1
00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:13,320
Speaker 1: This is the me Eater podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,

2
00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:15,280
Speaker 1: bug bitten, and in my case, underware.

3
00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:19,240
Speaker 2: Listening past, you can't predict.

4
00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,920
Speaker 1: Anything brought to you by first Light. When I'm hunting,

5
00:00:23,079 --> 00:00:27,640
Speaker 1: I need gear that won't quit. First light builds, no compromise,

6
00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:31,480
Speaker 1: gear that keeps me in the field longer, no shortcuts,

7
00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:34,840
Speaker 1: just gear that works. Check it out at first light

8
00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:38,639
Speaker 1: dot com. That's f I R S T L I

9
00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:45,239
Speaker 1: t E dot com. Today we're joined joined by uh

10
00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:50,880
Speaker 1: what I say? Joined joined by George Buman, who's a

11
00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:53,600
Speaker 1: sculptor of bronze artists. He's a naturalist. But here's the

12
00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:56,560
Speaker 1: main deal for our for our purposes here, he's an

13
00:00:56,600 --> 00:01:01,600
Speaker 1: animal language and animal intelligence expert. Teaches courses on the

14
00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:05,679
Speaker 1: intelligence of animals. We'll go to those things in Yellstone

15
00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:10,440
Speaker 1: National Park. Leads seminars there of helping people understand what

16
00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:13,920
Speaker 1: they're hearing, what they're seeing, about how animals do their business.

17
00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:17,119
Speaker 1: He's got a new book called Eavesdropping on Animals. What

18
00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:22,679
Speaker 1: we can learn from wildlife conversations. We're gonna dive in

19
00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:25,920
Speaker 1: on all that. But just as a little tickler hit

20
00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:29,760
Speaker 1: me with, you don't need to say a word. Okay,

21
00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:33,920
Speaker 1: now listen, listen, this is this is George Buman. No

22
00:01:34,319 --> 00:01:37,720
Speaker 1: brody verify, yeah, no diaphragm in his mouth.

23
00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:40,160
Speaker 3: No, no animals in the studio.

24
00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:43,319
Speaker 1: No animals in the studio. We have some bronze pete.

25
00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,640
Speaker 1: We have a bronze piece. We have like the makings

26
00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:49,680
Speaker 1: of a bronze piece in the studio. So that turkey

27
00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:52,919
Speaker 1: right there, Tap that turkey so people realize that's not okay,

28
00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:55,160
Speaker 1: that's not that turkey is not making this noise.

29
00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:01,920
Speaker 4: Okay, hit us with okay, hit us with the note.

30
00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:04,800
Speaker 1: Hit us with some turkey vocalizations. No, no, this is

31
00:02:05,040 --> 00:02:20,080
Speaker 1: just just flat out okay, all right, okay, hit us

32
00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:20,800
Speaker 1: with some kyotes.

33
00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:36,000
Speaker 4: Way off? You got a good wolfall Oh yeah, let's

34
00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:49,720
Speaker 4: hear a wolf. Oh dude, can you do a good

35
00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:51,080
Speaker 4: elk way off bugle?

36
00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:53,880
Speaker 1: Yanni does a good bugle, but his Yanni's bugle is

37
00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:54,720
Speaker 1: miles away.

38
00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:57,000
Speaker 2: Yeah yeahn might be miles away.

39
00:02:57,120 --> 00:03:08,359
Speaker 1: Hit me with a good mile away off elk. That's

40
00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:11,079
Speaker 1: a lot closer than Yannis. Yannis is like, you can't

41
00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:11,440
Speaker 1: even tell.

42
00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:11,799
Speaker 4: If you heard it.

43
00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:18,639
Speaker 1: You're wondering you've got any good magpie vocalizations? Ravens anything

44
00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:19,799
Speaker 1: of the Ravens.

45
00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:27,959
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh, one of my favorites. They've got a lot

46
00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:29,880
Speaker 2: of a lot of range, a lot of meaning there.

47
00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:31,600
Speaker 1: Let me, I want I want to talk a bunch

48
00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:33,840
Speaker 1: about those guys, because man, it makes some crazy ass.

49
00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:36,240
Speaker 4: Noises and it can't be just that making noises for

50
00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:36,840
Speaker 4: no reason.

51
00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:38,720
Speaker 2: Oh no, no, no, no.

52
00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:41,520
Speaker 4: Okay, here's a real challenging one. And just just telling me.

53
00:03:41,560 --> 00:03:44,000
Speaker 1: If you can't do it, I wish I could. Can

54
00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:47,280
Speaker 1: you like this tests your whistling skills? Can you hit

55
00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:49,040
Speaker 1: a black can you do black cap chickenye?

56
00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:53,800
Speaker 2: Not to mind action. Yeah, there's they're certain to do

57
00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:54,560
Speaker 2: it now too.

58
00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:56,839
Speaker 4: Good.

59
00:03:57,320 --> 00:03:59,400
Speaker 1: That's a tough one, but you know how good it works.

60
00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:01,480
Speaker 1: So yeah, because people that can do it can bring

61
00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:02,400
Speaker 1: them in like crazy.

62
00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:08,960
Speaker 2: That's pretty good. Yep, damn yeah.

63
00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:13,200
Speaker 1: All right, all right, we're gonna get it off and

64
00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:15,440
Speaker 1: now that but what like, like, here's the main thing

65
00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:16,600
Speaker 1: I want. One of the main things I want to

66
00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:17,880
Speaker 1: talk to about when we get to I got to

67
00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:21,040
Speaker 1: do a couple of announcements is not just the noises,

68
00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:21,480
Speaker 1: but like.

69
00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:26,440
Speaker 4: There's the what like what they're talking about?

70
00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:29,560
Speaker 2: It means stuff. Oh, I can show you things you

71
00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:31,159
Speaker 2: would never ever have found.

72
00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:34,160
Speaker 1: They obviously mean stuff, but like because they're not doing

73
00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:37,320
Speaker 1: it for fun. No, I mean, it might be fun,

74
00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:39,920
Speaker 1: but they're not you know what I mean. Yeah, what

75
00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:42,360
Speaker 1: it all means. One of the main the first thing

76
00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:43,800
Speaker 1: to so you know what's gonna come. One of the

77
00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:47,240
Speaker 1: first things I'm gonna ask you about is you know

78
00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:50,440
Speaker 1: a pine squirrels pissed off noise or whatever his noise is.

79
00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:54,039
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't do it real good, but there's a

80
00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:55,039
Speaker 2: ton of meaning in that.

81
00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,720
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, Ton, Yeah, you know.

82
00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:05,400
Speaker 1: He's pissed at his body.

83
00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:04,479
Speaker 2: Fisted at the bobcat.

84
00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,800
Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, real quick.

85
00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:11,320
Speaker 1: So there's a new YouTube. The Bear Grease YouTube channel

86
00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:13,960
Speaker 1: is becoming its own thing. A little behind the scenes

87
00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:17,960
Speaker 1: thinking here, Clay Clay started a YouTube.

88
00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:19,440
Speaker 4: Channel million years ago and it was like the.

89
00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:23,039
Speaker 1: Bear Journal or because when Clay owned Bear Hunting Magazine,

90
00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:25,440
Speaker 1: he had had a YouTube channel, So it's always been

91
00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:28,440
Speaker 1: kind of lurking around there. That YouTube channel is going

92
00:05:28,480 --> 00:05:31,080
Speaker 1: to stay like that's Clay's baby. But Clay and Bear

93
00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:34,840
Speaker 1: Nwcomb are going to build out the Bear Grease YouTube channel.

94
00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:38,159
Speaker 1: So all about them making them little bows out of sticks.

95
00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:45,839
Speaker 1: Hunting content, Mule content cooking stuff okay, And they're also

96
00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:50,600
Speaker 1: launching their own Instagram page, Round Bear Grease and I'll

97
00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:52,160
Speaker 1: tell you we haven't gotten it. I might be the

98
00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:57,720
Speaker 1: first guy ever mentioned this. Clay's book that's coming out

99
00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:00,599
Speaker 1: in a long time from now is exceptionally good.

100
00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:05,240
Speaker 4: It's good. I mean, I've only read the first five chapters.

101
00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,360
Speaker 4: It's it's a book. It's a it's a book. It's

102
00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:12,640
Speaker 4: like a history of the black bear. It is good,

103
00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:18,480
Speaker 4: including a large chapter on the circumpolar bear culture. I

104
00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:20,520
Speaker 4: don't know if I can. I'm allowed to. Yeah, why not?

105
00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:25,320
Speaker 1: Clay just he's turning his booking right now. There's circumpolar

106
00:06:25,360 --> 00:06:25,960
Speaker 1: bear culture.

107
00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:28,640
Speaker 4: Is crazy because there's like a latitude.

108
00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:35,200
Speaker 1: Band all around the continent, so it touches North America, Europe, Asia,

109
00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:38,720
Speaker 1: around the northern hemisphere. It's yeah, it's a band of latitudes,

110
00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:45,240
Speaker 1: northern northern latitudes all around the globe. And if you

111
00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:48,520
Speaker 1: think about the human diaspora, like how people spread around

112
00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:51,039
Speaker 1: the world, these are people that split. There's people within

113
00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:55,560
Speaker 1: this that split apart way long ago. Like meaning if

114
00:06:55,600 --> 00:07:00,800
Speaker 1: you imagine, like imagine it's human's column, like humans are

115
00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:05,080
Speaker 1: kind of in.

116
00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:05,400
Speaker 4: The Middle East. Humans are in Africa.

117
00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:09,480
Speaker 1: You know, humans are up in Spain wherever, and eventually

118
00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:13,160
Speaker 1: some of them come around and wind up in Siberia

119
00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:15,920
Speaker 1: and some come around and wind up in northern Europe.

120
00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:18,880
Speaker 1: Now by this point they haven't been hanging out together

121
00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:21,920
Speaker 1: for tens of thousands of years, right.

122
00:07:22,520 --> 00:07:22,680
Speaker 4: But.

123
00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,840
Speaker 1: You look at their religious structures and sort of like

124
00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:32,080
Speaker 1: spiritual understandings of bears, and you have this circumpolar bear

125
00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:35,360
Speaker 1: culture where people that wouldn't have no interaction with each

126
00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:39,320
Speaker 1: other develop or no interaction with each other for thousands

127
00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:43,720
Speaker 1: and thousands of years, develop the same sort of religious

128
00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:49,240
Speaker 1: understandings of bears and how bears fit into their culture

129
00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:54,120
Speaker 1: and the shamanistic aspects and like motivations that are assigned

130
00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:58,600
Speaker 1: to bears. And you cannot explain it how some dude

131
00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:01,760
Speaker 1: in Siberia, some dudent America, some dude in Europe have

132
00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:07,040
Speaker 1: the same concept of like how you treat a bear

133
00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:09,560
Speaker 1: when you hunt for a bear? What are your obligations

134
00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:11,880
Speaker 1: to the bear? That you definitely don't want a bear

135
00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:15,000
Speaker 1: to see you once it's dead, So if you kill

136
00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:17,080
Speaker 1: a bear, you approach it from behind.

137
00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:19,960
Speaker 4: Like these dudes are on the same trip all over

138
00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:21,160
Speaker 4: the do you know what I'm saying.

139
00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:26,280
Speaker 1: No, it's so weird, man. I hope he's not pissed

140
00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:27,040
Speaker 1: that I'm bringing that up.

141
00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:30,960
Speaker 2: Does he have no bear Mother story in there? Is

142
00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:33,199
Speaker 2: that that one that goes all over Northern Hemisphere?

143
00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:35,520
Speaker 4: It's all over, It's in there. He's got every damn

144
00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:37,720
Speaker 4: thing in there. Yeah, that's neat.

145
00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:41,720
Speaker 1: No, it's a super cool book available long time from now.

146
00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:45,800
Speaker 1: So the Beary's YouTube channel be run by Baron Clay nukeomb.

147
00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:48,640
Speaker 4: Yeah.

148
00:08:49,920 --> 00:08:53,960
Speaker 1: Oh February eleventh, two days before I turn fifty two,

149
00:08:55,160 --> 00:09:00,400
Speaker 1: very auspicious days.

150
00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:04,480
Speaker 4: Here's a great correction.

151
00:09:04,520 --> 00:09:06,319
Speaker 1: We're gonna start a thing where you win a prize

152
00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:09,240
Speaker 1: for you know, we're trying to, like in an age

153
00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:12,320
Speaker 1: of disinformation, shady information.

154
00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:17,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, we're trying to. We're gonna have a weekly prize

155
00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:20,559
Speaker 4: called Correction of the.

156
00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:25,400
Speaker 1: Week for the biggest fib so no rewarding people who catch.

157
00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:25,920
Speaker 4: Us being wrong.

158
00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:28,240
Speaker 2: Ah, that's a good thing.

159
00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:29,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, check this out.

160
00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:31,880
Speaker 1: For instance, there dam made a comment and that was

161
00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:34,080
Speaker 1: this is when we talking about stuff I didn't know. Well,

162
00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,559
Speaker 1: he even has the thirty seven minute mark. Episode eight

163
00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:44,000
Speaker 1: twenty six, was that episode called Skunk Smells Her First?

164
00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:48,199
Speaker 5: No, that wasn't it how skunks can ruin a marriage?

165
00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:52,960
Speaker 1: Okay, I said, oh, to my defense, I'm still this

166
00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:56,040
Speaker 1: is still a correction. To my defense, I said, I

167
00:09:56,240 --> 00:10:00,760
Speaker 1: don't think that a human operating word here being I said,

168
00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:06,480
Speaker 1: I on the subject of skunks and skunk essence, I said,

169
00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:11,480
Speaker 1: I don't think that a human can make.

170
00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:14,520
Speaker 5: That.

171
00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:18,000
Speaker 1: I didn't finish quite then, I okay, I.

172
00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:20,280
Speaker 4: Said, I don't think that a human can make.

173
00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:24,000
Speaker 1: I don't think in a lab you could make as

174
00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:31,200
Speaker 1: pugnacious or resilient of an order in a laboratory. Guy

175
00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:34,120
Speaker 1: wrote in He's like, you're way wrong.

176
00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:39,480
Speaker 4: They can't. Humans can and have, And he gets into

177
00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:40,600
Speaker 4: some of these odors.

178
00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:46,640
Speaker 1: While the skunk order is due to fields mercaptains sulfur

179
00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:52,240
Speaker 1: containing compounds, he says, there are other compounds, both synthesized

180
00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:56,120
Speaker 1: and isolated in laboratories that samel much worse.

181
00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,160
Speaker 4: I like this one. They have a.

182
00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:05,120
Speaker 1: Lab ba odor called cadaverine, which is a lab produced

183
00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:16,719
Speaker 1: odor of decaying flesh. They have pyridine putressine, and what

184
00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:19,000
Speaker 1: he regards to be the worst smell of all time,

185
00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:27,400
Speaker 1: thio acetone order, so potent it causes nausea. Vomiting and unconsciousness.

186
00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:32,680
Speaker 1: There was a lab leak. There was a lab leak

187
00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:36,240
Speaker 1: in Germany where they had they had a lab leak

188
00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:42,800
Speaker 1: of thio acetone and Germany and for a half mile

189
00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:51,000
Speaker 1: radius around the lab people reported nausea, vomiting, and unconsciousness

190
00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:52,680
Speaker 1: from a leak.

191
00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:58,040
Speaker 2: Powerful and what do they use that for?

192
00:11:58,280 --> 00:11:59,320
Speaker 4: Usually I don't know why.

193
00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:01,680
Speaker 1: I don't know how they justif either way, I don't

194
00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:04,040
Speaker 1: know how. That's a great question. This would be one

195
00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:07,200
Speaker 1: of those things we talk about ridiculous maybe when you're

196
00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:10,280
Speaker 1: like hacking on science, like the dumb stuff they spend

197
00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:12,840
Speaker 1: money on making bad smells.

198
00:12:13,040 --> 00:12:14,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, all right, so I'm staying corrected.

199
00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:17,760
Speaker 1: That's a good correction right there, man, I said, this

200
00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:18,560
Speaker 1: is the kind of correction.

201
00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:20,760
Speaker 4: What will be the prize when you get correction in

202
00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:22,520
Speaker 4: the week, It's gotta be something good. But it's we

203
00:12:22,559 --> 00:12:23,360
Speaker 4: have a lot of it.

204
00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:25,239
Speaker 5: We're gonna maybe.

205
00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:26,240
Speaker 4: We gotta fifty two of them.

206
00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:28,440
Speaker 5: Maybe this will excite people more.

207
00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:30,959
Speaker 6: So.

208
00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:34,719
Speaker 5: We will have a segment sponsored by to Cova's. To

209
00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:36,760
Speaker 5: Covas is.

210
00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:38,640
Speaker 4: Well, They're gonna do the they are.

211
00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:43,240
Speaker 5: Kickers Correction of the week and we will choose the

212
00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:47,200
Speaker 5: winning correction of the week. For We'll do this for

213
00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:51,240
Speaker 5: about a month first to see and the correction of

214
00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:53,719
Speaker 5: the week winner gets a pair of takovas.

215
00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:56,240
Speaker 1: Oh, so we're gonna start out you get a pair

216
00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:58,600
Speaker 1: of ship kickers, and then but we'll come up with

217
00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:00,880
Speaker 1: something comparable every time.

218
00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:06,080
Speaker 5: Sure that's phenomenal corrections.

219
00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:08,880
Speaker 1: This would be this would be a great This would

220
00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:11,440
Speaker 1: be a great one, I say, And again I said, think.

221
00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,120
Speaker 1: I say, you can't make something worse than that in

222
00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,120
Speaker 1: a lab. Guys say, hey you can. Here's another correction.

223
00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:20,800
Speaker 1: He calls it a craction by omission, but I'd like

224
00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:25,360
Speaker 1: to correct him. It's not a correction, bio missions, just

225
00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:30,280
Speaker 1: a correction. So I don't think he'd win because like

226
00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:34,600
Speaker 1: he's saying, hey, here's a correction by omission, and then

227
00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:36,440
Speaker 1: when I tell you the craction, you realize it's not

228
00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:38,880
Speaker 1: a correction, it's just a correction. He's just trying to

229
00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:44,040
Speaker 1: soup it up. I said. We were talking about retrieval laws.

230
00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:47,959
Speaker 1: We're talking about that in different states you have these

231
00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:53,679
Speaker 1: different governing laws about whether you can go and get retrieve.

232
00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:56,560
Speaker 4: Game. Okay, so picture that you're sitting there.

233
00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:01,199
Speaker 1: You're sitting there and you you you shoot a duck,

234
00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:04,360
Speaker 1: you know, ducks flying overhead, and you shoot a duck

235
00:14:04,440 --> 00:14:06,640
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden he like sails off and

236
00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:11,040
Speaker 1: plump lands overund the neighbor's place. States clarify. All states

237
00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:14,680
Speaker 1: have clarified, Like what are you allowed to do? Some

238
00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:20,120
Speaker 1: states you just flat out go get it. There's a

239
00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:25,360
Speaker 1: state where you can leave your gun behind and go

240
00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,200
Speaker 1: fetch it. And there are states like the one I'm

241
00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:32,200
Speaker 1: sitting in right now, you have no right or authority

242
00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:34,400
Speaker 1: to go fetch it. You'd have to go take it

243
00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:36,440
Speaker 1: up with the landowner and be like, listen, man, I

244
00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:37,760
Speaker 1: sailed to duck over around your place.

245
00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:38,560
Speaker 4: Can I go grab it?

246
00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,680
Speaker 1: And as terrible as it sounds, I mean I'm totally like,

247
00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:46,200
Speaker 1: I'm like totally fine with that rule, but I would

248
00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:52,320
Speaker 1: like to think that most landowners would, when approached, facilitate

249
00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:55,480
Speaker 1: the recovery. I understand. I'm not condemning the rule because

250
00:14:55,480 --> 00:15:01,480
Speaker 1: I understand that there are situations is where someone could

251
00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:03,920
Speaker 1: set up in a way where they just basically know.

252
00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:04,960
Speaker 4: That that's going to be the outbum.

253
00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:07,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it could be abused for sure, especially

254
00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:08,560
Speaker 3: with big game.

255
00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:12,600
Speaker 1: I feel like, yeah, where you're hunting in a spot

256
00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:15,440
Speaker 1: where you're just if you're sitting there going like, well, yeah,

257
00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:17,480
Speaker 1: I know it's going to run on in the neighbor's place,

258
00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:19,040
Speaker 1: but I'm allowed to go get it, so that doesn't

259
00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:21,479
Speaker 1: matter like that, that's probably that could be potentially problematic,

260
00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:25,800
Speaker 1: he points out. So I say, in South Dakota, how

261
00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:31,680
Speaker 1: it's legal to retrieve upland game such as pheasants without

262
00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:38,240
Speaker 1: land owner permission? Okay, but yetta be unarmed. We clarified

263
00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:40,680
Speaker 1: that meaning you hit a pheasant, you hit a pheasant,

264
00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:43,280
Speaker 1: he sails off. On the neighbor's place in South Dakota,

265
00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:46,520
Speaker 1: you lean your shotgun whatever, set your shotgun down, you

266
00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:49,000
Speaker 1: run over and fetch it, he pointed out, And he

267
00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:51,440
Speaker 1: says that it was correction by omission.

268
00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:55,320
Speaker 4: He points out, you can't do that with big game.

269
00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:56,680
Speaker 4: Isn't that weird?

270
00:15:57,160 --> 00:16:01,120
Speaker 3: Strange? But I think it might be. South Dakota has

271
00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:04,160
Speaker 3: that rule where you can hunt in the ditch alongside roads.

272
00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:07,400
Speaker 3: It's like a right away. So I think a lot

273
00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:10,280
Speaker 3: of those birds that get shot end up ten yards

274
00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:15,080
Speaker 3: onto you know, where you're not permitted to go.

275
00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:17,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, they're doing it because of the rule.

276
00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:21,840
Speaker 1: You can ditch hunt Yeah, that's what I think. Yeah,

277
00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:24,840
Speaker 1: but you can't. Yeah, so just you can't. You can't.

278
00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:26,840
Speaker 4: You can chase a pheasant, but you can't chase the deer.

279
00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:29,520
Speaker 4: But if a buck sprung up out of that ditch.

280
00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:32,000
Speaker 1: And you are allowed to have your dog run over

281
00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:32,640
Speaker 1: and fetch it.

282
00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:35,080
Speaker 4: But check this out.

283
00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:39,080
Speaker 1: Let's say your dog runs over to fetch it flush

284
00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:41,920
Speaker 1: is a pheasant. This is what this guy's saying. If

285
00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:44,160
Speaker 1: he's wrong, sending a correction, and he'll have to give

286
00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:51,040
Speaker 1: you a prize for correcting him. If your dog runs

287
00:16:51,120 --> 00:16:54,960
Speaker 1: over onto a private Let's say you're hunting your ditch

288
00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:58,720
Speaker 1: hunting and your dog runs onto some dude's place and

289
00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:01,600
Speaker 1: flushes a bird off that dude's place, and that bird

290
00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:05,480
Speaker 1: then flies over you on the right of way. You

291
00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:11,080
Speaker 1: can't shoot the bird because your dog can go retrieve,

292
00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:12,920
Speaker 1: but he can't go hunt.

293
00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:23,200
Speaker 4: And that's basically having a dog with a shotgun. Here's

294
00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:27,360
Speaker 4: a nurse skunk story that was a bad segue.

295
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,360
Speaker 1: This guy says this, this last week, I had been

296
00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:34,520
Speaker 1: skinning a skunk that caught the coyote trap. I wasn't

297
00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:37,119
Speaker 1: really paying attention when I accidentally poked a hole in it.

298
00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:37,840
Speaker 4: Sent gland.

299
00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:41,080
Speaker 1: After realizing the terrible crime. Oh, we're done with corrections,

300
00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:44,960
Speaker 1: not right, Yeah, this is this is this is a story.

301
00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:46,080
Speaker 4: Okay.

302
00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:49,240
Speaker 1: After realizing the terrible crime I had just committed, I

303
00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:52,359
Speaker 1: put the skunk outside to let things air out, so

304
00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:56,960
Speaker 1: he was skinning an inside. An hour later, the cop

305
00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:58,920
Speaker 1: showed up. Well, the local police showed up in my

306
00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:03,919
Speaker 1: house to inform me that there was a terrible smell

307
00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,400
Speaker 1: coming from my house, to the point that the local

308
00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:12,640
Speaker 1: middle school had to go into lockdown because they thought

309
00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:14,760
Speaker 1: kids were smoking massive amounts of weed.

310
00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:16,680
Speaker 4: He's the word marijuana.

311
00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:21,760
Speaker 1: They even had the fire department come to the school

312
00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:26,880
Speaker 1: to test the air for toxins. Now, my whole town

313
00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:29,520
Speaker 1: has been talking about me and infern to me as

314
00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:37,440
Speaker 1: skunk boy. I don't think the smell was that bad,

315
00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:39,520
Speaker 1: but I'm not sure what to do because I make

316
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,320
Speaker 1: a homemade skunk based lure that I used to catch

317
00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:45,600
Speaker 1: all my predators. Here it goes into a question. This

318
00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:48,760
Speaker 1: becomes like a like a advice advice. This is becoming

319
00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:49,840
Speaker 1: an advice column.

320
00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:53,360
Speaker 4: Do I stop making it and risk being less successful?

321
00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:56,679
Speaker 4: He's leading the witness.

322
00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:03,840
Speaker 1: He asked, do I stop making it in risk being

323
00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:08,399
Speaker 1: less successful on the trap line, or do I keep

324
00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:11,920
Speaker 1: making it in secret and hope there isn't another incident.

325
00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:16,840
Speaker 1: I think that there is a middle ground Hunter Gregory.

326
00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:18,760
Speaker 1: See here's the evidence. The name of your kid Hunter

327
00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:24,840
Speaker 1: doesn't backfire. Yeah, his name's Hunter, didn't backfire. No names

328
00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:28,359
Speaker 1: their kid fishermen angler.

329
00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:29,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, they probably don't.

330
00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:30,520
Speaker 5: I don't know.

331
00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:31,439
Speaker 4: I've never heard it.

332
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:39,440
Speaker 1: No names are kids, sportsperson outdoors? A person his name's Hunter.

333
00:19:39,480 --> 00:19:43,000
Speaker 1: It didn't backfire. Obviously he's obviously he's like neck deep

334
00:19:43,040 --> 00:19:47,600
Speaker 1: in the disciplines he's from. I'm not gonna give his

335
00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:52,760
Speaker 1: last name. I think you got to take this whole

336
00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:59,680
Speaker 1: operation elsewhere if it depends you have the right. Well,

337
00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:03,919
Speaker 1: what's that machine we want to get the founder of

338
00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:05,600
Speaker 1: this machine on the.

339
00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:07,720
Speaker 4: Nasal raider nasal radar.

340
00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:10,800
Speaker 1: We're calling the raider, but the nasal there's a machine

341
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:14,760
Speaker 1: that they use that quantifies bad smells. You know about this,

342
00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:18,439
Speaker 1: called the nasal radar. I would say nasal raider, but

343
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:19,960
Speaker 1: I was misreading it. That's a correction.

344
00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:21,760
Speaker 4: The nasal radar.

345
00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:26,680
Speaker 1: It's like when you get a oh, nasal ranger, sure, okay,

346
00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:30,399
Speaker 1: nasal ranger. When you get a smell complaint, like some

347
00:20:30,480 --> 00:20:33,760
Speaker 1: dude skin and skunks. It's so subjective.

348
00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:37,080
Speaker 4: Yeah right, it's like why not bother you?

349
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:40,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like the lady over there thinks it smells too bad.

350
00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,520
Speaker 1: The guy over here, he doesn't think it smells that bad,

351
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,560
Speaker 1: So it does it smell that bad. The nasal ranger

352
00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:49,480
Speaker 1: is a machine that you put on your nose. It

353
00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:52,919
Speaker 1: looks like an elk bugle with contraptions coming off it.

354
00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:56,760
Speaker 1: Can you pull this up, Phil, just so people can

355
00:20:56,800 --> 00:20:59,400
Speaker 1: see it? To me again, you don't have a little

356
00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:00,240
Speaker 1: computer over there, and.

357
00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:01,040
Speaker 5: What was to do it?

358
00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:02,879
Speaker 6: I do, but I don't have a picture.

359
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:04,000
Speaker 2: I guess I could just google it.

360
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:07,119
Speaker 3: It tells you how bad you think it should smell.

361
00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:10,880
Speaker 4: The nasal Ranger. I watched this whole video, but it.

362
00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:11,600
Speaker 2: Just looks insane.

363
00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:12,640
Speaker 4: Okay, Okay, Like.

364
00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:14,879
Speaker 1: Let's say someone's like, dude, the hog farm next to

365
00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:16,119
Speaker 1: my place is killing me.

366
00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:18,120
Speaker 4: It smells so bad.

367
00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:19,640
Speaker 1: And it winds up being like, well, according to who

368
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:23,440
Speaker 1: the nasal ranger you.

369
00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:25,520
Speaker 4: It looks like an Eler bugle that hooks to your nose.

370
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:29,560
Speaker 1: There's a little nose coup, but it's got filters and

371
00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:32,840
Speaker 1: shit coming off. Okay, you go out there and there's

372
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:35,200
Speaker 1: a meter that shows like what it.

373
00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:42,399
Speaker 4: Okay, right there, it looks like if a cop was, yeah,

374
00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:45,200
Speaker 4: clocking you radar.

375
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,320
Speaker 1: You would think that if you saw this, you would

376
00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:49,880
Speaker 1: think a cop is smelling how fast your car's going.

377
00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:52,800
Speaker 4: Okay, there's a.

378
00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:55,439
Speaker 5: Whole article in the New York Times, like.

379
00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 1: I'm getting to that, but I want to tell you

380
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,600
Speaker 1: I want one so bad because I want to be

381
00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:05,719
Speaker 1: able to use it in arguments of my wife.

382
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:07,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, be like see it's not so bad.

383
00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:10,960
Speaker 1: She sends me one of her like twice a year.

384
00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:12,160
Speaker 1: I can't live like this.

385
00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:16,200
Speaker 5: Okay, oh yeah we can. We can invest in one,

386
00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:18,840
Speaker 5: just like we did the Warner Bratsler's Sheer Force.

387
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:20,760
Speaker 4: They're less expensive.

388
00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:24,479
Speaker 1: That's good, Like we bought that and I don't know,

389
00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:27,840
Speaker 1: maybe we spent too much money on that thing for

390
00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:29,000
Speaker 1: how much we needed it.

391
00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:31,920
Speaker 5: We're gonna keep trying to get our money's worth.

392
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,520
Speaker 1: Okay, here's here's my here's the other day, here's my wife.

393
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:37,919
Speaker 1: My wife has this to say to me.

394
00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:41,600
Speaker 3: She's gonna have a lot more to say to you

395
00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:44,119
Speaker 3: after you put this in a podcast.

396
00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:46,679
Speaker 5: Wife says, two thousand dollars.

397
00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 1: By the way, there's two thousand bucks little background of

398
00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:53,440
Speaker 1: my wife. My wife all has always worked. She worked

399
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 1: all through having babies. She's taking time off of work

400
00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,200
Speaker 1: and now she's like, now that she doesn't have baby,

401
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:01,639
Speaker 1: she's not working. She just know what people do with themselves.

402
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 1: So it's great. She started to trying.

403
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:08,920
Speaker 4: She's not play tennis totally great, started baking.

404
00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:15,159
Speaker 1: I am at tennis and can't figure out why my

405
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:19,520
Speaker 1: ankles are so itchy. I have small itchy bumps on

406
00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:24,160
Speaker 1: both ankles. If you brought fleas into our house because

407
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,679
Speaker 1: of the things you trapped, you need to figure that

408
00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,520
Speaker 1: out now, like before work. I am not going to

409
00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:35,360
Speaker 1: live like this, soie right.

410
00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:36,520
Speaker 4: I get these all the time.

411
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:39,320
Speaker 1: A lot of times they have to do with defensive odors.

412
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:43,520
Speaker 1: And if I had a nasal ranger, I would be

413
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:47,280
Speaker 1: able to be like, well, let's check you could avoid

414
00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:50,160
Speaker 1: cons I would be like, let's see is it offensive

415
00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:50,600
Speaker 1: or not.

416
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 4: Let's take the subjectivity out of it.

417
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:54,560
Speaker 5: We need to make content out of it.

418
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:55,439
Speaker 4: Let's measure.

419
00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:58,120
Speaker 5: I'm going to talk to our CFO about getting.

420
00:23:57,840 --> 00:23:59,560
Speaker 3: The subjectivity is the hard part.

421
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:00,640
Speaker 4: Man, That's what the ranger.

422
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:05,359
Speaker 2: So you can you can put any kind of ranger

423
00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 2: on that you want.

424
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:07,919
Speaker 1: I'll be like, well, you know what, it's actually not

425
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:10,560
Speaker 1: offensive because I hit it with the nasal ranger and

426
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,440
Speaker 1: it's in it's inemptible living.

427
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:17,200
Speaker 4: So now then ranger, you hook it to your nose.

428
00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:20,159
Speaker 1: And so let's say someone's like it comes to you

429
00:24:20,280 --> 00:24:22,760
Speaker 1: with their complaining about how something smells, and they go

430
00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:27,400
Speaker 1: just smell. Yeah, Well people don't breathe that way, right,

431
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:29,560
Speaker 1: That's that's not fair.

432
00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:32,720
Speaker 4: You know, no one comes around going.

433
00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:37,879
Speaker 3: Not Just last week, I was, uh, I had already

434
00:24:37,880 --> 00:24:43,479
Speaker 3: boiled this coyote skull, but it needs a little touch up.

435
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 3: There was some things that were still hanging on there,

436
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:49,160
Speaker 3: and my wife laughed. I was like, I'm just gonna

437
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:52,920
Speaker 3: do it on the stove. Sure I didn't smell a thing,

438
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,439
Speaker 3: but when she got back she smelled it, yeah, and

439
00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 3: I was just like, it smells a little like boiling meat.

440
00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 4: That's all exactly.

441
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:08,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, we'd clean out the whole university building that way.

442
00:25:08,320 --> 00:25:10,960
Speaker 1: That's that is its own kind of that is a

443
00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:15,119
Speaker 1: crazy odor. The nasal ranger you put it up to

444
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:19,119
Speaker 1: your nose and there's a little meter that shows that

445
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:22,760
Speaker 1: you're inhaling normally, So you can't go in and not

446
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:25,760
Speaker 1: breathe and say like, I don't smell nothing because you're

447
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:28,960
Speaker 1: not breathing and you can't go in and over smell.

448
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:36,880
Speaker 1: It makes it that you're hitting like a baseline normal breathing,

449
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,400
Speaker 1: and it's got these contraptions on it that are sucking

450
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 1: in the air and it's throwing out a calibrated offensive measurement.

451
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:50,439
Speaker 4: So you can apply a number to when something reeks.

452
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:53,040
Speaker 4: I love it. So let's say someone in.

453
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 1: The summer, some guy hits deer and stop by your

454
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:57,800
Speaker 1: house or whatever, and it's chromnell maggots and someone's like,

455
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:00,520
Speaker 1: my god, that smells. Imagine if you can go, yeah,

456
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 1: it's a five, yep, and apply a number to a

457
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: thing that is just entirely subjective.

458
00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:10,919
Speaker 6: I have a feeling that with fifty years of a

459
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 6: life lived, you know, breaking down animals, smelling everything there

460
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:17,000
Speaker 6: is to smell, I have a feeling that the nasal

461
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 6: Ranger will skew towards the gen pop and probably I

462
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,119
Speaker 6: think everything you are completely deadened to will read as

463
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 6: offensive to most people.

464
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:31,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why I need a nasal ranger.

465
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:35,159
Speaker 3: Tweak the settings a little bit so it comes out

466
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:36,320
Speaker 3: in your favor, Like.

467
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,919
Speaker 1: Hack into the software or whatever to make it like

468
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,399
Speaker 1: not because yeah, because what if it backfires in Your

469
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,680
Speaker 1: wife is like, no, dude, this is a high as

470
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 1: it's an eleven.

471
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:49,199
Speaker 4: Yep, it's an eleven anyway.

472
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 1: So this guy making this lure, and I understand, but

473
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 1: I don't know why in the world you're making that

474
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:57,479
Speaker 1: next to the school. It's like, I feel like you

475
00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 1: have a right to do it, but take the operation elsewhere.

476
00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:05,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he did puncture the gland, which I'm

477
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,679
Speaker 3: sure made it. Oh well, he a hundred times worse.

478
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:10,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, so he probably knows if he's making this lure.

479
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:11,439
Speaker 4: He knows that.

480
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:14,199
Speaker 1: You go down to Murdochs and you go into the

481
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 1: veterinarian care aisle and you get one of them large

482
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:22,439
Speaker 1: gauge hypodermic needles. I mean the kind of needle you

483
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:23,800
Speaker 1: can look through the son of a bitch, you know

484
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 1: what I mean. You get one of those heavy gauge

485
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:31,399
Speaker 1: veterinarian needles that they use inject cattle with, put that

486
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:32,600
Speaker 1: into there and.

487
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 4: Suck that smell out elsewhere yep, not at home.

488
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:39,879
Speaker 1: Then you mix it in with your vasoline or your

489
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:41,920
Speaker 1: petroleum jelly or whatever you're putting in New so you

490
00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 1: got a skunk based paste elsewhere out in the woods.

491
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:49,959
Speaker 1: Here's another tip he might want to know about. And

492
00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 1: I was turned on to this one that works very well.

493
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:57,480
Speaker 1: Get yourself a big sack of kitty litter. Get yourself

494
00:27:57,520 --> 00:27:59,400
Speaker 1: one of those small action packers or everyone.

495
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:00,159
Speaker 4: He was, I don't care.

496
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:03,280
Speaker 1: This tough five gallon bucket whatever, Fill it with kitty litter.

497
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 1: Once you make your lure, deep six it in that cat.

498
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,920
Speaker 4: Litter, deep six the lure in there.

499
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:17,959
Speaker 1: Store it incaste. I got store it in a in

500
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:26,920
Speaker 1: a container deep down in kitty litter for your offensive odors.

501
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 1: That won't escape that no, And when I get a

502
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:31,320
Speaker 1: nasal range, I'll prove it.

503
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:33,239
Speaker 4: I'll prove it.

504
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:36,320
Speaker 1: We'll take a draw off some skunk and then we'll

505
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:38,280
Speaker 1: put it down in a bottle and kiddy lure and

506
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 1: take a draw off it.

507
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 4: And you won't.

508
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:41,520
Speaker 1: That naise range is not going to pick it up.

509
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,480
Speaker 1: Another guy wrote in about skunks. He's in the nuisance

510
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:49,920
Speaker 1: wildlife removal business. They do with a lot of skunks

511
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:52,080
Speaker 1: in the spring and summer. You can picture this skunk

512
00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 1: gets in your house, living under your porch. Someone gets upset.

513
00:28:56,720 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 1: They they catch them in cage traps and they kill

514
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 1: them with in a CO two chamber for euthanasia. Do

515
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 1: you guys remember we were talking earlier. Do you remember

516
00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: during the pandemic when they had to like in northern

517
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:21,720
Speaker 1: Europe they had to kill all those hundreds of thousands

518
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 1: of mink.

519
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 4: Which they pelted, you know, they pelted those all out,

520
00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:28,200
Speaker 4: they did.

521
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought that it would like make mink prices

522
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,680
Speaker 1: skyrocket because they killed all these branch or whatever. But

523
00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 1: someone's like that all went to market anyhow. Why I didn't

524
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 1: realize they got these little gas powered rigs they drive

525
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,480
Speaker 1: around in on those mink farms, and there's a box

526
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 1: on the rig and it's harvesting its own CO two.

527
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,520
Speaker 1: So like you're driving this little golf cart around and

528
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 1: it's harvesting its own emissions. To youth, the whole thing

529
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:59,040
Speaker 1: sounds just like not a good line of work, like

530
00:29:59,120 --> 00:29:59,920
Speaker 1: a tough business to.

531
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 4: That's how they do that. They're killing him like that.

532
00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:06,040
Speaker 1: So this dude is saying, when they get like a

533
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 1: problem skunk, they euthanize it with CO two. Well anyways,

534
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 1: and then they throw him in a freezer, which I

535
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 1: don't get. But they had a guy in there, and

536
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 1: he says, I'll put it delicately and say he lacked

537
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:20,959
Speaker 1: attention to detail. He pulls a skunk out of the

538
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 1: CO two chamber too early and places it into a freezer.

539
00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:31,920
Speaker 1: A half hour later, a different guy comes along and

540
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 1: opens the freezer and there's a skunk. Bam, fine no oh,

541
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 1: shuts the freezer real quick. I got you, makes a

542
00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 1: plan on how he's gonna deal with this, but then

543
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,920
Speaker 1: the skunks waiting for him the next time.

544
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:53,080
Speaker 4: He opens the freezeropp nailed them. He says, you can't

545
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:54,480
Speaker 4: get that smell out of that freezer.

546
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that doesn't surprise me.

547
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 4: Lastly, oh so you do want to say this. You're

548
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 4: back to wanting to say this. Okay please? Uh one

549
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:08,880
Speaker 4: more launch.

550
00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 1: We got a thing coming out called twelve and twenty six,

551
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 1: So that means in twenty twenty six we're gonna.

552
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 4: At least like twelve outdoor films.

553
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:19,480
Speaker 1: Each episode showcases a hunt from a different Meat Eater

554
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:23,920
Speaker 1: crew member. The first episode features Yanni's archery black Bear

555
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:28,160
Speaker 1: Hunting Manitoba, which is out now, so stay tuned for

556
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 1: more and check out these hunt episodes of twelve and

557
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 1: twenty six series all Right.

558
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 4: George hit me with, let's don't know, I want to.

559
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:44,760
Speaker 1: Get into the animal communication stuff here, and I want

560
00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:46,520
Speaker 1: to talk about brown sculptures, but I want to dive

561
00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 1: into the animal communication stuff here. If you could think

562
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:55,320
Speaker 1: about from your career and your study of animals, what

563
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 1: and let's let's keep to what lives around here? What

564
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 1: animal do you think lives around here? Has the or

565
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:04,959
Speaker 1: not doesn't need to be around here? What American animal

566
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 1: that people would be familiar with in your who in

567
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 1: your mind, has the greatest vocabulary.

568
00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:18,400
Speaker 2: Land critters, you know, probably the one that's been studied

569
00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 2: that way most. And that's probably because it's only because

570
00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 2: that's the one that's been studied that I detail is

571
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:32,000
Speaker 2: prairie dogs. They have an incredible vocabulary that goes down

572
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 2: to the level of there's a guy walking through the

573
00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 2: colony with a green shirt on and he's tall. No, yep,

574
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: he's walking fast, he's walking slow. It's another guy. He's

575
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 2: got a red shirt on or a yellow shirt. There's

576
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:56,000
Speaker 2: a badger, there's a hawk hawks flying fast, on and

577
00:32:56,040 --> 00:33:00,000
Speaker 2: on and on. Yeah, this guy called what yeah?

578
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 4: Yeah.

579
00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 2: They went down to the level of saying, you know

580
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 2: it at a certain level they needed to analyze it

581
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:09,680
Speaker 2: with computers because you just can't hear prairie dog at

582
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 2: that level. Okay, so they slow it down. You can

583
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 2: see all the bumps and blips in the spectrogram on

584
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 2: the computer, and these differences are parsing out with their

585
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:24,560
Speaker 2: experimental design here. And they even went to the level

586
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:29,080
Speaker 2: of let's put something in there they've never seen. So

587
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 2: what they did is they basically put a cardboard cutout

588
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 2: or maybe you apply with painted black, put it on

589
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:39,040
Speaker 2: wire and strung it through, moved it through, pulled it

590
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 2: through the colony. They came up with a new word,

591
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:46,400
Speaker 2: something they'd never heard him say before. They put it away.

592
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:49,760
Speaker 2: Instead of an oval like the first one, they put

593
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 2: out a square, they say something different. They pull it

594
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,200
Speaker 2: back out a little while later, they use the same

595
00:33:56,240 --> 00:34:01,080
Speaker 2: word for the oval. Same words. Yeah, yeah, And that's probably.

596
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,880
Speaker 1: All like permutations of that what we would just when

597
00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:05,480
Speaker 1: we hear it's just an alarm call.

598
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:08,960
Speaker 2: It's just like like, all right, I'm not getting much

599
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 2: out of that. But when you start listening with like

600
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 2: a lot of this stuff, you're like, oh, there is

601
00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 2: a little difference there. And if you could listen with

602
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:21,960
Speaker 2: the ears of a ground squirrel or a pocket gopher

603
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:24,799
Speaker 2: or any of these things. You might hear it too,

604
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:28,759
Speaker 2: but some of those they can, like the researchers. It

605
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,879
Speaker 2: was so funny. They were so accurate that they had

606
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 2: different vocalization for dog versus kyote. No really, So they're

607
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:41,360
Speaker 2: sitting there and the researchers can hear this difference and

608
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:46,480
Speaker 2: they're hanging out and this this prairie dog says, uh,

609
00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:49,560
Speaker 2: there's a kyote coming, and clearly the researchers can see

610
00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:51,799
Speaker 2: it's a dog, and they're like, ha, they messed up

611
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 2: this time. It's like one example, and it gets closer

612
00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,520
Speaker 2: and it's a kyote. They're like, what the heck.

613
00:34:59,000 --> 00:34:59,879
Speaker 4: Hand and say that to me again.

614
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 2: So they identified this thing right, it was a coyote.

615
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 2: They gave the kyote alarm. But the researchers not knowing

616
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 2: their language real well, well, they knew the language enough

617
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,040
Speaker 2: to say, hey, they're alarming for kyote. Through their eyes

618
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:17,840
Speaker 2: they're seeing what they think is a dog.

619
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 4: Oh, so the research is like, oh, it's a domestic dogs.

620
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:22,759
Speaker 2: It's a domestic dog. It looks like a kylet. They

621
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 2: just messed up. And it gets close, they're like, sound

622
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:32,200
Speaker 2: a gun it's a coyote, So that stuff is actually everywhere, isn't.

623
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:34,719
Speaker 2: But prairie dogs have been the best studied that way.

624
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:38,759
Speaker 2: Their vocabulary. They even say that they they have these

625
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:43,279
Speaker 2: sound bites that are like phonemes. They're basically like ba

626
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:47,520
Speaker 2: duh at, you know, sound fragments that we recombine into

627
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:52,560
Speaker 2: making words in sentences, paragraphs. They have sounds that function

628
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:56,360
Speaker 2: the same way, so they can recombine these sounds to

629
00:35:56,400 --> 00:36:04,879
Speaker 2: say dog, kyote, hawk, badger guy, short guy, tall guy

630
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:06,760
Speaker 2: coming through the colony.

631
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 1: I was reading this thing long ago. It's like one

632
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:14,480
Speaker 1: of the dirtiest tricks I've ever heard in science. I

633
00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:16,279
Speaker 1: don't know where they were doing it. I don't know where.

634
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:19,400
Speaker 4: Where's the vervet monkey live? A vervet monkey?

635
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:21,839
Speaker 2: Verbets are African.

636
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 1: They were looking at the vocabulary of verbant monkeys and

637
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:30,880
Speaker 1: they were getting this idea that they had and it

638
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 1: might be more nuanced than this, but they're like, there's

639
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 1: a thing that says threat from above, okay, and maybe

640
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:40,600
Speaker 1: like certain avian predators.

641
00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 4: And they had a noise that they realized it.

642
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:48,640
Speaker 1: Meant thread on the ground, and they thought specifically it

643
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:49,360
Speaker 1: was about leopards.

644
00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:55,080
Speaker 4: That's what it was leopards. So they.

645
00:36:56,400 --> 00:37:02,880
Speaker 1: Would record these vervet monkeys making these vocalizations and you

646
00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:05,839
Speaker 1: could play it and get the response. Meaning, if there's

647
00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:08,160
Speaker 1: a threat on the ground, everyone goes into a tree.

648
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:12,480
Speaker 1: If there's a threat from the air, the troop all

649
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:19,400
Speaker 1: seeks overhead protection. Then they recorded a monkey, they recorded

650
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 1: his threat call, and they would play it and everyone

651
00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:29,719
Speaker 1: would respond. But they eventually burned the guy out where

652
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 1: he became the boy who cries wolf. Poor guy, and

653
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:37,000
Speaker 1: they burned him out where they're like, he always does

654
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:40,759
Speaker 1: that and he's wrong, to the point where if he

655
00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:44,920
Speaker 1: did vocalize, they would ignore it because they're like, that

656
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 1: dude makes that noise all the time because they have

657
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:49,560
Speaker 1: been playing it to everybody, and they burned the dude

658
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:53,680
Speaker 1: out on it. Yeah, but this is like, well, you're

659
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:55,839
Speaker 1: talking about way more I mean like way more than

660
00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:57,600
Speaker 1: hey on the ground, Hey in the air.

661
00:37:58,040 --> 00:37:59,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's like a.

662
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 3: Deer camp with the kids, Like when you and I

663
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:06,160
Speaker 3: walked through the Prairie dog Town. Those things are like eh.

664
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:07,839
Speaker 3: But when they see Jimmy, they're like.

665
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:11,920
Speaker 4: Holy kid, they probably.

666
00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 2: Do and he's got a gun. He's got a gun

667
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 2: against that one kid. Yeah, totally yeah, it's so, I

668
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 2: think you're referring to that chaining safer. I did a

669
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:23,960
Speaker 2: lot of that work in Abaselli National Park where they're

670
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:25,800
Speaker 2: looking at those vervets. And yeah, they had a different

671
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 2: call for something in the air, those Marshall eagles, I

672
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:31,920
Speaker 2: think they were. That's different one for leopards, and they

673
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 2: had a different one for snakes.

674
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:35,560
Speaker 4: Okay, I remember that now.

675
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, and yeah, and there's that's a tuughy with these

676
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:44,360
Speaker 2: animal vocalizations, like how do you know you don't speak

677
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:48,320
Speaker 2: that language, So they have these really clunky, sometimes really

678
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:53,839
Speaker 2: you know, mean ways of figuring out. All right, at

679
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:57,759
Speaker 2: least it's this level, this is what they're meaning. But

680
00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 2: in between, like for me, into a ton of ravens.

681
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:03,319
Speaker 2: I just fascinated by ravens and the stuff they say

682
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:06,840
Speaker 2: just blows me away. They've got accents, they've got dialects,

683
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 2: they've got stuff you can't even imagine.

684
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 1: At what point did you first start getting interested in

685
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:15,520
Speaker 1: in the just like the vocalizations of animals.

686
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 2: Well, I grew up like you guys did. I hunted

687
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 2: and fished and trapped for you know, a lot of

688
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:22,080
Speaker 2: my youth because that was you know, the culture I

689
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:25,240
Speaker 2: grew up in so I grew up learning call turkeys

690
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:30,839
Speaker 2: and ducks and gear, and but like it wasn't enough

691
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:34,200
Speaker 2: for me, just me being me, I was like, I

692
00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:35,839
Speaker 2: want to know more. You know, what are they doing

693
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:38,200
Speaker 2: outside of hunting season? What do they say when this happens?

694
00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:41,799
Speaker 2: What are they doing when nobody else is watching? And

695
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 2: you needn't watch birds like nobody. I didn't know anybody

696
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:49,680
Speaker 2: that watched birds until I went to college and they're like, oh, yeah,

697
00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:50,680
Speaker 2: we're going to birding.

698
00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:55,480
Speaker 1: Really, you know, mile Man he had an interesting bird taxonomy,

699
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 1: like as a as a hunter, you now, it was like,

700
00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 1: there's this huge chunk of birds that were tweety birds. Yeah, yeah,

701
00:40:03,120 --> 00:40:06,520
Speaker 1: they meant like the ones like like outside of my

702
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 1: there's intensely interested in game birds. There's a handful of

703
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 1: other birds that catch my interest, but then there are

704
00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 1: the tweety birds.

705
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. My friend has a system. He has it's

706
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 2: arts and narts for hawks. Arts are a redtail, narts

707
00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 2: are not a redtail. Was like Jason not, you know,

708
00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:29,399
Speaker 2: it takes redtails to get a couple of years under

709
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 2: their belt before they get a red tail. He's like, God, damn,

710
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:35,000
Speaker 2: it throws a whole damn system off.

711
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:38,239
Speaker 1: I was reading and I think it was in Barry

712
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:42,200
Speaker 1: Lopez's Arctic Dreams where I think it was in that

713
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:46,960
Speaker 1: book where he's talking about into Its map drawing m

714
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,480
Speaker 1: This is early like he was relating for early like

715
00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:53,040
Speaker 1: early contact with certain Into It hunter groups and they

716
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:56,319
Speaker 1: would draw maps and they wouldn't do the maps would

717
00:40:56,320 --> 00:41:02,960
Speaker 1: be to the scale of interest. So if they're mapping

718
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:06,320
Speaker 1: an island and there's a bay where they hunt ducks,

719
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:10,200
Speaker 1: when you draw the map, the island gets really small

720
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,600
Speaker 1: because they don't do it doesn't matter and the bay

721
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:16,799
Speaker 1: ocky is the map. Yeah, And it's kind of like,

722
00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:21,239
Speaker 1: here's the part on something, here's the part of interest,

723
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:25,640
Speaker 1: and then I'll just kind of rough in something to suggest.

724
00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 4: The rest of it.

725
00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:30,799
Speaker 1: Right, And I feel like with a lot of wildlife stuff,

726
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 1: it's like Elk right, the bugle, you know, because it's

727
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 1: useful in hunting, and you can probably hunt Elko whole life.

728
00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:45,319
Speaker 4: And never be like, what really is going on with

729
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:45,759
Speaker 4: that thing?

730
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 2: Right?

731
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 1: You know, like it works or don't work, but it's

732
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 1: kind of you You sort of have a like we'll

733
00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:57,759
Speaker 1: map it from a hunter's perspective, will map its vocalization

734
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:00,600
Speaker 1: pattern and it'll only go as far is what I

735
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:06,560
Speaker 1: need to know to satisfy my like base plan.

736
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,480
Speaker 3: You're not really interested in what you might be saying

737
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:11,279
Speaker 3: to them, right it works or don't?

738
00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:15,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah right. And that's to human nature, like we're

739
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:19,239
Speaker 2: we're simplifying machines. That's what our brains are designed for,

740
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:23,759
Speaker 2: is after sensory stuff like problem solving, figuring out what

741
00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:26,560
Speaker 2: those patterns are. You know, what does that mean? And

742
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:28,960
Speaker 2: I only pay attention to the stuff that affects me,

743
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:32,520
Speaker 2: you know, But when you start paying attention to what

744
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:35,839
Speaker 2: affects them, then the world opens up.

745
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 4: What was the first What was the first animal? Was it? Turkey's?

746
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:40,279
Speaker 1: Like, what was the first animal? You kind of dove

747
00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:42,680
Speaker 1: into and started realizing you were finding out things that

748
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:44,040
Speaker 1: maybe other people didn't know.

749
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:47,239
Speaker 2: Well, I was obsessed with turkeys, like I was like,

750
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:49,600
Speaker 2: my career was going to be making turkey calls, going

751
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:53,000
Speaker 2: around calling contests and all that stop upstate New York.

752
00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:55,880
Speaker 2: And they just recognized that area. So I was taking

753
00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 2: every spare minute. You could only hunt till noon, but

754
00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:01,920
Speaker 2: I was going out before school every day during the season.

755
00:43:03,239 --> 00:43:07,640
Speaker 2: This is a funny one. The disciplinarian principle. The vice

756
00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 2: principal when my folks were in that school had retired

757
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:13,520
Speaker 2: by this point, and I called well enough that he's like,

758
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 2: can you come with me, you know, skip school? Come

759
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:22,280
Speaker 2: with me on Monday and Tuesday. My mom's like, hell no,

760
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:26,080
Speaker 2: Frank Dunhald wants you to skip does vice principal wants

761
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 2: you to skip school so you can go turkey call

762
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:28,319
Speaker 2: for him?

763
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:29,640
Speaker 5: Jam up.

764
00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:31,640
Speaker 2: I was like, that's a gent right.

765
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:32,280
Speaker 4: Hello.

766
00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:36,480
Speaker 3: Were you mouth calling back like no, no call? Or

767
00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:37,360
Speaker 3: were you using calls?

768
00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:39,719
Speaker 2: I was doing it. I was building wingbone calls, I

769
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:42,960
Speaker 2: was building slate calls, box calls, using my voice. Was

770
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 2: doing all of it, you know. And but it was

771
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:49,560
Speaker 2: interesting because sort of like we're talking about in that

772
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:52,239
Speaker 2: hunting scene, you know, there was a there's a core

773
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,600
Speaker 2: palette of sounds that you use and they do the job.

774
00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:58,719
Speaker 2: But I hit a certain point. It was actually when

775
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:01,160
Speaker 2: I went to my first calling contests, I'm like, wait

776
00:44:01,239 --> 00:44:04,439
Speaker 2: a minute, this is what the guy there's a guy

777
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:07,160
Speaker 2: behind that curtain over there, and he's like telling me,

778
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 2: if I sound like a turkey, there's no turkeys in

779
00:44:09,640 --> 00:44:13,640
Speaker 2: this contest. And there's certainly no turkeys behind the curtain saying, yeah,

780
00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:18,160
Speaker 2: that sounds like a turkey, you know. I was like, hmm,

781
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:22,520
Speaker 2: what you know? And there was even I found an

782
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:24,480
Speaker 2: article when I was working on the book, this guy

783
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:27,319
Speaker 2: who is a judge. He said, you know, if you

784
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:34,160
Speaker 2: hear a lot of really bad calling, you know, it's

785
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:37,200
Speaker 2: it's a wild turkey. If a lot of really good calling,

786
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:40,719
Speaker 2: it's a guy. You know, turkeys make a lot of mistakes.

787
00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:45,319
Speaker 2: And I'm like, wait a minute, dude, mistakes. I think

788
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:49,240
Speaker 2: it cost them. It cost them. You make a sound,

789
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:52,600
Speaker 2: the predator's got to beat on you, right, you make

790
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 2: a sound. It cost energy to make the sound. Like

791
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,160
Speaker 2: they're not doing it for no reason. Just because we

792
00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:01,040
Speaker 2: don't know the reason doesn't mean it doesn't have one.

793
00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:04,960
Speaker 1: But there's the I get the point. There's no no

794
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:05,720
Speaker 1: like the point.

795
00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:05,960
Speaker 4: Would be this.

796
00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 1: There's there's a there's a YouTube video I love and

797
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:12,759
Speaker 1: it's a hen, like a wild ass hen in the

798
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:15,359
Speaker 1: woods and she has the most.

799
00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:23,520
Speaker 4: Raucous bad box call yelp, which.

800
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:27,440
Speaker 1: She stands there and does twenty seven times in a row,

801
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:30,319
Speaker 1: twenty seven times in a row.

802
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:35,920
Speaker 4: If you heard that, there's no way he'd be like,

803
00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:37,120
Speaker 4: that's a hen.

804
00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:39,680
Speaker 1: You'd be like, that is some twelve ass year old

805
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:44,360
Speaker 1: kid with his dad's box call and he's just gonna

806
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:45,719
Speaker 1: stand on that ridge and do that.

807
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 4: Yeah, I would one say that that's what that was.

808
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:53,440
Speaker 1: I'm like some kid up there. It's a hand stander

809
00:45:53,560 --> 00:45:55,239
Speaker 1: twenty seven times in a row.

810
00:45:55,640 --> 00:45:56,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

811
00:45:56,160 --> 00:46:00,400
Speaker 4: So, but so, like if you could interview her, You're like,

812
00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 4: OMETT are you doing this on accident? Is this all

813
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 4: a mistake?

814
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:09,840
Speaker 1: She would probably tell you no, No, what I'm doing.

815
00:46:09,640 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 2: Is I'm You should have seen the last time I

816
00:46:13,040 --> 00:46:15,720
Speaker 2: did this. Yeah, you know what happened.

817
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:18,360
Speaker 4: But like I don't know, like what is she doing?

818
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:20,600
Speaker 4: You know what is she doing? Yeah?

819
00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:24,920
Speaker 2: How much variability is in there that's acceptable for purpose X?

820
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:28,319
Speaker 2: Like how are you doing a lost call? It does

821
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:33,560
Speaker 2: go on twenty plus notes, but like within there, how

822
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:37,160
Speaker 2: much stuff's coded in there beyond I'm lost or where

823
00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:39,600
Speaker 2: the heck are you? That's where they're find with some

824
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 2: of these new studies on songbirds and stuff, because they

825
00:46:43,120 --> 00:46:48,320
Speaker 2: hear differently than us. They're hearing into these sounds stuff

826
00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:51,600
Speaker 2: that hey, either happens way too fast or as in

827
00:46:51,680 --> 00:46:56,279
Speaker 2: frequency ranges that we don't register real well. So it's

828
00:46:56,320 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 2: like it almost seems in some cases, like the side

829
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:02,600
Speaker 2: of the animal and their metabolism, their pace of life

830
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:07,680
Speaker 2: is coded to their communication. So like there was a

831
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 2: study where they actually took sperm whale clicks. Let me explain. So,

832
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:17,560
Speaker 2: like sperm whales, huge animal communicating, these clicks travel real

833
00:47:17,600 --> 00:47:20,920
Speaker 2: well underwater, and somebody had the bright idea. You know,

834
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 2: they're trying to figure out what the heck these things mean,

835
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:26,239
Speaker 2: you know, whe are the using this in this and

836
00:47:26,320 --> 00:47:28,879
Speaker 2: they've since found out a whole bunch. But somebody had

837
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:31,120
Speaker 2: the bright idea to go in and delete all the

838
00:47:31,200 --> 00:47:35,560
Speaker 2: spaces in between the clicks, and lo and behold, it

839
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:39,800
Speaker 2: sounds like a songbird. Like you hear all the rising

840
00:47:39,880 --> 00:47:41,840
Speaker 2: and falling of this, you know, and we're used to

841
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:46,640
Speaker 2: listening to humans birds they're communicating so fast. But maybe

842
00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:50,319
Speaker 2: those smaller animals, their pace of life, their metabolic whatever

843
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:54,880
Speaker 2: it is that makes them them, they're able to, in essence,

844
00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 2: from our perspective, slow down that sound of the winter

845
00:47:57,640 --> 00:48:02,640
Speaker 2: ren or the magnolia warbler, and here into little tweaks

846
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:07,399
Speaker 2: of individual notes, let's say, and get more information out

847
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:07,640
Speaker 2: of that.

848
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:12,120
Speaker 1: I remember what I was reading somewhere or some guys

849
00:48:12,120 --> 00:48:14,239
Speaker 1: saying that, like when you go to like you're gonna

850
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:17,400
Speaker 1: you see a fly and you're just gonna smack them.

851
00:48:17,680 --> 00:48:19,520
Speaker 4: Do you know what I mean that?

852
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:23,560
Speaker 1: To the fly he might be like, in a minute,

853
00:48:23,600 --> 00:48:27,360
Speaker 1: I'm gonna move because there's this thing coming toward me.

854
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 4: You know.

855
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:34,840
Speaker 1: Like his trip, his like trip through life is just

856
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:38,480
Speaker 1: the perception is so different than what we think. So

857
00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:41,200
Speaker 1: we think we're going wow, you know, and he's like, no,

858
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:52,680
Speaker 1: it's going totally is just going ape shit crazy. Yeah,

859
00:48:52,719 --> 00:48:57,640
Speaker 1: like what yeah, something else might be like oh, he's saying,

860
00:48:57,719 --> 00:48:58,839
Speaker 1: oh kinds.

861
00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:02,600
Speaker 2: Of yeah, yeah. It just there's a great essay written

862
00:49:02,640 --> 00:49:06,080
Speaker 2: in the nineteen thirties I think is early forties about

863
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:08,280
Speaker 2: the title is what It's like to be a bat

864
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:12,399
Speaker 2: and the clue. You know, even if we could take

865
00:49:12,440 --> 00:49:15,000
Speaker 2: the best ai and all these models and figure out

866
00:49:15,040 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 2: their language and speak the same language, we still wouldn't

867
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 2: have a clue what they're talking about. You know this

868
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:21,400
Speaker 2: when you go to a different country or even if

869
00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:26,440
Speaker 2: they're speaking English, there's culture. There's that culture behind and

870
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:29,359
Speaker 2: underneath all that language that when you make a joke

871
00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 2: among friends, like everybody knows in that group what the

872
00:49:32,120 --> 00:49:35,880
Speaker 2: hell you're talking about. But even if we could know

873
00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:39,560
Speaker 2: that language for a bat, for a bird, it takes

874
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:43,360
Speaker 2: being able to hear like a bat. Yeah, breathe like

875
00:49:43,400 --> 00:49:45,480
Speaker 2: a bat. You know, all these things that contribute to

876
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:48,680
Speaker 2: them being what they are that factors into how they

877
00:49:48,719 --> 00:49:50,200
Speaker 2: interpret what they hear and say.

878
00:49:50,360 --> 00:49:52,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, like we've long, I mean, like forever have known

879
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:56,360
Speaker 1: that there are decibels the animals communicate in that we

880
00:49:56,440 --> 00:49:58,880
Speaker 1: flat out don't hear. So it's like sort of you

881
00:49:58,920 --> 00:50:01,080
Speaker 1: started with that, like one hundred. There's things we don't

882
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:04,440
Speaker 1: hear that we know we don't hear. There's research about

883
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:06,959
Speaker 1: the way birds proceed. You know, there's so much iridescence

884
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:10,799
Speaker 1: and birds there's probably something in their eye when they

885
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:14,799
Speaker 1: see iridescence. It just reads fundamentally different than what we

886
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:19,880
Speaker 1: see when we see iridescence. They take it in and

887
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:23,319
Speaker 1: the idea that there are like you're saying that when

888
00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:27,879
Speaker 1: you're at a turkey calling contest, what we're going when

889
00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 1: we're saying, man, that sounds a lot like a turkey

890
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,440
Speaker 1: could be tons of gibbers to a turkey.

891
00:50:34,840 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 4: Yeah.

892
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:39,360
Speaker 2: Great, example is like when I do a hen yelp,

893
00:50:40,920 --> 00:50:43,520
Speaker 2: I found over years, I wouldn't get the same response

894
00:50:43,520 --> 00:50:46,279
Speaker 2: as if I used a box call or slate and

895
00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:49,480
Speaker 2: I the only thing I could come to is that

896
00:50:50,080 --> 00:50:53,280
Speaker 2: it sounded good to me, but there was things in

897
00:50:53,320 --> 00:50:58,560
Speaker 2: my call. Maybe it's missing frequencies or something that made

898
00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:03,239
Speaker 2: it sound plastic or fake ors or something just that

899
00:51:03,400 --> 00:51:06,440
Speaker 2: didn't get the same response. Literally, just go to a

900
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 2: box call. You know, you got incidentt response, like what's

901
00:51:11,680 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 2: up with that? You know?

902
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 4: Is it?

903
00:51:14,360 --> 00:51:17,360
Speaker 2: You know, certain frequencies like high frequency drops off real fast,

904
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 2: so over distance, you know, whether it's an elk call

905
00:51:21,719 --> 00:51:24,319
Speaker 2: or what have you. You're generally picking up the low

906
00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:27,640
Speaker 2: frequency sounds that travel better. But when you're right up

907
00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:30,040
Speaker 2: close to something like holy cow, you hear that elk

908
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:32,520
Speaker 2: bugle right next to the car. If you're in Yellstone

909
00:51:32,600 --> 00:51:36,080
Speaker 2: or something, you're like, whoa, I'm missing a ton of stuff.

910
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:37,640
Speaker 4: There's a lot more going on here.

911
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:40,759
Speaker 2: What you know, what are they hearing? You know? They

912
00:51:41,120 --> 00:51:44,000
Speaker 2: you know, like a lot of the canines, wolves, coyotes,

913
00:51:44,040 --> 00:51:46,360
Speaker 2: they can hear, you know. Dave Meach found that in

914
00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 2: open terrain wolves can you're up to ten miles an

915
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:55,040
Speaker 2: open train and max I think for me, unless wind

916
00:51:55,080 --> 00:51:57,759
Speaker 2: conditions and other things are going on. The max is

917
00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 2: about three miles from me. So this is where often

918
00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:04,919
Speaker 2: with students and stuff, I'm like, look, you can't ever

919
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:07,960
Speaker 2: hear that. You won't ever smell that, not even with

920
00:52:08,040 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 2: the nosearranger. Just can't do this. But if you start

921
00:52:17,080 --> 00:52:22,160
Speaker 2: watching these animals closer, you're like, hey, wait, all of

922
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:25,799
Speaker 2: a sudden, they're starting to gather up their face in

923
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 2: one direction and then they howl hmm instantly. You know, Okay,

924
00:52:32,320 --> 00:52:34,960
Speaker 2: I'm looking at half of this story. The other half

925
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:37,279
Speaker 2: of the book is I've had this happen. You know,

926
00:52:37,320 --> 00:52:41,319
Speaker 2: friends with radios, they're six miles away. Yeah, yeah, we

927
00:52:41,400 --> 00:52:44,120
Speaker 2: got the I got well packed there howling to the east,

928
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,240
Speaker 2: you know, Yeah, I'm watching the druids or they're listening

929
00:52:47,280 --> 00:52:49,879
Speaker 2: to the west and they're going back and forth having

930
00:52:49,880 --> 00:52:54,360
Speaker 2: a conversation for hour two hours. We can't hear anything

931
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:58,440
Speaker 2: but the individuals standing in front of us. There's so

932
00:52:58,520 --> 00:53:01,360
Speaker 2: many animals doing stuff like that that we're like getting

933
00:53:01,400 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 2: these fragments thinking that we know what's going on, and

934
00:53:04,200 --> 00:53:08,759
Speaker 2: when they're having conversations over space and in terrain that

935
00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:10,960
Speaker 2: we don't even know are happening.

936
00:53:11,280 --> 00:53:14,840
Speaker 1: You know, we'll move away from Turkey's in a minute.

937
00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:21,960
Speaker 1: But you've obviously been super close to hens like all

938
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:23,840
Speaker 1: the like, I don't know what.

939
00:53:23,880 --> 00:53:24,200
Speaker 4: I don't know what.

940
00:53:24,280 --> 00:53:26,440
Speaker 1: I can't think, Like what distance you become aware of it?

941
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:27,680
Speaker 1: But they're always making noises.

942
00:53:27,880 --> 00:53:30,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, those little noises you wouldn't hear from one hundred

943
00:53:30,520 --> 00:53:32,759
Speaker 3: yards away, but in ten yards you can hear it, right,

944
00:53:32,800 --> 00:53:33,040
Speaker 3: you know?

945
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:35,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, what.

946
00:53:37,120 --> 00:53:39,680
Speaker 1: Let's I'm taking it in the wrong direction. Let's not

947
00:53:39,719 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 1: talk about ones people aren't familiar with. Let's just take like,

948
00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:45,360
Speaker 1: let me ask some real simple Do you feel that

949
00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:46,640
Speaker 1: a gobble.

950
00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:49,400
Speaker 4: Is just a gobble.

951
00:53:50,719 --> 00:53:53,240
Speaker 1: Or do you feel that there are there are different

952
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:57,640
Speaker 1: gobbles that mean different things.

953
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:01,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think there are different gobbles. And I I

954
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:04,360
Speaker 2: had thought for years that gobbles just a gobble, and

955
00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:07,200
Speaker 2: a young tom makes not as good a gobble.

956
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:10,319
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's the idea. Right. He sucks at it.

957
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:11,919
Speaker 2: He just sucks. He hasn't learned how.

958
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 4: To do it because he aspires them one day be.

959
00:54:14,360 --> 00:54:21,239
Speaker 7: Like exactly just blow your hair back, but in fact

960
00:54:21,320 --> 00:54:23,920
Speaker 7: he's It was in grad school I was talking with

961
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:27,520
Speaker 7: a friend who's he's really sharp on bird behavior and

962
00:54:28,360 --> 00:54:32,880
Speaker 7: all things, you know, research wise and scientific question answering

963
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:37,759
Speaker 7: kind of wise, and he turned my mind on it,

964
00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:41,000
Speaker 7: and I thought for years, you know, a young tom,

965
00:54:41,200 --> 00:54:42,400
Speaker 7: you know, full on gobbler.

966
00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:45,560
Speaker 2: It looks like a big, full long and then you

967
00:54:45,640 --> 00:54:50,000
Speaker 2: hear a Jake, you know, it's like it's just chunked

968
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:55,200
Speaker 2: up and he's He's like, no, you got to understand

969
00:54:55,239 --> 00:55:01,239
Speaker 2: they're gobbling in context to who's around them. And then

970
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:04,680
Speaker 2: I started noticing, son of a gun, he's right if

971
00:55:04,680 --> 00:55:08,000
Speaker 2: it was just that Jake had many times, or that

972
00:55:08,120 --> 00:55:12,000
Speaker 2: Jake would actually give a full armed gobble because he

973
00:55:12,080 --> 00:55:14,360
Speaker 2: was by himself, he didn't know the big guy was

974
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:18,080
Speaker 2: over that ridge, and Holland asked over to kick his

975
00:55:18,160 --> 00:55:21,319
Speaker 2: butt mm so he could say whatever he wanted to.

976
00:55:21,440 --> 00:55:23,080
Speaker 2: And of course he wants to sound like the big

977
00:55:23,080 --> 00:55:25,799
Speaker 2: guy on campus, right, And I'm like, son of a gun.

978
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:27,520
Speaker 2: Then I started seeing in the field and I'm like,

979
00:55:28,239 --> 00:55:30,400
Speaker 2: a gobble isn't a gobble?

980
00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:32,200
Speaker 4: Maybe he's like a subservient gobble.

981
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:36,640
Speaker 2: I'd love to, you know, correct me and add to it.

982
00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:40,520
Speaker 2: If listeners have listened for this kind of stuff more,

983
00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:42,839
Speaker 2: I'd love to learn more about that because that you know,

984
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:45,239
Speaker 2: my Turkey days are a little further back than some

985
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:48,440
Speaker 2: other stuff that it's fascinating with Just to think of that.

986
00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:50,759
Speaker 3: If you could read into a gobble and be like, oh,

987
00:55:50,800 --> 00:55:54,319
Speaker 3: that gobble, he's like, I'm coming now that gobble he's like, yeah,

988
00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:55,040
Speaker 3: I heard you all.

989
00:55:55,200 --> 00:55:57,359
Speaker 2: Maybe you get a double gobble, you're like, oh, he's

990
00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:00,680
Speaker 2: really liking that call, you know, triple gobble. You'll he's

991
00:56:00,680 --> 00:56:01,319
Speaker 2: got to be coming.

992
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:03,120
Speaker 4: Do you think he's loving the call when hears a

993
00:56:03,160 --> 00:56:03,840
Speaker 4: double gobble?

994
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:08,920
Speaker 2: That always, to me seemed like a good barometer to

995
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:12,760
Speaker 2: how excited they were. Yeah, they gobble off the roost

996
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:15,080
Speaker 2: and they hit the ground and gobbling and kind of

997
00:56:15,120 --> 00:56:18,040
Speaker 2: gobble along. But once you get them fired up, many

998
00:56:18,520 --> 00:56:22,759
Speaker 2: they're double triple gobbling repeatedly, and you're like, get ridy,

999
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:25,200
Speaker 2: get ready, get ready, here they're come, you know.

1000
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:27,200
Speaker 4: So hey.

1001
00:56:27,200 --> 00:56:30,040
Speaker 2: You know, if you look at it, the more I

1002
00:56:30,080 --> 00:56:33,040
Speaker 2: started looking at it from the turkey's perspective, the more

1003
00:56:33,080 --> 00:56:36,120
Speaker 2: I started understanding from my human perspective.

1004
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:40,759
Speaker 1: Uh, you say, you think about do you spend more

1005
00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:42,160
Speaker 1: time on crows around ravens?

1006
00:56:42,680 --> 00:56:44,839
Speaker 2: We just have more ravens around home, so I spend

1007
00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:46,239
Speaker 2: more time listening to them.

1008
00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:48,919
Speaker 4: Okay, the other day, it wasn't too long ago.

1009
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:52,000
Speaker 1: I was watching one and he just seems to be like,

1010
00:56:52,080 --> 00:56:54,800
Speaker 1: from my perspective, he seems to be just wasting energy.

1011
00:56:55,360 --> 00:57:01,880
Speaker 1: He's flying along, just raising hell, just making racket.

1012
00:57:02,239 --> 00:57:06,439
Speaker 4: Yeah right yeah, at a high way out mm hmm.

1013
00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:09,160
Speaker 1: And I'm like, he's not with anybody, he's just like

1014
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:13,600
Speaker 1: making racket. Like, give me some insight into what like

1015
00:57:13,680 --> 00:57:17,560
Speaker 1: what they're capable of conveying. Sure, yeah, and there's got

1016
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:19,680
Speaker 1: to be something like I found something to eat, like

1017
00:57:19,720 --> 00:57:20,560
Speaker 1: that's pretty clear.

1018
00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:23,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's stuff that it'll blow your doors off. And

1019
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:26,280
Speaker 2: I you know, I've only scratched the surface. I've found

1020
00:57:26,640 --> 00:57:31,480
Speaker 2: stuff that researchers haven't found. I've corroborated for myself things

1021
00:57:31,520 --> 00:57:34,439
Speaker 2: that they've found that yeah, that that holds here too.

1022
00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:39,920
Speaker 2: And it's to me, it's always about starting into these conversations,

1023
00:57:39,960 --> 00:57:43,000
Speaker 2: listening to what's most common. You pick the most common

1024
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:45,120
Speaker 2: thing close to you, and pick the most common thing.

1025
00:57:45,120 --> 00:57:49,280
Speaker 2: It says, Okay, so it's like I only have pigeons around, great, awesome,

1026
00:57:49,400 --> 00:57:52,360
Speaker 2: use pigeons because the lessons you learn through the pigeons

1027
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:56,600
Speaker 2: actually are going to apply to the red squirrel, the raven,

1028
00:57:57,360 --> 00:57:59,440
Speaker 2: the coyote, all those kind of other things because you

1029
00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:01,680
Speaker 2: start sensing ties in your own nervous system to it.

1030
00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:04,480
Speaker 2: And so when we were living in the park, I

1031
00:58:04,600 --> 00:58:07,320
Speaker 2: purposely i'd finished my graduate work. I was like done

1032
00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:10,760
Speaker 2: with academia. I did not want to read another scientific paper,

1033
00:58:11,040 --> 00:58:14,160
Speaker 2: and in that case, I just wanted the ravens to

1034
00:58:14,240 --> 00:58:18,280
Speaker 2: teach me. It took longer, but I learned a lot

1035
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:22,120
Speaker 2: more So. The most common thing they were saying was.

1036
00:58:25,400 --> 00:58:29,560
Speaker 4: Yep. They like saying that. Yeah, like on a lit.

1037
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:36,280
Speaker 2: It took me the longest time to realize the ones

1038
00:58:36,320 --> 00:58:38,960
Speaker 2: that were doing that were the ones that were right

1039
00:58:39,040 --> 00:58:43,520
Speaker 2: next to our cabin, and it was two. It was

1040
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:47,160
Speaker 2: the resident pair. I'm like, oh, this is their song.

1041
00:58:48,680 --> 00:58:51,840
Speaker 2: This is their territorial call that they used to keep

1042
00:58:51,840 --> 00:58:54,840
Speaker 2: the riff raff out. Their largest songbird in the world,

1043
00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:58,480
Speaker 2: even though it's not melodic, that's their no trespassing sign.

1044
00:58:59,760 --> 00:59:02,600
Speaker 4: The largest songbird in the world.

1045
00:59:01,320 --> 00:59:05,600
Speaker 2: Yep, common ravens. And so I was like.

1046
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:10,280
Speaker 4: The least melodic, you're the largest songbird.

1047
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:13,400
Speaker 1: But the people you could like so that that that's

1048
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:15,520
Speaker 1: funny because I ever thought about that classification.

1049
00:59:15,640 --> 00:59:17,160
Speaker 4: They'd be classified as a songbird.

1050
00:59:17,560 --> 00:59:20,600
Speaker 2: They are, OK, Yeah, they're in the passerine order, which

1051
00:59:20,640 --> 00:59:23,800
Speaker 2: is the all the perching birds corvidaet family, you know,

1052
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:29,720
Speaker 2: which is Jay's crows, Jackdaws, Magpies stuff. But that that

1053
00:59:29,800 --> 00:59:31,880
Speaker 2: gave me a hook. I was like, okay, I I

1054
00:59:31,920 --> 00:59:33,840
Speaker 2: think I know what that three note thing is now

1055
00:59:34,400 --> 00:59:36,920
Speaker 2: and then the key and I always stress this. The

1056
00:59:36,920 --> 00:59:41,760
Speaker 2: folks is start listening for where it varies. So there's

1057
00:59:41,760 --> 00:59:43,120
Speaker 2: one day I was out and you know, the ravens

1058
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:44,280
Speaker 2: are out there to.

1059
00:59:44,320 --> 00:59:46,800
Speaker 1: Hit me with the hymn, sitting on a post, being like,

1060
00:59:47,080 --> 00:59:48,120
Speaker 1: this is where I hang out.

1061
00:59:48,120 --> 00:59:48,680
Speaker 4: This is my song.

1062
00:59:48,800 --> 00:59:49,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is my turf.

1063
00:59:50,600 --> 00:59:57,240
Speaker 4: Give me the noise, okay.

1064
00:59:55,280 --> 00:59:57,880
Speaker 2: Right, And in this kind of group, you know, your

1065
00:59:57,960 --> 01:00:02,360
Speaker 2: listeners like making animals is cool, like in pop culture,

1066
01:00:02,440 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 2: Like you meet somebody at the dinner party and they're

1067
01:00:04,800 --> 01:00:06,800
Speaker 2: speaking to one person in Korean and one person in

1068
01:00:06,840 --> 01:00:09,640
Speaker 2: Italian and another person in French, and you're like, dude,

1069
01:00:09,680 --> 01:00:12,480
Speaker 2: who is this guy? You know, we see that as sophistication.

1070
01:00:12,640 --> 01:00:14,600
Speaker 2: You know, it's like he must have all this you know,

1071
01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:18,960
Speaker 2: worldly experience. But you make an animal sound and they're like, like,

1072
01:00:19,480 --> 01:00:21,360
Speaker 2: you know, so I always trying to prematice. I'm like, no,

1073
01:00:21,840 --> 01:00:26,400
Speaker 2: that betrays our bias against animals as stupid and under us.

1074
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:29,720
Speaker 2: You need to start seeing them as those creatures that

1075
01:00:29,760 --> 01:00:32,560
Speaker 2: look into the ultraviolet, as those creatures that hear in

1076
01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:36,520
Speaker 2: an ultrasonic and subsonic sounds, and those creatures that smell

1077
01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:40,640
Speaker 2: it parts per trillion, like they best us in so

1078
01:00:40,760 --> 01:00:45,800
Speaker 2: many ways. So listen from that perspective when I make

1079
01:00:45,880 --> 01:00:51,280
Speaker 2: animal noises, because it's a crowd pleaser, but the value

1080
01:00:51,320 --> 01:00:55,520
Speaker 2: in there is starting to get people to listen beyond okay,

1081
01:00:55,520 --> 01:01:05,000
Speaker 2: that common call just counting. There's more notes and it's faster,

1082
01:01:05,560 --> 01:01:09,120
Speaker 2: and I discovered that's a simple thing alone. Was happening

1083
01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:12,320
Speaker 2: when the tourists pulled out on the pullout in the

1084
01:01:12,400 --> 01:01:15,520
Speaker 2: road right below the corral fence and popped out the

1085
01:01:15,520 --> 01:01:20,000
Speaker 2: bag of Cheetos, like they see food, they know it's

1086
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:23,640
Speaker 2: in their territory. I'm gonna get it if anybody is,

1087
01:01:23,960 --> 01:01:26,160
Speaker 2: and you sure as hell better not come in here

1088
01:01:26,160 --> 01:01:28,160
Speaker 2: and think you're gonna steal it from me. So like

1089
01:01:28,200 --> 01:01:31,960
Speaker 2: that extra energy and repeated notes was almost like a

1090
01:01:32,080 --> 01:01:36,600
Speaker 2: more emphatic mine, mind, mind, mind, mind mine, hmmm. Right.

1091
01:01:36,840 --> 01:01:39,480
Speaker 2: You know, you know we'd walk into an area, you know,

1092
01:01:39,560 --> 01:01:41,480
Speaker 2: as a group to go sit down and listen and

1093
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:44,920
Speaker 2: watch and just us being there, those ravens would jump

1094
01:01:45,000 --> 01:01:52,200
Speaker 2: off their perches and start flying over doing that, like.

1095
01:01:52,240 --> 01:01:53,360
Speaker 4: But they're not talking to you.

1096
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:56,160
Speaker 1: They're talking to other ravens, Like, whatever's going on here

1097
01:01:56,200 --> 01:01:57,120
Speaker 1: is in our turf.

1098
01:01:57,120 --> 01:01:57,720
Speaker 4: We're on it.

1099
01:01:58,440 --> 01:02:01,080
Speaker 2: If food, that's that's what it seems like.

1100
01:02:01,080 --> 01:02:01,840
Speaker 4: I got a question for.

1101
01:02:02,040 --> 01:02:04,720
Speaker 3: So that was a situation where there's people involved and

1102
01:02:04,760 --> 01:02:08,720
Speaker 3: they recognize that that's potential food source. Would you hear that?

1103
01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:11,640
Speaker 3: Did you ever hear that same noise like when they

1104
01:02:11,640 --> 01:02:13,520
Speaker 3: were like out in the back country when there was

1105
01:02:13,560 --> 01:02:14,560
Speaker 3: a carcass around?

1106
01:02:15,440 --> 01:02:18,120
Speaker 2: That's an awesome question, Brodie, because that I've seen that,

1107
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:22,280
Speaker 2: so it's corroborating. Mind Like, the one I think of

1108
01:02:22,360 --> 01:02:25,800
Speaker 2: most is there was a spot in Slew Creek Big Flats.

1109
01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:28,280
Speaker 2: This bison had died, had been dead for a long time,

1110
01:02:28,560 --> 01:02:32,680
Speaker 2: pretty much eaten up, but the resident ravens every time

1111
01:02:32,680 --> 01:02:35,760
Speaker 2: another raven came within like half a mile, they were

1112
01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:39,680
Speaker 2: up in the ka count and if not flying over

1113
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:43,040
Speaker 2: toward them to perch and you give them another cussing

1114
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:48,920
Speaker 2: from within the turf. So it's both, Yeah.

1115
01:02:48,920 --> 01:02:52,520
Speaker 4: What is they like? What are they doing vocally around?

1116
01:02:52,680 --> 01:02:55,000
Speaker 1: Like we know all these sounds, Like to go back

1117
01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:57,560
Speaker 1: turkeys for a minute, We know all these sounds that

1118
01:02:57,640 --> 01:03:00,080
Speaker 1: in our human understanding, we've kind of got it like

1119
01:03:00,280 --> 01:03:05,160
Speaker 1: these are sounds of courtship. Okay, the same way we

1120
01:03:05,240 --> 01:03:06,600
Speaker 1: might look at it, elk, But you can be like,

1121
01:03:06,680 --> 01:03:12,840
Speaker 1: that's a sound of courtship. What like when you hear

1122
01:03:12,880 --> 01:03:15,480
Speaker 1: a raven, you're just hearing raven noise. You don't understand

1123
01:03:16,080 --> 01:03:19,480
Speaker 1: what is a What are they doing in the breeding season?

1124
01:03:19,560 --> 01:03:21,720
Speaker 1: Like what kind of things does a raven want to

1125
01:03:21,720 --> 01:03:25,640
Speaker 1: communicate in the breathing season? What would be the equivalent

1126
01:03:25,800 --> 01:03:28,120
Speaker 1: of how we at least how we perceive to be

1127
01:03:28,440 --> 01:03:31,360
Speaker 1: a gobbler going through the woods, goblin, you know, trying

1128
01:03:31,400 --> 01:03:32,240
Speaker 1: to draw hens in.

1129
01:03:33,160 --> 01:03:35,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's it's different for raisins because they're

1130
01:03:35,600 --> 01:03:39,720
Speaker 2: just socially different. You know, Turkeys are flock creatures. You know,

1131
01:03:39,960 --> 01:03:41,760
Speaker 2: toms are hanging out together, but the hens and the

1132
01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:44,480
Speaker 2: poults are hanging out together. They mix and mingle in places.

1133
01:03:44,920 --> 01:03:48,960
Speaker 2: Ravens are very much territorial with you know, kind of

1134
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:53,000
Speaker 2: a slew of travelers and non residents filtering in and

1135
01:03:53,040 --> 01:03:56,880
Speaker 2: around through there. Except times when somebody kills a bison

1136
01:03:57,240 --> 01:04:00,200
Speaker 2: got our way or an elk and those big foods

1137
01:04:00,200 --> 01:04:03,400
Speaker 2: has become big attractions. We know now from the research

1138
01:04:03,440 --> 01:04:05,720
Speaker 2: in the park that some of these birds are coming

1139
01:04:05,760 --> 01:04:10,280
Speaker 2: from Bozeman, flying to my house and gardener and Yellstone

1140
01:04:10,440 --> 01:04:14,400
Speaker 2: over carcas to feed on carcasses during the bison cause the.

1141
01:04:14,400 --> 01:04:16,800
Speaker 3: Word spreads down the valley somehow.

1142
01:04:17,120 --> 01:04:20,840
Speaker 1: Yes, that's wild you know what, man, you know what? Like,

1143
01:04:22,760 --> 01:04:27,000
Speaker 1: we were hunting the area with my kids. We were

1144
01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:29,280
Speaker 1: hunting area this year where like there's a lot there's

1145
01:04:29,280 --> 01:04:35,000
Speaker 1: a big cow elk harvest in a certain area pretty annually.

1146
01:04:35,840 --> 01:04:39,120
Speaker 1: I was even coming to my kids like I'm like,

1147
01:04:39,240 --> 01:04:43,080
Speaker 1: these things know what goes on here, and they're like

1148
01:04:43,240 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 1: in town for it. I didn't know they were in

1149
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:47,160
Speaker 1: town from far away. I meant I thought they were

1150
01:04:47,160 --> 01:04:49,400
Speaker 1: in town from the other side of the valley or something.

1151
01:04:49,560 --> 01:04:52,240
Speaker 2: That's what I used to think. No way in hell.

1152
01:04:52,560 --> 01:04:57,080
Speaker 2: These suckers are traveling twenty to thirty miles in the morning.

1153
01:04:57,960 --> 01:04:59,760
Speaker 2: So you think of a Yellstone bird, You're like, oh,

1154
01:04:59,760 --> 01:05:01,680
Speaker 2: that's wilderness bird. They just hang out in the park.

1155
01:05:01,800 --> 01:05:04,320
Speaker 2: Now they come up, they're either feeding at the dumping

1156
01:05:04,400 --> 01:05:09,560
Speaker 2: gardener or West Yellstone or out Cody flying back at midday.

1157
01:05:09,640 --> 01:05:13,200
Speaker 2: They're commuting, literally commuting in the morning off the food source,

1158
01:05:13,400 --> 01:05:15,480
Speaker 2: flying back in the day to maintain their terror.

1159
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:16,640
Speaker 4: Potentially thirty miles away.

1160
01:05:16,800 --> 01:05:19,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's daily, you know, saying.

1161
01:05:19,560 --> 01:05:22,280
Speaker 1: No, they somewhere have their own place they would regard

1162
01:05:22,280 --> 01:05:24,680
Speaker 1: as their hangout, their house as territory.

1163
01:05:24,800 --> 01:05:28,280
Speaker 2: So to get back to that, the call that I

1164
01:05:28,440 --> 01:05:37,439
Speaker 2: learned next in sequence with Ravens was this, And before

1165
01:05:37,480 --> 01:05:40,080
Speaker 2: I even saw them, I knew that they were moving, right.

1166
01:05:40,880 --> 01:05:44,360
Speaker 2: That's the sound they make when somebody's violated the no

1167
01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:48,920
Speaker 2: fly zone in their turf. So they have to be

1168
01:05:49,000 --> 01:05:53,080
Speaker 2: back there on their territory to hold that space for them.

1169
01:05:53,520 --> 01:05:56,560
Speaker 2: So when the tour season rolls back around and everybody's

1170
01:05:56,560 --> 01:06:00,720
Speaker 2: got frozen pizza and baloney sandwiches, they don't have to

1171
01:06:00,760 --> 01:06:04,280
Speaker 2: do any fighting in border control. They're good to go

1172
01:06:04,360 --> 01:06:07,720
Speaker 2: because everybody knows that's their turf. But we're to close

1173
01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:09,880
Speaker 2: the loop on the mating season stuff. Like I think

1174
01:06:09,920 --> 01:06:14,320
Speaker 2: a lot of these big food source locations end up

1175
01:06:14,360 --> 01:06:19,360
Speaker 2: being like the bar the dating scene for Ravens, and

1176
01:06:19,400 --> 01:06:22,400
Speaker 2: so you will see them displaying. They aren't vocalizing as

1177
01:06:22,520 --> 01:06:25,560
Speaker 2: much that we can hear if you're close and you

1178
01:06:25,640 --> 01:06:27,600
Speaker 2: hang out at the dump for the ravens like I

1179
01:06:27,680 --> 01:06:31,000
Speaker 2: do sometimes and not for the trash, you hear all

1180
01:06:31,040 --> 01:06:35,080
Speaker 2: these crazy soft sounds that probably I don't know if

1181
01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:36,320
Speaker 2: we'll ever figure out what they mean.

1182
01:06:37,000 --> 01:06:37,440
Speaker 4: You know, like.

1183
01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:42,160
Speaker 2: You know, you probably heard those like a water drop

1184
01:06:42,240 --> 01:06:45,360
Speaker 2: and stuff, and they use them in context of getting

1185
01:06:45,960 --> 01:06:48,240
Speaker 2: know each other. And you can tell at times when

1186
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:51,000
Speaker 2: they display they're not fanning like a turkey, but they'll

1187
01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:53,520
Speaker 2: puff their throat, they'll hold their beak up. You've probably

1188
01:06:53,520 --> 01:06:55,920
Speaker 2: seen them, especially around a like a gut pile or

1189
01:06:55,960 --> 01:07:00,600
Speaker 2: something where the birds converge. Look real close. Because in

1190
01:07:01,120 --> 01:07:03,400
Speaker 2: a general sense, when you see those birds that kind

1191
01:07:03,400 --> 01:07:05,480
Speaker 2: of drop their wings a little bit, they're proffing up,

1192
01:07:05,480 --> 01:07:08,760
Speaker 2: they drop their flank feathers, those are your residant birds.

1193
01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:12,640
Speaker 2: Those are the territorial ones who own that space, so

1194
01:07:12,720 --> 01:07:16,880
Speaker 2: to speak. The others are interlopers, and they'll be trying

1195
01:07:16,880 --> 01:07:19,760
Speaker 2: to run them off. In fact, when I did start

1196
01:07:19,800 --> 01:07:23,640
Speaker 2: reading back into the literature on ravens, it confirmed what

1197
01:07:23,760 --> 01:07:28,240
Speaker 2: I had seen in Yellowstone where what bren Heinrich, one

1198
01:07:28,280 --> 01:07:31,080
Speaker 2: of the world's leading authorities on ravens, had found near

1199
01:07:31,080 --> 01:07:35,800
Speaker 2: his cabin in Maine. Was this dead moose. One dead moose,

1200
01:07:36,480 --> 01:07:41,400
Speaker 2: and one raven finds it, it lands and gives this call,

1201
01:07:44,040 --> 01:07:47,280
Speaker 2: and ravens come out of the woodwork and start feeding

1202
01:07:47,320 --> 01:07:51,560
Speaker 2: on it with it. And he's like, that makes no sense, right,

1203
01:07:52,560 --> 01:07:56,000
Speaker 2: You like, make a beautiful barbecue dinner for you and

1204
01:07:56,080 --> 01:07:57,880
Speaker 2: your family, and before you eat, you have the high

1205
01:07:57,920 --> 01:08:01,880
Speaker 2: school football team come over and dine first, like biologically

1206
01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:06,680
Speaker 2: behaviorally like that didn't make sense until he started studying

1207
01:08:06,760 --> 01:08:09,840
Speaker 2: him and marking them, And what he figured out was

1208
01:08:09,880 --> 01:08:14,520
Speaker 2: the ones doing that were younger ones and non territorial birds.

1209
01:08:15,160 --> 01:08:17,920
Speaker 2: And that call, which is a great way if you

1210
01:08:17,960 --> 01:08:20,360
Speaker 2: ever injure an animal, or you've got a downed animal

1211
01:08:20,400 --> 01:08:22,640
Speaker 2: and train you can't track him on, you got to

1212
01:08:22,680 --> 01:08:28,200
Speaker 2: listen to the ravens. Because that call doesn't mean food

1213
01:08:28,360 --> 01:08:32,679
Speaker 2: in a generic sense any food. It means meat really,

1214
01:08:33,200 --> 01:08:39,760
Speaker 2: So that bird is calling out to avoid being persecuted

1215
01:08:39,760 --> 01:08:43,320
Speaker 2: by the residents who own that turf. So if that

1216
01:08:43,360 --> 01:08:45,360
Speaker 2: bird who found the moose was caught by the residents,

1217
01:08:45,400 --> 01:08:47,040
Speaker 2: it'd be run out and it wouldn't get any food.

1218
01:08:47,200 --> 01:08:52,439
Speaker 2: But by going it brings in an overwhelming number of

1219
01:08:52,479 --> 01:08:55,200
Speaker 2: other ravens, and everybody ends up getting some.

1220
01:08:56,920 --> 01:08:59,280
Speaker 1: That I can think of an analog that a friend

1221
01:08:59,280 --> 01:09:04,960
Speaker 1: of mine was accidentally trespassing and found a mammoth jaw,

1222
01:09:08,320 --> 01:09:13,640
Speaker 1: so he had to go over and say, sir, I

1223
01:09:13,720 --> 01:09:15,200
Speaker 1: was accidentally trespassing on.

1224
01:09:17,439 --> 01:09:21,800
Speaker 4: And lo and behold up on a mammoth jaw. What

1225
01:09:21,840 --> 01:09:22,720
Speaker 4: are we gonna do about this?

1226
01:09:23,280 --> 01:09:25,320
Speaker 2: And that bunny called in all his buddies is standing

1227
01:09:25,360 --> 01:09:27,320
Speaker 2: around him to make sure he got the right answer.

1228
01:09:27,840 --> 01:09:32,120
Speaker 1: Because he's like, he's like that raven. He's like, dude, like,

1229
01:09:32,479 --> 01:09:37,240
Speaker 1: I know, I'm on your place. It's a big elk you.

1230
01:09:37,520 --> 01:09:39,639
Speaker 1: I just would like to know what happens with the

1231
01:09:39,680 --> 01:09:41,960
Speaker 1: thing and just try to be part of this, you know,

1232
01:09:42,520 --> 01:09:44,559
Speaker 1: admitting that I'm on you.

1233
01:09:46,680 --> 01:09:48,519
Speaker 3: And what I'm gonna do is calling a bunch of

1234
01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:51,479
Speaker 3: my buddies to help me pack it out there?

1235
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:56,960
Speaker 4: You go, no way? Yeah, hit me with the meat

1236
01:09:57,000 --> 01:09:57,519
Speaker 4: call again.

1237
01:09:58,760 --> 01:10:02,040
Speaker 2: So let me qualify. It sounds very similar to what

1238
01:10:02,160 --> 01:10:05,760
Speaker 2: young birds do when they're still on the nest and

1239
01:10:05,800 --> 01:10:09,160
Speaker 2: they're fledging. So if you've ever had a raven or

1240
01:10:09,200 --> 01:10:11,840
Speaker 2: a crow nest near your place, they never you know,

1241
01:10:11,880 --> 01:10:14,640
Speaker 2: they never shut up, like they just talk, and a

1242
01:10:14,640 --> 01:10:20,759
Speaker 2: lot of that is which just grates on your nerves,

1243
01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:23,120
Speaker 2: and it's supposed to because in essence, what they're saying.

1244
01:10:22,920 --> 01:10:29,960
Speaker 1: Is mom, Mom.

1245
01:10:27,120 --> 01:10:31,760
Speaker 2: Hey mom. Right. So, if you see an adult bird,

1246
01:10:31,760 --> 01:10:34,559
Speaker 2: and the way you tell on a lot of birds,

1247
01:10:35,160 --> 01:10:38,320
Speaker 2: and certainly for corvids, is if you see them, call,

1248
01:10:39,439 --> 01:10:43,679
Speaker 2: pick up your binox and look in their mouth. If

1249
01:10:43,680 --> 01:10:46,120
Speaker 2: the lining of the mouth is black, it's an adult.

1250
01:10:46,200 --> 01:10:49,120
Speaker 2: It's three years or older. We can't agent beyond that.

1251
01:10:49,160 --> 01:10:52,160
Speaker 2: We just know that after about two years, the mouth

1252
01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:56,120
Speaker 2: lining is all black. If it's a red pink, it's

1253
01:10:56,160 --> 01:10:59,920
Speaker 2: a juvenile. So if you hear a juvenile going on

1254
01:11:00,240 --> 01:11:04,400
Speaker 2: like that in August or September, you're like, eh, stupid kids,

1255
01:11:04,800 --> 01:11:07,200
Speaker 2: I'm trying to get the parents to still feed them.

1256
01:11:07,479 --> 01:11:11,040
Speaker 2: But if it's a black mouthed adult doing that, you

1257
01:11:11,080 --> 01:11:13,680
Speaker 2: want to start looking. You want to start looking for

1258
01:11:13,720 --> 01:11:15,639
Speaker 2: the magpies going in and out. You want to see

1259
01:11:15,640 --> 01:11:17,840
Speaker 2: there it seeing if that there's a coyote coming over

1260
01:11:17,880 --> 01:11:20,439
Speaker 2: the hell Oh you know, it's just the corroborating evidence

1261
01:11:20,479 --> 01:11:23,240
Speaker 2: that there's something there that you're missing. That the eyes

1262
01:11:23,280 --> 01:11:24,280
Speaker 2: in the sky picked.

1263
01:11:24,080 --> 01:11:27,880
Speaker 4: Up and do the noise again, and you don't have.

1264
01:11:27,920 --> 01:11:30,120
Speaker 2: To hear it once like I've had guide friends They're like, Hey,

1265
01:11:30,160 --> 01:11:32,320
Speaker 2: there's a new bison in the Lamar Valley in Yellowstone.

1266
01:11:33,560 --> 01:11:33,880
Speaker 4: That's it.

1267
01:11:33,920 --> 01:11:36,080
Speaker 2: I don't tell me anymore. I'll go in the park

1268
01:11:36,120 --> 01:11:38,840
Speaker 2: and i'll hang out. I'll go to a real good viewpoint,

1269
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:43,320
Speaker 2: prominent point, and I'll close my eyes and I'll listen

1270
01:11:43,360 --> 01:11:45,719
Speaker 2: for the first time I hear that call. And often,

1271
01:11:45,760 --> 01:11:48,920
Speaker 2: because we often bias our other senses, sometimes I'll point

1272
01:11:49,960 --> 01:11:51,559
Speaker 2: in the direction I think it is and then I'll

1273
01:11:51,560 --> 01:11:54,760
Speaker 2: open my eyes and there it is, almost without fail.

1274
01:11:55,640 --> 01:11:57,080
Speaker 4: Because he's making that racket.

1275
01:11:57,160 --> 01:12:00,360
Speaker 2: He's making that racket because it found the food, and

1276
01:12:00,400 --> 01:12:02,920
Speaker 2: it's calling in buddies to make sure the residents don't

1277
01:12:02,960 --> 01:12:06,840
Speaker 2: run them out. You can, that's one of the best

1278
01:12:06,840 --> 01:12:08,000
Speaker 2: ways to find that there.

1279
01:12:08,200 --> 01:12:10,400
Speaker 1: Also, what he I got mixed up bout what he's

1280
01:12:10,439 --> 01:12:15,519
Speaker 1: saying or what you're he's being like, if I go

1281
01:12:15,640 --> 01:12:21,040
Speaker 1: down by myself, I'm gonna get her ass and run off.

1282
01:12:21,280 --> 01:12:25,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, So he's basically calling in reinforcements.

1283
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:28,320
Speaker 1: So the thing going and feed and they're not and

1284
01:12:28,320 --> 01:12:30,519
Speaker 1: they got enough people there where it's not going to be.

1285
01:12:30,640 --> 01:12:34,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like a smoke screen, feathered smoke screen to

1286
01:12:34,200 --> 01:12:36,519
Speaker 2: give them the opportunity to sneak in there without getting

1287
01:12:36,680 --> 01:12:39,599
Speaker 2: beat up. And you'll hear it too, Like, there's an

1288
01:12:39,720 --> 01:12:43,600
Speaker 2: awesome reference. Do you ever read any of Richard Nelson's

1289
01:12:43,600 --> 01:12:47,280
Speaker 2: ethnography work from Alaska? In Prayers to Raven there's a

1290
01:12:47,320 --> 01:12:50,080
Speaker 2: passage on there book it's awesome and there's like a

1291
01:12:50,160 --> 01:12:53,720
Speaker 2: one sentence description in there that I just like, I

1292
01:12:54,000 --> 01:12:56,320
Speaker 2: just want to know what he's talking about. There he said,

1293
01:12:56,320 --> 01:12:59,479
Speaker 2: when the native hunters quitchen find a fresh bear track

1294
01:13:00,080 --> 01:13:05,000
Speaker 2: in the snow, they hide and they make the calls

1295
01:13:05,040 --> 01:13:09,200
Speaker 2: of a raven to draw the bearon. And I'm like, oh, really,

1296
01:13:09,360 --> 01:13:12,200
Speaker 2: what is that all like? And then he just keeps going.

1297
01:13:12,240 --> 01:13:16,360
Speaker 2: I'm like, no, you know, come back that. There's two possibilities.

1298
01:13:16,720 --> 01:13:22,560
Speaker 2: One is that non territorial bird saying right, that's possible.

1299
01:13:22,960 --> 01:13:25,960
Speaker 2: The other one, which I think is probably more likely,

1300
01:13:26,640 --> 01:13:30,200
Speaker 2: is the squabbling calls you hear when ravens are on

1301
01:13:30,240 --> 01:13:32,160
Speaker 2: the ground at a carcass fight.

1302
01:13:32,280 --> 01:13:34,360
Speaker 4: Oh, and they're all duking it out, duking.

1303
01:13:34,080 --> 01:13:40,920
Speaker 2: It out, tolding you that like, we got a good

1304
01:13:40,960 --> 01:13:41,760
Speaker 2: deal here.

1305
01:13:41,800 --> 01:13:43,880
Speaker 1: Interesting, man, you'd go and get a bunch of guys

1306
01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:45,600
Speaker 1: that could do that and start making that noise and

1307
01:13:45,640 --> 01:13:46,559
Speaker 1: see what shows up.

1308
01:13:47,520 --> 01:13:49,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know how effective it was, but it's

1309
01:13:49,560 --> 01:13:51,920
Speaker 2: effective enough apparently in their culture that they're that's a

1310
01:13:52,000 --> 01:13:52,439
Speaker 2: known thing.

1311
01:13:52,600 --> 01:13:55,120
Speaker 1: One of my favorite things, and make make prayers of

1312
01:13:55,120 --> 01:13:56,920
Speaker 1: the raven One of my favorite things that he learned

1313
01:13:56,960 --> 01:13:58,800
Speaker 1: from those guys he's hanging out with, is you know

1314
01:13:58,800 --> 01:13:59,360
Speaker 1: they'd like to.

1315
01:13:59,320 --> 01:13:59,960
Speaker 4: Then dig bear.

1316
01:14:00,520 --> 01:14:04,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, and their take is like, man, anybody can you know,

1317
01:14:04,880 --> 01:14:06,639
Speaker 1: because we look at that like, you know, most people

1318
01:14:06,680 --> 01:14:09,280
Speaker 1: look at that like a cowardly act, you know, unsportsmanlike.

1319
01:14:10,160 --> 01:14:12,120
Speaker 1: Their take is like, man, anybody can shoot a bear

1320
01:14:12,200 --> 01:14:16,120
Speaker 1: walking around, Go climb in there and drag.

1321
01:14:15,920 --> 01:14:18,960
Speaker 2: Them right right, And the old days they're doing it

1322
01:14:19,000 --> 01:14:22,200
Speaker 2: with a lance. Yeah, they let the bear charge them.

1323
01:14:22,320 --> 01:14:24,439
Speaker 1: You know, go climb in there and drag them out,

1324
01:14:24,439 --> 01:14:25,880
Speaker 1: and tell me about how easy it is.

1325
01:14:26,439 --> 01:14:30,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, Woosy, that's.

1326
01:14:30,280 --> 01:14:30,679
Speaker 4: A good book.

1327
01:14:31,040 --> 01:14:33,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, he spends a lot of time on I mean

1328
01:14:33,280 --> 01:14:38,160
Speaker 1: obviously that that thing of like the significance of that bird,

1329
01:14:38,400 --> 01:14:41,120
Speaker 1: which is probably in some way motivated by it's just

1330
01:14:41,120 --> 01:14:42,160
Speaker 1: incredible intelligence.

1331
01:14:42,160 --> 01:14:44,920
Speaker 2: And I could totally see like people will often ask

1332
01:14:45,040 --> 01:14:47,400
Speaker 2: questions of like, you know the wolves around, you know,

1333
01:14:47,439 --> 01:14:50,599
Speaker 2: are they leading wolves to kills? And so far as

1334
01:14:50,600 --> 01:14:53,000
Speaker 2: we can see. No, Like there might be one or

1335
01:14:53,040 --> 01:14:55,760
Speaker 2: two instances in the last thirty years where somebody can

1336
01:14:55,800 --> 01:14:59,639
Speaker 2: say I'm pretty sure the ravens were maybe goaded those

1337
01:15:00,120 --> 01:15:04,520
Speaker 2: wolves over a friend of mine was watching a brown.

1338
01:15:04,720 --> 01:15:06,120
Speaker 4: Tap into the carcass or something.

1339
01:15:06,120 --> 01:15:09,439
Speaker 2: But yeah, or you know, here's a weak animal. There's

1340
01:15:09,479 --> 01:15:13,400
Speaker 2: a carcass right here. You know it's more there just

1341
01:15:13,439 --> 01:15:16,000
Speaker 2: like parasites to the wolves. They're just taking advantage of

1342
01:15:16,040 --> 01:15:18,280
Speaker 2: the wolves killed. I've seen times where wolves will be

1343
01:15:18,280 --> 01:15:21,200
Speaker 2: feeding on the back end of an old wear out

1344
01:15:21,280 --> 01:15:23,479
Speaker 2: bull elk, and the ravens are literally an antlers like

1345
01:15:23,520 --> 01:15:26,559
Speaker 2: waiting their turn. Come on, man, give us, give us

1346
01:15:26,600 --> 01:15:27,919
Speaker 2: a little space about it.

1347
01:15:27,960 --> 01:15:30,519
Speaker 1: But you don't see that there's like a legitimate like hey,

1348
01:15:30,560 --> 01:15:32,679
Speaker 1: come quick, this thing's will no no.

1349
01:15:32,840 --> 01:15:37,320
Speaker 2: But like the northern cultures all over the globe were like, yeah,

1350
01:15:37,320 --> 01:15:40,280
Speaker 2: that's how we find the caribou. And I think a

1351
01:15:40,320 --> 01:15:47,719
Speaker 2: lot of those signals are as much behavioral, Like, for instance,

1352
01:15:47,760 --> 01:15:49,639
Speaker 2: because we live on the edge of the National Forest

1353
01:15:49,720 --> 01:15:52,679
Speaker 2: right north of the park, there's a lot of hunting

1354
01:15:52,720 --> 01:15:54,479
Speaker 2: that goes on, and I can go out for a

1355
01:15:54,520 --> 01:15:57,800
Speaker 2: walk with a dog and I'm like, uh, somebody killed

1356
01:15:57,800 --> 01:16:02,120
Speaker 2: something over by the travertine two miles away, just by

1357
01:16:02,120 --> 01:16:07,400
Speaker 2: the continual unidirectional flight of every single raven going that way.

1358
01:16:07,640 --> 01:16:09,799
Speaker 2: So I think a lot of those early cultures probably

1359
01:16:09,840 --> 01:16:11,760
Speaker 2: were not just picking up on sound, but they were

1360
01:16:11,800 --> 01:16:17,000
Speaker 2: picking up on directional flight, flight altitude. If you see

1361
01:16:17,000 --> 01:16:20,120
Speaker 2: arab back, you know, acrobatics in the air, they probably

1362
01:16:20,320 --> 01:16:23,840
Speaker 2: you're close. There's a certain I don't know number of

1363
01:16:23,960 --> 01:16:27,400
Speaker 2: hundreds of yards, hundreds of meters that you'll see ravens

1364
01:16:27,800 --> 01:16:29,880
Speaker 2: chasing each other trying to get food away from each other,

1365
01:16:29,960 --> 01:16:31,960
Speaker 2: and you know, like so you know you see that,

1366
01:16:32,040 --> 01:16:34,479
Speaker 2: you're like, oh, we're within a couple hundred yards of

1367
01:16:35,040 --> 01:16:35,920
Speaker 2: that food source.

1368
01:16:36,160 --> 01:16:42,320
Speaker 1: I was in Tanzania this summer. In the trackers use

1369
01:16:43,400 --> 01:16:44,639
Speaker 1: what oxpeckers do.

1370
01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:45,240
Speaker 4: In the morning.

1371
01:16:45,680 --> 01:16:48,840
Speaker 1: It's it's like it's diagnostic. I mean they don't look

1372
01:16:48,840 --> 01:16:53,640
Speaker 1: at like, oh, maybe maybe there's something over there that

1373
01:16:53,640 --> 01:16:57,120
Speaker 1: it's going to. Yeah, they're like he's up in the morning,

1374
01:16:57,840 --> 01:16:59,840
Speaker 1: when he flies out, he already knows.

1375
01:17:00,240 --> 01:17:03,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, he knows where they're at the buffalo.

1376
01:17:04,040 --> 01:17:07,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, like he knows where they are because he was

1377
01:17:07,320 --> 01:17:10,360
Speaker 1: with them before or whatever, and he's going there. Yeah,

1378
01:17:10,800 --> 01:17:12,880
Speaker 1: you know, and so yeah, in that way, and those

1379
01:17:12,920 --> 01:17:16,040
Speaker 1: messages they might they might not go there because of

1380
01:17:16,080 --> 01:17:17,040
Speaker 1: whatever factors.

1381
01:17:17,360 --> 01:17:19,320
Speaker 4: But they're like at daybreak when.

1382
01:17:19,240 --> 01:17:22,800
Speaker 1: Six of them go yeah and disappeared down somewhere, like

1383
01:17:24,240 --> 01:17:26,360
Speaker 1: that's not for something else.

1384
01:17:26,280 --> 01:17:29,679
Speaker 2: And the bugs do that. You know, you probably read

1385
01:17:29,680 --> 01:17:32,840
Speaker 2: Boyd Vardi's you know, line Tracker's Guide to Life or

1386
01:17:32,880 --> 01:17:36,439
Speaker 2: something like that. One of his mentors was finding found

1387
01:17:36,479 --> 01:17:38,040
Speaker 2: a lion kill from watching the.

1388
01:17:37,960 --> 01:17:39,599
Speaker 4: Flies No same deal.

1389
01:17:39,680 --> 01:17:41,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I interviewed a guy from the book

1390
01:17:41,600 --> 01:17:43,320
Speaker 2: and he didn't It didn't end up making it into

1391
01:17:43,360 --> 01:17:45,519
Speaker 2: the final cut, but he and his buddy hunted a

1392
01:17:45,520 --> 01:17:47,960
Speaker 2: lot in California, really rocky ground.

1393
01:17:48,160 --> 01:17:48,320
Speaker 4: You know.

1394
01:17:48,400 --> 01:17:52,000
Speaker 2: The first time it happened, they shot a bucket, ran

1395
01:17:52,040 --> 01:17:54,599
Speaker 2: off somewhere, could kind of see, you know, ran out

1396
01:17:54,640 --> 01:17:58,840
Speaker 2: of blood, didn't know, just kind of gave up almost

1397
01:17:59,040 --> 01:18:01,759
Speaker 2: sitting on this this hill or next to this trail

1398
01:18:01,800 --> 01:18:04,120
Speaker 2: and start seeing. He called him meat bees, you know,

1399
01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:07,960
Speaker 2: el jackets that you're trying to avoid if you're processing

1400
01:18:08,000 --> 01:18:13,160
Speaker 2: game from getting stung. Yellow jackets keep going up this trail.

1401
01:18:15,160 --> 01:18:18,679
Speaker 2: So he followed him, and he's used that for years

1402
01:18:18,720 --> 01:18:23,360
Speaker 2: thereafter to find down game God in places he couldn't track.

1403
01:18:23,680 --> 01:18:25,880
Speaker 4: You know Tom Petty, Late Tom Patty.

1404
01:18:25,960 --> 01:18:28,000
Speaker 1: He once said in one of his songs, he says,

1405
01:18:28,040 --> 01:18:31,720
Speaker 1: I can track a single bee to its hive, which

1406
01:18:31,760 --> 01:18:35,640
Speaker 1: is like how these define Yeah, staying there, starms and

1407
01:18:35,880 --> 01:18:38,160
Speaker 1: standing there way till one goes by, see as far

1408
01:18:38,200 --> 01:18:39,200
Speaker 1: as it went, go.

1409
01:18:39,120 --> 01:18:40,680
Speaker 4: There, standing there, wait for.

1410
01:18:40,640 --> 01:18:42,439
Speaker 1: The nuther one to go by, and you'll find your

1411
01:18:42,439 --> 01:18:45,360
Speaker 1: buck like that. Man, Yeah, badass, you can.

1412
01:18:46,120 --> 01:18:50,639
Speaker 2: And it's it's all that's to me. And I don't

1413
01:18:50,720 --> 01:18:56,200
Speaker 2: hunt anymore. And that's a whole different conversation. But just

1414
01:18:56,320 --> 01:18:59,280
Speaker 2: paying attention and trying to see the world through these

1415
01:18:59,320 --> 01:19:02,479
Speaker 2: other creatures, you start picking that stuff up a lot more.

1416
01:19:02,880 --> 01:19:05,560
Speaker 2: And this is what our ancestors, all of our ancestors

1417
01:19:05,640 --> 01:19:09,240
Speaker 2: knew this animal language stuff in far better detail than

1418
01:19:09,280 --> 01:19:11,120
Speaker 2: I do. Like a friend of mine's hung out with

1419
01:19:11,120 --> 01:19:15,400
Speaker 2: the San people in the Kalahari. They are unfreaking believable

1420
01:19:15,880 --> 01:19:20,200
Speaker 2: in interpreting non human communication. And the ones are the best.

1421
01:19:20,479 --> 01:19:24,000
Speaker 2: You would think are the hunters. He's like, no, actually

1422
01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:27,440
Speaker 2: it's the women. The women are out in the bush

1423
01:19:28,000 --> 01:19:31,000
Speaker 2: digging roots. They've got kids with them, they got old

1424
01:19:31,040 --> 01:19:34,840
Speaker 2: people with them, all these people that are very vulnerable.

1425
01:19:34,960 --> 01:19:38,000
Speaker 2: If the hyenas or leopard or the lions come through,

1426
01:19:38,280 --> 01:19:41,800
Speaker 2: so they are ultra peaked. And he went out with

1427
01:19:41,840 --> 01:19:44,639
Speaker 2: them one day and they're digging away and these women's

1428
01:19:44,600 --> 01:19:47,240
Speaker 2: are spread out. You're like, dude, that's not safe right

1429
01:19:47,439 --> 01:19:50,400
Speaker 2: from our perspective, hundreds of yards between these different women

1430
01:19:50,600 --> 01:19:54,120
Speaker 2: with the children, digging roots and things like that. And

1431
01:19:54,760 --> 01:19:57,799
Speaker 2: he'd walk up to any of them, We're the closest lions.

1432
01:19:58,120 --> 01:20:03,120
Speaker 2: Without even stopping, they point, how far about this far?

1433
01:20:03,800 --> 01:20:05,920
Speaker 2: Walk to another one, Hey, where are the closest lions?

1434
01:20:06,360 --> 01:20:09,920
Speaker 2: They point, go around and visit multiple women, doing this

1435
01:20:10,640 --> 01:20:15,000
Speaker 2: just effortlessly as part of their day. They are absorbing

1436
01:20:15,080 --> 01:20:18,840
Speaker 2: this information as they go. And in that particular case,

1437
01:20:18,880 --> 01:20:22,240
Speaker 2: they went over a couple hours later in a vehicle.

1438
01:20:22,640 --> 01:20:26,760
Speaker 2: There's the fresh lion tracks, got it, and even on

1439
01:20:26,880 --> 01:20:29,960
Speaker 2: down really specific stuff, like he told me this story.

1440
01:20:29,840 --> 01:20:35,320
Speaker 2: They were in this It was small plot of forest

1441
01:20:35,920 --> 01:20:37,240
Speaker 2: and they hang out there in the day because it

1442
01:20:37,240 --> 01:20:40,439
Speaker 2: gets really really hot. And they said to them, the

1443
01:20:40,840 --> 01:20:43,840
Speaker 2: white guys, the tourists, do not leave this patch of forest.

1444
01:20:44,080 --> 01:20:48,400
Speaker 2: There's Mama's out here, there's cobras, there's hyenas. The whole

1445
01:20:48,680 --> 01:20:51,519
Speaker 2: laundry list, but one of the guys with him. There

1446
01:20:51,560 --> 01:20:54,559
Speaker 2: was one of his students in animal language bird language,

1447
01:20:55,680 --> 01:20:57,880
Speaker 2: and this student of his comes over. He says, Hey,

1448
01:20:57,880 --> 01:20:59,639
Speaker 2: I know we're not supposed to leave, but I'm hearing

1449
01:20:59,640 --> 01:21:02,320
Speaker 2: this bird do something that I think might be talking

1450
01:21:02,320 --> 01:21:05,760
Speaker 2: about a snake. Can you come listen to it? So

1451
01:21:05,800 --> 01:21:07,120
Speaker 2: he goes over there with him at the edge of

1452
01:21:07,120 --> 01:21:09,680
Speaker 2: this little patch of trees and he's like, yeah, I

1453
01:21:09,760 --> 01:21:12,400
Speaker 2: think you're right, but you know, we're not gonna go

1454
01:21:12,400 --> 01:21:15,000
Speaker 2: out there. Let's but let's go get the one white

1455
01:21:15,040 --> 01:21:18,000
Speaker 2: guy and he's got a gun. We will check it out.

1456
01:21:18,160 --> 01:21:20,840
Speaker 2: So he comes over. The three of them walk out

1457
01:21:21,640 --> 01:21:23,920
Speaker 2: and he's like, yeah, I think I think you're right.

1458
01:21:23,960 --> 01:21:25,720
Speaker 2: I think it's I think it's a snake. But let's

1459
01:21:25,760 --> 01:21:28,360
Speaker 2: go get aasi Quah. You know this this native guy,

1460
01:21:28,400 --> 01:21:33,639
Speaker 2: his name literally translates into cobra, he'll know. So Isakulah comes.

1461
01:21:33,640 --> 01:21:36,719
Speaker 2: The four of them then walk within I'll say sixty

1462
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:38,880
Speaker 2: eighty yards and he's like, yep, there it is. It's

1463
01:21:38,960 --> 01:21:42,960
Speaker 2: a it's a black mamba. Don't go over there. So

1464
01:21:43,160 --> 01:21:46,320
Speaker 2: my friend says to his student who were originally found

1465
01:21:46,320 --> 01:21:50,080
Speaker 2: this whole deal, he's like, now watch this. They go

1466
01:21:50,200 --> 01:21:53,400
Speaker 2: back into the trees and there's like five women sitting

1467
01:21:53,400 --> 01:21:58,759
Speaker 2: around making beads with ostrich eggs shells and they're just talking.

1468
01:21:58,840 --> 01:22:01,920
Speaker 2: Kids are playing around, people are working on tan and highs,

1469
01:22:01,920 --> 01:22:04,599
Speaker 2: just the usual stuff of a community. So they stand

1470
01:22:04,640 --> 01:22:09,280
Speaker 2: their patient and finally there's a break in the conversation

1471
01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:11,920
Speaker 2: and the translator says, you want to ask the question.

1472
01:22:13,120 --> 01:22:16,240
Speaker 2: So my friend says, yeah, do you ladies hear any

1473
01:22:16,520 --> 01:22:19,840
Speaker 2: alarms right now? And in unison, all five of them

1474
01:22:19,920 --> 01:22:24,679
Speaker 2: point over their shoulder to what is hundreds of yards away,

1475
01:22:24,840 --> 01:22:27,280
Speaker 2: says there's a mamba over there. Don't go over there.

1476
01:22:27,680 --> 01:22:29,040
Speaker 4: Hmm.

1477
01:22:29,160 --> 01:22:32,880
Speaker 2: So not only through their regular routine were they hearing it,

1478
01:22:33,960 --> 01:22:37,400
Speaker 2: they also knew exactly what it meant. Have not even

1479
01:22:37,400 --> 01:22:39,639
Speaker 2: seen it with all this other noise and stuff going on,

1480
01:22:39,760 --> 01:22:43,120
Speaker 2: Like that's the level that not just Native Africans, not

1481
01:22:43,160 --> 01:22:47,320
Speaker 2: just Native Amazonians, like our ancestors knew that. And it's

1482
01:22:47,400 --> 01:22:49,840
Speaker 2: like so cool that we're discovering it now. It's like, no,

1483
01:22:50,840 --> 01:22:55,080
Speaker 2: it's neat, but this is really old and it was

1484
01:22:55,600 --> 01:22:59,559
Speaker 2: used because it was so useful. It was retained because

1485
01:22:59,560 --> 01:23:02,479
Speaker 2: dinner was on the hoof, and you need to know

1486
01:23:02,520 --> 01:23:04,679
Speaker 2: it was in there before you even went in there

1487
01:23:06,240 --> 01:23:09,200
Speaker 2: to just limit the chaos that that life brings at you.

1488
01:23:10,320 --> 01:23:12,840
Speaker 2: So and for me, it's like I was guiding a ton,

1489
01:23:13,000 --> 01:23:14,840
Speaker 2: you know. So like people are paying you to find

1490
01:23:14,880 --> 01:23:21,040
Speaker 2: the bear. Well, ha, Well, if there's anybody on a

1491
01:23:21,080 --> 01:23:24,360
Speaker 2: carcass that's out there, it's probably gonna be a bear,

1492
01:23:25,080 --> 01:23:27,000
Speaker 2: you know. So you got to listen to the raven.

1493
01:23:27,680 --> 01:23:29,360
Speaker 2: You got to watch the duck. So I don't I

1494
01:23:29,520 --> 01:23:31,360
Speaker 2: want to see a wolf, you know some people I like,

1495
01:23:31,439 --> 01:23:35,759
Speaker 2: I don't care. You gotta watch everything here because everything

1496
01:23:35,880 --> 01:23:38,680
Speaker 2: has a response and a relationship with everything else. And

1497
01:23:38,720 --> 01:23:40,680
Speaker 2: the more you pay attention to that, the more you're

1498
01:23:40,720 --> 01:23:45,280
Speaker 2: gonna see all those connections start done, just blossom. And

1499
01:23:45,320 --> 01:23:49,519
Speaker 2: what's even more cool is when you see the position

1500
01:23:49,920 --> 01:23:55,000
Speaker 2: you yourself hold you're being talked about. They respond to you,

1501
01:23:55,080 --> 01:23:58,080
Speaker 2: Steve different than you, Brody different than you can and

1502
01:23:58,560 --> 01:24:01,880
Speaker 2: they respond or eating our dogs dog has a different

1503
01:24:01,880 --> 01:24:05,519
Speaker 2: bark for the ups guy because he gives them snacks.

1504
01:24:05,560 --> 01:24:08,719
Speaker 2: Definitely different bark for the FedEx guy. No snacks there,

1505
01:24:09,600 --> 01:24:12,519
Speaker 2: different bark for the neighbor knows that guy pretty well.

1506
01:24:13,200 --> 01:24:16,799
Speaker 2: Different bark for or behaviors when one of the family

1507
01:24:16,880 --> 01:24:20,519
Speaker 2: comes home so we're not in isolation of this, you know,

1508
01:24:20,800 --> 01:24:23,320
Speaker 2: as it's seen in the wild world, like we're doing it,

1509
01:24:23,600 --> 01:24:26,360
Speaker 2: our pets are doing it. It's just paying attention a

1510
01:24:26,400 --> 01:24:28,559
Speaker 2: little bit more so that you start seeing in the

1511
01:24:28,560 --> 01:24:30,679
Speaker 2: places that you want to know more.

1512
01:24:30,960 --> 01:24:34,320
Speaker 1: Our dog has a greeting for people whose house she

1513
01:24:34,400 --> 01:24:35,400
Speaker 1: has stayed at before.

1514
01:24:36,160 --> 01:24:39,599
Speaker 4: What is it? Just a level of like swirling around,

1515
01:24:39,720 --> 01:24:41,800
Speaker 4: make the wine. You know, it's like rolling over on

1516
01:24:41,840 --> 01:24:46,360
Speaker 4: her back. That means she's like been dog sat by them. Yeah.

1517
01:24:46,439 --> 01:24:48,280
Speaker 1: Well, the crazy thing is like if you haven't done that,

1518
01:24:48,439 --> 01:24:49,680
Speaker 1: she's not gonna do it right.

1519
01:24:50,920 --> 01:24:54,599
Speaker 2: It's true. It's so true. And like literally three mornings ago,

1520
01:24:54,640 --> 01:24:56,559
Speaker 2: my wife and I are working at the dining room

1521
01:24:56,600 --> 01:24:59,639
Speaker 2: table and our dog, We've got a black lab Hobbs.

1522
01:24:59,720 --> 01:25:03,599
Speaker 2: Hobb starts going bananas like ape shit. I'm like, what

1523
01:25:03,920 --> 01:25:07,080
Speaker 2: he only does that level of craziness for the ups guy,

1524
01:25:07,720 --> 01:25:10,519
Speaker 2: or if the neighbor's dog comes in the yard because

1525
01:25:10,560 --> 01:25:13,680
Speaker 2: he wants to go play, right, I'm like, what is it?

1526
01:25:13,800 --> 01:25:16,200
Speaker 2: He's just like bouncing. It almost looked like a coonhound.

1527
01:25:16,200 --> 01:25:19,040
Speaker 2: You know, it's babe, you know, treat to a raccoon

1528
01:25:19,800 --> 01:25:22,000
Speaker 2: bouncing on his front feet. Bark and barking, barking, And

1529
01:25:22,080 --> 01:25:24,400
Speaker 2: I look out the front door before I let him out,

1530
01:25:24,520 --> 01:25:26,640
Speaker 2: and here's a bobcat walking up the stairs from the

1531
01:25:26,640 --> 01:25:29,439
Speaker 2: lower yard into the upper yard, twenty feet from the

1532
01:25:29,720 --> 01:25:32,360
Speaker 2: from the door, and then just veers off and through

1533
01:25:32,400 --> 01:25:34,200
Speaker 2: the yard. You'd see those tracks. You're like, oh, yeah,

1534
01:25:34,200 --> 01:25:36,760
Speaker 2: that bobcat came through the night, Like, no, dude, it

1535
01:25:36,800 --> 01:25:39,439
Speaker 2: was ten thirty in the morning. We were working and

1536
01:25:39,479 --> 01:25:43,320
Speaker 2: we would have missed it had hobs or in other cases,

1537
01:25:43,320 --> 01:25:46,479
Speaker 2: we've seen lines in our yard because the magpies told us.

1538
01:25:47,600 --> 01:25:49,560
Speaker 2: You know, we had a line with four kittens in

1539
01:25:49,600 --> 01:25:53,040
Speaker 2: our yard this spring and they disappeared after a while.

1540
01:25:53,439 --> 01:25:55,360
Speaker 2: Didn't think we'd see him again. And we're sitting on

1541
01:25:55,360 --> 01:25:58,479
Speaker 2: the porch, my wife and I and Jenny says hear that.

1542
01:25:59,160 --> 01:26:03,720
Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, magpies. Magpies. When they are social and

1543
01:26:03,760 --> 01:26:09,000
Speaker 2: just hanging out together, they'll go yeka, can hear it

1544
01:26:09,040 --> 01:26:11,200
Speaker 2: in different places they're just checking in. But when it

1545
01:26:11,240 --> 01:26:15,280
Speaker 2: goes down ye yah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

1546
01:26:15,640 --> 01:26:18,960
Speaker 2: it's like that's what we heard. And she says there's

1547
01:26:18,960 --> 01:26:22,080
Speaker 2: something down there. I'm like, I know, and she no

1548
01:26:22,200 --> 01:26:25,519
Speaker 2: more than stands up walks less than the distance from

1549
01:26:25,520 --> 01:26:27,719
Speaker 2: here to Brody looks over the railing into the lower

1550
01:26:27,800 --> 01:26:31,800
Speaker 2: yard and she says, fucking lion. And because of the

1551
01:26:31,840 --> 01:26:33,679
Speaker 2: fore warning, he had enough time running the house, grab

1552
01:26:33,680 --> 01:26:35,960
Speaker 2: her camera and got this killer footage of the cat

1553
01:26:36,040 --> 01:26:42,520
Speaker 2: walking like thirty feet from the corner of our deckoree

1554
01:26:42,560 --> 01:26:46,519
Speaker 2: in the afternoon, when you least expect it. It's like

1555
01:26:46,920 --> 01:26:50,400
Speaker 2: when your life is on the line, like a magpie

1556
01:26:50,439 --> 01:26:53,120
Speaker 2: who might be whacked by a wild cat, or a

1557
01:26:53,240 --> 01:26:55,760
Speaker 2: raven who might get whacked by an eagle, like look

1558
01:26:55,800 --> 01:26:57,880
Speaker 2: to those things that their lives depend on most, and

1559
01:26:57,880 --> 01:27:00,840
Speaker 2: then you just start seeing this, this whole scene open up.

1560
01:27:00,960 --> 01:27:04,519
Speaker 2: Is that's why they're talking that way, and you're just

1561
01:27:05,040 --> 01:27:07,240
Speaker 2: you're just an eavesdropper listening. I was like, oh, whoa,

1562
01:27:08,040 --> 01:27:12,000
Speaker 2: Like ravens have a specific call for golden eagles. Some

1563
01:27:12,080 --> 01:27:16,479
Speaker 2: things seem generic, but some things are extremely specific. And

1564
01:27:17,080 --> 01:27:18,960
Speaker 2: this one and it can take a while, Like this

1565
01:27:19,000 --> 01:27:21,880
Speaker 2: one took me about five years to figure out what

1566
01:27:21,920 --> 01:27:24,160
Speaker 2: the heck it meant. I'd heard it. I'm like, WHOA,

1567
01:27:24,200 --> 01:27:29,880
Speaker 2: that's different. I can't figure it out. Flying high just

1568
01:27:29,920 --> 01:27:34,120
Speaker 2: making noise right, No, No, that's what happens when there's

1569
01:27:34,120 --> 01:27:34,800
Speaker 2: a golden eagle?

1570
01:27:35,040 --> 01:27:35,800
Speaker 4: What is that noise?

1571
01:27:35,880 --> 01:27:35,960
Speaker 5: Like?

1572
01:27:36,400 --> 01:27:40,760
Speaker 2: So it's a very consistent, uniform series of notes to

1573
01:27:40,880 --> 01:27:53,080
Speaker 2: just go on and and it's it's serious. And I

1574
01:27:53,120 --> 01:27:55,439
Speaker 2: was having lunch with a guy who runs the bird

1575
01:27:55,479 --> 01:27:59,680
Speaker 2: programs in Yellstone. I'm like, hey, Dave, you did you

1576
01:27:59,680 --> 01:28:00,880
Speaker 2: graduate working on golden eagles?

1577
01:28:00,920 --> 01:28:01,040
Speaker 4: Right?

1578
01:28:01,360 --> 01:28:05,120
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah. He's like, you know this raven call. I've

1579
01:28:05,120 --> 01:28:07,120
Speaker 2: been hearing this raven call. I'm pretty sure it's just

1580
01:28:07,160 --> 01:28:10,519
Speaker 2: for goldens. He's like, oh yeah, that's exactly what we

1581
01:28:10,600 --> 01:28:13,479
Speaker 2: listened for to know to get the eagle traps ready

1582
01:28:13,479 --> 01:28:14,280
Speaker 2: because one's coming.

1583
01:28:14,680 --> 01:28:20,000
Speaker 4: Oh really, why are they tuned into goldens?

1584
01:28:20,439 --> 01:28:21,160
Speaker 2: They're killers?

1585
01:28:21,280 --> 01:28:22,920
Speaker 4: So goldens will kill them off of those.

1586
01:28:24,680 --> 01:28:28,000
Speaker 2: I've only seen it twice myself. It happens more, but

1587
01:28:28,040 --> 01:28:29,000
Speaker 2: it's really infrequent.

1588
01:28:29,080 --> 01:28:30,680
Speaker 4: But he wants he wants to eat it.

1589
01:28:30,880 --> 01:28:34,559
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, they're eating them. It's like a difference between

1590
01:28:34,680 --> 01:28:38,080
Speaker 2: a wolf killing a coyote versus a lion. Lion will

1591
01:28:38,120 --> 01:28:44,439
Speaker 2: eat you. Wolf just kills you, you know, till the

1592
01:28:44,439 --> 01:28:48,679
Speaker 2: their level of response is different. That line is gonna

1593
01:28:48,760 --> 01:28:53,519
Speaker 2: hunt you. That wolf is gonna opportunistically kill you because

1594
01:28:53,520 --> 01:28:58,080
Speaker 2: you're filching off. It's kill and they know these variations.

1595
01:28:58,080 --> 01:28:59,880
Speaker 2: So I asked Dave and Likes to have, you know,

1596
01:29:00,200 --> 01:29:02,920
Speaker 2: a variation for bald eagles, because I think I have,

1597
01:29:03,880 --> 01:29:06,320
Speaker 2: and he's like, nah, you know, he wasn't doing research

1598
01:29:06,360 --> 01:29:09,040
Speaker 2: on them, so he didn't. But on the spectrum of

1599
01:29:09,240 --> 01:29:12,920
Speaker 2: raven chasing another raven off versus raven chasing a golden

1600
01:29:12,960 --> 01:29:17,280
Speaker 2: eagle off back from that golden eagle, end of the

1601
01:29:17,320 --> 01:29:19,640
Speaker 2: spectrum is something that has a few more gaps in it,

1602
01:29:19,720 --> 01:29:23,880
Speaker 2: a few more bits of inflection. And it's hard because

1603
01:29:24,320 --> 01:29:28,160
Speaker 2: you see the value of indigenous knowledge of a landscape

1604
01:29:28,200 --> 01:29:32,080
Speaker 2: because I only get maybe half a dozen of these

1605
01:29:32,439 --> 01:29:36,240
Speaker 2: in a lifetime, some of these behaviors and calls. But

1606
01:29:36,320 --> 01:29:39,360
Speaker 2: if you've got one hundred other people who listen for

1607
01:29:39,439 --> 01:29:42,439
Speaker 2: exactly the same thing for a couple of thousand years,

1608
01:29:42,680 --> 01:29:45,680
Speaker 2: and you're telling the stories, yeah, you see why the

1609
01:29:45,680 --> 01:29:48,479
Speaker 2: bushmen are so damn good. But I've been able to

1610
01:29:48,479 --> 01:29:50,439
Speaker 2: call it on bald a few times. You know, you

1611
01:29:50,479 --> 01:29:57,240
Speaker 2: hear and I don't know if you can hear the

1612
01:29:57,280 --> 01:30:01,720
Speaker 2: differences in there. It's not that and it's not the

1613
01:30:01,800 --> 01:30:07,479
Speaker 2: raven chasing another raven. There's a little more insistence to it.

1614
01:30:07,520 --> 01:30:10,400
Speaker 2: There's a little more uniformity, but compared to the Golden Eagle,

1615
01:30:10,600 --> 01:30:14,439
Speaker 2: there's still more inflection, there's more spacing in there, and

1616
01:30:15,400 --> 01:30:16,920
Speaker 2: they're doing those things for a reason.

1617
01:30:17,880 --> 01:30:20,000
Speaker 3: It's all this stuff like are you doing all this

1618
01:30:20,800 --> 01:30:24,519
Speaker 3: just kind of based on memory and things you're hearing

1619
01:30:24,560 --> 01:30:29,240
Speaker 3: repetitively out while you're out are like, are you recording

1620
01:30:29,280 --> 01:30:32,320
Speaker 3: it all to like listen to this stuff and get

1621
01:30:32,439 --> 01:30:33,360
Speaker 3: nuance out of it?

1622
01:30:33,479 --> 01:30:37,120
Speaker 2: Or is it just for years? For twenty plus years,

1623
01:30:37,160 --> 01:30:41,400
Speaker 2: it's been me just listening in ways other people haven't

1624
01:30:41,439 --> 01:30:47,080
Speaker 2: been and making some connections and missing most right. But

1625
01:30:47,200 --> 01:30:50,439
Speaker 2: what's really cool right now is my friend's kind of

1626
01:30:50,439 --> 01:30:53,760
Speaker 2: at the center of initiating a bioacoustics project in Yellstone,

1627
01:30:54,160 --> 01:30:58,880
Speaker 2: which at the most specific level is wanting to disentangle

1628
01:30:59,000 --> 01:31:02,200
Speaker 2: wolf language. You know, can you sense this a wolf

1629
01:31:02,200 --> 01:31:05,080
Speaker 2: population in a place like Colorado? Can you keep wolves

1630
01:31:05,120 --> 01:31:08,479
Speaker 2: out of a place by playing certain types of howls

1631
01:31:08,680 --> 01:31:11,519
Speaker 2: in an area to keep them on of cattle? Right?

1632
01:31:11,800 --> 01:31:14,360
Speaker 2: So they're doing more or less the basic research, though

1633
01:31:14,400 --> 01:31:17,760
Speaker 2: it's just based you're putting out all these recorders and

1634
01:31:17,840 --> 01:31:21,280
Speaker 2: recording twenty four by seven, three hundred and sixty five

1635
01:31:21,320 --> 01:31:24,040
Speaker 2: days a year. But you're not just getting wolves. You're

1636
01:31:24,040 --> 01:31:26,240
Speaker 2: getting everything. You're getting all the ravens, you're getting all

1637
01:31:26,240 --> 01:31:30,439
Speaker 2: the bis in conversation, You're getting everything. And we've got

1638
01:31:30,479 --> 01:31:33,000
Speaker 2: one of them in our yard a part of this project.

1639
01:31:33,400 --> 01:31:36,240
Speaker 2: So what I have now is a spreadsheet on my

1640
01:31:36,280 --> 01:31:39,760
Speaker 2: phone where I see a raven chase a golden eagle over.

1641
01:31:40,160 --> 01:31:42,840
Speaker 2: I just make them time and date stamp and a

1642
01:31:42,920 --> 01:31:45,559
Speaker 2: note of behavior in my phone. And now I can

1643
01:31:45,600 --> 01:31:48,160
Speaker 2: actually go back because you're you all have this. If

1644
01:31:48,200 --> 01:31:51,760
Speaker 2: you're trying to take a photo of something, you're trying

1645
01:31:51,760 --> 01:31:54,759
Speaker 2: to record something, it's over before you're done, especially these things.

1646
01:31:56,080 --> 01:31:59,800
Speaker 2: I only have a few data points ever, but this

1647
01:31:59,880 --> 01:32:00,200
Speaker 2: is but.

1648
01:32:00,160 --> 01:32:01,240
Speaker 4: This is not always running.

1649
01:32:01,320 --> 01:32:03,639
Speaker 2: It's always running. So I can now make a note

1650
01:32:03,680 --> 01:32:07,599
Speaker 2: and I'm like raven being you know, chased by this

1651
01:32:07,720 --> 01:32:10,120
Speaker 2: or raven chasing that I can go back to the

1652
01:32:10,160 --> 01:32:12,080
Speaker 2: sound recordings and listen to it over and over and

1653
01:32:12,120 --> 01:32:17,920
Speaker 2: it's context totally. That's where this AI stuff is really

1654
01:32:18,000 --> 01:32:22,240
Speaker 2: cool on one level with wildlife acoustics and other behaviors,

1655
01:32:22,400 --> 01:32:26,799
Speaker 2: but you still need the field time. You still need

1656
01:32:26,840 --> 01:32:29,760
Speaker 2: somebody who's died in the wool in the field, and

1657
01:32:29,800 --> 01:32:32,640
Speaker 2: that's all they do to interpret that data. Otherwise just

1658
01:32:32,760 --> 01:32:37,240
Speaker 2: it's just noise. So that's the part I really enjoy,

1659
01:32:37,320 --> 01:32:41,559
Speaker 2: and I like, I'm really wanting to figure out. I

1660
01:32:41,600 --> 01:32:45,120
Speaker 2: have a strong suspicion of what the alarm coyotes use

1661
01:32:45,320 --> 01:32:49,439
Speaker 2: for when they encounter a cougar. It's different than when

1662
01:32:49,479 --> 01:32:53,280
Speaker 2: they find a wolf because they're bad dudes, and they're

1663
01:32:53,320 --> 01:32:56,280
Speaker 2: going to tell everybody about it. They want them known

1664
01:32:56,760 --> 01:33:00,160
Speaker 2: and they want to avoid them themselves and their families.

1665
01:33:01,600 --> 01:33:06,160
Speaker 2: But I've only had four instances where I can verify

1666
01:33:06,360 --> 01:33:10,480
Speaker 2: that that coyote through snow tracking or somebody else's observations,

1667
01:33:10,520 --> 01:33:14,679
Speaker 2: that kyote was barking at a cougar one data point.

1668
01:33:15,920 --> 01:33:18,880
Speaker 2: And I hope this bioacoustics stuff is allow us to

1669
01:33:19,000 --> 01:33:22,000
Speaker 2: then go in because like he and I hooked up

1670
01:33:22,439 --> 01:33:25,400
Speaker 2: with a high school honors student kid wanted a project

1671
01:33:25,400 --> 01:33:27,559
Speaker 2: on wildlife. So we're like, great, we need to train

1672
01:33:27,600 --> 01:33:30,400
Speaker 2: the AI model. So we had him go listen to

1673
01:33:30,479 --> 01:33:33,360
Speaker 2: a bunch of stuff and accumulate enough howls to say,

1674
01:33:33,680 --> 01:33:35,760
Speaker 2: this is a howl. It's not an airplane, This is

1675
01:33:35,800 --> 01:33:37,960
Speaker 2: a howl. It's not a truck. This is a howl

1676
01:33:38,000 --> 01:33:40,840
Speaker 2: of a wolf, not a coyote, so that then you

1677
01:33:40,840 --> 01:33:43,400
Speaker 2: can let the machine listen to a year's worth of

1678
01:33:43,439 --> 01:33:46,559
Speaker 2: recordings without you having to sit there for a year

1679
01:33:46,800 --> 01:33:49,439
Speaker 2: for every single unit, and you know, isolate all the

1680
01:33:50,280 --> 01:33:54,000
Speaker 2: right And you know, there's been an explosion in the

1681
01:33:54,000 --> 01:33:56,799
Speaker 2: amount of info out there in the research world about

1682
01:33:56,800 --> 01:34:00,840
Speaker 2: this kind of stuff in the last fifteen years. Like

1683
01:34:00,880 --> 01:34:03,519
Speaker 2: a friend wrote a book in h came out in

1684
01:34:03,640 --> 01:34:06,320
Speaker 2: twenty twelve called What the Robin Knows by John Young.

1685
01:34:07,240 --> 01:34:09,280
Speaker 2: They had they had to scratch and dig to find

1686
01:34:09,320 --> 01:34:13,800
Speaker 2: any documentation that talked about any of this stuff. You know,

1687
01:34:13,880 --> 01:34:16,640
Speaker 2: everybody's got the app now, like here's the Song of

1688
01:34:16,680 --> 01:34:21,120
Speaker 2: the Robin, you know, here's the Song of the Phoebe.

1689
01:34:21,160 --> 01:34:23,680
Speaker 2: You know all these What they don't tell you and

1690
01:34:23,720 --> 01:34:26,520
Speaker 2: they can't is what the hell that actually means.

1691
01:34:26,600 --> 01:34:26,760
Speaker 1: You know.

1692
01:34:28,200 --> 01:34:33,080
Speaker 2: And so there's been a lot more research in that

1693
01:34:33,200 --> 01:34:38,040
Speaker 2: field recently, which is just it's pointing to the complexity

1694
01:34:38,080 --> 01:34:41,920
Speaker 2: that we've been ignoring as modern humans for a long

1695
01:34:42,040 --> 01:34:46,800
Speaker 2: darn time. And as it's fun. You know, you don't

1696
01:34:46,840 --> 01:34:50,800
Speaker 2: need expensive equipment to engage with this stuff. You just

1697
01:34:50,960 --> 01:34:54,200
Speaker 2: you don't even need binoculars. Just listen. Well, I don't

1698
01:34:54,200 --> 01:34:56,120
Speaker 2: have good hearing anymore. I shot too many guns or

1699
01:34:56,320 --> 01:34:58,479
Speaker 2: like me, you know, power tools and guns, and you know,

1700
01:34:58,479 --> 01:35:01,280
Speaker 2: I got compromised hearing. But it's not about what you

1701
01:35:01,439 --> 01:35:05,160
Speaker 2: can hear or can see. It's what you do with

1702
01:35:05,160 --> 01:35:09,400
Speaker 2: what you can hear and see. Like I noticed a

1703
01:35:09,439 --> 01:35:11,400
Speaker 2: friend of mine who's had a lot of the same history.

1704
01:35:11,720 --> 01:35:14,680
Speaker 2: We pick up on cars on dirt road, a lot

1705
01:35:14,720 --> 01:35:18,519
Speaker 2: further off than our wives do. Get the dogs, Get

1706
01:35:18,560 --> 01:35:20,120
Speaker 2: the dogs in out of the road, Like, what are

1707
01:35:20,160 --> 01:35:21,680
Speaker 2: you talking about. There's a car coming. Yeah, there's a

1708
01:35:21,720 --> 01:35:25,360
Speaker 2: car coming. I don't hear it. Well, just give it

1709
01:35:25,400 --> 01:35:28,519
Speaker 2: a sec you know, and there it comes. So each

1710
01:35:28,560 --> 01:35:30,640
Speaker 2: of us comes to the to the game with a

1711
01:35:30,680 --> 01:35:33,280
Speaker 2: slightly different set of superpowers, if you want to put

1712
01:35:33,320 --> 01:35:36,519
Speaker 2: it that way. And we're tuning into things in ways

1713
01:35:36,520 --> 01:35:39,360
Speaker 2: that you aren't, or you're tuning in stuff that I don't,

1714
01:35:39,360 --> 01:35:41,240
Speaker 2: which is in some ways, like I don't like to

1715
01:35:41,240 --> 01:35:43,840
Speaker 2: give a lot of instruction on this stuff because I

1716
01:35:43,920 --> 01:35:45,760
Speaker 2: want to hear what you find. And if I tell

1717
01:35:45,800 --> 01:35:48,080
Speaker 2: you what to look for, that's all you're going to see.

1718
01:35:49,280 --> 01:35:52,160
Speaker 2: You follow me, you know, So I really it's like, yeah,

1719
01:35:52,240 --> 01:35:54,400
Speaker 2: I'm gonna tell you some cool stuff to get you

1720
01:35:54,960 --> 01:35:57,760
Speaker 2: started plant that seed, but man, I really want you

1721
01:35:57,800 --> 01:36:01,639
Speaker 2: to do this on your own and te me what

1722
01:36:01,720 --> 01:36:05,040
Speaker 2: you find. Oh yeah, the lions, you know, the Kyle's

1723
01:36:05,040 --> 01:36:06,679
Speaker 2: do that at the lion, but it's when the lion's

1724
01:36:06,720 --> 01:36:10,280
Speaker 2: behaving like this. So like when that bobcat came through

1725
01:36:10,280 --> 01:36:11,880
Speaker 2: the yard the other day, I did get a small

1726
01:36:11,920 --> 01:36:14,920
Speaker 2: recording of the magpies, and it was nothing like what

1727
01:36:15,000 --> 01:36:19,800
Speaker 2: I would point out and say, bobcat over there. And

1728
01:36:19,840 --> 01:36:24,520
Speaker 2: what you start to realize is there oftentimes talking about

1729
01:36:24,760 --> 01:36:29,559
Speaker 2: Sure they're talking about the animal specifically, but as well

1730
01:36:29,680 --> 01:36:32,920
Speaker 2: in that mix as them talking about that animal's behavior,

1731
01:36:33,800 --> 01:36:37,040
Speaker 2: it's intention, you might say. So when a cat is hunting,

1732
01:36:37,600 --> 01:36:40,920
Speaker 2: those alarms go through the roof, they'd light up the woods.

1733
01:36:41,000 --> 01:36:42,680
Speaker 2: But if the cat like this one the other day,

1734
01:36:42,680 --> 01:36:44,960
Speaker 2: it was just kind of like walking through the yard.

1735
01:36:45,160 --> 01:36:45,439
Speaker 4: You know, it.

1736
01:36:45,520 --> 01:36:48,400
Speaker 2: Drops off the retaining wall, sits down on a log

1737
01:36:48,520 --> 01:36:53,799
Speaker 2: in the little cops of cottonwoods. Yeah, yeah, there's a trouble,

1738
01:36:53,880 --> 01:36:57,439
Speaker 2: but we're not ratting it out like crazy, you know.

1739
01:36:57,560 --> 01:37:01,000
Speaker 2: So in many cases you can you can actually read

1740
01:37:01,160 --> 01:37:04,519
Speaker 2: into the behavior. You can read into the direction in

1741
01:37:04,560 --> 01:37:07,000
Speaker 2: the animals moving. Like so when the kyote is alarming

1742
01:37:07,040 --> 01:37:11,519
Speaker 2: at something like us. Naturally, they'll often shadow it as

1743
01:37:11,600 --> 01:37:16,439
Speaker 2: it progresses, so you'd be like, Okay, there's a there's

1744
01:37:16,439 --> 01:37:20,120
Speaker 2: a wolf over there, and it's going right to left

1745
01:37:20,120 --> 01:37:22,840
Speaker 2: at a trot, I think, and if we want to

1746
01:37:22,880 --> 01:37:25,040
Speaker 2: see it, we're going to have to go over on

1747
01:37:25,080 --> 01:37:27,679
Speaker 2: the hill here where we're down wind. You can start

1748
01:37:27,720 --> 01:37:31,000
Speaker 2: doing these predictive things that our ancestors were using intimately

1749
01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:37,200
Speaker 2: because they're hunting with rocks and sticks, need everything, and

1750
01:37:37,600 --> 01:37:40,200
Speaker 2: this is one of those tools that helps you on

1751
01:37:40,240 --> 01:37:44,200
Speaker 2: that razor's edge of survival. It's like the you know

1752
01:37:45,280 --> 01:37:47,840
Speaker 2: the crow Indian, you know Crow tribal folks here, they

1753
01:37:47,840 --> 01:37:49,920
Speaker 2: had to know Crowfair. I don't know if you guys

1754
01:37:49,960 --> 01:37:51,760
Speaker 2: have been to Crowfair, but they were just a few

1755
01:37:51,840 --> 01:37:54,160
Speaker 2: years ago. A twitter with the fact this one elder

1756
01:37:54,280 --> 01:37:57,280
Speaker 2: was coming out of the mountains to tend and this

1757
01:37:57,400 --> 01:38:00,200
Speaker 2: photographer friend of mine got to meet him, and you know,

1758
01:38:00,240 --> 01:38:04,519
Speaker 2: he's very low key asking questions, and the elder asked

1759
01:38:04,520 --> 01:38:06,519
Speaker 2: this friend of mine, He's like, so, you know what

1760
01:38:06,560 --> 01:38:09,320
Speaker 2: do you do. I'm a photographer? You so, oh, what

1761
01:38:09,360 --> 01:38:13,120
Speaker 2: do you like to photograph? Bears and wolves and otters

1762
01:38:13,160 --> 01:38:15,040
Speaker 2: and stuff like that? You want to know where every

1763
01:38:15,040 --> 01:38:18,360
Speaker 2: bear is, every wolf is. He's like, yeah, he's like

1764
01:38:18,400 --> 01:38:20,960
Speaker 2: getting his notebook out. He's like, you know, thinking he's

1765
01:38:21,000 --> 01:38:24,920
Speaker 2: gonna draw map, and he's like, he says, no. He says,

1766
01:38:24,960 --> 01:38:27,920
Speaker 2: you listen to the birds. He says, they're like our women,

1767
01:38:28,320 --> 01:38:29,719
Speaker 2: the gossip about everything.

1768
01:38:30,680 --> 01:38:34,360
Speaker 8: Yeah, you know that's some deep wisdom right there, because

1769
01:38:35,520 --> 01:38:38,120
Speaker 8: it's going on all the time, but we just don't

1770
01:38:38,160 --> 01:38:40,839
Speaker 8: give it the credit it's due.

1771
01:38:42,240 --> 01:38:47,840
Speaker 1: What ah, What other animals that people that people listen

1772
01:38:48,000 --> 01:38:52,240
Speaker 1: would know would have a familiar familiarity with the with

1773
01:38:52,320 --> 01:38:53,920
Speaker 1: the vocabulary already?

1774
01:38:54,439 --> 01:38:58,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, great ones likerels. Okay, well in North America at least,

1775
01:38:58,040 --> 01:38:59,840
Speaker 2: you know, gray squirrel is a great one. They're in Europe,

1776
01:39:00,040 --> 01:39:02,200
Speaker 2: you know, they've been introduced to Europe and there a

1777
01:39:02,280 --> 01:39:05,920
Speaker 2: plague over there. But again, nature doesn't care whether you're

1778
01:39:05,960 --> 01:39:11,120
Speaker 2: non native or native. Everybody's contributions to this community conversation

1779
01:39:11,439 --> 01:39:16,720
Speaker 2: is equal and listened to. So gray squirrels. If you

1780
01:39:16,760 --> 01:39:19,040
Speaker 2: spend time in the woods, you know something's coming through

1781
01:39:19,080 --> 01:39:22,920
Speaker 2: when you hear what what what?

1782
01:39:20,960 --> 01:39:21,000
Speaker 4: What?

1783
01:39:25,800 --> 01:39:28,320
Speaker 2: Which is in contrast to.

1784
01:39:32,760 --> 01:39:39,560
Speaker 4: Does it ever hear that one? But without the yes.

1785
01:39:39,479 --> 01:39:44,599
Speaker 2: Exactly look up? That is typically for a threat from

1786
01:39:44,600 --> 01:39:45,000
Speaker 2: the air.

1787
01:39:46,560 --> 01:39:48,800
Speaker 4: He leaves off the couple like whatever.

1788
01:39:48,600 --> 01:39:53,920
Speaker 2: The chucks or chucks. The chucks are typically something on

1789
01:39:54,000 --> 01:39:57,080
Speaker 2: the ground. Same with red squirrels.

1790
01:39:58,920 --> 01:40:00,880
Speaker 4: That's him, that's something tally.

1791
01:40:00,520 --> 01:40:03,160
Speaker 2: On the ground. There's some there's some debate in the

1792
01:40:03,160 --> 01:40:07,080
Speaker 2: scientific community over what that actually means. And no, it

1793
01:40:07,080 --> 01:40:09,320
Speaker 2: doesn't mean that. It means this, and we don't know.

1794
01:40:09,400 --> 01:40:12,840
Speaker 2: And the bottom line is the squirrels. Now listen to

1795
01:40:12,880 --> 01:40:22,240
Speaker 2: the squirrels, spend time with the squirrels, because when they got.

1796
01:40:18,720 --> 01:40:22,720
Speaker 4: That one, what does that mean? Because there got a

1797
01:40:22,800 --> 01:40:25,439
Speaker 4: version that just means I'm mad at another squirrel.

1798
01:40:25,720 --> 01:40:29,639
Speaker 2: There is that. Yeah, you can't discount that, that's for sure, Like, dude,

1799
01:40:29,640 --> 01:40:30,479
Speaker 2: get out of my midden.

1800
01:40:30,560 --> 01:40:34,200
Speaker 1: I wish, I wish I could isolate the one because

1801
01:40:34,200 --> 01:40:36,679
Speaker 1: I'm really interested in the one where he sees something.

1802
01:40:38,280 --> 01:40:40,240
Speaker 4: But then a lot of times you'd be watching him.

1803
01:40:40,080 --> 01:40:42,160
Speaker 1: From a fire and he'd be like he's fired up

1804
01:40:42,200 --> 01:40:44,639
Speaker 1: because he's fired up at that squirrel. Yeah, you know,

1805
01:40:44,840 --> 01:40:47,400
Speaker 1: he's not telling about some elk coming down the trail.

1806
01:40:47,439 --> 01:40:48,679
Speaker 4: He's like pissed at a squirrel.

1807
01:40:49,400 --> 01:40:52,599
Speaker 2: And what's really crazy cool is not only is are

1808
01:40:52,680 --> 01:40:56,720
Speaker 2: most of these things innate in these species. So like

1809
01:40:56,720 --> 01:41:00,719
Speaker 2: those vervet monkeys, they are wired from birth to yell

1810
01:41:00,800 --> 01:41:05,000
Speaker 2: at the leopard like they do you think, so we know.

1811
01:41:05,080 --> 01:41:09,800
Speaker 2: So what they don't always have, well, yes and no.

1812
01:41:10,160 --> 01:41:12,760
Speaker 2: What they need is refinement of how to use that.

1813
01:41:13,240 --> 01:41:15,680
Speaker 2: So like young ones they've seen in those verbts, like

1814
01:41:15,760 --> 01:41:18,920
Speaker 2: adults basically like cuff the kids like, shut up that

1815
01:41:19,000 --> 01:41:21,719
Speaker 2: it's a root. It's a tree, root, it's not a snake.

1816
01:41:22,320 --> 01:41:23,120
Speaker 4: Oh all right.

1817
01:41:23,160 --> 01:41:26,840
Speaker 2: So there there are these innate tendencies, there's these innate alarms.

1818
01:41:27,000 --> 01:41:30,439
Speaker 2: But then there's also training that comes with the social

1819
01:41:30,520 --> 01:41:33,280
Speaker 2: arrangement that that helps them refine it so that the

1820
01:41:33,320 --> 01:41:36,400
Speaker 2: group can agree. Right, And that's also where you end

1821
01:41:36,479 --> 01:41:39,639
Speaker 2: up with these dialects. You know, the ravens on Vancouver Island, like, dude,

1822
01:41:39,640 --> 01:41:42,799
Speaker 2: they say stuff I've never heard before from here, Okay,

1823
01:41:43,240 --> 01:41:48,200
Speaker 2: totally different accent in California. Dude, he's on my surfboard.

1824
01:41:48,439 --> 01:41:51,400
Speaker 2: You know, it's like Manaier's you know, those ravens have

1825
01:41:51,439 --> 01:41:55,599
Speaker 2: different sounds, same in Alaska. Like you can see. Then

1826
01:41:55,640 --> 01:42:03,520
Speaker 2: it's like there are these pockets of agreed upon sound culture. Yeah,

1827
01:42:03,560 --> 01:42:11,120
Speaker 2: and they're talking about things in pretty complex ways. They're

1828
01:42:11,120 --> 01:42:13,960
Speaker 2: talking about us too, which I don't think a lot

1829
01:42:14,000 --> 01:42:16,640
Speaker 2: of people realize they're talking about us in ways that

1830
01:42:16,680 --> 01:42:21,360
Speaker 2: these wild communities are actually across species, not just across species,

1831
01:42:21,360 --> 01:42:26,360
Speaker 2: across genera family, order of organism that are all listening

1832
01:42:26,439 --> 01:42:29,800
Speaker 2: to each other simultaneously. So the mink is listening to

1833
01:42:29,880 --> 01:42:33,719
Speaker 2: the frogs, The frogs are listening to the owl, the

1834
01:42:33,720 --> 01:42:35,720
Speaker 2: the you know, the the owl is listening to the

1835
01:42:35,800 --> 01:42:39,400
Speaker 2: jet going overhead. You know, there's this this whole hierarchy

1836
01:42:39,560 --> 01:42:42,360
Speaker 2: of of order that.

1837
01:42:42,240 --> 01:42:45,479
Speaker 1: They have a great point that, like as much you're

1838
01:42:45,479 --> 01:42:48,640
Speaker 1: talking about trying to like sort figure out what the

1839
01:42:48,680 --> 01:42:51,200
Speaker 1: noises make, there's all these different noises that have to

1840
01:42:51,200 --> 01:42:55,120
Speaker 1: mean something. It's interesting to get into it, Like what

1841
01:42:55,200 --> 01:42:59,000
Speaker 1: are other animals? So here you are a human. Here

1842
01:42:59,000 --> 01:43:05,600
Speaker 1: you are one specie hearing an elk bugle, drawing conclusions

1843
01:43:05,600 --> 01:43:10,240
Speaker 1: from that, But that elk is listening to a pine squirrel,

1844
01:43:11,720 --> 01:43:12,880
Speaker 1: drawing conclusions from that.

1845
01:43:13,439 --> 01:43:16,160
Speaker 2: None of them are in isolation. We are the ones

1846
01:43:16,760 --> 01:43:17,440
Speaker 2: in isolation.

1847
01:43:17,520 --> 01:43:18,000
Speaker 4: We're the ones.

1848
01:43:20,240 --> 01:43:21,720
Speaker 2: And it's not like you got to go into a

1849
01:43:21,760 --> 01:43:24,759
Speaker 2: wild place to hear this. No Like, literally, I'm gassing

1850
01:43:24,840 --> 01:43:26,400
Speaker 2: up here and bows before I got here, and the

1851
01:43:26,479 --> 01:43:28,880
Speaker 2: chickeny is pissed off at something. I didn't see what

1852
01:43:28,880 --> 01:43:31,000
Speaker 2: it was, but I at least knew something's going on

1853
01:43:31,080 --> 01:43:35,320
Speaker 2: over there. I've done enough times walk over and be like, oh,

1854
01:43:35,880 --> 01:43:39,280
Speaker 2: I bet nobody in this neighborhoods seen that owl. Mmm,

1855
01:43:40,400 --> 01:43:42,679
Speaker 2: it's been sitting there, probably lived there its whole life,

1856
01:43:42,760 --> 01:43:46,120
Speaker 2: years and nobody's known that it's sitting right there.

1857
01:43:47,200 --> 01:43:49,000
Speaker 4: We had one hanging dead in that tree there today,

1858
01:43:49,040 --> 01:43:49,559
Speaker 4: din't you really?

1859
01:43:49,680 --> 01:43:51,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, what happened to it?

1860
01:43:51,800 --> 01:43:54,639
Speaker 1: We emailed or our texted one of the game wardens,

1861
01:43:55,400 --> 01:43:57,760
Speaker 1: and you said, there's so much avian influenza right now,

1862
01:43:57,760 --> 01:43:59,519
Speaker 1: and it's sitting the owls hard enough where they don't

1863
01:43:59,520 --> 01:44:02,679
Speaker 1: even they're out even testing all the birds anymore, that's said,

1864
01:44:03,640 --> 01:44:05,680
Speaker 1: And that's he was going to come by and grab it,

1865
01:44:05,720 --> 01:44:07,200
Speaker 1: but he was like, he's like, there's a lot.

1866
01:44:07,160 --> 01:44:09,600
Speaker 2: Pretty sure of it. Yeah, overwhelmed.

1867
01:44:09,680 --> 01:44:12,720
Speaker 4: And that's yeah, that's there's too many to check them

1868
01:44:12,720 --> 01:44:13,280
Speaker 4: all right now.

1869
01:44:14,040 --> 01:44:17,760
Speaker 2: That's what I lament is as we see biodiversity tanking

1870
01:44:18,200 --> 01:44:23,719
Speaker 2: around the globe, is we're losing these informants. We're losing

1871
01:44:23,720 --> 01:44:27,920
Speaker 2: these community members who are more than happy to welcome

1872
01:44:28,000 --> 01:44:30,599
Speaker 2: us in and share information with us. If we slow

1873
01:44:30,640 --> 01:44:33,519
Speaker 2: the hell down. Like something I do with the students

1874
01:44:33,520 --> 01:44:35,640
Speaker 2: that I have done for years is I'll take him

1875
01:44:35,640 --> 01:44:39,960
Speaker 2: out somewhere in the park and I said, everybody puts

1876
01:44:40,000 --> 01:44:43,840
Speaker 2: your phones, your watches, everything in a bag. Pull out

1877
01:44:43,840 --> 01:44:45,799
Speaker 2: a notepad or a piece of paper and a pencil.

1878
01:44:45,840 --> 01:44:48,120
Speaker 2: That's all you're allowed to have. Spread out, you know.

1879
01:44:48,160 --> 01:44:50,240
Speaker 2: So we all have everybody spread out for you know,

1880
01:44:50,280 --> 01:44:53,320
Speaker 2: a few yards between everybody over a let's say an acre,

1881
01:44:54,360 --> 01:44:56,679
Speaker 2: and we're going to sit for an hour, sixty minutes.

1882
01:44:56,720 --> 01:45:01,639
Speaker 2: That's it, sixty minutes and then and I just want

1883
01:45:01,680 --> 01:45:04,200
Speaker 2: you to look for any animals, you see, any sounds

1884
01:45:04,240 --> 01:45:08,320
Speaker 2: you hear, just jot them down, and we come together

1885
01:45:08,360 --> 01:45:12,680
Speaker 2: at the end of that. And I keep time, and

1886
01:45:12,720 --> 01:45:14,760
Speaker 2: they have a crude way for them to keep rough

1887
01:45:14,840 --> 01:45:18,120
Speaker 2: time stamps of when we're out there, so they can

1888
01:45:18,400 --> 01:45:23,280
Speaker 2: correlate certain things. And I'll say to them, what did

1889
01:45:23,280 --> 01:45:25,679
Speaker 2: you hear? Nothing?

1890
01:45:25,760 --> 01:45:25,920
Speaker 4: Man?

1891
01:45:25,960 --> 01:45:29,160
Speaker 2: There was nothing for like, I don't know, I thought

1892
01:45:29,200 --> 01:45:32,000
Speaker 2: I heard a chickadee like maybe minute, you know, around

1893
01:45:32,000 --> 01:45:34,120
Speaker 2: minute forty or when you made the signal for the

1894
01:45:34,160 --> 01:45:37,360
Speaker 2: fourth quarter or something like. There was nothing, and then

1895
01:45:37,400 --> 01:45:41,760
Speaker 2: there's stuff all over. I'm like anybody else notice that, Like, yeah,

1896
01:45:41,840 --> 01:45:44,799
Speaker 2: actually the nutatge came down the tree, I saw coyo.

1897
01:45:45,040 --> 01:45:51,200
Speaker 2: Like all these things start happening. I said, do you

1898
01:45:51,240 --> 01:45:56,439
Speaker 2: think us going in there screwed things up? Did they

1899
01:45:56,479 --> 01:45:59,880
Speaker 2: know we were coming? And you see the wheels starting?

1900
01:46:00,280 --> 01:46:04,519
Speaker 2: The answer to that is absolutely yes. The same signal

1901
01:46:04,520 --> 01:46:06,920
Speaker 2: system that's ratting out the Cooper's Hawk coming through the

1902
01:46:06,960 --> 01:46:10,200
Speaker 2: neighborhood or the owl perched up in this spruce is

1903
01:46:10,240 --> 01:46:14,240
Speaker 2: the same system that's telling everybody else about us.

1904
01:46:14,560 --> 01:46:18,280
Speaker 3: That's it super interesting from a hunting perspective because like

1905
01:46:19,240 --> 01:46:21,800
Speaker 3: you could be Glass and some mule deer that are

1906
01:46:21,840 --> 01:46:24,479
Speaker 3: saying a thousand yards away and you're like, they have

1907
01:46:24,560 --> 01:46:27,599
Speaker 3: no idea we're here, But maybe they do and they're

1908
01:46:27,640 --> 01:46:28,880
Speaker 3: just not worried about it yet.

1909
01:46:29,200 --> 01:46:33,400
Speaker 2: You know, they know the proximities, they know the priors.

1910
01:46:33,479 --> 01:46:37,240
Speaker 2: They know that squirrel isn't going to do that until

1911
01:46:37,280 --> 01:46:40,680
Speaker 2: it sees something of trouble. But they're three hundred four

1912
01:46:40,720 --> 01:46:41,559
Speaker 2: hundred yards down.

1913
01:46:42,400 --> 01:46:42,840
Speaker 4: Mm hmm.

1914
01:46:43,200 --> 01:46:45,280
Speaker 2: If we see the Kyle Hall and ass up through

1915
01:46:45,280 --> 01:46:48,360
Speaker 2: this meadow past us, we know that trouble's gotten about

1916
01:46:48,360 --> 01:46:53,240
Speaker 2: another one hundred yards closer. You know that ghost buck

1917
01:46:53,320 --> 01:46:57,080
Speaker 2: that nobody could ever harvest they at a very fine level.

1918
01:46:57,080 --> 01:47:00,920
Speaker 2: At that age had to be half to be tuning

1919
01:47:00,960 --> 01:47:06,200
Speaker 2: into these ultra fine details of alarm in their environment.

1920
01:47:06,240 --> 01:47:09,879
Speaker 2: And every species has a different threshold, you know, so Toey's,

1921
01:47:09,920 --> 01:47:13,040
Speaker 2: for instance, they're out of there so fast, or like ninjas,

1922
01:47:13,400 --> 01:47:15,439
Speaker 2: you just notice like they're gone, like where the hell

1923
01:47:15,520 --> 01:47:19,840
Speaker 2: they go. The sparrows, you know, pay attention and they

1924
01:47:19,840 --> 01:47:21,679
Speaker 2: make a couple of chip notes and then they take off,

1925
01:47:21,720 --> 01:47:23,960
Speaker 2: you know, and a couple of minutes later, here comes

1926
01:47:24,200 --> 01:47:27,240
Speaker 2: the dog has followed your trail into the woods.

1927
01:47:28,240 --> 01:47:30,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, when you're sneaking along thinking that the thing that's

1928
01:47:30,960 --> 01:47:33,600
Speaker 1: alerting stuff is you crunch and leaves and if you

1929
01:47:33,640 --> 01:47:36,799
Speaker 1: think about and you's like like the forest is alive

1930
01:47:36,840 --> 01:47:39,280
Speaker 1: with bird calls and whatever and squirrels and stuff. But

1931
01:47:39,360 --> 01:47:41,760
Speaker 1: you think it's like you step down a twig. Yeah,

1932
01:47:41,760 --> 01:47:43,679
Speaker 1: it's a good point. They might have been taught about

1933
01:47:43,720 --> 01:47:44,280
Speaker 1: you for forever.

1934
01:47:44,320 --> 01:47:48,280
Speaker 2: Man the turkey step on twigs, elk break brand, big break,

1935
01:47:48,520 --> 01:47:50,360
Speaker 2: big stuff. So like why aren't they alarming?

1936
01:47:50,400 --> 01:47:50,640
Speaker 4: At that?

1937
01:47:50,720 --> 01:47:53,120
Speaker 2: I was like so pissed as a kid, like watching

1938
01:47:53,120 --> 01:47:55,639
Speaker 2: these birds on my grandmother's feet are like a woodpacker

1939
01:47:55,640 --> 01:47:57,720
Speaker 2: come in and flush everybody, or a jay or you know,

1940
01:47:57,800 --> 01:48:00,800
Speaker 2: squirrel sidles up, I walk out. Everybody off. I'm like,

1941
01:48:01,200 --> 01:48:02,000
Speaker 2: I'm not bad.

1942
01:48:02,439 --> 01:48:03,040
Speaker 4: I'm not bad.

1943
01:48:03,160 --> 01:48:05,800
Speaker 2: Guy, Like, come on, let's you know, hang out, show

1944
01:48:05,840 --> 01:48:09,320
Speaker 2: me some stuff. And no, it's like you screw the

1945
01:48:09,680 --> 01:48:13,559
Speaker 2: least common denominator as a hiker, a dog walker, a

1946
01:48:13,560 --> 01:48:17,120
Speaker 2: beach comber, and you scare everybody. That's the piece we

1947
01:48:17,160 --> 01:48:21,280
Speaker 2: don't get is if you scare the robin, you've already

1948
01:48:21,280 --> 01:48:26,880
Speaker 2: been blown for everything. You scare the brown creeper, you

1949
01:48:26,920 --> 01:48:27,639
Speaker 2: scare the mink.

1950
01:48:28,000 --> 01:48:28,559
Speaker 4: You know.

1951
01:48:28,600 --> 01:48:31,120
Speaker 2: It's like and then there's this beautiful this is like

1952
01:48:31,200 --> 01:48:34,400
Speaker 2: gourmet level stuff where you start getting into secondary alarms.

1953
01:48:34,880 --> 01:48:39,320
Speaker 2: So like, as you slow down, I'll back up just

1954
01:48:39,360 --> 01:48:41,760
Speaker 2: a second, so that one exercise of making everybody sit

1955
01:48:41,800 --> 01:48:46,360
Speaker 2: for sixty seconds or sixty minutes, I'll say, how many

1956
01:48:46,400 --> 01:48:49,439
Speaker 2: times have each of you gone out in the woods

1957
01:48:49,560 --> 01:48:53,559
Speaker 2: or somewhere just wildish and sat for sixty minutes and

1958
01:48:53,640 --> 01:48:57,720
Speaker 2: done nothing but pay attention? You ask that yourself, like

1959
01:48:58,600 --> 01:49:00,679
Speaker 2: you know hunters some.

1960
01:49:00,920 --> 01:49:03,360
Speaker 4: But yeah, archery, whitetail hunters.

1961
01:49:03,600 --> 01:49:05,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's how I learned it a lot.

1962
01:49:05,680 --> 01:49:07,800
Speaker 1: That's when you see everything, well, you got it. Like

1963
01:49:07,800 --> 01:49:11,280
Speaker 1: you gotta go sit there. At like an hour in Alston,

1964
01:49:11,280 --> 01:49:12,599
Speaker 1: You're like, where is all this stuff?

1965
01:49:12,600 --> 01:49:13,040
Speaker 4: Normally?

1966
01:49:13,200 --> 01:49:13,519
Speaker 2: Bingo?

1967
01:49:13,960 --> 01:49:16,559
Speaker 4: You know, it's like stuff everywhere.

1968
01:49:16,280 --> 01:49:19,519
Speaker 2: It's normally exactly like you see after that hour. And

1969
01:49:19,560 --> 01:49:22,920
Speaker 2: that's what this lesson conveys them, is like I've never

1970
01:49:23,000 --> 01:49:25,640
Speaker 2: said anywhere for an hour. And so the result is

1971
01:49:26,000 --> 01:49:27,720
Speaker 2: the reason we don't pick up on so much of

1972
01:49:27,760 --> 01:49:31,439
Speaker 2: this stuff is we have never ever seen the environment

1973
01:49:31,479 --> 01:49:34,040
Speaker 2: we live, our home, the place we think we know

1974
01:49:34,120 --> 01:49:36,919
Speaker 2: the best, in anything other than a state of alarm

1975
01:49:37,200 --> 01:49:42,280
Speaker 2: and disruption, alarm and disruption that we have created ourselves.

1976
01:49:42,920 --> 01:49:46,280
Speaker 2: But the beauty is as you start to pay attention

1977
01:49:46,439 --> 01:49:53,040
Speaker 2: to that, they recognize it in you. And it's very simple,

1978
01:49:54,160 --> 01:49:59,160
Speaker 2: slow down, walk without an intention. Photographers, you know, even

1979
01:49:59,200 --> 01:50:03,320
Speaker 2: the photograph for not hurting anything, doing anything. The behavior

1980
01:50:03,360 --> 01:50:05,360
Speaker 2: most people take on when they're trying to get a photo,

1981
01:50:05,720 --> 01:50:09,320
Speaker 2: it's predator like I see you, I'm focused on you.

1982
01:50:09,439 --> 01:50:15,040
Speaker 2: I'm That is scary as hell to wild animals. What

1983
01:50:15,200 --> 01:50:17,880
Speaker 2: it's saying is I'm going to get you. I'm getting you.

1984
01:50:18,080 --> 01:50:21,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like I'm acknowledging that you're there, right, So

1985
01:50:22,120 --> 01:50:23,880
Speaker 1: like if you're yeah, coming up and you tell people

1986
01:50:24,000 --> 01:50:25,519
Speaker 1: if you're trying to get up on a cotton, ta'll

1987
01:50:25,520 --> 01:50:28,200
Speaker 1: be like last thing you do. Don't look at it exactly,

1988
01:50:28,200 --> 01:50:30,880
Speaker 1: look at it out of the corner, your eyeballs at it,

1989
01:50:30,880 --> 01:50:32,720
Speaker 1: because when you aim your eyeballs at it, it knows you're

1990
01:50:32,720 --> 01:50:33,960
Speaker 1: aiming your eyeballs.

1991
01:50:33,520 --> 01:50:39,640
Speaker 2: At it exactly exactly. It's that language. So as you

1992
01:50:39,760 --> 01:50:43,400
Speaker 2: slow down and as a friend calls it, I love

1993
01:50:43,439 --> 01:50:46,920
Speaker 2: this term that the honoring routine. You start to honor

1994
01:50:46,960 --> 01:50:50,600
Speaker 2: their space, you very quickly can tell what the squirrel's

1995
01:50:50,640 --> 01:50:54,800
Speaker 2: personal space extends to you respect that you give them

1996
01:50:54,800 --> 01:50:56,720
Speaker 2: a little bit of room. Ah, you know, I'm just

1997
01:50:56,720 --> 01:50:58,360
Speaker 2: trying to get to the store, like I'm not walking

1998
01:50:58,360 --> 01:51:01,280
Speaker 2: around every pigeon, Well, that is the barrier that's going

1999
01:51:01,360 --> 01:51:05,360
Speaker 2: to stop you from moving through the woods, Like that ghostbuck,

2000
01:51:06,680 --> 01:51:11,080
Speaker 2: like that lion. Do you follow me? They are paying

2001
01:51:11,120 --> 01:51:16,320
Speaker 2: attention to the signals in the environment and working around

2002
01:51:16,400 --> 01:51:20,559
Speaker 2: them and using environmental components to their advantage. So there's

2003
01:51:20,560 --> 01:51:22,960
Speaker 2: some places there are worthless to try to hunt until

2004
01:51:23,000 --> 01:51:26,639
Speaker 2: it's a south wind, right, You got to wait till

2005
01:51:26,640 --> 01:51:29,840
Speaker 2: the wind's right. You see, certain birds and predators hunt

2006
01:51:29,840 --> 01:51:34,400
Speaker 2: when it's pouring down rain, their survival is so narrow

2007
01:51:34,960 --> 01:51:40,520
Speaker 2: on that razor edge, and they've got this huge neighborhood

2008
01:51:40,560 --> 01:51:44,439
Speaker 2: watch trying to disarm them and keep them from killing

2009
01:51:45,280 --> 01:51:48,240
Speaker 2: their prey. And so they're doing all these different things

2010
01:51:48,280 --> 01:51:52,679
Speaker 2: to try to subvert the community of communication. That's busting them,

2011
01:51:53,120 --> 01:51:57,559
Speaker 2: that's busting you, that's busting you. You step like, literally,

2012
01:51:57,600 --> 01:52:01,000
Speaker 2: you got two minutes. Usually this is a fun one

2013
01:52:01,000 --> 01:52:04,840
Speaker 2: to play with. Tell everybody to meet me at this

2014
01:52:04,880 --> 01:52:09,439
Speaker 2: trail intersection at eleven o'clock, let's say, except you get

2015
01:52:09,439 --> 01:52:12,000
Speaker 2: in there at ten, So it means you leave your

2016
01:52:12,000 --> 01:52:13,600
Speaker 2: car or you know, do whatever you have to do

2017
01:52:13,720 --> 01:52:16,800
Speaker 2: to be sitting down by ten and let things go

2018
01:52:16,880 --> 01:52:18,519
Speaker 2: back to normal m h.

2019
01:52:20,520 --> 01:52:23,560
Speaker 1: And then which is thirty minutes whatever, Yeah, yeah, to

2020
01:52:23,680 --> 01:52:27,080
Speaker 1: lease at least it's usually more like forty to sixty minutes.

2021
01:52:28,280 --> 01:52:30,280
Speaker 2: And then as you're sitting there and the birds are

2022
01:52:30,320 --> 01:52:34,160
Speaker 2: feeding and they're preening and they're singing, you hear the

2023
01:52:34,160 --> 01:52:41,360
Speaker 2: most common alarm in the woods, what is it? Silence?

2024
01:52:44,200 --> 01:52:48,160
Speaker 2: Silence is the most overlooked and most common alarm in

2025
01:52:48,280 --> 01:52:53,519
Speaker 2: nature that exists. So you just might think there's nobody

2026
01:52:53,600 --> 01:52:57,000
Speaker 2: singing over there anymore, and then you see a couple

2027
01:52:57,040 --> 01:53:00,439
Speaker 2: of birds like hauling ass going from the park lot

2028
01:53:00,479 --> 01:53:07,560
Speaker 2: area past. You set your watch two minutes, so you

2029
01:53:07,640 --> 01:53:08,840
Speaker 2: got two minutes to figure out do you want to

2030
01:53:08,840 --> 01:53:12,120
Speaker 2: scare the tart and my buddy, do you want to hide?

2031
01:53:12,200 --> 01:53:13,840
Speaker 2: Or do you want to you know, go to somewhere

2032
01:53:13,840 --> 01:53:16,120
Speaker 2: else where I can watch them and screw them.

2033
01:53:16,560 --> 01:53:18,479
Speaker 4: This is one about the quietness, man.

2034
01:53:18,600 --> 01:53:23,000
Speaker 2: This is what the lion or the deer knows of you.

2035
01:53:24,560 --> 01:53:24,640
Speaker 1: Is.

2036
01:53:24,720 --> 01:53:28,680
Speaker 2: It's got two minutes through the robins, through the sparrows

2037
01:53:28,800 --> 01:53:33,960
Speaker 2: to do a wide loop out, listen about your progress

2038
01:53:34,000 --> 01:53:37,720
Speaker 2: through all the other birds and animals, and then you've

2039
01:53:37,760 --> 01:53:39,599
Speaker 2: had I know you, guys, if you spent any amount

2040
01:53:39,640 --> 01:53:41,800
Speaker 2: of time in the woods, you come back the same

2041
01:53:41,840 --> 01:53:44,639
Speaker 2: trail you went in on. You're like, son of a bitch,

2042
01:53:44,680 --> 01:53:47,559
Speaker 2: there's bear tracks right on my tracks, or wolf tracks

2043
01:53:47,640 --> 01:53:51,759
Speaker 2: or coyote tracts or the deer. You know, it's because

2044
01:53:51,800 --> 01:53:55,240
Speaker 2: they walk around you. They're listening and monitoring you through

2045
01:53:55,600 --> 01:53:59,120
Speaker 2: the animal language in the environment, so they're like, oh, yeah, okay,

2046
01:53:59,120 --> 01:54:01,840
Speaker 2: he's still going. He's going on left over that ridge.

2047
01:54:02,280 --> 01:54:06,439
Speaker 2: And this stuff is is of such high utility that

2048
01:54:07,520 --> 01:54:10,200
Speaker 2: it's one fella I mentioned in the book interviewed him.

2049
01:54:10,280 --> 01:54:14,840
Speaker 2: He was training special ops crews and he had a

2050
01:54:14,880 --> 01:54:18,200
Speaker 2: guy he trained in bird language as well as tracking,

2051
01:54:18,360 --> 01:54:23,360
Speaker 2: and they had a Humbye ran over an ied you know,

2052
01:54:23,400 --> 01:54:25,439
Speaker 2: in the road, just made a mess of this thing,

2053
01:54:25,520 --> 01:54:28,519
Speaker 2: and they sent him, this student of the the fell

2054
01:54:28,600 --> 01:54:34,520
Speaker 2: I I knew, in to find the bomb layer. And

2055
01:54:34,560 --> 01:54:37,840
Speaker 2: he does a few loops around the Humby site, you know,

2056
01:54:38,040 --> 01:54:42,560
Speaker 2: just chaos, bleeding guys, screaming guys, smoke fire. He picks

2057
01:54:42,640 --> 01:54:47,000
Speaker 2: up a single set of tracks leaving same set. Came

2058
01:54:47,040 --> 01:54:50,360
Speaker 2: in one way, left another. So he starts sign cutting.

2059
01:54:50,480 --> 01:54:52,800
Speaker 2: You know, some of you might know that term. You're

2060
01:54:52,800 --> 01:54:55,800
Speaker 2: moving fast, but you're you're periodically rechecking that you're on

2061
01:54:55,880 --> 01:54:56,280
Speaker 2: the prints.

2062
01:54:56,320 --> 01:54:56,560
Speaker 4: Okay.

2063
01:54:56,640 --> 01:54:59,000
Speaker 2: He broke a branch over there, you know, just trying

2064
01:54:59,000 --> 01:55:03,080
Speaker 2: to catch up. And he gets to a certain point

2065
01:55:03,160 --> 01:55:07,280
Speaker 2: where he's this is Afghanistan. There's this waddy is little ravine,

2066
01:55:07,880 --> 01:55:13,840
Speaker 2: and he hears the alarms. He's like that guy's he's

2067
01:55:13,840 --> 01:55:17,360
Speaker 2: over in there. And as he's standing there trying to

2068
01:55:17,400 --> 01:55:19,400
Speaker 2: figure out what to do, he starts hearing the bird

2069
01:55:19,400 --> 01:55:25,680
Speaker 2: alarms go up this ridge beyond the wadi, and based

2070
01:55:25,720 --> 01:55:28,920
Speaker 2: on what he learned, he want the opposite direction, so

2071
01:55:28,960 --> 01:55:30,880
Speaker 2: he get it over on to another point, get a

2072
01:55:30,880 --> 01:55:33,320
Speaker 2: clear view of that ridge and ends up taking the

2073
01:55:33,360 --> 01:55:37,400
Speaker 2: guy out. Never saw him up until that point, but

2074
01:55:37,520 --> 01:55:40,760
Speaker 2: he was clearly delineated in his movements and direction and

2075
01:55:40,920 --> 01:55:45,880
Speaker 2: speed even through the bird conversations. And that's the thing.

2076
01:55:45,920 --> 01:55:48,240
Speaker 2: He didn't know any of the birds. You don't need

2077
01:55:48,280 --> 01:55:50,000
Speaker 2: to know any of the birds. You learn the birds

2078
01:55:50,040 --> 01:55:52,480
Speaker 2: at home, and the patterns you find anywhere you go

2079
01:55:52,560 --> 01:55:55,840
Speaker 2: are the same. They're going to be filled by different species.

2080
01:55:56,160 --> 01:55:58,200
Speaker 2: But like I've heard so many people say, hey, you know,

2081
01:55:59,120 --> 01:56:01,280
Speaker 2: I never would have seen that at Mongoose. We're in Africa.

2082
01:56:01,360 --> 01:56:04,720
Speaker 2: But it's responding exactly the way the sparrows do at

2083
01:56:04,720 --> 01:56:08,400
Speaker 2: my place along the river when the mink comes through.

2084
01:56:09,560 --> 01:56:12,720
Speaker 2: The painted dogs, oh my gosh, Like we never would

2085
01:56:12,760 --> 01:56:15,640
Speaker 2: have seen them. But those birds, whatever they are, are

2086
01:56:15,760 --> 01:56:18,200
Speaker 2: the height off the ground. They're excited in the same

2087
01:56:18,240 --> 01:56:20,240
Speaker 2: way the birds are in my yard when the neighbor's

2088
01:56:20,320 --> 01:56:23,840
Speaker 2: dog gets loose and comes over yep. So that's the

2089
01:56:24,200 --> 01:56:27,960
Speaker 2: universality of that concept. Is fascinating to me that we

2090
01:56:28,120 --> 01:56:31,920
Speaker 2: all are operating on this same level of awareness and

2091
01:56:32,400 --> 01:56:37,320
Speaker 2: use of sound to know what's going on. Sometimes miles

2092
01:56:37,360 --> 01:56:40,839
Speaker 2: beyond our own sensory abilities, Like I know there's wolves

2093
01:56:40,840 --> 01:56:43,120
Speaker 2: in the park two and a half miles away. If

2094
01:56:43,160 --> 01:56:47,040
Speaker 2: I'm walking my dog, I hear, oh yeah yeah. At

2095
01:56:47,040 --> 01:56:49,800
Speaker 2: this point, it's not even a if, it's just where

2096
01:56:50,840 --> 01:56:53,920
Speaker 2: so I'll find that that signal maker or the coyoteor wherever.

2097
01:56:53,960 --> 01:56:55,680
Speaker 2: And I just set up the scope and from the

2098
01:56:55,680 --> 01:56:57,240
Speaker 2: deck of the house, you're like, oh, yep, you know

2099
01:56:57,280 --> 01:57:01,880
Speaker 2: there they are. It seems like mad to people, but

2100
01:57:01,920 --> 01:57:07,480
Speaker 2: it's not. It's just paying attention better people. And when

2101
01:57:07,480 --> 01:57:12,440
Speaker 2: you pay attention better, you get treated different. That's the

2102
01:57:12,480 --> 01:57:14,920
Speaker 2: real beauty to me is you start getting to know

2103
01:57:15,160 --> 01:57:20,440
Speaker 2: individual wild animals and they at the same time they've

2104
01:57:20,480 --> 01:57:21,880
Speaker 2: always already known you.

2105
01:57:22,600 --> 01:57:23,160
Speaker 4: Oh yeah.

2106
01:57:23,200 --> 01:57:25,000
Speaker 1: It's like why certain people can be out in their

2107
01:57:25,040 --> 01:57:26,280
Speaker 1: yard and have stuff come into it.

2108
01:57:26,760 --> 01:57:29,720
Speaker 2: Absolutely, that kid is the one when he comes to

2109
01:57:29,760 --> 01:57:34,280
Speaker 2: the prairie dog community town, he's freaking popping our buddy's off.

2110
01:57:34,600 --> 01:57:37,560
Speaker 2: That guy he doesn't even care. And they remember real

2111
01:57:37,680 --> 01:57:43,480
Speaker 2: well whether you've been nice or especially if you've been naughty.

2112
01:57:44,640 --> 01:57:47,280
Speaker 2: So there are times like even pigeons, let's go back

2113
01:57:47,320 --> 01:57:51,800
Speaker 2: to pigeons, like they remember hundreds of people faces. You

2114
01:57:51,800 --> 01:57:55,040
Speaker 2: can change your clothes, and the pigeons remember you. There's

2115
01:57:55,080 --> 01:57:57,360
Speaker 2: some there's a study done in Paris to that effect,

2116
01:57:57,360 --> 01:57:59,960
Speaker 2: one done in Philadelphia where they guessed that the pigeon

2117
01:58:00,080 --> 01:58:04,280
Speaker 2: and rocked up might know and remember thousands of people

2118
01:58:05,400 --> 01:58:08,640
Speaker 2: remember who's a regular, who's a tourist, you know, and

2119
01:58:08,720 --> 01:58:13,040
Speaker 2: log all this stuff. We are being patterned all the time.

2120
01:58:15,560 --> 01:58:18,560
Speaker 4: There's probably some dude listening who's thinking like.

2121
01:58:18,560 --> 01:58:22,720
Speaker 1: I am that there's probably some like if you think

2122
01:58:22,760 --> 01:58:29,520
Speaker 1: about like trying to call mallards or something that like that,

2123
01:58:29,680 --> 01:58:33,440
Speaker 1: there's like some code that you could crack, do you

2124
01:58:33,480 --> 01:58:36,120
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like that to a duck when

2125
01:58:36,240 --> 01:58:39,760
Speaker 1: duck comes over and it's clearly looking for other ducks,

2126
01:58:40,880 --> 01:58:44,400
Speaker 1: and it's like the ducks like I know that that's not.

2127
01:58:45,920 --> 01:58:48,200
Speaker 4: Right, Like I don't get the problem.

2128
01:58:48,360 --> 01:58:51,800
Speaker 1: Right, there's some thing that's not right. Yeah, you're doing

2129
01:58:51,840 --> 01:58:52,840
Speaker 1: something that's not right.

2130
01:58:52,920 --> 01:58:53,800
Speaker 2: Everybody's just bothering.

2131
01:58:54,720 --> 01:59:00,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's something like there's something you could say, you know,

2132
01:59:00,600 --> 01:59:05,160
Speaker 1: there's something you could say that would just make it absolutely.

2133
01:59:04,240 --> 01:59:05,600
Speaker 4: That duck would have to come down.

2134
01:59:05,840 --> 01:59:08,720
Speaker 1: But you'll never well, you'll never learn it, you know

2135
01:59:08,720 --> 01:59:11,200
Speaker 1: what I mean, You'll never learn Like when he goes

2136
01:59:11,280 --> 01:59:12,720
Speaker 1: like no, not buying it.

2137
01:59:13,240 --> 01:59:18,080
Speaker 2: Yeah. That speaks to another point where I don't sometimes

2138
01:59:18,120 --> 01:59:25,040
Speaker 2: share too much because what these animals offer you when

2139
01:59:25,080 --> 01:59:30,040
Speaker 2: you are let into their world is to see their strengths,

2140
01:59:30,240 --> 01:59:34,720
Speaker 2: their incredible talents, but vulnerabilities. But you see their achilles

2141
01:59:34,800 --> 01:59:39,480
Speaker 2: heels too, and that I don't. It's thrown around so

2142
01:59:39,600 --> 01:59:43,720
Speaker 2: cliche but sacred. That to me is there's a sacredness

2143
01:59:43,720 --> 01:59:47,280
Speaker 2: in what they have shared to then betray that. Like

2144
01:59:47,320 --> 01:59:49,480
Speaker 2: a great example. You probably know this from your bison work,

2145
01:59:49,560 --> 01:59:54,160
Speaker 2: is bison have this achilles heel of following the matriarch. Yeah,

2146
01:59:54,200 --> 01:59:58,520
Speaker 2: and those bison hunters and partly annihilated them because of

2147
01:59:58,520 --> 02:00:01,480
Speaker 2: their allegiance to the matriarch. They don't move anywhere.

2148
02:00:01,480 --> 02:00:03,560
Speaker 4: I watched the exploit that.

2149
02:00:05,440 --> 02:00:07,400
Speaker 2: So she can't move, and everybody meals around, and you

2150
02:00:07,440 --> 02:00:09,720
Speaker 2: just mow the rest of them down. Anybody else tries

2151
02:00:09,760 --> 02:00:12,040
Speaker 2: to take off and charge a new course, you bust

2152
02:00:12,120 --> 02:00:15,440
Speaker 2: them through the guts. Everybody mills around, and you you know,

2153
02:00:15,520 --> 02:00:17,720
Speaker 2: you in one stand you can get a dozen or

2154
02:00:17,720 --> 02:00:19,560
Speaker 2: a hundred. I think there's one record of like a

2155
02:00:19,680 --> 02:00:21,440
Speaker 2: hundred or something bison in one stand.

2156
02:00:21,480 --> 02:00:23,480
Speaker 4: Guy named Vick Smith got over a hundred one time.

2157
02:00:24,720 --> 02:00:31,720
Speaker 2: So to me, when you're let in, it's it's changed

2158
02:00:31,720 --> 02:00:36,000
Speaker 2: the way I There are things I couldn't reconcile hunting,

2159
02:00:38,800 --> 02:00:41,160
Speaker 2: And part of that was.

2160
02:00:41,120 --> 02:00:43,840
Speaker 1: There there are things about hunting you couldn't reconcile, or

2161
02:00:43,840 --> 02:00:46,240
Speaker 1: there are animals that you couldn't reconcile hunting.

2162
02:00:46,000 --> 02:00:51,280
Speaker 2: For it was the former, like I didn't know what

2163
02:00:51,440 --> 02:00:56,240
Speaker 2: it was, but there was an honoring piece, a recognition,

2164
02:00:56,720 --> 02:01:00,800
Speaker 2: a sacredness that got cloud out. It over and me

2165
02:01:00,920 --> 02:01:04,440
Speaker 2: trying to get that turkey, that tom, that specific tom there,

2166
02:01:04,880 --> 02:01:11,600
Speaker 2: that buck or something like that that I'm I missed

2167
02:01:12,360 --> 02:01:16,080
Speaker 2: I've found now and for me this is just me.

2168
02:01:17,280 --> 02:01:21,280
Speaker 2: It took me stepping away from hunting to really soak

2169
02:01:21,440 --> 02:01:25,480
Speaker 2: into their world on their terms if you follow me,

2170
02:01:25,480 --> 02:01:28,600
Speaker 2: and that you know, and so they share things like

2171
02:01:32,160 --> 02:01:37,320
Speaker 2: there's a there's a mule deer dough model mother, model

2172
02:01:37,360 --> 02:01:43,200
Speaker 2: mama just we called her Mamma Deer and she she

2173
02:01:43,320 --> 02:01:46,040
Speaker 2: always brought off funds. She was amazing. In one year

2174
02:01:46,120 --> 02:01:51,040
Speaker 2: she had triplets, actually no, no, I think it was tried. Quadruplets,

2175
02:01:51,280 --> 02:01:53,800
Speaker 2: which for meal dr almost never happens, like she knew

2176
02:01:53,880 --> 02:01:57,240
Speaker 2: or to feed build up those reserves could handle that

2177
02:01:57,320 --> 02:02:01,400
Speaker 2: many kids and love behole. We start into that winter

2178
02:02:01,560 --> 02:02:05,360
Speaker 2: and it's a bitch, and one by one we start

2179
02:02:05,360 --> 02:02:08,400
Speaker 2: seeing those fawns not show up on the yard, and

2180
02:02:08,480 --> 02:02:13,240
Speaker 2: pretty soon it's down to just one. And then we

2181
02:02:13,240 --> 02:02:17,000
Speaker 2: don't even see Mama deer. They're gone. I'm like, what

2182
02:02:17,040 --> 02:02:20,480
Speaker 2: the hell? And we had years with this deer, like

2183
02:02:20,760 --> 02:02:23,320
Speaker 2: we had enough understanding that I would walk with at

2184
02:02:23,320 --> 02:02:26,879
Speaker 2: that time, our two black labradors, each about seventy pounds,

2185
02:02:27,520 --> 02:02:29,400
Speaker 2: and I'd go to get the mail the mailbox like

2186
02:02:29,440 --> 02:02:33,280
Speaker 2: tenth of mile up the driveway, and she'd be there grazing,

2187
02:02:33,600 --> 02:02:35,640
Speaker 2: you know, off a distance. But in the meantime she

2188
02:02:35,760 --> 02:02:41,400
Speaker 2: might come like right along the driveway and I would

2189
02:02:41,440 --> 02:02:43,880
Speaker 2: put my hands on the shoulders of dogs. Not they

2190
02:02:43,880 --> 02:02:46,480
Speaker 2: weren't even they weren't leashed, you know, our dogs run.

2191
02:02:47,240 --> 02:02:50,760
Speaker 2: But to her, this was my gesture of it's okay,

2192
02:02:51,000 --> 02:02:53,280
Speaker 2: they're with me, and I'm not going to let them

2193
02:02:53,400 --> 02:02:55,960
Speaker 2: bother you. And there are times we could walk within

2194
02:02:56,400 --> 02:02:59,640
Speaker 2: twelve feet of her and the fawns, like I go

2195
02:02:59,680 --> 02:03:02,600
Speaker 2: sit in the yards sometimes and she was so comfortable

2196
02:03:03,120 --> 02:03:05,520
Speaker 2: that she would walk between me, sitting on the edge

2197
02:03:05,520 --> 02:03:08,320
Speaker 2: of the retaining wall and the edge of the decking,

2198
02:03:08,560 --> 02:03:13,080
Speaker 2: which was like at most thirty feet she'd walk through

2199
02:03:13,240 --> 02:03:17,640
Speaker 2: like we had an understanding. It wasn't she wasn't my pet.

2200
02:03:18,040 --> 02:03:20,960
Speaker 2: I didn't, you know, but we gave each other the

2201
02:03:21,120 --> 02:03:25,520
Speaker 2: space and understanding of each other's boundaries. Well, that hard

2202
02:03:25,560 --> 02:03:29,600
Speaker 2: winter that she disappeared, we assumed she was just gone.

2203
02:03:30,880 --> 02:03:34,480
Speaker 2: And lo and behold, like mid February, maybe early March,

2204
02:03:35,400 --> 02:03:39,560
Speaker 2: who shows up on our deck but Mama, dear, and

2205
02:03:39,640 --> 02:03:42,600
Speaker 2: she's just emaciated. She had this huge patch of hair

2206
02:03:42,680 --> 02:03:46,960
Speaker 2: missing on her back right side, like a Lombard vertebra.

2207
02:03:46,960 --> 02:03:48,360
Speaker 2: I don't know if she'd been hit by a car.

2208
02:03:48,760 --> 02:03:51,640
Speaker 2: You could see her ribs. And what does she do?

2209
02:03:52,080 --> 02:03:56,240
Speaker 2: She came up embedded down on the welcome mat to

2210
02:03:56,320 --> 02:03:59,200
Speaker 2: our front door. She came up on the deck, which is,

2211
02:03:59,240 --> 02:04:02,200
Speaker 2: you know, like a eight inch step up, and she

2212
02:04:02,640 --> 02:04:06,120
Speaker 2: bedded down there every night for I think it was

2213
02:04:06,160 --> 02:04:09,640
Speaker 2: three or four days until she eventually went under the

2214
02:04:09,680 --> 02:04:10,320
Speaker 2: deck and died.

2215
02:04:11,160 --> 02:04:14,000
Speaker 4: Because she knows it's nothing going to get her there exactly.

2216
02:04:14,800 --> 02:04:20,600
Speaker 2: She and I and our family had put in the

2217
02:04:20,640 --> 02:04:24,880
Speaker 2: time for her to see us, as in her worst hour,

2218
02:04:25,920 --> 02:04:30,000
Speaker 2: her worst time, she knew she could find refuge with

2219
02:04:30,080 --> 02:04:32,720
Speaker 2: that with us. Like to me, that was like one

2220
02:04:32,760 --> 02:04:38,920
Speaker 2: of the most crushingly heartbreaking but also beautiful things at

2221
02:04:38,960 --> 02:04:41,400
Speaker 2: the same time, that we had made enough of a

2222
02:04:41,440 --> 02:04:44,720
Speaker 2: connection that she felt that she could live out her

2223
02:04:44,760 --> 02:04:49,760
Speaker 2: last hours in our company, and that I can't now

2224
02:04:51,160 --> 02:04:54,840
Speaker 2: look at another deer and not offer them that same

2225
02:04:54,880 --> 02:04:59,040
Speaker 2: capacity to reproduce what Mamma deer did. Yeah, not that I,

2226
02:04:59,120 --> 02:05:02,360
Speaker 2: let's say, wouldn't hunt again, but the way I would

2227
02:05:02,480 --> 02:05:05,760
Speaker 2: hunt and view that is. And the author Joe how

2228
02:05:05,840 --> 02:05:09,600
Speaker 2: to put it, really succinctly nicely this way, it's not.

2229
02:05:09,040 --> 02:05:10,720
Speaker 4: Not the dude did all that work with turkeys.

2230
02:05:11,000 --> 02:05:13,320
Speaker 2: He did my life as a turkey, and buc did,

2231
02:05:13,320 --> 02:05:15,920
Speaker 2: and he wrote, he did a great film and book

2232
02:05:16,040 --> 02:05:19,040
Speaker 2: called Touching the Wild on these Mulier down in Lander,

2233
02:05:20,560 --> 02:05:24,960
Speaker 2: and uh, Joe, still he is. He moved back to Florida.

2234
02:05:27,280 --> 02:05:29,480
Speaker 2: You know, I keep touching now and then, and he's

2235
02:05:29,560 --> 02:05:31,560
Speaker 2: such a wealth of show.

2236
02:05:31,680 --> 02:05:32,000
Speaker 4: Some time.

2237
02:05:32,680 --> 02:05:36,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, I been some stuff going on, So I don't

2238
02:05:36,200 --> 02:05:40,320
Speaker 2: know how he's doing right now, but I would he's

2239
02:05:40,040 --> 02:05:42,640
Speaker 2: He's another one that's put in the time to see

2240
02:05:42,760 --> 02:05:45,960
Speaker 2: all these other facets that most of us overlook when

2241
02:05:46,000 --> 02:05:49,600
Speaker 2: we say, oh, look a deer, you know, And in

2242
02:05:49,640 --> 02:05:54,000
Speaker 2: the way he sort of described what I'm I feel

2243
02:05:54,160 --> 02:05:56,640
Speaker 2: is like, yeah, I'm going to go hunt again, but

2244
02:05:57,000 --> 02:06:00,640
Speaker 2: now I have to reckon with the fact that it's

2245
02:06:00,680 --> 02:06:04,880
Speaker 2: not what I'm killing as much anymore. It's who ye,

2246
02:06:05,400 --> 02:06:07,400
Speaker 2: who am I? Who am I choosing to take out

2247
02:06:07,400 --> 02:06:13,040
Speaker 2: of this population? Is this the matriarch, mama? Is this

2248
02:06:13,280 --> 02:06:16,720
Speaker 2: a fawn, a fawn that has a certain spark and

2249
02:06:16,800 --> 02:06:19,919
Speaker 2: talent that none of the others do. You know, It's

2250
02:06:21,000 --> 02:06:24,160
Speaker 2: it'd be very hard for me to go into hunt

2251
02:06:24,160 --> 02:06:28,160
Speaker 2: the way I used to when I was younger, and

2252
02:06:28,240 --> 02:06:30,600
Speaker 2: when I did kill something, if I did kill something,

2253
02:06:31,480 --> 02:06:36,440
Speaker 2: I would it wouldn't be with high fives anymore, you

2254
02:06:36,520 --> 02:06:39,040
Speaker 2: know what I mean, like get that big buck or

2255
02:06:39,080 --> 02:06:46,320
Speaker 2: something like that. It would be you know, silence, silence,

2256
02:06:46,360 --> 02:06:50,440
Speaker 2: with that understanding that.

2257
02:06:48,880 --> 02:06:52,040
Speaker 4: That it was a who who.

2258
02:06:52,080 --> 02:06:58,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And just every single day of our lives

2259
02:06:58,520 --> 02:07:01,680
Speaker 2: is enriched by paying attention of these conversations and having

2260
02:07:01,720 --> 02:07:04,200
Speaker 2: these individuals come in and out of our world because

2261
02:07:05,320 --> 02:07:09,120
Speaker 2: they are our best teachers. When you have a shit

2262
02:07:09,240 --> 02:07:13,560
Speaker 2: day at work and your family is pissed about something,

2263
02:07:13,680 --> 02:07:16,200
Speaker 2: or you know, it's like you can always look to that.

2264
02:07:16,680 --> 02:07:20,240
Speaker 2: Look at that. You know, that kid over there is

2265
02:07:20,520 --> 02:07:24,400
Speaker 2: it's got a broken leg, you know, and it's it's

2266
02:07:24,440 --> 02:07:27,720
Speaker 2: not making excuses. It's still keeping up with the pack.

2267
02:07:28,160 --> 02:07:31,440
Speaker 2: Be it a little slower, you know. Listening to nature

2268
02:07:31,440 --> 02:07:35,560
Speaker 2: at that level is you start seeing issues and trends

2269
02:07:35,600 --> 02:07:41,040
Speaker 2: that magazines and the pop popular media want to make into,

2270
02:07:42,880 --> 02:07:44,760
Speaker 2: you know, the save the whales kind of approach where

2271
02:07:44,760 --> 02:07:46,920
Speaker 2: it's like top down, big stop. You know, It's like,

2272
02:07:47,280 --> 02:07:51,040
Speaker 2: to me, this is the groundswell of where caring for

2273
02:07:51,080 --> 02:07:55,920
Speaker 2: your environments, real stewardship, real conservation takes places you through

2274
02:07:56,160 --> 02:08:01,520
Speaker 2: these conversations and over overhearing what matters to them lets

2275
02:08:01,560 --> 02:08:06,840
Speaker 2: you into their world to know what you're doing that

2276
02:08:07,000 --> 02:08:09,600
Speaker 2: is harmful that you weren't even aware of. Like, oh shit,

2277
02:08:09,720 --> 02:08:12,800
Speaker 2: I guess I shouldn't mow the grass there now because

2278
02:08:12,840 --> 02:08:16,240
Speaker 2: those that's where the bunnies, that's where that's where the

2279
02:08:16,280 --> 02:08:19,120
Speaker 2: litter is coming off as that hole underneath that long grass. Okay,

2280
02:08:19,800 --> 02:08:23,080
Speaker 2: I won't mow there for a month. More like simple stuff. Sometimes,

2281
02:08:23,120 --> 02:08:26,480
Speaker 2: don't cut down that dead tree that's the woodpecker nest

2282
02:08:26,600 --> 02:08:33,000
Speaker 2: site or that is the sentinel location for the principal

2283
02:08:33,040 --> 02:08:39,240
Speaker 2: players in your neighborhood wildlife alarm system. You take that

2284
02:08:39,280 --> 02:08:42,640
Speaker 2: one seemingly useless dead tree out, and all these animals

2285
02:08:42,640 --> 02:08:45,440
Speaker 2: can't get a view now of what's coming before it's

2286
02:08:45,440 --> 02:08:48,800
Speaker 2: on them. You know, It's like, so you have a

2287
02:08:48,880 --> 02:08:55,720
Speaker 2: true bottom up level of appreciation and interaction that makes

2288
02:08:55,720 --> 02:08:58,560
Speaker 2: you a better neighbor. I think I feel that way.

2289
02:08:58,600 --> 02:09:01,640
Speaker 2: I still feel like a fool. I still feel ignorant

2290
02:09:01,880 --> 02:09:08,760
Speaker 2: and like I'm making so many mistakes, but I feel

2291
02:09:08,960 --> 02:09:11,520
Speaker 2: and I know when you enter into those spaces with

2292
02:09:11,640 --> 02:09:16,000
Speaker 2: that sort of humility, nature's pretty resilient. It gives you

2293
02:09:16,080 --> 02:09:22,880
Speaker 2: more latitude than you would have otherwise. Like people ask me, well,

2294
02:09:23,160 --> 02:09:26,640
Speaker 2: should if I'm should I make animal noises when I'm out?

2295
02:09:26,960 --> 02:09:28,960
Speaker 2: You know, I see some deer when I'm out for

2296
02:09:29,000 --> 02:09:30,440
Speaker 2: a walk, or I see the fox, Do I make

2297
02:09:30,480 --> 02:09:31,080
Speaker 2: fox noises?

2298
02:09:31,240 --> 02:09:31,280
Speaker 4: Like?

2299
02:09:31,440 --> 02:09:34,680
Speaker 2: No, do not. I don't imitate animals in the wild

2300
02:09:34,880 --> 02:09:37,400
Speaker 2: anymore because the reason is I want to see them

2301
02:09:37,400 --> 02:09:39,640
Speaker 2: do what they naturally do. And once you inject yourself,

2302
02:09:39,920 --> 02:09:43,720
Speaker 2: it's game over. It's like pulling the trigger. Almost you

2303
02:09:43,880 --> 02:09:46,280
Speaker 2: change the entire equation. I've been with people, we've actually

2304
02:09:46,360 --> 02:09:50,720
Speaker 2: killed animals through making noises and interrupting the situation. I

2305
02:09:50,760 --> 02:09:52,680
Speaker 2: want to see them do what they naturally do, so

2306
02:09:52,720 --> 02:09:54,840
Speaker 2: I have a better sense of what they have to

2307
02:09:54,880 --> 02:10:02,560
Speaker 2: teach me and your own voice. A lot of indigenous

2308
02:10:02,600 --> 02:10:05,240
Speaker 2: cultures will say, when we talk to the animals in

2309
02:10:05,280 --> 02:10:10,480
Speaker 2: our native tongue, they treat us like family. And so however,

2310
02:10:10,520 --> 02:10:14,040
Speaker 2: people are like, well, only American, I speak English, and

2311
02:10:14,120 --> 02:10:17,760
Speaker 2: you know, like you speak in the most expressive language

2312
02:10:17,920 --> 02:10:23,360
Speaker 2: you have and be sincere, and you'll start having experiences like,

2313
02:10:23,760 --> 02:10:25,520
Speaker 2: you know, the deer jump up on the morning walk

2314
02:10:25,560 --> 02:10:27,200
Speaker 2: with a dog and say, hey, wait, wait, it's us,

2315
02:10:27,200 --> 02:10:31,680
Speaker 2: it's us, And they stop and they go back to grazing.

2316
02:10:32,800 --> 02:10:37,040
Speaker 2: They might even bed back down like that. But if

2317
02:10:37,080 --> 02:10:39,600
Speaker 2: you bring a friend with you to watch, huh huhm,

2318
02:10:39,920 --> 02:10:43,200
Speaker 2: it doesn't work because they're always responding to the lowest

2319
02:10:43,200 --> 02:10:46,520
Speaker 2: common denominator. You bring in somebody that's not paying attention,

2320
02:10:46,560 --> 02:10:51,120
Speaker 2: and we give off infinite amount of micro signals and

2321
02:10:51,160 --> 02:10:54,040
Speaker 2: they know whether you're paying attention or not. There's stories

2322
02:10:54,040 --> 02:10:56,000
Speaker 2: of like the horses that can do math and tell

2323
02:10:56,080 --> 02:10:59,560
Speaker 2: time and read calendars and stuff, and they find out

2324
02:10:59,640 --> 02:11:02,080
Speaker 2: they can't do that stuff. What they're doing is queuing

2325
02:11:02,120 --> 02:11:05,280
Speaker 2: off of their handlers at such a fine minute level

2326
02:11:05,440 --> 02:11:08,040
Speaker 2: that it gives the impression that another member of this

2327
02:11:08,280 --> 02:11:12,080
Speaker 2: you know, another species has these capabilities when they're just

2328
02:11:12,240 --> 02:11:15,640
Speaker 2: it's called the kluger Hans effect. They're paying attention to

2329
02:11:15,680 --> 02:11:20,760
Speaker 2: you so well better than most humans pay attention. It's like,

2330
02:11:20,800 --> 02:11:24,800
Speaker 2: how are we missing these cues? Well, your life doesn't

2331
02:11:24,840 --> 02:11:28,680
Speaker 2: depend on it. When it does, you start paying attention

2332
02:11:28,720 --> 02:11:33,080
Speaker 2: to stuff. You know, we all have the capacity like oh,

2333
02:11:33,320 --> 02:11:36,000
Speaker 2: the furnace shut off, you know, look to the things

2334
02:11:36,040 --> 02:11:38,760
Speaker 2: that are important to us. We still have those capabilities,

2335
02:11:38,880 --> 02:11:43,840
Speaker 2: we just have directed them other places right right, like

2336
02:11:43,960 --> 02:11:47,160
Speaker 2: something there's something screwed up with that trailer got pull over,

2337
02:11:47,240 --> 02:11:49,680
Speaker 2: pull over, we got to check the change. There's a

2338
02:11:49,680 --> 02:11:52,440
Speaker 2: bearing going out or you know, like we are laser

2339
02:11:52,480 --> 02:11:55,600
Speaker 2: focused on those kind of details. But the power of

2340
02:11:55,640 --> 02:11:58,320
Speaker 2: our brain to do that can be used then to

2341
02:11:58,320 --> 02:12:02,200
Speaker 2: go back into the natural world like our our people

2342
02:12:02,200 --> 02:12:06,520
Speaker 2: did in deep time and know stuff that is magic seeming.

2343
02:12:08,200 --> 02:12:12,400
Speaker 2: But in ways that's really damn fulfilling, you know, when

2344
02:12:12,440 --> 02:12:14,200
Speaker 2: you get you know, it's like I'd love to see

2345
02:12:14,240 --> 02:12:17,200
Speaker 2: about in line at all, Like well we get we

2346
02:12:17,240 --> 02:12:20,480
Speaker 2: get photos of them, you know, it's like that it

2347
02:12:20,560 --> 02:12:25,440
Speaker 2: changes the whole equation. You do, you have opportunities that

2348
02:12:25,440 --> 02:12:26,400
Speaker 2: you wouldn't have otherwise.

2349
02:12:27,120 --> 02:12:31,480
Speaker 4: Tell me about the artwork you do real quick, you know.

2350
02:12:31,680 --> 02:12:36,440
Speaker 2: I always say my artwork is kind of my tourist

2351
02:12:36,440 --> 02:12:39,960
Speaker 2: trinkets or my souvenirs from living. So every piece is

2352
02:12:40,000 --> 02:12:42,840
Speaker 2: not just done to make a turkey or make a bear.

2353
02:12:42,920 --> 02:12:47,360
Speaker 2: It's done to tell an individual story that I've been

2354
02:12:47,440 --> 02:12:49,680
Speaker 2: let in on. Some of these animals I've known for

2355
02:12:49,720 --> 02:12:53,640
Speaker 2: an hour or two, some of them I've known for years.

2356
02:12:53,960 --> 02:13:00,280
Speaker 2: Some of them I've known for generations. And so I

2357
02:13:00,480 --> 02:13:04,080
Speaker 2: feel that the artwork, to me, is the a focal

2358
02:13:04,120 --> 02:13:06,320
Speaker 2: point to spend a ton of time figuring out what

2359
02:13:06,360 --> 02:13:09,360
Speaker 2: the heck that experience meant to me, if that makes sense,

2360
02:13:11,080 --> 02:13:14,120
Speaker 2: and it forces me to see details I would miss otherwise.

2361
02:13:14,640 --> 02:13:17,320
Speaker 2: And she noticed that that bowl has a knot in

2362
02:13:17,480 --> 02:13:22,440
Speaker 2: his lower you know, metatarsal. He broke that, you know

2363
02:13:22,480 --> 02:13:24,680
Speaker 2: at some point or oh there's people will say, oh,

2364
02:13:24,680 --> 02:13:27,120
Speaker 2: there's that that cow elk is you know, walking across

2365
02:13:27,160 --> 02:13:29,480
Speaker 2: the lawn and mammoth she's in she's limping. No, that's

2366
02:13:29,600 --> 02:13:31,560
Speaker 2: actually part of the normal gait. But that one over

2367
02:13:31,600 --> 02:13:36,080
Speaker 2: there she's got she's got a tooth infection. Look close,

2368
02:13:36,200 --> 02:13:39,360
Speaker 2: see that little swell here. No, no, not the bulge.

2369
02:13:39,400 --> 02:13:43,920
Speaker 2: That's the mass of r muscle or the bucinator muscle

2370
02:13:43,920 --> 02:13:45,680
Speaker 2: in her cheek. But right below that, it's a little

2371
02:13:45,800 --> 02:13:52,480
Speaker 2: you know, it's like it deepens further still. My my

2372
02:13:52,560 --> 02:13:53,200
Speaker 2: experience with.

2373
02:13:53,160 --> 02:13:56,440
Speaker 4: The wild, so that turkey is a turkey.

2374
02:13:56,440 --> 02:13:59,960
Speaker 2: That's a specific one inspired by I gave it a

2375
02:14:00,120 --> 02:14:02,320
Speaker 2: couple of talks at a nature center in Utah, and

2376
02:14:02,360 --> 02:14:07,400
Speaker 2: they had three toms, Tom, Tommy and Thomas. And after

2377
02:14:07,440 --> 02:14:10,120
Speaker 2: I was done with my obligations, I just followed him

2378
02:14:10,120 --> 02:14:12,400
Speaker 2: around with some clay and sculpted, and you know, it's

2379
02:14:12,480 --> 02:14:15,760
Speaker 2: just I was just so taken with that dexterity in

2380
02:14:15,800 --> 02:14:18,000
Speaker 2: their tail. It's like a geisha, you know. They waved

2381
02:14:18,000 --> 02:14:25,200
Speaker 2: that tail back so beautiful, you know, And when you

2382
02:14:25,320 --> 02:14:29,560
Speaker 2: enter into these spaces you find that words don't really work,

2383
02:14:30,360 --> 02:14:32,320
Speaker 2: And I guess that's I grew up around sculpture, tried

2384
02:14:32,440 --> 02:14:35,600
Speaker 2: like hell not to do it, but it came back

2385
02:14:35,640 --> 02:14:37,680
Speaker 2: around in a way that I could do it my way,

2386
02:14:37,760 --> 02:14:41,000
Speaker 2: And for me, it picks up where the words sort

2387
02:14:41,000 --> 02:14:44,120
Speaker 2: of trail off like that, just that curve of the

2388
02:14:44,160 --> 02:14:47,200
Speaker 2: Achilles on the bear or that shin bone, that line

2389
02:14:47,200 --> 02:14:50,720
Speaker 2: of always loved bones and skulls, and it's like it

2390
02:14:51,040 --> 02:14:54,560
Speaker 2: was a place to put it. My love of that stuff,

2391
02:14:54,760 --> 02:14:58,400
Speaker 2: like knowing every bone, every muscle from the inside out,

2392
02:14:58,480 --> 02:15:01,080
Speaker 2: then seeing the overlay of the behavi behavior and when

2393
02:15:01,120 --> 02:15:03,520
Speaker 2: they do this, how that bone articulates this way. So

2394
02:15:03,560 --> 02:15:05,680
Speaker 2: I don't use photos. I don't use video. I used

2395
02:15:05,680 --> 02:15:07,440
Speaker 2: to take a ton of that stuff I found, I

2396
02:15:07,480 --> 02:15:10,800
Speaker 2: didn't use it. I got a roadkill kit. I got

2397
02:15:10,800 --> 02:15:14,720
Speaker 2: a tackle box full of calipers and dissecting knives and

2398
02:15:14,760 --> 02:15:17,000
Speaker 2: rubber gloves, and my own data sheets. I made up

2399
02:15:17,000 --> 02:15:18,640
Speaker 2: one for birds and one for mammals. So I find

2400
02:15:18,680 --> 02:15:21,520
Speaker 2: a moose or a grizzly bear that something's illegal to have.

2401
02:15:21,560 --> 02:15:23,200
Speaker 2: I can take a full set of measurements and have

2402
02:15:23,320 --> 02:15:27,520
Speaker 2: that archive in my studio to go back to. But

2403
02:15:27,560 --> 02:15:32,200
Speaker 2: more accurately, what it does for me is on an elk,

2404
02:15:32,320 --> 02:15:35,680
Speaker 2: I find a dead elk, I might take fifty measurements,

2405
02:15:35,720 --> 02:15:40,000
Speaker 2: but in stretching the tape measure or the calipers, that

2406
02:15:40,360 --> 02:15:42,680
Speaker 2: number of measurements guarantees I have my hands on that

2407
02:15:42,760 --> 02:15:46,600
Speaker 2: animal at least one hundred different ways. So when I

2408
02:15:46,680 --> 02:15:51,640
Speaker 2: go to work on a sculpture. I'm working from more

2409
02:15:51,640 --> 02:15:56,200
Speaker 2: of a felt sense of the creature. I see just

2410
02:15:56,240 --> 02:16:00,200
Speaker 2: a momentary pose that a fox or a bad or

2411
02:16:00,200 --> 02:16:02,440
Speaker 2: an otter might do, or something like. I can freeze

2412
02:16:02,480 --> 02:16:04,160
Speaker 2: that in my mind and I can fill in all

2413
02:16:04,200 --> 02:16:07,400
Speaker 2: the details of what was where to make that happen.

2414
02:16:08,560 --> 02:16:11,680
Speaker 1: Does most of your income come from the art or

2415
02:16:11,840 --> 02:16:14,360
Speaker 1: from your work as a naturalist and guide?

2416
02:16:14,440 --> 02:16:18,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the art by far we're starting to do.

2417
02:16:18,160 --> 02:16:19,880
Speaker 4: You're like occupationally an artist.

2418
02:16:20,560 --> 02:16:24,360
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, But when you just kind of follow your interests,

2419
02:16:24,400 --> 02:16:29,000
Speaker 2: you kind of start screwing up the ability to be defined.

2420
02:16:30,000 --> 02:16:32,080
Speaker 2: Like I love I love since as the time of

2421
02:16:32,160 --> 02:16:36,720
Speaker 2: the kid loved stone tools and ancient technology. You know.

2422
02:16:36,760 --> 02:16:39,440
Speaker 2: It took me thirty years and flew to Clovis Point.

2423
02:16:39,480 --> 02:16:42,920
Speaker 2: But like always as a kid, there was just the

2424
02:16:43,000 --> 02:16:45,520
Speaker 2: time I was young, a desire to have a felt

2425
02:16:45,600 --> 02:16:49,000
Speaker 2: sense of what it meant to to make that.

2426
02:16:50,440 --> 02:16:51,840
Speaker 4: I was able to do it because I had to

2427
02:16:51,840 --> 02:16:52,560
Speaker 4: teed up for me.

2428
02:16:55,280 --> 02:17:00,360
Speaker 1: I give it the final little flap. I know it

2429
02:17:00,440 --> 02:17:03,880
Speaker 1: was all teed up. Yeah I did, but I took

2430
02:17:03,920 --> 02:17:05,320
Speaker 1: a dirty way to get there.

2431
02:17:05,520 --> 02:17:09,200
Speaker 2: That's dirty, dude, because the if whoever made the pre

2432
02:17:09,240 --> 02:17:17,480
Speaker 2: form for you will tell you the flute's nothing, little.

2433
02:17:17,240 --> 02:17:22,600
Speaker 1: Thumb off right, sounds like I'm done. I could do

2434
02:17:22,640 --> 02:17:23,880
Speaker 1: a second.

2435
02:17:25,080 --> 02:17:27,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's what's you know that sort of stuff

2436
02:17:27,560 --> 02:17:29,320
Speaker 2: as well. I just has always turned my crank and

2437
02:17:29,360 --> 02:17:32,000
Speaker 2: I find a flake of obsidian on the ground near

2438
02:17:32,040 --> 02:17:35,520
Speaker 2: the house or something like. I know almost exactly what

2439
02:17:35,600 --> 02:17:40,000
Speaker 2: that what size and dimension that thing would have been

2440
02:17:40,200 --> 02:17:43,280
Speaker 2: off of. I know what direction the blow came from.

2441
02:17:43,680 --> 02:17:45,360
Speaker 2: I know what it was trying to do to take

2442
02:17:45,400 --> 02:17:48,240
Speaker 2: off that lump on whatever the pre form like, just

2443
02:17:49,040 --> 02:17:52,840
Speaker 2: that's always really been gratifying to me to have that

2444
02:17:53,520 --> 02:17:57,039
Speaker 2: bottom up, inside out kind of look at things, and

2445
02:17:57,080 --> 02:17:59,400
Speaker 2: the art and the educational programs, they're just kind of

2446
02:17:59,840 --> 02:18:02,400
Speaker 2: you know, the little venier at the top.

2447
02:18:03,959 --> 02:18:07,840
Speaker 4: And then hold on, when when is the book out

2448
02:18:07,879 --> 02:18:09,320
Speaker 4: and available? Right now? It is.

2449
02:18:09,360 --> 02:18:12,840
Speaker 2: It's available now wherever books are sold. You can find

2450
02:18:12,840 --> 02:18:16,480
Speaker 2: them all over Amazon and beyond your local bookstores. Can

2451
02:18:16,600 --> 02:18:18,600
Speaker 2: order it through Graystone Books.

2452
02:18:18,920 --> 02:18:19,240
Speaker 4: Okay.

2453
02:18:19,280 --> 02:18:22,360
Speaker 1: The title is Evesdropping on Animals What we Can Learn

2454
02:18:22,400 --> 02:18:30,080
Speaker 1: from Wildlife Conversations by George Beuman, got a forward by

2455
02:18:30,120 --> 02:18:30,680
Speaker 1: John Young.

2456
02:18:32,480 --> 02:18:36,240
Speaker 4: Anywhere books are sold. Yeah, thanks for coming on.

2457
02:18:36,200 --> 02:18:38,800
Speaker 2: Man, thanks for having me. Can I give one plug.

2458
02:18:40,240 --> 02:18:42,920
Speaker 2: What do you mean for something other than the book

2459
02:18:43,600 --> 02:18:47,000
Speaker 2: we're doing right now. It just went live. We got

2460
02:18:47,000 --> 02:18:51,160
Speaker 2: an online event that's where some of our education is No,

2461
02:18:51,280 --> 02:18:55,680
Speaker 2: oh no, that's fine. We have an event for people

2462
02:18:55,680 --> 02:18:59,920
Speaker 2: who love nature and Yellstone Park called the Yellstone Summit,

2463
02:19:00,720 --> 02:19:03,080
Speaker 2: and it brings together. We have this year over thirty

2464
02:19:03,280 --> 02:19:05,800
Speaker 2: world expert speakers, as we have for the last five

2465
02:19:05,879 --> 02:19:10,439
Speaker 2: years on Yellowstone talking about everything from filming mountain lions,

2466
02:19:10,879 --> 02:19:14,440
Speaker 2: the history of beavers in the park, to population census

2467
02:19:14,600 --> 02:19:19,320
Speaker 2: of moose, geology, Native American history. If you are thinking

2468
02:19:19,360 --> 02:19:22,440
Speaker 2: of coming to the park and want some insight on

2469
02:19:22,480 --> 02:19:25,360
Speaker 2: what to do and think about, join us. If you

2470
02:19:25,720 --> 02:19:29,520
Speaker 2: longtime yellow Stoner want more deep stuff, join us. If

2471
02:19:29,560 --> 02:19:32,360
Speaker 2: you're from the region. There's nothing that thrills me more

2472
02:19:32,400 --> 02:19:36,080
Speaker 2: than run into somebody from Billings or Beed or you know,

2473
02:19:36,360 --> 02:19:39,000
Speaker 2: Idaho Falls or something. There's like, oh my gosh.

2474
02:19:38,720 --> 02:19:41,560
Speaker 3: Is that like an ongoing thing or is it so

2475
02:19:42,040 --> 02:19:43,920
Speaker 3: time or yeah.

2476
02:19:43,080 --> 02:19:48,119
Speaker 2: It's online, so anybody with internet can get involved watch

2477
02:19:48,120 --> 02:19:51,880
Speaker 2: it anywhere in the world. It's registration just opened, so

2478
02:19:51,920 --> 02:19:54,480
Speaker 2: by the time this airs, registration will still be open.

2479
02:19:54,560 --> 02:19:58,400
Speaker 2: It goes live on February nineteenth through the twenty second

2480
02:19:58,720 --> 02:20:03,640
Speaker 2: of this a year. And yeah, it's cheap. We try

2481
02:20:03,680 --> 02:20:06,280
Speaker 2: to make it affordable. For fifteen bucks. You can get

2482
02:20:06,320 --> 02:20:09,640
Speaker 2: to access for forty eight hours. Oh to all those

2483
02:20:09,680 --> 02:20:13,039
Speaker 2: programs where if you want all access, which which means

2484
02:20:13,080 --> 02:20:15,120
Speaker 2: you can like it's great because it's one.

2485
02:20:15,120 --> 02:20:18,240
Speaker 1: There's a live component too, you can watch. You can

2486
02:20:18,240 --> 02:20:19,680
Speaker 1: get a ticket watch online.

2487
02:20:19,440 --> 02:20:23,000
Speaker 2: So like Deputy Superintendent Mike Trannelle of Yellstone will be

2488
02:20:23,000 --> 02:20:25,240
Speaker 2: given a park update and you can show up and

2489
02:20:25,320 --> 02:20:27,959
Speaker 2: ask him questions yourself, so like, yeah, since the flood,

2490
02:20:28,000 --> 02:20:30,400
Speaker 2: you know what actually is going on with the road

2491
02:20:30,520 --> 02:20:33,520
Speaker 2: and things like that. We've got folks who use it

2492
02:20:33,560 --> 02:20:37,120
Speaker 2: for homeschool curriculum. We've got folks who use it to

2493
02:20:37,160 --> 02:20:39,840
Speaker 2: train their park guides, so this is a training tool

2494
02:20:39,879 --> 02:20:41,720
Speaker 2: for them. We got park service people who watch it

2495
02:20:41,760 --> 02:20:44,199
Speaker 2: for their own training. So it's a very high level

2496
02:20:44,200 --> 02:20:47,000
Speaker 2: but also has entry level basic stuff for anybody interested,

2497
02:20:47,000 --> 02:20:49,800
Speaker 2: whether they actually ever make it here or not. And

2498
02:20:50,920 --> 02:20:53,840
Speaker 2: just to check it out at Yellstone Summit dot com.

2499
02:20:54,120 --> 02:20:57,520
Speaker 1: Got it so Yellstone Summit dot com and eavesdropping on

2500
02:20:57,600 --> 02:21:00,840
Speaker 1: animals what we can learn from wildlife Converse stations with

2501
02:21:01,200 --> 02:21:01,959
Speaker 1: George Buming.

2502
02:21:02,000 --> 02:21:02,880
Speaker 4: Thanks for coming on man

2503
02:21:03,480 --> 02:21:04,920
Speaker 2: My pleasure guys, thanks for having me