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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds and a p r.

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Speaker 2: Ipoll says fifty two percent of Americans see Trump as

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Speaker 2: a dangerous dictator whose power should be limited before he

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Speaker 2: destroys American democracy. Where is the line? We have such

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Speaker 2: a great show for you today. The Nation's cheat here

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Speaker 2: stops by to talk to us about the Canadian election

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Speaker 2: and what it means for Trump's rule of America. Then

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Speaker 2: we'll talk to New York Times his own Peter S.

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Speaker 2: Goodman about what the empty shipping containers coming into America's

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Speaker 2: ports means for it the shelves in your local grocery store.

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Speaker 2: But first the news.

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Speaker 3: Somalie, there's a thing with Trump that things are always on,

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Speaker 3: then they're off again. They're on, they're off again. This morning,

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Speaker 3: Caroline Levitt was throwing a major major about the idea

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Speaker 3: of Amazon putting the prices of tariffs on things. Now

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Speaker 3: Amazon is denying they're going to do it, even though

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Speaker 3: it was it a punch bowl newsletter that was sponsored

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Speaker 3: by Amazon.

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Speaker 2: Amazon. I watched the press conference this morning. It actually

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Speaker 2: is a smart idea on the part of Amazon to

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Speaker 2: point out how much tariffs are costing the consumer. It

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Speaker 2: got Carolyn Levitt really miffed, It got Donald Trump furious. Look,

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Speaker 2: Jeff Bezos finds himself in a bad position, despite the

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Speaker 2: fact that he has a good zillion dollars. No one

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Speaker 2: wants to see their company in decline. Much of what

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Speaker 2: is available on Amazon is cheap and made in China. Ergo,

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Speaker 2: there is every reason in the world why Bezos is

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Speaker 2: not happy with these tariffs.

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Speaker 4: And this was I.

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Speaker 2: Think a pretty effective pushback. Made Trump fury again. I

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Speaker 2: think really important to remember Jeff Bezos is now a

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Speaker 2: captured billionaire. He's like these law firms. He is under capture.

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Speaker 2: He has made a deal with Trump, he has sucked

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Speaker 2: up to Trump, and now he serves at the pleasure

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Speaker 2: of Donald Trump. So despite the fact that he has

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Speaker 2: billions of dollars and is super wealthy and powerful, he

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Speaker 2: is ultimately trying not to get regulated out of existence

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Speaker 2: by Donald Trump. Now is this stupid? Yes? Could he

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Speaker 2: stand up to Trump? Absolutely? Would Trump be able to

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Speaker 2: regulate him out of existence? It would take a lot

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Speaker 2: of time and a lot of confidence to things that

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump doesn't have a huge supply. So you see,

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Speaker 2: it's a real example of someone who who has created

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Speaker 2: the capture that they are involved in, and Bezos is

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Speaker 2: now perhaps cowering, perhaps pushing back. We'll see how this

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Speaker 2: plays out, but I think it's important to remember these

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Speaker 2: tariffs are bad for business, and Bezos is just one

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Speaker 2: of the many, many, many, many business owners who are

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Speaker 2: about to really get fucked by these one hundred and

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Speaker 2: forty five percent tariffs. So you'll see more of this.

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Speaker 2: And again, Bezos has created this capture for himself and

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Speaker 2: now he is in a possible situation that he put

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Speaker 2: himself in, and quite frankly, it's well deserved.

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Speaker 3: We saw similar behavior with Paramount this week, and when

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Speaker 3: the statement on sixty minutes is that they are afraid

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Speaker 3: of their.

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Speaker 2: Merger behavior to go through.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think Bezos has much more power here

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Speaker 3: because that could bring down Trump's approval real fast.

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Speaker 2: I mean, the reality is Trump's approval is terrible, right.

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Speaker 2: His approval is now down to what it was in

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Speaker 2: the first term, that sort of dregs approval. We've seen

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Speaker 2: even just from the universities that Harvard is now in

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Speaker 2: a much better position than Columbia is, where Columbia is

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Speaker 2: trying to make these deals. They have no one to

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Speaker 2: protect them. Trump World keeps going back on the deals,

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Speaker 2: and at least Columbia has the courts to protect them.

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Speaker 2: You're almost better off going into a court fight with

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump then rolling over and letting him do whatever

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Speaker 2: he wants.

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Speaker 3: Agreed. Well, speaking of rolling over and doing whatever he wants,

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Speaker 3: he's issuing executive orders, ramping up America's police state.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. So again, there is a headline here that's very scary,

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Speaker 2: and it's certainly possible that something very scary will happen here.

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Speaker 2: But it's also I think really important to remember that

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Speaker 2: executive orders are the least legally binding thing that the

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Speaker 2: president can do, and they keep you know, he's not

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Speaker 2: passing a law, and in fact, he has passed the

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Speaker 2: least laws of any president at this point. You know,

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Speaker 2: Executive orders are like just there vibes. Okay, there are

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Speaker 2: things that he feels like, there are things he wants

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Speaker 2: to do. These are things that are going to die

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Speaker 2: in court, okay, Like so many of Trump's ideas. Does

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Speaker 2: Trump want to be an autocrat? Yes? Does the Supreme

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Speaker 2: Court want him to be? I think seven of them

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Speaker 2: don't Alito and Thomas forget it. They'll go with whatever.

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Speaker 2: But are his instincts scary and terrible. Yes. By the way,

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Speaker 2: he's done executive orders that have targeted Mark Elias. My

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Speaker 2: man has done a ton of executive orders about everything

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Speaker 2: and everyone. So I don't think that we should take

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Speaker 2: them so seriously at this point. Yes, he would love

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Speaker 2: to do this. Is he going to be able to

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Speaker 2: do it? Absolutely not. The thing that is worth remembering

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Speaker 2: is that Pam Bondy is going along with a lot

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Speaker 2: of stuff that she knows is not legal, that she

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Speaker 2: knows is not going to go anywhere. And this is

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Speaker 2: like another example of someone who knows better just destroying

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Speaker 2: themselves for Trump because he wants them to.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Another thing that they're trying to do to consolidate

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Speaker 3: and protect powers that they hope will stay on their

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Speaker 3: side is they are blocking inquiries into the Trump administration

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Speaker 3: and signal scandal.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. So look again, you had Bondy trying to take

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Speaker 2: away protections for journalists from being subpoena. They don't want

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Speaker 2: you to know what they're doing, which is a pretty

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Speaker 2: good sign they're not doing good stuff. Right If they

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Speaker 2: wanted you to know what they were doing, they wouldn't

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Speaker 2: be constantly trying to office scate. So signal gate is

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Speaker 2: super embarrassing for Republicans. Trump did not fire heg set

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Speaker 2: By the way, there's so much more coming on the

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Speaker 2: heag sets stuff. Right, we have an office that is

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Speaker 2: at war with each other. There's just going to be

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Speaker 2: more and more embarrassing stuff. Everyone in the world out

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Speaker 2: of that office is leaking. I think trying to cover

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Speaker 2: up signal gate is going to be the least of

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Speaker 2: their problems. And again this is example. Trump has decided

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Speaker 2: that if he fires heg set he'll look stupid, so

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Speaker 2: he doesn't want to fire hegsas, so he's doing everything

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Speaker 2: he can to keep the guy on. But there's just

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Speaker 2: no way this doesn't continually snowball into more and more.

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Speaker 2: And last week we saw another story about a different

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Speaker 2: signal chat with the wife and the brother. Then we

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Speaker 2: saw a story about heg Seth having a makeup studio

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Speaker 2: built that is very embarrassing. And we're just seeing trickles

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Speaker 2: of embarrassing stories. And you know why, because you know,

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Speaker 2: he has an organization and everyone in there hates each

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Speaker 2: other and they're just leaking. Like a said, so I

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Speaker 2: think you'll see more of it, and I think you'll

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Speaker 2: see more Republicans trying to cover it for it. And

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Speaker 2: here's the thing. Donald Trump could end this tomorrow just

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Speaker 2: by firing Pete Hegsath. But he won't. And so many

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Speaker 2: of the things we've talked about today. Donald Trump could

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Speaker 2: end tomorrow the trade war. He could say no more

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Speaker 2: trade war, that was a mistake, Let's just go back

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Speaker 2: to normal, and it would end tomorrow. They're not going

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Speaker 2: to onshore manufacturing by making things more expensive. That's not

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Speaker 2: how that works. We saw Howard Lutinx today giving an

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Speaker 2: interview and he said, and I think this is really important,

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Speaker 2: he said, So gave an interview today and it was

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Speaker 2: like very wilber Ross. He said, c NBC. Remember there

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Speaker 2: has been a ton of the Trump administration trying to

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Speaker 2: go out and calm the markets. You had Treasury Secretary

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Speaker 2: Beson yesterday or Monday giving a talk say that he's

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Speaker 2: got all these trade deals in the hopper. By the way,

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Speaker 2: we were told by Peter and Navarro there would be

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Speaker 2: trade deals in ninety days. We're like two and a

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Speaker 2: half weeks into this and we have yet to have

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Speaker 2: a trade deal. China has said there are nowhere near

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Speaker 2: a trade deal. Japan no trade deal, India no trade deal.

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Speaker 2: But I want to talk about this interview Lutnik on

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Speaker 2: CNBC trying to make everyone feel better. CNBC says if

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Speaker 2: a company were to say we're raising prices because of tariffs,

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Speaker 2: is that a hostile act? And Lutinix says, I think

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Speaker 2: if you go out of your way to try to

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Speaker 2: make it seem like your price has changed, when it's nonsense.

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Speaker 2: A ten percent tariff is not going to change virtually

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Speaker 2: any price, and in fact, a ten percent tariff means

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Speaker 2: you're going to pay ten percent more good stuff.

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Speaker 3: Speaking of Trump's authoritarian reaches, a top White House aid

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Speaker 3: by the name of Stephen Miller says that JB. Pritzker

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Speaker 3: calling for protests could be construed as inciting violence.

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Speaker 2: Sure, so here's an interesting thing. Pritzker has been a

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Speaker 2: very strong speaker lately. He is the governor of Illinois,

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Speaker 2: but he's also the scion of the Pritzker family. The

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Speaker 2: Pritzker family is a wildly wealthy, deeply liberal, very philanthropic,

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Speaker 2: and pretty great family filled with a lot of really

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Speaker 2: smart people who give a lot of money to really

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Speaker 2: good stuff. So basically the opposite of elo. You know

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Speaker 2: how Elon is trying to strip the federal government. So,

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Speaker 2: and Pritzker has been really strong about criticizing Trump. Part

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Speaker 2: of that is because he has political aspirations, but part

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Speaker 2: of that is because he does not. He's not a coward. Now,

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Speaker 2: is he not a coward because he has billions of

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Speaker 2: dollars to back them up? Maybe, but it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 2: I mean, Jeff Bezos seems pretty cowardly, and he has

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Speaker 2: more money than Pritzker, So I'm not going to write

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Speaker 2: off his bravery so quickly. I wonder if Steven Miller

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Speaker 2: understands what he's opening the door to here. Now, want

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Speaker 2: you to think back to last week part of why

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Speaker 2: Trump stopped this crazy tariff thing or paused it. It

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Speaker 2: will come back like the gun on the wall in

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Speaker 2: the play in the third act. Right, this trade war

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Speaker 2: is still very much going to happen to us. But

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Speaker 2: I want to talk about this idea that Trump know,

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Speaker 2: Trump does not want to become an emerging market, right,

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Speaker 2: he understands, But I mean that's the real that's sort

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Speaker 2: of the real red lawne here, is that he understands

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Speaker 2: that the dollar is a safe haven, right, and he

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Speaker 2: does not want to have capital flight because if they

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Speaker 2: have capital flight, it means that our debt will become

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Speaker 2: so expensive that it will be almost impossible to service it.

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Speaker 2: And we have so much debt in this country, much

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Speaker 2: of which is held by the Chinese, and as the

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Speaker 2: dollar gets more expensive, we will have more trouble servicing

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Speaker 2: our debt. So what is happening here? So if Stephen

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Speaker 2: Miller were to go after JP Pritzker, that would be

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Speaker 2: real banana of public stuff, right, arresting a billionaire because

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Speaker 2: you're mad that he said something. Pritzker said he wanted

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Speaker 2: mass protests. Stephen Miller says it could be construed as

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Speaker 2: inciting violence. So if Stephen Miller is able to will

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Speaker 2: a scenario where they start arresting the governor of the

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Speaker 2: state of Illinois, who happens to be a left leaning billionaire,

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Speaker 2: you're going to see some capital fucking flight, man, and

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Speaker 2: you're going to see a lot of constitutional crisis, is screaming,

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Speaker 2: and a lot of stuff. So do I think Stephen

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Speaker 2: Miller is crazy enough to do that? There is no

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think Steven Miller is just waiting for

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Speaker 2: the chance, but you are opening the door to the

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Speaker 2: kind of market cratering, the kind of bond sell off

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Speaker 2: that I don't think anyone is ready for. And by

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Speaker 2: the way, we're already heading into very likely a stagflationary

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Speaker 2: period because of the trade war. I'm not sure that

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Speaker 2: Stephen Miller wants more than that to happen. Get here

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Speaker 2: is a contributor to the nation and the host of

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Speaker 2: the time of Monsters. Welcome back to Fast Politics.

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Speaker 4: Cheat, good to be on the program.

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Speaker 2: You are a Canadian bureau chief here Fast Politics, and

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Speaker 2: as Canadian bureau chief, you are uniquely situated to speak

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Speaker 2: to us about the Canadian elections, which Donald Trump played

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Speaker 2: a massive, massive role in.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, including on election day where he had

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Speaker 4: this tweet where he was suggesting that that Canadians vote

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Speaker 4: for him, and which seemed a little and odd because

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Speaker 4: he was not on the ballot anywhere in Canada. But metaphorically,

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Speaker 4: I think it's it's absolutely true that Trump had a

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Speaker 4: massive influence. Now I have to say, like Canada, where

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Speaker 4: the tenth of the size of the US in terms

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Speaker 4: of population. Pierre Elliot Trudeau, who is the father of

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Speaker 4: Justin Trudeau and was a Prime minister in the sixties

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Speaker 4: when he met Richard Nixon, he said, well, for Canadians,

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Speaker 4: living next to the United States is like living next

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Speaker 4: to an elephant. However benign the elephant is if it

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Speaker 4: starts twitching and grunting. We notice in this case, like

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Speaker 4: imagine living next to an elephant, but it's actually on

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Speaker 4: crack and it's paging through the tendle. That kind of

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Speaker 4: has an impact. So Trump is the rampaging elephant of

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Speaker 4: this this election.

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Speaker 2: So, yeah, people have talked about the Canadians feel like

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Speaker 2: they're living over a crack house. That's what I've heard.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, that's also the betaphor. Yeah yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 2: In any case, so explain to us just the fundamentals

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Speaker 2: of how Canadian elections work. You guys have prime ministers,

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Speaker 2: they are elected for charge. It's more of a coalition government. Explain.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I know. I mean it's a parliamentary system.

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Speaker 4: So what it basically means is that the party is

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Speaker 4: like the House of Representatives, like you have like all

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Speaker 4: these districts, and whichever party has the most number of seats.

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Speaker 4: In American terms, it would be as if, like previously

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Speaker 4: Nancy Pelosi have been Prime Minister and then Johnson, but

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Speaker 4: it could easily be Keem Jeffries in twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 4: Now having said that, the other big difference though, is

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Speaker 4: that it's not a two party system. There are in

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Speaker 4: fact many parties. The Liberals and Conservators the two big parties,

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Speaker 4: but there's also the NDP, which is a social democratic party,

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Speaker 4: the New Democratic Party. There's a block Quebec QUAH, which

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Speaker 4: only runs in Quebec but is a sovereigntist party, but

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Speaker 4: it's also center left. And there's a Green Party which

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Speaker 4: had two seats in a Hasuan. And there's a right

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Speaker 4: wing party, the People's Party. Now, what happened in this election.

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Speaker 4: One of the big things that happened was that both

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Speaker 4: on the left and the right, the votes consolidated. Both

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Speaker 4: the Liberals and the Conservatives got more votes than they

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Speaker 4: did last time because people who normally would vote for

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Speaker 4: the third parties went to the main ones. So you

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Speaker 4: had like a more polarized electorate.

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Speaker 2: In a way, like a real lesson to Democrats. Right,

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Speaker 2: because in the twenty twenty four cycle we saw that

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Speaker 2: the Green Party or Just Staying Home or RFK Junior

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Speaker 2: siphoned off some amount of votes, right.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you know. I mean, I think the analogy would

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Speaker 4: be that, like in American politics, when the Democrats can

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Speaker 4: consolidate the left of center vote, they win. When they

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Speaker 4: when you have people who either vote third party or

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Speaker 4: don't vote at all, Democrats are in a bad position

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Speaker 4: often lose. So I think Trump can be credited with

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Speaker 4: consolidating the liberal vote. Now, prior to like Trump's intervention,

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Speaker 4: for the last two years, the Conservative Party has been

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Speaker 4: leading in the polls. The Liberals had a minority government

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Speaker 4: supported by the NDP. This, as you meant a lot

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Speaker 4: of very good things because the NDPS wore social democratics,

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Speaker 4: So the Liberals pushed through things like extending dental care,

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Speaker 4: so now our healthcare system has a dental care component.

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Speaker 4: But like a lot of governments, you know, the Liberals

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Speaker 4: were suffering from post COVID inflation, cost of living, a

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Speaker 4: housing crisis, and then there's a real desire for change,

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Speaker 4: and the Conservatives under Pierre Polliever had a really compelling populist,

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Speaker 4: right wing populist message, which is Canada is broken. They

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Speaker 4: had a massive lead in the polls of like twenty

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Speaker 4: point lead over the Liberals, which basically would have meant

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Speaker 4: that the Conservatives could have formed a majority government, and

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Speaker 4: I have to say, like, you know, even though I

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Speaker 4: don't like the Conserna party politically, I think that is

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Speaker 4: a compelling message in this time this you know, like

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Speaker 4: it's a change election. We want to do things. And

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Speaker 4: the Liberals were responding by saying Canada has never been broken,

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Speaker 4: which to my mind right in the of Hillary Clinton

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Speaker 4: saying America has always been great, Like it's not a

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Speaker 4: good response to people wanting change. But in any case,

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Speaker 4: and Trudeau was unpopular, but then Trump came along and

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Speaker 4: started saying, like Governor Crudeo, and we want Canada to

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Speaker 4: be the fifty first state and you'll be a chair state.

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Speaker 4: And so the election didn't become about, you know, do

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Speaker 4: we want to change as Canada broke? And it's like

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Speaker 4: should Canada survive? And for the Liberals were much stronger

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Speaker 4: on this issue. They replaced Trudeau with Mark Carney, who

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Speaker 4: had been a very centrist figure who had been in

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Speaker 4: the Bank of Canada. Even despite his centrism, a lot

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Speaker 4: of mean I know a lot of people who were

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Speaker 4: in the MDP, and I think the polls bear this

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Speaker 4: out went to the Liberals because they realized that now

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Speaker 4: the main issue is Canada surviving, and the Liberals put

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Speaker 4: forth a very strong nationalist message, which is a Canada's

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Speaker 4: a sovereign state and we will stand up for it.

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Speaker 4: And this will allow the Liberals to get out of

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Speaker 4: their holding disaster really and they ended up getting like

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Speaker 4: I think roughly forty four percent of the vote. Now now,

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Speaker 4: right now, the Liberals are a little bit short of

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Speaker 4: forming a majority. They are at one hundred and sixty

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Speaker 4: eight roughly, and they need one hundred and seventy two

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Speaker 4: to form a majority. But having said that, the votes

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Speaker 4: are still being counted and the Liberals are picking up

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Speaker 4: speed because they were very strong in the early voting.

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Speaker 4: All their voters went in very early selection and those

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Speaker 4: are the last votes counted, and so there's a real

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Speaker 4: chance that the Liberals could form a majority. I'll be

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Speaker 4: a slim one. But if they don't form a majority,

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Speaker 4: what will happen is that there's still like the NDP

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Speaker 4: went down from twenty five seats to seven, but they

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Speaker 4: have enough seats that they can work with the Liberals

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Speaker 4: and we'll see a return to what we had before,

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Speaker 4: which is a Liberal minority government with NDP support.

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Speaker 2: So I want to talk about Carnie for another minute,

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Speaker 2: because I think that's a really important point. Trudeau had

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Speaker 2: become pretty unpopular, and despite the fact that he had

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Speaker 2: been earlier very popular, he was and he was quite handsome,

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Speaker 2: which is for a politician sometimes play.

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Speaker 4: No no, I mean tu. Trudau is a very effective

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Speaker 4: campaigner and he got the Liberals one of the strongest

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Speaker 4: majorities that they've ever had. And Carney is not an

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Speaker 4: effective campaigner, Yes.

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Speaker 2: Right, he's not. But he is, however, the man that

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Speaker 2: got Britten through Brexit, and is a very good negotiator

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Speaker 2: and good at negotiating trade, and good at negotiating prickly

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Speaker 2: financial situations, which Canada finds itself in being the neighbors

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Speaker 2: who live over the crack house, and who are the

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Speaker 2: trading partners with America. Right now, there's a percentage of

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Speaker 2: Canadians maybe twenty thirty percent or boycotting American goods just right,

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Speaker 2: and you have a lot of Canadian goods that America

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Speaker 2: used to be a pretty a good trading partner. So

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Speaker 2: I'm really curious what happened behind the scenes that got

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Speaker 2: Carneie into this position, because it sounds like there was

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Speaker 2: a fair amount of smart, real politics going on.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. I mean having the Liberal Party.

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Speaker 4: First of all, it's a very successful political party overall.

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Speaker 4: In the last in the twentieth century, the Liberals governed

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Speaker 4: for seventy out of one hundred years, right, so seven

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Speaker 4: So they're kind of like the natural governing party. And

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Speaker 4: part of their successes that they pay a lot of

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Speaker 4: attention to leadership and have Actually, I mean one interesting

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Speaker 4: thing is they always switched from English to French because

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Speaker 4: it's a binational country. So actually like regularly for the

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Speaker 4: last hundred years, First you have a French leader, Crudeo.

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Speaker 4: Then you bring in an English person Carney. And Carney

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Speaker 4: was sort of cultivated. He had this background. He was

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Speaker 4: a central banker, governor both first and back of Canada

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Speaker 4: and the Bank of England. I think when once they

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Speaker 4: decided Trudeau had to go, they thought, like bringing him

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Speaker 4: someone who's like, hadn't been in politics before, has been

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Speaker 4: a broad mainstream acceptance. As you said, you know those finances,

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Speaker 4: knows how to deal with crisis. That seems a pretty

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Speaker 4: compelling figure. And I think that they were right. I mean,

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Speaker 4: he has negatives because he's not a politician he's actually

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Speaker 4: I think much less charismatic than Hudo or even I

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Speaker 4: have to say Polly ever, who's not my cup of tea,

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Speaker 4: but has been very effective on the campaign trail, you know.

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Speaker 4: But having said that, I mean, Carney, I think switching

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Speaker 4: out was a smart move. And because in Canada they

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Speaker 4: were we hold our things very quickly. They were well,

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Speaker 4: the leadership convention very quickly. So like I would imagine like, yeah,

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Speaker 4: Biden had stepped down much earlier, and you know, they

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Speaker 4: had gone through a proper convention, you know, like you

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Speaker 4: could have had either hair share or someone or you

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Speaker 4: would have had someone with legitimacy. I mean, the very

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Speaker 4: important that they didn't just put this guy in. They

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Speaker 4: actually had a leadership convention and they picked him. I mean,

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Speaker 4: I think the Liberals did a lot of very kind

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Speaker 4: of smart moves, and I think there s at of

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Speaker 4: national stitches that they put and actually the genuine fear

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Speaker 4: that people in the cane left had a Polyevra who

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Speaker 4: did kind of mix our creuppy noises about fake news

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Speaker 4: and going after the media and other things. I think

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Speaker 4: that scared a lot of people on the left and

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Speaker 4: that contributed to consolidating the vote, So liberals like and

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Speaker 4: I think, you know, they went from being twenty points

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Speaker 4: down to being ahead because they picked up a lot

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Speaker 4: of mainly NDP votes, but also a lot of black

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Speaker 4: quebec Qua votes Green Party votes.

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Speaker 2: So Jesse has a question, which is, there's a report

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Speaker 2: that Carney said to Trump that Canada will sell its

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Speaker 2: US bonds if Trump doesn't knock off the fifty first

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Speaker 2: state stuff. Do you think that's real? Do you think

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Speaker 2: that's true? What do you think of that?

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Speaker 4: I don't know how, I mean, it's I don't know this.

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Speaker 4: I think that. I mean, there's another story which is

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Speaker 4: sort of circumstantial evidence for which is when Kearney first

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Speaker 4: came in, he went to the Europe and he met

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Speaker 4: with the European leaders, and I believe that Japanese Prime

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Speaker 4: Minister was either went there or on the call. And

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Speaker 4: you know, Kearney's a guy with a banking background, and

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Speaker 4: they did reportedly they talked about bonds and you won.

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Speaker 4: You know, like when Trump did Liberation Day and the tariffs,

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Speaker 4: one of the big things that happened was that not

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Speaker 4: just a stock market went down, but people started taking

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Speaker 4: money off the bonds. Now that the American creasure bonds

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Speaker 4: are held, you know, not just by private individuals, but

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Speaker 4: by governments. The Canadian government, European governments, Japan have a

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Speaker 4: lot of treasury bonds. And we do know for a

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Speaker 4: fact it is actually an absolute fact that the people

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Speaker 4: who were take selling treasure bonds after Liberation Day was

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Speaker 4: not as some people suspected the Chinese, who do you know,

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Speaker 4: basically kept on holding onto them, but actually Japan, the

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Speaker 4: Europeans in Canada.

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Speaker 2: Right just something.

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Speaker 4: So it's whether there was like a coordinated effort or not.

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Speaker 4: I can't verify that.

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Speaker 2: And you'll remember that the bond market was the thing

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Speaker 2: that finally got Trump to realize that he was running

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Speaker 2: a losing game. Now that said their.

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Speaker 4: Yel because I mean the bond market is very like

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Speaker 4: you know, people need to understand this. If you sell

433
00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:01,560
Speaker 4: bonds then like to make for that, interest rates will

434
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 4: go up. And also the US the amount of money

435
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 4: that the US Treasury has to pay out ADEPT goes

436
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:10,679
Speaker 4: up like bally substantial amounts. So this is really like

437
00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 4: the kind of leverage point that could undo the American economy,

438
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,160
Speaker 4: oh no question, and arguably the world economy. I mean,

439
00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:19,880
Speaker 4: this is serious thoughts.

440
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that seems like a real thing. Now,

441
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 2: I'm wondering if you can explain to us a little

442
00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:31,200
Speaker 2: bit about there's still votes coming in. They are counted

443
00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:34,320
Speaker 2: in a way that the early votes are counted last.

444
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:38,199
Speaker 2: So the question is what number of seats do you

445
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 2: have to get to in order for the Liberals to win.

446
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 4: One hundred and seventy two?

447
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:46,960
Speaker 2: Okay, And I'm curious, like when you look at these

448
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 2: two candidates, what was Carneie's idea? You know, does he

449
00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 2: have plans for tariffs? I mean, I feel like he's

450
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 2: a very smart guy and if you were getting he's

451
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:03,160
Speaker 2: like the person you would want to negotiate your tariff issue.

452
00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:06,560
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, I mean I think that the there's a

453
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,159
Speaker 4: couple of things that are in play. What is you know,

454
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 4: in the Canada and US have a great agreement and

455
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:16,280
Speaker 4: it's actually a trade agreement that Trump nomin only like negotiated.

456
00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:18,520
Speaker 4: I mean when he came in, he tur DAFTA. Then

457
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:23,120
Speaker 4: we have the you know, US, Canada and Mexico. Yeah,

458
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 4: which is you know, after with some changes. Now now

459
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,400
Speaker 4: that's coming up again, and I think that the way

460
00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:30,960
Speaker 4: that Carnie could go forward, I think the Mexican government

461
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:32,879
Speaker 4: is on board on this is to say, like, well,

462
00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:35,479
Speaker 4: let's read to go. Let's just do terrorists under this

463
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,879
Speaker 4: ambed and renegotiate it. I think one thing is that

464
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:41,640
Speaker 4: this gives Trump an exit ramp, because I think Trump

465
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:44,160
Speaker 4: has gotten himself into something that he did not fully

466
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:46,719
Speaker 4: understand what's going to happen, and all the trouble that

467
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:49,119
Speaker 4: he's having to deal with now with the stock market

468
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 4: and everything else. And I think that this gives like

469
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:53,600
Speaker 4: a way in which he can kind of say, Phace,

470
00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 4: you know, just do like rename it, like you know,

471
00:25:56,280 --> 00:26:01,280
Speaker 4: this is a Trump agreement, just the big whatever non

472
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 4: wal tages. I mean, I think that, like, you know,

473
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 4: the auto workers have a legitimate belief that they want

474
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:10,000
Speaker 4: wage guarantees for Mexican workers because the wages of Mexican

475
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 4: workers has actually gone down under free trade and is

476
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:14,920
Speaker 4: now like you know, they're making three dollars an hour

477
00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:18,640
Speaker 4: at auto plants, and I think one could legitimately say,

478
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:20,920
Speaker 4: you know, to raise that. Yeah. So I think that

479
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:23,199
Speaker 4: is the way out of this. But I have to

480
00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:25,720
Speaker 4: say Trump continues to talk about, you know, Canada has

481
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:28,560
Speaker 4: to be the fifty per state, and I don't know

482
00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:31,639
Speaker 4: how that's going to go, except that I think that,

483
00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 4: you know, with the election out of the way, I

484
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:37,399
Speaker 4: think everyone across the political speaker in Canada will have

485
00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:41,199
Speaker 4: an incentive to unite and is very noticeable that, you know,

486
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 4: some of the leading Conservatives on a provincial level, the

487
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:48,879
Speaker 4: Premier of Ontario are very on board with working with Kearnie.

488
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:53,119
Speaker 2: From what I understand, what really killed the Conservative Party,

489
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 2: your Republican Party, was that they had people who supported Trump,

490
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 2: so they couldn't distance themselves from him. So that's almost

491
00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 2: a little bit of what we could see in the midterms, right.

492
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,399
Speaker 4: Yeah, No, I know absolutely, I think that that was

493
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 4: like a kind of a major problem. I mean, I

494
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:13,040
Speaker 4: think the two pounds is that their main issues were

495
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 4: kind of taken off the table. I mean, there's still

496
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 4: real issues, but also there were people inside their party

497
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:22,560
Speaker 4: that you know, admired Cromp. There are people inside their

498
00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:24,960
Speaker 4: party that are very close to jad events. I think

499
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 4: that that gives the Liberals some sort of like advantage. So,

500
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 4: I mean, I do think that like as Trump's you know,

501
00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:34,480
Speaker 4: Tariff said, other things happen, there's a kind of backlash

502
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:37,199
Speaker 4: to him, of which this election is one example. But

503
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:39,400
Speaker 4: I think what is already seeing in the United States,

504
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,520
Speaker 4: and you know the special elections that have already happened,

505
00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:46,440
Speaker 4: including the judgeship in Wisconsin. Yeah, I think that the

506
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,159
Speaker 4: Democrats are a pretty good position in terms of their

507
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:50,120
Speaker 4: midterm Do.

508
00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:54,359
Speaker 2: You think Trump's threatening to make Canada a fifty first state?

509
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:57,360
Speaker 2: Do you think there's any logic? Again, I don't want

510
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:02,080
Speaker 2: to prescribe logic done either, why there isn't?

511
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:04,919
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, no, I mean we've had this blog your core, like,

512
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,800
Speaker 4: we don't want to be saying loves right.

513
00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 2: We don't want to say my man is playing three

514
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 2: dimensional chess, because he never is. What do you think

515
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:13,360
Speaker 2: of thinking here?

516
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:16,800
Speaker 4: Is well the thinking or maybe we can invest discribs

517
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,199
Speaker 4: unthinking is that Trump doesn't understand how trade works, or

518
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 4: he thinks of trade literally the way people in the

519
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:27,280
Speaker 4: eighteenth century thought of trade. It's mercantilism, right, And in

520
00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:30,879
Speaker 4: the eighteenth century, the various kingships that existed did not

521
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 4: believe in free trade. In fact, that's why in terms

522
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,200
Speaker 4: of American history, you know, like they had the Stamp

523
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 4: Act and weren't allowing Americans to buy Dutch tea. The

524
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 4: idea was that you would keep the wealth within the

525
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,400
Speaker 4: country or within the empire, not trade with others, because

526
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:46,480
Speaker 4: that means you'd be losing money. And the only way

527
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 4: you could expand was through imperialism by conquering other countries.

528
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 4: And so the British and the French and the Dutch

529
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 4: all did this. They just like expanded and had wars

530
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 4: and fought. And then you know, people came on and said, like,

531
00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:00,120
Speaker 4: you know, like this is kind of stupid, Like we

532
00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:02,160
Speaker 4: were just trading with each other. We don't have to

533
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,200
Speaker 4: cut you conquer each other, right, And in the American Revolution,

534
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 4: you know, it was really fought on this free trade

535
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 4: issue where the Americans thought like, well, it's stupid that

536
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 4: we can't trade with the Dutch. You know, we want

537
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 4: to buy Dutch tea, you know, like we don't want

538
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 4: to be forged to buy the English tea. Now the

539
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 4: Trump thinks, but Trump thinks in this eighty such a way.

540
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 4: He thinks that if the United States is buying products

541
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:26,360
Speaker 4: from Canada, buying Timber, America is giving money to Canada,

542
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,480
Speaker 4: and Bunny is leaving the country, right. And this is

543
00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:31,640
Speaker 4: like Trump's on a very primarial level. This is the

544
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,560
Speaker 4: way he does all his own business deals and why

545
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 4: he's a bad businessman because he could not understand the

546
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 4: idea of like reciprocity and you know, you're exchanging one

547
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 4: thing for another for virtual benefit. And he thought like

548
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 4: someone is trying to screw someone in a trade. So

549
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 4: he thinks like, if Canada and the US are trading,

550
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 4: the US is losing something, whereas if Canada and the

551
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:54,320
Speaker 4: US are one, then America is bigger, and on a

552
00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:56,760
Speaker 4: more even primitive level, Like I think he thinks like

553
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 4: a child, and he's like thinking, Okay, if there's the

554
00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 4: US and Canada and land, like will be the biggest

555
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:04,440
Speaker 4: thing on the map, right, we'll be here everyone else.

556
00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:07,400
Speaker 4: So I honestly think that the thinking here is this

557
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 4: kind of primitive tell thinking. And it's also this kind

558
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,760
Speaker 4: of older economic way of thinking. I says, why he

559
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,320
Speaker 4: praises mcimney all the time, right, like it is that

560
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 4: sort of you know, nineteenth century imperialism of which I

561
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 4: hope that humanity grown.

562
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you jet here, thank you all.

563
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 4: It's great to be on the progo.

564
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:32,040
Speaker 2: Peter Goodman is a reporter at The New York Times

565
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 2: and the author of How the World Ran Out of

566
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 2: Everything Inside the global supply chain. Welcome to fast Politics, Peter.

567
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:43,280
Speaker 5: Great to be back with you, miy.

568
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:45,520
Speaker 2: We are at the beginning I think of a supply

569
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 2: chain crisis, not so dissimilar from COVID. So talk us

570
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 2: through what's happening right now.

571
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:55,320
Speaker 5: Yes, what's happening right now is lots of companies that

572
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 5: have depended upon supply chains that stretch across the Pacific

573
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,960
Speaker 5: Ocean have quite understandably said, we don't feel like paying

574
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 5: one hundred and forty five percent extra for all the

575
00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 5: stuff we're bringing in from China. Maybe we'll just hold

576
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 5: on with that. But it's not so obvious where else

577
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 5: they can go, because a lot of companies have shifted

578
00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:19,680
Speaker 5: production from China to places like Cambodia, Vietnam, India, other

579
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 5: countries to try to avoid previous tariffs. As we speak,

580
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:27,240
Speaker 5: we're in this ninety day pause on these extraordinary towers

581
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 5: in some of those countries. But there's so much uncertainty

582
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:31,960
Speaker 5: about the rules that will apply that a lot of

583
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,040
Speaker 5: companies have said, let's just maybe stash our stuff in

584
00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 5: a warehouse somewhere on the other side of Pacific and

585
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 5: wait and hope that things get better. And as a result,

586
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:46,360
Speaker 5: we've got literally zero container ships at the Port of

587
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 5: Seattle Tacoba, which is one of the biggest ports on

588
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 5: the West Coast. We've got sharp traffic projected down at

589
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:57,280
Speaker 5: La Long Beach. These are the two ports in south

590
00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 5: of California that are together, they're the gateway for forty

591
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:04,320
Speaker 5: percent of all imported stuff reaching the United States by

592
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 5: container vessels. And the head of that of the La

593
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:11,080
Speaker 5: Porta Soroka is now out there saying we really don't

594
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 5: know what's going to happen. We got the dock workers

595
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 5: union saying they're really worried. So you got all these

596
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 5: factors that say less stuff coming in.

597
00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:23,480
Speaker 2: So this is all about unintended consequences here, Like the

598
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 2: tariff story, is about this idea that there are intented consequences. Right,

599
00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:33,320
Speaker 2: Trump wants to ontour manufacturing. I'm not sure how making

600
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:37,560
Speaker 2: how imposing these steep tariffs can will countries to build

601
00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:41,000
Speaker 2: factories to ontour manufacturing. You know, this was the kind

602
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:43,000
Speaker 2: of thing that needed to be done with the scalpel,

603
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 2: not a sledgehammer. But I want you to sort of

604
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 2: explain to us why this uncertainty is going to cause

605
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 2: problems for the supply chain, So people are not importing

606
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 2: to these you'res not seeing port ships because they're not importing.

607
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 2: Just go downstream of that, right, So we're gonna have

608
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:05,320
Speaker 2: dock workers drivers like, talk to me sort of what

609
00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:06,080
Speaker 2: this looks like.

610
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 5: Sure, So if there's less stuff crossing the Pacific headed

611
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 5: for these giant ports or on the East coast, you know,

612
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:14,680
Speaker 5: for that matter, because stuff comes in from India and

613
00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 5: even in some cases from the East as that is,

614
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 5: fewer containers to lift off of container ships and onto

615
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:23,920
Speaker 5: the shore by dock workers, who are some of the

616
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:28,320
Speaker 5: most highly paid and also militant workers in the American

617
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:33,320
Speaker 5: labor world. Then very unorganized truckers who are really at

618
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 5: the mercy of swings in the global economy. Less stuff,

619
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,560
Speaker 5: less work for truck drivers. You're gonna have a lot

620
00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:42,320
Speaker 5: of people just sitting around waiting and hoping that cargo

621
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:46,200
Speaker 5: materializes and on it goes, you know, people working in warehouses,

622
00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:50,000
Speaker 5: and eventually retailers are likely to be hit because if

623
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,160
Speaker 5: there's less stuff coming in, there's less stuff to move

624
00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 5: and less stuff to sell.

625
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 2: And but retailers are going to be hit with less

626
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 2: stuff to sell. But ultimately consumers are going to bear

627
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 2: the brunt. Explain to us how that goes.

628
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,720
Speaker 5: I mean, if you're going off to Walmart or Target

629
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:09,080
Speaker 5: with the expectation that these operations are enormous, it's just

630
00:34:09,160 --> 00:34:11,320
Speaker 5: like a magic trick. They never run out of anything.

631
00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:14,879
Speaker 5: They've got seventeen different choices for whatever product is we're

632
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 5: looking for. You could discover that things are back ordered,

633
00:34:18,320 --> 00:34:21,000
Speaker 5: the shelves are empty. And the part of this that

634
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 5: always bears discussing is there are lots of monopoly components

635
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:29,359
Speaker 5: of these supply chains. If there's a lot of competition,

636
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:34,120
Speaker 5: then there's a chance that somebody steps in to replace

637
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 5: whatever it is that you're looking for, and that can

638
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:39,560
Speaker 5: keep prices lower. If you're a company that's got a

639
00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:44,960
Speaker 5: dominant hole on your industry, then this could be fantastic

640
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:45,680
Speaker 5: for you.

641
00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 2: Give me an example of this.

642
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 5: I mean beef. You know there's four companies in the

643
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,120
Speaker 5: United States control eighty five percent of the beef supply.

644
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 5: We saw this during the pandemic wild yeah, I mean

645
00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 5: that's beyond the robber barondage, right, I mean, four companies

646
00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:01,879
Speaker 5: control eighty five percent of the beef supply, and there's

647
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:06,520
Speaker 5: engineered scarcity there. They're all sorts of lawsuits alleging that

648
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:11,439
Speaker 5: these four companies essentially conspire they stop their purchases when

649
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:15,800
Speaker 5: supplies are building up too high, precisely so you generate

650
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 5: panic buying. I mean the same thing that we saw,

651
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 5: you know, in terms of discussing av and flu in

652
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 5: terms of the egg supply terms out there's only a

653
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:24,400
Speaker 5: couple compries that dominate those those industries.

654
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 2: This sounds a lot like opek to May, where the

655
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:32,279
Speaker 2: oil companies got together to inflate the price of gasoline.

656
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:34,719
Speaker 5: Is that a similar This is what we saw during

657
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 5: the pandemic, right, so we saw product shortages that were

658
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:42,160
Speaker 5: caused by the chaos and disruption of the pandemic itself.

659
00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:45,759
Speaker 5: It's not like there was some grand conspiracy by monopolism, No, no,

660
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 5: disappear but once.

661
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:52,080
Speaker 2: But it is a grand conspiracy by monopolies to keep

662
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:54,759
Speaker 2: prices inflated in a way that they wouldn't otherwise be.

663
00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:58,400
Speaker 5: I mean the shipping industry, right Like, every time there's

664
00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 5: a hit to the supply in somewhere, we hear, oh

665
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:05,400
Speaker 5: this is terrible for the global container industry. Oh my goodness,

666
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:08,719
Speaker 5: the hooties are opening fire on from Yemen, you know,

667
00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:11,000
Speaker 5: on ships that are headed to the Red Sea. This

668
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:13,520
Speaker 5: is such a disaster for the shipping industry because now

669
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:15,759
Speaker 5: instead of going through the Red Sea to get from

670
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:17,799
Speaker 5: Asia to Europe, they got to go the long way

671
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 5: around Africa. Guess what, you know, shipping prices go four

672
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:25,000
Speaker 5: hundred percent And that's everywhere, right because there's three alliances.

673
00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 5: Why not, there's three alliances to control ninety percent of

674
00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:30,800
Speaker 5: the traffic across the Pacific. So if a whole bunch

675
00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 5: of ships are suddenly deployed to go the long way

676
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:35,920
Speaker 5: around Africa instead of through the Red Sea, that's an

677
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:38,719
Speaker 5: opportunity to rip your face off in terms of pricing.

678
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:41,759
Speaker 5: And yeah, we're all paying for that in terms of

679
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 5: higher costs. We saw this during the pandemic, where we

680
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 5: were told, oh, there's all this chaos, and that's why

681
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:50,440
Speaker 5: the price of moving a shipping container from China to

682
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:52,760
Speaker 5: the West coast of the United States goes up from

683
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:56,320
Speaker 5: something like twenty five hundred dollars to north of twenty

684
00:36:56,320 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 5: five thousand dollars. We're talking tenfold increase in this space

685
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:02,640
Speaker 5: of six months. And people said, well, this is just

686
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:06,239
Speaker 5: you know, terrible for the shipping industry record profits. I mean,

687
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:08,239
Speaker 5: we're talking like record profits.

688
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 2: So talk to me about diapers.

689
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:15,399
Speaker 5: Diapers are a product that, despite their sheer simplicity, are

690
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:19,200
Speaker 5: actually constructed of lots of different pieces. Can't remember the

691
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 5: exact number. It's like dozens of parts drawn from around

692
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:24,920
Speaker 5: the world. You run out of one of them somewhere,

693
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,120
Speaker 5: you can't make a diaper. You know, think about the

694
00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:31,000
Speaker 5: computer chip and cars during the pandemic. Right, there's thirty

695
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:33,400
Speaker 5: thousand parts in a car. If you run out of

696
00:37:33,480 --> 00:37:36,759
Speaker 5: one component of a computer chip, you can make the

697
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 5: rest of the car. As you know, Ford at one

698
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:43,240
Speaker 5: point was making the F one fifty, its most popular

699
00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:47,120
Speaker 5: pickup truck, and then parking them across the street from

700
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:49,879
Speaker 5: Henry Ford Elementary School in the shadow of Ford's corporate

701
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,560
Speaker 5: headquarters because they couldn't get enough chips. You know, the

702
00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:56,279
Speaker 5: diaper gets affected. We saw during the pandemic that you know,

703
00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:59,800
Speaker 5: we've ran out of infant formula because there's one company

704
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:01,799
Speaker 5: that has a dominant hold on that market in the

705
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 5: United States. And if there's any disruption anywhere, we don't

706
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:08,800
Speaker 5: know where the problems will pop up where they will,

707
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:10,200
Speaker 5: but they'll pop up somewhere.

708
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:12,920
Speaker 2: Right. It's a really good point, and you know, you

709
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 2: can't just skip out on diapers, right, You're gonna need diapers.

710
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 5: And you're gonna pay.

711
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:18,319
Speaker 2: You're gonna pay.

712
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a pricing power moment, right because if I mean,

713
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 5: if you've got a kid in the house who needs

714
00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 5: diapers and the word gets out that there could be

715
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:28,520
Speaker 5: a shortage, that's something you'll pay. I mean, think about

716
00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:31,000
Speaker 5: the toilet paper shortage, right, I mean, those are the

717
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 5: during the pandemic. I remember I was living in London,

718
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:36,400
Speaker 5: you know, having to go down to schmooze, the guy

719
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 5: who talked to the truckers, you know, who could tell

720
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 5: me like what times the toilet paper show up. You know,

721
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:44,759
Speaker 5: it could be like that with diapers. If you need them,

722
00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,399
Speaker 5: you'll do whatever it takes to get them. And don't

723
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:50,000
Speaker 5: think that companies don't know that in terms of pricing.

724
00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:53,720
Speaker 2: Right, like right now, there's this ninety day pause, which

725
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:57,879
Speaker 2: means that nobody knows anything. There's no stability. Trump says

726
00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:00,920
Speaker 2: ninety deals in ninety days, or that was Navarro. We

727
00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 2: have yet to see a single deal. May We've heard

728
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:07,799
Speaker 2: like whispers of talks of whatever. It just seems like

729
00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 2: with the dock numbers, we are careening towards the same

730
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,040
Speaker 2: thing that happened during COVID, careening towards a scarcity event.

731
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 5: It's a similar dynamic. And one of the things that

732
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 5: we learned during COVID is that fear of shortages create shortages, right.

733
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 5: I mean, that's what happened toilet Peper. We didn't actually

734
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 5: run out of stuff to make toilet paper with. We

735
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 5: got a surplus of people saying, oh my god, I

736
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:32,799
Speaker 5: better go buy some toilet paper. And that can happen

737
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:35,239
Speaker 5: not just a household level, but at the retail level, right.

738
00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:38,719
Speaker 5: I mean, if again, your Amazon, your Target, your Walmart,

739
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 5: you have enormous resources around the globe, You're able to

740
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 5: charter your own container ships if you need to, and

741
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,560
Speaker 5: you want to get out in front of this as

742
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:51,319
Speaker 5: they're doing, we could wake up and discover that warehouses

743
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:54,320
Speaker 5: for a select handful of companies that are big enough

744
00:39:54,560 --> 00:39:58,320
Speaker 5: have got all the stuff. Smaller players have got nothing. Meanwhile,

745
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 5: households run out to buy as much stuff as they

746
00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 5: can because they're nervous, and that's how we end up

747
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:06,319
Speaker 5: in shortages. There's a whole other scenario, by the way,

748
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 5: that nobody talks about because we're too consumed with what's

749
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 5: actually happening. If Trump tomorrow said, oh, I'm really worried

750
00:40:13,160 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 5: about this. Okay, I'm lifting all the tariffs. Let's just

751
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:17,759
Speaker 5: go back to how it was now predicting this, not

752
00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 5: saying that's how it is. That would be the COVID scenario,

753
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:23,560
Speaker 5: and we would get the shortages because what happened in

754
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:27,280
Speaker 5: COVID was first factories in places like China and around

755
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:30,080
Speaker 5: the world were disrupted and we made less stuff. Then

756
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:34,920
Speaker 5: it turned out we wildly we I say, the economists, businesses,

757
00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 5: they wildly miscalculated the impacts of this supply chain hit.

758
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:44,360
Speaker 5: So they assumed, Okay, we're locked down, can't go to work,

759
00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:46,880
Speaker 5: so we don't need stuff. This is going to be

760
00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:51,520
Speaker 5: a basic economic downturn where the demand for everything goes down. Well,

761
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:54,720
Speaker 5: that was wildly wrong. So we're not going to the gym,

762
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,640
Speaker 5: but we're now we're working out at home. We need pelotons.

763
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:00,960
Speaker 5: Our kids aren't going to school still now we're cooking

764
00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:02,759
Speaker 5: twenty seven meals for them at home, so now we

765
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:05,680
Speaker 5: need more kitchen supply. Are they're stuck in the backyard

766
00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 5: or we're buying trampolines and all this stuff comes in

767
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:13,680
Speaker 5: from China. Once factories turned back on the container shipping industry,

768
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,080
Speaker 5: which had actually set aside a lot of ships they

769
00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:20,000
Speaker 5: were idling in warm waters places like Greece, they said,

770
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:22,839
Speaker 5: oh my goodness, there's actually more demand for stuff than ever.

771
00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 5: And then we got what people may remember, these crazy

772
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:29,719
Speaker 5: floating traffic jams off the ports of La Long Beach,

773
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:34,520
Speaker 5: where you had seventy five ships circling around for weeks

774
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:37,240
Speaker 5: at a time waiting for a chance to dock because

775
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:40,560
Speaker 5: they all came at once. And that's what could happen here.

776
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:43,359
Speaker 5: Whenever this ends, we're going to get a surge of

777
00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:46,400
Speaker 5: orders from wherever it can produce them, and that could

778
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:49,120
Speaker 5: swamp the gears where we get the reverse, like instead

779
00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:51,040
Speaker 5: of worrying about there's no ships in Seattle, there's no

780
00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:53,040
Speaker 5: ships in La we can get all the ships coming

781
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,880
Speaker 5: at once. The dock workers can only handle so many.

782
00:41:56,200 --> 00:41:58,919
Speaker 5: We can run out of truck drivers, which is in truth,

783
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 5: we just downgraded truck driving to such a degree at

784
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:03,439
Speaker 5: any time people have to go look for another job,

785
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:04,840
Speaker 5: and then they get one, they don't like to go

786
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:07,560
Speaker 5: back to it. That's how we got the worst of

787
00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:11,040
Speaker 5: the shortages, and that could very much be ahead of us.

788
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:14,640
Speaker 2: So let's talk this through for a second, because I

789
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:19,799
Speaker 2: remember during the COVID pandemic, we saw like lines of

790
00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 2: ships at different ports, and you know, like hundreds of

791
00:42:24,239 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 2: ships at ports, and so you think that's sort of

792
00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:29,440
Speaker 2: the scenario we're looking at.

793
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:32,719
Speaker 5: I think for now, we're looking at the reverse of that, right,

794
00:42:32,760 --> 00:42:33,800
Speaker 5: we're looking at futures.

795
00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 2: I mean, eventually.

796
00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:38,880
Speaker 5: But if it turns it back, I think whenever. I mean, okay,

797
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:41,840
Speaker 5: if we take as a given that this policy is

798
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:46,560
Speaker 5: designed to have us wean our dependence on long supply

799
00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:48,840
Speaker 5: chains and span across oceans, that I guess we'll just

800
00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:51,000
Speaker 5: start making everything in the US and everything will be fun.

801
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:55,239
Speaker 5: No one believes that this can happen anytime soon. So

802
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:58,560
Speaker 5: at some point there's going to be some policy change

803
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:01,480
Speaker 5: that will prompt us to go back, maybe not China,

804
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,680
Speaker 5: maybe back to factors in Vietnam and Cambodia and other

805
00:43:04,719 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 5: parts of Southeast Asia, maybe India. And whenever there's enough

806
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:12,719
Speaker 5: certainty that the big retailers say okay, I get it now,

807
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:16,960
Speaker 5: I get where it's economical for me to source my stuff,

808
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 5: there will be a surge of orders to replenish inventory

809
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:24,880
Speaker 5: and that is likely to lead to traffic jams somewhere.

810
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:28,080
Speaker 2: Yes, so I wonder if we could talk about Carolyne

811
00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:31,920
Speaker 2: Levitt for a minute, the White House Press secretary. Today,

812
00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 2: Amazon decided, and it is actually kind of brilliant to

813
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:43,840
Speaker 2: publish exactly what these tariffs will cost. Right, so you

814
00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 2: go on your Amazon page to buy a toothbrush, it

815
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 2: says this toothbrush was seven dollars. It'll now be ten dollars,

816
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:57,160
Speaker 2: you know, or whatever because of a three dollars ra

817
00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:02,759
Speaker 2: or whatever. So uh, reporter, Amazon will soon display a

818
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:04,800
Speaker 2: number next to the product, the price of each product

819
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:09,280
Speaker 2: plus the amount that the Trump tariff is adding. Levitt

820
00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:14,520
Speaker 2: responds as a hostile and political act by Amazon, discuss.

821
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:17,560
Speaker 5: The whole Trump fantasy. Here is somebody else is going

822
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 5: to pay for this, not American consumers. Now there's a

823
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:24,319
Speaker 5: lot to unpack here, right, because Amazon is reminding the

824
00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:28,040
Speaker 5: customer that if you increase the costs of the stuff

825
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:31,160
Speaker 5: that we buy from far away to serve you, we

826
00:44:31,200 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 5: will pass on those costs to you. However, we have

827
00:44:34,239 --> 00:44:38,120
Speaker 5: no idea what Amazon's margins are on any particular product.

828
00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:41,080
Speaker 5: We don't know how much competition there is, we don't

829
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:45,280
Speaker 5: know to what degree Amazon is availing itself of consumer

830
00:44:45,320 --> 00:44:50,440
Speaker 5: anxiety and now stoking consumer anxiety to justify price increases.

831
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,879
Speaker 5: I mean, look again, think back to eggs, a thing

832
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:54,880
Speaker 5: that we've all talked about to bet we know that

833
00:44:55,000 --> 00:44:57,480
Speaker 5: there's legitimate reason to think that the price of egg

834
00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:00,399
Speaker 5: should go up when there's avian flu, right, know that,

835
00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 5: and when there's inflation in general, how much, Well, we

836
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:06,920
Speaker 5: don't know, because there's a couple of companies that dominate

837
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:11,160
Speaker 5: the egg business. And any time we go to the

838
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:13,520
Speaker 5: supermarket and think, boy, I better buy some more eggs.

839
00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:15,799
Speaker 5: You know, I noticed the shelves are empty. All these

840
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:18,880
Speaker 5: people are jogging around parts of the day, they are

841
00:45:18,880 --> 00:45:21,640
Speaker 5: no eggs at all. I better. That is pricing power,

842
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:25,600
Speaker 5: and Amazon certainly has pricing power as a dominant retailer.

843
00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:29,400
Speaker 5: So the White House is not crazy to say there's

844
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,719
Speaker 5: a stunt connected to this. Amazon is not crazy to

845
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:36,240
Speaker 5: say you stick one hundred and forty five percent terrify

846
00:45:36,239 --> 00:45:38,200
Speaker 5: on Chinese goods. That's going to hit a lot of

847
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:40,840
Speaker 5: stuff that you used to buying from Amazon. And you know,

848
00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:43,360
Speaker 5: I think it's fair to say that Jeff Bezos's enterprise

849
00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:45,840
Speaker 5: is not charitable we're going to look to take it

850
00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:46,760
Speaker 5: out of you, customer.

851
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 2: So it is a really good point, right, which is

852
00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:52,640
Speaker 2: that they don't need to raise their prices, but they

853
00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:56,320
Speaker 2: are going to raise their prices, and we don't really

854
00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,839
Speaker 2: know what their markups are. So it's not like they're saying,

855
00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:03,719
Speaker 2: we buy this from China for twenty five cents and

856
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:07,480
Speaker 2: we are paying a seventy five percent of tariff. Right,

857
00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:10,120
Speaker 2: We're not really seeing what the tariff is. We're seeing

858
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:13,520
Speaker 2: what the tariff number is on the final price.

859
00:46:13,960 --> 00:46:16,960
Speaker 5: This is premised on if you assume that our business

860
00:46:17,280 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 5: is entirely about satisfying consumer interest for low prices, and

861
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:26,440
Speaker 5: our margins are tiny and fair, and we don't engage

862
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:29,640
Speaker 5: in any predatory behavior, so our prices are to imagine

863
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:36,120
Speaker 5: perfect representation of Milton Friedman's market economy, then sure you

864
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:38,520
Speaker 5: stick us with some tariff that gets passed on to

865
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 5: the consumer pool. We know that it's a lot messier

866
00:46:41,080 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 5: than that.

867
00:46:41,840 --> 00:46:46,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, really good point. But it is this Carolyn Levit comment.

868
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:50,080
Speaker 2: It does I find it interesting they really are offended

869
00:46:50,160 --> 00:46:55,719
Speaker 2: by the idea that Amazon would transmit what they're doing, right.

870
00:46:55,840 --> 00:46:58,839
Speaker 2: I mean, ultimately that seems like the cardinals in here

871
00:46:58,920 --> 00:47:02,080
Speaker 2: is not up the goods to the American people.

872
00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:07,319
Speaker 5: Wait, counter programming, right like in this reality show Presidency,

873
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:11,239
Speaker 5: it's all about I'm working to bring jobs back to America.

874
00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:13,879
Speaker 5: You know, some days they say it's impossible to deal

875
00:47:13,960 --> 00:47:16,040
Speaker 5: with inflation, but most of the time they say, you know,

876
00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:18,920
Speaker 5: I mean, they certainly are aware that inflation seems to

877
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:21,799
Speaker 5: be how Trump came back to the White House, and

878
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:24,640
Speaker 5: they don't like the idea that one of the richest

879
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:26,719
Speaker 5: most powerful people on a guy, by the way, they

880
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:30,000
Speaker 5: thought they'd sort of muzzled with the whole fenestration of

881
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:34,160
Speaker 5: the Washington Posts ed operation is now out there swinging

882
00:47:34,320 --> 00:47:37,600
Speaker 5: saying no, let me talk directly to your constituents, and

883
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,080
Speaker 5: now I've got something to say, and you're jacking up

884
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:43,400
Speaker 5: their prices. Clearly that's not part of the programming that

885
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:44,879
Speaker 5: the White House would like to put out there.

886
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:48,760
Speaker 2: Yeah. Pretty incredible, I mean, and a really good point.

887
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:52,520
Speaker 2: We will see how this plays out. Thank you, Thank you, Peter,

888
00:47:53,040 --> 00:47:55,880
Speaker 2: thank you, Molly.

889
00:47:56,120 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 3: No moment, Jesse Cannon, Mollie, this is so just cruel,

890
00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:07,120
Speaker 3: engross And I know that that's the point, but I

891
00:48:07,160 --> 00:48:09,320
Speaker 3: know a lot of people whose lives have been saved

892
00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:13,760
Speaker 3: by the NARCAN program in New York, and I've seen it.

893
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:17,279
Speaker 3: It's a miracle what it does for giving people a

894
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:19,560
Speaker 3: second chance when they're at a bad place in their life.

895
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 3: And so a person who is a heroinaut for twelve

896
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:27,120
Speaker 3: years named RFK Junior, who runs HHS, decides, Eh, we

897
00:48:27,160 --> 00:48:27,880
Speaker 3: can get rid of it.

898
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:32,040
Speaker 2: This is stripping the federal government. RFK Junior is nhsass

899
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 2: to take it apart, just like Linda McMahon is in

900
00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:39,600
Speaker 2: the Department of Education, to take the Department of Education apart.

901
00:48:39,760 --> 00:48:43,880
Speaker 2: This is Project twenty twenty five, dis assembling the federal government,

902
00:48:44,120 --> 00:48:48,239
Speaker 2: selling it for parts, making the government so small that

903
00:48:48,280 --> 00:48:52,040
Speaker 2: it doesn't do anything for people. That is the goal here.

904
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 2: So you can expect that RFK Junior is going to

905
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 2: do a ton of things like this. But part of

906
00:48:57,760 --> 00:49:01,080
Speaker 2: it is also he does not care about public health.

907
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:04,560
Speaker 2: This is just a stick. He cares about power. This

908
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 2: is his last chance to get into power, and that's

909
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:10,520
Speaker 2: what we're doing here. This has nothing to do with

910
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 2: public health. Personally, I think this is bad, but I

911
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:16,640
Speaker 2: think there's one hundred other things you could point to

912
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:20,680
Speaker 2: that are this bad or worse. That's it for this

913
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:27,239
Speaker 2: episode of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday

914
00:49:27,400 --> 00:49:31,319
Speaker 2: and Saturday to hear the best minds and politics make

915
00:49:31,480 --> 00:49:35,480
Speaker 2: sense of all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast,

916
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:39,240
Speaker 2: please send it to a friend and keep the conversation going.

917
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:40,840
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.