1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,800 Speaker 1: This episode of Thinking Sideways is not brought to you 2 00:00:02,840 --> 00:00:06,880 Speaker 1: by Louis Mr Teeny twot. Instead, it's brought to you 3 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:11,799 Speaker 1: by all the other furry creaters in the world that really, 4 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 1: really really want to give you some loving. So listen, 5 00:00:14,520 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 1: you you need, you need some friendship. You really would 6 00:00:18,079 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 1: love to have a friend. They're waiting for you when 7 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:24,720 Speaker 1: you get home. And guess what, there's somebody who would 8 00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: love to be that friend waiting for you when you 9 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:30,800 Speaker 1: get home. And that is a critter from your local 10 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:35,200 Speaker 1: animal shelter. So go visit your shelter and adopt a friend. 11 00:00:35,440 --> 00:00:37,599 Speaker 1: And if hey, you've already got enough friends that live 12 00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 1: in your house a k a. Your rulers, the little 13 00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:44,040 Speaker 1: furry ones, well you can still help out by volunteering, 14 00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:47,720 Speaker 1: by donating. There's a bazillion ways to do it, So 15 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 1: go out, give your time, give yourself. It's all for 16 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: a great cause and we we know you're gonna do 17 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: a good job and the little ones are gonna be 18 00:00:56,520 --> 00:01:20,199 Speaker 1: happy sickly. Hey, guys, welcome to another episode of Thinking 19 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: Sideways the podcast. I Am Devin, joined as always by 20 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 1: Steve uh and Joe. I love that you. I think 21 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:36,360 Speaker 1: maybe I don't know. I don't remember. I don't remember 22 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 1: my alias showed up. Today we're going to talk about 23 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:43,039 Speaker 1: a mystery and it's a disappearance and I'm willing about 24 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 1: it's one you've never heard of. Yeah, I would say 25 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:49,720 Speaker 1: most people have not heard because it's from Canada. Yeah, 26 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: that's a few people have heard of Canada. America's hat Yeah, um, sorry, 27 00:01:57,360 --> 00:01:59,280 Speaker 1: there are going to be some Canadian shows. What does 28 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: that make Mexic I don't want Okay, America's pants Okay, Yeah, anyway, 29 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 1: today we're going to talk about the disappearance of Stephanie Stewart. 30 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:13,240 Speaker 1: It's nice alliteration. What Canadian name is? Yeah? And um, 31 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:17,399 Speaker 1: actually Megan suggested this mystery in two thousands sixteen, so 32 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:21,399 Speaker 1: thank ye thanks Meg. Yeah. Um, well, I guess let's 33 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:26,079 Speaker 1: get to it. In two thousands six seventy year old 34 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:30,120 Speaker 1: Stephanie Stewart disappeared. She was an avid outdoors woman and 35 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: had spent eighteen consecutive summers fire spotting. You guys know 36 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:36,639 Speaker 1: what fire spotting is, right, you should probably tell their listeners. 37 00:02:36,639 --> 00:02:38,760 Speaker 1: She's not everybody's gonna know. It's literally sitting in a 38 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:41,640 Speaker 1: tower with like binoculars looking to see if you can 39 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:45,239 Speaker 1: see any fires, happy smoke smoke. Well, typically you're looking 40 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:48,480 Speaker 1: for smoke, looking for smoke. Yes, anyway, so um, the 41 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:53,919 Speaker 1: last thirteen years of her fire spotting career were spent 42 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:58,560 Speaker 1: at the same cabin slashed tower combo, about fifteen miles 43 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 1: orkilometers outside of Hinton, Alberta, Canada, which is about three 44 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:07,640 Speaker 1: hours west of Edmonton, Alberta, which I think is the 45 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:13,600 Speaker 1: largest closest largest city. Everybody knows where Edmonton is, so yeah, 46 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 1: it's it's up there, yeah, yeah, north parallel. Yeah. The 47 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:22,040 Speaker 1: tower is called the Athabaska Tower, And I have heard 48 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: that it's not like terribly remote. It's only like three 49 00:03:24,720 --> 00:03:28,960 Speaker 1: miles or five kilometers off of a fairly major highway. 50 00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:32,240 Speaker 1: And this one is a nice it's like just a 51 00:03:32,360 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 1: drive up and we'll talk about that and all that stuff. 52 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: But it's also really close to Edson, Alberta, just if 53 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 1: anybody is like familiar with that area. So it wasn't 54 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 1: such a lonely outpost to be at, I guess to 55 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:50,720 Speaker 1: be clear, I said cabin tower combo. So the way 56 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 1: these things work is you have this big tower, at 57 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: least this particular one. Most of them worked this way 58 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:59,600 Speaker 1: do they. I think most of them do. Like around here, 59 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:01,800 Speaker 1: most of the towers around here, it's like the cabin 60 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: in the tower combined. Yeah, the cabin is at the 61 00:04:04,480 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: top of the tower. That's where you live, which probably 62 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: would have been a better situation. Yeah, But the way 63 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 1: that the towers work in Canada, or at least in 64 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 1: this area of Canada, is their tower cabin combos. So 65 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,159 Speaker 1: the tower is relatively small at the top. You know, 66 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:24,720 Speaker 1: I think it has room for you know, chairs and 67 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:28,080 Speaker 1: desks or whatever, but it's pretty small. Otherwise you're just 68 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:30,159 Speaker 1: kind of up there with a book or your thoughts 69 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 1: or whatever. And then you climb down the ladder every 70 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 1: night and there's a big cabin where you stay with 71 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 1: your bed in your kitchen and your bathroom and all 72 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,080 Speaker 1: of that stuff. And you know, it's funny is that 73 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: I had seen old school fire towers before, so I 74 00:04:45,279 --> 00:04:47,720 Speaker 1: was actually a little taken off guard when I saw this. 75 00:04:47,760 --> 00:04:49,480 Speaker 1: And I know that some people may think that this 76 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 1: is what they are, but they're steel constructs. The towers. 77 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:56,000 Speaker 1: The towers are. It's you know, it's a big giant 78 00:04:56,040 --> 00:05:00,360 Speaker 1: pole in the sky with a god would be say, Joe. 79 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 1: It's like ten by ten, fifteen by fifteen, But it's 80 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:06,720 Speaker 1: all glassed in, like it's not open to the elements. 81 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 1: It's it's rather sheltered in that way. And it must 82 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 1: be a joy to be inside on a hot day. Oh, 83 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: I can only imagine. But the ones I was used 84 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 1: to seeing for when I was a kid in the 85 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 1: open wood and wood one, Yeah, wore a wooden platform 86 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 1: and we're lucky if they had a handrail around. So 87 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:26,039 Speaker 1: those are pretty nice. Actually, there's still around. You can 88 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 1: you know, you can still you can stay in there. 89 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:30,760 Speaker 1: You can rent it for a weekend. Yeah, as mentioned, 90 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:35,600 Speaker 1: Stephanie did her you know, stint for thirteen years at 91 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:38,720 Speaker 1: the same on this one, same cabin, and so she 92 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:43,120 Speaker 1: lived every year April two September in that cabin tower combo. 93 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: It sounds like kind of a fun summer job. For 94 00:05:46,839 --> 00:05:50,039 Speaker 1: some people I would die because they hate being alone, 95 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 1: very extroverted. But I know a lot of people who really, 96 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:58,159 Speaker 1: I think would super enjoy this. And that wasn't so 97 00:05:58,240 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 1: far It really wasn't so far out of the stick, 98 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: except people couldn't come and visit either. I think she 99 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,200 Speaker 1: did have visitors well, and I know that like you 100 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:06,520 Speaker 1: could have somebody live with you and all that stuff, 101 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 1: but I need stuff. Yeah. Well, she was obviously was 102 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:12,200 Speaker 1: one of those people that being by herself, and I 103 00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:15,360 Speaker 1: mean you always he listed that she was gardening, and 104 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,880 Speaker 1: was it knitting? Is that the thinker? She was knitting, 105 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 1: and there was some other hobby that she had. So 106 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 1: she had all these very solitary, singular person hobbies. One 107 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:28,960 Speaker 1: thing she was fun of doing it was going out 108 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:33,320 Speaker 1: in the woods and teasing the bears. Keep trying to 109 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 1: frame a theory a little foresaw is that she she 110 00:06:38,480 --> 00:06:42,919 Speaker 1: obviously she had interests that lent themselves to this, whether 111 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:45,440 Speaker 1: she had them before she started it or learned them 112 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:48,640 Speaker 1: during her time. Yeah, she probably already knew how to 113 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:53,720 Speaker 1: read in the gardens. Probably. I think on her time 114 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: off she spent most of it outdoors. Actually, she had reportedly, 115 00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:03,360 Speaker 1: very recently, at seventy years old, climbed Mount Kilimanjaro in Africa. 116 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 1: I mean, that's pretty that. That would be hard for 117 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 1: me to do. And I'm thirty, so she's in much 118 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 1: better health than I am, which you know, it was fine. 119 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:16,520 Speaker 1: And she wintered at a resort community called Rocky Mountain 120 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: in somewhere in Alberta, Canada. I didn't bother to really 121 00:07:20,280 --> 00:07:22,240 Speaker 1: look up because I didn't think it mattered that much. 122 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 1: There was a senior community send us an email. You know, 123 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: somebody's going to be community probably think so. Yeah, she 124 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: had at least one daughter, but other than that, details 125 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 1: on her life are very sparse, and I think that's 126 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:41,400 Speaker 1: kind of intentional. You know, Like we said, spotters live 127 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 1: pretty much alone during their time at the cabins, though 128 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 1: it will it is noted that they're allowed to have 129 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 1: you know, like a spouse or a dog or something 130 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:52,640 Speaker 1: like that with them, but most of them do it alone. 131 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: And it does seem like that was a draw for Stephanie. 132 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 1: She did seem to be into that lonely lifestyle. And 133 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:00,840 Speaker 1: then yeah, I've mentioned she was seventy year old. Seventy 134 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: years old at her time of disappearance, five to and 135 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 1: about a hundred and five pounds. Yeah, that's that's a 136 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:16,520 Speaker 1: small person. Fire spotters do make routine calls via radio 137 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 1: or phone, um depending on the time of the day, 138 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:22,640 Speaker 1: to check in yeah, to a kind of like central 139 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 1: tracking hub which is run by a supervisor, to report 140 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:31,840 Speaker 1: all clear or anything needing further investigation and Stephanie was 141 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:34,320 Speaker 1: by all reports, very good about making these calls. She 142 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 1: checked in every time by the time that was required. 143 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 1: Not crazy early, but I mean more so now than then. 144 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 1: But they were obviously big on safety. You know, you 145 00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:47,200 Speaker 1: wanted to check in on your people multiple times, just 146 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 1: to make sure because they are out in the middle 147 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:52,200 Speaker 1: of nowhere by themselves, especially if they take a tumbill 148 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:55,679 Speaker 1: coming down those stairs in the tower. That's exactly what 149 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:57,080 Speaker 1: I was gonna go to is if you look at 150 00:08:57,080 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 1: photos of her online, you can actually see her wearing 151 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:04,560 Speaker 1: her harness to tether up to the stairs or the 152 00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:06,800 Speaker 1: ladder I should say, yeah, because it's one of those 153 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 1: ladders with the circular bands of metal around it so 154 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:12,960 Speaker 1: that if you fall over you stay contained. But she 155 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 1: also was harnessed in all the time, not necessarily stay containing, 156 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:18,760 Speaker 1: you just sort of like you don't you just sort 157 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:21,840 Speaker 1: of rattle down that little too. Yeah, but if you're 158 00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 1: supposed to be that and you see pictures ever in 159 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:28,439 Speaker 1: that so I mean a the safety equipment was present 160 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:31,199 Speaker 1: and be it sounds like from the way she took 161 00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 1: things she took very seriously and it was by the 162 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 1: book all the time. Yeah, Well, I mean The other 163 00:09:35,040 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 1: reason you want your fire spotters to check in all 164 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:41,480 Speaker 1: the time is fires can get very quickly out of hand. Um, 165 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 1: And so you know, the more notice you have to 166 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 1: send somebody to go check on that spot where it's 167 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:49,000 Speaker 1: coming with smoke coming out of it, the better chance 168 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 1: you have to really contain it and have it not 169 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:53,680 Speaker 1: spread into like what we're seeing in California right now 170 00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:56,080 Speaker 1: or what we saw in Oregon over the summer. And 171 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:58,160 Speaker 1: you want to make sure your spotter is therefore on 172 00:09:58,200 --> 00:10:03,359 Speaker 1: the job and not like you know, just stopped taking around. Yeah. Absolutely, 173 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:07,960 Speaker 1: So let's get into the night of the night before 174 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 1: Stephanie's disappearance and the circumstances surrounding. Shall we be the 175 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 1: night before the night of the night before? It's hard 176 00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 1: to tell. On the evening of August six, Stephanie called 177 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 1: a relative and I've literally never maybe you guys with 178 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:27,240 Speaker 1: like eagle eyes. I know I posted a couple like 179 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 1: threads and I honestly did not look at every single 180 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: post on every single thread. So sorry guys, but um, 181 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 1: but if you egalize saw this, my egis some reason 182 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:41,560 Speaker 1: I'm thinking it was your daughter. I had the same 183 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 1: I never saw, but I had the same thought. Well, 184 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 1: and we'll talk about that in theories because I also 185 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:50,360 Speaker 1: think that. But um, but Stephanie called a relative and 186 00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:52,240 Speaker 1: that's literally the only way you will ever see it 187 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: reported is that she called a relative. I think it 188 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:58,080 Speaker 1: was about nine pm, and that was the last time 189 00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:02,520 Speaker 1: that anybody officially spoke to her. I'm I mean probably 190 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:07,920 Speaker 1: other people spoke to her, depending on the theory, but 191 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: that's the last time that somebody actually spoke to her, 192 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:13,800 Speaker 1: like mentioned, Like we mentioned just a couple of minutes ago. 193 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: Spotters are required to check in every morning as well, 194 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:19,599 Speaker 1: right to say hey, I'm up, I'm headed up to 195 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:22,560 Speaker 1: the tower. I'm not dead yet, not dead yet. And 196 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:26,360 Speaker 1: Stephanie missed her required check in that morning. On so 197 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 1: on the August six, Since Stephanie was super reliable, you know, 198 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 1: her supervisor figured ocation and just sleep over a right 199 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:40,920 Speaker 1: but oversleep. Yeah, sorry, but I'll give her a call 200 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:44,600 Speaker 1: on the phone just to you know, check And nope, 201 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:48,680 Speaker 1: no answer. So the supervisor called a spotter that was 202 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: close to Stephanie's location and said, hey, I can't get 203 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:56,320 Speaker 1: in contact with Stephanie. Can you just run over to 204 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 1: her cabin slashed tower, See what's going on, you know, 205 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:02,199 Speaker 1: see if she needs any help, check on her, check 206 00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 1: on her, you know. Normal. Officially, this spotter that was 207 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:10,679 Speaker 1: close to her went to the cabin tower combo situation 208 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 1: and found a pot of boiling water, a pot or kettle, 209 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 1: it's unclear which of boiling water, but no Stephanie. Also 210 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:23,800 Speaker 1: missing were two pillows with blue pillow cases, a burgundy 211 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:27,240 Speaker 1: bed sheet. This is all a tongue twister from me. Apparently, 212 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:33,160 Speaker 1: burgundy bed sheet and a Navajo printed bed cover, and 213 00:12:33,240 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 1: a gold watch Stephanie's. I assumed the initial spot or 214 00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:40,520 Speaker 1: didn't just walk right in there and notice that stuff gone. No, yeah, 215 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 1: that was later. Yeah, but this is a better storytelling 216 00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:50,199 Speaker 1: this way. Her truck was also still there. No, she 217 00:12:50,240 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 1: didn't leave a note, no, no, nothing just anything like that. 218 00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 1: A massive hunt was launched. Um no sign of her 219 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:02,839 Speaker 1: whatsoever was found. The police have ruled this a homicide. 220 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 1: Now you may be wondering, but Devin, she just was 221 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:11,080 Speaker 1: missing with some stuff. Why is this a homicide? Well, 222 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 1: dear listeners, from all of the reporting, it does seem 223 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:19,080 Speaker 1: like it was pretty muntine. But I have read what 224 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: I I cannot substantiate this, but I find it to 225 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 1: be credible for whatever reason its may cut. I don't 226 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:31,400 Speaker 1: know that there was a massive amount of blood in 227 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:35,720 Speaker 1: the cabin, and that there were a lot of unanswered 228 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:40,640 Speaker 1: phone calls placed to the cabin, but not unanswered they 229 00:13:40,640 --> 00:13:43,400 Speaker 1: were picked up and hung up. I was going to say, 230 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:46,439 Speaker 1: we actually be careful by saying there's a massive amount 231 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 1: of blood. We know that. I mean, there's a bunch 232 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:51,720 Speaker 1: of stuff that talks about blood, but we don't actually 233 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:55,600 Speaker 1: have any idea if it is a splatter of blood 234 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 1: or a room full of blood. The things that I've 235 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:02,960 Speaker 1: seen lean more towards way more right. But the problem 236 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:05,080 Speaker 1: is that none of those are official, and so I 237 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 1: just want to I just want to put in that 238 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:11,040 Speaker 1: that little bit of hesitation, because totally don't. We can't 239 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:13,200 Speaker 1: say that the room was soaked in blood, right, so 240 00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 1: I think I what I want to say is in 241 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 1: order for the police who have ruled it a homicide, 242 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 1: they had to have found enough blood evidence to prove 243 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:25,480 Speaker 1: that somebody was dead. Like you, I don't. I don't 244 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,280 Speaker 1: know if you guys watch forensic files or not, but 245 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 1: they're that's my jam. But there are a couple stories 246 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:35,520 Speaker 1: where they'll talk about something has been proven a homicide 247 00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:39,680 Speaker 1: even without a body. And in order to do that, Yeah, 248 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:41,240 Speaker 1: in order to do that, they have to be able 249 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:44,240 Speaker 1: to say, wow, there's a ton there's like enough blood 250 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:47,840 Speaker 1: here to definitely assume that person is dead. Uh, And 251 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:50,160 Speaker 1: it all came from the same person in this case. 252 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 1: I don't know that they made like bothered to test. 253 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:54,760 Speaker 1: There's a lot of stuff that's not released to the 254 00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 1: public on this case, and I think that's intentional, right, 255 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:01,200 Speaker 1: But yeah, and then there was also those phone calls 256 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 1: where the phone rang and I, uh, it's my understanding 257 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:07,720 Speaker 1: the phone rang and was picked up and then put 258 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 1: back down, like nobody actually said hello, right, but like 259 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 1: a number of times before the phone was just unplugged 260 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 1: from the wall, which would also lead anybody who was 261 00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:21,760 Speaker 1: examining the case to believe that somebody was there, somebody 262 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 1: like stayed there for a little bit, like maybe stay tonight. Maybe. Yeah. 263 00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: This cabin, as we talked about, was what's called the 264 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 1: drive up cabin, and there are two different types of cabins. 265 00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 1: I don't know that I really need to say this, 266 00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 1: but I'm gonna anyway. A drive up cabin is a 267 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 1: cabin you can drive your car up to Yeah. Uh, 268 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 1: and then they're also there are some and I don't 269 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 1: know how many are in service. It would assume that 270 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:52,400 Speaker 1: the majority of the fire spotting cabins in use are 271 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: drive up cabins, but they also have hike in cabins, which, again, 272 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:59,160 Speaker 1: as the name would lead you to believe, you just 273 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 1: you have to hike in. You park at a trailhead 274 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:02,920 Speaker 1: or whatever, and you hike in and you take all 275 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:05,760 Speaker 1: your stuff with you, which seems like kind of a bummer, 276 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:12,280 Speaker 1: but myself, Yeah, the drive in cabin tower combos have 277 00:16:12,480 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 1: seen massive improvements over the past ten years. Really, it 278 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:19,800 Speaker 1: happened like pretty close after Stephanie to say it was 279 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:22,000 Speaker 1: definitely driven by this case. And if and if there 280 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:24,120 Speaker 1: is a you know, they kind of say, if there's 281 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 1: a silver lining here, it is that a lot of 282 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 1: people are way safer now. But it doesn't strike me 283 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:33,040 Speaker 1: as a terribly hazardous job. Yeah, but you are out 284 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 1: in the middle of nowhere. It does make you an 285 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 1: easy target. Yeah, that's why, you know, I just do 286 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 1: you definitely want to have a revolver or something with you, 287 00:16:41,080 --> 00:16:43,520 Speaker 1: you know, yeah, you know, if you're in America, you 288 00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:47,720 Speaker 1: have a gun, but just to briefly touch on the cabins, 289 00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:53,400 Speaker 1: especially drive up cabins were relatively unsafe. Um they were unsecure. 290 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:57,120 Speaker 1: They were safe necessarily, but they weren't you'd be pretty 291 00:16:57,160 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 1: easy for somebody to just break in. So there was 292 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 1: no there are now gates, chain link fences with you know, 293 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 1: barbed wire around the cabins there that didn't exist. You 294 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 1: could just drive up from any angle up to the cabins, 295 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:17,920 Speaker 1: which is already kind of like. I haven't seen if 296 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:22,159 Speaker 1: there were any unaccounted for tire marks or anything, but 297 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:25,840 Speaker 1: I think it's likely that the spotter who came to 298 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 1: check on Stephanie would have ruined any of that, like, 299 00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:30,720 Speaker 1: would have driven up and just like you know, gone 300 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 1: over any kind of tire marks if there had been. Yeah, 301 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:35,160 Speaker 1: like if somebody had pulled their car up and then 302 00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:37,680 Speaker 1: pulled away, they probably would have pulled up and pulled 303 00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 1: away in the same fashion that the you know them 304 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:43,880 Speaker 1: and then the police. Also because once the police responded, 305 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 1: they probably didn't really know what they were looking at. 306 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:48,960 Speaker 1: And so I think it's likely that if there were 307 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 1: other tire tracks, that they had been destroyed. And by 308 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:55,960 Speaker 1: the way, did the spot or did he like walked 309 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,440 Speaker 1: through the house or that the cabin and like make tracks. 310 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 1: I don't know like that, I have no idea. I 311 00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 1: don't think so. I don't think they are terribly large cabins, 312 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:08,680 Speaker 1: you know, it's not like there's like five rooms where 313 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:10,880 Speaker 1: you'd be like Stephanie or you in here, stephaniely you're 314 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,879 Speaker 1: in here. But I don't know. I have no answer 315 00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:17,199 Speaker 1: to that question. But also they find any any like 316 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:20,719 Speaker 1: pop prints, you know, like wolves, bears, anything like that. 317 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 1: Blood they ruled They ruled out an animal attack, is 318 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:27,720 Speaker 1: what I will say to you. I know you keep 319 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:29,760 Speaker 1: saying this, and well, we can talk about this all 320 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:34,879 Speaker 1: in theories. But additionally, there was brush surrounding the cabin, 321 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 1: which would have made it really hard for you. I mean, 322 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:39,600 Speaker 1: you know, on the one hand, it's a privacy thing 323 00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,119 Speaker 1: for you as a person who's inside a cabin, right 324 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:44,880 Speaker 1: because it's harder to see just directly into the windows. 325 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 1: But on the other hand, you can't just look out 326 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: and be like, oh, there's a person running at the cabin. 327 00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:54,360 Speaker 1: Brush outside, you mean, like bushes growing and covering your windows, 328 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:58,200 Speaker 1: and so you didn't have any good lines of visibility 329 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:01,399 Speaker 1: that's since been cut down of fire not at all well, 330 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:04,240 Speaker 1: or even visibility like you can't see, you know, down 331 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:06,280 Speaker 1: the road to see that there's a truck coming up 332 00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:09,360 Speaker 1: invisibility to you is line of fire to hit fair enough, 333 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:15,080 Speaker 1: same thing, that's fair pretty much. There was just one 334 00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:18,359 Speaker 1: phone in the house or in the cabin, is my understanding, 335 00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:21,479 Speaker 1: which you know, again, pretty easy for somebody to just 336 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:26,119 Speaker 1: deny you access to that. And the doors were super flimsy. 337 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: They were like cardboard, right, They're just yeah, they were 338 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 1: literally just cut out of card No, they're just normal 339 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:35,200 Speaker 1: wooden doors, kind of like the interior doors. Yet in 340 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:37,280 Speaker 1: a lot of newer houses where it's just a piece 341 00:19:37,320 --> 00:19:39,960 Speaker 1: of like one eighth inch plywood on each side with 342 00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:42,360 Speaker 1: the hollow middle kind of thing. Yeah, I mean, it's 343 00:19:42,359 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 1: my understanding it with a wooden and there were wooden frames, 344 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 1: so you know, again it's pretty easy to just put 345 00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:50,639 Speaker 1: your fist through it, yeah, or you know, force your 346 00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:53,600 Speaker 1: way in or whatever. That's one of the big improvements 347 00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,200 Speaker 1: they have since made. All of the doors in these 348 00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:59,840 Speaker 1: drive up cabins are steel reinforced, but they also change 349 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:02,480 Speaker 1: at the glass and all. Yeah, they're now shatterproof glass 350 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 1: and there's panic buttons. So the firewatchers. As mentioned, they 351 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:09,400 Speaker 1: have these harnesses that they're supposed to wear and now 352 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:13,479 Speaker 1: apparently whenever they're on premises. It's my understanding whether this 353 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 1: is true or not, you know, it means to be seen, 354 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:18,520 Speaker 1: but that they're supposed to wear their like tagged with 355 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:22,159 Speaker 1: trackers basically, so that it was a radio that had 356 00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:24,159 Speaker 1: a panic button. It's both. I thought it was like 357 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:27,399 Speaker 1: their regular walkie talkie talk to the world radio is 358 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: the way I took this to be. Oh, I thought 359 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,920 Speaker 1: it was two separate things that on their radio they 360 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:36,200 Speaker 1: have a panic button and they also were tagged. They 361 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:39,000 Speaker 1: had like you can like the old people life alert thing. 362 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 1: Those don't those don't have geo trackers. Okay, well, well 363 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 1: this is the it doesn't have service version of it. 364 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:51,399 Speaker 1: So well, it's my understanding that those trackers don't have 365 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:55,120 Speaker 1: panic buttons in them or anything. They just are basically geolocators, 366 00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:57,840 Speaker 1: so that if you went missing or you pushed a button, 367 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:00,600 Speaker 1: they could be like and we know exactly where that 368 00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 1: person is or they know where that's right, but so 369 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 1: that that would also help track somebody they went by. Yeah, yeah, 370 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 1: even if you didn't have time to push a panic button. 371 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:17,440 Speaker 1: Or whatever, that they'd be too separate, that's my understanding. Yeah, 372 00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:21,439 Speaker 1: which would have been really helpful if Stephanie had again 373 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: one of those kind of like maybe silver linings, you know, 374 00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:27,280 Speaker 1: I'd be easier just to output them with guns. I 375 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:30,160 Speaker 1: don't know, I mean, I don't think that's a solve all, 376 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,679 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, like it's not always going 377 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:34,119 Speaker 1: to have it right at hand, but you need it, 378 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 1: but you know still, yeah, yeah, anyway, that is our story. 379 00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:43,040 Speaker 1: So that's about it. Yeah, so she as she vanished, 380 00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:45,480 Speaker 1: and nobody's heard a word about it. There's been no leads, 381 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:48,480 Speaker 1: total cold trail, nothing found. They beat the brush. I mean, 382 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:50,080 Speaker 1: they looked more than just like I had to repeat 383 00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:52,720 Speaker 1: from the cabin, I assume, oh yeah, absolutely, it was 384 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:57,440 Speaker 1: like thousands of acres actually tens of thousands, I think. Yeah. 385 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:00,239 Speaker 1: And they did air and they did diver is in 386 00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:02,879 Speaker 1: lakes and like all sorts of stuff, and they just 387 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:06,920 Speaker 1: never found any hide nor hair of her, which is 388 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 1: pretty incredible. You probably don't know this that they bring 389 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:11,800 Speaker 1: in trackers or anything like that before they went out 390 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 1: and store. This totally started thrashing around the brush that 391 00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:17,479 Speaker 1: they're bringing any trackers. You could really good at following 392 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 1: people through the world. Visual trackers like people are dogs 393 00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:26,640 Speaker 1: or both. I don't think so. Um, yeah, I think 394 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 1: the presumption is well, actually, why don't we just like 395 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:37,240 Speaker 1: talk about theories and then we can talk about that. Yeah, ok, buff, First, 396 00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:45,960 Speaker 1: let's take a break. Mothra glides over the city with 397 00:22:46,119 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 1: nary a care in the world. Oh look, there's gon 398 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:52,240 Speaker 1: Tilla over there. Oh and on the other side of 399 00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:56,480 Speaker 1: town is Manila, Godzilla's big baby getting into trouble again. 400 00:22:57,200 --> 00:23:01,240 Speaker 1: Oh no, Manila smashed the only big catcher store in town. 401 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,800 Speaker 1: Oh watch out, buddy. Oh he just crushed the place 402 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 1: that sells those cute little shoes. That could cause some 403 00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 1: major problems for Mothra's wedding registry, But she's not worried. Nope, 404 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:17,160 Speaker 1: because she signed up at Zola. Zola is the wedding 405 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,359 Speaker 1: company that will do anything for love. They're reinventing the 406 00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:24,080 Speaker 1: wedding planning and registreet experience to make the happiest moment 407 00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:28,360 Speaker 1: in our couple's lives even happier. 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Don't let a 425 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:36,640 Speaker 1: Manila or any other little monster ruin your big day 426 00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:43,439 Speaker 1: and we're back. So I guess the presumption is is 427 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 1: that if there was as much blood as it seems 428 00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:49,439 Speaker 1: like there was at the site, that she was killed 429 00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 1: and then like wrapped up and taken away in the cabin. Yeah, 430 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:54,639 Speaker 1: I mean that she would have been murdered in the 431 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:58,840 Speaker 1: cabin and then that's why the blankets and the quiote 432 00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:01,240 Speaker 1: we're missing, is that somebody wrapped her up in that 433 00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:03,879 Speaker 1: and then in the back of the truck and then 434 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,040 Speaker 1: drove away. I think that is the by and large 435 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 1: the presumption, particularly if if she did lose so much blood, 436 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,800 Speaker 1: there would have been a blood trail, if she had 437 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 1: been left on foot or been dragged or like whatever. Yeah, 438 00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:19,239 Speaker 1: so that so the trail of blood they went out 439 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 1: to the driveway, and then I don't think there was 440 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:24,360 Speaker 1: a trail of blood. I think there was enough blankets, 441 00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 1: especially if they bled out already. But yeah, there. Maybe 442 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,440 Speaker 1: she didn't die, maybe she was kidnapped and carted away. 443 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 1: She's still around, so uh to up the creepy factor. 444 00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:39,159 Speaker 1: The other speculation of why the blankets and pillows and 445 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:43,280 Speaker 1: stuff were missing that the speculation on why those items 446 00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:47,280 Speaker 1: were missing was that somebody else spent the night with Stephanie, 447 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 1: with her without her consent, and if she was dead 448 00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:53,800 Speaker 1: or alive, I really hope that wasn't an amorous encounter 449 00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:58,959 Speaker 1: and that yeah, especially if she was dead. Yeah, and 450 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:03,879 Speaker 1: that there needed phone calls spooked the person into getting 451 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,240 Speaker 1: to leaving with her body or with her Yeah, I 452 00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:09,320 Speaker 1: probably figured, you know, it's just not going to be 453 00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:11,240 Speaker 1: just I'm not in so far in the middle of nowhere, 454 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 1: I can you expect nobody's going to show up for 455 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:16,199 Speaker 1: the next three months. Or maybe didn't know that the 456 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:22,160 Speaker 1: checkens were compulsory, you know, like maybe didn't realize that somebody, Yeah, 457 00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:24,359 Speaker 1: I didn't understand, you know, they thought, well, they probably 458 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:26,359 Speaker 1: just check in if a fire happens, right, So like 459 00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:28,560 Speaker 1: if they don't hear from her like oh no, right, 460 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:31,000 Speaker 1: and that the reason that like the pillows were missing, 461 00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 1: for instance, would be that if they had slept, they realized, okay, 462 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 1: I left trace evidence. I got to get rid of these. 463 00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,960 Speaker 1: So so this, I mean, are we what are you 464 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:44,919 Speaker 1: saying with this theory? You're saying that this is a 465 00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:47,960 Speaker 1: targeted attack. Are you saying this is random attack? I 466 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,120 Speaker 1: don't know, because somebody like up the creepy factor. I'm 467 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,920 Speaker 1: trying to like add I guess the theory is like 468 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:59,320 Speaker 1: why why was that stuff missing? Okay? Because that was 469 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,440 Speaker 1: when you were talking about the person not knowing the schedule. 470 00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:06,080 Speaker 1: That to me talks a little bit about premeditation. You know, 471 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:08,000 Speaker 1: I see this person, I decided I want to kill 472 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 1: this person, but not I think it can go either way, honestly, 473 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:15,000 Speaker 1: Like you know, even if it's like I said, that 474 00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,359 Speaker 1: somebody would want to target her. So that's why I 475 00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:21,399 Speaker 1: was a little confused. There's a few things. But but 476 00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:23,720 Speaker 1: more than that, I think that if somebody did want 477 00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:26,880 Speaker 1: to target her, they knew what the process was like. 478 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,159 Speaker 1: And so I think that this speaks more to it 479 00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:33,360 Speaker 1: at being a random or less meditated murder. But if 480 00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:36,720 Speaker 1: it were just some random psychopath who lived in the town, 481 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:40,040 Speaker 1: you know, like close by, and just was like, I'm 482 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:42,880 Speaker 1: gonna go kill somebody, and drove up and killed her, 483 00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:46,199 Speaker 1: and actually it's uh my, that makes me wonder if 484 00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 1: it maybe it was somebody who actually had an idea 485 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:51,200 Speaker 1: of where the towers were, who worked in them, because 486 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:53,360 Speaker 1: she would seem like the ideal target for a random 487 00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: She's a very tiny for a thrill kill. Yeah, there's nobody. 488 00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:01,040 Speaker 1: She's not gonna be able to fight back as much 489 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:06,439 Speaker 1: as a pound person would. Guy, And even though she 490 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 1: wasn't like excellent, oh, yeah, but that was kind of 491 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:12,119 Speaker 1: suggest to me, and maybe it wasn't entirely just random 492 00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:15,560 Speaker 1: stranger killing after all. Yeah, so you must have been 493 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:18,800 Speaker 1: the smallest of the spotters. Uh yeah, probably she was 494 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 1: one of the smaller ones. Yeah. Um, let's let's dig 495 00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 1: into some of the like solid theories here. We're gonna 496 00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:33,800 Speaker 1: dive into you know, libel or whatever. Um and name 497 00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:37,640 Speaker 1: some people. So one of the people that I see 498 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:40,800 Speaker 1: the name I see this tossed around a lot on 499 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:45,000 Speaker 1: the Internet, and actually, after digging into the one case 500 00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:49,000 Speaker 1: officially associated with this person, I don't think it's so 501 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:53,000 Speaker 1: terribly off base, but there are a lot of question marks. Anyway, 502 00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:57,680 Speaker 1: Steve making his speculation face. Yeah, we're talking about Darth Vader. 503 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:06,760 Speaker 1: He is nowhere near that cool. Yeah, not Darth Vader. Sorry, 504 00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:12,360 Speaker 1: Travis Edward Vader. He sure it's pronounced Vader. It is Canadian, 505 00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:19,320 Speaker 1: that's true. I'm my call with Vader. Yeah. Anyway, this 506 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 1: man Vader is currently in jail for the murder of 507 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,760 Speaker 1: two I'm gonna say elderly. I don't like to classify 508 00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:36,200 Speaker 1: Stephanie as elderly retirees. These people were retirees. They were 509 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,720 Speaker 1: they were like eighties, so that's more elderly. I think 510 00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 1: that's we'll call We'll just call everybody retirees hose the 511 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 1: politically correct term anyway, until we get an email about it. Yeah, 512 00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 1: I'm sure there's some term that we didn't know about. 513 00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:54,320 Speaker 1: Vader is currently serving time for the murders of Lyle 514 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: and Marie McCann. Not no relation to Madeleine. I know 515 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,520 Speaker 1: you can't see that name and not think about year 516 00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:07,080 Speaker 1: old couple. Eighty and seventy nine. So he was eight, 517 00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 1: she was. Their bodies were also never found. So let's 518 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:17,440 Speaker 1: talk about their story real quick, because you know, apparently 519 00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:21,840 Speaker 1: this was not far away. It was like an hour away. 520 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:28,520 Speaker 1: They're abouts, yeah, hours drive thereabouts. And on July three, 521 00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:32,920 Speaker 1: the Meccans left their home in St. Albert for vacation. 522 00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:35,840 Speaker 1: They were also supposed to pick their daughter up on 523 00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 1: the tenth at abbot's Ford International Airport. They were seen 524 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:45,320 Speaker 1: on that day, the third sorry of July, getting gas 525 00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:49,400 Speaker 1: and it is noted that they were also towing their 526 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 1: green Hyundai behind their SUV. They were driving SUV because 527 00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:57,360 Speaker 1: they were retired r V. I'm sorry, yeah, the Hunda 528 00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:01,080 Speaker 1: is the suv. I'm sorry, um, but Yeah, they were 529 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:04,240 Speaker 1: driving RV because they were tires. You know old people 530 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 1: in RVs that on a wy they go together either 531 00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,360 Speaker 1: because they don't want to actually because they don't actually 532 00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:12,800 Speaker 1: want to camp, but campgrounds are cheap. Well know, you 533 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 1: know what one of the things listen, I now know 534 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,320 Speaker 1: some folks that are of the age to have r 535 00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 1: vs and they love it because when you're at one 536 00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: park and you've been there for a couple of months 537 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:28,040 Speaker 1: and you get sick and tired of your neighbors, you 538 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,280 Speaker 1: know what you do. You unplug and you drive to 539 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:34,920 Speaker 1: the next park and suddenly you don't live next to 540 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 1: the jerk wad who's always, you know, doing whatever's annoying you. 541 00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 1: That's kind of cool. You know, he's not monas long enough, 542 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 1: and that bothers you. So you moved to a different one. 543 00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:48,360 Speaker 1: Not that you're mean a trailer park, not an r 544 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: V park. RV r vs, you will see them in 545 00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:56,160 Speaker 1: trailer parks. They a fair number of them, at least 546 00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:59,680 Speaker 1: in the southern portion of this country, have slots that 547 00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:03,160 Speaker 1: are open for day and week rentals, depending I mean 548 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,600 Speaker 1: obviously depending on the level of the park, but fair enough. 549 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:10,120 Speaker 1: Although they owned a home as well, so I think 550 00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:12,920 Speaker 1: their r V was just like a convenient, a fun 551 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:14,960 Speaker 1: way for them to travel, fun way for him to 552 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,840 Speaker 1: take out the overhangs and gas station for real. Anyways, 553 00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:21,080 Speaker 1: it is actually it's nice to not have to go 554 00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:25,000 Speaker 1: into the hotel room and unpack your crap totally, but 555 00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,080 Speaker 1: still so anyway, they were driving an r V and 556 00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:31,240 Speaker 1: on the evening of July so, two days after they 557 00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,680 Speaker 1: were seen getting gas, firefighters responded to an RV fire 558 00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 1: at the Middle Lake Campground near Edson, Alberta remember Edson. 559 00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:45,360 Speaker 1: No bodies were found. Um police discovered that the RV 560 00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 1: did belong to them hands, but there was no sign 561 00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:52,480 Speaker 1: of their Hondai SUV that they had been towing behind it. 562 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:58,840 Speaker 1: The Royal Canadian Mounted Police, the Mounteas visited the mccans home. 563 00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,600 Speaker 1: They didn't find they didn't get an answer, so they 564 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:03,280 Speaker 1: kind of just were like, all right, well, I guess 565 00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:06,760 Speaker 1: they're presumed missing, but they weren't going to do too 566 00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:09,120 Speaker 1: much searching for them because their car was missing, so 567 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:12,120 Speaker 1: they were just like, you know, they probably drove away. Yeah, 568 00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:14,719 Speaker 1: they might have. Might have been like an insurance fraud thing, 569 00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:18,720 Speaker 1: and hindsight, it's a weird lax bit of motion on 570 00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:21,600 Speaker 1: the part of the Mountains. I'm not criticizing, like in hindsight, 571 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:24,800 Speaker 1: it's like should might have been a busy day in 572 00:33:24,840 --> 00:33:26,800 Speaker 1: their office, but yeah, they probably should have been a 573 00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: little quicker than they were. Five days later, on July tenth, 574 00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:32,120 Speaker 1: when they were supposed to pick their daughter up from 575 00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:37,920 Speaker 1: the airport, they didn't arrive. So their daughter, whose name Trudy, 576 00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:42,040 Speaker 1: notified of the Mounties and they filed a missing report 577 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:44,760 Speaker 1: person's report and also released one. Right, you know, be 578 00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:48,960 Speaker 1: on the lookout. At that point, the Mounties realized that, oh, hey, McCann, 579 00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:52,480 Speaker 1: that sounds interesting. He why does that sound interesting? Why 580 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:58,120 Speaker 1: does that sound familiar? Ay, I don't know. Oh hey, yeah, 581 00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:03,240 Speaker 1: I know. Um it's the that RV that was burnt 582 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: down by the Tim Horton's I'm sorry, I'm so sorry. 583 00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:12,680 Speaker 1: I've been waiting this whole time for that to happen. 584 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:15,600 Speaker 1: I knew. Yeah, I'm pretty good at a Canadian accent, 585 00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:19,439 Speaker 1: so our apologies to our Canadian listeners. By the way, 586 00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I love love the maple leaf. Oh yeah, god, 587 00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 1: you guys are amazing. Anyway, So the Mounties were like, 588 00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:30,000 Speaker 1: oh crap, um, okay, these people are actually missing, great, 589 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:35,399 Speaker 1: so let's search for him. So in the sixteen six 590 00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:40,040 Speaker 1: days later, the Mounties did actually find that hondai um 591 00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:43,880 Speaker 1: and they actually found it near Highway sixteen and like 592 00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:49,319 Speaker 1: it's called Range Road, Yeah, of course, yeah, familiar, We're 593 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:52,360 Speaker 1: all familiar with it. It's about eighteen miles or thirty 594 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:57,719 Speaker 1: kilometers east of Edson, which is near Hinton, which is right. Yeah, 595 00:34:57,800 --> 00:35:01,560 Speaker 1: it's really near Hinton, which is near n Yeah. Edson 596 00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,760 Speaker 1: and Hitting are both really close to our tower. Actually, 597 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 1: our tower is on Highway sixteen. It's that's the one 598 00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:13,040 Speaker 1: that it's like three miles off of. Anyway, the police 599 00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:16,759 Speaker 1: amounties at that point did say that they thought that 600 00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:20,799 Speaker 1: the meccansas parents was foul play, and then that's at 601 00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:23,920 Speaker 1: that time they announced that they thought that Vader was 602 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:27,239 Speaker 1: responsible for it through a number of connections. And I 603 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:29,000 Speaker 1: don't want to go too deep into this because it's 604 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:32,359 Speaker 1: not it's not an episode about the mccans, But so 605 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:38,399 Speaker 1: I I didn't ever see anything that was strongly linking him. 606 00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:40,360 Speaker 1: Can you at least give us one or two to 607 00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:44,919 Speaker 1: the mccans or to the mccans some cans, I can, yeah, 608 00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:49,120 Speaker 1: because I didn't see anything yeah, like the most circumstantial case. 609 00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:51,600 Speaker 1: Based on the reporting that I kept coming across, there 610 00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:54,680 Speaker 1: was there was some circumstantial evidence, but that paired with 611 00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:57,560 Speaker 1: the fact that his brother said, yeah, he's staying with 612 00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:02,600 Speaker 1: me because he says he burned in r V. I 613 00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:05,800 Speaker 1: didn't catch didn't see that. Yeah, And then the girlfriend 614 00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:09,000 Speaker 1: was also like, yeah, he like showed up in this car, 615 00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:10,880 Speaker 1: and I was like, get rid of that car. Whose 616 00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 1: car is that? Like there was some reporting around it 617 00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:16,719 Speaker 1: where people close to him when they were interviewed told 618 00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:21,080 Speaker 1: the mount He's like he had stuff that Yeah. Yeah, 619 00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:23,480 Speaker 1: I mean it wasn't like stuff, but they that he 620 00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:26,440 Speaker 1: had shown up and he looks like tired and disheveled, 621 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:28,120 Speaker 1: and they're like, what happened. He was like, oh, I 622 00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:33,000 Speaker 1: burned down a r V. Yeah, So there was a lot. Yeah, 623 00:36:33,120 --> 00:36:35,480 Speaker 1: and but I mean, like I said that, I actually 624 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:37,879 Speaker 1: don't think I said this. He is currently serving time 625 00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:40,560 Speaker 1: for the crime, but it's been a bit of back 626 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:42,839 Speaker 1: and forth. Like he was initially arrested and then they 627 00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:44,799 Speaker 1: released him because they didn't have enough evidence, and then 628 00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:47,640 Speaker 1: they reopened the case and they found actually maybe they 629 00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:50,239 Speaker 1: did have enough evidence, so they tried to get him 630 00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,320 Speaker 1: and he was released again, and then finally they were like, 631 00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:55,440 Speaker 1: all right, we have enough evidence and they charged him 632 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,080 Speaker 1: and he's now in jail for it. Well they tried 633 00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:00,239 Speaker 1: him before though, I mean, if he was tried for 634 00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:03,359 Speaker 1: the crime, wasn't he Yeah, yeah, and they kept him 635 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:05,400 Speaker 1: in jail for like four and a half years, Like, 636 00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:07,399 Speaker 1: they kept him in jail for a long time before 637 00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:11,040 Speaker 1: they really decided we've got a good case. Yeah, And 638 00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:13,720 Speaker 1: that was rough because you know, he came out and said, 639 00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,719 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, of course, like any sane human, 640 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:18,600 Speaker 1: he was like, no, I did not do that, because 641 00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:20,839 Speaker 1: like you never why would you ever be like, yeah, 642 00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,160 Speaker 1: of course I do right, So he was like, yeah, 643 00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:25,120 Speaker 1: I didn't do that. And actually the Mountins have ruined 644 00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:26,839 Speaker 1: my life because they kept me in prison for four 645 00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:28,799 Speaker 1: years trying to figure out if I did this. So 646 00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 1: like that's pretty ruined. Branted, he has a pretty significant 647 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:36,759 Speaker 1: rap sheet like already, although nothing, you know, nothing too 648 00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:39,200 Speaker 1: terribly violent, frankly, I mean, I mean he was a 649 00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:41,880 Speaker 1: lot of his stuff stopped far far short of murder, 650 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:48,279 Speaker 1: vehicular theft, in possession of breaking tools, driving a motor vehicle, unauthorized, 651 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:50,839 Speaker 1: operating in a regular motor vehicle. I want to hear 652 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:55,360 Speaker 1: that story trailer and weapon charges in two thousand nine, 653 00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:58,319 Speaker 1: stealing and burning a truck in two thousand nine, and 654 00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:01,319 Speaker 1: then careless use of a firearm and authorized possession of 655 00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:04,360 Speaker 1: a firearm in June two thousand ten leading up to 656 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,720 Speaker 1: the disappearance. It sounds like a loose cannon. It sounds 657 00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:12,840 Speaker 1: like escalating as well, maybe, but I mean, still way 658 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:17,319 Speaker 1: way way short of murder, right, But again, um, this 659 00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:20,120 Speaker 1: isn't a story about the Meccans, right, So, like I know, 660 00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:22,840 Speaker 1: I opened this can of worms and we could go 661 00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:26,839 Speaker 1: back and forth, but no, it could be said though 662 00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:29,240 Speaker 1: there still could be a connection. Even if Vader is innocent, 663 00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:32,040 Speaker 1: there still could be you know, for this crime, still 664 00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:35,239 Speaker 1: could be our perp too. So you're bringing him up 665 00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,040 Speaker 1: because you're we've and I've read the reading online too, 666 00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:41,040 Speaker 1: and I want this for people to understand, is that 667 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 1: the idea is that he is responsible for what happened 668 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,120 Speaker 1: to Stephanie exactly because he was in that area and 669 00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:55,399 Speaker 1: obviously he did something very questionable things. So I mean, 670 00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:57,720 Speaker 1: you know, one of the things that we can say 671 00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:01,239 Speaker 1: is that we've said this before about people who are 672 00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:05,319 Speaker 1: have only been convicted of like the one murder, but 673 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 1: they seem like super skisy leading up to it just 674 00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:13,200 Speaker 1: means they got caught that one time. So with this 675 00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:16,680 Speaker 1: kind of rap sheet like circling around. I'm not saying 676 00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:20,000 Speaker 1: that people with rap sheets like this are like murderers. 677 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:24,520 Speaker 1: I'm not, and I'm not saying necessarily that Vader is, 678 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,960 Speaker 1: you know. But the theory is is that um, that 679 00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:33,160 Speaker 1: pot that was that was boiling um somebody said, and 680 00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:35,000 Speaker 1: I actually thought this was kind of you know, it 681 00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:38,600 Speaker 1: can go either way, um, but I think it's worth mentioning. 682 00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:41,000 Speaker 1: Is that somebody said it's a bad way to do it, 683 00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:44,080 Speaker 1: but you can kind of start a fire that way, 684 00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:47,920 Speaker 1: depending on the pot, depending on the stove, depending on brothers, 685 00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:52,640 Speaker 1: lots of dependence. But just because that's lots of tendance 686 00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:55,640 Speaker 1: doesn't mean that like somebody who's kind of dummy didn't 687 00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:58,640 Speaker 1: try it. You know. I gotta tell you, I never 688 00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:04,399 Speaker 1: saw as much in the boiling pot or kettle as 689 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:07,560 Speaker 1: most of the the internet seems to. And here's my 690 00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:11,279 Speaker 1: reason for is that I've lived in places in the 691 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,720 Speaker 1: summer where it was hot as hell and the only 692 00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:18,120 Speaker 1: way that you could make your house not feel like 693 00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:22,960 Speaker 1: it was, you know, the desert was to have water 694 00:40:23,600 --> 00:40:26,440 Speaker 1: on the heat so that there was some moisture in 695 00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:27,920 Speaker 1: the air. Because I don't know about you, but if 696 00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:30,520 Speaker 1: it's really hot for a period of time, my sinuses 697 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:33,480 Speaker 1: dry out, I'll get nosebleeds. And I know people who 698 00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:37,360 Speaker 1: will just have a pot of water on simmer or 699 00:40:37,440 --> 00:40:39,480 Speaker 1: a cattle you know, people do it pot pourri too, 700 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:42,799 Speaker 1: but something to get some moisture in the air. So 701 00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:45,759 Speaker 1: it is just not such an arid environment where you're 702 00:40:45,800 --> 00:40:47,680 Speaker 1: at all the time. So I was just like, oh, 703 00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:49,719 Speaker 1: she probably, I mean, it could very well have just 704 00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:52,680 Speaker 1: been something she always had going and on a simmer 705 00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:58,239 Speaker 1: like boil. Boil could be a term that inflames people's 706 00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:02,239 Speaker 1: ideas of the story. Well there's a simpler answer for that, 707 00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:06,720 Speaker 1: and that is that whoever intruded upon her time didn't 708 00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,000 Speaker 1: spend the night. They came in the morning and they 709 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:12,640 Speaker 1: interrupted her morning routine of boiling water for tea or 710 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:15,920 Speaker 1: something like that. Right, But I just wanted to I 711 00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:18,040 Speaker 1: want to run with this one real quick, like, let's 712 00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:19,840 Speaker 1: you know, I just want to run with the idea 713 00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:25,680 Speaker 1: of somebody who is serving time for murdering retirees. And 714 00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:30,400 Speaker 1: then setting the scene on fire within like a close proximity, 715 00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:34,800 Speaker 1: is at least somebody who's worth mentioning, right, and managed 716 00:41:34,840 --> 00:41:37,759 Speaker 1: to dispose of two bodies without being found. Yeah, the 717 00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:40,279 Speaker 1: bodies of the Meccans have never been found. That's why 718 00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:42,759 Speaker 1: I mean, Vader or not, I think the same purp. 719 00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:45,520 Speaker 1: I wouldn't be surprised. I wouldn't either, And I really 720 00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:49,719 Speaker 1: wouldn't be surprised if it was a really poorly informed 721 00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:53,720 Speaker 1: attempt at starting a fire in the cabin, because again, 722 00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:57,000 Speaker 1: I think we can safely assume that whoever did this 723 00:41:57,200 --> 00:42:02,160 Speaker 1: didn't really understand the procedure of fire watching. They probably 724 00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:04,680 Speaker 1: didn't think that within fifteen minutes somebody would be there 725 00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:07,960 Speaker 1: checking on her, right, especially since I think they let 726 00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,400 Speaker 1: so many calls happen, and I think they let like 727 00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:13,440 Speaker 1: three or four calls happen and like picked up and 728 00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:16,080 Speaker 1: hung up and then finally unplug the phone. And then 729 00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:18,839 Speaker 1: at that point the supervisor was like, Okay, well, we're 730 00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:23,000 Speaker 1: definitely spending someone out there, like what it is. Even so, 731 00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:25,400 Speaker 1: I don't think it's a good way to start a 732 00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:27,600 Speaker 1: house fire. But if somebody thought they had a long 733 00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:31,160 Speaker 1: time and it looked like, you know, there was wood around, 734 00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:34,399 Speaker 1: and they could really start. I don't know. I don't 735 00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:36,279 Speaker 1: think it's a great theory, but I think it's worth 736 00:42:38,520 --> 00:42:43,279 Speaker 1: to use a empty pot to start a water to 737 00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:46,279 Speaker 1: start a fire. It would make a hell of a 738 00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:49,640 Speaker 1: lot more sense to just pour the water out of 739 00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:53,480 Speaker 1: the pot and put the empty pot on top of 740 00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:56,280 Speaker 1: the eat source with the intention of it then causing 741 00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:59,480 Speaker 1: Like spattering hot water is not going to cause the 742 00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:01,759 Speaker 1: fire is gonna be It's not the spattering, it's after 743 00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:04,680 Speaker 1: it dries out, right, So my point is you empty 744 00:43:04,719 --> 00:43:07,400 Speaker 1: the water out of the container that you're heating to 745 00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:10,400 Speaker 1: speed up this. I'm going to burn everything down with 746 00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:13,040 Speaker 1: the pot or a dry a dry potter, dry cattle thing, 747 00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:17,160 Speaker 1: unless you're trying to give yourself time to create an alibi, 748 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:20,160 Speaker 1: Like if you're so, I mean, it's like a long 749 00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:24,879 Speaker 1: time for a dry pan or pots. It's not. It's 750 00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:27,080 Speaker 1: not likely to say no, absolutely, it's not. And like 751 00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:31,080 Speaker 1: I am continuing to say, I think it's a bad 752 00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:33,800 Speaker 1: way to start a fire, but I can see a 753 00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:36,759 Speaker 1: kind of a dummy thinking, Okay, so here's what I'm 754 00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:39,000 Speaker 1: gonna do. I'm gonna set this pot of water to 755 00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,120 Speaker 1: boil because I know that he's wrong, right, But he says, okay, 756 00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:44,160 Speaker 1: because I think that'll start a fire. But I'll start 757 00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:45,880 Speaker 1: a fire in like an hour and a half, right, 758 00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:48,239 Speaker 1: so I have time to go back to Edson, to 759 00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:51,760 Speaker 1: go sit in a local cafe, create like a serious 760 00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:54,440 Speaker 1: alibi for myself, so that people know where I am at, 761 00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,879 Speaker 1: like whatever given time, and so that like even more 762 00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:01,040 Speaker 1: if for whatever reason it's somebody were like, oh, I 763 00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:04,280 Speaker 1: wonder where fire started. McGhee, is you know at the time, 764 00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:07,480 Speaker 1: then I at least can say, well, I was at 765 00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:09,960 Speaker 1: the coffee shop. But here's the thing. Number one, he 766 00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:12,359 Speaker 1: you know, or to give himself enough lead time. It's 767 00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:15,439 Speaker 1: a lousy way to start a fire. Oh absolutely start 768 00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:17,439 Speaker 1: a fire. Number number one. Number two. If you really 769 00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:20,279 Speaker 1: want to have a delayed reaction fire, you use the microwave. 770 00:44:21,640 --> 00:44:23,279 Speaker 1: I don't know that there was a microwave there. That's 771 00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:25,600 Speaker 1: a good point there, maybe, But there's better ways than 772 00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:27,959 Speaker 1: the pot of the stove. I think somebody just put 773 00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:30,600 Speaker 1: a pot on there too, just to boil and forgot 774 00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:32,960 Speaker 1: about it. I just forgot about I agree. I'm getting 775 00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:35,160 Speaker 1: in Devon's chair, so I am channeling her, and I'm 776 00:44:35,160 --> 00:44:38,080 Speaker 1: saying that is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Okay, fine, 777 00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:43,839 Speaker 1: um there, while we're on the topic of Edson, because 778 00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:47,080 Speaker 1: we are, because Edson is pretty close to Slander the 779 00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:52,279 Speaker 1: entire town, not the entire town. This is Canada, and 780 00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:54,560 Speaker 1: Canada is only a few hundred miles from here. Yeah, 781 00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:56,560 Speaker 1: that's true. I could come down to murder us. Edson 782 00:44:56,760 --> 00:45:02,319 Speaker 1: is um only about people as of two sixteen. I 783 00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:06,640 Speaker 1: don't know where the population has gone since then. Well 784 00:45:05,600 --> 00:45:09,560 Speaker 1: it's full of killers and probably down well, but that's 785 00:45:09,560 --> 00:45:13,040 Speaker 1: the thing that's like weird, is like you go through 786 00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:16,080 Speaker 1: the threads and people are like, oh, yeah, well, there's 787 00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,880 Speaker 1: this other rapist from Edson that it could be, or 788 00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:22,200 Speaker 1: there's this other murderer from Edson that it could be, 789 00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:28,200 Speaker 1: And it's like, how many freaking rapists in that stuff? 790 00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:32,120 Speaker 1: Because people reach back way in the archives. I mean, 791 00:45:32,120 --> 00:45:35,960 Speaker 1: there could be somebody who lived in Edson and committed 792 00:45:35,960 --> 00:45:39,160 Speaker 1: a string of rapes twenty five or thirty years prior 793 00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:42,320 Speaker 1: and maybe doesn't even live in the area anymore, but 794 00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:44,319 Speaker 1: they'll find that, so then they'll start, well, look at 795 00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:46,040 Speaker 1: this and it's got to be this Like we have 796 00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:50,200 Speaker 1: to be careful with that because there wasn't people's Well, 797 00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:53,080 Speaker 1: it's also the town that size. You know, it really 798 00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:55,520 Speaker 1: doesn't take doesn't take more than a couple of families 799 00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:59,680 Speaker 1: of dirtbags to really skew this statistics. Absolutely true. Yeah, 800 00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:05,719 Speaker 1: another theory that I saw, which is less vicious. I mean, 801 00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:08,800 Speaker 1: I don't know, it's pretty vicious. Still, it's my understanding. 802 00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:12,719 Speaker 1: So Edson, it's my understanding that Edson is like you 803 00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:16,239 Speaker 1: can see it basically from this fire tower you can 804 00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:19,720 Speaker 1: see into it, or like the outskirts, I am given 805 00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:23,600 Speaker 1: to understand that Edson has a pretty intense meth problem. 806 00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:27,920 Speaker 1: Many small towns do. That is true, yes, um, and 807 00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,400 Speaker 1: you know other crime things like a lot of people 808 00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:34,279 Speaker 1: go missing on Highway sixteen for instance, which again is 809 00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:37,200 Speaker 1: the one that's like three miles away from the fire tower. 810 00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:40,640 Speaker 1: So there is also this theory, which is again I 811 00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:46,080 Speaker 1: think a pretty interesting theory, that Stephanie could have witnessed 812 00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:49,240 Speaker 1: something or at least been perceived to have witnessed something 813 00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:53,319 Speaker 1: go down. How far from from Edson's tower, It's not 814 00:46:53,640 --> 00:46:56,440 Speaker 1: that far. I don't know, it's a couple of miles. 815 00:46:57,040 --> 00:46:59,080 Speaker 1: But I think I think Devon actually hit the name 816 00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:03,719 Speaker 1: the nail on the head by saying perceived she maybe yeah, 817 00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:06,960 Speaker 1: you know, I mean, let's be honest, when people are tweaking, 818 00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:09,840 Speaker 1: they come up with some pretty cookie ideas and they go, 819 00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:12,120 Speaker 1: there's the fire oh god, the person in the fire tower, 820 00:47:14,600 --> 00:47:17,080 Speaker 1: I mean. But or alternately, like I said, a lot 821 00:47:17,120 --> 00:47:20,920 Speaker 1: of people go missing from Highway sixteen, which was three 822 00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:27,239 Speaker 1: miles away from but like easily to be spotted perceived again, right, 823 00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:31,320 Speaker 1: so if somebody kidnapped somebody that like is not somehow 824 00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:33,680 Speaker 1: not even connected to this, or you know, it's a 825 00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:37,280 Speaker 1: Jane Doe missing from who knows where, but somebody kidnapped 826 00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,600 Speaker 1: someone and thought, oh, I bet whoever's in that tower 827 00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:45,160 Speaker 1: saw this, better go take care of that. Also, like, unfortunately, 828 00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:49,080 Speaker 1: that could also give reason to take the bed sheets 829 00:47:49,120 --> 00:47:52,360 Speaker 1: with them. That if they kidnap somebody, they go to 830 00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:57,800 Speaker 1: the cabin, they kill Stephanie, rape who or whatever whoever 831 00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:00,799 Speaker 1: they kidnapped, and then take it all with them, your 832 00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:04,080 Speaker 1: second and third characters. And yeah, that would also, I mean, 833 00:48:04,120 --> 00:48:08,080 Speaker 1: that's like extra that as an additional tragedy to this 834 00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:12,440 Speaker 1: whole story. But but the idea that either somebody knew 835 00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:15,719 Speaker 1: that she saw something bad happen or thought that she 836 00:48:15,800 --> 00:48:19,319 Speaker 1: saw something illegal or bad happen and thought, I gotta 837 00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:21,880 Speaker 1: go take that witness out. This is one of the 838 00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:23,719 Speaker 1: lamest of the theories that are out there. And now 839 00:48:23,719 --> 00:48:25,360 Speaker 1: you didn't come up with I didn't come up with 840 00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:27,279 Speaker 1: any of these theories. Yeah, it's like the whole idea. 841 00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:29,600 Speaker 1: It's like, oh my god, there's a tower two miles away. 842 00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:32,200 Speaker 1: I'm sure that. Yeah, because their binoculars on me the 843 00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:34,719 Speaker 1: whole time. I don't even even at two miles I 844 00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:37,360 Speaker 1: had not seen a par of binoculars that are going to, like, 845 00:48:37,400 --> 00:48:40,080 Speaker 1: you know, actually bring the kind of resolution and magnification 846 00:48:40,080 --> 00:48:42,640 Speaker 1: to make me actually be able to identify somebody committing 847 00:48:42,640 --> 00:48:45,280 Speaker 1: a crime. But but I will say, like what Steve 848 00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:48,680 Speaker 1: was saying before is super valid that like I you know, 849 00:48:48,760 --> 00:48:51,560 Speaker 1: Portland's used to, I don't know if we still do, 850 00:48:51,680 --> 00:48:54,400 Speaker 1: but definitely used to have a pretty serious meth problem. 851 00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:57,360 Speaker 1: It's smooth Van Tucky and I have no I know 852 00:48:57,640 --> 00:49:00,960 Speaker 1: enough people like I interacted with a couple of people 853 00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:04,879 Speaker 1: who were like really really heavily addicted to meth. And 854 00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:09,480 Speaker 1: you know, I've definitely seen some of the weird insane 855 00:49:09,560 --> 00:49:13,239 Speaker 1: spirals that that drug can send people on. And it 856 00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:16,200 Speaker 1: I don't think it's beyond reason to think that somebody 857 00:49:16,239 --> 00:49:20,239 Speaker 1: could have, you know, gotten high on meth and thought, 858 00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:22,799 Speaker 1: oh yeah, that person saw me, I gotta go take 859 00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:27,200 Speaker 1: him out. And then also oftentimes not I feel like 860 00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:31,080 Speaker 1: I should say not to like stereotype people who are 861 00:49:31,320 --> 00:49:33,960 Speaker 1: on meth, but like oftentimes people are on meth, like 862 00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:37,840 Speaker 1: we'll take refuge wherever they can, and so, you know, again, 863 00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:40,000 Speaker 1: then we circle back to like maybe they stayed the 864 00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:43,640 Speaker 1: night up they were, Like I would actually buy more 865 00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,360 Speaker 1: into the theory that somebody not even on math or whatever, 866 00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:48,880 Speaker 1: somebody just neated a place to hold up for you know, 867 00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:53,520 Speaker 1: happening a knife. Yeah yeah, I mean also like it's 868 00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:55,560 Speaker 1: it's also possible like I don't know what time she 869 00:49:55,640 --> 00:49:57,480 Speaker 1: went to bed, but they could have thought it was 870 00:49:57,960 --> 00:49:59,880 Speaker 1: except for her truck was outside, so never mind. I 871 00:49:59,920 --> 00:50:01,120 Speaker 1: was gonna say they could have thought it was just 872 00:50:01,200 --> 00:50:04,520 Speaker 1: an abandoned empty cabin and then been surprised and killed her. 873 00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:06,799 Speaker 1: But I don't think that's true. I think with the 874 00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:09,640 Speaker 1: truck outside, they probably could have known it was occupied. 875 00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:13,399 Speaker 1: I have a I have an issue with the this 876 00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:16,759 Speaker 1: you know, this this drug adult theory as well as 877 00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:20,640 Speaker 1: I did with Vader. Is that the fact that the 878 00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:23,719 Speaker 1: sheets were taken, like the whole conversation of well, they 879 00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:26,239 Speaker 1: knew their DNA was on it, so they were hiding it. 880 00:50:26,640 --> 00:50:30,200 Speaker 1: Like I think that's a mental process that would be 881 00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:33,520 Speaker 1: beyond the people in that type of circumstance. I could 882 00:50:33,520 --> 00:50:36,200 Speaker 1: see it being the you know, bundle the body up 883 00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:38,640 Speaker 1: in something to put it in the car and get 884 00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:41,400 Speaker 1: rid of it. But I wouldn't you know, the protect 885 00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:43,919 Speaker 1: yourself to hide your DNA like that, Just I think 886 00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:46,719 Speaker 1: that would be beyond somebody in that condition. If it 887 00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:48,759 Speaker 1: was just somebody who was like homeless or on the 888 00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:50,839 Speaker 1: run or whatever like that, maybe they wanted a couple 889 00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:53,560 Speaker 1: of pillows and some blankets, just you know, for camping. 890 00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:57,560 Speaker 1: I guess I I'm I don't have a problem with 891 00:50:57,600 --> 00:51:00,560 Speaker 1: that as much because I am not necessarily willing to 892 00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:02,880 Speaker 1: say that they woke up in the same condition that 893 00:51:02,920 --> 00:51:06,600 Speaker 1: they committed the crime in. I always struggle with this 894 00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:09,719 Speaker 1: when I'm trying to put things delicately. But there there 895 00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:16,799 Speaker 1: are some long term cognitive effects to serious usage, and 896 00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:22,920 Speaker 1: there can be two long term serious usage of that drug. 897 00:51:23,719 --> 00:51:28,160 Speaker 1: I think that the majority of people would find changes 898 00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:32,799 Speaker 1: in their mental capacity and somebody to be I would 899 00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:35,240 Speaker 1: perceive somebody to be in the state to have gone 900 00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:39,120 Speaker 1: to this length for whatever, they would have to be 901 00:51:39,520 --> 00:51:44,879 Speaker 1: pretty far in the bag. I wants to agree with you, yes, 902 00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:48,359 Speaker 1: but from personal experience, you know, again, nobody I know 903 00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:53,040 Speaker 1: murdered someone, right, But I will say that, you know, 904 00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:57,799 Speaker 1: the people that I interacted with were two totally different people. 905 00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:01,480 Speaker 1: You know, went on when high and then when not high, 906 00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:05,319 Speaker 1: and so I don't know. Again, you know, it's it 907 00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:10,520 Speaker 1: just depends on the absolutely because there's no good theory 908 00:52:10,600 --> 00:52:14,359 Speaker 1: on this. There's another There's one other theory in terms 909 00:52:14,400 --> 00:52:17,799 Speaker 1: of like her getting murdered, and that is that apparently 910 00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:22,919 Speaker 1: she didn't always get along with the local guides there. 911 00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:24,560 Speaker 1: You know, there are a lot of adventure sports in 912 00:52:24,600 --> 00:52:27,839 Speaker 1: areas like this, and so there were a couple um 913 00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:32,880 Speaker 1: people who are guides for like kayaking trip or you know, hiking, 914 00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:36,520 Speaker 1: engineering whatever, yeah or whatever, and apparently she didn't totally 915 00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:38,960 Speaker 1: get along with a lot of them, and so you know, 916 00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:41,319 Speaker 1: there was a theory that she had had a bad 917 00:52:41,360 --> 00:52:42,880 Speaker 1: interaction with one of them and they were like, well, 918 00:52:42,920 --> 00:52:44,880 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna go kill her. But I feel like 919 00:52:44,960 --> 00:52:47,920 Speaker 1: that is like of all of them. That's the dumbest, 920 00:52:48,040 --> 00:52:52,280 Speaker 1: Like somehow I believe I even believe Joe's forthcoming theory 921 00:52:52,440 --> 00:52:57,399 Speaker 1: that a bear ate her more than I believe any 922 00:52:57,440 --> 00:53:00,719 Speaker 1: of the others. Yeah, do you to talk about your 923 00:53:00,800 --> 00:53:04,040 Speaker 1: bear theory, the animal attack theory? Well, weren't you going 924 00:53:04,120 --> 00:53:06,480 Speaker 1: to talk about another theory where whereby she staged your 925 00:53:06,560 --> 00:53:08,640 Speaker 1: murder and just left to start a new life. Yeah, 926 00:53:08,680 --> 00:53:10,600 Speaker 1: I mean I was going to end with that because 927 00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:13,960 Speaker 1: it'd be like a nice okay, nice Yeah, a nice thing. Yeah. 928 00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:16,080 Speaker 1: I kind of like the bears things too, because at 929 00:53:16,120 --> 00:53:18,080 Speaker 1: least at least it means that, you know, a bear, 930 00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:20,240 Speaker 1: a couple of bears got a good meal out of it, 931 00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:23,120 Speaker 1: you know, which is better than some some crackhead. But 932 00:53:23,160 --> 00:53:27,320 Speaker 1: does it ex randomly? But does it explain the missing 933 00:53:27,480 --> 00:53:30,759 Speaker 1: blankets and pillows and gold watch? It does because they 934 00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:33,560 Speaker 1: were Yogi and Boo Boo and they needed to buy 935 00:53:33,560 --> 00:53:36,440 Speaker 1: a piccanic bass. Yeah, Yogi would like a new watch. 936 00:53:36,480 --> 00:53:38,680 Speaker 1: That's probably true, But I don't know that if you 937 00:53:38,680 --> 00:53:42,400 Speaker 1: think about Yogi always had he did. But here's what 938 00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:45,920 Speaker 1: I will say, yes, but yeah, but here's what I 939 00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:48,719 Speaker 1: will say is that it was her gold watch, and 940 00:53:48,760 --> 00:53:50,840 Speaker 1: I cannot imagine. I mean, I imagine her wrist was 941 00:53:50,880 --> 00:53:53,239 Speaker 1: about the same size as mine. I don't imagine that 942 00:53:53,239 --> 00:53:57,440 Speaker 1: would fit on Yogi's wrists. Listen, bears don't understand the sizing, 943 00:53:58,640 --> 00:54:02,000 Speaker 1: so you can't. You can't hold that against them. They 944 00:54:02,040 --> 00:54:04,600 Speaker 1: make bears are grumpy for a reason because they buy 945 00:54:04,640 --> 00:54:08,399 Speaker 1: ill fitting jewelry on a regular basis. But Yogi and 946 00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:13,680 Speaker 1: boo boo, right, notwithstanding, what do you I mean, do 947 00:54:13,719 --> 00:54:15,799 Speaker 1: you have an explanation for what happened to the what 948 00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:18,120 Speaker 1: could have happened to those Yeah, well, I mean it's 949 00:54:18,160 --> 00:54:20,719 Speaker 1: like if she decided to take off and go for 950 00:54:20,960 --> 00:54:24,480 Speaker 1: like an early morning hike with her blankets and pillows. Well, 951 00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:27,120 Speaker 1: I'll get to that in a second. If she wanted 952 00:54:27,160 --> 00:54:30,040 Speaker 1: to take off and go for a hike, um, well, 953 00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:31,960 Speaker 1: you know, she probably would have taken her watch with 954 00:54:32,080 --> 00:54:34,439 Speaker 1: her because she had to check in at a certain time, 955 00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:36,000 Speaker 1: so she had to keep track of the time. It 956 00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:38,120 Speaker 1: goes off, gets eaten by bears, you know, and we 957 00:54:38,200 --> 00:54:40,600 Speaker 1: never hear from her again. As far as everything else 958 00:54:40,600 --> 00:54:42,440 Speaker 1: that was missing, it wasn't a hell of a lot 959 00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:46,080 Speaker 1: of stuff. And you know, I'm really not sure exactly 960 00:54:46,120 --> 00:54:48,239 Speaker 1: how they accounted for what was there that should have 961 00:54:48,239 --> 00:54:51,120 Speaker 1: been there versus not there, et cetera. I mean, I 962 00:54:51,160 --> 00:54:53,080 Speaker 1: really don't know how they did that. It would be 963 00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:56,960 Speaker 1: my guess, um, and this is just a guess, but um, 964 00:54:57,719 --> 00:54:59,799 Speaker 1: growing up, we had a cabin that we shared with 965 00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:04,680 Speaker 1: three other families, and there it was cabin's stuff. You 966 00:55:04,719 --> 00:55:09,400 Speaker 1: had your yeah, totally, So it would be my guess 967 00:55:09,400 --> 00:55:14,360 Speaker 1: that they furnished everything, you know, except for food, you know, consumables, 968 00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:19,319 Speaker 1: and they provided that stuff for you, especially the hike 969 00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:21,040 Speaker 1: in ones. You know, you like, you don't want to 970 00:55:21,080 --> 00:55:22,680 Speaker 1: have to carry all that stuff. So I don't know 971 00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:24,759 Speaker 1: why they wouldn't also for the drive in ones. So 972 00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:27,600 Speaker 1: that's my guess as to how they were able to 973 00:55:27,680 --> 00:55:30,399 Speaker 1: figure out what was missing was because they said, well, 974 00:55:30,400 --> 00:55:33,440 Speaker 1: we have this inventory. It says it should have this stuff. 975 00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:37,160 Speaker 1: Now that she might have hated that crap and replaced it. 976 00:55:37,400 --> 00:55:40,480 Speaker 1: I was gonna say, that does not explain that. I 977 00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:45,320 Speaker 1: presume that there were only two pillows totally in the 978 00:55:45,320 --> 00:55:48,279 Speaker 1: whole cabin, But it's true she could have just hated it. 979 00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:51,239 Speaker 1: I guess, you know. I mean, it's like this inventory 980 00:55:51,239 --> 00:55:54,040 Speaker 1: of stuff that they're sure is missing. I'm a little questioned. 981 00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:58,040 Speaker 1: She was also the only fire watcher there for the 982 00:55:58,120 --> 00:56:01,160 Speaker 1: last thirteen years, so it's maybe she was just sick 983 00:56:01,200 --> 00:56:02,840 Speaker 1: of that crap and this year she decided it was 984 00:56:02,880 --> 00:56:06,320 Speaker 1: time for a change. Totally as far as well, you know, 985 00:56:06,360 --> 00:56:09,399 Speaker 1: I gotta tell you, people do just put water on 986 00:56:09,480 --> 00:56:12,000 Speaker 1: and forget about it, and it has happened. There was 987 00:56:12,040 --> 00:56:13,919 Speaker 1: a reason for her to wear a watch she left, 988 00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:15,439 Speaker 1: I think, and I think what they need to do 989 00:56:15,880 --> 00:56:18,239 Speaker 1: is just check all the bear poop and about a 990 00:56:18,760 --> 00:56:21,759 Speaker 1: hundred mile radius, they'll probably find a gold watch in there. 991 00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:24,399 Speaker 1: So you're saying that the phone calls that were picked 992 00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:28,960 Speaker 1: up and put down, the phone unplugged, and the blood 993 00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:31,560 Speaker 1: around is just like made up. That's just an addition 994 00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:34,680 Speaker 1: to the story. Would have been really smart bears. Yeah, okay, yeah, 995 00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:36,919 Speaker 1: all right, I just wanted to next theory to fat 996 00:56:36,920 --> 00:56:41,200 Speaker 1: and yeah, it's just all this talk about depravity and 997 00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:44,920 Speaker 1: serial killers and meth heads depressing. Yeah. I think the 998 00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:47,759 Speaker 1: whole bear theory is actually a little more cheery. It 999 00:56:47,840 --> 00:56:50,960 Speaker 1: is somehow. Yeah. Yeah, and that's you know my other theories, 1000 00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:53,960 Speaker 1: like it's just a staged murder, it's just dear blood 1001 00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:59,680 Speaker 1: and your death, or you know, to go climb Mount Kilmanjaro. Again. 1002 00:56:59,719 --> 00:57:02,680 Speaker 1: I mean, like, I don't know one thing I will 1003 00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:06,560 Speaker 1: add to the kind of more depressing, especially the witness 1004 00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:10,040 Speaker 1: to the crime, but other theories where you know, maybe 1005 00:57:10,080 --> 00:57:12,840 Speaker 1: she was murdered by somebody she knew, maybe she witnessed 1006 00:57:12,840 --> 00:57:17,280 Speaker 1: a crime. We mentioned earlier that the police have not 1007 00:57:17,480 --> 00:57:21,680 Speaker 1: and do not release what relatives she spoke with the 1008 00:57:21,800 --> 00:57:26,960 Speaker 1: night before. Right. Additionally, as far as I can tell, 1009 00:57:27,400 --> 00:57:30,280 Speaker 1: I've never seen so I've never seen the last name 1010 00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:34,480 Speaker 1: of the daughter released, and I believe that's intentional. I 1011 00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:37,360 Speaker 1: also believe it's intentional that they have not released the 1012 00:57:37,440 --> 00:57:40,479 Speaker 1: names of any other family members or anybody else who's 1013 00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:43,760 Speaker 1: connected to Stephanie. They printed a map of the all 1014 00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:46,160 Speaker 1: the firewatched cabins and the ones that are ready to 1015 00:57:46,200 --> 00:57:49,600 Speaker 1: get to. But but I so, I I almost wonder 1016 00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:53,600 Speaker 1: if the police are intentionally withholding this because they suspect 1017 00:57:54,120 --> 00:57:58,240 Speaker 1: it's somebody with a vendetta against Stephanie, and they think, Okay, 1018 00:57:58,440 --> 00:58:00,840 Speaker 1: she talked to somebody on the phone between the time 1019 00:58:00,880 --> 00:58:03,080 Speaker 1: that she was witnessed this crime and the time we 1020 00:58:03,120 --> 00:58:05,760 Speaker 1: got to her, Right, so that person is now also 1021 00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:09,880 Speaker 1: a target. I don't think that's accurate, but it adds 1022 00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:11,880 Speaker 1: a little bit to that theory. But all I want 1023 00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:14,000 Speaker 1: to say is that I really hope that she just 1024 00:58:14,120 --> 00:58:17,960 Speaker 1: like threw dear blood everywhere and like left to go 1025 00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:24,120 Speaker 1: live with Alan Cordermain and yeah, Steve Irwin, you know whatever. Yeah, 1026 00:58:24,160 --> 00:58:27,320 Speaker 1: I think that's Australia. I think you're probably right. Yeah, 1027 00:58:27,440 --> 00:58:30,880 Speaker 1: very close enough. It's a foreign country where they speak 1028 00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:36,600 Speaker 1: a weird version of English. Won't fit in your wallet. 1029 00:58:36,800 --> 00:58:40,840 Speaker 1: I don't know everywhere. I don't have any good theories. 1030 00:58:40,880 --> 00:58:43,360 Speaker 1: Almost I would say the random killing is probably the 1031 00:58:43,360 --> 00:58:45,960 Speaker 1: most likely deal. I would too. As far as somebody 1032 00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:48,160 Speaker 1: having a vendetta against her, it's hard to imagine. She 1033 00:58:48,240 --> 00:58:53,160 Speaker 1: seemed pretty harmless. I mean, she's like really nice, just 1034 00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:55,560 Speaker 1: a cranky old lady. If she wasn't nice, she was 1035 00:58:55,640 --> 00:58:58,440 Speaker 1: just a cranky old lady. And but so what I mean, 1036 00:58:58,520 --> 00:59:00,320 Speaker 1: she was cracky or not. She was in the middle 1037 00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:02,280 Speaker 1: of nowhere. Is not too many people who get upset 1038 00:59:02,280 --> 00:59:05,720 Speaker 1: by her. Yeah, actually my understanding too. So she was 1039 00:59:05,720 --> 00:59:08,440 Speaker 1: actually pretty nice. People would drop by the cabin, strangers 1040 00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:10,400 Speaker 1: or friends or whatever, and she would always be well. 1041 00:59:10,440 --> 00:59:12,800 Speaker 1: I think the cabin had like a thousand visitors a year. 1042 00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:18,120 Speaker 1: Or something like that or something, right, yeah, right on it. Yeah, 1043 00:59:18,720 --> 00:59:22,480 Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, but as a final parting thought, 1044 00:59:22,560 --> 00:59:24,640 Speaker 1: for any of you who you know are the killer 1045 00:59:25,040 --> 00:59:28,920 Speaker 1: or are Yogi or whatever, there is a twenty thousand 1046 00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:33,680 Speaker 1: dollar reward for well, for any leads leading to significant 1047 00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:37,240 Speaker 1: break in the case. Yeah, that's I mean, that's nothing. 1048 00:59:37,680 --> 00:59:41,800 Speaker 1: We'll give up. Yeah, do it. Definitely do it. Somebody rats, 1049 00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:45,760 Speaker 1: somebody up, come on. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, Um, that's the 1050 00:59:45,880 --> 00:59:49,480 Speaker 1: end of this really uplifting story in which somehow a 1051 00:59:49,520 --> 00:59:55,600 Speaker 1: bear attack is the kindest theory, at least at the bears. 1052 00:59:55,680 --> 00:59:57,960 Speaker 1: You really can't hold it against him, now, yeah, it's 1053 00:59:58,160 --> 01:00:01,040 Speaker 1: all the bears to know better. Well, bears tend to 1054 01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:05,320 Speaker 1: only attack one provoked. But yeah, whatever. Anyway, if you 1055 01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:07,320 Speaker 1: want to see some of the links to some of 1056 01:00:07,360 --> 01:00:10,800 Speaker 1: our research, you can do that on the website. You 1057 01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:13,760 Speaker 1: can also find links to our merch I know at 1058 01:00:13,760 --> 01:00:15,480 Speaker 1: our meet up a lot of people are like, can 1059 01:00:15,520 --> 01:00:17,200 Speaker 1: we buy shirts? Well, guess where? You can buy a 1060 01:00:17,240 --> 01:00:19,880 Speaker 1: shirt from a link on the website, not even on 1061 01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:23,600 Speaker 1: our actual website. You're welcome. You can also download or 1062 01:00:23,640 --> 01:00:27,160 Speaker 1: stream the episodes there. That website is Thinking Sideways Podcast 1063 01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:31,360 Speaker 1: dot com. You can connect with us on a mardrid 1064 01:00:31,440 --> 01:00:38,240 Speaker 1: of social media sites, myriad whatever some word that starts 1065 01:00:38,240 --> 01:00:44,920 Speaker 1: like Africa and Australia to multitude multitude of different social media's. UH. 1066 01:00:45,200 --> 01:00:48,040 Speaker 1: You can find us on Twitter, where we are Thinking Sideways. 1067 01:00:48,080 --> 01:00:50,200 Speaker 1: You can find us on Reddit, where we have a 1068 01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:53,200 Speaker 1: subreddit just called Thinking Sideways. You can also find us 1069 01:00:53,200 --> 01:00:55,440 Speaker 1: on Facebook, where there is a group and a page. 1070 01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:57,160 Speaker 1: If you do want to join the group, you have 1071 01:00:57,240 --> 01:01:00,240 Speaker 1: to answer the questions. We literally will not have provie 1072 01:01:00,240 --> 01:01:02,760 Speaker 1: if you don't answer the questions what is your favorite color? 1073 01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:04,760 Speaker 1: What is the average air speed of a swallow? Those 1074 01:01:04,760 --> 01:01:11,080 Speaker 1: are the questions. Yes, you can also you know where 1075 01:01:11,120 --> 01:01:13,880 Speaker 1: you're finding us UM to stream us it's you know, 1076 01:01:14,240 --> 01:01:16,800 Speaker 1: if it's on iTunes, if it's on Stitcher, if it's 1077 01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:20,200 Speaker 1: who the heck knows where else it is lots of them. 1078 01:01:20,280 --> 01:01:23,520 Speaker 1: If you can subscribe, do so. If you can leave 1079 01:01:23,560 --> 01:01:26,640 Speaker 1: a comment in a rating, a review in a rating, 1080 01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:30,720 Speaker 1: do so. And then finally, if you want to talk 1081 01:01:30,720 --> 01:01:34,280 Speaker 1: to us about how offended you are about my Canadian impression, 1082 01:01:34,640 --> 01:01:38,680 Speaker 1: especially in the wake of Jim Lahi's death, UM, if 1083 01:01:38,720 --> 01:01:42,680 Speaker 1: you want to correct us about anything, you want to 1084 01:01:42,680 --> 01:01:45,320 Speaker 1: suggest episodes. You just want to talk to us, you 1085 01:01:45,320 --> 01:01:47,680 Speaker 1: can do all that via our email, which is Thinking 1086 01:01:47,720 --> 01:01:52,440 Speaker 1: Sideways Podcast at gmail dot com. I think that's everything. Thanks, 1087 01:01:52,640 --> 01:01:55,720 Speaker 1: so I was paying attention. Great, all of that having 1088 01:01:55,800 --> 01:01:58,600 Speaker 1: been said, we are gonna get on out of here. 1089 01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:01,320 Speaker 1: Hang on, let me that Clement, that Clem think. Nope, 1090 01:02:01,400 --> 01:02:06,600 Speaker 1: don't back fuck fire. No, there's