1
00:00:00,400 --> 00:00:03,920
Speaker 1: The cheerleaders at a gym in Buffalo have been recording

2
00:00:03,960 --> 00:00:09,240
Speaker 1: themselves to make a new documentary where the news reporters

3
00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:13,160
Speaker 1: because one year ago a mass shooting changed their lives.

4
00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:15,400
Speaker 1: He just walked around shot all the black people. The

5
00:00:15,480 --> 00:00:18,440
Speaker 1: cheer squad, most of whom are black, had to figure

6
00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:21,160
Speaker 1: out how to go on and how to compete. I

7
00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:23,840
Speaker 1: wanted to win for them more than anything this season.

8
00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:28,640
Speaker 1: Listen to the embedded podcast from NPR within the iHeartRadio app,

9
00:00:28,800 --> 00:00:32,720
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Carol Fisher and

10
00:00:32,760 --> 00:00:36,800
Speaker 1: I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas,

11
00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:40,200
Speaker 1: it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find

12
00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:44,560
Speaker 1: a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt

13
00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:48,040
Speaker 1: to be eligible bachelors. One of them was of the

14
00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:53,239
Speaker 1: Baron bat On paper he was perfect, but in reality,

15
00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:58,080
Speaker 1: this guy's a wacko. He shouted to the point went unconscious.

16
00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:00,560
Speaker 1: I would call him and I would say, I know

17
00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:03,480
Speaker 1: you killed my sister. You can listen to The Girlfriends

18
00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:07,680
Speaker 1: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get

19
00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:10,919
Speaker 1: your podcasts. This is the story of a man who's

20
00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:15,280
Speaker 1: fascinated me. His name was Sweet Daddy Grace, and that's

21
00:01:15,280 --> 00:01:18,600
Speaker 1: a name you don't forget. He was a visionary who

22
00:01:18,640 --> 00:01:21,720
Speaker 1: built a fortune as a black man during Jim Crow

23
00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:26,440
Speaker 1: during the Depression, but today not many people know about him.

24
00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:29,640
Speaker 1: The race sort of wiped out, and I wonder if

25
00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:33,480
Speaker 1: this was done intentionally. Listen to Sweet Daddy Grace on

26
00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:39,280
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi,

27
00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:42,600
Speaker 1: I'm free and I'm rthy. We have spent the last

28
00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:45,640
Speaker 1: twenty years building and working at some of the largest

29
00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:48,640
Speaker 1: companies in the world. We worked with some remarkable people.

30
00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:51,360
Speaker 1: Rob mcalinney. When I see the people of Wrexham, I

31
00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:53,840
Speaker 1: grew up exactly like them. Check out the ARTHI and

32
00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:58,840
Speaker 1: Trrom show. That is a R D HI and s

33
00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:03,240
Speaker 1: R I R A M show. Listen to the Acadienstry

34
00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:07,120
Speaker 1: Show on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast or whenever

35
00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:13,480
Speaker 1: you get to your podcast. Much of today's testimony was

36
00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:17,560
Speaker 1: about the rocky relationship between Hannah Roden and Jake Wagner.

37
00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:22,440
Speaker 1: The two had dated and they also had a daughter together. Okay,

38
00:02:22,480 --> 00:02:26,280
Speaker 1: miss Many, can you tell us who she was afraid of?

39
00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:31,920
Speaker 1: The Wagner family. You know this was an abusive relationship

40
00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:36,840
Speaker 1: between Hannahme and Jake. She talked about Jake chasing her

41
00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:42,040
Speaker 1: down in a vehicle one time. Even though George Wagner

42
00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:44,800
Speaker 1: is the one on trial here, all of this testimony

43
00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:48,720
Speaker 1: about Jake is relevant because prosecutors say a custody battle

44
00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:51,720
Speaker 1: over is the reason four members of the Wagner family

45
00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:55,240
Speaker 1: murdered eight members of the Roden family. One of the

46
00:02:55,280 --> 00:02:59,120
Speaker 1: defense lawyers told the Jersey, every time you hear the

47
00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:03,040
Speaker 1: Wagner keep in mind that George Wagner is the only

48
00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:12,040
Speaker 1: one on trial here. This is the Piked and Massacre.

49
00:03:12,400 --> 00:03:17,640
Speaker 1: Return to Pike County Season four, Episode eight, A family

50
00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:23,320
Speaker 1: Torn m Courtney Armstrong, a television producer at Katie Studios,

51
00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,800
Speaker 1: with Stephanie Lydecker and Jeff Shane in the middle of

52
00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:30,200
Speaker 1: George Wagner, the fourth's trial. A typical Ohio fall has

53
00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:33,040
Speaker 1: settled on Piked In. The wind is picked up and

54
00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:36,680
Speaker 1: temperatures are dropping into the thirties. But unlike the vibrant

55
00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:39,480
Speaker 1: autumn leaves springing up all around the Pike County Courthouse

56
00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,840
Speaker 1: in Waverley, Ohio, the mood in the courtroom is dark.

57
00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:47,600
Speaker 1: In the biggest murder investigation in Ohio's history. Jake Wagner's

58
00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:50,960
Speaker 1: older brother, George the Fourth, stares down eight counts of

59
00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:56,520
Speaker 1: aggravated murder with death penalty specifications. It's important to note

60
00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:59,960
Speaker 1: that George Wagner the Fourth, currently on trial, has pleaded

61
00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,480
Speaker 1: not guilty and has maintained he did not kill anyone.

62
00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:07,960
Speaker 1: His father, Billy Wagner, whose trial is upcoming, has also

63
00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:12,920
Speaker 1: pleaded not guilty to all charges. This episode contains frequent

64
00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:15,880
Speaker 1: mentions of the names of the children impacted by this crime.

65
00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:20,480
Speaker 1: We will continue to avoid exposing their identities. Here's Judge

66
00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:23,960
Speaker 1: Randy Deering. Now there's a state ready to proceeded to

67
00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:28,920
Speaker 1: stop right, is the defense ready? All the state may

68
00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:32,839
Speaker 1: call him on the witness. Of course, this entire trial

69
00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:37,040
Speaker 1: has been gut wrenching, but today's testimony was also deeply

70
00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:40,640
Speaker 1: emotional as Prosecutor Angie Kineppa called friends and family of

71
00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:46,480
Speaker 1: the Rodents to the stand. These relatives and friends were

72
00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:48,880
Speaker 1: forced to relive the day the Rodents had been murdered,

73
00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:52,039
Speaker 1: where they were, when they found out whom they were with,

74
00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:57,360
Speaker 1: and how they handled the harrowing news the state. April.

75
00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:04,480
Speaker 1: The first witness was April Manly, the wife of James Manly,

76
00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:09,200
Speaker 1: Dana Roden's brother. April was Hanname's aunt and extremely close

77
00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:12,039
Speaker 1: to her. She has long blonde hair and wears a

78
00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:16,480
Speaker 1: rose colored Vnex sweater on the stand. Intermittently, April wipes

79
00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:19,600
Speaker 1: tears from her eyes. She lives less than a mile

80
00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:22,560
Speaker 1: to the east of Dana Roden's home. On the morning

81
00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:25,120
Speaker 1: of the murders, April said she rode in the ambulance

82
00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:29,080
Speaker 1: to Adams County Regional Medical Center with Hanname's newborn baby,

83
00:05:29,600 --> 00:05:33,440
Speaker 1: her child with Charlie Gillie. The four day old was unharmed.

84
00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:37,480
Speaker 1: Fighting back tears, April said her husband, James knew something

85
00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:40,520
Speaker 1: was wrong when outside the road and home he heard

86
00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:45,680
Speaker 1: Hanname's infant crying NonStop. They knew Hanname would not let

87
00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:49,200
Speaker 1: her baby cry like that. So your husband comes back

88
00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:53,760
Speaker 1: and tells you that that he believes DNA is dead. Yes,

89
00:05:55,200 --> 00:05:57,960
Speaker 1: what do you do? As result of that? I went

90
00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:02,640
Speaker 1: with you. Master Dad's was an emotional wret. I didn't

91
00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:07,279
Speaker 1: want him to be alike. Did he tell you anything

92
00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:16,120
Speaker 1: about at that time? Jameses, Yeah, they'd hurt cry. Anna

93
00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:20,080
Speaker 1: d wouldn't walked back here. He knew what kinda mother.

94
00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:27,600
Speaker 1: Hannah wasn't she wouldn't be currently okay, So he was

95
00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:32,000
Speaker 1: concerned because he felt Hannah would have been tending to

96
00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:38,360
Speaker 1: the baby. Yes. Then at the hospital, April had what

97
00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:43,040
Speaker 1: she described as an unsettling encounter with Jake. According to April,

98
00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:47,520
Speaker 1: Jake seemed apathetic about hannahme Rodin's death. He seemed more

99
00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:52,000
Speaker 1: concerned with taking custody of her newborn child, who we

100
00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:57,760
Speaker 1: would come to learn was not even his. And while

101
00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:01,760
Speaker 1: you were there, did anybody else show up to the hospital?

102
00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:04,520
Speaker 1: I got recall who all? But I knew when there

103
00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:06,640
Speaker 1: was a couple of my nieces and nephews there and

104
00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:10,400
Speaker 1: a cousin of mine. And then eventually at the end,

105
00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:15,240
Speaker 1: Jake showed up, Jake Wagner. Okay, And where were you

106
00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:20,040
Speaker 1: when Jake Wagner showed up? I was outside? Okay? And

107
00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:24,880
Speaker 1: can you tell us how that interaction went? He was motionless?

108
00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:28,360
Speaker 1: That makes sense to he did? I cried, and I like,

109
00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:34,680
Speaker 1: he wasn't worried about nothing. Wasn't someone that bought, had

110
00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,560
Speaker 1: just lost someone that claimed to love, So he was

111
00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:41,760
Speaker 1: not showing emotion in that time. Okay, why was he there?

112
00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:46,680
Speaker 1: He came to checking to see if he could take her.

113
00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:52,120
Speaker 1: Did you inform him that he could not take her? Yes? Okay?

114
00:07:53,160 --> 00:08:00,400
Speaker 1: And did he hug you at all while he was there? Yes.

115
00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:08,400
Speaker 1: April then commented that she wondered whether Jake had Hannah's

116
00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:11,680
Speaker 1: blood on him when he was embracing her. Jake was

117
00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:15,440
Speaker 1: extremely controlling over Hannah me Rodin, April said, and had

118
00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:19,920
Speaker 1: negatively shaped her body image. He was very controlling over Hannah,

119
00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:23,320
Speaker 1: like we wasn't allowed to text check her treat and

120
00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:28,000
Speaker 1: even knows Hannah's week. Hannah was always a chunky little monkey,

121
00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:31,600
Speaker 1: and she had got down so tiny because he would

122
00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:33,360
Speaker 1: tell her that she was fat and tell her not

123
00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:37,199
Speaker 1: to eat. Did Hannah ever tell you that she was

124
00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:42,439
Speaker 1: scared yes, of Jake? Yes? And did she indicate that

125
00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:48,160
Speaker 1: she was afraid of Jake and his family? Yes? Okay?

126
00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:55,240
Speaker 1: And can you tell us what she was afraid of?

127
00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:04,720
Speaker 1: The defense objects to this line of questioning, and Judge

128
00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:09,559
Speaker 1: Daring sustains the objection. According to April, Jake also physically

129
00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:13,000
Speaker 1: threatened Hannah on multiple occasions, even engaging her in a

130
00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:17,839
Speaker 1: dangerous high speed chase. And can you tell us you

131
00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:20,440
Speaker 1: indicated Jake Wagner was the one who would be around

132
00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:23,200
Speaker 1: the most because of Hannah, and then he would sometimes

133
00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:25,880
Speaker 1: be up at that residence that Frankie and Hazel were

134
00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:28,920
Speaker 1: found in, when Dana and Hannah and little Chris lived there.

135
00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:33,360
Speaker 1: Can you tell us what your interactions would have been

136
00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:37,400
Speaker 1: with him? We didn't interact. I didn't like him. He

137
00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:42,240
Speaker 1: didn't like me, Okay, Why not because he thought I

138
00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:45,760
Speaker 1: was noisy and needed just stay in my place because

139
00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:49,040
Speaker 1: I would defend Hannah, Okay. And how do you know

140
00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:52,040
Speaker 1: that he felt that way? Because I was at my

141
00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:57,360
Speaker 1: house one evening and Ned got into it and Hannah'd left.

142
00:09:57,400 --> 00:09:59,199
Speaker 1: She had just got a driver's license, she was a

143
00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:03,080
Speaker 1: new driver, and she called me. He'd left after her,

144
00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:04,840
Speaker 1: and she called me and said he was chasing her

145
00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:07,760
Speaker 1: around at high speeds, and I told her to try

146
00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:11,319
Speaker 1: to get away somewhere, and she got finally got away

147
00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:13,560
Speaker 1: from him and hid behind a church on Union Hill,

148
00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,760
Speaker 1: and I called her mom, and her mom caught her dad,

149
00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:20,079
Speaker 1: and then I called Hannah back and stayed home with her.

150
00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:24,920
Speaker 1: That's so Chris Scott to her. April commented that it

151
00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:29,040
Speaker 1: wasn't only Jake she found scary. Hannah was also fearful

152
00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:31,719
Speaker 1: of Billy Wagner, who usually walked around with a gun

153
00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:36,439
Speaker 1: holster to his side. April also described the disturbing experience

154
00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:39,959
Speaker 1: of seeing the Wagners at the Rodents funerals. Did you

155
00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:44,480
Speaker 1: see Billy Wagner there at the funeral? Yes? Did you

156
00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:47,560
Speaker 1: observe any injuries on him at that time? He had

157
00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:51,400
Speaker 1: bruisine only his face. And what about Jake Wagner did

158
00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:56,240
Speaker 1: you see him at the funerals? Yes? Okay? Emotional and raw,

159
00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:59,320
Speaker 1: April Manley was an effective witness for Angie Caneppa's team,

160
00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:04,200
Speaker 1: offering deeper insight into Jake's depravity. Here's Long Crime Network

161
00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:08,120
Speaker 1: reporter a Jeanette Levy. She's been following the case for years.

162
00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:13,400
Speaker 1: I think April Manly provided some really good testimony for

163
00:11:14,320 --> 00:11:18,920
Speaker 1: the prosecution. She talked about how you know this was

164
00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:23,440
Speaker 1: an abusive relationship between hannahme and Jake. She talked about

165
00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:28,719
Speaker 1: how the Wagner's Billy, George, and Jake attended the funerals

166
00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:32,280
Speaker 1: of the road and family members. I mean, that's pretty

167
00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:36,600
Speaker 1: stunning to think that somebody who was part of killing

168
00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:39,600
Speaker 1: your family members showed up at the funerals with their

169
00:11:39,679 --> 00:11:42,440
Speaker 1: family members who were also accused. Now Billy and George

170
00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:46,160
Speaker 1: maintained they didn't do this. They've pleaded not guilty. But

171
00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:49,800
Speaker 1: just the fact that we actually have photographs and video

172
00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:53,079
Speaker 1: of Jake and George and Billy at the funerals is

173
00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:57,439
Speaker 1: pretty stunning. It's very eerie. But April manly provided some

174
00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:07,800
Speaker 1: testimony that was very damaging to Jake Wagner. It should

175
00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:10,720
Speaker 1: be pointed out that none of an April's testimony incriminates

176
00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:12,920
Speaker 1: George the fourth or puts him at the crime scene,

177
00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:16,480
Speaker 1: nor does it indicate that George Wagner had any motive

178
00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:19,199
Speaker 1: to carry out his brother's grudge against Hannah may Roden.

179
00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:23,320
Speaker 1: But according to Ohio based criminal defense attorney and legal

180
00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:26,839
Speaker 1: analyst Mike Allen, Kneppa is trying to weave a larger

181
00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:29,760
Speaker 1: narrative about the Wagners as a family unit that did

182
00:12:29,840 --> 00:12:36,679
Speaker 1: everything together, including murder. One of the defense lawyers, in

183
00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:41,280
Speaker 1: his opening statement, was very very short, told the jurors

184
00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:45,600
Speaker 1: that every time you hear the Wagners, you know, keep

185
00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:48,599
Speaker 1: in mind that George Wagner is the only one on

186
00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:51,959
Speaker 1: trial here, and you know, we don't know what went

187
00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:55,000
Speaker 1: on in chambers. When the judge talks from the prosecutor

188
00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:58,560
Speaker 1: and defense counsel. I mean, perhaps the judge told all

189
00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:01,600
Speaker 1: the prosecutor, hey, you know, you're getting a little bit

190
00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:03,839
Speaker 1: of field on some of these witnesses. You're going to

191
00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:06,600
Speaker 1: have to narrow it down. That happens all the time.

192
00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:09,760
Speaker 1: But it sure seems though, like he had pretty much

193
00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:13,560
Speaker 1: free reign to tell the tale of the Wagner family,

194
00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:18,400
Speaker 1: even if what the witnesses were saying was not particularly

195
00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:22,920
Speaker 1: relevant to George. A lot of testimony came in that

196
00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:26,120
Speaker 1: was not relevant to George. As a matter of fact,

197
00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:28,480
Speaker 1: I'd go as far as to say most of it.

198
00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:32,360
Speaker 1: But again, she's telling the story. The judge was letting

199
00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:34,720
Speaker 1: her do it. I would have done the same thing

200
00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:39,120
Speaker 1: if I was prosecuting the case. Judges will permit prosecutors

201
00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:43,000
Speaker 1: to do things like this, telling the tale and setting

202
00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:45,439
Speaker 1: it up like that, But at some point, if it

203
00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:48,640
Speaker 1: gets to be too much, the judge can step in.

204
00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,920
Speaker 1: But he didn't feel it appropriate to do that. And

205
00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:55,000
Speaker 1: you know, again, I think it was the prosecutor's desire

206
00:13:55,040 --> 00:13:59,400
Speaker 1: to just weave the tale about how awful this family was.

207
00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:04,800
Speaker 1: Another part of the prosecution strategy is to maintain constant

208
00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:10,520
Speaker 1: sympathy for the victims. Obviously, the prosecutor wants to create

209
00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:13,599
Speaker 1: as much sympathy for the victims that she can, and

210
00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:16,760
Speaker 1: from what I understand, she has been able to do that.

211
00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:20,880
Speaker 1: You know, the roads are obviously their family members were

212
00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:23,840
Speaker 1: brutally murdered and they want to be there. And it

213
00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:27,600
Speaker 1: helps the state too with the jury because again I

214
00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:31,320
Speaker 1: think there was a motion shown at the appropriate time,

215
00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:36,920
Speaker 1: so it helps the state. Were the Wagners, including George,

216
00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:40,120
Speaker 1: the tight knit clan they appeared to be, did they

217
00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:42,800
Speaker 1: always take action as a unit following what's known in

218
00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:47,920
Speaker 1: the Appalachian fringe as the Code of the Hills. So far,

219
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:51,400
Speaker 1: the prosecution may have fallen short of proving that. Here

220
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:56,320
Speaker 1: again internet Jake's daughter. Custody of his daughter is really

221
00:14:56,440 --> 00:14:58,920
Speaker 1: what the prosecution says was the motive in this case,

222
00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:01,920
Speaker 1: and they say it's a conspiracy and that four people

223
00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:04,680
Speaker 1: were involved in the conspiracy. So a lot of the

224
00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:09,000
Speaker 1: testimony seems to point more to Jake, and we hear

225
00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:13,360
Speaker 1: way more about Jake and Angela Wagner than we do

226
00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:18,400
Speaker 1: about George. So George seems like in some ways to

227
00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:21,560
Speaker 1: not be that much of a fixture or a feature

228
00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:24,040
Speaker 1: in his own murder trial. At a lot of points

229
00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:27,560
Speaker 1: when we're listening to some of this testimony, it seems strange.

230
00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:30,160
Speaker 1: It's not the first time I've covered a trial where

231
00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:33,520
Speaker 1: it seems like you don't hear that much about the defendant.

232
00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:36,440
Speaker 1: When I've seen this happen in the past, it's always

233
00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:39,680
Speaker 1: been a case that involved more than one defendant, right.

234
00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:44,040
Speaker 1: I mean, Jake Wagner is really the main player in

235
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:47,680
Speaker 1: this case. And Jake Wagner, of course pleaded guilty and

236
00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:51,440
Speaker 1: admitted it said that this is why the family carried

237
00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:55,720
Speaker 1: out these crimes. But if you're George Wagner's defense attorneys,

238
00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:57,920
Speaker 1: I would think you'd be thinking, you know what, my

239
00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:01,040
Speaker 1: guy's name hasn't been mentioned very often up to this point,

240
00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:04,040
Speaker 1: so I'd be trying to exploit that as much as

241
00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:06,720
Speaker 1: I could, because it's all been about Jake and Hannah

242
00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:10,920
Speaker 1: may Or, about Angela and Hannah may Or, Angela and

243
00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,360
Speaker 1: Jake and the child. It hasn't really been that much

244
00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:19,640
Speaker 1: about George. We're going to take a break. We'll be

245
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:25,440
Speaker 1: back in a moment. Oh. I'm Carol Fisher and I'm

246
00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,000
Speaker 1: hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends Back in the nineteen

247
00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,880
Speaker 1: nineties in Las Vegas, A few of us dated the

248
00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:37,880
Speaker 1: most eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He spoke several languages,

249
00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:43,120
Speaker 1: he did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He

250
00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:47,720
Speaker 1: was perfect on paper, but he wasn't. He really wasn't.

251
00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:52,360
Speaker 1: He shouted into the point she went unconscious. Bob could

252
00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:56,280
Speaker 1: lie about anything, but only takes the one time when

253
00:16:56,520 --> 00:17:00,440
Speaker 1: somebody ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us girl friends

254
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:02,960
Speaker 1: know how to fight back. I wanted him to pay

255
00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:06,080
Speaker 1: for his crime. He needed to be put to justice.

256
00:17:06,320 --> 00:17:07,879
Speaker 1: I'll be honest with you. If I saw him right now,

257
00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:10,159
Speaker 1: I'd spit on him. I would call him and I

258
00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:13,040
Speaker 1: would say, I know you killed my sister. I will

259
00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:16,080
Speaker 1: always hound you and haunt you. You can listen to

260
00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:20,280
Speaker 1: the girl Friends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or

261
00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:25,240
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts from iHeart podcasts. Whitney Hill

262
00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:28,760
Speaker 1: is going on here. Everyone has their limits. I'd never

263
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:31,200
Speaker 1: confronted a situation like this. I just thought it was

264
00:17:31,200 --> 00:17:34,679
Speaker 1: just a really terrible immoral thing, a line they won't cross.

265
00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:38,359
Speaker 1: I was stunned, and I just said, no, we're killing people.

266
00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:41,560
Speaker 1: You may never have to face that decision. When you

267
00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:45,320
Speaker 1: find yourself at that line. It's ricin ORNs ricin and

268
00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,040
Speaker 1: somebody needs to just for once give everybody the whole truth,

269
00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:53,639
Speaker 1: like this is evil and the only person who can

270
00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:56,960
Speaker 1: sound the alarm is you. I wasn't just going to

271
00:17:57,040 --> 00:18:02,600
Speaker 1: sit silently. Buy from iHeart Podcasts. These are the whistleblowers.

272
00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:05,080
Speaker 1: If you are disloyal, things are going to happen. To

273
00:18:05,160 --> 00:18:09,200
Speaker 1: speak out disgrace to our cut. Evil po be prosecuted

274
00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:14,520
Speaker 1: when power corrupts. Conscience is the last line of defense.

275
00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:19,360
Speaker 1: I'm Miles Taylor. Listen to the Whistleblowers on the iHeartRadio app,

276
00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:28,480
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name's

277
00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:32,840
Speaker 1: Laverne Cox. I'm an actress, producer, fashionista, and host of

278
00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:35,800
Speaker 1: The Laverne Cox Show. You may remember my award winning

279
00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:40,080
Speaker 1: first season. I've been pretty busy. There's always time to

280
00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:43,399
Speaker 1: touch incredible guests about important things people like me have

281
00:18:43,560 --> 00:18:46,280
Speaker 1: been screaming for years. We've got to watch the Supreme Court.

282
00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:48,760
Speaker 1: What they're doing is wrong, what they're doing as evil.

283
00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:51,720
Speaker 1: They will take things away. And I can only hope

284
00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:54,480
Speaker 1: that Dobbs is that like Pearl Harbor moment or you

285
00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:57,240
Speaker 1: and I both know what it to just get through

286
00:18:57,280 --> 00:18:59,359
Speaker 1: the day in New York City and get home in

287
00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,440
Speaker 1: one piece. And so the fact that we're here and

288
00:19:02,600 --> 00:19:06,520
Speaker 1: what you've achieved and what I've achieved, you know, that's momentous.

289
00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:09,720
Speaker 1: It's not just sitting around complaining about some bills. The

290
00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:12,240
Speaker 1: only reason that you might think, as Chase said, that

291
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:15,760
Speaker 1: we're always miserable is because people are constantly attacking us

292
00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:18,520
Speaker 1: and we're constantly noticing it. Listen to the Laverne Cox

293
00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:22,440
Speaker 1: Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you

294
00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:29,320
Speaker 1: get your podcast. Be sure to subscribe and share LA's

295
00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:33,159
Speaker 1: reputation not so great. People from LA will have a

296
00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:36,120
Speaker 1: very superficial, nice conversation with you, and they won't lift

297
00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:40,800
Speaker 1: a finger to help you. People represent vapidity stops that

298
00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:45,240
Speaker 1: like oh the best goals, like oh shoot. As someone

299
00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:47,880
Speaker 1: born and raised here, I can tell you there's much

300
00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:51,880
Speaker 1: more to LA than this. My name is James Kim,

301
00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:55,240
Speaker 1: and I'm the creator of a new anthology fiction podcast

302
00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:59,760
Speaker 1: called You Feeling This. It's ten different stories about LA

303
00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:03,840
Speaker 1: and the real people who make up this city. What name?

304
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:07,080
Speaker 1: Did you listen to? My message? We're just trying to

305
00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:10,359
Speaker 1: get bought. I think I was just freaking out because

306
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:14,240
Speaker 1: I'm scared by connecting with each other. I'm going to

307
00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:19,840
Speaker 1: be a father. Yes? Are you feeling this? A fiction podcast?

308
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:23,720
Speaker 1: Mixtape about love? Listen to it on the iHeartRadio app,

309
00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:35,240
Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. April Manley's

310
00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:39,480
Speaker 1: son Cody also takes the stand. He's got short blonde

311
00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:42,480
Speaker 1: hair and glasses and wears a blue checkered button down shirt.

312
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:48,479
Speaker 1: He is very composed. Please tell me if I am

313
00:20:48,760 --> 00:20:52,960
Speaker 1: correct about this. Your testimony is that you saw George

314
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:58,560
Speaker 1: Wagner a few times at Chris's fireworks correct, yes, okay,

315
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:04,080
Speaker 1: And that you knew him enough to recognize him correct correct, okay.

316
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:06,159
Speaker 1: And in addition to that, you saw him at the

317
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:10,520
Speaker 1: funeral correct okay. Do you recognize him in the courtroom

318
00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:14,120
Speaker 1: here today? Yes? And can you please tell us where

319
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:17,240
Speaker 1: he is sitting in what he is wearing over there?

320
00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:21,800
Speaker 1: And at vest and white shirt and black hie. Cody

321
00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:24,879
Speaker 1: and Frankie Rodin were best friends. Frankie lived down the

322
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:27,120
Speaker 1: road from Cody and rode with him every day to work.

323
00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:30,760
Speaker 1: On the morning of April twenty second, Frankie didn't show

324
00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:33,840
Speaker 1: up at Cody's house like he usually did, so Cody

325
00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:35,960
Speaker 1: drove over to the Rodens to see what was going on.

326
00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:39,520
Speaker 1: Cody described arriving at the scene of the murders and

327
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,359
Speaker 1: seeing his aunt Bobby Joe Manley's car along with the

328
00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:46,200
Speaker 1: police officer's car. He then walked into the scene of

329
00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:53,000
Speaker 1: the crime. I just put alongside the road and walked in.

330
00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:57,879
Speaker 1: And frankis okay, and can you tell us where did

331
00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 1: you see the cop car? Where was Bobby Joe's car in?

332
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:06,359
Speaker 1: Rodo's car was in the driveway slash yard and the

333
00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:12,000
Speaker 1: cop car was like driveway slashwaard. Okay, so kind of

334
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:14,160
Speaker 1: half half in the driveway and half in the road,

335
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,720
Speaker 1: right okay. And you walked into Frankie's house, right okay?

336
00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:20,600
Speaker 1: And what happened? I want tweets bedroom and like fruits?

337
00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:25,640
Speaker 1: Why did you freeze? Because I saw things I didn't

338
00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:31,639
Speaker 1: want to see. What he saw was Frankie Rodin and

339
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:36,480
Speaker 1: Hannah Hazel lying in a pool of blood. Cody testified

340
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:40,040
Speaker 1: that Chris Senior's dog, Chance probably knew the killers because

341
00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:43,719
Speaker 1: they would have likely attacked them if he didn't. Something

342
00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:48,879
Speaker 1: special about cheese, something different? What was that? What do

343
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:53,320
Speaker 1: you mean different? Well? Was Chance a gentle dog or

344
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,960
Speaker 1: or not? To me? Yes? He was gentle to you,

345
00:22:57,640 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 1: and chance knew you because you had been to that

346
00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:03,240
Speaker 1: proper often, right, right, I was a chance with people

347
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:09,480
Speaker 1: he didn't know. They wont went in the house. Here's

348
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:14,800
Speaker 1: Angeinette's overview of Cody's testimony. Cody Manly is Hannah May's

349
00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:19,399
Speaker 1: cousin and the son of James and April Manly, and

350
00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:23,920
Speaker 1: he was close with Frankie Rowden. He ended up actually

351
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: going down to Frankie's house and saw Bobby Joe in

352
00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:33,920
Speaker 1: the driveway, and he walked into the house to see

353
00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:37,119
Speaker 1: what was going on, and he actually found Frankie and

354
00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:43,200
Speaker 1: Hannah Hazel dead in the bed. A deputy came in

355
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 1: and told him, look, you've got to get out of here.

356
00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 1: He said he was frozen, he just couldn't move. And

357
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,639
Speaker 1: he testified about Hannah May being fearful of the Wagners.

358
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:59,080
Speaker 1: He didn't say necessarily that Hannah May was fearful of George,

359
00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:03,120
Speaker 1: but that she did fear the Wagoners. She wasn't living

360
00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 1: there with the Wagoners anymore. That's why she broke it

361
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:08,639
Speaker 1: off with Jake. He had made some threats to her

362
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 1: in the past as well, and kept her in her

363
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 1: bedroom for periods of time and wouldn't let her leave

364
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,919
Speaker 1: the house. So listening to Cody Manley talk about how

365
00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:26,040
Speaker 1: Hannah was fearful of the Wagners was pretty telling. First

366
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:29,960
Speaker 1: of all, can you tell us your name? Kendra Rodin Okay?

367
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:32,600
Speaker 1: And Kendrick? Can you tell us how would you are

368
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:38,919
Speaker 1: twenty five? Okay? And where do you work? I currently

369
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 1: work as a nurse at Brookdale. It's a nursing facility

370
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:48,400
Speaker 1: for demental residence. Okay? And where is that located? And Inglewood, Ohio.

371
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:54,119
Speaker 1: Kendra Roden, Kenneth's daughter, also gave heart wrenching testimony. She

372
00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:56,960
Speaker 1: wore a white shirt with lace accents and her long

373
00:24:57,000 --> 00:25:00,359
Speaker 1: blonde hair and a neat braid. She was extremely close

374
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:04,040
Speaker 1: to Hannah May and witnessed many of Jake's abuses. And

375
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 1: you mentioned Hannah. Who are you talking about when you

376
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 1: say Hannah? Hannah Roden? She was Chris's daughter, She was

377
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 1: my cousin, my best friend. We were like sisters. And

378
00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:17,720
Speaker 1: can you tell us for how long of your life

379
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,440
Speaker 1: that was? Was that? Did that start in early childhood

380
00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:24,119
Speaker 1: or did that start later in life? Early childhood we

381
00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:27,520
Speaker 1: were only a month apart, so we had been together forever.

382
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,439
Speaker 1: Kendra echoed April Manley's claim that Jake was controlling and cruel.

383
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:36,679
Speaker 1: Did you continue to hang out with Jake and Hannah

384
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 1: on various occasions? Yes, okay. Was there ever a time

385
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:47,840
Speaker 1: that you expressed a disliking of Jake? Yes? I told

386
00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:51,879
Speaker 1: Hannah I did not like Jake okay? And can you

387
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,800
Speaker 1: tell us what led you to say that? He would

388
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,479
Speaker 1: constantly try to be controlling? He would follow her anywhere

389
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:00,280
Speaker 1: we went. She was never allowed to be a loan.

390
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,920
Speaker 1: So give us some examples of that. An example would

391
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:05,400
Speaker 1: be when we went to the Reared and White Tail

392
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:09,080
Speaker 1: Deer Festival, Hannah would like need to go to the bathroom,

393
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 1: or we would say that we were going to go

394
00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:12,879
Speaker 1: to the bathroom and Jake had attack among and then

395
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:16,680
Speaker 1: he would wait outside until we were done. And did

396
00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:19,840
Speaker 1: anything happen at the I believe you said, the Cyota

397
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 1: County Fair, Yes, ma'am okay. At the Sida County Fair,

398
00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:28,240
Speaker 1: Jake had made a demeaning remark to Hannah Roden and

399
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:30,399
Speaker 1: grabbed her by the arm, in which I turned and

400
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:31,960
Speaker 1: kicked him in the shin because I didn't like it.

401
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 1: And then Hannah got in between the both of us.

402
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 1: She had come to me, She had arranged a little

403
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:40,360
Speaker 1: day for us to be together, and we had went

404
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,320
Speaker 1: to a man made pond that my family had built

405
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:45,879
Speaker 1: out on left Work Road. We were swimming and fishing

406
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:49,000
Speaker 1: in the pond there when she stopped and she told

407
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,159
Speaker 1: me that she was pregnant. I thought she was joking.

408
00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:55,119
Speaker 1: I was hoping she was joking, but she told me

409
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 1: she was really pregnant with his child and that everything

410
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,400
Speaker 1: was going to be okay. Did you support her through

411
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,240
Speaker 1: that process as much as I could? I wasn't allowed

412
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:06,640
Speaker 1: to be around. And when you say you weren't allowed

413
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:13,440
Speaker 1: by who? By Jake Wagner. At one point during her separation,

414
00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 1: Hannah shared with Kendra deeply disturbing voice recordings of Jake.

415
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,680
Speaker 1: It was testimony that ran a gauntlet of objections from

416
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:27,480
Speaker 1: the defense. At some point, did Hannah end up leaving Jake? Yes, ma'am,

417
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 1: And what do you remember from that? The night that

418
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:36,360
Speaker 1: she had left Jake, she came to my mother's residency

419
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:40,399
Speaker 1: where I was staying at seven dollars Lane, and she

420
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,800
Speaker 1: was a little distraught. We light on my bed and

421
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:48,200
Speaker 1: she had played audio recordings from Jake Wagner phone calls

422
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:50,680
Speaker 1: that they had had or from when they were in person.

423
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:56,520
Speaker 1: There are multiple different ones about incidents that had occurred

424
00:27:56,600 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 1: between Jake and her. Okay. And do you know what

425
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 1: occurred between them? Yes, ma'am. She not only told me,

426
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 1: but had played audio recordings of Jake admitting to hitting her,

427
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:14,359
Speaker 1: choking her, pushing her against a wall. When he was

428
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:18,040
Speaker 1: admitting to that stuff, what was the tenor of those

429
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:23,479
Speaker 1: in the tone of those recordings, was he saying other

430
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:26,280
Speaker 1: things to her? For instance? And was this before or

431
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:30,479
Speaker 1: after Hannah had left Jake? It was after she had

432
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,159
Speaker 1: left Jake. How are you able to listen to this conversation?

433
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 1: Hannah had the phone on speaker phone, that way I

434
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 1: could be witnessed anything that was said. Okay, And there

435
00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:43,320
Speaker 1: was an intentional act on her part, yes, ma'am. Okay.

436
00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:46,520
Speaker 1: And how do you know that it was Jake Wagner

437
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 1: on the other end of the phone. I've met Jake before,

438
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:53,400
Speaker 1: I've talked to Jake before. I know his voice. And

439
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 1: what was that discussion that you heard? The discussion was

440
00:28:56,760 --> 00:28:58,800
Speaker 1: actually because Hannah had found out she was pregnant with

441
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 1: her youngest and Jake had believed that was his and

442
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,000
Speaker 1: we were trying to point out to him that she

443
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 1: absolutely was not his and that he couldn't be a

444
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 1: part of her life. And at what point do you

445
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:19,760
Speaker 1: learn My aunt Michell had later got a text because

446
00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: none of us had service, and she became frantic and

447
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:25,640
Speaker 1: screamed out that my father was that you were still

448
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 1: at the church at that time. Yes, ma'am, let's stop

449
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 1: here for another break. Oh. I'm Carol Fisher, and I'm

450
00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:41,560
Speaker 1: hosting a podcast called The Girl Friends. Back in the

451
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,880
Speaker 1: nineteen nineties in Las Vegas, a few of us dated

452
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 1: the most eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He spoke several languages,

453
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 1: he did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He

454
00:29:56,440 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 1: was perfect on paper. But he wasn't he re Julie

455
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 1: wasn't he shouted into the point she went unconscious. Bob

456
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,800
Speaker 1: could lie about of anything, but only takes the one

457
00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 1: time when somebody ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us

458
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 1: girlfriends know how to fight back. I wanted him to

459
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 1: pay for his crime. He needed to be put to justice.

460
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 1: I'll be honest with you. If I saw him right now,

461
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 1: I'd spit on him. I would call him and I

462
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 1: would say, I know you killed my sister. I will

463
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:29,160
Speaker 1: always hound you and haunt you. You can listen to

464
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 1: the girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever

465
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:38,520
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts from iHeart podcasts. Whitney, hell is

466
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 1: going on here. Everyone has their limits. I'd never confronted

467
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:44,360
Speaker 1: a situation like this. I just thought it was just

468
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 1: a really terrible, immoral thing, a line they won't cross.

469
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: I was stunned, and I just said, no, we're killing people.

470
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:54,680
Speaker 1: You may never have to face that decision when you

471
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:58,440
Speaker 1: find yourself at that line. Bounce ricin, arn't ricin, and

472
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 1: somebody needs to just for once give everybody the whole truth.

473
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:07,120
Speaker 1: This is evil and the only person who can sound

474
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 1: the alarm is you. I wasn't just going to sit silently.

475
00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:16,160
Speaker 1: Buy from iHeart podcasts. These are the whistleblowers. If you

476
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: are disloyal, things are going to happen. To speak out

477
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 1: disgrace to our gun. Evil play should be prosecute. When

478
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:28,920
Speaker 1: power corrupts, conscience is the last line of defense. I'm

479
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 1: Miles Taylor. Listen to the Whistleblowers on the iHeartRadio app,

480
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:41,600
Speaker 1: Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name's

481
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:45,920
Speaker 1: Laverne Cox. I'm an actress, producer, fashionista, and host of

482
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:48,920
Speaker 1: The Laverne Cox Show. You may remember my award winning

483
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 1: first season. I've been pretty busy. There's always time to

484
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:56,520
Speaker 1: touch incredible guests about important things. People like me have

485
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,360
Speaker 1: been screaming for years. We've got to watch the Supreme Court.

486
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,880
Speaker 1: Where they're doing is wrong. What they're doing is evil.

487
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 1: They will take things away, and I can only hope

488
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 1: that Dobbs is that like Pearl Harbor moment. Girl. You

489
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 1: and I both know what it took to just get

490
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: through the day in New York City and get home

491
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,360
Speaker 1: in one piece. And so the fact that we're here

492
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,160
Speaker 1: and what you've achieved and what I've achieved, you know,

493
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: that's momentous. It's not just sitting around complaining about some bills.

494
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:25,280
Speaker 1: The only reason that you might think, as Chase said,

495
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:28,680
Speaker 1: that we're always miserable is because people are constantly attacking

496
00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 1: us and we're constantly noticing it. Listen to The la

497
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 1: Verne Cox Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or

498
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:39,560
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcast. Be sure to subscribe and share.

499
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:45,640
Speaker 1: How Rude Tanta Rito's is the full House rewatch podcast.

500
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,680
Speaker 1: You've been waiting for. Each week, get together with iconic

501
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 1: characters Stephanie Tanner and Kimmy Gibbler, also known as actresses

502
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 1: Jody Sweeten and Andrea Barber as they team up to

503
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:59,200
Speaker 1: relive every episode of your favorite Friday night comfort show.

504
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:02,360
Speaker 1: We spend our entire childhood's on a little show called

505
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 1: Full House, playing frenemies but becoming besties whenever the cameras

506
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 1: weren't rolling, and now thirty five years later, it's our

507
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 1: biggest adventure yet. Get ready for Jody and Andrea to

508
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 1: tell all as they take an in depth book back

509
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 1: at life in and around the Tanner Home from the

510
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 1: very very beginning. So if you think you know everything

511
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 1: there is to know about Full House, how Rude, We'll

512
00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 1: be reliving every moment with you, and we'll be joined

513
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: by our Full House family, including all your favorites from

514
00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: one hundred and ninety two episodes. We'll reveal the hidden

515
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:33,040
Speaker 1: treasures you may have missed within the show, and we'll

516
00:33:33,080 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 1: take a trip down memory lane together. Listen to how

517
00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 1: Rude tannertos on the iHeartRadio Appicable podcasts or wherever you

518
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 1: get your podcasts and Kneppa asked Kendra to describe the

519
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 1: moment she learned of the murders and was helped out

520
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 1: by a quote stadie or state police. Do you stay

521
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:01,840
Speaker 1: at the church? Upon learning that my father had been

522
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 1: killed as well? I walked down the hill there until

523
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:09,960
Speaker 1: a family friend had actually picked me up. Her name

524
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:12,920
Speaker 1: was Melissa, and I told her that I just needed

525
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,279
Speaker 1: to get across the highway. She took me across the

526
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: highway and I got out. There was a stadi there

527
00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:21,239
Speaker 1: that stopped me. I just I was trying to get

528
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 1: Tannah because I just wanted to be with her. I

529
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:29,439
Speaker 1: was crying and the stadi I had dropped to the ground.

530
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:31,800
Speaker 1: The stadie helped me get back up. At what point

531
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 1: did you learn that something had happened? My boyfriend at

532
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 1: the time I had woke me up around eight thirty,

533
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,719
Speaker 1: we had missed a phone call from a family friend,

534
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 1: Nicole Francis, that had said that my uncle Chris Senior,

535
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:50,600
Speaker 1: had been shot. She had heard it on a police radio.

536
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 1: So I called her back, and at that point she

537
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 1: had told me that Chris had been shot. I tried

538
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:58,520
Speaker 1: to call Hannah. I can't get a hold of Hannah.

539
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,279
Speaker 1: I can't get a hold of anybody so my brother

540
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 1: and I, his girlfriend and my ex boyfriend. We drove

541
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:08,240
Speaker 1: to Union Hill, in which we were stopped just before

542
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 1: Frankie Driveway, stopped by whom the sheriffs that were there.

543
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:17,600
Speaker 1: It's a time that you got that call. Was the

544
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:20,960
Speaker 1: only information you had was that Christinior had been shot? Yes, ma'am.

545
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 1: At what point did you learn differently? At some point,

546
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:30,279
Speaker 1: my brother Luke Rowden had obtained some information from one

547
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:35,000
Speaker 1: of the sheriffs that Hannah had also been shot, in

548
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 1: which he had come and told me that she had

549
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:40,880
Speaker 1: been shot as well and she was dead. What did

550
00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:45,120
Speaker 1: you do at that point? I became very upset. I

551
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:50,400
Speaker 1: couldn't believe that she had also been shot. I cried,

552
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: we age. There was a few of us that had

553
00:35:55,080 --> 00:36:01,240
Speaker 1: actually tried to push past the sheriffs. At this point, George,

554
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 1: the fourth lawyer, began a flimsy cross asking Kendra if

555
00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:07,880
Speaker 1: she had any knowledge of Chris Senior's drug dealings. The

556
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:12,200
Speaker 1: line of questioning ran aground, now referring to the information

557
00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 1: which you had provided previously to law enforcement. You had

558
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 1: given information about an individual you know as Big Mike.

559
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:24,480
Speaker 1: Is that right? Yes? And Big Mike is someone who

560
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:28,640
Speaker 1: is from the Cincinnati area to my knowledge, Okay, that's

561
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 1: information that you had given agents though, right, that I

562
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:34,479
Speaker 1: had heard from my father. You were asked about drug

563
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 1: dealing with your family's involvement with drug dealing. Right you

564
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 1: are asked that question? Yes, okay, And so I'm eventually

565
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,080
Speaker 1: going to ask you about Big Mike. Did you ever

566
00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:52,319
Speaker 1: observe an African American mel with Chris Senior or your father?

567
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:57,279
Speaker 1: Not a reall? Okay? Do you have personal knowledge of

568
00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:04,160
Speaker 1: Chris Senior preparing to buy a building for a pill mill? No?

569
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:08,200
Speaker 1: Do you remember providing that information to agents? I provided

570
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: it based on Hairsay, okay. You were also asked about

571
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 1: Billy Wagner by associate or by agents? Right? Yes, you

572
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:21,759
Speaker 1: described the relationship between Chris Senior and Billy Wagner as

573
00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:26,440
Speaker 1: business associates. Yes, you're aware of Chris Senior's involvement in

574
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 1: marijuana traffic right, yes, And you're aware that he was

575
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 1: in Asian more than just Mariworna traffic. Not firsthand knowledge

576
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:38,880
Speaker 1: you had told me SEI agents about more than just

577
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 1: Marimann traffic. Yes, based on what I heard. Thank you?

578
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: Again and again, the defense failed to gain ground and

579
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:53,520
Speaker 1: George the Fourth's favor, but neither really did the prosecution

580
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:57,760
Speaker 1: make a clear case against Jake's older brother George. Instead,

581
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,600
Speaker 1: they seem focused on painting Jake, as I said, sociopath

582
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 1: here again, Mike Allen. It's not all that probitive or

583
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 1: relevant because George is on trial, not Jake. But I

584
00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 1: think the prosecution had a strategy to paint Jake. It's

585
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 1: kind of a depraved lunatic throughout the entire trial, and

586
00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,120
Speaker 1: I think they were successful in doing it. I mean,

587
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 1: anytime that they could take a shot at Jake one

588
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 1: way or the other, they did. I think that was

589
00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:30,840
Speaker 1: probably the strategy there. Oh. I think the jury's picking

590
00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:33,880
Speaker 1: up on that, and the prosecutor has been pounding it

591
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:38,480
Speaker 1: throughout the trial, and it just shows that this is

592
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:42,320
Speaker 1: a family like no other family that I've seen before.

593
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:46,839
Speaker 1: They're depraved and they don't care about anyone other than

594
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:50,960
Speaker 1: their family, and that is coming through loud and clear

595
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:56,359
Speaker 1: on this trial. But George's abuse of tendencies will come

596
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:59,440
Speaker 1: to light soon when his x weft Tabitha takes the stand.

597
00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:04,880
Speaker 1: Here's Mike and Angeanette. Well Tambatha was on the stand

598
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:09,080
Speaker 1: the next day and gave testimony that she worked at

599
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:13,319
Speaker 1: the group home that Frederica Wagner owned. It was called

600
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 1: Crystal Springs. She cheated on George while working at that

601
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:21,960
Speaker 1: group home. They fired her and took her phone. She

602
00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:24,799
Speaker 1: was allowed to go outside home alone when she was there.

603
00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:28,359
Speaker 1: And it's really frightening too, you know. She talked about

604
00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:31,120
Speaker 1: that night she fled the house. She said that Angela

605
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:34,760
Speaker 1: and Hannah May had gone out to get some toys

606
00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 1: for the kids and she was home with her son,

607
00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:43,240
Speaker 1: and Angela had told her. She claimed that she needed

608
00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:46,040
Speaker 1: to clean up the dishes from lunch. Well, she didn't

609
00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 1: do it. She laid down to take a nap with

610
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 1: her son, and she said that when Angela came home,

611
00:39:51,320 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 1: she was very upset with her for not completing that

612
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:57,799
Speaker 1: task or that chore. There was an argument. George got

613
00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 1: upset with her for yelling at Angela. George slapped her

614
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:06,920
Speaker 1: and hit her with a belt. She escaped living with

615
00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:10,399
Speaker 1: them by hiding under George's truck, then getting a bike

616
00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:14,279
Speaker 1: out of the barn and riding away. She rode the

617
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:16,520
Speaker 1: bike down to the gas station down the road and

618
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:20,280
Speaker 1: she had her mom pick her up. She was hiding

619
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:24,400
Speaker 1: from them because he was scared of being shot. George

620
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:28,279
Speaker 1: took their son to Alaska when the Wagoners fled, but

621
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,239
Speaker 1: did not let Tabitha know she had no contact with

622
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:36,359
Speaker 1: her son while the Wagoners were in Alaska. George kept

623
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:40,880
Speaker 1: making excuses as to why, and one of George's closest

624
00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 1: friends testifies that George wasn't in his usual self after

625
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:49,919
Speaker 1: the killings. Samantha Staley had also testified though, that after

626
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:54,080
Speaker 1: the homicides, she was with George and some other people

627
00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 1: and they went fishing, and she said, he wasn't the

628
00:40:57,640 --> 00:41:02,480
Speaker 1: same George. He just different. It wasn't the same George.

629
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 1: And she brought up the fact that Frankie had been

630
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:09,520
Speaker 1: killed in the rest of the family and he George,

631
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,839
Speaker 1: she said, told her to shut the f up, which

632
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:15,480
Speaker 1: sounds like it was pretty out of character for him,

633
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:21,560
Speaker 1: at least when dealing with her. More on that next time.

634
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:25,960
Speaker 1: For more information on the case and relevant photos, follow

635
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 1: us on Instagram at Katie Underscore Studios. The Piked and

636
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:34,440
Speaker 1: Masker is produced by Stephanie Lydecker, Jeff Shane, Alan Wider,

637
00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:40,560
Speaker 1: Andrew Arnow, Gabriel Castillo and me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and

638
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:45,200
Speaker 1: sound designed by Jeff Tua, music by Jared Aston. The

639
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 1: Piked and Masker is a production of iHeartRadio and Katie Studios.

640
00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:51,839
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from My Heart Radio, visit the heart

641
00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

642
00:41:56,239 --> 00:42:01,880
Speaker 1: favorite shows. I'm Carol Sure and I'm hosting a podcast

643
00:42:01,960 --> 00:42:06,160
Speaker 1: called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties

644
00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:09,560
Speaker 1: and it is time to find a husband. There were

645
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:14,239
Speaker 1: four Jewish doctors who were felt to be eligible bachelors.

646
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:18,320
Speaker 1: One of them was the spot Bremaut. On paper, he

647
00:42:18,560 --> 00:42:22,840
Speaker 1: was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wackome. He

648
00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 1: shouted to the point she went unconscious. I would call

649
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,279
Speaker 1: him and I would say, I know you killed my sister.

650
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 1: You can listen to The Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app,

651
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 1: Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm

652
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:40,720
Speaker 1: free and I'm Rthie. We have spent the last twenty

653
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:43,840
Speaker 1: years building and working at some of the largest companies

654
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 1: in the world. We worked with some remarkable people. Rob mclenny.

655
00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 1: When I see the people of Wrexham, I grew up

656
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:52,359
Speaker 1: exactly like them. Check out the art in Trarm Show

657
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 1: That is a r d Hi and s R I

658
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:01,479
Speaker 1: R A M Show. Listen to the arcadianstry On Show

659
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast Oh, wherever you

660
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:08,440
Speaker 1: get your podcast This is the story of a man

661
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:12,800
Speaker 1: who's fascinated me. His name was Sweet Daddy Grace, and

662
00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:16,280
Speaker 1: that's a name you don't forget. He was a visionary

663
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:19,359
Speaker 1: who built a fortune as a black man during Jim

664
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:23,719
Speaker 1: Crow during the Depression, but today not many people know

665
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:26,840
Speaker 1: about him. The race sort of wiped out, and I

666
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 1: wonder if this was done intentionally. Listen to Sweet Daddy

667
00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:34,680
Speaker 1: Grace on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you

668
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:39,120
Speaker 1: get your podcasts. I'm will daily. For years, I've been

669
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:41,839
Speaker 1: on the road, playing shows and seeing America through live music.

670
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:44,360
Speaker 1: This summer, I'll hit the stage. Who's Season two of

671
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 1: Sound of Our Town ten cities twelve episodes every other Thursday.

672
00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:51,640
Speaker 1: We explore the live music venues and culture of a

673
00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:54,960
Speaker 1: new American city. With each new episode, our tour continues

674
00:43:55,000 --> 00:43:56,520
Speaker 1: into the kind of venues you want to get to

675
00:43:56,600 --> 00:44:01,160
Speaker 1: when you land in Detroit, Providence, Denver, or Apple. Listen

676
00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:04,480
Speaker 1: to Sound of Our Town on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts,

677
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts,