1 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:12,400 Speaker 1: Welcome to pathology with doctor Priya. Doctor, how are you. 2 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 2: I'm great. I'm still rolling off the high of crime 3 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:18,640 Speaker 2: con and being in Denver, but I'm back in business. 4 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,280 Speaker 1: Okay. Well, honey, that's easy to roll on with, isn't it. 5 00:00:22,640 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 2: It is it is. It was contagious in a good way, in. 6 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: A great way. Well, I want to talk to you 7 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 1: about our fifteen year old runaway that's been found in 8 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 1: the trunk of a car of a singer that goes 9 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:36,880 Speaker 1: by David. 10 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm just learning about this case, but there's a 11 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:44,879 Speaker 2: lot of sort of peripheral interest. My phone keeps blowing up, 12 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:46,199 Speaker 2: so I had to look into it. 13 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 1: Well, you know, the singer's name is David Anthony Burt. 14 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: He's got thirty three million listeners. He's on a world tour, 15 00:00:57,520 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 1: but he's got a little situation. 16 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:04,680 Speaker 2: He might have a lot more world of trouble. Now 17 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 2: we have to I'm going to preface this. I'm not 18 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 2: a lawyer, you're not a lawyer. Everybody is innocent until 19 00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 2: proven guilty. You know, there are multiple variables. There's no 20 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 2: way that we're saying, or I'm not saying that he 21 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:21,679 Speaker 2: is absolutely associated with leading to the girl's death or 22 00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:25,120 Speaker 2: disappearance or anything to her. Okay, but his car is 23 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:29,040 Speaker 2: his car absolutely is, and I think time will tell 24 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:30,479 Speaker 2: what else. Maybe. 25 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:34,440 Speaker 1: So if you and I were working this together, here's 26 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:37,800 Speaker 1: the things I would won't personally talk to you about. 27 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,840 Speaker 1: I would want to know, does this victim have certain 28 00:01:41,920 --> 00:01:47,200 Speaker 1: jewelry tattoos, what's the clothing situation? All the things we 29 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 1: talked about in a previous episode. 30 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:51,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's what we talked about him. I think 31 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 2: that set like a good precedent to discuss a specific 32 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 2: case now from what I understand, and correct me if 33 00:01:57,400 --> 00:01:59,720 Speaker 2: I'm wrong, because I've just read, like I said, my 34 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:01,960 Speaker 2: phone blowing up. My friends are like, what's going on? 35 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:04,920 Speaker 2: And you know, we're all moms to tweens or teens. 36 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:07,960 Speaker 2: So I think it captures a certain you know, my 37 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 2: colleagues and friends who want to know, like, hey, this 38 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 2: has been circulating in the news. I think one of 39 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 2: my girlfriends said I got a case for you in 40 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:21,399 Speaker 2: her text. And so my understanding is this girl who 41 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 2: was missing now identified, had been missing for over a year, 42 00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 2: and there was like a missing person's report because she's 43 00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:32,560 Speaker 2: a minor, and we can get into her age and 44 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 2: how they identified her or I don't know if we know, 45 00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:36,160 Speaker 2: but regardless. 46 00:02:37,160 --> 00:02:39,920 Speaker 1: You know, they identified her forensically. 47 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 2: Forensically, but I'm saying I don't know if it was 48 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:44,560 Speaker 2: which specific forensic. 49 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:46,639 Speaker 1: Oh I understand, man, you know method. 50 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:52,120 Speaker 2: Because that's going to be kept hush hush. And in 51 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:55,200 Speaker 2: any case, like all of this, they had to you know, 52 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 2: find They found her in a trunk of a car, 53 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:02,840 Speaker 2: his car, a Tesla, and then it was like what now, right, 54 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:04,239 Speaker 2: And that's where we would come in. 55 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:09,720 Speaker 1: And let me just say, fairby, listen, when I work 56 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 1: a case, I work it backwards. I know the ending. 57 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:15,359 Speaker 1: She's in a trunk of a car, so now we've 58 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 1: got to go backwards. One of the first things that 59 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: leaped into my head. How does a famous singer cross 60 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:26,600 Speaker 1: paths with a fifteen year old runaway. It's usually not 61 00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:27,640 Speaker 1: a good way. 62 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:31,160 Speaker 2: No, I mean, you know, we know, I'm a mom 63 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:33,280 Speaker 2: to a daughter. I've said it multiple times, and I'm 64 00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 2: you know the world can be very unkind to children, 65 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 2: but especially young girls, and when you run away, you 66 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 2: don't have that safety net. So she's at high risk. 67 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 2: I would say, for you know, bad things happening, even 68 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:50,600 Speaker 2: I mean unfortunately leading to death. You know, the extreme 69 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 2: worst case scenario. But you know, I think most lay 70 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 2: people you don't need to be a doctor or a 71 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 2: CSI to know that the streets can be very rough. 72 00:03:59,760 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 1: And listen, we're not saying David had anything to do 73 00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:07,000 Speaker 1: with it. What we're saying is his car did. And 74 00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: here's what concerns me. That car was not reported stolen. 75 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:14,160 Speaker 1: Some neighbors have said they've seen the car there for 76 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:17,159 Speaker 1: a month now. If that's the case, I don't know 77 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:19,360 Speaker 1: how long he's been on tour. I don't know if 78 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:22,960 Speaker 1: other people have access to that car I have. There's 79 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:28,240 Speaker 1: so many questions. And then again, her mom has come 80 00:04:28,279 --> 00:04:31,480 Speaker 1: forward already and said she had a boyfriend named David. 81 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: They have matching tattoos, which again is something I would 82 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 1: have relied on you. 83 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 2: Oh, absolutely, yes. 84 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:43,200 Speaker 1: What can you get from this body that's been in 85 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: a bag in a trunk? And I want to talk 86 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 1: about that because when you start talking about decomposition in 87 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: a bag is going to speed it up. In a 88 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 1: trunk is going to speed it up. In the heat 89 00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:58,040 Speaker 1: is going to speed it up. So I mean, how 90 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 1: much do you do you think they can really tail 91 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:06,559 Speaker 1: about her face? Potential injuries, potential causes of death. 92 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 2: I would start by saying, we definitely have a pickle 93 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:11,479 Speaker 2: on our hand, right if we If I get so 94 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:15,120 Speaker 2: in my job at a very unique situation where doctors 95 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:17,720 Speaker 2: did go to crime scenes like this, you know, where 96 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:21,599 Speaker 2: it's obvious, obvious foul play or you know, very suspicious, 97 00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:25,680 Speaker 2: let's say, and they would call me regardless of day 98 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 2: or night location, right anywhere in the state. I would respond, 99 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 2: my investigator and I, you know, and so then we 100 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 2: would meet police and you on the scene. And this 101 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:40,400 Speaker 2: is where, you know, not every case fits a cookie cutter, right, 102 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 2: I would say, this is a very unique case compared 103 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:47,920 Speaker 2: to our more regular, you know, normal deaths, if you will, 104 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:50,480 Speaker 2: I don't want to say normal, but more readily occurring, 105 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 2: you know. And that's where we have to sort of, 106 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:56,040 Speaker 2: you know, work together. 107 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 1: Right. 108 00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:59,920 Speaker 2: So you're opening the trunk, and the police will have 109 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:05,160 Speaker 2: that special ability to run the plates see who it's 110 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:07,280 Speaker 2: registered to. Because when I show up, I'm getting all 111 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 2: that information from them. I have no idea this is 112 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 2: just a random car, right, and so I'm going to 113 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 2: ask that information, but they'll put that in the police report. 114 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,719 Speaker 2: I think the task at hand and you know, I 115 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:20,960 Speaker 2: think you would agree with me, is how do we 116 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 2: deal with the body at this moment? Right, we have 117 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 2: a very delicate situation. This is a car that probably 118 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:30,760 Speaker 2: hasn't been running, and then we open it, We're like, 119 00:06:30,800 --> 00:06:32,560 Speaker 2: who the heck is this? We don't even know what's 120 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:36,279 Speaker 2: a boy or girl? Really, right, because decomposition can happen 121 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:40,600 Speaker 2: so fast and so advanced that we may I mean, 122 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 2: she's not You can't just look at her face and 123 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:45,360 Speaker 2: tell us you know who she is or that it's 124 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 2: a girl, and you think, oh, that's crazy, Krea. What 125 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:51,680 Speaker 2: you know? Why is that well during decomposition, hair slips off, 126 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 2: the skin color changes, the eyes deflate. I mean, people 127 00:06:56,000 --> 00:07:00,080 Speaker 2: don't look like who they are, especially as the decomposition advances. 128 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:04,040 Speaker 2: So I don't know where on the sort of range 129 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:07,599 Speaker 2: of decomposition she was. This is all very privileged information 130 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:10,760 Speaker 2: right to the medical examiner and police because they have 131 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 2: a you know, a difficult investigation ahead, high profile, you know, especially, 132 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 2: so what we would do is really like work with you. 133 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:23,160 Speaker 2: I think the plastic bag is money. First of all, 134 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 2: where did it come from? Does it have any unique 135 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 2: stamps on it? I mean, obviously plastic bags are you know, 136 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 2: they are prevalent, but sometimes you can even trace it 137 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 2: back to like the manufacturer where was it sold if 138 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 2: you could get a serial number or make of it. 139 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:40,400 Speaker 2: And then remember we're still going back to basics, touch 140 00:07:40,480 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 2: DNA and fingerprints even on a plastic bag. Right, and 141 00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 2: and how there's a special technique for it if I 142 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 2: remember right mac. 143 00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:53,040 Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, you can do sonocrylic fuming super glue. 144 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:55,160 Speaker 2: I call it crazy glue, right. I grew you know, 145 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 2: first glew up with it as crazy glue. And it's funny, 146 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 2: right because your parents would be like, don't at it 147 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 2: on your skin. You're you've never been it's going to 148 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 2: stick to your skin, right, I remember thinking, oh gosh, 149 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 2: like my stingers are stuffed together. But you know we've 150 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:13,760 Speaker 2: all done it, right, But you know that that everyday 151 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:15,840 Speaker 2: sort of thing. Right, It's like pick it up at 152 00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:19,360 Speaker 2: CVS or Target or home depot and there you go. Right, 153 00:08:19,480 --> 00:08:26,240 Speaker 2: this sort of magical chemical has has a lot of 154 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:27,200 Speaker 2: power in this case. 155 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: Sure, and they can also swab it for DNA on 156 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:31,360 Speaker 1: the outside. 157 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 2: Well, right, so think about where it's touched the outside 158 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:36,080 Speaker 2: for touch DNA, the not like if the if the 159 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 2: bag is knotted, or if there's a tie, a zip tie, whatever, 160 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 2: think about how someone's touching it and that you're not 161 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:45,200 Speaker 2: going to do the whole bag, right, But I think 162 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 2: there's high yield areas that we want to get that 163 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 2: right at the scene. And honestly that's where I work 164 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 2: with you and your colleagues. Like I think I've talked 165 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:57,960 Speaker 2: about it before. There was like a guy had been dragged, 166 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 2: so like touch DNA at the hem of the ants 167 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:02,720 Speaker 2: is really important. And I know he had been shot, 168 00:09:02,800 --> 00:09:05,839 Speaker 2: so like in my terms, the blood was going to 169 00:09:05,880 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 2: stain the pants further, so it's going to make the 170 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 2: testing more difficult. Same thing here is I would almost 171 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 2: work up the bag as much as possible at the 172 00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:18,480 Speaker 2: scene without disturbing it, and then like then open it, 173 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 2: you know, and we're photographing this a dozen times, right, 174 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 2: But you know what, before I get into the bag 175 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 2: and sort of get to the goal of the body, 176 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:32,200 Speaker 2: we need to think very carefully. You know, what's going 177 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 2: to help the investigation through to the end. 178 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 1: I want to know the size of the bag because 179 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:40,440 Speaker 1: was the entire body put in a bag? Now she 180 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 1: was a small person, five to two and seventy one 181 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 1: pounds tiny or was she in pieces when she went 182 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: in the bag or was it dcom that caused her 183 00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:53,559 Speaker 1: to look like she was in pieces? 184 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:57,360 Speaker 2: Right? And I actually don't know because I've sort of 185 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:01,920 Speaker 2: read mixed messages. Right, So her missing person since listing right, 186 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 2: the poster had her picture, so she has been identified. 187 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 2: But at the time, like when she's just you know, 188 00:10:09,520 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 2: when we find her the she's listed to one hundred 189 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:16,199 Speaker 2: and twenty pounds. But decomposition makes the body lighter, Okay, 190 00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:20,200 Speaker 2: so that's something to remember. So she's found I think dismembered, 191 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:23,360 Speaker 2: and you know, so think about fluids have leaked out, 192 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 2: the tissue has decomposed, so air is filled up the tissue, 193 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 2: so she's gonna look bigger than she is if she's bloated. 194 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 2: And like I said, that is only one stage of decomposition. 195 00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:37,160 Speaker 2: But you can't just look at a decomposed body and 196 00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:40,360 Speaker 2: really assess the weight. And it's always surprising to me 197 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:42,880 Speaker 2: how big it can look because of gases that form 198 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:45,920 Speaker 2: post mortem. But when you weigh it, it's much less 199 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 2: than the known weight. And I think, bacoarly, it's like 200 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:51,800 Speaker 2: I think they were said the body at the scene 201 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:54,880 Speaker 2: or at autopsy was only seventy one pounds, so she's 202 00:10:55,559 --> 00:10:59,240 Speaker 2: almost half of her living weight that stage. 203 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:02,600 Speaker 1: Decomp Her face is not going to be helped to us. 204 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:06,440 Speaker 1: She's a juvenile. Fingerprints aren't going to be helpful to us. 205 00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:09,559 Speaker 1: So again we're relying on the things that we can 206 00:11:09,679 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 1: see now. With a body in advanced decomp they were 207 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 1: still able to see the tattoo. Can you explain how 208 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:17,319 Speaker 1: that is able to happen. 209 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:20,720 Speaker 2: Not every part of the body will decomp at the 210 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:24,480 Speaker 2: same time, especially in a closed environment. I don't know 211 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: what was sort of more towards the surface, more hidden, 212 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:31,000 Speaker 2: if you will, But assuming they could see the tattoo 213 00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 2: or let me back up, I have done this. I've 214 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 2: used infrared photography even on the most severely burned or 215 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:44,760 Speaker 2: decomposed bodies to pop out tattoos and it is amazing 216 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 2: to see the difference. The IR filter really still is 217 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:54,240 Speaker 2: able to differentiate ink even on dark skin. With black ink, 218 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:56,319 Speaker 2: you know, you can really see it, and that's been 219 00:11:56,440 --> 00:12:02,520 Speaker 2: very valuable to me to identify in the past. If 220 00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 2: that's not available, let's just say someone is unique and 221 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:08,080 Speaker 2: doesn't have a tattoo. So now I'm generalizing. You still 222 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:11,640 Speaker 2: can do teeth right, like the teeth formation x rays 223 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:13,600 Speaker 2: if someone's gone to a dentist. But remember you have 224 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:16,199 Speaker 2: to have some clue who this person is to ask 225 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:20,160 Speaker 2: for dental records, right, So what happens is like I 226 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:22,040 Speaker 2: just went to the dentist. They took my X rays 227 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:26,320 Speaker 2: to check for cavities. Now, every tooth root and the 228 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,440 Speaker 2: way it looks in the mouth and even other cavities 229 00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 2: in the head known as sinuses, all are unique, and 230 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:37,280 Speaker 2: so you can use that data once someone's past, But 231 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 2: you have to still be able to be like, hey, 232 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:41,520 Speaker 2: this is Jane, do I need her X rays? If 233 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:45,520 Speaker 2: I don't know who this is yet, then that gets trickier, right, 234 00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 2: And then of course there's DNA, but you have to 235 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:50,160 Speaker 2: have the same thing comparison DNA, right, you have to 236 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:54,240 Speaker 2: know who I'm like, you know, comparing the known to 237 00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:56,840 Speaker 2: you know, when I'm alive. They'll take a toothbrush, a 238 00:12:56,880 --> 00:13:00,320 Speaker 2: hair sample, even the parents, but you have to know 239 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:03,920 Speaker 2: whose mom to go to mom or dad or sister brother, right, 240 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:07,680 Speaker 2: So it's not you can't just start testing everybody. So 241 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 2: I think the tattoo was extremely telling in this case. 242 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,079 Speaker 2: It was a very unique tattoo, and as far as 243 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:17,080 Speaker 2: I read in the late you know, just newspaper and releases, 244 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:20,560 Speaker 2: that he has a similar tattoo. So again, this is 245 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 2: I would say, you know, circumstantial evidence at best, but still, 246 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:27,960 Speaker 2: you know, raises a little bit of a red flag 247 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:28,199 Speaker 2: to me. 248 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 1: Well you want to talk to him, there's no question. 249 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 1: And then the whole landscape of how this thing is 250 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 1: playing out. He's got a song called romantic homicide. Yeah, 251 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:41,320 Speaker 1: I learned it. 252 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:46,120 Speaker 2: So I may be older than his target audience, you know, 253 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:48,440 Speaker 2: so I am not cool enough to know who he 254 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:51,240 Speaker 2: was prior to this, but I looked him up, you know, 255 00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 2: and then as I did, I learned a lot about 256 00:13:54,880 --> 00:14:00,320 Speaker 2: his music. And again let's just talk about coincidences, you know. 257 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:05,360 Speaker 2: So romantic homicide, My first thought was, oh no, who 258 00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 2: approved that title? Right? It's a little bit edgy. That's 259 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:15,960 Speaker 2: fine in this case. It doesn't again paint a good 260 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:16,840 Speaker 2: picture for him. 261 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 1: It's a great title if you don't have a dad 262 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 1: fifteen year old in the truck in your. 263 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,440 Speaker 2: Car, that's right. And I think I would hesitate, given 264 00:14:23,520 --> 00:14:25,760 Speaker 2: what we do, I would probably hesitate to call any 265 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 2: song that I that I publish romantic. Just you know, okay, 266 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 2: not romantic escapaid, Romantic field. 267 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:36,680 Speaker 1: Trip, right like romantic. 268 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 2: I mean, I come up with so many other words 269 00:14:40,080 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 2: that would make me happy. But nonetheless, everybody has an 270 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 2: opinion on that, and it's his music, it's his creativity. 271 00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:48,200 Speaker 1: Romantic field trip, I could get with that song. 272 00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 2: Write a picnic cupcakes. I'm all good as long as 273 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 2: I come back alive. Nonetheless, I think another coincidence, at 274 00:14:57,760 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 2: least released to the media nothing is fact checked yet, 275 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 2: is that Romantic Homicide was released on her birthday of 276 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 2: September seventh, and she's been missing for quite a while. 277 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 2: So we talked about the car maybe even being there 278 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 2: a month. But my understanding from the missing person's poster 279 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 2: was she's been missing over. 280 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: A year May of twenty twenty four, right. 281 00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:21,760 Speaker 2: So we're over a year. 282 00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 1: And I will say, again, how many twenty year old 283 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:29,480 Speaker 1: man crosspads with a fifteen year old runaway. It is 284 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 1: not at Bible study. 285 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 2: In all seriousness, Even if you're a Bible study, she's 286 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:39,440 Speaker 2: still illegally a minor. I find it interesting that the 287 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:42,560 Speaker 2: mom did know that she had an older boyfriend. You know, 288 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:44,400 Speaker 2: that should raise alarms right there. 289 00:15:44,760 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: She's a minor. He's a grown man. 290 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:50,160 Speaker 2: Grown man, right, and it's not like seventeen and eighteen, 291 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:54,120 Speaker 2: like they have a five year age gap. So you know, 292 00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 2: there's no blurred lines there in who's the adult and 293 00:15:57,280 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 2: who's the miner. 294 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: I mean, a tenth grader and a sophomore in college. 295 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 1: That's a world apart. You're not driving yet, he's in 296 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:07,480 Speaker 1: a fragh. 297 00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:09,200 Speaker 2: That's true. That's true. That's true. 298 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:12,560 Speaker 1: And you have no parents. She has no parents, She 299 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 1: has no legal guardian. Somebody's paying for that tattoo, somebody's 300 00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:20,360 Speaker 1: paying for her jewelry, somebody's paying for her food. So again, 301 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:23,480 Speaker 1: I don't know where she came from that they met. 302 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:27,960 Speaker 2: It's suspicious, yes, I mean it makes you wonder. Right, 303 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:30,560 Speaker 2: we're both moms and we both are in that you know, 304 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,560 Speaker 2: have daughters, and like I don't want my daughter just 305 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:36,880 Speaker 2: even if this kid is good, like I would still hesitate, right, Like, 306 00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:38,240 Speaker 2: what are you doing with a twenty year old? You 307 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:39,080 Speaker 2: have to be in school. 308 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 1: Here's the other thing we need to address. So either 309 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,520 Speaker 1: she's been in the trunk of that car a month 310 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:48,920 Speaker 1: or seven days or five days, no matter, Let's say 311 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: it's only the five days. The shortest amount of time. 312 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: For five days, he hasn't been able to reach her. 313 00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:58,040 Speaker 1: For five days, he hasn't reported her missing. 314 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 2: And I mean for one reason, his car was impounded 315 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:04,400 Speaker 2: or in a toe lot. 316 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 1: Because it was abandoned on that street. So finally they 317 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:08,960 Speaker 1: called and said this car has been here. 318 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:13,440 Speaker 2: But it's not like he went looking in his trunk 319 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 2: and said, oh, no, you know this person's there. Like 320 00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:18,959 Speaker 2: it was so like that, not circling back at I mean, 321 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:20,760 Speaker 2: Tesla's aren't cheap, as far as I know, if my 322 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:23,679 Speaker 2: car was missing, I would be even if someone borrowed it. Right, 323 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 2: I'm like, where the heck. 324 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,719 Speaker 1: Is my car? Girl? I got a better car, and 325 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: if it ain't in my driveway, I'm call somebody. And again, 326 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:33,639 Speaker 1: he never reported it missing. 327 00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 2: I'm sure we've all let people borrow our cars, you know, 328 00:17:36,560 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 2: in a time of need. But I expect it back 329 00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:42,719 Speaker 2: in one piece without a dead body in it. So, 330 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:46,439 Speaker 2: you know, I think our listeners are smart. That's what 331 00:17:46,520 --> 00:17:50,480 Speaker 2: I learned at crime con very astute. And I think 332 00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:54,200 Speaker 2: anybody at least listening to what is known about the case. 333 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 2: Now I want to back up, so, like this girl 334 00:17:56,840 --> 00:18:00,560 Speaker 2: has had an autopsy, okay. And I've handled multiple cases 335 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:07,200 Speaker 2: in my career where specifically because a it's a complicated case, 336 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 2: but b because the detectives want time to interrogate people. 337 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:15,679 Speaker 2: They don't want me to release the cause and manner 338 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:19,159 Speaker 2: of death, even if it's known, Okay, I suspect. In 339 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:22,320 Speaker 2: this case, with the decomposed body, it's a much more 340 00:18:22,359 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 2: complex workup. Okay, they're depending on the condition of her body, 341 00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 2: especially that her death is suspicious, I would get like 342 00:18:29,920 --> 00:18:33,160 Speaker 2: forensic anthropology involved, you know, and so that's a very 343 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 2: detailed examination we do in parallel like the Emmy and 344 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:40,239 Speaker 2: the and the anthropologist, and so we need to make 345 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:43,720 Speaker 2: sure about that toxicology. You know, that's a very key 346 00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:45,840 Speaker 2: part of the puzzle, right, like how did she end up? 347 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:49,199 Speaker 2: You know, is she drugged? Is she drinking? Is she 348 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:52,640 Speaker 2: doing whatever? Is she taking any medication? I mean, all 349 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:54,280 Speaker 2: of the above needs to be answered. 350 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,280 Speaker 1: That brings me to a question. Is that why the 351 00:18:57,280 --> 00:18:59,080 Speaker 1: medical examiner said deferred? 352 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 2: Well, I think I was getting to that, meaning this 353 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:04,199 Speaker 2: is a very complex case. Like we said, this is 354 00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:07,120 Speaker 2: not a run of the mill sort of autopsy, right, 355 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:10,639 Speaker 2: this is going to take weeks to months to finish 356 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:13,239 Speaker 2: and So what I think in my if I was, 357 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:16,359 Speaker 2: you know, playing armchair quarterback like as the EM, I 358 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 2: would write pending further studies or deferred, you know, depending 359 00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 2: on your language. But to me important issues to address 360 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:28,440 Speaker 2: includes again toxicology, which is pending, forensic anthropology. I need 361 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 2: to make sure there's no unexplained wounds, and like you 362 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 2: can't often tell because there's maggot activity d comp you 363 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:37,879 Speaker 2: can get holes in the tissues. Now is that a 364 00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:41,879 Speaker 2: bullet hole? Is that a knife wound? Is their strangulation? 365 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:45,240 Speaker 2: She's young, so I need to look at her hyoid, right, 366 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:48,119 Speaker 2: I look at sort of you know, it's like looking 367 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:50,360 Speaker 2: with a magnifying glass at the bones to make sure 368 00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:53,919 Speaker 2: there's no cut marks, no metal left in her. You know, 369 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:57,080 Speaker 2: she's definitely gonna get X rayed. And then you know, 370 00:19:57,160 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 2: sort of putting the puzzle together and seeing like what 371 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:04,560 Speaker 2: the police find. So it's multiple issues sort of playing 372 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:07,080 Speaker 2: at the same time that make it extra complicated. So 373 00:20:09,359 --> 00:20:12,440 Speaker 2: you know, usually she's known at least to be young 374 00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:17,119 Speaker 2: and healthy, right, So obviously now I'm thinking this is 375 00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:21,399 Speaker 2: non natural, like what is what nefarious thing or things 376 00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:23,280 Speaker 2: have happened to her? And who did it? 377 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:26,520 Speaker 1: Pending makes more sense to me than deferred. I get 378 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,640 Speaker 1: now why they used it, but I like your terminology better. 379 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:33,479 Speaker 2: So I used to say pending further studies, which you know, 380 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 2: if it's only investigation, then I would say pending investigation. 381 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:40,240 Speaker 2: But usually think about a toxicology is always pending, right, 382 00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 2: That's not an instant read. So to me, pending further studies, 383 00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:47,800 Speaker 2: whatever that may be, sort of encompasses all of it. 384 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 1: So here's the last thing. When you and I would 385 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 1: be talking, and this would be our case. The tattoos, 386 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:57,919 Speaker 1: the jewelry, the clothing that might give me an idea 387 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 1: of what was going on at the time time she 388 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:03,359 Speaker 1: went missing and was put in the trunk of the car. 389 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:05,879 Speaker 1: As a murder victim, I think we're looking at a 390 00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:09,639 Speaker 1: homicide again. To wind up in some type of plastic bag, 391 00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:12,960 Speaker 1: that is what I believe he're looking at. So here's 392 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:17,720 Speaker 1: the deal. When you call somebody a runaway, that ain't 393 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:21,760 Speaker 1: the end of the story. Something has to happen. Either 394 00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:25,639 Speaker 1: the child goes back home or they learn the streets. 395 00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:29,080 Speaker 1: And here's what I mean by that. They either start 396 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:33,399 Speaker 1: a life of prostitution, they get trafficked, or they're in 397 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:38,160 Speaker 1: a bad domestic situation. Most runaways that I have dealt 398 00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:42,800 Speaker 1: with have a bad home life that has a sexual 399 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:43,680 Speaker 1: abuse component. 400 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:46,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, highly logical. I mean I don't know the stats, 401 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 2: but no, you know, usual kid doesn't run away unless 402 00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:53,120 Speaker 2: they're running away from something disturbing in their environment. 403 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:55,840 Speaker 1: And I'm just talking about the majority that I've dealt with. 404 00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 1: Prostitution is not a long walk. They had to do 405 00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:03,200 Speaker 1: things and got no benefit. So if they're going to 406 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:05,960 Speaker 1: do things and get a benefit, whether it's drugs, food, 407 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,760 Speaker 1: a place to live, or all the above, and then 408 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 1: the trafficking is something that they don't have a say 409 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:15,920 Speaker 1: so in. But if they're young enough, scared enough, hungry enough, 410 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: what are they going to do? Their options are limited. 411 00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:22,119 Speaker 1: They either go back to the abuse, they go to 412 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:28,840 Speaker 1: some juvenile hall type situation, or again they learn to 413 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:32,240 Speaker 1: work the street. So to me, this fifteen year old, 414 00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 1: it's one of those three things. 415 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 2: To me, absolutely, and I think whether there's no father 416 00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:40,880 Speaker 2: or parental figures, father, mother, I mean, her mother stepped up, 417 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 2: but where was she all this time? And then you 418 00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,480 Speaker 2: know that's something to explore. I'm not blaming her per se, 419 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,160 Speaker 2: but what's going on. There's so much sort of time 420 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 2: lapse right between when she went missing and when she's found, 421 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:55,680 Speaker 2: and then how did she get introduced to this guy? 422 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:02,000 Speaker 2: You know? Is there drugs? Lifestyle? You know, she went 423 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:03,879 Speaker 2: from being like a high school student to being in 424 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:07,000 Speaker 2: the you know, entertainment world, right, like music world. That's 425 00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:10,600 Speaker 2: a far leap. And so that's all the kind of 426 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:12,840 Speaker 2: stuff I would ask the police. You know, that's a 427 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:16,560 Speaker 2: critical part. I mean, we can I'm my gut feeling 428 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:18,480 Speaker 2: is this is a homicide? You know, I haven't done 429 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 2: the autopsy. That's why I'm hesitating. Everybody's like, duh it 430 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 2: is you know, I'm not. I'm playing armchair quarterback, right, 431 00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:31,240 Speaker 2: but the circumstances are very very bad. And if it's 432 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,000 Speaker 2: a homicide, well we've still have to explain everything that 433 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:35,760 Speaker 2: led to that, or a lot of what led to that, 434 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:40,760 Speaker 2: you know, who's responsible, who had access to the car? Like, uh, 435 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:42,840 Speaker 2: you know, is she I think they even mentioned she 436 00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:46,119 Speaker 2: might be dismembered, so like you know, and that's a 437 00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 2: disposal process. Usually it's not how they die, but it's 438 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 2: usually what I've seen sort of post mortem to get 439 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,040 Speaker 2: her to fit into the trunk and the bag whatever 440 00:23:55,080 --> 00:24:00,119 Speaker 2: it is. And so these are all very very important steps. 441 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 2: And then the one thing I didn't talk about in anthropology. 442 00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:05,200 Speaker 2: I want to step back is if the body's dismembered, 443 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:08,240 Speaker 2: then we got to look at the bones because it'll 444 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,719 Speaker 2: tell me what kind of tool might have been used 445 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,240 Speaker 2: to dismember her. So we need to go back and 446 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 2: find that tool and do like a matching to the edge, 447 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:19,200 Speaker 2: like a tool mark analysis. 448 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 1: It could all be in the trunk of the car. 449 00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:23,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's so much right. We don't know if 450 00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:24,439 Speaker 2: it's in the bag. We don't know, if it's in 451 00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:26,640 Speaker 2: the house. We don't know, like in the car. 452 00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:29,639 Speaker 1: Let's just get real. Let's get real. You've got a 453 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:32,720 Speaker 1: fifteen year old girl dead in the truck of your car, 454 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 1: a car you never reported missing. Your song is published 455 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,679 Speaker 1: on her birthday. You have matching tattoos of this girl. 456 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:45,600 Speaker 1: I mean, there's a lot there already that I don't 457 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:48,120 Speaker 1: know that he's going to be able to explain, and 458 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,160 Speaker 1: just saying, well, he's on tour, he's on tour now, 459 00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,359 Speaker 1: But when did he leave to go on tour? 460 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 2: Correct? And I think now the sort of fallout or 461 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,000 Speaker 2: the follow up is that it seems like his tour 462 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:07,040 Speaker 2: has been canceled, endorsements are being being pulled, so you know, 463 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,920 Speaker 2: it's not like he's being let free either. So I'm 464 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,080 Speaker 2: sure the police are probably like, hey, buddy, you need 465 00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:15,879 Speaker 2: to stay around here. You know, you can't just go 466 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:20,480 Speaker 2: around the nation cavorting while the serious situation is unfolding 467 00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:21,960 Speaker 2: and we don't know all the answers. 468 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 1: Well, let me say this, inside that bag may not 469 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:29,680 Speaker 1: just be her. There could be evidence of the killer, 470 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,959 Speaker 1: whoever that might be. So once you contain something, you 471 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:34,840 Speaker 1: have contained it. 472 00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:36,920 Speaker 2: Right, And that's why I was saying swabbing the bag 473 00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 2: thinking of how it was tied. Looking inside, I mean, right, 474 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 2: we've I mean I found bullet casings, and I mean, 475 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:47,840 Speaker 2: you know sometimes napkins whatever it is, right, sort of 476 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,680 Speaker 2: gloves Like gloves are huge, right, because you can swab 477 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:52,800 Speaker 2: the inside of a glove for DNA. So you've really 478 00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:55,800 Speaker 2: got to think about like what you might find and 479 00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:58,440 Speaker 2: where to look. And I mean we're not the lawyers. 480 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 2: We're not getting search warrants, but I'm sure the police 481 00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:02,840 Speaker 2: certainly are and will continue to. 482 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:07,119 Speaker 1: Well, I would be as interested in the inside of 483 00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:10,840 Speaker 1: that bag as I am the outside. Well, doctor, I 484 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,880 Speaker 1: appreciate you. And you know, it's funny every single day 485 00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,119 Speaker 1: since crime con we have talked on the phone. 486 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 2: All I know, isn't that funny got bond, That bond 487 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,280 Speaker 2: hasn't been broken, that energy. 488 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,440 Speaker 1: But we've had so many shared experiences that. 489 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:27,080 Speaker 2: Were so fantastic, classed to have gone. 490 00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:29,080 Speaker 1: There with oh, no doubt. I mean, just sitting at 491 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,439 Speaker 1: a tables me, you and Matt Murphy and then it 492 00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:33,919 Speaker 1: was me, you and Callahan Walsh. I mean we just 493 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: had a ball. And then of course Marcia Clarke. I mean, 494 00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:37,640 Speaker 1: it was a great. 495 00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:40,160 Speaker 2: Oh my god, that was epic. She looks fantastic. 496 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:42,560 Speaker 1: I thought she did too, and I thought she just 497 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:45,520 Speaker 1: had a great sense of humor and style about her. 498 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:50,000 Speaker 1: It was wonderful, wonderful to meet her. Finally, all right, well, sugar, 499 00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:51,160 Speaker 1: I appreciate you. 500 00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:52,520 Speaker 2: Thank you till next time. 501 00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,960 Speaker 1: Then, well, I'll talk to you tomorrow, I'm sure, and. 502 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,600 Speaker 2: Hopefully, you know, maybe we can revisit this case like 503 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 2: once we know more. Right, if it's not soon, but 504 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 2: in the future, I would definitely like to sort of 505 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,360 Speaker 2: put the pieces of the puzzle together as they unfold. 506 00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:08,199 Speaker 1: Well, I think that's relevant and also, you know, just 507 00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:11,800 Speaker 1: let people know our case wouldn't end at autopsy. I 508 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:14,840 Speaker 1: would maintain communication with you about it. So I think 509 00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:16,600 Speaker 1: that's that's a valid. 510 00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,679 Speaker 2: Step, right, And I'm sure you and your colleagues at 511 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:22,399 Speaker 2: the police would be all over this, lots of talking, 512 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:24,880 Speaker 2: lots of meetings until we figure it out. 513 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:27,240 Speaker 1: I would be reading song lyrics all night. 514 00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:30,960 Speaker 2: I know, I haven't listened to the song. I think 515 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 2: I'll stay unbiased, but the title will be all I know. 516 00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:37,920 Speaker 1: Well, you can stay unbiased, but I will say from 517 00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:43,359 Speaker 1: a pr standpoint, I mean it's it's something that they're 518 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 1: going to bring up. I mean, he basically in one 519 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,280 Speaker 1: song you know, says I killed you and I ain't 520 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 1: sorry about it. So I mean it's you know, and 521 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:55,040 Speaker 1: I'm paraphrasing, of course, but I mean that's what he said. 522 00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:59,639 Speaker 1: So you can call it poetry, yes, right, right, but 523 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 1: I may call it stakes exhibit one A. 524 00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:05,040 Speaker 2: Oh life imitates art, right or the other way around. 525 00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,639 Speaker 2: So anyways, well we'll leave it from here, all 526 00:28:07,720 --> 00:28:09,159 Speaker 1: Right, Baby, I'll talk to you tomorrow.