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Speaker 1: This is the Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. Hi,

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Speaker 1: I'm Jason Kelly, and welcome to the Bloomberg Business of Sports.

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Speaker 1: On this podcast, I've got a treat for you. I

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Speaker 1: caught up with Rich Paul, the founder of Clutch Sports. Arguably,

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Speaker 1: maybe not even arguably, maybe definitively one of the most

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Speaker 1: influential voices in sports today. He has become an agent

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Speaker 1: and an agent of change in many ways, representing Lebron

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Speaker 1: James and Anthony Davis, now widening to represent athletes in

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Speaker 1: professional baseball and football. Fun fact, Clutch represented the number

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Speaker 1: two and the number three picks in this year's new

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Speaker 1: look NFL Draft. I talked with Rich in a wide

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Speaker 1: ranging conversation about what's going on in sports right now,

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Speaker 1: how we get back to some sense of normalcy. But

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Speaker 1: we also took a turn into essentially the philosophy of Clutch.

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Speaker 1: How he may the decision to start the firm, to

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Speaker 1: leave what he described as a pretty good job, to

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Speaker 1: go out on his own, inspired by another member of

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Speaker 1: the inner circle of Lebron James, What that was like,

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Speaker 1: what he's learned along the way, and maybe where this

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Speaker 1: business goes next. Check it out. So Rich Paul, I

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Speaker 1: want to start by asking you, you know, we're living

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Speaker 1: in this world that is for the most part, still

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Speaker 1: without sports. How do we get back from here? What

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Speaker 1: do you think we need to do to get back

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Speaker 1: to something resembling normalcy when it comes to the world

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Speaker 1: of sports. Well, I think, you know, the first steps

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Speaker 1: it's always to just kind of look at all things

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Speaker 1: in front of us, um and you know, it's not

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Speaker 1: a decision that could be rushed, obviously, because different from

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Speaker 1: most business decisions before, we were making decisions, or we

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Speaker 1: are making decisions that entails the lives of you know,

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Speaker 1: whether it's players, workers, coaches, you know, family members, et cetera.

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Speaker 1: So anytime you have that obstacle in front of you,

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Speaker 1: you know, there's no there's no way you can make

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Speaker 1: a rush decision. I do think that the proper steps

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Speaker 1: are being taken to try to get us back to

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Speaker 1: playing sports in any capacity. But ultimately, you know, it

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Speaker 1: takes patients, it really does. Because this thing hit, no

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Speaker 1: one really understood the information coming out, no one really

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Speaker 1: understood what's accurate, what's inaccurate, you know, And so for

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Speaker 1: for for me, I've really just been valuing, uh, the

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Speaker 1: time and trying to get a better understanding of what's

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Speaker 1: what's really happening, and so but I do think as

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Speaker 1: we're seeing here now, we're seeing a little light amongst

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Speaker 1: all our professional sports that we can maybe get back

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Speaker 1: to being active and then hopefully, you know, take the

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Speaker 1: next step after that, and then the next step after

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Speaker 1: that to utimately and with normalcy. So I'm optimistic about it.

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Speaker 1: I'm positive about it. I try to always keep a

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Speaker 1: positive mindset while understanding what's in front of us and

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Speaker 1: and noting that serious. Well, I want to talk about

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Speaker 1: the implications for for your business and in a few minutes,

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Speaker 1: But before we get to that, I do wonder as

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Speaker 1: you are having conversations I know every day with players,

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Speaker 1: and I know that it's hard to to generalize, but

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Speaker 1: how are players feeling? I mean, you are in their heads.

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Speaker 1: You your job is to have their best interests in mind,

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Speaker 1: and and we can talk a lot about sort of

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Speaker 1: how society thinks about athletes, and I know it's something

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Speaker 1: you've thought a lot about, but I wonder what's on

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Speaker 1: their mind. You know, what are they thinking about across

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Speaker 1: and it may vary across different leagues, And I know

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Speaker 1: you have clients across all of that. But but what's

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Speaker 1: foremost for them. I think the NBA players were pretty

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Speaker 1: much hit the hardest to start, because they were in

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Speaker 1: mid stream of the season. They had played eight percent

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Speaker 1: of their games, and they were, you know, just in

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Speaker 1: full stride. You know, the playoffs are shaping up. Uh,

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Speaker 1: individual awards was pretty much shaping up. You understand, who

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Speaker 1: were kind of in those lanes or whatnot. You know,

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Speaker 1: teams have played each other two or three times already,

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Speaker 1: and so I think those guys the world was punt

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Speaker 1: upside down from a from a playing a professional playing

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Speaker 1: perspective um, because they were mid string, mid stride, and

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Speaker 1: you know, it was shaping up to be ahead of

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Speaker 1: the season, and so in talking to those guys, it's

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Speaker 1: just it's it's unbelievable, you know, it really is. They've

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Speaker 1: never been in this position, obviously as the world has it,

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Speaker 1: but it's hard to imagine. It's hard to not be

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Speaker 1: in the flow of doing things that you've been used

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Speaker 1: to doing for so long. And even for myself, you know,

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Speaker 1: getting up going to games, talking to teams, talking to players,

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Speaker 1: you know, you pretty much know the schedule on their

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Speaker 1: schedule and it's for that to come to a complete stop.

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Speaker 1: It's definitely still to this day, it's just you know,

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Speaker 1: it's it's just hard to even believe and understand. But

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Speaker 1: with that being said, they are looking forward to getting

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Speaker 1: back to playing. They do want to come back and play.

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Speaker 1: And it's helped some guys who who was injured and

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Speaker 1: was able to rehab why everything else stopped, So you know,

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Speaker 1: there's a positive from that perspective, but it's definitely, definitely

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Speaker 1: their world was slipped upside down, as in terms of

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Speaker 1: whether baseball who now would be playing just getting into

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Speaker 1: their season. They've never been through it, obviously, and and

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Speaker 1: it's it's affecting them tremendously as well as we see

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Speaker 1: with all the conversations about this proposal, that proposal which

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Speaker 1: argumently affects your salaries and things of that nature. And

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Speaker 1: then I think football is a little different because they

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Speaker 1: had the draft, and obviously it whether your normal draft

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Speaker 1: because they don't know that the players didn't really know

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Speaker 1: what it was like that they had never been to

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Speaker 1: a draft before, so you know, they understood, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: didn't get to shape good Dell's hand, but they still

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Speaker 1: got the setting to being drafted and their home with

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Speaker 1: their families, et cetera. They their season has yet to start,

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Speaker 1: so there's a confidence that they will play this season,

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Speaker 1: and so they're in a different position ship. But that's

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Speaker 1: pretty much the three across the board. But I think

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Speaker 1: basketball was really, really really hit UM, at least up

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Speaker 1: to this point, the hardest because right now we'll be

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Speaker 1: heading into the conference finals at this point, right yeah. Well,

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Speaker 1: and and then specifically to that point, I mean, you

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Speaker 1: were watching, I mean, to get very specific, you were

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Speaker 1: watching the fruits of probably one of the most amazing

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Speaker 1: deals that's been pulled off in the last few years,

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Speaker 1: which was, you know, getting a d and Lebron on

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Speaker 1: the same team. And obviously that was was clicking for

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Speaker 1: them and for you, and obviously for for Lakers fans.

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Speaker 1: I mean that that really came screeching to a halt. Now,

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Speaker 1: obviously that story is yet to be written, and we'll

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Speaker 1: talk about what may happen next. But that must have

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Speaker 1: been hard to watch. I mean, you know it was.

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Speaker 1: It was It was hard to watch for all forever,

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Speaker 1: for everyone. Honestly, you know, it's hard to watch UM

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Speaker 1: because you just know what these guys, what they put

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Speaker 1: into it, but they put it to getting back. Um, obviously,

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Speaker 1: when your season, when you come up short the previous year,

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Speaker 1: you had this this motivation and it's dry and to

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Speaker 1: come back and too, you know, adding different pieces to

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Speaker 1: your teams and and you know have and creating those moments,

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Speaker 1: capturing those key moments and milestones, you know, and forward

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Speaker 1: to come to the cree stop. It's extremely hard. And

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Speaker 1: so let's talk about basketball if we can't just for

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Speaker 1: a second. And you know, you and I are speaking

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Speaker 1: on Wednesday. There's a lot of speculation on you know,

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Speaker 1: what may happen. Nothing is official, and maybe by the

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Speaker 1: time people are listening to this it is. But from

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Speaker 1: your perspective, what's the most important thing for the players

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Speaker 1: going into this? What are they thinking about as they

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Speaker 1: sort of contemplate a you know, playing in the bubble

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Speaker 1: and you know, a sort of quarantined shorten different kind

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Speaker 1: of season. What's front of mine for them and for him? Well,

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Speaker 1: for me, I think what would be front of mine

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Speaker 1: is number one. You know, it's always tough to when

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Speaker 1: you rev an engine up like they do in terms

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Speaker 1: of playing the game at the level that they play,

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Speaker 1: it's very tough to come to a complete stop. So

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Speaker 1: now to start back up, I think the most consideration

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Speaker 1: to be taken would be understanding that I have to

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Speaker 1: protect myself because we're all step of injury going forward, right,

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Speaker 1: and so you want to be doing things now to

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Speaker 1: give you the the minimum risk of injury happening. And

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Speaker 1: so guys have to really take a serious You have

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Speaker 1: to really you know what what you don't have is

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Speaker 1: you don't have your team pushing you to do X,

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Speaker 1: Y and z. So it takes a lot of self

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Speaker 1: motivation and you have to be focused to be able

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Speaker 1: to do these things to prevent the risk of things

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Speaker 1: happening as such, that's my biggest concerns and I tell

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Speaker 1: all guys, you know, try to do things to stay

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Speaker 1: in shape, keep your flexibility, um, you know, stripting your

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Speaker 1: cored and things that nature. Making sure. Obviously you can't

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Speaker 1: be in game shape because you haven't played a game,

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Speaker 1: but doing all things all the way up to that

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Speaker 1: to help you because as the professional, you just gotta

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Speaker 1: stay ready. You have to be ready. You're being paid

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Speaker 1: to do a job. It's it's unfortunate times that we're

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Speaker 1: all in But at the same time, if they say Okay,

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Speaker 1: well in two weeks we're starting back up. Depending on

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Speaker 1: where you were at prior to that could could have

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Speaker 1: a huge effect on you. And so you want to

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Speaker 1: take this time not as a vacation, not at the

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Speaker 1: time to where you know, I don't have to do

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Speaker 1: anything but play a video game or watch net picks

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Speaker 1: all day. You're still a professional athlete, and honestly, as

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Speaker 1: a professional athlete, you should never be out shape, right,

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Speaker 1: It should be in shape all year round, to be honest.

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Speaker 1: But everyone's different. So that's my biggest thing. So if

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Speaker 1: we do end up in in this situation where you

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Speaker 1: know they're playing in the NBA, players specifically are playing

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Speaker 1: in a bubble, you know you are their key advocate.

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Speaker 1: You know you are the key person who is dealing

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Speaker 1: with teams and owners and whatnot. UM, how does it

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Speaker 1: change the way that you advocate for them? You know,

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Speaker 1: even during that interim period or during that period where

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Speaker 1: they're they're living in the bubble, there's not a change

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Speaker 1: of advocacy. I think we're all we're in the bubble

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Speaker 1: understanding what's in front of book, understanding you know, the

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Speaker 1: responsibilities that you have. UM And and in this case,

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Speaker 1: you really have to work together because ultimately you're trying

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Speaker 1: to protect our sport, and so everyone matters, everyone's important

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Speaker 1: at this time, and you have to applause old who

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Speaker 1: are really in a lot of ways, you know. So

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Speaker 1: I would say, hey, I'm putting my life on the

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Speaker 1: line to make sure that this thing continues on, and

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Speaker 1: so that has to be held with hell, with the

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Speaker 1: utmost respect. And that's my that's my perception of it,

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Speaker 1: and that's just my stance on it. Ultimately, you want

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Speaker 1: the guys to be able to finish this season, and

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Speaker 1: you have to respect those that's doing the littlest things

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Speaker 1: and the biggest thing to allow them to do something. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's a really interesting point because I think we've you know,

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Speaker 1: as you said earlier in the conversation, you know, you

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Speaker 1: obviously worry about injuries and things like that, but we've

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Speaker 1: never been in this position where you're really worried about

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Speaker 1: players safety from a very basic health perspective, And I

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Speaker 1: would imagine that adds sort of a different wrinkle to

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Speaker 1: your job to some extent. It does. You just try

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Speaker 1: to have the conversation with the guys to be responsible,

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Speaker 1: you know, you really you really have to put another

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Speaker 1: layer of responsibility because this is something you can't see,

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Speaker 1: and it's you can prepare for as much as you want.

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Speaker 1: But given that there is uh irresponsible actions being taken,

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Speaker 1: it could affect all. It's just that serious, and so

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Speaker 1: that I think that would be my conversation will repeat, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I would imagine you're already having you You're

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Speaker 1: having those conversations uh all the time now for sure. Well,

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Speaker 1: I do wonder, you know, in terms of this moment,

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Speaker 1: you said something interesting earlier in the conversation about how

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Speaker 1: you know you're sort of taking this time to reflect

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Speaker 1: about your business. This has been a pretty amazing by

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Speaker 1: all accounts, um twelve months for you too, you know,

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Speaker 1: twelve to eighteen months, maybe even longer, depending on how

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Speaker 1: you want to define it. I mean even this calendar year.

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Speaker 1: Uh are certainly this trailing year with some acquisitions that

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Speaker 1: you've made to expand Clutch. I do wonder, you know,

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Speaker 1: at this moment, as you've had as maybe you have

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Speaker 1: had a little bit of time to reflect, do you

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Speaker 1: think about your business differently? What what happens at this

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Speaker 1: moment for Clutch? I think that any time something like

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Speaker 1: this happened there's there's an opportunity for one to um

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Speaker 1: excel and in this in this instance, my mindset has

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Speaker 1: has always be main the same events, continuing to try

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Speaker 1: to build the best team going forward, to to represent

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Speaker 1: athletes in a capacity that is different than what was

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Speaker 1: before us and more so than than ever, I think

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Speaker 1: coming out of this, I think the landscape of the

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Speaker 1: business will change because prior to this, you know, your

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Speaker 1: or anything, just his human nature to just be okay

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Speaker 1: with something remains the same over and over and over again.

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Speaker 1: Long is just not a negative effect, right, you know,

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Speaker 1: you're okay with it, it's great, there's no issues. But

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Speaker 1: the moment something like this takes place, then I think

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Speaker 1: everything changes. And I think coming out of this, people

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Speaker 1: are going to look for what we've always been preparing

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Speaker 1: ourselves to be, and that's, uh, you know, a more creative, thinking,

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Speaker 1: scrappy um, you know, driven, UM, you know, empowering, the

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Speaker 1: voice of the athlete type of environment. And we came

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Speaker 1: in the doors in that person. And I think that

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Speaker 1: coming out of this that would be sought after even

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Speaker 1: more so. We're built for the change because, as you know,

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Speaker 1: before the business was it was what it was, it

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Speaker 1: was just it was only repeat again the same the

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Speaker 1: same uh. Environments, you know, the same culture is the same, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, infrastructures, it was all the same. And it

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Speaker 1: was just like, hey, you know, we've we've been around

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Speaker 1: for so long and we've had success for so long,

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Speaker 1: and and people just you don't really challenge that. But

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Speaker 1: now I think it would be it would it would

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Speaker 1: be different. And so my focus has been, like I

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Speaker 1: said before, just trying to continue to add the right pieces.

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Speaker 1: We have a great foundation, We've had success. You know,

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Speaker 1: we we were to stand on our pillars of of

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Speaker 1: integrity and and you know, um work, ethic and knowledge

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Speaker 1: and and you know, trying to you know, commitment and

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Speaker 1: trust and things of that nature. UM. But at the

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Speaker 1: same time I think it even they step forward and

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Speaker 1: and just have a better understanding, um, not only are

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Speaker 1: respective sports, but the business around it and ultimately who

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Speaker 1: that athlete wants to be and and help and educate

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Speaker 1: them and and and it's not and again it's not

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Speaker 1: it's not going to be for everybody. We understand that.

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Speaker 1: I understand that, but that doesn't mean that you can't

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Speaker 1: prepare as such. And so that's that's what our focus

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Speaker 1: has been, so it will remain that and I think

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Speaker 1: that we will be sought after coming out of this

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Speaker 1: because I think this gives this gives the athletes the

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Speaker 1: opportunity to sit back and really evaluate what was in

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Speaker 1: front of them and came. You know, maybe I made

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Speaker 1: a decision because it didn't refer these fathers at that time.

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Speaker 1: I was in a different position in my life at

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Speaker 1: that time, but now it's not and I'm okay with

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Speaker 1: make the decision actuls best for me. But it's a

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Speaker 1: pease and others and thay that nature. So I'm looking

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Speaker 1: forward to it. I'm excited about it also being I'm

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Speaker 1: excited to get the world back the world's heartbeat back beating,

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Speaker 1: because I think sports is the heartbeat of the world globally,

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Speaker 1: and you know, and seeing our our players get back

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Speaker 1: into the flow of things would be great. And hopefully

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Speaker 1: at some point here, you know, we're as as as

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Speaker 1: a nation, as a country, as again as as a world,

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Speaker 1: we're able to get back to normalcy. Yeah, it's it's

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Speaker 1: a really interesting point sort of that that self reflection

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Speaker 1: that it does feel like all of us are going

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Speaker 1: through to some extent, and I do wonder you know,

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Speaker 1: for for athletes that that you're talking to, I mean,

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Speaker 1: are they thinking about how I guess the question would be,

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Speaker 1: how is it manifesting for them? Are they thinking about

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Speaker 1: their pay differently? Are they thinking about teammates differently? Are

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Speaker 1: they thinking about you know, geography and and all these

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Speaker 1: things that play into it, Like, how are they how

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Speaker 1: are they thinking differently? How in terms of how they

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Speaker 1: want to be. On the other side, I think I

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Speaker 1: think for most athletes, there's a lot of trends. Right

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Speaker 1: We've seen it. We've seen the tech We've seen the

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Speaker 1: tech trends, uh where where there was a lot of

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Speaker 1: guys going to that space and it was the hot

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Speaker 1: thing to do, but we didn't see the end result, right,

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Speaker 1: we don't know what the end result really was. Um.

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Speaker 1: I think right now you're seeing the fashion space, you know,

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Speaker 1: because there's a lot of opportunity there were live in

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Speaker 1: the world to where today, uh, this brand is nothing,

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Speaker 1: tomorrow is everything. We've seen that, and guys want to

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Speaker 1: take advantage of that opportunity as well. So what I

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Speaker 1: tell guys, we don't put a cap on his thing. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: your foundation is playing your respective sports, your proect that

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Speaker 1: that is one thing you are a professional act the

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Speaker 1: other things you want to be involved in. But you

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Speaker 1: have to have the same values and understanding going forward

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Speaker 1: in that business as you're doing yours. The biggest thing

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Speaker 1: is infrastructure. Money doesn't bring you um results or success

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Speaker 1: from that perspective, so you have to respect. You have

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Speaker 1: to respect that space and really educate yourself on it,

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Speaker 1: align yourself with the right people, having the right resources

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Speaker 1: and right relationships, and ultimately educating yourself on this on

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Speaker 1: the space to take baby steps. Now, it's very difficult

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Speaker 1: to be Ralph Sampson and Ralph Lauren and just god

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Speaker 1: just just don't work like that. But at the same time,

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Speaker 1: you can have success in several things that you do.

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Speaker 1: It may be a piece to pie over here, smaller

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Speaker 1: pieces of pie over there, and that's okay. It's ultimately

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Speaker 1: what you're trying to do is you're trying not to

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Speaker 1: be totally successful in this space and then take that

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Speaker 1: success and ultimately the earnings that you've made in this

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Speaker 1: space and dump it over here. From a from a

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Speaker 1: from an uneducated standpoint, just to lose you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: we all want to create finance, financial stability for our families.

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Speaker 1: And in a lot of cases, you only have to

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Speaker 1: do that once. You know, if you're if you're if

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Speaker 1: you're taking the proper steps, especially the money that these

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Speaker 1: guys are making, so you know, be very careful that

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Speaker 1: you know, you can take the leap off the treat,

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Speaker 1: but you don't want to carry your truck over here

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Speaker 1: needs it. And so that that's my conversation because you've

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Speaker 1: got allow guys to involve as people that they're not

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Speaker 1: just basketball, football and baseball players. Their young men and

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Speaker 1: husbands and fathers and uncles, and they want to and

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Speaker 1: their and their creator. That there's a ton of athletes

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Speaker 1: out there that are really, really really talented in other things.

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Speaker 1: But we just have to be smart as it pertains

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Speaker 1: to that talent or that want and be very careful

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Speaker 1: who you're lying yourself with because the losses are hard

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Speaker 1: to come by. You're losing liquid. It's a different dynamic

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Speaker 1: where you get to that point. And so that's that's

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Speaker 1: a conversation that we have a lot and I have

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Speaker 1: a lot with a lot of my with a lot

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Speaker 1: of my guys because you know, just it's just important,

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Speaker 1: you know, and it's also important too to understand who

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Speaker 1: you are and be and be okay with that. You

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Speaker 1: don't have to be complacent. You don't necessarily have to

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Speaker 1: be totally content, but just because comfortable, be comfortable and

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Speaker 1: and and it's okay to to to be you and

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Speaker 1: be confident that being used is good enough and you

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Speaker 1: tend to have some success and and ultimately, you know,

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Speaker 1: live the life that you want to live as long

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Speaker 1: as about allows you to live it. You know, it's interesting,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting to hear you talk about that, in part

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Speaker 1: because it feels like this is a lesson that was

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Speaker 1: learned more quickly in the NBA and by players in

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Speaker 1: the NBA than some of the other major sports. And

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Speaker 1: maybe we could argue the merits and demerits of of

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Speaker 1: that argument. It doesn't seem like it's an accident that

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Speaker 1: that is how you sort of you came up is

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Speaker 1: working initially with basketball players and now you've you've expanded

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Speaker 1: the roster clearly, what what do you see as you

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Speaker 1: look across the different athletes that you represent, and may

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Speaker 1: be what are those lessons that and do you agree

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Speaker 1: with the idea that maybe those lessons were learned early

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Speaker 1: in basketball, but but maybe a little later coming to

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Speaker 1: to uh, specifically baseball and football. Well, what I see is, well, no,

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Speaker 1: I think in all athletes, I think that to this way.

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Speaker 1: In any other business, when you're successful, you're okay with that, right, right,

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Speaker 1: But I think that sometimes there's an insecurity and athletes

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Speaker 1: step because I made my money plan a sport. That

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Speaker 1: means that people don't do me as smart or as

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Speaker 1: you know, um, my success didn't come from something that

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Speaker 1: you had the necessarily go to school for an etcetera,

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Speaker 1: and and and some people struggle with that. There's an

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Speaker 1: insecurity there. There's there's there's uh, you know, a lack

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Speaker 1: there of confidence that I could be p out of

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Speaker 1: who I was and where my where my wealth and

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Speaker 1: success came from. And I'm saying, no, that's that's wrong.

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Speaker 1: Everybody is different, whether you're a fashion design or whether

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Speaker 1: you're you know, whether you Bill Gates, whether you're an athlete,

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Speaker 1: you know, whether you started amavon. That's okay. But I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of times where God is getting trouble

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Speaker 1: is they want to prove that they're more dame this

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Speaker 1: person for someone else's approval. And to me, that's wrong. Now,

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Speaker 1: if you want to if if you want to challenge

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Speaker 1: yourself or if you want to, if you want to

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Speaker 1: express your other talents, I'm all for that, But do

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Speaker 1: that for you. Don't do that trying to prove to

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Speaker 1: someone else that you're more than just this per And

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Speaker 1: because that's where I made my money at No, you

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Speaker 1: made your money where God gave you the talent. You know.

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Speaker 1: God gave coulders and and people that were great with

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Speaker 1: algorithms and and different things a talent to to build

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Speaker 1: certain create certain things over here. You gave a creative

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Speaker 1: geniuses a talent to create certain things over there. He

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Speaker 1: gave writers and producers their talent, gave athletes their talent.

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Speaker 1: And I'm okay with that. Now, put some athletes become

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Speaker 1: writers and singers and those things. Yeah, but do that

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Speaker 1: for you. Don't do that to appease the perception of

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Speaker 1: someone else. Um and and how they do use and

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Speaker 1: be confident in that, and and that's okay. So I

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Speaker 1: just I just I look at that a lot. I

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Speaker 1: see it, and I try to help guys understand that

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Speaker 1: you could be confident and okay with how you got

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Speaker 1: to this point. I'm very confident, okay with how I

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Speaker 1: got to to where I'm at with the understanding I

421
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Speaker 1: have a long way to go and you don't get

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Speaker 1: here by yourself. But at the same time, hey, I

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Speaker 1: don't go to Harvard, I don't go to m I

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Speaker 1: t or Pen And that's fine. I wouldn't. I gotta

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Speaker 1: masters at the University of Nike fantastic with me. I

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Speaker 1: always try to help guys just have a better understanding

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Speaker 1: and know that it's okay, because then the be who

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Speaker 1: they are and double down on that. And you know,

429
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,040
Speaker 1: I think one of the biggest things you can do

430
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:40,960
Speaker 1: is align yourself with people who were successful in different

431
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:45,360
Speaker 1: spaces and conversate with them on how they got there.

432
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:48,360
Speaker 1: Would you agree though, that it feels like that has

433
00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:52,639
Speaker 1: manifested itself more prominently in the NBA than some of

434
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:56,080
Speaker 1: the other professional leagues in terms of what just in

435
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:58,359
Speaker 1: terms of it. I mean, it's interesting to hear you

436
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 1: explain that because it feels like the n B A

437
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,879
Speaker 1: into some extent, especially the modern NBA, the NBA of

438
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 1: the last twenty years especially, has been almost like institutionally

439
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:14,399
Speaker 1: and culturally more comfortable with exactly what you're saying. You know,

440
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:19,199
Speaker 1: this idea that a player can you know, be an

441
00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:22,880
Speaker 1: excellent athlete on the court and and obviously I will

442
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 1: show my cards completely. Like obviously Lebron Is is a

443
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,720
Speaker 1: really interesting and maybe the alpha example of that, uh

444
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 1: in in many ways, And you think about Chris Paul

445
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:35,200
Speaker 1: or you think about you know, some of the athlete

446
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:37,919
Speaker 1: other athletes that have have come along through the n

447
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: b A who it feels like the league and maybe

448
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 1: the sport itself uh have have been more either open

449
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:52,000
Speaker 1: to that or have been a more fertile ground uh

450
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 1: for for that. And I do wonder if that has

451
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 1: something to do what the relationship is to the popularity

452
00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: of basketball and all that. You know what I'm saying, Well, yeah, well,

453
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 1: I think I think the sport of basketball is the

454
00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:09,960
Speaker 1: one sport that allows you to be integrated with the

455
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 1: movers and shakers of multiple industries. It's an intimate watch

456
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:20,840
Speaker 1: your closely action guys interact, you know who they are accessible.

457
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 1: Lebron land this space starting out because of that, and

458
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 1: I think you started to see more guys do it.

459
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 1: But at the same time, Junior Bridgeman, it's a very

460
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 1: very very successful businessman that no one knows about why

461
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 1: because he wasn't a high profile player when he did play,

462
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 1: and he played many many, many years ago. But he

463
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:52,040
Speaker 1: stands here today and extremely successful businessman, in which it

464
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 1: should be a prerequisite to have to speak to Junior

465
00:29:55,840 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: Bridgeman as you enter the NBA UH between years three

466
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 1: and seven, you should want to talk to him. Everybody's

467
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 1: not gonna be Lebron. It's just not. It's not in

468
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:12,320
Speaker 1: the card, and that's okay. In the event you're able

469
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:17,800
Speaker 1: to understand what it's like to be a professional athlete,

470
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:24,640
Speaker 1: you can really position yourself strongly in life. Create because

471
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 1: the ultimate goal is to do what have a strong foundation.

472
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 1: When you build a house, the first step is doing what,

473
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:38,200
Speaker 1: pouring the concrete to create the foundation of that home.

474
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 1: Once you have that solidified, it's up to you the

475
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 1: type of home you decide to build. It's the same

476
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:50,480
Speaker 1: way in professional sports. I think Lebron's success came from

477
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 1: knowing what he don't know, aligning himself with the right people. Ultimately,

478
00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 1: we have an environment to wear and it's really when

479
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:02,680
Speaker 1: you really look at it, it's a very sad thing.

480
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:07,200
Speaker 1: Everyone wants a personal paying pizza when you can really

481
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:12,440
Speaker 1: have the party practice. If you decided to communicate, to

482
00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:17,760
Speaker 1: share information, to not want the credit. Think about this,

483
00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 1: Jeff Ago said to me, Rich, this opportunity for you

484
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:29,920
Speaker 1: two have zero zero zero zero zero zero zero point

485
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 1: zero zero zero one percent of of Amazon. But nobody's

486
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 1: gonna know it, don't matter, blah blah blah. I'm saying,

487
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:47,160
Speaker 1: come on with it. Yeah, now there's a trip to that.

488
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:51,160
Speaker 1: That's easy for you to say now, knowing the company

489
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 1: is as successful as it is. But would you have

490
00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 1: made that safe decision prior to its success or would

491
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,840
Speaker 1: you have wanted to go out and try to start

492
00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: your own Amazon. The opportunity costs of you doing that

493
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:15,040
Speaker 1: would be the company's success today. This is the challenge

494
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:19,720
Speaker 1: amongst our athletes from a business perspective now, which which

495
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 1: India is here, Everyone wants to personal pay pizza. We

496
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:29,520
Speaker 1: could have the party planners if we just communicate and

497
00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:33,880
Speaker 1: done business together. Who cares? Lebrons gets the credit today,

498
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 1: somebody else gets the credit tomorrow, don't matter, It doesn't matter.

499
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,600
Speaker 1: But we don't think that way. But yet, and still

500
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:46,360
Speaker 1: we just saw five owners. Five owners started to heal

501
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,640
Speaker 1: the company. So how does that translate to your business?

502
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 1: So how do you take those lessons and that philosophy

503
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 1: that you just laid out. How does it inform Clutch? Well,

504
00:32:57,880 --> 00:33:01,440
Speaker 1: Crutch partners with U t A. That was the decision made.

505
00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 1: Now would you go I didn't you know, we didn't

506
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 1: have to do that, but that would because you made

507
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 1: to give us a better infrastructure, give us better reach,

508
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 1: give us better resources, better relationships to better represent our clients.

509
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:22,400
Speaker 1: And so does that also change how and when you

510
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:26,400
Speaker 1: make acquisitions and you know if you uh, you know,

511
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 1: does it change how you know if you're going after

512
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: a title or a revolution, like, how are those conversations

513
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:39,520
Speaker 1: different or what do they involved? What's the pitch to them? Well,

514
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 1: there is no pitch. It's often made my decision. But

515
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 1: when you have partners, you want to be in communication thoroughly.

516
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:56,880
Speaker 1: Obviously everyone's involved everyone at this level, the insight is

517
00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: very important. And so I'm I bet on people and

518
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:05,200
Speaker 1: taking those first steps going into those different sports. I'm

519
00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:09,880
Speaker 1: betting nor people. Right, We're not stopping there. That's just

520
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:14,000
Speaker 1: step one. Tomorrow there could be today there's one head

521
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:17,879
Speaker 1: of football, Tomorrow there could be cohead. But the penetration

522
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:23,200
Speaker 1: had to come from some point, and you know, we

523
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:25,719
Speaker 1: made a decision to to to go into it with

524
00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:32,920
Speaker 1: with these respective people. But ultimately the goal is to

525
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 1: continue to build the teen. It's not an I, it's us.

526
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,920
Speaker 1: You want to build a great team. You know. I've

527
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:46,759
Speaker 1: been extremely fortunate to work with the people that I

528
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 1: work with um and empowering different people and so it's

529
00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 1: it's it's been fantastic. I have a I have an

530
00:34:54,400 --> 00:35:00,120
Speaker 1: unbelievable tween with me Superstar as my cello and and

531
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 1: in fair Left, she's amazing. And we brought the great

532
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:07,799
Speaker 1: team internally and and you know, partner in the U

533
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:11,800
Speaker 1: t A adding more great people and more experienced people

534
00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 1: and things of that nature. And it's been fantastic. It's

535
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:18,920
Speaker 1: really been blat I'm looking forward to, uh what's next.

536
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,560
Speaker 1: I think we have a great set up and and

537
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 1: you know, I can't I can't be more excited about

538
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:27,839
Speaker 1: the times. And you know, and obviously I know we're

539
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:33,200
Speaker 1: in this this pandemic stage, but you have to stay positive.

540
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 1: That's the one thing I can say. Two people out there, young, old,

541
00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:39,480
Speaker 1: there's a lot of people that that that lost their

542
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:42,319
Speaker 1: jobs and things like that, and it's it's a very

543
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 1: unfortunate time. But you you know, you just have to

544
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:48,319
Speaker 1: stay positive because things come back. Around. You know, my

545
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 1: dad always should tell me you have to stay down

546
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:54,960
Speaker 1: and come back up, And that's very important. And I

547
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:57,719
Speaker 1: think a lot of times people do a lot of

548
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:01,719
Speaker 1: working out right, we're buying the peloton, like you're doing

549
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:04,400
Speaker 1: the acts on your phone and things that nature. But

550
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 1: the most important muscle that you con strengthened is your mind.

551
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: So we're got to start there. And so how do

552
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:13,840
Speaker 1: you do that in this time? Are you reading? More like?

553
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:15,480
Speaker 1: What are you reading? What are you watching? What are

554
00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 1: you listening to? I'm mentally strong when God wakes me

555
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 1: up every morning. I only to read a book to

556
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:24,840
Speaker 1: do mentally strong. And I'd rather talked to the living

557
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:29,640
Speaker 1: legends then read it in the book. Honestly, who are

558
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 1: you looking to? Right? Who are you talking to? I

559
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:40,080
Speaker 1: talked to I talked too different and yeah, successful people.

560
00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 1: And when I say influences, not get goods and glands.

561
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 1: I'm talking about people who who who changed their business.

562
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 1: One person I enjoyed. Obviously, you know, I'm not into names.

563
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:56,240
Speaker 1: I don't like to do that. But across the board,

564
00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:59,200
Speaker 1: I talked to you to several people that have had

565
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 1: a tremendous mind of success. I just lost a guy

566
00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 1: who became a really good friend of mine. Andre Horrell,

567
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 1: who had an unbelievable impact on the music business, was

568
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 1: just a sweep, sweep guy. Every time you've seen him,

569
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,840
Speaker 1: he was positive. He was obviously he was. He was

570
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:23,799
Speaker 1: pro black and wanted the best for us and and

571
00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:28,360
Speaker 1: wanted you to really value your position and understand, you know,

572
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,480
Speaker 1: the mountain that you climb and p pict to this

573
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 1: point and not to take that for granted. And you know,

574
00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 1: we lost him and her fortune and it's time. You

575
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 1: can't even really say your respects the proper way. But

576
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:49,920
Speaker 1: several people male female, Uh, it doesn't really matter the

577
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:54,480
Speaker 1: the the race. But I just tried to surround myself

578
00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 1: and and and speak to those. Don't get the wrong

579
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:03,920
Speaker 1: those who passed away and left behind impact and trail blaze.

580
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 1: It's it's definitely people that you want to look to

581
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:13,680
Speaker 1: and and read how they got there. But I'm also understanding, well,

582
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:16,759
Speaker 1: if I was alive and it was alive and had

583
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 1: the opportunity to speak to them when they were doing it,

584
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 1: I would wanted to do it then, So why not

585
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,600
Speaker 1: do it now? And so I started to do that

586
00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:26,640
Speaker 1: as well. So as you look back and we'll wrap

587
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:29,560
Speaker 1: up in a second. But Uh, as you look back

588
00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 1: on on sort of the evolution of of clutch and

589
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:36,680
Speaker 1: obviously there you've got a lot of big things ahead

590
00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:39,160
Speaker 1: of you, what do you see as like the one

591
00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:42,520
Speaker 1: or two sort of catalytic moments. What are the moments

592
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:44,359
Speaker 1: you look back and say, all right, that was an

593
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 1: inflection point. Uh, maybe it's something recent, maybe it's something

594
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:52,200
Speaker 1: uh further back. What do you think about? Well, I

595
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:57,000
Speaker 1: just think that when I look back at on just

596
00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:01,160
Speaker 1: the last eight years, it's in which is really not

597
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 1: that long ago. I think, Jef, the we want and

598
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:09,760
Speaker 1: the willingness to take the step forward that I did,

599
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:14,680
Speaker 1: it was was very important to actually create it, to

600
00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:19,440
Speaker 1: actually make the decision to do it. Yes, because a

601
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:21,719
Speaker 1: friend of mine was not even a friend of mine,

602
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 1: a brother to me, was doing Uh. He was speaking

603
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:33,040
Speaker 1: at a graduation. He was the commission speaker, and he

604
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:37,400
Speaker 1: spoke about being content with the good ass job. This

605
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:41,360
Speaker 1: is an Africa I'm talking about, just just speaking about

606
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 1: having a good ass job and growing up because you

607
00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:52,160
Speaker 1: don't have your without opportunity, you lack the higher education levels,

608
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:54,919
Speaker 1: which I did, and I was fortunate that my dad

609
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:58,000
Speaker 1: really put a focus on education, but for most they

610
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: did having a good ass job. That was that was involved,

611
00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:08,120
Speaker 1: That was being successful, that was that was fantastic, That

612
00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:12,120
Speaker 1: made the family proud, you know, it was it was

613
00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:15,239
Speaker 1: beyond the height that you thought you could go. Right,

614
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:20,040
Speaker 1: That's what everyone's tried to have, just a good ass job. Well,

615
00:40:20,160 --> 00:40:24,520
Speaker 1: I had a good ass job, and I wasn't satisfied

616
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:28,640
Speaker 1: with that good ass job, which is why I say

617
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 1: to take that step to create clutch, and then not

618
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:36,279
Speaker 1: only create clutch, but not be satisfied with it either.

619
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:40,200
Speaker 1: Coming in you have to be able to persevere through

620
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 1: the name thing. And they hate I get so much. No,

621
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:47,400
Speaker 1: you don't understand how many parents I talked to that

622
00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: prior to them even having one conversation with me, they

623
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:54,640
Speaker 1: talked to fifteen people telling them why they shouldn't imagine

624
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:59,719
Speaker 1: swimming through that sanitation only in sports, this is very

625
00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:02,800
Speaker 1: imp Or if you went out to buy a computer,

626
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:07,719
Speaker 1: what type of computer would you buy? Right? Because you

627
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:12,360
Speaker 1: consider them to be what the best? The best? Exactly?

628
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:15,360
Speaker 1: It's doing out and bought a car, what type of

629
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:17,279
Speaker 1: car with you buy it? You can afford it? You know,

630
00:41:17,360 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 1: you may not buy baility you may not buy it Ferai,

631
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:21,680
Speaker 1: but you're probably gonna buy a band that you can

632
00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:25,760
Speaker 1: afford it. Right, it's kind of mid stream, not too loud,

633
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: drives well luxurious. You're gonna buy a bans. So there's

634
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:33,719
Speaker 1: two things that we talked about that if you can

635
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:38,800
Speaker 1: afford it, you're gonna get the best. Well, in my business,

636
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 1: people found upon the fact that you represent the best players.

637
00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:51,720
Speaker 1: Was that Lebron whether that's for Anthrew David or John Walt,

638
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:57,320
Speaker 1: best sellers, whoever, they say that means he's not gonna

639
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:00,319
Speaker 1: have time for you. That means it's gonna be all

640
00:42:00,360 --> 00:42:03,880
Speaker 1: about this person. Well, wait a minute. If I'm making

641
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:08,560
Speaker 1: a business decision in the space of representation, why if

642
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Speaker 1: I was buying a computer, I would buy an Apple,

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Speaker 1: which is considered the best. If I was buying a car,

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Speaker 1: a biding the Stages, which is considered pound for pounds

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Speaker 1: the best. But as it pertain to my representation and

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Speaker 1: the business decision that I'm making going forward in a

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Speaker 1: space where these guys, I'm not going to align myself

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Speaker 1: with the best because I'm valuing attention over expertise. That

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Speaker 1: seems backwards to me, and its sis seem backwards to most.

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Speaker 1: But we have an environment where there's amateur athletics and

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Speaker 1: there's habits built within the environment and the infrastructure amateur

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Speaker 1: athletics all the way up unto the point you become

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Speaker 1: a pro. But because you built bad habits along the way,

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Speaker 1: the one day you get where you cross over that

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Speaker 1: bridge from amateur to pro allows you or disallows you

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Speaker 1: to value to excutise over the attention because ultimately you've

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Speaker 1: done what your whole time coming up as an amateur athletes.

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Speaker 1: Attention was what the hierarchy. There was no excuse necessary.

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Speaker 1: And that was my conversation with Rich Paul, founder of

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Speaker 1: Clutch Sports. I have to say I really enjoyed catching

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Speaker 1: up with him and clearly a lot going on in

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Speaker 1: the world of sports, but also a look into how

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Speaker 1: he thinks the decision he made to create Clutch and

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Speaker 1: inspired in many ways by his association with not just

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Speaker 1: Lebron James, but members other members of that very tight

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Speaker 1: circle that Lebron has created over the years. And you

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Speaker 1: hear from Rich a lot of ambition, but also a

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Speaker 1: vision of what representation could be and maybe the importance

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Speaker 1: of sports as we try to get back to some

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Speaker 1: sense of normalcy. I've Jason Kelly, You've been listening to

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business of Sports. Check it out every week on Monday,

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Speaker 1: Wednesday and Thursday. This is Bloomberg