1
00:00:01,600 --> 00:00:09,360
Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Garth. Hi, everyone,

2
00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:13,440
Speaker 1: welcome to I Choose Me. This podcast is all about

3
00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:17,160
Speaker 1: the choices we make and where they lead us. I

4
00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:20,440
Speaker 1: am so excited for my guests today. Not only do

5
00:00:20,840 --> 00:00:23,680
Speaker 1: they have a huge heart, but they are someone who

6
00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:26,840
Speaker 1: is putting so much good back out into the world

7
00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:30,840
Speaker 1: and spreading a message of love and positivity. And I'm

8
00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:34,200
Speaker 1: all about that. My guest today is known for being

9
00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:38,400
Speaker 1: a part of the Fab Five on Netflix's Emmy winning

10
00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:44,320
Speaker 1: Queer Eye. He's an author, an LGBTQIA plus activist, and

11
00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:46,840
Speaker 1: he is the host of his very own talk show.

12
00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:51,360
Speaker 1: Please welcome Caramo to the I Choose Me Podcast. I'm

13
00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:52,960
Speaker 1: very excited to talk to you, so thank you.

14
00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:54,600
Speaker 2: I'm very shcityed to talk to you.

15
00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,200
Speaker 1: Do you remember the last time we saw each other?

16
00:00:57,400 --> 00:00:59,240
Speaker 2: Of course, well a fortune, real.

17
00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:00,800
Speaker 1: Fortune, celebrity Wheel of Fortune.

18
00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:05,880
Speaker 2: Yes, of course you thought I would forget that. I

19
00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:08,480
Speaker 2: mean standing next first of all, standing next to one

20
00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:11,240
Speaker 2: of the most iconic and most beautiful women in the world.

21
00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:14,039
Speaker 2: I'm a huge fan of you, but also like we

22
00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:16,160
Speaker 2: were on there and I was like, what the fuck

23
00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:17,360
Speaker 2: is going on? Right now?

24
00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:20,360
Speaker 1: I can This was one of the most fun days

25
00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:23,640
Speaker 1: because you were struggling so hard and we were trying

26
00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:26,080
Speaker 1: to send you like the answers struggling.

27
00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:28,080
Speaker 2: I couldn't do it. I couldn't do it.

28
00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:28,920
Speaker 1: It was the pressure.

29
00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:30,600
Speaker 2: It was a pressure, that's what it was.

30
00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:34,080
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I felt for you. But anybody who

31
00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:37,080
Speaker 1: hasn't seen that episode of us on Wheel of Fortune,

32
00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:39,360
Speaker 1: you have to check it out because it will make

33
00:01:39,360 --> 00:01:45,600
Speaker 1: you laugh. Oh very well, very very well. Such an

34
00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:49,200
Speaker 1: exciting time in my life and yours.

35
00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:51,880
Speaker 2: Yes, tell me what's making your exciting? I want to hear.

36
00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:53,760
Speaker 2: I know it's about when you're interviewing me, but I'm

37
00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:56,280
Speaker 2: always like, yeah.

38
00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:58,000
Speaker 1: I just have a lot of really fun new things

39
00:01:58,040 --> 00:02:00,800
Speaker 1: happening at this age in the stage in my life

40
00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:04,480
Speaker 1: I never really saw coming, and it's just all happening

41
00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:05,160
Speaker 1: and I love it.

42
00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:08,480
Speaker 2: That's exciting. Yeah, that's really true.

43
00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:12,760
Speaker 1: I listened to your book over the weekend. I couldn't

44
00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:14,600
Speaker 1: read it. I had to listen to it, but I

45
00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,120
Speaker 1: really enjoyed it. I got to know so much about

46
00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:20,880
Speaker 1: not just you, but the culture that you grew up in.

47
00:02:21,320 --> 00:02:25,080
Speaker 1: And it was so personal and honest and candid, and

48
00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:27,120
Speaker 1: I know that was a few years ago now that

49
00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:28,200
Speaker 1: you did that book, right.

50
00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:33,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it still all applies, yeah, change it was.

51
00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:37,840
Speaker 1: The journey to where you are today is so layered. Yeah,

52
00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:40,160
Speaker 1: for those of us that don't know, can we just

53
00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:43,280
Speaker 1: kind of like rewind to the beginning or talk about,

54
00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:46,560
Speaker 1: like you grew up in Houston. I did, and I

55
00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:50,120
Speaker 1: would just love to hear about your household and your

56
00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:52,200
Speaker 1: relationship with your parents a little bit.

57
00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:54,720
Speaker 2: Sure. So I grew up in Houston, Texas. I'm the

58
00:02:54,800 --> 00:02:57,400
Speaker 2: son of immigrants, so on first generation America, and my

59
00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:01,480
Speaker 2: parents are jamaking in Cuban. And it was a it

60
00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:06,040
Speaker 2: was a tough childhood because my father was not a

61
00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:08,600
Speaker 2: great father. So I grew up in a house where

62
00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:12,360
Speaker 2: my mother was abuse. He wasn't responsible with money, So

63
00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:17,480
Speaker 2: we moved constantly, constantly, constantly moved. I don't think I

64
00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:20,920
Speaker 2: ever stayed in a place longer than a year, honestly,

65
00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:23,160
Speaker 2: just moving, moving, moving. And then it got worse. We

66
00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:25,320
Speaker 2: were in a hotel for a little bit, you know,

67
00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:28,040
Speaker 2: just now I realized we were homeless. At the time,

68
00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:29,440
Speaker 2: I thought it was like a fun little like for

69
00:03:29,520 --> 00:03:32,080
Speaker 2: an hotel. You know, we're all staying twin beds, you know,

70
00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:34,920
Speaker 2: it's so crazy with you how you process things as

71
00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:36,960
Speaker 2: a kid and then as an adult you're like, hmm,

72
00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:42,000
Speaker 2: that was a mess. But yeah, but there was, you know,

73
00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:43,760
Speaker 2: there was, it was, it was, it was. It was

74
00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:48,640
Speaker 2: difficult childhood because I had these intersections of my personality

75
00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:51,040
Speaker 2: that just never seemed to fit with anywhere I lived

76
00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:55,560
Speaker 2: or anywhere I was. So it was my father did

77
00:03:55,600 --> 00:03:57,800
Speaker 2: this thing that he thought he was doing the best,

78
00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:01,920
Speaker 2: where he always moved into an apartment complex that was

79
00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:07,240
Speaker 2: on the edge of whatever rich neighborhood that you know,

80
00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:10,120
Speaker 2: we could be near. And the reason it was because

81
00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:12,640
Speaker 2: he wanted us to be in the best school districts,

82
00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:16,440
Speaker 2: and so those school districts were predominantly white because of

83
00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:20,839
Speaker 2: the income. And so now here I am, We're in

84
00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:23,920
Speaker 2: the apartment complex next to the rich neighborhood. So I'm

85
00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:25,520
Speaker 2: going to the good school, but I don't have the

86
00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:30,720
Speaker 2: money they have. I also am a my name is Kamos.

87
00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:33,600
Speaker 2: That's completely different from everyone else, who is John Kevin,

88
00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:38,919
Speaker 2: Bill Jason. Then, like I tell people, like they would

89
00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:41,680
Speaker 2: bring lunches and they had peanut butter and jelly sandwiches,

90
00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:44,480
Speaker 2: and I'd be bringing Oxtella curry goat because it was

91
00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:47,360
Speaker 2: whatever we ate the night before. Like imagine a little

92
00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:50,640
Speaker 2: sixth grader bringing in food to Mike uwaid. It just

93
00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:53,760
Speaker 2: was all a train rack, you know. And now I

94
00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:55,719
Speaker 2: look back and I laugh and I think it's humorous,

95
00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:58,159
Speaker 2: But in the moment, it was like what in the hell.

96
00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:01,359
Speaker 2: So it just seemed like I never just fit. But

97
00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:04,760
Speaker 2: even with that happening, and always in having the hard

98
00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:08,839
Speaker 2: things at home, I just still felt like there's some

99
00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:11,599
Speaker 2: there's gonna be something better. I just always was optimistic.

100
00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:14,400
Speaker 2: I'm just an optimistic person. I just always have been that, like,

101
00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:17,200
Speaker 2: this can't be it. There has to be something more.

102
00:05:16,960 --> 00:05:19,280
Speaker 2: There has to be something more, There has to be

103
00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:22,040
Speaker 2: a better life. And that's sort of how I lived

104
00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:23,600
Speaker 2: my childhood into my adulthood.

105
00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:27,040
Speaker 1: And what's your relationship with your parents?

106
00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:30,200
Speaker 2: Like, now, oh, mom, my mother and I. So I'm

107
00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:33,040
Speaker 2: the youngest, I have all sisters, and mother and I

108
00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:36,279
Speaker 2: are very close, so we hang all the time. I

109
00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:38,480
Speaker 2: actually just moved my mom to California a couple of

110
00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:41,640
Speaker 2: years ago, so I bought our house out And for

111
00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:45,159
Speaker 2: anybody who's from California and Woodland Hills, which is nice

112
00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:48,520
Speaker 2: and it's just come out all the time. My father

113
00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:53,880
Speaker 2: and I have had a tumultuous relationship because at the

114
00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:58,960
Speaker 2: age of fifteen, I let him in. Regarding my sexuality.

115
00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:02,680
Speaker 2: Use the term coming out. It's actually a term that

116
00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:06,359
Speaker 2: I've been spending the last couple of years trying to destroy.

117
00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:09,960
Speaker 1: I love this, by the way, because I've never felt

118
00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:14,159
Speaker 1: comfortable saying coming out. That phrase just didn't feel right.

119
00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:17,039
Speaker 2: It's antiquated, and I think there was a time in

120
00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:21,520
Speaker 2: the LGBTQIA community where it was empowering. It's like, you're

121
00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:23,440
Speaker 2: not going to force me to hide, I am going

122
00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:28,240
Speaker 2: to be But now it's like we're forcing people to

123
00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:32,560
Speaker 2: make these grand announcements to people who don't matter to

124
00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:37,159
Speaker 2: them and don't have any any bearing on their lives.

125
00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:41,279
Speaker 2: And we're also forcing people to say to someone you

126
00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:43,760
Speaker 2: now have the power to accept or deny me based

127
00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:46,760
Speaker 2: on me coming out to you, and that's actually not

128
00:06:46,839 --> 00:06:48,920
Speaker 2: the process. The process is I'm going to let you

129
00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:51,599
Speaker 2: in because I trust you and I love you. And

130
00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:53,080
Speaker 2: if I don't want to let you in, it doesn't

131
00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:55,360
Speaker 2: mean I'm ashamed of who I am. It doesn't mean

132
00:06:55,400 --> 00:06:58,320
Speaker 2: that I am not okay with me. It means that

133
00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:00,880
Speaker 2: the same way, I don't let everyone my front door.

134
00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:03,040
Speaker 2: I don't need to let you into my personal life

135
00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:05,640
Speaker 2: because you're not worthy of that space, or maybe you're

136
00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:10,240
Speaker 2: not emotionally or mentally intelligent enough to handle it. And again,

137
00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:13,520
Speaker 2: your choice, it's my choice. It's my choice. You don't

138
00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:15,680
Speaker 2: get the power to accept or deny me because I

139
00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:19,400
Speaker 2: have already accepted myself, right, And so I left my

140
00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:23,320
Speaker 2: family in my family when I was fifteen regarding my sexuality,

141
00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:26,520
Speaker 2: and my father had an adverse reaction. He just couldn't

142
00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:29,000
Speaker 2: reconcile his relationship with his son with his relationship with

143
00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:33,720
Speaker 2: his religion, and it became abusive. He didn't you know,

144
00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:36,280
Speaker 2: he didn't have memory in high school. He would just

145
00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:39,760
Speaker 2: walk past me for days and not talking too, and

146
00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:46,040
Speaker 2: you know, it was abusive. And then and then once I,

147
00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:48,160
Speaker 2: you know, graduated high school, I was like, deuces, I

148
00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:50,600
Speaker 2: don't need to do in my life. You know, I'm gone.

149
00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:55,560
Speaker 2: And we didn't speak for about I don't know, thirteen years, fourteen,

150
00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:59,160
Speaker 2: fifteen years. We didn't speak, no contact at all. And

151
00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:02,080
Speaker 2: during that time I forgave him, like I'm one of

152
00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:04,320
Speaker 2: these people who I don't hold on to grudges. I

153
00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:07,120
Speaker 2: kind of like there's a nature in me that I

154
00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:09,080
Speaker 2: don't know where it came from, but I'm just like,

155
00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,320
Speaker 2: I don't want to hold on to like your bs.

156
00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:14,040
Speaker 2: I don't want to hold onto it like I'm able

157
00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:15,360
Speaker 2: to release it pretty easily.

158
00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:17,440
Speaker 1: That's lucky, good, Yes, it is.

159
00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:20,080
Speaker 2: I help so many people who don't know how to

160
00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:21,960
Speaker 2: do that, and I'm always trying to give them the

161
00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:24,000
Speaker 2: tools too, And like, for some reason, my entire life,

162
00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:26,720
Speaker 2: I've been able to. And so it wasn't until about

163
00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:28,720
Speaker 2: maybe six years ago he came back around and he

164
00:08:28,760 --> 00:08:30,440
Speaker 2: wrote me a letter and said, I'm so sorry for

165
00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:32,680
Speaker 2: the way I treated you. I'm so sorry for now

166
00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:36,240
Speaker 2: loving you as a parent, and he asked for my forgiveness,

167
00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:38,560
Speaker 2: and I was like, I forgave you. I was like,

168
00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,000
Speaker 2: I forgave you years ago. You've been holding onto this.

169
00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:44,520
Speaker 2: I moved on, and so now we have somewhat of

170
00:08:44,520 --> 00:08:48,280
Speaker 2: a relationship. You know, it's it's growing. But yeah, that's

171
00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:49,959
Speaker 2: that's me and my parents and my family.

172
00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:52,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes me feel so good. I'm happy that

173
00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:55,480
Speaker 1: you that he came to that place.

174
00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, on his own journey, his own journey, and yeah,

175
00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:02,320
Speaker 2: you know, I think what I've learned from that that

176
00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:05,720
Speaker 2: I try to teach people is, you know, setting the

177
00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:08,360
Speaker 2: boundaries and being clear about you're not going to be

178
00:09:08,400 --> 00:09:11,920
Speaker 2: allowed to hurt me allowed him the space to make

179
00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:14,160
Speaker 2: a choice for the turpe of person he decided he

180
00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:18,240
Speaker 2: should be, and allowed him to say because I realized

181
00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:23,360
Speaker 2: I don't want to force anybody to learn, right, It's

182
00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:28,040
Speaker 2: not my job. I'm open to helping somebody grow, but

183
00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:30,640
Speaker 2: I can't help you learn about the person that you

184
00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:32,839
Speaker 2: want to be. And I say that both professionally and

185
00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:35,880
Speaker 2: just as a human being, I can't. You have to

186
00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:38,679
Speaker 2: make the choice that you want to learn, and you know,

187
00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:40,880
Speaker 2: like I can be blue in the face telling you

188
00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:44,559
Speaker 2: to read this book, learn about this, understand and until

189
00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,360
Speaker 2: you make that choice, no, But once you make that choice,

190
00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:49,240
Speaker 2: I'm going to be there with open arms to help

191
00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:51,920
Speaker 2: you to grow, to help you to understand how you

192
00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:53,760
Speaker 2: can use that knowledge to be better and to be

193
00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:56,600
Speaker 2: a better human being for yourself and other people. And

194
00:09:56,679 --> 00:10:00,040
Speaker 2: because I let him go, he made the choice to learn,

195
00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:01,960
Speaker 2: and then I was there to help him grow. And

196
00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:05,280
Speaker 2: he's growing into a better man that he's ever been

197
00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:09,120
Speaker 2: in his seventy five years. He's finally turning into the

198
00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:10,640
Speaker 2: man that maybe he should have been when we were

199
00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:11,240
Speaker 2: all younger.

200
00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:16,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh, I mean, thank god he's there now, but yeah,

201
00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:21,360
Speaker 1: sorry for those stairs. Yeah god, you are a beautiful,

202
00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:25,199
Speaker 1: open gay man. And I think that maybe one of

203
00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:30,840
Speaker 1: the bravest, scariest liberating moments in any LGBTQ plus person's

204
00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:33,800
Speaker 1: life is that I choose me moment when you choose

205
00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:36,400
Speaker 1: to open up to the world or to your inner

206
00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:39,600
Speaker 1: circle about your identity, and that you choose to let

207
00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:41,520
Speaker 1: those people in, like we were talking about, and you

208
00:10:41,559 --> 00:10:43,880
Speaker 1: did that when you were a teenager your set. You said,

209
00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:47,280
Speaker 1: what was that like for you? And who was the

210
00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:48,560
Speaker 1: first person you let in?

211
00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:51,160
Speaker 2: I think it was just kind of a group in

212
00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:54,120
Speaker 2: high school. See, I didn't have any choice. The reason

213
00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:56,280
Speaker 2: I let people n I fifteen wasn't It was just

214
00:10:56,280 --> 00:11:00,680
Speaker 2: because all my peers were dating and I wanted to date,

215
00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:04,680
Speaker 2: and they were all talking about crushes. And I've always

216
00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:06,480
Speaker 2: anyone who knows me personally knows how to have an

217
00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:09,640
Speaker 2: honest filter, Like I mean, I like, I just am

218
00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,000
Speaker 2: just like I can't. I just not able to hold

219
00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:15,080
Speaker 2: it in. I'm able to And so I'm like, you

220
00:11:15,160 --> 00:11:17,040
Speaker 2: all are talking about who you like I want to

221
00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:20,439
Speaker 2: talk about who I like. And the guy that had

222
00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:23,240
Speaker 2: a crush on was his name was John Brown, and

223
00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:26,240
Speaker 2: he was just beautiful. And we sat next together because

224
00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:28,520
Speaker 2: my name was Caramo Brown and he was like six '

225
00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:31,120
Speaker 2: four and gorgeous, and I just thought he was the

226
00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:33,320
Speaker 2: most gorgeous person. So I just spit it out. I

227
00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:35,440
Speaker 2: was like, is anybody else obsessed with John Brown? Because

228
00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:40,679
Speaker 2: I'm a Brown And so it just became that conversation.

229
00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:43,760
Speaker 2: So it was like, you know, I just it was

230
00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:47,200
Speaker 2: just out of that teen hormones running in that I

231
00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:50,079
Speaker 2: was like, I cannot, I can't, I can't. I gotta

232
00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:50,439
Speaker 2: say it.

233
00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:53,080
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I really wish that I grew up

234
00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:55,520
Speaker 1: with you. We would have been very good friends.

235
00:11:55,640 --> 00:12:00,520
Speaker 2: Oh my god, you it would have been a good time.

236
00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:06,600
Speaker 1: Have been trouble. I've been thinking about something, and I'm

237
00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:10,600
Speaker 1: sure if I have questions about this subject, other people do,

238
00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:13,360
Speaker 1: so maybe this will be useful to some people. I

239
00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:15,840
Speaker 1: have someone in my life whom I love very much

240
00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:19,160
Speaker 1: that is gay, but we've never really talked about it,

241
00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:23,240
Speaker 1: not like really gotten deep and spoken about it. Yeah,

242
00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:27,680
Speaker 1: And I don't know why it wasn't like it. Maybe

243
00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:31,360
Speaker 1: there were times when I avoided the conversation and everybody knew,

244
00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:33,800
Speaker 1: but nobody was talking about it. So I didn't want

245
00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,240
Speaker 1: to be the one that talked about it. And I'm

246
00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:38,880
Speaker 1: the baby of the family and it just didn't feel

247
00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:42,840
Speaker 1: like my place. Yeah, but how I mean for anybody

248
00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:45,160
Speaker 1: out there who might be struggling with the same thing, Like,

249
00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:48,920
Speaker 1: what advice do you have for me to start that

250
00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:51,480
Speaker 1: conversation and why should I start that conversation?

251
00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:55,079
Speaker 2: Well, I think the importance we starting that conversation is

252
00:12:55,120 --> 00:12:58,600
Speaker 2: letting somebody know that your safe space. I think still

253
00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:00,760
Speaker 2: even in twenty twenty four. Oh my god, look at

254
00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,440
Speaker 2: your own dog. Hi, maybe what's her name?

255
00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:08,840
Speaker 1: This is Sandy.

256
00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:10,839
Speaker 2: I wish you could see my two at my feet

257
00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:14,440
Speaker 2: right now. They're Leo, They're both. Isn't it crazy how

258
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:15,880
Speaker 2: they just stay right beside you.

259
00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:17,400
Speaker 1: I have three dogs in here right now.

260
00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:22,640
Speaker 2: No. But I think even in twenty twenty four, we

261
00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:26,840
Speaker 2: forget that, like, this world is still unfortunately an unsafe

262
00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:31,679
Speaker 2: space and in some places where Astqia people and I

263
00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:35,040
Speaker 2: think the more people know that there's people in their

264
00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:37,079
Speaker 2: life that want to be a safe space for them,

265
00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:39,760
Speaker 2: that want to be there for them, want to make

266
00:13:39,760 --> 00:13:43,080
Speaker 2: sure they're advocating for them being an ally. It is important.

267
00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:45,400
Speaker 2: I think it's important for any one of us. And

268
00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:48,480
Speaker 2: so when you ask that question of like why should

269
00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:50,319
Speaker 2: I want to be curious, because it lets the other

270
00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:52,600
Speaker 2: person know that I want to learn and I want

271
00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:55,760
Speaker 2: to know that I can be there to support you,

272
00:13:56,240 --> 00:13:59,040
Speaker 2: to make sure that you always feel seen. It's an

273
00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:03,040
Speaker 2: important thing we all want that, you know. I equate

274
00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:04,520
Speaker 2: it to kind of what I'm trying to do in

275
00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:06,880
Speaker 2: this space in my life. I realized that I was

276
00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:09,040
Speaker 2: one of these gay guys before that had a lot

277
00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:11,720
Speaker 2: of girl I have tons of girlfriends, but I would

278
00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:15,319
Speaker 2: always make comments about like lady parts, like oh, I

279
00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:17,680
Speaker 2: don't want to see it, I don't whatever. And I

280
00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:20,520
Speaker 2: realized one day I was like, this is so fucking

281
00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:23,360
Speaker 2: excuse me for cussing, but I was like, this is

282
00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:27,600
Speaker 2: so like deal with misogyny and like like the fact

283
00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:29,920
Speaker 2: that I'm like ill to the female body and I'm

284
00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:32,080
Speaker 2: like supposed to be an ally to women, and like

285
00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:35,000
Speaker 2: when I'm having some straight men, I don't I don't

286
00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:38,120
Speaker 2: know enough about the female body and I know about

287
00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:39,560
Speaker 2: their feelings, but I don't know about like how to

288
00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:43,680
Speaker 2: support them in conversations that I was like, I want

289
00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:45,040
Speaker 2: to stop doing that. And so I've been in this

290
00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:46,960
Speaker 2: space about learning about the female body, like you can't

291
00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:49,240
Speaker 2: even know. I'm digressing a little bit. Oh my gosh,

292
00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:51,720
Speaker 2: the rabbit holes and the books that I'm going down

293
00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:55,680
Speaker 2: to learn. But I'm doing this because I need my

294
00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:58,360
Speaker 2: girlfriends to know that when it comes to their health

295
00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:02,360
Speaker 2: and the things there feel and how they're changing, that

296
00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:04,600
Speaker 2: I'm a safe space that we don't have to just

297
00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:10,800
Speaker 2: talk about boys, cocktails, going out, you know, like I mean,

298
00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:12,640
Speaker 2: we do have deeper conversations, but I want them to

299
00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:14,840
Speaker 2: know that when they're talking about what's important to them

300
00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:17,960
Speaker 2: and how they feel, that I'm there and that I've

301
00:15:18,080 --> 00:15:20,680
Speaker 2: taken the time to learn and read. And I think

302
00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:23,760
Speaker 2: to your point in your conversation by saying I want

303
00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:25,640
Speaker 2: to learn and I want you to know that I'm

304
00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:30,520
Speaker 2: here for you, that there's something that's special about that.

305
00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:33,360
Speaker 2: But I think the way to approach that conversation the

306
00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:37,080
Speaker 2: second part of your question is is this letting the

307
00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,120
Speaker 2: people in your life know that I'm so willing you know,

308
00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:43,360
Speaker 2: you don't even have to bring up sexuality, your gender

309
00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:45,320
Speaker 2: or you know, in the gender if you don't want to.

310
00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:48,560
Speaker 2: Maybe I don't know where that relationship is, but privately

311
00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:52,160
Speaker 2: being around them and saying I'm I'm so open to talking.

312
00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:53,920
Speaker 2: I'm so open to being here for you. I'm so

313
00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:56,440
Speaker 2: open to just being a place that you can talk to.

314
00:15:57,640 --> 00:15:59,560
Speaker 2: They're going to get the clue that you want to

315
00:15:59,600 --> 00:16:02,640
Speaker 2: be there have conversations, and that allows you to organically

316
00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:05,080
Speaker 2: find it. But I think just the desire and what

317
00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:08,120
Speaker 2: you're asking is such an important thing, because what you're

318
00:16:08,200 --> 00:16:10,280
Speaker 2: essentially saying is I want to be the best ally

319
00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:14,520
Speaker 2: and support for people who already have right.

320
00:16:14,720 --> 00:16:19,360
Speaker 1: Right. Yeah, I'm very in tune with keeping the conversation

321
00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:23,920
Speaker 1: present and open, you know, and being accepting of I've

322
00:16:24,040 --> 00:16:27,960
Speaker 1: just I'm always been accepting. There's no question for me,

323
00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:32,840
Speaker 1: like yeah, and so I have always just accepted it.

324
00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:36,920
Speaker 1: But I do think that verbalizing that and just clarifying

325
00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:39,720
Speaker 1: what you're talking about that I do care enough about

326
00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:42,520
Speaker 1: you to want you to know that it's safe to

327
00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:43,480
Speaker 1: talk to me about anything.

328
00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:45,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, about anything exact.

329
00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:55,400
Speaker 1: I like that. Over here at our house, my family

330
00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:58,920
Speaker 1: and I are fans of your shows. We're just basically

331
00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:05,800
Speaker 1: Coroma fans over here. Yeah, no denying it. You've just

332
00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:09,280
Speaker 1: finished the filming the upcoming season of Queer Eye, which

333
00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:10,480
Speaker 1: is season nine, right.

334
00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,560
Speaker 2: Season nine, Yes, in Vegas, and oh boy, for people

335
00:17:14,560 --> 00:17:15,040
Speaker 2: to see.

336
00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:16,919
Speaker 1: This, that's gotta be a good season.

337
00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:21,919
Speaker 2: I'm gonna tell you it's a good season because Vegas

338
00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:26,159
Speaker 2: is one of those places that you realize outside of

339
00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:30,240
Speaker 2: the strip, there is so much heart and unfortunately there's

340
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:35,359
Speaker 2: so much hurt because this transient city. People come and

341
00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:37,720
Speaker 2: they so one of the people. We're not gonna talk

342
00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:39,880
Speaker 2: about this, yeah, but I can share a little bit.

343
00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:44,439
Speaker 2: There's a person that we're helping who worked at her

344
00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:48,040
Speaker 2: job for twenty five years and then that job just

345
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:50,120
Speaker 2: told her they were closing randomly.

346
00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:52,679
Speaker 1: And twenty five years. Wow.

347
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:56,440
Speaker 2: And this is this is that her whole life changed

348
00:17:56,560 --> 00:18:00,000
Speaker 2: literally a week before we were going to help her. Wow.

349
00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:03,199
Speaker 2: Perfect timing, perfect timing, perfect timing.

350
00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:05,880
Speaker 1: I mean for her to grow with you, wow.

351
00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:08,679
Speaker 2: Yes, everything, for her to be able to grieve the

352
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:11,080
Speaker 2: change in her life, understand how she's going to have

353
00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:15,440
Speaker 2: to move forward believing in herself again. Also just financially

354
00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:17,600
Speaker 2: like for us to be able to come in and say,

355
00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:20,280
Speaker 2: here is some support as you're about to go through

356
00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:24,160
Speaker 2: this new change. We just I just fell in love

357
00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:27,760
Speaker 2: with the people who live outside of the Strip of Vegas,

358
00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:32,800
Speaker 2: and I was like, Wow, this town is more than

359
00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:35,439
Speaker 2: we give it credit for, and so I'm so excited

360
00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:37,840
Speaker 2: to see it. We also have a new cast member, Jared.

361
00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:42,800
Speaker 1: Yes, and what happened Bobby left the show? You and

362
00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:44,840
Speaker 1: Bobby are close? We're close? Are you still close?

363
00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,800
Speaker 2: Yeah? Me and Bobby are like best friends. He lived out,

364
00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:48,200
Speaker 2: so we see each other all the time.

365
00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:52,280
Speaker 1: Oh perfect. I love that I've had that happen where

366
00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:54,959
Speaker 1: you're on a long running show and then someone that

367
00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:59,760
Speaker 1: you love, your friend, your castmate, leaves, and I know

368
00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:03,679
Speaker 1: that can be difficult ground and like, how did you

369
00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:08,160
Speaker 1: navigate that friendship with someone when you're working relationship ends?

370
00:19:08,200 --> 00:19:09,960
Speaker 1: Because I think a lot of people can relate to that,

371
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:12,040
Speaker 1: no matter what their career is.

372
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:16,199
Speaker 2: Yeah. For me, like, I believe that any friendship. So

373
00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:18,280
Speaker 2: I have people who I work with that I'm friends

374
00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:19,960
Speaker 2: with at work, and I have friends and this is

375
00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:21,520
Speaker 2: not on Queerie. Queer as one of the shows I

376
00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:25,440
Speaker 2: get along with everyone, So I'm friends. I'm friends with everyone,

377
00:19:25,560 --> 00:19:28,000
Speaker 2: I say to say in other spaces, I've had friends

378
00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:29,840
Speaker 2: who work friends and I have friends that I know

379
00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:31,680
Speaker 2: that I want to build a relationship with, and I

380
00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:35,040
Speaker 2: think sometimes people don't have that clear distinction, and so

381
00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:39,280
Speaker 2: things happen, and transitions happen. It becomes muddy and weird

382
00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:42,280
Speaker 2: because some people don't know where they stand. Yeah, we've

383
00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:46,520
Speaker 2: never had a real transparent conversation because it's hard because

384
00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:49,080
Speaker 2: the assumption is, because we've spent eight hours a day

385
00:19:49,119 --> 00:19:52,400
Speaker 2: together for four years, five years, twenty years, that we

386
00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:55,359
Speaker 2: know each other. And sometimes you realize you don't. You

387
00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:57,600
Speaker 2: know a version of me that's at work. You know

388
00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:00,240
Speaker 2: this part of me, but I've never let you into

389
00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:04,760
Speaker 2: the rest of my life. And so for me, maintaining

390
00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:08,880
Speaker 2: the relationship was more so about being an empathetic listener.

391
00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:10,520
Speaker 2: You know, I tell people all the time. My granny

392
00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:12,440
Speaker 2: used to tell me I have two ears and one mouth,

393
00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:14,240
Speaker 2: which means he's supposed to be doing one of those

394
00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:16,880
Speaker 2: things double time. And the thing that you're doing double

395
00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:21,600
Speaker 2: time is listening. And so during this transition, I realized

396
00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:23,439
Speaker 2: my job was not to run my mouth. It was

397
00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:26,560
Speaker 2: to listen to how everyone is feeling, Like, tell me

398
00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:30,000
Speaker 2: how you're feeling, and know that I'm space that is

399
00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:32,480
Speaker 2: not trying to solve it, not trying to be a solution,

400
00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:35,040
Speaker 2: but just wants you to know that you're being heard,

401
00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:39,720
Speaker 2: because I think that sometimes in transition, people don't feel heard,

402
00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:45,000
Speaker 2: and we don't feel heard, that's when the feelings of anxiety,

403
00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:49,280
Speaker 2: of loneliness, of isolation pop up, because you feel like

404
00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:53,919
Speaker 2: I'm on this island by myself. And so what helped

405
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:57,600
Speaker 2: my transition with Bobby is that he always knows he's heard.

406
00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:01,120
Speaker 2: He's always felt hurt, and he knows that I'm listening

407
00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:04,200
Speaker 2: and that I'm not here to judge his choices or

408
00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 2: anyone else's choices. I'm here just to listen and let

409
00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:10,600
Speaker 2: him know that I'm here for him. And you know,

410
00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:12,560
Speaker 2: one of the things that I love about what Bobby

411
00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:14,280
Speaker 2: does is like like he gives me a call, like

412
00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:15,960
Speaker 2: when we were shooting, and he's like, I hope it's

413
00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:19,280
Speaker 2: going great. I hope the season's awesome. I hope this

414
00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:22,440
Speaker 2: is happening, and I'm like that just shows the character

415
00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:24,320
Speaker 2: of you know, He's like, I hope the guys are

416
00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:27,280
Speaker 2: having a good time, and it just shows that for

417
00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:30,479
Speaker 2: each of us, you know, like no matter what, we

418
00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:33,439
Speaker 2: understand that there's a bigger piece, which was helping people

419
00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:36,800
Speaker 2: and you just still want that to be good. Yeah,

420
00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:38,400
Speaker 2: I appreciate, right.

421
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:41,639
Speaker 1: How is it working with your new castmate, Jeremiah.

422
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:44,440
Speaker 2: Jeremiah is one of the most Have you ever met

423
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:45,440
Speaker 2: Jeremiah or Nate?

424
00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:48,639
Speaker 1: I've met Nate, I don't know about I think I

425
00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:50,080
Speaker 1: met Jeremiah on a plane once.

426
00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 2: Yes, Oh my gosh, you're very love He's he's one

427
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:59,840
Speaker 2: of the sweetest, most honest people ever, dear kind at all.

428
00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:02,359
Speaker 2: So what he brought to this season, and if I

429
00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:04,879
Speaker 2: can be really transparent with you, is that you know

430
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,040
Speaker 2: this from working on a long running show. After a while,

431
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:12,680
Speaker 2: it becomes a routine. You know, everyone knows what they're doing,

432
00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:15,720
Speaker 2: and everyone knows what their role, and it becomes very

433
00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:21,639
Speaker 2: Having Jeremiah there made me see this show like how

434
00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 2: I saw season one.

435
00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:24,680
Speaker 1: Oh, that's so good.

436
00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:29,440
Speaker 2: Because I had someone there who from the first day.

437
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,840
Speaker 2: I remember we walked into a house. On the very

438
00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:34,920
Speaker 2: first episode of season nine, we walked to the house

439
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,919
Speaker 2: and Jeremiah, as we were walking out and we were

440
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:40,520
Speaker 2: all deciding what we were going to do, started crying

441
00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:45,040
Speaker 2: and he was so tearful, and I was like, I

442
00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,239
Speaker 2: turned him and I was like, baby, what's wrong? And

443
00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:50,440
Speaker 2: he was like, this is so thoughtful. Y'all are being

444
00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:53,119
Speaker 2: so thoughtful about what you're about to do for this person,

445
00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:55,160
Speaker 2: because a lot of people don't realize, like we really

446
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:57,280
Speaker 2: are thoughtful. We really think about it, you know this,

447
00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:59,199
Speaker 2: We really figure out what we're going to do to

448
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:01,200
Speaker 2: help them, and we tell the producers, and the producers

449
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:03,360
Speaker 2: then support what we've said how we're going to help them.

450
00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:08,639
Speaker 2: And so he was like crying. He was like, Wow,

451
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,080
Speaker 2: this is not just something where you know, you get

452
00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:12,960
Speaker 2: on camera and then you walk away. Y'all are really

453
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:16,000
Speaker 2: huddled up talking about what's going to be best for

454
00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 2: this person to have the best life. And I was like, yeah, baby,

455
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,280
Speaker 2: we do. And it just it just gives you this

456
00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:25,399
Speaker 2: sort of like reinvigorating like and so and he works

457
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:28,640
Speaker 2: so hard this season. Sorry, I'm laboring on Jeremiah so much,

458
00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:33,040
Speaker 2: but he worked so hard that it made us even

459
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:37,920
Speaker 2: work even harder because he was fresh and we wanted

460
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 2: to match him and like his excitement and so our

461
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,880
Speaker 2: excitement all went up too. Not saying we weren't excited,

462
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,200
Speaker 2: but like it can lose.

463
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:48,760
Speaker 1: Its vigor after a while.

464
00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,000
Speaker 2: When it comes, and so we're used to it. We

465
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:55,200
Speaker 2: know formulas being the maggot. We've seen the formula, we've

466
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:59,440
Speaker 2: seen the magic we know, and with him there, every

467
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,120
Speaker 2: episode in season nine felt like every episode in season one.

468
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:07,160
Speaker 1: Oh that's great, those fresh eyes. Fresh eye aspired that.

469
00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:11,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, every moment and which was beautiful and so ever

470
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:15,080
Speaker 2: people to see this because I'm like, I'm like, we

471
00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 2: haven't been like this, patting my own stuff on the

472
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:22,680
Speaker 2: back like this since one or two, like where you're

473
00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:28,880
Speaker 2: just in it like everyone over hours, hours and hours

474
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:30,879
Speaker 2: over like when we did like season one and two

475
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,280
Speaker 2: and three where we're like I would be sitting there

476
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,800
Speaker 2: like really digging and having conversations for hours and putting

477
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,960
Speaker 2: hours and now coming back and we just did that,

478
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:42,680
Speaker 2: and I'm like, okay, we're thanks, Jeremiah, thank you.

479
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:55,680
Speaker 1: Oh good. Fresh energy is always good always for anything, anything, right, Yeah,

480
00:24:55,880 --> 00:25:00,520
Speaker 1: talk about fresh energy. You had your father too, incredible, Yes,

481
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:04,560
Speaker 1: and then your journey to fatherhood happened in kind of

482
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:10,919
Speaker 1: a surprising, somewhat shocking a little shocking. How did you

483
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,760
Speaker 1: find out you were Jason's father and then Christian came

484
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:14,399
Speaker 1: into your life?

485
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:19,360
Speaker 2: Yes? Yes, yes, so I have only had where everyone's

486
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 2: adult here had sex with one girl he was my

487
00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:26,240
Speaker 2: best friend. You're best friend since we were in seventh grade.

488
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:29,359
Speaker 2: Eighth was beginning ending in seventh grade, and she had

489
00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 2: a boyfriend in ninth grade who was a senior and

490
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:35,959
Speaker 2: she was going to lose his virginity to him, and

491
00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:38,040
Speaker 2: she didn't want to be bad, and so she asked

492
00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 2: me if we could practice. She knew itay, yeah, I

493
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 2: was like, I was like, okay, yeah, sure, this makes sense.

494
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:49,159
Speaker 2: We're fifteenth for out of practice. And I mean, she

495
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:51,359
Speaker 2: knew I was gay, but it was like I was safe.

496
00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:52,800
Speaker 1: You were safe. Yeah, I was.

497
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,399
Speaker 2: I was a guy she could be weird with and

498
00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:57,840
Speaker 2: vulnerable with, and she wasn't. She couldn't be that with

499
00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,640
Speaker 2: her boyfriend, but she could me. So we slipped school

500
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:08,360
Speaker 2: and we tried. It lasted no joke six seconds at

501
00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 2: and I literally sat on the side of the bed

502
00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:17,199
Speaker 2: and I apologize to her now for this, and we

503
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:18,680
Speaker 2: have a good joke, but at the moment, I was

504
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 2: like on the mat of your bed, like, no, I

505
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:21,880
Speaker 2: don't want to do that ever again. No, I don't

506
00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:22,080
Speaker 2: want to.

507
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:26,960
Speaker 1: It was probably a little hard for her to her

508
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:27,560
Speaker 1: and like.

509
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:29,520
Speaker 2: That's why I apologize and we laughed about it. Now

510
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:31,800
Speaker 2: but I was like, I took your first moment away,

511
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 2: Like you would have had a better shot with him

512
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:35,560
Speaker 2: where a special and he would have held you and

513
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 2: he was your boyfriend.

514
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:38,280
Speaker 1: Like who's to know?

515
00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, I used to know, but I'm like, you definitely

516
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 2: didn't have a good good It wasn't good with the

517
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 2: gay guy. We definitely know, me on the side of

518
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:49,719
Speaker 2: the bed rocking holding myself a blanket was not the

519
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:54,840
Speaker 2: first good look for it. And so she, you know,

520
00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 2: we laughed about it. We stayed friends. And then at

521
00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:59,159
Speaker 2: the end of that school year, she moved away. And

522
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:01,880
Speaker 2: this is you know, I'm forty three about it, forty four,

523
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 2: So this is nineteen ninety five. There was no cell

524
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,919
Speaker 2: phones like there are today. There was no Instagram or

525
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,439
Speaker 2: social media. So when someone moved, if you didn't have

526
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 2: their home phone number or mailing address, you know, like

527
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 2: they were gone. Yeah, And I went on my life.

528
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 2: I went on with high school and I just she

529
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 2: I thought about her, but she was, you know, she

530
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 2: just was a kid that moved away. And then when

531
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 2: I was twenty five years old, I got a stack

532
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 2: of paper for back child support. I was living in

533
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:35,280
Speaker 2: California at this point. For this kid. I didn't know.

534
00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 2: And if I can be honest with you, I thought

535
00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:40,200
Speaker 2: I was being punked because I was on MTV's Real

536
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 2: World when I was after undergrad. I was twenty three

537
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,399
Speaker 2: years old, and I thought that MTV was doing like

538
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 2: some pumped of the gay guy, like, let's punk the

539
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 2: gay guy that he has a kid. And so when

540
00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:53,320
Speaker 2: I saw these papers on my doorstep, I thought that

541
00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 2: Ashton Kutcher was in my house.

542
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:56,840
Speaker 1: You thought he was just gonna pop out?

543
00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:58,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought it was like I thought like someone

544
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 2: was pranking me. Why why would I ever think that

545
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:05,639
Speaker 2: was the last time I'd ever saw a girl or like,

546
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,840
Speaker 2: didn't put a girl like and this is years now,

547
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,359
Speaker 2: a decade. I'm like, there's no way that I have

548
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:15,120
Speaker 2: a kid. So Ashon Coutcher's in my house, I read

549
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,520
Speaker 2: a plank me. I literally went down to my car

550
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 2: and changed clothes into a new outfit because I wanted, Yeah,

551
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:25,879
Speaker 2: I want to look good for oh. I was like,

552
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 2: I got to and I walked in the house and

553
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 2: if you would have saw the performance I had when

554
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 2: I walk in that house, like I would and nobody

555
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 2: was there to see it because the house's empty, And

556
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 2: so I thought that the papers were for my neighbor,

557
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 2: who is this straight bachelor, And I was like, oh,

558
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 2: they're putting the wrong doorstep. I'll give you to him tomorrow.

559
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 2: I literally threw the papers out, and later that night

560
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:50,760
Speaker 2: is when I opened them and I saw her name

561
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:53,080
Speaker 2: them my name, and it was my first time seeing

562
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 2: her name since I was fifteen, my son's name, and

563
00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 2: it blew my mind, and I immediately went back to

564
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:05,800
Speaker 2: Texas to confirm paternity. That took about two weeks. They

565
00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 2: confirmed the fraternity and they gave me her address and

566
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 2: I went to her house and I showed up on

567
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:13,760
Speaker 2: her doorstep same way the paper showed up on mind.

568
00:29:14,760 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 2: And when I opened the door, she was shocked because

569
00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,080
Speaker 2: she didn't come after me for back child support. She

570
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:23,600
Speaker 2: had applied for benefits for her other children she had had.

571
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 2: She had five children total, and she had applied for

572
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:28,840
Speaker 2: food stamps, and because she had put me on the

573
00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:32,520
Speaker 2: birth certificate, the state came after me. Wow the benefit

574
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:34,840
Speaker 2: she was receiving. So when I showed up on her doorstep,

575
00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:36,400
Speaker 2: she was shocked.

576
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 1: Everybody was shocked.

577
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:43,360
Speaker 2: Everyone was shocked, and in that moment realizing she was shocked,

578
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 2: any anger that I had went away because I realized

579
00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 2: she wasn't being malicious. She was just a fifteen year

580
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 2: old who was trying to make the right, best decisions.

581
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:57,640
Speaker 2: And the first that was I knew one of us

582
00:29:57,720 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 2: had a chance of having a good life, and I

583
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 2: wanted to be you because you were always so kind

584
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 2: to me. And that's sort of why she didn't tell me.

585
00:30:06,200 --> 00:30:08,520
Speaker 2: And when you hear that, you knowing the life she had,

586
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 2: which was abusive family, I just I forgave her and

587
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:16,600
Speaker 2: we became best friends immediately. And then like later that day,

588
00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 2: she was like, you want to meet your son. He's

589
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:23,240
Speaker 2: going to be home to school in three hours.

590
00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:24,280
Speaker 1: And wow, that must have blown your mind.

591
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:27,040
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, girl, I was like twenty five and

592
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 2: a ten year old's a nine year old's walking home.

593
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 2: I'm like, what am I about to do right now

594
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:31,560
Speaker 2: with this?

595
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 1: Like no, yeah, I mean, but I know I can

596
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 1: tell for you that being a dad has just given

597
00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 1: you such purpose and meanings in your life.

598
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 2: Having finding out my son, and then within six months

599
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 2: I petitioned for full custody with her support because she

600
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 2: had five kids twenty five years old, you know, she

601
00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 2: was struggling. She did grat her in high school, so

602
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 2: you know, she had to drop off because she was

603
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:05,280
Speaker 2: a team mom, and so it was my way of saying,

604
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,800
Speaker 2: I'm doing well, I'm done with college. My family's doing well.

605
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:13,560
Speaker 2: Now like let me support. And then within that time period,

606
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 2: her other son was being molested and the state was

607
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:20,040
Speaker 2: going to remove the kids out of the house, and

608
00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:24,840
Speaker 2: so I said, well, I was a safe placement because

609
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 2: I was licen in the state of Texas, and so

610
00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:28,920
Speaker 2: he was going to stay with me for six weeks.

611
00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:31,320
Speaker 2: Why they did investigation. Six weeks started to six months,

612
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 2: six months to return to a year. And then one

613
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:34,960
Speaker 2: day he walked in the room and he called me Dad,

614
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:36,760
Speaker 2: And all of a sudden, I realized that I was

615
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:39,320
Speaker 2: a father of too, and he was doing great. So

616
00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 2: I asked her for if I could take custody of him.

617
00:31:44,680 --> 00:31:47,400
Speaker 2: She said yes. And and when I tell you, she

618
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:50,320
Speaker 2: said yes, this was with This wasn't an easy yes

619
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:53,000
Speaker 2: for her. I say that now in like hindsight, but

620
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:54,960
Speaker 2: in the moment, she's rappling, like, am I being a

621
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 2: bad mom? Right? She knew that I would keep them close.

622
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,560
Speaker 2: She knew that I would keep them safe, and so

623
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 2: I became his father of two by twenty six, like

624
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:07,240
Speaker 2: a ten year old and a seven year old, and

625
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:08,720
Speaker 2: it was like the weirdest thing.

626
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:12,800
Speaker 1: With just no gradual build up to where they were.

627
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:14,480
Speaker 1: It was thrown in.

628
00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 2: Alright deep, which I think, I like that in my life,

629
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 2: and so I, yeah, they saved my life because I

630
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 2: was I was dealing with my own issues from my father,

631
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 2: like I told you about of him being abusive to

632
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:30,920
Speaker 2: my mother and him being abusive to me that I

633
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:33,680
Speaker 2: had never processed. I had forgiven him, but I had

634
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 2: never processed the pain. And having kids it made me

635
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 2: realize that I, first of all, I wanted to break

636
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 2: that generational curse. I wanted to break that cycle of abuse.

637
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 2: It was so important to me. But breaking that cycle

638
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 2: of abuse made me focus on the things that happened

639
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:49,840
Speaker 2: to me, like when I wouldn't react to the same

640
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 2: way to my kids that my father reacted to me.

641
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 2: It made me them processed. But why did he react

642
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 2: to me that way? And I need a clarity? And

643
00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:59,920
Speaker 2: it made me start digging and healing myself in a way.

644
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 2: And I wouldn't have done if I wasn't a parent

645
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:04,320
Speaker 2: making better decisions.

646
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:09,080
Speaker 1: Right, did you instinctually parent the way you were parented

647
00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 1: like in the beginning, no I.

648
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:14,440
Speaker 2: Knew because it was so chaotic my childhood that I

649
00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:18,040
Speaker 2: knew I had to do the opposite. So everything was

650
00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 2: the opposite of what happened in my childhood. So for instance,

651
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 2: like the minute I got them, when we moved into

652
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 2: a place and we were in that the same place,

653
00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:26,760
Speaker 2: I was like, you're not moving around. You're going to

654
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:28,360
Speaker 2: be in the same home, and this is going to

655
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 2: be your bedroom, and you're going to put It's going

656
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 2: to sound like the smallest things, but I was like,

657
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 2: you get to put posters on the wall because for me,

658
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,440
Speaker 2: no wall ever had anything on it because I didn't

659
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:41,200
Speaker 2: know how long I was going to be there. So

660
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:46,200
Speaker 2: it was important that they knew that that was their room.

661
00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:50,040
Speaker 2: It just I you know, I didn't I got hit

662
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 2: because we you know, we were spanked and beat and

663
00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:55,360
Speaker 2: so for them, I was like, there's I'm never going

664
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 2: to there's always going to be a conversation, you know,

665
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:00,440
Speaker 2: Like it wasn't gentle parenting, so I wasn't like why

666
00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 2: do you feel this way? It was still stern. I

667
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,880
Speaker 2: was still stern dad, but it was like I'm going

668
00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 2: to talk to you, you know, you're you're eleven years old,

669
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 2: so I can have a conversation with you. Do you

670
00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 2: understand the impact of the decision. Do you understand what's

671
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 2: going on? And now do you understand there's a consequence.

672
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 2: The consequence is I'm taking this. You're going to be

673
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:18,680
Speaker 2: in your room, You're not going anywhere, and these are

674
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:22,080
Speaker 2: things are going to happen. And so and now, like

675
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:25,880
Speaker 2: I with my kids, like they're not fearful of me

676
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:28,799
Speaker 2: because they never got hit by me. They never they

677
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,759
Speaker 2: were never screamed at in that way, you know what

678
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 2: I mean? Like it, So I just did the opposite

679
00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:36,960
Speaker 2: of what I had how I was treated, and it

680
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:40,160
Speaker 2: healed them while also helping me to understand how to heal.

681
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:43,839
Speaker 1: So interesting how your journey taught you so much about

682
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:46,239
Speaker 1: how you didn't want to be I think a lot

683
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 1: of people have that you provided them with that structure

684
00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:52,280
Speaker 1: and that discipline that's so vital to being a parent,

685
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:56,279
Speaker 1: but also the acceptance and the love and the communication

686
00:34:56,440 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 1: and encouragement. Yeah, that's a really important balance. It's because

687
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:04,839
Speaker 1: you don't want to lean too hard on either direction. Yeah,

688
00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:07,760
Speaker 1: you want to incorporate both of those, all of those things.

689
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,239
Speaker 2: Agreed Yeah, having them feel safe enough to talk to

690
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:13,160
Speaker 2: me was like the was paramount because I never felt

691
00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 2: safe enough, Yeah, talk to my parents and my childhood,

692
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:19,760
Speaker 2: like I could never open up to them about anything

693
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:20,960
Speaker 2: I was feeling or going through it.

694
00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 1: I saw the episode where you and Jason talked on

695
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:30,799
Speaker 1: your show about overcoming his struggle with addiction, and that

696
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 1: traumatic experience that you went through finding him and learning

697
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:38,040
Speaker 1: about his addiction probably the one time when you didn't

698
00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 1: he wasn't communicative with you about what was going on

699
00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 1: with him.

700
00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, that was hard. So during the pandemic, I

701
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:49,840
Speaker 2: found my son overdosed, and I guess, so this is

702
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 2: what the problem is that I've talked about this for

703
00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:54,960
Speaker 2: I put my child in a box because he was

704
00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 2: the good child that I never had to worry about.

705
00:35:57,239 --> 00:36:00,919
Speaker 2: Jason has always been the responsible child. He's always been.

706
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:03,319
Speaker 2: I could count on him to be where he said

707
00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:04,680
Speaker 2: he was going to be at the time he said

708
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:07,360
Speaker 2: he was going to be. When he was in high school.

709
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:09,640
Speaker 2: He could stay out a little later because I knew

710
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:12,319
Speaker 2: that he wasn't doing anything like he's always been that.

711
00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:14,880
Speaker 2: And his brother Chris was always the one that I

712
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:16,480
Speaker 2: had to pay a little bit more attention to it,

713
00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:19,399
Speaker 2: like who I had to focus on a little bit more.

714
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:23,080
Speaker 2: And because I put Jason in that box, it didn't

715
00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:27,720
Speaker 2: allow me to see any signs of him having an addiction,

716
00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:32,359
Speaker 2: because you know, when he slept in a little bit later,

717
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:34,160
Speaker 2: I was like, well, it's just because he's working hard.

718
00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 2: I would fill in the blank for him because I

719
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:39,800
Speaker 2: put him in a box. And I realized how harmful

720
00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:44,040
Speaker 2: that was, not allowing my child, or period for human beings,

721
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:47,399
Speaker 2: not allowing human beings to be holistic that you put

722
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:49,239
Speaker 2: them in a box of like, this is who you are,

723
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:52,319
Speaker 2: and now anything you do, I'm going to fill in

724
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,200
Speaker 2: the blank because I've already made my decision that this

725
00:36:54,239 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 2: is who you are. And that's why I think a

726
00:36:56,480 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 2: lot of us miss signs of when someone is hurting, depress,

727
00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 2: maybe having suicidal ideations, is because we've already put them

728
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 2: in a box said, oh, oh that's my strong friend,

729
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:10,040
Speaker 2: they can handle everything. Oh that's the friend who always

730
00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:12,839
Speaker 2: shows up for you always. You put them in their

731
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,719
Speaker 2: box and now you're not going to see anything but that.

732
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 2: And that's what I did with Jason, So he had

733
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:22,520
Speaker 2: was not dealing with the pandemic at all. He wasn't

734
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 2: dealing with it. He felt isolated, felt alone, even though

735
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 2: like we talked every day and everything else, and he

736
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 2: was living with his girlfriend. I still put him in

737
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:33,040
Speaker 2: a box where I was like he could handle this,

738
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 2: Like he's handling this, he's going great. And it just

739
00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:39,560
Speaker 2: got worse and worse. And the only reason I found

740
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:41,200
Speaker 2: out is because he was supposed to catch a flight

741
00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:44,520
Speaker 2: to his mother's back to Houston to be with his mom,

742
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 2: and he missed the flight. The driver was in front

743
00:37:47,080 --> 00:37:50,279
Speaker 2: of his apartment and they couldn't find he didn't come out,

744
00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:54,239
Speaker 2: and I went over there upset.

745
00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:55,320
Speaker 1: Because he thought he was just sleeping.

746
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 2: Yeah. I was like, I was like, Okay, now this

747
00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:59,560
Speaker 2: is being irresponsible. I know it's a pandemic, but like,

748
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:02,560
Speaker 2: there's a flight that's been paid for, car service has

749
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:04,360
Speaker 2: been paid for. You said you wanted to go to

750
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 2: your mom, like, So I went over there like angry

751
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 2: and then walked in and saw the door a jarred

752
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 2: and like him fased down in his cat's cat litter,

753
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:19,799
Speaker 2: and just was I mean, it was devastating. It was

754
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:21,120
Speaker 2: one of the hardest things that I ever saw in

755
00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 2: my life.

756
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 1: I bet that just turned your world upside down, side down,

757
00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 1: especially because you thought she was the one that could

758
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 1: handle it and was handling it.

759
00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 2: I know, not anymore, not anymore Like I. After that moment,

760
00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 2: I did a reevaluation of every person in my life

761
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,240
Speaker 2: who I put in a box, and that goes from

762
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 2: sisters to coworkers who I was like, I mean everyone.

763
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:46,680
Speaker 2: I just I realized there were so many people that

764
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:52,040
Speaker 2: unconsciously I had already fined who they were, and I

765
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:55,040
Speaker 2: erased all those definitions and said, no more defining you.

766
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 2: I'm going to allow you to be yourself without any definition,

767
00:38:58,719 --> 00:39:00,920
Speaker 2: which is going to allow me to truly see you

768
00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 2: and again hear you, really hear you, and be there

769
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 2: for you.

770
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:09,359
Speaker 1: I think that that is such a great message that

771
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 1: you sort of took stock and reassessed your friendships and

772
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:17,359
Speaker 1: your relationships, but even just people on the street. You know,

773
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:20,680
Speaker 1: we put people in boxes all day long, every day. Yeah,

774
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 1: and nobody knows what anybody's really dealing.

775
00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 2: With exactly exactly, And so if you want to get

776
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:30,839
Speaker 2: to know what they're dealing with, you know, first don't

777
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 2: put them in that box. Secondly, let them know, like

778
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:36,279
Speaker 2: we talked about earlier, that your space to be there

779
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:38,120
Speaker 2: to really hear them and be there for them and

780
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 2: listen and then do like I said before, you have

781
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 2: two ears, listen more than you're talking. That has helped

782
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:51,360
Speaker 2: my relationships tremendously in my life because now I'm getting

783
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:54,320
Speaker 2: to see people and be there for people in ways

784
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:57,000
Speaker 2: that I wasn't before because they were they were this

785
00:39:57,200 --> 00:39:57,400
Speaker 2: or that.

786
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:02,840
Speaker 1: I mean, I can you being an expert when it

787
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,480
Speaker 1: comes to providing guidance in these areas for other people.

788
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:08,080
Speaker 1: And then to have this happen in your own life,

789
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:10,799
Speaker 1: I can imagine all of the emotions that you must

790
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:11,600
Speaker 1: have been going through.

791
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:16,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think the thing was the biggest emotion was

792
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:18,759
Speaker 2: that came through the first thought is that when I

793
00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:22,200
Speaker 2: got Jason, I promised his mom that I would keep

794
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:25,120
Speaker 2: him safe. That was my biggest promise. I said, I'll

795
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:26,680
Speaker 2: keep him safe. Don't worry, I'll keep because you know,

796
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 2: like I said again, like, it was a big decision

797
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:31,000
Speaker 2: for her for her to hand over her son. Yeah,

798
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 2: and inadvertently I was a stranger. Even though we were

799
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:37,319
Speaker 2: kids as friends, I mean friends as kids, I was

800
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 2: a stranger. It was ten years later and it was

801
00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:42,440
Speaker 2: a big decision and so I was like don't worry.

802
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:45,360
Speaker 2: That's why I stay close. And so that parent guilt

803
00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 2: of like I didn't keep him safe. I didn't. I

804
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:51,320
Speaker 2: didn't keep him safe. I didn't give him the tools.

805
00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:53,960
Speaker 2: I didn't give him something. And I think that rap

806
00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:57,120
Speaker 2: that that that rattled me for a long time, like

807
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:01,279
Speaker 2: I didn't do it. I didn't have make ship runs

808
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:03,839
Speaker 2: of my family. Like my father was an addict in

809
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 2: my twenties, I was an addict. I I loved drinking

810
00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:08,279
Speaker 2: and I love cocaine. And when I was in my

811
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:10,960
Speaker 2: twenties and so and I thought that I had broken

812
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:14,200
Speaker 2: that cycle because we had such transparent conversations about drugs.

813
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:18,320
Speaker 2: And what I didn't realize is that I talked to

814
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:22,000
Speaker 2: him about how bad the drugs were, but I didn't

815
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:24,320
Speaker 2: talk to him about how easy they can come into

816
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:28,080
Speaker 2: your life. And that was a conversation I realized, Like

817
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:29,840
Speaker 2: the conversation was always like it was so bad, I

818
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:32,040
Speaker 2: was in a dark space. But I didn't realize I

819
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:34,560
Speaker 2: didn't tell him that when I started drugs, I wasn't

820
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:36,920
Speaker 2: in a dark space. I was in a happy space.

821
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:41,240
Speaker 2: I was with friends. Like the first time I drank

822
00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:45,040
Speaker 2: and did cocaine, I wasn't in a dark space. I

823
00:41:45,120 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 2: wasn't like depressed. On some corner, I was at a

824
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:51,719
Speaker 2: nightclub looking really cute and some friend was like, do

825
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:53,160
Speaker 2: you want to bump girl? And I was like, I've

826
00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:55,359
Speaker 2: never done it, but sure, Like I was in a

827
00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:59,800
Speaker 2: happy place, and I didn't explain that to him. Is

828
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:04,359
Speaker 2: that these vices can come into your life at some

829
00:42:04,400 --> 00:42:07,400
Speaker 2: of your happiest moments because your guard is down and

830
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:10,759
Speaker 2: because you feel invincible. And then what happens is that

831
00:42:10,800 --> 00:42:14,719
Speaker 2: once you've let it in, now the darkness inside of

832
00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:17,319
Speaker 2: you that you might be keeping out of bay is

833
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:19,560
Speaker 2: now going to start growing because you're feeding it with

834
00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 2: these vices. And that's what happened to him. It's the

835
00:42:23,160 --> 00:42:25,840
Speaker 2: beginning of the pandemic. He's having fun with his girlfriend

836
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,520
Speaker 2: and his friends and he's like, we've got this, but

837
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 2: wasn't processing the emotions that he was feeling. And now

838
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 2: I've tried a drug because we're we're twenty and we're

839
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 2: having fun, and now it's turned into another and now

840
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 2: I'm depressed, and now it's getting darker and darker, and

841
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:45,240
Speaker 2: I'm doing more to try to find that first feeling

842
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:48,319
Speaker 2: that I had on that first day. And one of

843
00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:51,520
Speaker 2: the things that I've now learned is I'm having conversations

844
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:54,680
Speaker 2: to help people to understand the dangers of drugs. I

845
00:42:54,800 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 2: talk more about like that first day, it's probably you're happy. Yeah,

846
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:03,400
Speaker 2: that's the time that you have to be most aware

847
00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:05,439
Speaker 2: is when you're happy and when right.

848
00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:08,560
Speaker 1: I wouldn't people don't think that. People what you think

849
00:43:08,840 --> 00:43:12,640
Speaker 1: of someone starts an addiction or drug addiction or drinking addiction,

850
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 1: that they're in a low place and there don't know

851
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:16,640
Speaker 1: where to turn.

852
00:43:17,200 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 2: Every story is different, obviously, but mijority of people I

853
00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:21,960
Speaker 2: have talked to or I have helped or I have counseled.

854
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:25,799
Speaker 2: They are with friends, they are in a club, at

855
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:30,879
Speaker 2: a party, they are feeling good, they are it was exciting.

856
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 2: It wasn't some dark alley moment you know, it gets

857
00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 2: can get there for people. It's always something fun and

858
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 2: like new and like, oh my gosh, are we trying this?

859
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 2: Are we going to do this? Are we having a shot?

860
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:44,319
Speaker 2: Are we're having this drug? And that's when you have

861
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:46,239
Speaker 2: to be more aware. And so what I try to

862
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:49,080
Speaker 2: tell younger people now especially is like when you're the

863
00:43:49,120 --> 00:43:52,239
Speaker 2: most happiest and those endorphins are running in you, is

864
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:55,440
Speaker 2: when you have to then be really conscious of like,

865
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:57,439
Speaker 2: this is the moment I have to say no, because

866
00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:00,280
Speaker 2: there's something that might be darker laying underneath that hapiness

867
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:02,680
Speaker 2: that you haven't focused on, that those drugs are going

868
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,200
Speaker 2: to trigger. And so this is where you really have

869
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:07,880
Speaker 2: to be paying attention. And this is where friend groups

870
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 2: have to say to each other. When we're our happiest

871
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:12,080
Speaker 2: is when we really have to protect each other. That

872
00:44:12,200 --> 00:44:16,359
Speaker 2: protecting your happiness statement takes a bigger like takes on

873
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:19,360
Speaker 2: a new way when you're like in our happiest, we

874
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:21,600
Speaker 2: really have to protect each other because that's when we're

875
00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:23,960
Speaker 2: most vulnerable to getting the shitty man that comes in

876
00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:28,000
Speaker 2: our life. Most happy is when we're most susceptible to

877
00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:31,360
Speaker 2: that drug coming in that Like, like every shitty relationship

878
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:32,840
Speaker 2: I've ever had, I was in the happy.

879
00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:34,840
Speaker 1: Space when it started.

880
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:36,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was like I was like, oh my gosh,

881
00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 2: he is so amazing. I love Like he's so right now,

882
00:44:40,040 --> 00:44:43,799
Speaker 2: it's so exciting we're meeting up. Everyone is that. And

883
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:46,799
Speaker 2: so like what I'm learning now is that protecting your

884
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:50,400
Speaker 2: happiness is more of a job than we actually tell people. Like,

885
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,520
Speaker 2: in those moments of happiness is you have to really

886
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:55,359
Speaker 2: say hold on. I know this is exciting right now,

887
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 2: but what if and this is not Debbie Downer, but

888
00:44:59,200 --> 00:45:02,040
Speaker 2: what if how are we going to protect your happiness

889
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 2: and how are you going to still spot the red

890
00:45:04,320 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 2: flags the things that are dangerous in the happiness because

891
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:10,840
Speaker 2: those thedorphins are going to make you not see it right.

892
00:45:11,400 --> 00:45:14,280
Speaker 2: And that's it. That's my soapbox about happiness. Sorry.

893
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:18,560
Speaker 1: Well, it's an interesting perspective and something I think people

894
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:22,000
Speaker 1: should think about. So it's good that you're bringing awareness

895
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:31,160
Speaker 1: to that. I just commend how you and your son

896
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:35,799
Speaker 1: have been so open about this. These struggles in your

897
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:38,400
Speaker 1: own personal struggles that I heard about in your memoir

898
00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:43,280
Speaker 1: has sobriety you think brought you and your son closer

899
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:46,319
Speaker 1: or formed a new and different kind of bond that

900
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:47,239
Speaker 1: you never would have had.

901
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so. Yeah, sure, like we were. I mean,

902
00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:53,879
Speaker 2: our communication has always been open, but now like there's

903
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:57,560
Speaker 2: nothing left to hide, you know, there's nothing left to hide,

904
00:45:57,600 --> 00:45:59,879
Speaker 2: There's nothing that because now we've made it through the dark,

905
00:46:00,719 --> 00:46:03,120
Speaker 2: there's nothing he could do or say that he knows

906
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:05,480
Speaker 2: that I would ever leave him or abandon him, and

907
00:46:05,600 --> 00:46:08,400
Speaker 2: so part of his fear of not telling me was

908
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:10,960
Speaker 2: that he thought how I would react, And now he

909
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 2: knows that I will always react in love. And I

910
00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:16,920
Speaker 2: think that has allowed us to get closer because now

911
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:19,560
Speaker 2: he's not afraid to tell me if something happens, because

912
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:23,480
Speaker 2: I think most children don't share because they're afraid that

913
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 2: they're not going to get a reaction of love. And

914
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:29,600
Speaker 2: now Wow knows no matter what, when I find out

915
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:32,720
Speaker 2: you're doing something that I don't approve of, I reacted

916
00:46:32,760 --> 00:46:34,320
Speaker 2: with love. I love you through this. I'm going to

917
00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:36,680
Speaker 2: love you. We're going to support you. It's all love.

918
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:41,640
Speaker 2: Ever a scolding, never a bad moment.

919
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:44,040
Speaker 1: I mean that's so hard as a parent though, in

920
00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:47,479
Speaker 1: the moment when something happens and you see your kid

921
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:52,160
Speaker 1: making a bad decision, is it's really really hard to

922
00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:55,880
Speaker 1: take a beat and just remember that you want to

923
00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:59,640
Speaker 1: lead with love and understanding. Yeah, so you don't sever

924
00:46:59,760 --> 00:47:00,680
Speaker 1: that relationship.

925
00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:03,959
Speaker 2: You know what comes in my mind? I always sing

926
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:05,799
Speaker 2: this in myself all the time. You know that song

927
00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:10,040
Speaker 2: I'm my young soul. I came to this strange We're

928
00:47:10,680 --> 00:47:12,799
Speaker 2: hoping you remember that song from back in the day.

929
00:47:13,239 --> 00:47:14,080
Speaker 1: No, not at all.

930
00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:19,880
Speaker 2: I'm saying I'm not a good singer. It's okay, but

931
00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:23,160
Speaker 2: it's about like being a new soul coming into this world.

932
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:25,799
Speaker 1: Can you hear it in your head?

933
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:28,719
Speaker 2: I have to find this now because I want you

934
00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:34,840
Speaker 2: to hear this. This is the song. The sound familiar

935
00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:40,239
Speaker 2: to all, so I can't do this strange.

936
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:46,120
Speaker 1: Yes, I completely recognize it.

937
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:49,000
Speaker 2: So in this song, she just talks about being a

938
00:47:49,040 --> 00:47:51,840
Speaker 2: young soul. And now since I came here, I'd just

939
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:55,040
Speaker 2: been making every mistake possible, and I just wish that

940
00:47:55,080 --> 00:47:58,160
Speaker 2: everyone could remember that I'm just a young soul. And

941
00:47:58,320 --> 00:48:01,359
Speaker 2: I keep I sing that to myself while I'm always like, well,

942
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:05,360
Speaker 2: you're young soul this strange world.

943
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:08,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, you got to remember that because they don't know.

944
00:48:09,120 --> 00:48:11,880
Speaker 2: They don't know, and so that's my little thing. Thanks

945
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:13,399
Speaker 2: for letting me find that.

946
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:17,040
Speaker 1: Stupid of course, I wanted you to finish that moment

947
00:48:17,360 --> 00:48:22,799
Speaker 1: for yourself. But I know the song now, so thank you.

948
00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:32,360
Speaker 1: I do love that song. Yeah, you and your son

949
00:48:32,680 --> 00:48:34,920
Speaker 1: co wrote children's books together.

950
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:39,120
Speaker 2: Yes, we have two. One it's called I'm Perfectly Designed,

951
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:42,239
Speaker 2: which just reminds people that you're perfectly designed, no matter

952
00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:46,640
Speaker 2: how you look, where you're from, you're perfectly designed and

953
00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:48,799
Speaker 2: to embrace and love yourself. And then the second one

954
00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:52,400
Speaker 2: is I'm okay to feel, which is important to like

955
00:48:52,520 --> 00:48:54,840
Speaker 2: tell young boys that it's okay to feel your feelings.

956
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 2: And yeah, you know, and so I'm proud of like

957
00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:00,600
Speaker 2: to have written two books with my boy. It's like amazing.

958
00:49:01,080 --> 00:49:04,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just embarked on a business with my middle daughter,

959
00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:10,480
Speaker 1: and there's something so rewarding, like you share that time together,

960
00:49:10,520 --> 00:49:13,920
Speaker 1: but you also see them developing these skills and just

961
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:14,799
Speaker 1: like blossoming.

962
00:49:15,120 --> 00:49:17,960
Speaker 2: It's wild. That's the same feeling. I'm like, this is

963
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:21,520
Speaker 2: just amazing. Like we also, he and I have just

964
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:25,040
Speaker 2: been the process. We just sold our first television show

965
00:49:25,080 --> 00:49:28,880
Speaker 2: to a network together. Yeah, I'm so excited. I mean, like,

966
00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:31,560
Speaker 2: you know this there's a process, so you know, not

967
00:49:31,719 --> 00:49:34,520
Speaker 2: easy when it will make it to air, that whole thing,

968
00:49:34,560 --> 00:49:37,200
Speaker 2: you know. So I haven't talked about it, but watching

969
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:41,959
Speaker 2: him write and become he's turning into this brilliant writer,

970
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:44,160
Speaker 2: which is like he was already a great writer growing

971
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:45,880
Speaker 2: up in high school and everything else, but to see

972
00:49:45,920 --> 00:49:49,160
Speaker 2: it like turning into like books and now a show,

973
00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 2: and I'm just like, oh my gosh, you're like, you're

974
00:49:53,080 --> 00:49:55,360
Speaker 2: like brilliant. I read his words and I'm like, I

975
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:57,200
Speaker 2: was on a call the other day and he was

976
00:49:57,239 --> 00:50:00,640
Speaker 2: sitting on the couch over there and and he heard

977
00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 2: me struggling to find the words to say, and he

978
00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:06,000
Speaker 2: just said it out loud, and I was like, oh

979
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:08,480
Speaker 2: my gosh, this is our relationship now, Like my son

980
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:13,520
Speaker 2: is this brilliant wordsmith and now he just knows how

981
00:50:13,520 --> 00:50:15,839
Speaker 2: to give dad the word. And I was like, I'm

982
00:50:15,880 --> 00:50:16,840
Speaker 2: just I couldn't believe it.

983
00:50:17,080 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm getting like emotional because you didn't know

984
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:22,759
Speaker 1: you were a dad and now your dad, and you're

985
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:25,120
Speaker 1: an amazing dad and you strive to be even better

986
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 1: and you really recognize the glory in it and the

987
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:32,760
Speaker 1: struggles in it, and you share all of that so openly.

988
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:36,239
Speaker 1: If that's what it's all about. We learn from you

989
00:50:36,680 --> 00:50:41,160
Speaker 1: because of you. Yep, Yeah, amazing. You talk a lot

990
00:50:41,200 --> 00:50:44,360
Speaker 1: about boundaries, and I know that that's not easy for

991
00:50:44,400 --> 00:50:48,840
Speaker 1: a lot of people setting boundaries and keeping boundaries. What

992
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:52,040
Speaker 1: would you say, just really quickly, what are some good

993
00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:56,120
Speaker 1: steps to creating boundaries in your life? Like what do

994
00:50:56,160 --> 00:50:58,920
Speaker 1: you need to tell yourself in order to make those boundaries?

995
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:02,319
Speaker 2: Well, First of all, most people are unclear on what

996
00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 2: they want in their life. So before you start setting

997
00:51:04,680 --> 00:51:08,800
Speaker 2: boundaries that you're not going to actually keep or enforce,

998
00:51:09,160 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 2: you need to write down what it is you want

999
00:51:11,120 --> 00:51:13,440
Speaker 2: out of life and what do you deserve, What do

1000
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:15,360
Speaker 2: you want and what do you deserve? And this is

1001
00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:17,200
Speaker 2: a practice I've been doing forever, and I try to

1002
00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:22,120
Speaker 2: tell people consistently, like, don't have it up here rattling around.

1003
00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:24,920
Speaker 2: Write it down where you can see it and reread it,

1004
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:29,160
Speaker 2: because it's important for you to understand. The reason this

1005
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:31,880
Speaker 2: boundary is important is because I want this for my

1006
00:51:31,960 --> 00:51:35,120
Speaker 2: life and I deserve this for my life. And when

1007
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:37,759
Speaker 2: you have those in front of you and you are

1008
00:51:37,800 --> 00:51:42,120
Speaker 2: aware of them, it's harder for somebody to break that boundary,

1009
00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:45,600
Speaker 2: overstep that boundary because you're not going to allow them.

1010
00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 2: When I know that I deserve a paycheck at the

1011
00:51:49,120 --> 00:51:52,240
Speaker 2: end of two weeks because I've done this amount of work,

1012
00:51:53,080 --> 00:51:54,799
Speaker 2: your boss comes to you and says, oh, I can't

1013
00:51:54,840 --> 00:51:58,080
Speaker 2: pay for another week, you don't just say okay. You

1014
00:51:58,120 --> 00:52:01,439
Speaker 2: say no, no, no, no, no, I worked, I did this.

1015
00:52:02,040 --> 00:52:05,040
Speaker 2: I want my money. And it's because you're clear that

1016
00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 2: working hard, doing your skills, you deserve this money. And

1017
00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:14,440
Speaker 2: the same thing goes for like your emotional state, your

1018
00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:17,240
Speaker 2: mental state. When you know what you want and you deserve,

1019
00:52:17,680 --> 00:52:20,360
Speaker 2: no one cannot give you your money, or give you

1020
00:52:20,400 --> 00:52:22,799
Speaker 2: the respect, or give you the love, or give you

1021
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:25,359
Speaker 2: what you deserve because you're aware of it. And so

1022
00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:27,080
Speaker 2: that's the first part. As I say, I think a

1023
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:29,080
Speaker 2: lot of people don't take that time to really be clear.

1024
00:52:29,560 --> 00:52:32,200
Speaker 1: That's amazing, that's an amazing message for our listeners.

1025
00:52:32,840 --> 00:52:34,840
Speaker 2: And then the second thing I would say, once you're clear,

1026
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:37,680
Speaker 2: I would say, before you can start setting boundaries, I

1027
00:52:37,719 --> 00:52:40,400
Speaker 2: tell people, get your boundary bodies. And this is important

1028
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:43,279
Speaker 2: things because if you never set boundaries before, it's very

1029
00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:47,040
Speaker 2: easy for narcissists manipulators in your life to learn how

1030
00:52:47,080 --> 00:52:50,719
Speaker 2: to go around your boundaries. And so when I say

1031
00:52:50,760 --> 00:52:53,960
Speaker 2: get your boundary bodies, it's those people who understand equally

1032
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,640
Speaker 2: what you want and what you deserve, who when if

1033
00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:58,680
Speaker 2: you have a moment where you feel weak, or you

1034
00:52:58,719 --> 00:53:02,399
Speaker 2: feel or you get sucked back into whatever pattern, these

1035
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:04,439
Speaker 2: people are there to remind you of what you want

1036
00:53:04,480 --> 00:53:07,080
Speaker 2: and deserve because they've read that sheet too. And I

1037
00:53:07,120 --> 00:53:10,960
Speaker 2: think when you have those two things compounded, it's easy

1038
00:53:11,040 --> 00:53:12,960
Speaker 2: for you to set boundaries with the people in your

1039
00:53:13,000 --> 00:53:17,680
Speaker 2: life and it allows you to stick with it. And

1040
00:53:18,160 --> 00:53:21,279
Speaker 2: boundaries who can save your life and chance?

1041
00:53:21,320 --> 00:53:24,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, they can. So write down what you want and

1042
00:53:24,360 --> 00:53:25,120
Speaker 1: what you deserve.

1043
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:25,880
Speaker 2: Yes.

1044
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:29,439
Speaker 1: I did a similar thing with in my therapy, which

1045
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:31,520
Speaker 1: was I wrote down my non negotiables.

1046
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:32,000
Speaker 2: Yep.

1047
00:53:32,239 --> 00:53:33,120
Speaker 1: It's very similar.

1048
00:53:33,200 --> 00:53:35,560
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, and then get to.

1049
00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 1: Define it yep. Get your boundary buddies, bbeses. I don't

1050
00:53:41,200 --> 00:53:43,400
Speaker 1: want to not talk about your talk show. I know

1051
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:46,200
Speaker 1: we're running over a little bit, but let's just briefly

1052
00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:53,400
Speaker 1: talk about this new season of Coromo, premiering September sixteenth, right, Yes, yeah,

1053
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:54,800
Speaker 1: is this season two or three?

1054
00:53:55,000 --> 00:53:55,760
Speaker 2: Season three?

1055
00:53:56,200 --> 00:53:56,439
Speaker 1: Three?

1056
00:53:56,719 --> 00:54:01,640
Speaker 2: Yes? Wow, it's been exciting. I shoot, so the syndication

1057
00:54:01,719 --> 00:54:03,839
Speaker 2: game is I shoot six to eight episodes a day,

1058
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:08,520
Speaker 2: so it's it's it's a grind. My ship is different

1059
00:54:08,600 --> 00:54:12,560
Speaker 2: because I don't have celebrities on, so I help everyday people.

1060
00:54:12,880 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 2: And the thing about the genre that I'm in is

1061
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:18,399
Speaker 2: that it's unfortunately, over the past couple of years, has

1062
00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:21,120
Speaker 2: got a bit of a bad rap because people have

1063
00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:25,960
Speaker 2: been screaming, running off, acting crazy. And one of the

1064
00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:29,360
Speaker 2: things that I'm most proud of is that, like I

1065
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:32,160
Speaker 2: give out therapy on my show, like anybody who comes

1066
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:35,279
Speaker 2: and opens themselves up. I pay for therapy. I you know,

1067
00:54:35,360 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 2: make the network pay for therapy, which they've never done.

1068
00:54:38,239 --> 00:54:40,239
Speaker 2: You know. I always make sure that we bring it

1069
00:54:40,280 --> 00:54:43,919
Speaker 2: back down to real conversations, real emotions. We're getting through it,

1070
00:54:44,560 --> 00:54:48,680
Speaker 2: like there's real healing, and it's it's, it's it's. It's

1071
00:54:48,800 --> 00:54:52,760
Speaker 2: been a journey of like rebranding this job and helping

1072
00:54:52,760 --> 00:54:56,040
Speaker 2: people to see like I'm not here for the solution.

1073
00:54:56,719 --> 00:54:59,360
Speaker 2: I'm here to tell you that you can be in

1074
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:01,640
Speaker 2: a better relationship with your mother, your father, your sister,

1075
00:55:01,719 --> 00:55:04,280
Speaker 2: your brother, or your boyfriend and your husband and your wife.

1076
00:55:04,880 --> 00:55:09,120
Speaker 2: And it's been great because the audience is receiving it,

1077
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:15,520
Speaker 2: which I'm just wanted. They're like please, yes, So it's

1078
00:55:15,560 --> 00:55:18,799
Speaker 2: been a great thing. So yeah, we're going to season three,

1079
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:22,040
Speaker 2: and I just know that, like this is a long game.

1080
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:24,560
Speaker 2: Like you know, I think about like I think about

1081
00:55:24,560 --> 00:55:26,240
Speaker 2: some of the people I look up to, like Oprah.

1082
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:28,880
Speaker 2: Her first seven seasons was not what we know about

1083
00:55:28,880 --> 00:55:32,720
Speaker 2: Oprah right now. Right people look back at early season Oprah,

1084
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:35,799
Speaker 2: they're like, oh, that's that's not the show that we

1085
00:55:36,040 --> 00:55:39,880
Speaker 2: ended up loving in the end. You know, you know,

1086
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:42,879
Speaker 2: like there was moments where Oprah used to wheel out

1087
00:55:42,920 --> 00:55:47,840
Speaker 2: wagons of fat and have you know baby Mama's fighting

1088
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:51,000
Speaker 2: on her show. And then you know, gradually she allowed

1089
00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:54,480
Speaker 2: people to see her heart. And so I'm just excited

1090
00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:56,920
Speaker 2: for the continued growth and for people to continue seeing

1091
00:55:56,960 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 2: me infuse me and what my whole life is about,

1092
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:02,200
Speaker 2: which is helping people into this show.

1093
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:06,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a perfect place for you. I'm very excited

1094
00:56:06,560 --> 00:56:08,439
Speaker 1: for you. You've shared your life, You've shared your ups

1095
00:56:08,520 --> 00:56:12,000
Speaker 1: or downs, the lessons that you've learned and challenges that

1096
00:56:12,080 --> 00:56:14,560
Speaker 1: you've faced, and you use that.

1097
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:19,040
Speaker 2: To reach people trying that's the goal.

1098
00:56:18,960 --> 00:56:21,000
Speaker 1: And help them through those big life moments.

1099
00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:22,959
Speaker 2: That's the goal. That is the goal.

1100
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:27,440
Speaker 1: Sister, Share, Share, Share What a gift you are?

1101
00:56:27,920 --> 00:56:29,200
Speaker 2: Your gift?

1102
00:56:29,480 --> 00:56:32,719
Speaker 1: Okay, two last questions. When it all ends, what do

1103
00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:36,320
Speaker 1: you hope the world remembers about Coromo.

1104
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:40,120
Speaker 2: That I hope that they just know that my only

1105
00:56:40,239 --> 00:56:42,680
Speaker 2: job on hair is to help people feel seen. That's

1106
00:56:42,680 --> 00:56:44,600
Speaker 2: all I want. That's the only thing. Like if I

1107
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:46,839
Speaker 2: die tomorrow, I feel pretty good that people know that,

1108
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:49,160
Speaker 2: Like I've been on this world to help you feel seen,

1109
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:51,000
Speaker 2: because I don't believe this life is for me. I

1110
00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:52,880
Speaker 2: believe that all these experiences I've been through is for

1111
00:56:52,920 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 2: me to help other people, because my life is an

1112
00:56:55,160 --> 00:56:57,360
Speaker 2: up and down road culture that I'm like, I'm like,

1113
00:56:57,640 --> 00:57:00,480
Speaker 2: God gave me this to help other people to be

1114
00:57:00,520 --> 00:57:03,000
Speaker 2: for a reason. There's there's no reason that the gay

1115
00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:05,880
Speaker 2: guy became a dad this way unless it was to help.

1116
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:08,640
Speaker 1: People and ended up on the platforms that you're.

1117
00:57:08,880 --> 00:57:11,879
Speaker 2: That you're able to reach this for someone else.

1118
00:57:11,920 --> 00:57:14,680
Speaker 1: It was all meant to be. Yeah, But before I

1119
00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:17,520
Speaker 1: let you go, Caromo, what was your last I choose

1120
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:18,040
Speaker 1: me moment?

1121
00:57:18,720 --> 00:57:22,000
Speaker 2: Ooh. I had a really important relationship in my life

1122
00:57:22,080 --> 00:57:26,720
Speaker 2: and because that person could not be a partner to

1123
00:57:26,760 --> 00:57:28,760
Speaker 2: me in a way that I needed them to be

1124
00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:32,600
Speaker 2: a partner. And I chose me because I decided that

1125
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:36,640
Speaker 2: what I want and hope for in this in relationships,

1126
00:57:36,680 --> 00:57:40,640
Speaker 2: going forward, business, personal, is for someone to be able

1127
00:57:40,680 --> 00:57:43,400
Speaker 2: to show up equally. And so I said, if it's

1128
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:47,560
Speaker 2: not equal, I'm not doing it, And so I chose me,

1129
00:57:47,840 --> 00:57:48,720
Speaker 2: which was beautiful.

1130
00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:52,400
Speaker 1: It is so beautiful. You are beautiful. Thank you for

1131
00:57:54,120 --> 00:57:54,600
Speaker 1: I love you.

1132
00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:55,600
Speaker 2: Love.

1133
00:57:56,680 --> 00:57:58,320
Speaker 1: I'll see you around, yes, you will.

1134
00:57:58,360 --> 00:57:59,640
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for everything.

1135
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:07,200
Speaker 1: Thank you. Wow. Okay, Caromo is so incredible. I just

1136
00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:09,920
Speaker 1: I love him. I just walked away from that conversation

1137
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:15,280
Speaker 1: feeling so empowered to revisit some boundaries in my life

1138
00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:21,560
Speaker 1: and to just live an organic, authentic, open life like him.

1139
00:58:21,960 --> 00:58:24,440
Speaker 1: Thank you Karamo for coming on. You are so amazing.

1140
00:58:25,080 --> 00:58:27,400
Speaker 1: I cannot wait for the new season of his talk

1141
00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:31,480
Speaker 1: show and the new season of Queer Eye. Such great

1142
00:58:31,480 --> 00:58:35,360
Speaker 1: work he's doing. As we continue to choose ourselves. Each week,

1143
00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:40,560
Speaker 1: I want you to think about boundaries. We talk a

1144
00:58:40,600 --> 00:58:43,480
Speaker 1: lot about that in this conversation, and I want you

1145
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:48,040
Speaker 1: to really ask yourself. Are you having healthy boundaries with

1146
00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:50,600
Speaker 1: the people in your life? Are you having to set

1147
00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 1: boundaries when it comes to your work life? After you

1148
00:58:53,480 --> 00:58:55,920
Speaker 1: think on that, if you feel unbalanced, I want to

1149
00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:59,120
Speaker 1: challenge you and empower you to start following some of

1150
00:58:59,160 --> 00:59:03,280
Speaker 1: those instructions that Karamo gave us today. What do you want?

1151
00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:08,080
Speaker 1: Be clear? What do you deserve? Setting boundaries helps make

1152
00:59:08,240 --> 00:59:11,360
Speaker 1: sure that your needs are met and that you can

1153
00:59:11,680 --> 00:59:13,840
Speaker 1: show up the way you want to show up. Without

1154
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:15,680
Speaker 1: them in place, it can be very hard to be

1155
00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 1: the best version of ourselves, and I know it might

1156
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:22,040
Speaker 1: not be easy, but this week I want you to

1157
00:59:22,160 --> 00:59:27,560
Speaker 1: try and define and set one boundary with that intention.

1158
00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:31,760
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to I Choose Me. You can check

1159
00:59:31,800 --> 00:59:34,920
Speaker 1: out all our social links. In our show notes, you

1160
00:59:34,920 --> 00:59:37,960
Speaker 1: can learn all about Karamo. You can rate us, review us,

1161
00:59:38,200 --> 00:59:40,280
Speaker 1: and be sure to use the hashtag I Choose Me.

1162
00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:43,320
Speaker 1: I will be right here next week. I hope you

1163
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 1: will choose to be here too,