1 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:10,119 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the 2 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at 3 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,119 Speaker 1: noon and five pm Eastern on Apple, Cocklay and Android 4 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever 5 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:25,040 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 6 00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:27,880 Speaker 2: We spent all day yesterday telling you the House was 7 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:31,080 Speaker 2: planning to vote on its budget resolution. At least that 8 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:34,040 Speaker 2: was the initial plan, and House leadership wasn't making it 9 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 2: firmly clear if they were still planning to go ahead 10 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:38,239 Speaker 2: with it, as there were four Republican holdouts who were 11 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:41,320 Speaker 2: suggesting they would vote no. You couldn't afford to lose 12 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 2: four votes with the margin Republicans were dealing with last night. 13 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:46,760 Speaker 2: So they bring this thing to the floor and then 14 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 2: they pull it and members actually start to leave the Capitol. 15 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:51,839 Speaker 3: Yeah, they were told to go home. 16 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:54,680 Speaker 2: And then they're called back to vote again. And what happens. 17 00:00:55,720 --> 00:00:58,440 Speaker 2: Three of the holdouts flip and the thing passes. 18 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 3: It's almost as if you were watching this in real time, 19 00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 3: as we all were. 20 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:08,040 Speaker 4: Magical. Thirteen minutes passed. Donald Trump on the phone with 21 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:12,000 Speaker 4: the holdouts. I believe, Kaylee, he flipped two of the 22 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:15,319 Speaker 4: three holdouts that made this all possible two seventeen two 23 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 4: point fifteen. The vote here remindingly one and a half 24 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:22,240 Speaker 4: trillion to two trillion dollars in spending cuts to pay 25 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 4: for four and a half trillion dollars in tax cuts. 26 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 4: The math is still hard for some members. 27 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 2: Here well, certainly Tom Massey, the one Republican who insisted 28 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:32,960 Speaker 2: on still voting no, being one of them. And we 29 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:35,399 Speaker 2: heard this question asked in the cabinet meeting that took 30 00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:37,759 Speaker 2: place at the White House just a while ago about 31 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:40,679 Speaker 2: not cutting Medicaid. The President maintains that he doesn't want 32 00:01:40,720 --> 00:01:43,520 Speaker 2: to touch other than looking at fraud. The problem is 33 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 2: the budget outline, which yes, did not dictate cuts to Medicaid, 34 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 2: did say the Energy and Commerce Committee needs to find 35 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:51,800 Speaker 2: eight hundred and eighty billion dollars worth of cuts somewhere. 36 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 2: The question is where, if not there, why. 37 00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:56,560 Speaker 4: We keep hearing about medicaid because it seems inevitable to 38 00:01:56,600 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 4: those reading the tea leaves here. Donald Trump untruth social 39 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:03,200 Speaker 4: Following passage of the bill, I hope the House and 40 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 4: Senator are able to agree on making the tax cuts permanent, 41 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 4: he writes in all caps, exclamation point, and that's where 42 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 4: we start with Bloomberg's Tyler Kendall, who is on Capitol 43 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 4: Hill looking at the fine print and some very challenging math. 44 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:16,920 Speaker 3: Tyler, what happens next? 45 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:20,080 Speaker 5: Yeah, Hey, Joe, Well, I actually caught up with Senator 46 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 5: Shelley Moore Capito, a Republican from West Virginia on the 47 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:26,400 Speaker 5: Appropriations Committee, earlier today, and she told me she congratulates 48 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:29,760 Speaker 5: the House, but that her chamber has some adjustments to do. 49 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:32,079 Speaker 5: There's a few different issues at play here, but as 50 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:35,720 Speaker 5: you mentioned, tax cuts perhaps the most contingents this House 51 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 5: plan calling for four point five brillion dollars that is 52 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:42,520 Speaker 5: likely only enough runway to extend President Trump's twenty seventeen 53 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:44,360 Speaker 5: A tax plan. And we heard from the Senate Budget 54 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 5: chair at Lindsay Graham, who called this bill neither big 55 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:49,680 Speaker 5: nor beautiful when it comes to tax cuts and says 56 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 5: that he will work in order to try to make 57 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:54,520 Speaker 5: those tax cuts permanent. But also important to keep in 58 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:56,840 Speaker 5: mind here, there are a lot of other campaign promises 59 00:02:56,880 --> 00:02:58,919 Speaker 5: when it comes to tax priorities that could be left 60 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 5: out of this, including no taxes on tips, overtime paid 61 00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:05,359 Speaker 5: social Security, a lower corporate tax rate for companies who 62 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,680 Speaker 5: try to move their manufacturing to the US. So all 63 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 5: of this starting to bubble up for Republicans to try 64 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 5: to find some additional pay for Is and Joe and Kelly. 65 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:19,239 Speaker 5: Those negotiations are already in full are already in full swing. 66 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 5: Bloomberg News reporting that House Speaker Mike Johnson Senate Majority 67 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 5: Leader John Thune heading to the White House later today. 68 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:27,919 Speaker 5: In that White House Chief of Staff Susie Wilds is 69 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 5: expected here on Capitol Hill for a lunch. 70 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:34,399 Speaker 2: Shortly yeah, after leaving the cabinet meeting that just took 71 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:36,760 Speaker 2: place at the White House early Tyler, And as we 72 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 2: just heard Elon Musk there with the rest of the 73 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 2: Cabinet and the President talking about their efforts to cut costs, 74 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 2: how is that working in tandem with the cuts that 75 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:46,400 Speaker 2: Congress is currently trying to find. 76 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 5: It's going to be very difficult, right because we are 77 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 5: seeing potentially huge numbers when it comes to adding to 78 00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 5: the deficit. The Committee for a Responsible Budget estimating that 79 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 5: this House plan at least would add at least three 80 00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 5: trillion dollars, and particularly when we are looking for those 81 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,320 Speaker 5: cuts you mentioned there. How President Trump has vowed that 82 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 5: Medicaid will not be impacted. But it's very difficult to 83 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 5: see how the math outlined in this House plan would 84 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 5: prevent that eight hundred and eighty billion dollars potentially could 85 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 5: go towards Medicaid. If just for the exercise, all of 86 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:17,920 Speaker 5: that money was taken out of the program, it would 87 00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 5: slash the program's annual budget by ten percent over the 88 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:25,440 Speaker 5: next ten years. This get very politically fraught for Republicans. 89 00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:27,880 Speaker 5: I was struck by one database kept by NYU which 90 00:04:27,880 --> 00:04:31,000 Speaker 5: found that thirty seven percent of House Speaker Mike Johnson's 91 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:34,400 Speaker 5: constituents in Louisiana or on Medicaid. This is going to 92 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:35,520 Speaker 5: be a tricky vote ahead. 93 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 2: Indeed, there's still a lot of work left to do. 94 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 2: Last night was really just step one Bloomberg Styler kind 95 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 2: of live on Capitol Hill for us. Thank you so much. 96 00:04:45,279 --> 00:04:47,719 Speaker 2: Of course, I would point out that on this show 97 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 2: or Balance of Power of the late edition yesterday, when 98 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:51,479 Speaker 2: we were still ahead of the vote and talking to 99 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 2: lawmakers about that, we spoke with Congress and Brian Style 100 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:57,240 Speaker 2: of Wisconsin, who was sounding pretty confident it would pass 101 00:04:57,360 --> 00:04:58,919 Speaker 2: last night, even though the face of a lot of 102 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:00,799 Speaker 2: people questioning that. 103 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 4: That's true, but also perfectly articulated the push and pull 104 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:06,800 Speaker 4: here between two sides within the Republican conference. Remember we're 105 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:10,599 Speaker 4: not even talking about Democratic members here. Some obviously concerned 106 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 4: about the potential for cuts to Medicaid. We've spoken with 107 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:15,679 Speaker 4: some of them, including Nicole Malia Takis. 108 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 3: She ended up being yes. 109 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:19,520 Speaker 4: Others don't think that we're cutting enough to make good 110 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 4: on the promise of tax cuts and Donald Trump's request 111 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 4: to make this permanent. That's another big ask, And how 112 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:27,040 Speaker 4: you get these two together in the same room is 113 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:27,720 Speaker 4: going to be interesting. 114 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:30,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, this is how the Congressman phrased it to us yesterday. 115 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:33,600 Speaker 6: To my colleagues on the right that say the reduction 116 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 6: and spending is insufficient, I remind them that by passing 117 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:38,839 Speaker 6: this procedural vote today, it's simply a floor that we 118 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 6: can build on the spending and saving reforms. To my 119 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:44,800 Speaker 6: colleagues that think it's too much, I would offer them 120 00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:47,080 Speaker 6: to really look hard and make sure that we're not 121 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:50,000 Speaker 6: simply measuring the inputs into some of our key programs, 122 00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:52,920 Speaker 6: in particular Medicaid, but instead we're measuring the outputs. 123 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 2: So for more we want to turn to another veteran 124 00:05:56,880 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 2: of Capitol Hill. Former Congressman and former chair of the 125 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:02,360 Speaker 2: Ways and Means Committee, Kevin Brady is here with us 126 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 2: in Oer Washington, d C. Studio. He's now a spokesperson 127 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 2: for the Alliance for Competitive Taxation, making him a pretty 128 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:10,719 Speaker 2: good person to talk to about all of this. Mister chairman, 129 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:11,400 Speaker 2: welcome back. 130 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 7: Good to see. 131 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 2: I would ask you if you were surprised that this 132 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 2: ultimately passed last night, but it also wasn't without its challenges, 133 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 2: and it makes me wonder, if it was that hard 134 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 2: to just get this done initially, how hard is the 135 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 2: next part going to be? 136 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:26,040 Speaker 7: Yeah, they I would like to tell you every steps easier, 137 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 7: but it's not. It's just a different type of difficult. 138 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 7: But there's no question House Republicans defied expectations, you know, 139 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:40,840 Speaker 7: delivered more quickly. I think then people expected lots of momentum, 140 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 7: you know, coming off the floor last night. Talking to 141 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 7: members of Congress and leadership, tax writers, budgeted folks, they 142 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 7: felt like, to Joe's point, they had found that common 143 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:51,240 Speaker 7: ground that's sort of that design that could move it 144 00:06:51,279 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 7: through a near zero majority if you think about it, 145 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:57,359 Speaker 7: just unprecedent that way. So yeah, I don't think you 146 00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 7: can underestimate how important a step this is, not that 147 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:04,839 Speaker 7: there's not more of them. And as the reporter said, 148 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 7: you know, launching right away in those reconciliation discussions with 149 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:11,720 Speaker 7: the Senate in the White House, you know, I think 150 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 7: they're hopeful that they can reach agreement, hopefully in March, 151 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 7: but certainly by early April's when the two new special elections. 152 00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:22,800 Speaker 7: I think that's right seat those two members from Florida. 153 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:26,080 Speaker 7: So it looks like that's the timetable, and that's that's 154 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 7: a that too, is a pretty prompt timetable. 155 00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 4: I'm sure you remember what it was like to get 156 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 4: a telephone call from the other end of Pennsylvania Avenue. 157 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:34,800 Speaker 3: What do these members go through? 158 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:38,400 Speaker 4: What did Victoria Sparks here when Donald Trump called the 159 00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:39,440 Speaker 4: cell phone last night? 160 00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 7: So I think they so one. I think to the 161 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 7: House leadership credit, they had really narrowed the number of 162 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 7: people who were on the fence to a very like 163 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 7: a surprisingly small number. And I think that's because of 164 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,160 Speaker 7: the work they had done in Budget Committee earlier that 165 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:57,320 Speaker 7: had really struck this this deal. And so I think 166 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:01,400 Speaker 7: cong Truman Sparks wanted to know the president administration was 167 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:04,040 Speaker 7: serious about those budget cuts, you know, finding way. 168 00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:05,640 Speaker 3: Is that a happy call though? 169 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:05,840 Speaker 8: Is it? 170 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:06,840 Speaker 3: Hey, how you doing? Kevin? 171 00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 4: I got a problem? Or is he upset? What he 172 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 4: calls and puts on the pressure what he needs? 173 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 7: You know, one he says, you'd imagine direct You know, No, 174 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 7: it is not threatening. People understand he's got a long memory. 175 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 7: He's very successful in his primaries. You don't really have 176 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 7: to say it much my experiences, he talks you through 177 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,119 Speaker 7: the need to move. In this case, it isn't even 178 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:33,200 Speaker 7: doing the tax cuts, it's giving creating the runway. It's 179 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 7: a procedural step that allows you to build what tax 180 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 7: your form you know, can land on, which is his 181 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:42,679 Speaker 7: top priority. So normally I think positive. And they were 182 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 7: on the phone quite a while, so clearly we had 183 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:45,599 Speaker 7: a good conversation. 184 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 8: Yeah. 185 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 2: Well, while we would all love to know what exactly 186 00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:50,000 Speaker 2: he said on those phone calls, we do know what 187 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:52,760 Speaker 2: exactly he said on True Social this morning, which is 188 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,960 Speaker 2: that he wants his twenty seventeen tax cuts made permanent 189 00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 2: and he can hope both chambers can get their heads 190 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 2: around that. The problem is, if you look at what 191 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:02,839 Speaker 2: was outlined last night, four and a half trillion dollars 192 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 2: the Ways and Means Committee has in terms of headway, 193 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,160 Speaker 2: that's just enough to extend the tax cuts. So how 194 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 2: do they actually make permanence happen? 195 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 7: Yeah, so one music to my ears on the front 196 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 7: that's clearly the most pro growth for the country and 197 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:17,959 Speaker 7: for families, certainly main street businesses. So that's a good thing. 198 00:09:18,080 --> 00:09:21,439 Speaker 7: I think their House and Center Republicans are both headed 199 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:24,200 Speaker 7: the same direction on permanence. They're just coming at it 200 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:28,200 Speaker 7: from different directions, different baselines, sort of different designs on 201 00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 7: how they get their bodies together. 202 00:09:31,640 --> 00:09:33,640 Speaker 2: Tell us more about that, because the Senate wants to 203 00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 2: do current baseline right, So what difference does that make 204 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 2: in the ultimate architecture of this pulse. 205 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:43,640 Speaker 7: So the bottom line is today, if Congress spends, you know, 206 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:48,560 Speaker 7: our budget organization assumes that spending will go forever. If 207 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:52,440 Speaker 7: you have tax cuts, they assume they expire. So sort 208 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 7: of different treatment of Congress's action and so current policy 209 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:59,520 Speaker 7: based on basically levels that was spending and says we 210 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:03,079 Speaker 7: assume in the budget those that current policy will go 211 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:06,720 Speaker 7: on unless Congress change. What that does is delivers a 212 00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:10,840 Speaker 7: smaller deficit number for them to work through, allows them 213 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:13,680 Speaker 7: I think a clear path to permanency. But I think 214 00:10:13,679 --> 00:10:16,720 Speaker 7: to the House, I think on the fiscal side of this, 215 00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:19,920 Speaker 7: the House is saying, you know, should we adopt current 216 00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:24,160 Speaker 7: policy baseline, because now they're a current law. We still 217 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 7: want to tether tax cuts to the spending cuts. So 218 00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 7: right now they sort of have a like rock climbers, 219 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 7: they have this static line. You know, the higher the 220 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:37,480 Speaker 7: spending cuts climb, the higher the tax space climbs. And 221 00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:39,560 Speaker 7: so I think that'll be one of the key key 222 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 7: discussions at the White House today. 223 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 4: We'll speak to that balance a little bit more because 224 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:46,200 Speaker 4: people hear a lot of jargon, they billion trillion nothing 225 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:50,520 Speaker 4: matters anymore. The difference between extending and making permanent. Knowing 226 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:52,839 Speaker 4: that we're talking about at the moment two trillion dollars 227 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 4: in cuts, can we actually define that that cost between 228 00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 4: these two options. 229 00:10:57,480 --> 00:11:00,640 Speaker 7: So you've got to reconcile a lot designed and a 230 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 7: lot of the numbers on the on these things. Permanency really, uh, Joe, 231 00:11:04,760 --> 00:11:07,200 Speaker 7: is if you can pay for that for a decade, 232 00:11:07,600 --> 00:11:10,200 Speaker 7: you know that that in effect creates permanency. 233 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:11,040 Speaker 3: So that's. 234 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:13,440 Speaker 7: No, no, no, it is not. 235 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:15,440 Speaker 3: In fact, what number do we need to be talking about? 236 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 7: Well, great question. I think it's shaped by the President's 237 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:23,160 Speaker 7: new tax proposals and overtime on tips, on Social Security 238 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:27,160 Speaker 7: salt and because yeah, at the end of the day, 239 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:31,079 Speaker 7: you know, my bet would be it will be in 240 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:34,280 Speaker 7: some form because what I learned as Ways and Means 241 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:37,679 Speaker 7: Chairman is you know, you can pay attention to his tweets, 242 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:41,600 Speaker 7: but pay real attention to his campaign promises because that's 243 00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:44,080 Speaker 7: what he wants to deliver on. I know, the Ways 244 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:47,480 Speaker 7: and Means Committee has been preparing options for the President 245 00:11:48,080 --> 00:11:51,320 Speaker 7: since day one on those proposals, so they'll have to 246 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 7: find a way to accommodate those priorities for the president. Yes, 247 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:59,480 Speaker 7: they will add money to to that overall. Number one 248 00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 7: of the questions are those permanent you know what I mean? 249 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,480 Speaker 7: Or all are those like pilot tax cuts to go 250 00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 7: a number of years you know? And then are they're reassessed? 251 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:11,720 Speaker 7: So yeah, lots of way to sort of turn the 252 00:12:11,800 --> 00:12:13,880 Speaker 7: Rubik's cube, you know what I mean, to try to 253 00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:14,559 Speaker 7: make this work. 254 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 2: Well, one thing the President made clear again and he 255 00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 2: actually said I've said this over and over when he 256 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:20,680 Speaker 2: was asked about it in the cabinet meeting today, is 257 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 2: that he doesn't want Medicaid to be touched. I think 258 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:25,480 Speaker 2: he referred to it as a read my lips thing 259 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 2: or that, throwing it back to the first President Bush, 260 00:12:30,679 --> 00:12:34,319 Speaker 2: I guess Christian. Yeah, well so I do wonder though, 261 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:36,480 Speaker 2: when you consider the pots that are available, if that 262 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:38,800 Speaker 2: is not one of them, how steep do the cuts 263 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:41,640 Speaker 2: everywhere else in terms of discretionary spending really have to get? 264 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:42,080 Speaker 9: You know? 265 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:46,560 Speaker 7: So two thoughts. One, I think the President, House, Republicans 266 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:49,640 Speaker 7: sent Republicans are all I think pretty much on the 267 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:54,640 Speaker 7: same page. Don't touch those Medicaid benefits, but touch the 268 00:12:55,640 --> 00:13:01,840 Speaker 7: program that sends money to ineligible people, waste money goes 269 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:06,240 Speaker 7: to undocumented immigrants, issues like that. So there are significant 270 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 7: numbers there, you know, that can really turn the turn 271 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 7: the dial on savings while protecting Medicaid itself and then 272 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:19,439 Speaker 7: the other cuts. If you think about it, just since COVID, 273 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:23,679 Speaker 7: our federal budget has grown by more than a third. 274 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:27,959 Speaker 7: It just exploded over the last four five years, and 275 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 7: it's not sustainable. I mean, running two trillion dollars deficits 276 00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:34,280 Speaker 7: just from the growth of that. So clearly they've got 277 00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:36,560 Speaker 7: a right size it back down, you know what I 278 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:42,120 Speaker 7: mean to a more manageable budget over spending budget over time. 279 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:45,200 Speaker 7: And so I think that's where to your question, where 280 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 7: else do you need to go? You know, you would 281 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 7: start with where have we grown over the last four years? 282 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:53,440 Speaker 7: And do we still need to be spending the COVID 283 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 7: levels in the non COVID world. 284 00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:56,680 Speaker 3: Just in our remaining moment. 285 00:13:56,679 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 4: You're one of the principles of this group Coalition for 286 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 4: North American t Yeah to protect, to renegotiate the USMCA. 287 00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:06,760 Speaker 4: Donald Trump says he's still headlong on Canada Mexico's tariffs 288 00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:07,480 Speaker 4: April second. 289 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:08,800 Speaker 3: Is that good for our economy? 290 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:11,959 Speaker 7: You know it's not. In fact, I think the US 291 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 7: Mexico Canada trading block is the most consequential trading partnership 292 00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 7: in the world. Has served us well in the past, 293 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 7: and with the new agreement, President renegotiate even stronger, especially 294 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 7: as we seek to compete against the Chinas of the world. 295 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:31,480 Speaker 7: And so I think what our goal is to create 296 00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 7: a framework to keep that agreement in place when it 297 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:37,280 Speaker 7: expires in twenty twenty six or is up for review. 298 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:41,240 Speaker 7: And I think those countries are very willing to sit 299 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:45,160 Speaker 7: down work the problems with President Trump, whether it's border 300 00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 7: or fentanyl or Chinese transhipments. You know what I mean. 301 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 7: In the US, I see a big willingness to try 302 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 7: to figure out a way to keep this trading partnership going. 303 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:56,920 Speaker 4: That's why some think they will never be implemented. Maybe 304 00:14:56,920 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 4: you're one of them. 305 00:14:57,720 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 7: Yeah, hard to know. 306 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 4: All right, We won't try to fordict. Donald Trump's next 307 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:04,880 Speaker 4: move was with Kevin Brady. It's great to see your Congressman. 308 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:06,960 Speaker 4: Always a pleasure to have the Chairman with us here 309 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 4: at the table in Washington. Will assemble our panel next 310 00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:12,360 Speaker 4: on the fastest show in politics. Stay with us alongside 311 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 4: Kaylee Lines. I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomberg. 312 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:20,640 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power Podcast. Catch 313 00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:24,160 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple, 314 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 1: Cocklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You 315 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:30,720 Speaker 1: can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship 316 00:15:30,800 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 1: New York station. Just say Alexa Play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 317 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 2: First Cabinet Meeting for the forty seventh President Wednesday. Donald 318 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:42,920 Speaker 2: Trump convening the secretaries and the heads of various agencies 319 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 2: at the White House today for the first time of 320 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:47,720 Speaker 2: this term. So far, and it wasn't just those who 321 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 2: have actually gone through the confirmation process in the Senate 322 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:54,760 Speaker 2: who were in attendance. Elon Musk was there as well, representing, 323 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 2: of course, the Department of Government Efficiency and an effort 324 00:15:57,680 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 2: to cost cutting, even though the White House also said 325 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 2: earlier this week he is not the actual administrator of DOGE. 326 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 2: That's someone else named Emy Gleeson, who's a holdover from 327 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,960 Speaker 2: when this was still the US Digital Service. But nonetheless, 328 00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 2: it was DOGE that Elon Musk was there to speak about, 329 00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:15,440 Speaker 2: and President Trump commended those efforts as well, including talking 330 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:18,480 Speaker 2: about the actual dollar figure they're ultimately targeting here. 331 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,960 Speaker 10: One of the most important initiatives is DOGE, and we 332 00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:29,360 Speaker 10: have cut billions and billions and billions of dollars. We're 333 00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:31,640 Speaker 10: looking to get it maybe to a trillion dollars. If 334 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:34,240 Speaker 10: we could do that, we're going to start getting to 335 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:37,520 Speaker 10: be at a point where we can think in terms 336 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 10: of balancing budgets. Believe it or not, something you haven't 337 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:41,760 Speaker 10: heard in many, many years, decades. 338 00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:46,200 Speaker 4: Actually, I'm not sure we've ever heard or seen a 339 00:16:46,240 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 4: cabinet meeting that resolved into a round of applause, which 340 00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:53,320 Speaker 4: all of the cabinet officials gave Elon Musk when they 341 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 4: were asked openly by the President if they had a 342 00:16:55,920 --> 00:16:57,800 Speaker 4: problem with them. He said he'd throw them out if 343 00:16:57,800 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 4: they did. And Elon Musk did address the room sitting 344 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 4: behind he wasn't actually seated at the table, and we 345 00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:05,600 Speaker 4: do want to be clear about that. There's fascinating reporting 346 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:09,200 Speaker 4: in the Washington Post today about the layer inside the 347 00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 4: Eisenhower Executive Office building right across the driveway from the 348 00:17:13,119 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 4: White House, where Elon Musk's office has been set up. 349 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:20,160 Speaker 4: It's in the old Secretary of War suite, where rainbow 350 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:23,119 Speaker 4: colored lights emanate from the tower and keyboard of a 351 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:27,120 Speaker 4: powerful gaming computer he uses to conduct government business. Imagining 352 00:17:27,160 --> 00:17:31,080 Speaker 4: the Alienware machine right. A Maga hat and a placard 353 00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:33,800 Speaker 4: reading doge sit in a large wooden desk, cord sneaking 354 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:35,880 Speaker 4: across the carpet into a surge protector. 355 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:37,120 Speaker 3: It sounds like a dorm room. 356 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 2: Well, and if you were seeing on Bloomberg TV, on 357 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 2: YouTube or anywhere else, Elon Musk in the back of 358 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:44,800 Speaker 2: the cabinet room, standing at the side of the table. 359 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:48,119 Speaker 2: He was wearing a hat, a baseball cap, and. 360 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:50,200 Speaker 3: A tech support sex supports. 361 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,119 Speaker 2: T shirt, saying that essentially the work they're doing in 362 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:56,280 Speaker 2: that building you just described is tech support for the government, 363 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,760 Speaker 2: looking at software and things that are outdated, that kind 364 00:17:58,800 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 2: of thing. 365 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:00,600 Speaker 3: Let's see how the panel feels about this. 366 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:02,479 Speaker 4: They were listening and watching along with all of us 367 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 4: an hour plus experience in the cabinet room. Jendi Shanzino 368 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:10,680 Speaker 4: is here Bloomberg Politics contributor, our Democratic analyst and senior 369 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:12,639 Speaker 4: Democracy Fellow with the Center for the Study of the 370 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 4: Presidency in Congress, and Republican strategist Mora Gillespie is back 371 00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:17,640 Speaker 4: Bluestack Strategy. 372 00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:18,680 Speaker 3: It's great to see you both. 373 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 4: Hear the optics that we're talking about, Genie are pretty remarkable. 374 00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:26,119 Speaker 4: To Kaylee's point, Elon Musk said, I call myself humble 375 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:27,120 Speaker 4: tech support here. 376 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:29,320 Speaker 3: Is that all he's doing in this administration? 377 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,080 Speaker 11: Well, I think there may be more to it. 378 00:18:33,119 --> 00:18:35,200 Speaker 12: But I was so glad to hear that he too 379 00:18:35,280 --> 00:18:38,280 Speaker 12: has wires everywhere. Since I have wires in my office, 380 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:41,000 Speaker 12: I thought maybe the healthiest man in the world ever 381 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:42,760 Speaker 12: could hide those wires. 382 00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:44,959 Speaker 11: So I'm glad to hear I'm not alone. 383 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:47,520 Speaker 12: Yeah, it was quite a sight, and you know, he 384 00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:51,919 Speaker 12: talked very deferentially to obviously the President as he normally would, 385 00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,879 Speaker 12: and to the cabinet, given that we've heard. You know, 386 00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:58,680 Speaker 12: there was some perhaps consternation about the email that went out. 387 00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:01,600 Speaker 12: The President said, oh no, there wasn't, as you said, 388 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:03,640 Speaker 12: if there was, they could just say now and get out. 389 00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:08,719 Speaker 12: So they tried to present a very unified front. And 390 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:11,159 Speaker 12: I love the fact that Donald Trump said, you know, 391 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:14,439 Speaker 12: dojing is now a verb, because he said many secretaries 392 00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:17,000 Speaker 12: are going to be doging in their own departments in 393 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 12: the next few days or the next few weeks, including 394 00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:23,640 Speaker 12: he said the EPA where he said Zelden is prepared 395 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,639 Speaker 12: to cut sixty five percent of the workforce, which is 396 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:27,520 Speaker 12: quite astonishing. 397 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 11: So there was some news made. 398 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:33,560 Speaker 12: There, but certainly, you know, they were very clear optically 399 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 12: that Elon Musk is not a member of the cabinet. 400 00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:40,920 Speaker 2: Well as Genie talks about the consternation or at least 401 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:44,919 Speaker 2: reported consternation over the whole email asking federal employees to 402 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:48,359 Speaker 2: justify their jobs or at least prove, if you were 403 00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:50,560 Speaker 2: to use the word of Elon Musk, that they have 404 00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:54,680 Speaker 2: a pulse by saying what they did last week. Mara, 405 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:57,640 Speaker 2: if there's not consternation there at the very least is confusionists. 406 00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 2: There's been some mixed messaging from department heads from the 407 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:02,960 Speaker 2: Office of Personnel Management specifically as to whether or not 408 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:06,840 Speaker 2: a response is required. We heard the President describe those people, 409 00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 2: well over a million of them who haven't responded as 410 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 2: being quote on the bubble today. Are these people actually 411 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:15,679 Speaker 2: at risk of getting fired or do we just not 412 00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:16,919 Speaker 2: have clarity around that. 413 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:20,439 Speaker 8: It does seem a bit confusing at the moment, and 414 00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:23,800 Speaker 8: I don't know that this cabinet meeting answered some of 415 00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:26,920 Speaker 8: those questions or alleviated that confusion. But I do think 416 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:30,679 Speaker 8: it's important that the DOGE entity gives the department heads 417 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:34,040 Speaker 8: a chance to clean house or to assess what's going 418 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,359 Speaker 8: on in their own departments. Some of them, as the 419 00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:39,359 Speaker 8: President did mention, only got in there one two days ago, so, 420 00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:42,520 Speaker 8: you know, giving them a chance to take an assessment 421 00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 8: of what's going on at their department, identify some of 422 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,959 Speaker 8: those broadways and abuse issues, whether that's pointed out by 423 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,480 Speaker 8: DOGE through a coordinated effort or an assistance from Elon 424 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 8: Musk and his department. Sure, but without allowing them even 425 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,960 Speaker 8: the chance, I think is what confused many and there 426 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:00,600 Speaker 8: needs to be some clarity there. I am glad to 427 00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:02,679 Speaker 8: hear that Elon Musk has an office there, because I 428 00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 8: think that coming in and making grands, sweeping gestures and 429 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:09,639 Speaker 8: blanket statements about all federal employees and without having had 430 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:13,879 Speaker 8: any experience is a little bit immature, because coming in 431 00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:15,879 Speaker 8: there and saying, Naye, five things you did this week 432 00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 8: that varies based on week to week, and I don't 433 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:20,560 Speaker 8: think that that's really an effective use. So he did 434 00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:22,960 Speaker 8: try and downplay that, which I was glad to hear, 435 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 8: and I do think that there's, you know, some importance 436 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:29,639 Speaker 8: there in recognizing the different nuances because government work, and 437 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,400 Speaker 8: at least from my experience, isn't necessary glamorous. I don't 438 00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 8: think that people are banging down the doors is nothing. 439 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:37,400 Speaker 8: It's a money making machine. It's you know, people wanted 440 00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:38,639 Speaker 8: to do the right thing for the right reason for 441 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 8: the large part, and so I think it's important to 442 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 8: remember that these are people who, while you know, went 443 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:46,080 Speaker 8: to work into government for attempts to leave it better 444 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:46,760 Speaker 8: than they found it. 445 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:52,560 Speaker 4: Enter the gold card genie that would create a path 446 00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:57,840 Speaker 4: to citizenship for anyone who pays five million dollars or more. 447 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,400 Speaker 4: This would be a placement of the older I guess 448 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:05,399 Speaker 4: the reinstatement of the old EB five visa program. Donald 449 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:08,920 Speaker 4: Trump today saying, if we sell ten million, ten million 450 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,600 Speaker 4: highly productive people coming in, they'll be young, they'll be talented. 451 00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:16,320 Speaker 4: That's fifty trillion dollars. That means our debt is totally 452 00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:17,920 Speaker 4: paid off. Did he just solve the puzzle? 453 00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:20,680 Speaker 11: He thinks he did. 454 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 12: And he pushed back a little bit on Lutnick. They 455 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,320 Speaker 12: are saying, you know, he was using another number. But 456 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 12: you know, this could this could go much higher. And 457 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:31,919 Speaker 12: you know, with Donald Trump's usual bombast, it was very optimistic. 458 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:34,879 Speaker 12: And in the clip you just played, of course, Donald 459 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:38,119 Speaker 12: Trump said something which is just stunning that nobody in 460 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:42,160 Speaker 12: years has talked about eliminating the debt. In fact, he 461 00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:45,120 Speaker 12: talked about it in twenty sixteen. He said he would 462 00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:48,080 Speaker 12: eliminate the entire national debt. And what did he do. 463 00:22:48,359 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 12: He added over eight trillion dollars to it in ten years. 464 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:56,280 Speaker 12: And of course this brings us to where we are headed. 465 00:22:56,359 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 12: You know, his gold card, which he is holding up 466 00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:03,919 Speaker 12: as potentially a panacea for debt. Elon Musk talking about 467 00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 12: firing people, are identifying people who don't even exist who 468 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,600 Speaker 12: are receiving sums of money from the public dole. 469 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:14,159 Speaker 11: As you know, Mora just said, this is not a 470 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 11: money making thing. 471 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:20,440 Speaker 12: And of course you eliminate the entire federal the federal employees, 472 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:23,720 Speaker 12: you're only at five percent. So the numbers they're using 473 00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:26,639 Speaker 12: don't add up. And if Elon Musk really wants to 474 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:31,280 Speaker 12: make an impact, go after the contractors, because that is 475 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:33,280 Speaker 12: what some people referred to as the deep state. But 476 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:35,760 Speaker 12: of course he can't do that since he himself is 477 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 12: thirty eight billion in as a federal contractor at this point. 478 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:44,159 Speaker 12: So lots of what they say sound very exciting and 479 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:47,960 Speaker 12: if they worked, would be incredibly, you know, wonderful, But 480 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:51,360 Speaker 12: the numbers, as usual, are not adding up here. 481 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 2: Well, and we of course know what they were saying 482 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:59,200 Speaker 2: in that cabinet room today, in part because it was live, 483 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:02,040 Speaker 2: but also there were reporters there asking questions about the 484 00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,080 Speaker 2: subjects that we've talked about in many others that we 485 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:06,560 Speaker 2: simply don't have the time to get to all of 486 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,960 Speaker 2: those who were in the room, which of course has 487 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:12,600 Speaker 2: some space constraints considering you're just tuttled around a cabinet table. 488 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,080 Speaker 2: Part of the White House Press Pool, which had some 489 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,399 Speaker 2: changes effective today more Genie, as you're well awares, the 490 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,680 Speaker 2: White House is now picking the group of outlets that 491 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 2: can actually be represented in that pool, and today two 492 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:27,920 Speaker 2: of the wire services Associated Press and Reuters were not 493 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:32,120 Speaker 2: part of it. Instead, Newsmax and Blaze Media were added instead. 494 00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:35,879 Speaker 2: Have Post also wasn't allowed to participate this time. That 495 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 2: slot went to Axios. We should note Bloomberg also is 496 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:42,199 Speaker 2: a wire service and was allowed to participate in the 497 00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:44,960 Speaker 2: pool today. But this is obviously a change in the 498 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 2: way this has always been done usually. More that is 499 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 2: the White House Correspondence Association that is coordinating this. In 500 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 2: wire services which distribute news to outlets all across the 501 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,920 Speaker 2: country have always all three of them had a seat 502 00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 2: on the plane or a spot in room. What does 503 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,120 Speaker 2: this do to the way in which the information coming out 504 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:07,400 Speaker 2: of this administration in this White House is going to spread? 505 00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 8: Yeah, if you listen to the Press Secretary talking about it, 506 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 8: you would think, yeah, sure, And if you're a Republican 507 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 8: you would think, of course we should have decided to 508 00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:18,120 Speaker 8: have you know, who gets to be in the room. 509 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:20,200 Speaker 8: It's a privilege, as she said, and all these things 510 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:21,920 Speaker 8: I don't know that they're going to have the same 511 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 8: tune in for eight years from now, when let's say 512 00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:26,800 Speaker 8: the Republicans don't win and they're not in the presidency. 513 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:29,640 Speaker 8: But you've now allowed this to be the case. You've 514 00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:33,359 Speaker 8: allowed this to be the norm now. And so how 515 00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,040 Speaker 8: will these members of the press feel, or how will 516 00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:38,200 Speaker 8: these members of the public feel if they're Republican and 517 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:41,160 Speaker 8: now the Democratic president in control is dictating who can 518 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:43,760 Speaker 8: be in the room covering news the way that he 519 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 8: wants it or she wants it covered. I think that 520 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,400 Speaker 8: it s it's a terrible president moving forward, and there 521 00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:51,879 Speaker 8: is a need for objectivity, and if nothing else, I 522 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 8: wish people would look at it without having their Republican 523 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 8: or Democratic lens on and think about it from the 524 00:25:57,480 --> 00:25:59,399 Speaker 8: standpoint of the freedom of the press and just the 525 00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:02,640 Speaker 8: important of having objective lenses in the room asking tough 526 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:05,200 Speaker 8: questions and you know that they're free to answer however 527 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 8: they feel. But this, this has caused for concern. 528 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 4: There was a time earlier in my career in a 529 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 4: different spot, Genie was my job to get a satellite 530 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 4: radio channel assigned to the radio pool. It was not 531 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,679 Speaker 4: easy and it ended up resolving in a vote among 532 00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 4: my peers. It was a successful voter. We started as 533 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,639 Speaker 4: part of that rotation. What is the difference between the 534 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:31,639 Speaker 4: White House picking who's in the pool and the self 535 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:33,720 Speaker 4: policing White House Correspondence Association. 536 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 11: Well, there's a big difference, you know. 537 00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 12: The number one is that the White House, as more 538 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:44,960 Speaker 12: just mentioned, Republicans may not be happy who the next 539 00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:48,960 Speaker 12: Democratic president or White House chooses to put in that pool. 540 00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 11: So it is very concerning, you know. 541 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:53,480 Speaker 12: I think if we just think about it broadly, there 542 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:56,880 Speaker 12: is a reason that the framers of the Constitution put 543 00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 12: only one private business, if you will, into the Constitution, 544 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 12: and that is the freedom of the press. 545 00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:06,919 Speaker 11: It's that important to democracy, all right. 546 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:10,920 Speaker 2: Jeanie Shanzano and Mara Gillespie our political panel today. Thank 547 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:13,000 Speaker 2: you so much for joining us as we follow what's 548 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,399 Speaker 2: happening at the White House also on Capitol Hill or 549 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:17,960 Speaker 2: we'll be going next after the passage of that House 550 00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:20,720 Speaker 2: budget resolution last night. This is Bloomberg. 551 00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:27,600 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 552 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:30,680 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on 553 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:34,080 Speaker 1: Apple Cockley and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. 554 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,480 Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts or watch 555 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 1: us live on YouTube. 556 00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 4: We weren't sure we'd be talking about results from a vote, 557 00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:45,439 Speaker 4: but it did happen last night, even after at one 558 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 4: point lawmakers were cleared from the House floor, they were 559 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 4: sent home, they didn't have the votes. Thirteen minutes later 560 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:55,160 Speaker 4: they did two seventeen two point fifteen, Kaylee. A big victory, 561 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:58,240 Speaker 4: one of many that will be required for Speaker Mike 562 00:27:58,320 --> 00:27:59,880 Speaker 4: Johnson to close the deal on Donald. 563 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,560 Speaker 2: Trump's Yeah, a big victory, if not a big margin 564 00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:05,399 Speaker 2: of victory. This thing did come down to the wire. 565 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 2: It was very, very close, and arguably there is still 566 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,080 Speaker 2: even harder work ahead because this was, as we heard 567 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:15,200 Speaker 2: from lawmakers ourselves yesterday, just a blueprint. Now they actually 568 00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:17,239 Speaker 2: have to iron out where these spending cuts are going 569 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:19,600 Speaker 2: to come from, whether the tax cuts will be made 570 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:22,399 Speaker 2: permanent as the Senate wants. It's still a lot of 571 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 2: work left to do. In joining us now with a 572 00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 2: look from Capitol Hill is Republican Congressman Troy Downing of Montana, 573 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:32,000 Speaker 2: who represents Montana's second district. Congressman, thanks so much for 574 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,840 Speaker 2: being here on Bloomberg TV and Radio. Obviously, last night 575 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:38,360 Speaker 2: was a little bit dramatic, and I do wonder what 576 00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,960 Speaker 2: you're hearing from your colleagues today on the path forward, 577 00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 2: given how much arm wrestling, including phone calls from the President, 578 00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 2: needed to happen just to get to the blueprint pasted. 579 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:51,840 Speaker 9: Well, I'm going to tell you I'm really happy with 580 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:55,280 Speaker 9: how it turned out. And I think it's a healthy process. 581 00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:58,960 Speaker 9: I mean, we don't just all, you know, automatically give 582 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 9: an answer. We need an opportunity to talk about to 583 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:04,600 Speaker 9: you know, air our grievances for lack of a better word. 584 00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:06,320 Speaker 9: And I think it's a healthy process. But then we 585 00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:08,440 Speaker 9: understand this is a team sport. We had to get 586 00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 9: come together and actually pass this. And I think there's 587 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:14,560 Speaker 9: been you mentioned it briefly, a lot of misconception. I mean, 588 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 9: this resolution really is almost a procedural part, you know, 589 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:20,920 Speaker 9: on the budget where the real work begins on the committees. 590 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:23,720 Speaker 9: And you know, we're ready to start doing that work. 591 00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:26,760 Speaker 9: Obviously there's a lot of work that's gonna you know, 592 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:28,520 Speaker 9: come of that, but I think it'll go through that 593 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:31,320 Speaker 9: same process where we will you know, debate in the 594 00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:33,720 Speaker 9: at the committee level, figure out you know, where we 595 00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:36,640 Speaker 9: come together to get this all together and I'll ultimately 596 00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 9: get this into a bill to you know, uh, really 597 00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:44,720 Speaker 9: make some changes that Donald Trump promised that we all 598 00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:46,840 Speaker 9: ran on and that the American people want, and I'm 599 00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 9: excited about the opportunity to do this. 600 00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 4: It does say a lot about the potential drama when 601 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 4: just passing the instructions requires so much angst. Here, Congressman, 602 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:57,680 Speaker 4: we just had a conversation with Kevin Brady, the former 603 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 4: chair of the Ways and Means Committee, who is charged 604 00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 4: with helping to get the Trump tax cuts not just 605 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:06,800 Speaker 4: extended but made permanent. He suggests this idea of cutting 606 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,160 Speaker 4: two trillion dollars in spending is not nearly enough to 607 00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:10,360 Speaker 4: pay for what the president wants. 608 00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 9: Do you agree, Well, here, here's the thing is the 609 00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:17,720 Speaker 9: Tax Cuts and Jobs Acts, it needs to be extended. 610 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:21,160 Speaker 9: That's that would be a twenty six percent tax increase 611 00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:23,920 Speaker 9: to Montana's if we don't get that extended, and that 612 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:27,240 Speaker 9: goes across the board, you know, from you know, from 613 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,120 Speaker 9: every strata of taxpayer, and you know, one of the 614 00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 9: things that's really important to a lot of my constituents 615 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:36,280 Speaker 9: is making sure that that death tax isn't repealed, because 616 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,640 Speaker 9: that could potentially start taking production agriculture out of production 617 00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 9: as airs and farms and ranches in Montana have to 618 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,440 Speaker 9: sell to pay their taxes. Everybody thinks that this is 619 00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,479 Speaker 9: some you know, wealthy loophole, where the reality of it 620 00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 9: is is a lot of these you know, farmers ranchers 621 00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:55,600 Speaker 9: Montana are very you know, land rich and you know, 622 00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:58,200 Speaker 9: capital poor, and this would just start to start to 623 00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 9: destroy them. But I do think that we all ran 624 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:05,040 Speaker 9: on this. You know, the American people want it, and 625 00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 9: we need to extend these I've heard that the Senate 626 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:12,600 Speaker 9: is likely going to you know, try to make these permanent. 627 00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:16,560 Speaker 9: I personally think that that's a good idea. I think 628 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:18,520 Speaker 9: that's positive, But we have to go through the process 629 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:20,000 Speaker 9: and see where we actually get with that. 630 00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:23,840 Speaker 2: Well, and part of this process, or at least part 631 00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:25,880 Speaker 2: of the math, if you listen to the words of 632 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:29,080 Speaker 2: the President, may include revenue that will come in because 633 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 2: of tariffs he intends to implements. As you talk about 634 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:34,560 Speaker 2: your constituents in Montana how they would be affected by 635 00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,160 Speaker 2: tax policy, I do wonder both for your constituents and 636 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 2: for the small businesses that you hear from as you 637 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,000 Speaker 2: sit on the Small Business Committee, what you're hearing about 638 00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 2: the potential negative impact of tariffs that could go into 639 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 2: places He once again today said twenty five percent on 640 00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:50,120 Speaker 2: Mexican and Canadian goods. 641 00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 9: That's happening, right, And you know where where the administration 642 00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,640 Speaker 9: falls on the tariffs or not. Obviously in Congress we're 643 00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 9: not you know, we're not doing that part of it, 644 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:02,760 Speaker 9: but we are trying to be very thoughtful in. 645 00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:04,240 Speaker 2: Making and I'm sure you're hearing about it. 646 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 9: Oh, yes, of course we're hearing about it. And there's 647 00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:09,040 Speaker 9: there's a lot of concern and where that actually you 648 00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,640 Speaker 9: know falls or doesn't fall, you know, will continue to 649 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,840 Speaker 9: make sure that the administration understands what our concerns are. 650 00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:17,640 Speaker 9: And I mean there's two parts of it. You talk about, uh, 651 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:20,920 Speaker 9: you know, the inflationary you know, potential of it coming in, 652 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:23,800 Speaker 9: but you can balance that in tax policy. You talk 653 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 9: about nobody you know wants a trade war. What's that mean? 654 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,320 Speaker 9: As you export, we need to be very thoughtful about 655 00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:32,080 Speaker 9: how surgical we are in applying that because you know, 656 00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 9: coming from an agricultural state, a lot of my producers 657 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:37,160 Speaker 9: are selling abroad. We need to make sure that they're 658 00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 9: not disadvantaged. And these are the conversations we'll have with 659 00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 9: the administration to make sure that we are using a 660 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 9: scalpel and not a sledgehammer when when he starts to 661 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:47,760 Speaker 9: push out this care policy. 662 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,160 Speaker 4: Well, Congressman, our viewers and listeners should know before you 663 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:55,080 Speaker 4: got to Capitol Hill in this most recent Congress, you 664 00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,320 Speaker 4: were a business owner, not just an Air Force veteran, 665 00:32:57,360 --> 00:32:59,680 Speaker 4: but you were the founder and former CEO of a 666 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:03,560 Speaker 4: story solutions company. You also founded a web calendar company. 667 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:05,440 Speaker 4: You sold the Yahoo So you know what it's like 668 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:07,320 Speaker 4: to balance a budget. You know what it's like to 669 00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 4: face a balance sheet. And I wonder how important it 670 00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:12,800 Speaker 4: is to you for these tax cuts, whether their extended 671 00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:14,200 Speaker 4: or made permanent, are paid for. 672 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 9: Yeah, well, here's here's the thing. Is coming from the 673 00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:21,480 Speaker 9: private sector, you understand, you know, the fits and spurts 674 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:23,560 Speaker 9: of having to you know, balance your budget, you know, 675 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:25,840 Speaker 9: for lack of a better word, making sure that you 676 00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:27,680 Speaker 9: know you can stay afloat, making sure you have access 677 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,240 Speaker 9: to capital, making sure you can you know, pay your expenses, 678 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:33,480 Speaker 9: all of that stuff, and sometimes you need to downsize 679 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,360 Speaker 9: and regroup. And I think that's an important thing to 680 00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:38,320 Speaker 9: think about. You see a lot of companies that get 681 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:41,120 Speaker 9: to a point where they have to you know, start 682 00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:44,280 Speaker 9: to downsize as they restructure, and they always will not always, 683 00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:46,320 Speaker 9: but often it will come back stronger. And I think 684 00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 9: it's important to understand that. You know, one of the 685 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:51,920 Speaker 9: things that's going on right now with with DOGE is 686 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 9: they're starting to you know, uncover all of this wasteful 687 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:57,479 Speaker 9: spending and I think a lot of the stuff that 688 00:33:57,600 --> 00:33:59,320 Speaker 9: we're going to find and continue to find is that 689 00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:01,160 Speaker 9: we're paying for a lot of things, overpaying for a 690 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 9: lot of things. The most Americans had no idea that 691 00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:08,040 Speaker 9: we were involved in. And there's a recent poll that 692 00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:10,400 Speaker 9: came out. I just saw it this morning. The shows 693 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,400 Speaker 9: between a super majority between seventy six and seventy seven 694 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:18,000 Speaker 9: percent approve of what the president is doing and rooting 695 00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 9: out this fraud, waste and abuse. And so, you know, 696 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:22,920 Speaker 9: one of the issues there that I think is important 697 00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:28,319 Speaker 9: is to you know, understand that that that that's going 698 00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 9: to start to release a lot of a lot of 699 00:34:30,480 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 9: this potential and we're not you know, necessarily going to 700 00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,640 Speaker 9: get fair you know CBO rating on that, and so 701 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,239 Speaker 9: I think it's important to keep that in your back 702 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:40,680 Speaker 9: pocket that we might see a lot more than most 703 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:44,040 Speaker 9: people expected, but the American people voted for Trump to 704 00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:46,799 Speaker 9: do what he's doing, and I'm I'm very supportive of 705 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:49,920 Speaker 9: that because in anything from private business to government, you 706 00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:53,480 Speaker 9: need to root out, you know, wasteful spending, fraud, and abuse. 707 00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:54,600 Speaker 9: And I'm happy that we're doing that. 708 00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:59,399 Speaker 2: Are there concerns, though, Congressmen, around things that could get 709 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:02,480 Speaker 2: thrown out with that bathwater when we consider the reductions 710 00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:05,080 Speaker 2: in the federal workforce, specifically in the Office of Personnel 711 00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:07,440 Speaker 2: Management just sent out a memo today that agencies have 712 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:12,400 Speaker 2: til March thirteenth to essentially outline their plans for large 713 00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:17,040 Speaker 2: scale reductions in their workforces. Veterans like yourself make up 714 00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:19,480 Speaker 2: a large chunk of the federal workforce. Are you worried 715 00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:22,760 Speaker 2: about the people ultimately who could be affected by this, Well. 716 00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:26,000 Speaker 9: First of all, you never want to see anybody being 717 00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:29,680 Speaker 9: affected like that. Obviously the effect on that person, that 718 00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 9: person's family is important. But on the other hand, we 719 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,960 Speaker 9: have to figure out where we're spending money. I mean, 720 00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:38,440 Speaker 9: we were elected to be stewards to you know, to 721 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:40,800 Speaker 9: the people that elected us, to the people of the 722 00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:42,960 Speaker 9: United States of America. Making sure that we're being stewards 723 00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,880 Speaker 9: to the taxpayer money and doing the right thing. And 724 00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 9: so as we start to look at these programs, we're 725 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:51,719 Speaker 9: going to have, you know, very serious conversations about what 726 00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:54,560 Speaker 9: is in the interest of the United States of America, 727 00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:59,439 Speaker 9: what is stewardship of taxpayer dollars. And you know, there's 728 00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:01,160 Speaker 9: going to be a lot of trimming of the fat 729 00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:02,520 Speaker 9: that is going to be part of it. I don't 730 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,760 Speaker 9: discount the fact that this, you know, will affect some people, 731 00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:09,080 Speaker 9: and you know, I don't discount that at all, but 732 00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:11,120 Speaker 9: it's something that we have to do. We're at the 733 00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,520 Speaker 9: precipice where we just don't have the ability as a country, 734 00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 9: the funds to continue spending ourselves into oblivion. You know, 735 00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,640 Speaker 9: I think about my path of you know, growing up 736 00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,960 Speaker 9: without you know, without money, without you know, family connections, 737 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:27,160 Speaker 9: without means, and being successful because the opportunities I had 738 00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:29,880 Speaker 9: as an American, and I worry about that being squandered 739 00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:32,640 Speaker 9: with a complete lack of fiscal restraint. And I think 740 00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:35,160 Speaker 9: that that American dream, you know, this country that was 741 00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:37,400 Speaker 9: so good to me when I'm growing up, is harder 742 00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:40,480 Speaker 9: and harder to achieve for this next generation of the 743 00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:42,759 Speaker 9: generation after I think of that brass ring of that 744 00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:46,560 Speaker 9: American dream. I worry about how a young family starting 745 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:50,400 Speaker 9: out today ever has a path to buy their first house. 746 00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,719 Speaker 9: I mean that that's the you know, the main part 747 00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:56,120 Speaker 9: of that American dream, and we need to start clawing 748 00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:58,719 Speaker 9: that back. I think a complete lack of fiscal constraint, 749 00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:03,160 Speaker 9: a complete lack of your stewardship for government funds, and 750 00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,080 Speaker 9: you know, it just comes down to you know, economics, 751 00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:07,320 Speaker 9: one on one. You keep pouring money into a system, 752 00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:11,600 Speaker 9: it's not helping anything. It's an inflationary factor. And we 753 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:13,960 Speaker 9: need to start clawing that back so that we make 754 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:16,319 Speaker 9: it so that our kids have the opportunities that I did. 755 00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:18,080 Speaker 9: We make it so they can buy that first house. 756 00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 9: We make it so they can be successful. 757 00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:23,920 Speaker 4: I appreciate the principle of what you're saying, Congressman, but 758 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:25,880 Speaker 4: I wonder if there should be a carve out for 759 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:29,240 Speaker 4: veterans and veterans services. Not only are you a veteran yourself, 760 00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:32,160 Speaker 4: but I know you work with Warriors and Quiet Waters Foundation. 761 00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:36,600 Speaker 4: The Post this morning reporting in Washington DOGE canceling government contracts, 762 00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,240 Speaker 4: eight hundred and seventy five of them that includes support 763 00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:42,440 Speaker 4: for medical and burial services, cancer programs and efforts to 764 00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:47,360 Speaker 4: recruit doctors for critical vacancies. Is there a space for 765 00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,719 Speaker 4: nonprofit to fill this gap or are you worried about 766 00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:50,320 Speaker 4: what's happening. 767 00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,640 Speaker 9: Well, obviously there's a lot of nonprofits that do fill 768 00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:58,000 Speaker 9: those GAPSS. You know an upward of sixty five thousand 769 00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:00,960 Speaker 9: veteran nonprofits in this country, and actually that's old data 770 00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:03,080 Speaker 9: might be more by now, but let me just be 771 00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:06,320 Speaker 9: really clear. I will always stand up and support our veterans, 772 00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:10,880 Speaker 9: and to the point that we start to lose programs 773 00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:13,319 Speaker 9: that they're depending on the then I will stand up 774 00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:15,479 Speaker 9: to that because that that is something that that can't 775 00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:18,440 Speaker 9: happen under my watch. What I'm saying right now and 776 00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 9: what I'm hopeful for is we're starting to trim that 777 00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:23,840 Speaker 9: fat that's not directly related to veteran services, but to 778 00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:27,600 Speaker 9: the administrative side parts where we can actually, you know, 779 00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:31,200 Speaker 9: trim the fat that is not directly related to services 780 00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:33,759 Speaker 9: that we've promised and have been giving our veterans. And 781 00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:36,520 Speaker 9: I will always stand up for that. The numbers that 782 00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:38,319 Speaker 9: you just gave me, it's first i've I've heard. So 783 00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:40,120 Speaker 9: I'm going to refrain from talking about that un till 784 00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:41,359 Speaker 9: I've had a chance to look at it. 785 00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I appreciate your answering that question, sir, and 786 00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,480 Speaker 4: we thank you for your service. That's Congressman Troy Downing, 787 00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:50,400 Speaker 4: Republican from Montana's second District, with us LIDE from Capitol 788 00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:51,719 Speaker 4: Hill here on Bloomberg. 789 00:38:56,640 --> 00:38:59,040 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. 790 00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:02,839 Speaker 4: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 791 00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:05,520 Speaker 4: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find 792 00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:09,279 Speaker 4: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at Noontimeeastern at 793 00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:10,520 Speaker 4: Bloomberg dot com.