WEBVTT - Are Pigeons Smarter Than They Look? 0:00:03.279 --> 0:00:11.959 Welcome to Part Time Genius, the production of iHeartRadio. Guess 0:00:12.000 --> 0:00:12.360 what Will? 0:00:12.400 --> 0:00:13.000 What's that Mango? 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:15.200 Did you hear about that pigeon that sold at auction 0:00:15.320 --> 0:00:16.640 for over a million bucks? 0:00:16.720 --> 0:00:18.560 You know, I know you may find this surprising, but 0:00:18.760 --> 0:00:21.920 I actually don't keep up with the world of pigeon auctions. 0:00:22.000 --> 0:00:24.840 But but seriously, though, did somebody actually pay a million 0:00:24.920 --> 0:00:25.800 dollars for a pigeon? 0:00:25.840 --> 0:00:29.000 It's actually slightly better than that. Somebody paid one point 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:32.000 four million dollars for a pigeon, and they did it 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:34.640 on this site. It's an auction site called Pippa, which 0:00:34.680 --> 0:00:38.280 is short for Pigeon Paradise, which almost makes all of 0:00:38.320 --> 0:00:41.720 us better. But to be fair, this was no ordinary bird. 0:00:42.080 --> 0:00:46.000 This high priced Belgian pigeon is actually an esteemed champion 0:00:46.080 --> 0:00:50.440 racer and his name is Armando. He's five years old. 0:00:50.680 --> 0:00:53.720 He's widely considered the best of the best long distance 0:00:53.760 --> 0:00:56.280 pigeons in the world. So for the buyer, having a 0:00:56.320 --> 0:00:58.800 champion bird as young as Armando means plenty of chances 0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:01.000 to breed him and to hopefully pass on his traits 0:01:01.000 --> 0:01:01.920 to future flyers. 0:01:02.080 --> 0:01:04.160 You know, I actually don't think I realized that investing 0:01:04.200 --> 0:01:05.960 in pigeons could be this lucrative. 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:08.720 I know you should have got into it years ago. Kid, 0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:12.040 most of us don't give pigeons nearly as much credit 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:13.920 as they deserve. I mean, the ones we're used to 0:01:13.959 --> 0:01:16.640 seeing can look drab or dirty. But the truth is 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:19.720 pigeons are exceptionally smart animals and they've been using that 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:22.880 brain power for the good of mankind for thousands of years. 0:01:23.240 --> 0:01:24.960 So in light of that, I thought we could use 0:01:24.959 --> 0:01:28.399 today's episode to give pigeons their due finally, from their 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:31.679 roles in scientific breakthroughs to all the times they delivered 0:01:31.680 --> 0:01:34.520 mail for us. So there's a lot to cover. Let's 0:01:34.560 --> 0:01:51.680 dive in. 0:01:56.640 --> 0:01:59.160 Hey, their podcast listeners, welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm 0:01:59.160 --> 0:02:01.600 Will Pearson and always I'm joined by my good friend 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:03.760 mangesh Hot Ticketerter. Now on the other side of that 0:02:03.840 --> 0:02:07.200 soundproof glass showing off his dance skills by doing the 0:02:07.400 --> 0:02:11.120 cou coo pigeon. That's our friend and producer Tristan McNeil, 0:02:11.320 --> 0:02:13.320 and I have to say Bert may have invented this 0:02:13.440 --> 0:02:16.200 dance and may have made it famous on Sesame Street 0:02:16.240 --> 0:02:18.639 back in the seventies. I think it was, but Tristan, 0:02:19.000 --> 0:02:20.560 I don't know about you mego, I feel like he's 0:02:20.600 --> 0:02:21.240 perfected it. 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:23.560 He really has, you know, gave actually sent me some 0:02:23.600 --> 0:02:26.079 research on this on doing the pigeon And apparently in 0:02:26.080 --> 0:02:28.840 the original opening, Burt is just hanging out watching home 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:31.560 movies of pigeons projected on his wall, and then a 0:02:31.600 --> 0:02:34.280 few seconds into the footage, he tells the viewer, I 0:02:34.400 --> 0:02:37.720 love pigeons more than anything else in the world besides oatmeal, 0:02:38.200 --> 0:02:40.760 and then he busts out doing this whole choreograph, dance 0:02:40.840 --> 0:02:43.200 and routine, and I just don't remember any of that, 0:02:43.280 --> 0:02:44.920 but it sounds so good. 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:47.920 Well, I can't speak to his oatmeal obsession, but Bert's 0:02:47.960 --> 0:02:50.560 right about pigeons. I mean, they are much cooler than 0:02:50.560 --> 0:02:53.160 we think. Just as an example, I was reading this 0:02:53.200 --> 0:02:57.840 week that pigeons are actually capable of understanding abstract concepts 0:02:57.919 --> 0:03:00.960 including space and time. Are you with me on this? 0:03:01.520 --> 0:03:04.080 It's pretty interesting, So it's definitely not something that you'd 0:03:04.080 --> 0:03:06.320 guess just by looking at them. But a couple of 0:03:06.360 --> 0:03:08.280 years back, there was this team of scientists at the 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:12.359 University of Iowa that showed just how smart pigeons really are. 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:15.240 So the team tested a group of pigeons by placing 0:03:15.240 --> 0:03:17.840 them in front of computer screens, and then they would 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:20.919 show them one of two lines, either this six centimeter 0:03:21.000 --> 0:03:24.120 line or a twenty four centimeter line, and each of 0:03:24.160 --> 0:03:27.200 the lines was paired with its own symbol, So anytime 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:29.880 the pigeons saw a line, they were supposed to peck 0:03:29.960 --> 0:03:33.440 the symbol that corresponded with the correct length. So whenever 0:03:33.440 --> 0:03:35.440 the birds got it right, the scientists fed them this 0:03:35.560 --> 0:03:37.840 treat is a way to reinforce that they had chosen, 0:03:37.880 --> 0:03:39.600 you know, the correct answer on this. 0:03:39.840 --> 0:03:42.280 Which shows that pigeons can tell the difference between different 0:03:42.280 --> 0:03:45.040 line lengths. But you said pigeons perceived time as. 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:47.160 Well, right, Yeah, So this is actually where things get 0:03:47.200 --> 0:03:50.720 really interesting, because the scientists tested the pigeons not only 0:03:50.760 --> 0:03:53.280 on the length of the lines, but also on how 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:56.560 long they were displayed for, so either two seconds or 0:03:56.680 --> 0:03:59.720 eight seconds, and the results showed that pigeons connect the 0:03:59.760 --> 0:04:03.560 concepts of space and time in this really interesting way. 0:04:04.040 --> 0:04:06.440 So whenever the birds saw a short line displayed for 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:09.320 eight seconds, they would peck the symbol meant for a 0:04:09.440 --> 0:04:12.280 long line. Because the line had been displayed for a 0:04:12.360 --> 0:04:15.880 longer period of time, the pigeons actually judged it to 0:04:15.920 --> 0:04:18.200 be longer. In length than it really was. And this 0:04:18.200 --> 0:04:20.719 way of thinking also persistent when the birds were tested 0:04:20.760 --> 0:04:23.760 on long lines being displayed. So anytime the pigeons saw 0:04:23.839 --> 0:04:27.080 a long line displayed for just two seconds, they would 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:30.480 peck the symbol meant for an eight second duration. Because 0:04:30.480 --> 0:04:32.760 the line was longer in length, the pigeons thought it 0:04:32.839 --> 0:04:34.880 existed for a greater amount of time. 0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:37.919 So that would mean pigeons actually perceived time in relation 0:04:38.040 --> 0:04:40.440 to space, right, which is what humans do, like using 0:04:40.480 --> 0:04:42.560 the number of people in a line to gauge how 0:04:42.640 --> 0:04:44.440 long a weight might be, for instance. 0:04:44.560 --> 0:04:47.720 Yeah, that's exactly right, And studies have shown that elephants 0:04:47.760 --> 0:04:50.520 and a few other primates tend to connect these concepts 0:04:50.520 --> 0:04:52.960 as well. The only thing weird here is that pigeons 0:04:53.080 --> 0:04:56.159 actually lacked the part of the brain that processes space 0:04:56.200 --> 0:04:59.760 and time that other animals have. So pigeons are making 0:04:59.760 --> 0:05:02.679 these same abstract connections that we are, but they're doing 0:05:02.720 --> 0:05:05.640 so through some other method that we actually haven't figured out. 0:05:05.560 --> 0:05:08.080 Yet, which is pretty amazing. It actually reminds me of 0:05:08.120 --> 0:05:09.839 this study I read about a while back where this 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:15.320 Japanese psychologist who's named Shigeru Watanabe. He trained a bunch 0:05:15.360 --> 0:05:18.520 of pigeons to distinguish between paintings done by Picasso and 0:05:18.560 --> 0:05:21.520 one's done by Monet, and the birds got so good 0:05:21.520 --> 0:05:24.080 at recognizing the two different styles that they could even 0:05:24.160 --> 0:05:27.839 sort out works of Cubism and Impressionism done by other artists. 0:05:28.600 --> 0:05:30.640 It kind of makes you wonder if they preferred one 0:05:30.680 --> 0:05:32.360 style over the other when they were looking at. 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:35.960 I mean, it's funny because the same researcher later conducted 0:05:36.000 --> 0:05:38.320 a different pigeon experiment where he trained a group of 0:05:38.360 --> 0:05:41.799 them to judge the artwork of elementary students. And apparently 0:05:41.880 --> 0:05:44.360 he showed the birds two dozen paintings made by students 0:05:44.360 --> 0:05:46.560 in Tokyo, and he taught the pigeons which of the 0:05:46.560 --> 0:05:49.359 paintings could be considered good and which ones should be 0:05:49.400 --> 0:05:52.400 labeled bad. I mean he did this by taking the 0:05:52.400 --> 0:05:54.479 grades assigned by the school's teachers and a panel of 0:05:54.520 --> 0:05:57.279 other adults. And anyway, once the pigeons had a grasp 0:05:57.320 --> 0:05:59.440 on what made a good painting or a bad painting, 0:05:59.640 --> 0:06:03.200 they were presented ten new paintings, and amazingly, the pigeons 0:06:03.200 --> 0:06:05.960 were able to correctly identify which of these paintings would 0:06:05.960 --> 0:06:09.240 get low marks by the panel and what's interesting is 0:06:09.240 --> 0:06:12.200 that the findings suggests that pigeons can naturally categorize things 0:06:12.279 --> 0:06:15.880 based on shape, color, and even texture, which is impressive 0:06:16.000 --> 0:06:18.000 because you know, not a lot of other species have 0:06:18.080 --> 0:06:18.440 that trait. 0:06:18.560 --> 0:06:20.720 Yeah, that's true. I guess it's one more unexpected thing 0:06:20.760 --> 0:06:21.640 we have in common with. 0:06:21.600 --> 0:06:24.800 Them, Right, and this list keeps getting longer. Apparently there's 0:06:24.839 --> 0:06:27.440 one more thing. Pigeons are the only non primates we 0:06:27.560 --> 0:06:31.200 know with ability to recognize letters. So in a twenty 0:06:31.279 --> 0:06:33.520 sixteen study this comes out of New Zealand, a team 0:06:33.560 --> 0:06:37.600 successfully trained four pigeons to recognize dozens of English words, 0:06:37.640 --> 0:06:41.120 including whether or not they were spelled correctly, and the 0:06:41.200 --> 0:06:44.279 smartest pigeon in the group learned to staggering fifty eight words, 0:06:44.360 --> 0:06:47.159 which it was able to distinguish from roughly one thousand 0:06:47.279 --> 0:06:50.839 made up words. In contrast, the dullest pigeon, or maybe 0:06:50.880 --> 0:06:53.400 the least motivated of these birds, still managed to build 0:06:53.400 --> 0:06:56.400 an impressive twenty six word vocabulary during its time of 0:06:56.400 --> 0:06:56.719 the lab. 0:06:56.760 --> 0:06:59.599 All right, so these birds weren't actually reading the words, right, 0:06:59.720 --> 0:07:02.159 They they didn't learn what the words meant or anything. 0:07:02.200 --> 0:07:05.360 They just memorized what the words look like. Is that right? 0:07:05.560 --> 0:07:07.320 Yeah, that's right, So they didn't have the meanings. It 0:07:07.360 --> 0:07:10.080 was just spellings. But you know, wild pigeons are smart 0:07:10.200 --> 0:07:12.680 enough that they can learn all these neat tricks. It's 0:07:12.760 --> 0:07:14.800 not like they're ever really called upon to be art 0:07:14.840 --> 0:07:16.680 critics in the wild. And at the end of the day, 0:07:16.880 --> 0:07:19.440 it does sort of seem like pigeons have all these 0:07:19.480 --> 0:07:22.160 powers of perception, but maybe aren't living up to their 0:07:22.160 --> 0:07:23.280 potential in the wild. 0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:25.200 I mean, but there's got to be a reason that 0:07:25.240 --> 0:07:28.080 they're capability these skills when you think, yeah, I mean, it's. 0:07:27.880 --> 0:07:30.640 True biologically, but in all the experiments we mentioned, the 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:33.440 pigeons were kind of making distinctions based on things that 0:07:33.560 --> 0:07:37.200 humans taught them, like impressionist art has all these features, 0:07:37.280 --> 0:07:39.840 or the word banana looks in a spell like this. 0:07:40.280 --> 0:07:41.960 Yeah, I mean, I can imagine there are cases where 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:45.600 recognizing visual patterns might help a pigeon, you know, forage 0:07:45.640 --> 0:07:48.680 for food or a beda predator like and maybe one 0:07:48.720 --> 0:07:50.880 notices their nest isn't the way they left it and 0:07:50.920 --> 0:07:53.440 that tips them off that something dangerous is in the 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:56.200 area or something like that. But going back to what 0:07:56.240 --> 0:08:00.520 you said about humans guiding and rewarding pigeons behavior, what's 0:08:00.520 --> 0:08:04.960 funny is that's something we unconsciously do, like including outside 0:08:04.960 --> 0:08:08.600 the laboratory setting. For instance, back in twenty eleven, there 0:08:08.600 --> 0:08:11.200 were these two researchers in Paris, and they discovered that 0:08:11.280 --> 0:08:15.080 pigeons can remember the appearance and behavior of specific people. 0:08:15.400 --> 0:08:18.720 So here's how it went. Over the course of multiple sessions, 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:21.480 these two researchers went to a local park and they 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:24.720 fed this same flock of pigeons. So the first time 0:08:24.720 --> 0:08:27.000 they go out, one researcher fed the birds and then 0:08:27.120 --> 0:08:29.920 just stood there while they ate this food. I Meanwhile, 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:32.840 the other researcher put some food down and then immediately 0:08:32.880 --> 0:08:35.680 turned hostile and chased the pigeons away. I'm sure everybody 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:38.920 else in the park was enjoying this. But the researchers 0:08:38.960 --> 0:08:42.760 then repeated the experiment again and again, except during the 0:08:42.800 --> 0:08:46.640 subsequent visits, neither of them chased away the pigeons. And 0:08:46.679 --> 0:08:50.199 here's the thing. The pigeons actually remembered which researcher had 0:08:50.200 --> 0:08:52.680 been nice to them and which one had showed them away, 0:08:53.120 --> 0:08:57.479 And so whenever the researchers returned, the pigeons continuously avoided 0:08:57.480 --> 0:08:59.920 that researcher who had shunned them. In the first place, 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:02.680 even though he hadn't done anything like that on any 0:09:02.679 --> 0:09:03.280 other occasion. 0:09:03.400 --> 0:09:06.520 Huh, that's pretty interesting. So what kind of like visual 0:09:06.559 --> 0:09:09.360 cues were the pigeons picking up, Like was the hostile 0:09:09.400 --> 0:09:13.439 researcher bigger or more intimidating or facial hair like, what 0:09:13.520 --> 0:09:14.240 was the distinction? 0:09:14.520 --> 0:09:16.840 Yeah, when I was reading about this, that was what 0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:19.080 I had assumed as well, is that maybe one researcher 0:09:19.200 --> 0:09:22.120 just look less threatening or was wearing more attractive color 0:09:22.360 --> 0:09:25.360 or something like that. But they actually accounted for all 0:09:25.400 --> 0:09:30.040 of this. In the experiment. The researchers were the same sex, age, build, 0:09:30.160 --> 0:09:34.000 skin color, They dressed similarly. It's true that each wore 0:09:34.040 --> 0:09:37.280 a different colored lab coat, but you know, I mean, 0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:40.040 they also switched lab coats on different visits, and the 0:09:40.080 --> 0:09:44.040 pigeons could still always tell which researcher had been hostile 0:09:44.080 --> 0:09:47.800 on that first encounter. So the most likely explanation for this, 0:09:47.840 --> 0:09:51.840 according to experts, is that pigeons recognize the researchers by 0:09:51.960 --> 0:09:55.600 their faces. So not only does that show how pigeons 0:09:55.720 --> 0:09:58.880 might use their perceptive powers in the wild, it also 0:09:58.960 --> 0:10:02.280 shows that pigeons are really smart about which visual information 0:10:02.400 --> 0:10:04.959 to keep track of. Like, you know, take the different 0:10:04.960 --> 0:10:08.080 colored lab codes for instance. It seems like the obvious 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:10.400 feature to remember, like since a lab code would have 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:13.800 you know, covered like ninety percent of their body. Yeah, 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:17.079 but it's like our version of feathers, you would think 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:20.640 at least. And yet the pigeons zeroed in on the researchers' 0:10:20.720 --> 0:10:24.080 facial traits, which is something that couldn't easily be changed 0:10:24.160 --> 0:10:27.080 day to day. And so according to these researchers, that 0:10:27.160 --> 0:10:30.680 distinction is likely something pigeons have picked up on, you know, 0:10:30.720 --> 0:10:34.199 over their years of living in cities and around other humans. 0:10:33.920 --> 0:10:36.080 Which makes a ton of sense. And I'm actually glad 0:10:36.080 --> 0:10:38.559 you're bringing up that city connection. We've talked a lot 0:10:38.640 --> 0:10:40.679 so far about the science of pigeons, So what do 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:42.640 you say we change gears in and talk a little 0:10:42.679 --> 0:10:44.480 pigeon history and how they came to cities in the 0:10:44.520 --> 0:10:45.040 first place. 0:10:45.120 --> 0:10:46.880 That sounds good. But before we get into that, let's 0:10:46.880 --> 0:11:13.760 take a quick break. 0:10:55.160 --> 0:11:03.600 And you're listening to part Time Genius and we're talking 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:06.160 about all the amazing things you never knew about the 0:11:06.280 --> 0:11:09.280 humble pigeon, And speaking of which, one thing I was 0:11:09.320 --> 0:11:11.920 surprised to learn this week is just how far back 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:16.000 our relationship with pigeons actually go. For instance, archaeologists have 0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:19.920 uncovered figurines, mosaics, and other works of art depicting pigeons 0:11:19.920 --> 0:11:22.400 at dig sites in modern day i Raq, and those 0:11:22.520 --> 0:11:25.040 artifacts are thought to date as far back as forty 0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:29.200 five hundred BCE. There's also evidence that pigeons were a 0:11:29.200 --> 0:11:31.440 staple food in the Middle East and Europe for thousands 0:11:31.480 --> 0:11:33.680 of years, and when you take all of that together, 0:11:33.880 --> 0:11:36.400 it's likely that the common rock pigeon, which is the 0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:38.880 species you find in most cities, may have been the 0:11:39.040 --> 0:11:41.280 very first bird that humans domesticated. 0:11:41.440 --> 0:11:43.880 And if I remember it, did that happen mainly because 0:11:43.880 --> 0:11:47.360 pigeons were an easy way to source meat or something. 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:49.920 Well, I think that was certainly their main appeal at first, 0:11:50.040 --> 0:11:52.720 while game was often seen hard to come by in Mesopotamia, 0:11:52.800 --> 0:11:55.240 so these protein rich rock pigeons would have been a 0:11:55.240 --> 0:11:58.760 godsend in all likelihood, though some hungry ancient farmer probably 0:11:58.760 --> 0:12:01.199 noticed the bird's milling around his crops and decided it 0:12:01.200 --> 0:12:03.120 would be better if he let the birds roost on 0:12:03.160 --> 0:12:05.240 his farm rather than drive him away. But one of 0:12:05.240 --> 0:12:07.240 the side effects from spending so much time in close 0:12:07.320 --> 0:12:10.080 quarters was that humans started to take liking to the birds, 0:12:10.080 --> 0:12:13.720 and not just the way they tasted. Against all odds, 0:12:14.080 --> 0:12:17.520 humans started seeing reflections of their own humanity and pigeons, 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:20.480 for instance, Unlike other animals, the pigeons were monogamous and 0:12:20.600 --> 0:12:24.080 couples working together to raise their offspring. They were seen 0:12:24.120 --> 0:12:28.600 as intelligent and fiercely protective when necessary, but also peaceful 0:12:28.640 --> 0:12:31.360 and calm when left to their own devices. And all 0:12:31.360 --> 0:12:34.120 these cultures kind of adapted the pigeon as a religious 0:12:34.160 --> 0:12:36.679 symbol or a deity as a result. For example, there 0:12:36.679 --> 0:12:41.679 are three different goddesses that were symbolized by the pigeons, ishtar, Aphrodite, 0:12:41.679 --> 0:12:46.160 and Venus, which spans Babylonia and Greece and Roman culture. 0:12:46.640 --> 0:12:50.360 And in Christian iconography, which I know a ton about, 0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:53.600 the pigion is used to represent the Holy Spirit, or 0:12:53.640 --> 0:12:55.520 at least that's what I read now. 0:12:55.559 --> 0:12:57.640 I know we probably have a lot of listeners thinking 0:12:57.679 --> 0:13:00.520 here that you're getting your birds mixed up, because didn't 0:13:00.520 --> 0:13:03.320 those religions use doves as symbols, not pigeons. 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:08.080 So prepare to have your mind blown, because scientifically speaking, 0:13:08.480 --> 0:13:11.960 the words dove and pigeon refer to the same animal. 0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:15.679 They're actually one of three hundred eight different bird species 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:17.920 in the columbide family. 0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:20.680 All right, So you're telling me that the pure white dove, 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:24.480 a universal symbol of peace, is really just another kind 0:13:24.520 --> 0:13:25.320 of pigeon. 0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:27.480 And vice versa. The gray rock pigeon you saw in 0:13:27.520 --> 0:13:29.480 the park the other day is also known as a 0:13:29.559 --> 0:13:30.040 rock dove. 0:13:30.280 --> 0:13:32.760 All right, So what about the birds themselves, Like, how 0:13:32.760 --> 0:13:36.360 did every city in America wind up overrun by pigeons? Yeah? 0:13:36.360 --> 0:13:38.360 I mean overrun's actually a good word for it. Rock 0:13:38.400 --> 0:13:42.400 pigeons are actually an invasive species. They were originally native 0:13:42.440 --> 0:13:45.200 only to Eurasia and northern Africa, but that changed in 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:48.600 the early sixteen hundreds when European settlers like the French, 0:13:48.920 --> 0:13:51.440 introduced the birds to North America for the very first time, 0:13:51.920 --> 0:13:54.360 and the domesticated birds have been brought along as a 0:13:54.360 --> 0:13:56.439 source of food or in some cases, just to be 0:13:56.559 --> 0:13:59.600 raised as a hobby. But somewhere along the way, many 0:13:59.640 --> 0:14:01.960 of them escaped to cities and made new homes from 0:14:02.000 --> 0:14:04.920 themselves on the ledges of buildings, which probably reminded them 0:14:04.960 --> 0:14:07.200 of the cliffs back home that they'd nest in the 0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:10.360 wild on. And from that point on, pigeons became a 0:14:10.400 --> 0:14:13.680 fixture in American towns and cities, really thriving in parts 0:14:13.720 --> 0:14:17.680 because pigeons aren't picky eaters. They don't have special diets 0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:20.960 like many other birds, so whatever trash or leftovers they 0:14:20.960 --> 0:14:23.400 found on city streets that kind of suited their taste 0:14:23.480 --> 0:14:24.080 just fine. 0:14:24.120 --> 0:14:26.160 Which I don't know why I always think about this quote, 0:14:26.160 --> 0:14:28.600 but there was that thirty Rock line where Tracy Jordan 0:14:28.680 --> 0:14:31.720 sees a pigeon eating trash and he just goes stop 0:14:31.760 --> 0:14:35.040 eating people's old French fries. Pigeon have some self respect, 0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:39.240 don't you know? You can fly, which is so good. 0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:42.520 But that lack of self respect has benefited them over 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:46.560 the years. The world pigeon population is estimated at four 0:14:46.680 --> 0:14:50.040 hundred million, with seven million pigeons living in New York 0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:53.000 City alone. That's almost a bird for every New Yorker 0:14:53.240 --> 0:14:54.200 minus the bronx. 0:14:54.320 --> 0:14:56.400 I was going to say, the population in the area 0:14:56.440 --> 0:14:58.520 is about that. That's pretty crazy. And all those birds 0:14:58.560 --> 0:15:01.080 in the US are descended from on that initial crop 0:15:01.120 --> 0:15:02.360 of European runaways. 0:15:02.440 --> 0:15:05.960 Yeah, they're all imported, but to be fair, that wasn't 0:15:06.000 --> 0:15:08.640 always the case. So when rock pigeons were first brought 0:15:08.640 --> 0:15:11.560 to American chores, in the seventeenth century, the continent actually 0:15:11.600 --> 0:15:15.680 had its own thriving indigenous pigeon species, and that's the 0:15:15.680 --> 0:15:19.000 passenger pigeon. And according to mental Floss, as many as 0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:22.200 five billion passenger pigeons lived here during the colonial era, 0:15:22.360 --> 0:15:25.320 accounting for somewhere between twenty five to forty percent of 0:15:25.320 --> 0:15:28.360 all birds in the entire country. However, as you probably know, 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:32.960 that's not the case anymore. Over, hunting and habitat loss, 0:15:33.000 --> 0:15:34.520 all of that kind of brought an end to the 0:15:34.520 --> 0:15:37.640 passenger pigeon in the early twentieth century, with the last 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:41.800 of their kind, this domesticateid female named Martha, passing away 0:15:41.840 --> 0:15:42.800 in nineteen fourteen. 0:15:42.880 --> 0:15:45.400 All right, this is probably the strangest transition that I'm 0:15:45.440 --> 0:15:47.120 going to make today, but you queued it up so 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:51.200 nicely for me. So, speaking of dead pigeons, one thing 0:15:51.240 --> 0:15:54.040 I've always wondered is, if New York is so chock 0:15:54.160 --> 0:15:56.480 full of them, then how are there not dead ones 0:15:56.520 --> 0:15:57.520 everywhere you look? 0:15:57.600 --> 0:15:57.680 Like? 0:15:57.720 --> 0:15:59.800 At least, not that I'm complaining about this, but if 0:15:59.800 --> 0:16:00.920 you have thought about that. 0:16:00.920 --> 0:16:03.160 You know I haven't thought about it. But now I'm 0:16:03.200 --> 0:16:05.000 curious what you learn, Like, did you get an answer 0:16:05.040 --> 0:16:05.240 for this? 0:16:05.400 --> 0:16:08.920 Well? It turns out that pigeon corpses really are something 0:16:08.960 --> 0:16:11.840 of a rarity in American cities, and the biggest reason 0:16:11.880 --> 0:16:14.440 for this is that the sheer number of predators that 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:18.200 pigeons are up against in urban areas is greater than 0:16:18.200 --> 0:16:20.640 you would think. Like, as someone at the Smithsonian once 0:16:20.680 --> 0:16:25.200 put it, rats, cats, raccoons, foxes, possums, they all love 0:16:25.320 --> 0:16:27.080 them some pigeon, is what they said. 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:32.360 That is Sasha Smithsonian thing Smithsonian. So you're saying most 0:16:32.440 --> 0:16:35.160 pigeons get eaten up by predators, But what about like 0:16:35.200 --> 0:16:37.160 the old timers. I mean, there have to be some 0:16:37.280 --> 0:16:39.400 pigeons that make it to old age. So where did 0:16:39.400 --> 0:16:40.240 those guys end up? 0:16:40.320 --> 0:16:42.760 Well, you're definitely talking about the minority here. I mean, 0:16:42.800 --> 0:16:46.560 most wild pigeons survive for five or six years on average, 0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:50.320 and that's compared to fifteen years or even longer in captivity. 0:16:50.760 --> 0:16:53.160 So the ones that aren't eaten, like the lucky ones, 0:16:53.200 --> 0:16:55.920 who have a lot more control over their deaths, they 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:58.080 tend to choose these peaceful nooks and crannies for their 0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:01.000 final resting places. So maybe the air ducts of a 0:17:01.040 --> 0:17:03.720 building or the corner ledge of a skyscraper. Some whether 0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:05.080 it's you know, not quite as visible. 0:17:05.640 --> 0:17:07.960 So I guess it really does depend on where you look. 0:17:08.040 --> 0:17:10.280 Yeah, I mean, you've got to really want to find 0:17:10.320 --> 0:17:12.200 a dead pigeon. I guess. 0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:16.600 It's a heck of a scavenger. But you know, the 0:17:16.640 --> 0:17:18.760 whole time we've been talking about this, I keep thinking 0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:21.920 of that story about Nixon's inaugurations. Do you remember this one? 0:17:22.400 --> 0:17:23.560 I don't think I do remember. This. 0:17:23.960 --> 0:17:26.399 Apparently had a tough go at his first inauguration in 0:17:26.480 --> 0:17:29.359 nineteen sixty nine, like the Vietnam War was in full swing, 0:17:29.480 --> 0:17:33.320 and Nixon's motorcade wound up being pelted with tomatoes and rocks. 0:17:33.640 --> 0:17:36.400 So when his second inauguration came around in seventy three, 0:17:36.680 --> 0:17:39.399 Nixon remembered how messy things had gotten the last time, 0:17:39.840 --> 0:17:43.080 and he wanted to take every possible precaution to avoid 0:17:43.119 --> 0:17:45.400 another embarrassment. And this is how far he went. Right. 0:17:45.440 --> 0:17:49.119 He had his people paint the branches of trees along 0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:53.320 the parade route with this special chemical called roost no more. 0:17:53.840 --> 0:17:56.679 It was this guy chemical that was supposed to make 0:17:56.680 --> 0:17:59.840 a pigeon's feet so itchy that it wouldn't want to 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:03.359 above the motor kit. I guess, And yeah, and obviously 0:18:03.400 --> 0:18:06.240 he was trying to avoid droppings falling on the car. 0:18:06.359 --> 0:18:08.280 But as you can probably tell about the fact that 0:18:08.320 --> 0:18:11.200 I'm telling you this story, things did not go as planned. 0:18:11.560 --> 0:18:14.800 So for starters, the pigeons didn't mind the itchiness of 0:18:14.880 --> 0:18:17.119 roofs no more, I guess. And what's worse, they didn't 0:18:17.160 --> 0:18:20.000 mind the taste of it either. So so many pigeons ate 0:18:20.080 --> 0:18:23.360 this highly toxic paste that the day of the parade, 0:18:23.960 --> 0:18:27.000 the entire route was like littered with dozens of dead 0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:30.600 and dying pigeons, which is so much worse than dirty windshields. 0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:32.760 Oh no kidding. Can you imagine being there? That would 0:18:32.760 --> 0:18:35.479 have been pretty brute, so weird. All right, Well, now 0:18:35.480 --> 0:18:37.600 that we've seen the time when pigeons and humans didn't 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:39.440 get along so well, I feel like we should take 0:18:39.440 --> 0:18:42.080 a look at a few examples of the opposite, you know, 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:45.400 the times when pigeons and people lived in perfect harmony. 0:18:45.480 --> 0:19:00.359 Yeah, let's do that, But first another break. 0:19:01.520 --> 0:19:03.679 Welcome back to part time genius. Somego. I know it 0:19:03.680 --> 0:19:06.080 can be dicey to try and pin down the etymology 0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:09.639 of a phrase. Any idiom you think of can probably 0:19:09.680 --> 0:19:12.720 have a half dozen or so false origin stories. But 0:19:13.119 --> 0:19:14.840 there is one that I came across this week that 0:19:14.960 --> 0:19:17.560 was just too interesting not to talk about it. So 0:19:17.920 --> 0:19:20.120 you've heard the term stool pigeon. 0:19:19.800 --> 0:19:22.720 Before, right, sure, like an informer or rat or whatever. 0:19:22.880 --> 0:19:25.320 That's right. And it's kind of a strange phrase when 0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:27.600 you think about it, because number one, how does a 0:19:27.680 --> 0:19:30.560 stool fit into any of this? And number two, pigeons 0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:33.720 aren't that talkative and you know, as far as birds go, 0:19:33.720 --> 0:19:34.879 they're actually pretty quiet. 0:19:34.920 --> 0:19:37.560