1 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: Yeah. Can I ask you a question? 2 00:00:04,720 --> 00:00:04,920 Speaker 2: Yeah? 3 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: Is it healthier to take a bath or a shower? 4 00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:11,479 Speaker 2: Is it healthier shower? 5 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:15,200 Speaker 1: From a medical perspective, I think more relaxing. Okay, which 6 00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:19,239 Speaker 1: is better? Bacon or ham? Which is better for the heart? 7 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 3: Lake? 8 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:20,639 Speaker 1: Which is more heart healthy? 9 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:21,840 Speaker 4: That's a toss up. 10 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 1: Okay, we'll say bacon is screaming a good cardiovascular workout. 11 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:33,920 Speaker 2: Gummy? 12 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:39,839 Speaker 1: All right, Time to take a bath while eating bacon 13 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:50,360 Speaker 1: and screaming my head off. From Gimblet Media, I'm Jonathan 14 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:54,680 Speaker 1: Goldstein and this is Heavyweight Today's episode. 15 00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:55,880 Speaker 2: Nick. 16 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:11,320 Speaker 1: Right after the break, Hey. 17 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 4: Hey, how's it going? 18 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:14,399 Speaker 3: How are you? 19 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 4: The clocks move forward an hour so it's not all 20 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:17,959 Speaker 4: dark anymore. 21 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 1: Huh. These two subdued dudes aren't on ludes. They're Canadian 22 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:29,640 Speaker 1: and their lack of expression is an expression of their 23 00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 1: proud Canadian heritage. One of these Canadians is me, Jonathan Goldstein, 24 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 1: and the other is Nick. Nick grew up in Ontario 25 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 1: with his older brother Chris. They had the same dad, 26 00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 1: but different moms. Still, Chris would always say. 27 00:01:47,319 --> 00:01:49,559 Speaker 4: There's no such thing as a half brother, no matter 28 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 4: what anyone says, like we're brothers. 29 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 1: Chris split his time between his parents' houses, so the 30 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:00,880 Speaker 1: brothers mostly saw each other on weekend, but I think. 31 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 4: Because of the rarity of his presence, it was that 32 00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:06,040 Speaker 4: much more special to spend time together. We'd stay up 33 00:02:06,080 --> 00:02:09,000 Speaker 4: until four in the morning playing video games, listening to music. 34 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:12,160 Speaker 1: Nick says his brother introduced him to the music that 35 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 1: would form the blueprint for his taste. Chris loved electronica 36 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 1: and house music, but his special love was beatboxing, and 37 00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:22,920 Speaker 1: Chris was an amazing beatboxer. 38 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 4: It was like relentless, Like we would go to McDonald's 39 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:29,000 Speaker 4: and the car ride there would be beatboxing, Sitting down 40 00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:31,240 Speaker 4: in the booth would be beatboxing. It would just be 41 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,720 Speaker 4: like constant. I'm not taking the picture. 42 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:38,519 Speaker 1: Nick sends me a grainy YouTube video from two thousand 43 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 1: and six. In it, a shaggy haired teenage Chris is 44 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:45,160 Speaker 1: leaning against a wall with a group of friends outside 45 00:02:45,200 --> 00:02:48,200 Speaker 1: a bowling alley. He pulls the gum from his mouth, 46 00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 1: and as casually as whistling a tune, starts to beatbox. 47 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:58,040 Speaker 1: It's hard to understand how the sound of a whole 48 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: drum line is coming from the mouth of one seventeen 49 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 1: year old boy. In the YouTube, comments a twelve year 50 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:15,639 Speaker 1: old Nick has written you were My Hero, only a 51 00:03:15,680 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: few months after the video was shot. Nick remembers coming 52 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,639 Speaker 1: downstairs one morning to find his mom sobbing. She told 53 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 1: him Chris had been in an accident. 54 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 4: At which point I thought, Okay, Chris has been an 55 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:29,440 Speaker 4: accident and broke his arm, Chris has been an accent 56 00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:32,080 Speaker 4: and broke his nose, whatever it might be. Yeah, you know, 57 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 4: when nothing that bad has happened to you in your life, 58 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:37,320 Speaker 4: you don't jump to the worst case scenario when someone 59 00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 4: says there's been an accident and then Chris had died. 60 00:03:48,200 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 1: Chris had been killed in a car crash. He was 61 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:51,880 Speaker 1: seventeen years old. 62 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:01,160 Speaker 4: I feel like I'm warned in the way a twelve 63 00:04:01,240 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 4: year old would like. I would often find myself doing 64 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:07,480 Speaker 4: things that I would think that Chris would have thought 65 00:04:07,600 --> 00:04:09,960 Speaker 4: were cool to do, and trying to keep those parts 66 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:13,280 Speaker 4: of him that I admired alive. So I got like 67 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 4: a little bit more into beatboxing, and of course listening 68 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:21,040 Speaker 4: to music to music that he liked, like mostly Bonobo. 69 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 1: Binobo is a British DJ and electronica musician. He was 70 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 1: Chris's favorite, and so became a favorite of Nick's too, 71 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: and even as Nick grew older, Chris's musical influence remained. 72 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 1: Through the years, he kept an ear out for new 73 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 1: albums by Chris's favorite bands, always wondering what Chris would 74 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:45,040 Speaker 1: make of them, which brings us to twenty seventeen. By 75 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:47,760 Speaker 1: this point, Nick was in his early twenties. He was 76 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 1: at his parents' place having a beer with a friend 77 00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 1: when the friend put on the newest Bonobo album. 78 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 4: And he started playing this track that opens like very 79 00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:59,360 Speaker 4: clearly with beatboxing. 80 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 1: It was just a short sample, a few seconds of 81 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 1: beatboxing that Binobo had looped several times. 82 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:17,960 Speaker 4: And the second I heard that, I'm just like, I 83 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 4: was like, that's Chris for sure. The sound of his 84 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 4: beatboxing is like just totally drilled into my head, like 85 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:29,640 Speaker 4: I just I just know what it sounds like, in 86 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 4: the same way I know what my wife's sneeze sounds like. There's, 87 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:40,479 Speaker 4: of course, like the very logical part of me that 88 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:43,359 Speaker 4: was being like, there's no way this is just some 89 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 4: random sample. There's no way that could be Chris. But 90 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:50,360 Speaker 4: the other ninety nine percent of me, I'm just like, 91 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 4: that's got to be him, Like that's got to be. 92 00:05:53,800 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 1: Him in that uncanny moment as he listened to the 93 00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 1: sound of his brother being brought back to life a 94 00:06:07,040 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 1: decade after his death. Nick looked over at his friend 95 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:12,600 Speaker 1: and said, nothing. 96 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 4: I remember, not wanting to bring it up in the 97 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 4: moment as to not like kind of freak him out, 98 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 4: to be like, well, this song reminds me of my 99 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:21,520 Speaker 4: dead brother. 100 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:26,160 Speaker 1: Nick's modus operandi is to never impose a burden on others, 101 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:29,839 Speaker 1: but as a result, even into his adulthood, he's never 102 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:32,279 Speaker 1: quite figured out how to broach the subject of his 103 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:36,279 Speaker 1: brother's death, even with some of his closest friends. Many 104 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:38,320 Speaker 1: of them don't even know Nick ever had an older 105 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 1: brother at all. But in the weeks that followed, Nick 106 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:47,640 Speaker 1: played the song in private over and over. The experience 107 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:50,360 Speaker 1: of listening to it and feeling Chris's breath in it 108 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 1: provided him with a space to grieve. Since Chris was cremated, 109 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:57,599 Speaker 1: there isn't a grave for Nick to visit, and so 110 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 1: the sonic space became all the more in value. 111 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:04,160 Speaker 4: Feels like that sound came from a different time, Like 112 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 4: came from the time of my memories as a kid 113 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 4: with Chris. It's nice to hear a person's voice, so 114 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 4: you don't get to hear anymore. 115 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: But Nick wants to be absolutely sure that he is 116 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 1: hearing his brother's voice. Despite his initial certainty, a part 117 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 1: of him wonders is his brain just working through the 118 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:25,160 Speaker 1: grief or is he really hearing his dead brother's voice 119 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:29,320 Speaker 1: in a track by a Grammy nominated musician. Nick has 120 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 1: several points of evidence to support the latter. First, of course, 121 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 1: it just sounds like Chris. Second, Chris often reached out 122 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 1: to musicians he admired. In fact, at the Ottawa Jazz Fest, 123 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:45,680 Speaker 1: Chris even navigated backstage to meet Binobo. The two ended 124 00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 1: up chatting about sampling in a bid to further impress Bonobo. 125 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 1: Nick thinks it's entirely possible Chris followed up that interaction 126 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 1: by sending him beatboxing samples. Samples Binobo might have saved. 127 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: The third point of evidence the song's name Ontario, Ontario, 128 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 1: the Canadian province Nick and Chris are from. Bonobo is 129 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 1: from England, but he met Chris in Ontario. Nick has 130 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 1: tried everything to get a definitive answer. He searched online 131 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:28,520 Speaker 1: for information about Bonobo's samples, and about once a year 132 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 1: he'll reach out to Bonobo. His management and his record label. 133 00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:35,480 Speaker 4: I'll like go on an emailing spree and I'll reach 134 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 4: out to like everyone who's ever sniffed Banobo, being like 135 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 4: I do not want to like say that my brother 136 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:45,080 Speaker 4: deserves credit for anything, or. 137 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 1: Like you just want to know payment or anything like that. 138 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:47,800 Speaker 4: I just want to know. 139 00:08:48,160 --> 00:08:51,679 Speaker 1: And they've never responded and never responded. I mean it's 140 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 1: not like the Rolling Stones, right, I mean you'd think 141 00:08:53,679 --> 00:08:56,600 Speaker 1: that he would be a little more accessible. Yeah, I'm 142 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,680 Speaker 1: just looking at Banobo just to get a sense of 143 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: but all I'm coming up with a wow, amazing pictures 144 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:06,800 Speaker 1: of primates. Oh yeah, that would also cow. I'm just looking. 145 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:11,199 Speaker 1: Oh god, it's very moving. You haven't experienced true emotion 146 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:14,440 Speaker 1: until you've seen a picture of two bonobos playing with 147 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 1: their baby. And then there's their personalities. Did you know 148 00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 1: bonobos share food with strangers, or that they make love 149 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 1: face to face, or that female bonobos show a preference 150 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:32,160 Speaker 1: for unaggressive males, that is, males who are subdued, not rude. 151 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: But Nick did not approach me to learn about bonobos, 152 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 1: even though they are wonderful. Nick came to me for help. 153 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:44,480 Speaker 4: It would be amazing to use your fame and clout 154 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:48,560 Speaker 4: and power to get a hold of the people that 155 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 4: I haven't been able to get a hold of. 156 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 1: Nick has an outsized view of my fame and clout 157 00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 1: and power. But it's not like I'll be trying to 158 00:09:57,240 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 1: get an actual Bonobo on the phone, which by the way, 159 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:04,640 Speaker 1: would be adorable. I'll only be trying to get Bonobo 160 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 1: on the phone. So I promise to try, and Nick, 161 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 1: in a subdued way, is thrilled. Awesome, thank you, thank you? 162 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: And in my own subdued way, so am I I 163 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 1: even break out a little beatboxing a mouse boosh? Did 164 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:24,400 Speaker 1: you hear that? 165 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:26,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, a little scratching. 166 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 1: Is it possible for a beatboxer to be recognized by 167 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:47,760 Speaker 1: just a brief sample? Can one actually identify beatboxing as 168 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 1: one would a voice? In short? Does Nick's story make sense? 169 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:56,440 Speaker 1: Before approaching Bonobo? I want to consult an expert, and 170 00:10:56,520 --> 00:11:00,520 Speaker 1: Nick thinks he knows just the person, beatboxing ic and 171 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:03,359 Speaker 1: former member of the Roots Rozelle. 172 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:07,200 Speaker 4: I remember Chris saying that Rozelle is the greatest of 173 00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 4: all time. 174 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:10,119 Speaker 1: I know this other guy named Devon. 175 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 5: Nice. 176 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,160 Speaker 1: Did I mention him last time we spoke. Devon was 177 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 1: a Gimblet intern who participated in many beatboxing competitions. Every 178 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:24,439 Speaker 1: time I'd run into him, like say in the bathroom 179 00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:27,760 Speaker 1: or about to go into the bathroom or coming out 180 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 1: of the bathroom, I'd say, hey, Devon, want to spit 181 00:11:31,440 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 1: a little something for me? And he'd laugh and say 182 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 1: maybe later. Yeah, Devon's pretty cool. 183 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 4: Rozelle is like beatboxing Royalty. 184 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:47,080 Speaker 1: But Nick seems super stoked about this Rozelle guy. 185 00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:51,920 Speaker 4: But I mean no, like, in no way do I 186 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:53,440 Speaker 4: mean to discredit Devon. 187 00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 1: I send Rozelle an email, and when I don't hear back, 188 00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:04,480 Speaker 1: my producer Khalila finds a phone number for him, which 189 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: oddly is listed on his Instagram. Is it possible that 190 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,800 Speaker 1: he's not aware of it, that he did it by accident? 191 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:12,199 Speaker 4: That would be weird. 192 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: I don't know. Look at me, I'm constantly making mistakes. 193 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:15,839 Speaker 1: How old is he? 194 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 4: It's fifty seven? 195 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 1: Oh fifty seven? What an inspiration? 196 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 4: Wow, here's more excited to talk to him because you're contemporaries. 197 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,720 Speaker 1: He's fifty seven and he's still beat boxing away. Fantastic. 198 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:40,840 Speaker 5: Leave your name and your number and someone will return local. 199 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 1: So I think we got the right number. The mailbox 200 00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: is full. 201 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 2: I cannot accept any messages at this time. 202 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:59,680 Speaker 1: The box it is, of course it is Devin. Remember 203 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:03,959 Speaker 1: that I said I knew named Devon, great beatboxer, really 204 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: cool guy. 205 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:06,679 Speaker 2: Hey. 206 00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:08,959 Speaker 5: Yeah. 207 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 1: After Nick's hero Rozelle crap the beatboxing bed, I was 208 00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:16,640 Speaker 1: blessed with the good fortune to get Devon on the phone. 209 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:22,440 Speaker 6: For pro beatboxers, it's very, very easy to tell who 210 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:25,199 Speaker 6: the beatboxer is just by a quick sample of their 211 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 6: beat boxing. 212 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 2: Right. 213 00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 6: Your idea that somebody could recognize that just from the 214 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:31,400 Speaker 6: beatboxing is totally on point. 215 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:34,880 Speaker 1: After Devon tells me that I'm totally on point, I 216 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:37,920 Speaker 1: asked if you could listen to the Bonobo sample alongside 217 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 1: a recording of Chris to see if it's the same person. 218 00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 5: Let's take a gamber. 219 00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:49,200 Speaker 1: When you went, I thought you were going to launch 220 00:13:49,240 --> 00:13:53,319 Speaker 1: into some beatboxing. Now you've given me an appetite. 221 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 6: Hey Ontario by Bonobo. 222 00:13:56,400 --> 00:14:00,040 Speaker 1: Devin forges ahead, ignoring my hint to rustle up a 223 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:08,240 Speaker 1: hasty beatboxing Bouya Bayze Ontario by Bonobo. Next, for a 224 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:11,520 Speaker 1: point of comparison, I send him the YouTube video of Chris, 225 00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:14,559 Speaker 1: and to my surprise, I've seen this video. 226 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 6: Really, I swear I've seen. 227 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:23,000 Speaker 1: That how why would you have seen it? 228 00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:26,560 Speaker 6: Because YouTube was the only way people learn how to beatbox, 229 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:31,720 Speaker 6: and this video is like, he has really really good 230 00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:35,240 Speaker 6: skills also for that time. It's shocking to me that 231 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:36,840 Speaker 6: you would be this good in two thousand and six. 232 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 6: That's crazy. Those are really impressive boxing skills. 233 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:45,560 Speaker 1: So impressive in fact, that Devin wonders, if indeed Chris 234 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,840 Speaker 1: is being sampled on the track, why wouldn't Binobo use 235 00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 1: a flashier example of his talent. Why would he instead 236 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:54,440 Speaker 1: loop something that sounds so sedate. 237 00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:02,240 Speaker 6: Like just very basic, That sort of would be the 238 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 6: type of thing anyone would do as their first sounds. 239 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 6: So I just don't know why he would take some 240 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 6: random kid sample of the most basic version of beatboxing 241 00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:12,200 Speaker 6: and put it. 242 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:16,800 Speaker 1: In Stylistically, Devon isn't able to link the Banobo sample 243 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: to the YouTube video, so I send him another example 244 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:29,280 Speaker 1: of Chris's work, hoping it might help clarify. 245 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:31,000 Speaker 6: Okay, I heard something interesting. 246 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: What's that right there? Okay, so is it that sound? 247 00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:37,200 Speaker 4: Yeah, he does that. 248 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 6: It's the same thing from the Lenobo song. It does 249 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:42,800 Speaker 6: actually sound pretty similar now that I'm hearing just that part. 250 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:53,000 Speaker 1: Now that Devin's confirmed the plausibility of Nick's story, reaching 251 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:56,440 Speaker 1: out to Bonobos seems like a reasonable next step. So 252 00:15:56,600 --> 00:16:00,840 Speaker 1: email is record label, then an email is management. Then 253 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:04,320 Speaker 1: I email his record label again, and his management again. 254 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:08,040 Speaker 1: After waiting several weeks, I call in a favor from 255 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:10,840 Speaker 1: a friend with music industry connections who gets me a 256 00:16:10,880 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 1: more direct email address. But just like Nick, I hear 257 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:18,640 Speaker 1: nothing back. Thanks calling red Light management if you know 258 00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:21,200 Speaker 1: your part of the extension. So I try phoning Bnobo's 259 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 1: management company, but there's no operator, no directory. I have 260 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 1: no way of knowing what extension to dial. Let me 261 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:29,880 Speaker 1: just try a random one maybe. 262 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:39,400 Speaker 2: In Validentary. Try again, in validentary, Please try again one 263 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:47,200 Speaker 2: one a ah in Validentary. 264 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:52,000 Speaker 1: For God's sake, my fame, power, even my clout is 265 00:16:52,000 --> 00:17:00,160 Speaker 1: getting me nowhere. Why is it so difficult to get 266 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 1: a response. In all my correspondence, I keep explaining over 267 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:07,919 Speaker 1: and over how this isn't about money or credit, how 268 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:11,560 Speaker 1: Chris idolized Bonobo and Nick listens to Ontario as a 269 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 1: way to mourn him, and yet I still can't get 270 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:17,760 Speaker 1: anyone to even engage. Maybe there's something about the whole 271 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:21,840 Speaker 1: business of sampling and authorship that's making them touchy because 272 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:25,360 Speaker 1: when sampling took off in the seventies, almost nothing was cleared, 273 00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:29,159 Speaker 1: but then about a decade later, the tide turned and 274 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:32,800 Speaker 1: the lawsuits began. The Beastie Boys are still paying for 275 00:17:32,800 --> 00:17:36,359 Speaker 1: the samples on Paul's boutique. Kanye West was sued by 276 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,320 Speaker 1: the parents of a child he sampled from a YouTube video, 277 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:42,879 Speaker 1: and just last summer there was drama between Beyonce and 278 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:48,000 Speaker 1: Calise because Beyonce used a sample for milkshake without Callis's permission. 279 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 1: Is it possible that for all our reassurances, Bonobo's people 280 00:17:53,119 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: still think we're angling for a lawsuit? And then, at 281 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:07,960 Speaker 1: long last, Benobo's people finally get back to me. I'm 282 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 1: sorry for the delay in responding. The email reads, I 283 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:15,159 Speaker 1: did get confirmation that the person you've emailed us about 284 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:20,320 Speaker 1: was not sampled in the song Ontario, thank you and best. 285 00:18:21,119 --> 00:18:23,840 Speaker 1: There's no sense of who was doing the confirming, no 286 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,520 Speaker 1: mention of Chris by name. He's only referred to as 287 00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 1: the person you've emailed us about. I write back, asking 288 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:34,480 Speaker 1: who and what was sampled so I can close the 289 00:18:34,520 --> 00:18:37,840 Speaker 1: loop on this whole thing. After waiting three months and 290 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,439 Speaker 1: receiving no reply, I follow up, but I never get 291 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:45,120 Speaker 1: a response. I did get confirmation that the person you've 292 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 1: emailed us about, you know, being your brother was not 293 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:52,040 Speaker 1: sampled in the song Ontario. After all the waiting, all 294 00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:54,800 Speaker 1: I have for Nick is a generic letter that turns 295 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,879 Speaker 1: his beautiful talisman, the song he's been listening to for 296 00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:01,320 Speaker 1: five years to dust. I wish that I even had 297 00:19:01,359 --> 00:19:07,159 Speaker 1: an email from them that was a little bit more considerate. 298 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:11,480 Speaker 7: Yeah, for sure, but yeah, thanks again so much for 299 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:15,240 Speaker 7: looking into it and really appreciate it. Well. 300 00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:18,920 Speaker 1: Nick's subdued reaction is to be expected. As a subdued 301 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:22,920 Speaker 1: Canadian myself, I can tell the news hurts, but being 302 00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:25,720 Speaker 1: the kind of person who never wants to burden, Nick 303 00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:36,439 Speaker 1: shows more concern for my disappointment than his own. Before 304 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:39,920 Speaker 1: this whole undertaking, Ontario could exist in a gray zone, 305 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,400 Speaker 1: Nick could believe he was hearing his brother. Now that 306 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:46,160 Speaker 1: that's been taken away from him, he's lost his place 307 00:19:46,240 --> 00:19:49,840 Speaker 1: to mourn. But maybe there's another way to provide Nick 308 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:53,399 Speaker 1: with such a space. And so I brainstorm ideas for 309 00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 1: a new Sonic memorial. Maybe I could get a remix 310 00:19:57,040 --> 00:19:59,680 Speaker 1: from that guy Devin, whom I think I already mentioned. 311 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:05,160 Speaker 1: What about offers my producer Khalila, that other musical act 312 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:10,440 Speaker 1: Chris liked. Do you mean Devin, I ask no, She says, 313 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:17,959 Speaker 1: the erbalizer Khalila is contradicting me. Isn't due to insubordination alone. 314 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: She's referencing a detail from that story about Chris's meeting 315 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:25,720 Speaker 1: Bonobo at the Ottawa Jazz Festival. Nick had mentioned that 316 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:29,240 Speaker 1: when Chris first slipped backstage, he ran into another. 317 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:31,800 Speaker 4: Group and He's like, Hey, can you guys tell me 318 00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:33,719 Speaker 4: where Bonobo is? Do I really want to meet him? 319 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:34,440 Speaker 4: He's my favorite. 320 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:37,440 Speaker 1: One of the men in the group turned to Chris 321 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:40,160 Speaker 1: and said, in a pronounced British accent. 322 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 4: Banobo, like, fuck Bonobo? 323 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 1: Where the herbalizer, the erbalizer? Pottymouth Banobo? Hating the erbalizer. 324 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 1: The erbalizer would go on to become another one of 325 00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:56,120 Speaker 1: Chris's all time favorites and Nick's as well. And so 326 00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 1: I email an address I find online and explain Nick's situation, 327 00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 1: and then I make my request. Maybe the Herbalizer could 328 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:16,440 Speaker 1: create a song that features Chris's beatboxing. Whereas I'd spent 329 00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 1: months trying to get anyone even remotely associated with Bonobo 330 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:23,240 Speaker 1: to respond I get an email from the Erbalizer that 331 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,919 Speaker 1: same day. It's from the band's co creator, Jake Werry, 332 00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:31,120 Speaker 1: who explains that while the Herbalizer is now defunct, he's 333 00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 1: working on a new project with a new partner. He 334 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:36,199 Speaker 1: tells me they'd be up to hear more about the idea. 335 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 1: So a few days later, I get on a video 336 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:43,920 Speaker 1: call with James Moss aka DJ Sterling Moss and Jake 337 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:47,440 Speaker 1: Werry aka The Herbalizer. 338 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:50,120 Speaker 8: With British and we say the Herbalize us sorry today, 339 00:21:50,359 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 8: an h you know none of this Herbalizer. Now look 340 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:55,800 Speaker 8: look here, oh boy, this is the bloody. 341 00:21:55,560 --> 00:22:00,439 Speaker 1: Herbalizer Herbalizer, Okay. Jake has the vibe of a character 342 00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:03,480 Speaker 1: from a Guy Ritchie film, the ex rugby player who 343 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:06,040 Speaker 1: works as an enforcer for a loan shark played by 344 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:11,200 Speaker 1: Jason Statham. You know, scary, but he is well within 345 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,040 Speaker 1: his right to be tearing me a new one. I 346 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 1: apologize for the faux pas. 347 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:17,119 Speaker 8: Oh, I'm minded kidding. 348 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:27,640 Speaker 1: I loved it. Sure, I've produced radio stories, but I've 349 00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:30,640 Speaker 1: never once produced a song, not even one of those 350 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:35,040 Speaker 1: public radio premium ones. Ira Glass and Peter Segel singing 351 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,080 Speaker 1: a parody version of Biggie and Puff Daddy's more money, 352 00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:42,520 Speaker 1: more problems, but with lyrics about how your money solves problems, 353 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:48,200 Speaker 1: problems inherent to sustaining important journalism. So, with neither musical 354 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:51,639 Speaker 1: training nor the slightest idea what I'm doing, I start 355 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:55,960 Speaker 1: music producing, offering suggestions for the vibe I'm going for. 356 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:00,399 Speaker 1: Elegiic might be overstating it, but like allowing some of 357 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:02,399 Speaker 1: that feeling of loss into it. 358 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:05,920 Speaker 3: Or you know, I think that the way that he 359 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:09,960 Speaker 3: beat boxes is not wistful. The story might be, but 360 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:11,800 Speaker 3: that's not the why that he performed. 361 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:12,400 Speaker 5: Yeah, I was just. 362 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:18,200 Speaker 1: Thinking wistful beatboxing. What was I thinking? James and Jake 363 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:20,879 Speaker 1: are well within their rights to be tearing me yet 364 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:21,960 Speaker 1: another new one. 365 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:26,280 Speaker 8: It should be more like a celebratory, positive, happy thing. 366 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:30,080 Speaker 8: It should be about him living on through the music. 367 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:33,160 Speaker 8: But I think to see what happens, rather than trying 368 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:36,159 Speaker 8: to force it to go in a direction, just just 369 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 8: let that, let the vibe happen. Man. 370 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:44,320 Speaker 1: Throughout our conversation, my mind keeps turning back to one question. 371 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 1: Why would two popular, successful musicians be so amenable to 372 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 1: talking to a first time music producer like myself. James 373 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,440 Speaker 1: has performed for crowds that have numbered in the hundreds 374 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:59,240 Speaker 1: of thousands, and Jake has had songs featured in Hollywood films. 375 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:02,359 Speaker 1: Why would they entertain a request to write a whole 376 00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:06,240 Speaker 1: piece of music honoring someone they don't even know. But 377 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:08,640 Speaker 1: it won't be long before the answer to my question 378 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 1: is revealed, And in the meantime, when I tell Nick 379 00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:14,000 Speaker 1: the idea, he's thrilled. 380 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:22,000 Speaker 9: Walking through a really nice suburb of London, Oh my 381 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:22,840 Speaker 9: way to see Jake. 382 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 1: In June, Nick travels to England to see family, but 383 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:29,560 Speaker 1: knowing Jake lives in London and being such a big fan, 384 00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,680 Speaker 1: Nick nervously asks me if Jake might want to meet up. 385 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:35,080 Speaker 1: I figure it's not a bad idea for the two 386 00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,080 Speaker 1: of them to get to know each other. It might 387 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:39,800 Speaker 1: even help the song. So I asked Jake if he'd 388 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:43,080 Speaker 1: be open to it, and once again Jake surprises me. 389 00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,640 Speaker 1: Not only does he agree, but he invites Nick over 390 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 1: to his home. 391 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:52,160 Speaker 9: It's lovely little street. It's not where i'd imagine Jake 392 00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:53,320 Speaker 9: of the Herbalizer to live. 393 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:56,680 Speaker 1: Nick records the visit and tells me about it later. 394 00:24:57,040 --> 00:25:00,800 Speaker 4: There's a little nerve wracking walking up there. Hey, Jake, 395 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 4: it's good, eh man, and this is surreal. That means 396 00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:06,320 Speaker 4: you have to say, honestly, I. 397 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 8: Wake up in the morning, I put my pants on 398 00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:08,560 Speaker 8: just like you. 399 00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:09,440 Speaker 2: Yeah. 400 00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:11,640 Speaker 7: I think I was a bit intimidated both it being 401 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,600 Speaker 7: someone who I kind of admire, who's music especially I 402 00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:16,840 Speaker 7: mean I admire, and then also just like the fact 403 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:19,320 Speaker 7: that they're British and you know, have that you know, 404 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,760 Speaker 7: different sense of humor and a bit of an edge 405 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,399 Speaker 7: to them and stuff. When I was here visiting my cousin, 406 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 7: he's like a diehard always sister. 407 00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:31,760 Speaker 1: Okay, right, Jake ushers Nick into the house and doesn't 408 00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:35,879 Speaker 1: bother standing on ceremony. Almost the second Nicks inside, before 409 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:39,160 Speaker 1: he's even positioned his microphone, Jake gets right into it. 410 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:42,760 Speaker 8: So how long is it since your brother poss uh? 411 00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:46,960 Speaker 4: Two thousand and six? I think, so, okay, I want 412 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 4: one two thousand and four. 413 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 1: My wife died in two thousand and four, Jake says. 414 00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,320 Speaker 1: And this, it turns out, is the reason why Jake's 415 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:59,200 Speaker 1: been so open to Nick. He relates to him. Around 416 00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:02,480 Speaker 1: the same time Nick lost Chris, Jake lost his wife Mary, 417 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:06,600 Speaker 1: also unexpectedly and also tragically, off. 418 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,320 Speaker 8: Of the plane going to jailing Popeans and I got 419 00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:11,960 Speaker 8: a call from my nigh by saying get to the hospital. 420 00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:12,640 Speaker 5: Case hospital. 421 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 1: The neighbor had heard Jake's two sons, only four and 422 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 1: five at the time, crying next door. An hour later, 423 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 1: the kids were still crying. 424 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:24,840 Speaker 8: She heard my little one say it's a pillow under 425 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:25,240 Speaker 8: her head. 426 00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:28,439 Speaker 1: It was then the neighbor jumped over the back fence 427 00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:32,600 Speaker 1: and found Mary lying on the floor dead. Mary had 428 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:35,879 Speaker 1: been emptying the dishwasher, hanging the utensils up on a 429 00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:39,400 Speaker 1: rack when she suddenly collapsed. It would take a few 430 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,159 Speaker 1: days to work out what had happened, but it seems 431 00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:44,679 Speaker 1: to screw on the utensil rack had connected with a 432 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:49,040 Speaker 1: live wire under the wall. Mary was electrocuted. It was 433 00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:51,159 Speaker 1: a freak accident, amazing. 434 00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 8: Mary was really tough, but I had two little kids 435 00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:57,280 Speaker 8: and so it has a testament to my love to her. 436 00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:59,920 Speaker 8: So I'm not going to fucking destroy me. Yeah, the 437 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:00,920 Speaker 8: best style I can. 438 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:01,679 Speaker 3: Like. 439 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,600 Speaker 7: I was essentially a stranger walking into his home and 440 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:06,800 Speaker 7: he told me his life story within five minutes, which 441 00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:09,400 Speaker 7: is admirable. You know something that I wish, I really 442 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,520 Speaker 7: wish I did have more the confidence just to be open, 443 00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:14,959 Speaker 7: just to be brutally open with everyone. 444 00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:15,240 Speaker 3: Well. 445 00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:17,920 Speaker 1: Nick often worries that talking about his grief might be 446 00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:21,280 Speaker 1: a burden to others. With Jake knowing he's been through 447 00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:25,160 Speaker 1: something similar, that burden disappeared, and so Nick was more 448 00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:28,280 Speaker 1: open than he usually is. He and Jay chatted about 449 00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 1: their respective losses. 450 00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,160 Speaker 7: There's something he said at one point that really stuck 451 00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:34,399 Speaker 7: with me. This like, you know, once you hit a 452 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 7: certain you know, a certain low point, you just can't 453 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:38,639 Speaker 7: get any lower than that, you know, you kind of 454 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:42,000 Speaker 7: bottom out. And and I related to that. Despite the 455 00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:45,240 Speaker 7: fact that on paper his hardship seriously pelt Weigh's mind, 456 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:48,680 Speaker 7: you know it, it felt like I've been where he's been. 457 00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:58,720 Speaker 7: He guys the most lovely little backyard with a cherry 458 00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:02,120 Speaker 7: tree in it and a few cherries, and my. 459 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 8: Answer check clumps. There's a fucking pain growing your own vegetables. 460 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 7: And then in the back backyard there's this studio, which 461 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,320 Speaker 7: is like also equally magical. It's a big, big shed, 462 00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:17,000 Speaker 7: got everything that's got a full drunkit inscene, collection of vinyl, 463 00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:18,919 Speaker 7: all sorts of other instruments. 464 00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:20,600 Speaker 8: That's one of my favorite ones. 465 00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:30,120 Speaker 1: In the studio, Jake plays Nick some of the things 466 00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:33,720 Speaker 1: he's been working on. As they continue to talk, I've had. 467 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:39,560 Speaker 8: Some fucking down, down down moments, days, weeks, months, years, 468 00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:43,400 Speaker 8: and music has definitely really been very cathartic for me. 469 00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:46,920 Speaker 1: When he was at his lowest, Jake couldn't bring himself 470 00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:49,320 Speaker 1: to make any music at all. It was a drought 471 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 1: that lasted years. But lately he's been on a tear. 472 00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 1: He tells Nick about a night last January, just after 473 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 1: leaving the studio two. 474 00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 8: In the morning, I was pretty high and went to 475 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:02,320 Speaker 8: bed and I was just playing the tracks on my 476 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:06,000 Speaker 8: phone on repeat. I was just like, I found myself 477 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:09,480 Speaker 8: chuckling aloud to myself with this like deep belly laugh, 478 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:14,960 Speaker 8: with this profound sense of just joy that the music 479 00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:17,760 Speaker 8: I was listening to sounded fantastic, and the realization that 480 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:18,760 Speaker 8: I had made it. 481 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:20,280 Speaker 1: I just couldn't believe it. 482 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:24,480 Speaker 8: So this sounds amazing, and I've made it. 483 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:29,920 Speaker 1: Jake's collaborator James, stops by to also meet Nick, and 484 00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 1: Nick tells him about that fateful meeting backstage at the 485 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:34,080 Speaker 1: Ottawa Jazz Fest. 486 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 10: Noble Worth of Herbalizer, and that's a fair responded it. 487 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:51,480 Speaker 4: I mean, he made me a Keish. 488 00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:54,760 Speaker 7: In all fairness, it was a microwave Keish, but it 489 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 7: was a very good microwave. 490 00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:56,320 Speaker 1: Keish. 491 00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:01,600 Speaker 7: Threw together a little salad fa We made keish and 492 00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:03,479 Speaker 7: salad in his backyard, and I think that was one 493 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:05,840 Speaker 7: of those real moments where it's like, you know, I'm 494 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,440 Speaker 7: not particularly religious, but if Chris were watching down on 495 00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,000 Speaker 7: me in that moment, he'd be having the laugh that 496 00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,240 Speaker 7: I'm having Kish with the fucking herbalizer. 497 00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:15,000 Speaker 5: Yeah. 498 00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:18,440 Speaker 7: If Chris could see this, he'd think it's insanely cool. 499 00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,960 Speaker 1: Nick is a husband, a new dad, But no matter 500 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,920 Speaker 1: how life moves along, and no matter how old he gets, 501 00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:29,600 Speaker 1: it'll always continue to think of Chris as the cool 502 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:34,240 Speaker 1: older brother, his hero, and eating Kish with the fucking herbalizer. 503 00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:36,560 Speaker 1: Chris would definitely approve. 504 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:45,080 Speaker 8: We're gonna have to go to train. 505 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,560 Speaker 7: At the end of all this, Jake offered to drive 506 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,800 Speaker 7: me to my train to the airport, which was so 507 00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 7: so nice of him, and I honestly I don't think 508 00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 7: I would have made my flight if it wasn't for that. 509 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:00,280 Speaker 4: Thanks again, man so much for all this. 510 00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:06,720 Speaker 7: The moral of the story is, indeed, fuck Binopo verb Flaser. 511 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:21,800 Speaker 8: Hey Hey, Hi, Nick, Hey, how's it going. 512 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 5: It's good. 513 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 4: I miss you guys. 514 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 1: Three months after they bonded with Nick. That day in London, 515 00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 1: Jake and James get back in touch and they've made 516 00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:35,200 Speaker 1: a song, a song featuring Chris's beatboxing. So we all 517 00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:38,280 Speaker 1: get on a call together to listen. Okay, here we go, 518 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: sona up Nick. The track is called We Are the Paradox. 519 00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:03,120 Speaker 5: Twitch. 520 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,560 Speaker 3: You know, we wanted to build something around your brother. 521 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:14,560 Speaker 3: He's the engine, and I had this really real feeling 522 00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 3: towards the end. It was like, you know, he's back. 523 00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:21,400 Speaker 3: He's here now and it's great to work with him, 524 00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:22,840 Speaker 3: even though he's not here. 525 00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:28,440 Speaker 1: Leaving Jake's one day, James said he had this lyric 526 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,320 Speaker 1: rattling around in his head. Put the beat in the box. 527 00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: So they added it to the song. 528 00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 3: And there's a lyric that says, cut the phone, stop 529 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:39,040 Speaker 3: the clocks, which is a reference to a W. H. 530 00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 3: Jordan poem called funeral Blues. It's an odes to a 531 00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:55,720 Speaker 3: lost loved one. We are the Paradox, which you can 532 00:32:55,960 --> 00:33:00,280 Speaker 3: interpret however you like. It will mean when it means 533 00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:03,479 Speaker 3: to you as it means for what it means to us. 534 00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:22,320 Speaker 1: Later, Nick also plays the song for his dad, unbelievable. 535 00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:48,600 Speaker 8: Twitch and then at the end everything drops out and 536 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:52,280 Speaker 8: it's kind of like sending Chris back to back to 537 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:54,520 Speaker 8: the world that he's in now, so kind of everything 538 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:57,720 Speaker 8: fades out and then Chris kind of goes to the 539 00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:12,480 Speaker 8: distance as well. It's it's saying goodbye again. Sorry. 540 00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:14,400 Speaker 4: Just incredible. 541 00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:17,279 Speaker 7: To have that much life and energy in the track 542 00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:19,240 Speaker 7: was something Chris would have been happy about. 543 00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:21,080 Speaker 5: You know, I don't know. 544 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:24,360 Speaker 4: It just feels right. It feels right, and I'm glad 545 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,879 Speaker 4: to feel like like it's mine. 546 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:32,840 Speaker 1: We're all a mess of paradoxes, believing in things we 547 00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:36,440 Speaker 1: know can't be true, missing the dead, but also whunwilling 548 00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:40,200 Speaker 1: to talk about them. We walk around carrying feelings too 549 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:44,560 Speaker 1: complicated and contradictory to express. When it all becomes too 550 00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:47,560 Speaker 1: big and words aren't enough to help get it all out, 551 00:34:48,520 --> 00:35:18,960 Speaker 1: there's always music. This episode of Heavyweight was produced by 552 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,799 Speaker 1: senior producer Khalila Holt and me Jonathan Goldstein, along with 553 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 1: Mohey mcgauker. Our supervising producer is Stevie Lane. Special thanks 554 00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:30,239 Speaker 1: to Chris's parents, Steve and Stephanie, as well as to 555 00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:34,160 Speaker 1: Emily Condon, Steve Marsh Liz Fulton, Max Green, Ellen Frankman, 556 00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:38,799 Speaker 1: Natalie Russell, Alex Bloomberg, and Jackie Cohen. Bobby Lord mixed 557 00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,680 Speaker 1: the episode with original music by Christine Fellows, John K. 558 00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:46,359 Speaker 1: Samson and he himself, Bobby Lord. James and Jake's new 559 00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,799 Speaker 1: group is called The Brilliant. Keep an eye out for 560 00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:51,680 Speaker 1: them in twenty twenty three, and in the meantime, check 561 00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:55,279 Speaker 1: out our own Brilliant, Christine Fellows' new album, Stuff We 562 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: All Get. Additional music credits can be found on our website, 563 00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:02,640 Speaker 1: gimlipmedia dot com. Slash Heavyweight. Our theme song is by 564 00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,120 Speaker 1: The Weaker Thans courtesy of Epitaph Records. Follow us on 565 00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:09,439 Speaker 1: Twitter at Heavyweight or email us at Heavyweight at gimbletmedia 566 00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:13,640 Speaker 1: dot com. This is our fiftieth episode. Next week fifty 567 00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:17,400 Speaker 1: one is our final episode of the season and if 568 00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:20,920 Speaker 1: I'm not mistaken, I believe it is our longest episode yet. 569 00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:22,760 Speaker 1: So see you then. 570 00:36:32,080 --> 00:37:05,000 Speaker 5: Twitch cut got the. 571 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:28,320 Speaker 11: Look the trap look down. 572 00:37:28,239 --> 00:37:31,240 Speaker 5: The part Then drop. 573 00:37:38,320 --> 00:38:12,240 Speaker 12: Boss what trop trop. 574 00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:27,440 Speaker 11: Wijn the drop look Come on the particle, the Trop 575 00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:49,640 Speaker 11: down the particle, the trap, moss in the mossssch moss 576 00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:54,560 Speaker 11: in the moss. 577 00:38:55,040 --> 00:39:06,120 Speaker 5: Twitch twists. 578 00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 13: H twork, she was, she was, she was, she wash, 579 00:39:23,719 --> 00:39:27,480 Speaker 13: she was, she was. 580 00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:30,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm being foxing even he loots. 581 00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:37,239 Speaker 13: Yeah, be being boxing even heavy loots. 582 00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,560 Speaker 1: I'm I'm I'm being foxing.