1 00:00:01,680 --> 00:00:07,120 Speaker 1: Colze Media a warning this episode includes violent content which 2 00:00:07,120 --> 00:00:08,639 Speaker 1: some listeners might find disturbing. 3 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 2: I'm Michael Phillips, an historian and the author of the 4 00:00:14,720 --> 00:00:18,160 Speaker 2: history of racism in Dallas called White Metropolis, and the 5 00:00:18,200 --> 00:00:21,800 Speaker 2: co author with longtime journalist Betsy Freeoff, of the history 6 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,840 Speaker 2: of the eugenics in Texas called The Purifying Knife. 7 00:00:25,079 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: And I'm Stephen Monchelli. I'm an investigative reporter who specializes 8 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,639 Speaker 1: in political extremism and far right internet culture, and I 9 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:34,800 Speaker 1: contribute to outlets like The Texas Observer, The barb Buyer. 10 00:00:34,840 --> 00:00:35,200 Speaker 3: And more. 11 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:39,879 Speaker 2: In the last episode, we began exploring the shady history 12 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:42,720 Speaker 2: behind the most popular form of capital punishment in the 13 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:47,320 Speaker 2: United States, lethal injection. We described how one after another, 14 00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:50,839 Speaker 2: execution by hanging, then the electric chair, and then the 15 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:55,440 Speaker 2: gash chamber was tauted's cleanest, quickest, most modern, painless way 16 00:00:55,480 --> 00:00:58,960 Speaker 2: to put a person to death. Each method, however, proved 17 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 2: more violent and grucie than previously expected. In order to 18 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:06,320 Speaker 2: prevent a ground swell of opposition to the death penalty, 19 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 2: politicians responded by abolishing public executions in the nineteen seventies 20 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:15,319 Speaker 2: latched on to lethal injection as the newest, gentlest and 21 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:17,520 Speaker 2: kindest method of state killing. 22 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 1: I discussed in the first episode. The lethal injection protocol 23 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 1: was designed by an Oklahoma corner doctor, Stephen Crawford, who 24 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:26,840 Speaker 1: once admitted to an interviewer that although he was an 25 00:01:26,840 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 1: expert in dead bodies, he didn't know how to get 26 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:33,360 Speaker 1: him that way. Authorities turned to Crawford because doctors who 27 00:01:33,440 --> 00:01:37,040 Speaker 1: dealt with living bodies wanted nothing to do with executions, 28 00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:40,319 Speaker 1: So Crawford designed a three drug protocol for executions that 29 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 1: he made up pretty much out of thin air, reasoning 30 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:44,679 Speaker 1: that if one deadly drug was good for killing, then 31 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: three drugs would be even better. The problem was that 32 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: the three drugs counteract each other and would result in 33 00:01:50,600 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 1: longer executions and in deaths that resembled slow drowning. 34 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 2: Crawford did no homework, and neither did the more than 35 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 2: thirty states that eventually adopted ly injection as a preferred 36 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:05,640 Speaker 2: method of execution. This occurred after the Supreme Court brought 37 00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:08,400 Speaker 2: the death penalty back to life with its nineteen seventy 38 00:02:08,440 --> 00:02:12,880 Speaker 2: six greg versus Georgia decision. Following a ten year pause, 39 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:16,440 Speaker 2: it would not be until December seventh, nineteen eighty two 40 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 2: the state of Texas carried out the first execution by 41 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 2: lethal injection in the world. In this episode, we'll talk 42 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:26,120 Speaker 2: to a journalist, Dick Revis, who witnessed brookes execution. 43 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:30,639 Speaker 4: One thing I noticed was that there were a half 44 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:33,959 Speaker 4: a dozen or more loanmen in there who had on 45 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:39,080 Speaker 4: cowboy hats. They did not remove that Charlie was killed, 46 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 4: and I also thought that wasn't quite bright. But in 47 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:49,000 Speaker 4: any case, I don't recall any anybody saying anything. We 48 00:02:49,000 --> 00:02:55,320 Speaker 4: were silent while all of this was going on, and 49 00:02:55,600 --> 00:03:01,120 Speaker 4: Charlie only spoke to say allow, and the beg was 50 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 4: dying when that happened. It was obvious that he was 51 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:05,960 Speaker 4: scared to death. 52 00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 1: Revis told us that Brooks, as he recalled it, seemingly 53 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,919 Speaker 1: drifted off to sleep. But that's not all that may 54 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 1: have been occurring. According to Professor Karin Elaine, the author 55 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:21,080 Speaker 1: of the recently published book Secrets of the Killing State, 56 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 1: who you heard from in the first episode, something very 57 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 1: different was likely going on in Brooks's mind and body. 58 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: According to Lane, Brooks was slowly suffocating. Medical experts, Lane said, 59 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:35,800 Speaker 1: believe that those executed with lethal injections are often not 60 00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 1: fully unconscious and that the paralytic drugs fed into their 61 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:42,840 Speaker 1: veins prevent them from fully communicating their suffering, even as 62 00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 1: they may be aware of it. 63 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 5: The courts that have heard this medical testimony. There was 64 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:49,800 Speaker 5: a court in. 65 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 3: Ohio and said, yeah, you know, all of the medical 66 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:58,400 Speaker 3: experts are describing acute pulmonary edema as a drowning from within. 67 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 3: It is you can't catch your breath, You've got fluid 68 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 3: coming into your lungs, and you can't do anything about it. 69 00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:09,360 Speaker 3: And the court said, you know, this is the sensation 70 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 3: akin to waterboarding. 71 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:13,839 Speaker 5: You know, we're waterboarding people to death. That's what we're 72 00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 5: actually doing. 73 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 2: In this episode, we'll also talk about how the modern 74 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:22,279 Speaker 2: death penalty peaked in the nineteen nineties, and why pressure 75 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:25,919 Speaker 2: from drug manufacturers and activists led not only to a 76 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 2: decline in executions, but the revival in some states of 77 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:32,920 Speaker 2: some very old forms of execution, such as the electric 78 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 2: chair and the firing squad. 79 00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 1: It's a fascinating but often frightening story, and one that 80 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:41,720 Speaker 1: will have to continue after perhaps less gripping messages from 81 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 1: our sponsors. 82 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 2: Big changes came to the death penalty in Texas in 83 00:04:56,040 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 2: nineteen twenty three. Before then, hangings were carried out by 84 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:03,159 Speaker 2: sheriffs and the counties where the murderers, rapes, and other 85 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:06,760 Speaker 2: crimes committed by the prisoner took place. Many of the 86 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 2: sheriffs were inexperience in hanging and goring mishaps took place. 87 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:14,360 Speaker 2: Texas last public execution on fold in August thirty first, 88 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 2: nineteen twenty three, when African American Nathan Lee was hanged 89 00:05:18,320 --> 00:05:22,480 Speaker 2: before one hundred and fifty spectators in Brazoria County. From 90 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 2: nineteen hundred to nineteen twenty, close to seventy percent of 91 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 2: the inmates executed in Texas were African American. 92 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: In nineteen twenty three, Texas sought to modernize and bring 93 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:37,520 Speaker 1: industrial efficiency to state killing. All executions henceforth would be 94 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:40,800 Speaker 1: carried out at the state prison in Huntsville, and prisoners 95 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:44,160 Speaker 1: would die in an electric chair. Locals gave it a 96 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: glib name, Old Sparky. The state's new killing machine got 97 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 1: a workout the day it debuted February eighth, nineteen twenty five. 98 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 1: Texas executed five prisoners that day, all black men. Between 99 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:59,160 Speaker 1: that date and July thirtieth, nineteen sixty four, when the 100 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:02,920 Speaker 1: state electrocuted did Joseph Johnson, a man convicted of fatally 101 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 1: shooting a store owner during a robbery. Texas sent three 102 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 1: hundred and sixty one inmates to the electric chair. African 103 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 1: Americans made up sixty three percent of the prisoners who 104 00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: died in that chair, while seventy percent of those who 105 00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:19,719 Speaker 1: died in the electric chair were Mexican American. Texas politicians 106 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:23,360 Speaker 1: insisted that their tough on crime policies served as a deterrent, 107 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:27,160 Speaker 1: but in fact, from nineteen thirty three to nineteen sixty four, 108 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:31,159 Speaker 1: the year Joseph Johnson was executed, the murdery in Texas 109 00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 1: was twelve point seven per one hundred thousand people, the 110 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 1: eight highest in the United States. Nevertheless, Texas leaders have 111 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:41,719 Speaker 1: continued to justify the death penalty in spite of its 112 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 1: seemingly negligible impact on the state's violent culture, and the 113 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:49,279 Speaker 1: violence of capital punishment was about performative toughness, not about 114 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,919 Speaker 1: stopping future murders. As a reporter who witnessed a hanging 115 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 1: laments in the film In Cold Blood and. 116 00:06:55,880 --> 00:07:01,760 Speaker 3: Then next one, next year, same thing will happen again, 117 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:04,839 Speaker 3: maybe this would help to start. 118 00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:07,280 Speaker 4: It never had. 119 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 2: After Johnson, Texas didn't execute another inmate for eighteen years. 120 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,920 Speaker 2: Following the Greg versus Georgia decision, Texas faced a potential 121 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:22,680 Speaker 2: public relations disaster. As we mentioned last episode, Dallas television 122 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 2: reporter Tony Garrett filed suit to allow television cameras to 123 00:07:26,440 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 2: film executions, and a federal district court ranted a preliminary 124 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 2: injunction in the reporter's favor. That injunction was later overturned, 125 00:07:35,520 --> 00:07:38,720 Speaker 2: But under the Texas Capital Dome there were was worry 126 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 2: about what would happen to support for the death penalty 127 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:46,520 Speaker 2: if an electrocution was broadcast live. The legislator who wrote 128 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 2: Texas new death penalty law to Greg decision said he 129 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:53,320 Speaker 2: was quote repulsed by the idea of an electrocution taking 130 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 2: place in someone's living room. Lethal injection, as Professor Lane 131 00:07:57,520 --> 00:08:00,960 Speaker 2: had put it, had visual appeal because it would resemble 132 00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 2: healthful medical procedures and because quote states have been euthanizing 133 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,280 Speaker 2: pets with pentode barbital since the nineteen thirties. 134 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:11,760 Speaker 1: Animals are typically put to sleep with a two drug protocol, 135 00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 1: first a sedative and then the drug that does the deed. 136 00:08:15,480 --> 00:08:17,560 Speaker 1: But the three drug protocol that would be adopted by 137 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 1: most states that allowed capital punishment produced nightmarish results that 138 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:24,600 Speaker 1: were typically invisible to witnesses. States typically allowed family members 139 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 1: of the crime victim to attend executions, and the condemned 140 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: also got to choose witnesses. In the early days of Texas' 141 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:34,240 Speaker 1: reborn death penalty, the state's populist Democratic Attorney General GYM. 142 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:36,800 Speaker 1: Mannix liked to make a show of attending each execution, 143 00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 1: and though much of the death penalty process has been 144 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:42,600 Speaker 1: shrouded in secrecy, such as who is providing the lethal chemicals, 145 00:08:42,880 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 1: states also allowed reporters to attend executions so that they 146 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 1: could serve as the eyes and ears of the public. 147 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 2: In his younger days, Dick Revis was the civil rights 148 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:55,679 Speaker 2: activists who served time in Alabama jail for his efforts 149 00:08:55,720 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 2: to secure vetting rights for African Americans. Revis became a journalist, 150 00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:02,400 Speaker 2: and by the early nineteen eighties he was a frequent 151 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:07,719 Speaker 2: contributor to Texas Monthly, one of the state's premier investigative publications. 152 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 2: In nineteen eighty two, he got the chance to witness 153 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 2: an event that had never happened in the United States 154 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:16,520 Speaker 2: or perhaps even the world. The Texas Department of Corrections 155 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 2: would soon pioneer the use of lethal injection, although the 156 00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:22,880 Speaker 2: first person to be put to death in this manner 157 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:23,840 Speaker 2: was still unclear. 158 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:28,080 Speaker 4: I recall a meeting with an editor and they said 159 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:32,160 Speaker 4: somehow they told me that there's a lady at the capitol, 160 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:35,560 Speaker 4: or a lady and the government in Austin, which is 161 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,839 Speaker 4: where I was, a living man, who was in charge 162 00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 4: of scheduling the executions. So I called her up and 163 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 4: she said, well, she didn't have any album scheduled, but 164 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 4: she could give me the naymes of it was either 165 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:56,960 Speaker 4: four or five people who would be first, and one 166 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:02,239 Speaker 4: of them who was candy Man, a fellow who poisoned 167 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 4: his own child, putting poisoned in some candy at Halloween. 168 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:12,120 Speaker 1: Revis is referring to Ronald Clark O'Brien, a Houston area 169 00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 1: optician who fell into debt. He was one hundred thousand 170 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:19,320 Speaker 1: dollars deep, so he bought a life insurance policy on 171 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:22,040 Speaker 1: his eight year old son and daughter before he prepared 172 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:26,280 Speaker 1: five pixie sticks poisoned with potassium cyanide, and on Halloween 173 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:29,079 Speaker 1: night in nineteen seventy four, he went trick or treating 174 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:31,800 Speaker 1: with his children. A neighbor and that man's two children. 175 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:34,200 Speaker 1: The group went to an abandoned house and knocked on 176 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:36,599 Speaker 1: the door, and when no one answered, O'Brien convinced the 177 00:10:36,640 --> 00:10:38,840 Speaker 1: rest of the group to move on. He caught up 178 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:41,040 Speaker 1: with them later and claimed that someone had in fact 179 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:43,960 Speaker 1: answered the door, and then he handed out four of 180 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:47,760 Speaker 1: the poisoned candies to the children. When the O'Brien's returned home, 181 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 1: the killer handed the fifth pixie stick to a neighborhood child. 182 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:54,880 Speaker 1: Later that night, O'Brien told his children that they could 183 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:57,040 Speaker 1: enjoy one candy from the evening, and he urged them 184 00:10:57,040 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: to choose the pixie sticks. And when his child, Timothy 185 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 1: complained the candy tasted bitter, O'Brien gave him kool aid 186 00:11:03,960 --> 00:11:07,839 Speaker 1: to wash down the poison. Timothy started vomiting and died 187 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:10,199 Speaker 1: on the way to the hospital. None of the other 188 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 1: children tried the poison candy. 189 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 4: That night. 190 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:16,480 Speaker 2: O'Brien claimed that a malevolent stranger had poisoned the candy, 191 00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:20,880 Speaker 2: and he sang at his son's funeral. His story fell apart, however, 192 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:24,800 Speaker 2: when the police discovered the life insurance policies. When O'Brien 193 00:11:24,840 --> 00:11:26,959 Speaker 2: was unable to identify the house where he had been 194 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 2: supposedly handed the pixie sticks, and when the cops found 195 00:11:30,040 --> 00:11:33,560 Speaker 2: out that O'Brien had purchased cyanide from a chemical store 196 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:36,920 Speaker 2: in Houston, a jury sends him to death on June third, 197 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 2: nineteen seventy five. The murder created a last day national legacy, 198 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:44,960 Speaker 2: sparking paranoia about the safety of trick or treating. 199 00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 1: State of Texas knew that executing O'Brien would be politically 200 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: popular and would probably boost support for the death penalty. 201 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,319 Speaker 1: Not knowing which resident of Texas's death row would be 202 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:57,319 Speaker 1: strapped to the gurney first, REVS ended up interviewing all 203 00:11:57,360 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 1: but one inmate on the list he had been given. 204 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 1: Heel's process, however, is unpredictable, and a Fort Worth man 205 00:12:03,400 --> 00:12:06,000 Speaker 1: known for most of his life as Charlie Brooks, would 206 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,199 Speaker 1: end up winning the dubious honor of being the first 207 00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:10,720 Speaker 1: to be put to death by lethal injection. He was 208 00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:12,679 Speaker 1: convicted for the fatal shooting of a twenty six year 209 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:16,440 Speaker 1: old mechanic, David Gregory, during a nineteen seventy six robbery. 210 00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 2: By the time REVIS interviewed him, Brooks had converted to 211 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:25,520 Speaker 2: Islam and taken the name Sharif Achmad abdul Rahem. That 212 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:27,680 Speaker 2: is the name we will use referring to him for 213 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:31,079 Speaker 2: the rest of the episode. Abdul Raheem had committed the 214 00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 2: robbery with another man, Witty lords He posed to someone 215 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:37,160 Speaker 2: wanting to buy a used car and asked to take 216 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:41,200 Speaker 2: a test strive. Gregory agreed to ride with him. Abdul 217 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 2: Rahem picked up Lordes. The pair through Gregory in a 218 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:48,480 Speaker 2: car trunk, drove him to a ramshackle motel, tied him 219 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 2: to a chair, and taped his mouth shut. Abdul Raheem 220 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:54,400 Speaker 2: and Lordis accused each other of firing the fatal shot. 221 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 2: No weapon was ever found. Lordis eventually received the death penalty, 222 00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:02,400 Speaker 2: but after that was a returned, he reached an agreement 223 00:13:02,440 --> 00:13:06,200 Speaker 2: with prosecutors and received a forty year sentence. He would 224 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:10,000 Speaker 2: end up serving only eleven. The disparity in sentencing is 225 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:12,839 Speaker 2: one of the defining features of how capital punishment is 226 00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:16,840 Speaker 2: carried out, even after greg versus Georgia had supposedly addressed 227 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,199 Speaker 2: that issue shortly before. 228 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:23,520 Speaker 1: His execution, Abdul Raheem insisted on his innocence, but according 229 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:26,959 Speaker 1: to Revis, the condemned man was lying. Revis described to 230 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: us his relationship with Abdul Raheem aka Charlie Brooks. 231 00:13:31,440 --> 00:13:37,080 Speaker 4: Charlie was very alert, a test on his feet, engaged. 232 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:42,280 Speaker 4: It was not moping around sad. He had a sense 233 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:45,960 Speaker 4: of humor. He told me in the first interview I 234 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 4: had with him that he was innocent and that this 235 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:56,840 Speaker 4: was rachel discrimination, that they executed more blacks than whites. 236 00:13:57,679 --> 00:14:00,959 Speaker 4: And I'm told him, oh, you want us for him 237 00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:05,319 Speaker 4: to excuse more white people? Huh. And that stunned me 238 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,600 Speaker 4: because I think no one had ever said that to him. 239 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:14,079 Speaker 4: But that would do away with racial discrimination. And there's 240 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,439 Speaker 4: lots of white people need executed too. It was my 241 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 4: way of thinking. 242 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 3: Uh. 243 00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:22,200 Speaker 4: And he didn't get mad at me or anything. He 244 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 4: kind of laughed at it himself. After he paused to 245 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 4: understand the question. Then he kind of laughed at it himself. 246 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:36,040 Speaker 4: But I would say he was even until until they're 247 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:40,520 Speaker 4: getting strapped down. He was in control of his own body. 248 00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 4: His mind was in great shape. He lied to me 249 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 4: about about whether or not he was innocent. 250 00:14:52,520 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 1: Brooks told Revis that although the gun went off, he 251 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:57,000 Speaker 1: didn't pull the trigger. It was an accident. 252 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 4: At some point I got in to say that, oh, 253 00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 4: the gun went off, and I went and pulled the 254 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:10,560 Speaker 4: transcript of this criminal trial. The gun was a revolver, 255 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 4: not an automatic. Revolvers don't go off to just that terry. 256 00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 4: I even took what I had and banged it on 257 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 4: the table while it was loaded and all and nothing happened. 258 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:31,360 Speaker 4: Revolvers don't go off until they've been cocked. Unless they've 259 00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:33,280 Speaker 4: been cocked, they can't go off. 260 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:36,720 Speaker 1: We'll return to the story of the world's first execution 261 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 1: by lethal injection and conceptive way it was used to 262 00:15:39,600 --> 00:16:03,520 Speaker 1: win public support for capital punishment. After this lovely adbreak. 263 00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:56,920 Speaker 2: There was a little bit of last spinted drama. A 264 00:15:57,120 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 2: zero hour for the execution of Charlie Brooks A came. 265 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 2: Abdul Rahem approached the Serreme Court rejected his appeal for 266 00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:08,640 Speaker 2: the last time. Shortly before the execution was scheduled began. 267 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 2: Jack Strickland, the prosecutor in abdul Raheem's murder trial, had 268 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 2: second thoughts about the differences between the condemned man sentence 269 00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 2: and that of his accomplice. Strickland testified on abdul Rahim's behalf, 270 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:25,520 Speaker 2: but to no avail. The Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals 271 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:28,880 Speaker 2: said the defense team had presented no new information that 272 00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 2: would justify a stay of execution. Just after midnight, State 273 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:36,840 Speaker 2: Attorney General Mark White called officials in Huntsville and told 274 00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 2: them that the historic execution could begin. 275 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:43,560 Speaker 1: From nineteen eighty two, the year of Abdulheim's execution, until 276 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:47,520 Speaker 1: twenty eleven. Texas allowed prisoners facing executions a choice of 277 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: a last meal of their choosing. Abdu Urheim's request, however, 278 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:52,640 Speaker 1: was rejected. 279 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:57,640 Speaker 4: He told me that for his last meal he wanted 280 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:03,240 Speaker 4: a prive shrimp and oysches, and he said he had 281 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:07,879 Speaker 4: told the authorities that that's what he wanted for his 282 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 4: last meal. When I got down there, I was told 283 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:18,440 Speaker 4: that there was no shellfish in the prison system's kitchens 284 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:21,680 Speaker 4: and Charlie had to pick. He finally picked steak in 285 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:28,159 Speaker 4: beach cobbler. But I felt bad about that because the 286 00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:32,200 Speaker 4: prison people knew that they could go to the grocery 287 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:36,720 Speaker 4: store and buy whatever Charlie wanted, and they didn't do it, 288 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,360 Speaker 4: and it was sort of I thought it was an 289 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:44,560 Speaker 4: indignity they inflicted on him. So when I went down 290 00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:48,440 Speaker 4: for the execution, I went down in the afternoon. Execution 291 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 4: was that night. I went out and laide fish just 292 00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:01,000 Speaker 4: how did he say? I don't know. Because of the situation, Worsham. 293 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:05,360 Speaker 1: Texas would end this final meal for prisoners on death 294 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:09,679 Speaker 1: row in twenty eleven. That's because of Lawrence Russell Brewer, 295 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 1: who was one of three white supremacists who chained an 296 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:15,240 Speaker 1: African American man, James Byrd, to the back of a 297 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 1: car in Jasper, Texas, and dragged him to death on 298 00:18:18,400 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: June seventh, nineteen ninety eight, as a last act. 299 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 2: Of bitter defiance. 300 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:26,760 Speaker 1: On the date of Brewer's execution September twenty first, twenty eleven, 301 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: Brewer ordered a last meal that included two chicken fried steaks, 302 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:35,560 Speaker 1: a triple meat bacon, cheeseburger, fried okra, a pound of barbecue, 303 00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 1: three fijidas, a meat lover's pizza, a pine of ice cream, 304 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:41,960 Speaker 1: and a slab of peanut butter fudge with crust of peanuts. 305 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 1: When he received all the food, he refused to touch 306 00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:49,239 Speaker 1: a bite. A State Senator, John Whitmeyer complained bitterly at 307 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:52,760 Speaker 1: the waste and expense lavished on such an infamous killer, 308 00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:57,280 Speaker 1: and prison officials immediately changed the policy. Today, those facing 309 00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,199 Speaker 1: execution are now only fed the same meal other prisoners 310 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 1: receive that day. 311 00:19:02,840 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 2: Revis believes that the process of being strapped down to 312 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:09,399 Speaker 2: a hospital like gurney is humiliating to those being executed. 313 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 4: Men die with more dignity when they're on their feet, 314 00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 4: For example, is walking to a scaffold when they still 315 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 4: feel in control of their lives. The hardest thing about 316 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:30,199 Speaker 4: lethal injections is that they strap you down where you 317 00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:37,520 Speaker 4: can't move, and you're sitting there, absolutely helped, helpless until 318 00:19:37,640 --> 00:19:39,840 Speaker 4: they till the drugs take effect. 319 00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 2: Revis described the atmosphere in the death chamber as Abdul 320 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:48,919 Speaker 2: Raheem was executed as tense and quiet. A prison girlfriend, 321 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 2: as Revis describes her, Vanessa Sap, was present, as were 322 00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:54,040 Speaker 2: numerous officials. 323 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:59,439 Speaker 4: First of all, the room it's too small. My recollection 324 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:02,600 Speaker 4: is there were was a circular self of chairs with 325 00:20:03,320 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 4: writing out ten feet twenty feet in a curve. It 326 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:12,479 Speaker 4: may not it may have been a corner, but it 327 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:16,320 Speaker 4: was barely room to hold the long man who wanted 328 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 4: to witness the execution, and Vaneza Sap and three reporters. 329 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 4: His wife was not present. She didn't want to be 330 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:30,600 Speaker 4: in and she didn't want to see it. As for 331 00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:36,119 Speaker 4: the audience, reaction. I don't recall that there was anything dramatic. 332 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:39,360 Speaker 4: Now I seem more routine. 333 00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:44,960 Speaker 1: Inspired by the story of Carol Chessman, the author and 334 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:48,520 Speaker 1: rapist executed in the gas chamber in nineteen sixty, who 335 00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:50,520 Speaker 1: worked out a signal he could send to reporters if 336 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:54,359 Speaker 1: he was suffering during execution. Revis and Abdul Raheem worked 337 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:57,879 Speaker 1: out a similar arrangement. If Abdul Raheem was suffering as 338 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 1: he was dying, he would shake his head. Reavis would 339 00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:03,160 Speaker 1: later regret making that arrangement. 340 00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 4: I interviewed him before the execution and we came up 341 00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:15,600 Speaker 4: with an idea. Unfortunately, it was mine that if he 342 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:20,960 Speaker 4: felt pain while he was dying, that he should shake 343 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:27,200 Speaker 4: his head. So I decided, and I say, it's unfortunate 344 00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 4: because and as things were, we were unable to I 345 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:36,040 Speaker 4: was unable to determine as if he was giving me 346 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:36,920 Speaker 4: that signal. 347 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:41,520 Speaker 2: The Revis did appeared that Abdul Raheem had simply drifted 348 00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:42,159 Speaker 2: off to sleep. 349 00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:47,640 Speaker 4: He seemed to die peacefully. I had to put down 350 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 4: a dog only a couple of years ago, or have 351 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:54,840 Speaker 4: the dog put down, and I was with him while 352 00:21:54,920 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 4: that happened, and I couldn't have you say. After seeing 353 00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:03,760 Speaker 4: those two things, I said, I wish I could dial 354 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:10,399 Speaker 4: that work. And yeah, there was no evidence with my dog, 355 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 4: for example, that there was any pain. It was like 356 00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:17,199 Speaker 4: I'm putting to sleep, and I think that's what they 357 00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:21,320 Speaker 4: did with Charlie. But it would take a doctor to know. 358 00:22:22,760 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 4: Of course. 359 00:22:23,359 --> 00:22:27,080 Speaker 2: Abdul Raheem's death was the first of its kind. As 360 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:29,800 Speaker 2: we mentioned last time, the three drug protocol that was 361 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:32,679 Speaker 2: used by most states over the last three decades was 362 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:35,919 Speaker 2: concocted out of thin air by someone no expertise on 363 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,719 Speaker 2: the effect of these drugs together on the human body. 364 00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:43,720 Speaker 2: Abdul Raheem's execution was a medical experiment conducted with no 365 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:48,200 Speaker 2: prior research. Professor Lane said that since abdul Rahem's execution, 366 00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:52,000 Speaker 2: doctors have had a chance to perform autopsies on those 367 00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:55,720 Speaker 2: executed by lethal injection, and witnesses have heard the cries 368 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,359 Speaker 2: of those who were able to speak while dying on 369 00:22:58,400 --> 00:22:58,920 Speaker 2: the gurney. 370 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 3: State experts to saying, oh, this first drug, you're going 371 00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:06,719 Speaker 3: to be ninety nine point nine niney nine percent of 372 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:09,840 Speaker 3: the public would be you know, out and dead within 373 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,040 Speaker 3: a minute. You don't even have to worry about those 374 00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:15,879 Speaker 3: other super tortuous drugs, and it's like, yeah, that's not 375 00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:19,760 Speaker 3: what was happening. They said they would stop breathing within 376 00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:24,480 Speaker 3: a minute, and there was some pretty prominent litigation, the 377 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 3: Morales case out in California, where they looked at the 378 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:34,400 Speaker 3: executions by lethal injection and said over half of them 379 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 3: they actually did not stop breathing within a minute. 380 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,399 Speaker 5: In fact, it was eight and nine minutes. 381 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,679 Speaker 3: And it did not kill them within two minutes of 382 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 3: injecting that third drug, which is called potassium chloride, but 383 00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:53,320 Speaker 3: it's referred to as liquid fire, and it chemically burns 384 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,480 Speaker 3: the veins as it races to the heart where it 385 00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 3: induces a cardiac arrest. 386 00:23:57,359 --> 00:23:59,359 Speaker 5: So they're like, you know, the experts like, oh, you 387 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:01,359 Speaker 5: know that is going to bring death in two minutes. 388 00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 6: That didn't happen, Like none of this was happening as 389 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:11,960 Speaker 6: the state and the state's experts were so confidently just saying. 390 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:16,440 Speaker 5: And it turns out, you know, no one had ever. 391 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 3: Studied these drugs in these amounts, nobody had ever injected 392 00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:23,479 Speaker 3: these drugs. 393 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:26,040 Speaker 5: In these amounts into people. This is not what was used. 394 00:24:26,119 --> 00:24:29,119 Speaker 3: I mean that's interesting too, Like this is not the 395 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:31,439 Speaker 3: drug that was used to use theized pets. 396 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,040 Speaker 5: This is not the drug that was used for positionists 397 00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:35,760 Speaker 5: as a suicide. 398 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 3: So it's like three totally different drugs, and you know, 399 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 3: and not only is nobody studied or nobody knew how 400 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:47,680 Speaker 3: they would work, but nobody could have predicted how they 401 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:49,320 Speaker 3: would have worked together. 402 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,920 Speaker 1: I was discussed in our last episode. A lethal injection 403 00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:58,600 Speaker 1: that killed Abdul Raheem included three drugs. Sodium theopental heavy sedative, 404 00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,840 Speaker 1: and coroni M bromide meant to suffocate the prisoner, and 405 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 1: potassium chloride meant to trigger a cardiac arrest. As Professor 406 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:09,280 Speaker 1: Lane wrote in her book Secrets of the Killing State, 407 00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:12,200 Speaker 1: because of one of the drugs using three drug protocol, 408 00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:16,880 Speaker 1: the drugs work poorly when combined. Quote, the pancoreum bromide 409 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,560 Speaker 1: couples the inability to breathe with the inability to struggle. 410 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 1: They cannot fight or scream or even rive in pain, 411 00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:29,199 Speaker 1: but all would seem calm on the surface. Texas's experiment 412 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:32,600 Speaker 1: in lethal injection was a political success for a while. 413 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:36,400 Speaker 1: The novelty of the revived death penalty brought back memories 414 00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:40,720 Speaker 1: of some public hangings. Students from nearby Sam Houston State 415 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:44,040 Speaker 1: University would show up and hold drunken parties outside the 416 00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:48,040 Speaker 1: prison in Huntsville on the night of executions, cheering loudly 417 00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:50,399 Speaker 1: enough that they could be heard inside the death chamber. 418 00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 1: The night that Ronald Clark O'Brien, the infamous candy man 419 00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,160 Speaker 1: who killed his son for insurance money, died, a crowd 420 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:01,919 Speaker 1: of about three hundred celebrated us, some yelling trick or 421 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: treat at the scheduled time of the execution, impelting anti 422 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:10,160 Speaker 1: death penalty protesters with candy. A huge cheer erupted when 423 00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:14,040 Speaker 1: the officials of the Walls Unit left, signaling that O'Brien 424 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:18,080 Speaker 1: had died a local bar through a Halloween party. Texas 425 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:20,879 Speaker 1: politicians made support for the death penalty central to their 426 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,160 Speaker 1: campaigns in this era. In the nineteen ninety Democratic Party 427 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:28,000 Speaker 1: gubernatorial primary, former Texas Governor Mark White faced off against 428 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 1: the state Attorney General, Jim Maddox and the eventual winner, 429 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:34,840 Speaker 1: State Treasurer Ann Richards. White and Maddox ran almost identical 430 00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: campaign ads, both walking past larger than life mug shots 431 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,760 Speaker 1: of murderers who were executed under their watch and claiming 432 00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:46,919 Speaker 1: credit for meeting out justice. Consider this ad for white. 433 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 7: These haggin criminals will never again murder, ripe or deal drugs. 434 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:55,760 Speaker 7: As governor, I made sure they received the ultimate punishment death, 435 00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:59,400 Speaker 7: and Texas is a cipher place for it. A tough 436 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,240 Speaker 7: talk is an enough. The criminals know how to tangle 437 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:05,280 Speaker 7: up the courts and delay executions. To bring them to 438 00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:09,280 Speaker 7: justice takes strength and dedication, because if the governor flinches, 439 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 7: they win. Only a governor can make executions happen. I did, 440 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,720 Speaker 7: and I will. 441 00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:20,840 Speaker 1: The popularity of the death penalty was sealed for decades. 442 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,200 Speaker 1: Starting with Abdul Raheem, Texas has led the United States 443 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:28,160 Speaker 1: in state killing. As of September twenty seventh, Texas had 444 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,439 Speaker 1: carried out five hundred and ninety six executions, more than 445 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:33,639 Speaker 1: thirty six percent of all of the executions that have 446 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:37,040 Speaker 1: unfolded since the United States Supreme Court allowed the death 447 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:40,359 Speaker 1: penalty to resume in this country in nineteen seventy six. 448 00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 2: More than forty percent of those executed in Texas since 449 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,639 Speaker 2: nineteen eighty two had been African American, almost thirty percent 450 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:51,480 Speaker 2: had been Mexican American. In twenty twenty four, Texas executed 451 00:27:51,520 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 2: six people. Only one was white. 452 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,040 Speaker 1: Meanwhile, Texas put to death sixty three prisoners who committed 453 00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 1: their crimes before they reached the age of twenty one. 454 00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 1: According to the Texas Coalition Against the Death Penalty, since 455 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy three, eighteen people sent to Texas death Row 456 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:10,879 Speaker 1: were later exonerated, out about two hundred nationally, and the 457 00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: group argues that there is strong evidence that at least 458 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:16,440 Speaker 1: six put to death in Huntsville were actually innocent. 459 00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:20,320 Speaker 2: Professor Lane argues that not only does death by lethal 460 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 2: injection violate the Eighth Amendments ban on cruel and Unusual punishment, 461 00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 2: but that most defendants facing the death penalty cannot afford 462 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 2: adequate legal counsel, and that an alarming number those sent 463 00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:35,840 Speaker 2: to death row, in some cases executed, have been innocent. 464 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 3: Two hundred people have been exonerated from death row two hundred. 465 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:45,640 Speaker 3: And when you put that next to the sixteen hundred 466 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:48,920 Speaker 3: executions that we've had in the modern era, what we 467 00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:53,640 Speaker 3: really have is for every eight executions, there's one exoneration. 468 00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:58,040 Speaker 3: That is a terrible, terrible number, right, for every eight 469 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 3: times we kill someone, we almost killed the wrong person. 470 00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:05,440 Speaker 3: And then there was this National Academy of Sciences report 471 00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,720 Speaker 3: that came out, this is the Gross Report, General Gross, 472 00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:13,800 Speaker 3: and they said, here's a conservative estimate. Four point one 473 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:19,840 Speaker 3: percent of all people on death row today are factually innocent. 474 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:23,000 Speaker 3: Four point one percent. That's one in twenty five. 475 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:28,160 Speaker 2: According to the Texas Coalition Against the Death Penalty, as 476 00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:31,880 Speaker 2: of twenty fourteen, the total legal cost of executing a 477 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:35,200 Speaker 2: prisoner was nearly four million dollars, as opposed to the 478 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:38,280 Speaker 2: one point three million spent to keep someone in prison 479 00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:43,200 Speaker 2: for life. Lane argues that morality aside capital punishment is 480 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 2: catastrophically expensive. Imposing sentences of life without parole, or what 481 00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:52,560 Speaker 2: criminal justice experts call l WOP, would not only eliminate 482 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,640 Speaker 2: the risk of making an irreversible mistake by putting an 483 00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:58,920 Speaker 2: innocent person to death, but also save taxpayers money. 484 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:05,479 Speaker 3: Example, here's Florida fifty one million dollars. Fifty one million. 485 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 3: That is what Florida spends every year to maintain the 486 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 3: death penalty, over and above what it would cost to 487 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:18,040 Speaker 3: punish all first degree murderers with l WOP. And if 488 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 3: you look at the costs that Florida spent and then 489 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:24,680 Speaker 3: look at the executions that they had, how much did 490 00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:26,280 Speaker 3: it cost per execution? 491 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:28,440 Speaker 5: You know, to maintain this system. 492 00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,840 Speaker 3: And then of course the product of it, execution is 493 00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:34,200 Speaker 3: what you're getting out of it per execution. Twenty four million, 494 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:40,520 Speaker 3: twenty four million dollars per execution, you know. And I'm 495 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:44,200 Speaker 3: a former prosecutor, and I just have to say, what 496 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:44,960 Speaker 3: could you do. 497 00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:47,640 Speaker 5: With twenty four million dollars? 498 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 3: You know, I'd take I'd take eight million, and I'd 499 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:53,240 Speaker 3: put it into victim services. 500 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 5: Now we're getting into the death penalty more broadly. 501 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:58,040 Speaker 3: But one of the things I've found as I'm on 502 00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:01,480 Speaker 3: this book tour and on the road, I'm talking to 503 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:07,920 Speaker 3: survivors their family members have been slain, and one, a 504 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:11,720 Speaker 3: woman in Tennessee, is particularly She's coming to mind right now, 505 00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:15,840 Speaker 3: and she said, listen, when my son was murdered, I 506 00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:18,320 Speaker 3: couldn't get out of bed in the morning. I was 507 00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:20,120 Speaker 3: afraid I was going to lose my job. I was 508 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:23,360 Speaker 3: afraid I was going to lose my house. I needed therapy, 509 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:27,080 Speaker 3: I needed services. I needed child care to help. I 510 00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 3: couldn't do that. My kids needed therapy. We had all 511 00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:34,920 Speaker 3: of these needs, and the State of Tennessee said, you know, 512 00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:38,920 Speaker 3: Department of Mental Health said, we don't have that money. Sorry, 513 00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,440 Speaker 3: you know, And so she said, we're spending it all 514 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,480 Speaker 3: and Zaga, what she said is it's selfish. You're spending 515 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:52,400 Speaker 3: millions upon millions upon millions on death sentences, and you know, 516 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 3: on the death penalty when it could actually go to 517 00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:57,440 Speaker 3: the people who need it. 518 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 1: Regardless of the financial costes, death by lethal injection has 519 00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:07,320 Speaker 1: become so commonplace that executions really catch public attention. Nationally, 520 00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:09,719 Speaker 1: one than three hundred and seventy seven people have been 521 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:12,120 Speaker 1: put to death by some form of lethal injection since 522 00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:15,880 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty two. Those executed suffered not only because of 523 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:19,520 Speaker 1: the chemicals used, but because, as was predicted in eighteen ninety, 524 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:23,600 Speaker 1: medical professionals have refused to participate because of ethical rules 525 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:27,720 Speaker 1: prohibiting the harm of patients. Doctors and nurses and paramedics 526 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,760 Speaker 1: generally refuse to administer the lethal cocktails used in death chambers. 527 00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 1: That task generally falls to seriously undertrained prison personnel, who 528 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,600 Speaker 1: are asked to secure an IV line for condemned prisoners who, 529 00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,640 Speaker 1: often because of age, history of drug abuse, or other 530 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 1: health problems, have veins that are difficult to access. Heavily 531 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:48,800 Speaker 1: muscled prisoners, those who are morbidly obese, and those with 532 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:52,480 Speaker 1: dark skin can also present challenges for the amateur phlebotomists 533 00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 1: trying to set up an execution. 534 00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:58,240 Speaker 2: Prisons sometimes lack the right equipment, such as the crest 535 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:02,400 Speaker 2: sized syringes are proper too. Being lethal injection drugs are 536 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,320 Speaker 2: pre made and have to be mixed by personnel not 537 00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:09,800 Speaker 2: properly trained in chemistry, which results in errors in dosing. Often, 538 00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:13,120 Speaker 2: people with any kind of medical competence who participate in 539 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:17,160 Speaker 2: executions are the ones with the shadiest ethical records. Professor 540 00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:19,280 Speaker 2: Lane came across one case in which the state of 541 00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 2: Missouri relied on a doctor who ignored ethical guidelines and 542 00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:27,360 Speaker 2: participated in the capital punishment process. He was incorrectly mixing 543 00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:30,520 Speaker 2: the chemicals so that the prisoners were only receiving half 544 00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:33,240 Speaker 2: the dose of the anesthesia meant to reduce the pain 545 00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:37,160 Speaker 2: of condemned as required by law. Doctor Lane shared the 546 00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 2: horrifying discoveries lawyers who condemned prisoners made about that particular doctor. 547 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 3: They looked at the protocol that was litigated and authorized 548 00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 3: by a federal court, and it was five grams of 549 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:56,479 Speaker 3: this particular drug. And they looked at the execution logs 550 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,680 Speaker 3: of the last several and stays we're using two point 551 00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,280 Speaker 3: five and so, you know. 552 00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:03,080 Speaker 5: They filed suit. 553 00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 3: That's half the anesthetic, you know, and the state you know, 554 00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:12,759 Speaker 3: wrote back and said, we are not using half the anesthetic. 555 00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:16,799 Speaker 3: It must be the pharmacy logs that are wrong. We're 556 00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:19,520 Speaker 3: going to track that down and figure out why they 557 00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:21,799 Speaker 3: are wrong. But we rest assure you we are not 558 00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:26,880 Speaker 3: violating the protocol. We're doing the amount that was legally authorized. Well, 559 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:29,360 Speaker 3: they have to come back the next day and say, oh, 560 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:34,719 Speaker 3: actually the logs were right, we were wrong. We were 561 00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:38,759 Speaker 3: injecting half of the amount. And so the court gives 562 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 3: the lawyers for the condemned prisoners a limited deposition to 563 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:47,160 Speaker 3: question this doctor behind a veil, like they didn't know 564 00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:50,839 Speaker 3: who he was, but to question them under oath, and 565 00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:53,360 Speaker 3: you know, they're like, why are. 566 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:53,960 Speaker 5: You using half? 567 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:56,920 Speaker 3: And he said, well, I'm dyslexic and so sometimes I 568 00:34:57,040 --> 00:35:02,680 Speaker 3: make mistakes. And yet Missouri stuff with them and said no, 569 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:07,080 Speaker 3: we have every confidence in him. They lose that. The 570 00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 3: trial court, the federal court says, this guy can't be 571 00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:15,840 Speaker 3: anywhere near look the whole thing, to the extent it's humane, 572 00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:21,880 Speaker 3: requires you to meticulously measure and mix chemicals in liquids 573 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,080 Speaker 3: and so you can't have someone who just makes mistakes. 574 00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,480 Speaker 3: And then in the meantime investigative journalists, which you know, 575 00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:31,200 Speaker 3: I have to take my hat off. I tip my 576 00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:35,000 Speaker 3: hat to investigative journalists. But they were like, gee, who 577 00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,640 Speaker 3: is this, you know, dyslexic doctor, and they find out 578 00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:38,320 Speaker 3: his identity. 579 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:40,080 Speaker 5: You know, he admits it's him. 580 00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 3: He had over twenty mil practice suits, he had had 581 00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:48,239 Speaker 3: his hospital privileges revoked at two hospitals. He had been 582 00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:52,400 Speaker 3: censured by the medical board. So you know, you're asking 583 00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:57,239 Speaker 3: someone to do something, to participate in something that is 584 00:35:57,360 --> 00:36:03,000 Speaker 3: fundamentally against your reason for being as a doctor. And 585 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:06,360 Speaker 3: you know, from time to time they find people, but 586 00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:10,120 Speaker 3: I think they're outliers. What I have found is they 587 00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:13,560 Speaker 3: are outliers not only on ethics, but in other ways too. 588 00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: Experts on capital punishment like Lane aren't comfortable with describing 589 00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:22,440 Speaker 1: executions that go off script as quote botched, even if 590 00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:26,640 Speaker 1: it's a commonly used term. No matter how the execution proceeds, 591 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,880 Speaker 1: the end result is the same, the inmate is dead. However, 592 00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:33,360 Speaker 1: there is no question that killing people by lethal injection 593 00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:36,320 Speaker 1: is so complicated and requires so much skill on the 594 00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:38,920 Speaker 1: part of the executioners that the process is typically far 595 00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 1: more agonizing than death penalty advocates tell the public. According 596 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:46,280 Speaker 1: to the anti capital punishment organization the Death Penalty Information Center, 597 00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:50,560 Speaker 1: out of nineteen executions in twenty twenty two, seven were botched, 598 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:53,400 Speaker 1: meaning that the death took far longer than expected, that 599 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:56,920 Speaker 1: prison personnel had to jab the condemned people multiple times 600 00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:59,920 Speaker 1: to get an IV line working, or worse. 601 00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:04,239 Speaker 2: When Oklahoma executed Clayton Lockett on April tweeny nine to 602 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:08,840 Speaker 2: twenty fourteen, the state used an untested combination of three drugs. 603 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:12,280 Speaker 2: The size of the syringes and the amount of drugs 604 00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:16,319 Speaker 2: used were wrong. Prison personnel made repeated mistakes as they 605 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,399 Speaker 2: tried to insert the needle for the IV. Even though 606 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:24,120 Speaker 2: the American Medical Association prohibits its members from participating in executions. 607 00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:27,880 Speaker 2: A doctor was on hand for the Lockett fiasco. The 608 00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:31,040 Speaker 2: physician tried but failed to insert an IV into the 609 00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:34,880 Speaker 2: jugular vein in Lockett's neck. The doctor then performed a 610 00:37:34,920 --> 00:37:38,160 Speaker 2: surgical procedure called a cut down, which is a deep 611 00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:41,319 Speaker 2: surgical incision through the skin, muscle, and fat performed to 612 00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:46,320 Speaker 2: expose a central vein under Lockett's clavicle procedure was bloody 613 00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:49,680 Speaker 2: and also failed, and the execution then tried and failed 614 00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:53,480 Speaker 2: to access a vein through Lockett's feet. Eventually, they tried 615 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:56,279 Speaker 2: to insert an IV through the femoral vein in the 616 00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,480 Speaker 2: upper thigh, a procedure only the most skilled surgeon in 617 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 2: sad Mass. Unfortunately, the available needle was the wrong length 618 00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:04,680 Speaker 2: for it to work properly. 619 00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:09,120 Speaker 1: Lockett reportedly was stoic throughout this repeated assault on his body. 620 00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:11,920 Speaker 1: After an hour of this torture had passed, the execution 621 00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:16,320 Speaker 1: team was finally able to inject the deadly drugs. Locket groaned, convulsed, 622 00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:19,800 Speaker 1: and at one point was asked, are you unconscious? According 623 00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:22,560 Speaker 1: to witnesses, Lockett opened his eyes and said no, I 624 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:26,120 Speaker 1: am not. After appearing to fall asleep, he began to moan, 625 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:28,880 Speaker 1: arched his back, and kicked a foot before he strained 626 00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,719 Speaker 1: against the straps holding him against the gurney, and he 627 00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:35,840 Speaker 1: tried to get up. Locket mumbled something is wrong, oh man, 628 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:39,480 Speaker 1: and this shit is fucking up my mind. The prison 629 00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:43,160 Speaker 1: warden ordered the blinds closed as the execution team scrambled. 630 00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,520 Speaker 1: Swelling had developed where the ivy had been inserted and 631 00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:49,880 Speaker 1: was blocking the flow of the third and final lethal drug. 632 00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:52,880 Speaker 1: The doctor was summoned to insert a needle and Lockett's 633 00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 1: other femeral vein, but Lockett was bleeding heavily and the 634 00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:58,240 Speaker 1: blood backed up into the ivy line. 635 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,680 Speaker 2: Oklahoma Governor Mayorrry Fallon had already decided to halt the execution, 636 00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:07,080 Speaker 2: but by this point Lockett's heart had irreversibly slowed down. 637 00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:12,239 Speaker 2: He subsequently died of heart failure. The entire execution from 638 00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:14,640 Speaker 2: the first attempt to stick an IV in his veins 639 00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:18,160 Speaker 2: to his death less than one hour and forty seven minutes. 640 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:21,560 Speaker 2: That was one of the longest executions in American history. 641 00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:25,719 Speaker 2: The state of Oklahoma later falsely claimed that Lockett had 642 00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:29,880 Speaker 2: been unconscious the entire time. In twenty twenty two, another 643 00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:34,240 Speaker 2: so called botched lethal injection, that of Joe Nathan James 644 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:39,480 Speaker 2: and Alabama, lasted three hours. In Ohio and elsewhere, executions 645 00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:42,279 Speaker 2: had to be abandoned when the prison staff couldn't get 646 00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:43,120 Speaker 2: an IV going. 647 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:47,080 Speaker 1: As we mentioned in the first episode, Reverend Jeff Hood 648 00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,000 Speaker 1: is a priest under the Old Catholic Right, who, by 649 00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:53,800 Speaker 1: the time we interviewed, had accompanied ten men during their executions. 650 00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:56,720 Speaker 1: He said that even the most professional execution is brutal, 651 00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:00,240 Speaker 1: but that some states, because of a regrettable amount of practice, 652 00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:02,400 Speaker 1: are much better at killing than others. 653 00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:05,279 Speaker 8: I do think that some states know what they're doing 654 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:10,360 Speaker 8: more than others, and I think that Texas knows what 655 00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:15,719 Speaker 8: they're doing. You don't see botched, are delayed or mishandled 656 00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:21,520 Speaker 8: executions in Texas. They go very quickly. And when you 657 00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:23,439 Speaker 8: talk to these guys, that's what they say. 658 00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:24,080 Speaker 4: They would prefer. 659 00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:26,239 Speaker 8: If you're going to be executed, you would want it 660 00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:29,680 Speaker 8: to go as quickly as possible. Yes, there are some 661 00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:33,839 Speaker 8: executions that look horrific. There are other executions that don't 662 00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:35,840 Speaker 8: go according to plan but don't get a lot of attention. 663 00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:40,120 Speaker 8: But they're all horrible, and I think they all have 664 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:42,520 Speaker 8: to be talked about as such. 665 00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:47,080 Speaker 2: Whether it's because the awareness of the messy and undeniably 666 00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:51,120 Speaker 2: painful executions like those of Lockett and James, the more 667 00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,360 Speaker 2: than two hundred death row exonerations achieved by groups like 668 00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:58,800 Speaker 2: the Innocence Project, the growing skepticism of law enforcement amongst 669 00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:02,800 Speaker 2: young people, are the greater consciousness of how racism warps 670 00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:07,239 Speaker 2: the entire criminal justice system. There's no question that death 671 00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:10,120 Speaker 2: penalty is the least popular it has been in the 672 00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:14,120 Speaker 2: past hundred years. Nor is there doubt that the rate 673 00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:17,560 Speaker 2: of executions in the United States has dropped well below 674 00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,400 Speaker 2: its peak during the height of the War and crime 675 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:25,600 Speaker 2: under the Clinton administration, when in nineteen ninety nine, three 676 00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:28,600 Speaker 2: hundred and fifteen death sentences were handed down, or in 677 00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:32,360 Speaker 2: nineteen ninety six when ninety eight prisoners were executed. 678 00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:36,600 Speaker 1: In any case, deaths like Lockett's are bad for business 679 00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:39,920 Speaker 1: for the pharmaceutical companies who have produced the drugs used 680 00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:43,040 Speaker 1: in lethal injections. In the next and final episode of 681 00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:45,840 Speaker 1: this three part series on the shady business of lethal injection, 682 00:41:46,239 --> 00:41:48,120 Speaker 1: we'll talk about how some states like Texas have been 683 00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:50,400 Speaker 1: forced to turn to the black market or the so 684 00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:54,720 Speaker 1: called gray market to buy lethal drugs, as pharmaceutical companies 685 00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,920 Speaker 1: have restricted the purchase of those drugs for that purpose. 686 00:41:58,520 --> 00:42:00,840 Speaker 1: We also talked to Jeff Hood about how the difficulty 687 00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:03,680 Speaker 1: in obtaining those drugs has led states like Alabama to 688 00:42:03,719 --> 00:42:06,240 Speaker 1: turn to one of the most gruesome forms of execution yet. 689 00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:08,960 Speaker 1: And we'll also hear the story of Race Buyan, a 690 00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,279 Speaker 1: victim of a hate crime who fought to prevent the 691 00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:15,920 Speaker 1: execution of his white supremacist attacker. And finally, we'll explore 692 00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,520 Speaker 1: whether the death penalty might be on its last legs 693 00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:21,960 Speaker 1: in the United States. H's Stephen Monchelly for It could 694 00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:23,560 Speaker 1: Happen Here and soil next time. 695 00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:25,840 Speaker 2: I'm Michael Phillips. Thanks for listening. 696 00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:31,400 Speaker 3: It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media. 697 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,640 Speaker 3: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 698 00:42:34,719 --> 00:42:38,320 Speaker 3: Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 699 00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:41,880 Speaker 3: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can 700 00:42:41,960 --> 00:42:44,320 Speaker 3: now find sources for it Could Happen Here listed directly 701 00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:45,480 Speaker 3: in episode descriptions. 702 00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:46,640 Speaker 5: Thanks for listening.