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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. How many hundreds of thousands

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Speaker 1: of dollars did this woman scam all under the pretense

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Speaker 1: of being a rich and influential German heiress. Anne is

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Speaker 1: Netflix pouring gas on the flame. I Nancy Grace, this

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Speaker 1: is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here

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Speaker 1: at Fox Nation and Sirius XM one eleven. Who am

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Speaker 1: I talking about? Of course, Anna Sorokin, that's her real name.

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Speaker 1: I think she goes by Anna Delvi and I'm sure

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Speaker 1: there have been many other aliases in between the two.

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Speaker 1: But first of all, take a listen to our sound

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Speaker 1: from Inside Edition. Shea she was a wealthy heiress from Europe,

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Speaker 1: worth more than sixty million dollars, but it was a lie.

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Speaker 1: Anasaurkan went to prison for two years for defrauding banks, hotels,

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Speaker 1: and even her closest friends out of hundreds of thousands

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Speaker 1: of dollars. Her trial drew international attention. This woman made

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Speaker 1: national headlines posing as a wealthy woman. Now, the woman

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Speaker 1: known as the SOHO Grifter is speaking to ABC's Deebrah Roberts.

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Speaker 1: This is the first time you've sat down for television interview.

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Speaker 1: Why are you talking with us? Why not I would

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Speaker 1: like to show the world that I'm not this ungreedy

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Speaker 1: person that they portrayed me to be. You ask her

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Speaker 1: who she really is? Did she tell you? Anna Saurkan

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Speaker 1: is very complicated character. You might believe that Annasaurkan is

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Speaker 1: a very gifted, clever, want to be businesswoman or a

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Speaker 1: complete con artist. And there are many people in her

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Speaker 1: wake who would tell you that she is the classic

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Speaker 1: con artist. Why can't she be both? Why can't she

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Speaker 1: be a great business person and the ultimate scammer? I

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Speaker 1: see her as both. Take a listen to hour cut

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Speaker 1: one from the Vanity Fair special Scandalous. By twenty sixteen,

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Speaker 1: Anna delvi was a regular in the NYC social scene,

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Speaker 1: frequenting many popular downtown restaurants, bars, and clubs. With an

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Speaker 1: extravagant lifestyle and a seemingly endless supply of money. Delvie

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Speaker 1: was an enigma that was made for the age of Instagram,

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Speaker 1: always at the right place, with the right people, living

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Speaker 1: her best life, but with no apparent cause for her

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Speaker 1: fame with Me and All Star panel to make sense

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Speaker 1: of what we know right now? As I imagine Netflix,

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Speaker 1: who's forking over hundreds of thousands of dollars to make

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Speaker 1: inventing Anna. I bet they're giving that times one hundred

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Speaker 1: for what they're making from Viewerships with Me. Wendy Patrick,

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Speaker 1: California prosecutor, author of Red Flags and hosted Today with

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Speaker 1: Doctor Wendy KCBQ. You can find her at Wendy Patrick

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Speaker 1: PhD dot com. Doctor Donna Rockwell Special guests joining US

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Speaker 1: clinical psychologists in both Michigan and New York specializing in

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Speaker 1: celebrity mental health on faculty Saybrook University. Jim Ellis with

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Speaker 1: a special guest joining US certified fraud examiner, former fed

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Speaker 1: with the FBI. Don't mess with this guy. FBI agent

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Speaker 1: twenty nine years now, Private investigator at jk E Texas

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Speaker 1: Private Investigator jke Texas dot com. But first, I want

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Speaker 1: to go to a woman I've been dying to talk to,

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Speaker 1: Rebecca Rosenberg with Fox News Digital. She's a crime reporter

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Speaker 1: and author of a fantastic book At any Cost, Rebecca,

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Speaker 1: who is this woman? Who is this woman? Well, her

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Speaker 1: family came from Russia. They moved to Germany, and I

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Speaker 1: believe her father was actually a truck driver. She does

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Speaker 1: not come from a wealthy family, and she just invented

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Speaker 1: this identity when she came to New York. Now, her

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Speaker 1: coming to New York was quite a story. So Russian

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Speaker 1: born moving to Germany the child of a truck driver,

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Speaker 1: she ends up getting a job or an internship that

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Speaker 1: takes her to Paris. From there, the position brings her

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Speaker 1: to New York. I believe it was Montak and then

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Speaker 1: she very simply overstayed her visa, which thousands of people

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Speaker 1: do every year, but none do it in the style

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Speaker 1: of Anna Sirokin. And take a listen to our cut

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Speaker 1: six our friends at Inside Edition. Is she in a

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Speaker 1: courtroom or at a red carpet event? Anna Saurakin is

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Speaker 1: accused of posing as an heiress to live an extravagant lifestyle,

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Speaker 1: but it's what she's wearing to trial that is making headlines.

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Speaker 1: The twenty seven year old defendant showed up wearing a

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Speaker 1: form fitting black dress with a plunging neckline and choker necklace.

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Speaker 1: It's a look that could backfire. Warren stylist Don Karen

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Speaker 1: black dress definitely a no no. It hypersexualize her. It

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Speaker 1: makes her appear to be like a seductress. The choker

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Speaker 1: kind of shows to me that she's trying to be

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Speaker 1: overtly sexy. The more sexy she appears to be, it

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Speaker 1: hurts her. Soarkin is so obsessed with her clothes she

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Speaker 1: refused to enter the courtroom because the outfit she was

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Speaker 1: given to wear was not up to her standards. The

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Speaker 1: angry judge told her this is unacceptable and inappropriate. This

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Speaker 1: is not a fashion show. Wow, well you know what.

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Speaker 1: It didn't work. She continued wearing designer clothes to every

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Speaker 1: single court appears. But this goes way back. Her desire

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Speaker 1: for a lifestyle she could not afford started in her teens.

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Speaker 1: Take a listening to our cut for me our buddy

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Speaker 1: Jesse Palmer at Daily MAILTV. Anna, who interned at a

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Speaker 1: trendy French magazine, reportedly managed to scam extended stays in

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Speaker 1: swanky Manhattan hotels, dinner at high end restaurants, and flights

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Speaker 1: on chartered jets to finance her lavish lifestyle and keep

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Speaker 1: the grift going. She allegedly built banks out of thousands

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Speaker 1: in cash. And that's not all. The fake heiress reportedly

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Speaker 1: fleeced her friend out of sixty two thousand dollars for

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Speaker 1: a world class trip to Morocco. But Anna went too

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Speaker 1: far when she attempted to take out a loan for

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Speaker 1: twenty two million dollars to finance a visual arts center

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Speaker 1: she called the Anna Delvi Foundation. In all, Anna reportedly

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Speaker 1: scammed a total of two hundred and seventy five thousand dollars,

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Speaker 1: and his double life began to crumble as hotels went

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Speaker 1: after her unpaid debts and banks began to investigate her

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Speaker 1: alleged assets. I mean, maybe it's just me, but to

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Speaker 1: you dotor Donna Rockwell joining us clinical psychologist Faculties Saber University.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Rockwell, I don't know very many people except maybe

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Speaker 1: Eloise that lives in hotels. No, I guess we don't

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Speaker 1: really know many people who live in hotels. But it's

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Speaker 1: very posh, isn't it to do that? She might be

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Speaker 1: a Eloise poser, I guess, But you know that makes

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Speaker 1: her look really unattainable and like she's got lots of money.

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Speaker 1: So I think people in her situation will do anything

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Speaker 1: they can to look like they're billionaires, not even millionaires.

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Speaker 1: And Rebecca Rosenberg joining us in Fox News Digital. Rebecca,

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Speaker 1: she wasn't just staying down at the Motel six. She

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Speaker 1: was staying at very very expensive and luxurious hotels. Yes,

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Speaker 1: she was staying at eleven Howard Street for a very

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Speaker 1: long time. It racked up a bill in the tens

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Speaker 1: of thousands of dollars. And that's where she lived here

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Speaker 1: for a big chunk of the times in New York.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's really interesting that she created this illusion

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Speaker 1: that super rich and super educated people fell for, and

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Speaker 1: I guess you'd call it New York society. Until she

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Speaker 1: went and basically invited herself to be on a yacht

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Speaker 1: in Ibiza, and then after everyone got off at the

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Speaker 1: end of the vacation, she and her boyfriend turn around

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Speaker 1: and get back on and stay for another week or

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Speaker 1: ten days. I mean, Jim Ellis, you're the certified fraud

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Speaker 1: examined her former FBI agent twenty nine years For beat's sake.

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Speaker 1: When you commandeer a yacht with a captain and a

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Speaker 1: staff and all the food and you're out at sea

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Speaker 1: and the gas, that is a huge bill, a huge bill.

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Speaker 1: And frankly, you know, she probably could have been stopped

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Speaker 1: and exposed at that point if any of these people

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Speaker 1: along the way he'd lost money, who got enticed by

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Speaker 1: her story had actually applied reason and common sense at

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Speaker 1: a certain point, things wouldn't have gotten as far as

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Speaker 1: as they did. Yeah, you know, that's really interesting. Wendy Patrick,

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Speaker 1: California prosecutor, author of Red Flags. You can hear her

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Speaker 1: on today with doctor Wendy CASEBQ. Doctor Wendy. I find it,

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Speaker 1: Wendy Patrick, I find it really interesting that the owners

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Speaker 1: or the people that had rented the yacht originally didn't

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Speaker 1: go after her. Now they were are really really wealthy

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Speaker 1: Hampton Nights. And I got to tell you something, Wendy,

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Speaker 1: I've been to the Hampton's a couple of times for

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Speaker 1: charity when I would be speaking to a group or

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Speaker 1: raising money somehow or other. That's the same, Wendy. I

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Speaker 1: couldn't wait till I packed up my little rental car

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Speaker 1: and got out. I mean, I knew I was a

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Speaker 1: dog upstairs. I did not fit in. That was not

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Speaker 1: where I was supposed to be. And these rich people

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Speaker 1: that got ripped off but didn't report it what they

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Speaker 1: didn't want to look step it or what. Yeah, no,

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Speaker 1: that's right, Nancy. I'm like you. I'm more I'm more

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Speaker 1: familiar with the Hampton Inn, with the free breakfast sealing

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Speaker 1: it go ahead. So this is the this is the

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Speaker 1: problem with the super super rich, and it is a

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Speaker 1: problem because financial responsibility should be everyone's responsibility. But they

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Speaker 1: probably either didn't know or didn't care. Why do I

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Speaker 1: say that, because we've covered so many stories where you

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Speaker 1: do have the ultra rich that are scammed are defrauded

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Speaker 1: by somebody like Anna, but don't consider it in the

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Speaker 1: ballast to be worth their while to pursue it, not

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Speaker 1: realizing there may be so many other victims that they

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Speaker 1: might be preventing by putting it into it sooner rather

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Speaker 1: than that may be why they didn't say anything. I'm

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Speaker 1: not quite sure Rebecca Rosenborg what her motivation is other

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Speaker 1: than just living the high life. But imagine the impact

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Speaker 1: she could have made being the daughter of a truck driver.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm the daughter of railroad worker and a

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Speaker 1: bank teller, and I know my parents worked overtime to

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Speaker 1: send me to college, to send me to law school,

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Speaker 1: and so much more. She actually has a brilliant mind. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I don't think that if she had been honest

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Speaker 1: about her origins, anybody and the people that she was

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Speaker 1: trying to hang out with the New York that they

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Speaker 1: would have really paid attention to her we know she

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Speaker 1: was born in Russia, grew up in Germany. Her father

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Speaker 1: worked at a transport company and went and solvent. At nineteen,

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Speaker 1: she left her parents and brother for Paris to decide

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Speaker 1: to pursue fashion. She has only ever spoken very vaguely

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Speaker 1: of her parents, as she terms conservative. But while she's

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Speaker 1: in Paris, she takes on the name Anna Delvi and

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Speaker 1: she shoots photographs for a fashion art magazine named Purple.

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Speaker 1: She only got four hundred euros a month and she

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Speaker 1: stayed financially dependent on her parents, who would send her

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Speaker 1: money pay for her apartment. Then she had a breakup,

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Speaker 1: headed to New York and she went for a trip

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Speaker 1: to Montauk and then a fashion week, and that really

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Speaker 1: did it. When she was at fashion Week, there was

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Speaker 1: no no suggestion she would ever turn back. She went

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Speaker 1: from boutique hotel to boutique hotel, always handing out CRISP

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Speaker 1: one hundred dollar tips and putting off bills with promises

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Speaker 1: of wire transfers that never happened. So, Rebecca Rosenberg, I

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Speaker 1: know we've got the one victim, Rachel Delosha Williams, but

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Speaker 1: that's two hundred and seventy five thousand dollars. What about

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Speaker 1: all of the hotels and all the other people she

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Speaker 1: ripped off. A lot of people didn't come forward, And

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Speaker 1: actually Rachel Delos was really interesting because at the end

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Speaker 1: Rachel actually couldn't get paid restitution because the jury did

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Speaker 1: not find Saroken guilty of ripping her off. That was

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Speaker 1: kind of that was one of the charges they did

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Speaker 1: not convict on. Take a listen, our cut five be

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Speaker 1: our friends at time. Prosecutor Katherine McCaw says the defendant

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Speaker 1: has not a sent to her name as far as

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Speaker 1: we can determine, also noting that Sarokin is Russian born,

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Speaker 1: not German, though she could be deported to Germany no

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Speaker 1: matter how the trial turns out, as she's reportedly overstayed

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Speaker 1: her visa under the name Anna Delvi. She arrived in

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Speaker 1: New York with a high priced wardrobe and was known

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Speaker 1: for handing out one hundred dollars cash tips, reportedly saying

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Speaker 1: at different points that her father was a diplomat, an

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Speaker 1: oil baron, or involved in the solar panel business, none

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Speaker 1: of which are the case. People who knew her said

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Speaker 1: she often asked others to use their credit cards to

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Speaker 1: cover cab and plane fares and then failing to repay them.

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Speaker 1: Rebecca Rosenberg. Netflix is now airing a multi episode creation

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Speaker 1: called Inventing Anna. What is It? It's a show based

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Speaker 1: on her life story, So based on her it kind

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Speaker 1: of glamorizes her. I'd say her criminal activity in New

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Speaker 1: York for which she was convicted, and she sold her

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Speaker 1: life rights to Netflix for them to do the show.

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Speaker 1: Jack listen our cut seven b our friends at GMA.

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Speaker 1: Prosecutors say the twenty eight year old, whose real name

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Speaker 1: is Anna Sorkin, stole two hundred and seventy five thousand

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Speaker 1: dollars from banks, hotels, and friends, all part of an

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Speaker 1: elaborate scheme to keep up her illusion of grander. Prosecutors

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Speaker 1: also alleged Sorkin tried securing a twenty two million dollar

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Speaker 1: loan to operate a private up, claims. Her lawyer denies.

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Speaker 1: I do not believe she had the intent to ever

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Speaker 1: commit a crime. Whether she always people money, that's effect

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Speaker 1: of life, that's the reality of doing business in New York.

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Speaker 1: Now facing charges of grand larceny and theft, she could

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Speaker 1: spend up to fifteen years in prison if convicted, but

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Speaker 1: officials say even if acquitted, she will be deported to Germany.

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Speaker 1: Sarkin's attorney says she got in over her head but

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Speaker 1: was just buying time until she could pay everyone back. Wow,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if I agree with that, because with

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Speaker 1: this woman cons she cons big. Take a listen to

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Speaker 1: our cut two from Vanity Fair. Prior to their departure,

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Speaker 1: Davis's manager told her, Delvi's bill and room charges were

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Speaker 1: starting to mount and we're still unpaid. As a result,

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Speaker 1: the hotel changed Delvi's room code and detained all of

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Speaker 1: her personal belongings. To renew her visa, Delvi said she

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Speaker 1: had to spend intervals of time out of the country,

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Speaker 1: so she decided to embark on an deventure to Morocco.

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Speaker 1: She invited her New York City circle of friends. This

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Speaker 1: trip was the quintessential example of the lavish lifestyle that

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Speaker 1: Delvey was known for, a private villa with a personal butler,

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Speaker 1: all for just a mere seven thousand dollars a night.

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Speaker 1: During their trip, Delvey, making one excuse after another, press

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Speaker 1: Williams to pick up the tab more and more frequently,

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Speaker 1: eventually covering costs for dinner and expensive Moroccan dresses, a

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Speaker 1: stark change from the days Delvi would pay for everything.

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Speaker 1: Then one morning, Delvey was informed by a hotel employee

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Speaker 1: that they did not have a working credit card on file.

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Speaker 1: Delve brushed this off as an issue with her bank,

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Speaker 1: but soon after Williams was pressured into putting down her

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Speaker 1: credit card by hotel management staff and security members. Knowing

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Speaker 1: something was not right. Williams left Morocco while Delvi stayed

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Speaker 1: behind Crime Stories with Nancy Grace to Rebecca Rosenberg joining

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Speaker 1: us for Fox News Digital. Even her closest friends didn't

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Speaker 1: know who she was. Yeah, I think that's true. But

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Speaker 1: I also think that her close friend was also enjoying

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Speaker 1: the advantages of having a friend who was picking up

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Speaker 1: the tab and paying for meals at the hotel, and maybe,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe didn't ask a lot of questions that

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Speaker 1: there were a lot of red flags there, and she

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Speaker 1: in the end got this great trip to Morocco. So

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Speaker 1: I think that was a little bit part of the

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Speaker 1: reason that jurors ultimately didn't convict on those charges. They

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Speaker 1: kind of felt like she came out ahead in the end,

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Speaker 1: especially because she was able to get an HBO TV

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Speaker 1: deal and a book, a very large advance on a

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Speaker 1: book recounting her experience. He who got that Rachel Deloche,

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Speaker 1: the friend that got for two hundred seventy five grand,

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Speaker 1: It was not just seventy five, It was actually about

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Speaker 1: sixty five seventy. Oh, I've got two hundred and seventy

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Speaker 1: five thousand, So two hundred and seventy five was the

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Speaker 1: total amount she was accused of, feeling at trial she

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Speaker 1: was only convicted for two hundred thousand of it because

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Speaker 1: they didn't convict on the Morocco track. Jim ellis joining

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Speaker 1: us former fed with the FBI. Have you ever seen

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Speaker 1: anything like it where a person who is so obsessed

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Speaker 1: with a lifestyle or getting money actually has alternate identities

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Speaker 1: and scams and lies to even their closest friends, their lovers.

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Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, I mean in her heart, Anasauric is a

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Speaker 1: con and she basically just cares about herself and she

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Speaker 1: doesn't care what's left in her weight. And I've seen

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Speaker 1: this through my career, both as an FBI agent and

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Speaker 1: as a private investigator. People act the same way. I'm

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Speaker 1: familiar with one con artist who dressed up He's a

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Speaker 1: Southern Baptist boy from Louisiana, and he dressed stuff like

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Speaker 1: an Hasidic Jew complete with clothing and makeup, so he

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Speaker 1: could go vouch to other people in the Jewish community

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Speaker 1: for himself. I mean that people will go to no

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Speaker 1: ends to satisfy their grieve, to satisfy their want for

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Speaker 1: fame and power. How do you untangle a case like

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Speaker 1: this well, I mean, obviously from a law enforcement perspective,

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Speaker 1: you don't even know about it to somebody who reports it.

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Speaker 1: I think the one thing that the Netflix show did

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Speaker 1: a good job of, even if it partily is fictionalized,

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Speaker 1: is the dog at work of the investigative reporter. You

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Speaker 1: can only tell so much online. You have to get

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Speaker 1: out there and talk to people and get actual documents,

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Speaker 1: and that's the only way to untang the deceit that

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Speaker 1: the Khan puts up. I'm thinking about her personality. She

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Speaker 1: goes to trial, she goes to trial. I want you

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Speaker 1: to hear what the attorney said in court. Take a

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Speaker 1: listen to our cut seven aur Prince at Guma. She

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Speaker 1: had to fake it until she can make it. Those

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Speaker 1: words from the defendant's own attorney, who claims she never

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Speaker 1: intended to commit a crime, but prosecutors call her a

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Speaker 1: fraud and a liar who would do almost anything to

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Speaker 1: prolong her life of luxury. This morning, the fate of

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Speaker 1: an alleged scam artist is now in the hands of

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Speaker 1: a jury, both sides wrapping up arguments for a case

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Speaker 1: that's drawn international outrage. The style savvy defendant even turning

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Speaker 1: heads in court wearing an animal print dress. She called

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Speaker 1: herself Anna Delvi, a fashionable globetrotter who, prosecutors day was

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Speaker 1: pretending to be a high flying German heiress living a

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Speaker 1: fairytale life of glitz and glam among Manhattan's elite. Wow, okay,

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Speaker 1: take a listen to her and a serroken in her

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Speaker 1: own words, are cut nine from the BBC. Did you

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Speaker 1: get a thrill from it? I mean, were you satisfied

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Speaker 1: when you got away with something, when you achieved something,

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Speaker 1: when you slipped under the radar and didn't have to pay.

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Speaker 1: Was it thrilling? Absolutely not, because in my head I

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Speaker 1: never thought that I was cheating or getting away with anything.

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Speaker 1: In my head, like any money that would borrow from them,

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Speaker 1: they would be getting back. And I felt like they

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Speaker 1: portrayed me as like someone who is very manipulative, which

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Speaker 1: I don't think I am. And I was never really

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Speaker 1: liked too nice of a person. I was never like

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Speaker 1: really trying to talk my way into anything. I kind

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Speaker 1: of just told people what I wanted and like the

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Speaker 1: either gave it to me or not, and I just

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Speaker 1: moved on. But she taught them into what she wanted

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Speaker 1: through lines. I mean, Donna rockwell, we really need a shrink.

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Speaker 1: How can she take hundreds of thousands of dollars in

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Speaker 1: luxury hotels, clothing that she got her friends to pay for,

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Speaker 1: raking up credit cards she needs She'd never pay back

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Speaker 1: hundreds of thousands of dollars in credit cards, all based

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Speaker 1: on lies. I mean, she had to know that was wrong.

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Speaker 1: She wasn't just fake in it, fake it till you

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Speaker 1: make it. She was outright lying for goods and services. Yes,

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Speaker 1: she was outright lying. That's how we see it. It's interesting,

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Speaker 1: you know, because a person who has early life narcissistic wounds. Okay,

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Speaker 1: see I don't know what that means, what it means

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Speaker 1: that someone is only really thinking about themselves. But you

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Speaker 1: said a narcissistic wound. What's a narcissistic wound? I know

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Speaker 1: who narcissis is, but what's a narcissistic wound? When we're

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Speaker 1: babies if our mother or primary caretaker doesn't look at

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Speaker 1: us and say, who is a pretty baby? Who is

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Speaker 1: a pretty baby, we don't know that we exist. So

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Speaker 1: without early life mirroring, meaning the parent or the caregivers

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Speaker 1: looking at you, you know you're existing, you're smiling back.

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Speaker 1: There becomes a deficit that develops in a person, and

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Speaker 1: that who becomes a narcissist or a self serving person

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Speaker 1: in adulthood, and we probably know many of them in

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Speaker 1: our own lives. However, in the context of same, there's

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Speaker 1: something called acquired situational narcissism, which means that the situations

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Speaker 1: that we come into after we're a baby, in other words,

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Speaker 1: like Anna when she was in her nineteen and in

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Speaker 1: her twenties, is enough to turn us into that kind

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Speaker 1: of a person, meaning all for me and none for you.

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Speaker 1: And how does she get away with that? She gets

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Speaker 1: away with it because she's in denial, which is a

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Speaker 1: psychological coping mechanism. So the only way that she can

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Speaker 1: do these things is to not have a conscience, to

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Speaker 1: not think about it. So she has a sense of

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Speaker 1: acquired situational narcissism because of her situations and then wanted

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Speaker 1: more of it and more of it and more of it.

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Speaker 1: And what people don't really understand about same is that

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Speaker 1: it is addictive. As heroine. The second we get a

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Speaker 1: taste of the spotlight, most of us, we want more

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Speaker 1: and more and more. And that's what happened with Anna.

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Speaker 1: She was in denial. She was projecting anything that she

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Speaker 1: was thinking about herself on to other people. She asked

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Speaker 1: for what she wanted, as we just heard on the tapes,

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Speaker 1: she got it or she didn't get it, and she

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Speaker 1: moved on. She did not have a conscience to think

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Speaker 1: about is this the right thing? Am I hurting anybody?

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Speaker 1: That's not how these people think. And it became more

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Speaker 1: and more and more, because fame is addictive, you know,

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Speaker 1: Wendy passion. She may have justified it in her own mind,

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Speaker 1: certainly not defending her because this is irrational. Rate, This

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Speaker 1: is not reasoning, it's irrational. She was taking from rich

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Speaker 1: people in the Hamptons. I'm talking to like thirty million

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Speaker 1: dollar homes with you know, guest houses that are bigger

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Speaker 1: than our homes or apartments. She was taking from someone

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Speaker 1: that could afford it, while she over date on the

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Speaker 1: yacht for a week because somebody else much richer than

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Speaker 1: her was paying for it. So I wonder in her

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Speaker 1: mind did she justify it that way only had it

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Speaker 1: been a very short amount of time, or something over

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Speaker 1: a weekend or maybe even a week. But the amount

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Speaker 1: of time, the duration that this went on, there was

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Speaker 1: no conceivable way in her mind that she possibly could

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Speaker 1: have thought she would pay any of it back. You know,

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Speaker 1: she may have faked it until she made it when

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Speaker 1: she first got to New York, but when stealing money

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Speaker 1: from others over that period of time, faking it is fraud.

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Speaker 1: Hopefully that was a sound bite somebody used at her trial,

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Speaker 1: because there's no other way circumstantially you can justify that

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Speaker 1: many victims over that long period of time, and even

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Speaker 1: now it's still all about her. Take a listen to

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Speaker 1: our friend Emily mate Less at the BBC cut ten.

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Speaker 1: Why do you think so many people believed you then?

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Speaker 1: What was it in your personality that could convince people?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I think, like maybe Beny and I

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Speaker 1: was smart and I was working on something that was

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Speaker 1: that could have like a great potential and that would

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Speaker 1: be successful. I don't know. I don't feel like it

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Speaker 1: has much to do with my personality. I guess I'd like,

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Speaker 1: I really believed in myself on out what I was doing. Um,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, it's just it's it's hard to explain.

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Speaker 1: I guess like people just see like I'm talented and

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Speaker 1: I'm focused, and I worked hard, and I couldn't make

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Speaker 1: them a lot of money. Rebecca Roisenberg worked hard at WHAT.

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Speaker 1: Every time I see a photo or a post of her,

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Speaker 1: she's on a luxury trip or she's shopping work at

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Speaker 1: WHAT Well. I think I think her a lot of

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Speaker 1: her victims wanted to believe in her success because it

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Speaker 1: meant their success too. You know, if she's saying, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to build this Anna Delby Foundation in Manhattan

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Speaker 1: for twenty two million, and you know one of the person,

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Speaker 1: one of the people she'd do with, the architect, well

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Speaker 1: for him, you know, he he wanted to be involved

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Speaker 1: in that big project, so he wanted to sort of

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Speaker 1: believe the lie because it would ultimately helped him. So

429
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 1: I think a lot of it was people wanting to

430
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: kind of believe it was true because there was an

431
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 1: advantage to them. These are just some of the things,

432
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,480
Speaker 1: And I want to go to you on Jim Ellis

433
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:16,880
Speaker 1: that we have uncovered falsifying financial documents from international banks.

434
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:25,000
Speaker 1: Wait for it, totally approximately sixty million euros, securing a

435
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:27,879
Speaker 1: loan of one hundred grand after lying to bank reps

436
00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 1: from CTI, depositing countless bad checks and to other banks.

437
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 1: I guess you know how you flow to check. You

438
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 1: deposit a check, you would draw the funds, and then

439
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:44,680
Speaker 1: you try to short up from another bad account so

440
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 1: that won't fall through, and then another He basically play

441
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:53,040
Speaker 1: ropadope on banks. That was totally nearly eighty thousand dollars.

442
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:56,680
Speaker 1: That doesn't include the money she conned off our friends,

443
00:27:56,840 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 1: never paying them back, theft of almost a half a

444
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 1: million dollars. I mean that's a lot of money, Jim. Oh, absolutely,

445
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:12,080
Speaker 1: it's a lot of money. And you mentioned earlier you

446
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 1: weren't sure how she ever worked hard. She worked hard

447
00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:21,160
Speaker 1: in preparing all these fraudulent documents and passing all those

448
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:25,879
Speaker 1: bogus checks and coming up with stories that were plausible

449
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:28,760
Speaker 1: but yet not too specific. The life of the con

450
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 1: is hard work, and they do it for the for

451
00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 1: the power, they do it for the money, They do

452
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 1: it for the same. I think she solved the banks

453
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 1: as her potential savior. You know, you think of of

454
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 1: like Elizabeth Holmes with Sarinos. You know, was she a

455
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 1: genius or was she a scam artist? You know, if

456
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 1: if if Sorkin was able to produce all these phony

457
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:58,920
Speaker 1: documents and convince a bank to lend her twenty two

458
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 1: million dollars, So why explain that to us mere mortals?

459
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 1: What do you mean produce phony documents and convinced big

460
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 1: banks to learn her a lot of money? Sure it happened.

461
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:15,200
Speaker 1: You know, she apparently was really adept in Adobe photoshop.

462
00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:19,080
Speaker 1: I mean, she was taking documents and altering them to

463
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:23,080
Speaker 1: convince the bankers that she had Swiss bank accounts, that

464
00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:27,600
Speaker 1: she had trust documents, that she had lawyers and CPAs

465
00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:31,719
Speaker 1: or accountants over in Europe. And it was going, at

466
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 1: least to a certain extent, probably until it hit the

467
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,600
Speaker 1: underwriting department, the people in the back of the office

468
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 1: who make sure everything's all the boxes are checked. It

469
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 1: was it was painting a picture of her, of exactly

470
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:50,280
Speaker 1: who she was claiming to be. And I think if

471
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:54,320
Speaker 1: she probably she possibly could have felt that if she

472
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 1: was able to land that loan, in her mind, she

473
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:00,480
Speaker 1: probably was going to pay all those people go back

474
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:04,040
Speaker 1: that she had scammed pre mind. It's in her mind,

475
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,160
Speaker 1: it's and she may have we don't know. She's kicking

476
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 1: the can down the road. She's getting her next victim,

477
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 1: and when that, when it comes time to pay them back,

478
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 1: she'll worry about that later. It's it's never ending. I mean,

479
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,360
Speaker 1: it's it's what brings down every Ponzi scheme in the end.

480
00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 1: And this wasn't a large scale Ponzi scheme, but you know,

481
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:28,720
Speaker 1: some of them money she scammed from from through those

482
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 1: phony checks that she deposited with City Bank and the

483
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 1: loan she got from um City National Bank, she used

484
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 1: to pay some of her debts that to the hotels

485
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 1: and other businesses so that she could stay afloat and

486
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:48,600
Speaker 1: maintain that illusion. Well, Jamillis, I guess what you're saying

487
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 1: is she would pay back the hotels to the extent

488
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:53,480
Speaker 1: that she could get them to allow her to stay

489
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:56,920
Speaker 1: there for even longer. I mean, what does that mean.

490
00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 1: Dakota check? Well, Dakata check. And it's a harder nowadays

491
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 1: than they used to be because the float, which is

492
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,400
Speaker 1: the time that a check is deposited into one bank

493
00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: and actually clears in the originating bank it's so much shorter.

494
00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 1: But you you basically take a check and you present

495
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:19,240
Speaker 1: it to a bank that you know is worthless. Order

496
00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:22,120
Speaker 1: may appear it has funds, but by the time that

497
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:25,160
Speaker 1: check is presented for payment to the originating bank, and

498
00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:29,760
Speaker 1: I'm sorry this is probably very very technical, there aren't

499
00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 1: any funds available. And from what I read, she's submitted

500
00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 1: one hundred and sixty thousand dollars worth of fraud in

501
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:39,680
Speaker 1: the checks and she was able to get seventy thousand

502
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:42,400
Speaker 1: in cash out of it. That's a that's actually a

503
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:47,400
Speaker 1: really good turnaround on the scam. I mean, she had

504
00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 1: to know that what she was doing was wrong, and

505
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 1: every day in court it played out like fashion week

506
00:31:56,360 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 1: in New York. Everyone was looking not me, but everyone

507
00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: else was looking to see what she was wearing, what

508
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 1: her demeanor was going to be. That day in court.

509
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,720
Speaker 1: She even had a confrontation with the judge about what

510
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 1: she wore to court. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace Take

511
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:33,240
Speaker 1: us to Our Cut eight is St. Johnson GMA. The

512
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,080
Speaker 1: courtroom drama played out late into the evening. At one

513
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 1: point the jury appeared deadlock, the defense asking for a mistrial,

514
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 1: but then the verdict jurors agreeing with the prosecution that

515
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 1: Annasaurkin built her fairy tale life on a foundation of

516
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:51,160
Speaker 1: theft and lies. Overnight, a New York City jury finding

517
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:56,200
Speaker 1: socialite Annasaurkan, a so called SOHO grifter, guilty on eight counts,

518
00:32:56,360 --> 00:33:01,720
Speaker 1: including grand larceny, attempted grand larceny, and theft services prosecutors

519
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 1: arguing the twenty eight year old stole a quarter of

520
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 1: a million dollars from banks, hotels and friends to fund

521
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 1: a lavish lifestyle. The jury's obviously believed our point of

522
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 1: view and followed our logic and acquitted her for the

523
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,200
Speaker 1: top charges. I'm sad and that she was convicted of

524
00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 1: some of the other charges. Sorkin was acquitted of two charges,

525
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 1: including the most serious, so attempting to steal more than

526
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:25,440
Speaker 1: one million dollars from City National Bank. She now faces

527
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 1: deportation and up to fifteen years in prison. Jee Rebecca

528
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 1: resuming joining us from Foxy's Digital, explaining the split verdict.

529
00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:37,480
Speaker 1: What was she convicted on? Anne on? What was she acquitted?

530
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 1: She was acquitted on trying to score this massive twenty

531
00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 1: million dollars loan, which was one of the top charges.

532
00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 1: That was the attempted grand larceny and she was acquitted

533
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 1: of stealing the number kind of buried, but around seventy

534
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:56,920
Speaker 1: thousand from Rachel Deloche. That was the trip that she

535
00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,840
Speaker 1: invited her best friend at the time, Richard Deloshan, to

536
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 1: Morocco where they stayed me seven thousand a night riad

537
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 1: in outside of Marrakesh, and at the end of the

538
00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 1: trip she stuck her with bill. She persuaded her to

539
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 1: put the entire trip on her credit card and she

540
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 1: would pay her back. So those were the two main

541
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:18,879
Speaker 1: counts she was acquitted on and then she was convicted

542
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:25,959
Speaker 1: in She was convicted in the chartered plane incident. Wait, wait,

543
00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 1: let me let that, so can Rebecca Riisenberg. They chartered

544
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 1: plane incident? What was that? So it was called Blade

545
00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: as the company, and she persuaded them to fly her

546
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:43,279
Speaker 1: without paying up front to a Berkshire Halthaway conference in

547
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:48,240
Speaker 1: Omaha and basically was like, I'll pay you later, and

548
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:50,880
Speaker 1: they thought she'd paid them later and she didn't. And

549
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:52,920
Speaker 1: that was about thirty five thousand dollars. It was a

550
00:34:53,000 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 1: chartered flight. They chartered flight incident. Okay, so she up

551
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:05,680
Speaker 1: going to not just jail, but to rikers is anybody

552
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:11,800
Speaker 1: on the panel familiar with Rikers? Okay, yes, just by reputation. Yeah,

553
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:14,600
Speaker 1: you don't want to go there unless you have to

554
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 1: take a Listen to Annasirokan aka Delvaney speaking to our

555
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 1: friend Deborah Roberts at ABC. Now thirty years old, Sarakin

556
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 1: says she's paid for her mistakes her time behind bars,

557
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:32,320
Speaker 1: including nineteen months in New York's infamous Rikers Island jailed,

558
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 1: some of it in solitary confinement. You're being held in Rikers,

559
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 1: one of the most frightening jails in the country. What

560
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:44,239
Speaker 1: was that like for you? Were you terrified in a

561
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:48,080
Speaker 1: way that was therapeutic? I mean it's a therapeutic I

562
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:50,680
Speaker 1: for example, use the time, like to read a lot

563
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:53,040
Speaker 1: and to write. You've heard that, You've said that it's

564
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,319
Speaker 1: a prison is kind of a waste of time. Yeah,

565
00:35:55,640 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 1: taking a person, stripping them off everything, putting them side

566
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:04,480
Speaker 1: where they have pretty much faith, few opportunities to rehabilitate.

567
00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:07,640
Speaker 1: So how is this supposed to help someone who already

568
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:10,680
Speaker 1: had to resort to life of crime? And that tells

569
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:16,600
Speaker 1: me right there that Anna Delvi aka Anna sirokan learned

570
00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:20,279
Speaker 1: nothing from her time behind bars. Wendy patric nothing. It

571
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:23,240
Speaker 1: also tells us that she is admitting that she resorted

572
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:26,279
Speaker 1: to a life of crime, which countradicts everything she said

573
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 1: before the trial and even in some interviews after the trial,

574
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:31,880
Speaker 1: that she knew because she wasn't working, As you pointed

575
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:34,640
Speaker 1: out several times, there was no way she was going

576
00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 1: to be able to repay these loans. But sitting through

577
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:41,239
Speaker 1: the trial, sitting in Riker's Island prison therapeutic, you have

578
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:43,799
Speaker 1: to wonder whether she received special treatment. We don't know

579
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,240
Speaker 1: one way or the other, but it is very interesting

580
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 1: that her attitude apparently hasn't changed. I'm sure she got

581
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:53,600
Speaker 1: special treatment because she had managed to convince everyone that

582
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:56,759
Speaker 1: she was a celebrity that deserves special treatment. You know,

583
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:59,720
Speaker 1: Rebecca Rosenburg, I'm not sure I understand the not guilty

584
00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:05,320
Speaker 1: on the sixty grand she ripped off from Rachel Delisha Williams.

585
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 1: What was the jury's thinking. Well, I spoke to a

586
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 1: couple of jurors after the verdict and they kind of

587
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:15,239
Speaker 1: felt that in the end, Rachel came out ahead, even

588
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 1: though it was this like really stressful situation for her

589
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:22,200
Speaker 1: where she had put the payment for this trip on

590
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:25,960
Speaker 1: her work visa card and just you know, it was

591
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,360
Speaker 1: a sum of money that was greater than what she

592
00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:33,440
Speaker 1: earned as a salary. But eventually, you know, she did,

593
00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:38,800
Speaker 1: she did end up with I think her book advanced

594
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:40,840
Speaker 1: was three hundred thousand dollars. I don't know what she

595
00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 1: got paid from HBO. So I think that they just

596
00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:46,319
Speaker 1: didn't feel that bad for her. But why because why

597
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:49,880
Speaker 1: did they not feel bad for Rachel Williams? Because she

598
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 1: was also using Anna Stroka. You could say, like she,

599
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:55,879
Speaker 1: you know, it's sort of weird, like she's going out

600
00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,800
Speaker 1: with Anna all the time, and Anna's always paying for

601
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:04,360
Speaker 1: absolutely free thing. You know, I personally wouldn't feel that

602
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,640
Speaker 1: comfortable if I was going out with somebody, even if

603
00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 1: they were much wealthier than me, with them footing the

604
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 1: bill every time. So I think that was kind of

605
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: their reasoning. Take a listen to what happens immediately when

606
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:21,640
Speaker 1: she walks out from behind bars our cut fourteen inside edition.

607
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:24,240
Speaker 1: If you walked out of prison a free woman, hid,

608
00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:26,759
Speaker 1: what was the first thing you did? They brought me

609
00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 1: my fouance. I got on social media. She came out

610
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:34,600
Speaker 1: of prison and immediately sat down to do this interview

611
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 1: with us and immediately went on social media and immediately

612
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:41,279
Speaker 1: started to resume kind of a glamorous life. Sarkin is

613
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,799
Speaker 1: now back in custody awaiting a hearing to see if

614
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:47,239
Speaker 1: she will be deported to Germany. The big question is

615
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,879
Speaker 1: will she be released, She could be in the next

616
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 1: few weeks, and will she be deported. But whatever happens,

617
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 1: there is no question in my mind that we have

618
00:38:56,160 --> 00:39:00,120
Speaker 1: not heard the last from Anasaurikin. So the first thing

619
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,360
Speaker 1: she does is hot on social media. What does that

620
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:07,319
Speaker 1: tell you, doctor Rockwell, the same thing it tells you,

621
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:11,640
Speaker 1: doctor Gray, That she didn't feel bad about one thing

622
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,360
Speaker 1: through this entire event, that there's a lack of conscience,

623
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 1: and that she was loving the spotlight and she couldn't

624
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,440
Speaker 1: wait to get back into it. As I say, it's

625
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:25,680
Speaker 1: an addiction. It makes the hormones flash in your mind,

626
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:30,000
Speaker 1: You have endorphins. Your brain comes alive with your own

627
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 1: image and you love it, You salivate over it. And

628
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:36,919
Speaker 1: that's what happened to Anna Sorkin. Jim Ella Certified Fraught

629
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:41,520
Speaker 1: Examiner or now with his own firm JKE Texas dot Com,

630
00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:46,000
Speaker 1: Jim shopaholics or people that get a thrill out of

631
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:51,840
Speaker 1: buying things. I think Anna sirokan aka na Anna Delvy

632
00:39:53,080 --> 00:39:56,800
Speaker 1: got a thrill of some sort of this fake life

633
00:39:56,920 --> 00:40:01,799
Speaker 1: she was leading. Do you think someone unlike her can

634
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:04,759
Speaker 1: turn over a new leaf or is this just who

635
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:07,600
Speaker 1: she is? Well, that's a good question. I mean, I

636
00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 1: always hope I didn't say what you hope, Jim allis

637
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:16,560
Speaker 1: you investigated so many con guys, what do you think

638
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 1: they don't stop? I mean, as you pointed out, she

639
00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 1: immediately got back on social media, and I agree with

640
00:40:24,080 --> 00:40:27,960
Speaker 1: doctor Rockwell that it was for the endorphin rush of

641
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:31,759
Speaker 1: getting that hit, of getting that fame and putting out

642
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:35,640
Speaker 1: that projection. But I think it's also a certain aspect

643
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:40,120
Speaker 1: that that is rebuilding her stature so that she can

644
00:40:40,239 --> 00:40:44,839
Speaker 1: now see where she can get her next meal ticket from.

645
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:49,120
Speaker 1: I mean, I saw in preparing for today that she's having,

646
00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 1: you know, contact with Julia Fox, who used to be

647
00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:56,920
Speaker 1: with Kanye West, and she's saying that they may have

648
00:40:57,160 --> 00:40:59,520
Speaker 1: a project in the works. Yeah, I wonder what that

649
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:03,919
Speaker 1: could be. But who in the right mind would want

650
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:07,880
Speaker 1: to work with somebody that just got out of prison

651
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:12,479
Speaker 1: for defrauding hundreds of thousands of dollars from the people

652
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 1: she was closest to well, you know what, I may

653
00:41:15,239 --> 00:41:18,520
Speaker 1: have an answer. Take a listen to my long time

654
00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 1: friend in colleague at ABC, Deborah Roberts oar Cut twelve

655
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:26,280
Speaker 1: now out on parole. Sorkin's documenting her freedom on social media,

656
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:29,839
Speaker 1: moving into a new apartment, shopping and dining out her

657
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:33,680
Speaker 1: new life, financed partly by a Netflix deal she signed

658
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:36,879
Speaker 1: while behind bars. It's said to be worth just over

659
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:40,640
Speaker 1: three hundred thousand dollars. Many people would find that very

660
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:44,840
Speaker 1: strange that you had gotten into trouble, You went to trial,

661
00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:47,800
Speaker 1: you went to prison, and there's a Netflix deal around

662
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:50,759
Speaker 1: your story. I find it strange deal. So were you

663
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 1: sort of milking your crime for the fame? Now? Definitely not.

664
00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 1: Do you feel badly? Do you have regrets? I feel

665
00:41:58,040 --> 00:42:01,239
Speaker 1: like I'm just trying to deal with with consequences of

666
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:06,120
Speaker 1: my actions. I was young. I would not repeat my actions.

667
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:08,400
Speaker 1: I'm just trying to make the best out of my situation.

668
00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:12,520
Speaker 1: I was young. It was just a couple of years ago. Okay,

669
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:16,960
Speaker 1: watch out for this woman. She's waiting for deportation Germany.

670
00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:22,400
Speaker 1: You can have her. We're sending her over cod Nancy

671
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:24,920
Speaker 1: Gray's crime story signing off goodbye friend,