WEBVTT - Ready, Jetset ... Can't Go 0:00:01.320 --> 0:00:05.720 Michael Houston, chief market analyst c MC Market's UK been 0:00:05.760 --> 0:00:09.040 in the business well in excess of thirty years now, 0:00:09.320 --> 0:00:12.360 so getting a bit along in the tooth. I suppose 0:00:12.840 --> 0:00:16.239 I don't really have the inclination to want to go 0:00:16.320 --> 0:00:20.560 abroad at the moment, given the images on TV of 0:00:21.040 --> 0:00:26.400 lost luggage, disruptions to travel plans, the delays. You know, 0:00:26.440 --> 0:00:28.480 who needs that if you want to leave the country. 0:00:28.560 --> 0:00:31.000 You want to leave the country. You know, it's sort 0:00:31.040 --> 0:00:34.239 of either recharge your batteries or be prepared to do 0:00:34.280 --> 0:00:37.640 a business meeting, none of which is what is happening 0:00:37.680 --> 0:00:52.559 in airports is conducive to that mindset. I'm David Merritt 0:00:52.640 --> 0:00:55.920 here in the London studio. This is in the City 0:00:55.920 --> 0:00:59.000 Bloomberg's podcast, connecting you to the stories at the heart 0:00:59.080 --> 0:01:03.040 of the city of them. As I sit traps in 0:01:03.040 --> 0:01:05.600 our London office with the forty degree heat outside and 0:01:05.640 --> 0:01:08.920 what is one of the hottest days ever in Britain, 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:13.360 with transport grinding to a halt, tales of piled up 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:18.400 luggage at airports, strikes on the railways, We've been thinking 0:01:18.400 --> 0:01:21.480 about how the golden age of business travel is there 0:01:21.560 --> 0:01:25.440 ever coming back? My co host Franci Lacwise actually on 0:01:25.560 --> 0:01:29.040 location in Rome as we speak. Francine, Hello, hey, Dave, 0:01:29.200 --> 0:01:31.720 ye here covering the political crisis in Rome. I have 0:01:31.840 --> 0:01:35.360 to acknowledge that your intrepid reporter, who usually loves traveling 0:01:35.400 --> 0:01:38.080 for work, is now actually dreading going to the airport 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:39.880 because I'm told I need to be there five hours, 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:42.880 five hours in advance to make sure I don't miss 0:01:42.880 --> 0:01:45.759 any flights. And every time the Italian government collapses, which 0:01:45.840 --> 0:01:48.560 is quite regularly, of course, now you've got to be there, right, 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:51.480 It's only choice. Exactly in this time, Dave, So, I 0:01:51.520 --> 0:01:53.080 was in the Guri on the north of between my 0:01:53.120 --> 0:01:56.000 hometown on holiday, and I was like, right, I have 0:01:56.160 --> 0:01:58.240 to go back to London because I have no makeup, 0:01:58.280 --> 0:02:01.400 I had no TV clothes, I was holiday. But then 0:02:01.440 --> 0:02:04.360 I actually decided to just go directly to Rome on 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:07.160 the train because I just knew how difficult it would 0:02:07.160 --> 0:02:10.519 have been at the airport otherwise. So seven and a 0:02:10.560 --> 0:02:14.120 half hours, seven and a half hours on an Italian train, 0:02:14.720 --> 0:02:17.920 no air conditioning was working. You know, it wasn't that fun. 0:02:21.639 --> 0:02:24.239 It's a complete mess. The question is is it enough 0:02:24.280 --> 0:02:28.720 of a mess for business people to lose interest in Travel. 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:32.440 We'll put that question to Martin Ferguson at American Express 0:02:32.680 --> 0:02:37.120 Global Business Travel and to understand what is happening and 0:02:37.120 --> 0:02:39.880 how it all went wrong. Francine spoke to Paul Charles. 0:02:40.040 --> 0:02:43.519 He's the chief executive officer of the PC Agency, which 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:47.120 which provides travel insight and policy advice to governments and 0:02:47.240 --> 0:02:50.400 global travel brands, and he's also the former director of 0:02:50.440 --> 0:02:55.040 Communications of Virgin Atlantic. Paul, thank you so much for 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:58.760 joining us. Can you just reassure me this is a nightmare. 0:02:58.760 --> 0:03:02.480 It's not just me. Difficult to get anywhere, luggage doesn't arrive, 0:03:02.840 --> 0:03:05.760 there are not enough customs people. You're right. All over 0:03:05.800 --> 0:03:08.320 the world people are being affected. It's not just a 0:03:08.600 --> 0:03:12.200 UK issue at Europe issue, but even in places like 0:03:12.320 --> 0:03:18.080 Canada there are major issues. And essentially the aviation industry 0:03:18.120 --> 0:03:20.720 in the travel industry more widely has been struggling to 0:03:20.880 --> 0:03:23.280 get out of the pandemic, to get out of this 0:03:23.400 --> 0:03:27.400 mode of lockdown for the last two years, and people's 0:03:27.480 --> 0:03:31.080 lives have been changed. And there are quite a few people, 0:03:31.280 --> 0:03:33.760 sadly who are laid off from the industry during the 0:03:33.840 --> 0:03:37.200 pandemic and they don't want to go back into the industry. 0:03:37.320 --> 0:03:40.240 And work in jobs where they feel they're not paid enough, 0:03:40.680 --> 0:03:46.080 perhaps as a baggage handler or cabin crew or security processor. 0:03:46.640 --> 0:03:51.560 And as a result, the industry easily has twenty gaps 0:03:51.680 --> 0:03:55.280 in his workforce globally, and therefore you've got all this 0:03:55.400 --> 0:03:58.720 consumer demand to travel. Everybody is desperate to go and 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:02.520 see friends and family again. But the airlines and airports 0:04:02.600 --> 0:04:06.120 can't deliver the service that we have bought because of 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:08.840 those staff shortages. So that's the issue. Do you have 0:04:08.880 --> 0:04:12.920 any sympathy for airlines and do you have any sympathy 0:04:13.000 --> 0:04:15.480 for airports or is this a hundre percent self inflicted? 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:18.960 I have huge sympathy for airlines and airport do you, 0:04:19.560 --> 0:04:21.960 especially as I used to work for one of them. 0:04:22.360 --> 0:04:25.640 I imagine yourself as the boss, the CEO of an 0:04:25.640 --> 0:04:29.400 airline or an airport. You have had to face constantly 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:32.799 changing government restrictions all over the world. You've had traffic 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:36.719 light systems, travel corridors, and you've had two years of 0:04:36.800 --> 0:04:40.920 that changing. So imagine trying to plan your business. It's 0:04:40.960 --> 0:04:43.000 impossible to plan. That's what you're paid for as a 0:04:43.080 --> 0:04:46.560 chief executive. You are, but you're paid also to manage 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:50.560 a business during a predictable environment, and governments around the 0:04:50.560 --> 0:04:54.080 world and partly obviously because of the pandemic has forced 0:04:54.120 --> 0:04:57.920 on them a totally unpredictable and uncertain situation. And the 0:04:57.920 --> 0:05:00.839 thing about airlines, because of the safety conscious nature of 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:04.440 that industry, you can't just make a decision overnight ready 0:05:04.440 --> 0:05:08.080 for tomorrow. It takes time to implement that decisions because 0:05:08.080 --> 0:05:10.120 pol of would have security checks, So if you're a 0:05:10.160 --> 0:05:12.440 baggage handler, you need to be checked for how long 0:05:12.480 --> 0:05:15.200 does it take for actually to get on boarded? So 0:05:15.279 --> 0:05:17.640 traditionally it would have taken four weeks to get a 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:20.960 security past, and of course everybody working in an airport 0:05:21.080 --> 0:05:23.599 or in an airline needs a security past, but now 0:05:23.680 --> 0:05:26.640 it's been taking upwards of ten weeks, and that slower 0:05:26.680 --> 0:05:29.200 processing time has meant that people could not be on 0:05:29.240 --> 0:05:32.279 board a quickly to help fill those gaps that the 0:05:32.360 --> 0:05:35.520 industry has. And if you think about it, many countries 0:05:35.560 --> 0:05:38.960 have only just recently come online. They've they've only just 0:05:39.080 --> 0:05:42.680 seen their border restrictions removed in the last few weeks. 0:05:42.800 --> 0:05:44.680 Then it takes three or four months to get new 0:05:44.680 --> 0:05:46.800 people in. But part of why were they laid off 0:05:46.800 --> 0:05:48.440 in the first place, I mean, I have. I've just 0:05:48.480 --> 0:05:50.120 come back from a horrific trips, so let me tell 0:05:50.160 --> 0:05:54.720 you my sympathy is like zero zero zero two. If 0:05:54.720 --> 0:05:56.520 you know that it's difficult to recruit, if you know 0:05:56.560 --> 0:05:59.120 that it's difficult to get security clear ends, why do 0:05:59.160 --> 0:06:01.160 you lay off people in the middle of a pandemic? 0:06:02.520 --> 0:06:04.839 Or you lay them off because the governments are giving 0:06:04.880 --> 0:06:07.680 you no indication that things are going to improve, And 0:06:07.839 --> 0:06:11.800 without that line of communication certainty, why would you have 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:14.120 that cost You're under pressure to reduce your costs to 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:18.880 save your airline or your airport which is losing millions 0:06:19.120 --> 0:06:21.680 and millions of pounds. But in the UK they were 0:06:21.720 --> 0:06:25.640 follow programs. There were, but they only lasted until September 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:28.800 last year, and of course then the Omicron variant came 0:06:28.839 --> 0:06:31.400 along and everybody locked down again, but there was no 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:34.520 extension of the furlough scheme. So as an airline, why 0:06:34.560 --> 0:06:37.279 would you be employing lots of people knowing that the 0:06:37.279 --> 0:06:39.920 government was again locking down your industry with no end 0:06:39.960 --> 0:06:42.839 in sight. And so a lot of it's down to 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:46.640 government communication with airlines and airports, and it didn't enable 0:06:46.720 --> 0:06:50.080 bosses to put in place there their management structures properly 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:52.120 and of course they lost lots of talent. Lots of 0:06:52.200 --> 0:06:55.000 senior talent disappeared as well. So not only are you 0:06:55.720 --> 0:06:59.680 where they're some of retired. They've gone to sectors that 0:06:59.720 --> 0:07:03.080 paid more money, like Amazon with golden handshakes of at 0:07:03.120 --> 0:07:05.800 least a thousand dollars in many cases at lower levels. 0:07:06.320 --> 0:07:09.239 They've seen the light in other sectors and and perhaps 0:07:09.279 --> 0:07:12.000 people because they were locked down for so long, they've 0:07:12.000 --> 0:07:14.559 had time to think about what they appreciate in life 0:07:14.560 --> 0:07:16.840 and where they want to work. So a PARSTI what 0:07:16.880 --> 0:07:20.240 happens now? Is there anything that you know that airlines 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:23.800 can do to recruit, for example, baggage handlers faster, and 0:07:23.880 --> 0:07:26.480 when do we get back to something more normal? Well, 0:07:26.480 --> 0:07:30.080 the first thing is that it's been a terrible situation 0:07:30.200 --> 0:07:32.840 for so many thousands of people, and it can't go on. 0:07:32.960 --> 0:07:35.920 Something's got to change, as you say, because there's been 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:40.800 enormous emotional and financial stress for so many individuals, couples 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:42.920 and families traveling and all the knock on effects that 0:07:42.920 --> 0:07:45.360 go with that. So the airlines have got to change. 0:07:45.560 --> 0:07:48.200 The way things can change is for government to speed 0:07:48.280 --> 0:07:51.000 up the security processing so that more people can come 0:07:51.040 --> 0:07:54.920 into the industry. Faster for airlines and airports to raise 0:07:55.000 --> 0:07:58.239 wage rates, and of course during a high inflation period 0:07:58.480 --> 0:08:00.600 they're under pressure to do that any way in order 0:08:00.600 --> 0:08:03.640 to avoid strike action by so much of the workforce. 0:08:03.960 --> 0:08:05.480 But they're going to have to pay more. They're gonna 0:08:05.520 --> 0:08:08.760 have to reset the level of wages. And then thirdly, 0:08:09.240 --> 0:08:11.800 it needs governments to help the industry. I think and 0:08:11.840 --> 0:08:15.200 showcase how attractive it is because it is a great industry. 0:08:15.280 --> 0:08:19.120 You do get to travel in many cases, you get 0:08:19.160 --> 0:08:21.080 to meet lots of different types of people during the 0:08:21.160 --> 0:08:23.360 day job. And I think it needs governments to talk 0:08:23.440 --> 0:08:26.320 up the industry more. Is there an air report that's 0:08:26.320 --> 0:08:27.880 west in the class at the moment or do the 0:08:27.880 --> 0:08:30.240 problems kind of move around? Well in the UK the 0:08:30.320 --> 0:08:32.880 worst he throw and get a work in London, they 0:08:32.880 --> 0:08:37.360 are there. Two worth affected Stands has done a lot 0:08:37.360 --> 0:08:39.840 better in terms of cancelations and cues. It has been 0:08:39.880 --> 0:08:42.680 a lot better in managing the flow. That's also because 0:08:42.720 --> 0:08:45.600 it has more shorthaul flights and not long haul flights, 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:48.640 and that's making a difference. Of course, in terms of 0:08:48.640 --> 0:08:52.360 passenger processing the short haul flights, there's often less luggage 0:08:52.400 --> 0:08:54.400 to process than there is for a long haul flight. 0:08:54.679 --> 0:08:56.840 So that's why those airports are doing well, and places 0:08:56.880 --> 0:08:59.200 like Leads Bradford have done really well and so so 0:08:59.240 --> 0:09:02.280 there's regionally. Pots have actually coped pretty well. Manchester hasn't. 0:09:02.559 --> 0:09:05.079 They've had a change of chairman as a result and 0:09:05.520 --> 0:09:07.880 they're now getting a bit better. But it's gonna be 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:10.360 a tougher summer for everybody. You can expect to be 0:09:10.440 --> 0:09:13.880 in delays and cueues this summer simply because there are 0:09:13.920 --> 0:09:17.120 so many people traveling. What why is it so tough 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:20.040 for he throwing Getwick. Heathrow is meant to be best 0:09:20.040 --> 0:09:24.520 in class. It certainly was, I think during the pandemic. 0:09:24.800 --> 0:09:27.280 Obviously it led to a decline in investment. They had 0:09:27.360 --> 0:09:30.080 less revenue coming into they haven't invested in the baggage 0:09:30.120 --> 0:09:32.640 systems as much as they needed to. They've had a 0:09:32.640 --> 0:09:35.240 lot of I T issues, they've lost a lot of staff, 0:09:35.520 --> 0:09:37.480 and when you put all of these things together, it's 0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:39.880 no wonder that it's been difficult to run an airport. 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:43.840 It goes back also to COVID. There's another wave of 0:09:43.880 --> 0:09:47.040 COVID going through where people are calling in sick at 0:09:47.040 --> 0:09:49.920 the last minute, and when that happens, you simply find 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:52.640 that your your people down. You can't run the operation 0:09:52.720 --> 0:09:55.600 as smoothly are you catching? How many flights are you 0:09:55.640 --> 0:09:59.160 catching this summer? So I just heard from British Airways 0:09:59.160 --> 0:10:02.760 that my flight been canceled for our family holiday. So 0:10:02.840 --> 0:10:05.880 as you can imagine, um, even the experts get caught 0:10:05.920 --> 0:10:09.480 out and I've had to rebook on another carrier pretty quickly. 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:12.480 But bear in mind the capacity is not back to 0:10:12.520 --> 0:10:15.240 where it was pre pandemic. Overall, flight capacities still only 0:10:15.880 --> 0:10:18.520 of what it was, and so there are fewer flights 0:10:18.640 --> 0:10:20.760 generally that you can book onto if your own has 0:10:20.800 --> 0:10:23.319 been canceled. It's a real challenge for a lot of people. 0:10:23.880 --> 0:10:29.040 As the French would say, bunch, thank you. You know, 0:10:29.120 --> 0:10:31.280 me and my wife we go to Scotland three or 0:10:31.320 --> 0:10:33.600 four times a year and we used to fly with 0:10:33.640 --> 0:10:36.920 easy Check from Gatwick Airport. You know, I cannot be bothered. 0:10:37.400 --> 0:10:39.840 I get in the car and I drive and I 0:10:39.960 --> 0:10:42.840 break it up over two days. So we drive halfway 0:10:42.840 --> 0:10:45.280 from Manchester, stay in the Premier in overnight and then 0:10:45.360 --> 0:10:47.280 drive the rest of the way and you know what, 0:10:47.520 --> 0:10:56.600 it's so much more relaxing. So we just heard Francine 0:10:56.679 --> 0:10:59.800 speaking to Paul Charles for an explanation of why there 0:10:59.800 --> 0:11:02.800 are so many scenes of chaotic travel across the news. 0:11:02.880 --> 0:11:06.360 But now let's discuss what this means to business travel 0:11:06.559 --> 0:11:12.760 moving forward. I'm Rebecca Chestsworth and the senior exety strategists 0:11:12.800 --> 0:11:16.439 at spider Ets, which is part of State Streets Global Advisors. 0:11:17.240 --> 0:11:20.280 I have been working in markets for quite a long 0:11:20.360 --> 0:11:23.200 period of time, but it's this way. I remember the 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:26.160 good old days of the when budgets were very high 0:11:26.200 --> 0:11:30.200 in the champagne was blowing. For me, business travel was 0:11:30.320 --> 0:11:35.040 quite different because my role was different. So uh. When 0:11:35.040 --> 0:11:37.280 I first started, I worked just in u text Is 0:11:37.320 --> 0:11:39.600 as an analyst and then as a fund manager, and 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:42.120 then most of my clients were UK based, so the 0:11:42.200 --> 0:11:47.720 travel was shorter, but there were always a few hotels, restaurants, shops, 0:11:48.920 --> 0:11:51.840 production facilities that needed to be seen on the continent 0:11:51.960 --> 0:11:54.320 or in America, and when one flew, it was always 0:11:54.320 --> 0:12:08.599 in style. Joining me now is Martin Ferguson is the 0:12:08.679 --> 0:12:12.640 vice president of Communications and Public Affairs and American Express 0:12:12.760 --> 0:12:15.600 Global Business Travel. There are a travel management company that 0:12:15.640 --> 0:12:19.760 also provides consulting services. Welcome Martin too in the city. 0:12:20.160 --> 0:12:23.080 Thanks for how immediately so Martin a lot of the 0:12:23.120 --> 0:12:25.600 workers in the city that we speak to have got 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:28.560 the same complaints. Just getting around the place is not 0:12:28.640 --> 0:12:31.840 as easy as it was. It's not just the cus airports, 0:12:31.840 --> 0:12:33.719 and we've seen the footage of that, of course on 0:12:33.760 --> 0:12:36.520 the news, but also we've got rail strikes, we've got 0:12:36.559 --> 0:12:38.960 traffic jams are getting worse. There's a real sense that, 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:42.360 you know, the glory days of the jet setting city 0:12:42.400 --> 0:12:46.560 worker are gone forever. Do you agree, first of all, 0:12:46.559 --> 0:12:50.840 that nor one likes disruption, what un certainty? And I 0:12:50.880 --> 0:12:53.520 think it's fair to see that maybe a few people, 0:12:53.640 --> 0:12:56.920 whether their business travelers or whether people who are going 0:12:56.920 --> 0:13:00.720 on hard they decided to avoid the airport and avoid 0:13:00.760 --> 0:13:04.520 flights and maybe not go on the train. And that's fine, 0:13:04.559 --> 0:13:08.679 But I honestly think that's quite a small number, um, 0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:13.320 because I think more generally, UM, this situation is very 0:13:13.400 --> 0:13:16.439 unusual time that we find ourselves in has really not 0:13:16.520 --> 0:13:19.960 put people off travel at all. In fact that I 0:13:20.000 --> 0:13:22.960 think travel is back in a really, really big way. 0:13:23.720 --> 0:13:26.160 It's just a difficult time because you know, it's like 0:13:26.200 --> 0:13:29.560 kin a perfect storm of post pandemic challenges. But you know, 0:13:29.679 --> 0:13:33.240 most people realize that this is a shot to medium 0:13:33.360 --> 0:13:36.000 term challenge and that we are going to get through it. 0:13:36.640 --> 0:13:39.120 So do you think therefore the the demand for the 0:13:39.200 --> 0:13:43.040 kind of the more premium and that's where the growth 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:45.400 were held up because people need the flexible tickets, don't 0:13:45.400 --> 0:13:47.400 they They need to know that it's going to be 0:13:47.640 --> 0:13:49.840 changeable the last minute. They need to know they're gonna 0:13:49.920 --> 0:13:51.640 there's gonna be a certain level of comfort that it's 0:13:51.640 --> 0:13:54.839 going to actually all go smoothly to achieve the ends 0:13:54.840 --> 0:13:58.960 of the of their trip. So business travel, which is 0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:03.240 something like three quotas of airlines pre pandemic profits but 0:14:03.280 --> 0:14:06.800 only about twelve of the seats, do you see that 0:14:07.040 --> 0:14:10.800 demand holding up even in a difficult economic situation that 0:14:10.840 --> 0:14:12.199 we found us out saying my companies are going to 0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:15.080 have to cut costs. It's true to see that. You know, 0:14:15.360 --> 0:14:18.160 airlines for the most part, make most of their money 0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:21.840 and sell few the fewest number of seats to business travelers. 0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:24.440 And I think that's why, you know, business travelers are 0:14:24.440 --> 0:14:27.560 obviously not immune from the situation at the moment. But 0:14:27.840 --> 0:14:29.840 let's just see, if you're an airline and you're looking 0:14:29.840 --> 0:14:33.120 at the network and the frequency of the flights and 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:36.160 the numbers you're you're less likely to to pull or 0:14:36.280 --> 0:14:41.280 cancel the profitable business route than you are let's say 0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:45.320 a less frequent leisure route. I think that just makes 0:14:45.480 --> 0:14:47.960 makes business sense. And then, of course you take into 0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:51.240 account that business travelers will book closer to the day 0:14:51.280 --> 0:14:55.320 of departure. So while airlines are making great efforts to 0:14:55.800 --> 0:14:58.480 cancel flights when they have to away in advance, it 0:14:58.520 --> 0:15:02.520 means it's less likely that the business traveler gets affected. 0:15:02.560 --> 0:15:05.400 Of course, that's not for all. Business travelers are still 0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:08.040 going to be a tremendous amount of of of of 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.560 last minute pain, both in terms of flights being canceled 0:15:11.640 --> 0:15:13.760 and at the airport and long cuise and so forth. 0:15:14.040 --> 0:15:16.240 You know, people have changed careers, haven't they. They've left 0:15:16.280 --> 0:15:19.320 the industry. Um, it's not going to be overnight to 0:15:19.360 --> 0:15:22.320 get them back. How long do you see this period 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:29.200 of chaos of staff shortages, last thing? When can things 0:15:29.240 --> 0:15:31.200 get more back to normal? Is it the end of 0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:33.960 the year, is it into three? I think it would 0:15:34.000 --> 0:15:36.280 be foolish of me to try and make that kind 0:15:36.280 --> 0:15:38.200 of prediction. In what I can tell use that there's 0:15:38.200 --> 0:15:41.040 a tremendous amount of their front and investment we made 0:15:41.080 --> 0:15:45.120 across the travel industry. Everybody is working as fast and 0:15:45.160 --> 0:15:48.120 as hard as they can to to get to where 0:15:48.160 --> 0:15:50.960 they need to be. But remember business travels are very 0:15:51.120 --> 0:15:55.320 large and resilience sector and it's historically grown at or 0:15:55.400 --> 0:16:01.280 above g d p U. And look, this period of 0:16:01.360 --> 0:16:04.440 disruption is more acute than any other, but there have 0:16:04.680 --> 0:16:08.880 been previous disruptions that have caused problem. So the aftermath 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:12.920 of September eleven on the global financial crisis in two 0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:15.840 thousand and eight. In both situations, you know, there was 0:16:15.880 --> 0:16:20.880 a period of view challenge and difficulty before a sustained 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:24.120 period of growth once things had realigned. So I fully 0:16:24.160 --> 0:16:27.160 expect us to to get back to the industry, to 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:31.000 get back to that level. Hi, my name is Kidju 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:33.920 because I'm head of foreign exchange strategy at the Journal 0:16:34.080 --> 0:16:36.640 in London. I would have said, actually a few months ago, 0:16:36.840 --> 0:16:38.280 you know, I'm not sure I ever want to travel 0:16:38.400 --> 0:16:43.000 this distent because my my relationship with business travels certainly 0:16:43.040 --> 0:16:46.040 deteriorated up nine eleven when when security started to get 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:49.000 so much more difficult. But going out and meeting other 0:16:49.040 --> 0:16:53.120 people in different cities, different countries, um, it's just fun. 0:16:53.200 --> 0:16:56.360 It's what they wanted. It's it strikes me as it's 0:16:56.400 --> 0:16:59.200 at least as important for business now as it evil was. 0:17:01.480 --> 0:17:04.960 How has the purpose of business travel changed as we 0:17:05.000 --> 0:17:08.720 emerge from from the pandemic. But I think there is 0:17:08.760 --> 0:17:14.240 going to be a fundamental shift related to part of 0:17:14.280 --> 0:17:20.840 what business travel addresses, and that's supporting the development and 0:17:21.200 --> 0:17:24.399 growth of company culture. And just let me explain what 0:17:24.440 --> 0:17:28.080 I mean by that. For many companies, not all, but 0:17:28.200 --> 0:17:31.679 for many companies that the office was the center of 0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:35.439 culture because almost everybody was there. It might be Monday 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:38.560 to Friday, it might be ninetel five. That's kind of 0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:40.879 been blown out the water now for many companies, again 0:17:40.920 --> 0:17:43.320 not all. Some companies have got everybody back, but for 0:17:43.400 --> 0:17:47.680 many companies are now having to embrace a more hybrid 0:17:47.800 --> 0:17:52.439 workforce or even in many cases and almost entirely virtual workforce. 0:17:52.880 --> 0:17:55.480 That that's something that brings with it its own challenges. 0:17:55.920 --> 0:17:59.359 I mean, on one hand, that provides tremendous flexibility for 0:17:59.680 --> 0:18:02.879 your your staff, but on the other hand, they're not 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:06.919 really having those interactions that they used to have together 0:18:06.960 --> 0:18:09.760 when they were all in the office. So companies now 0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:13.119 need to be really thoughtful about how they can bring 0:18:13.200 --> 0:18:18.120 together their their dispersed workforces, how they can gather them 0:18:18.160 --> 0:18:23.040 in ways that develop bonds, that create culture and and 0:18:23.080 --> 0:18:26.760 make that kind of employee experience far more valuable, which 0:18:26.800 --> 0:18:29.399 should in turn that I have loyalty and keep people 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:31.760 with your business for longer. So I think this is 0:18:31.800 --> 0:18:35.399 actually one of the most important changes that we've seen 0:18:36.240 --> 0:18:38.159 in the business travel sector. And just to give you 0:18:38.160 --> 0:18:42.160 an example, you know, there was a there was an 0:18:42.200 --> 0:18:45.879 idea during the pandemic that you know, business travel volumes 0:18:45.880 --> 0:18:49.399 would dropped to of pre pandemic levels and never recover 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:51.840 beyond that, and that no one would ever travel for 0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:55.399 an internal meeting again because we've got video conference and technology. 0:18:55.920 --> 0:18:59.960 I mean, we obviously thought that was shortsighted and nonsensical 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:02.720 at that time, but maybe what we didn't expect was 0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:05.400 that in this kind of first year have been back 0:19:05.400 --> 0:19:09.280 out traveling again. Internal travel has grown faster than any 0:19:09.280 --> 0:19:12.040 other type of travel, and that's because companies are trying 0:19:12.080 --> 0:19:14.320 to get their people back together again. You know, people 0:19:14.359 --> 0:19:17.160 have gone a long time without seeing their colleagues, without 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:20.480 maybe even meeting colleagues for the first time. And what's 0:19:20.480 --> 0:19:23.399 really interesting is you've kind of got this release of 0:19:23.520 --> 0:19:26.680 human energy that's been built up while people have been 0:19:26.720 --> 0:19:30.280 working on plans and ideas in their kitchens and their 0:19:30.320 --> 0:19:32.920 living rooms, in their home offices, and now they only 0:19:32.960 --> 0:19:35.280 ta get back together to put these plans into action. 0:19:35.359 --> 0:19:39.800 It's actually a really extraordinary to watch. Well. I've traveled. 0:19:39.880 --> 0:19:42.719 I've done a type of fine trips this year, and 0:19:43.080 --> 0:19:45.560 for me, that's great. It's great to be back on 0:19:45.600 --> 0:19:48.679 the road. The travel is not as easy, but I 0:19:48.720 --> 0:19:53.000 actually think that act of meeting your clients, being in 0:19:53.040 --> 0:19:56.560 the same room, really understanding what their problems are and 0:19:56.560 --> 0:19:59.200 how you can help them, is really worth that extra 0:19:59.280 --> 0:20:02.120 effort and that incan you have to go through now. 0:20:05.040 --> 0:20:08.600 Transport Secretary Grant Shops did recently say after meeting with 0:20:09.119 --> 0:20:12.280 industry aviation industry leaders. I think the quote was that 0:20:12.400 --> 0:20:15.520 there was poor planning and overbooked flights they cannot service 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:18.440 and kind of pointing the finger from Grant Shops at 0:20:18.480 --> 0:20:21.560 the industry and airlines and saying it was their fault 0:20:21.560 --> 0:20:23.760 and they should have seen this coming. I mean, that's 0:20:24.040 --> 0:20:26.480 just nonsense. No matter what would you look at it, 0:20:26.640 --> 0:20:33.800 finger pointing in this situation has no value. M sure 0:20:34.119 --> 0:20:37.159 that there, as I said, the airlines and all the 0:20:37.200 --> 0:20:41.720 companies associated with with air travel could have made better 0:20:41.800 --> 0:20:45.400 decisions about how deep they cut their workforces. But how 0:20:45.400 --> 0:20:48.720 were they to know. I mean, shops stopped or the 0:20:48.760 --> 0:20:51.280 government stopped the support for the travel industry with the 0:20:51.280 --> 0:20:54.280 furlough scheme in September, and then there was six months 0:20:54.480 --> 0:20:56.800 until restrictions were lifted to when there was no idea 0:20:56.840 --> 0:21:00.680 of what demand would look like, there was no meaningful income. Um, 0:21:00.720 --> 0:21:02.360 you know, they're co between the rock and a hard place. 0:21:02.920 --> 0:21:04.520 Of course, it's easy to say that we could have 0:21:04.520 --> 0:21:06.760 done this, and we could have done that. My company 0:21:06.800 --> 0:21:09.000 is no ex section, but that's not the reality. So 0:21:09.080 --> 0:21:12.199 for Shafts to say that this is entirely at the 0:21:12.240 --> 0:21:15.520 door of the airlines and the airports is just it's 0:21:15.520 --> 0:21:18.520 just not facing up to reality. The government has a 0:21:18.560 --> 0:21:21.760 fair share of responsibility to take for a lot of 0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:24.240 the oils in the travel sect at the moment. Yeah, 0:21:24.240 --> 0:21:25.600 and of course we don't know who's going to be 0:21:25.640 --> 0:21:28.720 the prime minister. Of course after the summer. That's still 0:21:28.800 --> 0:21:30.320 very much up in the area. But what would you 0:21:30.359 --> 0:21:32.480 like to see the government doing and prioritizing in the 0:21:32.520 --> 0:21:37.320 coming years. There are a number of different topics that 0:21:37.400 --> 0:21:42.439 I could bring up. Expansion that he throw expansion of 0:21:42.760 --> 0:21:46.680 regional airports, more investment in the railways, and these are 0:21:46.720 --> 0:21:52.600 all important, but again there needs to be better, more 0:21:52.720 --> 0:21:57.879 frequent and the more meaningful dialogue between the government and 0:21:57.920 --> 0:22:01.080 the travel industry. And from my perspective, particularly the business 0:22:01.119 --> 0:22:06.159 travels sector, it's it's not existed hitherto. It's kind of 0:22:06.200 --> 0:22:08.600 improved a little bit over the pandemic, but there has 0:22:08.640 --> 0:22:14.600 to be much better interaction and decision making and policy 0:22:14.640 --> 0:22:18.200 making to support the UK as a as an international 0:22:18.200 --> 0:22:20.600 trading nation. I mean, there's just no question about that 0:22:20.640 --> 0:22:23.159 in my mind. And that's something for whoever is the 0:22:23.160 --> 0:22:27.919 Transport secretary from the Auto Well, this is about international trade, 0:22:28.440 --> 0:22:31.600 it's about tax, it's about the treasury. Look that this 0:22:31.640 --> 0:22:35.159