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Speaker 1: You're listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM

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Speaker 1: paranormal podcast network, where we offer you podcasts of the

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Speaker 1: supernatural and the unexplained. Get ready now for Shades of

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Speaker 1: the Afterlife with Sandra Champlain.

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Speaker 2: The thoughts and opinions expressed by the host our thoughts

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Speaker 2: and opinions only, and do not necessarily reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio,

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Speaker 2: Coast to Coast AM, employees of Premiere Networks, or their

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Speaker 2: sponsors and associates. You are encouraged to do the proper

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Speaker 2: amount of research yourself, depending on the subject matter and

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Speaker 2: your needs.

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Speaker 1: Hi.

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Speaker 3: I'm Sandra Champlain. For over twenty five years, I've been

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Speaker 3: on a journey to prove the existence of life after death.

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Speaker 3: On each episode, we'll discuss the reasons we now know

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Speaker 3: that our loved ones have survived physical debt, and so

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Speaker 3: we welcome to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm very excited today.

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Speaker 3: I'm excited to share our guest. I'm excited that there's

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Speaker 3: a new way to communicate with our loved ones. Today

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Speaker 3: you'll meet doctor Matthew McKay, who's a psychology professor in Berkeley, California,

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Speaker 3: who never would have believed in the world of the

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Speaker 3: afterlife and communication had his own adult son not been

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Speaker 3: taken from him. Doctor McKay has authored or co authored

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Speaker 3: more than twenty five psychology, self help and therapist texts

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Speaker 3: and books specializing in anxiety and depression. And in this

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Speaker 3: episode today you'll hear his story and what he does

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Speaker 3: to connect with his son Jordan. Here's doctor Matthew McKay.

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Speaker 4: I'm glad to be with you, Sander. So it's more

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Speaker 4: than fifteen years now since Jordan. He was on his

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Speaker 4: way home from work on his bicycle and men attacked him,

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Speaker 4: probably to try to steal a bike. Eventually, after a

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Speaker 4: tremendous physical battle, they shot him and he died on

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Speaker 4: the street. As anyone can imagine, that's the worst thing

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Speaker 4: that happened, is losing your child at that moment or

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Speaker 4: very shortly afterwards. I think that the two things that

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Speaker 4: mattered most to me, And I think this may be

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Speaker 4: true for a lot of appearance or anyone who loses

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Speaker 4: a loved one. Does that soul still exist? And are

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Speaker 4: they okay? Are they in a place where they feel good?

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Speaker 4: And I was just consumed with that question, and so

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Speaker 4: I did start looking for Jordan started seeking him in

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Speaker 4: different ways, and we went to mediums and got some

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Speaker 4: sense of something he was saying through them. And yet

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Speaker 4: while there was some sense of him, some reassurance he

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Speaker 4: might still exist, it wasn't anything that really warmed our hearts,

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Speaker 4: and so we began looking in other ways. We sought

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Speaker 4: out Alan Botkin, who discovered accidentally something he calls and

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Speaker 4: do s death after death Communication. Went to Chicago. It's

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Speaker 4: a technique that comes from EMDR. I moved into sensitization

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Speaker 4: through processing, which is something that we used to help

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Speaker 4: treat trauma. I've used it with hundreds of clients over

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Speaker 4: the years, but in this case, we were going to

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Speaker 4: see him and he was going to use his variation

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Speaker 4: of that with us. During that experience, I had my

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Speaker 4: first direct contact with Jordan. I could hear his voice

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Speaker 4: very clearly, and it was not inside my head. It

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Speaker 4: was a voice that was coming from outside of me.

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Speaker 4: It was his voice, and he was telling me the

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Speaker 4: very things that I needed to know that he still existed.

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Speaker 4: In fact, he's watching over us, he was observing our lives.

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Speaker 4: He was connected to us, and he was good and

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Speaker 4: he was happy where he was. So this was a

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Speaker 4: first major step for me for us, my wife and

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Speaker 4: I to begin to connect to him again and to

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Speaker 4: re establish the relationship through the curtain to the other side.

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Speaker 4: So that was important. Also before this, I had read

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Speaker 4: a lot of Michael Newton's work on the jury of

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Speaker 4: souls and so forth, and I had learned because I'm

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Speaker 4: psychotherapist and I'm a good hypnotist, I'd learned his particular

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Speaker 4: method of regressing people to their past lives and then

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Speaker 4: from there bouncing into the life between lives and having

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Speaker 4: them observe the life between lives. And I had done

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Speaker 4: that with quite a few people. I didn't charge him,

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Speaker 4: but I did it. If anybody wanted it and needed

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Speaker 4: I would do it, and I got to observe their experience.

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Speaker 4: But I never got to have it. And so somewhere

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Speaker 4: along this point in time, I got involved with Ralph Messner,

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Speaker 4: who was the late Ralph Messer was a specialist in

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Speaker 4: the afterlife and after deathcommunication. He did that same process.

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Speaker 4: He induced me into a past life and then the

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Speaker 4: life between lines that I could make contact with Jordan

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Speaker 4: in that way. And it's confirming that souls reincarnate together

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Speaker 4: and often in very different relationships to each other in

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Speaker 4: each particular life, they often have very different ways of connecting.

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Speaker 4: The problem still was that it was all one way.

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Speaker 4: I was. With Alan Bodkin's process, I was just hearing

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Speaker 4: Jordan passively. With mediums, I was hearing their representation of

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Speaker 4: what Jordan was saying. Even in this hypnotic process. With Ralph,

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Speaker 4: it was a passive process. I was experiencing things, but

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Speaker 4: I was not able to participate in the communication. So

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Speaker 4: finally Ralph taught me how to do channel communication. And

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Speaker 4: it didn't take him very long, as it was actually

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Speaker 4: a fairly simple process, and I tell your audience how

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Speaker 4: to do it if they would be interested. But in

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Speaker 4: less than an hour he taught me how to do it, proudly,

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Speaker 4: much less an hour. I went home that night, and

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Speaker 4: I had my first experience of conversation with Jordan, a

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Speaker 4: conversation in which I could ask questions, he could answer them,

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Speaker 4: I could respond, he could respond to whatever I was saying,

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Speaker 4: and it felt like we had gone back to those

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Speaker 4: beautiful days around the kitchen table where we could talk

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Speaker 4: about anything and had these long, beautiful and endless conversations.

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Speaker 4: And I had my first experience of being able to

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Speaker 4: have that again and greatly shifted the grief, the grief

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Speaker 4: of having lost him to I've lost his physical presence,

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Speaker 4: but the relationship and the love is still completely there,

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Speaker 4: completely intact, completely alive. So that was an enormous transformation

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Speaker 4: for me. And I still have Jordan in my life,

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Speaker 4: and to have that has made all the difference in

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Speaker 4: terms of facing this loss, but also in terms of learning.

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Speaker 4: I learn so much from him, and that's made a

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Speaker 4: big difference. I have a completely different understanding and cosmology

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Speaker 4: how the universe works as a result of his communications.

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Speaker 3: Before we end our chat today, we'd love to know

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Speaker 3: those steps, but I'd like to find a little bit

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Speaker 3: more about some of the things that Jordan talked to

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Speaker 3: you about. And in the beginning, A father knows his love.

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Speaker 3: I know my dad's love. No one can convince me

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Speaker 3: that some of the things I've experienced were just my imagination.

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Speaker 3: You feel his presence as you write.

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Speaker 4: Question, I feel his love, if I could put it

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Speaker 4: that way, I can feel his love inside of me,

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Speaker 4: feeling his presence like he's sitting in the room. I

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Speaker 4: don't actually have that experience. I can feel him in

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Speaker 4: my body and I can feel the love in my body.

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Speaker 4: But how he manifests himself is the things he says

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Speaker 4: that are occurring inside my mind but are definitely channeled,

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Speaker 4: because there are things that I never dreamed of, have

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Speaker 4: thought of imagined, and they're said in his way of communicating,

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Speaker 4: not in mind. So what I get from him is

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Speaker 4: is communication. But I do feel him physically.

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Speaker 3: That's I guess the answer I was looking for in

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Speaker 3: that love. No one can take that away. What kind

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Speaker 3: of things did he talk about? Did he tell you

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Speaker 3: about the spirit world, what he's doing, what life's about?

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Speaker 4: That? Yeah, over time they shared all of that with me,

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Speaker 4: and he's decided that he's going to write certain books,

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Speaker 4: and he set out to write a book, Lewini's Landscape

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Speaker 4: in the Afterlife, which is really helping people with a

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Speaker 4: fear of death and telling them exactly what is out there,

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Speaker 4: what to expect, what that afterlife looks like and feels,

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Speaker 4: and also why we leave it to come here. So

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Speaker 4: he outlined the book in about five minutes and then

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Speaker 4: over time, basically I channeled all of his It's all

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Speaker 4: from him. So what does he say the afterlife is

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Speaker 4: their components to it. The first thing that happens after

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Speaker 4: we die. We end up in he calls the landing place,

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Speaker 4: and it's just adjacent to the spirit world. And in

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Speaker 4: the landing Place, the main function of that spot is

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Speaker 4: to get used to having a non physical experience. We

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Speaker 4: see it three hundred and sixty degrees, not just straight ahead.

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Speaker 4: We are hearing things telepathically. We move by intention, but

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Speaker 4: not by muscle motions. And this landing place is often

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Speaker 4: familiar in some ways. It's a setting that we might

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Speaker 4: have known in our lives, but it also has a

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Speaker 4: surreal quality of heightened colors and so forth, very very beautiful.

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Speaker 4: And it's there we meet guides and some of the

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Speaker 4: important souls, perhaps from our soul group, who come to

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Speaker 4: greet as in that's place. We're getting used to this

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Speaker 4: not being physical anymore. But it's also a place where

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Speaker 4: guides evaluate our readiness to enter the spirit world. If

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Speaker 4: we have a lot of intense residual emotions from the

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Speaker 4: unfinished issues in our life that are really strong and overwhelming,

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Speaker 4: a lot of fear or a lot of anger, we'll

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Speaker 4: go to ancillary places where Bardo's where we work on

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Speaker 4: that before we can enter the spiritual You can't ender

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Speaker 4: the spirit world with intense negative emotions, and so there's

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Speaker 4: sometimes a pausing that goes on and certain healing processes

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Speaker 4: that have to happen before the soul is ready to

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Speaker 4: fully enter the afterlife. The sort of sorting out is

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Speaker 4: done in this anti room landing place. And so once

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Speaker 4: we enter the spirit world, the very first stop is

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Speaker 4: where we do life review as many people have talked

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Speaker 4: about that. Jordan describes it, and I've had a little

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Speaker 4: bit of the experience also when I've done the life

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Speaker 4: between life regressions. It's a very powerful experience. And in

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Speaker 4: that experience we experience everything we've done, every choice we've

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Speaker 4: made from our own perspective, but also for from the

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Speaker 4: perspective of the person who was affected by that choice

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Speaker 4: or that behavior. So we're experiencing it both ways. And

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Speaker 4: on top of that, not only do we experience it

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Speaker 4: as that person experienced it at the moment, but over

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Speaker 4: time how it impacted them in terms of moving forward

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Speaker 4: in their life, how what we did impacted and affected them.

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Speaker 4: And we're going through every single significant choice that we

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Speaker 4: made in our lives and observing its effect on ourselves

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Speaker 4: on others over time longitudiny. So it's a very powerful process.

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Speaker 4: It takes a while. We're supported by guides, and we

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Speaker 4: do a tremendous amount of learning in this process. It's

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Speaker 4: just it's huge. It's a monumental re experiencing of life

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Speaker 4: from all perspectives. Then there are other steps that we

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Speaker 4: can see in the afterlife. But fairly soon we reunite

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Speaker 4: with our soul group. And as I think many people

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Speaker 4: are aware of, the soul group is based our family.

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Speaker 4: It's our spiritual family, and there's any work between oh

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Speaker 4: I don't know, six and twenty or so souls in

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Speaker 4: each group. And then there are a lot of adjacent

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Speaker 4: soul groups that connect to our own. We're not only

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Speaker 4: involved our own soul group. You could think of it

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Speaker 4: like a neighborhood. The soul group lives in one house

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Speaker 4: and a little family together, and then there are houses

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Speaker 4: that are next door and across the street and down

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Speaker 4: the street, and these are all adjacent soul groups with

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Speaker 4: whom we often have very significant and powerful connections of

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Speaker 4: love and with whom we reincarnate. Typically, we often reincarnate

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Speaker 4: with our own soul group at the same time, the

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Speaker 4: same place, in various relationships.

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Speaker 3: This is a good time to take our first break,

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Speaker 3: and then we'll be back with doctor Matthew McKay. He

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Speaker 3: talks about some interesting things and he explains reincarnation in

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Speaker 3: a way I've never heard before.

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Speaker 5: So we'll be back.

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Speaker 3: You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeart

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Speaker 3: Radio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

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Speaker 5: Stay right there, there's more. Sandra Common Write app.

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Speaker 6: The Coast to Coast AM mobile app is here and

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Speaker 6: waiting for you right now. With the app, you can

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Speaker 6: head on over to the Coast to COASTAM dot com website.

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Speaker 6: We have a handy video guide to help you get

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Speaker 3: Of your mobile app usage.

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Speaker 6: All the infos waiting for you now at Coast to

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Speaker 6: COASTAM dot com. That's Coast to Coast AM dot com.

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Speaker 7: Hey, it's producer Tom and you're right where you need

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Speaker 7: to be. This is the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

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Speaker 7: AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

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Speaker 3: Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain,

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Speaker 3: and this episode is dedicated to Professor Matthew McKay and

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Speaker 3: the way he learned to communicate with his son Jordan.

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Speaker 3: Some of the concepts that he brings up are new

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Speaker 3: to me. And whether it's this episode or any episode

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Speaker 3: of mine, or anybody that talks about the afterlife, use

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Speaker 3: what fits to empower you in your life. If you

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Speaker 3: can imagine going into a clothing store and maybe you're

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Speaker 3: looking for a coat, you try on different coats, Maybe

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Speaker 3: none of them fit, maybe a couple of them fit,

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Speaker 3: those that fit, those that make you feel great, take

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Speaker 3: them for your life. That's the same with different concepts

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Speaker 3: around the afterlife. For all the billions of people who

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Speaker 3: have ever lived, and the billions of ways that we've

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Speaker 3: lived our life, I have a sneaky suspicion that there's

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Speaker 3: not just one exact way that we experience our transitions

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Speaker 3: depends on our beliefs and so forth. So now we'll

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Speaker 3: get back to doctor McKay and he's talking about soul

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Speaker 3: groups and reincarnating as soul groups.

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Speaker 4: We often reincarnate with our own soul group at the

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Speaker 4: same time the same place, in various relationships. Others from

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Speaker 4: adjacent groups will be part of our incarnational existence. So

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Speaker 4: we return to our family and to our neighborhood essentially,

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Speaker 4: And in the soul group, initially there's just a big

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Speaker 4: celebration and in the afterlife there's a lot of fun.

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Speaker 4: I just want to mention that that there's music, there's games,

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Speaker 4: there's partying literally partying where people get together and just

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Speaker 4: enjoyed the love of each other and catch up and communicate.

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Speaker 4: There's a little lot of things that we do in

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Speaker 4: the afterlife that are really pleasurable and recreational. And we

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Speaker 4: do that in our soul group as well as a

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Speaker 4: particularly soul group that Jordan is and they call it

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Speaker 4: the Farm because in the afterlife you can create images,

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Speaker 4: and so whatever you actually think or imagine, you can

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Speaker 4: create that image in such a way that it has

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Speaker 4: a kind of a certain reality. And so that particular

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Speaker 4: soul group has created a house that looks like a farmhouse,

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Speaker 4: and for that reason they call their little group the Farm.

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Speaker 4: And of course there's a celebration, there's an re engagement. Now,

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Speaker 4: I just wanted to say something that might be of interest.

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Speaker 4: Part of our soul energy always stays in the afterlife.

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Speaker 4: It always stays, so we are always present in our

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Speaker 4: soul group. We are always present in the afterlife even

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Speaker 4: though we incarnate, and so when we incarnate, part of

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Speaker 4: our soul energy enters a body, but part of our

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Speaker 4: soul energy always remains in the afterlife. So we reunite

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Speaker 4: with the part of our energy that has always been there.

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Speaker 4: It's more full and vibrant energy because now all of

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Speaker 4: our energy is in one place. But it is also

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Speaker 4: an opportunity now to do more learning. So a lot

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Speaker 4: of what we do and should have fun is we

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Speaker 4: engage in a lot of learning. There are guys who

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Speaker 4: are specialty teachers that come in to our Soul group

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Speaker 4: and offer lessons about all manner things, but we also

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Speaker 4: engage in learning in other ways. One of the big

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Speaker 4: things that we do is we visit the Akashak Record

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Speaker 4: as part of our learning process in the afterlife. And

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Speaker 4: the Akashak Record is, I'm sure many know you can

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Speaker 4: think of it as a gigantic library and in its

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Speaker 4: contained everything that's ever happened. It's everything that's ever happened,

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Speaker 4: particularly everything that's ever happened to any conscious entity conscious

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Speaker 4: of soul, and a lot of the Akashak Record also

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Speaker 4: involves incarnations and what each soul did in the incarnation

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Speaker 4: on many, many countless planets, because we incarnate on many

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Speaker 4: many different planets, Earth being one of the more difficult ones.

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Speaker 4: So we do a lot of studying of that, and

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Speaker 4: part of that is studying the life we lived, but

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Speaker 4: also the life that we might have lived. So we

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Speaker 4: can actually in the caution record, we can look at

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Speaker 4: what if I decided something else, and then a chapter

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Speaker 4: opens and we can now see the outcome of what

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Speaker 4: that would have looked like had we made that other choice,

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Speaker 4: And there's a lot of learning that comes from that,

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Speaker 4: and we can do the same thing with other souls.

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Speaker 4: We can go back and take a look at Abraham

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Speaker 4: Lincoln and see, okay, what would have happened if he

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Speaker 4: didn't sign the Emancipation Proclamation. What would have been the

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Speaker 4: outcome we're going to see, We could study that. So

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Speaker 4: we're studying outcomes, we're studying what happens when you do

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Speaker 4: X and Y and z, and there's just so much

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Speaker 4: learning there. So it's not just what I did, but

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Speaker 4: what I might have done, or choices that were potential

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Speaker 4: but never made. So it's a beautiful opportunity and when

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Speaker 4: we certainly close up the record, that chapter becomes null.

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Speaker 4: It's not like a parallel universe. It's just a possible

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Speaker 4: universe that exists just as long as we were observing

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Speaker 4: it and learning from it, and then close it, it goes

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Speaker 4: back into kind of avoid state.

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Speaker 3: I wanted to ask, because Jordan never said, Dad, I

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Speaker 3: know you're going through pain. This is the point of

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Speaker 3: being there on earth.

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Speaker 4: I think that's the greatest gift he's given me, is

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Speaker 4: a sense of our purpose here. Why do we come

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Speaker 4: to this place that's so painful, where we go through

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Speaker 4: such struggle. And I think a lot of people feel

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Speaker 4: like pain is a bad thing. It's like a sign

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Speaker 4: of failure. It's like something we've done wrong. We shouldn't

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Speaker 4: have pain. But in fact, we come to a physical

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Speaker 4: world under a body that has a nervous system, so

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Speaker 4: that we can actually encounter pain. And so why would

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Speaker 4: we do that? What is the point of pain? What

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Speaker 4: Jordan says is that we incarnate in order to learn

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Speaker 4: how to love in the face of pain. That's the

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Speaker 4: main task we have here. We are learning how to love. See,

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Speaker 4: in the spirit world, love exists without qualification. We just

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Speaker 4: exist in the state of love. Love is essentially the

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Speaker 4: air that we breathe in the spirit world, and it's

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Speaker 4: what connects all of us. But we incarnate to learn

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Speaker 4: how to love intentionally, meaning how to love in the

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Speaker 4: face of obstacles and push back from the world we

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Speaker 4: live in. Maybe a silly example would be the parent

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Speaker 4: who comes home is exhausted and is worn out and

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Speaker 4: their kid is upset by something and it needs some

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Speaker 4: help with their homework and so forth. We have to

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Speaker 4: love in the face of the pain of the tiredness.

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Speaker 4: Maybe we had a bad day of work, we're feeling

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Speaker 4: anxious in the face of the anxiety. Maybe we're upset

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Speaker 4: with our kid because they've been misbehaving, and so we

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Speaker 4: have to love in the face of that anger or irritation.

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Speaker 4: So that's what love is about. That's what we're learning here,

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Speaker 4: how to love in the face of these obstacles, in

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Speaker 4: the face of the pain, and the pain is teaching

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Speaker 4: us how to love. It's teaching us how to love.

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Speaker 4: In the spirit world, there is no pain, and love

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Speaker 4: is effortless. But we have to learn how to love intentionally,

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Speaker 4: and that's what we come here to do. And the

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Speaker 4: last thing I'll say It's just another comment here is

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Speaker 4: that everything we're learning we come here to learn, and

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Speaker 4: everything we're learning we're uploading to all. So not only

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Speaker 4: are we learning it as individual souls, but our mission

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Speaker 4: here is to keep teaching all, is to give all

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Speaker 4: everything that we've learned and it uploaded. And so the

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Speaker 4: mission of learning to love in the face of pain

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Speaker 4: and everything else that we learn about in this existence

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Speaker 4: is given to all, and all continues to grow and

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Speaker 4: develop and evolve. Now, some people think that God is

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Speaker 4: perfect and it doesn't evolve and doesn't grow. That's not

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Speaker 4: at all true for you, to Dan, God is evolving God,

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Speaker 4: all of consciousness is evolving, growing and continually learning. And

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Speaker 4: the means by which most of God's learning occurs is

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Speaker 4: us incarnating in physical worlds, and all the things we

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Speaker 4: learn become part of the knowledge of God.

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Speaker 3: I want to ask you about God. A lot of

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Speaker 3: people I've interviewed have had near death experiences and they've

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Speaker 3: seen whoever the person is from their own religion. Some

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Speaker 3: people just feel this incredible light and it's this unconditional love.

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Speaker 3: Can you talk a little bit more through Jordan about

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Speaker 3: this unconditional love, this light, this God it's the best word.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, the best way I can describe it is that

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Speaker 4: all for use the word all actually because God is

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Speaker 4: a kind of limited word. So like we have this

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Speaker 4: picture of some little guy in a white beard sitting

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Speaker 4: in a big golden crusted chair something, and that's not

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Speaker 4: what it is. All is all of us. We are

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Speaker 4: all God. Every single conscious entity is part of all

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Speaker 4: and is part of God. And that's why when we

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Speaker 4: learn something, God learns something, that's because we are part

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Speaker 4: of it. And so when you talk about, you know,

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Speaker 4: feeling the love of God and feeling the love and

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Speaker 4: connection to God, what we're talking about is oneness. We're

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Speaker 4: talking about feeling the love of all because we're all

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Speaker 4: connected with love. That's what holds God together, That's what

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Speaker 4: holds all consciousness together. And in fact, everything, the conscience creates,

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Speaker 4: all the world's all the physical, everything is held together

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Speaker 4: with the gravity of love. So when we're feeling the

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Speaker 4: love of God, we're feeling that oneness, that deep connection

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Speaker 4: to all, and the love that holds it all together,

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Speaker 4: holds all of us together and unites us and connects

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Speaker 4: us as one. So it's a little different than in

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Speaker 4: my understanding Jordan's a little different from God is an

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Speaker 4: entity personality that showers love out. But Jordan's understanding. What

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Speaker 4: he's taught me is that we are all God, and

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Speaker 4: the love we experience is the love of connectedness to

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Speaker 4: all and everything that exists, and that love is something

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Speaker 4: shared as opposed to showered on us. If that makes sense.

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Speaker 4: It's something that we all share and experience together, as

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Speaker 4: opposed to an entity showers us with love.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for that. I want to read just a

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Speaker 3: few sentences that I read in your book because it

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Speaker 3: deals with doubt. You're led, I'm exhausted. I blow out

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Speaker 3: the candle. I want to believe everything I've heard, but

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Speaker 3: I hate self deception. It's a response I inherited from

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Speaker 3: my father, a man who despised the ways people lie

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Speaker 3: to themselves to justify their needs and actions. But suddenly

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Speaker 3: it's clear I will have to live with that remembered

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Speaker 3: content in order to keep listening. If I want to

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Speaker 3: open the channel so my boy can talk to me,

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Speaker 3: then I'll also have to live with a doubt, perhaps

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Speaker 3: even ridicule Matt. So many people we doubt our own thoughts.

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Speaker 3: We worry about what other people have to say about

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Speaker 3: what we're doing. What would you say that helped you

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Speaker 3: move through that? You know what, I've got a backbone

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Speaker 3: to share this, this is reality and to push through

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Speaker 3: that doubt.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think that what you say is really important

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Speaker 4: about pushing through because it's not a matter of certainty.

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Speaker 4: And actually, some people clients of mine that I've taught

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Speaker 4: how to channel, and I'm resisted because they say, I'm

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Speaker 4: only going to channel if I have no doubt, if

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Speaker 4: I have certainty, and then they don't. They don't channel

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Speaker 4: even though they could, even though they have because they

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Speaker 4: are insisting on certainty in order to reach out across

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Speaker 4: the veil and reach the loved ones on the other side.

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Speaker 4: So if we're going to say I have to have

433
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:01,679
Speaker 4: uncertainty to do this, and most of us will not

434
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:02,720
Speaker 4: be able to do it.

435
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:05,359
Speaker 3: We need to take a quick break, and I promise

436
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:08,640
Speaker 3: we'll pick up right where we left off. You're listening

437
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 3: to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast

438
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:22,359
Speaker 3: to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

439
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:27,320
Speaker 2: Don't go anywhere. There's more Shades of the Afterlife coming

440
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:33,000
Speaker 2: right up, hey, folks.

441
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,400
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442
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443
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445
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446
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448
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449
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450
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452
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454
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455
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456
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Speaker 7: the top. It's the official Coast to Coast AM YouTube channel.

457
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458
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459
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Speaker 7: start your free listening now.

460
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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. Keep it here on the iHeartRadio on

461
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 1: Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

462
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 3: Welcome back, to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sanders Champlain

463
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 3: and we're with doctor Matthew McKay, author of the book

464
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 3: Seeking Jordan and how I learned the truth about death

465
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:07,359
Speaker 3: and the Invisible Universe. I just asked him about doubt.

466
00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:11,639
Speaker 3: Very difficult to think. Are these thoughts coming in my mind?

467
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 3: Are they mine? Or are they really from someone in

468
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 3: the afterlife. So as we continue on, we'll talk about

469
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:22,159
Speaker 3: pushing through doubt, we'll talk about grief, and he'll share

470
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:27,400
Speaker 3: with us his method of connecting to loved ones and

471
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 3: even our soul.

472
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:31,719
Speaker 4: Clients of mind that I've taught how to channel. And

473
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 4: it resisted because if they say I'm only going to

474
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:36,840
Speaker 4: channel if I have no doubt, if I have certainty,

475
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 4: and then they don't. They don't channel even though they could,

476
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 4: even though they have, because they are insisting on certainty

477
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:47,120
Speaker 4: in order to reach out across the veil and reach

478
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 4: the loved ones on the other side. So if we're

479
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 4: going to say I have to have uncertainty to do this,

480
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 4: then most of us will not be able to do it.

481
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 4: But it's just what you said, it's pushing through the

482
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 4: doubt and doubt shows up for me. Still, I have

483
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:03,720
Speaker 4: moments where the thought occurs to me, is this real?

484
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 4: Or something Jordan says makes me wondering, what would you

485
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 4: just say? Does that make sense? And oftentimes even just

486
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 4: starting the process, I have to start with the awareness

487
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 4: that I have fear that something might happen that might

488
00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 4: lead me to believe that it's not true, So that

489
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:23,240
Speaker 4: doubt is there. I've been doing this now for fifteen years,

490
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:27,600
Speaker 4: and I would say the doubt has diminished somewhat, but

491
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:33,080
Speaker 4: it still shows up. And so every time I start,

492
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 4: I usually channel with Jordan once a week. Every time

493
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 4: I start to channel, I can feel a little of

494
00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:41,920
Speaker 4: that edge of anxiety that what if something happens here

495
00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:45,040
Speaker 4: that makes me wonder if this is true? And there's

496
00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 4: a little bit of doubt, And so I have to

497
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:52,280
Speaker 4: push through it because my biggest value is the love

498
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 4: between Jordan and myself and enact that and be part

499
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 4: of that and engage with him with love. That's my

500
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:02,360
Speaker 4: biggest and I have to do that even though sometimes

501
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:03,000
Speaker 4: there's some doubt.

502
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 3: It's so tough being human. I tell you, we all

503
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 3: know this. We have this voice in our head that's

504
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:10,200
Speaker 3: not our biggest champion.

505
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 2: I know.

506
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,360
Speaker 3: Sometimes there's that divine guidance and that self with the

507
00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:17,719
Speaker 3: big ass and our soul self. But why do we

508
00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 3: believe the voice of this negativity when we look at

509
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:23,360
Speaker 3: the mirror and mine shows the extra pounds and the

510
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 3: gray hairs and all that, and it is not my

511
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,760
Speaker 3: best friend. Yet we believe it for so many other things.

512
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:31,960
Speaker 3: So push through that doubt. I love that I do.

513
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 4: Remember when I said love in the face of pain. See,

514
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,320
Speaker 4: if we're going to engage in a loving way with

515
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 4: the souls on the other side and maintain that relationship

516
00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 4: and send love back and forth, we have to do

517
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,840
Speaker 4: it in the face of pain here, and the pain

518
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:53,400
Speaker 4: is doubt an uncertainty, and pain is missing that person

519
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:56,280
Speaker 4: and grieving, and then when we try to make contact,

520
00:30:56,320 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 4: it brings up the grief. So this is another example.

521
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 4: In this case, it's love across the veil. But we

522
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:03,160
Speaker 4: have to hear we have to do it in the

523
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 4: face of pain, and doubt is one of those difficult things.

524
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 3: Agreed, If you wouldn't mind share some tools about how

525
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 3: we can channel, as you call it, with our loved ones,

526
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:18,479
Speaker 3: because Matt who's listening right now, could be experiencing some

527
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 3: of the worst grief imaginable, and we want to believe.

528
00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:24,840
Speaker 3: How would we start if you wouldn't mind, We'd love

529
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 3: to learn.

530
00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, there was one other thing I wanted to say

531
00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 4: about God and the afterlife. There is no judgment in

532
00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:36,640
Speaker 4: the afterlife. God doesn't judge, or that all doesn't judge.

533
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 4: This whole idea that we have to live this life

534
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 4: and we're going to be judged at the end of

535
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:43,720
Speaker 4: it and go to hell and go to have it's

536
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:48,640
Speaker 4: completely false and Jordan's just said that over and over

537
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 4: and over again. It's false. There is no judgment in

538
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 4: the afterlife. All we do is go there and learn

539
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 4: from the life we just lived. We're not judged, we're

540
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:04,560
Speaker 4: not ridiculed, we're not examined, we're not turned back because

541
00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 4: of things we did. So I just want to really

542
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:09,080
Speaker 4: emphasize that that that's one of the other really important

543
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 4: things about the afterlife is a place of love and

544
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:15,040
Speaker 4: zero judgment, and there are no places where people will

545
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 4: go to and suffer. Okay, how do I channel? Sorry

546
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,640
Speaker 4: for that little bit digression, but it's perfect.

547
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:22,840
Speaker 3: We needed to hear it.

548
00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 4: So just I would encourage people to just select a

549
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:30,080
Speaker 4: place that you feel safe and secure. I actually usually

550
00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:33,240
Speaker 4: channel right here in this room, right at this desk

551
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:35,640
Speaker 4: and such my childhood desk and my folks gave me

552
00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 4: when I was eleven. Find something that makes the place

553
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 4: that you feel safe and set that up as a

554
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 4: kind of a ritual for where you'll channel. Then you

555
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 4: need to clarify the spiritual address of where you're sending

556
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:50,880
Speaker 4: your communications to the afterlife. You can just be aware

557
00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:53,240
Speaker 4: of the soul you're trying to communicate by the way

558
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:56,080
Speaker 4: you can channel yourself. You can channel your own soul

559
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:59,200
Speaker 4: energy in the afterlife, and that could be an address

560
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 4: you send community vccasions, you can channel to guides and

561
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 4: so anyway, just be clear on the address, Who is it,

562
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:10,280
Speaker 4: what entity are you? Are you seeking to communicate with?

563
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 4: I think it's sometimes it's very helpful in terms of

564
00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:16,600
Speaker 4: communicating to these souls who we knew in life and

565
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:19,920
Speaker 4: have died. Is to have a little talisman, something that

566
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 4: connects us to them, a physical object, something that maybe

567
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:25,880
Speaker 4: they gave us, or something that belonged to them. I

568
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 4: use Jordan, I use actually this business card that he

569
00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:35,080
Speaker 4: had that says Jordan McKay that the CEO of Mega Technology,

570
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 4: there was no Mega Technology. He used this to get

571
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:40,200
Speaker 4: into trade shows when he was in high school. But

572
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 4: I keep the card because it just reminds me of

573
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 4: his humor. And it's just the quality of a person

574
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 4: to create a person.

575
00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:49,000
Speaker 5: And that's my talents.

576
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 4: But you find one of your own and get something

577
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 4: that nexts you to that person in a physical way.

578
00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,440
Speaker 4: It really is helpful for I fixation. Just use a candle,

579
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:02,360
Speaker 4: just something that holds your attention. You can look at it,

580
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 4: but it could be anything. It could be a mandala

581
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 4: or some certain seapoly stone or celtic not whatever. But

582
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 4: find something you can put your attention on, and then

583
00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:16,480
Speaker 4: take a breath, and as you exhale, now we're going

584
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:17,719
Speaker 4: to go into the kind of a symbol of a

585
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:21,799
Speaker 4: pasta meditation. As you exail, just form the intention to

586
00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:25,040
Speaker 4: open the channel. Bring all attention down to the diaphragm.

587
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 4: Focus on the diaphragm. It's a center of breath, center

588
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 4: of life. On each outbreath count So first out breath,

589
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:35,719
Speaker 4: one second, but two, three, four, keep counting to ten.

590
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 4: If you're starting to feel receptive and open, you can

591
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 4: start moving into channeling. If not, do another round of ten.

592
00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:47,239
Speaker 4: So it's just a simple meditation where we attend to

593
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 4: the breath. When there's a thought that comes up, let

594
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:53,560
Speaker 4: the thought go, go back to the breath and just

595
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 4: count each outbreath, each out there, one, two, three, letting

596
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,399
Speaker 4: go of thoughts and returning to the breath. Very very

597
00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 4: simple meditation. And it's okay when thoughts show up, but

598
00:35:03,719 --> 00:35:05,560
Speaker 4: just leave the thought as soon as you notice it

599
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 4: and get back to the breath. So that gets us

600
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,320
Speaker 4: into a kind of a receptive state. And the meanwhile,

601
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:13,080
Speaker 4: while you're doing the meditation, just keep your eyes fixed

602
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:15,799
Speaker 4: on the candle. What Ralph taught me is this little

603
00:35:16,120 --> 00:35:19,160
Speaker 4: divination to add to this. And what you do is

604
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:21,520
Speaker 4: you visualize at orb just above your head, maybe six

605
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:25,640
Speaker 4: inches above your head, color the sun, and just visualize

606
00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:29,080
Speaker 4: it there and then see it elongating into a tube

607
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:32,000
Speaker 4: like connection to the soul you're trying to reach. And

608
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:34,960
Speaker 4: this is the channel opening. We visualize it the orb

609
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 4: and now we just visualize the channel opening all the

610
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:43,120
Speaker 4: way to that soul. And in fact, that's exactly what happens,

611
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:45,640
Speaker 4: because every soul in the afterlife who we love is

612
00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:47,520
Speaker 4: just a thought of way, since we think about them,

613
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,920
Speaker 4: it opens the channel. And so the channel is opening

614
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:54,240
Speaker 4: as we are thinking about with love, we're thinking about

615
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:56,400
Speaker 4: that soul that we want to connect to, and so

616
00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:59,840
Speaker 4: the channel is now open. I think it's really important

617
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:03,040
Speaker 4: is to make sure that the communications are written down.

618
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 4: So get it in a notebook or whatever. But you

619
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:09,560
Speaker 4: have to paper and have a writing implement and write

620
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:13,839
Speaker 4: your question down, write your first question down, and then wait.

621
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:16,759
Speaker 4: The answer will show up in your mind. But the

622
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 4: answer is being channeled or it's being communicated telepathically, so

623
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 4: just wait. And it can come in different ways. Sometimes

624
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,720
Speaker 4: it comes as a big download, just this huge download,

625
00:36:28,760 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 4: it doesn't even words, just knowing. Sometimes it comes as

626
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:35,319
Speaker 4: an image or a picture. Sometimes it comes as a

627
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:39,879
Speaker 4: few distinct words, you're very succinct. Sometimes it comes as

628
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 4: a phrase, and then you have to wait for the

629
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:44,960
Speaker 4: phrase to turn into a whole sentence, and then you

630
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:46,680
Speaker 4: may wait a little bit for the next sentence. And

631
00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:50,280
Speaker 4: sometimes it comes slowly. So it comes in all different ways,

632
00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:53,640
Speaker 4: and it's okay. Every way is fine. If it comes

633
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:56,680
Speaker 4: as a picture or just knowing, then you have to

634
00:36:56,719 --> 00:37:00,440
Speaker 4: find words to describe the knowing or the picture. But

635
00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 4: in every case, write down what you get, whether it's

636
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:10,279
Speaker 4: just a few words, very very compressed information, or in

637
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:13,840
Speaker 4: some cases it's many, many sentences, and just stay with

638
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:17,320
Speaker 4: it until it stops, stay with it until the communication stops,

639
00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:20,640
Speaker 4: and then you write down the next question. And the

640
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:23,879
Speaker 4: other thing is the act of writing. Watching the ink

641
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:28,400
Speaker 4: on the page is part of channeling because it actually

642
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:30,880
Speaker 4: puts us in a very receptive state. Literally watching the

643
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:33,200
Speaker 4: ink form on the page puts us in very recept state.

644
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:35,360
Speaker 4: So that's why it's so important in my view to

645
00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:38,080
Speaker 4: write down the questions and the answers that come down.

646
00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:39,720
Speaker 4: The other reason you want to write down the answers

647
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 4: is you want to have a record to look back

648
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 4: on later. I have lots of things that Jordan has

649
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 4: said to me and I'll go back years later just

650
00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 4: read them and go, oh my god, I forgot that,

651
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:50,120
Speaker 4: and that's important and that actually happens to me all

652
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:54,440
Speaker 4: the time. So having the record helps preserve the learning

653
00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:57,200
Speaker 4: that you're getting. And you can ask anything. You can

654
00:37:57,239 --> 00:38:00,359
Speaker 4: ask how that soul is what they're doing. One point,

655
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:03,920
Speaker 4: I asked Jordan if he incarnated, he had incarnated as

656
00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:06,879
Speaker 4: a little girl, and he could tell me some things

657
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:09,799
Speaker 4: about that life if I was curious. But you can

658
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:11,880
Speaker 4: ask about what's happening with the soul right now, what

659
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 4: they're learning in the afterlife. Jordan's talked a lot about that,

660
00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:18,480
Speaker 4: He's learning a lot about how to influence people, how

661
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:22,720
Speaker 4: to influence people to see things in new ways. Also,

662
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 4: you can ask about what is going on up there,

663
00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 4: what is the afterlife like. Also you can ask advice

664
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:30,960
Speaker 4: for your own life. These souls are very wise. Every

665
00:38:31,040 --> 00:38:34,440
Speaker 4: soul has had many, many lives, and they have the

666
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:37,080
Speaker 4: benefit of wisdom that we've forgotten. When they come here,

667
00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:40,720
Speaker 4: we leave that behind as part of the amnesia of life.

668
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:43,319
Speaker 4: So they have all this wisdom. So we can ask

669
00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:46,799
Speaker 4: their advice. I Jordan about advice about every day about

670
00:38:46,840 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 4: his sister. How should I respond to this or that?

671
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:52,280
Speaker 4: I asked him the work problems. I asked his advice

672
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:55,440
Speaker 4: while I'm doing a psychotherapy session, I'm feeling stuck, what

673
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:59,600
Speaker 4: do I do now? And he speaks up and usually

674
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:03,120
Speaker 4: it's some that didn't occur to me. And so you

675
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:05,000
Speaker 4: can ask for advice. We can ask for the nature

676
00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 4: of reality that we can help let us form a

677
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 4: new or a more accurate cosmology of how things really

678
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,000
Speaker 4: are and why we're here. And we can ask about

679
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:17,520
Speaker 4: them and what's going on for them. I think it

680
00:39:17,560 --> 00:39:21,799
Speaker 4: is important though, in these communications to convey love to

681
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:26,200
Speaker 4: that so to send them love in whatever form, because

682
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:29,120
Speaker 4: they need our love just like we need their love.

683
00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 4: It enhances their existence. So sending love, I think is

684
00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:36,160
Speaker 4: an important part of channeling. When we're channeling love when

685
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 4: something side. So that's basically it's pretty much as simple

686
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:43,240
Speaker 4: as that. And after perious silence, when you finish one question,

687
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 4: you can just write another one them.

688
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 3: Let's go for our last break, and there's more to

689
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:52,120
Speaker 3: say from doctor Matthew McKay. We'll be right back. You're

690
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 3: listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and

691
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:59,800
Speaker 3: Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

692
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,600
Speaker 1: Don't go anywhere. There's more Shades of the Afterlife coming

693
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:10,200
Speaker 1: right up.

694
00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:25,560
Speaker 5: Before the Art Belvault has classic audio waiting for you. Now.

695
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 5: Go to Coast to COASTAM dot com for details. Take

696
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 5: us with you anywhere. This is the iHeartRadio and Coast

697
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,120
Speaker 5: to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

698
00:40:53,640 --> 00:40:56,920
Speaker 3: Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain

699
00:40:57,520 --> 00:41:02,800
Speaker 3: and we've been listening to professor and psychotherapist doctor Matthew

700
00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:08,800
Speaker 3: McKay on how he channels his son Jordan through writing.

701
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 3: If you're anything like me, this is an episode we

702
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:15,800
Speaker 3: want to listen to again with the notebook handy. As

703
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 3: we move on, he's speaking about love and I have

704
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 3: some more questions for him about this channeling process, and

705
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:27,480
Speaker 3: then we also get into the very important topic of grief,

706
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 3: So let's continue.

707
00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:32,560
Speaker 4: I think it is important though, in these communications to

708
00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:36,759
Speaker 4: convey love to that's so to send them love in

709
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:40,719
Speaker 4: whatever form, because they need our love just like we

710
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:45,120
Speaker 4: need their love. It enhances their existence. So sending love,

711
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:47,600
Speaker 4: I think is an important part of channeling. When we're

712
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:51,000
Speaker 4: channeling love on something the other side, Well, that's basically.

713
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:54,440
Speaker 4: It's pretty much as simple as that. And after purious silence,

714
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:57,239
Speaker 4: when you finish one question, you can just write another one.

715
00:41:57,239 --> 00:41:59,560
Speaker 3: That a couple of things that came to mind.

716
00:41:59,760 --> 00:41:59,920
Speaker 4: One.

717
00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:04,560
Speaker 3: I think it's great writing it down because I know,

718
00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 3: if I want to talk to my dad, I'll start, hey, Dad,

719
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 3: and then all of a sudden, it's what are we

720
00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:10,160
Speaker 3: going to have for dinner tonight?

721
00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:13,799
Speaker 4: Exactly a lot of distractions. Yes, that's a good one.

722
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, So we're writing it down when mister or missus

723
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,279
Speaker 3: doubt does creep in though. Something comes out of the

724
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:23,799
Speaker 3: pen and the mind starts to analyze and think, oh,

725
00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:25,960
Speaker 3: that's crazy, I just made it up. Do we go

726
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:28,360
Speaker 3: back to the candle? Do we go back to taking

727
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:32,200
Speaker 3: a few breaths? Thank you doubt for sharing. But we're

728
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:34,000
Speaker 3: going to keep going with this push through that.

729
00:42:34,960 --> 00:42:37,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, I just keep going, Just keep going. Sometimes he

730
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:40,400
Speaker 4: says something. Jordan says a lot of things to me

731
00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:42,600
Speaker 4: that haven't occurred to me before, which is one of

732
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:47,600
Speaker 4: the ways I feel clear about the authenticity of this communication.

733
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:51,680
Speaker 4: But I sometimes you'll say something, I'll go, what is that?

734
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 4: But I just keep going. I just stay with the process.

735
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 4: I asked the next question, or I asked him to

736
00:42:57,239 --> 00:43:01,760
Speaker 4: clarify it, or I'll you men doing boy, I'm feeling

737
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:05,239
Speaker 4: a lot of uncertainty, and so he'll just respond to

738
00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:08,360
Speaker 4: that at some way. So I bring it into the conversation.

739
00:43:08,840 --> 00:43:10,839
Speaker 4: But I think it's important to just keep going, don't

740
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:14,799
Speaker 4: give up when doubt shows up, don't stop stay with it.

741
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:17,400
Speaker 3: I remember when I wrote my book, I had a

742
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 3: writing coach and she says, just let it all flow.

743
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:24,440
Speaker 3: Let it all flow. The time to analyze it is

744
00:43:24,560 --> 00:43:27,200
Speaker 3: after after you got your stories out. And I think

745
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:30,799
Speaker 3: two when we do the channel in writing, don't write

746
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:32,759
Speaker 3: a sentence and read a sentence. Write a sentence, read

747
00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 3: a sentence. Maybe just be in that flow, be open

748
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:42,920
Speaker 3: and experiment with it. I also think, Matt, that it's important.

749
00:43:43,600 --> 00:43:46,360
Speaker 3: I know you say you work with Jordan every week.

750
00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:50,840
Speaker 3: There's so many people and myself included, we want immediate results.

751
00:43:50,880 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 3: We want maybe the lights to flicker on and off

752
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 3: or something so obvious it takes something from us. I

753
00:43:57,880 --> 00:43:59,919
Speaker 3: think it's not that they can't give us a good sign,

754
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:03,600
Speaker 3: because they can, but to open up that relationship and

755
00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 3: keep it going. So would it make sense to make

756
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:10,680
Speaker 3: a date with our loved ones and keep that journal

757
00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:14,120
Speaker 3: and today's date is such and such. How often did

758
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:17,680
Speaker 3: you channel with Jordan when you started.

759
00:44:18,440 --> 00:44:21,920
Speaker 4: I can't remember. I would channel with him fairly often,

760
00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:24,440
Speaker 4: but it might have been about the same interval now

761
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:27,319
Speaker 4: as once a week, I would say. And so over

762
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:32,160
Speaker 4: the course of fifteen years, I've had hundreds of communications

763
00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:37,399
Speaker 4: and I've been so blessed to hear from him. And

764
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:41,279
Speaker 4: so I don't think there's any rule about this, but

765
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:43,440
Speaker 4: I do think that people should try to do it

766
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:47,359
Speaker 4: often enough. If they stay connected. It's the same thing

767
00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:49,319
Speaker 4: when you're any loved one. You have to talk to

768
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:53,440
Speaker 4: them periodically, and that's what feeds the relationship. And you

769
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 4: talk to them, you connect, You find out what's going

770
00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:58,640
Speaker 4: on with them, they find out what's going on with you,

771
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:02,800
Speaker 4: and through that that process, love flows between you. And

772
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:05,160
Speaker 4: I think it's exactly the same thing with loved ones.

773
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:07,880
Speaker 4: In the affli and Jordan has been so clear about this,

774
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:13,600
Speaker 4: I guess I want to say this that relationships always live.

775
00:45:14,719 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 4: It doesn't matter if that person dies, the relationship lives.

776
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:22,240
Speaker 4: That person is just a thought away. They love us,

777
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:27,319
Speaker 4: and the love is still living, still active, still flourishing.

778
00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:31,120
Speaker 4: And that's true regardless of whether we connect to them

779
00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:33,760
Speaker 4: or not, whether we channel or not. But when we channel,

780
00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:36,800
Speaker 4: we get to act on that love ourselves and we

781
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,040
Speaker 4: get to bathe in the love. We get to feel

782
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:41,920
Speaker 4: the love, which is such a beautiful thing. That's one

783
00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 4: of the things that is so wonderful for me. There.

784
00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:47,040
Speaker 4: It doesn't happen every time I channel, but there are

785
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 4: moments when I just feel Jordan's love all through me,

786
00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:55,360
Speaker 4: and I feel my love for him inside my body,

787
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,359
Speaker 4: and it's just such a beautiful moment, and that's one

788
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:01,239
Speaker 4: of the rewards of channeling is feeling that love as

789
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 4: an act of living, experience beautiful words.

790
00:46:05,239 --> 00:46:10,279
Speaker 3: I know personally grief can come on like waves, and

791
00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:14,720
Speaker 3: all the investigating I've done really has helped with the grief,

792
00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:17,400
Speaker 3: but the grief is still there. So if we're in

793
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:21,080
Speaker 3: one of those waves of grief, do we wait till

794
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:24,560
Speaker 3: another time to do it? Push through it, include our

795
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:27,879
Speaker 3: loved one in it. Any words on.

796
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:34,520
Speaker 4: Grief, all emotions are waves, and interestingly, some resources shows

797
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:37,640
Speaker 4: the average emotion lasts less than seven minutes, even in

798
00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 4: grief itself. Now there'll be another wave, but all emotions

799
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:44,680
Speaker 4: come as waves, and to not be afraid of them

800
00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:48,400
Speaker 4: when that wave comes, allow it to ride it. And

801
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:52,160
Speaker 4: it's also you mentioned one choice we have when that

802
00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:56,239
Speaker 4: grief shows up is to turn it into communication, to

803
00:46:56,320 --> 00:46:58,759
Speaker 4: open the channel during the period of grief. And I

804
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 4: think sometimes there's complicated things about grief, and sometimes grief

805
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:04,360
Speaker 4: actually blocks the channel. So people are waiting for the

806
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:06,680
Speaker 4: loved ones to show up or appear to them or

807
00:47:06,719 --> 00:47:09,040
Speaker 4: give them a sign, and their grief is so powerful

808
00:47:09,040 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 4: it kind of blocks the channel and the loved one

809
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:15,759
Speaker 4: can't get through but also paradoxically, if you deliberately open

810
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:18,080
Speaker 4: the channel during grief, I think it can make it.

811
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:21,560
Speaker 4: The communication is more intense, more beautiful in some ways,

812
00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:25,440
Speaker 4: because now we're just not conveying words, we're conveying our

813
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 4: deepest feelings, our love on the deepest level. So the

814
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:32,880
Speaker 4: grief actually is an opportunity to open the channel with

815
00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:36,960
Speaker 4: great power and truthfulness. And the two things here, one

816
00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:39,919
Speaker 4: is don't be afraid of the wave. Let the wave come. See,

817
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:41,799
Speaker 4: people are afraid of grief because they think it's a model.

818
00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:43,960
Speaker 4: Oh the grief's gonna come, it's gonna crush me and

819
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:46,279
Speaker 4: down I go, I won't be able to survive it.

820
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:49,160
Speaker 4: But it doesn't work like that. It's just a wave

821
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:52,239
Speaker 4: and a wave of subsides, and after a period of

822
00:47:52,280 --> 00:47:55,880
Speaker 4: time there'll be another way. The longer out we go

823
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 4: after the person's death, usually the waves are further apart,

824
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:04,439
Speaker 4: and sometimes they're a little less intense. But it's also

825
00:48:04,600 --> 00:48:07,520
Speaker 4: possible years later you can have a wave that goes

826
00:48:07,600 --> 00:48:09,799
Speaker 4: right through the roof and ride it and allow it

827
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:12,360
Speaker 4: and don't be afraid of it, and that wave is

828
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:15,920
Speaker 4: actually an opportunity to connect. I just want to encourage

829
00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:20,240
Speaker 4: people to allow the feeling. On some level, the feeling

830
00:48:20,320 --> 00:48:24,879
Speaker 4: is beautiful because what makes grief so intense is the love,

831
00:48:25,680 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 4: and so when we allow the grief, we're also allowing

832
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:31,720
Speaker 4: the love. And I guess I want to encourage people

833
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:33,759
Speaker 4: to do that. And the last thing I will say

834
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:37,080
Speaker 4: about grief is I've learned if I could put that

835
00:48:37,120 --> 00:48:40,919
Speaker 4: way to grieve Jordan's physical absence, and he'd be thirty nine.

836
00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:42,839
Speaker 4: I don't get to see him grow up. I don't

837
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:44,360
Speaker 4: get to see him having fa I mean, he was

838
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 4: twenty three when he died. They're not going to be

839
00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:49,040
Speaker 4: a family. His girlfriend when he died has a new

840
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:51,680
Speaker 4: partner and has a kid, and I won't get to

841
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:53,680
Speaker 4: have any of that. But I or get to observe

842
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 4: any of that or be part of any of that,

843
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 4: And Jordan, in his life doesn't get to have that.

844
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:01,120
Speaker 4: And so I can have grief about it physical absence,

845
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:05,319
Speaker 4: but I don't have grief about he's gone. And I

846
00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:08,000
Speaker 4: don't have grief about the love I have for him

847
00:49:08,040 --> 00:49:10,040
Speaker 4: has nowhere to go, or the love he has for

848
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:13,840
Speaker 4: me I can't receive. That is not part of the grief.

849
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:16,520
Speaker 4: The grief is just limited to Oh, his physical presence

850
00:49:16,560 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 4: is not here, but Jordan is here. Jordan is with me,

851
00:49:20,600 --> 00:49:23,880
Speaker 4: and he says that to me all the time. Bill Tarious,

852
00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:25,879
Speaker 4: I say it all the time. He's done.

853
00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:26,520
Speaker 5: I am with you.

854
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:29,560
Speaker 4: I am with you, and he is. So the grief

855
00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:34,120
Speaker 4: is limited when we start really communicating and connecting, limited

856
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:37,600
Speaker 4: to just the loss of that physical manifestation of that soul.

857
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:42,359
Speaker 3: Beautiful words. I spoke with a mom you may know her,

858
00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:46,919
Speaker 3: Maria pay, whose two sons were murdered by her ex

859
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:50,239
Speaker 3: husband and then he killed himself, and she said, when

860
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:53,359
Speaker 3: those waves of grief come, I think of a good

861
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:56,120
Speaker 3: memory with my boys. I think I have the love,

862
00:49:56,719 --> 00:49:59,399
Speaker 3: and then I start talking to them. So that's her

863
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:04,240
Speaker 3: way in and then really touched my heart. Matt, any

864
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:06,000
Speaker 3: more words you wish to share?

865
00:50:06,640 --> 00:50:09,879
Speaker 4: Jordan asked me to say. When I have an opportunity

866
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:13,560
Speaker 4: to tell a little bit about history in US, is

867
00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:18,920
Speaker 4: that He just says, Remember, you will be received, you

868
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:22,120
Speaker 4: will be cared for, and you will be loved. When

869
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:26,480
Speaker 4: you die, he says, the dark door will open and

870
00:50:26,560 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 4: the light of love take you. So you don't have

871
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:32,040
Speaker 4: to be afraid of death. And also we don't have

872
00:50:32,120 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 4: to be afraid of the impermanence. Here where loved ones

873
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:41,359
Speaker 4: appear to die, the dark door opens and the light

874
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:45,080
Speaker 4: of love has taken them in and will take us.

875
00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:46,920
Speaker 4: So enjoyed being with you then.

876
00:50:47,239 --> 00:50:50,600
Speaker 3: And thank you to doctor Matthew McKay, author of the

877
00:50:50,600 --> 00:50:54,360
Speaker 3: book Seeking Jordan, How I learned the truth about death

878
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:59,520
Speaker 3: and the Invisible Universe. I hope you give doctor Matt's

879
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:03,960
Speaker 3: channeling a try. Whether you call it automatic writing or

880
00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:08,960
Speaker 3: inspired writing, it's all dealing with the same tools to connect.

881
00:51:09,840 --> 00:51:12,600
Speaker 3: Our loved ones are with us, and they work with

882
00:51:12,680 --> 00:51:16,359
Speaker 3: us in such subtle ways, and sometimes we just need

883
00:51:16,400 --> 00:51:20,640
Speaker 3: to quiet that busy mind to let the floodgates open.

884
00:51:21,080 --> 00:51:23,839
Speaker 3: That little voice of doubt will always be there for us.

885
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:27,399
Speaker 3: But the more we do this, the more we will

886
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:31,359
Speaker 3: be convinced that it is our loved ones speaking. I

887
00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:34,279
Speaker 3: came across a few quotes today that I want to

888
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:38,360
Speaker 3: share with you, not about the afterlife, but about living life.

889
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:41,799
Speaker 3: Often it's very hard to take the first step in

890
00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:44,640
Speaker 3: the direction of our dreams, and it may be to

891
00:51:44,680 --> 00:51:48,880
Speaker 3: do the practice doctor McKay told us about today. William

892
00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:52,480
Speaker 3: shed said a ship in a harbor is safe, but

893
00:51:52,560 --> 00:51:55,600
Speaker 3: that is not what ships are built for and Neil

894
00:51:55,640 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 3: Donald Walsh said life begins at the end of your

895
00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:03,239
Speaker 3: comfort It zonne my friend. It is so difficult being

896
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:06,040
Speaker 3: a human being. But when we venture out of the

897
00:52:06,080 --> 00:52:09,440
Speaker 3: safe harbor and we have our eyes focused on a goal,

898
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 3: miracles happen. You can fill the sales with gratitude and

899
00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:19,360
Speaker 3: kindness and being of service to others. I think that's

900
00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:23,040
Speaker 3: the recipe for a good life. As a reminder, my

901
00:52:23,160 --> 00:52:26,200
Speaker 3: home base is we Don't Die dot com. If you

902
00:52:26,360 --> 00:52:28,719
Speaker 3: enter your name and your email address on that front

903
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,400
Speaker 3: page down at the bottom, you get a free copy

904
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:35,120
Speaker 3: of my book. Chapter ten is how to Survive Grief.

905
00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:37,959
Speaker 3: I do hope you take me up on that. It's

906
00:52:37,960 --> 00:52:42,000
Speaker 3: so powerful. We also offer our free Sunday gathering of

907
00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:48,560
Speaker 3: course with medium demonstration included wonderful classes, demonstrations, events, and

908
00:52:48,680 --> 00:52:52,960
Speaker 3: so much more. I'm Sandra Champlain and from the bottom

909
00:52:53,080 --> 00:52:56,640
Speaker 3: of my heart, thank you for listening to Shades of

910
00:52:56,680 --> 00:53:00,279
Speaker 3: the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to co Stay

911
00:53:00,440 --> 00:53:03,240
Speaker 3: m Paranormal Podcast Network.

912
00:53:10,160 --> 00:53:12,719
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

913
00:53:12,760 --> 00:53:15,759
Speaker 1: Day and Paranormal Podcast Network. Make sure and check out

914
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 1: all our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going

915
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:24,480
Speaker 1: to iHeartRadio dot com