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Speaker 1: Hey, I do Part two.

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Speaker 2: It's your host, Jane Kramer, and I've got one of

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Speaker 2: your favorite celebrity mentors here on the pod with me,

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Speaker 2: Jennifer Fessler. And today we're diving into all the divorce

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Speaker 2: and Chapter two headlines in the news this week, because

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Speaker 2: there is a lot happening. Let's start off with these

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Speaker 2: Mormon wives.

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Speaker 3: Him my love, Oh you look beautiful, beautiful, you always

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Speaker 3: look freaking beautiful.

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Speaker 2: You all right, girlfriend, Jen, It's a pleasure to have you.

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Speaker 2: I'm so glad that we are back together catching up

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Speaker 2: and there's a lot to catch up on. So let's

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Speaker 2: dive in first with all this Mormon white stuff. Have

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Speaker 2: you seen all the headlines with in Dakota? And then

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Speaker 2: they're the latest video just dropped too, from the incident.

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Speaker 3: I mean, this is happening in h this is happening

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Speaker 3: in real time. I mean we literally this happened five

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Speaker 3: minutes before we just started recording. So yeah, unfortunately, unfortunately it.

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Speaker 1: Was hard to miss. And did you see it?

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Speaker 3: Did you see the because I saw one of the podcasters, Oh,

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Speaker 3: Nikki what's her name whatever, like talking about it and

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Speaker 3: they said, you know, I am not even gonna post it.

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Speaker 3: You can go to TMZ if you want to see it,

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Speaker 3: which I did, and so I was able to actually

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Speaker 3: see the whole thing.

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Speaker 1: Did you see it? I can't watch it.

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Speaker 2: I given my d the whole DV background. I I

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Speaker 2: I those things are super triggering, and especially I heard

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Speaker 2: that the daughter got hit, and I just I'm like,

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Speaker 2: I can't. I struggle with yeah, things like that, you know, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I do know. So I'm glad. I don't know how

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Speaker 2: many what was your from what what I was told,

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Speaker 2: And we just spoke about this my podcast wind down

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Speaker 2: to we were talking about he was saying stop and

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Speaker 2: being like, this is what abuse looks like. And she

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Speaker 2: just kept got him in the headlock, hurled some stools

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Speaker 2: at him, and then apparently the daughter.

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Speaker 1: Even which they usually are everything like they.

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Speaker 2: Even Coda obviously sent this video because he recorded it.

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Speaker 1: Well he's saying that. I think he's saying that he did.

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Speaker 3: I mean, honestly, like to our listeners, this is happening

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Speaker 3: in real time. I think he's claiming that he didn't

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Speaker 3: or his rep is I don't know either way.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't even matter because he.

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Speaker 2: Probably sent it to somebody too. And then like you know,

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Speaker 2: what I mean, because that yeah, yeah, and then that

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Speaker 2: person probably leaked because there it's like it's been earlier

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Speaker 2: she said about all of it, and probably from the

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Speaker 2: last allegations of her choking him with the necklace, and

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Speaker 2: then what she's saying that he was he was the

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Speaker 2: aggressor in the car, and both things can be true, right, Like,

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Speaker 2: that's the thing where it's unfortunate with the situation is, yes,

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Speaker 2: he could have been the aggressor in the car, and

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Speaker 2: yes she could have been the aggressor with choking him

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Speaker 2: with the necklace, But what was your stance when you

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Speaker 2: watch the video? Because I think when I watched the videos,

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Speaker 2: all it was sickening, and everyone is going to feel

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Speaker 2: this way. I think it was just the baby was

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Speaker 2: the part that was the whole thing was sickening, and

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Speaker 2: then you factor in the baby, and so that's like

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Speaker 2: a whole different level of you know, just awful, disgusting,

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Speaker 2: you know, just gut wrenching. And then so I watched

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Speaker 2: the first season of Mormon Wives, and our producer Heather

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Speaker 2: had reminded me that like the first episode that was

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Speaker 2: when it was all happening, that she had gotten They

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Speaker 2: showed her getting arrested, which by the way, was my

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Speaker 2: and I just had also spoken about this. It always

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Speaker 2: kind of rubbed me the wrong way that it just

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Speaker 2: kind of went away, you know.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, what happened?

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Speaker 2: And are we addressing the fact that abuse is not

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Speaker 2: okay on both sides? You know?

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Speaker 3: And if I remember correctly, that happened, but they stayed together.

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Speaker 1: They it's been like back and forth. They broke up.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I'm actually gether. They broke up, so they're off

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Speaker 2: and on. Okay, yeah, they're off and on. So again

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Speaker 2: watching the video.

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Speaker 3: So watching the video is gut wrenching, and I'm really

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Speaker 3: glad you didn't watch it. And also I thought, whoever

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Speaker 3: accepted that final rose if that person is not running

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Speaker 3: for the hills, I don't know how. I mean, I'm

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Speaker 3: sorry now, I'm just thinking in terms of like TV

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Speaker 3: and these are real people in real lives. So I

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Speaker 3: don't mean to be callous. But I saw her also

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Speaker 3: today or yesterday on the Today Show.

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Speaker 1: She don't get more Americ excuse me? On Good Morning America.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, she's been on Regis. I'm sorry, not rags, Markan Kelly.

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Speaker 2: She's being Morning America. She's been doing the rounds because

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Speaker 2: Bachelor I supposed to air on Sunday, which from this

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Speaker 2: now video, do you think that it should air so?

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Speaker 3: Well?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 3: But also, and I'll tell you why. But I watching

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Speaker 3: her on Good Morning America, I thought she handled it

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Speaker 3: like a champ. Right now, I hadn't seen her.

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Speaker 2: She said the same thing. I thought she handled it

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Speaker 2: really well on the mark in Kelly.

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Speaker 1: I didn't see her.

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Speaker 2: Because she was basically just like all of my premieres

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Speaker 2: have been ruined. You know, he's tried to sabotage my premieres,

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Speaker 2: you know so.

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Speaker 3: And I didn't hear her say that on Good Morning America. Okay,

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Speaker 3: I heard her say more like this is I can't

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Speaker 3: hide it. This is like the worst thing that could

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Speaker 3: ever happen. And I'm still showing up. I don't and

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Speaker 3: whatever she said, I don't, you know, I don't remember

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Speaker 3: the words. But I found her personally. I found her sympathetic,

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Speaker 3: right And now I am not jury, I'm not god.

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Speaker 3: I only have though. Yeah, I just I'm coming right

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Speaker 3: off of that video and it's just awful. And it

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Speaker 3: feels to me like spotlighting that they said that she was.

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Speaker 3: Didn't she get help when she went away for a

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Speaker 3: couple of weeks.

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Speaker 2: She I believe she went to some sort of retreat center.

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Speaker 2: I know there's a place called the Hoffmann Institute, which

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Speaker 2: I debated.

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Speaker 1: Going to after my divorce.

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Speaker 2: I ended up choosing on site, which is in another

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Speaker 2: amazing place to you know, do a lot of healing work.

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Speaker 2: And I was so proud of her because that work

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Speaker 2: is some really hard work to go back and clearly

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Speaker 2: she's had some trauma in her life. And you know,

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Speaker 2: I don't know his story as much, but just from

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Speaker 2: what I've been, just from what I've watched and learned

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Speaker 2: about her, that she really needed that place. And so

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Speaker 2: I was hoping that that place and then you know,

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Speaker 2: with doing the Bachelorette and being happier and finding that healing,

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Speaker 2: that she would be on the other side of it.

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Speaker 2: But then to hear more allegations of that abuse again

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Speaker 2: is sour.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well so he they say that he was an addict,

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Speaker 3: but I guess he was an addict. I don't know

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Speaker 3: if he's said it also and that, but also Taylor's

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Speaker 3: dad was abusive to Taylor's mom. I mean, this is

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Speaker 3: you know, abuse repeating yourself. Dakota's right, so Dakota is

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Speaker 3: supposed to be an or is an addict. I'm not sure,

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Speaker 3: but there's always it's always I think he's in recovery,

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Speaker 3: but it's always messy and awful.

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Speaker 1: And I guess there's so many.

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Speaker 3: Pieces of this right like, but the piece right now

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Speaker 3: is that this show is about to air. And I

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Speaker 3: don't know, I don't know how you watched this show

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Speaker 3: with a smile and in a way that's impartial, and

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Speaker 3: you know, it's such a fun show to watch.

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Speaker 1: I love well, you want for people to find love.

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Speaker 1: It's to see that.

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Speaker 2: You know, when when you watch The Bachelor, the girls,

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Speaker 2: you know they're they're a little uh who they are

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Speaker 2: bond and I had their bonds and stuff. And then

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Speaker 2: when you watch the Bachelorette, it's like, okay, these the

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Speaker 2: guys and and kind of you know, seeing right who's

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Speaker 2: you know, who's who would be you know, good fit

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Speaker 2: for her? But right now, I mean it sounds like

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Speaker 2: she's like a little you know, it's myself.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And I mean it's like a little fairy tale,

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Speaker 3: right It's like it's it's it's fun, and it's you're

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Speaker 3: hoping that they're going to ride away.

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Speaker 1: Into the sunset.

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Speaker 3: But whoever took that last rose from her, we're already

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Speaker 3: kind of like, how is that panning out? I mean

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Speaker 3: it just so it's I feel like it's over before

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Speaker 3: it even begins. But you know, who am I I'm

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Speaker 3: this is I'm just just as a viewer. But I

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Speaker 3: felt like when I watched it, and I feel like

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Speaker 3: everyone else feel like this. It's awful. But the baby

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Speaker 3: of it all was horrendous.

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Speaker 2: And I think what's really sad about this too. I

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Speaker 2: didn't know that she grew up in a violent household,

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Speaker 2: but unfortunately, when you were a child of abuse, that

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Speaker 2: is then ingrained in you to think that is what

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Speaker 2: is normal, and that is the farthest thing from what

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Speaker 2: is actually normal. And unfortunately then she's just taking on

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Speaker 2: that pattern then for her children.

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Speaker 3: Well, so she didn't grow up with her dad, I guess.

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Speaker 3: But I can also say that I grew up with

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Speaker 3: a certain amount of abuse as well, physical and I

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Speaker 3: don't really talk about a lot, but anyway, but I've

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Speaker 3: been through thirty years of therapy, you know, and I

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Speaker 3: because God forbid, I repeat my childhood and I'm very

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Speaker 3: proud of that. And I married the world's most gentleman.

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Speaker 3: So there's also that, but I feel for her, I

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Speaker 3: feel for there are patterns and everything about it is

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Speaker 3: just sad. And maybe we judge, we should judge, maybe

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Speaker 3: we shouldn't judge. I don't even know, but I just

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Speaker 3: don't think at this point that I would watch the bacherette.

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Speaker 2: Do you think if it was a man in this situation,

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Speaker 2: they would pull it?

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Speaker 1: Yes?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's where I think it's not it's it's

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Speaker 2: it shouldn't be a double standard when it comes to abuse.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 3: I've also been talking to just people that I know

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Speaker 3: in casting who say that, you know, she went directly

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Speaker 3: from one show to the next, and I don't know,

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Speaker 3: I don't know how extensive at that point, Like the

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Speaker 3: background checks, there's so much when you go into a

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Speaker 3: real at least for me, you tell me.

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Speaker 1: But like when I.

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Speaker 3: About the arrests though, I mean you know about the

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Speaker 3: arrest I guess there wasn't anything else at that point. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: But like when I got cast, I was not just

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Speaker 3: a background check on me. I mean, my husband wasn't

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Speaker 3: getting paid. They did a full background check on him

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Speaker 3: and a full deep dive into everything we've ever done

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Speaker 3: on Facebook and social media, and you know, so there

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Speaker 3: is something.

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Speaker 2: I do want to say about the divorce or sorry,

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Speaker 2: that's the divorce. But the abuse side of things is

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Speaker 2: that so many times it's the man is the abuser,

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Speaker 2: but there are cases where the women where the woman

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Speaker 2: is also the abuser, and it's not talked about as

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Speaker 2: much because people just automatically think the man's the abuser.

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Speaker 2: And I am by no means calling her the soul

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Speaker 2: abuser by any by any means. But what I do

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Speaker 2: want to highlight is a term called violent resistance. And

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Speaker 2: it's something that I learned going through my DV story.

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Speaker 2: When you are in an abusive relationship, nine out of

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Speaker 2: ten women end up retaliating with violent resistance. Now then

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Speaker 2: their abuser will say, well, you're abusive. But the violent

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Speaker 2: resistance is a lot categorizes under a self defense, it

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Speaker 2: categorizes under it at times. It's also when they want

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Speaker 2: they want to fight back for themselves, they want to

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Speaker 2: either regain the control. But that is where it becomes cloudy.

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Speaker 2: And this might be this might be Taylor in that

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Speaker 2: violent resistance mode because but it's hard when you watch

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Speaker 2: a video where he's saying stop and I think that's

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Speaker 2: where it gets a little hard because if he's saying stop,

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Speaker 2: then she's not in immediate danger. So people will just

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Speaker 2: think she's the abuser, but they don't they're not aware

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Speaker 2: of the violent resistance piece of it where she has

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Speaker 2: maybe because we don't know, she maybe has endured lots

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Speaker 2: of violence from him.

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Speaker 1: Maybe who knows.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so what are your thoughts about this from this

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Speaker 3: was three years are coming out today?

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Speaker 2: Well, again, I think it's the part where we don't

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Speaker 2: know the full story. And that's why I want to

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Speaker 2: bring up the violent resistance because I think if someone

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Speaker 2: watches that video, they're just gonna be like, oh, she's

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Speaker 2: the abuser. But there is such a big piece and

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Speaker 2: this is where it's not talked about. And this is

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Speaker 2: why I want DV to be spoken about more, is

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Speaker 2: because there is that violent resistance piece of it. And

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Speaker 2: again because we don't have all the facts. Again, I'm

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Speaker 2: not saying what she did is okay, absolutely not, like

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Speaker 2: I know that you're not like you are not no

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Speaker 2: means am I using very clear of course, yeah, but

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Speaker 2: like you should not put your hands on someone else.

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Speaker 1: Having said that, within the violent.

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Speaker 2: Resistance in an abusive relationship, these women feel like they

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Speaker 2: have to fight back. Yeah, and what was the video

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Speaker 2: showing before he recorded things?

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Speaker 1: Again, I'm not saying it's okay.

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Speaker 2: And my therapist I always say that it's like violence

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Speaker 2: is not the answer. Having said that, when you are

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Speaker 2: in an abusive relationship, and again, nine out of ten

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Speaker 2: women end up going into that violent resistance And the

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Speaker 2: problem is the woman ends up getting arrested because of

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Speaker 2: reactions then because now he's rolling a camera, what was

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Speaker 2: he doing before they came?

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Speaker 1: Again, none of it is.

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Speaker 2: Okay, like any part of it is okay, But there's

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Speaker 2: also a bigger picture within what happens when you are

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Speaker 2: in a domestic violence And so let me let me

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Speaker 2: be this relationship.

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Speaker 3: What if you spin that right and you say and

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Speaker 3: or she also could just be this like that to who? Again,

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Speaker 3: we don't know, because women can be the abuser to

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Speaker 3: So that's what I was gonna say. So, how often

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Speaker 3: when you see a man being violent do we say

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Speaker 3: was he? Is there such a thing as a man

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Speaker 3: also being a violent resistor?

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Speaker 1: I understand what you're saying with that. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I'm a percent I'm not.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, but and you know, maybe you know what

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Speaker 2: I mean. I don't know that situation, but we also

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Speaker 2: know for you know, yes, they could say, well, a

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Speaker 2: woman could just walk away. He's saying stop, he could

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Speaker 2: have you know, he was trying to get away. Apparently

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Speaker 2: it's from what this video is. And that's a good question.

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Speaker 2: That's something you know that I haven't spoken to my

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Speaker 2: therapist about that piece, you know. But in cases, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm it should be the same way. But he also no,

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Speaker 2: because he shouldn't. A man also shouldn't lay his hands

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Speaker 2: on a woman, and again a woman shouldn't either. So

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Speaker 2: in most cases it is the healthy yes, that's where

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Speaker 2: it's like, but no, no hands should ever be on anyone,

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Speaker 2: that's the thing. But if you are feeling like you

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Speaker 2: are unsafe and you need to protect yourself, that is

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Speaker 2: when it gets cloudy, because if they feel trapped or stuck,

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Speaker 2: and there's a there's a whole list online about the

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Speaker 2: different stages of why someone does the violent resistance, and

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Speaker 2: you know, and again when you went in the court

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Speaker 2: of law, it's it's really hard because they'll look at

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Speaker 2: that video and go, well, you weren't in danger, so

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Speaker 2: you were the you were the one attacking like they're

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Speaker 2: happened to yesterday, what happened course, Like they're not going

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Speaker 2: to take into account what happened the last five years

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Speaker 2: in their relationship.

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Speaker 3: They're just going to see her as the abuser. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: And I also think that, let's get real for a minute.

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Speaker 3: It's it's a woman that is, I mean, I'm even

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Speaker 3: allowed to say that in this day and age, but

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Speaker 3: more likely that the woman is taking the physical abuse. Sorry,

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Speaker 3: it's just it just is. But I'm not saying it

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Speaker 3: doesn't happen like in this case, and I'm not saying

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Speaker 3: that a woman can't be the physical abuser. And I

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Speaker 3: don't know if it's okay for a man to then

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Speaker 3: develop that kind of resistance. It's all very ugly and

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Speaker 3: complicated and sad, and I think you're right, needs to

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Speaker 3: be talked about more, you know. And also I guess

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Speaker 3: she was also, I guess she used to be drinking.

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Speaker 3: She was a drinker back when it happened three years ago,

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Speaker 3: and she's not anymore.

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Speaker 1: And so Physis.

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Speaker 2: In the context of intimate partner violence, a man can

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Speaker 2: engage in violent resistance, which is defined as the use

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Speaker 2: of violence in response to a partner's course of controlling

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Speaker 2: violence when.

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Speaker 1: Men are more while men are more.

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Speaker 2: Often the primary per portrayers of intimate terrorism, Research indicates

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Speaker 2: that some men use violent violence to resist, defender retaliate

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Speaker 2: against a partner's controlling behaviors.

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Speaker 1: And and and that might be what's happening.

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Speaker 2: They're they're toxic relationship back and forth, like they both

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Speaker 2: need to just co parent separately.

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Speaker 1: And really, yeah.

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Speaker 2: I mean this is not especially since it's you know,

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Speaker 2: even after the Bachelorette, this is still happening where they're

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Speaker 2: still talking about his past and perhast people.

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Speaker 1: Like in the.

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Speaker 2: You should not be putting your hands on anybody, plain

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Speaker 2: and simple. And something that I've learned is anytime that

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Speaker 2: anything ever gets heated, we just have to you have

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Speaker 2: to walk away. You know.

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Speaker 3: It's you know, what's so funny, Jane, is that I

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Speaker 3: don't even know if you watch Jersey because it feels

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Speaker 3: like now it was one hundred years ago.

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Speaker 1: But the finale of.

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Speaker 3: The last season that we did, which was season fourteen,

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Speaker 3: got violent, and so it did, and I the whole

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Speaker 3: cast was a whole cast finale, and I just left

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Speaker 3: and I got to look for it from my viewers

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Speaker 3: because a lot of them just said it was supposed

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Speaker 3: to I was not supposed to do. I was like

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Speaker 3: hosting this luncheon with Dolores, and as soon as it

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Speaker 3: got violent, my I just couldn't whether it's my own

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Speaker 3: you know, past and and what I've I get very

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Speaker 3: freaked out and I just couldn't stay. I was like,

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Speaker 3: I'm not out of here, and I did. I got

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Speaker 3: a lot of youer crap for it, like she leaves,

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Speaker 3: you were hosting the lunch. That's your job. That ain't

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Speaker 3: my job. My job job, it's not my job. Nomen

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Speaker 3: take them out to get sorry.

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Speaker 1: I have no interest in that. Yeah, none, Well good

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Speaker 1: for you.

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Speaker 3: Well, I'm just saying like if I make good TV,

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Speaker 3: like all this is such a great it's not a

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Speaker 3: great set.

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Speaker 1: Abuse it's never a great TV. That's the thing.

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Speaker 2: Like that is where like, uh, it's being physical. That

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Speaker 2: is not something that our children need to see. That's

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Speaker 2: not something that we need to witness or do to

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Speaker 2: somebody else to the respect level. When you have to

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Speaker 2: grab someone, hurt someone, push someone verbally physically, that is

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Speaker 2: not something to get viewership for. And if that's something

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Speaker 2: that ABC is going to keep on, that just shows

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Speaker 2: that they are feeding into this really awful narrative that

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Speaker 2: it's acceptable and it's not acceptable on the side, whether

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Speaker 2: violent resistance or not, like there is you should not

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Speaker 2: Like again, do you have to defend yourself one hundred percent,

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Speaker 2: like defend yourself to get out of a situation if

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Speaker 2: that's you know, the case. But it's not something where

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Speaker 2: you should be highlighting or saying that behavior is okay,

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Speaker 2: because it's not okay.

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Speaker 3: I agree completely. Do you think that ABC should call

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Speaker 3: it off?

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Speaker 1: What do you think?

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Speaker 2: I think I hope they do, just because if not,

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Speaker 2: then they're wanting to see the viewership of the And

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Speaker 2: I'm proud of the girls for not filming The Secret

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Speaker 2: Life and being like, you guys need to figure this

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Speaker 2: out because you're just enabling a situation that is not

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Speaker 2: healthy and is not safe for anybody. It is like

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Speaker 2: DV is not something to joke about, to get viewership

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Speaker 2: about to It's just not at all. And if it

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Speaker 2: was a guy, they would have shut it down immediately.

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Speaker 1: We're on the same side of history here, and it

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Speaker 1: is a guy too. It's a it's this is the thing.

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Speaker 1: It's not. I don't think it's just one person.

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Speaker 2: I think it's the both of them are in, you know,

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Speaker 2: a toxic cycle that they have to step right outside

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Speaker 2: from each other.

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Speaker 3: The other piece is even if you which you can't.

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Speaker 3: But I'm just talking like hypothetically, even if they were

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Speaker 3: together again and there wasn't violence, So how are you

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Speaker 3: going in through a whole season knowing that they were

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Speaker 3: unless they were just exchanging kids, I guess or something.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I'm just thinking of like the logistics of

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Speaker 3: you know, after you get the final rose, then you're

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Speaker 3: kind of what I know about it right from what

402
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Speaker 3: I'm just a viewer, But you're isolated. You go somewhere,

403
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Speaker 3: you can't talk to anyone. I think that your kid

404
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,120
Speaker 3: would be brought to you. You wouldn't go hang out

405
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Speaker 3: with your ex who you were in an abusive relationship with.

406
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Speaker 3: I don't know, the whole thing is just a show.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's sad. It's really sad because there's kids involved. Yeah,

408
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Speaker 1: I didn't. I didn't obviously never saw this.

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Speaker 3: I knew she'd been arrested, but I didn't really know

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Speaker 3: all the details. But I've been asked before just in

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Speaker 3: talking about pop culture, like out of all the Mormon wives,

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Speaker 3: I was like, I always liked the messy girl, Like,

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Speaker 3: I just think she's so cute and she's so all

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Speaker 3: over the place. And you know, I didn't know her past.

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Speaker 3: I wasn't judging like, oh, she had been arrested. I

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Speaker 3: guess I didn't even at that point factor into it.

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Speaker 3: I just thought she was just a little bit of

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Speaker 3: a hot mess and I'm always drawn to those people.

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Speaker 1: But anyway, so I liked her.

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Speaker 3: I liked her in Good Morning America when I watched

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Speaker 3: her two days ago.

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Speaker 2: There needs to be, yeah, a lot of a lot

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Speaker 2: of healing work done though, and yeah, separation from them,

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Speaker 2: and if you know anyone called the National Domestic Violence

425
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Speaker 2: Hotline at one eight hundred seven nine nine seven two

426
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Speaker 2: three three hard. Turn now to the brutal reason why

427
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Speaker 2: Keith Urban's daughter Sunday snubbed the singer. So Keith Urban

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Speaker 2: Nicole Kiman's daughter have reportedly fully taken their mom's side

429
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Speaker 2: after their parents' divorce. Sunday recently snubbed her father in

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Speaker 2: a new interview in which she gushed over Kidman and

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Speaker 2: failed to mention him. Sunday called Kidman her biggest inspiration

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Speaker 2: in life and a key part of everything she does.

433
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Speaker 2: An interview with Elle, in which Urban reportedly took issue

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Speaker 2: but felt a numb too. They've made their own choices

435
00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,240
Speaker 2: about their dad, a source claim to the outlet. Kidman

436
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Speaker 2: isn't like that Keith hasn't tried much to make things better.

437
00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 2: In their eyes, the girls have always been close with

438
00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:08,080
Speaker 2: their mother. They are her everything. A source also told

439
00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:10,159
Speaker 2: the aule Of that Sunday and Faith are hurt and

440
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,600
Speaker 2: angry on her behalf following their parents split after nineteen

441
00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:16,720
Speaker 2: years of marriage. There's some resentment against Keith. If they

442
00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 2: are blaming someone, it's him, not her, they said. Urban

443
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,399
Speaker 2: is reportedly worried about his relationship with his daughters, but

444
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 2: it's hopeful that I will turn around. He's hurt, but

445
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 2: he feels he can patch things up. He doesn't blame Nicole,

446
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:29,960
Speaker 2: and it doesn't seem like she's alienating them from him.

447
00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:32,800
Speaker 2: You know, I feel like when kids are that age,

448
00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:37,760
Speaker 2: at fifteen seventeen, they're like, I was very aware what

449
00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:40,280
Speaker 2: happened in my parents' divorce. I was thirteen years old.

450
00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:46,359
Speaker 2: I understood that what happened happened, and it was never

451
00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:49,600
Speaker 2: my mom saying your dad's a bad person. I made

452
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 2: up for myself what I thought it was. And now

453
00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:54,040
Speaker 2: my dad and I have a great relationship, but that

454
00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 2: was a relationship that just took time because of the

455
00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:58,880
Speaker 2: things that I witnessed and I saw and I felt

456
00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:01,600
Speaker 2: as a kid, and I think in those years that's

457
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:07,359
Speaker 2: a really tough age. And as well, I went to

458
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:09,440
Speaker 2: my mom and that too because you want to protect

459
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:12,320
Speaker 2: your mom and you see, maybe certain things I'm not

460
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:13,360
Speaker 2: saying Keith did any bad.

461
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:14,239
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know.

462
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:17,720
Speaker 2: Again, we don't know anything right from our own personal yes,

463
00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 2: But I just make up from my own personal experience

464
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 2: that why I gravitated towards my mom. I believe that

465
00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:28,159
Speaker 2: again from what I saw.

466
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:35,240
Speaker 3: Well, my parents have been divorced seven times between them,

467
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:38,359
Speaker 3: so it started at a very young age, right, And

468
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,120
Speaker 3: like I was three and my sister was two and

469
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:43,719
Speaker 3: my mom my mom and dad divorced and there were

470
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:46,040
Speaker 3: lots of horrible stepparents.

471
00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:47,000
Speaker 1: But that's for another episode.

472
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:52,199
Speaker 3: But anyway, and there was a ton of bad mouthing

473
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 3: on both sides, and I, you know, for me, like

474
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:01,480
Speaker 3: mommy was just mommy. You know, she was my safe

475
00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:05,320
Speaker 3: place at least when I was very young. And but

476
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:09,360
Speaker 3: I never ever like, you know, I wanted his love

477
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:13,600
Speaker 3: so badly, and it was never like there was never

478
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,480
Speaker 3: a choice. Really, I never felt like I had a choice,

479
00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. I was always just kind

480
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 3: of juggling defending one or defending the other. Again, I

481
00:25:22,520 --> 00:25:28,520
Speaker 3: mean I was very young and then so but with

482
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 3: my kids. I think we've talked about this before, but

483
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 3: I was separated for a year and a half and

484
00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 3: now we got back together.

485
00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:40,680
Speaker 1: But you guys are good now. Yeah, it's like a miracle.

486
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:43,000
Speaker 3: Well we look at it her like I wonder if

487
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 3: it would have ever if it would have ever been

488
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 3: this good, you know, I don't know, Yes, Well, but

489
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 3: the thing is when it happened, I've had so much

490
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 3: trauma in terms of like my parents and divorce and

491
00:25:55,960 --> 00:26:00,879
Speaker 3: step whatever, all of it. So we not never once

492
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,560
Speaker 3: in that year and a half did anything to say

493
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:06,399
Speaker 3: anything but wonderful things about the other. Like I was

494
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 3: more conscious of it because I've been through it. He

495
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,359
Speaker 3: had a his parents were never divorced, and they were wonderful

496
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 3: to each other. But I remember once he was in

497
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:16,200
Speaker 3: the car with my kids and Rachel, my daughter called

498
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:21,119
Speaker 3: me on speaker and started complaining and Dad, whatever you know,

499
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:23,359
Speaker 3: I don't remember the exact whatever it was, and I

500
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,720
Speaker 3: was like, honey, you dialed the wrong number. If you

501
00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:29,440
Speaker 3: want to complain about Jeff Fessler, you find someone else

502
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 3: to call it. You have the best father, and so

503
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:34,199
Speaker 3: you're barking up the wrong tree.

504
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:38,280
Speaker 2: And I think parent parent alienation and co parenting is

505
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 2: I think one of the worst things you can do

506
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,960
Speaker 2: for that child. And again, I'm so grateful that my

507
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:45,880
Speaker 2: mom didn't do that. Again, I think kids are smart

508
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 2: enough to make up their own minds. But and it

509
00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:53,879
Speaker 2: sounds like, you know, Nicole isn't alienating them or saying things,

510
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 2: and I think it's but I have known people that

511
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 2: speak so poorly about out their exes to their kids,

512
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:05,720
Speaker 2: and I have some how it has affected and I

513
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:10,040
Speaker 2: believe that's that's a form of manipulation. And it's not

514
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 2: like do I love my ex husband. No, do I

515
00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 2: want to say certain things the kids like, I mean, sure,

516
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 2: but I would never do that because like, for example,

517
00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 2: I was just talking Jolie called me the other day

518
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:26,000
Speaker 2: at his house because he redid her room, and I'm

519
00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 2: just like.

520
00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:28,879
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, Daddy gave you the best room ever.

521
00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:32,479
Speaker 2: And it's like I want her to feel safe, loved,

522
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,680
Speaker 2: adored by her father because he is a good dad,

523
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 2: you know, and he he loves her and he's showing

524
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:40,879
Speaker 2: up for her, and so you know, I want you know,

525
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 2: do I get frustrated at times because I feel differently

526
00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:46,960
Speaker 2: in certain situations? Sure, but like that's not for them

527
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:52,760
Speaker 2: to take on my feelings about my ex. Like all

528
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 2: they need to know and feel is loved, supported and safe, you.

529
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 1: Know, and why God bless you, like good for you.

530
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:01,399
Speaker 1: Clearly you have put the work in because I.

531
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:03,680
Speaker 2: Just know the effects and I've seen it from like

532
00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:08,000
Speaker 2: the first time of like how I they will when

533
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:10,719
Speaker 2: they're older, they can make up the assumptions they like,

534
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 2: And I don't want to manipulate how their relationship is

535
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:16,399
Speaker 2: gonna look. That's not fair, like just because oh I

536
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 2: want to look like the better parent, Like no, like

537
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,400
Speaker 2: they'll know what happened in our marriage eventually, but like

538
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:23,160
Speaker 2: I want them to be like, yeah, but my dad

539
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:26,359
Speaker 2: loves me and that's all that matters, Like it's between us.

540
00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 2: Shouldn't then influence them?

541
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 3: And well yeah, right, most of my friends who are

542
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,840
Speaker 3: going through or have been through divorce, they're not able

543
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 3: to do that.

544
00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: So kudos to you. I have a lot of.

545
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 2: I'm grateful that my kids were young when we got divorced,

546
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 2: because I don't know, it would have been a lot

547
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 2: harder because I had been like dad, you know what

548
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:49,120
Speaker 2: I mean, I probably would have gone off the rails.

549
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 2: If they were maybe a little older, maybe you wouldn't

550
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:52,560
Speaker 2: have a lot.

551
00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 3: But like I say that you wouldn't because you did

552
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 3: not you know. But like I I've had a lot

553
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 3: of friends and a lot of people that they're in

554
00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:06,520
Speaker 3: the process that I know that I know now and

555
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:08,120
Speaker 3: that just can't help it.

556
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: Yea, and they get they become so incurable their father

557
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 1: is not.

558
00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:14,680
Speaker 2: Paying for Yeah, Like I would never tell my kids that.

559
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,760
Speaker 2: I mean again, they're not old enough to listen to

560
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:19,440
Speaker 2: my podcast, but like, yes, I talk about my resentment

561
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 2: of having to pay child support, But never would I

562
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:23,200
Speaker 2: ever say to them, well I have to pay your

563
00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 2: daddy for years, because I'm like, then they're going to think, oh,

564
00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 2: negative of their father.

565
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 3: And that's people don't even understand how much that takes

566
00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 3: to hold back. I mean I think that I it's

567
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,080
Speaker 3: so funny we have two different situations.

568
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,360
Speaker 1: Like I grew up with parents.

569
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 3: It was a it was a shit show and they

570
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:44,320
Speaker 3: both had horrible things to say, and it was every time,

571
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 3: and I felt like they were angry at me when

572
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 3: I would go back, and you looks like you grew

573
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:50,160
Speaker 3: up and your mother specifically was so wonderful.

574
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 1: Well I knew what my dad did.

575
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 2: Again, I she didn't have to tell me, you know

576
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:56,959
Speaker 2: what I mean? I tell those things where it's like

577
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 2: I again in these this situation, but between Sunday and Faith,

578
00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 2: it's like they're old enough to know and have seen

579
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:08,720
Speaker 2: and witness things to make up their own mind. And

580
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:11,920
Speaker 2: like my mom didn't want to like alienate us anymore.

581
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 2: He his actions alienated us enough, you know.

582
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:15,960
Speaker 1: Yeah.

583
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 2: I mean my mother took adulthood to then men not

584
00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 2: and I took, you know, being in my late thirties

585
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 2: to go mid thirties to go Okay, what were you

586
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:29,080
Speaker 2: going through at that time that made you did that?

587
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 2: And to have grace and compassion. But that took years,

588
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 2: you know, So.

589
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 1: I don't know. I never I never had the courage

590
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:35,320
Speaker 1: to get mad.

591
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,880
Speaker 3: And my dad about any of it, and he denies

592
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 3: a lot of it to this day.

593
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 2: But well, all that age because they didn't do therapy

594
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 2: they're not the ownership and our age is not right, not.

595
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 3: Any Yeah, but I mean I was there, Like I

596
00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 3: remember him calling his soon to be wife. But you

597
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 3: remember cousin Linda from the wedding cousin. We all got

598
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 3: a cousin Linda, all right.

599
00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: We all got a cousin Linda. So I was old

600
00:30:57,960 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 1: enough to remember that.

601
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:03,000
Speaker 3: But it was a situation where it was bad and

602
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 3: with anyway, the point is, I am very impressed with

603
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 3: the fact that you've been able to hold back in

604
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:11,480
Speaker 3: that way when it comes to your kids.

605
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:12,040
Speaker 1: I hope that.

606
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 3: And I was heartbroken when these two split up. I

607
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 3: always love Nicole and Keith.

608
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 1: I know I was. Actually I was so sad, I know,

609
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:22,440
Speaker 1: so cute, but you know what we never it was

610
00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 1: behind closed doors.

611
00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 3: Isn't it weird that, Like I think back to like

612
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:30,080
Speaker 3: her and Tom Cruise and how those two kids. It

613
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 3: looks like, I mean whatever, just as a just as

614
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,560
Speaker 3: a viewer or whatever, that they went the way of

615
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 3: Tom Cruise. Maybe because of scientology, I don't know, but

616
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 3: it looks like she kind of lost those two.

617
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:45,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I haven't thought it is. It is very interesting.

618
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:47,200
Speaker 1: It's very sad, But I would.

619
00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 2: Say and think about to help your kids with filling

620
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,600
Speaker 2: your resentment to their you know, to them.

621
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:58,239
Speaker 3: Meant, look at Brad Pitt and Angelina and now all

622
00:31:58,280 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 3: those kids. I mean, I guess it's a very hard

623
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 3: thing to escape, you know. And kids are allowed to

624
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:03,840
Speaker 3: have also their own feelings when they're old enough to

625
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,239
Speaker 3: have seen it like you were and understand the way

626
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 3: it all went down.

627
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, you know, there's there's that.

628
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 2: And I also have a lot of listen going through

629
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 2: a divorce, especially if some if you were wronged by

630
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:18,640
Speaker 2: this person, which you're when you get divorced, someone's angry

631
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 2: at somebody, clearly because you're you're divorcing. But there is also,

632
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 2: again so much grace for the fact that you have

633
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:33,520
Speaker 2: that anger and that resentment, and nobody will fault you

634
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:35,880
Speaker 2: for the time that you've maybe said one or two

635
00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 2: comments out of pure frustration, you know. And again that's

636
00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 2: why I'm saying, I'm glad my kids were younger, because

637
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 2: I who knows, you know, I might have needed a

638
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:48,040
Speaker 2: buddy then to be like, God, your dad is such

639
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 2: a lov you know what I mean, Like, because I

640
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 2: wanted a friend and I sometimes you know, we think

641
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 2: of our kids as friends at times, and they're not

642
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 2: in those situations, you know, and they shouldn't be your

643
00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,800
Speaker 2: ear and you're counter part in that because that's you're

644
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 2: talking about their father and that's not okay.

645
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 1: So hopefully Goldberg, what's going on?

646
00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:09,600
Speaker 2: Yes, well, Big Goldberg says after three divorces, her sex

647
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:13,080
Speaker 2: life now consists of hit and runs. I don't know why,

648
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 2: but the headline just makes me laugh and it's so funny.

649
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 2: And I'm also like, yeah, girl, like it's a hit

650
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:20,800
Speaker 2: and run when she needs it. You know, she's she's

651
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 2: seventy years old, you know what I mean. Like she's

652
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:31,640
Speaker 2: clearly you know, she says, uh sorry, she's didn't hesitate

653
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:34,120
Speaker 2: to relate. She said, I bar hop, I go hang,

654
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 2: she said, prompting co host Joey to ask whether she

655
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 2: personally missed that chapter of a life. She goes, I'm single,

656
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 2: Goldberg seventy replied, I do hit and runs when I

657
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 2: need it, but I'm not married to anybody and I

658
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 2: don't have responsibilities. And listen, I mean, good, Onya. I

659
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:50,400
Speaker 2: think it's hilarious and I think it's great. And when

660
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 2: you're seventy, I mean, she's like, I don't want to

661
00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 2: live with anybody. She added, I have lots of people

662
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 2: that I love, but I don't need them living with me.

663
00:33:58,200 --> 00:33:59,600
Speaker 1: I don't need to be sleeping with them.

664
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:04,440
Speaker 2: And I I think it's at seventy.

665
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 3: Whatever, I think, whatever I will give, she could fuck

666
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 3: whoever she wants to.

667
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:09,040
Speaker 1: I think it's all good as well.

668
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:14,160
Speaker 3: I think that for me, I don't think that I

669
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:16,000
Speaker 3: would be looking for a hit and run at seventy.

670
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:19,399
Speaker 3: If Jeff and I divorced, I'm single tomorrow. If I'm

671
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:24,000
Speaker 3: getting with someone, it's probably more for companionship. I would

672
00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:26,720
Speaker 3: want to have somebody, you know, where everybody's different.

673
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:28,600
Speaker 1: She wants to be alone. I don't know if that

674
00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 1: i'd ever.

675
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:31,680
Speaker 3: Get married again per se, but I think what I

676
00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 3: would be looking for is more of companionship. Yeah, companionship

677
00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 3: a best friend. And who knows, maybe I would be

678
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:40,960
Speaker 3: bar hoping and hitting and running all over the place.

679
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:44,480
Speaker 3: I don't but yeah, I'm not. I don't have that

680
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:47,360
Speaker 3: in me now for my husband, who I love. So

681
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 3: I don't know that i'm you know, I mean, I whatever,

682
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:51,799
Speaker 3: you understand what I'm saying, like I'm not. I don't

683
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:53,640
Speaker 3: get like, oh my god, I got to get it

684
00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 3: going on tonight?

685
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:55,799
Speaker 1: But would be good for hers? Right?

686
00:34:55,920 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 3: I mean, and I'm at this point in twenty twenty six.

687
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,040
Speaker 3: It makes you happy, it makes me happy, so good

688
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:02,319
Speaker 3: for her?

689
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:05,920
Speaker 2: Have you heard of alpine divorce? So men are ditching

690
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:08,319
Speaker 2: women during hikes and over twenty five million people are

691
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:11,440
Speaker 2: deeply disturbed by what is being called an alpine divorce.

692
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,719
Speaker 2: Something extremely unsettling has been circulating around the internet and

693
00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:17,840
Speaker 2: if you're addicted to scrolling you might have seen it.

694
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:20,560
Speaker 2: People are calling it alpine divorce, so not an officially

695
00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:23,400
Speaker 2: coin term, it describes a situation where a man intentionally

696
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 2: abandons his female partner during a hike or outdoor trip

697
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 2: without a phone, water, or other resources. Conversations about alpine

698
00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:34,640
Speaker 2: divorce can be found all over social media, and one

699
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,360
Speaker 2: woman's experience caught the attention of over twenty five million

700
00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:38,160
Speaker 2: on TikTok.

701
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:41,319
Speaker 1: Well, I mean I alpined. That's called being a douchebag

702
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 1: devil's advocate.

703
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 2: If there is a situation where maybe the person feels

704
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 2: unsafe and they want to be in public when they

705
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 2: speak out about, you know, being like, hey, I don't

706
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:05,920
Speaker 2: want to be married to anymore.

707
00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:07,080
Speaker 1: I don't want to be with you.

708
00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:11,239
Speaker 2: Or this if they maybe feel like they're in a

709
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 2: situation where they don't feel safe. That is the only

710
00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:15,799
Speaker 2: way that I think that that would be.

711
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 3: I say this is they're describing this this term as

712
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 3: a situation where a man, yes intentionally a female partner

713
00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 3: during a hike, maybe he feels unsafe. I'm giving him.

714
00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 1: I'm giving him a little and a lot of grace.

715
00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:33,239
Speaker 1: I'm giving a lot of.

716
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 2: Credit, my friend, just thinking maybe if he's in a

717
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:37,440
Speaker 2: bad situation.

718
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 1: Stan with you on this one. I don't know, just

719
00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:42,720
Speaker 1: take a call, okay and say give it something.

720
00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:49,040
Speaker 3: John's something you John thrown at the top of a mountain,

721
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:50,839
Speaker 3: see you later, good luck.

722
00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:53,520
Speaker 2: I know. I'm just thinking from like I've got Dakota

723
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 2: and Taylor on my mind right now, so I'm like,

724
00:36:56,080 --> 00:36:59,080
Speaker 2: like I'm safe or something, and like he just wants like,

725
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 2: you know, you're just not.

726
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:07,279
Speaker 1: That I am. I think he's a douchebag. To have

727
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:09,480
Speaker 1: a douchebag divorce, that's what we're going to call that.

728
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:11,120
Speaker 1: A douchebag divorce.

729
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 2: Jessica Alba and Cash Warren's multi million dollar settlement revealed

730
00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:18,839
Speaker 2: so one month after the producer moved to finalize his

731
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 2: and the Fantastic four actress divorce proceedings. A judge officially

732
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 2: has signed all the documents. This this divorce made me

733
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:26,279
Speaker 2: sad because.

734
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,720
Speaker 1: They just also also a couple of divorce.

735
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 2: But yeah, I just yeah, it made me sad. They

736
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:36,799
Speaker 2: they they And this is the part two where it's

737
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:41,440
Speaker 2: the okay reading about the settlements. I don't know, maybe

738
00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:44,719
Speaker 2: because I had my settlement all in the page. It

739
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 2: just makes me, honestly feel a little uncomfortable, even being like,

740
00:37:47,080 --> 00:37:50,760
Speaker 2: all right, he's got a pay or five thousand experience.

741
00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:52,720
Speaker 1: We know, yeah it's.

742
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:56,479
Speaker 2: And then it also just makes me sad too because

743
00:37:56,520 --> 00:38:00,239
Speaker 2: I remember when I signed my divorce papers. To this day,

744
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:04,320
Speaker 2: it's like doing our parenting plan. Seeing our kids' names

745
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 2: on the parenting plan. That was that gutted me more

746
00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 2: than the price that I had to pay pay him.

747
00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 2: Like even though yes I still have resentment over the

748
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:15,560
Speaker 2: amount of child support and the payment, it's the fact

749
00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:17,880
Speaker 2: that I had to see there's sweet little names on

750
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 2: a piece of paper and having to divide like that

751
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:24,000
Speaker 2: was the part that I'm like, this is so, this

752
00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:25,680
Speaker 2: is so sad, and this is so emotional and so

753
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:28,120
Speaker 2: hurtful and so personal. And then yeah, now it's public

754
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 2: information and the people can see that, and it just

755
00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 2: makes me I don't know things like this. I'm just like,

756
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 2: I don't want to see it. I don't want to know, Like,

757
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:36,959
Speaker 2: let that be, let that be private.

758
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:37,279
Speaker 1: You know.

759
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:42,000
Speaker 3: I yes, number one, I agree, I think it is icky.

760
00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:43,359
Speaker 3: The only thing I will tell you is that when

761
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 3: I read this specific the specifics of their settlement, it

762
00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:54,839
Speaker 3: sounded like it was they're getting shared custody. There are

763
00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:59,319
Speaker 3: looks like everything down the middle besides what was the

764
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:02,320
Speaker 3: money that they made before the marriage and obviously after

765
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:06,640
Speaker 3: And it sounded like he got they sold the house,

766
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 3: but he got the money for it.

767
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:08,960
Speaker 1: Sounded like.

768
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:13,479
Speaker 3: That it was I don't know for sure, but that

769
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:17,480
Speaker 3: it was it had been awful, but still they kind

770
00:39:17,480 --> 00:39:19,000
Speaker 3: of split things right down the middle.

771
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:23,239
Speaker 1: They're both the kids. When the kids are on it,

772
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:25,080
Speaker 1: it seems very kids are right.

773
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 3: Like when the kids are with one parent, that parent

774
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:29,560
Speaker 3: they trust each other enough that that parent make the

775
00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:34,440
Speaker 3: decisions on the healthcare unless it's an emergency that you know,

776
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 3: they and I guess she had said something really positive here.

777
00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:40,280
Speaker 1: She said something I guess recently.

778
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:47,640
Speaker 3: Here's so a colorful past year filled with connection, growth, adventure, laughter, piece, sisterhood, transformation, rebirth, joy,

779
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 3: and so much love. So that's unusual, right, and sending

780
00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:53,359
Speaker 3: hugs to everyone going through it. So I hope from

781
00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:55,840
Speaker 3: what I read, and you obviously never know, but it

782
00:39:55,960 --> 00:40:01,320
Speaker 3: sounds like that they are working together, and they're gonna

783
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:03,759
Speaker 3: work together when it comes to making decisions about these

784
00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:08,200
Speaker 3: kids and trust each other, which is not easy, right, No.

785
00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 1: Not at all.

786
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:13,240
Speaker 2: Scott Wolf addresses reunion with ex Kelly Wolf their kids

787
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:15,680
Speaker 2: a mid divorce so as the former couple moves forward

788
00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:18,360
Speaker 2: in their divorce proceedings, The doc star addressed a photo

789
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,160
Speaker 2: he shared with his X and their kids. While I

790
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,000
Speaker 2: would never have wanted anything to have been made public,

791
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 2: I guess I just it just felt like our family

792
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 2: deserved to have things not just sit in some kind

793
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,680
Speaker 2: of awful dark place in terms of perception. While the

794
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:35,280
Speaker 2: work we're all doing is really the only thing that matters,

795
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:38,239
Speaker 2: it has been made public, he continued. While it's impossible

796
00:40:38,239 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 2: to go into any real detail about much of any

797
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:42,880
Speaker 2: of it, I love all of these four people, and

798
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,720
Speaker 2: all of those four people love each other, and that's

799
00:40:45,800 --> 00:40:49,040
Speaker 2: what matters. In fact, Scott was so sure to emphasize that.

800
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 2: In the photo at the music park, he captioned it healing.

801
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,520
Speaker 2: Scott and Kelly navigate their new normal since they had

802
00:40:56,560 --> 00:41:00,520
Speaker 2: broken up after twenty one years of marriage. Hugh Scott

803
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:04,160
Speaker 2: of abuse and child endangerment amid the proceedings of fifty

804
00:41:04,200 --> 00:41:07,200
Speaker 2: year old slam the allegations, calling them entirely false and disturbing.

805
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 2: There are some significant challenges that are making our situation

806
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 2: incredibly difficult. It's tragic for all involved, he had said.

807
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 2: Although her claims are completely baseless and incredibly dangerous, the

808
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:21,040
Speaker 2: worst part is that they are traumatic for our children.

809
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,240
Speaker 2: I hope that anyone who might speak public or publicly

810
00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 2: or report on such things will reconsider, will consider this

811
00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:30,799
Speaker 2: before spreading any further information from a clearly unreliable and

812
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:32,160
Speaker 2: completely compromise source.

813
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:33,600
Speaker 1: Listen.

814
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:36,719
Speaker 2: I think it's again so sad when things get said

815
00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:40,520
Speaker 2: that aren't true, then they're made public. Then there's certain perception,

816
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:43,920
Speaker 2: and people sometimes will only read just that headline and

817
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:46,680
Speaker 2: then have that perception of that person for the rest

818
00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:50,080
Speaker 2: of their Internet scrolling life. They'll be like, Oh, that

819
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 2: person did this, but then they don't know the context

820
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:55,360
Speaker 2: that he didn't do that or this didn't happen, And

821
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:59,240
Speaker 2: the fact that he shared this beautiful photo just shows

822
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:01,160
Speaker 2: his love for him his kids.

823
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 3: Well, is the implication that they're trying to work things

824
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,359
Speaker 3: out or just they showed a nice photo. Again, you're right,

825
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:10,719
Speaker 3: what you just said is absolutely correct. We don't know

826
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:13,760
Speaker 3: the details, but what I did read about was her

827
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:17,799
Speaker 3: going a little bit off the deep end and that

828
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:23,239
Speaker 3: it got very, very contentious. So this is feels like

829
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:25,520
Speaker 3: a very happy moment. The fact that they would even

830
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:27,520
Speaker 3: be in a place where they could pose like this

831
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:32,600
Speaker 3: with all of them together, because it did not sound good.

832
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think it's showing a lot of grace

833
00:42:34,719 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 2: on his side too, because if that isn't true, the

834
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:39,319
Speaker 2: fact that he's read I still love you and I

835
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:41,400
Speaker 2: know maybe you were going through something, and that just

836
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:45,440
Speaker 2: shows his heart and agreed. And then again his love

837
00:42:45,480 --> 00:42:49,439
Speaker 2: for his children, which we've touched so much on about

838
00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:55,400
Speaker 2: keeping that relationship one separate from your own internal frustrations

839
00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:56,080
Speaker 2: with your partner.

840
00:42:56,560 --> 00:43:00,640
Speaker 1: So plus, he's so damn cute that Scott Wilf. I

841
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 1: just I just love him.

842
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:05,160
Speaker 2: You're too young, you know, like, oh no, I love

843
00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:06,399
Speaker 2: he was great. I loved him.

844
00:43:06,840 --> 00:43:08,800
Speaker 3: I mean I just loved him, and I felt badly

845
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:10,759
Speaker 3: for him throughout this whole thing and for her, but

846
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:13,040
Speaker 3: you know you do sometimes you don't have all of

847
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:13,680
Speaker 3: the details.

848
00:43:13,880 --> 00:43:16,560
Speaker 1: But I thought this was a beautiful agreed. There's a

849
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:17,640
Speaker 1: lot of headlines to get through.

850
00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:20,160
Speaker 2: We hope if you're going through divorces, this helped you

851
00:43:20,200 --> 00:43:22,320
Speaker 2: to realize you aren't alone and if you need someone,

852
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,440
Speaker 2: I need some advice on how to navigate life in

853
00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:26,800
Speaker 2: chapter two, call or email us all the infos in

854
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:27,480
Speaker 2: the show notes.

855
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:29,800
Speaker 1: Follow us on socials. Make sure to rate and review

856
00:43:29,800 --> 00:43:30,360
Speaker 1: the podcast.

857
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:33,440
Speaker 2: I do Part two, an iHeartRadio podcast where falling in

858
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:36,839
Speaker 2: love is the main objective. Jennifer, it was so great

859
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:38,319
Speaker 2: to see you, catch up with you.

860
00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:41,400
Speaker 1: I adore you. I just I think you're amazing. A

861
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,359
Speaker 1: great chat. I appreciate your friend the same. I think

862
00:43:44,400 --> 00:43:46,760
Speaker 1: you're great. Tell your daughter, I said, Hi, I will