WEBVTT - Dr. Ibram X Kendi on Community Organization and Opposing Oppressive Systems (Part 1) 0:00:00.400 --> 0:00:02.920 Broadcasting from the Hip Hop Weekly Studios. I'd like to 0:00:02.960 --> 0:00:05.360 welcome you to another episode of Civic Cipher, where our 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:08.960 mission is to foster allyship empathy and understanding. I am 0:00:08.960 --> 0:00:09.959 your host, Ramsey's job. 0:00:10.039 --> 0:00:13.000 He is Ramsy's job. I am q Ward. You are 0:00:13.080 --> 0:00:14.080 tuned in the Civic. 0:00:13.840 --> 0:00:16.000 Cipher, Yes you are, and we would like for you 0:00:16.079 --> 0:00:17.959 to stick around today because we are going to be 0:00:18.040 --> 0:00:22.840 talking to the one, the only doctor Ebram x KNDy. Now, 0:00:22.880 --> 0:00:24.840 for those who don't know, Doctor Ibram x Kindy is 0:00:24.880 --> 0:00:28.520 a National Book award winning author of sixteen books for 0:00:28.600 --> 0:00:32.560 adults and children, including ten New York Times bestsellers, five 0:00:32.600 --> 0:00:35.239 of which were Number one New York Times bestsellers, including 0:00:35.520 --> 0:00:37.720 How to Be Anti Racist. That's certainly a book that 0:00:37.760 --> 0:00:40.920 we've discussed on this show more than once. We've taken 0:00:40.960 --> 0:00:44.199 a lot of content from that book, that book to 0:00:44.360 --> 0:00:48.080 conceive of segments that we thought would be meaningful and useful. 0:00:48.800 --> 0:00:51.920 But there's there's more than that, of course, But for 0:00:51.920 --> 0:00:54.320 those who don't know, How to Be Anti Racist was 0:00:54.400 --> 0:00:57.640 described in the New York Times as the most courageous 0:00:57.640 --> 0:01:00.400 book to date on the problem of race in the 0:01:00.440 --> 0:01:04.840 Western mind. Add to that that doctor ibramax Kindi is 0:01:06.080 --> 0:01:12.520 a person who goes viral consistently online whose ideas about 0:01:12.600 --> 0:01:18.360 the state of this country are certainly a thought provoking 0:01:18.560 --> 0:01:21.080 and they lead to the sort of discussions that we 0:01:21.640 --> 0:01:24.080 feel are necessary on this show. And so for us 0:01:24.120 --> 0:01:26.040 to be able to have a conversation with him today, 0:01:27.200 --> 0:01:29.920 it means the world. So stick around for that. The 0:01:29.920 --> 0:01:31.640 first part of the show, we're going to be discussing, 0:01:32.440 --> 0:01:34.560 you know, just kind of the current state of the 0:01:34.600 --> 0:01:37.960 world and what we need to know. And for those 0:01:38.000 --> 0:01:41.160 of us who feel like we need to resist, we'll learn, 0:01:41.319 --> 0:01:43.280 you know, what that looks like nowadays. And for those 0:01:43.280 --> 0:01:46.160 that don't, well, at least know what we're up against. 0:01:46.560 --> 0:01:49.960 But before we get there, as always right now, it 0:01:50.040 --> 0:01:54.760 is time for us to start with some ebony excellence, 0:01:55.080 --> 0:01:57.800 shall we? I think that we shall. And today's ebny 0:01:57.840 --> 0:02:02.560 excellence comes from the sports. I will share a bit. 0:02:02.760 --> 0:02:07.480 Who is Young Mullah Ynom as video of black pilot 0:02:07.520 --> 0:02:11.239 goes viral on TikTok for his dreads and grills as 0:02:11.240 --> 0:02:14.680 he thanked God for the successful flight. Young Mullah Hynom, 0:02:14.800 --> 0:02:18.240 a black pilot, received criticism for wearing dreadlocks with grills 0:02:18.280 --> 0:02:21.680 on his teeth after releasing a video of himself with 0:02:21.720 --> 0:02:25.000 grills and dreadlocks after a successful flight. A black pilot 0:02:25.080 --> 0:02:27.520 name Young Mullah is receiving criticism and doubts about his 0:02:27.560 --> 0:02:30.680 abilities owing to his non conventional looks, which has stirred 0:02:30.680 --> 0:02:33.880 a debate between social media users. However, many have come 0:02:33.960 --> 0:02:37.600 to the black pilot's defense, citing his skill set which 0:02:37.639 --> 0:02:40.560 saw him become not only a pilot but a captain, 0:02:40.600 --> 0:02:44.280 which negates how he looks. Young Mullah is viral on TikTok, 0:02:44.320 --> 0:02:48.560 where he often posts videos about his work, and the 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:52.400 reason why we thought it was important to shout him 0:02:52.400 --> 0:02:57.959 out is because in the age of attacks on DEI, 0:02:58.120 --> 0:03:00.880 in the age of attacks on affirmative action, in the 0:03:00.919 --> 0:03:05.080 age of really attacks on all things black from an 0:03:05.120 --> 0:03:09.160 oppressive political system, in many people's opinions, it is important 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:13.720 that we celebrate our culture, our people, our accomplishments. And 0:03:14.040 --> 0:03:16.200 this is the platform that we've built to do just that. 0:03:16.960 --> 0:03:19.760 And when we came across the video, of course we 0:03:19.800 --> 0:03:23.720 saw a pilot the same as everyone else, who has 0:03:23.760 --> 0:03:28.080 a gorilla and wears his hair and locks. But you know, 0:03:28.120 --> 0:03:31.960 the comments section made it seem like he wasn't qualified 0:03:32.000 --> 0:03:34.040 to even be a co pilot, but he has enough 0:03:34.040 --> 0:03:35.920 stripes to actually be a pilot. And I think with 0:03:36.000 --> 0:03:38.440 a look like that, it suggests that he probably had 0:03:38.440 --> 0:03:41.440 to work even harder. And if we don't acknowledge that, 0:03:41.560 --> 0:03:44.240 no one else will. And so from where we sit, 0:03:44.480 --> 0:03:48.200 young Mulah, as you like to call yourself, keep going. 0:03:48.920 --> 0:03:50.880 I checked out a few more of your videos. You're 0:03:50.920 --> 0:03:55.960 an inspiration be yourself, and you know, keep flying and 0:03:56.000 --> 0:03:57.400 if you thank God at the end of your flights 0:03:57.440 --> 0:04:00.120 and keep doing that, and we'll keep checking out your videos. 0:04:00.120 --> 0:04:04.360 But certainly commendable and wish wishing you all the best. 0:04:05.200 --> 0:04:08.880 All right, doctor Ebram X, kindy welcome to the show. 0:04:08.960 --> 0:04:12.000 It is an honor we say that from time to time, 0:04:12.360 --> 0:04:16.839 but whatever is higher than that. That is how today feels. 0:04:16.880 --> 0:04:19.600 We've been just really excited in the studio looking forward 0:04:19.640 --> 0:04:25.480 to this conversation and we couldn't be more pleased that 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:27.560 you would take a moment to come and just share 0:04:27.560 --> 0:04:30.719 your thoughts with us now for our audience that may 0:04:30.720 --> 0:04:34.919 not be intimately familiar with the work that you do 0:04:35.000 --> 0:04:37.200 and so forth, and of course we gave a brief introduction. 0:04:37.680 --> 0:04:39.120 Do us a favor and tell us a little bit 0:04:39.120 --> 0:04:41.880 about yourself, maybe a little bit about your upbringing, your background, 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:45.040 what led you to today's conversation, Just to kind of 0:04:45.080 --> 0:04:47.120 bring folks up to speed so they know who we're 0:04:47.120 --> 0:04:48.479 talking to today. 0:04:49.040 --> 0:04:49.320 Sure. 0:04:49.480 --> 0:04:55.320 So I'm a professor an author. I write books on 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:59.560 the history of racism and even what it means to 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:03.360 be anti racist, which is to say what it means 0:05:03.360 --> 0:05:07.400 to challenge racism. And I was born and raised in Queens, 0:05:07.480 --> 0:05:12.880 New York, went to fam You at FAMU, I started 0:05:12.880 --> 0:05:17.520 thinking about wanting to write as a journalist on racism. 0:05:18.320 --> 0:05:21.760 When to get my masters in Black studies because I 0:05:21.800 --> 0:05:24.480 didn't believe that since I was black, I was automatically 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:27.560 an expert on black people. And then when I was there, 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:31.039 I really saw the life of the professor and saw 0:05:31.080 --> 0:05:34.600 that I felt like I'd have more freedom, so to speak, 0:05:34.839 --> 0:05:41.200 to really think through and write in research, you know, 0:05:41.400 --> 0:05:44.280 really for the liberation of black people. So I decided 0:05:44.279 --> 0:05:46.520 to become a professor. And here I am. 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:47.359 I love that. 0:05:50.320 --> 0:05:54.640 I think it goes without saying that you've been critical 0:05:54.760 --> 0:06:00.880 of the current administration in your opinion. I know this 0:06:00.920 --> 0:06:03.839 will be hard to narrow down, but what are the 0:06:03.960 --> 0:06:08.520 three biggest threats to Black Americans under this Trump administration. 0:06:13.000 --> 0:06:19.080 So I think I think the first, in no order 0:06:21.000 --> 0:06:21.760 would be. 0:06:24.360 --> 0:06:33.440 This effort at eliminating diversity, equity, and inclusion, because the 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:39.200 real sort of desire behind that is to resegregate this 0:06:39.360 --> 0:06:46.919 country and to eliminate our presence, particularly in places that 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:52.760 are coveted and in places of power. I would say, secondly, 0:06:55.480 --> 0:07:03.920 the efforts at really the mass deportation of immigrants. So 0:07:04.200 --> 0:07:07.880 African Americans. The overwhelming percentage of African Americans are descendants 0:07:07.920 --> 0:07:11.960 of enslaved Africans, and we're likely here even before most 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:15.200 the white Americans got here, but they still conceive of 0:07:15.280 --> 0:07:19.760 us as aliens, as illegal, as not truly Americans. And 0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:23.240 so I actually, I know a lot of black folks 0:07:23.280 --> 0:07:25.600 aren't worried about that because they know they're born in 0:07:25.640 --> 0:07:28.720 this country, their grandparents were born in this country. But 0:07:28.840 --> 0:07:34.239 I am because you know, once because simultaneously they're trying 0:07:34.240 --> 0:07:37.040 to do away with even birthright citizenship right. So to me, 0:07:37.280 --> 0:07:42.440 there's a connection there. And then the third thing, you know, 0:07:42.480 --> 0:07:52.880 I would also say, is this willingness to weaponize the 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:58.640 the FBI and policing potentially at levels we haven't seen 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:03.920 since the sixties, and and you know, as many as 0:08:03.920 --> 0:08:04.760 many people know. 0:08:06.280 --> 0:08:08.760 The civil rights movement and the Black power movement. 0:08:09.800 --> 0:08:14.960 Certainly there were internal strife, but there were so many 0:08:15.080 --> 0:08:21.120 organizations and leaders who were targeted by the FBI and 0:08:21.200 --> 0:08:26.120 policing forces really imploding or exploding, you know, our movements. 0:08:26.320 --> 0:08:31.000 And and and I see something similar happening now in which, 0:08:31.320 --> 0:08:33.000 you know, over the next few years, we're going to 0:08:33.040 --> 0:08:35.679 see leaders and organizations. 0:08:36.320 --> 0:08:38.960 Being undermined. 0:08:40.080 --> 0:08:45.040 And and and and and and really being destroyed, and 0:08:45.040 --> 0:08:47.240 and it's going to be made to seem as if 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:50.640 they are the problem, that they did something wrong, and 0:08:50.679 --> 0:08:55.040 we won't necessarily know the hands of spies and FBI 0:08:55.120 --> 0:08:55.920 agents behind that. 0:08:56.720 --> 0:09:04.080 Yeah, there's another component here too that I think that 0:09:04.120 --> 0:09:08.200 a lot of us who were trying to motivate people 0:09:08.240 --> 0:09:10.520 to vote during the last election, a lot of us 0:09:10.520 --> 0:09:15.440 that were concerned about Project twenty twenty five. There's an 0:09:15.440 --> 0:09:18.160 additional element with this administration that a lot of us 0:09:18.400 --> 0:09:23.160 did not even conceive of, and that is Elon Musk. 0:09:24.200 --> 0:09:30.960 And you know, for all intents and purposes, Twitter and 0:09:31.000 --> 0:09:33.839 by extension, you know, other social media platforms, but Twitter 0:09:33.880 --> 0:09:35.600 in particular is. 0:09:35.600 --> 0:09:36.080 Sort of a. 0:09:38.840 --> 0:09:45.880 Community watering hole. It's almost like something that there's a 0:09:45.920 --> 0:09:51.400 public discourse element there. It serves the community, and yet 0:09:51.440 --> 0:09:56.040 it's held by a private citizen right and so it's 0:09:56.080 --> 0:10:00.400 not subjected to FCC laws in the same that like 0:10:00.480 --> 0:10:02.480 radio stations were and so forth. And they don't have 0:10:02.520 --> 0:10:03.920 to give back to the community in the way that 0:10:04.160 --> 0:10:08.480 television stations radio stations do per the FCC guidelines. And 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:11.240 so it provides a benefit to the community, and the 0:10:11.240 --> 0:10:14.480 community by and large uses and consumes it, but it's 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:18.920 subjected to the whims of a private individual. And with 0:10:18.960 --> 0:10:24.000 the emergence of Elon Musk sort of functioning almost like 0:10:24.040 --> 0:10:28.040 an elected representative, though he is not talk to us 0:10:28.080 --> 0:10:34.840 a bit about what threat, if any, is associated with 0:10:35.880 --> 0:10:38.840 Elon Musk in particular, and of course, you know, to 0:10:38.840 --> 0:10:46.880 to a lesser extent or a lesser degree folks like Facebook, 0:10:46.679 --> 0:10:50.600 Mark Zuckerberg and other folks like him, and what we 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:53.560 can do about that that threat. 0:10:55.480 --> 0:11:05.880 So Elon Musk comes from a family of people who. 0:11:07.280 --> 0:11:10.720 Not only literally went to. 0:11:10.640 --> 0:11:16.160 South Africa because of apartheid, but then became major defenders 0:11:16.200 --> 0:11:20.520 and champions of apartheid. That's that's that's Elon Musk's family 0:11:20.559 --> 0:11:23.559 people who literally they're not they were you know, his 0:11:23.559 --> 0:11:29.160 his grandfather was in Canada and was like, Yo, look 0:11:29.160 --> 0:11:31.760 at that white supremacy. They're doing that really well over 0:11:31.800 --> 0:11:38.400 in South Africa. Moved to South Africa with Elon Musk's 0:11:38.400 --> 0:11:44.600 mother and and became a major defender. So that's that's 0:11:44.679 --> 0:11:50.439 Elon Musk. So for any black person to think that 0:11:50.920 --> 0:11:59.040 Elon Musk or even Twitter is in any way is 0:11:59.120 --> 0:12:02.760 anything but an engine of white supremacy, you only need 0:12:02.800 --> 0:12:05.520 to look at Elon Musk's own port of personal history 0:12:05.960 --> 0:12:11.120 and what these leaders are seeking to do today. It 0:12:11.280 --> 0:12:13.640 just reminds me of you know, one of the most 0:12:13.640 --> 0:12:18.720 classic books in African American history, which was written by 0:12:18.760 --> 0:12:22.280 Carter G. Woodson called The mis Education of the Negro, 0:12:22.920 --> 0:12:26.600 and that book and Cartigie talked about the ways in 0:12:26.640 --> 0:12:32.880 which our schools systematically miseducate us, systematically create our own 0:12:32.920 --> 0:12:40.960 ignorance so that we can ultimately not confront racism and 0:12:41.000 --> 0:12:42.520 white supremacy. 0:12:43.640 --> 0:12:45.800 But what these social. 0:12:45.440 --> 0:12:50.560 Media companies are doing, namely Twitter, is they got that 0:12:50.679 --> 0:12:54.520 down to a science, Like they're able to micro target people, 0:12:55.000 --> 0:12:59.400 so you know, through their algorithms, they're able to figure 0:12:59.440 --> 0:13:06.280 out each of our weakest spots and or those areas, 0:13:06.320 --> 0:13:09.240 those groups of people we really don't like, or those 0:13:09.679 --> 0:13:12.640 reasons why we think there's a problem with black people, 0:13:12.679 --> 0:13:17.120 and constantly feed us that information, force feed us that 0:13:17.240 --> 0:13:20.720 poison so that we continue to maintain you know, that 0:13:20.840 --> 0:13:23.880 the problem is black people, and we don't even know 0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:27.400 that it's happening to us, that they're poisoning our minds, 0:13:27.520 --> 0:13:30.240 that they're force feeding us, that they're micro targeting us 0:13:30.320 --> 0:13:33.000 where we're weak, But that's precisely what they're doing. 0:13:35.320 --> 0:13:40.440 You know, we've noticed a lot of corporations voluntarily rolling 0:13:40.520 --> 0:13:47.480 back or completely getting rid of DEI initiatives, and historically 0:13:47.520 --> 0:13:52.320 one way to fight back was through boycott. I think 0:13:52.400 --> 0:13:56.080 as of last year, or maybe even as recent as 0:13:56.440 --> 0:14:00.960 the beginning of this year, the total buying power of 0:14:01.000 --> 0:14:06.040 the black consumer is estimated around two trillion dollars. That 0:14:06.160 --> 0:14:10.560 is a more impactful weapon of leverage than I think 0:14:10.640 --> 0:14:15.000 even black people realize. Recently, Al Sharpton has called for 0:14:15.240 --> 0:14:19.640 black people to boycott. You know, these these companies who 0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:26.360 have made trillions of dollars off of our support. Do 0:14:26.440 --> 0:14:30.280 you think that's a good idea? Do you think there 0:14:30.320 --> 0:14:34.120 are there is something better that we can do. I'd 0:14:34.120 --> 0:14:36.240 love to hear where you stand there. 0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:40.520 So I actually do think it's a good idea, and 0:14:40.520 --> 0:14:44.840 and and it's not and it's a good idea that 0:14:44.840 --> 0:14:48.440 that's based in history. So of course, two of the 0:14:48.520 --> 0:14:53.920 most pivotal moments of the civil rights movement we're boycotts. 0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:57.640 Of course, there's the Montgomery bus boycott, and I don't 0:14:57.640 --> 0:15:01.480 think we have fully been taught that the reason why 0:15:02.360 --> 0:15:08.480 Montgomery the city essentially capitulated, was because black people were 0:15:08.480 --> 0:15:11.000 the primary ones who were taking the buses right, and 0:15:11.040 --> 0:15:16.280 so through boycotting those buses, we literally bankrupted the system. 0:15:16.680 --> 0:15:19.920 The second one, which we don't know as much about, 0:15:20.200 --> 0:15:23.280 is I'm sure people are familiar with those images from 0:15:23.280 --> 0:15:27.480 Birmingham where those young people are being shot with water hoses, 0:15:27.920 --> 0:15:31.200 and so that was in nineteen sixty three where young 0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:34.880 people were sort of marching in Birmingham. What was also 0:15:35.000 --> 0:15:40.480 happening is they specifically decided to do that demonstration on 0:15:40.560 --> 0:15:43.280 Easter weekend. And the reason why they did it on 0:15:43.320 --> 0:15:49.000 Easter weekend is because Easter weekend was a huge buying 0:15:49.120 --> 0:15:54.080 day in Birmingham, in downtown Birmingham, so they organically created 0:15:54.720 --> 0:16:03.040 a boycott of Birmingham's store, which then compelled the owners 0:16:03.040 --> 0:16:04.560 of those stores to feel like, Okay, we can't have 0:16:04.640 --> 0:16:07.600 too much more this right, we need to come and 0:16:07.720 --> 0:16:12.320 negotiate an end to Jim Crow segregation. And so boycotts 0:16:13.080 --> 0:16:16.040 historically have been incredibly effective, you know. 0:16:16.120 --> 0:16:16.640 And I'm just. 0:16:16.600 --> 0:16:19.960 Giving those two examples in you know, in Alabama, and 0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:23.240 I think they can be effective now. Now it's gonna 0:16:23.280 --> 0:16:27.640 take time, right and it's gonna take organizing, but I 0:16:27.680 --> 0:16:29.040 do think it can be effective. 0:16:30.840 --> 0:16:30.960 Now. 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:32.840 I want to I want to rewind just a bit 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:36.240 because you said something earlier, and I think that we 0:16:36.280 --> 0:16:38.600 can make that live a little bit more for our 0:16:38.640 --> 0:16:43.880 audience today. So let's let's say that we have some 0:16:44.040 --> 0:16:53.479 listeners who maybe they're not directly connected with immigrants, immigrant communities. 0:16:53.560 --> 0:16:56.120 They it doesn't feel real to them. Let's say that 0:16:56.240 --> 0:17:03.200 they've listened to the the debates during the campaign season 0:17:03.440 --> 0:17:05.520 and they've listened to this. I'd say what they're going 0:17:05.560 --> 0:17:06.960 to say that, I'd say what they're going to say. 0:17:08.160 --> 0:17:10.920 You mentioned that immigration is one of the things that 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:15.320 you know, people should be concerned about. Let's connect that 0:17:15.520 --> 0:17:18.160 if we can a little bit more to outcomes in 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:21.600 this individual who's listening to their lives. If they don't 0:17:21.640 --> 0:17:25.879 themselves know someone who's an immigrant, how does this current 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:30.640 let's call it attack on immigrants, how does this affect 0:17:31.400 --> 0:17:32.760 those listeners' lives? 0:17:36.080 --> 0:17:38.960 So let me just speak first rhetorically. 0:17:39.280 --> 0:17:48.440 Okay, the President of the United States has described black 0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:54.520 nations in the same way he's described black communities the 0:17:54.560 --> 0:17:56.200 same He's used the same language. 0:17:56.240 --> 0:18:01.479 So black nations and black communities are incredibly dangerous to 0:18:01.520 --> 0:18:04.040 the point in which we're all living in hell. So 0:18:04.240 --> 0:18:08.240 the way he's framed black people abroad and black people 0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:12.359 at home is pretty much the same. Then that same 0:18:12.520 --> 0:18:16.560 president has not only advocated for border walls so that 0:18:16.640 --> 0:18:18.880 black people and brown people won't be able to come 0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:23.200 in the United States, he's also advocated for border walls 0:18:23.280 --> 0:18:25.560 around white suburban communities. 0:18:25.640 --> 0:18:28.240 Like he is literally argued. 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:34.720 Uh and and and and eliminated policies that allowed us 0:18:34.760 --> 0:18:38.800 to gain better access to affordable housing and others, you know, 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:42.720 in predominantly white community. Uh, in predominantly white community. So 0:18:43.240 --> 0:18:46.240 it's interconnected in that sense, But I think in a 0:18:46.359 --> 0:18:54.760 larger sense to me, from the standpoint of racist white Americans, 0:18:55.760 --> 0:18:59.639 they see people of color in the same from the 0:18:59.720 --> 0:19:03.400 same vantage point, whether we are a citizen or whether 0:19:03.440 --> 0:19:12.639 we're an immigrant, and their advocacy of policies and programs 0:19:12.680 --> 0:19:18.640 that refuse to give us as African Americans equal access 0:19:19.080 --> 0:19:26.480 to opportunities and resources dovetails their refusal to provide immigrants 0:19:26.880 --> 0:19:31.760 with access to opportunities and resource It's all connected, but 0:19:32.200 --> 0:19:35.399 they also recognized that the people who are struggling the 0:19:35.440 --> 0:19:40.280 most are also going to need more resources. So there's 0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:45.800 a reason why they pretty adeptly decided that they were 0:19:45.840 --> 0:19:51.200 going to take immigrants in Texas, in Arizona, in Florida 0:19:51.760 --> 0:19:55.720 and send them on planes and buses to Chicago, to Detroit, 0:19:56.000 --> 0:19:58.840 to New York City. They didn't do that by happenstance. 0:19:58.960 --> 0:20:02.560 They did that because they wanted us, as African Americans, 0:20:02.960 --> 0:20:08.359 to feel as if immigrants were taking resources that were ours, 0:20:08.720 --> 0:20:13.040 so that we could be just as upset as white Americans. 0:20:13.240 --> 0:20:18.200 So I'm saying that to say they tricked us, and frankly, 0:20:18.200 --> 0:20:25.720 there's enough resources for everyone and opportunities for everyone, but 0:20:25.880 --> 0:20:29.240 they've led us to believe that there's this sort of 0:20:29.400 --> 0:20:32.919 zero sum that we as African Americans we have to 0:20:32.960 --> 0:20:36.400 sort of protect ourselves because you know, if we start 0:20:36.760 --> 0:20:39.600 advocating for immigrants, then they're going to take our resources. No, 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:43.359 what actually happens is we're empowering people who are going 0:20:43.400 --> 0:20:45.120 to take our resources. 0:20:45.520 --> 0:20:46.760 That's what actually happens. 0:20:47.880 --> 0:20:51.639 You know, I want to add to that, because the 0:20:51.720 --> 0:20:56.359 truth is is that we live in a border state, 0:20:56.520 --> 0:20:58.560 so we were able to see a lot of the 0:20:58.600 --> 0:21:03.720 fear mongering, a lot of the weaponization of the plight 0:21:03.760 --> 0:21:11.160 of immigrants, a lot of villainization and demonizing of immigrant communities. 0:21:11.800 --> 0:21:14.200 And I don't want to pretend like there's not an 0:21:14.240 --> 0:21:17.879 issue with immigration in this country. All countries deal with 0:21:17.920 --> 0:21:21.680 that on some level or another, and you know the process, 0:21:21.680 --> 0:21:24.919 I'm sure it evolves according to the country's sensibilities and 0:21:24.960 --> 0:21:27.800 needs and so forth. But you know what I remember 0:21:28.200 --> 0:21:31.600 is that there was supposed to be a border bill 0:21:32.080 --> 0:21:34.760 that was supposed to be sent to the president, and 0:21:34.840 --> 0:21:39.719 Donald Trump stepped in intentionally and said, uh, you know, 0:21:40.240 --> 0:21:42.800 Republicans don't approve that or don't vote for that border bill, 0:21:42.800 --> 0:21:47.119 even though it was a bipartisan bill, And he instructed 0:21:47.160 --> 0:21:50.639 Republicans not to move forward with that so that he 0:21:50.720 --> 0:21:54.680 could run on run his campaign on Joe Biden having 0:21:54.720 --> 0:21:57.840 a weak border. And so because we covered that in 0:21:57.880 --> 0:22:01.719 the news and then subsequent quickly saw him campaign on 0:22:01.760 --> 0:22:05.359 it again. Us living in a border state, we saw 0:22:05.400 --> 0:22:09.960 the impact that that has on real people and not 0:22:10.040 --> 0:22:12.720 just migrants. You know, we live in a place where 0:22:12.760 --> 0:22:15.600 there's a lot of this used to be Mexico where 0:22:15.600 --> 0:22:22.919 we live. So there are Mexican people who, you know, 0:22:23.000 --> 0:22:26.520 for all intents and purposes, go back generations on this land, 0:22:27.280 --> 0:22:29.679 long before this land was ever even a part of 0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:34.399 the United States, who live in fear now because they 0:22:34.440 --> 0:22:38.080 can be profiled and with the broad police powers that 0:22:38.400 --> 0:22:42.480 you know, Donald Trump was suggesting he would give to police. 0:22:42.560 --> 0:22:45.520 It's reminiscent of SB ten seventy, which is something that 0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:48.800 in Arizona, you know, we had to deal with, and 0:22:49.520 --> 0:22:54.399 you know, it's it's just really a sad state for 0:22:54.480 --> 0:22:57.280 us to be in. But you know, conversations like this 0:22:57.400 --> 0:22:59.000 certainly help us get to the bottom of it.