WEBVTT - Undefeated Feldman Orbit: An Interview with Bruce Feldman 0:00:08.440 --> 0:00:15.200 Three two one zero, all engine running lift off. 0:00:15.440 --> 0:00:16.599 We have a liptop. 0:00:17.079 --> 0:00:20.480 Welcome back to the UFO Show. 0:00:20.560 --> 0:00:26.120 Dan, Thank you, Wow, whoa Wellye, that's that that spooky 0:00:26.160 --> 0:00:26.720 tie voice. 0:00:26.760 --> 0:00:29.240 I like, how are you? It's got a little grovel 0:00:29.320 --> 0:00:32.639 to it, a little more raspiness than usual. It's ever 0:00:32.680 --> 0:00:37.320 since that McConaughey interview. Man, that's what did me in. Really. Yeah, 0:00:37.360 --> 0:00:38.640 I don't know about midway. 0:00:38.720 --> 0:00:41.720 Gave so much juice about midway. 0:00:41.240 --> 0:00:43.080 Through if you go back and listen. I don't know 0:00:43.120 --> 0:00:47.000 how intently folks listen to our show, but about midway 0:00:47.040 --> 0:00:50.880 in my voice just starts cutting out. I've I'm starting 0:00:50.880 --> 0:00:53.239 to worry that maybe McConaughey took my voice. Maybe it's 0:00:53.240 --> 0:00:55.640 gone for good. Wow. 0:00:56.400 --> 0:00:59.640 You know what, Maybe it'll come back in an interesting way. 0:00:59.640 --> 0:01:01.800 Maybe it goes all the way down and you reboot 0:01:01.840 --> 0:01:05.920 it from square one and you have like a cool accent. 0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:07.640 It comes back Portuguese exactly. 0:01:07.760 --> 0:01:09.679 Yeah, I would love that. I would love for that. 0:01:09.680 --> 0:01:12.560 That's a real differentiator in the space. Tis It's the 0:01:12.640 --> 0:01:13.679 UFO Show, is it not? 0:01:14.120 --> 0:01:16.640 It is the UFO Show. And as you know, so 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:19.280 we had a big interview a week ago. We're continuing 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:23.959 with that trend that ultra megastar Friday trend in with 0:01:24.440 --> 0:01:27.399 another superstar in our world, are we not? 0:01:28.600 --> 0:01:31.800 We are absolutely Welcoming back to the show Bruce Feldman 0:01:31.880 --> 0:01:34.919 to talk about his new book, brand new book, Flip 0:01:34.959 --> 0:01:37.560 the Script. Lessons learned on what on the Road to 0:01:37.560 --> 0:01:40.080 a Championship? I always get it on the road there. 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:42.200 It is on the Road to a Championship about not 0:01:42.280 --> 0:01:46.440 just the twenty nineteen LSU undefeated, wildly successful and explosive 0:01:46.440 --> 0:01:50.640 offensive season, but also the specific path that ed Orgeron 0:01:50.720 --> 0:01:54.720 took from longtime assistant to interim coach at USC and 0:01:54.840 --> 0:01:58.440 too essentially being unemployed. And I asked, Bruce what and 0:01:58.440 --> 0:02:01.240 this I did the interview myself spoiler right now, but 0:02:01.560 --> 0:02:04.200 what ed arsand was up to in that year gap 0:02:04.240 --> 0:02:06.559 he took a gap year between when he was hired 0:02:07.320 --> 0:02:09.680 by Les Miles as a defensive line coach and everything 0:02:09.720 --> 0:02:12.400 that happened at USC and what that added to his 0:02:12.520 --> 0:02:15.760 path and then how everything came together for twenty nineteen 0:02:15.880 --> 0:02:19.239 Joe Burrow stuff, Joe Brady stuff, David Randa stuff, and 0:02:19.480 --> 0:02:22.440 even touched on how we look back on it now 0:02:22.480 --> 0:02:26.200 knowing that the PostScript flip the script post script, you 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:27.359 see what I come. 0:02:27.240 --> 0:02:28.080 On on time? 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:35.120 You're true pro rubbing my back? How that characterizes it, 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:39.040 if at all? Because of the weird defensive downfall and 0:02:39.080 --> 0:02:43.560 offensive struggles and injuries and new assistants, so fascinating stuff 0:02:43.560 --> 0:02:45.760 With Bruce. He gave me and us a ton of time, 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:49.320 and we also talked PAC twelve with the season out 0:02:49.360 --> 0:02:52.639 west beginning. I guess you're listening to this Friday or Saturday, 0:02:52.639 --> 0:02:53.960 but imminently. 0:02:54.000 --> 0:02:56.840 Yeah, well, we're going to get to some news on 0:02:56.880 --> 0:03:00.120 that front. Maybe not all PAC twelve teams will be 0:03:00.160 --> 0:03:05.000 in action this weekend given circumstances, but alas some probably will, 0:03:05.600 --> 0:03:07.800 and it is exciting to now have the full boat 0:03:08.720 --> 0:03:12.120 back in general, as he said, since you did the interview, 0:03:12.200 --> 0:03:14.440 trying to give my voice a little bit of a 0:03:14.480 --> 0:03:20.600 bye week here. Yeah, what was Bruce's general takeaway with 0:03:20.680 --> 0:03:24.640 regard to the PAC twelve this season? Is it playoff worthy? 0:03:24.840 --> 0:03:26.960 Are there any teams that he is super bullish about? 0:03:27.080 --> 0:03:28.800 I guess we'll get into that. Well, we'll get to 0:03:28.800 --> 0:03:31.640 hear all of that, But what was your initial takeaway 0:03:32.200 --> 0:03:35.160 from I guess Bruce's takeaway of the conference. 0:03:36.040 --> 0:03:38.040 I think he has a lot of optimism, and I 0:03:38.320 --> 0:03:41.840 use the term room for growth because it's obvious when 0:03:41.840 --> 0:03:44.680 you look across the conference where the specific room for 0:03:44.760 --> 0:03:48.480 growth lies with new coaches in I think there's only 0:03:48.520 --> 0:03:50.720 two new coaches this year. Maybe I got that wrong, 0:03:50.800 --> 0:03:54.040 but Carl Durell and Jimmy Lake. Am I missing anybody? 0:03:54.240 --> 0:03:56.840 I think that's across the board. Those are the new coaches, 0:03:56.840 --> 0:04:00.000 but a lot of new coordinators, big time coordinator hires, 0:04:00.160 --> 0:04:02.520 big questions, And we don't really talk about playoff stuff 0:04:02.560 --> 0:04:04.640 because I don't know at this point in the Pac 0:04:04.680 --> 0:04:08.280 twelve season that doesn't seem fully relevant and where the 0:04:08.360 --> 0:04:10.040 back twelve has been these past couple of years. I 0:04:10.080 --> 0:04:12.240 just want to see good football and improve football in 0:04:12.240 --> 0:04:15.280 the Pac twelve, and I think Bruce is aligned with that, 0:04:15.400 --> 0:04:17.839 and so he weighed in on his thoughts on Oregon 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:20.200 losing what they did, but what the guys they have 0:04:20.320 --> 0:04:23.200 back can possibly do along with Joe moorehead and Jimmy 0:04:23.240 --> 0:04:26.240 Lake at Washington and the experience of Keaton Slovas at 0:04:26.320 --> 0:04:29.440 USC with that new Todd Orlando defense on the other side, 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:34.080 and possible optimism with the Arizona schools and UCLA and 0:04:34.200 --> 0:04:38.520 so we get onto a lot of the PAC twelve 0:04:38.800 --> 0:04:42.719 mountain top just in terms of ten thousand foot view 0:04:42.760 --> 0:04:45.159 of the conference, so very I mean, he's out west, 0:04:45.160 --> 0:04:46.920 he knows all these guys he's going to you know, 0:04:47.000 --> 0:04:49.480 he's at their practices in normal times, so he's a 0:04:49.520 --> 0:04:51.440 relationship with a lot of the people in the conference. 0:04:51.480 --> 0:04:54.920 So really cool to have Bruce Way in. And obviously, 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:57.720 as you know, aside from the book flip the script, 0:04:57.760 --> 0:04:59.880 you can listen to to Bruce with Stumandel on the 0:05:00.000 --> 0:05:01.560 audible and read them at the Athletic. 0:05:02.080 --> 0:05:04.720 All right, before we get to your interview with Bruce, 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:06.719 we do have some news dance since I don't we 0:05:06.800 --> 0:05:09.520 do since I can't do the breaking news thing. Here's 0:05:09.560 --> 0:05:17.120 the sound. Do you have a spin on my normal 0:05:17.240 --> 0:05:19.599 kind of antics that you would like to add in here. 0:05:21.520 --> 0:05:25.080 For breaking news? Not that rich healthy boys. 0:05:25.120 --> 0:05:27.240 You don't have the falsetto, but it's okay. 0:05:27.279 --> 0:05:32.839 I wouldn't try breaking new. Yeah, there are some unfortunate 0:05:32.880 --> 0:05:35.680 COVID cases around college football. So if you're wondering why 0:05:36.279 --> 0:05:40.159 your perceived slate has been disrupted for Saturday and beyond, 0:05:40.200 --> 0:05:44.680 it looks like Louisville, Virginia has been postponed. I think 0:05:44.720 --> 0:05:48.160 only a week to November fourteenth, if my calendar math 0:05:48.240 --> 0:05:52.000 is correct. CAL Washington looks to be somewhat in doubt 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:53.960 at the time we're recording this because of a positive 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:58.839 test within the CAL program. Tulsa excuse me, yeah, Tulsa, 0:05:58.839 --> 0:06:01.320 excuse me. I think it's Tulsa Navy is off. I 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:03.240 don't want to get that wrong and say two Lane Navy. 0:06:03.279 --> 0:06:07.080 I know it's a tul but I'm verifying now. It 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:10.279 is Tulsa Navy that has been it says postponed, with 0:06:10.360 --> 0:06:13.680 no makeup date announced at the moment. So there's that. 0:06:14.160 --> 0:06:18.600 Joe Rossi, the Minnesota defensive coordinator, has contracted COVID. I 0:06:18.760 --> 0:06:21.080 haven't seen anything regarding symptoms. I hope he is all right. 0:06:22.200 --> 0:06:24.120 And to sort of bring it all full circle, so 0:06:24.160 --> 0:06:27.919 obviously Rossi will be missing Minnesota's game against I believe Illinois. 0:06:28.920 --> 0:06:31.279 And to bring things sort of full circle just with 0:06:31.360 --> 0:06:34.120 a show Bruce Feldman is involved with. I don't know 0:06:34.160 --> 0:06:38.119 about his specific health, but because of COVID protocol, Big 0:06:38.200 --> 0:06:43.080 Noon Saturday. So it's Urban Meyer, Rob Stone, your Boy, 0:06:43.120 --> 0:06:47.679 Brady Quinn, Reggie Bush, Matt Liinert are all quarantining because 0:06:47.720 --> 0:06:51.040 of Fox Sports COVID protocol, and so there will be 0:06:51.040 --> 0:06:54.880 no big Noon Saturday this weekend hosted by the normal people. 0:06:54.880 --> 0:06:56.880 If that's a show you watch, I think they're bringing 0:06:56.960 --> 0:06:58.680 on like a manual a show and stuff like that. 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:01.279 Who's great, But I think it's a bunch of NFL people. 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:04.880 I want to say, just standing in. We were available. 0:07:05.279 --> 0:07:08.120 No longer because we're insulted, but we were available. 0:07:08.200 --> 0:07:10.760 Yeah we were. Now it's true. My voice isn't it's 0:07:10.760 --> 0:07:11.480 still not back. 0:07:12.520 --> 0:07:15.000 But I mean we can get Pete right, we get 0:07:15.000 --> 0:07:18.600 Mayor Pete, he's still the experience. We get Pete Boodha 0:07:18.680 --> 0:07:19.480 judge to talk. 0:07:19.360 --> 0:07:21.600 About to do a ty hilt and brand impression. 0:07:22.640 --> 0:07:26.119 I think that's the move if why settle, that's people 0:07:26.600 --> 0:07:29.080 watching Boardwalk impressionist in DC. 0:07:29.240 --> 0:07:30.160 That's what folks said. 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:35.760 Yeah, So I think that covers a lot of the news. 0:07:35.800 --> 0:07:38.640 Maction is back, which is pretty exciting. So we'll talk 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:41.120 about a little bit more about you know, the MAC 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:44.480 returning on our recap show. But I think that's the 0:07:44.520 --> 0:07:49.160 news I have, And stay tuned post Bruce another teas 0:07:49.280 --> 0:07:51.880 because we'll get into the interview. Now Ty will give 0:07:51.920 --> 0:07:55.679 his gut, intrigue, instinct thoughts about what he just wants 0:07:55.720 --> 0:07:58.000 to watch this season, these six regular season games in 0:07:58.000 --> 0:08:01.360 the Pac twelve for everybody. And also so we're going 0:08:01.400 --> 0:08:07.600 to tie this tie UFO show to the I Guess 0:08:07.680 --> 0:08:12.840 guest as well on this Undefeated Feldman Orbit. 0:08:13.000 --> 0:08:18.960 Wow, thank you Undefeated Feldman Orbit. We are excited to 0:08:19.000 --> 0:08:20.920 hear from Bruce. It's always a pleasure to have him 0:08:20.920 --> 0:08:23.600 on the show. Don't forget if you're out and about 0:08:23.800 --> 0:08:26.080 this weekend, if you're looking to stay in tune with 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:29.000 college football, find out what's going on in the world. Yeah, 0:08:29.640 --> 0:08:32.280 College Football Blitz put on by our good friends at 0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:35.319 Learfield IMG College. You can get to it by searching 0:08:35.360 --> 0:08:38.680 for college Sports now on tune In or by going 0:08:38.679 --> 0:08:42.000 to channel eighty four on your series XM dial. They 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:45.280 jump in and out of local broadcasts. It's really cool. 0:08:45.320 --> 0:08:47.400 I said this time and again. It's been my secret 0:08:47.440 --> 0:08:49.920 weapon over all these years. I'm glad that we finally 0:08:49.920 --> 0:08:51.800 get the promo with because they do an awesome job 0:08:52.160 --> 0:08:54.440 jumping in and out of broadcasts to get something like 0:08:54.520 --> 0:08:58.440 fifty six minutes I want to say, of actual play 0:08:58.480 --> 0:09:01.480 by play coverage every hour. It goes all day long, 0:09:01.520 --> 0:09:04.240 all throughout the college football Saturday. So if like me, 0:09:04.400 --> 0:09:05.880 you're going to be out there in the world, you 0:09:05.920 --> 0:09:08.560 can't always be perched in front of the TV. Maybe 0:09:08.600 --> 0:09:10.679 you're making your own window of opportunity. I don't know, 0:09:10.960 --> 0:09:13.240 whatever the case may be for you, College Football Blitz 0:09:13.240 --> 0:09:15.240 is where it's at. They can help you stay up 0:09:15.280 --> 0:09:18.520 to date, of course, until you get the Sunday or 0:09:18.520 --> 0:09:20.320 Monday and get a chance to listen to Sliverble. 0:09:21.440 --> 0:09:24.360 All right, And with that, it's been far too long. Obviously, 0:09:24.360 --> 0:09:26.480 it's very difficult. During the season, we had him on 0:09:26.640 --> 0:09:29.040 to talk about I think Miami Ohio State when we 0:09:29.040 --> 0:09:32.440 were doing the rewatches. But he is the author of 0:09:32.840 --> 0:09:36.920 the brand new book Flip the Script, about ed Orgeron 0:09:37.000 --> 0:09:41.000 in the twenty nineteen LSU Championship Tigers. You read Meat Market, 0:09:41.000 --> 0:09:43.840 you read the QB. You've seen him on sidelines, you've 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:46.400 listened to him on the audible, you read him on 0:09:46.480 --> 0:09:49.240 the Athletic I don't know, Big Noon Saturday. I mean, 0:09:49.280 --> 0:09:51.840 I honestly, we could turn this show into your resume. 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:53.960 But Bruce Feldman, thanks for coming on. 0:09:54.800 --> 0:09:56.920 Thank you, Dad. It's good to hear your voice. You 0:09:56.960 --> 0:09:59.480 know how much I respect you guys and what you do. 0:10:00.200 --> 0:10:03.480 It's very cool to reunite with you. 0:10:04.400 --> 0:10:07.679 Nice all right, So you you write this book, I 0:10:07.679 --> 0:10:09.240 want to talk about this. I have not read the 0:10:09.240 --> 0:10:12.080 book yet, I've read reviews, I've listened to you talk 0:10:12.160 --> 0:10:15.680 about it. I watched a lot of twenty nineteen LSU football. 0:10:16.120 --> 0:10:19.240 But what does flip the script and lessons on the 0:10:19.280 --> 0:10:21.880 way to a championship season? I think I'm paraphrasing that, 0:10:22.080 --> 0:10:24.440 but what is where does flip the script come from? 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:29.640 So it here's where it comes from. So as you 0:10:29.640 --> 0:10:32.440 you know, mentioned meat market at some point the UH. 0:10:34.880 --> 0:10:37.200 I really wanted to tell the story of how college 0:10:37.240 --> 0:10:40.640 football programs retreat, and so I was on the flannel 0:10:40.640 --> 0:10:43.679 wall for two years there and basically the book did 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:45.760 pretty well, and I think a lot of people kept 0:10:46.000 --> 0:10:47.640 ask me, Hey, are you ever going to do a 0:10:47.679 --> 0:10:51.160 sequel for this? And I really didn't think I would, 0:10:51.600 --> 0:10:56.000 But I did follow Ojon's career from after a spectacular 0:10:56.040 --> 0:10:58.960 flame out at Ole Miss and then he gets on 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:01.080 and you know this where eventually get to be the 0:11:01.080 --> 0:11:03.960 interim head coach after Lane gets fired at USC and 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:07.520 then right you know, things really turn up for him 0:11:07.600 --> 0:11:10.400 and go in a different direction, And I think, to 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:16.679 flip the script, term really came from basically in Dan 0:11:16.800 --> 0:11:19.880 and Bruce parlance. You know, he basically pulled the Costanza 0:11:20.400 --> 0:11:23.920 and he did everything the opposite of all his instincts 0:11:23.960 --> 0:11:28.720 at USC, and it worked. Now, I don't think it 0:11:28.760 --> 0:11:33.480 was as as simplistic as that, But because he had 0:11:33.520 --> 0:11:38.720 been through the process of his battles with substance and 0:11:38.760 --> 0:11:43.360 he's now twenty years sober, but his issues with alcoholism, 0:11:43.520 --> 0:11:47.440 I think he's he's learned from the recovery process and 0:11:47.520 --> 0:11:51.920 taken those lessons in that really deep look inside of like, hey, 0:11:52.320 --> 0:11:54.160 you know, I may I may not have had a 0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:56.280 great relationship with my ideal miss, and I may not 0:11:56.360 --> 0:11:59.520 have the resources and this and that, but ultimately it's 0:11:59.679 --> 0:12:02.040 I got to look inward with me first. I can't 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:05.600 make all these excuses and on other people and blame 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:07.960 other people. I got to start with me. So I 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:10.040 think he learned from his own mistakes then when he 0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:12.040 got to USC, and certainly when he was a Tennessee, 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:14.560 he was Lane's right hand man there, and then he 0:12:14.640 --> 0:12:17.040 was certainly a Lane's right hand man at USC. So 0:12:17.120 --> 0:12:19.600 he when Lane gets fired, he sees all this stuff 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:22.720 that Lane has been doing and how he's running the program. 0:12:23.120 --> 0:12:25.480 And he was like, we're going to flip the script 0:12:25.480 --> 0:12:29.160 and do all these things basically opposite to get guys respond. 0:12:29.320 --> 0:12:32.360 And it's crazy because as you know what his persona is. 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:36.320 I had asked him, I said, you know, you're kind 0:12:36.320 --> 0:12:38.200 of doing it George Costanza here, do you know what 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:40.560 that is? And he kind of knew who George Costanze was, 0:12:40.600 --> 0:12:43.120 but he's he's not a Seinfeld watcher. 0:12:43.160 --> 0:12:44.040 It wasn't right. 0:12:44.120 --> 0:12:47.320 So but and the Seinfeld reference, to be clear is 0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:49.679 George wakes up one day and decides everything he's been 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:51.200 doing has been wrong, so he might as well do 0:12:51.240 --> 0:12:52.439 the exact opposite. 0:12:52.960 --> 0:12:54.880 Yeah, at some point, I feel like they're in the 0:12:54.960 --> 0:12:59.400 diner and there's like a really attractive woman and he's like, 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:01.440 I'm going to own this, this and this, and he goes, no, 0:13:01.480 --> 0:13:03.880 I'm not, and then he rethinks it. It goes against 0:13:04.000 --> 0:13:07.600 everything else, and all of a sudden his luck turns. 0:13:07.880 --> 0:13:12.560 And that, to some degree, is how things change for 0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:16.240 ed Ozeron in USC and then subsequently I think he 0:13:16.280 --> 0:13:18.120 really kept on building on that. So that's where flip 0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:19.000 the script comes. 0:13:19.600 --> 0:13:23.679 Okay, and so he obviously after USC and before LSU, 0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:26.080 he's sort of in no man's land. 0:13:26.080 --> 0:13:26.679 He's not working. 0:13:26.720 --> 0:13:29.800 Les Miles eventually hires him to be a defensive line coach, 0:13:29.840 --> 0:13:32.520 and at Oorzron eventually goes on to be an interim 0:13:32.520 --> 0:13:33.199 and full time. 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:33.720 Coach at LSU. 0:13:34.160 --> 0:13:39.400 What was that period of time, like when a major 0:13:39.480 --> 0:13:44.160 head coach at USC, interim head coach and assistant coach 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:48.720 at LSU, there's that space. Is that a time where 0:13:48.720 --> 0:13:51.120 at Orizron's working on himself? Is that a time where 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:53.000 he's working on what he's going to do if and 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:55.880 when he gets another opportunity? What is that that blank period? 0:13:56.040 --> 0:13:58.920 Like that's a great question. So it really was, And 0:13:58.920 --> 0:14:00.560 I don't know if he would have described it as 0:14:00.600 --> 0:14:03.080 I'm working on myself, but I think what he really 0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:05.640 realized is, remember, this is a guy who when he 0:14:05.679 --> 0:14:08.760 was the head coach, when he was at Tennessee, he 0:14:08.840 --> 0:14:11.439 lived in a hotel and he didn't want to take 0:14:11.440 --> 0:14:14.560 his kids at a school in Louisiana, and so you know, 0:14:14.640 --> 0:14:17.040 he would commute back to see them sometimes. Know, when 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:19.520 he was at USC, the kids were in high school, 0:14:19.720 --> 0:14:22.080 he did not want to move them, so he lived 0:14:22.080 --> 0:14:25.080 in the Radisson near USC and that was for a 0:14:25.080 --> 0:14:30.000 few years. So when he gets told and he finds 0:14:30.080 --> 0:14:32.440 not out, doesn't find this out from Pat Hayden, the 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:34.240 ad at US, see, he finds it out from somebody 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:38.360 else that Steve Sarkisian's actually getting the USC job, not him. 0:14:38.760 --> 0:14:41.600 He is crushed and you know, he said, other than 0:14:41.640 --> 0:14:43.720 when his dad died, it was the worst day of 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.640 his life. And so he flied, you know, he goes 0:14:46.680 --> 0:14:51.160 back home with his wife, and he is you know, 0:14:51.240 --> 0:14:53.400 he has devastated to the point where his kids had 0:14:53.440 --> 0:14:56.320 told me and now his kids are both out of college, 0:14:56.360 --> 0:14:59.480 but he had said that they had told me, we've 0:14:59.520 --> 0:15:02.280 never seen our dad like unshaven and scruffy and lying 0:15:02.360 --> 0:15:04.400 and sleeping on the couch all day like it was like, 0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:07.200 wasn't just like like like a guy going through a 0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:09.560 woman going through a bad breakup who was like that 0:15:09.760 --> 0:15:13.280 time's you know, probably twenty for him. And you know, 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:17.680 I think the guy who's really been kind of a 0:15:17.720 --> 0:15:21.400 big brother to him, Brian Kennedy, who's really helped him 0:15:21.400 --> 0:15:26.200 out through the recovery process for these twenty years. You know, 0:15:26.240 --> 0:15:29.680 he had talked to me about Brian sober now about 0:15:29.680 --> 0:15:33.720 fifty years about just how much concern he had because 0:15:33.800 --> 0:15:37.760 when when people go through very traumatic experiences, you know, 0:15:37.840 --> 0:15:42.000 lose a job, wife leaves them, whatever that can I mean, 0:15:42.000 --> 0:15:43.760 for a lack of a better term, you know, when 0:15:43.800 --> 0:15:46.720 guys people go off the wagon. And he was like, 0:15:46.800 --> 0:15:49.040 I called him, I couldn't hear anything back, and I worried. 0:15:49.760 --> 0:15:52.840 And Ojoran told me in the for the book that 0:15:53.880 --> 0:15:56.320 you know, at one point urban Meyer had reached out 0:15:56.360 --> 0:15:58.880 to him about possibly a d line job Nick Saban 0:15:58.960 --> 0:16:00.600 had and he was like, I would have been good 0:16:00.640 --> 0:16:03.280 to nobody at that point. The way I felt and 0:16:04.160 --> 0:16:07.520 where the work done himself part was he really threw 0:16:07.560 --> 0:16:12.880 himself into getting back into his son's lives. His one 0:16:12.920 --> 0:16:15.520 son was like, I guess the best tennis player in 0:16:15.520 --> 0:16:18.560 the state of Louisiana and his age range and he's 0:16:18.600 --> 0:16:20.680 so he started going out to all the tennis matches 0:16:20.720 --> 0:16:23.920 and his son was telling me, and this is Cody, 0:16:23.960 --> 0:16:26.400 who actually ended up being the quarter starting quarterback at 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:29.080 McNee State, was like, you know, my dad's coming to 0:16:29.120 --> 0:16:31.760 these tennis matches and you know he's got that voice, 0:16:31.800 --> 0:16:33.840 and I'm like that you don't do that at tennis 0:16:33.920 --> 0:16:37.160 matches and you know, he's and he goes and nobody 0:16:37.160 --> 0:16:39.120 goes to tennis match in Louisiana. So it's bad enough 0:16:39.120 --> 0:16:40.720 his voice carries, but now he's one of like three 0:16:40.720 --> 0:16:44.080 people there, and he's grumbling and rough, you know, and 0:16:44.200 --> 0:16:47.280 yelling things like that you got a chill. And then 0:16:47.320 --> 0:16:50.760 you know his other brother, his other his twin brother 0:16:51.880 --> 0:16:54.440 played football, and so he would be out at those 0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:57.640 and same thing. You know, it's just like he really 0:16:58.240 --> 0:17:01.520 I think he kind of got a deep connection with 0:17:00.960 --> 0:17:05.280 his sons and I think that really impacted him. Now crazy, 0:17:05.400 --> 0:17:08.199 There's so many crazy twists in Ojeon's life, but I 0:17:08.240 --> 0:17:11.919 think this one really is something that you have to 0:17:12.080 --> 0:17:14.720 take a step back to kind of get how improbable 0:17:14.760 --> 0:17:19.119 his story is. So he obviously gets a law. Like 0:17:19.280 --> 0:17:22.960 most guys who are football coaches, if you become an 0:17:23.000 --> 0:17:25.800 interim head coach, you maybe get one or two or 0:17:25.840 --> 0:17:29.520 three games tops. Usually guys don't get fired in September 0:17:29.640 --> 0:17:32.280 or with almost a full season. So Lane obviously got 0:17:32.320 --> 0:17:36.800 fired early in the season at usc So Ojean got 0:17:36.840 --> 0:17:39.359 eight games to basically show that he was not the 0:17:39.400 --> 0:17:43.000 head coach that he looked like he was at Ole Miss. Well, 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:47.359 then he goes to LSU. And remember LSU, there was 0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:50.600 a game that they were playing in November against Texas 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:53.520 A and M and all the reports are that LSU 0:17:53.640 --> 0:17:56.960 is going to fire less Miles, and the stadium is 0:17:57.000 --> 0:17:59.320 all packed in support of less Miles is obviously a 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:04.000 a you know, beloved character who also is kind of 0:18:04.040 --> 0:18:08.040 larger than life, you know, Less's persona and the players 0:18:08.040 --> 0:18:10.440 play their butts off for him, and they beat Texas 0:18:10.440 --> 0:18:13.000 in them and unss she doesn't end up firing him 0:18:13.480 --> 0:18:16.120 late in the year, but you know what, like so 0:18:16.359 --> 0:18:18.760 there's no coaching search at LSU. If there was a 0:18:18.840 --> 0:18:22.360 coaching search, they're not hiring it o'jon at that stage 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:26.080 to be the head coach at LSU. Instead, they keep 0:18:26.200 --> 0:18:31.920 less On. He loses to Wisconsin at in Lambeau to 0:18:31.960 --> 0:18:35.000 start the season, and later he loses to Auburn. They 0:18:35.040 --> 0:18:38.359 fire him early. So the chance of being an interim 0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:42.080 head coach twice is rare to begin with, the chance 0:18:42.119 --> 0:18:44.399 to be an interim head coach and have almost a 0:18:44.440 --> 0:18:48.960 full season is ridiculous. And then he gets it. He 0:18:49.480 --> 0:18:52.280 you know, he's kind of made the additional tweaks from 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:56.359 his time at you know, when he was at USC 0:18:56.640 --> 0:19:00.200 even more so. And I think that really helped helped 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:03.720 him get at least a real shot at getting this job, 0:19:03.840 --> 0:19:07.879 which is again so shockingly improbable given his path. 0:19:09.160 --> 0:19:11.760 What is the biggest difference between I remember there was 0:19:11.760 --> 0:19:14.920 a cookie story right at USC that he let guys 0:19:14.920 --> 0:19:17.560 eat cookies, and it sounds funny, it sounds silly, but like, 0:19:17.600 --> 0:19:19.440 you want guys to buy in, You want guys to 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:21.399 trust you, You want guys to believe that you are on 0:19:21.480 --> 0:19:24.600 their side. What is the biggest difference? Is it a 0:19:24.640 --> 0:19:27.720 culture thing? Is it an on field thing between whatever 0:19:27.840 --> 0:19:31.280 at Origron was doing even at USC, but between what 0:19:31.359 --> 0:19:34.000 he did in a less successful part of his head 0:19:34.000 --> 0:19:36.320 coaching career and what he eventually was able to do 0:19:36.359 --> 0:19:36.919 at LSU. 0:19:37.600 --> 0:19:39.280 You know, before we get to that, it's funny. The 0:19:39.280 --> 0:19:41.399 cookie thing stands out to a lot of people. And 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:43.480 when we talked about it at USC, one of the 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:46.000 things that he kept on bringing up was like, Lane 0:19:46.000 --> 0:19:48.280 will get the turkey bacon in there. And I was like, 0:19:48.560 --> 0:19:52.240 he talked about turkey bacon like the way I think 0:19:52.280 --> 0:19:54.600 of like fat free cheese that I once had. It 0:19:54.680 --> 0:19:59.440 was like, Okay, you know this is this is unconscionable 0:19:59.520 --> 0:20:02.600 or whatever, but his distain for the turkey bacon they 0:20:02.640 --> 0:20:06.760 served at USC, you know, just like it seems to 0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:09.639 stick in his craw to this day. Well, anyway, to me, 0:20:10.080 --> 0:20:13.560 the biggest difference in him, and I didn't know this 0:20:13.680 --> 0:20:16.840 until we started working on the book really and talking 0:20:16.920 --> 0:20:21.879 about it, and then it started to materialize, was his 0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:25.720 understanding of like I knew he had evolved, and you know, look, 0:20:26.000 --> 0:20:27.960 I once worked on a book with Mike Leach. Michael 0:20:28.040 --> 0:20:30.720 Leach might be the most stubborn of the stubborn people 0:20:30.880 --> 0:20:34.080 in a profession that's you know, loaded with stubborn dudes, 0:20:35.840 --> 0:20:38.879 and they don't usually evolve or they don't change much. 0:20:39.000 --> 0:20:44.080 So I knew Oseron had evolved, and it was clear 0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:47.960 that he had. But what I was kind of thinking 0:20:48.200 --> 0:20:51.720 in terms of this is you become different. And what 0:20:51.840 --> 0:20:54.960 he had kind of explained and articulated in a way 0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:56.879 where I don't even know he was like not telling 0:20:56.920 --> 0:20:58.720 me that this is what happened. He was just telling 0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:05.160 me about it. As the instincts you have, they don't change, 0:21:05.240 --> 0:21:09.879 the impulses you have, they don't change. What change is 0:21:10.160 --> 0:21:13.879