker 1: function and who's actually defining it. But then in twenty thirteen, 89 00:07:03,036 --> 00:07:06,396 Speaker 1: the DSM was revised again. Now we're at the fifth 90 00:07:06,396 --> 00:07:09,516 Speaker 1: and most recent iteration with a couple of edits since, 91 00:07:10,156 --> 00:07:14,596 Speaker 1: and in this version there is no Aspergers, no infantile autism, 92 00:07:14,636 --> 00:07:19,636 Speaker 1: no childhood schizophrenia whatever that was. There is only autism 93 00:07:19,796 --> 00:07:25,596 Speaker 1: spectrum disorder, or ASD. Our understanding of autism has always 94 00:07:25,636 --> 00:07:30,036 Speaker 1: been pretty fuzzy because the definition of autism has itself 95 00:07:30,116 --> 00:07:34,116 Speaker 1: always been pretty fuzzy. Take this explanation from the nineteen 96 00:07:34,156 --> 00:07:39,036 Speaker 1: forties by psychiatrist Leo Connor, one of the earliest autism doctors. 97 00:07:39,796 --> 00:07:46,036 Speaker 1: We have two specific symptoms that always have to be 98 00:07:46,196 --> 00:07:50,916 Speaker 1: present in order to justify the diagnosis. They are extreme 99 00:07:50,996 --> 00:07:54,956 Speaker 1: aloneness from practically the beginning of life, and what I 100 00:07:55,116 --> 00:07:59,196 Speaker 1: call a desire for the preservation of sameness, which is 101 00:07:59,236 --> 00:08:02,436 Speaker 1: not at all the criteria that's used to diagnose autism. Now, 102 00:08:03,396 --> 00:08:06,316 Speaker 1: in the history of the word autism, there has never 103 00:08:06,436 --> 00:08:09,876 Speaker 1: been a fixed definition. It's always been a moving target. 104 00:08:10,596 --> 00:08:14,076 Speaker 1: And that kind of sucks because when I originally started 105 00:08:14,116 --> 00:08:18,796 Speaker 1: this journey, I thought a diagnosis, one beautiful word, would 106 00:08:18,836 --> 00:08:22,836 Speaker 1: explain things, simplify them, tell me why it was so weird, 107 00:08:23,356 --> 00:08:26,676 Speaker 1: maybe even help fix things for me. But after I 108 00:08:26,916 --> 00:08:31,596 Speaker 1: got the diagnosis and started learning more and more about autism, 109 00:08:31,636 --> 00:08:36,116 Speaker 1: I realized it could never be that simple. Autism and 110 00:08:36,316 --> 00:08:41,676 Speaker 1: all its many tendrils defy clear understanding. With this diagnosis, 111 00:08:42,196 --> 00:08:46,916 Speaker 1: this word, I was descending into some pretty cloudy territory. 112 00:08:51,036 --> 00:08:53,676 Speaker 1: You're listening to the loudest girl in the world, who 113 00:08:53,796 --> 00:08:55,876 Speaker 1: is not the lady behind you in line at the 114 00:08:55,876 --> 00:09:01,236 Speaker 1: grocery checkout. It's me, Lauren Ober, The Loudest Girl in 115 00:09:01,236 --> 00:09:04,116 Speaker 1: the World is a show about finding yourself broken in 116 00:09:04,156 --> 00:09:07,396 Speaker 1: a pretty dark place and emerging from that place a 117 00:09:07,596 --> 00:09:17,836 Speaker 1: mostly glued back together our person. So with my diagnosis, 118 00:09:18,116 --> 00:09:21,356 Speaker 1: I had a word, well, I guess more like three 119 00:09:21,836 --> 00:09:26,716 Speaker 1: autism spectrum disorder, and those three words were embedded in 120 00:09:26,756 --> 00:09:30,356 Speaker 1: a whole paragraph that gave name to who and what 121 00:09:30,516 --> 00:09:35,556 Speaker 1: I was in very clinical terms like level one, which 122 00:09:35,636 --> 00:09:41,156 Speaker 1: just means subtle autism that requires minimal support. But stowed 123 00:09:41,196 --> 00:09:45,436 Speaker 1: away inside of doctor Natalie's one paragraph diagnosis was a 124 00:09:45,516 --> 00:09:50,956 Speaker 1: crazy quilt of feelings, mostly bad sadness for little Lauren, 125 00:09:51,196 --> 00:09:53,876 Speaker 1: who might have had an easier time of things if 126 00:09:53,956 --> 00:09:59,396 Speaker 1: only anger at being forever misunderstood, relief that a question 127 00:09:59,436 --> 00:10:03,156 Speaker 1: I had about myself had finally been answered, but also 128 00:10:03,196 --> 00:10:07,036 Speaker 1: a sneaking sense that I was perpetrating some ornate fraud, 129 00:10:07,556 --> 00:10:10,916 Speaker 1: that doctor Natalie got it all wrong, that I wasn't 130 00:10:10,996 --> 00:10:17,516 Speaker 1: actually autistic. Now I had a word. Instead of obnoxious, rude, 131 00:10:17,676 --> 00:10:21,556 Speaker 1: or loud, the word was now autistic. But what did 132 00:10:21,556 --> 00:10:25,116 Speaker 1: that word even mean? And how was doctor Natalie's assessment 133 00:10:25,196 --> 00:10:27,436 Speaker 1: going to help me? As I moved on in my life. 134 00:10:28,476 --> 00:10:32,356 Speaker 1: This is just a difference in brain wiring. And then 135 00:10:33,116 --> 00:10:35,436 Speaker 1: sorry me, I interrupted before we please, you're going to 136 00:10:35,516 --> 00:10:38,076 Speaker 1: have to interrupt one you're gonna be in trouble, so good, 137 00:10:38,196 --> 00:10:40,596 Speaker 1: before we get sort of too far down the line, 138 00:10:40,796 --> 00:10:45,276 Speaker 1: I'd like a working definition from your perspective of autism. 139 00:10:45,396 --> 00:10:50,276 Speaker 1: Spectrum will site condition rather than disorder. But what is it? 140 00:10:51,356 --> 00:10:56,796 Speaker 1: So in terms of autism, I'll give you my definition. 141 00:10:57,236 --> 00:10:59,516 Speaker 1: One of the best ways to define autism is by 142 00:10:59,596 --> 00:11:02,916 Speaker 1: what it's not, because again, we have these tropes in 143 00:11:03,036 --> 00:11:10,196 Speaker 1: society of Rainman and Sheldon from the Big Bang theory, 144 00:11:10,476 --> 00:11:16,436 Speaker 1: and children lacking sociability, narcissistic, lack of empathy, and those 145 00:11:16,476 --> 00:11:23,756 Speaker 1: are just absolutely incorrect assumptions that the media really sells. Remember, 146 00:11:23,876 --> 00:11:27,876 Speaker 1: doctor Natalie is autistic herself, and her understanding of autism 147 00:11:27,996 --> 00:11:32,516 Speaker 1: is that it's largely positive and often inherited. So thanks 148 00:11:32,556 --> 00:11:35,916 Speaker 1: mom and dad. What autism is It is a difference 149 00:11:35,996 --> 00:11:39,996 Speaker 1: in brain wiring and that we are optimized for certain things. 150 00:11:40,556 --> 00:11:43,276 Speaker 1: It is genetic. It's got an eighty percent genetic component. 151 00:11:44,156 --> 00:11:47,196 Speaker 1: We have these specialized skills in the brain. We've got 152 00:11:47,236 --> 00:11:51,596 Speaker 1: this localized hyper connectivity. And what that does is allows 153 00:11:51,676 --> 00:11:55,916 Speaker 1: us to be excellent lateral thinkers. Basically the ability to 154 00:11:55,916 --> 00:12:00,596 Speaker 1: solve problems in indirect, creative and unexpected ways. Carry on. 155 00:12:00,756 --> 00:12:03,236 Speaker 1: You know, many of us are autodidacts, people who are 156 00:12:03,236 --> 00:12:07,116 Speaker 1: self taught. We tend to be very intelligent. And I 157 00:12:07,156 --> 00:12:11,076 Speaker 1: would also include in that we whire varying levels of support, 158 00:12:11,156 --> 00:12:15,676 Speaker 1: and I think that's something that people misunderstand. And so 159 00:12:16,076 --> 00:12:19,156 Speaker 1: we do have all these great things. But like I 160 00:12:19,156 --> 00:12:21,636 Speaker 1: always say to people that if nature gives something, it 161 00:12:21,756 --> 00:12:24,596 Speaker 1: takes something. But what doctor Natalie is telling me is 162 00:12:24,636 --> 00:12:28,476 Speaker 1: all the positive stuff that she associates with autism. Autistics 163 00:12:28,516 --> 00:12:32,596 Speaker 1: are creative problem solvers and great systematizers and smart and 164 00:12:32,716 --> 00:12:35,876 Speaker 1: clever and teach themselves all kinds of cool and weird things. 165 00:12:36,516 --> 00:12:39,356 Speaker 1: But that's not what the DSM sets. The main thing 166 00:12:39,476 --> 00:12:43,596 Speaker 1: is that the DSM talks about these as deficits, right, 167 00:12:43,636 --> 00:12:46,756 Speaker 1: and I call them differences. So it's a difference that 168 00:12:46,916 --> 00:12:50,956 Speaker 1: optimizes us for certain things, which also means that there 169 00:12:50,956 --> 00:12:53,996 Speaker 1: are things that are less optimum for us. Right, So 170 00:12:54,116 --> 00:13:00,036 Speaker 1: neurotypicals are optimized for socializing and we're optimized for work. 171 00:13:00,396 --> 00:13:07,036 Speaker 1: We're literally specialized for skills. So if you think of 172 00:13:07,116 --> 00:13:09,316 Speaker 1: us more as a specialist, whereas a neurotive it was 173 00:13:09,356 --> 00:13:14,516 Speaker 1: a generalist. Hm, I feel anything but a specialist, unless 174 00:13:14,596 --> 00:13:17,996 Speaker 1: by a specialist doctor Natalie means someone who melts down 175 00:13:18,036 --> 00:13:20,716 Speaker 1: at the sight of pulverized roadkill on the side of 176 00:13:20,756 --> 00:13:24,396 Speaker 1: a highway or panics at the appearance of a caper 177 00:13:24,396 --> 00:13:28,396 Speaker 1: on her plate, in which case, yeah, I'm real special. 178 00:13:29,556 --> 00:13:32,316 Speaker 1: But as I talked to doctor Natalie, I began to 179 00:13:32,356 --> 00:13:36,076 Speaker 1: think that she was a little bit of an autistic exceptionalist. 180 00:13:36,356 --> 00:13:41,156 Speaker 1: You got autism, you have a superpower, rather than autism 181 00:13:41,156 --> 00:13:44,196 Speaker 1: just being a difference in brain wiring. The end, Doctor 182 00:13:44,276 --> 00:13:46,876 Speaker 1: Natalie seems to see autism as a thing that makes 183 00:13:46,876 --> 00:13:50,676 Speaker 1: autistic people just a wee bit better than non autistic people. 184 00:13:51,236 --> 00:13:53,716 Speaker 1: And I mean I get that. As a gay person, 185 00:13:53,796 --> 00:13:56,956 Speaker 1: I've long held the belief the gays are better period. 186 00:13:57,476 --> 00:14:00,516 Speaker 1: Just kidding. I think it's just a stance that people 187 00:14:00,636 --> 00:14:04,716 Speaker 1: with marginalized or minority identities use as a bomb against 188 00:14:04,716 --> 00:14:08,756 Speaker 1: a world that doesn't always feel very welcoming. But I'm 189 00:14:08,796 --> 00:14:12,596 Speaker 1: not a point in my neurodivergent journey where I feel exceptional, 190 00:14:12,996 --> 00:14:17,036 Speaker 1: where I feel that this designation is something to be celebrated. Hell, 191 00:14:17,116 --> 00:14:19,676 Speaker 1: I only just got the diagnosis. I'm not ready to 192 00:14:19,676 --> 00:14:23,076 Speaker 1: be an autistic superhero, the loudest girl in the world, 193 00:14:23,396 --> 00:14:26,156 Speaker 1: able to talk bad guys into submission, so long as 194 00:14:26,196 --> 00:14:28,756 Speaker 1: she doesn't have to eat eggplant or wear scratchy wool. 195 00:14:32,236 --> 00:14:35,676 Speaker 1: Some of what doctor Natalie was saying really resonated with me. 196 00:14:36,236 --> 00:14:39,116 Speaker 1: Autism doesn't have to be a deficit. It can just 197 00:14:39,196 --> 00:14:43,196 Speaker 1: be a difference. And my brain does sometimes feel more 198 00:14:43,236 --> 00:14:46,716 Speaker 1: like a workhorse than a party animal. But a few 199 00:14:46,716 --> 00:14:49,916 Speaker 1: of the things doctor Natalie said I didn't really vibe with. 200 00:14:50,636 --> 00:14:53,156 Speaker 1: What if I don't want to be a superhero, what 201 00:14:53,276 --> 00:14:57,236 Speaker 1: if I just want to be incidentally autistic? I called 202 00:14:57,276 --> 00:15:00,036 Speaker 1: doctor Natalie back to get her thoughts. You're the same 203 00:15:00,036 --> 00:15:02,636 Speaker 1: person who you were before. Yeah, the thing that you're 204 00:15:02,676 --> 00:15:05,276 Speaker 1: going to do now is be able to better understand 205 00:15:05,316 --> 00:15:08,356 Speaker 1: your superpowers and better understand how to manage your kryptonite's. 206 00:15:09,476 --> 00:15:12,276 Speaker 1: But I guess I just wasn't totally sold on this 207 00:15:12,316 --> 00:15:16,516 Speaker 1: whole idea. For one, the Superman reference doesn't quite land, 208 00:15:16,836 --> 00:15:20,636 Speaker 1: mostly because I'm not a comics person. Also, it's just 209 00:15:20,756 --> 00:15:23,436 Speaker 1: hard to assign that many positives to the way my 210 00:15:23,476 --> 00:15:28,236 Speaker 1: brain works, especially because it's been problematized for so long. 211 00:15:29,196 --> 00:15:31,796 Speaker 1: I haven't exactly been celebrated over the years for my 212 00:15:31,956 --> 00:15:35,476 Speaker 1: endless talking, or my blunt opinions, or my sensory weirdness. 213 00:15:36,476 --> 00:15:39,556 Speaker 1: But maybe what doctor Natalie was talking about more broadly 214 00:15:39,796 --> 00:15:44,476 Speaker 1: was reclaiming the popular narrative about autistic people that we're 215 00:15:44,556 --> 00:15:49,196 Speaker 1: unempathetic automatons, incapable of making meaningful emotional connections with people 216 00:15:49,476 --> 00:15:52,676 Speaker 1: because we're too busy memorizing world flags, taking apart the 217 00:15:52,756 --> 00:15:57,676 Speaker 1: vacuum cleaner, or doing calculus for fun. I decided to 218 00:15:57,676 --> 00:16:00,276 Speaker 1: call my girlfriend Hannah for a gut check. I just 219 00:16:00,396 --> 00:16:03,556 Speaker 1: needed to talk some of this out. I see why 220 00:16:04,436 --> 00:16:07,236 Speaker 1: the idea of the superpower is so important for people, 221 00:16:07,916 --> 00:16:10,836 Speaker 1: for the idea of finding this thing that makes it good. 222 00:16:11,316 --> 00:16:15,236 Speaker 1: Like these are the ways in which autism isn't a problem, 223 00:16:15,236 --> 00:16:19,076 Speaker 1: It's just a condition. It's just just a neurological difference. 224 00:16:19,436 --> 00:16:22,276 Speaker 1: F why I I'm cleaning my apartment while we're talking, 225 00:16:22,556 --> 00:16:26,116 Speaker 1: which is why everything is rattling around, And so you 226 00:16:26,196 --> 00:16:29,556 Speaker 1: look at this sort of traits of autism, and right 227 00:16:29,556 --> 00:16:32,636 Speaker 1: now I'm seeing is the ways in which they are 228 00:16:33,716 --> 00:16:39,596 Speaker 1: negative of parstablish you know, and I think that I 229 00:16:39,636 --> 00:16:42,876 Speaker 1: haven't quite figured out the ways that this would be 230 00:16:42,916 --> 00:16:45,676 Speaker 1: a good thing, you know, like I might not be 231 00:16:45,756 --> 00:16:48,356 Speaker 1: able to have people touched me in a particular way, 232 00:16:48,556 --> 00:16:51,996 Speaker 1: but I have this other thing that makes it positive. 233 00:16:52,836 --> 00:16:56,596 Speaker 1: You can't be like, oh Lynch sent Johnny was, you know, 234 00:16:56,636 --> 00:16:59,196 Speaker 1: if only he weren't like this, he would be perfect. 235 00:16:59,276 --> 00:17:06,596 Speaker 1: Can't be like if only this, then this m like 236 00:17:06,676 --> 00:17:10,116 Speaker 1: I couldn't say, like Lauren would dope the Holy shows 237 00:17:10,156 --> 00:17:16,876 Speaker 1: not just that's probably true though it's actually college on yourself. 238 00:17:19,076 --> 00:17:23,636 Speaker 1: Thank you for the affirmation my truest love. After talking 239 00:17:23,676 --> 00:17:26,596 Speaker 1: to doctor Natalie and Hannah, I was still feeling sad 240 00:17:26,636 --> 00:17:30,036 Speaker 1: and angry and confused. Also, I didn't want to be 241 00:17:30,076 --> 00:17:32,996 Speaker 1: an autistic superhero, not even if it came with a 242 00:17:33,036 --> 00:17:36,916 Speaker 1: cute outfit. I thought my diagnosis would be my answer, 243 00:17:37,236 --> 00:17:40,876 Speaker 1: but it wasn't enough, mostly because it just brought up 244 00:17:40,916 --> 00:17:45,156 Speaker 1: more questions, not just questions about the science behind autism, 245 00:17:45,356 --> 00:17:48,476 Speaker 1: but also about my place on the spectrum. All the 246 00:17:48,676 --> 00:17:52,836 Speaker 1: science and official definitions and doctor Natalie's superpower stuff were 247 00:17:52,956 --> 00:17:57,476 Speaker 1: not helping. I wanted it more on the ground understanding 248 00:17:57,476 --> 00:18:00,596 Speaker 1: of autistics. What did the culture think of us, and 249 00:18:00,836 --> 00:18:03,716 Speaker 1: how we moved through the world, and how did autistics 250 00:18:03,796 --> 00:18:08,196 Speaker 1: view themselves. I wanted to see myself reflected back at me. 251 00:18:09,436 --> 00:18:12,476 Speaker 1: So after the break, it's time to hit my personal 252 00:18:12,516 --> 00:18:24,796 Speaker 1: autism library and get my read on. In addition to 253 00:18:25,036 --> 00:18:29,236 Speaker 1: being a charming and delightful podcast host, I am also 254 00:18:29,276 --> 00:18:34,516 Speaker 1: a journalist. I love diving into information. Naturally, I was 255 00:18:34,556 --> 00:18:39,396 Speaker 1: trying to learn everything I could about autism, which, FYI, 256 00:18:39,476 --> 00:18:44,156 Speaker 1: is very autistic. I wasn't quite ready to plunge into 257 00:18:44,236 --> 00:18:48,716 Speaker 1: the very active online autism community, but I was ready 258 00:18:48,756 --> 00:18:52,036 Speaker 1: to do some heavy reading. I read books about autism 259 00:18:52,036 --> 00:18:55,316 Speaker 1: and feminism, and books about autism and blackness, and books 260 00:18:55,316 --> 00:18:57,476 Speaker 1: about autism that never should have been written at all 261 00:18:57,476 --> 00:19:01,636 Speaker 1: because they were so boring. I read memoirs and historical 262 00:19:01,676 --> 00:19:05,636 Speaker 1: deep dives and cute little graphic novels. I dogeared and 263 00:19:05,756 --> 00:19:09,516 Speaker 1: highlighted and scribbled in the margins of so many books. 264 00:19:09,916 --> 00:19:12,956 Speaker 1: And I also learned some fun facts about the Oscar 265 00:19:12,996 --> 00:19:16,076 Speaker 1: winning movie rain Man. The nineteen eighty eight film is 266 00:19:16,116 --> 00:19:19,396 Speaker 1: perhaps the most famous representation of autism on the big screen. 267 00:19:19,956 --> 00:19:23,596 Speaker 1: The movie star Dustin Hoffman, plays an autistic man named 268 00:19:23,716 --> 00:19:26,756 Speaker 1: Raymond Babbitt who lives in a mental hospital and has 269 00:19:26,836 --> 00:19:30,756 Speaker 1: recently inherited his father's fortune, which is cool until his 270 00:19:30,836 --> 00:19:34,196 Speaker 1: younger brother, Charlie played by Tom Cruise, comes on the 271 00:19:34,196 --> 00:19:37,076 Speaker 1: scene and absconds with Raymond in an attempt to snatch 272 00:19:37,116 --> 00:19:41,796 Speaker 1: the inheritance. It's like a disability buddy comedy road movie 273 00:19:41,796 --> 00:19:46,316 Speaker 1: with casinos and Lamborghinis and a non autistic actor playing 274 00:19:46,316 --> 00:19:52,876 Speaker 1: an autistic savant. Good morning coffee, Yes, Semi Cris Shally 275 00:19:52,996 --> 00:19:58,596 Speaker 1: dips dips salad for six nine two. How did you 276 00:19:58,636 --> 00:20:02,396 Speaker 1: know my phone number? How do you know that? Said, 277 00:20:02,436 --> 00:20:05,236 Speaker 1: read the telephone book Class NAC tips Sally for six 278 00:20:05,316 --> 00:20:09,796 Speaker 1: one o one nine two. He remembers things, little things, 279 00:20:09,796 --> 00:20:14,916 Speaker 1: sometimes very cleverable. I'll be right back. In order to 280 00:20:14,956 --> 00:20:17,036 Speaker 1: prep for the role, Hoffman got a job as a 281 00:20:17,116 --> 00:20:20,556 Speaker 1: nurse's aid at the New York Psychiatric Institute. He played 282 00:20:20,596 --> 00:20:23,356 Speaker 1: ping pong and scrabble with the patience and did the 283 00:20:23,396 --> 00:20:27,876 Speaker 1: occasional pan oversight. All cute. I guess by now my 284 00:20:27,956 --> 00:20:32,156 Speaker 1: brain was exploding with autism trivia, some fun, some not 285 00:20:32,276 --> 00:20:36,076 Speaker 1: so fun. But all this optimistic book learning didn't exactly 286 00:20:36,196 --> 00:20:39,916 Speaker 1: have the desired effect. Learning the facts of autism didn't 287 00:20:39,956 --> 00:20:43,716 Speaker 1: make me understand any more. About myself in a way, 288 00:20:43,996 --> 00:20:47,356 Speaker 1: it had the opposite effect. I was hardly seeing myself 289 00:20:47,476 --> 00:20:50,956 Speaker 1: in any of what I was reading. Maybe it would 290 00:20:50,996 --> 00:20:53,076 Speaker 1: be different if I dipped a toe in the cool 291 00:20:53,196 --> 00:20:57,396 Speaker 1: waters of autism social media. So I started following people 292 00:20:57,436 --> 00:21:01,196 Speaker 1: who used the actually autistic hashtag on Twitter, and I 293 00:21:01,276 --> 00:21:04,636 Speaker 1: tried watching some YouTube videos. Ted x seemed to have 294 00:21:04,676 --> 00:21:09,236 Speaker 1: an unusually large collection of female autistics talking about their experiences. 295 00:21:09,916 --> 00:21:14,756 Speaker 1: By myself autistic. As you can see, you can't tell 296 00:21:14,796 --> 00:21:17,916 Speaker 1: from looking that I'm autistic. I had always had autistic 297 00:21:17,916 --> 00:21:19,996 Speaker 1: traits and struggles, but I just thought I was weird. 298 00:21:20,116 --> 00:21:24,916 Speaker 1: Imagine someone on the autism spectrum. You probably didn't imagine 299 00:21:25,076 --> 00:21:28,996 Speaker 1: someone who looks like me. At first, this diagnosis was 300 00:21:29,076 --> 00:21:34,236 Speaker 1: not easy to hear, but then something shifted got Asperger's 301 00:21:34,916 --> 00:21:38,996 Speaker 1: for me. It's just the way my brain functions and 302 00:21:39,116 --> 00:21:42,876 Speaker 1: how it functions is very overwhelming. If it was so 303 00:21:42,956 --> 00:21:45,996 Speaker 1: lovely to hear all these autistic women talk about their 304 00:21:45,996 --> 00:21:50,036 Speaker 1: own experiences, like yeah, girl, I see you. But then 305 00:21:50,276 --> 00:21:53,196 Speaker 1: the deeper down the rabbit hole I went, the more 306 00:21:53,236 --> 00:21:56,036 Speaker 1: I got caught up in the stereotypes, and I just 307 00:21:56,076 --> 00:21:58,916 Speaker 1: couldn't see myself in any of them. About people who 308 00:21:58,916 --> 00:22:05,076 Speaker 1: are nerdy, intelligent, socially awkward, socially isolated, and who are 309 00:22:05,076 --> 00:22:08,476 Speaker 1: obsessed with computer games, but who can't look after themselves. 310 00:22:09,196 --> 00:22:12,516 Speaker 1: Yeah that's not really me. Where was my place on 311 00:22:12,516 --> 00:22:16,076 Speaker 1: this autism spectrum? What if I was just an autistic imposter? 312 00:22:16,436 --> 00:22:19,676 Speaker 1: Did I even have an autistic special interest? Of course 313 00:22:19,876 --> 00:22:22,476 Speaker 1: I had to talk to Hannah about it. I'm like, 314 00:22:22,516 --> 00:22:27,396 Speaker 1: I'm forty two. I don't have an interest in video 315 00:22:27,476 --> 00:22:35,916 Speaker 1: games or fantasy world pre sci fi speculative fiction. I don't. 316 00:22:36,716 --> 00:22:38,876 Speaker 1: I don't feel like you can't find a place where 317 00:22:38,876 --> 00:22:41,356 Speaker 1: you belong. What's like, where's the place? Do you know 318 00:22:41,396 --> 00:22:44,196 Speaker 1: what I mean? This is what happened. You live with this, 319 00:22:44,356 --> 00:22:50,756 Speaker 1: summarize Oh what you're like, Okay, so now today I 320 00:22:50,796 --> 00:22:54,796 Speaker 1: am autistic. Like here I go starting up the stick 321 00:22:54,876 --> 00:22:58,316 Speaker 1: lie and you're like, oh, so I'm going to be 322 00:22:58,356 --> 00:23:05,396 Speaker 1: at the Comic Con convection. No, I like, also, I'm 323 00:23:05,476 --> 00:23:08,516 Speaker 1: going to play video games. I have to get myself 324 00:23:08,556 --> 00:23:13,116 Speaker 1: a base. It had a switch, so you cagle switch 325 00:23:13,196 --> 00:23:17,196 Speaker 1: and you're like, fuck, man, that's expensive, you know, So 326 00:23:17,316 --> 00:23:21,316 Speaker 1: you look for off brand Nintendo like Nintenda or something, 327 00:23:25,636 --> 00:23:27,676 Speaker 1: and then so you try it out. Then you're like, 328 00:23:27,756 --> 00:23:31,836 Speaker 1: I can't like I can't even get Mario up one 329 00:23:31,916 --> 00:23:37,076 Speaker 1: fucking ladder. Yeah, and what Hannah is so expertly doing 330 00:23:37,116 --> 00:23:40,716 Speaker 1: here is showing me how utterly ridiculous I was being. 331 00:23:41,316 --> 00:23:43,676 Speaker 1: I do not have to be a basement dwelling gamer 332 00:23:43,756 --> 00:23:46,916 Speaker 1: in order to inhabit my autism. Also, nothing wrong in 333 00:23:46,956 --> 00:23:50,156 Speaker 1: the slightest with basement dwelling gamers. I just haven't played 334 00:23:50,156 --> 00:23:52,836 Speaker 1: a video game since nineteen ninety eight, when Super Mario 335 00:23:52,876 --> 00:23:55,796 Speaker 1: and Duck Hunt came as a Nintendo Super two fer. 336 00:23:56,396 --> 00:24:00,156 Speaker 1: So if gaming was a requirement for my neurodivergent membership card, 337 00:24:00,316 --> 00:24:04,356 Speaker 1: I surely wouldn't qualify. Social media felt like was full 338 00:24:04,396 --> 00:24:08,516 Speaker 1: of gen zs or nerds and popular media. Well, that's 339 00:24:08,556 --> 00:24:11,396 Speaker 1: a real x bag when it comes to representing autistic 340 00:24:11,436 --> 00:24:16,436 Speaker 1: people or really disability writ large. Up until very recently, 341 00:24:16,556 --> 00:24:20,596 Speaker 1: autistic characters were played by non autistic actors are Pala, 342 00:24:20,716 --> 00:24:25,116 Speaker 1: Dustin Hoffmann, Leonardo DiCaprio, and what's even Gilbert grape Claire 343 00:24:25,196 --> 00:24:29,556 Speaker 1: Dane's any biopic Temple Grandin. I mean, sure, if Gillian 344 00:24:29,516 --> 00:24:32,516 Speaker 1: Anderson or Julian Moore want to play autistic me in 345 00:24:32,556 --> 00:24:36,516 Speaker 1: the movie version of my astoundingly mundane life. I'm here 346 00:24:36,556 --> 00:24:40,436 Speaker 1: for it, gun for that, Oscar Ladies, But for real, 347 00:24:40,676 --> 00:24:45,916 Speaker 1: I wasn't really seeing any autistic representation that felt relatable anywhere. 348 00:24:46,636 --> 00:24:51,636 Speaker 1: Maybe that's because most media portraying autistic people isn't made 349 00:24:51,796 --> 00:24:56,236 Speaker 1: by autistic people, shocker, so it's hard to tell if 350 00:24:56,276 --> 00:24:58,356 Speaker 1: what you're going to get is the real tea or 351 00:24:58,476 --> 00:25:03,796 Speaker 1: just some contrived pap made by slash four neurotips. Of course, 352 00:25:03,916 --> 00:25:07,596 Speaker 1: I watched Rainman Nam the Temple Grandin biopic and saw 353 00:25:07,676 --> 00:25:13,956 Speaker 1: almost nothing now was relatable. But then I saw Hannah Gadsby, 354 00:25:13,996 --> 00:25:17,596 Speaker 1: and Hannah Gadsby was someone I could get into and 355 00:25:17,756 --> 00:25:37,916 Speaker 1: who I do get into after a break. Hannah Gadsby 356 00:25:38,236 --> 00:25:41,836 Speaker 1: is a genius Australian comedian who made waves in twenty 357 00:25:41,916 --> 00:25:46,076 Speaker 1: eighteen when her stand up special Nanette came out on Netflix. 358 00:25:46,716 --> 00:25:48,876 Speaker 1: I think it's fair to say that she blew all 359 00:25:48,916 --> 00:25:51,796 Speaker 1: our minds. At least she blew my tiny mind right 360 00:25:51,836 --> 00:25:55,116 Speaker 1: on my little leer holes. Here was someone I felt 361 00:25:55,116 --> 00:25:58,236 Speaker 1: a deep kinship with, and not just because we're both 362 00:25:58,276 --> 00:26:01,836 Speaker 1: gay and I think I'm hilarious, because I felt I 363 00:26:01,876 --> 00:26:05,396 Speaker 1: could relate to her particularities. My favorite sound in the 364 00:26:05,436 --> 00:26:07,716 Speaker 1: whole world is a sound of a take up finding 365 00:26:07,716 --> 00:26:14,356 Speaker 1: its place. Also in Gadsby's sophomore special called Douglas, she 366 00:26:14,596 --> 00:26:19,156 Speaker 1: directly addressed being autistic. I hadn't been diagnosed yet. Autism 367 00:26:19,276 --> 00:26:22,396 Speaker 1: was only on the periphery of my consciousness. But when 368 00:26:22,396 --> 00:26:25,836 Speaker 1: I heard this, boy, howdy, did it resonate. I have 369 00:26:26,316 --> 00:26:29,836 Speaker 1: what's called high functioning autism, which is a terrible name 370 00:26:29,876 --> 00:26:32,596 Speaker 1: for what I have because it gives the impression that 371 00:26:32,676 --> 00:26:37,356 Speaker 1: I function highly. I do not to give you an 372 00:26:37,396 --> 00:26:39,396 Speaker 1: idea of what it feels like to be on the spectrum. Basically, 373 00:26:39,396 --> 00:26:41,396 Speaker 1: it feels like being the only sober person in a 374 00:26:41,476 --> 00:26:44,516 Speaker 1: room full of drunks, or the other way around. Basically, 375 00:26:44,556 --> 00:26:47,676 Speaker 1: everyone is operating on a wavelength you can't quite key into. 376 00:26:48,196 --> 00:26:51,436 Speaker 1: When I saw Gadsby perform this live well before COVID 377 00:26:51,556 --> 00:26:55,076 Speaker 1: or my diagnosis, I just kept saying out loud, yes, yes, yes, yes, 378 00:26:55,156 --> 00:26:58,876 Speaker 1: yes yes, because this is always how I feel in 379 00:26:58,916 --> 00:27:03,876 Speaker 1: social situations, and here was someone articulating it so perfectly 380 00:27:04,236 --> 00:27:08,796 Speaker 1: and with heart and humor. After rewatching gadsby specials, I 381 00:27:08,836 --> 00:27:11,116 Speaker 1: had the feeling that everything was going to be fine. 382 00:27:11,156 --> 00:27:15,876 Speaker 1: I was practically skipping neurodiversey is beautiful, I'm amazing. Hannah 383 00:27:15,876 --> 00:27:19,196 Speaker 1: Gatsby and I are going to be best friends. But 384 00:27:19,436 --> 00:27:22,676 Speaker 1: Gadsby Specials were maybe the only time I felt like 385 00:27:22,716 --> 00:27:27,356 Speaker 1: I really saw myself reflected back at me. Most of 386 00:27:27,356 --> 00:27:30,516 Speaker 1: the TV shows and feature films and documentaries on my 387 00:27:30,556 --> 00:27:35,636 Speaker 1: list got real grim, real fast, Like this little nineteen 388 00:27:35,756 --> 00:27:39,116 Speaker 1: sixty nine picture called Change of Habit with a young 389 00:27:39,156 --> 00:27:44,116 Speaker 1: fellow you might be familiar with named Elvis. Oh I got. 390 00:27:44,156 --> 00:27:47,076 Speaker 1: The opening scene is nun's taking out their clod, which 391 00:27:47,076 --> 00:27:54,196 Speaker 1: seems like a little respe for nineteen sixty nine. They're 392 00:27:54,236 --> 00:28:00,356 Speaker 1: putting stockings, Okay. The premise of the film is that 393 00:28:00,436 --> 00:28:02,916 Speaker 1: Mary Tyler Moore is a sexy nun who is also 394 00:28:03,116 --> 00:28:06,396 Speaker 1: a psychiatric nurse, and Elvis is a sexy doctor in 395 00:28:06,436 --> 00:28:10,876 Speaker 1: Spanish Harlem who also plays guitar. The nun sister Michelle, 396 00:28:10,956 --> 00:28:13,916 Speaker 1: gets assigned to help doctor Elvis in his clinic, and 397 00:28:13,996 --> 00:28:16,436 Speaker 1: of course they fall in love, even though Mary Tyler 398 00:28:16,476 --> 00:28:19,596 Speaker 1: Moore's character is already married to the Lord. But the 399 00:28:19,716 --> 00:28:22,316 Speaker 1: b plot of the film is sister Michelle and doctor 400 00:28:22,356 --> 00:28:27,076 Speaker 1: Elvis's ongoing interactions with a non speaking girl named Amanda. 401 00:28:27,236 --> 00:28:31,396 Speaker 1: Brace Yourselves from my running commentary, It only goes downhill 402 00:28:31,516 --> 00:28:36,356 Speaker 1: from here. Is Amanda your daughter? My sister's kid. She's 403 00:28:36,356 --> 00:28:38,356 Speaker 1: just come and tumped around me a couple of years ago. 404 00:28:38,636 --> 00:28:42,676 Speaker 1: Nice work. She never wanted a kid in the first place. Oh, 405 00:28:42,716 --> 00:28:47,156 Speaker 1: I think she's autistic. Artistic. Nah, she don't even lift 406 00:28:47,196 --> 00:28:51,316 Speaker 1: up a crayon. Oh my god, no autistic. Sometimes when 407 00:28:51,356 --> 00:28:53,836 Speaker 1: a child's rejected very early in life, they could call 408 00:28:53,876 --> 00:28:57,156 Speaker 1: inside themselves and shut out the whole world, as if 409 00:28:57,156 --> 00:28:59,556 Speaker 1: they're trying to punish the rest of us along with themselves. 410 00:28:59,876 --> 00:29:05,996 Speaker 1: Oh my god, are you kidding me? So they make 411 00:29:06,036 --> 00:29:09,836 Speaker 1: a diagnosis in about thirteen seconds, and then later sister 412 00:29:09,916 --> 00:29:12,796 Speaker 1: Marshall and doctor Elvis cure Amanda of her autism by 413 00:29:12,876 --> 00:29:19,036 Speaker 1: using a real, albeit pseudo scientific technique called rage reduction therapy. 414 00:29:19,316 --> 00:29:22,436 Speaker 1: It's where a therapist restrains and confronts a child in 415 00:29:22,556 --> 00:29:26,196 Speaker 1: order to provoke a rage response that will ultimately end 416 00:29:26,236 --> 00:29:31,076 Speaker 1: in some sort of breakthrough prompted by eye contact. And 417 00:29:31,356 --> 00:29:37,196 Speaker 1: it's just as nightmarish as it sounds. Get rid of 418 00:29:37,196 --> 00:29:40,476 Speaker 1: all your hate, do manage you can? You can start 419 00:29:40,276 --> 00:29:44,116 Speaker 1: for the love and take a love. Oh try get 420 00:29:44,116 --> 00:29:50,036 Speaker 1: away the baby. I love you Amanda, she liking people 421 00:29:50,116 --> 00:29:54,316 Speaker 1: love you. I want to see you. Just get out 422 00:29:54,316 --> 00:29:58,116 Speaker 1: of you. This is truly terrible. After Amanda stops kicking 423 00:29:58,116 --> 00:30:00,916 Speaker 1: and screaming and looks doctor Elvis in the eye, hoof 424 00:30:01,276 --> 00:30:05,636 Speaker 1: no more autism, Oh Amanda, we love you, love you, 425 00:30:06,796 --> 00:30:16,036 Speaker 1: love you, love love love love you you who love you? 426 00:30:17,796 --> 00:30:22,796 Speaker 1: Love you? This is not love you love you. Yes, 427 00:30:22,996 --> 00:30:28,596 Speaker 1: that's a big girl, Big girl. And this apparently is 428 00:30:28,636 --> 00:30:31,956 Speaker 1: what the medical community used to think about autistic kids 429 00:30:32,036 --> 00:30:35,516 Speaker 1: just ten years before I was born, That they had 430 00:30:35,516 --> 00:30:37,956 Speaker 1: a well of hate and rage built up in their 431 00:30:37,996 --> 00:30:41,916 Speaker 1: systems and all they needed was to be squeezed into submission. 432 00:30:42,596 --> 00:30:49,076 Speaker 1: Then magically their inborn neurological condition would suddenly vanish. This 433 00:30:49,156 --> 00:30:52,556 Speaker 1: was the world we had just barely left behind, and 434 00:30:52,636 --> 00:30:55,796 Speaker 1: this was the legacy I was stepping into with my diagnosis. 435 00:30:56,916 --> 00:31:00,316 Speaker 1: All of a sudden, this autism exploration was starting to 436 00:31:00,356 --> 00:31:04,436 Speaker 1: feel really bad, and then I kind of lost it, 437 00:31:05,636 --> 00:31:10,996 Speaker 1: just like, where where can I go? Or I feel safe? 438 00:31:11,636 --> 00:31:22,876 Speaker 1: Taken care of where the world is about bending to 439 00:31:23,036 --> 00:31:26,516 Speaker 1: meet me and not the other way round, not be 440 00:31:27,196 --> 00:31:31,916 Speaker 1: contorting myself and two billion jeemes definite figure out how 441 00:31:31,956 --> 00:31:37,076 Speaker 1: to fit, how to live how to live with noise 442 00:31:37,356 --> 00:31:51,756 Speaker 1: and disruption, and how to deal with just being too much, 443 00:31:53,196 --> 00:32:10,236 Speaker 1: too loud, too aggressive. I don't know. I just like 444 00:32:10,316 --> 00:32:24,516 Speaker 1: I'm done. They don't even do it done me. Of course, 445 00:32:24,636 --> 00:32:28,316 Speaker 1: as anyone who has ever experienced any mental health troubles 446 00:32:28,356 --> 00:32:32,156 Speaker 1: can attest, sometimes our brains are jerks. They tell us 447 00:32:32,196 --> 00:32:35,956 Speaker 1: bad things about ourselves and we listen, and the work 448 00:32:36,076 --> 00:32:39,996 Speaker 1: is to beat back all that badness, and it's exhausting. 449 00:32:40,836 --> 00:32:43,436 Speaker 1: I felt like my fact finding mission kind of failed. 450 00:32:44,036 --> 00:32:46,956 Speaker 1: This wasn't just something I could research my way out of. 451 00:32:52,676 --> 00:32:54,836 Speaker 1: I talked to my therapist at the time. Are lean 452 00:32:54,916 --> 00:32:57,516 Speaker 1: about it. We have all these bits and pieces, so 453 00:32:57,596 --> 00:33:01,236 Speaker 1: it feels kind of crazy making and until you can 454 00:33:01,276 --> 00:33:04,396 Speaker 1: start connecting things. That's that's what humans do. We make 455 00:33:04,396 --> 00:33:06,396 Speaker 1: a narrative, you know, And that's what you're trying to 456 00:33:06,396 --> 00:33:08,916 Speaker 1: do with your podcasts, and it's very hard when you're 457 00:33:08,956 --> 00:33:13,716 Speaker 1: the subject is well with Maybe that was part of 458 00:33:13,716 --> 00:33:17,836 Speaker 1: the problem. I'm a reporter. I'm used to telling stories 459 00:33:17,876 --> 00:33:21,156 Speaker 1: and finding truths, and you do that by researching and 460 00:33:21,276 --> 00:33:24,956 Speaker 1: pounding the pavement and asking questions, but of other people, 461 00:33:25,436 --> 00:33:29,236 Speaker 1: never about yourself. Now I was faced with a word 462 00:33:29,716 --> 00:33:33,076 Speaker 1: and I needed answers about what that word meant for me, 463 00:33:33,796 --> 00:33:36,836 Speaker 1: and I wasn't getting them. I tried to pass through 464 00:33:36,876 --> 00:33:40,676 Speaker 1: it because you've lived one way for a very long time, 465 00:33:41,596 --> 00:33:45,556 Speaker 1: in a sort of you know, non autistic way, in 466 00:33:45,636 --> 00:33:49,956 Speaker 1: a non autistic world. Then to be given a diagnosis 467 00:33:49,956 --> 00:33:53,636 Speaker 1: that says, well, now you're autistic, and it's like, well, 468 00:33:53,676 --> 00:33:58,876 Speaker 1: what how do I What does that mean? And it 469 00:33:58,916 --> 00:34:01,436 Speaker 1: doesn't I guess. Then it's like, well, it doesn't really 470 00:34:01,436 --> 00:34:03,316 Speaker 1: have to mean anything if you don't want it to 471 00:34:03,396 --> 00:34:08,516 Speaker 1: mean anything. I think the first thing for you. Then 472 00:34:09,196 --> 00:34:12,876 Speaker 1: that's what we're doing now, is digesting this for yourself. 473 00:34:13,396 --> 00:34:17,476 Speaker 1: It's like figuring out your relationship with it. But my 474 00:34:17,556 --> 00:34:21,156 Speaker 1: work wasn't just figuring out my relationship with autism. Though 475 00:34:21,196 --> 00:34:24,476 Speaker 1: that was plenty to keep me occupied. I also had 476 00:34:24,516 --> 00:34:28,916 Speaker 1: to consider all my people's orientation towards autism, my friends, 477 00:34:29,236 --> 00:34:32,276 Speaker 1: my family. At some point I was going to have 478 00:34:32,276 --> 00:34:37,676 Speaker 1: to tell them I've been masking for so long, camouflaging 479 00:34:37,756 --> 00:34:42,396 Speaker 1: my eccentricities and my battles and my general weirdness. What 480 00:34:42,476 --> 00:34:44,156 Speaker 1: was I going to say to people when I did 481 00:34:44,196 --> 00:34:48,076 Speaker 1: come out? Would anyone believe me? And how can I 482 00:34:48,076 --> 00:34:51,236 Speaker 1: talk about something I'm only just learning about with people 483 00:34:51,276 --> 00:34:55,636 Speaker 1: who know even less. I want to let my people 484 00:34:55,796 --> 00:34:59,196 Speaker 1: into my reality, but not if it comes with a cost, 485 00:34:59,916 --> 00:35:02,636 Speaker 1: not if I feel like I have to prove something. 486 00:35:03,276 --> 00:35:07,116 Speaker 1: I talked to Hanna about that, Like, I can just 487 00:35:07,396 --> 00:35:13,076 Speaker 1: imagine that almost every single person I talk I talked 488 00:35:13,076 --> 00:35:18,436 Speaker 1: to there's resistance. But that's true. That will be hard. 489 00:35:18,596 --> 00:35:25,316 Speaker 1: That's hard, you know, it's hard, Except what Hannah doesn't 490 00:35:25,356 --> 00:35:28,036 Speaker 1: know is that I'm going to prove her wrong. I'm 491 00:35:28,076 --> 00:35:30,276 Speaker 1: going to tell all my people and they're all going 492 00:35:30,316 --> 00:35:32,996 Speaker 1: to be so understanding and ask all the right questions 493 00:35:33,036 --> 00:35:37,476 Speaker 1: and it's not going to be awkward at all. Right, 494 00:35:45,276 --> 00:35:47,556 Speaker 1: you've been listening to The Loudest Girl in the World. 495 00:35:47,916 --> 00:35:51,396 Speaker 1: It's hosted, written, end executive produced by me Lauren Obert. 496 00:35:51,636 --> 00:35:55,676 Speaker 1: Our senior producer is writer. Also our associate producer is 497 00:35:55,796 --> 00:35:59,676 Speaker 1: David jah. Sophie Crane is our showrunner and senior editor. 498 00:36:00,116 --> 00:36:03,636 Speaker 1: Jake Gorski is our mix engineer. Music imposed by my 499 00:36:03,716 --> 00:36:08,676 Speaker 1: autistic Kiwie Pale the Inimitable Lady Hawk. Our artwork was 500 00:36:08,716 --> 00:36:12,836 Speaker 1: created by the autistic illustrator Loretta Ipsum. The show is 501 00:36:12,876 --> 00:36:16,956 Speaker 1: fact checked by Andrea Lopez Cruzado and our autism consultant 502 00:36:17,116 --> 00:36:22,556 Speaker 1: is Sarah Cappett. Our executive producers are Mia Lobel and Letamlad. 503 00:36:23,036 --> 00:36:26,396 Speaker 1: Special thanks to doctor Natalie Ingelbrick. You can find her 504 00:36:26,396 --> 00:36:31,476 Speaker 1: on Facebook at Embrace Autism, Inc. Also thanks to Arlene 505 00:36:31,556 --> 00:36:35,316 Speaker 1: Levinson and thanks to you friend for listening