1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Tracy V. 3 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:18,360 Speaker 1: Wilson and I'm Holly Frye. I had already finished this 4 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:22,959 Speaker 1: episode and emailed the outlined Holly when I was trying 5 00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:24,520 Speaker 1: to figure out what I was going to talk about 6 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 1: next and realized listener Angela requested this ages ago. So 7 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:34,159 Speaker 1: thank you, Angela. I mean incredibly long time ago. Thank you, Angela. 8 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:38,199 Speaker 1: Today we are going to talk about an industrial disaster, 9 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:42,239 Speaker 1: one that's sometimes described as the worst industrial disaster in 10 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 1: US history. And unlike a lot of industrial disasters that 11 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 1: involve kind of a single acute incident like an explosion 12 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 1: or a gas leak or a collapse, the Hawk's Nest 13 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: Tunnel disaster involved thousands of workers being exposed to silica 14 00:00:59,080 --> 00:01:02,960 Speaker 1: dust over the entire course of the project, and then 15 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 1: people continued to get sick and die for years after 16 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:11,320 Speaker 1: it was finished. In the words of Representative Glenn Griswold 17 00:01:11,360 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 1: in a House subcommittee report, quote, it is the story 18 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,360 Speaker 1: of a tragedy worthy of the pen of Victor Hugo, 19 00:01:17,959 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 1: the story of men in the darkest days of the Depression, 20 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:25,240 Speaker 1: with work hard to secure, driven by despair and the 21 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:28,960 Speaker 1: stark fear of hunger, to work for a mere existence 22 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 1: wage under almost intolerable conditions. A lot of the men 23 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:37,680 Speaker 1: who died as a result of their work on this 24 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 1: project were black men who had come to West Virginia 25 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:44,119 Speaker 1: from farther south. They had basically heard that there were 26 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 1: good paying jobs in the minds and then they instead 27 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 1: wound up in this situation. Uh, this is one of 28 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 1: those episodes that I knew was going to be, you know, 29 00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 1: a little more difficult going in, but then it turned 30 00:01:57,440 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 1: out to be a lot worse than I realized that. 31 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 1: In a lot of ways, this is a story about 32 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 1: people making business decisions with just total disregard for workers' 33 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,959 Speaker 1: lives and safety, all for the sake of doing something 34 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:14,640 Speaker 1: faster and cheaper. And this even extended to how people's 35 00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:18,760 Speaker 1: bodies were treated after they died. A lot of the 36 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 1: specifics of this disaster are tricky to confirm. A lot 37 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:25,960 Speaker 1: of the records relating to it have been lost or destroyed. 38 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 1: Some of this probably was not malicious, like one hospital 39 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 1: went through a merger in the nineteen forties and it's 40 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:36,799 Speaker 1: old records apparently were not retained. But some of this 41 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:41,160 Speaker 1: missing record situation is suspicious at best, like out of 42 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 1: court settlements requiring workers lawyers to hand over all the 43 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:48,480 Speaker 1: evidence that they had gathered to the companies involved, and 44 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 1: that happened more than once. Some of the records also 45 00:02:53,160 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 1: just never existed. Like today, employers in the United States 46 00:02:57,360 --> 00:03:00,760 Speaker 1: are expected to keep records of all that their employees 47 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 1: for tax purposes, including their Social Security numbers. There for 48 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: sure people that don't do that, but you're supposed to. 49 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 1: Those's Security numbers weren't introduced until nineteen thirty six, though, 50 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:18,959 Speaker 1: and record keeping prior to that point could be really lax. Also, 51 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 1: once this construction project was over, a lot of the 52 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 1: people who had come to West Virginia trying to find 53 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 1: work moved on to other places. Once investigations started. They 54 00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:32,360 Speaker 1: couldn't really be found. And on top of that, the 55 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:36,240 Speaker 1: information that we do have is full of contradictions. In 56 00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 1: court and congressional testimony, workers and managers described the Hawk's 57 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:45,400 Speaker 1: Nest Tunnels working conditions in almost totally opposite ways. There 58 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: were also multiple witnesses who initially supported workers accounts, only 59 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 1: to change their testimony later on and support management's version 60 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 1: of events. Various court cases involved suspicions of witness and 61 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:03,200 Speaker 1: jury tampering. A radical labor newspaper called People's Press printed 62 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 1: a lot of unsubstantiated information that was picked up by 63 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 1: more authoritative sources. The novel Hawk's Nest, published in nineteen 64 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:15,720 Speaker 1: forty one, was a fictionalized version of the disaster, but 65 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:19,279 Speaker 1: some of its possibly fictionalized details were picked up as 66 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:24,479 Speaker 1: fact in later writing, so it's a lot to kind 67 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 1: of try to puzzle through. Although another company carried out 68 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:33,600 Speaker 1: the actual construction, The Hawk's Nest Tunnel was built for 69 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:38,520 Speaker 1: Union Carbide and Carbon Corporation, later just known as Union Carbide. 70 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:42,600 Speaker 1: Union Carbide and Carbon Company was formed in nineteen seventeen 71 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:46,240 Speaker 1: through the consolidation of several companies that had some overlap 72 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:50,840 Speaker 1: in their businesses. Most of them produced calcium carbide or ascettelene, 73 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:54,560 Speaker 1: which is made from calcium carbide, or they used those 74 00:04:54,720 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 1: compounds in some way. This newly created company started expanding 75 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:03,920 Speaker 1: into new industries and it acquired additional companies as it did. 76 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 1: One was Electro Metallurgical Company, which manufactured calcium carbide and acettling, 77 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:14,400 Speaker 1: as well as other materials like tungsten, titanium, and various alloys. 78 00:05:15,200 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 1: Union Carbide acquired Electro Metallurgical Company in nineteen twenty two. 79 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 1: Soon after, Boncar, West Virginia, on the Kanaw River was 80 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 1: selected as the site for a new electro Metallurgical Company plant. 81 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:31,359 Speaker 1: Boncar was named as a rearrangement of the syllables in 82 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 1: the word carbon, and it was renamed Alloy in nineteen 83 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 1: thirty one. This new plant would need electricity, and in 84 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 1: January of nineteen twenty seven, Union Carbide established the new 85 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:48,040 Speaker 1: Kana Power Company as a wholly owned subsidiary. This company 86 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 1: was licensed to provide power for both industrial and more 87 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:55,840 Speaker 1: community residential use. There was some suggestion that it would 88 00:05:55,920 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 1: ultimately be a public utility, but in reality Union Carbide 89 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:04,160 Speaker 1: establish this company solely to provide power to this new 90 00:06:04,320 --> 00:06:09,679 Speaker 1: electro Metallurgical Company plant. Union Carbide already controlled a dam 91 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:12,919 Speaker 1: on the Kana River, but this didn't provide enough electricity 92 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: to power the proposed new plant, So the plan was 93 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:19,359 Speaker 1: to build a dam on the New River just below 94 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:23,000 Speaker 1: Hawk's Nest Peak near the town of golly Bridge. A 95 00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:25,719 Speaker 1: tunnel would divert water from the New River to a 96 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:29,160 Speaker 1: power plant in Bonkar. This tunnel would be a little 97 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:32,640 Speaker 1: more than sixteen thousand feet or roughly three miles long. 98 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 1: It's about four point eight kilometers. It would also drop 99 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:39,600 Speaker 1: one hundred and sixty two feet or almost fifty meters, 100 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:42,920 Speaker 1: giving the water flowing through it more power to turn 101 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:47,160 Speaker 1: the turbines at the lower end. If this were happening today, 102 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:51,719 Speaker 1: there would be way more discussion among government agencies and 103 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:56,359 Speaker 1: environmental groups and other organizations. Damming this river created a 104 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:59,160 Speaker 1: two hundred and fifty acre lake behind it, and the 105 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:03,080 Speaker 1: tunnel div bverded water away from several miles of the riverbed. 106 00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:07,160 Speaker 1: That stretch of river was nicknamed the Dries because it 107 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:10,520 Speaker 1: was dry most of the time. The New River is 108 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 1: a tributary of the Knar River, and in times of 109 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:16,160 Speaker 1: low water flow, they can provide more than half of 110 00:07:16,200 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 1: the Ohio River's volume, So there was just a huge 111 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: water system downstream of this dam that could be affected 112 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: by it. At the time, though, the biggest questions about 113 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:31,000 Speaker 1: this were about whether the dam would affect the passage 114 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:35,800 Speaker 1: of coal barges. Various state and federal agencies either approved 115 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 1: the project or didn't get in the way of it. 116 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:43,559 Speaker 1: Union Carbide selected construction company Rehinehart and Dennis to build 117 00:07:43,560 --> 00:07:47,080 Speaker 1: the tunnel. Rehinehart and Dennis was the lowest bidder, but 118 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:51,200 Speaker 1: also had a reputation for high quality work. Reinehart and 119 00:07:51,240 --> 00:07:55,080 Speaker 1: Dennis worked under Union Carbide supervision, carrying out a project 120 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 1: that was planned and designed by Union Carbide engineers. The 121 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: project was classified as a construction project, not a mine, 122 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 1: which meant that at least at first, it was free 123 00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:10,600 Speaker 1: from oversight and inspection by the West Virginia Department of Mines, 124 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:14,640 Speaker 1: and West Virginia laws involving things like ventilation in minds 125 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 1: did not apply. Yeah, these laws were not particularly robust, 126 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: but they existed. Yeah. However, though this tunnel was a mine, 127 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:30,960 Speaker 1: it cut through Gaully Mountain, which was largely made of sandstone, 128 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 1: and Union Carbide was aware of the potential to find 129 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 1: silica as the workers drilled through it. Silica is used 130 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:41,960 Speaker 1: to make things like glass, ceramic, and bricks, and it's 131 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,199 Speaker 1: used in the metallurgical work that was going to be 132 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:48,760 Speaker 1: carried out at the newly built plant. And the workers 133 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:51,200 Speaker 1: did find silica. They found a lot of it, and 134 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:54,760 Speaker 1: some of it was exceptionally pure. Most of this tunnel 135 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:57,960 Speaker 1: measured thirty two feet in diameter, but about a third 136 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:01,400 Speaker 1: of it was expanded to four six feet in diameter 137 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 1: to allow the workers to remove more of the silica 138 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:09,079 Speaker 1: as they were drilling it. A lot of workers described 139 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:12,440 Speaker 1: this as a cause and effect situation. They found a 140 00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:15,280 Speaker 1: source of more than ninety percent pure silica while drilling, 141 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:18,200 Speaker 1: so the company decided to widen the tunnel to get 142 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:21,200 Speaker 1: more of it. While we don't know exactly when the 143 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:24,440 Speaker 1: decision was made to widen the tunnel, there is evidence 144 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:26,960 Speaker 1: that this expansion was part of the plan, or at 145 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:31,960 Speaker 1: least a known possibility from the beginning. Various blueprints note 146 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 1: the possibility of expanding the tunnel's diameter, and some that 147 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 1: show the increase are dated about a month before drilling 148 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 1: started on that section, before high quality silica was discovered 149 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:47,160 Speaker 1: in the tunnel. There's other circumstantial evidence as well, like 150 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:50,640 Speaker 1: there's no evidence that Reinhardt and Dennis was paid more 151 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: for this unexpected increase in the size of the job, 152 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:56,559 Speaker 1: which they were originally expected to finish in the same 153 00:09:56,640 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 1: two year timeframe that they had originally agreed to. More 154 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 1: than half a million cubic yards of material was removed 155 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: from this tunnel as it was being built. This included 156 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:12,960 Speaker 1: three hundred thousand tons of silica that was all transported 157 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 1: to the bond car factory site for later use in 158 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 1: metallurgical work. When inhaled silica dust causes a form of 159 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:26,840 Speaker 1: pulmonary fibrosis called silicosis. The silica particles damaged the lung tissue, 160 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:29,360 Speaker 1: leading to scarring that can make it hard to breathe. 161 00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:35,199 Speaker 1: Silicoses can also make people more susceptible to tuberculosis and pneumonia. 162 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,480 Speaker 1: Even today, there is no cure for silicosis, but in 163 00:10:39,559 --> 00:10:44,319 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty there was neither cure nor treatment. It's estimated 164 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 1: that at least seven hundred sixty four of the roughly 165 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:49,679 Speaker 1: three thousand men who worked in the Hawk's Nest tunnel 166 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,920 Speaker 1: died of silicosis, although that number may be too low 167 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:57,120 Speaker 1: and it's likely that many more dealt with chronic silicoses 168 00:10:57,120 --> 00:10:59,959 Speaker 1: for the rest of their lives. We'll get into more 169 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 1: detail about this after a sponsor break. People have been 170 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 1: associating the breathing of dust with lung diseases really sense antiquity, 171 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,200 Speaker 1: and by the sixteenth century people were also connecting this 172 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 1: specifically to working in minds, and they were making recommendations 173 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:30,760 Speaker 1: on how to make mining safer. German scholar Georgius Agricola, 174 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 1: who is sometimes called the father of mineralogy, wrote this 175 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:38,160 Speaker 1: in his on the Nature of Minerals, published in fifteen 176 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:41,880 Speaker 1: fifty six. Quote, some minds are so dry that they 177 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:45,600 Speaker 1: are entirely devoid of water, and this dryness causes the 178 00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: workmen even greater harm. For the dust which is stirred 179 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:52,840 Speaker 1: and beaten up by digging, penetrates into the windpipe and 180 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:57,080 Speaker 1: lungs and produces difficulty in breathing and the disease which 181 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:01,560 Speaker 1: the Greeks call asthma. If the dust has corrosive qualities, 182 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:06,000 Speaker 1: it eats away the lungs and implants consumption in the body. Hence, 183 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,800 Speaker 1: in the minds of the Carpathian Mountains women are found 184 00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:12,199 Speaker 1: who have married seven husbands, all of whom this terrible 185 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 1: consumption has carried off to a premature death. Georgia's Agricola 186 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:21,439 Speaker 1: recommended that workers wear loose veils over their faces so 187 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:24,199 Speaker 1: that the dust wouldn't be drawn into their windpipes or 188 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:28,040 Speaker 1: their lungs, or getting their eyes. Me also described various 189 00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 1: ventilating machines to draw stagnant air out of the mind 190 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:37,079 Speaker 1: shafts during the Industrial Revolution in the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, 191 00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:42,640 Speaker 1: people started making more connections between respiratory diseases and inhaled substances, 192 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 1: especially coal, dust, asbestos, and silicon. Various people, governments, and 193 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:52,880 Speaker 1: regulators started trying to reduce people's exposure to these substances 194 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:56,679 Speaker 1: at work. For example, wet drilling, which was introduced in 195 00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 1: Britain in eighteen ninety seven, usually took long and was 196 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:04,320 Speaker 1: more expensive than dry drilling, but it produced far less dust. 197 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 1: In nineteen eleven, dry drilling was banned in South Africa altogether, 198 00:13:10,440 --> 00:13:13,679 Speaker 1: although the US lagged behind Britain a bit, By the 199 00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: early twentieth century, the US Public Health Service and the 200 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 1: US Bureau of Mines were both looking at ways to 201 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 1: reduce workplace exposure to dust. In nineteen fourteen, the Federal 202 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:28,800 Speaker 1: Bureau of Mines started recommending annual physicals for workers who 203 00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:32,240 Speaker 1: were exposed to silica dust. The Public Health Service of 204 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:36,559 Speaker 1: the Department of Mines also investigated respiratory diseases that were 205 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:40,960 Speaker 1: occurring in mine workers in Joplin, Missouri. They released a 206 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 1: report on their investigations in nineteen fifteen in that they 207 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:48,720 Speaker 1: found that inhaled dust was a primary factor in the 208 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:53,520 Speaker 1: diseases that the workers were developing. They also clearly documented 209 00:13:53,559 --> 00:13:58,280 Speaker 1: a distinction between silicosis and tuberculosis, as well as the 210 00:13:58,280 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 1: fact that silicosis made a person and more susceptible to tuberculosis. 211 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:07,319 Speaker 1: British researchers had connected silica dust exposure to lung fibrosis 212 00:14:07,679 --> 00:14:10,439 Speaker 1: back in the eighteen sixties, but this work in the 213 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:14,160 Speaker 1: nineteen teens led to huge efforts to educate miners and 214 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 1: mine operators about the dangers of dust exposure. In the US, 215 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 1: the US Public Health Service started distributing bulletins about the 216 00:14:22,520 --> 00:14:27,240 Speaker 1: hazards of silica dust. In nineteen seventeen, a device called 217 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 1: the impinger was introduced to measure airborne dust in mines. 218 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:34,320 Speaker 1: This was nicknamed the bubbler for the way the gases 219 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:36,880 Speaker 1: bubbled through a vial of liquid, and it was more 220 00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: efficient and reliable than earlier methods of measuring airborne dust. 221 00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:45,440 Speaker 1: There were also specific recommendations to reduce the amount of 222 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:49,240 Speaker 1: dust in the air, like using wet drilling instead of 223 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: dry drilling. The US Bureau of Mines also started making 224 00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:59,240 Speaker 1: recommendations for ventilation and protective equipment, including recommending specific respirators 225 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:03,080 Speaker 1: starting in Ninia oneteen twenty six. Crews broke ground on 226 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: the Hawk's Nest Tunnel project on March thirtieth, nineteen thirty, 227 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:10,080 Speaker 1: at which point the dangers of airborne silica had been 228 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 1: well established, but little to no effort was put into 229 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:17,600 Speaker 1: reducing workers exposure to silica. At the Hawk's Nest Tunnel, 230 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: ventilation was provided through a canvas pipe that was not 231 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 1: sufficient and was also increasingly full of holes that were 232 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 1: made by falling rocks and debris. Workers also alleged that 233 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 1: the ventilation system was only turned on when inspectors or 234 00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:37,040 Speaker 1: company visitors came to the tunnel. People who routinely worked 235 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:40,560 Speaker 1: in the tunnel were not provided with respirators, although inspectors 236 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:43,920 Speaker 1: and company managers reportedly wore them while they were in 237 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 1: the tunnel, and according to worker testimony, this work mostly 238 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 1: involved dry drilling, not wet drilling. Some of the drills 239 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 1: they were using were equipped with hose attachments, but workers 240 00:15:56,680 --> 00:16:00,720 Speaker 1: testified that water was only turned onto them when inspectors 241 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:04,400 Speaker 1: were on site. Crews used a heading and bench method, 242 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:07,920 Speaker 1: drilling forward into the heading and then down into the bench, 243 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:11,240 Speaker 1: and they would fill the holes with explosives. Clear the 244 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:15,680 Speaker 1: mind for detonation. In theory, detonations happened at the end 245 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:17,520 Speaker 1: of the shift, and there was at least a two 246 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: hour break to allow the dust to settle, but multiple 247 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:24,520 Speaker 1: workers testified that this break could be as little as 248 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: thirty minutes, and then as soon as they started work, 249 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:31,640 Speaker 1: they started kicking up dust again. Workers described this tunnel 250 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 1: being thickly clouded with dust, sometimes with only a few 251 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:38,800 Speaker 1: feet of visibility. If most of the workers in the 252 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 1: tunnel had been local men with mining experience, they may 253 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 1: have been more aware of the dangers of silica dust, 254 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:49,479 Speaker 1: although obviously this would not have absolved their employers of anything. 255 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 1: But the vast majority of the men who worked inside 256 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: the tunnel were not local residents or men with mining experience. 257 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: They were predominantly black men who had come to West 258 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:02,920 Speaker 1: Virginia from farther south having heard that there were good 259 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:06,520 Speaker 1: paying jobs in the mines. In some cases, they heard 260 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:10,240 Speaker 1: this from recruiters who were specifically looking for tunnel workers, 261 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: but in other cases it was word of mouth through communities. 262 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:17,800 Speaker 1: But the Great Depression had seriously impacted the mining industry 263 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:21,280 Speaker 1: in West Virginia, so instead of high paying jobs as 264 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:24,440 Speaker 1: coal miners, these men made slightly more than they would 265 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:28,200 Speaker 1: have doing agricultural work in the south drilling this tunnel. 266 00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:32,600 Speaker 1: The highest paid, most experienced workers on the tunnel project 267 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:35,840 Speaker 1: were ones who had come with Reinhart and Dennis, not 268 00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 1: people who were hired from the local community. In addition 269 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 1: to all of that, under the terms of its contract, 270 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:46,760 Speaker 1: Hinehart and Dennis was supposed to provide a hospital for workers, 271 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:50,320 Speaker 1: but in reality it only set up four first aid stations. 272 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:54,960 Speaker 1: Seriously injured workers were taken to Coal Valley Hospital about 273 00:17:55,000 --> 00:18:00,240 Speaker 1: fourteen miles away. Two doctors, one employed by Rhinehardt and 274 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:04,000 Speaker 1: Dennis and the other by Nucana Power Company, both testified 275 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:07,720 Speaker 1: in court that they did not know anything about silicosis 276 00:18:07,840 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 1: or other occupational diseases. It's really not clear whether they 277 00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:16,960 Speaker 1: were really ignorant of this or whether they were lying 278 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:19,480 Speaker 1: to try to protect themselves in some way. Either way, 279 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,919 Speaker 1: like this was inexcusable. It's a little unfathomable that like, 280 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:28,560 Speaker 1: two doctors working in West Virginia mine country would be 281 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:34,119 Speaker 1: unaware of silicosis. We don't keep up to date on anything. Yeah, 282 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,880 Speaker 1: either way, it's bad. Both of them reportedly gave sick 283 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,200 Speaker 1: workers pills that were nicknamed little black devils. These were 284 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:44,800 Speaker 1: baking soda covered with sugar. They would have done nothing. 285 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 1: While each of these doctors diagnosed some sick workers with 286 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:53,320 Speaker 1: pneumonia or tuberculosis, which they may actually have had, at 287 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:56,680 Speaker 1: least one of them frequently told workers they had ton 288 00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:01,159 Speaker 1: of ititis, saying this was a temporary condition by harmless 289 00:19:01,240 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 1: rock dust. Racism was also a factor in all of this. 290 00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:09,560 Speaker 1: When black workers started getting sick and dying, doctors claimed 291 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:12,679 Speaker 1: that it was because black people were unusually susceptible to 292 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 1: lung diseases. The population of the county where this project 293 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:20,119 Speaker 1: was located was about eighty percent white, but the workforce 294 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:22,919 Speaker 1: at the tunnel was more than sixty five percent black. 295 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:26,840 Speaker 1: Seventy five percent of the people who worked partly or 296 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:30,040 Speaker 1: exclusively inside the tunnel were black, and many of the 297 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:33,120 Speaker 1: white workers in the tunnel were foreman or were classified 298 00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:37,320 Speaker 1: as skilled workers. Meanwhile, black workers were assigned to the 299 00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:41,720 Speaker 1: dirtiest and most dangerous jobs, including drilling and hauling debris. 300 00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:46,640 Speaker 1: Black workers were also treated differently off the job. Most 301 00:19:46,680 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 1: of the workers on the tunnel project lived in a 302 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:52,400 Speaker 1: company town made of tar paper shacks, and that town 303 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:56,359 Speaker 1: was destroyed after the project was over. This was really 304 00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 1: pretty common for these sorts of jobs at the time, 305 00:19:58,840 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 1: particularly when they were taking place in remote areas. White 306 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:07,080 Speaker 1: workers lived four to a shack, and their shacks had electricity, 307 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:11,520 Speaker 1: although this was mostly one bare light bulb. Black workers, though, 308 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:14,359 Speaker 1: lived in shacks that were the same size, but they 309 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:18,720 Speaker 1: had as many as fifteen people in each one. Sometimes 310 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 1: they were even sleeping two to a bunk. Rant on 311 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,200 Speaker 1: the shacks was deducted from workers pay, and the amount 312 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 1: was the same regardless of how many people were living 313 00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:31,840 Speaker 1: in the same shack. Workers were also charged for coal 314 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:35,560 Speaker 1: and electricity, whether they were using it or not. Black 315 00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:38,639 Speaker 1: workers were not only paid less than white workers, but 316 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:41,320 Speaker 1: were also paid in script at the end of each shift, 317 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:44,960 Speaker 1: while white workers were paid cash once a week. The 318 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:48,560 Speaker 1: rationale for the pay schedule for this was also racist. 319 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:52,679 Speaker 1: Managers claimed that black workers couldn't mentally keep up with 320 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,359 Speaker 1: a whole week's worth of shifts. Script could only be 321 00:20:56,440 --> 00:20:59,200 Speaker 1: used at the company store, and while black workers could 322 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,440 Speaker 1: exchange their script for cash once a week, the company 323 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:06,640 Speaker 1: deducted a fee to do so. Many black workers reported 324 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:11,040 Speaker 1: experiencing bullying, harassment, and threats, including at the hands of 325 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: armed shack rousters who cleared the camps at the start 326 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:17,640 Speaker 1: of the workday, including forcing people who were too sick 327 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:20,959 Speaker 1: to work out of their beds. Yeah, because people were 328 00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:23,119 Speaker 1: living in company housing, if they were too sick to 329 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: come back to work, they were often just kicked out 330 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:31,680 Speaker 1: of the housing entirely. There was nowhere for any of 331 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:35,439 Speaker 1: these workers to shower or change their clothes at the 332 00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 1: ends of their shifts. There's actually no mention of hygiene 333 00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:42,600 Speaker 1: facilities in the site plans at all, So people left 334 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 1: the tunnel for the day covered in silica dust. Witnesses 335 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:51,520 Speaker 1: who lived in Gollybridge described workers leaving a trail of 336 00:21:51,640 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 1: white footprints behind them which went on for hundreds of 337 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 1: feet as they left at the end of their shift. 338 00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:01,200 Speaker 1: People who lived local, which I mean there were some 339 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,800 Speaker 1: people who did live locally, they got home still covered 340 00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:07,879 Speaker 1: in dust, so they exposed their family members as well. 341 00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:11,600 Speaker 1: It is not known how many additional people may have 342 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:15,040 Speaker 1: developed silicosis as a result to exposure from their like 343 00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 1: fathers or brothers or husbands, clothing and hair and all 344 00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: of that. And then for the folks that lived in 345 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:26,520 Speaker 1: the company town couldn't escape from the dust. It was 346 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,720 Speaker 1: always with them and we're going to talk about how 347 00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,200 Speaker 1: all of this combined to form an industrial disaster after 348 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:45,480 Speaker 1: we pause for a sponsor break. As we said earlier, 349 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:49,320 Speaker 1: Cruise broke ground on the Hawk's Nest tunnel on March thirtieth, 350 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:52,480 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty, but major digging didn't start until a few 351 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: months later. This involved four shafts being drilled at once, 352 00:22:57,640 --> 00:22:59,600 Speaker 1: although they didn't all start at the same time. That's 353 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:01,800 Speaker 1: where they were or four first aid stations. There was 354 00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:05,639 Speaker 1: like one at each tunnel entrance. Two shafts were drilled 355 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:10,080 Speaker 1: from the tunnel's entrance and exit toward the middle. Two 356 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,679 Speaker 1: more started roughly in the middle at a shaft that 357 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:15,760 Speaker 1: was drilled down from a ravine, and they worked outward. 358 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:19,600 Speaker 1: After a cycle of drilling and blasting, crews would level 359 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 1: the floor of the tunnel. They would lay tracks for 360 00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 1: equipment before they started the whole cycle over again. In 361 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:29,679 Speaker 1: addition to the dust exposure, workers were also exposed to 362 00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:33,960 Speaker 1: carbon monoxide and exhaust from dinky engines. These were basically 363 00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 1: miniature locomotives that were used to haul cars full of 364 00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:41,919 Speaker 1: equipment coming in or debris going out. Men started getting 365 00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 1: six soon after construction started, and in court testimony. Workers 366 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:49,840 Speaker 1: described carrying between ten and fifteen people out of the 367 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:53,800 Speaker 1: tunnel every day after they'd been overcome by exhaust or dust, 368 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 1: and turnover among the workforce was huge. Sixty percent of 369 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 1: men who worked in the tunnel were they for less 370 00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:04,479 Speaker 1: than two months, eighty percent lasted less than six months, 371 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:08,320 Speaker 1: and ninety percent stayed less than a year. On average, 372 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:11,480 Speaker 1: white tunnel workers held the job for sixteen weeks, as 373 00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:15,280 Speaker 1: compared to fifteen weeks for black workers, but again black 374 00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 1: workers were far more likely to be in the tunnel. 375 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:22,399 Speaker 1: The turnover rate was not entirely due to illness. People 376 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:26,119 Speaker 1: also left for other reasons or got fired. But it 377 00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:29,360 Speaker 1: quickly became obvious that working in the tunnel was hazardous, 378 00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:33,119 Speaker 1: and within two months of drilling starting, workers were dying, 379 00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:38,400 Speaker 1: so Ryan Hard and Dennis hired replacements. The Great Depression 380 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:41,600 Speaker 1: was ongoing. People were desperate for work, and they had 381 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:47,159 Speaker 1: been really overwhelmed with interested workers from the start. We 382 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 1: don't know what happened to everyone who died while working 383 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:53,119 Speaker 1: on the tunnel, whether their death was due to silicosis 384 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:56,560 Speaker 1: or some other cause. In terms of black workers, there 385 00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 1: are records of only ten bodies being shipped back to 386 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 1: family ones. In North Carolina and Tennessee, black workers' bodies 387 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:07,560 Speaker 1: could not be buried in local Whites only cemeteries, and 388 00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:10,240 Speaker 1: there were rumors that some of them were placed along 389 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,520 Speaker 1: the river bank and covered in stone that had been 390 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:17,200 Speaker 1: excavated from the tunnel. Another rumor involved burials taking place 391 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:21,720 Speaker 1: in old slave cemeteries or in mass graves in fields. 392 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,359 Speaker 1: So as far as I know, neither of those rumors 393 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: was substantiated, but Reinhardt and Dennis definitely paid local undertaker 394 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:34,520 Speaker 1: Hadley See White fifty five dollars a burial, which was 395 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,359 Speaker 1: twenty five dollars more than was typically charged for a 396 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: paupers burial. They paid him this to bury at least 397 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 1: thirty bodies. White said that he did this at a 398 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 1: cemetery he had created on the outskirts of his mother's farm, 399 00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:52,720 Speaker 1: and that each person was buried in his own pine coffin, 400 00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:56,760 Speaker 1: but locals believed that he buried one hundred and sixty 401 00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: nine people at the farm in a mass grave. It 402 00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 1: is not clear where this number came from. During a 403 00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:09,120 Speaker 1: highway expansion in nineteen seventy two, a crew identified sixty 404 00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:12,199 Speaker 1: three potential grave sites at the former site of the 405 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,719 Speaker 1: White family farm, and then afterward the remains of forty 406 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:19,520 Speaker 1: two people were moved from that site to another place 407 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:23,960 Speaker 1: known as Whipperwill Cemetery. I have a sidebark question, yeah, 408 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:28,840 Speaker 1: that you may not know of those sixty three grave sites. 409 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,160 Speaker 1: Where did those appear to be as he had said 410 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 1: that he had put them in coffins and buried them separately? 411 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: Or was that not apparent? It's a little hard to tell, gotcha. 412 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:44,560 Speaker 1: Like it does seem like there were individual burials. There 413 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: was wood in some of them, gotcha. Beyond that, I 414 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:54,360 Speaker 1: did not find extensive detail. That was just my own curiosity. 415 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:57,920 Speaker 1: In the spring of nineteen thirty one, Robert Lambee, director 416 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,919 Speaker 1: of the West Virginia Department of Mines, heard that a 417 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,399 Speaker 1: lot of workers were dying at the Hawk's Nest Tunnel 418 00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:07,359 Speaker 1: and ordered an inspection. He also called for respirators to 419 00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,960 Speaker 1: be issued to the workers and for warnings to be 420 00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:15,040 Speaker 1: posted about the dangers of silica dust. That was never done. Initially, 421 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:18,320 Speaker 1: Lamby was very critical of conditions at the tunnel, but 422 00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,199 Speaker 1: later on he changed his opinion completely and testified on 423 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:26,119 Speaker 1: behalf of Reinhardt and Dennis. He later said that his 424 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:29,440 Speaker 1: initial information had come from his staff, whose comments had 425 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 1: been precautionary and did not reflect actual conditions at the tunnel. 426 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,119 Speaker 1: Shortly after all of this, Lamby left the Department of 427 00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:43,120 Speaker 1: Mines and started working as a private consultant to mining corporations. Yeah, 428 00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:45,520 Speaker 1: just to be clear, there were some inspections of the tunnel. 429 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:48,840 Speaker 1: We've referenced some inspections, but like the posting of warnings 430 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:53,440 Speaker 1: and the issuing of respirators is what didn't happen. Workers 431 00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:56,119 Speaker 1: broke through the connection on two of the shafts on 432 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:59,399 Speaker 1: August sixth of nineteen thirty one. They broke through the 433 00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:03,240 Speaker 1: other two on September nineteenth, which made the tunnel one 434 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 1: Haull Tunnel. Finishing work continued inside the tunnel until December. 435 00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,200 Speaker 1: The entire project was completed, about ten weeks ahead of schedule. 436 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,959 Speaker 1: Only two percent of the original workforce of people who 437 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,840 Speaker 1: were working in the tunnel were still there when the 438 00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:24,320 Speaker 1: tunnel was finished. It's estimated that more than sixty percent 439 00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:27,399 Speaker 1: of the more than twelve hundred workers who spent more 440 00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:31,280 Speaker 1: than two months working in the tunnel died of silicosis 441 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 1: within seven years. Although people in the area around golly 442 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 1: Bridge had heard rumors about worker deaths at the tunnel 443 00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:43,560 Speaker 1: didn't really spread beyond that for a few years. There 444 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: had been one article in the Fayette Tribune on May twentieth, 445 00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:51,080 Speaker 1: nineteen twenty one, which mentioned a gag order keeping reporters 446 00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:55,920 Speaker 1: from being able to confirm details. Then coverage mostly disappeared 447 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 1: until nineteen thirty three. In nineteen thirty four, when workers 448 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:04,040 Speaker 1: in the family started filing lawsuits, more than five hundred 449 00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 1: of them, many of which were settled out of court. 450 00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 1: One group of one hundred and fifty seven plaintiffs sought 451 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:15,080 Speaker 1: a total of four million dollars in damages, but ultimately 452 00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:18,080 Speaker 1: settled for one hundred and thirty thousand dollars, and half 453 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,560 Speaker 1: of that settlement went to the attorney's dudge. J. W. 454 00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:25,360 Speaker 1: Eery heard these cases and recommended settlement amounts that were 455 00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:29,520 Speaker 1: based on the men's race and their marital status. So 456 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 1: the recommendation was survivors of a black man would receive 457 00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 1: four hundred dollars if he was unmarried, or six hundred 458 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 1: dollars if he was married. Survivors of an unmarried white 459 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,520 Speaker 1: man would received eight hundred dollars or one thousand dollars 460 00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:45,600 Speaker 1: if he was married. And then there was an additional 461 00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:48,920 Speaker 1: payment suggested for married white men of six hundred dollars, 462 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 1: making the maximum total payout sixteen hundred dollars. One of 463 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 1: the most drawn out individual cases involved a white miner 464 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,680 Speaker 1: named Raymond Johnson. This was the first suit to be filed, 465 00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:04,120 Speaker 1: and at the time he was believed to have about 466 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,120 Speaker 1: a year left to live. His case ended in a 467 00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:10,959 Speaker 1: hung jury, and there were allegations of witness and jury tampering. 468 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 1: His attorneys tried to file another suit, but Johnson died 469 00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:18,840 Speaker 1: of acute silicosis before that suit could be heard. In 470 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,720 Speaker 1: March of nineteen thirty five, the West Virginia House of 471 00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:26,080 Speaker 1: Delegates passed a new worker's compensation law that covered silicosis. 472 00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:31,280 Speaker 1: Silicosis had been sort of implicitly mentioned in earlier legislation 473 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:36,120 Speaker 1: but not specifically mentioned, but the requirements meant that none 474 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,640 Speaker 1: of the men who had survived working in the Hawk's 475 00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 1: Nest Tunnel qualified. A worker had to have been exposed 476 00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:47,320 Speaker 1: over more than two years of continuous employment, but the 477 00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 1: Hawk's Nest Tunnel construction had not lasted that long. More 478 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,920 Speaker 1: than two hundred workers who tried to apply for compensation 479 00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 1: anyway had their cases dismissed because more than a year 480 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:03,080 Speaker 1: had passed, so considered to be outside the statute of limitations. 481 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:07,800 Speaker 1: On January sixteenth, nineteen thirty six, hearings on the Hawk's 482 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:11,400 Speaker 1: Nest disaster began before the US House of Representatives Committee 483 00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:16,120 Speaker 1: on Labor. Newsweek reported on these hearings on January twenty fifth, 484 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:20,120 Speaker 1: again bringing more national awareness of what had happened. The 485 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:24,600 Speaker 1: hearings continued until February fourth. The people who testified before 486 00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:28,880 Speaker 1: the subcommittee included a social worker named Philippa Allen, workers 487 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:33,640 Speaker 1: who had developed silicosis, and surviving family members. One engineer 488 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:37,160 Speaker 1: testified that he had also developed silicosis from exposure to 489 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:40,280 Speaker 1: dust in the months before respirators were issued to the 490 00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:45,520 Speaker 1: engineering team. There were also doctors, journalists, and expert witnesses. 491 00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:50,920 Speaker 1: The subcommittee recommended full congressional hearings, but these were never 492 00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:53,720 Speaker 1: carried out, and the subcommittee's report was read into the 493 00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:58,520 Speaker 1: Congressional record on April first, nineteen thirty six. This report 494 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 1: included finding's quotquote that in most of the tunnel rock 495 00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: which was drilled contained more than ninety percent silica, that 496 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 1: in some of the headings that ran as high as 497 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:10,120 Speaker 1: ninety nine percent pure silica. That this is a fact 498 00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 1: that was known, or by the exercise of ordinary and 499 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:17,480 Speaker 1: reasonable care, should have been known to the New Kana 500 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:21,960 Speaker 1: Power Company and the firm of Dennison Reinhardt. The findings continued, 501 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,120 Speaker 1: quote the effect of breathing silica dust is well known 502 00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:29,320 Speaker 1: to the medical profession and to all properly qualified mining engineers. 503 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:33,920 Speaker 1: The disease is incurable, it always results in physical incapacity, 504 00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:37,320 Speaker 1: and in a majority of cases, is fatal. That for 505 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:40,440 Speaker 1: more than twenty years, the United States Bureau of Minds 506 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:44,600 Speaker 1: has been issuing warnings and information while conducting the educational 507 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,120 Speaker 1: campaign on the dangers of silicosis and means of prevention. 508 00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:52,120 Speaker 1: That the principal means of prevention are wet drilling, adequate 509 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,440 Speaker 1: and proper ventilation and circulation of air, the use of 510 00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: respirators by the workmen, and drills equipped with a suction 511 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:03,440 Speaker 1: or vacuum cuppliants. The sub committee found quote that there 512 00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 1: was an utter disregard for all and any of these 513 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:10,320 Speaker 1: approved methods of prevention in the construction of this tunnel. 514 00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:13,560 Speaker 1: That the dust was allowed to collect in such quantities 515 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:16,160 Speaker 1: and become so dense that the visibility of workmen was 516 00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,400 Speaker 1: lowered to a few feet. That workmen left the tunnel 517 00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:21,520 Speaker 1: at the close of a working shift with their clothing 518 00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:24,640 Speaker 1: and bodies covered with a dense coating of white silica dust. 519 00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:29,400 Speaker 1: That the air circulating system was inadequate, insufficient, and out 520 00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:33,480 Speaker 1: of repair. That respirators were not furnished or used by 521 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 1: the employees of Dennis and Reinhardt. That the majority of 522 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:39,680 Speaker 1: drills in use were used for dry drilling. That dry 523 00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:42,640 Speaker 1: drilling is more rapid and affects a large saving in 524 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 1: time and labor costs. That no appliances were used on 525 00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:48,680 Speaker 1: the drills to prevent concentration of dust in the tunnel. 526 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:52,360 Speaker 1: That gasoline locomotives were used in the headings as well 527 00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,760 Speaker 1: as the tunnel entrance, and that as a result, there 528 00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:58,800 Speaker 1: was great suffering from monoxide gas among the workers. That 529 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:03,040 Speaker 1: the whole driving the tunnel was begun, continued and completed 530 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:08,000 Speaker 1: with grave and inhuman disregard of all consideration for the health, 531 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:11,800 Speaker 1: lives and future of the employees. That as a result, 532 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:15,239 Speaker 1: many workmen became infected with silicosis, that many died of 533 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:17,960 Speaker 1: the disease, and many not yet dead are doomed to 534 00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,800 Speaker 1: die from the ravages of the disease as a result 535 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,799 Speaker 1: of their employment and the negligence of the employing contractor. 536 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:29,279 Speaker 1: That such negligence was either wilful or the result of 537 00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:34,000 Speaker 1: inexcusable and indefensible ignorance. There can be no doubt on 538 00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:37,160 Speaker 1: the face of the evidence presented to the committee. This 539 00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:40,640 Speaker 1: disaster and the lawsuits and hearings around it, led to 540 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:45,040 Speaker 1: a push for better standards around worker safety, and Francis Perkins, 541 00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:49,200 Speaker 1: Secretary of Labor, declared a war on silicosis. The Walsh 542 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:52,960 Speaker 1: Heeley Public Contracts Act, passed in nineteen thirty six as 543 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:56,800 Speaker 1: part of President Franklin D. Roosevelt's New Deal, mandated that 544 00:34:56,920 --> 00:35:00,480 Speaker 1: federal contracts would not be performed under working care conditions 545 00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:04,520 Speaker 1: that were quote unsanitary, hazardous, or dangerous to the health 546 00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:08,719 Speaker 1: and safety of employees engaged in the performance of the contract. 547 00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:13,240 Speaker 1: States also started passing laws about worker safety, including laws 548 00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:19,000 Speaker 1: directly aimed at preventing silicosis. Industry leaders came together in 549 00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,960 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty six to establish the Air Hygiene Foundation to 550 00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:28,040 Speaker 1: combat quote misleading publicity about silicosis, which they believed would 551 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:32,240 Speaker 1: quote result in a flood of claims whether justified or unjustified, 552 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:37,399 Speaker 1: and will tend toward improperly considered proposals for legislation. While 553 00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 1: the Air Hygiene Foundation did work toward establishing safe in 554 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:46,960 Speaker 1: quotation marks thresholds for exposure levels, it also lobbied for 555 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:50,319 Speaker 1: definitions of safe that were seen as acceptable to the 556 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:54,480 Speaker 1: businesses involved, but like they weren't really grounded in any 557 00:35:54,560 --> 00:35:59,600 Speaker 1: kind of scientific or medical analysis. They kind of arrived 558 00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:06,120 Speaker 1: at another and said that's what the threshold should be. 559 00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:09,120 Speaker 1: Going to be bad for a second. In nineteen thirty six, 560 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:12,960 Speaker 1: blues musician John White released a song called Silicosis Is 561 00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:17,160 Speaker 1: Killing Me under the name of Pinewood Tom. That same year, 562 00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 1: poet Muriel Rickiser and photographer Nancy Naumberg went to West 563 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:24,720 Speaker 1: Virginia to research the disaster. Their plan was to publish 564 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:28,400 Speaker 1: poems and photographs on the incident as one work. For 565 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:31,680 Speaker 1: unclear reasons, this project did not happen, and most of 566 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:36,239 Speaker 1: Nomberg's photographs were lost, but Rickiser's poem sequence The Book 567 00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:38,480 Speaker 1: of the Dead, was published as part of her book 568 00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:42,680 Speaker 1: US One in nineteen thirty eight. It was republished as 569 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 1: a standalone work with non Berg's few surviving photos and 570 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:50,160 Speaker 1: an introductory essay by Catherine Vennable Moore in twenty eighteen, 571 00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:54,280 Speaker 1: and this is sort of a it's become seen today 572 00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:58,080 Speaker 1: as kind of a lesser known classic work of American 573 00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:03,880 Speaker 1: literature from that part of the twentieth century. Whipperwell Cemetery 574 00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:07,719 Speaker 1: is now known as Hawk's Nest Workers Memorial Cemetery. This 575 00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:11,360 Speaker 1: area unfortunately fell into neglect after the worker's bodies were 576 00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:15,200 Speaker 1: moved there. People basically started using it as a dumping ground. 577 00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:20,440 Speaker 1: Local resident Charlotte Yeger spearheaded clean up efforts and consecration 578 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:23,399 Speaker 1: of the burial site in the twenty teens, and more 579 00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:27,040 Speaker 1: recently has worked with a power company contractor that cleared 580 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:31,120 Speaker 1: a lot of trees from around the cemetery during another 581 00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:35,600 Speaker 1: highway project. By the time the lawsuits were settled, Reinhardt 582 00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:38,239 Speaker 1: and Dennis had stopped doing business and most of its 583 00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:42,960 Speaker 1: assets had been liquidated. The Electro Metallurgical Company plant in Alloy, 584 00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:46,200 Speaker 1: West Virginia is still in operation, now jointly owned by 585 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,279 Speaker 1: Globe and Dow Corning. Union Carbide still exists as a 586 00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:55,200 Speaker 1: subsidiary of Dow Chemical Company today. Union Carbide is more 587 00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:59,920 Speaker 1: infamously connected to another disaster, the boupol gas disaster in Bopa, 588 00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:03,600 Speaker 1: India in nineteen eighty four, in which thousands of people 589 00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:07,440 Speaker 1: were killed. There is a limited series podcast on this 590 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:11,279 Speaker 1: disaster called They Knew Which Way to Run. For a 591 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,080 Speaker 1: long time, there was a rumor slash belief that if 592 00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:17,600 Speaker 1: the water was ever drained from the Hawks and Nest Tunnel, 593 00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:20,960 Speaker 1: it would collapse due to erosion. But in twenty twenty 594 00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:23,160 Speaker 1: the gates of the dam were opened to lower the 595 00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:27,080 Speaker 1: water level by twenty five feet to allow for an inspection. 596 00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:31,160 Speaker 1: This inspection was carried out using remote operated vehicles, and 597 00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:34,680 Speaker 1: inspectors said the tunnel interior was still in really good condition, 598 00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,200 Speaker 1: looking almost as it would have when it was first built. 599 00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:43,000 Speaker 1: While the building of the tunnel was a disaster, the 600 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:46,880 Speaker 1: tunnel and the dam themselves were and still are considered 601 00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:51,160 Speaker 1: to be an engineering marvel. Water is also released into 602 00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:54,000 Speaker 1: the dries below the dam several times a year, which 603 00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:59,000 Speaker 1: has been negotiated by the organization American Whitewater. During these 604 00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:02,360 Speaker 1: scheduled periods, the drives are open to private and commercial 605 00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:06,440 Speaker 1: trips down the rapids. There are also unscheduled releases of 606 00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,360 Speaker 1: water from time to time due to water levels and 607 00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: weather conditions. Silica dust exposure continues to be an issue 608 00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:16,440 Speaker 1: in a lot of industries today, and some of the 609 00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:21,560 Speaker 1: industries are obvious things like mining, masonry, construction, sand blasting, 610 00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:26,080 Speaker 1: but dentists can also be exposed to airborne silica, as 611 00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:29,440 Speaker 1: can people who work in things like glass blowing or ceramics, 612 00:39:29,560 --> 00:39:33,359 Speaker 1: including people who do those things as hobbies. Fracking has 613 00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:36,000 Speaker 1: been cited as one of the more recent areas of 614 00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:40,440 Speaker 1: concern for silicosis exposure. In the US, it's estimated that 615 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:44,879 Speaker 1: two million workers are chronically exposed to silica every year. 616 00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:49,040 Speaker 1: In twenty sixteen, the US Occupational Safety and Health Administration 617 00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:53,520 Speaker 1: issued new standards for crystaline silica exposure, and those standards 618 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:58,719 Speaker 1: went into effect in twenty seventeen. Oh, Tracy, I know, 619 00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:03,440 Speaker 1: do you have a less anger making a listener mail 620 00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:07,040 Speaker 1: to take us out? I knew this email is from Kyle, 621 00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:09,719 Speaker 1: and Kyle wrote after our episode on Doctor Anna and 622 00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:12,279 Speaker 1: Milk Sickness, and Kyle said, hello, I was surprised in 623 00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:15,200 Speaker 1: your recent podcast on Doctor Anna and Milk Sickness when 624 00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:18,759 Speaker 1: you read the quote about how cows were affected but goats, sheep, 625 00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:21,680 Speaker 1: and horses were not. I thought you'd already mentioned horses 626 00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:24,760 Speaker 1: getting ill, although perhaps I was misremembering. However, I certainly 627 00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:27,920 Speaker 1: couldn't agree with the part about goats being picky eaters. 628 00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:31,359 Speaker 1: When I was young, my family was quote gifted two 629 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,200 Speaker 1: goats after a relative couldn't take care of them anymore. 630 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:37,040 Speaker 1: One died soon afterward, but the other lived on for 631 00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:40,600 Speaker 1: years and became my responsibility. Her favorite food was leaves 632 00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:43,360 Speaker 1: from our weeping willow tree. She would stand up on 633 00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:45,640 Speaker 1: her back legs to eat them, which kept the tree 634 00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:48,839 Speaker 1: trim to the perfect height to mow under. She often 635 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,600 Speaker 1: spent most of her summer time tied to a tire, 636 00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:53,640 Speaker 1: which was light enough that she could drag it to 637 00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:55,799 Speaker 1: where she wanted to go, but heavy enough to slow 638 00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:59,040 Speaker 1: her down from sneaking into the neighbor's garden. Once, my 639 00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:01,440 Speaker 1: sister was introduced a friend to the goat, and she 640 00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:03,560 Speaker 1: asked if she was a fainting goat. The goat had 641 00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:05,719 Speaker 1: never fainted before, but sure enough she met the friend 642 00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:10,919 Speaker 1: and fell right over. As for the picky eating. As 643 00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:13,520 Speaker 1: for the picky eating, the goat was known to nibble 644 00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:16,640 Speaker 1: on shirts, ate foam out of my dirt bike seat. 645 00:41:16,719 --> 00:41:18,839 Speaker 1: I don't know how she didn't get sick from that, 646 00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:21,480 Speaker 1: and once saint some of my mom's cash after she 647 00:41:21,520 --> 00:41:24,120 Speaker 1: had come home from the bank. My favorite goat story, 648 00:41:24,200 --> 00:41:25,840 Speaker 1: so I had to scoff at the idea that a 649 00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:28,640 Speaker 1: goat would be cheesy about what it was eating. In 650 00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:31,160 Speaker 1: the winter, when we felt like spoiling the goat, we 651 00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:33,560 Speaker 1: would make it oat meal, which of course we called 652 00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:36,319 Speaker 1: goat meal. Again, on the subject of being cheosy, the 653 00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:40,960 Speaker 1: goat preferred cheap, non brand oatmeal over Quaker oats picky eaters. Indeed, 654 00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:42,680 Speaker 1: thanks for all the work on the podcast. I've been 655 00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:45,839 Speaker 1: listening for years and always enjoy them, Kyle, So thank 656 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:49,840 Speaker 1: you Kyle for this email. The part about the horses 657 00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:51,719 Speaker 1: and goats was one of the things that made me 658 00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:56,120 Speaker 1: go I have doubts about these diary entries. Also, I 659 00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:58,840 Speaker 1: don't think I told this story and the behind the scenes, 660 00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:01,480 Speaker 1: But when I was making notes about that part, I 661 00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:04,200 Speaker 1: had in all capital letters in my notes. Doctor Anna, 662 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:08,239 Speaker 1: have you ever met a goat? Because I used to 663 00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:11,680 Speaker 1: know a goat that would eat cigarette butts off the ground, 664 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:15,680 Speaker 1: and it's like, it's this goat. I don't I don't 665 00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:21,239 Speaker 1: remember this. The girl go to a boycot, but favorite 666 00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:27,640 Speaker 1: favorite delicacy was dried corn. Uh, dried corn was would 667 00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:31,520 Speaker 1: just eat forever, just dried corn. So yeah, like this, 668 00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:35,759 Speaker 1: the idea that all goats will even eat a tin 669 00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:39,040 Speaker 1: can is like not like that's that's going a little far, 670 00:42:39,120 --> 00:42:42,279 Speaker 1: but bus the goats I have known definitely were not 671 00:42:43,239 --> 00:42:45,200 Speaker 1: so picky that you'd be like, oh, they would never 672 00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:51,040 Speaker 1: eat snake root because I mean cigarette butts off the ground. Yeah. 673 00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:53,360 Speaker 1: I once had a I have a friend that I 674 00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:55,879 Speaker 1: used to work with who had a goat at her 675 00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:59,240 Speaker 1: family's farm that ate an entire, like industrial sized bag 676 00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:01,560 Speaker 1: of dried dawn food one night, and she had to 677 00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:04,120 Speaker 1: spend her whole night walking it up and down the 678 00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:07,960 Speaker 1: road because the vet was like, I am busy birthing 679 00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:10,200 Speaker 1: a foal right now, but if that goat lies down, 680 00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:12,239 Speaker 1: I don't know what's gonna happen to its stomach, So 681 00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:17,480 Speaker 1: cheap it moving. The goat lived. It was just stupid 682 00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:21,040 Speaker 1: and never learned its lesson. Listen, Ghats are smart, but 683 00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:28,719 Speaker 1: they don't always know about not putting things in their minds. Yeah, yeah, 684 00:43:28,800 --> 00:43:31,239 Speaker 1: I can relate goats. I've overeaten and then done the 685 00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:37,399 Speaker 1: same thing again, even after it maybe miserable Uh, thank 686 00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:40,040 Speaker 1: you so much for that email, Kyle. If you would 687 00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:42,080 Speaker 1: like to send us a note about this or any 688 00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:46,759 Speaker 1: other podcast or a history podcast a iHeartRadio dot com. Uh. 689 00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:51,360 Speaker 1: We also have some social media accounts. There's Facebook, there's 690 00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:54,719 Speaker 1: x which used to be Twitter. We're still over there, 691 00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:59,719 Speaker 1: still haven't started other accounts beyond that, also Instagram we have. 692 00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:03,720 Speaker 1: You can subscribe to our show on the iHeartRadio app 693 00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:11,520 Speaker 1: or wherever else you'd like to get your podcasts. Stuff 694 00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:14,320 Speaker 1: you Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. 695 00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:19,279 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 696 00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:21,440 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.