1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,560 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:28,000 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is do they call 6 00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:31,200 Speaker 1: me Ben? We're joined as always with our superproducer Paul. 7 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: Mission Control deconds. Most importantly, you are you, You are here, 8 00:00:35,479 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 1: and that makes this the stuff they don't want you 9 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 1: to know. It's the most wonderful time of the week, folks. 10 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 1: We are sharing correspondence from across the world from our 11 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 1: favorite people, your fellow conspiracy realists. This week's segment is 12 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:54,400 Speaker 1: going to take us to some disasters. It's going to 13 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 1: take us to the edges of the science of the mind. 14 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 1: Because we've received so much fantastic correspondence about dreams. We 15 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: are also going to be diving into, um, several things 16 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 1: that don't make the news the way they should UM. 17 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 1: And and just to just to lay out the land 18 00:01:15,160 --> 00:01:18,920 Speaker 1: briefly here as we hurtle towards the end of the year, UH, 19 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 1: you may hear a few more listener male segments from 20 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:28,360 Speaker 1: us as we get closer to twenty two. Um, I 21 00:01:28,400 --> 00:01:30,760 Speaker 1: think is what the kids are calling it nowadays. And 22 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 1: that's gonna be that's gonna give us a little bit 23 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 1: of time to go do all the familial and social 24 00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 1: obligations that come at the end of the year. Uh. 25 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:44,039 Speaker 1: And we hope that you enjoy them as much as 26 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 1: we enjoy making them. So with that in mind, uh, 27 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:52,240 Speaker 1: now that we're in the holiday spirit, and um, we're 28 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,200 Speaker 1: all very alexa play the Mountain Goats or whatever. Uh, 29 00:01:55,920 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 1: let's let's let's darken the palette a little bit more. Uh. 30 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:05,279 Speaker 1: Let's talk about disasters, because there's so many that people 31 00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: just never talk about. Right, Like you you might remember 32 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:13,480 Speaker 1: big things like Pearl Harbor, you might remember disasters like 33 00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: Chernobyl or whatever. But it turns out that human civilization 34 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:22,320 Speaker 1: is just kind of a constant stream of things going 35 00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 1: terribly wrong. Yeah, and to learn more about it, let's 36 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:29,919 Speaker 1: go to this anonymous person who left us a message. 37 00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 1: Good morning, afternoon, evening, sdd W I, d K crew, 38 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:38,800 Speaker 1: whatever time you're listening to this. The girl has been 39 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 1: a small, medium sized mining area in northeastern Pennsylvania, and 40 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 1: there were two critical events that happens that put an 41 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:50,679 Speaker 1: end to mining in that area, and number one would 42 00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:53,920 Speaker 1: be the nocks Mine disaster. There was a mind collapse 43 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:56,840 Speaker 1: that bloody all of the minds in the area and 44 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:00,760 Speaker 1: reader to useless from there. In the Nik's already there 45 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:04,720 Speaker 1: was an event called the called their Mindsell. So what 46 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:08,600 Speaker 1: that was was a a drainage hole that they opened 47 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:13,400 Speaker 1: up to during these minds and it ended up getting 48 00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:19,400 Speaker 1: loaded with toxic industrial waste that company just kept dumping 49 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:22,239 Speaker 1: into and it actually ended up being a super fun 50 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:26,359 Speaker 1: site which was recently removed from the list. Definitely we're 51 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 1: looking into. I think it was a really interesting episode 52 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:31,639 Speaker 1: and I'd love to hear about it, especially have my 53 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 1: small punt of it's been an old Forge reference. Feel 54 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:38,160 Speaker 1: free to use this and my voice on the podcast 55 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 1: love listening to you guys. Get the episodes coming. Thanks. Yes, 56 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:48,200 Speaker 1: anonymous person who lives somewhere in Pennsylvania. Uh, it's it's 57 00:03:48,240 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 1: so funny when I started looking into something like this, 58 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: I don't know why I spent way too much time 59 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:57,280 Speaker 1: in Google Maps just to orient myself of the place 60 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,320 Speaker 1: where things are occurring, because I have no idea what 61 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 1: it even means, what any of the proper nouns mean 62 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:05,520 Speaker 1: where they are what it looks like. So I ended 63 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:09,520 Speaker 1: up going here and guys, the area where this anonymous 64 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:15,080 Speaker 1: person is from is right near Scranton, Pennsylvania. Yes, granted, 65 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:19,480 Speaker 1: which was like Joe Biden's catchphrase when he was running 66 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 1: for president, Santon Scranton was like a It was like 67 00:04:25,040 --> 00:04:27,880 Speaker 1: Scranton was a baby he had just had. And when 68 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 1: you it's not a political point, but when whenever somebody 69 00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:35,680 Speaker 1: has had a child recently, you know, every conversation inevitably 70 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:38,719 Speaker 1: leads back to that. And that was very much Biden 71 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,000 Speaker 1: and Scranton. Yeah, I'm not taking digs at the guy, 72 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:43,400 Speaker 1: but it's just like I thought for a second he 73 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:46,360 Speaker 1: might be being paid to mention it like every time, 74 00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 1: or what the campaign meeting was like. But Pennsylvania is 75 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:53,680 Speaker 1: as a beautiful place. We've got a lot of listeners 76 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 1: in that state. Um, this may be a story that 77 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:00,440 Speaker 1: a lot of people in Pennsylvania are from earlier with, 78 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:04,000 Speaker 1: but I would be surprised if it's very familiar to 79 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:06,919 Speaker 1: a lot of people outside of the area, you know 80 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:09,840 Speaker 1: what I mean very much, So it's kind of a 81 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 1: local thing. Although the specific disaster that this anonymous person mentions, 82 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:18,360 Speaker 1: the Knox Mind disaster, had a wide effect on the 83 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:23,160 Speaker 1: coal mining industry in general, though as I've learned, it 84 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: wasn't like the thing that destroyed the industry altogether. It 85 00:05:26,200 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 1: was a large mixture of circumstances and events that cause 86 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,640 Speaker 1: coal mining in that area to shut down to a 87 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 1: large extent. Right in this very very specific area that 88 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:40,719 Speaker 1: we're talking about's called the Wyoming Valley, And if you 89 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 1: look on Google Maps, you can search for Scran that's 90 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:46,479 Speaker 1: probably the easiest way to get there, and you will 91 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 1: see this interesting I don't know, it's kind of just 92 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:55,240 Speaker 1: a splotch, a line of a splotch of civilization amongst 93 00:05:55,279 --> 00:05:57,840 Speaker 1: a whole heck of a lot of trees if you're 94 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:00,280 Speaker 1: looking at it from far far above, And it runs 95 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:03,360 Speaker 1: from a place called Nanticoke kind of in the southwest, 96 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:07,120 Speaker 1: all the way up to the northeast to Carbondale, Simpson. 97 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:10,600 Speaker 1: Those are the towns, and it is a really interesting 98 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 1: thing to see on a map and then to imagine 99 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 1: that this place it's it's kind of home. Well, much 100 00:06:18,080 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 1: of Pennsylvania is, but this particular place is home to 101 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:25,760 Speaker 1: anthracite coal mining and that entire industry that existed in 102 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:28,880 Speaker 1: their you know, late eighteen hundreds. I me existed there 103 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:31,159 Speaker 1: even before that, but it was really thriving in the 104 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 1: eighteen hundreds and the early nineteen hundreds, right before World 105 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:39,479 Speaker 1: War Two. So this thing, the Knox Mind disaster, occurred 106 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 1: on January twenty second, nineteen fifty nine. It was a 107 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:48,840 Speaker 1: mine called the River Slope Mine in the Jenkins Township 108 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:53,279 Speaker 1: of Pennsylvania. It's also near a place called Pittston and 109 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 1: another place called Port Griffith that is probably the closest 110 00:06:57,200 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 1: place to where this mine was located. In what happened, 111 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 1: so long story short, there is a large there are 112 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:07,360 Speaker 1: several large and site coal mines that exist in this 113 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:09,560 Speaker 1: area that you can kind of see where the civilization 114 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 1: is on the map. And the Susquehanna River runs right 115 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 1: down alongside where mine, where mines are on the east 116 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 1: bank and the west bank of that river. And the 117 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 1: operators of one of these mines decided that they were 118 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:29,400 Speaker 1: going to illegally have their workers mine underneath the Susquehanna River. 119 00:07:29,440 --> 00:07:31,800 Speaker 1: This is a large river, lots and lots of water 120 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:35,040 Speaker 1: flowing through it at all times. And when these workers 121 00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:39,040 Speaker 1: did this by the orders of their superiors, they unfortunately 122 00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:41,920 Speaker 1: dug a little bit too close to the riverbed and 123 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:45,680 Speaker 1: water started pouring into the mine. And the reason why 124 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 1: it's a disaster is because that water flooded that mine 125 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 1: system and twelve individuals were killed. They were drowned and 126 00:07:56,800 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 1: locked in that mine. They were never recovered, and numerous 127 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:03,920 Speaker 1: others were trapped in the mind for a long time. 128 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:07,720 Speaker 1: Uh many of them did end up escaping, thankfully because 129 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 1: of the heroic efforts of one man. You can read 130 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:13,120 Speaker 1: about all of this stuff if you search the Knox disaster, 131 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:16,240 Speaker 1: you can find a place called Pagan p A G. E. 132 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 1: N web w eb dot org that has a really 133 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:22,840 Speaker 1: nice rite up from an original article. It's very it's 134 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 1: rather short, actually, but you can but you can read 135 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,280 Speaker 1: the original article there. You can also go to Knox 136 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: Mine disaster dot com. That's where you can find an 137 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 1: entire documentary that was produced about this disaster, about the 138 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 1: effects that it had on the coal mining industry overall, 139 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:43,120 Speaker 1: and it even includes stories from people who were there, 140 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:48,120 Speaker 1: which is a fascinating thing. In that documentary was produced 141 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:51,120 Speaker 1: fairly recently and it's it's really great. The trailer at 142 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 1: lease makes it look really great and u heart wrenching. 143 00:08:55,559 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 1: Actually would recommend that highly. So what do you guys 144 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:04,360 Speaker 1: think this Knox disaster. Really, it's a story of workers, 145 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:08,120 Speaker 1: regular folks who are earning a living, doing their job 146 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: pretty good, living in the anticite coal mines around that time. Uh, 147 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: they were just told to do something that they knew 148 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:17,920 Speaker 1: was probably not the right thing to do. But you 149 00:09:17,960 --> 00:09:20,880 Speaker 1: do it or you lose your job. And many of 150 00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:24,680 Speaker 1: them perished, and it really affected the whole place because 151 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 1: those minds, guys, are all connected, the ones I was 152 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:30,560 Speaker 1: talking about. According to somebody I spoke with, I'll tell 153 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 1: you about in just a moment, the mind systems from 154 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 1: Port Griffith all along that Susquehanna River down to that 155 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 1: place that I mentioned, Nanticoke. Those mines were all flooded 156 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 1: because of this disaster. So it wasn't as though it 157 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 1: was one small thing, right. It's imagine a cave system 158 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:55,199 Speaker 1: getting flooded completely because of the decision of some managers somewhere. Well. Uh, 159 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 1: first shout out to on a positive note, shout out 160 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: to the one and only on Ado Pankatti, who is 161 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 1: just as cool as his name sounds. I think that's 162 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:07,680 Speaker 1: the hero they're describing. He Uh, he is a reason 163 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:11,640 Speaker 1: that Uh sixty nine people were able to survive, and 164 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:14,280 Speaker 1: he got a Carnegie Medal for it. But one of 165 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:17,280 Speaker 1: the things we have to understand about this disaster is 166 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: that in this time, and this is preaching to the 167 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,439 Speaker 1: choir for people in coal mining country in this time 168 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:28,959 Speaker 1: met what you were describing as absolutely accurate. They if 169 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:31,080 Speaker 1: they didn't do as they were told, then they were 170 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 1: kicked out of a job in an area where that 171 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 1: was one of the one of the only really solid 172 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: jobs you could have at the time. And so many 173 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:46,280 Speaker 1: disasters in the world of mining occur across the world, 174 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 1: you know, because of safety standards, they cut into the 175 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 1: bottom line, and then as uh as the mind gets depleted, 176 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 1: they are increasingly dangerous methods to bring every last drop 177 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:01,720 Speaker 1: of or out of it, every last pebble, I guess 178 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:04,920 Speaker 1: is a better phrase. Uh. And often these things occur 179 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:10,200 Speaker 1: without consequences. So the good news to anybody who was 180 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 1: just no hearing of this story is that there were 181 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:18,640 Speaker 1: legal actions taken against what ten people. One of them 182 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 1: was the Mind superintendent. One of them, this was the 183 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 1: most interesting part to me about this guys. One of 184 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:27,640 Speaker 1: them is a secret owner of the Mind. His name 185 00:11:27,679 --> 00:11:31,400 Speaker 1: is I guess j Lippy. We're not gonna keep him anonymous, right, Yeah, 186 00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:35,079 Speaker 1: you can imagine to hear that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. 187 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 1: One thing I know for sure is that is one 188 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 1: haunted as abandoned mine right there. Well, much of it 189 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 1: remains flooded, and because they were never able to pump 190 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:47,360 Speaker 1: the water out, they attempted, they spent a lot of 191 00:11:47,360 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 1: money attempting to pump the water out of there. Because 192 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 1: this disaster affected fifteen thousand jobs, that's a that is 193 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:59,200 Speaker 1: a number. That's an estimate, right, But I get that 194 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: number from the Anthracite Heritage Museum there in Scrand, Pennsylvania, 195 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,560 Speaker 1: from the curator John Fielding. I spoke with him for 196 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,400 Speaker 1: quite a while just learning about some of this stuff, 197 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:13,880 Speaker 1: and it really was a major thing because when you 198 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:16,319 Speaker 1: think about the coal mining industry, it's not just the 199 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:18,560 Speaker 1: people who are in the minds getting the coal out. 200 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 1: It's drivers, right, who are delivering that kind of stuff. 201 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: It's people who sell the coal. It's other industries like 202 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:30,280 Speaker 1: that are attached directly to the coal industry. Yeah, yeah, 203 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:34,839 Speaker 1: there's there's a lot, right, And I would just highly 204 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:39,200 Speaker 1: recommend anybody who's interested. You can go to www. Dot 205 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:42,640 Speaker 1: Anthracite That is a n T h R A c 206 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:46,840 Speaker 1: I T E Museum dot org, and you can you 207 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:51,400 Speaker 1: can learn really stories of individuals as well as the 208 00:12:51,480 --> 00:12:54,040 Speaker 1: industry as a whole, just like how that whole region 209 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:59,080 Speaker 1: was developed because of this one thing basically that existed there. Yeah, 210 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 1: I have to point out, and I'm sure the curator 211 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 1: pointed this out too, but for anyone unfamiliar with the area, 212 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:12,280 Speaker 1: this is only about an hour away from Centralia, Pennsylvania. 213 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:15,440 Speaker 1: You guys, remember that that's the place that is still 214 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:19,160 Speaker 1: literally on fire. It has been on fire since nineteen 215 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:23,400 Speaker 1: sixty two, so just a few years after the terrible 216 00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:27,400 Speaker 1: events that we're mentioning in in this part of the show. 217 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 1: It's it's strange because you know, minors m I n e. 218 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:37,319 Speaker 1: R S are some of the hardest working people historically, 219 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 1: and the health consequences can be pretty delatorious and damaging. 220 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:46,440 Speaker 1: But um, there's a there's a bit of empathy. I 221 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,440 Speaker 1: think that too often gets missed when people talk about 222 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:54,120 Speaker 1: this industry. It is people's livelihood, you know. It's it's 223 00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:57,199 Speaker 1: not as if it's not as if you can tell 224 00:13:57,240 --> 00:14:01,559 Speaker 1: these thousands of folks stop what you're doing. You know 225 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:04,680 Speaker 1: and go what become a ping pong champion or something. 226 00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:08,680 Speaker 1: So the people who are working in these minds and 227 00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:13,000 Speaker 1: have worked in these minds are very much not the enemy. 228 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 1: They're just people who are trying to make a living. 229 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 1: If you feel like, um, the mining practices do need 230 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 1: to be eliminated, which will inevitably occur, at least in 231 00:14:22,520 --> 00:14:25,000 Speaker 1: the world of coal mining. UM. If you feel those 232 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 1: practices need to be eliminated, then the best way to 233 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: bring that idea into a reality is to start at 234 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:36,640 Speaker 1: the top. Don't vilify the people who are just like people. 235 00:14:36,720 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 1: Don't wake up and say I can't wait to go 236 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: hundreds of feet underground. I am so pumped, you know. Um, 237 00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:47,200 Speaker 1: that's just to note I want to make because mining 238 00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: has really mining has left permanent, permanent effects on this 239 00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:55,840 Speaker 1: country and many others. Um. I just don't think the 240 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:59,080 Speaker 1: average person is a villain. They're usually not. They've been 241 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:01,720 Speaker 1: watching them in the series on Hulu I think called 242 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:04,960 Speaker 1: Dope Sick. Uh. It's about the Sackler family and you 243 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:08,800 Speaker 1: know the oxycotton opioid epidemic and all that, and obviously 244 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:12,600 Speaker 1: a place that was hit very very hard by that 245 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:16,160 Speaker 1: was West Virginia, which is a you know, coal mining country, 246 00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:20,040 Speaker 1: and one of the main characters in the show gets 247 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 1: in an accident, um in a coal mining situation and 248 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 1: ends up you know, addicted to OxyContin um. So I 249 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: mean it's a very inherently dangerous profession um not to 250 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 1: mention the conditions and you know the long term effects 251 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:38,400 Speaker 1: of breathing in all of that, all of those materials. 252 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:41,520 Speaker 1: So you know, you're absolutely right. Certainly not would be 253 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 1: someone's first choice, but people that are in that profession 254 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:46,440 Speaker 1: are very proud of it. And then there's often like 255 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: multigenerational families um that have you know, mined for coal 256 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 1: for for many generations. And so when you start to 257 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:59,320 Speaker 1: see that kind of legacy um industry dry up, While 258 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:03,520 Speaker 1: it makes sense on a environmental level, it's certainly sad, 259 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:05,760 Speaker 1: and it's not like people look like you said, then 260 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:09,760 Speaker 1: people have some other option or they're like, given, oh sorry, 261 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:12,640 Speaker 1: we're taking your your whole industry is gone, but here's 262 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 1: another option for you. That's not usually how it works. 263 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 1: It's the same with like textile factories. You know, during 264 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:23,960 Speaker 1: the housing crisis, you know, literally dried up entire towns economies. 265 00:16:24,040 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 1: So it's very sad. I agreed, we have to end 266 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:30,680 Speaker 1: this segment. Guys, just really quickly to hit the Butler 267 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:33,800 Speaker 1: Tunnel thing. You can learn about that as well. I 268 00:16:33,800 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 1: would head to Greater Pittston. That's p I T T 269 00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 1: S T O N Progress. You can search for that 270 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:42,520 Speaker 1: and you can find a story. They're titled Butler mind 271 00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 1: Tunnel Contamination Revisited at Mining History Month program. It's really 272 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:49,040 Speaker 1: interesting there you can just read a bit about it. 273 00:16:49,280 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 1: You can also head over to e p A dot 274 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:55,400 Speaker 1: gov and see the story about how it was removed 275 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:59,640 Speaker 1: from the list of the nation's most contaminated sites, which 276 00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:03,160 Speaker 1: is very interesting. Because last thing, guys, if you are 277 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,000 Speaker 1: looking at that Google Maps and you follow the Susquehanna 278 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:09,440 Speaker 1: River north from Port Griffith, which is where the Fort 279 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:12,960 Speaker 1: Knox disaster occurred, you just follow it just a little 280 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: bit north. You will see some weird orange red stuff 281 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:21,040 Speaker 1: coming into the Susquehanna River and that is coming from 282 00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:25,199 Speaker 1: the Lackawanna River. And that if you continue following up 283 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:29,199 Speaker 1: the Lackawanna River to where it ends, is where the 284 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:33,880 Speaker 1: Butler Tunnel disaster occurred. Where the dumping was occurring that 285 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: has caused the river to literally turn that color. According 286 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:40,600 Speaker 1: to John at the museum, that is actually what it 287 00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:43,200 Speaker 1: looks like. It's not some trick of the satellite imagery 288 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,640 Speaker 1: or something like that. It's actually orange. The rocks are 289 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:50,920 Speaker 1: colored orange, and it's because of iron and other things 290 00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:55,000 Speaker 1: that were inside these mines where other toxic materials were 291 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:58,159 Speaker 1: dumped or just left when a company shut down, and 292 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:00,320 Speaker 1: then when flooding occurs or when there is a lot 293 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:02,880 Speaker 1: of water coming through the areas in those mines get 294 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:06,320 Speaker 1: you know, like runoff water basically in them. It flushes 295 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:09,920 Speaker 1: that stuff out into the river system. But according to 296 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 1: the e p A, everything's fine. You don't have to 297 00:18:12,119 --> 00:18:14,159 Speaker 1: worry about it anymore. And they're kind of right at 298 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:17,000 Speaker 1: least according to their own logic and the readings that 299 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:19,360 Speaker 1: have been coming out of that area. It's still very 300 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 1: striking to look at all. Right, that's an anonymous color. 301 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:25,840 Speaker 1: We hope you have a wonderful day. They're in Pittston 302 00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:29,679 Speaker 1: and we'll be right back with more messages from you. 303 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:40,160 Speaker 1: And we're bad with another message. This one comes from listener. 304 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:43,639 Speaker 1: Anvil alf I'm trying to picture that is it's like 305 00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 1: an anvil in the shape of of alf. The cat 306 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:53,880 Speaker 1: eating uh space creature from from nineties sitcom Fames Watch 307 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:56,760 Speaker 1: alf Oh yeah, what was this deal? Was there? Was it? 308 00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:00,119 Speaker 1: Was it Spencer? There's a nerdy kid named Spencer. Was 309 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:02,200 Speaker 1: that the dad? I don't remember anyway, I can't believe 310 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 1: that show less as long as it did. Who what 311 00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:06,879 Speaker 1: was that pitch meeting? Like? What a fun idea. I 312 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:10,439 Speaker 1: think there was a probably a lot of cocaine. I 313 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:13,159 Speaker 1: mean because his main his main character flaws that he 314 00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:20,119 Speaker 1: can and will eat any cat. Yeah, it's pretty dark, Yeah, 315 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:23,440 Speaker 1: pretty dark. But it came right before Unsolved Mysteries, which 316 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:28,159 Speaker 1: it was searing your toes in the paranormal that it 317 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:30,520 Speaker 1: was a nice segue. It's one of those shows where 318 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 1: it's like it was a little too like goofy for 319 00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:35,440 Speaker 1: adults and a little too adult for kids, and yet 320 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:38,560 Speaker 1: somehow it succeeded far way longer than I would have thought. Anyway, 321 00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 1: and the alf Right Ty Ben, Matt and Nold. I'm 322 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:44,760 Speaker 1: a longtime listener and fan of the show, podcasting show 323 00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:48,920 Speaker 1: after show as I renovated my house here in Oxfordshire. Uh, 324 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 1: your big ticket shows are great, but I also find 325 00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:53,880 Speaker 1: your views of current world news fascinating. From your side 326 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,040 Speaker 1: of the pond, especially the recent political shenanigans in the US, 327 00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 1: well balanced opinions bouncing off each other in an inner 328 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:03,120 Speaker 1: retaining way. Good job, well, Gee, thanks, and well Alf, 329 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:06,640 Speaker 1: that's very kind, he goes on. Back in the early 330 00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:10,679 Speaker 1: nineteen seventies, I was at university in Swansea, Wales. I 331 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:15,880 Speaker 1: started lucid dreaming. Um. It was great, free entertainment. Every 332 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 1: night I could pick up on a good previous dream, 333 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:20,960 Speaker 1: steer my dreams and wake myself up if things got 334 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 1: out of hand. I knew I was dreaming, but brighter, sharper, 335 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 1: more real than a normal dream. Not uncommon, but one 336 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:32,160 Speaker 1: of my favorite dreams was flying, breathing in to go up, 337 00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:35,920 Speaker 1: out to go down, swooping around and around, so all good. 338 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:39,080 Speaker 1: I would regale my dreams, meeting the duck people and 339 00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 1: such light to my housemates as we drove into college 340 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 1: in the morning, much to their amusement. This one morning 341 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:47,760 Speaker 1: we drove into college as normal, I found a parking 342 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,680 Speaker 1: place and not always easy. I ran into the lecture hall, 343 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:53,480 Speaker 1: got a seat in the middle, found my pencil tuned 344 00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:57,000 Speaker 1: into the lecture. Then I woke up. Wow that was odd. 345 00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:00,600 Speaker 1: Not much fun. There, so set off to colloge again, 346 00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:03,680 Speaker 1: got into the lecture, found my place, lecture started, woke 347 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:07,199 Speaker 1: up again three times in a row, groundhog day. I 348 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:10,639 Speaker 1: then began to doubt whether I was awake or not anytime. 349 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:14,440 Speaker 1: I stopped walking along the nearby cliffs, as I had 350 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 1: massive urges to jump off and fly as I did 351 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 1: in my dreams. But now I wasn't dreaming, was I? 352 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:25,119 Speaker 1: I was really freaked out. It was like my brain said, Okay, 353 00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:27,640 Speaker 1: you have fun at my expense, try some of this. 354 00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:31,199 Speaker 1: I switched off the dreaming by repeating you will not 355 00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:34,560 Speaker 1: dream over and over again in my head. I started 356 00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:38,320 Speaker 1: lucid dreaming by repeating I will dream, I will dream. 357 00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:41,000 Speaker 1: For the record, I wasn't on drugs, just plenty of beer. 358 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:44,320 Speaker 1: For a long time, I didn't dream or remember any dreams. 359 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,400 Speaker 1: And now my dreams are the normal fuzzy mix of stuff, 360 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:50,919 Speaker 1: and I'm quite happy with that. I thought it my interest. 361 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,640 Speaker 1: You use any you wish on the show. Props. Cheers 362 00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:59,720 Speaker 1: anvil elf. I guess we just found a potential drawback 363 00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:04,000 Speaker 1: of ucid dreaming. Guys, well that's it. That is astonishing, 364 00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:07,679 Speaker 1: and I've never heard that before. A three X Groundhog 365 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:14,320 Speaker 1: Day style like scenario happening on repeat, um, especially with 366 00:22:14,359 --> 00:22:17,520 Speaker 1: something as mundane as waking up doing a regular routine, 367 00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:19,760 Speaker 1: being at the place you're supposed to be at, then 368 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:22,240 Speaker 1: it happening again and again and again. That's weird. I mean, 369 00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:25,399 Speaker 1: props to UH anvil Alf for figuring out how to 370 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:28,200 Speaker 1: steer it and control it and you know, seemingly having 371 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:30,199 Speaker 1: such a handle on the whole process. I mean that 372 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:32,640 Speaker 1: sounds fascinating and then it would be a lot of fun. 373 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,000 Speaker 1: But I think, you know, some of the research into 374 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,399 Speaker 1: it that we've been talking about, UM, and also I 375 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,760 Speaker 1: think the last email that we got about lucid dreaming 376 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,439 Speaker 1: was you know, it led us to discuss how lucid 377 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:48,680 Speaker 1: dreaming and UH night terrors or you know, sleep paralysis 378 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 1: where kind of two sides of the same coin in 379 00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 1: a weird way that like, you know, the the sleep 380 00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:57,360 Speaker 1: paralysis was almost a nightmarish form of lucid dreaming. This 381 00:22:57,400 --> 00:22:59,440 Speaker 1: is somewhere in the middle. It really makes me think 382 00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:02,159 Speaker 1: of like the nightmare on elm Street movies, you know, 383 00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:05,600 Speaker 1: where the characters don't know they're dreaming until something kind 384 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:07,440 Speaker 1: of spooky happens and then all of a sudden. You know, 385 00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,159 Speaker 1: the audiences included into the fact that they're dreaming. Um 386 00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 1: this I don't know, Like this would really wreck my 387 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:17,479 Speaker 1: brain and make me really paranoid. Uh if if this 388 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:20,560 Speaker 1: was happening to me, what do you think, ben? Uh? Yeah, 389 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:26,720 Speaker 1: most reoccurring dreams or recurring dreams are the typical scientific 390 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 1: assumption is that they are revealing the presence of an 391 00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:34,440 Speaker 1: unresolved conflict or a source of stress, which is why 392 00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:40,919 Speaker 1: so many recurring dreams are unpleasant. Uh this this idea, 393 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 1: they can recur multiple times in one sleep cycle. Uh. 394 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:48,360 Speaker 1: You know, because you don't remember most of your dreams 395 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:52,959 Speaker 1: if you're human. Everybody does. The vast majority of humans 396 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:57,600 Speaker 1: tend to enter that state just uh not everybody brings 397 00:23:57,760 --> 00:24:01,560 Speaker 1: those stories or those experiences back with them as efficiently 398 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:04,359 Speaker 1: to the waking world. So I would be interested and 399 00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:09,200 Speaker 1: the alf to hear um and to hear a little 400 00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 1: bit more about your sleep schedule and about how how 401 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:17,480 Speaker 1: you typically find yourself waking up. Because most people don't 402 00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:20,160 Speaker 1: sleep the solid aid all the time, you have these 403 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:22,640 Speaker 1: moments where you're a little closer to the waking world. 404 00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 1: And that's where things like lucid dreaming and sleep paralysis 405 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 1: can occur. Your muscle antonia may not all be all 406 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:34,720 Speaker 1: the way activated. So it may be that there was 407 00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:39,320 Speaker 1: something in your subconscious that was very much bothering you. 408 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:43,400 Speaker 1: And remember that part of the mind speaks in its 409 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:46,520 Speaker 1: own language, with its own logic and syntax, and it's 410 00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:50,639 Speaker 1: all based on symbols, and those symbols. Don't let dream 411 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:55,480 Speaker 1: dictionaries fool you. Those symbols are not necessarily universal. They 412 00:24:55,520 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 1: are culturally based and individually um accented like language. So 413 00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 1: you may have in your in your experience, your brain 414 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:09,160 Speaker 1: may have been trying to tell you something and now 415 00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:11,280 Speaker 1: it's just a matter of sort of the other part 416 00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:16,880 Speaker 1: of your mind decoding what the sleeping you was trying 417 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:19,440 Speaker 1: to was trying to tell you. And yes, kudos to 418 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:26,880 Speaker 1: taking agency over your over your experiences. UM. I tend 419 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: to think that a lot of people have recurring dreams. 420 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: One thing that's interesting about this too, and it's somewhat related, 421 00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 1: is I would love to hear from anvil alf and 422 00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:40,760 Speaker 1: from you, Matt. And you know, have you had periods 423 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 1: of time where you find yourself waking up at a 424 00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:46,639 Speaker 1: very specific like a specific time, like you know, you 425 00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 1: go through a run of three months where at least 426 00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:51,800 Speaker 1: once a week or waking up at exactly three thirty 427 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: seven am. Things like that. No, I'd be weird, though 428 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,200 Speaker 1: I've never really had any experience like this. UM it's 429 00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: fascinating to me and one of my favorite musical artists 430 00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,960 Speaker 1: of all time, Richard D. James or Aphex twin UM. 431 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 1: He talks about experimenting with lucid dreams, but he's also 432 00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 1: a notorious troll with interviews and hates doing him and 433 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:12,680 Speaker 1: often just kind of like, you know, pulls the leg 434 00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: of whome embers interviewing him. But he did specifically refer 435 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:19,639 Speaker 1: to using lucid dreaming in the creation of his album 436 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:23,359 Speaker 1: Selected Ambient Works, Volume two, which is like super you 437 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 1: know like that the title suggests very like, you know, 438 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:29,280 Speaker 1: dream like ambient soundscapes with kind of alien you know, 439 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:33,440 Speaker 1: pitched vocals and just super bubbly, lovely stuff, really great 440 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:35,720 Speaker 1: to fall asleep to. A handful of tracts though, are 441 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 1: more like hearing you towards the nightmare side of things. 442 00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 1: But he specifically talks about UM learning how to lucid dream, 443 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,280 Speaker 1: coming up with compositions in his dream, and then forcibly 444 00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:50,040 Speaker 1: waking himself up and then trying to recreate the compositions 445 00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:52,960 Speaker 1: from his dream in the real world. Uh. And Ben, 446 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,280 Speaker 1: You've mentioned in the past, you know, the idea of 447 00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:59,520 Speaker 1: um writers using lucid dreaming to kind of create, you know, 448 00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 1: a aguitative scenarios as well. So I just thought this 449 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:05,280 Speaker 1: was a neat analog to that. Yeah, and Matt, I'm 450 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:09,399 Speaker 1: so interested in that earlier question. Did you ever experience this, 451 00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:13,320 Speaker 1: like waking up at the same moment? Yeah, yes, definitely 452 00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:18,200 Speaker 1: around three am is when I generally will wake up. 453 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:22,040 Speaker 1: It's not a very specific you know, new number right 454 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:26,040 Speaker 1: like three seventeen or something, but right around three am. 455 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:30,520 Speaker 1: Always after never at to something. It's always after three am, 456 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: within give or take fifteen minutes. Um. Yeah, I don't know, 457 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:37,520 Speaker 1: but I've certainly never had this thing where it's like 458 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:40,240 Speaker 1: my daily routine. You know, Like if you guys, imagine 459 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:43,720 Speaker 1: us like waking up, driving to the studio, getting inside, 460 00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:45,800 Speaker 1: sitting down with all three of us in the studio 461 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:48,800 Speaker 1: that we start rolling and then you wake up, and 462 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:50,640 Speaker 1: then you do it again, and then you wake up, 463 00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:52,199 Speaker 1: and then you do it again and you wake up 464 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:54,760 Speaker 1: until you That would mess me up. I wouldn't know 465 00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 1: if this was an actual conversation or just my dream 466 00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:00,720 Speaker 1: versions of y'all that I'm conversing with. Oh yeah, you 467 00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:04,560 Speaker 1: gotta wake up now, man. No, shoot, you gotta have 468 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:06,520 Speaker 1: like a safe word, you know, like a like a 469 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 1: wake up word. Um. That's that's that's what they call 470 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:13,199 Speaker 1: it with Siri and other smart devices that want a 471 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 1: wake word, which is the word that you say that 472 00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 1: that causes the device to start listening even though you 473 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:21,639 Speaker 1: know who knows all the time. So they're dreaming the 474 00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:25,359 Speaker 1: whole time. They're not they're in dream stasis, yeah, exactly, 475 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,720 Speaker 1: and they're potentially dreaming of electric sheep. I would go 476 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,639 Speaker 1: with Cthulhu. They're dead and dreaming. You know, it doesn't 477 00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:35,280 Speaker 1: take as much as you think to wake him up. 478 00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 1: Just say the magic words. We're getting closer and closer 479 00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:42,680 Speaker 1: to the Arthur C. Clarke quote, where in, uh, sufficiently 480 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:47,120 Speaker 1: advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. So strange when you 481 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: think about it that way. You're casting spells with that's 482 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:55,160 Speaker 1: what voice activation is. But yeah, this is uh, Alf, 483 00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:58,000 Speaker 1: you gotta right back and let us know if you 484 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 1: have had some of these experiences that were mentioning or 485 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,320 Speaker 1: were exploring here. I do want to say this is 486 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:08,640 Speaker 1: not an imperative thing, but it would be an interesting 487 00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:13,760 Speaker 1: experiment if you were to get yourself into that liminal 488 00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 1: state between waking and sleep that's when imaginations are super active, 489 00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:22,240 Speaker 1: and then try to take yourself back to that routine, right, 490 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,760 Speaker 1: and see how far you can get the story to go. 491 00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:29,840 Speaker 1: That's one of the problems the Groundhog Day, right, He's 492 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:34,120 Speaker 1: trying to figure out how far he can take this 493 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:38,000 Speaker 1: existence before the clock resets. Also shout out to one 494 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:43,600 Speaker 1: of my favorite underrated sketch groups, Chris and Jack. If 495 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:47,240 Speaker 1: you're listening, guys, great job on your Groundhog Day sketch. 496 00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 1: Did I send that to you? Guys? I was really 497 00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:52,760 Speaker 1: not supposed those books. Oh it's great. It's great Alph. 498 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,200 Speaker 1: You'll love it too, Chris and Jack. They're not paying 499 00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:57,680 Speaker 1: me to say it. Chris and Jack Groundhog Day. Well, 500 00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 1: everyone google that as well, and then we can all 501 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:04,320 Speaker 1: enjoint together during this commercial break and we be back 502 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 1: with one more piece of listener mail, and we have returned. 503 00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:18,000 Speaker 1: We're going to hear something pretty interesting that might be 504 00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 1: new to a lot of people from our pal Skippy. Hey, guys, 505 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,240 Speaker 1: it's Skippy, you guys are good to use my voice 506 00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:29,040 Speaker 1: on air. Live in southeastn Idaho, we have a place 507 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:32,840 Speaker 1: called the I n L, the Idaho National Laboratory, and 508 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 1: I've met a few people. I've even worked closely with 509 00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 1: a few people who who have either done work out 510 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: there or actually work out their full time. They have 511 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 1: offices in a town called Idaho Falls, and the secrecy 512 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 1: that surrounds this particular laboratory is almost as intense as 513 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:55,719 Speaker 1: Area fifty one. A good friend of mine, without hunting 514 00:30:56,160 --> 00:31:02,280 Speaker 1: one bright fall morning, uh and wandered onto I n 515 00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 1: L land. He's in his full hunting get up and 516 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:12,320 Speaker 1: he was about uh not a twenty minute walk. He 517 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:16,560 Speaker 1: didn't realize that he was on their land, and twenty 518 00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,120 Speaker 1: minutes after he crossed what they told him later was 519 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:26,560 Speaker 1: the line. A UH darkened suv, big off roading suv 520 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 1: pulled up. Some guys in security uniforms got out, asking 521 00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,800 Speaker 1: what he was doing. As he told him who he was, 522 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 1: escorted him off off the land and told him that 523 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,840 Speaker 1: if he UH did it again that there would be 524 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,440 Speaker 1: no warning that he would be prosecuted to the full 525 00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 1: extent of the law, with no explanation as to why 526 00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:48,920 Speaker 1: or anything like that, and then they got in the 527 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:53,800 Speaker 1: vehicle and left. Next day he got a phone call 528 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,800 Speaker 1: from He wasn't sent sure who it was it was 529 00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:02,200 Speaker 1: calling him. They told him that he uh. Basically, they 530 00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:04,400 Speaker 1: just reiterated the same thing you told him. You're not 531 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:07,440 Speaker 1: allowed to go back out there. It happens again, still 532 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:10,200 Speaker 1: get arrested. I'd love for you guys to go into 533 00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: the history, because some of the listeners out there obviously 534 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 1: aren't going to know the history behind this place. But 535 00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:17,960 Speaker 1: I'd love for you guys to dig into it and 536 00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:22,920 Speaker 1: talk about this on air. The secrecy behind this particular 537 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:27,680 Speaker 1: national laboratory is intense. Again, my name is Skippy, and 538 00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:31,920 Speaker 1: you guys are amazing well Chucks, thank you Skippy. This 539 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:37,320 Speaker 1: is you're spot on about how obscure this is going 540 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,320 Speaker 1: to be for a lot of people, and I would 541 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:43,320 Speaker 1: argue that as partially by design. Before we dive in, 542 00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:49,520 Speaker 1: Noel Matt, had either of you heard of this laboratory before. 543 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,600 Speaker 1: I'm saying laboratory because it sounds fancier. That's the only 544 00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,560 Speaker 1: reason sounds scarier when you say laboratory, sound like the 545 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,440 Speaker 1: way you know Dr Frankenstein might say it let's lean 546 00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:03,680 Speaker 1: into it. Just say, like laboratorium. I want to say 547 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 1: we encountered this a while ago when we were doing 548 00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:10,840 Speaker 1: something on nuclear energy or nukes. You're right, you're right. 549 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:16,760 Speaker 1: Established by the Atomic Energy Commission in the hub of 550 00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:20,400 Speaker 1: Atomic Innovation in the United States, of course to the 551 00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 1: Atomic Heritage Foundation website, right, yeah, And I think I 552 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:27,200 Speaker 1: have a link there in in our doc if if 553 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,680 Speaker 1: you want to pull that up here. So here's the deal. 554 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:36,160 Speaker 1: This place is part of the d Oe Department of Energy, 555 00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:42,120 Speaker 1: and it is a huge deal to the US, and 556 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:45,440 Speaker 1: it's a huge deal globally. And they're messing with things 557 00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:49,720 Speaker 1: that people literally don't understand, which is part of what researches, 558 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,520 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. They're not like the dwarves 559 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:56,480 Speaker 1: delving too deep and Lord of the rings there. They're 560 00:33:56,520 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 1: working on very important, mission critical stuff for the future 561 00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:05,760 Speaker 1: of energy. And if the world does say goodbye to 562 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:09,719 Speaker 1: Cole completely, doing a callback, guys, that's what you call 563 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:12,960 Speaker 1: it in the business. Uh. If Cole has ever fully 564 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:16,439 Speaker 1: gone from the world, the Idaho National Laboratory will play 565 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,560 Speaker 1: a part in that. It has there there were like 566 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:24,120 Speaker 1: fifty two reactors there. It's it has had the highest 567 00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:28,200 Speaker 1: density of nuclear reactors on the planet. All but three 568 00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:33,320 Speaker 1: were I think eventually decommissioned. So why why this secretsy? 569 00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:36,160 Speaker 1: If you go to their website, there's something really interesting, 570 00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:39,160 Speaker 1: which is you can you know, you can learn about 571 00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:42,680 Speaker 1: the history of the site, which we'll get into in 572 00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:46,280 Speaker 1: a sect. You can learn about what they're working on now. 573 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: But some links on the website are dead. The website 574 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:56,040 Speaker 1: links that pertain to national security do not work, which 575 00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,160 Speaker 1: is not a good look if you're trying to quell 576 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:03,440 Speaker 1: people's fear and suspicions. It has also been the site 577 00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 1: of um of a tremendous disaster. It wasn't until when 578 00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:16,680 Speaker 1: federal authorities when public and admitted that in two radiation 579 00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:22,760 Speaker 1: and chemicals probably killed people in relation to this. Uh. 580 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:26,359 Speaker 1: It's the kind of thing that if you are a 581 00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:31,320 Speaker 1: foreign operator or sometimes they're called collectors, which is somehow 582 00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:33,880 Speaker 1: even more creepy to me. If you're a foreign collector 583 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:38,440 Speaker 1: or operator and you're a spy, this is one of 584 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,600 Speaker 1: like the top places on your tour of the US. 585 00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:45,680 Speaker 1: And this is the kind of like the level of 586 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:51,279 Speaker 1: skill that these folks are functioning at becomes in I 587 00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:54,240 Speaker 1: hate to say it, but it becomes inherently conspiratorial because 588 00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,360 Speaker 1: so few people know how to do what these folks 589 00:35:57,400 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 1: are doing. It's kind of like how a q con 590 00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:05,520 Speaker 1: almost single handedly spread nuclear weaponry around the world. And 591 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,800 Speaker 1: they do, you know, they do important peaceful stuff, fuel 592 00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:13,360 Speaker 1: cycle research, development, trying to make the next iteration or 593 00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:17,520 Speaker 1: the next innovation in nuclear reactors, light water reactors. We 594 00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:22,759 Speaker 1: talked about those before. Shout out to who was a Haliburton. Uh. 595 00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:26,880 Speaker 1: They also they are working on cybersecurity and working on 596 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:33,279 Speaker 1: national security, working on nuclear non proliferation ideas, and that 597 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:36,839 Speaker 1: gets that gets really sticky very quickly. You know. So 598 00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:39,960 Speaker 1: this is a Tom Waits, what's he building in their situation? 599 00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:43,200 Speaker 1: The truth of the matter is that it's very difficult 600 00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:47,320 Speaker 1: to tell from the outside. And although the show is 601 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:49,799 Speaker 1: against censorship, I don't know about you guys, but I 602 00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:54,040 Speaker 1: have to admit you probably have to have it that way. 603 00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:57,000 Speaker 1: Probably can't have, you know, somebody popping on Instagram and 604 00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,680 Speaker 1: going out, O we we thought we knew what we 605 00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:01,800 Speaker 1: were doing with the reactor. It blew up l M 606 00:37:01,840 --> 00:37:06,240 Speaker 1: A O U. Or we've we've made a new propulsion system. 607 00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:08,960 Speaker 1: Can't wait to get this firework popped off, you know 608 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,000 Speaker 1: what I mean, Like they can't talk about that and 609 00:37:12,040 --> 00:37:16,960 Speaker 1: they can't publicize it. And I would also posit, Skippy 610 00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:19,719 Speaker 1: that in your friends defense, it doesn't matter what it 611 00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 1: was wearing, you know what I mean, Like did the 612 00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:27,200 Speaker 1: hunting gear help? Maybe not? Maybe not? But did the uh? 613 00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:29,040 Speaker 1: But would it have mattered if you was, you know, 614 00:37:29,080 --> 00:37:32,520 Speaker 1: addressed as a stormtrooper or doing a Naruto run or 615 00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:38,200 Speaker 1: something like that. It doesn't. Uh. It's these places are 616 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:42,479 Speaker 1: very very tight security. I think mentioned before. A good 617 00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:47,560 Speaker 1: friend of ours on the show went to Roswell went 618 00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:49,800 Speaker 1: to went to Groom Lake with his brother on a 619 00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:54,000 Speaker 1: road trip and they almost got shot. They stopped at 620 00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:56,680 Speaker 1: the sign where it says, you know, you can't go 621 00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:58,799 Speaker 1: past this point. They stopped their truck and they got 622 00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: out and they were just looking around because when are 623 00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:02,520 Speaker 1: we going to be here again? And that's when they 624 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,960 Speaker 1: saw the glint of what was probably a sniper scope. 625 00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:08,080 Speaker 1: And then that's also where they got almost run off 626 00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 1: the road by a military vehicle and they didn't even 627 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:15,440 Speaker 1: cross the trespassing line. So I would say, be very 628 00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:18,560 Speaker 1: very very careful with that stuff. And it's got a 629 00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 1: men in black situation, which is another cool part of 630 00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:26,600 Speaker 1: the story, Skippy, although it is spooky admittedly for these 631 00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:29,160 Speaker 1: other folks to come back the next day and just 632 00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:33,680 Speaker 1: say and just see, no, we weren't kidding, like on 633 00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:37,200 Speaker 1: the off chance he thought, Ah, that's no big deal, 634 00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:40,439 Speaker 1: I'm gonna be back there again. I wonder how many 635 00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:42,920 Speaker 1: people have been in a situation where you get a 636 00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:46,359 Speaker 1: follow up like that because they I'm sure they did 637 00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:49,239 Speaker 1: an extensive background check on the guy too, you know 638 00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:51,560 Speaker 1: what I mean, And if he had ever traveled like 639 00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:55,360 Speaker 1: Tearran in the past, the conversation might have gone differently. 640 00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:59,719 Speaker 1: I completely agree. One of the only things that's really 641 00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:03,440 Speaker 1: sticking in my mind right here is the size of 642 00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:07,160 Speaker 1: the laboratory because if you again look, I'm sorry I'm 643 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:10,240 Speaker 1: so Google centric today, but if you search for it, 644 00:39:10,239 --> 00:39:13,560 Speaker 1: it shows you this one lab, like it's clearly a 645 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:17,800 Speaker 1: large building that is a lab that is there in Idaho, 646 00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:22,760 Speaker 1: in Idaho Falls, I think, um, But on their website 647 00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:25,400 Speaker 1: they say they have an eight hundred and nineties square 648 00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:30,839 Speaker 1: foot laboratory, like whatever, that means eight hundred and nine 649 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:35,040 Speaker 1: square foot And this person that we're hearing from trespassed 650 00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:37,200 Speaker 1: on land. So I'm trying to figure out where all 651 00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:41,960 Speaker 1: this square footage is, right, like, where actually is this place? 652 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:46,400 Speaker 1: Because I can't find it? And maybe that's the point. Yeah, 653 00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:49,920 Speaker 1: that's that's kind of the point. It's it's uh, it's 654 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:54,160 Speaker 1: a different approach from the from the window List building 655 00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:57,800 Speaker 1: in Manhattan. But it is supposed to it is supposed 656 00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:01,640 Speaker 1: to be difficult to find, and and it's important it's there. 657 00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:05,480 Speaker 1: It's been It was originally an artillery range in the 658 00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:09,520 Speaker 1: nineteen forties and it predates the events of Pearl Harbor. 659 00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:12,680 Speaker 1: But it makes sense to have something like that located 660 00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:15,959 Speaker 1: where it is because it's not by the coast, it's 661 00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:19,120 Speaker 1: difficult to get there. It's in the heartlands, the interior 662 00:40:19,160 --> 00:40:24,000 Speaker 1: of the country. Um. And if anything, it's kind of 663 00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:28,839 Speaker 1: surprising that it is so public facing and you can, 664 00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:30,680 Speaker 1: you know, go to their website and learn so much 665 00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:33,480 Speaker 1: stuff about it, because because it seems like it could 666 00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:36,360 Speaker 1: have been easy for this facility to be secret, the 667 00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:41,280 Speaker 1: way that so many other nuclear research initiatives were conducted 668 00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:44,799 Speaker 1: in secrecy, like entire towns didn't officially exist. We did 669 00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:49,879 Speaker 1: an episode on that. Um. Yeah, I don't know, I 670 00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:53,960 Speaker 1: I don't know whether you can get a tour yet. Skippy, though, 671 00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:56,359 Speaker 1: I am going to give it the old college try. 672 00:40:56,480 --> 00:41:00,000 Speaker 1: It's just amazing that they do so much stuff, all 673 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:06,720 Speaker 1: so hybrid energy systems, robotics, nuclear waste processing, uh, bio energy. 674 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:08,960 Speaker 1: I mean, what are they up to? All right? What 675 00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:12,800 Speaker 1: are they building in there? Uh? Not to answer your question, 676 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:18,759 Speaker 1: they do have a a large desert location somewhere, but 677 00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:23,719 Speaker 1: somewhere probably don't want to skip these friends to tell us. 678 00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:27,840 Speaker 1: Mm hmmm. Well, there's a weird i'm gonna call it 679 00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:32,560 Speaker 1: a splotch again of kind of a dark area near 680 00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:37,000 Speaker 1: Atomic City out there, and there's a place called Atomic City. 681 00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:39,680 Speaker 1: And I'm wondering if that's like a part of their 682 00:41:39,719 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 1: thing or just something completely different. Uh. Yeah, it's just 683 00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:48,600 Speaker 1: it's just to the west of where Idaho falls, that 684 00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:52,200 Speaker 1: area that that Skippy was describing. I don't know, it's 685 00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:57,239 Speaker 1: weird stoic city. Yeah, it's a great name. Uh. And 686 00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:00,560 Speaker 1: if you go to Atomic City today, I think there's 687 00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:05,520 Speaker 1: like one store and a couple of rundown houses and 688 00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:09,560 Speaker 1: the place no longer sell even sells gasoline because there 689 00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:13,200 Speaker 1: was a nuclear explosion in nine and most people got 690 00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:18,440 Speaker 1: out of Atomic City. How is that? Yeah, it's big whoops. Um. 691 00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,239 Speaker 1: But if you want to look at some of the 692 00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:24,759 Speaker 1: more I guess sinister allegations, sinister by which I mean 693 00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:29,600 Speaker 1: not unfortunate accidents skippy, but stuff that they're accused of 694 00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:33,440 Speaker 1: doing on purpose, by design, I would direct your attention 695 00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:38,400 Speaker 1: to the New York Times two thousand eleven article wherein 696 00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:46,600 Speaker 1: they said that the Idaho National Laboratory UM was instrumental 697 00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:49,879 Speaker 1: in the creation of something called stucks net. So it's 698 00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:55,880 Speaker 1: weaponizing nuclear non proliferation and stucks net. Stucks. That was 699 00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:59,799 Speaker 1: like a Lamborghini of malware. Man, it was. It was 700 00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:03,959 Speaker 1: a Mona Lisa of malware. It was you know, an international, 701 00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:09,239 Speaker 1: an international initiative. But there is controversy. The New York 702 00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:15,279 Speaker 1: Times usually get stuff right. There's controversy because so the 703 00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:18,880 Speaker 1: official statement of the I n L is no way ted. 704 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:23,799 Speaker 1: We did not create stucks net. We we are just 705 00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:28,240 Speaker 1: trying to defend from things, to defend the US against 706 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:31,799 Speaker 1: things like that if someone else happened to build them. 707 00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:35,880 Speaker 1: But the best way to defend oneself against things of 708 00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:40,440 Speaker 1: that nature is to build the things the offensive side 709 00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:44,320 Speaker 1: of it and then just reverse engineer from there. Right, Um, 710 00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:46,560 Speaker 1: So I don't buy it. I don't know. What do 711 00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:48,120 Speaker 1: you guys think? You think they're on the up and up? 712 00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:50,880 Speaker 1: Is it like how actors can't say when they have 713 00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:53,520 Speaker 1: a cameo in a Marvel movie until it comes out. 714 00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,399 Speaker 1: I think, Jeff, they always do. They always screw it up. 715 00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:02,239 Speaker 1: Oh my god, you guys, Yeah, I have to tell 716 00:44:02,239 --> 00:44:06,080 Speaker 1: you this. I think I think there's stuff going on. 717 00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:09,680 Speaker 1: But then to your to answer your question that they 718 00:44:09,719 --> 00:44:12,640 Speaker 1: just can't talk about. There's some weirdness because it's advanced 719 00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:15,719 Speaker 1: energy systems as well. Like I know they have a 720 00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:19,359 Speaker 1: clear focus on nuclear energy, but it feels to me 721 00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:23,520 Speaker 1: that they've got other things maybe going on because they 722 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:26,640 Speaker 1: are directly involved with the Center for Advanced Energy Studies, 723 00:44:26,719 --> 00:44:28,839 Speaker 1: which is like a you know, a whole bunch of 724 00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:31,880 Speaker 1: different people doing R and D for that. But they've 725 00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:34,480 Speaker 1: got again I'm gonna harp on it. This whatever, this 726 00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:38,640 Speaker 1: square mile thing is where they can just test stuff out. 727 00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:41,560 Speaker 1: And I was looking around on Google Maps. This is 728 00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:43,319 Speaker 1: my mantra for the day that I was looking around 729 00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:46,080 Speaker 1: on Google Maps. I found a thing called the E 730 00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:50,400 Speaker 1: B R DASH I I or two and the MFC. 731 00:44:51,120 --> 00:44:53,520 Speaker 1: They're out in the middle of this desert area that 732 00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:59,319 Speaker 1: is pretty immediately to the west of the laboratory and 733 00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:05,399 Speaker 1: it look expand like that's where the stuff happens. Mm hmm, 734 00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:11,080 Speaker 1: I see, that's where the nuclear sausage gets ground. Yeah. Yeah, 735 00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:12,960 Speaker 1: you know what you what else you might see here? 736 00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:14,640 Speaker 1: Because I was trying to find one of like the 737 00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:18,399 Speaker 1: craziest things and one one story I found that really 738 00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:21,200 Speaker 1: stood out and I thought you guys, as fellow fans 739 00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:24,440 Speaker 1: of cryptids, would be interested in this. There was a 740 00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:28,960 Speaker 1: mountain lion in Collie cougar that was discovered in the 741 00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:31,560 Speaker 1: area with a second set of teeth growing out of 742 00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:35,440 Speaker 1: its skull. And this was not alleged. The animal was 743 00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:38,799 Speaker 1: hunted and someone got it. They bagged it, and they 744 00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:42,760 Speaker 1: brought it in. And this, uh, this is a pretty 745 00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:47,279 Speaker 1: highly developed, very distinct kind of deformity, but it can 746 00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:52,560 Speaker 1: happen with a lot of living creatures. Uh. The I'm 747 00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:55,640 Speaker 1: laughing because this is this is almost like the three 748 00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:59,400 Speaker 1: eyed fish in the Simpson's kind of situation, because there 749 00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:05,360 Speaker 1: are people that are convinced that radiation from the I 750 00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:11,640 Speaker 1: N L had somehow contributed to this. So radioactive critters 751 00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:14,239 Speaker 1: are in the mix too. If you find the you know, 752 00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:18,120 Speaker 1: if you find the right speculative forums. I don't know. 753 00:46:18,440 --> 00:46:20,959 Speaker 1: I don't know if that's the truth, because as we've 754 00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:27,680 Speaker 1: seen again in like the Chernobyl example, uh, there's not Unfortunately, 755 00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:32,560 Speaker 1: radiation when it does cause mutations, it doesn't cause like 756 00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:36,560 Speaker 1: the cool X Men style mutations. There aren't any flying 757 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:40,200 Speaker 1: mountain lions. There aren't any mountain lions that can turn 758 00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:44,680 Speaker 1: to steel or have laser eyes instead. Animals tend to, 759 00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:49,960 Speaker 1: you know, get the short end of the stick man um. 760 00:46:50,000 --> 00:46:52,480 Speaker 1: I would also be I wanted to say that, like, 761 00:46:52,520 --> 00:46:55,120 Speaker 1: would you guys be concerned about living next to something 762 00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:58,640 Speaker 1: like that? Absolute? Yeah, for sure. E b R, by 763 00:46:58,640 --> 00:47:02,799 Speaker 1: the way, is experimental breeder reactor, and number two is 764 00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:06,080 Speaker 1: the second one. Number one is just just down the 765 00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:09,040 Speaker 1: desert from there. And I would not want to live 766 00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:14,280 Speaker 1: anywhere near where the first experimental reactors are being created. 767 00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:16,799 Speaker 1: That's true, that's true. Do you want to live in 768 00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:18,880 Speaker 1: the testing site? That's a really good point. And the 769 00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:24,200 Speaker 1: decommissioned dB R two, I think, but but still it's Uh, 770 00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:28,880 Speaker 1: if something goes wrong and you decommission the thing, that 771 00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:32,680 Speaker 1: doesn't automatically mean that it's fine to live there again. 772 00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:35,800 Speaker 1: And I don't think i'd want a second set of teeth. 773 00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:39,160 Speaker 1: I don't know about you, guys. I think it might 774 00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:42,279 Speaker 1: be for some people, but that's nightmare fuel for me. Yeah, 775 00:47:42,719 --> 00:47:45,680 Speaker 1: thank you. But we're seeing the inside of a goose's mouth. 776 00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:49,880 Speaker 1: That's gross. Yeah, it's offensive. Teeth on the roofs of 777 00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:53,839 Speaker 1: the roofs of their mouths, and it's pure nightmare fuel. Yeah. 778 00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:55,760 Speaker 1: I don't know why might take away from this story 779 00:47:55,840 --> 00:47:59,080 Speaker 1: is now I find the mouth of geese offensive. I 780 00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:02,600 Speaker 1: just it's it's wrong. You know, it shouldn't be happening. 781 00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:07,680 Speaker 1: Is that real? Yeah, No, it's true, like their beaks 782 00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:10,520 Speaker 1: or they actually have teeth. Yeah, it's like teeth on 783 00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:14,000 Speaker 1: the inside of their mouths. Swans, I think it's swans. 784 00:48:16,239 --> 00:48:18,399 Speaker 1: I think it's I think it's geese too. I think 785 00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:22,600 Speaker 1: it's multiple birds. And now we officially are gonna blame 786 00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:27,000 Speaker 1: the Idaho National Laboratory for the entire thing. Excuse me, laboratory. Um, 787 00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:31,600 Speaker 1: but this does, this does put us in a great 788 00:48:31,600 --> 00:48:34,560 Speaker 1: spot to highlight one of the profound dilemmas of this 789 00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:38,080 Speaker 1: sort of work. Someone inevitably is going to do it. 790 00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:42,000 Speaker 1: Would you rather it be you? Or would you rather 791 00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:45,960 Speaker 1: it be some other country? Right? And it's it's very 792 00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:49,640 Speaker 1: much a devil you know situation, and it's very much 793 00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:53,319 Speaker 1: a nimby situation. Not in my backyard. There's there's not 794 00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:55,520 Speaker 1: really an easy way around it. That's why these things 795 00:48:55,520 --> 00:49:00,000 Speaker 1: are often put in. That's why these things aren't always 796 00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:05,319 Speaker 1: put in uh bustling metropolis like Los Angeles or New York. 797 00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:07,760 Speaker 1: But their home to their own creepy stuff as well 798 00:49:08,239 --> 00:49:12,280 Speaker 1: as any long time fellow conspiracy realist is well aware. 799 00:49:12,880 --> 00:49:16,400 Speaker 1: Uh Skippy, thank you so much for writing in. We're 800 00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:19,560 Speaker 1: going to maybe return to this in the future because 801 00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:25,319 Speaker 1: there is a great deal of history in in the 802 00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:29,280 Speaker 1: world of nuclear proliferation, in the world of nuclear research 803 00:49:29,600 --> 00:49:33,319 Speaker 1: that remains untold in the modern day, and it is 804 00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:36,680 Speaker 1: often literally the stuff they don't want you to know. 805 00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:41,200 Speaker 1: So I suggest we pause the conversation for today. We're 806 00:49:41,239 --> 00:49:44,120 Speaker 1: gonna be back very soon. I can't wait to hear 807 00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:48,000 Speaker 1: your thoughts on the stories that anonymous anvil alf and 808 00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:51,759 Speaker 1: Skippy himself shared with us today. Uh, and tell us 809 00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:55,720 Speaker 1: about the weird sketchy things in your neck of the woods. 810 00:49:56,120 --> 00:49:58,640 Speaker 1: We're sure they're out there. We try to make it 811 00:49:58,680 --> 00:50:01,800 Speaker 1: easy to find us online. You can find us on Facebook, Twitter, 812 00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,680 Speaker 1: and YouTube at the handle conspiracy Stuff. You can find 813 00:50:04,719 --> 00:50:08,680 Speaker 1: us a conspiracy stuff show. Yes, yes, remember that YouTube 814 00:50:08,680 --> 00:50:12,120 Speaker 1: Conspiracy Stuff. Go there, check out the videos. They're so great. 815 00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:15,200 Speaker 1: And if you want to leave us a voicemail, just 816 00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:18,799 Speaker 1: the way Skippy and Anonymous left, you can call one 817 00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:22,360 Speaker 1: eight three three st d w y t K. Please 818 00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:24,840 Speaker 1: give yourself a cool nickname. Let us know whether or 819 00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:27,480 Speaker 1: not we can use that name and your message on 820 00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:30,759 Speaker 1: the air in one of these episodes. And hey, you've 821 00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:33,640 Speaker 1: got three minutes say whatever you'd like. We were just 822 00:50:33,680 --> 00:50:36,080 Speaker 1: tickled to hear your voice. Thanks for doing it. And 823 00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:38,319 Speaker 1: if you've got more to say than can fit into 824 00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:40,799 Speaker 1: that three minutes, please instead send us a good old 825 00:50:40,800 --> 00:51:00,360 Speaker 1: fashioned email. We are conspiracy at iHeart radio dot com. Yeah. 826 00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:05,640 Speaker 1: Stuff they don't want you to know is a production 827 00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:08,800 Speaker 1: of I heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, 828 00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:11,760 Speaker 1: visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 829 00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:13,160 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.