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Speaker 1: Morning. Everybody is DJ n V Charlomagne the gout. We

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Speaker 1: all to Breakfast Club. We got our co host with

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Speaker 1: us this morning, Miss Jess Hilarius. That's right, and we

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Speaker 1: have our special guests first time here. Yes, thank you

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Speaker 1: for joining us, Laverne Cox Welcome, thank you, thank you,

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Speaker 1: thank you. I am so excited to be at the

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Speaker 1: Breakfast Club. You have become such an important space for

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Speaker 1: the culture on so many different levels, politically, in terms

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Speaker 1: of music, and it's just lovely to be here in

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Speaker 1: all of my multitudes. Yeah, thank you. That's what Jason said.

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Speaker 1: That's what Jason said said we had reached out, So

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Speaker 1: we reached out last year when my barbie came out,

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Speaker 1: I was like, it would be great to come onto

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Speaker 1: the Breakfast Club and talk about the Laverne Cots barbie.

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Speaker 1: I'm the first trans person to have a barbie created

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Speaker 1: by and I thought it would be great, and I

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Speaker 1: sold it would block because and I and I think

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Speaker 1: this audience is really valuable. And I think this audience, um,

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Speaker 1: I was, I was talking to Jason about this, and

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Speaker 1: I think there's there's there's I don't like to say

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Speaker 1: there's white media and black media, but like a lot

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Speaker 1: of the work that I've done, the audiences have been diverse,

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Speaker 1: but a lot it's been a majority white audience. And

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Speaker 1: I'm working at e now and it's definitely a diverse

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Speaker 1: audience there, but there's this is a black audience and

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Speaker 1: I I'm black and I love being black, and this

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Speaker 1: black excellence is I'm doing things out here, and I

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Speaker 1: think that it's important for this audience to know that

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Speaker 1: that was about this because it's given black superhero. Thank you, okay,

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Speaker 1: thank you for it's this is so this is Manfrey

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Speaker 1: Terry Muglair. It's vantage is from his Fall Fall Um

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Speaker 1: nineteen eighty nine Buick Winter collection, obviously inspired by motorcycles,

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Speaker 1: inspired by cars. Terry mcglair actually has an exhibit at

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Speaker 1: Brooklyn Museum right now. If people will like this, there's

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Speaker 1: something in the exhibit that's similar to this. I collect

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Speaker 1: enters Terry muglare So yes, I'm glad you mentioned that.

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Speaker 1: You have to kind of see the whole stand up

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Speaker 1: sounds too rich for my blood. Listen my favorite pieces.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for asking I collect Muglair. I'm obsessed in

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Speaker 1: a good way. I think maybe unhealthy. Um, they should

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Speaker 1: be giving you free stuff a whole um because Megan

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Speaker 1: the Stallion has a line and planed b Mugler's suits

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Speaker 1: in my meetings, and she m in the video she's

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Speaker 1: wearing all Muglaire Now. Kasey Kadwalder is the executive director

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Speaker 1: of Muglair. Now, mister Muglair died who founded the company,

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Speaker 1: but it's run beautifully now by Casey um Burnby took

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Speaker 1: over here because he just knows Target and Walmart t

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Speaker 1: shirts Lair. The girls are wearing Muglaire, the boys are

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Speaker 1: wearing Muglaire. That non binary people are wearing Muglair. Feel

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Speaker 1: the fan, Anessey, Honey, and get into it. Learn it.

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Speaker 1: I get on the bike though, y'all just gonna wait

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Speaker 1: a movie. I ain't going I am not getting on

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Speaker 1: a bike. Years ago, when I was a waitress, so this,

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Speaker 1: I met this guy. I used to work at Coffee

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Speaker 1: Shopping Union Square. I remember Coffee Shopping Square. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I remember the coffee shop. I used to be a

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Speaker 1: waitress there and I met this guy. And like you know,

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Speaker 1: when I was a waitress, I was young, in my twenties.

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Speaker 1: I would meet guys at work. Yeah, and then the

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Speaker 1: dude and he waited for me get off from work

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Speaker 1: and he wanted to go hang out and he had

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Speaker 1: to hit a motorcycle and I was like, sweetie, I'm

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Speaker 1: not getting on this motorcycle. I was like, you can

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Speaker 1: pay for me for a cab and then we can

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Speaker 1: meet at the diner. Yeah. He got me a taxi

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Speaker 1: and we met at the diner. I was not getting

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Speaker 1: on that motorcycle. I had no interest now for a

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Speaker 1: movie role. I'll do almost anything for a movie roll.

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Speaker 1: So if someone wants to pay me, I'll get on

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Speaker 1: a motorcycle. Okay, yeah, I think one wants to pay me. That.

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Speaker 1: So many of us when you were acting on Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I told you when I first met you with the

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Speaker 1: iHeart Music Festival. He was backstage and I came up

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Speaker 1: with you and I was like, yo, I'm a fan.

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Speaker 1: I used to you know. I still love Oranges the

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Speaker 1: New Block. Thank you. So acting is what you really

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Speaker 1: really want to do, that's your passion. It absolutely is,

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Speaker 1: and I'm still acting. Um. Last year a lot of

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Speaker 1: people saw me Inventing Anna, which was a huge show

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Speaker 1: on Netflix. UM. I played Casey Duke in that. UM.

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Speaker 1: I have a guest spot in something that I can't

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Speaker 1: talk about yet, but it's really cool, and we're prepping

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Speaker 1: to do a show UM with Norman lear the legendary

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Speaker 1: Norman Leer, and I'll talk over here as well, UM

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Speaker 1: called Clean Slate. George Wallace, the legendary comedian, plays my Dad.

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Speaker 1: It's said in my hometown of Mobile, Alabama. It's a

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Speaker 1: comedy and it's about this woman who goes back home

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Speaker 1: and tries to reconnect with her dad after many years

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Speaker 1: of being away. So we start shooting that it's Havannah

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Speaker 1: next month. Oh my god, I don't think it's Eara

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Speaker 1: Ready for Norman Lea a comedy. Norman Liars the Jeffersons

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Speaker 1: and uh good Time, Well Ready in Time. One Day

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Speaker 1: to Time did really well, and he has he has

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Speaker 1: new shows. Norman is one hundred years old and he's

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Speaker 1: still producing shows and people are watching. So as long

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Speaker 1: as they watch, and we're gonna be as long as

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Speaker 1: they're watching. Yeah, Norman is amazing. He is. Getting to

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Speaker 1: know him and just being in a room with him

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Speaker 1: when we pitched the show to him ques just iconic.

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Speaker 1: We sat in the room with him for like ninety

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Speaker 1: minutes and after the meeting, he said he was ninety

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Speaker 1: six of them. He said, I learned more about life

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Speaker 1: in this last hour that I should have known that

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Speaker 1: I didn't know. And I'm so grateful. And we started

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Speaker 1: working together and pitching a show and it took years

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Speaker 1: and now here we are. I want to go back.

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Speaker 1: For people that don't know, this is Burncock's first time

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Speaker 1: on a breakfast class. So how did you get into acting?

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Speaker 1: What made you want to act? What got you into

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Speaker 1: that mind frame as a kid? Break it down. I've

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Speaker 1: I've always been a performer. So I started as a

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Speaker 1: dancer and during PEE. So I'm fifty years old, so

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Speaker 1: back in the day, right, but that's black. So back

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Speaker 1: in the day there was PEE physical education and during PE,

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Speaker 1: I would always dance and I would have I would

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Speaker 1: have music in my head and I would have characters

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Speaker 1: in my head and I would express these characters through movement.

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Speaker 1: And so I started studying dance in third grade. But

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Speaker 1: I always knew I wanted to act, that I would

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Speaker 1: transition to acting. And when I got to college, I

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Speaker 1: was a dance major at mary Mount Monhant College and

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Speaker 1: started acting there. I did my first play there. I

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Speaker 1: did a lot of stuff in that theater department there,

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Speaker 1: and just that was in the nineties. I was like,

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Speaker 1: I moved to New York in ninteen ninety three, so

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Speaker 1: I've been acting like since college and did my first

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Speaker 1: moving my senior year at Marymount in nineteen ninety s.

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Speaker 1: I knew that's what you wanted to do. I always knew,

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Speaker 1: but then I had. I finally accepted being trans when

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Speaker 1: I was in nineteen ninety eight and started transitioning, and

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Speaker 1: I was like, well, they're aren't any transactors, so I

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Speaker 1: don't know if I can't really be an actor and

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Speaker 1: be trans. And so I went to fashion school for

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Speaker 1: three semesters. I went to f I T and then

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Speaker 1: I was like, I don't really want to do this.

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Speaker 1: I love fashionbon I don't want to do it. And

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Speaker 1: then like, I did a few more movies, just auditioned

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Speaker 1: and got a few dependent films, and then I started

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Speaker 1: training seriously with this woman named Susan Batts and who

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Speaker 1: was an iconic acting coach. She's trained Oprah and Juliet

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Speaker 1: Bnosh and Jamie Fox everybody, and she has a great

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Speaker 1: studio here in New York. And I got really serious

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Speaker 1: about acting and I just went for it, and it

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Speaker 1: took years and years and years, but finally, basically twenty

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Speaker 1: years after I moved to New York, I got my

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Speaker 1: big break in Orange New Black. That was auditioning for that,

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Speaker 1: because you know, at first, I'm sure people didn't necessarily

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Speaker 1: SA so I don't know if Laverne fits this or

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Speaker 1: how difficult was that being turned down. I mean, it

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Speaker 1: was years of nots. I mean the reason why it

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Speaker 1: took twenty years is that there were no roles for me.

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Speaker 1: So at Susan's studio, she would have industry nights and

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Speaker 1: I would audition for casting directors and agents and they'd

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Speaker 1: be like, you're very talented, but there's no roles for

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Speaker 1: you your trans It's like, maybe you should move to

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Speaker 1: la And so it was. It was constantly that, and

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Speaker 1: every once in a while trans something or drag thing

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Speaker 1: would come up. And a lot of times in the

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Speaker 1: beginning when I was auditioning, it would say drag queen,

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Speaker 1: but I would just go in and they didn't know

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Speaker 1: the difference between drag and trans and I would book

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Speaker 1: or I wouldn't book. And so for years there just

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Speaker 1: weren't roles for me. And so when the Orange's New

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Speaker 1: Black Audition came along. I actually was going to stop acting.

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Speaker 1: I turned forty that year, so this was eleven years ago.

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Speaker 1: It was twenty twelve. I turned forty. The big break

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Speaker 1: hadn't happened. I was like, well, girl, you're forty, you're black,

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Speaker 1: you're trans. Who do you think you're kidding? Thinking you

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Speaker 1: can do this? And I was studying from my gr

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Speaker 1: e to go to grad school. Um, I was in

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Speaker 1: student loan dead. It was a mess. Girl. I was

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Speaker 1: in renterrears like I was in a payment plan to

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Speaker 1: avoid eviction from my apartment. It's a girl, right when

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Speaker 1: I said, I love that girl. Girl is ginger neutral.

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Speaker 1: So girl is ginger neutral, like a lot of people say, dude,

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Speaker 1: and this ginger neutral girl is ginger neutral for me.

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Speaker 1: So everybody's girl time. So it was so. But the

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Speaker 1: great thing about when the Orange Audition it happened is

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Speaker 1: that even though it was a struggle, I had been

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Speaker 1: an acting class every week because I loved it. And

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Speaker 1: this is what I say to people. If you want

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Speaker 1: to be an actor and you don't love it, you

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Speaker 1: should do something else because you're going to be too old,

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Speaker 1: too young, too short, too thin to trans do black

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Speaker 1: too white, and so all the rejection, I kept loving it,

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Speaker 1: and so I kept even though I kind of gave

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Speaker 1: up hope. I kept going to class because I love acting.

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Speaker 1: And so when the audition came along, I did the

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Speaker 1: one audition, I booked it. And then this juicy role

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Speaker 1: came along, and this beautiful writing, and I was prepared.

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Speaker 1: I was ready because I had trained, I had done

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Speaker 1: independent films for free, student films for free. I did

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Speaker 1: everything I could to get experienced, and so when this

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Speaker 1: opportunity came, I was ready. And I and I love

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Speaker 1: the Oprah sets this as this thing is luck. Luck

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Speaker 1: is only when preparation meets opportunity. And when my opportunity came,

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Speaker 1: I was prepared. And I'm still here, and I still

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Speaker 1: love what I do, and I get to do so

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Speaker 1: many different things now. I love that I'm an actor,

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Speaker 1: but I also get to host rick carpets and I

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Speaker 1: have an interview show. It's amazing. That's what I want

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Speaker 1: to ask. Do you like one more than the other?

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Speaker 1: Do you like being in a live red carpet space

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Speaker 1: more than you do like what? Because because then we

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Speaker 1: get to see your personality, we get to see like

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Speaker 1: how you bond with other celebrities and like certain questions

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Speaker 1: and stuff that you ask, like do you like being

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Speaker 1: in that? I love it. I didn't think I would

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Speaker 1: when they and when he approached me, I was like, well,

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Speaker 1: I hosted their countdown show in twenty twenty and had

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Speaker 1: a lot of fun doing it, and then they asked

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Speaker 1: me to, you know, be their new red carpets And

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Speaker 1: it's like, do I want to do this? And will

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Speaker 1: people forget that I act? And acting has always been that.

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Speaker 1: Even though I've always said a lot of different things,

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Speaker 1: I know that I'm an actor first and that's what

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Speaker 1: I prioritize and that's why people even care about me.

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Speaker 1: But I love it. I love it. I love it

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Speaker 1: because we get to have fun on the red carpet.

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Speaker 1: I love the fashion piece of it and we laugh,

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Speaker 1: but we also can get to have space at the Grammars.

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Speaker 1: Recently I interviewed Machine Gun Kelly and he came to

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Speaker 1: the carpet really vulnerable. It was intense. I was like,

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Speaker 1: what's going on here? It was a different energy than too,

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Speaker 1: and he was he was really emotional. He found out

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Speaker 1: in the car on the way way there that he

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Speaker 1: had lost the Grammy and he was planning to win,

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Speaker 1: and he had built up Basically, he said that he

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Speaker 1: had built up like all of this. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: prove people wrong and I'm going to be valid now

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Speaker 1: because I've won this Grammy and he didn't win it,

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Speaker 1: and he actually had the courage to be vulnerable and

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Speaker 1: admit that and on live television, and it was a

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Speaker 1: beautiful raw moment. And I love being the whole space

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Speaker 1: for that. I have a show with E called if

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Speaker 1: We're Being Honest that's on Peacock and it's an interview show.

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Speaker 1: When I get the whole space for a complexity, for

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Speaker 1: people's humanity. We laugh, we cry at this great interview

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Speaker 1: with Joe Ky where we like talked about him kind

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Speaker 1: of repeating a pattern that his father sort of you know,

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Speaker 1: walked out on him. And then he talks in his

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Speaker 1: book about how he kind of like wasn't there for

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Speaker 1: his kid and how he repeated that pattern, but then

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Speaker 1: how he interrupted it and he was in tears thinking

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Speaker 1: about this mother. There's this beautiful moment in his book

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Speaker 1: where he talks about going to he was in conflict

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Speaker 1: with his ex wife who was a father of his child.

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Speaker 1: And he goes and she's like, she's broken open a

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Speaker 1: piggy bank and she's like, you know, looking, you know,

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Speaker 1: looking for change to buy food. And he's like, what

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Speaker 1: are you doing. She's like, I don't have enough money

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Speaker 1: to buy food for your child. And he saw it

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Speaker 1: in that moment. They had been fighting. He saw in

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Speaker 1: this moment and then he broke down and he's like,

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Speaker 1: I'm never gonna let you go through this again. And

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Speaker 1: it's such a powerful moment in the book. And I

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Speaker 1: asked him about that moment, and it was a moment

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Speaker 1: where he had been repeating the pattern of his absentee father,

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Speaker 1: but he broke that pattern in that moment. And this

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Speaker 1: is the shit I love. This is the stuff I

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Speaker 1: love where we can like have real moments to interrupt

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Speaker 1: patterns of historical trauma. You talk about that all the time.

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Speaker 1: I love moments when we can have revelations and understand

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Speaker 1: something new about ourselves with the guests them speaking with

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Speaker 1: and then hopefully the audience. And so I love being

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Speaker 1: an actor, but I feel like that's it's the same

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Speaker 1: thing as an actor. As an actor, what we do

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Speaker 1: is we mind the depths of who we are as

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Speaker 1: human beings and hopefully create empathy for these characters so

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Speaker 1: that people can learn about themselves. Ultimately, people don't watch

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Speaker 1: television to you know, watch you. They watch to see

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Speaker 1: themselves to learn about themselves. And so in all the

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Speaker 1: work that I get to do, it's all really about that.

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Speaker 1: It's a space of healing. You're always sending healing energy

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Speaker 1: to everyone, and we need a lot of healing in

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Speaker 1: this world and not what my job, I feel is

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Speaker 1: as an artist and as a public person is to

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Speaker 1: create these spaces of healing. That's why I encourage therapy

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Speaker 1: so much, because I feel like it interrupts those patterns

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Speaker 1: that you're talking about good therapy. I've been in therapy

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Speaker 1: since two thousand, for twenty three years. Sometimes people like

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Speaker 1: does it dot work? Why are you still in there

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Speaker 1: for twenty three years? And I may just still needed

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Speaker 1: things that happen. It's a process. It's not like healing

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Speaker 1: isn't like I got it and it's done. You know,

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Speaker 1: when the pandemic happened in twenty twenty, I was just

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Speaker 1: stuff hit me that I didn't even and I've been

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Speaker 1: in therapy obviously, but at that point for twenty years.

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Speaker 1: But like the voices when you're by yourself all the time,

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Speaker 1: those voices that like tell me you that you're not enough,

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Speaker 1: that they come back and you and you had to

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Speaker 1: do a different level of work. But what's so exciting

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Speaker 1: about the work that I've done in therapy over the

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Speaker 1: years is that I can hold space in an interview

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Speaker 1: for complexity and for someone being raw. I can hold

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Speaker 1: space in the romantic relationships and my friendships that I

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Speaker 1: can that love. It's in my life right now and

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Speaker 1: I can show up for it. You know. I was

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Speaker 1: talking to a dear friend of mine and she was

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Speaker 1: and she was I was asking you about her love life,

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Speaker 1: and she was like, I need to be in therapy

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Speaker 1: before I try to be in another relationship. She was like,

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Speaker 1: I think the last guy was a good guy, but

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Speaker 1: I didn't know how to handle it. And I think

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Speaker 1: so often this good thing might come to us romantically,

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Speaker 1: professionally and we might not be able to receive it.

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Speaker 1: Do you remember that moment, This is such an iconic

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Speaker 1: moment for me, when um Oprah was ending her talk

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Speaker 1: show and she interviewed Eyan La van Zande. Do we

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Speaker 1: remember this moment? We should go and watched when they

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Speaker 1: had their healing moment and and Oprah was like, because

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Speaker 1: Oprah was like, I did you understand I was sat

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Speaker 1: in the audience that I had you on stage and um,

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Speaker 1: I won't go in through the whole history of but

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Speaker 1: they had a falling out and Oprah was like, did

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Speaker 1: you not understand that? How I you know? I trusted

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Speaker 1: you on my show to beyond you know, be on

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Speaker 1: stage in my show. She and Janna said I couldn't

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Speaker 1: receive it. She was like, I was broken, I'm ghetto,

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Speaker 1: I was this, and then she literal She said it

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Speaker 1: like four times and she was almost in tears. I

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Speaker 1: couldn't receive it. And the last time she said I

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Speaker 1: couldn't receive the Oprah's like, I get it. I get it.

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Speaker 1: So we have to get ourselves ready to receive the

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Speaker 1: blessings that the universe has for us. Waiting for us

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Speaker 1: in therapy is a great way to do that. I

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Speaker 1: think therapy um for people people are struggling with addiction.

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Speaker 1: I think if you can't afford therapy, there are twelve

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Speaker 1: step programs out there for people to go that are free,

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Speaker 1: and there's it's nice to not just drugs or alcohol.

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Speaker 1: There's codependency, UM twelve steps, there's um debtors anonymous girl,

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Speaker 1: go get your go, get your hell, girl, you can heal.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you about the red carbon thing

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Speaker 1: because I wanted to ask what did you learn in

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Speaker 1: the moment with Will and Jada, Like, after you received

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Speaker 1: a backlash and everything, what did you learn? Oh? Hey,

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Speaker 1: they um to be really brutally honest. I learned. I

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Speaker 1: learned a few things. I learned that the world was

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Speaker 1: not ready for the evolved relationship that they were presenting us.

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Speaker 1: Because when I, you know, I just jokingly said, you know,

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Speaker 1: we're looking for, you know, more entanglements. I love read

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Speaker 1: table talk. I love this mess. And people thought I

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Speaker 1: was being shady and like and I talked to Jada afterwards.

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Speaker 1: She was fine, she thought it was funny. But the

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Speaker 1: world interpreted it as mess. The world saw so much

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Speaker 1: of what they had put out about their relationship in

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Speaker 1: an open, honest way. They I feel like their intention

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Speaker 1: was for us to heal, for us to see a

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Speaker 1: different way to do relationships that wasn't like this traditional thing,

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Speaker 1: and the world made it into mess, and that the

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Speaker 1: world wasn't ready that it was constantly they were they

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Speaker 1: were the world was like wanting to make it into

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Speaker 1: something that they weren't giving us. And it also reminded

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Speaker 1: me that when you make your relationship, um public, it

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Speaker 1: becomes entertainment for people, and it's not They're not real people,

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Speaker 1: and so I'm going to keep my stuff private. Um.

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Speaker 1: So it was that piece of the entertainment pizza. But

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Speaker 1: it's also like, oh, the world isn't ready for this

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Speaker 1: evolved relationship that they presented us with, and that made

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Speaker 1: me sad. And I think it means that we just

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Speaker 1: have more work to do around letting go of um,

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Speaker 1: traditional heteronormative, monogamous ideas about what a relationship should look like.

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Speaker 1: I think everyone can do relationships on their own terms

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Speaker 1: and should do relationships on their own terms, and I

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Speaker 1: think they're doing that and the people just don't get it.

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Speaker 1: How did you deal with it with all the social

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Speaker 1: media and the backlash, and you know, because social media

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Speaker 1: would be a nasty place, they gave you a lot

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Speaker 1: of small There was oh my god, it was I

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Speaker 1: watched one video I won't say who I watched, and

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Speaker 1: the first thing went in and I was like, I'm

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Speaker 1: not watching anything else, so and I just didn't just

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Speaker 1: let were not even don't girl, No, I didn't, okay,

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Speaker 1: but I just stopped. I just stopped that you don't.

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Speaker 1: This has happened, luckily, I'm this has happened before when

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Speaker 1: I did when I did rock Here a picture show,

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Speaker 1: and when I was cast in that, and there was

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Speaker 1: just an outrage and an uproar. I just stopped watching

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Speaker 1: and stopped reading. I just didn't engage with it at all.

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Speaker 1: And I think that's what I have to do. I

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Speaker 1: have to just not engage with it and understand that

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Speaker 1: it's not about me. And I think it's hard to

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Speaker 1: feel misunderstood though when to feel that piece is very difficult.

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Speaker 1: But I have to remind myself who I am. I

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Speaker 1: have to remind myself what my intentions are and not engage.

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Speaker 1: But I also think there's it's tricky for me because

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Speaker 1: I also think one needs to be open for feedback.

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Speaker 1: One needs to be open to receive criticism when it's

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Speaker 1: in good faith. So that's what I have to balance

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Speaker 1: because I'm not above reproach and I've made mistakes. My

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Speaker 1: prayer today, my prayer every day is God, give me

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Speaker 1: permission to do this imperfectly and allow me to be

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Speaker 1: of service. So it's not it's not gonna be perfect,

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Speaker 1: and I'm a perfectionist in a bad way. So I

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Speaker 1: have to let go of that and hopefully I'll be

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Speaker 1: of service. And so I can't. I have to be

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Speaker 1: able to balance like getting getting critique from trustedsources that

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Speaker 1: elevates me and makes me better and holding myself accountable

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Speaker 1: and being held accountable. Right, we all have to do that,

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Speaker 1: but then not allowing trolls and people who don't have

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Speaker 1: the best of intentions and are operating in good faith

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Speaker 1: not letting that in. Yeah, I'm gonna be able to distinguish.

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Speaker 1: So I go through that still to this day. And

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Speaker 1: that's what I wanted to also ask you to so

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Speaker 1: I you know, being a comedian, we we often speak

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Speaker 1: on that nothing is off limits, you know what I'm saying,

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Speaker 1: Like we speak on things that you know, people in

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Speaker 1: this in these days these days and times may take

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Speaker 1: a total different way than we're trying to, you know,

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Speaker 1: put it out there. Has do you think that because

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Speaker 1: a comedian has a joke about LGBT that they're homophobic?

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Speaker 1: Like do you like, what are your thoughts on that?

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Speaker 1: Because I got a lot of jokes about the LGBT,

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Speaker 1: but I have a lot of jokes about straight people too. Yeah, everybody.

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Speaker 1: I think it's really complicated. I interviewed um Cameron Espizto

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Speaker 1: on my show if We're being honest, and Cameron's a

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Speaker 1: non binary stand up comic, and Cameron thinks you should

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Speaker 1: be able to joke about anything. But Cameron also said

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Speaker 1: that a lot of comedians who have problems who's saying

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Speaker 1: they're always being canceled and they can't aren't allowed to

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Speaker 1: joke anymore, aren't used to getting feedback. Cameron said, like,

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Speaker 1: since I've stepped since I stepped on a stage, Cameron's

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Speaker 1: assigned female at birth, it's non binary. Cameron is like,

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Speaker 1: ever since I stepped on the stage as a stand up,

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Speaker 1: I've been getting feedback. And Cameron said, you've probably been

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Speaker 1: getting feedback since you stepped on the public stage. And

427
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 1: these people, I think they're not used to getting feedback

428
00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:07,399
Speaker 1: and so feedback so so so there's that piece. And

429
00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:14,200
Speaker 1: I think too that one can say something or do

430
00:22:14,280 --> 00:22:18,840
Speaker 1: something that may be homophobic or racist and not be racist, right,

431
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:22,000
Speaker 1: But there's a difference between I am like a statement

432
00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:25,119
Speaker 1: of um Brene Brown distinguishers between shame and guilt is

433
00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:28,159
Speaker 1: shame is I am a mistake, and guilt is I

434
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:32,680
Speaker 1: made a mistake right. So I think that's an important

435
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:37,359
Speaker 1: distinction to make that someone can unknowingly right say something

436
00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:41,480
Speaker 1: or do something that's um that's transphobic and not be transphobic.

437
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:43,280
Speaker 1: I was on set for a show that I was

438
00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:47,480
Speaker 1: doing many years ago and M, one of my coworkers

439
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:49,720
Speaker 1: who I adore and we're still friends to this day,

440
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:51,800
Speaker 1: said the T word, the T word that ends with

441
00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:56,480
Speaker 1: a why. And I wasn't I wasn't upset by it,

442
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,080
Speaker 1: but I was like, I understood in that moment that

443
00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:01,560
Speaker 1: this my coworker didn't understand that a lot of trans

444
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:05,639
Speaker 1: people would take that as a slur. Yah. See, you

445
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 1: didn't know, and a lot of people don't know. And

446
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:12,119
Speaker 1: so I was like, girl, just so you know, I'm cool,

447
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 1: but a lot of transpolkes if you said that word

448
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:17,520
Speaker 1: would have a problem. And she was like, oh my god,

449
00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:19,639
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry. She sent me flowers.

450
00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:22,159
Speaker 1: It's like, girls, it's not that serious. No, she just

451
00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 1: didn't know. And I think we need to be able

452
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:28,880
Speaker 1: to give people grace when they don't know and give

453
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:34,920
Speaker 1: them space to evolve. And I'm not language police either.

454
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:37,560
Speaker 1: I'm not a language police either, but I think that

455
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:42,360
Speaker 1: things can be I think transphobia exists, and then there

456
00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:47,120
Speaker 1: are many comics who say really transphobic things. I don't

457
00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:50,600
Speaker 1: necessarily believe they are transphobic, but what they're doing is

458
00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 1: transphobic phobic. So it's just like something just like with racism, right,

459
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:56,720
Speaker 1: Like I could think somebody can do something racist or

460
00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:00,920
Speaker 1: say something racist, not necessarily intending it in a certain way.

461
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 1: They're worth that we might not even know are problematic

462
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:07,400
Speaker 1: and we just don't know, but it is racist, it

463
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,199
Speaker 1: is transphobic. So a thing can be a thing, and

464
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,320
Speaker 1: we can call a thing a thing. And for me,

465
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,920
Speaker 1: it's about people evolving, giving people space to evolve. I'm

466
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,800
Speaker 1: not into like canceling people in cancel culture doesn't really

467
00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:25,040
Speaker 1: about comedians though, because there is a difference between feedback

468
00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:27,640
Speaker 1: and backlash, and I think a lot of comedians think

469
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,439
Speaker 1: they're getting backlash and comedians thrive off of that, but

470
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:36,399
Speaker 1: actual feedback, like who's thriving off of it? Um that

471
00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:40,359
Speaker 1: can think of he loves he loves someone. I don't

472
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:46,080
Speaker 1: the transphobic and I wonder how much of it is

473
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:48,680
Speaker 1: actual feedback as opposed to backlash. Like there are people

474
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:50,879
Speaker 1: who will take the time to teach, you know, like

475
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:52,919
Speaker 1: a sloop like my man David Johns, he'll take the

476
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:55,200
Speaker 1: time to teach, but a lot of times they don't

477
00:24:55,240 --> 00:25:00,359
Speaker 1: feel like they're teaching. They're just upset. Yeah, And it's

478
00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:04,040
Speaker 1: I think it's a piece of like not being comfortable

479
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 1: getting feedback or wanting to. I mean, for you, it's

480
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:10,919
Speaker 1: a comic. I mean, I mean, have you been criticized

481
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:14,560
Speaker 1: your critique for some of your LGBTQ definitely, most definitely.

482
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:18,160
Speaker 1: But it made me. I was mad. I was very

483
00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,320
Speaker 1: upset because I'm like, how can you say I'm homophobic?

484
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,240
Speaker 1: Homophobic because of this and because of that? And then

485
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,160
Speaker 1: and then it comes to thing of like if you say,

486
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,280
Speaker 1: oh yo, you know my brother gay or I got

487
00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 1: a gay best friend, then they still put you in

488
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:37,280
Speaker 1: a box like well that's like that's like yeah, and

489
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:44,639
Speaker 1: which I hate what oh yeah, yeah, yeah. It's people

490
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:46,800
Speaker 1: always you know, say I was born a man and

491
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 1: all that, and I hate that. And how does that

492
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:50,720
Speaker 1: make you feel? How did it make you feel when

493
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 1: people when people as as as as a non trans woman.

494
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,720
Speaker 1: To be honest with you, I really do not get upset.

495
00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 1: I know I have that I don't. I don't get upset.

496
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:03,399
Speaker 1: I honestly have never got upset. I actually started putting

497
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,119
Speaker 1: it in my jokes. But it's other people that were

498
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 1: a lot of black women for a lot of black

499
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,119
Speaker 1: women get upset about that. Yeah, I'm gonna be totally

500
00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:14,720
Speaker 1: honest with you. No, I didn't get upset for that.

501
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:19,040
Speaker 1: I got upset that I called this this guy he

502
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:22,400
Speaker 1: was LGBT. He called me the T word that ended

503
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 1: with a why, And I called him the F word,

504
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,640
Speaker 1: and I felt like and and but it was blue,

505
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:30,680
Speaker 1: I said. I felt like, all right, slur for slur

506
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 1: and and he's like, oh, you know, everybody's like, you're

507
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,199
Speaker 1: not a part of the community. You can't say that.

508
00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:38,640
Speaker 1: It gives him the right to tell me that I'm

509
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 1: a T word, Like you didn't know. He was being smart.

510
00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:46,879
Speaker 1: He knew exactly that I was a woman, that you

511
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: know that I'm born a woman and a woman. But like,

512
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 1: I got mad that. I didn't get mad that he

513
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:56,200
Speaker 1: even called me that. I got upset because it's like, yo,

514
00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:57,960
Speaker 1: you called me that, and I can't call you this,

515
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: like I don't like that. I just I can't. I can't.

516
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:04,800
Speaker 1: I just couldn't get with that, Like, Yo, you hit

517
00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:06,919
Speaker 1: me below the belt and and you weren't saying it

518
00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 1: because you were you really thought that you said it

519
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 1: because you knew that something like oh yeah, there's a

520
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:16,080
Speaker 1: there's I think it's it was it Umm one of

521
00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 1: the city girls who just has a lyric about like

522
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 1: pretty like transgender, like we it's It shouldn't be an

523
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,960
Speaker 1: insult to say that someone I mean, look at me, right,

524
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 1: but it shouldn't be an insult to say that someone

525
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:34,840
Speaker 1: looks trans it's trans is beautiful, but right transit hashtag

526
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:38,959
Speaker 1: trans is beautiful. But let's not. Let's not like really

527
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:42,560
Speaker 1: like not look at how it was bought too, Like

528
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:44,600
Speaker 1: it was brought to me like he was being smart.

529
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:47,639
Speaker 1: It wasn't brought to oh you are pretty, and I

530
00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:50,360
Speaker 1: think it wasn't like, well, it's deep to me about that.

531
00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 1: Just historically, I love looking at history. There is a

532
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 1: history in America. I think this is why it's tricky

533
00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: for a lot of black women when just the exist

534
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:02,680
Speaker 1: since of trans women, particularly black trans women. But then

535
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: when non trans women are called trans or say they

536
00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 1: look trans. There's a whole history of discounting the womanhood

537
00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:11,320
Speaker 1: of black women in the United States of America. Wins

538
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 1: the journal Truth declared a I woman in eighteen fifty

539
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:19,919
Speaker 1: one in Ohio. She did that in the context of

540
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:22,679
Speaker 1: a system that said if you are black, then you're

541
00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 1: a man, and if you're a woman, you're a white woman.

542
00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:28,640
Speaker 1: And so she was invisibilized in that system. And there

543
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,560
Speaker 1: is a history of that in the United States. And

544
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:35,880
Speaker 1: black women have different bills and different bodies shapes, and

545
00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:40,080
Speaker 1: it's beautiful, but there's that history that we have to

546
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: reckon with. And I think that, like so much of

547
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 1: transphobia in well in America and all over the world,

548
00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: a lot of it in the black community, I think

549
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 1: it is also about just colonialism in general and the

550
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:59,600
Speaker 1: impact of like racism on our community, the historic emasculation

551
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 1: of black men, Like there's there's been literally during when

552
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:07,160
Speaker 1: black men were lynched, they would you know, their genitals

553
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:10,440
Speaker 1: were cut off, And there's that whole history that we're

554
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:14,280
Speaker 1: trying to sort of reckon with as Americans. That's deeply painful,

555
00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:16,920
Speaker 1: and trans people like represent that. I think for some

556
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 1: black folks, that history that trauma, and then I think it.

557
00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,360
Speaker 1: I always believe if you have a problem with somebody

558
00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:27,440
Speaker 1: else being themselves, it's something inside of you that's not

559
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 1: quite right. And and that's why our healing journey is

560
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:33,400
Speaker 1: so important. I think, like, um, I say on my

561
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 1: podcast that like I think fifty percent, it's like, Okay,

562
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 1: there are systems in place. Racism is a system. Transphole

563
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:41,080
Speaker 1: b as a system. We're all like raised in these

564
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: systems and are affected and internalize these things that we

565
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 1: have to unlearn if we want to decolonize our minds

566
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 1: and liberate ourselves. But what's my fifty percent? I am

567
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 1: responsible ultimately for my life. I'm responsible for how I feel.

568
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:56,479
Speaker 1: I've never been a victim and your own healing, and

569
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:58,480
Speaker 1: I'm responsible to my own healing if you didn't, even

570
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: if you didn't cause your own trauma, I'm a sponsible

571
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:03,440
Speaker 1: for my hand as an adult. As an adult, and

572
00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 1: I think too, when in that moment being using that

573
00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 1: f sler, you were mad, I was like that reaction

574
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 1: took and for me, I was I I've decided. Many

575
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:18,800
Speaker 1: years ago, I had an incident in a gay club

576
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:23,000
Speaker 1: and I was I was co hosting an event and

577
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,880
Speaker 1: I used the F word. I said, used some loud

578
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:29,239
Speaker 1: F words. This was years ago. After the show, these

579
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:32,040
Speaker 1: two black gay men came up to me and read

580
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 1: me for They read me for filth and I'm there

581
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:36,840
Speaker 1: with my friend Ari, May he rest in peace and

582
00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, we're reclaiming that word and I'm trans

583
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 1: and they were like not having it. And I talked

584
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,160
Speaker 1: to my friend Ari and iself right because I was like,

585
00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:48,920
Speaker 1: we're reclaiming that word. We're taking the power away from

586
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,240
Speaker 1: that word, and Ari was like absolutely. And I talked

587
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:54,680
Speaker 1: to my brother. My brother is identified as a practicing homosexual.

588
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: He doesn't like the word gay. He thinks it's a

589
00:30:56,800 --> 00:31:01,480
Speaker 1: white bourgeois construct and he prefers the idea of practiced orition. Anyway,

590
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 1: we're twins, and I talked to my brother about it,

591
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:06,840
Speaker 1: and I expected my brother would be like, yeah, they

592
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:09,360
Speaker 1: were crazy and they were wrong. And my brother was like,

593
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:12,240
Speaker 1: that's not your word to reclaim. It's like but no,

594
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 1: but no, it's like, that's not your word to reclaim.

595
00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:16,280
Speaker 1: And then he said it a third time and then

596
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,959
Speaker 1: I started crying. Yeah, because I had to admit that

597
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 1: I said something that was hurtful. I saw the hurt

598
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 1: in their eyes and I didn't. I immediately became defensive,

599
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:33,280
Speaker 1: and that defensiveness I get, but like that that uncomfortability,

600
00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:38,520
Speaker 1: that that moment of sitting with like I hurt somebody

601
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 1: and I didn't intend to, but I hurt somebody and

602
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 1: that felt awful. So that's how it was for me

603
00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:49,920
Speaker 1: when the whole community felt like what felt like the

604
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 1: whole community was because like that's like half of my

605
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 1: fan base LGBC, like what my community has come hard

606
00:31:56,520 --> 00:32:00,239
Speaker 1: for me too, and it's and then sometimes it's like, yo,

607
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 1: I know, I didn't mean that. I didn't mean to

608
00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 1: hurt all of y'all. You know what they're trying to

609
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,280
Speaker 1: hurt that I try to hurt that one person because

610
00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 1: he was trying and only because he was trying to

611
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: hurt me, not even oh I think this way about

612
00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: like nah, And it was like it was kind of

613
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,040
Speaker 1: hard to come back from. That was the I was

614
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: the first social media influencer to be canceled and then

615
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:24,120
Speaker 1: by such a big community of people who supported me.

616
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: And what's the healing for you? What's what's the healing

617
00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:30,040
Speaker 1: for you? Because I think for me, I think like

618
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: is there I would I want to be in a

619
00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:36,720
Speaker 1: moment where someone I let someone have me go out

620
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:40,080
Speaker 1: of character to insult them. That that's something That's what

621
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:43,720
Speaker 1: I think. But for you, has there been healing around that?

622
00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 1: Has there been? Because I think the what we don't

623
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:48,720
Speaker 1: see a lot of for me when somebody is quote

624
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 1: unquote canceled is we don't see the evolution of what

625
00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 1: they've learned and how they've learned it, right, Like what

626
00:32:56,760 --> 00:33:00,120
Speaker 1: did I learn from this situation? Like how did I

627
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:04,040
Speaker 1: hold myself accountable? What have I learned about it? That's

628
00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 1: what I think. This is what people need when when

629
00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 1: someone's been through the meal, like what have I learned

630
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:14,400
Speaker 1: from it? Whatever? You so what my like my apology

631
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 1: was bad then because it was you know, that was

632
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 1: the thing where you did somebody get canceled? You must

633
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 1: apologize And then they called my apology backhanded like I

634
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 1: said before, and vernam always think like this. I'm like, look,

635
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:33,600
Speaker 1: if you want me to respect you, you must respect me.

636
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:36,760
Speaker 1: You get what I'm saying, like you must you you

637
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 1: are in this community, you can be whatever you want.

638
00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: It don't bother me. If you are the LGBT, it

639
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:46,560
Speaker 1: don't matter. You will respect me. As who I am

640
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:48,640
Speaker 1: and imna respect you as who you are. You could

641
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:51,240
Speaker 1: have said anything, Oh you ugly you d you called

642
00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 1: me that because that was gonna get a reaction, like

643
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:57,480
Speaker 1: you called me a slur that that if somebody said

644
00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 1: that to you, you would you hate it? Like you can't.

645
00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: That's an unspoken word. You can't. You set it yourself

646
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:08,680
Speaker 1: like other transgender can't even spew that word like you

647
00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. You you said the F word

648
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 1: them too, menday thing like that, like what you're a

649
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,239
Speaker 1: part of the community, you still can't say. You have

650
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:18,279
Speaker 1: to respect me if you want me to respect you.

651
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:21,880
Speaker 1: Like so, I want to apologize to the community. I said.

652
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:25,719
Speaker 1: I meant what I said to him. I said, man,

653
00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:30,160
Speaker 1: y'all want me to respect. It starts with respect, no

654
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,200
Speaker 1: matter if you know the person or not. Everybody a

655
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:34,759
Speaker 1: human being. You're a human being first, That's what you

656
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:38,719
Speaker 1: are first. I hear you everything else, That's how I'm

657
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:42,399
Speaker 1: always be, But I hear you, man. Offer. I can't

658
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:46,239
Speaker 1: make anybody to anything. Absolutely. I can't make anybody respect me.

659
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 1: I actually, like so much of my healing work around

660
00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:51,839
Speaker 1: relationships is I can't make somebody love me. I can't

661
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:55,160
Speaker 1: make somebody treat me right. I can't make somebody see me.

662
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 1: I can take myself out of the situation I can't

663
00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:00,880
Speaker 1: take my I can put my myself in a situation

664
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,919
Speaker 1: where someone can see me, can respect me, and it's

665
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 1: able to Some people aren't able to respect us because

666
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 1: they don't respect themselves right. So like so I can't

667
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:15,799
Speaker 1: make somebody do something, and so like the whole um,

668
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:19,880
Speaker 1: you will respect me thing I'm like people, they might not,

669
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:23,920
Speaker 1: you know. I feel like I come with nothing but love,

670
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:27,160
Speaker 1: and I work my ass off, and there's so many

671
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:29,719
Speaker 1: people who are only going to see my transnis and

672
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 1: never see the excellence, see the hard work, see the talent,

673
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:37,399
Speaker 1: and I can't make them do that. I can't make

674
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 1: them do that. If you ever get tired of being

675
00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 1: I don't want to say the face, but the person

676
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:43,359
Speaker 1: that everybody comes to when it's a joke that people

677
00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:45,960
Speaker 1: don't like, or when somebody says something in a lyric

678
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,839
Speaker 1: or spoke for me, you get tired of that. I'm

679
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 1: not anymore. There's so many more of us. And what

680
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: I what I love about my career and what I'm

681
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:58,439
Speaker 1: really proud of is that I'm the first openly trans

682
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:00,080
Speaker 1: person to be nominated for an acting in Me, and

683
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: I'm not the last. I'm the first transperson to be

684
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:04,480
Speaker 1: on the cover of Time magazine, but I'm not the last.

685
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,080
Speaker 1: Um There's so many more trans people with the platform now.

686
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:11,960
Speaker 1: What I am frustrated by with these legislative attacks against

687
00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:14,120
Speaker 1: trans people now is that people aren't talking to enough

688
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:17,239
Speaker 1: trans people. They're like lots of pundits and people who

689
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:20,359
Speaker 1: like talk about trans issues without a transperson insight. There

690
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 1: used to be a time I'm old enough, where you know,

691
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:24,560
Speaker 1: people would talk about trans issues and actually bring on

692
00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 1: trans people to talk. I can't. What I've learned is

693
00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 1: I can't speak on every issue because it's exhausting. This

694
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:42,480
Speaker 1: stuff is also traumatizing. Transphobia is traumatizing, Racism is traumatizing,

695
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:45,160
Speaker 1: is traumatizing, and I can't live in that space. I

696
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:46,960
Speaker 1: can't live in that space all the time. And that

697
00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:52,040
Speaker 1: twenty twenty taught me that too, Oh girl, trauma on

698
00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:56,319
Speaker 1: top of trauma, So I have to sometimes I have

699
00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:58,480
Speaker 1: to go away and not speak on those things. And

700
00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:00,760
Speaker 1: I'm so blessed that I get to have a public

701
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 1: platform where I don't talk about being trans at all

702
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:04,880
Speaker 1: where I get to go on the red carpet and

703
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:07,440
Speaker 1: I talk about artists in their work, and I go

704
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 1: on my show and I talk about artists in their work,

705
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:11,839
Speaker 1: and so it's not it can't always be about that.

706
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,799
Speaker 1: I love being trans. Trans is beautiful. I always say,

707
00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:18,440
Speaker 1: I'm not beautiful despite my big hands, my big feet,

708
00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:20,640
Speaker 1: my white shoulder, was my deep voice. I'm beautiful because

709
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:22,960
Speaker 1: of those things, those things that make me noticeably trans.

710
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:28,080
Speaker 1: But I get to occupy spaces that where my transance

711
00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 1: is not the only thing. So I'm honored that I've

712
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 1: been chosen, I think, by power greater than myself, to

713
00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:39,560
Speaker 1: be a vessel for all of the visibility that trans

714
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:43,480
Speaker 1: people have now. And it used to feel like a

715
00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 1: lot of pressure. And I used to feel this obligation

716
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 1: to speak up about everything. And now I pray to

717
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 1: God that like i'd say thank you, but I'm like,

718
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:54,360
Speaker 1: can I wear this light more lightly and with more joy?

719
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,960
Speaker 1: And I'm getting there. I'm in, and I'm getting there

720
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:00,880
Speaker 1: by staying in the love. I started ending my emails

721
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 1: like God twenty years ago, stay in the Love, to

722
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:05,719
Speaker 1: remind myself and my fellow artists that we got into

723
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:07,919
Speaker 1: this because we love it, not because the business part

724
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:11,560
Speaker 1: of being an artist is treacherous. But I love it,

725
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:15,080
Speaker 1: and I think love is always the solution. When I

726
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:18,160
Speaker 1: talked to coronerl West on my podcast, he said a

727
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 1: lovely thing to me that I'm in the tradition of

728
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:22,799
Speaker 1: love warriors that we've had in the black community from

729
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 1: you know, time memorium, Like he said, you know that,

730
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:29,000
Speaker 1: you know they hated us, but we have taught people

731
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:31,839
Speaker 1: how to love. It's black folks. We consistently do that,

732
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,640
Speaker 1: and like that. For me, it's what it's all about.

733
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: It's about existing and inhabiting love and putting that out

734
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:42,359
Speaker 1: there and hopefully getting that back. And I think that

735
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:46,560
Speaker 1: is the only thing with all of the vitriol and

736
00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:49,560
Speaker 1: policies that are being passed. They are attacking trans people,

737
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:53,799
Speaker 1: They're attacking like you know, ap African American studies and

738
00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:57,320
Speaker 1: just all these things that we have to Education is important.

739
00:38:57,320 --> 00:39:00,480
Speaker 1: I'd like to remind people that in everyone osis, but

740
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:02,839
Speaker 1: it's just good to be reminded that they didn't want

741
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:06,120
Speaker 1: slaves to read. They did not want if you learn

742
00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 1: to read as a slave, you would be be you

743
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 1: would be killed. They did not want us to be educated.

744
00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:14,440
Speaker 1: And right now you have a governor of Florida, governor

745
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:16,759
Speaker 1: of Texas who wants their banning books. They don't want

746
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,720
Speaker 1: you to learn about things. And so in this moment,

747
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:23,000
Speaker 1: like as black people, as marginalized people, we need to

748
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:26,920
Speaker 1: educate ourselves. We need to learn critical thinking to on

749
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 1: the internet to figure out what's misinformation and what's not.

750
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:34,399
Speaker 1: That education and learning it's like, it's it's it's it's

751
00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:37,680
Speaker 1: a practice of freedom. Education has always been freedom for

752
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,520
Speaker 1: black folks, and it is now as well, and it's

753
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:44,560
Speaker 1: it's extended to trans people. Trans people, we've always been here.

754
00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 1: I like to remind folks that transposed have existed and

755
00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:50,200
Speaker 1: indigenous cultures all over the world. In Hawaii they had Mahoo,

756
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:55,279
Speaker 1: in India, Hydra and Africa there there um you know,

757
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:57,960
Speaker 1: non but they wouldn't be called trans people now but

758
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:01,840
Speaker 1: with colonialism, with spirits, so I think two spirits and

759
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:05,239
Speaker 1: Native American cultures. Um in Angola, there was um um

760
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:08,680
Speaker 1: um in Zinga Queen and Zinga had her um I

761
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:11,319
Speaker 1: forget the name, the name of her sort of non

762
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:15,399
Speaker 1: binary kind of um folks um in her court. So

763
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:19,399
Speaker 1: we've existed throughout time. Trans folks and people who didn't

764
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:22,439
Speaker 1: exist within the binary and this gender binary thing it's

765
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:26,440
Speaker 1: a white, colonial Western thing, right, So like, let's educate

766
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,640
Speaker 1: ourselves about that and understand that when we're being transphobic

767
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:32,879
Speaker 1: and we're enforcing this like binary idea of man and woman,

768
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:35,839
Speaker 1: we're like doing some colonial shit. We're doing some like

769
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 1: wide imperialist stuff. Right. Let's like if we look at

770
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:42,080
Speaker 1: indigenous cultures and look at the way other people of

771
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:46,120
Speaker 1: practiced things, you know, um, transient or gender knock conformed people, health,

772
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:50,000
Speaker 1: sacred spaces, and in um in India, you would wouldn't

773
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 1: have a wedding or christening without the presence of a

774
00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:55,920
Speaker 1: hydred of bless that child or bless that wedding. And

775
00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 1: trans folks have been spiritual leaders throughout history. A new

776
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 1: want to ask mcause we're talking about it when it

777
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:06,560
Speaker 1: comes to gender identity, should we let kids wait until

778
00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:08,400
Speaker 1: they are older to make that decision? Because I know

779
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,880
Speaker 1: that's a big it is a big conversation right now.

780
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:14,160
Speaker 1: And what I say to that is that if you

781
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 1: are not a trans child, or have a parent or

782
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,800
Speaker 1: a parent of a child who thinks they might be trans,

783
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:23,799
Speaker 1: it's none of your business. I think what has been

784
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 1: happening with the GOP specifically now and all of the like.

785
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:29,920
Speaker 1: We have to protect kids, kids in sports, kids, this

786
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:33,040
Speaker 1: kids that it's never been about kids. It's always been

787
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 1: about stigmatizing trans people. There's a law in Oklahoma that

788
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:38,920
Speaker 1: was just introduced that would ban gender firm incare up

789
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:41,520
Speaker 1: until the age of twenty six. This tells me what

790
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 1: I've already always known. There's never been about kids. It's

791
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:47,239
Speaker 1: about making trans people not exist. Donald Trump just made

792
00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:49,120
Speaker 1: a speech saying we need to ban gender firm in

793
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:52,879
Speaker 1: care for everybody. He may have misspoken, He misspeaks a lot,

794
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:55,800
Speaker 1: but he said we need to ban it for everybody.

795
00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:59,040
Speaker 1: That is the plan. So I think when we are

796
00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:02,680
Speaker 1: talking about some one else's access to healthcare or bodily autonomy,

797
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,560
Speaker 1: it's nobody else's business, whether they're a child or an adult.

798
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:09,920
Speaker 1: The American Academy for Pediatrics, the American Medical Association, the

799
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:13,200
Speaker 1: Endocrine Society have a set of protocols and they're all

800
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:16,600
Speaker 1: well respected for treating trans kids. And that should be

801
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:20,880
Speaker 1: handled by doctors, not legislators, not people who are not involved.

802
00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:24,160
Speaker 1: There's nobody's business. And I think when we have these

803
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:28,600
Speaker 1: conversations about trans people, and we focus on transition body surgery.

804
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:32,960
Speaker 1: When you're a Supreme Court confirmation hearing and they're talking about,

805
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,959
Speaker 1: you know, mutilating children or you know, castraating children, that

806
00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:41,879
Speaker 1: language objectifies trans people and dehumanizes us. This whole conversation

807
00:42:42,120 --> 00:42:45,200
Speaker 1: has been deeply dehumanizing. And when you can dehumanize people,

808
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 1: you can take away their rights, and that is exactly

809
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 1: what they're doing right now. They've done a really good

810
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:53,520
Speaker 1: job of dehumanizing trans people, LGBTQ plus people in general,

811
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 1: and they're they're taking away our rights within no one's

812
00:42:57,000 --> 00:43:02,000
Speaker 1: really doing anything about it. So our work is to

813
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:07,839
Speaker 1: rehumanize everybody, to rehumanize each other. When we dehumanize somebody else,

814
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 1: we dehumanize ourselves. When I interviewed doctor Joy Degree, who

815
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:13,840
Speaker 1: I'm coined the term post traumatic slave syndrome on my podcast,

816
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:17,840
Speaker 1: she said that, like the healing is not just for

817
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:20,239
Speaker 1: um formally enslaved people, it's also for the people who

818
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:24,440
Speaker 1: enslaved folks. When they enslaved us, they were dehumanizing themselves.

819
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:28,719
Speaker 1: When you discriminate against other people, you dehumanize yourself when

820
00:43:28,760 --> 00:43:32,800
Speaker 1: you allowed yourself to you know, come out of character

821
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:35,800
Speaker 1: and respond to that that dude who said that to you,

822
00:43:36,239 --> 00:43:39,920
Speaker 1: that that was you were not humanize, you were not

823
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 1: giving yourself the dignity, the reality, the royalty, the humanity

824
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:48,880
Speaker 1: that you deserve to be above that in that moment

825
00:43:49,080 --> 00:43:51,440
Speaker 1: and for many years, a trans elder said to me,

826
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 1: it's not what they call you, it's what you answer to. No,

827
00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:57,160
Speaker 1: I get it. Do you feel like he was wrong? Absolutely?

828
00:43:57,200 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 1: All right? Absolutely, because for a while it was so

829
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:02,840
Speaker 1: one sided, like it's like, no, you can say that

830
00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:05,200
Speaker 1: because he's a part of I'm like, no, you can't,

831
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 1: and he can say whatever you want to say. I'm

832
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:08,520
Speaker 1: not like that I was saying that. I'm just saying like,

833
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:11,600
Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, one of my favorite,

834
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:17,279
Speaker 1: one of my favorite things though absolutely very human, very human,

835
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:20,759
Speaker 1: and I'm not I'm very human, but like, and we're

836
00:44:20,840 --> 00:44:23,080
Speaker 1: human beings. But when if we when we want to

837
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:26,440
Speaker 1: evolve and we want to grow spiritually, how do we

838
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:29,200
Speaker 1: then proceed? And one of my favorite things that I

839
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:31,440
Speaker 1: heard and from a therapist is what other people say

840
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:34,080
Speaker 1: about me, it is none of my business because if

841
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:36,880
Speaker 1: I'm in this constant space of like, you must respect me,

842
00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:38,919
Speaker 1: you want we see it on reality shows all the time.

843
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:41,120
Speaker 1: You got to respect me. And then I'm fighting with

844
00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:43,560
Speaker 1: somebody and I'm just I'm fighting and I'm like coming

845
00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:46,080
Speaker 1: out of character. It's like, this is not why God

846
00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:48,960
Speaker 1: put me here. God did not put me here to

847
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:53,279
Speaker 1: be reactive to somebody who in some low vibrational, low

848
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:57,640
Speaker 1: vibrational place, um some low vibrational energy. God put me

849
00:44:57,719 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 1: here to to be annoyed, to live in the annoyance

850
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 1: space that i'm I'm so, I'm not coming out of

851
00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 1: character because someone's calling me something. People call me stuff

852
00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 1: all the time. My whole life. People have been calling

853
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:11,520
Speaker 1: me stuff. You know, I'm glad you here because we

854
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:13,920
Speaker 1: can't even help just unpack another little bit of trauma

855
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:16,160
Speaker 1: that she went through. Remember just I saw you say

856
00:45:16,200 --> 00:45:18,399
Speaker 1: this on it Don't Call Me White Girl podcast. Yeah,

857
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:20,840
Speaker 1: it was a guy holing at you floor out and

858
00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:22,840
Speaker 1: you was trying to try to fly you outright. I

859
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 1: wasn't into excuse me what happened? Okay, I need I

860
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:40,920
Speaker 1: need kind know. Okay, there was this guy, he's known

861
00:45:41,200 --> 00:45:48,560
Speaker 1: everybody knowing me's a singer. Try to holler me too,

862
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:52,600
Speaker 1: saying the ones that will act like they didn't. But yeah,

863
00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: he um d MD me and he was like, he

864
00:45:56,719 --> 00:46:03,680
Speaker 1: wanted me to you know, of him, um, have sex

865
00:46:03,719 --> 00:46:06,840
Speaker 1: with him, Yeah, have sex with him. But he wanted

866
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:10,279
Speaker 1: me to bend him over because whyn't you strip on? No,

867
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:14,319
Speaker 1: he thought I had that already came like that. He

868
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:17,520
Speaker 1: thought that you were a trans woman who had had

869
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:21,400
Speaker 1: and he really wanted this experience. And he didn't know

870
00:46:21,440 --> 00:46:25,640
Speaker 1: he hit me after. I might know who it is.

871
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:30,800
Speaker 1: She might not even be shocked, but the thing is,

872
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:34,600
Speaker 1: and I was like, wow, like and this was traumatizing

873
00:46:34,680 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 1: for you? No, I just was like, no, it wasn't.

874
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:45,000
Speaker 1: It was not you man trying to exult me. He

875
00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:48,640
Speaker 1: just literally thought that I was you know, he was.

876
00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:51,719
Speaker 1: He was really wanting. I wasn't upset at all. When

877
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:53,200
Speaker 1: I seen the money, I was like, dang, I wish

878
00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:58,960
Speaker 1: I did have one of those. Because he was thought

879
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:01,279
Speaker 1: you were a sex worker. Yes, he thought he were

880
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:05,240
Speaker 1: sex worker. He thought you were trans. People always often

881
00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:08,000
Speaker 1: assume they're transfer people, the sex workers. We're not all

882
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 1: sex workers. There's other things we can do. And this

883
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:13,520
Speaker 1: is not to you know, demean sex work. We we

884
00:47:13,719 --> 00:47:18,400
Speaker 1: you know, we're sex workers should be decriminalized and all that. Um, wow.

885
00:47:18,760 --> 00:47:21,360
Speaker 1: But when I told have been looking. When I was like, okay,

886
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:24,680
Speaker 1: so no I am you know woman, he was like,

887
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:27,440
Speaker 1: oh damn, all right, well see like it was like

888
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:29,600
Speaker 1: you still slop me out for the money if you

889
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:33,560
Speaker 1: But no, he wanted something very specific, Yeah, very specific,

890
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,919
Speaker 1: and he wasn't disrespectful after he wasn't and I wasn't

891
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 1: about to put that up, you know, none of that.

892
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:44,200
Speaker 1: But he was really like, I wouldn't say disappointed, but

893
00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 1: it was like that's all right, Like we have to

894
00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:54,440
Speaker 1: you know. It's it's tricky to talk about sax. We're

895
00:47:54,480 --> 00:47:57,640
Speaker 1: transford because we're often sexualized, right, and so to have

896
00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:01,160
Speaker 1: an adult conversation about sex and sexual reality and not

897
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:04,480
Speaker 1: again to elevate the humanity of trans people. This is

898
00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:07,760
Speaker 1: this is my work to elevate the humanity of trans people.

899
00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:12,400
Speaker 1: But there are straight identified men who enjoy being pegged

900
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:15,760
Speaker 1: having a woman strap on, who enjoy a trans woman

901
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:18,360
Speaker 1: who might you know, give them that that that pleasure,

902
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:21,840
Speaker 1: and they still identify a straight because she's still a woman. Right.

903
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:25,840
Speaker 1: So I think that like a more evolved conversation that

904
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:28,560
Speaker 1: a lot of people aren't ready for, is that a

905
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:33,000
Speaker 1: sex act does not define your sexuality. A sex act

906
00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:35,839
Speaker 1: does not define your sexuality. So you can have a

907
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:41,320
Speaker 1: sex act that involves you know, you know him wanting

908
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:46,640
Speaker 1: to do right now. It's nobody can tell you who

909
00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:49,319
Speaker 1: you are. Nobody can tell you who you are, so

910
00:48:49,480 --> 00:48:53,279
Speaker 1: you people. Sexuality exists on a spectrum, and I think

911
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:57,600
Speaker 1: it's like really problematic when we find out that someone

912
00:48:57,920 --> 00:49:02,160
Speaker 1: enjoys something sexually and we start telling them that they

913
00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:05,640
Speaker 1: are gay or start telling them of their sexuality. It

914
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:08,719
Speaker 1: is not our business to tell somebody their sexuality if

915
00:49:08,719 --> 00:49:11,200
Speaker 1: they're in the closet, if they're in denial, that's actually

916
00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:15,080
Speaker 1: not our business either, right, So there's too much of

917
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 1: that I think we can allow. And people are doing

918
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:22,680
Speaker 1: all sorts of things, um sexually, and I think it's

919
00:49:22,719 --> 00:49:25,759
Speaker 1: all wonderful. I think it's great, liveal it's all it's

920
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:31,040
Speaker 1: just consensual and everybody is an adult and it's great.

921
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:34,760
Speaker 1: And I don't I think that, like it's an advanced concept,

922
00:49:34,760 --> 00:49:37,840
Speaker 1: but sex separating a sex act from someone's sexuality, I

923
00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:40,520
Speaker 1: think it's something that's very evolved that I would love

924
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:47,799
Speaker 1: for people to be able to potentially does that doesn't

925
00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:53,000
Speaker 1: necessarily mean he's gay, that's what she's sayings, but not people.

926
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:56,360
Speaker 1: I just love the fact that a transplement potentially took

927
00:49:56,440 --> 00:49:59,919
Speaker 1: one of justice prospects. That's what That's what I think

928
00:50:00,040 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 1: found here. He found the girl. Yeah, one of me,

929
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:09,799
Speaker 1: one of me? You want me? Do you want me?

930
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:11,560
Speaker 1: To this day? You could have been like I could

931
00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:14,320
Speaker 1: strap on? Did you offer that? Yes? Because the money

932
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:18,680
Speaker 1: you did? Much? How much was fifty thousand dollars? Girls

933
00:50:18,760 --> 00:50:25,000
Speaker 1: like what? Okay? You can tell the girls who this girl?

934
00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 1: The sex worker girls out there there is a man,

935
00:50:28,280 --> 00:50:31,839
Speaker 1: a singer offering fifty thousand dollars and they better give

936
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:36,280
Speaker 1: me a piece of Oh he's like he's over fifty.

937
00:50:36,840 --> 00:50:40,080
Speaker 1: He's like this was like somebody we listened to like

938
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:44,520
Speaker 1: that in this ain't still listening. We're still listening to

939
00:50:44,560 --> 00:50:47,719
Speaker 1: them right now. Fifty thousand dollars, girl, A lot of

940
00:50:47,760 --> 00:50:49,800
Speaker 1: girls can use that, and so I did you know,

941
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 1: just talking it over with my it's so beautiful to

942
00:50:56,120 --> 00:50:59,400
Speaker 1: be a black dutiful to be a black trans woman

943
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:03,480
Speaker 1: and not me that money. It's good, beautiful to make

944
00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 1: my own money. Can we talk about this please? Yes? Barbie?

945
00:51:06,719 --> 00:51:09,440
Speaker 1: Can we get the ball? We can we talking about Barbie?

946
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 1: We were talking about this. You will Mittel be okay

947
00:51:13,719 --> 00:51:17,880
Speaker 1: with us having that conversation and they're talking about I

948
00:51:17,880 --> 00:51:19,520
Speaker 1: want to know, how did this doll come about? Was

949
00:51:19,560 --> 00:51:23,360
Speaker 1: this dream of yours? When I found out Aba Duvernet

950
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:24,960
Speaker 1: had a dollar, I was like, I want a doll too.

951
00:51:25,040 --> 00:51:26,719
Speaker 1: When I said to my manager Paul, it's like, I

952
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:29,160
Speaker 1: want a Barbie, and like, I don't know if he

953
00:51:29,239 --> 00:51:32,120
Speaker 1: reached out, but like if several years later Mattel reached

954
00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:34,640
Speaker 1: out and said, we'd love to do a Barbie. We're

955
00:51:34,640 --> 00:51:37,400
Speaker 1: doing a tribute collection. And I said absolutely. It's like

956
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:40,560
Speaker 1: it was a dream and it was. I have a lot.

957
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 1: I've talked a lot about this when the barbe came out.

958
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:45,040
Speaker 1: But when I was a kid, I wanted Barbie and

959
00:51:45,040 --> 00:51:46,880
Speaker 1: my mom did not allow me to play with Barbie.

960
00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:51,120
Speaker 1: She it was forbidden. And when I was around thirty

961
00:51:51,160 --> 00:51:53,719
Speaker 1: and I was in therapy, like starting therapy was like

962
00:51:53,960 --> 00:51:56,239
Speaker 1: two mid two thousands, I was in therapy and I

963
00:51:56,280 --> 00:51:58,399
Speaker 1: told that story to my therapist, and my therapist said,

964
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:01,360
Speaker 1: you can It's never too late to have a happy childhood.

965
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:03,839
Speaker 1: You can reparent that inner child. I think you should

966
00:52:03,840 --> 00:52:05,919
Speaker 1: go and buy yourself a Barbie. Did you and play

967
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:08,600
Speaker 1: with her? I absolutely did. I bought a Barbie, I

968
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:11,719
Speaker 1: played with her, addressed her, and it was healing. And

969
00:52:11,719 --> 00:52:13,799
Speaker 1: then I told my mom about it. And then my

970
00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:17,239
Speaker 1: mom are sending me barbies always. Oh really, my mom

971
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:21,520
Speaker 1: started sending me barbies this. I'm not going to crown

972
00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:25,920
Speaker 1: the Breakfast Club really, um and black Barbie. Absolutely, so

973
00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:28,040
Speaker 1: it'send to me black Barbies. And it was just this

974
00:52:28,400 --> 00:52:31,480
Speaker 1: wonderful like that we all have a little kid inside

975
00:52:31,480 --> 00:52:36,719
Speaker 1: of us that that needs attention, that needs healing, and um,

976
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:39,799
Speaker 1: yeah she's been I've been taking really good care of

977
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,279
Speaker 1: my inner child and Barbie has been a huge part

978
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:44,200
Speaker 1: of that. And so what was so exciting for me

979
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,520
Speaker 1: about having my own Barbie is that other people can

980
00:52:47,600 --> 00:52:50,680
Speaker 1: have this space, whatever age you are, or like reparent

981
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:54,719
Speaker 1: your inner child or and and have and know that

982
00:52:54,760 --> 00:52:57,279
Speaker 1: you can be trans or non binary and that like

983
00:52:58,080 --> 00:53:03,080
Speaker 1: you exist. Yeah, they're absolutely brought it for you. Yeah,

984
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:06,200
Speaker 1: and you forgive your mom? Why did you forgive your mom?

985
00:53:06,239 --> 00:53:09,040
Speaker 1: Because you had to be some resentment the fact that

986
00:53:09,080 --> 00:53:10,719
Speaker 1: you wanted to play the ball but she wouldn't let you.

987
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:12,880
Speaker 1: But you also have to understand that at that time,

988
00:53:13,680 --> 00:53:15,560
Speaker 1: I you know, this is a while. Look this is

989
00:53:15,600 --> 00:53:19,160
Speaker 1: probably like God ground that same time two thousand and five,

990
00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:20,839
Speaker 1: two thousand and six. So I don't know how old

991
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:23,640
Speaker 1: I was. I was like thirty, mid early to mid thirties,

992
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:27,520
Speaker 1: and I just realized I needed to. When we hold

993
00:53:27,520 --> 00:53:30,840
Speaker 1: on to resentment, it's like giving taking poison and expecting

994
00:53:30,840 --> 00:53:34,000
Speaker 1: it to hurt, you know, hurt someone else, that old proverb.

995
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:36,239
Speaker 1: And so I just realized. She did the best she

996
00:53:36,280 --> 00:53:40,160
Speaker 1: could what she had. And my mom is an incredible

997
00:53:40,239 --> 00:53:43,560
Speaker 1: human being. She put herself through college, she got a

998
00:53:43,560 --> 00:53:45,759
Speaker 1: master's degree, she was a teacher, she's retired now. My

999
00:53:45,840 --> 00:53:48,360
Speaker 1: mother took care of to kid. My mother's an incredible

1000
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:51,799
Speaker 1: human being, and she did the best she could and

1001
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:54,240
Speaker 1: with what she had. And I turned out pretty well.

1002
00:53:54,280 --> 00:53:57,120
Speaker 1: And I love myself now and that's my mom is

1003
00:53:57,239 --> 00:53:59,160
Speaker 1: responsible for that. So yeah, I forgave my mom a

1004
00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:02,719
Speaker 1: long time. I yeah, call me stupid because when I

1005
00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:05,840
Speaker 1: first heard about the doll, you know, representation matters, we

1006
00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:07,960
Speaker 1: know that, but how are you supposed to know this

1007
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:11,719
Speaker 1: is a trans Well, my face is on the back

1008
00:54:11,719 --> 00:54:14,520
Speaker 1: because there's Laverne Cox and then my pictures on the back,

1009
00:54:14,600 --> 00:54:18,799
Speaker 1: So um, I'm trans. So I mean, yeah, so it's

1010
00:54:19,280 --> 00:54:21,600
Speaker 1: technical and it's not trans barbie, but it's the first

1011
00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:24,919
Speaker 1: Barbie to be made in the image of a trans person. Yeah,

1012
00:54:24,920 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 1: it's a Barbie doll. Oh and then if you read

1013
00:54:28,360 --> 00:54:34,560
Speaker 1: this on the bag, you literally can yeah, okay you yeah, yeah,

1014
00:54:34,600 --> 00:54:38,480
Speaker 1: literally needs to be styled. Though we appreciate you for

1015
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:41,040
Speaker 1: joining us. We are and we have a question. I'm

1016
00:54:41,040 --> 00:54:43,640
Speaker 1: sure Charlot man and just feel the same if there's

1017
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:47,080
Speaker 1: ever something that we have to call upon and ask

1018
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:49,279
Speaker 1: a question. We want you to be a friend of

1019
00:54:49,320 --> 00:54:50,600
Speaker 1: the room where we can call you if you're in

1020
00:54:50,760 --> 00:54:53,680
Speaker 1: la and say, hey, Laverne this, there's this situation. What's

1021
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 1: your opinion. So sometimes we might not get your representation

1022
00:54:56,719 --> 00:55:01,040
Speaker 1: because it's exhausted, and don't call up. You can call me,

1023
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:04,719
Speaker 1: you can call me. I there's certain things that don't

1024
00:55:04,719 --> 00:55:07,520
Speaker 1: comment on, Like there's certain nions who do their thing

1025
00:55:07,560 --> 00:55:11,000
Speaker 1: and I don't. I don't like because I also don't

1026
00:55:11,040 --> 00:55:13,480
Speaker 1: want to be for me, it's important to be critical

1027
00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:18,600
Speaker 1: of concepts and ideologies and mindsets, but love people and

1028
00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:21,319
Speaker 1: the media will be is very quick to put you

1029
00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:25,839
Speaker 1: in Laverne Cox by this person, or Laverne Cox calls

1030
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:27,640
Speaker 1: out this person. Then all of a sudden, I'm feuding

1031
00:55:27,640 --> 00:55:30,279
Speaker 1: with someone, I am not here to feed with anybody.

1032
00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:32,960
Speaker 1: I'm not here to like be in conflict with another

1033
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:36,560
Speaker 1: famous person. Don't pick me against anybody. So like that,

1034
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:40,600
Speaker 1: I can talk about I can talk about concepts and ideas,

1035
00:55:40,640 --> 00:55:45,640
Speaker 1: but I'm just I'm very careful not to be People

1036
00:55:45,640 --> 00:55:47,919
Speaker 1: still try to pick me against folks, but I don't

1037
00:55:47,920 --> 00:55:50,640
Speaker 1: do it, and so I'm very careful about that. So

1038
00:55:50,680 --> 00:55:53,320
Speaker 1: I'll speak about, you know, an idea or a concept

1039
00:55:53,400 --> 00:55:55,440
Speaker 1: or like or something specific. If you want to talk

1040
00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:58,719
Speaker 1: about why something's fansophobic, like, we can break some stuff down.

1041
00:55:58,760 --> 00:56:02,879
Speaker 1: That's example that the different conversation in Dubai and people

1042
00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:06,360
Speaker 1: were upset and we would say, there's so many states

1043
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:11,080
Speaker 1: here that necessarily don't respect that anti so it was like,

1044
00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:12,880
Speaker 1: so what's the difference. So we didn't understand it, So

1045
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:14,600
Speaker 1: that would be like, well, what what what were your

1046
00:56:14,600 --> 00:56:18,839
Speaker 1: thoughts on that? You know, I'm in the be high

1047
00:56:19,040 --> 00:56:27,000
Speaker 1: like hardcore no matter which multiple times, multiple times like please.

1048
00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:30,520
Speaker 1: And Beyonce actually gave me my first fashion campaign Ivy

1049
00:56:30,560 --> 00:56:33,960
Speaker 1: Park Fall Winner twenty seventeen. My first fashion campaign was

1050
00:56:34,000 --> 00:56:37,319
Speaker 1: from Beyonce. Let Beyonce make her money let Beyonce make

1051
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:41,840
Speaker 1: her money and then on. But and honestly, there's what

1052
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:46,640
Speaker 1: is it. It's February whatever, it's mid February. And this

1053
00:56:46,760 --> 00:56:49,400
Speaker 1: year alone, over three hundred pieces of anti trans and

1054
00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:52,399
Speaker 1: LGBTQ legislation have been introduced in stay legislatures all over

1055
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:56,640
Speaker 1: the country, over three hundred pieces. So everybody who's saying

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00:56:56,719 --> 00:56:59,479
Speaker 1: that there's you know, there's a lot of states here

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Speaker 1: in the United State. Are you just not gonna go

1058
00:57:02,880 --> 00:57:06,880
Speaker 1: to the concert there? Because like in Florida and Oklahoma,

1059
00:57:06,960 --> 00:57:12,560
Speaker 1: in Texas and Tennessee girl, Arizona girl, and I feel

1060
00:57:12,560 --> 00:57:15,880
Speaker 1: like communities, certain communities need to experience joy, right, so

1061
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:17,680
Speaker 1: you gotta find those pockets of joy when you can

1062
00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:22,800
Speaker 1: what perfect place. And it's just because the government is

1063
00:57:23,200 --> 00:57:27,360
Speaker 1: discriminatory does not necessarily mean that the people there are right.

1064
00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:31,560
Speaker 1: We live under people live under passive regimes, and doesn't

1065
00:57:31,560 --> 00:57:33,400
Speaker 1: mean that people are bad, right, It just means the

1066
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:36,920
Speaker 1: government is so right. Because when I went to London

1067
00:57:36,960 --> 00:57:38,880
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, I was like, I ain't

1068
00:57:38,920 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 1: want to talk about the queen, And one of the

1069
00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:43,000
Speaker 1: produces was like, man, and I can't say what he

1070
00:57:43,080 --> 00:57:45,040
Speaker 1: says say And I was like whoa, so y'all don't care,

1071
00:57:45,080 --> 00:57:48,880
Speaker 1: and he was like, nah, nah, we don't care. Yea.

1072
00:57:49,240 --> 00:57:52,400
Speaker 1: It depends right, But like you said, like the government,

1073
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:56,360
Speaker 1: the politics and the government, sometimes their people don't even

1074
00:57:56,640 --> 00:57:59,080
Speaker 1: be worried about what they got, you know, what they

1075
00:57:59,120 --> 00:58:01,560
Speaker 1: got going on date. They agree with what their people

1076
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:04,760
Speaker 1: instead of who runs them. It's my last question. I

1077
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:07,200
Speaker 1: guess it's more like even though a statement, I guess

1078
00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:10,160
Speaker 1: the challenge I have is a personality is I often

1079
00:58:10,200 --> 00:58:13,280
Speaker 1: wonder what's more impactful? Right, because you're Laverne Cocks to me,

1080
00:58:13,560 --> 00:58:16,960
Speaker 1: like you're not transgender actors, n co Laverne Cocks, You've

1081
00:58:16,960 --> 00:58:18,120
Speaker 1: got a lot of things going on, So I wonder

1082
00:58:18,160 --> 00:58:21,520
Speaker 1: what's more powerful? Just having you on a platform like

1083
00:58:21,560 --> 00:58:24,200
Speaker 1: this and just having a conversation about everything that you're doing.

1084
00:58:24,440 --> 00:58:28,120
Speaker 1: Are allowing you to speak to your your transmiss because

1085
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:29,960
Speaker 1: to me, I could take you, I could take it

1086
00:58:29,960 --> 00:58:33,520
Speaker 1: to leaving the way I can do vow bind a

1087
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:39,040
Speaker 1: girl who can do vot that? For me, it's like

1088
00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:43,520
Speaker 1: I the most just living my life as I'm fifty

1089
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:46,000
Speaker 1: years old, living my life. I worked in restaurants in

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00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:48,240
Speaker 1: New York for twenty years. I did not go to

1091
00:58:48,240 --> 00:58:50,520
Speaker 1: the restaurant talking about my transit. When I was working

1092
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:52,640
Speaker 1: in a coffee shop, I just went to the restaurant

1093
00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:54,880
Speaker 1: and I was myself, and some people knew I was trans,

1094
00:58:54,960 --> 00:58:57,840
Speaker 1: some people didn't. They they got to know me. It's

1095
00:58:57,840 --> 00:59:02,040
Speaker 1: a human being and that is the most powerful thing. Ever.

1096
00:59:02,200 --> 00:59:04,720
Speaker 1: When I'm on sets, I'm not like educating people are

1097
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:08,240
Speaker 1: doing diversity inclusion of training. I'm doing my job and

1098
00:59:08,440 --> 00:59:11,040
Speaker 1: showing up and doing me has been the best way.

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00:59:11,120 --> 00:59:14,320
Speaker 1: So I think it's like it's about our humanity. Yes

1100
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:16,560
Speaker 1: I'm trans, but like I'm so much more than that,

1101
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:19,680
Speaker 1: and every trans person is so much more than that,

1102
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:26,320
Speaker 1: and and this just our humanity, like our like don't

1103
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 1: reduce us to transitions or surgery. You know. I think

1104
00:59:29,600 --> 00:59:32,360
Speaker 1: it's it can be reverally valuable for other trans people

1105
00:59:32,360 --> 00:59:35,720
Speaker 1: to see, you know, trans folks transition online. But like

1106
00:59:36,760 --> 00:59:39,760
Speaker 1: so often people think it's all about that, and it's not.

1107
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:43,440
Speaker 1: It's about a life lived. It's like, yes, I'm I'm

1108
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:45,800
Speaker 1: I love my body, I'm happy with where I'm at,

1109
00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 1: with being done with transition whatever that means, But there's

1110
00:59:49,880 --> 00:59:53,520
Speaker 1: so much more life than like that. Like that. It's

1111
00:59:54,440 --> 00:59:59,600
Speaker 1: the issue is when people don't want to let trans

1112
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:04,080
Speaker 1: people exist, when they're murdering us, when they're misgendering us,

1113
01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:06,760
Speaker 1: when they don't want to let us be in school

1114
01:00:06,800 --> 01:00:10,600
Speaker 1: and and use our right pronouns, and discrimination like trying

1115
01:00:10,600 --> 01:00:13,040
Speaker 1: to ban us from homeless shelters. An employment you know,

1116
01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:15,520
Speaker 1: I'm an employment rate is three times a national average

1117
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:19,840
Speaker 1: UM seventy eight percent of trans kids or bulleting in schools.

1118
01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:23,280
Speaker 1: That's the problem as existing is not the problem people

1119
01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:27,840
Speaker 1: people's insecurity. You know, lean tin price my idol black operating,

1120
01:00:27,920 --> 01:00:30,800
Speaker 1: or would saying you know, um, racism is never the

1121
01:00:30,840 --> 01:00:34,480
Speaker 1: problem of the black artist. It's everybody else's problem. So

1122
01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:38,040
Speaker 1: that so the work really for is everybody else getting

1123
01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:41,440
Speaker 1: getting on board, you know, And I thin people have

1124
01:00:41,600 --> 01:00:44,200
Speaker 1: and people have a lot of feelings about that. I

1125
01:00:44,240 --> 01:00:46,640
Speaker 1: get it. I understand people. People are frustrated I have

1126
01:00:46,720 --> 01:00:49,360
Speaker 1: to use this pronoun now, and like the non binary thing,

1127
01:00:49,360 --> 01:00:51,320
Speaker 1: people a lot of confused it by even other trans

1128
01:00:51,320 --> 01:00:54,080
Speaker 1: people have difficulty with it. And I had difficulty with

1129
01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:58,000
Speaker 1: it and pronounced for a while. But like what I think,

1130
01:00:59,440 --> 01:01:01,920
Speaker 1: it's a bad out. As understanding, particularly as black folks,

1131
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:05,120
Speaker 1: is that we were black people were second class citizens

1132
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 1: for really long time in the United States. In a

1133
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:12,120
Speaker 1: lot of ways, we still are. And this whole inclusivity

1134
01:01:12,160 --> 01:01:14,400
Speaker 1: thing is about acknowledging that we're here, that we have

1135
01:01:14,480 --> 01:01:19,360
Speaker 1: somebody contribute, and that we should have equal access and equity.

1136
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:21,920
Speaker 1: Same thing with transfer. We've always been here, we've been

1137
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:25,400
Speaker 1: second class citizens, and so it just if we're going

1138
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:28,000
Speaker 1: to acknowledge that these folks are here, let's just like

1139
01:01:28,160 --> 01:01:32,360
Speaker 1: respect them and let them be. And it shouldn't affect you.

1140
01:01:32,640 --> 01:01:36,320
Speaker 1: It really shouldn't. And I think that like some men

1141
01:01:36,440 --> 01:01:38,600
Speaker 1: who get upset, like I feel like a lot of

1142
01:01:38,600 --> 01:01:41,120
Speaker 1: men who get upset about trans women, it's like they

1143
01:01:41,200 --> 01:01:44,360
Speaker 1: want to be misogynist and they want to like holler

1144
01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:49,600
Speaker 1: at a girl and like know that she was assigned

1145
01:01:49,600 --> 01:01:52,080
Speaker 1: female at birth, and they get upset, and it's like,

1146
01:01:53,360 --> 01:01:56,120
Speaker 1: that's not my problem, because my problem if you're dragged

1147
01:01:56,160 --> 01:01:58,680
Speaker 1: to me, it's not like my problem that you clicked

1148
01:01:58,840 --> 01:02:00,640
Speaker 1: swipe right on me on a date app like it

1149
01:02:00,840 --> 01:02:04,240
Speaker 1: just unmatched and move on. It's like people get so

1150
01:02:05,160 --> 01:02:09,200
Speaker 1: and then I think, right, you know what I'm saying. Hell,

1151
01:02:11,240 --> 01:02:14,680
Speaker 1: And and for some women, people who are signing female

1152
01:02:14,720 --> 01:02:16,560
Speaker 1: at birth and who are a woman identified who had

1153
01:02:16,600 --> 01:02:19,560
Speaker 1: probably issues who transplant. We're not here to take your spot.

1154
01:02:19,640 --> 01:02:22,560
Speaker 1: We're not here to like we're we can all. There's

1155
01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:24,480
Speaker 1: room enough for all of us, you know. It's a

1156
01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:27,400
Speaker 1: lot of this is about scarcity, and there's enough for

1157
01:02:27,520 --> 01:02:30,280
Speaker 1: there's enough for everyone, right, And it's like we're not

1158
01:02:30,320 --> 01:02:32,120
Speaker 1: a threat. We just want to exist. We want to

1159
01:02:32,160 --> 01:02:37,280
Speaker 1: just live our lives, you know, Laverne Cox. We're being

1160
01:02:37,320 --> 01:02:41,240
Speaker 1: honest with Laverne Cox on Peacock Yes, yes, and Oscars,

1161
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:44,280
Speaker 1: red carpet. That's right, March, that's right, March twelve. Well,

1162
01:02:44,280 --> 01:02:46,400
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us. We appreciate you,

1163
01:02:46,520 --> 01:02:50,080
Speaker 1: and don't be a stranger. Thank you. It's the Breakfast Club,

1164
01:02:50,080 --> 01:02:50,840
Speaker 1: as Laverne Cox