1 00:00:00,960 --> 00:00:05,680 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Big Fish, Small Pop. I'm Andrew Werdahl, 2 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:11,639 Speaker 1: and today is August twelfth, So this Friday, what I'm 3 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:16,119 Speaker 1: doing is following up on the podcast from Wednesday. I 4 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 1: introduced it as part one of this sort of myth 5 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: of the small market Marlins, and this is really the 6 00:00:23,400 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 1: second part of that. In brief, I do recommend you 7 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: listen to the podcast on Wednesday, but just in brief 8 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:33,600 Speaker 1: to catch you up. What I really like have found 9 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:36,240 Speaker 1: is that the Marlins are in a market that could 10 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:39,199 Speaker 1: support a team. They have the population and they have 11 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:44,800 Speaker 1: the income locally to find at least a crowd that could. 12 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:46,480 Speaker 2: Make it to ballgames. 13 00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:49,360 Speaker 1: I mean, we do see that certainly with other sporting 14 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: events in the area with the heat and the Dolphins. 15 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: But you could maybe make an argument that baseball is 16 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:00,280 Speaker 1: in a different space than those sports, but more like 17 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:03,640 Speaker 1: a valid argument that'd be something of an excuse for 18 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 1: the team. And really the whole essence of the myth 19 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:10,560 Speaker 1: of the small market Marlins is that the population is 20 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 1: not the market that the Marlins are reaching. Maybe there's 21 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:16,959 Speaker 1: an argument that the stadium is hard to get to 22 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 1: from the northern parts of South Florida. Maybe there's an 23 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,400 Speaker 1: argument that the Marlins team hasn't been winning. Maybe there's 24 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:28,399 Speaker 1: an argument that the Marlins haven't made a great showing 25 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:31,919 Speaker 1: for the public funds that they took back to build 26 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:35,240 Speaker 1: Marlins Park, but it all seems rather removed with the 27 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:39,399 Speaker 1: way the Marlins business is structured. I do think this 28 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:42,560 Speaker 1: is a major League Baseball issue on the whole, that 29 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:47,280 Speaker 1: Major League Baseball is only really targeting fans that are 30 00:01:47,319 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: into baseball and not the group of people that could 31 00:01:52,120 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 1: be into baseball that potential market. I think they're overlooked 32 00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:58,440 Speaker 1: by things like the Field of Dreams game and Harry 33 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 1: Carey singing take me out to the ballgame. It doesn't 34 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 1: seem like it would register with someone that's totally, like, 35 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:10,359 Speaker 1: not yet into baseball. It would be just some odd 36 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:14,560 Speaker 1: ephemeron in an Ohio cornfield. So I definitely don't mean 37 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:20,359 Speaker 1: some roast on the Marlins specifically that they're missing their market, 38 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: but I do think that is the case, and talking 39 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 1: a bit about that, like, the Marlins obviously have a 40 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 1: major League Baseball team that's like a key part of 41 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 1: their product. In a marketing sense, really what you need 42 00:02:35,880 --> 00:02:40,680 Speaker 1: to consider is what is your product? Can people afford 43 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:42,960 Speaker 1: your product. How are people gonna get to your product, 44 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:45,320 Speaker 1: and how are you like presenting that to them? 45 00:02:45,320 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 2: How are you promoting it? 46 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:49,920 Speaker 1: So really like key to that pretty ironed out is 47 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: like where the Marlins play and what it costs. 48 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 2: But that is like a rather. 49 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:59,799 Speaker 1: Flexible equation usually changes year to year, and it is 50 00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 1: like baseball, it's an unpredictable thing. So the question of 51 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 1: their product is going to be something that changes year 52 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:08,960 Speaker 1: to year, and I want to get into that a 53 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:11,640 Speaker 1: bit in a moment. But it's also really important how 54 00:03:11,639 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 1: the Marlins are promoting the team, how they get the 55 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: eyes of not unsuspecting customers, but the people that aren't 56 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 1: necessarily considering going to a baseball game. How do they 57 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 1: present themselves to that fan and get their attention and get. 58 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 2: Them to the ballpark. 59 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 1: Really it's there that they can sell their merchandise, the concessions, 60 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 1: get their eyes for sponsors, and make that money. The 61 00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 1: actual attendance of the game is only a real portion 62 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: of that equation. But back to the idea of the 63 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: product the Marlins performance on the field, A lot of 64 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 1: people might say there's been subpart for what it needs 65 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:57,880 Speaker 1: to be that the Marlins are not quite playing competitive baseball, 66 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 1: and get into that a bit, the Dodgers really are 67 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:04,720 Speaker 1: who I think of when I think of a team 68 00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:08,840 Speaker 1: that is like consistently delivering a solid product. 69 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 2: They're often in the playoffs. 70 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 1: And they seem to I mean, Baseball Reference estimates about 71 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 1: like two hundred and eighty nine million dollars that they 72 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:20,760 Speaker 1: spend on their payroll, and they draw over forty eight 73 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 1: thousand fans per game, and as much as we are 74 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 1: talking about a different sort of like economic picture in 75 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 1: California and Florida, so it's not like a perfect dress comparison. 76 00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:33,400 Speaker 1: But as we talked about on Wednesday, the fan cost 77 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 1: condex of Miami is only about one hundred and eighty six. 78 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:41,279 Speaker 1: That's about the money it takes a fan to attend 79 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:45,080 Speaker 1: a family four to attend a Marlins game versus the 80 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:49,039 Speaker 1: California FCI of three twenty six. 81 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 2: And that'll like. 82 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 1: Across an eighty one game season, that projects to get 83 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: them about thirty three hundred and nineteen million dollars just 84 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 1: from the of attendance, parking, and concessions, which more than 85 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: covers their payroll. And that certainly is the argument for 86 00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 1: Major League Baseball as a profitable business venture. The model works. 87 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:16,719 Speaker 1: People will spend money to see a great product on 88 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 1: the field. But in the new market like Miami, and 89 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:22,800 Speaker 1: it is a new market for Major League Baseball relative 90 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:27,280 Speaker 1: to the long history of the Los Angeles Dodgers, is 91 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 1: that the sort of if you build it, they will 92 00:05:29,600 --> 00:05:32,760 Speaker 1: come business model doesn't quite work as well, or at 93 00:05:32,839 --> 00:05:35,760 Speaker 1: least it doesn't seem to be working quite as well. 94 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 1: Credit where it's due for Miami, they have like done 95 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:41,880 Speaker 1: a lot of things to like keep the Marlins on 96 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:45,039 Speaker 1: the airwaves. They've got a new TV broadcasting deal and 97 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 1: stadium rights, and they have been able to get some 98 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:50,560 Speaker 1: free agents to improve the team. 99 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:52,360 Speaker 2: But what we haven't. 100 00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: Seen is a substantial change to the course of the franchise. 101 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 1: They've done little to shift away from like the Lauria 102 00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 1: esque ownership narrative pinching any penny they can get. And 103 00:06:02,480 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: there is opportunity in the market with those unaware of 104 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 1: the intricacies of baseball, and the Marlins have the potential 105 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 1: to develop a fan base and that means literally growing 106 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:20,320 Speaker 1: the game in a grassroots sense. While you have a 107 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:24,120 Speaker 1: whole geographic area as you're like domain for the Marlins, 108 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: you also have a bunch of like savvy customers who 109 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: might not want to take that risk of spending thirty 110 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:34,239 Speaker 1: five dollars on a ticket and being disappointed with their time. 111 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 1: I mean, like the worst thing would be if they 112 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 1: wish that they just spent that money at AMC Theaters. 113 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:42,240 Speaker 1: It would just validate their choice to have missed out 114 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:45,600 Speaker 1: on the Marlins to this point. So personally, I think 115 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 1: the Marlins should do something to really ease that. Something 116 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:54,599 Speaker 1: like issuing a single free ticket to every individual Miami 117 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: Dade resident could help fill the stadium for like a 118 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:02,719 Speaker 1: good while and make good on the desk to be paid. 119 00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:03,599 Speaker 2: By the county. 120 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:08,839 Speaker 1: Estimates are in the Wednesday episode, but it does seem 121 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:11,400 Speaker 1: that the Miami Dade County will spend quite a lot 122 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 1: of money to have this Marlins team locally and as 123 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 1: a publicly funded stadium, you could maybe argue that there's 124 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 1: some sort of like civic obligation to be giving back 125 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 1: to that taxpayer, and that really hasn't quite been done 126 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 1: by the Marlins. So in a way giving a free 127 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 1: ticket to every single person, not in like some like 128 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:36,600 Speaker 1: long tendered, sustained way, just simply like a single ticket 129 00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: to every single person that has to be like booked 130 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:43,360 Speaker 1: online and advance something to like, you know, just like 131 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:46,960 Speaker 1: encourage people to tune into the Marlins and get over 132 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,000 Speaker 1: those like sort of jitters about whether or not they're 133 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 1: going to have a good time at the ballgame. It's 134 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:55,720 Speaker 1: certainly a strong gesture, and it is definitely a gesture. 135 00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 1: It could be used to heavily. They could be like 136 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:02,000 Speaker 1: heavily promoted itself and utilize to like promote the team, 137 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:05,080 Speaker 1: the season, the players, and it could be delivered in 138 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:10,600 Speaker 1: tandem with more like literal efforts of growing the game, 139 00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:14,160 Speaker 1: like getting gloves in the hands of kids and building 140 00:08:14,240 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: ball fields to help the sport stick with people that 141 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:22,040 Speaker 1: it might not otherwise even reach. I know, personally, I 142 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 1: owe a lot to my family for getting me into baseball, 143 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:27,760 Speaker 1: and all the research seems to point to the fact 144 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:32,880 Speaker 1: that access is very important to getting people into baseball, 145 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 1: and also that access isn't always there. Teams like the 146 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:41,920 Speaker 1: Yankees do give like free tickets to like nonprofits locally 147 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:46,319 Speaker 1: things like that, but this would be a real radical effort. 148 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 1: I think it'd be something that would really put to 149 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 1: the test the term small market and to actually put 150 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 1: the market to the test give like families just this 151 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 1: ticket in hand to then plan ahead a time that 152 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:04,000 Speaker 1: they could go to a game that they want to 153 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:06,840 Speaker 1: go that works for them and check it out. 154 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:09,840 Speaker 2: Maybe they stick, maybe they buy more tickets. 155 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 1: Certainly they'll be there buying concessions, maybe some merchandise too. 156 00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:16,679 Speaker 1: It really might be a thing that even like helps 157 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 1: that like per capita figure for other expenses, and maybe 158 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 1: you have the like the cheap skates or like whatever 159 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: sort of It's hard to imagine that you would get 160 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:31,600 Speaker 1: like unruly behavior or whatever it is that you could 161 00:09:31,679 --> 00:09:35,520 Speaker 1: be afraid of from the fan. More likely, it seems 162 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 1: like you'd get a crowd who's there eager to see 163 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 1: a baseball game behind the player, and a different atmosphere 164 00:09:43,440 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 1: at Lone Depot Park. Personally, I don't think that there's 165 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:51,840 Speaker 1: any way everyone in South Florida fully understands baseball fully 166 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:54,520 Speaker 1: understand like the change of dynamics between like strike one 167 00:09:54,559 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 1: and strike two. There's certainly a lot of like possible 168 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:01,760 Speaker 1: fans that just aren't there yet in terms of knowledge. 169 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:04,240 Speaker 1: I know personally I've had to teach people the game, 170 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 1: and the Marlins certainly have the right platform to educate, 171 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:11,839 Speaker 1: But the approach we've seen from Bruce Sherman's Marlins Derek 172 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 1: Jeter in all is offering more baseball to people who 173 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:19,000 Speaker 1: already know that they want baseball and already have it. 174 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:22,959 Speaker 1: It's really that like Field of Dreams in a sense 175 00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 1: of if you've already seen Field of Dreams and understand 176 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:30,080 Speaker 1: that it's implications, maybe you'll want to come to what 177 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: they built. But that's not the way everyone thinks. Into 178 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:38,160 Speaker 1: the Marlins, an empty stadium seat costs just as much 179 00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:41,240 Speaker 1: as one that's full, while they are losing out on 180 00:10:41,280 --> 00:10:45,119 Speaker 1: those potential concessions merchandise and eyes for your sponsors. 181 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 2: And it's that sort of like unorthodox. 182 00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 1: Move that you would hope to see from a team 183 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:54,360 Speaker 1: that's trying to get ahead of the competition. And maybe 184 00:10:54,400 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 1: in a market that's like seemingly saturated like the Dodgers 185 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,559 Speaker 1: have no issue selling out, you might fear that lowers 186 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:02,560 Speaker 1: like the value of attending the game to get that 187 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:06,240 Speaker 1: free ticket. But for Miami, in an aggressive push now 188 00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:12,319 Speaker 1: to lower those barriers of access now might lower them 189 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:14,880 Speaker 1: for the future as more people have a good time 190 00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: at Lone Nebo Park and want to come back again 191 00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: soon next year or tomorrow. It's exactly the sort of 192 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:26,319 Speaker 1: promotion that would reach further. 193 00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:26,960 Speaker 2: Than just a discount. 194 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:31,359 Speaker 1: So rather than thinking about Miami as a small market, 195 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 1: it seems more that it's a market that's just improperly set. 196 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: The effort could certainly still be done to change that, 197 00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 1: but it does seem like an effort certainly needs to 198 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 1: be made to change that. So for Bigfish, Small Pod, 199 00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 1: I've been to Andrew Rdull. Today is the twelfth. This weekend, 200 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: the Atlanta Braves are in town for four games, a 201 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 1: doubleheader day night on Saturday, with your typical evening start 202 00:11:58,120 --> 00:12:01,400 Speaker 1: time tomorrow. The Fish Stripes Live will be with you 203 00:12:02,280 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 1: before the game. Check it out, and if anything happens 204 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:08,040 Speaker 1: between now and then with the Marlins, you'll hear it 205 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:09,840 Speaker 1: there on Fish Strips. 206 00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:13,040 Speaker 2: Thank you for listening. I'll be back with you next week.