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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.

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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to stop? Mom never told you?

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Speaker 1: From housetop works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast.

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Speaker 1: This is Molly and I'm Kristen and Christine. Today I

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Speaker 1: wanted to talk to you about some recent history. In

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Speaker 1: two thousand five, I don't know if you remember this,

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Speaker 1: there was a big controversy when the president of Harvard

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Speaker 1: made some remarks that suggested that there were innate reasons

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Speaker 1: for why women did not perform as well as men

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Speaker 1: on tests of math and science. I do remember that,

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Speaker 1: and I vote, just with personal experience as my background,

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Speaker 1: I vote that this is not true, that there's no

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Speaker 1: biological reason for why uh men and womanship performed any

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Speaker 1: differently on science. Because I was on the math team

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Speaker 1: when I was younger. Well that was you're talking about science,

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Speaker 1: that was that's math. Molly different. You think that you

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Speaker 1: want to the boys and girls do just as well.

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Speaker 1: I do. The math team was made up of half

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Speaker 1: girls have boys. And I will say, although I was

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Speaker 1: not a science team member, science leaked. I feel that

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Speaker 1: the class breakdown and that was also even interesting interesting.

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Speaker 1: I was. I was homeschooled, so I was not a mathlete.

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Speaker 1: I was on I had my own math team. But um,

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Speaker 1: I I do think though, that that there's something to

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Speaker 1: the idea that that men and women at least think differently. Okay, Like,

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Speaker 1: right before we came in here, I decided to do

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Speaker 1: a little Google search, UM on a very scientific magazine

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Speaker 1: called Cosmopolitan that you may have seen, um, because there

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Speaker 1: seems to be sort of an obsession with especially with

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Speaker 1: like those types of female magazines, that guys definitely think differently.

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Speaker 1: And so I just looked through a few covers and um,

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Speaker 1: almost every single one of them had some kind of

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Speaker 1: headline about an article relating to, you know, decoding the

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Speaker 1: male brain. Um. So I think that I think there's

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Speaker 1: at least a belief out there that men and women's

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Speaker 1: brains are different. Okay, So let's investigate today whether they

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Speaker 1: think differently, and if they do, if they are better

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Speaker 1: at math and science. Okay, Okay, Christen, Let's start our

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Speaker 1: investigation with just some generic stats from the New York

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Speaker 1: Times their studies where they find that men score better

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Speaker 1: at tasks that involve orienting objects in space, which would

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Speaker 1: seem to indicate, you know, more aptitude for math and

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Speaker 1: science and that kind of reasoning. And the women score

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Speaker 1: better at language tests, which might explain, you know, why

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Speaker 1: women talk too much. Whoa Molly, I mean, that's that's

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Speaker 1: kind of a stereotype. You know, men men can read maps,

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Speaker 1: women talk too much. I don't. I don't. I don't

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Speaker 1: know that. I fully buy that. Well, and that's when

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Speaker 1: you're on the same side with scientists. They are very

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Speaker 1: hesitant to sort of draw major conclusions from that because

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Speaker 1: they don't want to look as if they're they're sexists somehow. Well,

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Speaker 1: let's let's go back, you know, let's go back to

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Speaker 1: studies and let's go back to the science. Um. In fact,

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Speaker 1: the matter is, men do have larger brains. As much

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Speaker 1: as I hate to say it, they really do proportionately. Um,

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Speaker 1: they got they got slightly bigger brains. Yeah, even when

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Speaker 1: you account differences and body size, and wait, the size

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Speaker 1: of the brain is bigger. And again, scientists are kind

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Speaker 1: of hesitant here because you know, they have found that

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Speaker 1: the old adage holds true that size does matter. Size

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Speaker 1: has been linked to bigger intelligence. Basically. But before we

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Speaker 1: go too far, that does not mean though that men

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Speaker 1: as a sex are more intelligent than women. Why not, Kristen,

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Speaker 1: Because I think we have to now go inside of

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Speaker 1: the brain to look at the different you know, parts

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Speaker 1: parts of our brains that that are different between men

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Speaker 1: and women, because I don't think that you can just

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Speaker 1: judge it by size alone. What if it's size of

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Speaker 1: certain sections, look look at that. Well. In two thousand one,

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Speaker 1: researchers from Harvard found that yes, indeed, men and women

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Speaker 1: have um different parts of our brains are larger depending

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Speaker 1: on your sex. For instance, for women, um, we have

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Speaker 1: larger frontal lobes, which are responsible for our problem solving

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Speaker 1: and decision making. So that's pretty awesome. And our limbic

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Speaker 1: cortex is also larger, and olymbic cortex is responsible for

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Speaker 1: regulating emotions. Figure, maybe that's why we're more emotional than men.

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Speaker 1: Is that what they're saying? I don't know, Well, what's what?

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Speaker 1: What about what they find for men? So men have

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Speaker 1: a bigger parietal cortex, which is responsible again for this

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Speaker 1: sort of idea of space perception and being able to

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Speaker 1: orient an object in space and visually or you know,

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Speaker 1: looking at everything and knowing where it is. And the

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Speaker 1: amygdala is bigger, and that regulates sexual and social behavior.

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Speaker 1: I really don't want to draw any conclusions about that,

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Speaker 1: not being a researcher, but so basically they're saying that,

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Speaker 1: you know, the house may be slightly bigger, but women

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Speaker 1: have rooms that kind of make up for for not

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Speaker 1: having as big a house as men. And uh, there's

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Speaker 1: also a difference in the amount of gray matter and

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Speaker 1: white matter between men and women. Um. Men have approximately

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Speaker 1: six point five times more gray matter than women. Um.

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Speaker 1: And the gray matter is is the part of the

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Speaker 1: brain that it's active. It's full of active neurons, which

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Speaker 1: does you know, the active thinking. Yeah, they're there, have

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Speaker 1: they have more space to have brilliant thoughts. That doesn't

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Speaker 1: make women Dollard's wait listen to this. In fact, women

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Speaker 1: have about ten times more white matter than men do. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a lot of white matter. And here's what the

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Speaker 1: white matter does. It's basically the connections between all these

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Speaker 1: active neurons. So basically we may not have as many

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Speaker 1: active thought places, but we have a lot of connections

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Speaker 1: between them all. So everything moves much faster in our brain.

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Speaker 1: And another reason why women's brains seem to work faster

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Speaker 1: is because we have up to twelve percent more neurons

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Speaker 1: than men. Basically, our neurons are just more uh, more

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Speaker 1: condensed and more tightly packed into our brains than men.

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Speaker 1: So maybe that makes up for the size difference. Men

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Speaker 1: have larger brains, but we have more neurons in a

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Speaker 1: smaller space. Yeah, And all of these you know details

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Speaker 1: about the gray matter and the white matter came from

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Speaker 1: this article in the l A Times about a researcher

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Speaker 1: who was um thinking about exactly where these neurons might

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Speaker 1: be different in a male brain versus a female brain,

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Speaker 1: and this psychologist, Sander Wittelston, basically found that on certain

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Speaker 1: layers of the cortex, especially for the ones that involve

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Speaker 1: you know, incoming outgoing signals, um, there's more of them

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Speaker 1: in women on those layers. Basically, if if you thought

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Speaker 1: of the brain like an onion and you peeled away

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Speaker 1: the different layers, there would be some layers that are

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Speaker 1: just crowded with neurons on a female brain that aren't

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Speaker 1: that way on a male brain. Right. But just because

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Speaker 1: we have differences in in our brain anatomies doesn't mean

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Speaker 1: that we the outcome the actual you know, intelligence, the

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Speaker 1: way we process things at the end, is all that

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Speaker 1: different from each other? Um. There was a study reported

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Speaker 1: in the New York Times UM evaluating the different ways

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Speaker 1: uh the different brain parts that lied up in men

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Speaker 1: and women when they are pronouncing a word. In men,

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Speaker 1: a very small part of their brain UM was active

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Speaker 1: when they were pronouncing a word, whereas for women, a

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Speaker 1: much much larger area in the brain on both sides

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Speaker 1: was active. But at the same time they were both

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Speaker 1: both men and women were successful at pronouncing the words.

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Speaker 1: Just because men were using a small amount of their

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Speaker 1: brain than women didn't mean that one was performing better

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Speaker 1: or worse than the other. Yeah, basically there's more than

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Speaker 1: one way to get to the same answer. And this may,

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Speaker 1: you know, help explain why you know, we think of

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Speaker 1: a guy as better at reading a map. It might

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Speaker 1: just be that his area the brain is better at

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Speaker 1: looking at that, whereas women have different associations with landmarks

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Speaker 1: and just view how to get there differently. Because all

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Speaker 1: in all, men and women have basically the same average

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Speaker 1: IQ scores. So you know, these these brain differences aren't

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Speaker 1: aren't making you know, one sex smarter than the other. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So then if it's not basically the brain structure. If

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Speaker 1: that's sort of there and set, and you know, it

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Speaker 1: evens out in the end, could it be society that

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Speaker 1: makes girls better at language and men better at math

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Speaker 1: and science? Yeah, I think that they're The environment might

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Speaker 1: have something to do with it. But what was her name?

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Speaker 1: Sander Wyteleston would disagree with that? She would disagree? Why

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Speaker 1: would disagree? Because she studied Albert Einstein's brain and basically

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Speaker 1: she found that he had a different brain and it

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Speaker 1: was like that from birth. It's not like anything happened

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Speaker 1: in Albert Einstein's upbringing that made him think differently and

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Speaker 1: you know, or made him better at math than a

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Speaker 1: female Albert Einstein might have been. Basically, he was always

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Speaker 1: going to sort of have this brain structure. And so

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Speaker 1: it doesn't matter how girly or raised or how you know,

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Speaker 1: manly or raised, if such an upbringing exists, UM, that

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Speaker 1: structure your brain is always going to be there. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think we also have to take into account um

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Speaker 1: brain development. Obviously, the brain that we're born with is

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Speaker 1: not the brain that we die with, hopefully um. And

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Speaker 1: so the case may be that girls and boys brains

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Speaker 1: are simply developing a different rate. And while that's happening.

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Speaker 1: You know, the education system isn't exactly UM compensating for that. Right, So, say,

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Speaker 1: you know, if you're you know, a third grade girl

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Speaker 1: and you're just not doing well at math, and it

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Speaker 1: just might be that those areas you brain haven't really

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Speaker 1: caught up to to those skill sets. UM. If you're

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Speaker 1: not doing well, it's not like your teacher is going

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Speaker 1: to recognize exactly what's having in your brain and things

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Speaker 1: down for you. So that might discourage the student and

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Speaker 1: she'll give up. Yeah, you get frustrated. You don't want

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Speaker 1: to keep trying in these classes where you're you're just

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Speaker 1: not mentally, I guess your brain is not ready for

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Speaker 1: the material yet. And I think that, uh that just

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Speaker 1: social bias in general can also impact this difference between

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Speaker 1: UM performance in math and science between girls and boys. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I think that you know, if you walk

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Speaker 1: into a classroom and you see that you're the omen girl,

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Speaker 1: that's going to be sort of further challenging for you,

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Speaker 1: just on a social aspect that you're saying. And there's

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Speaker 1: this one study that was reported in UM on Live

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Speaker 1: science dot com that kind of backs that up. They

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Speaker 1: looked at these female students who at a college level

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Speaker 1: or pursuing degrees and very you know, typically male um

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Speaker 1: fields like math, science, engineer, ring, um. And they showed

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Speaker 1: one group of the female students of video where they

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Speaker 1: could go to the summer program to really develop their

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Speaker 1: skills in their fields, and the classroom was evenly distributed

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Speaker 1: males females. And then they showed another group of video

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Speaker 1: where there was just like, you know, two females in

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Speaker 1: a classroom full of males. And who do you think

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Speaker 1: wanted to go to the workshop after seeing those videos,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna guess the one where it was gender neutral.

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Speaker 1: It was, and you know, they wanted to guess somewhere

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Speaker 1: where they could be um, you know, not the odd

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Speaker 1: man out or the odd female out, if you will, Right,

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Speaker 1: But females aren't the only you know, we aren't the

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Speaker 1: only ones who are susceptible to those kind of environmental influences.

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Speaker 1: One study conducted at n y U evaluated white men's

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Speaker 1: mass scores when they were taking a test um when

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Speaker 1: they knew that they would just be scored on their

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Speaker 1: own performance, and then again when they thought that they

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Speaker 1: were going to be scored against Asian students scores Asian

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Speaker 1: men's scores, to be specific, and their scores actually dropped

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Speaker 1: when they thought that they were going to be evaluated

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Speaker 1: against the Asian or so you might always have sort of, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, conscious thought that there's someone out there that's

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Speaker 1: better than you. Add this because in the same study, um,

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Speaker 1: when females were told that the exam was gender neutral,

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Speaker 1: they did much better when they told, you know, when

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Speaker 1: they weren't going to be evaluated against males. But on

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Speaker 1: the upside, that tells us that either male, whether male

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Speaker 1: or female, we can overcome these biological differences. You know.

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Speaker 1: It might just be things in our environment that are

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Speaker 1: that are sort of holding us back, right, it's all

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Speaker 1: on our head, um. And but the thing about it, Christen,

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Speaker 1: is that not everyone is as enlightened as you and

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Speaker 1: I are. And some worry that if you know that

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Speaker 1: a female brain is different than a male brain, even

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Speaker 1: if you know they get to the same place eventually,

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Speaker 1: it might you know, be sort of a discrimination factor.

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Speaker 1: Would you not hire a female for a certain job,

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Speaker 1: would you not take a female to a certain school,

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Speaker 1: And that's you know, that's a danger. But I think

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Speaker 1: what we really should worry about here is that if

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Speaker 1: men and women have these different brains, then it can

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Speaker 1: really affect them physically. Uh. For instance, most research for

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Speaker 1: new medication is conducted just on male test subjects and

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Speaker 1: male animals because the thinking goes that women would make

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Speaker 1: um bad test subjects because of our periods or whatever

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Speaker 1: stage in our menstrual cycle where and you know it

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Speaker 1: could make you could skew the results because our our

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Speaker 1: brains are behaving erratically. So they're just testing on men

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Speaker 1: and not taking into account the differences between male and

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Speaker 1: female brains. Yeah, and at some point, you know, a

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Speaker 1: woman on a in a menstrual cycle, we'll have to

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Speaker 1: take a pill that's only been tested um on a man.

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Speaker 1: So while disorders like depression and chronic anxiety are diagnosed

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Speaker 1: a lot more often in women, UM disorders such as autism, dyslexia,

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Speaker 1: and schizophrenia are for more likely to be diagnosed in men. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And also there's some evidence that if there was like

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Speaker 1: a brain injury, like if you had a stroke, then

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Speaker 1: your brain would come back from that differently depending on

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Speaker 1: whether you're male or female. Um. You know, maybe if

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Speaker 1: you were trying to learn how to pick up something again,

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Speaker 1: and we have these differences in sort of visual spatial reasoning.

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Speaker 1: Your arm might do different things based on what your

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Speaker 1: brain is telling you if you're a male or female. Right, So,

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Speaker 1: it seems like from what we've learned, UH, to some extent,

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Speaker 1: we need to embrace and recognize the differences between men

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Speaker 1: and women's brains, because it doesn't necessarily mean that one

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Speaker 1: sex is more intelligent than the other. They simply work differently, exactly,

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Speaker 1: I would. I think we worked with that matter out

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Speaker 1: with our white matter. But whether you're male or female,

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Speaker 1: white matter, gray matter, there's one thing that can be

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Speaker 1: the same for everyone. With the checking out this article

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Speaker 1: and other articles about the brain at how stuff works

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Speaker 1: dot com for moral this and thousands of other topics.

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